超然兔洞

让我们先讲一个小故事。

Let's start this off with a little bit of a story.

好吗？

Okay?

这并不是一个好故事，但对这一集来说是必要的。

It's not a good story, but it's a necessary story for this episode.

大约一个月前，或者一个多一点前，我正在为一期关于现代有毒约会建议的播客做研究。

So about a month ago, maybe a little over a month ago, I was doing research for a podcast episode about modern toxic dating advice.

这个主题是收集现代有毒约会建议，然后在这档播客里分享我的看法——就是你现在正在听的Emma Chamberlain的播客。

The concept was I gather modern toxic dating advice and then give my thoughts on it here on this very podcast, anything goes with Emma Chamberlain, the podcast that you're listening to right now.

于是我上网进行了一次深度搜索。

So I was on the Internet doing a deep dive.

我阅读了关于现代约会建议的文章。

I was reading articles about modern dating advice.

我还去了TikTok，查找约会建议。

I was going on TikTok, looking up dating advice.

最重要的是，为了这个故事，我当时在YouTube上搜索现代恋爱建议。

And most importantly, for the sake of this story, I was on YouTube looking up modern dating advice.

在我的搜索中，反复出现的一个关键词是‘抽离’。

And a buzzword that kept coming up in my search was detachment.

起初，我有点忽略它，因为我觉得这明显是有毒的。

And at first, I kind of ignored it because I was like, that's, like, obviously gonna be toxic.

你知道的？

You know?

我会回头再看这个，因为它一出现我就觉得它有毒。

Like, I'll go back to that later because that immediately to me sounds toxic.

所以，在我的研究过程中，或者不管怎样，我就直接把它放一边了。

So I guess in my research or whatever, I just kinda wrote it off.

我当时想，哦，我先把这个记下来，稍后再看。

I was like, oh, I I'll put a pin in that for now.

我正在努力找一些可能没那么明显的建议。

I'm trying to find stuff that is maybe less obvious.

你明白我的意思吗？

Do you know what I mean?

因为根据我对‘疏离’这个词的理解，所谓在爱情中保持疏离，从一开始我就觉得这主意很糟。

Because based on my understanding of the word detached, detachment, the concept of being detached in love, to me, out the gate sounded like a bad idea.

听起来很有毒。

Sounded toxic.

明白吗？

Okay?

仅仅基于我对这个词的模糊理解。

Just based on my vague knowledge of what that word means.

所以我先放一放，继续我的研究，找到了一堆现代的有毒恋爱建议，然后最终我又回到了‘疏离’这个话题上。

So I put a pin in it, continued my research, found a bunch of modern toxic dating advice, and then I eventually went back to detachment.

我想，最后但同样重要的是，这到底是什么意思？

I was like, last last but not least, what is this all about?

我点开了第一个关于疏离与爱情的视频，听到的内容让我大吃一惊。

And I clicked the first video I found about detachment and love, and I was shocked at what I heard.

我当时想，等等。

I was like, wait a minute.

这根本一点都不有毒。

This is not toxic at all.

就是这样。

That's it.

这真的完全不有毒。

It's just not toxic at all.

于是我心想，哦，好吧。

And so I was like, oh, okay.

我想我不该把这条列入有毒的约会建议了。

I guess I'm not adding that to my list of toxic dating advice.

然后我就放下了。

And then I let it go.

明白吗？

Okay?

接下来的一周，我的算法几乎只给我推送关于抽离与爱的视频。

And then my algorithm decided to almost exclusively feed me videos about detachment and love for the following week.

最终，我陷入了其中。

And eventually, I fell into it.

我渐渐深入了抽离这个话题，尤其是在爱情的语境下。

And I kinda went down the detachment rabbit hole, specifically within the context of love.

但就我个人而言，它的影响超出了这个范围。

But I I would say on a personal level, it extended beyond that for me.

是的，很多相关内容都围绕着约会、浪漫和关系展开。

Like, yes, a lot of the content around it was about dating, romance, relationships.

但作为这一理念的内容消费者，我看待它的视角更加宽广。

But I would say as a consumer of content around this concept, I've sort of looked at it with an even broader lens.

但不知为何，我被推送了大量关于抽离与爱的内容。

But for whatever reason, I've been fed a lot of content about detachment and love.

说实话，这个理念及其传达的信息对我帮助极大。

And I'll be honest, the concept of it, the message around it has actually been incredibly helpful for me.

所以今天我们要深入探讨这个话题。

And so that's what we're going to be digging into today.

我先短暂打断一下本期节目，告诉大家本集《Anything Goes》由hotels.com赞助。

I briefly interrupt this episode to let you know that this episode of Anything Goes is presented by hotels.com.

Save Your Way是hotels.com推出的新功能，顾名思义，非常简单。

Save your way is a new feature on hotels.com, and it's as simple as it sounds.

作为hotels.com会员，当你预订旅行时，你可以自行决定如何使用你的节省金额。

When you book a trip as a hotels.com member, you decide how to use your savings.

是现在享受即时优惠，还是将节省的金额累积为未来奖励，由你决定。

Take the instant savings now or bank the savings as rewards for later.

仅在hotels.com，由你做主。

It's your call, only at hotels.com.

Save Your Way功能目前适用于美国和英国的hotels.com会员，仅限会员价酒店。

Save Your Way is available to loyalty members in The US and UK on hotels with member prices.

其他条款适用。

Other terms apply.

详情请见。

Seesight for details.

现在回到节目。

Now back to the episode.

首先，我应该解释一下，为什么我最初如此怀疑这个概念，为什么我如此苛刻地评判它。

To start, I should explain why I initially doubted this concept so hard, why I I judged it so hard.

事实上，疏离的定义是保持客观或冷漠的状态。

Well, the technical definition of detachment is the state of being objective or aloof.

冷漠意味着不友好、不坦率、冷淡且疏远。

Aloof meaning not friendly or forthcoming, cool, and distant.

但这与我热爱浪漫恋爱的哲学相悖。

Now that goes against my love romance dating philosophy.

我主张坦诚表达情感，真心相待。

I'm all about wearing your heart on your sleeve, to be honest.

我完全认同这一点。

I'm all about that.

尽管这对我说来很难，但我认为，如果我们都能坦诚表达内心，约会和恋爱会容易得多。

Because even though that's something that's challenging for me, I think dating and romance would be so much easier if we all just wore our heart on our sleeve.

我的意思是，这儿的显而易见者就是我。

I mean, captain obvious over here, me.

但你不这么认为吗？

But don't you think?

如果我们都能完全坦诚，随时把一切摊开来说，那会有多大的帮助呢？

Like, if we all just were completely honest, put it all out on the table at any given moment, how helpful would that be?

会有极大的帮助。

Immensely helpful.

在爱情和恋爱中，我们有多少次在字里行间揣测，绞尽脑汁想弄清对方在想什么？

How often in love and romance do we read between the lines, drive ourself nuts trying to figure out what the other person is thinking?

我们约会的对象，又有多少次因为猜不透我们在想什么而折磨自己？

How often do people that we date drive themselves up a wall trying to figure out what we're thinking?

如果我们都能坦诚表达内心，那该有多轻松啊。

What a relief it would be if we all just wore our heart on our sleeve.

我不喜欢在爱情中保持冷漠，尤其是在长期承诺的关系中。

I don't like the idea of being aloof in love, especially in a long term committed relationship.

绝对不喜欢。

Absolutely not.

冷淡疏远听起来像一段糟糕的关系。

Being cool and distant sounds like a shitty relationship.

感觉太糟糕了。

Sounds like a terrible vibe.

我在一段关系中，想要的是依偎的氛围。

I'm in a relationship, I wanna be cuddled vibes.

我想感受到被夸奖的氛围。

I wanna be complimented vibes.

我想要一点点‘舔狗’的氛围，但不是那种彻底的舔狗，比如我们总得聊点别的，不能只谈你觉得我有多棒。

I want a little bit of simp vibes, not like full on simp vibes where it's like, oh, we need to talk about something other than how awesome you think I am.

你懂的？

You know?

我的意思是，那种事其实从来没发生在我身上。

Like, that not that that's, yeah, really ever happened to me.

我从来没被人这么宠过，这其实是好事。

I've never been simped on that hard, which is a good thing.

我觉得这样挺好。

That's fine with me.

但在一段长期的恋爱关系中，如果你愿意这么说的话，我不喜欢那种客观或疏离的态度。

But in a long term relationship, in in in love, if you will, I don't love the idea of being objective or aloof.

关键是，你真的对某个人充满热情，可能还打算和对方共度一生。

Like, the whole point is that you're really stoked on someone, and you might potentially wanna build a life together.

这在各个方面都相当严肃。

That's pretty serious in every capacity.

所以对我来说，这似乎有点违背常理，或者根据‘超然’这个概念本身来看，我觉得有点不合逻辑。

So it seems to me kinda counterintuitive, or it seemed to me kind of counterintuitive based on the definition of detachment as its own sort of thing.

在我听来，这就像不在乎、冷漠的样子。

It sounded to me like not caring, being stoic.

坚忍意味着在面对痛苦或困难时，不抱怨、不流露情感或显示软弱。

Being stoic means to endure pain or hardship without complaining, showing emotion, or displaying weakness.

再说一遍，所有这些在我看来在爱情中都完全不合常理。

Like, again, all of this to me feels completely counterintuitive in love.

在我看来，根据我的经验，爱情应该是这样的，或者甚至不一定是爱情。

Love should be, in my opinion, in my experience, what I crave in it is or not even love.

我得小心使用‘爱情’这个词，因为我觉得我应该用‘浪漫’和‘约会’这样的词，但我还是用了‘爱情’，因为它就是自然而然地冒出来了。

I need to be careful with the word love because, like, I should stick to the words romance and dating, but I'm throwing love in there because it just kinda comes out.

但爱情很复杂，因为爱一个人意味着以某种特定的方式关心他们的福祉和幸福。

But love is tricky because, like, loving somebody means to care about their well-being and their happiness in a very particular way.

我不知道。

I don't know.

爱情其实挺复杂的。

Like, love is kinda complicated.

我觉得很多时候，我们约会某个人，以为自己爱他们，但其实并没有。

And I think a lot of times we date people, and we think that we love them, but we actually don't.

所以这是一件非常复杂的事情。

So it's a very tricky thing.

比如，你可以和某人约会却并不爱他们，但你们仍然在约会。

Like, you can be dating somebody and not love them, and yet you're still dating.

好的。

Okay.

我的大脑现在快要从耳朵里融化出来了。

Now my brain is starting to melt out of my ears.

我们得收一收。

We need to reel it in.

收一收。

Reel it in.

回到正题，我之前说的是，约会和浪漫的全部意义就在于它是脆弱的。

Getting back on track, what I was saying was the whole point of dating and romance is that it's vulnerable.

这是浪漫的，因此才叫浪漫。

It's romantic, hence the word romance.

这非常有力量。

It's deeply powerful.

你会以一种深刻而深远的方式感受到它。

You feel it in a really deep, profound way.

这很令人兴奋。

It's exciting.

有点像吸毒一样。

It's kind of drug like.

所有这些正是让它如此出色的原因。

Like, all of this is what makes it so awesome.

你知道的。

You know?

因此，对我来说，面对这些通常如此富有情感、深刻而强大的东西时，

And so to me, the idea of approaching all of this stuff that's normally so emotive, if you will, so profound, so powerful, whatever.

若以冷漠或超然的态度去对待，我觉得未免有些遗憾。

To, like, approach it with a stoicism or detachment seems kind of unfortunate to me.

你知道的。

You know?

就像，根本不在乎。

Like, to just not care.

关键是，你其实是在乎的。

It's like, but the whole point is that you care.

你追求这个人，正是因为你在乎他们，这种在乎可能比你对大多数人的情感要更深刻。

The whole point the reason why you're pursuing this person is because you care about them in a different, perhaps deeper way than you normally feel about most people.

所以我觉得这说不通。

So it didn't make sense to me.

但当我点开那个关于疏离与爱的YouTube视频时，我才意识到，这有点不一样。

But then upon clicking on the YouTube video about detachment and love, I was like, oh, it's a little different.

听好了。

Listen.

我不会摆出一副权威的姿态，因为我们都知道，艾玛根本不知道自己在说什么。

I'm not gonna take a place of authority here because we all know Emma doesn't know what the fuck she's talking about.

我只是个生活的学习者，和你们大家一样。

I'm just I'm a student of life just like the rest of y'all.

明白吗？

Okay?

我不清楚发生了什么。

I don't know what's going on.

顺便说一下，你可能也不知道，但在我看来，‘超然’这个术语的技术定义，在当今关于恋爱的讨论中被误用了。

And by the way, you probably don't either, but it does kinda seem to me that the technical definition of detachment is, like, not be it's not being used properly in these conversations about dating today.

比如，网上那些谈论在爱情中保持超然的人，这个词正被赋予新的含义。

Like, people who are on the Internet talking about being detached in love, it's taking on a new life.

在爱情和浪漫的语境下，它的含义更加微妙。

It's a bit more nuanced in a love capacity, in a romance capacity.

这有点让人困惑。

And that's a bit confusing.

你懂我的意思吗？

You know what I mean?

因为我觉得浪漫中的‘超然’定义和‘超然’的实际定义并不相同。

Because I don't feel like the definition of detachment in romance is the same as the actual definition of detachment.

似乎每个人在谈论这种语境时都在使用不同的定义，这让人困惑。

Seems like everybody's using a different sort of definition when it's in that context, which is confusing.

所以，一开始我有点怀疑整个说法，这也很正常。

So it makes sense that, you know, I kinda doubted this whole thing in the beginning.

但看了些视频后，我惊讶地发现人们是如何使用这个词的。

But upon watching videos, I was shocked to hear the way people are using this word.

明白吗？

Okay?

根据网络上的人所说，浪漫和爱情中的‘超然’是这样的。

According to people on the Internet, detachment in in romance and in love is as follows.

明白吗？

Okay?

这并不是说不在乎那个人。

It's not about not caring about the person.

这并不是关于冷漠或故作神秘。

It's not about being aloof, being coy.

而是以一种健康的方式与对方在情感上保持距离，以减轻因爱情引发的焦虑，并确保你保持自我认同。

It's about being emotionally separated from the other person in a healthy way to help reduce love induced anxiety and ensure that you maintain your own sense of self.

明白吗？

Okay?

这并不是完全无动于衷。

It's not about being detached fully.

根据我所了解的，这更像是适度抽离，以便你依然能保持自我，你仍然是自己世界的中心。

It seems to me based on what I've gathered that it's more about detaching yourself just enough that you can still maintain your own like, you are still the center of your universe.

你知道吗？

You know?

你仍然是自己最重要的优先事项。

You are still your number one priority.

这有点像在照顾别人之前先照顾好自己。

It's it's kinda like taking care of yourself before taking care of others.

这就像是飞机上的安全手册。

It's like the airplane safety manual.

你知道吗？

You know?

他们说，如果氧气面罩掉下来了，你要先给自己戴上，再帮别人戴。

They say, like, if the oxygen masks come down, you put your mask on before you put anyone else's on.

为了照顾别人，你首先得照顾好自己。

In order to take care of others, you have to take care of yourself in a way.

也许我理解错了，也许这只是我自己的解读。

And maybe I'm reading this wrong, and maybe this is just my own interpretation.

顺便说一句，如果真是这样，我并不觉得自己是啥智慧源泉。

And by the way, if that's the case, I'm not claiming to be sort of a source of wisdom here.

我只是在分享我所发现的东西，以及它如何影响了我。

I'm more just talking about what I've discovered and how it's impacted me in a way.

这就是我今天来这里要做的。

Like, that's what I'm here to do today.

我来这里并不是为了教育你。

I'm not here to necessarily educate you.

更多的是分享我从这一切中所获得的，以及它如何让我受益。

More just share, like, what I've gathered from all this and how it's benefited me.

然后你可以随便怎么处理它。

And then you can do whatever the fuck you want with it.

但在我看来，这个概念是，你要足够从你所爱的那个人身上抽离出来，先照顾好自己，再照顾他们，这样你就不会被他们的生活、痛苦、挑战、他们的想法和行为完全吞噬。

But it seems to me that the concept is, like, about detaching yourself enough from a particular person that you love that you can take care of yourself before you take care of them so that you're not being completely consumed by their life, their pain, their challenges, what they're thinking, what they're doing.

最终，你能保持一种真正根植于你自己、而非他人身上的平衡神经系统。

You can maintain, honestly, a balanced nervous system at the end of the day that's rooted in you rather than anyone else.

但这并不是说你不关心。

But it's not about not caring.

这本质上是一种健康的界限。

It's basically a healthy boundary, really.

但我认为‘抽离’这个词很有力量，因为至少对我来说，这些都是我隐约相信的东西。

But I think there's something powerful about the word detach because at least for me, this is all stuff that I vaguely knew I believed in.

对吧？

Right?

就像，我在探索这种抽离的过程中，并没有学到什么完全全新的东西，但它在我脑海中勾勒出一幅非常美好的画面，自那以后一直对我很有帮助。

Like, I didn't necessarily learn anything completely new going down this detachment rabbit hole, but rather it, like, really painted a beautiful picture in my head that's been really helpful ever since.

而且，是的，对我来说，'抽离'这个词在描绘这幅画面时特别有帮助，方式是我以前从未见过的——它意味着你并不是完全抽离。

And, yeah, the word detach to me was really helpful in painting that picture in my head in a way that I've never seen it before where it's like, you're not detaching all the way.

对吧？

Right?

比如，你不需要完全抽离，因为在我看来，完全抽离就意味着不再关心某人，训练自己不再在乎对方，对吧？在这个语境下。

Like, you don't need to detach all the way because I think to detach all the way is to not care about somebody anymore, to, like, train yourself to not care about somebody anymore, right, in this context.

但抽离这个概念似乎在于维持关系中的独立性，从而建立更健康的关系，因为依赖会在这双方都引发负面情绪。

But it seems that the concept of detachment is about maintaining a sense of independence in relationships in order to have a healthier relationship because dependence breeds negative emotions on both sides.

对吧？

Right?

那个可能更依赖的人，会一直为另一个人感到压力，因为那个人几乎成了他们生活中的一切来源。

The person who's perhaps more dependent is, like, constantly stressed about this other person because that other person is, like, their source of everything in life.

你知道吧？

You know?

快乐的来源、满足感的来源、安慰的来源，等等不一而足。

Source of joy, source of fulfillment, source of comfort, the list goes on.

如果你把这些东西的来源寄托在别人身上，天哪。

If your source of those things is in somebody else, oof.

你知道吧？

You know?

那不是一个可靠的信息来源。

That is not a reliable source.

理想情况下，所有这些都尽可能来自内心，理论上是这样。

Ideally, all those things come from as much as possible from within, right, in theory.

而对于那个可能被更多依赖的人，他们可能会感到窒息。

And then for the other person, the other person who is being depended on perhaps more, they can feel suffocated.

天哪。

Like, oof.

你知道吗，我感觉就像背着这个人走来走去一样。

You know, I feel like I'm carrying this person around in a backpack in a way.

就像背负着一种重量。

Like, it's just this weight.

因为这个人以非常重要的方式在情感上依赖我。

Like, I because this person is relying on me emotionally in such a significant way.

我感到一种令人恐惧而沉重的责任感。

Like, I feel responsible in a way that is kind of dreadful and heavy.

关键是要在关系中保持足够的独立性，或者不管怎样。

It's about detaching enough to be independent still in a relationship or, you know, whatever.

我想，是的，在一段关系中。

I guess, yes, in a relationship.

但任何类型都行。

Any type, though.

我认为这适用于任何类型的关系。

I think this applies to any type.

我觉得这就像再次提到‘脱离’这个词，它真的变得非常有力，在我脑海中勾勒出一幅清晰的画面。

I think of it sort of like again, the word detach really became a a very strong like, it just painted such a good picture in my head.

当我思考独立与关系这个概念时。

Like, when I was thinking about the concept of independence and relationships.

这本来就是我早已知道有价值的东西，但在我脑海中形成画面后，以一种全新的方式让它更加坚定了。

Again, this is something I already knew was valuable, but seeing it in my head solidified it in a brand new way.

我想象着，你知道的，你和你所爱的人之间是用细线连接着的。

Like, I was imagining it, like, you know, like, you and people that you love are connected by threads.

明白吗？

Okay?

这可能是一个隐喻，一个你以前可能也想过类似的画面。

This is probably a metaphor, an image that you have probably thought about in your head before too.

我再次强调，我觉得自己并没有在描绘什么全新的图景。

Like, I don't again, I don't think I'm, like, painting a brand new picture here.

好吗？

K?

我不是爱德华·蒙克在画《呐喊》。

I'm not Edvard Munch painting the scream.

明白吗？

Okay?

我不是，也没有声称自己在这么做。

This is not I'm not and I'm not claiming to do so.

我不是在画一幅新画。

I'm not painting a new painting.

对吧？

Right?

我现在简直就是在临摹梵高的自画像。

It's like I'm fucking copying Van Gogh's self portrait right now.

我知道这一点，但我承认了。

And I know that, but I'm admitting to it.

我是在分享想法，把功劳归于原作者。

I'm giving I'm giving idea creds.

我觉得，你和你所爱的人之间是用线连在一起的，就像缝在一起一样。

I think of it as, like, you and people that you love are connected by threads, like, sewn together.

对吧？

Right?

对我来说，保持一定距离的想法，就像是剪断这些线，然后再把它们缝得更分散一些，这样你就离那个人更远了。

And the to me, the idea of maintaining a level of detachment is to, like, you kinda cut the threads, and then you resew them more spread out so that you're further away from that person.

你仍然有联系。

You're still connected.

你依然有线将你们连接着。

You still have the threads connecting you.

但不是被缝得那么紧，紧到你几乎动弹不得，而是剪断那些线，再缝得松一点，这样每个人都能自由活动，但爱依然存在。

But instead of being so tightly sewn together that you can barely move, you can cut those threads and you can sew them a bit looser so that everybody can move freely, but that love is still there.

那种联系依然存在。

And there is still that connection.

对我来说，这种视觉比喻是：当你被紧紧地缝在一个人身上，几乎无法动弹， versus 能够完全自由地活动，仿佛那些线根本不存在，但实际上线依然在那里。

And I think that visual to me, the comparison between being so tightly bound and sewn to somebody that you can barely move versus being able to move completely freely and wonderfully almost as if the threads aren't there, but the threads are there.

你明白我的意思吗？

You know what I mean?

对我来说，那个画面非常有价值，它来自于这种抽离的深入思考。

Like, that visual to me was so valuable, and that came from the this this detachment rabbit hole.

我认为，在深入这个抽离的思考过程中，我还发现了一件有趣的事：这关乎于放弃对别人的控制，允许他们犯错，放下对他们行为的焦虑，摆脱对他人责任的负担，接受他人的行为在某种程度上是我们无法控制的事实。

I think another interesting thing that I discovered going down this rabbit hole is that it's about relinquishing control of others, letting them make mistakes, letting go of anxiety about what they're doing, relieving ourselves from the responsibility of others, like accepting the fact that others' behaviors to an extent are out of our control.

这正是如果你有焦虑症，别人常给你的关键建议之一。

And that is, like, one of the key pieces of advice that you receive if you're somebody with anxiety.

放手那些你无法控制的事情。

You know, let go of things that you can't control.

而这与这一点是相辅相成的。

And this is going hand in hand with that.

对吧？

Right?

但我确实认为，我们有时会忘记他人的行为其实很大程度上是我们无法控制的。

But I do think that at times, we can forget how out of our control other people's actions are.

你知道吧？

You know?

比如，我们无法控制约会对象是否出轨。

Like, we can't control if somebody that we're dating cheats on us.

我们无法控制他们是否在没有我们的情况下玩得开心。

We can't control if they have fun without us.

我们无法控制他们对我们的感情是否发生变化。

We can't control if their feelings about us change.

这些我们都无法控制。

We can't control any of that.

我认为我们以为可以通过自己的行为来控制这些。

I think that we think that we can through our actions.

比如，我们觉得，如果我们在关系中做到最完美，这种事情就永远不会发生。

Like, we think, like, if we're the perfectest, most perfect person in a relationship that that would never happen.

但这是真的吗？

But is that true?

就像，不行。

It's like, no.

我实际上开始相信，根本不存在那种完美到没人会离开你的状态。

I actually sort of am starting to believe that there's no such thing as being, like, so perfect that somebody could never leave you.

就像，连这一点也不成立。

Like, even that doesn't work.

我觉得，相信人们最终会看透真实的你，不管你喜不喜欢，他们要么喜欢，要么不喜欢，这反而让人松了一口气。

I think it's sort of a relief to believe that people are gonna figure out who you are, whether you like it or not, and they're either gonna like it or they're not.

就这样。

And that's it.

你可以一直装模作样，但我认为这行不通。

Like, you can you can put on a show all you want, but I I don't think it works.

我觉得人们迟早会看穿这一切。

I think eventually people will see through it.

终究，你无法长时间维持这种伪装，最终他们会看穿的。

Eventually, you cannot keep up the charade for that long, and eventually, they will see through it.

所以对我来说，这某种程度上是一种解脱。

And so to me, that's kind of a relief.

对吧？

Right?

而且，也许这并不正确。

And, again, maybe that's not true.

也许你可以一辈子都装下去，他妈的。

Maybe you can put on a charade your whole fucking life.

这听起来很悲惨，但你知道，你确实可以这么做。

And, I mean, sounds miserable, but, you know, you could do it.

但想到最终无论你伪装成什么样子，你的真实面目都会被揭穿，这反而让人松了一口气。

But it it's it's sort of a relief to think that eventually you will be find out found out for who you are regardless of what kind of charade you're trying to put on.

而且我认为这并不会改变一段关系的结果。

And I don't think it it changes the outcome of of a relationship.

我觉得一段关系要么能走下去，要么就不能。

Like, I think a relationship is either gonna work or it's not.

你所扮演的伪装并不会改变这一点。

And a charade that you're putting on is not gonna is not gonna change that.

因为我觉得，这又回到了我之前提到的内容。

Because I think, again, this goes back I I promise that this goes back to what I was talking about.

超脱的一部分，就是放弃对他人行为、想法和感受的控制。

A part of detachment is relinquishing control of others, what they're doing, what they're thinking, what they're feeling.

这些都超出了我们的控制范围。

That's out of our control.

我们必须放手。

We must let it go.

我们必须足够超脱，才能让这一切随它去。

We must we must detach enough to let that go.

我觉得这很棒，因为它让你在关系中能够做真实的自己。

And I think what's great about that is that that allows you to be yourself in a relationship.

这要好得多，因为无论如何，你最终都会被看穿。

And that is so much better because, again, you're gonna get found out anyway.

所以，不如一开始就直接做，这样可以避免不必要的疲惫。

So it's like just do it out the gate and save yourself the exhaustion in a way.

但同时，如果你对某个你远程 romantically 感兴趣的人的行为感到担忧，比如你觉得他们经常不带你出去玩，觉得他们和你在一起时没那么开心，诸如此类，即使你已经试图抽离，这些事可能还是会让你困扰。

But also too, like, yeah, if if you're, like, concerned about what somebody you're remote romantically interested in is doing, if you're concerned about it, like, you feel like they go out without you too much, you feel like they have more fun without you, this and that, Like, that might still bother you even if you're detached.

而这可能是一个信号，表明你们可能并不合适。

And that's then a sign that maybe you're not compatible.

你知道的。

You know?

也许这段关系并不奏效。

Maybe it's not working.

你可能会发现这一点。

Like, you could still discover that.

我认为，如果你是一个特别依恋的人，每次他们不和你一起玩时，你都会感到沮丧。

I think it's just that if you're somebody who's particularly attached, you're gonna get upset, like, every time they they're not hanging out with you.

只要他们不和你一起玩、独自享受乐趣，你就会感到不安。

Anytime they're not they're having fun without you, that's gonna freak you out.

你知道吗？

You know?

你会过度思考，然后陷入焦虑。

And you're gonna overthink it, and you're gonna spiral about it.

这完全没有必要。

And that's not necessary.

这是在浪费精力。

It's a waste of energy.

如果你已经保持距离了，却仍然关心他们做什么，还不信任他们，那就是个问题。

If you're detached and then you're still concerned about what they're doing and stuff and you don't trust them, that's like that's that's an issue.

这是一个合理的问题。

That's a valid issue.

但我觉得我们常常会为这些事陷入恶性循环。

But I think we can oftentimes spiral about those things.

而沿着‘抽离’这条思路深入下去，最后的‘抽离’支柱，可以说是：对事情结果的抽离。

And then the final discovery going down the detachment rabbit hole, the last sort of detachment pillar, if you will, would be the concept of detaching from the outcome of the situation.

明白吗？

Okay?

这对我来说在个人层面上可能是最深刻的。

This was perhaps the most profound for me on a personal level.

尽管我之前已经对这一点有了一些理解，但我感觉这次真的让我在脑海中更加坚定了这一点，我对此非常感激。

Even though this is something I already had somewhat of a grasp on, I feel like, again, this really solidified something in my head in a way that I am so grateful for.

现在它在我脑子里如此稳固，真的帮了我大忙。

Like, it's been so helpful to have this be as solidified as it is in my brain now.

它现在感觉像一块磐石，而以前可能像比萨斜塔一样摇摇欲坠。

Like, it feels rock solid in a way where maybe before it was like the Leaning Tower Of Pisa.

现在它不再那么倾斜了。

Well, now it's it's, like, more not leaning.

那什么是不倾斜的建筑呢？

Like, what's a building that's not leaning?

比如卢浮宫。

Like, the Louvre.

是的。

Yeah.

是的。

Yeah.

是的。

Yeah.

就是这样。

That's it.

比萨斜塔，它看起来很棒。

The Leaning Tower Of Pisa, it it looks great.

它已经存在很久了，但它确实倾斜了。

It's been there a long time, but it is leaning.

而卢浮宫则不同，它对称、完美，非常稳固。

The Louvre, on the other hand, that thing is, like, symmetrical and perfect and, like, rock solid.

你知道吧？

You know?

不过，它被偷过吗？

Although, did it get robbed?

因为这可能会破坏我原本的思路，哦，对了。

Because maybe that kind of fucks up my oh, yeah.

是的，被偷过。

It did.

我忘了这回事。

Forgot about that.

然后我想起来了，他们偷了珠宝。

And then I just remembered they stole jewels.

好吧。

Okay.

也许卢浮宫并不是个合适的例子，因为它显然没有我想象中那么结构稳固；我需要一个在隐喻中真正坚固的东西。

Maybe the Louvre wasn't the right idea because it, clearly it's not as structurally sound as I'm trying to like, I need something in this metaphor that's, like, really structurally sound.

但我的意思是，即使卢浮宫曾经被偷过，它的结构依然稳固。

But I I mean, the Louvre is still structurally sound even though it did get robbed.

但那更多是关于别的，而不是结构。

But that was more of, like, not about the structure.

我们还是专注于建筑吧。

Let's stick to architecture here.

从建筑角度来看，卢浮宫非常坚固，我想大概是这样。

Architecturally, the Louvre is very solid, I would say, probably.

无论如何，我一直明白不期待精确结果的重要性。

Anyhoo, I've had an understanding of the importance of not expecting an exact outcome.

我甚至在这个播客里讨论过这一点。

I've even talked about that on this podcast.

比如，我很久以前就明白了这一点。

Like, I have had an understanding of that for a long time.

你知道，保持目标足够宽泛的重要性，让生活能够自然展开，而不是被锁定在一种结果上。

You know, the importance of keeping your goals sort of broad enough that life can sort of unfold as it may, and you're not locked into one sort of outcome.

对吧？

Right?

比如，事情可以自然发展，如果你不执着于对生活有具体明确的设想，你就能更凭直觉地生活。

Like, things can unfold naturally, and you can be a bit more intuitive in your life if you don't have this exact specific idea about what your life is gonna be.

我脑子里一直有这种想法，就像比萨斜塔那样倾斜着。

I've had that going on in the brain, Leaning Tower of Pisa style.

但当我深入探索抽离的层面，逐渐理解了放下对结果的执着，我不确定。

But going down the detachment rabbit hole and kinda grasping this concept of detaching from the outcome, I don't know.

这听起来和我原本就持有的信念似乎没什么不同。

It's like it doesn't sound that different from what I already held as a belief.

你知道的？

You know?

但‘抽离’这个词对我来说却变得异常有力。

But it's there's something about the word detached that ended up being really powerful for me.

我觉得我真正领悟了它，而以前可能并没有真正理解。

And I feel like I've truly grasped it in a way that I maybe didn't before.

或者，不如说没有。

Or, like, no.

其实我不会这么说。

I I wouldn't say that, actually.

我会说，它在我脑海中比以往任何时候都更清晰了。

I would say it just feels clearer in my brain than ever.

它变得清晰而精炼，最近在我的生活中真的很有帮助。

It feels sharp and refined in a way that has really been helpful for me in my life recently.

这是关于释放对未来的期待，以便能够享受当下，理性地分析自己当下的行为，并在关系中做出明智的下一步决定。

It's about releasing expectations about the future so that one can enjoy the moment and analyze one's actions rationally as they occur and make smart decisions about the next move in the relationship.

你明白我的意思吗？

You know what I mean?

如果你一上来就认定，比如在第五次约会时，或者甚至才交往一年，就决定这个人是你将来要结婚的对象，而你可能定得太早了，这取决于你的生活和处境，这样就没有任何空间允许自己可能犯错。

If you're all like, you know, if you've decided that this is the person you're gonna marry on, like, the fifth date or even a year in, and you've decided that perhaps too soon, depending on your life and circumstances, doesn't leave any room to potentially be wrong.

而有时候，尤其是在约会中，你确实会错，或者一开始你会想，天啊。

And sometimes you're wrong about those things, especially in dating, Or, like, at first, you're like, oh my god.

这就是我的真爱。

This is the love of my life.

然后你们彼此更了解一些，就会想：你知道吗？

And then you get to know each other a little better, and you're like, you know what?

我们其实并不那么合适。

We're actually not that compatible.

过去，我一直是那种很快就能下定决心的人。

And see, I've been the type in the past to, like, make up my mind really quickly.

哦，我要娶这个人。

Like, oh, I'm gonna marry this person.

是的。

Yep.

这就是我要娶的人。

This is the person I'm gonna marry.

但后来事情没成。

And then it doesn't work out.

我们其实并不那么合适。

We're not actually that compatible.

我们不应该结婚。

We should not get married.

我们并不适合彼此。

We are not good for each other.

我会比应该的更久地维持关系，因为我已经做出了那个决定。

And I will stay in relationships longer than I should because I kinda made that decision.

对吧？

Right?

我认为，我过去经历的这些事迫使我去学会放下期待，因为当你判断错误时，跌落的痛苦远比你根本不知道会发生什么、只是接受不确定性并保持开放要强烈得多。

And I think that those experiences that I've had in the past have forced me to work on releasing expectations because I think the fall is much harder when you're wrong than if you just didn't know if you just accept that you didn't know what was gonna happen and you left it open ended.

但你看，我不是那种喜欢把事情留白的人。

But see, I'm not somebody who likes to leave things things open ended.

我喜欢有计划。

I love having a plan.

但我认为，在人生的某些事情上，计划过于严密反而会适得其反。

But I think in certain things in life, having a a super buttoned up plan, it can backfire.