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这里是All Ears English播客，第2711期。
This is an All Ears English podcast, episode 2711.
你应该说B像Bravo里的B，还是B像Boy里的B？
Should you say B as in Bravo or B as in Boy?
欢迎收听All Ears English播客，下载量已超过两亿次。
Welcome to the All Ears English podcast, downloaded more than 200 million times.
你是不是觉得英语学习卡住了？
Are you feeling stuck with your English?
我们会教你如何变得无所畏惧、流利自如，专注于交流，而不是追求完美。
We'll show you how to become fearless and fluent by focusing on connection, not perfection.
你的美国主持人，雅思专家Aubrey Carter和英语冒险家Lindsay McMahon，从美国亚利桑那州和科罗拉多州为你带来节目。
With your American hosts, Aubrey Carter, the IELTS Wiz, and Lindsay McMahon, the English Adventurer, coming to you from Arizona and Colorado, USA.
想要在手机上获取实时文本，并创建你的个性化词汇表，试试All Ears English的iOS和Android应用吧。
To get real-time transcripts right on your phone and create your personalized vocabulary list, try the All Ears English app for iOS and Android.
在allearsenglish.com/app开始你的七天免费试用。
Start your seven-day free trial at allearsenglish.com/app.
你有时候在客服电话里很难让人听懂吗？
Do you sometimes struggle to be understood on customer service calls?
今天，我们给你一个解决办法，确保你能被听懂，顺利完成任务。
Today, get a solution to make sure that you are understood and can accomplish your task on the phone.
通过和真人交流，你在工作中会变得更自信。
You get confident in English at work by speaking with real people.
这正是我们商务英语课程的核心。
That's what our Business English Course is built around.
每周最多两次，你可以在我们的开放对话俱乐部里练习。
Up to twice a week, you practice in our open conversation club.
所以当你的经理问：“有什么想法吗？”
So when your manager asks, "Any thoughts?"
你已经准备好发言了。
You're ready to speak up.
选择个人教练计划，把你真实的工作问题带到我们每周的直播问答中。
Choose the Personal Coach plan and bring your real work questions to our live weekly Q+A.
是不是有棘手的邮件或演示要准备？
That tricky email or presentation coming up?
现场获取答案，做好准备。
Get answers live to be ready.
下周我和奥布里会有一个现场启动会，我们会强势开场。
And we start strong at a live kickoff with me and Aubrey next week.
仅限本周，你可以节省高达100美元，并享受我们的30天退款保证。
This week only, you can save up to $100 and get our 30-day money-back guarantee.
但这个优惠在纽约时间周日午夜截止。
But this ends Sunday at midnight, New York time.
访问 allearsenglish.com/business。
Go to allearsenglish.com/business.
网址是 allearsenglish.com/business。
That's allearsenglish.com/business.
你好，林赛。
Hello, Lindsay.
你今天怎么样？
How are you today?
挺好的，Aubrey。
Good, Aubrey.
你怎么样？
How are you doing?
一切都好吗？
How's everything going?
非常好。
Excellent.
对，一切都很顺利。
Yeah, going great.
我有个有趣的问题想问你。
I have an interesting question for you.
你有没有遇到过这样的情况：打电话给客服时，经常需要澄清某个字母，比如名字里的某个字母？
Are there any letters that you often have to clarify when calling customer service, example, maybe something in your name?
让我想想，我的名字里确实有。
Let's see, in my name, yeah.
有时候别人会让我拼出来，或者举例说明字母，或者让我说慢一点。
Sometimes people will ask me to spell out, to give examples of the letters or to slow down.
但我觉得我的名字在发音上倒不是特别麻烦。
But I guess my name's not too problematic in terms of-
有意思。
Interesting.
但我在想，M这个字母，有没有人听成N或者M？
But I was wondering if the M would be, if anyone ever hears N or M.
因为我的名字里有M和N。
Because I have an M and an N.
所以我得特别清楚地念出来。
So I have to really enunciate that.
对，有意思。
Yeah, interesting.
对，就是这样。
But yeah.
那你呢，Aubrey？
What about you, Aubrey?
你的名字有什么难搞的地方吗？
Do you have anything tricky?
嗯，我娘家姓是Sievers，拼写是S-I-E-V-E-R-S。
Well, my maiden name was Sievers, spelled S-I-E-V-E-R-S.
每次我要报名字的时候，别人都不太清楚到底怎么拼。
And every time when I would have to give my name, it's not clear really how it's spelled.
有人可能会拼成S-E-A，然后等我说到V的时候，客服或者电话那头的人——
Someone might spell it S-E-A, and then when I would say the V, customer service or anyone on the phone-
V
V
……就会说：“等等，是B、D还是V？”
... would be like, "Wait, B or D or V?"
所以他们就经常会说一个词，或者我也会说一个词。
So then they would often say a word, or I would say a word, too.
然后这挺有意思的，因为我们收到了一个关于这个的好问题，就是用什么词来澄清字母。
And then this is funny because we got a great question about this, about what word do you use to clarify the letter.
所以我联系了一堆人去问，结果发现我爸妈和我兄弟姐妹，我们每个人用来澄清那个V的词都不一样。
And so I reached out to a bunch of people to ask, and I found out that my parents and my siblings, we all use a different word to clarify that V.
有意思。
Interesting.
我一般会说vacuum。
I would always say vacuum.
我会说V，就像vacuum里的V。
I'd say V as in vacuum.
我爸总是说Valentine。
My dad always said Valentine.
他会说V，就像Valentine里的V。
He'd say V as in Valentine.
有意思。
Interesting.
然后一个兄弟说V，像Victor，然后——
And then one brother says V as in Victor, and then-
……我另一个兄弟说V，像Victorious。
... my other brother says V as in Victorious.
Victorious。
Victorious.
太搞笑了。
It's hilarious.
我在想，这是不是就像一种测试，看你脑子里在想什么，看你有多自信。
I wonder if it's like a litmus test for what's on your mind, how confident you're feeling.
也许吧。
Maybe.
你说Victorious。
You say Victorious.
他是在试图展现未来的成功。
He was trying to project future success.
V，代表胜利。
V as in Victorious.
我都能想象客服人员当时心里想的是："好吧。"
I can only imagine the customer service agent being like, "Okay."
好吧。
Okay.
那也行吧，我想。
That works, I guess.
我知道你在说什么。
I know what you're saying.
哇。
Wow.
所以今天我们要聊一个非常独特的话题，你们在其他地方绝对找不到。
So today we have another really unique topic that you're not going to find anywhere else, guys.
这个问题来自Mauro，我觉得Mauro是我们的老听众之一，所以非常感谢——
So this is based on a question from Mauro, and I think Mauro is one of our longtime listeners, so huge-
是的
Yes
……感谢Mauro收听我们的节目。
... thank you to Mauro for listening to the show.
Aubrey，我可以直接念一下这个问题吗？
Shall I go ahead and read the question, Aubrey?
好，来吧。
Yeah, let's do it.
Mauro说：“我有一个问题想问你们。
So Mauro says, "I have a question for you.
我想知道你们在需要向别人拼写复杂内容时，尤其是打电话的时候，会不会用北约音标字母表。”
I wonder if you guys use the NATO phonetic alphabet when you have to spell something complex for someone, especially over the phone."
会。
Yes.
奥布里，北约音标字母是什么？
And what is the NATO phonetic alphabet, Aubrey?
对，这个问题问得真好。
Yeah, this is such a great question.
北约音标字母给从A到Z的每个字母都分配了一个独特且广为人知的代码词。
So the NATO alphabet assigns a distinct, widely understood code word to each letter from A to Z.
好的。
Okay.
它在全球的航空、军事、海上无线电通信中都有使用，所以你很可能听过Alpha、Bravo、Charlie、Delta、Echo、Foxtrot这些。
It's used globally in aviation, military, marine radio operations, so you've probably heard Alpha, Bravo, Charlie, Delta, Echo, Foxtrot.
整个字母表都是这样。
Goes through the whole alphabet.
有些我们不太熟悉，尤其是那些发音和字母本身不太一样的，所以我们平时很少听到。
Some of them we're less familiar with, especially if it doesn't have a letter that sounds the same, so we don't hear it very often.
但这确实让我思考了一下，因为我第一反应是“不会”。我们听说军事专业人员会用它，但是——
But this really got me thinking, because my initial instinct was no. We hear that military professionals use that, but-
……在日常对话中，没人会这么做。
... in daily conversations, no one does.
但我心想：“我得确认一下。”
But I was like, "I'm going to just confirm."
所以我给一群人发了短信。
So I texted a bunch of people.
我做了个非正式的调查，结果让我很意外。
I sort of did some informal surveying, and I was surprised.
并不是每个人都像我这样。
Not everyone does what I do.
你是怎么做的，Lindsay？
What do you do, Lindsay?
你会用北约音标字母表吗？
Do you use the NATO alphabet?
不，我自己编了一套。
No, I make up my own.
我就是当时随便想一个词。
I just kind of try to think of a word in the moment.
我也是，或者有一些固定的词。
Same, or there's sort of some specific go-tos.
我之前真没想过可以直接背下北约音标字母表，然后就有个固定的词。
I didn't really think about the fact that I could just memorize the NATO phonetic alphabet and just have a go-to word.
我也没想过。
Me neither.
所以有时候我会坐在那儿想，努力想另一个词。
So sometimes I'll sit there thinking, trying to think of another word.
这会花掉客服电话很多时间。
It'll take up a lot of time on customer support calls.
这真是太——
This is so-
不太好。
It's not good
……有意思，而且我其实发现，对有些人来说，这挺让他们烦的——
... interesting, and I actually found out that for some people it's their pet peeve-
……就是当有人那样做的时候，当有人——
... when someone does that, when someone's-
大概就是
It's probably
……做我们俩这样的事，就是四处找最近的……以那个字母开头的名词，或者说“A as in apple”那种。
... doing what I do and you do, where we're looking around at the closest- ... noun that starts with that letter maybe, or saying A as in apple.
这其实不省时间，对吧？
It doesn't exactly save time, right?
对，或者如果他们觉得应该总是那样，比如军人或者做过客服的人，觉得每个人都该用北约音标字母表。
Right, or if they're thinking it should always be that maybe a military or someone who worked in a call center who feels like everyone should use the NATO phonetic alphabet.
那他们可能会觉得烦，当——
It might be their pet peeve when-
对，因为那——
Right, because that's-
像我们这样的人不会
... people like us don't
对，因为可能培训的时候，来电的人就是这么用的
... right, because maybe the training came in with callers-
完全同意
Totally
用那个方式。
... using that.
是的。
Yes.
有意思。
Interesting.
但在我们深入今天这个特别的话题之前，Aubrey，我们是不是有个投票要公布？
But before we go any deeper into this unique topic today, Aubrey, do we have a poll to announce?
我们很喜欢分享对听众、对你们的见解
We love to share our insights about our listeners, about you all-
对
Yes
……通过我们的投票。
... through our polls.
我们学到了什么？
What did we learn?
是的，没错，我们最近有一个投票，很多人参与了，我其实特别期待看到这个结果。
Yes, exactly, and we have a recent poll that a lot of people responded to, and I was actually really excited to hear the results for this.
那是第2666期节目。
It was episode 2666.
对。
Yes.
在那期精彩的节目之后，你们欠我们一个人情。
After this amazing episode, you owe us one.
在那期节目里，我们聊到了一个表达，关于叫电梯，然后把电梯送回去。
And in it we talked about this expression about calling the elevator, sending the elevator back down.
天哪。
Oh my gosh.
所以投票的问题是，你到楼层后会把电梯按回去吗？
So the poll was, do you send the elevator back down when you reach your floor?
结果真的很有意思。
And this was really interesting, the results.
结果怎么样，Lindsay？
What were the results, Lindsay?
好的，结果是，会的人占37.9%，不会的人占62.1%。
Okay, the results were yes, we had 37.9%, and no, 62.1%.
有意思。
Interesting.
所以大多数人，我属于不会的那一派——
So most people, I'm with the nos, though-
对，我也是。
Yeah, me too
……
...
我现在想想，觉得我应该这么做。
I feel like I should now that I think about it.
我就觉得，按一下按钮把它送回去，其实挺有道理的。
I'm like, that actually really makes sense to just hit the button and send it back down.
但我一直属于不送的那一派。
But I've always been among the nos.
我知道。
I know.
我挺惊讶有这么多人选择送回去。
I'm impressed there were this many yeses.
确实挺让人惊讶的。
It's very impressive.
这些人可能是文化差异，比如在他们的文化里——
These are people who are, it's possible that it's cultural, like in their culture-
对
Yes
……他们可能会想，"怎么会有人不这么做呢？"
... they might be thinking, "How could you not?"
这真的很有意思。
It's so interesting.
我知道，我得承认，我也是反对的那一方。
I know, I have to admit, I'm a no too.
我根本不会想那个。
I don't think about that.
通常我下电梯后会想，"好，现在该往哪走？"
Usually, I get off the elevator and think, "Okay, where do I go now?"
那是下一步的事。
It's the next step.
没错。
Exactly.
我从来不会想那么远。
I'm never four steps ahead.
我总是一步一步来。
I'm always at the next step.
你懂我的意思吗？
You know what I mean?
所以呢。
So.
这可能跟美国文化中的某种自私有关。
And this may be related to maybe selfishness within American culture.
对。
Yes.
这甚至是我们不常谈论的话题。
This is not something we even talk about.
我后来问过几个美国人——
I've asked a few people since, Americans-
……他们就说：“从来没想过这个问题。”
... and they're like, "Never even thought about it."
对，没有。
No. Nope.
是的，我也是。
Yeah, same here.
对，这就是为什么住在日本让我大开眼界。
Yeah, that's why living in Japan was such an eye-opener for me.
那种程度。
The level.
你去过日本吗，奥布里？
Have you been to Japan, Aubrey?
没去过。
I haven't.
好的。
Okay.
我很想去。
I'd love to go.
那种礼貌和尊重，还有时刻为周围其他人着想的态度，跟美国文化太不一样了。
The level of politeness and respect, and just thinking about all other citizens around us, is so different from American culture.
真的很有意思。
It's fascinating.
甚至到了那种程度——
To the point where when-
而且特别让人敬佩。
And so admirable.
确实特别让人敬佩。
So admirable
作为美国人，我觉得我们感受更深。
... to us as Americans, I feel like we notice it even more.
就是觉得特别了不起。
Like it's impressive.
天哪。
Oh my gosh.
我们更容易注意到这一点，因为我记得有一次坐飞机回来，我坐的是美国航空，从东京待了一年半后回来，当时我很震惊，觉得空姐对我好像很粗鲁，但其实她并不粗鲁。
We notice it more because I remember coming back on a plane, I flew American Airlines back from my year and a half in Tokyo, and I was shocked how rude the airline stewardess seemed to be to me, but she wasn't rude.
相比之下。
In comparison.
她只是美国人而已。
She was just American.
跟我之前在日本的经历相比。
Compared to what I'd experienced in Japan.
你已经不习惯了，然后你会觉得，哇。
You weren't used to it anymore and you're like, "Wow."
真是有意思。
It's fascinating.
所以总之，回来之后，大家记得一定要参与我们的投票。
So anyways, coming back, so guys, be sure to participate in our polls.
我们想更多地了解听众的想法和观点，以及我们作为一个社区是如何生活的。
We want to know more about what our audience believes and thinks and how we live as a community.
是的。
Yes.
当然。
Absolutely.
你可以在Spotify上找到这些投票。
You can find those polls on Spotify.
所以去填一填，看一看吧。
So fill them out, check them out.
我们都会看的。
We read them.
我们对每个人的想法都很感兴趣。
We're really interested in everyone's thoughts.
对。
Yes.
所以，是的，回到Spotify上来。
So yes, come back to Spotify.
我们今天会有一个问题让你回答。
We'll have one today for you to answer.
好的。
Okay.
然后，对。
And yeah.
好。
Good.
让我们开始吧。
And let's dive into this.
这很有意思。
This is interesting.
好的，那我们从哪里开始呢？
Okay, so where do we start here?
我们回到这个话题上来。
Let's come back into it.
所以我们了解到——
So we understand that-
很多人其实不用北约字母表，对吧？
... a lot of people are not using the NATO alphabet, right?
我不用。
I don't.
你们大多数人不知道。
Most of you don't know.
对。
No.
我们不用。
We don't.
普通老百姓一般都不用，对吧？
The average just citizen doesn't, right?
不过军队里确实在用。
But it is used by military personnel.
我们肯定也听过——
We definitely hear it-
在电影和电视剧里。
... in movies, TV shows.
如果是空中交通管制之类的场景，他们就会用这套系统。
If it's air traffic control, something like that, this is what they're going to use.
不过，比我预想的要有更多普通老百姓知道并会使用这个北约音标字母。
But more just average citizens than I expected do know and use this NATO alphabet.
挺有意思的。
Interesting.
就像你刚才说的，如果他们是在呼叫中心工作，作为培训的一部分就会学到。
Like you were saying, as part of training if they're working at a call center.
或者即使不是军人，只要他们从事空中交通管制工作，用的就是这个。
Or even if they're not military, if they work for air traffic control, this is what they would use.
然后他们一辈子都会用这些，
And then they would go through their lives using them-
对
Yes
所以感觉再回去用别的会很不习惯。
... so feel like it would be strange to go back.
想象一下，如果把所有在军队待过的人一辈子打客服电话的时间加起来，他们因为不用想词能省下多少时间。
And imagine the amount of time combined, if you add it all up over the lifetime of these people that have worked in the military during their personal customer service calls, how much time they save by not having to think-
完全同意
Absolutely
想一个词的时间。
... of a word.
说得太对了。
So true.
也许我们也该学学这个。
Maybe we need to learn it.
说到这个，我觉得来个小小的测验会很有趣，Lindsay。
And on that note, I thought it would be fun to have a little quiz, Lindsay.
有几个我其实也不知道。
There are a few that I did not know.
我对这个代码和北约音标字母表感到惊讶，所以我要问你几个，看看你是否知道——
I was surprised by this code and the NATO phonetic alphabet, so I'm going to ask you a few of these and see if you know them-
或者能不能猜出来。
... or can guess them.
那么字母K的代码词是什么？
So what is the code word for the letter K?
有想法吗？
Any idea?
我不知道，但我第一个想到的词是万花筒，但那是个很长的词。
I don't know, but the first word that comes to mind is kaleidoscope, but that's a really long word.
那会很有趣——
That would be really funny-
这些都是瞎猜的。
These are wild guesses
……就好像是——
... to just be like-
这些都是瞎——
These are wild-
……军事专业人员，K就是kaleidoscope里的K。
... military professional, K as in kaleidoscope.
其实是Kilo，你一听就会觉得——
It's Kilo, and once you hear it, you're like-
Kilo。
Kilo
……对，我觉得我在电影里听过这个，对吧？
... okay, I feel like I've heard that on a film, right?
士兵或者谁在说“Kilo Bravo Foxtrot”。
Soldier or someone saying, "Kilo Bravo Foxtrot."
天哪。
Oh my gosh.
Kilo。
Kilo.
那N会是什么呢？
And so what would N be?
我有——
I have-
N让我很意外。
N surprised me.
你有猜到吗？
Do you have a guess?
哦，完全没头绪，Aubrey。
Oh, no idea, Aubrey.
一点都不知道——
No clue-
好的
Okay
……会是什么。
... what it would be.
是什么？
What is it?
十一月。
November.
是十一月。
It was November.
哦，这也太随意了。
Oh, that's so random.
确实很随意。
It is so random.
我还在找规律呢。
I was looking for a pattern.
我当时就想，"根本没有规律。"
I was like, "There's no pattern."
确实没有规律。
There's no pattern.
而且我本以为会更多听到这个，因为M和N发音那么像，我以为我们会更多用这个。
And I would think I'd hear that more because M and N sound so alike that I would think we'd use this one more.
十一月。
November.
然后是R。你对R有什么猜测吗？
And then R. Do you have a guess for R?
那就猜个稀有的吧。
Let's say rare.
我也不知道。
I don't know.
猜得不错。
Good guess.
是Romeo。
It was Romeo.
Romeo。
Romeo.
R就是Romeo。有意思。
Romeo is the one for R. Interesting.
我喜欢这个。
I like that.
所以这些词里有很多元音，至少Romeo这个词是这样。
So lots of vowel sounds in those words, at least in the word Romeo.
元音很重。
Heavily vowels.
而且实际上，目标就是选一个听起来不像其他词的词，这样就不会混淆。
And really, the goal is to have it be a word that doesn't sound like any other word, so then there's no confusion.
你听到那个词就知道是哪个字母了，对吧？
You know the letter when you hear that word, right?
完美。
Perfect.
对。
Yes.
太喜欢了。
Love it.
但有趣的是，大多数普通人，我们其余的大多数人——
But what's interesting is most civilians, most of the rest of us-
普通人
Average people
……会像林赛说的那样做。
... do what Lindsay was saying.
我们要么直接想到一个以那个字母开头的词。
We will either just grab the first word we think of that starts with that letter.
对。
Yes.
然后我们会说，"比如"，对吧？
And then we'll say, "As in," right?
对。
Yes.
我们会说，"S，就像Sam里的S"。
We'll say like, "S as in Sam."
或者，"F，就像Frank里的F"。
Or, "F as in Frank."
所以我们做的是，我把发音相似的字母分组了，这样-
So what we've done, I've pooled the groups of letters that sound the same, so that-
好的
Okay
我们经常需要这样做，而且我们要分享的是，至少美国英语使用者最常用的那些。
... we have to often do this, and we're going to share what At least American English speakers would most often use.
但然后，对于我调查的所有人，我让他们分享了一些特例，那些-
But then, for all the people I surveyed, I had them share some of the outliers, the ones-
好的，不错。
Okay, cool
……他们经常用，但不在这些里面的。
... that they use often that were not among these.
所以我们会分享这些。
So we'll share those.
有意思。
Interesting.
对，没错。
And yeah.
然后，如果你在外面，比如你想说，‘我不想用北约那个，因为感觉太军事化了，但我想用——’
And then so if you out there, if you're like, "I want to use, not NATO, because that feels too military, but I want to use-"
……普通母语者会用的那些词，’现在你就知道了。
... the words that the average native speaker would use," now you'll know them.
我喜欢这个。
I love it.
而且有时候，说实话，我觉得每次都能想出新的东西来。
And then sometimes, I feel like honestly I come up with something new every time.
我确实发现自己经常用S，就是Sam的那个S，因为Sam这个名字太常见了。
I do feel like I find myself using S as in Sam, because Sam is such a common name.
对。
Yes.
感觉既有点现代，又有点老派。
Just feels kind of modern, but also kind of old-fashioned at the same time.
很经典，对吧？
It's classic, right?
但有些词，我同意你的看法。
But for some of them, I agree.
我们会直接想到什么就说什么。
We'll come up with the first word we think of.
所以这就是在浪费我们生命中的时间。
So wasting time here in our lives.
好的。
All right.
那么最常见的，再说一遍，S和F的第一名，我们用的是什么？
So most common, again, number one, for S and F. What do we use?
再告诉我们一次。
Tell us again.
就是S，像Sam里的S。
So S as in Sam.
这个就是那种我问的每个人都在用的。
And that's one of those where everyone I asked, that's what they use.
没有人用别的奇怪的——
Nobody had a random other-
那挺有意思的。
That's interesting
……以S开头的词，所以就这样。
... word that starts with S, so.
可能是因为S这个字母没那么特别，或者说用S as in Sam就是感觉很自然。
Maybe because S is not as, or it just feels right to say S as in Sam.
感觉自然。
Feels right.
为什么——
Why is-
我相信肯定有人会说出另一个以S开头的词。
I'm sure there are people out there who will throw out another word that starts with S.
对，比如stiletto什么的。
Yeah, stiletto or something.
大多数人都会说S as in Sam。
Most of us, S as in Sam.
好的。
All right.
F as in Frank，对吧？
F as in Frank, right?
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所以S和F这两个音，通常很难听清楚，对吧？
So S and F are commonly, they're hard to hear, right?
这些字母在电话里确实很难分辨。
These words are hard to hear.
对，它们听起来差不多。
Yeah, they sound the same.
所以如果你的名字里有S或F，
So you often, if there's an S or an F in your name-
尤其是在打电话的时候，你可能得说：“这个S，就是Sam里的S。”
... and you're on the phone especially, you might need to say, "This S as in Sam."
还有，有几个人说他们会说Fox。
And also, a couple of people said they say Fox.
好的。
Okay.
F，就是Fox里的F。
F as in Fox.
好的。
Okay.
好的。
Okay.
然后还有M和N。我的姓氏里正好这两个字母都有。
And then M and N. Again, in my last name, I have both of these letters.
人们会说M像Mary里的M，N像Nancy里的N。
People say M as in Mary and N as in Nancy.
但你知道吗，让我觉得有意思的是，到目前为止这些名字，Sam可能还算现代，但Frank、Mary、Nancy这些听起来都比较老派。
But you know what strikes me is that all these names so far, Sam's could be modern, but Frank, Mary, Nancy, these are all older names.
这些名字有点像婴儿潮一代的名字。
These are baby boomer names, in a way.
你不觉得吗？
Don't you think?
嗯，这也说得通，因为这些名字已经用了很长时间了。
Well, and it makes sense because these have been being used for a long time.
这些词可能就是我爷爷奶奶那辈人用的。
These are probably the same words that my grandparents used.
而且这往往是第一个想到的词，因为我们听爷爷奶奶说过，也许他们在拼写单词、确认字母时就是这么说的。
And that's often the first word that comes to mind because that's what we've heard our grandparents say maybe if they had to spell a word and clarify what the letter was.
对，没错。
Yeah, exactly.
所以问题就变成了，等我们老了，会不会用千禧一代的名字？
So, the question then becomes, is there going to be a point where when we're older, we're using millennial names?
我们不会用——
We're not using-
哦，这倒是个好问题。
Oh, that's a good point.
我在想
I wonder
……这些会不会就固定下来了？
... the, are these going to get locked in?
这些会变吗？
Are these going to change?
可能会吧。
Probably.
是啊，谁知道呢？
Yeah, who knows?
我也问过我的女儿们，她们比较年轻，十几岁，但她们用的也是这些词。
And I asked my daughters, too, who are, they're younger, they're in their teens, but these are the same words.
她们要么就像我们刚才说的那样，随便看一眼，然后找到她们看到的第一个东西。
They either will do what we were saying, where they'll just look and find the first thing that they see.
所以她们会说，"P，像Pillow里的P。"
So they're saying, "P as in Pillow."
N，像Necklace里的N。
N as in Necklace.
这也太没效率了。
It's so inefficient.
或者他们也会说很多这些词，因为他们在电影里听过，或者他们听过这些，听起来很熟悉。
Or they'll say a lot of these, too, because they've heard these in movies, or they've heard these, they sound familiar.
所以我们得再过20年再来看看到时候我们用什么。
So we'll have to check in again in 20 years and see what we're-
我很好奇它会不会变。
I'd be curious if it changed
……到第10000期的时候，我们会告诉你们我们用什么。
... for episode 10,000, we'll see, we'll let you know what we're using.
好的。
All right.
那么下一个是B、D、P和T。这些字母之间的区别很难理解吗？还是说它们之间有配对？
So next one is B, D, P, and T. Is it hard to understand the difference between all of these letters or are there pairs here?
是的，这四个，尤其是在电话里——
Yes, these four, on the phone especially-
……听起来都一样。
... all sound the same.
所以如果你遇到这些字母，可能会有人问：“等等，是B还是P？”
So if you have any of these letters, you might end up having someone say, "Wait, B or P?"
他们可能会说——
And they might say-
对
Yes
比如，最常见的说法是“B as in Boy”。
... for example, B as in Boy is the most common.
这个很常见。
That's common.
但有人告诉我他们说的是“B as in Banana”。
But someone told me they say B as in Banana.
那也行。
That works, too.
这里都是基础词，对吧？
Basic words here, right?
对。
Yes.
D就是Dog的D。
D as in Dog.
Dog是个非常基础的词。
Dog is a very basic word.
有时候还是孩子学英语的第一个词呢。
Sometimes it's the child's first word in English.
对。
Yes.
是的。
Yep.
然后P就是Peter的P。
And then P as in Peter.
这又是一个婴儿潮一代的名字，对吧？
People might, again, another boomer name, right?
这个名字比较老派。
This is an older name.
对，确实是这样。
Yeah, that's true.
T，就像Tom里的T。
T as in Tom.
T也是。
And T as well.
这也算是X世代或者婴儿潮一代的名字。
Also kind of a Gen X, boomer name.
T，就像Tom里的T。
T as in Tom.
有意思。
Interesting.
有意思。
Interesting.
有意思。
Interesting.
但话说回来，我们很多人就是随便扫一眼，然后说出第一个想到的词。
But again, a lot of us will just kind of glance around and say the first thing or just think of the first thing we say.
所以这些并不是每个人都会说的，但根据网上查的，还有我发短信问了一堆人“你用什么词？”，这些是最常见的。
So these aren't, certainly not what everyone says, but these are the most common, from looking online and then also texting a bunch of people and like, "What word do you use?"
有意思。
Interesting.
所以你们可以在今天节目最后选择，要不要用这些，这些是简单的。
So you guys can choose at the end of today's episode, do you want to take these, these are the easy ones.
你是想用北约字母表，还是每次打客服电话时自己发挥创意？
Do you want to take the NATO alphabet, or do you want to come up with your own and be creative each time you call customer support?
没错，对吧？
Exactly, right?
我其实特别好奇。
I'm actually really curious.
我真的很想跟客服的人聊聊。
I'd love to talk to some people in customer support.
如果这算是一种情况，也许他们之间会互相抱怨，比如“当有人花很长时间想一个词来解释时，是不是很烦？”
If this is a sort, maybe they're talking with each other like, "Isn't it annoying when-" "... someone takes forever to think of a word to clarify."
这太离谱了。
It's so ridiculous.
挺搞笑的。
It's funny.
那接下来呢？下一组是什么？
And then we have, what are the next, what's the next set?
对，下一组字母是A、H、J和K，这些发音听起来都差不多。
Yeah, the next set of letters are A, H, J, and K, which can all sound the same.
最常见的说法是“A as in Apple”，但也有几个人说他们会说“A as in Alligator”。
So most common is A as in Apple, but a couple people said they say A as in Alligator.
这个说法挺有意思的。
That's a fun one.
H，比如Hotel里的H，或者Harry里的H，或者Henry里的H。
H as in Hotel, or as in Harry, or as in Henry.
这些名字都挺老派的，不过我觉得Harry现在又流行起来了，Henry也是。
Again, kind of older names, though the name Harry's coming back in style now, I think, and Henry, too.
对，确实是这样。
Yes, that's true.
而且有很多人回复说，他们几乎总是用名字来区分，因为这样更容易让人听清楚说的是哪个字母。
And I have, a lot of people responded that they'll almost always use a name because they think it's easier to tell what word they're saying.
他们知道这样不会和其他词混淆。
And they know it won't sound like anything else.
所以挺有意思的，很多人说，如果他们要澄清……
So that's interesting, that a lot of people will say, if they have to clarify-
……说的是哪个字母，他们会说“字母，比如……”，
... what letter they're saying, they'll say the letter as in-
……然后选一个非常常见的名字。
... and then pick a very common name.
有意思。
Interesting.
然后人们可能会说J，比如John里的J，K，比如Kate里的K。
And then people might say J as in John, K as in Kate.
或者K，比如Kangaroo里的K，Kite里的K，就是我们放上天的那个东西，对吧？
Or K as in Kangaroo, K as in Kite, the thing we fly in the air, right?
没错，是的。
Exactly, yeah.
嘿，大家好。
Hey, guys.
我是Aubrey。
It's Aubrey.
你有没有在开会时，明明有个好点子，却保持沉默，不是因为不知道答案，而是因为不确定该怎么表达？
Have you ever sat in a meeting, had a great point, and stayed quiet, not because you didn't know the answer, because you weren't sure how to say it?
这正是商务英语课程要解决的问题。
That's exactly what the Business English Course is for.
你会学到闲聊、开会、写邮件和做演示时用到的语言。
You'll learn the language for small talk, meetings, emails, and presentations.
然后你每周在我们的开放对话俱乐部里，和真人一起练习流利度。
Then you practice your fluency, live, with real people every week in our open Conversation Club.
有了个人教练，你还能参加每周的直播问答，并且我会直接给你的作业提供反馈。
With Personal Coach, you also get our Live Weekly Q&A and my direct feedback on your assignments.
这周你可以省下高达100美元，而且我们还有30天退款保证。
This week, you can save up to $100, plus we have a 30-day money back guarantee.
这个优惠到纽约时间周日午夜截止。
The offer ends Sunday at midnight, New York time.
访问 allersenglish.com/business。
Go to allersenglish.com/business.
就是 allersenglish.com/business。
That's allersenglish.com/business.
好的，Aubrey，我们回来再聊几组。
Okay, Aubrey, we're back for a couple of more pairs here.
下一对容易混淆的发音是什么？
What's the next pair that can be confusing?
好的。
Yes.
接下来是 I 和 Y，它们的发音……
Next is I and Y, which sound-
……很像。
... a lot alike.
I 像 ice 里的 I 是最常见的，但我实际上说的是 igloo 里的 I。
I as in ice was the most common, but I actually say I as in igloo.
好的。
Okay.
还有几个人说他们也这么说。
And a couple other people said they say that as well.
有意思。
Interesting.
有意思。
Funny.
然后是Y，像yellow里的Y，对吧？
And then Y as in yellow, right?
人们会说黄色的那个Y。
People say the color yellow.
最后一对是C和Z。对，如果你听自己说这两个，它们听起来确实很像。
The last pair is C and Z. Yeah, if you hear yourself saying those, they do sound similar, those two sounds.
C，Z。
C, Z.
特别是拼写的时候，你通常说得很快。
Especially when you're spelling something, you usually say it really quickly.
是的。
Yes.
你会说C-H-A-R，然后就想，等等，是C还是Z？
You're like C-H-A-R and then it's like, wait, C or Z?
对。
Yes.
所以我们说C，就像cat里的C。
So we say C as in cat.
再说一遍，这里用的都是很简单的词，对吧？
Again, very simple words here, right?
对。
Yes.
还有Z，就像zebra里的Z。
And Z as in zebra.
对，这些其实是我随便问了一些人得来的。
And yeah, so these are just from my kind of casual polling.
这太有意思了。
This is so interesting.
我真想跟每个人聊聊，看看他们怎么说——
I want to be able to talk to everyone and find out-
我知道。
I know
……你们用什么词？
... what words do you use?
你们是不是跟我们一样，直接就说出来——
Are you the same as us, where you just cast out-
我知道。
I know
……就是想到的第一个词。
... for the first word you think of.
所以我已经等不及要告诉听众我们的投票问题了。
So I can't wait to let our listeners know about our poll question.
这个马上就来，各位。
That's coming up soon, guys.
不过首先，让我们进入一个标志性的角色扮演环节。
But first, let's get into a signature role play.
那我们来模拟一个客服电话吧，奥布里，怎么样？
So let's have a customer service call, shall we, Aubrey?
你打电话给一家公司，是关于你的账户问题——
You call a company, you're about your account-
……而我呢，就是接电话的客服代表。
... and I am the customer service representative that answers.
好，那咱们开始吧。
All right, let's do it.
那电话铃响了，对吧？
So ring, ring, right?
对。
Yes.
能告诉我你的用户名吗？
Can you tell me your username?
当然可以。
Sure.
是F-A-4-8-2。
It's F-A-4-8-2.
好的。
Okay.
让我查一下。
Let me pull that up.
你说的是S-A-4-8-2吗？
Did you say S-A-4-8-2?
不是，是F，Frank的F。
No, F as in Frank.
哦，好的，谢谢。
Oh, okay, thanks.
明白了。
Got it.
我找到你的账户了。
I found your account.
让我确认一下你的邮箱地址。
Let me just verify your email address.
是bdsanders@gmail.com。
It's bdsanders@gmail.com.
B是boy的B，D是dog的D。
B as in boy, D as in dog.
好的。
Perfect.
我现在已经调出你的账户了。
I have your account pulled up now.
太好了。
Nice.
哇，这次比平时快多了，也高效多了。
Wow, that was a lot faster and more efficient than normally.
通常不会这么顺利，对吧？
This usually doesn't go that well, right?
你花的时间更长——
Takes you longer-
有时候确实会有点难搞。
Sometimes it's going to be challenging
……因为B是butter的B。
... because B as in butter.
D是——
D as in-
让我想想——
Let me think-
……donkey的D。
... donkey
……我昨晚吃了什么来着？
... what did I have for dinner last night?
哎呀，天哪。
Oh, gosh.
D，就像甜甜圈的D。
D as in donuts.
我现在特别想吃什么呢？
What food am I craving?
那我们从头过一遍。
So let's go through it.
然后你说：“好。
So, you said, "Okay.
让我查一下。
Let me pull that up.
你说的是S-A-4-8-2吗？”
Did you say S-A-4-8-2?"
然后我说了什么？
And I said?
然后你说：“不对，是F，就像Frank里的F。”
And then you said, "No, F as in Frank."
有些人就会直接说“不，F”，他们想说得更清楚一些。
Some people will just say, "No, F," and they're trying to say it more clearly.
对。
Yes.
我觉得这绝对是礼貌的做法，而且说“F，比如”加上一个以那个字母开头的单词，这样更快。
This is definitely, I think, the polite thing to do and faster to say, "F as in," and then a word that definitely starts with that letter.
嗯，而且这样做也更安全，对吧？
Well, and the safer thing to do, too, right?
因为接下来会发生什么——
Because what will happen-
是的，因为他们还是可能听错你。
Yeah, because they still might mishear you
……他们可能听错你，然后发邮件发错账户，你又得等客服，不知道要等多久，对吧？
... they could mishear you, and then they could send an email to the wrong account, and then you have to wait on hold again for who knows how long, right?
所以——
So-
没错。
Exactly.
这有时候风险挺高的，对吧？
This is sometimes high stakes, right?
风险确实高。
High stakes.
我之前和我女儿为了她学校的事，等了一个小时的电话。
I was on hold with my daughter for an hour-
哦，是吗
Oh, yeah
和她大学那边——
... with her college to-
哦，这样啊
Oh, okay
——办点事，结果好像就是因为类似的情况，他们弄错了邮箱地址什么的，我们最后还得再打一次电话。
... get something done, and then because I think it was something like that, they had got the wrong email address or something, we ended up having to call again.
天哪。
Oh, my gosh.
所以，是的。
So, yeah.
确实。
For sure.
把事情说清楚绝对对你有好处。
It's definitely to your benefit to be clear.
哦，太对了，尤其是现在。
Oh, it's so true, and especially now.
我上周跟科罗拉多州那边打电话，等了好久，因为——
I was on the phone last week with the state of Colorado, and it takes a long time on hold because-
哦，对
Oh, yeah
——各州人手不足，对吧？
... states are short of staff, right?
所以现在时间成本很高，大家得注意了。
So the stakes are very high now in terms of your time.
你们一定要试试这个。
You will want to do this, guys.
好，接下来是什么？
Okay, what's the next piece?
然后你给了你的邮箱地址。
So then you gave your email address.
你说的是bdsanders@gmail.com。
You said it's bdsanders@gmail.com.
这很有意思，因为当你的名字或邮箱地址里有些字母容易混淆时，你显然已经准备好了，甚至不用别人问就会说——
And this is interesting because when you have a name or an email address where you know some of the letters could be confused, you're clearly ready without even being asked to say-
紧接着就说，“B as in boy, D as in dog。”
... right after, "B as in boy, D as in dog."
有些人甚至可能会在开头就说这个。
Some people might even say that at the beginning.
他们可能会说——
They might say it's-
对
Yes
——“B as in boy, D as in dog”——
... "B as in boy, D as in dog"-
——“sanders@gmail.com。”
... "sanders@gmail.com."
奥布里，这确实是个好主意。
That's actually a good point, Aubrey.
这可以作为一个推荐的策略。
This could be a recommended strategy.
你直接开始给出字母，随便你想给哪些字母。
You just start by giving them the letters, whatever letters you want.
但甚至不用把邮箱地址拼出来。
But don't even spell out the email address.
就直接开始拼写，用那个……
Just start to spell it out with the-
直接说出来。
Say it right away.
我跟我娘家姓Sievers就是这么做的，因为……
That's what I started doing with my maiden name, Sievers, because-
……几乎每次他们都不确定是V还是B还是D。
... almost always they weren't sure if it was a V or a B or a D.
所以我每次都说S-I-E，V as in vacuum，E-R-S。
So I would say S-I-E, V as in vacuum, E-R-S every time.
我喜欢这个。
I love that.
真聪明。
So smart.
好了，Aubrey，今天我们给听众的投票是什么？
All right, Aubrey, what is our poll for our listeners today?
他们大概能猜到。
They can probably guess.
是啊。
I know.
我们很好奇，你们平时会用北约音标字母表吗？
We're curious, do you use the NATO phonetic alphabet?
所以我们想知道。
So we want to know.
我猜如果不用的话，你们要么有一些常用的替代词，要么就像我和林赛一样，随便抓一个最先想到的词。
My assumption is if not, you either have these kind of go-to words that are common, or you might be like Lindsay and I and cast about- ... for the first thing you think of.
天哪。
Oh, my gosh.
太有意思了。
So funny.
所以告诉我们吧。
So let us know.
这就是那个投票。
That's the poll.
这期节目一上线，投票就会立刻开放。
It'll be live right now as this episode comes out.
对。
Yes.
所以去Spotify上听节目，参与投票，选是或否就行，我们之后会在节目里公布结果。
So go on over, make sure you're listening in Spotify to answer the poll, and just select yes or no, and we will announce the results on the show later.
好吗？
All right?
好。
Yes.
太棒了。
Awesome.
不错。
Good.
我特别想知道结果，所以大家一定要去填一下。
Dying for those results, so definitely go fill it out.
另外，我们也想确保你没有错过最近的一集节目。
And we also want to make sure that you didn't miss a recent episode.
第2710期是《你应该告诉别人他们像美酒一样越老越有味道吗？》。
2710 was, Should You Tell Someone They're Aging Like a Fine Wine?
对。
Yes.
所以一定要去看看那一期，学学关于变老的礼貌说法和词汇。
So definitely go check that one out for vocabulary, the polite way to talk about getting older.
是的，我很喜欢。
Yes, love it.
所以，今天要记住的一点是，客户服务也是一种连接。
So, for a takeaway today, customer service is also connection.
你当然有目标，但首要目标应该是友善，对吧？
You have a goal, of course, and the first goal should be kindness, right?
让我们建立联系，保持友善，因为做客服真的不容易，对吧？
Let's connect, let's be kind, because being a customer service agent cannot be easy, right?
是的。
Yes.
这样我们就能确保自己不会感到沮丧。
And this is a way we can make sure we don't get frustrated.
也许我们应该从一开始就把事情说清楚。
Maybe we want to go and spell things out from the beginning.
对。
Yes.
把这些话说清楚，这样就不会出错，好吗？
Give these words so we don't have mistakes, okay?
完全同意。
Absolutely.
省得自己浪费时间，还头疼。
Save yourself time and a headache.
一开始就要把话说清楚。
Make sure you get it clear in the first place.
但我也很喜欢你这一点，Lindsay，就是先以……
But I love that, Lindsay, too, to lead with-
……善意出发。
... kindness.
对。
Yes.
我做过客服代表，那工作确实让人很沮丧。
I have been a customer service representative, and it is a frustrating job.
有时候客户脾气不好，态度也不好，这时候如果有人愿意友善、体贴地对待你，感觉真的完全不一样。
Sometimes people are grumpy and unkind, and it makes such a difference when someone's trying to be kind and thoughtful.
确实如此。
It's so true.
而且在接电话之前，我们可以选择自己在这通电话里要表现出什么样的态度。
And before we get on the phone, we can choose how we want to be in that call.
对。
Yes.
说得真好。
Love it.
就算我们已经在电话里等了一个小时——
Even if we've been waiting on hold for an hour-
即便如此，
Even so
我们还是可以保持友善。
... we can still be kind.
这不是他们的错。
It's not their fault.
对，确实不是他们的错。
Even so, it's not their fault, for sure.
好了，各位，聊得真不错。
All right, good stuff, guys.
如果你喜欢All Ears English，就点一下关注按钮吧，我们很快再见，Aubrey。
Hit the follow button if you love All Ears English, and we'll see you soon, Aubrey.
祝你今天愉快。
Have a good day.
太棒了。
Awesome.
下次见。
See you next time.
好的。
Okay.
再见。
Bye.
感谢收听All Ears English。
Thanks for listening to All Ears English.
你想知道你的英语水平吗？
Would you like to know your English level?
来做我们两分钟的测试吧。
Take our two-minute quiz.
访问 allearsenglish.com/fluencyscore。
Go to allearsenglish.com/fluencyscore.
如果你相信连接而非完美，那就现在订阅，确保不错过任何内容。
And if you believe in connection not perfection, then hit subscribe now to make sure you don't miss anything.
下次见。
See you next time.
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