FWA与NFT的新市场结构 | Adam (Rhynotic) 和 Eric Conner

就像，一边是各种NFT，另一边是ETH。

Like, you have NFTs, a splattering of NFTs on one side, and you have ETH on the other.

所以这实际上就是ETH被当作货币来购买一堆NFT。

And so this is actually just like Ether being used as money for a splattering of NFTs.

而NFT进来的方式是，每个人根据自己认为合理的价格来定价。

And the way that the NFTs come in is that the individual prices it according to what they think is correct.

我们能聊聊那个机制吗，就是那种自然的机制？

Can we talk about that mechanism, that, like, organic mechanism?

对个人来说有什么惩罚？

What are the penalties for an individual?

我知道，协议有规定的惩罚，但为什么这个定价机制能行得通？

And I and I know it mean, like, protocol ascribed penalties, but, like, why does the pricing mechanism work?

比如说，我是那个朋克连帽衫的持有者，我觉得我的朋克值300。

So let's say I'm say I'm the punk hoodie owner and I fairly value my punk at 300.

假设那是公平的，你知道，上帝来说，是的。

Say say that is fair, you know, God comes and says, yes.

对。

Correct.

那很合理。

That's fair.

如果我把它定价为3.5美元，会有什么惩罚？

What are the penalties if I were to actually value it at $3.50?

或者如果我把它定价为2.5美元呢？

Or what if I were to actually value it at $2.50?

为什么市场能正确地引导价格趋向实际公允价值？

Like, why does the market guide things correctly towards the actual fair value?

这到底是怎么运作的？

How does that actually work?

对。

Yeah.

所以你有动力不去低估它，因为那样的话它更有可能被买走。

So you're incentivized to not underprice it because then it is more likely to be purchased.

所以，如果市场上有300个ETH的买单挂在cryptopunks.app上，你就没理由把它标成2.50了。

And so there's no reason for you to put it at $2.50 when it's 3 let's say even instead of God, there's a 300 standing ETH bid on cryptopunks.app.

如果你标价2.50，任何理性的买家都会觉得这便宜，买下来转手就能在别处高价卖出。

And so if you listed at $2.50, like, there's a 99% any rational actor will decide to, if they purchase it, will take the NFT because they can sell it higher elsewhere.

所以这方面其实已经不成问题了。

So that's kind of already, like, solved in that sense.

但要是你定价太高，比如标到3.50，甚至翻倍到600 ETH，那通过协议卖出去就难了。

And if you overprice it too much, let's say you overprice it $3.50 or let's say double, you price it at 600 ETH, it's harder to get purchased from the protocol.

但如果它真的被买走了，买家大概率会拿走 ETH，因为他们能拿到更多的钱。

But if it does get purchased, then the purchaser will most likely take the ETH because they're getting more money.

现在当价格非常接近的时候，比如说在10%的范围内。

Now when it gets really close, let's say it's within 10%.

假设你用300个ETH做抵押，它的价值也是300个ETH，然后我把它买下来。作为一个理性的参与者，我得做个决定：我是想要这个NFT，还是想要270个ETH（因为打了九折）？

And so if you back it by 300 ETH and it's worth 300 ETH and I purchase it and I'm a rational actor, I have to decide, do I want this NFT or do I want 300 ETH times point nine because it's a 10% haircut?

目前这10%的折扣全部归协议方所有，用来回购代币，但你会因此得到270个ETH。

And that haircut currently all 100% goes to the protocol and buys the token, but you would get 270 ETH as a result.

所以只要当前的出价在那10%的范围内，你就会选择拿走这个NFT。

And so as long as the standing bid is within that 10%, like, you will take the NFT.

这就是促使大家公平定价的动力所在。

And so that's kind of the incentive to price it fairly.

目前我们还没看到这种情况完全发生，但我相信随着时间的推移，在正确的激励机制下，它最终会实现的。

And we haven't seen that play out exactly, but I think over time and with, you know, the correct incentives, it will.

不过

But

还有一点，定价要准确。

One other thing too, pricing it correctly.

所以尽量把价格定得接近实际价值。

So pricing it as close as possible.

你设定的回购价越高，协议收取的费用就越多，你赚到的也就越多。

You earn the higher you back, the more protocol fees you earn, essentially.

因此，你在某种程度上有动力把价格定高一点，因为这样你能分到更多的协议费用。

So, like, you are somewhat incentivized to price higher because you would get a higher cut of the protocol fees.

对。

Mhmm.

嗯，在ETH方面，你得到的，比如说即使有100个东西进来，每个价值100美元，每个项目得到1美元，不管支持率如何，但是有FWA激励，这些激励会给予支持率更高的资产，这就像是价格的平方根。

Well, the the, on the ETH side, you get so let's say even if there's, you know, say there's a 100 things in and it's a $100, each item gets $1 regardless of the backing, but there are, FWA incentives that go and are given to, higher backed assets and it's like the square root of the price.

所以，就这一点来说。

And so, just in that sense.

但你之所以要准确支持它，是因为它们在池子里待的时间更长，因为赔率更高，或者它们不太可能被撤走。

But the reason you also back it accurately is because they last longer in the pool because the odds are higher or, like, it's they're less likely to get it pulled.

所以总的来说，你不需要那么频繁地微调，所有的激励措施都是为了让它定价完美。

And so overall, like, you don't have to micromanage it as much and it's all the incentives were there to try to get it to price perfectly.

所以仍然存在一种情况，也许有一个v2池可以解决所有这些问题，即使这些问题被认为是问题。

And so there is still a world where maybe there's, again, a v two pool that solves all of these issues that if they're even considered issues.

但我们对v1在一个月后仍然运行良好感到非常满意，人们还在继续使用它。

But pretty happy with how v one is kind of still working after a month and, like, people are still playing with it.

一个大问题是，哦，那之后会发生什么。

A big thing was, oh, what happens after the n yeah.

我们停止发放代币，所有供应都在外面，而且事实上还有任何活动，说明它还在运作，而且对于一个希望运行多年的协议来说，现在还为时过早。如果我不幸被公交车撞了，希望不会发生，它仍然会运行，而且不会出现任何故障。

We stop emitting tokens and all of the supplies out there and the fact that there's any activity at all, like, it's it's working and it's, it's still a pretty early for a, hopefully, multiyear protocol that will like, if I get hit by a bus, god forbid, that doesn't happen, but, it will still run, and there's no there's no failure.

我唯一的意思是，唯一的单点故障可能是Chainlink，你知道，那现在是一家价值100亿美元的公司吗？

The only I mean, the single point of failure is probably Chainlink, you know, and that's was it $10,000,000,000 company right now?

所以，是的。

And so Yeah.

而那个故障只是意味着你不能购买，但你可以提取你所有的资产。

And that failure will just be you can't purchase and you can withdraw all your assets.

所以，

And so,

而且，万一发生不幸，也会是逐步缩减，而不是崩溃。

also, god forbid, will wind down, not a crash.

没错。

Exactly.

但希望一切顺利。

But knock on wood.

如果我被车撞了，Chainlink 又出问题，那它就会慢慢停摆。

If I get hit by a bus and Chainlink fails, it will wind down.

所以这已经很不错了。

And so that's pretty good.

当然，天有不测风云，Chain 那边可能会出什么漏洞。

Obviously, god forbid, there is some sort of exploit, things around Chain.

第一版的时候其实就出过漏洞，我们不得不自己掏钱赔，因为当时没做审计，后来才做了概念验证，然后才去审计的。

There already was an exploit in the first version that we had to pay back out because I didn't get it audited and then prove the concepts, got it audited.

现在我们走到这一步了。

We're now here.

一切都很顺利。

Things are wonderful.

所以几乎得感谢那个利用漏洞的人，因为，对。

And so can almost thank the exploiter because Right.

我们发现了它

We found it

是这样的。

It was

而不是第30天。

instead of day 30.

所以，对。

And so yeah.

从那以后就一直在酝酿。

And it's been cooking since.

但是

But

是什么阻止我去看那些白名单里的NFT，找到最便宜的一个，买一个便宜的，放进FWA池子里，然后把它估得特别高，比如一万个以太坊？

What stops me from like going and looking at the white listed NFTs, finding the cheapest one, buying a cheap one, putting it into the FWA pool, and valuing it astronomically high, like 10,000 Ether?

我为什么不会这么做呢？

Like, why wouldn't I do that?

我觉得，确实没有理由不这么做。

I I mean, there's there's no reason you wouldn't.

就像那样，我们现在已经见过了。

It's like that's we've we've seen that now.

有个叫Knock的，大概50块。

There's been there's a knock on me go at, like, 50.

还有个Punk，300块。

There's a punk at 300.

但你冒的风险是，如果有人成功从协议里买走了它，你就得按你抵押的价格从他们那买回来。

The the risk you're taking though is if someone manages to purchase it from the protocol, you're buying it back from them at whatever you backed it with.

所以，哦，因为

And so Oh, because

你还得用真实的

you have to back it also with the actual real

对。

Yes.

没错。

Exactly.

所以如果我放一个很蠢的NFT，抵押价值一千美元，然后他们把它卖回给我，我就得付一千美元。

And so if I put in a stupid NFT at a thousand dollar backing and then they sell it back to me, I pay I pay for

你基本上就是花一千美元从他们手里买回来。

You're basically buying it from them for a thousand dollars.

对。

Yeah.

所以或者说，

And so or a

一千个以太币。

thousand a thousand ETH.

然后那些以太币不是给我的。

And then that ETH doesn't go to me.

它们进了协议里。

It goes into the protocol.

那些以太币给了他们。

That ETH goes to them.

难怪。

No wonder.

哦，原来是这样，因为他们没问题。

Oh, so then because they're okay.

我明白了。

I see.

然后对。

And then Right.

好的。

Okay.

打个九折，因为他们拿不到全部的钱，但对他们来说，拿走其中的九成还是划算的。

The 10% haircut because, like, they don't get all of it because so but it's still worth it for them to take a 90% of it.

剩下的那百分之十会用来购买FWA代币，然后流向

That other 10% will buy the FWA token and go to

协议方。

the protocol.

所以，如果我放一个愚蠢的NFT，价值一千个以太坊，他们看到，哦，我刚得到这个愚蠢的NFT，但协议愿意以九百个以太坊的价格从我这里买回去。

So they so if I put in a stupid NFT at a thousand ETH, they see, like, oh, I just got this stupid NFT, but the protocol is offering to buy it back from me at, like, 900 ETH.

显然，我会接受。

Obviously, I'm going to take that.

协议收走一百个以太坊，然后我，那个存了一千个以太坊在愚蠢NFT里的人，拿不回我的一千个以太坊了。

Protocol collects, a 100 ETH, and then me who deposited a thousand ETH in a stupid NFT, I don't get my 1,000 ETH back.

但我一直在赚取以太坊的费用，所以理论上，这些费用应该已经把我付清了。

But I've been printing ETH fees along the way, and so in theory, that should have paid me out anyways.

对。

Yeah.

而且我更喜欢把它想成不是协议从你那里买，而是你作为存款人把它买回来。

And I do like to think of it more like the protocol not buying it from you, but you the depositor buying it back.

我觉得这样更合理。

I think it makes more sense.

但还是，对，就是这样。

But still, like, yeah, exactly.

所以，非常酷。

And so Very cool.

我喜欢这一点，就像Eric提到的那样，NFT市场的流动性真的枯竭了。

The thing I like about this is that to to Eric's point, like liquidity really dried up on in the NFT world.

这有点像是一个通用的买家，或者说一个通用的流动性引擎。也就是说，如果OpenSea上根本没人出价买你的东西，你可以去FWA那里操作一下。

And this is this is kind of like a universal buyer or just like a universal liquidity engine so that, you know, if you if there's literally not an offer for you on OpenSea, you can go to FWA and you can do something there.

我觉得如果我们能有更多这样的机制，NFT的飞轮效应会更稳固、更可持续，持有者也会更有底气，因为他们知道总有办法获得流动性，或者以某种方式换回ETH。

And it feels like if we had many more mechanisms like this, the NFT flywheel would have been a little bit more sticky and sustainable, and, like, owners would have had just more assurances that there would be liquidity or a way for them to get ETH in some way or another.

所以我觉得，在FWA成功的条件下，这对NFT行业真的很有好处。

And so I I do think that under the success conditions of FWA, like, this is really good for the NFT industry.

我也这么认为。

I like to think so.

我是说，有些人不喜欢它，因为显然它带有一定的游戏化色彩。

I mean, some people don't like it because, obviously, it's a little gamified.

我觉得我们早就见过这种游戏化的NFT了。

I think we've seen gamified NFT for years.

他们就可以直接玩。

They can just They can just playing.

我知道。

I know.

我觉得这绝对是利大于弊的。

I think it's it's a net positive.

我觉得这给NFT带来了乐趣，这也是我过去几年一直在努力的方向。

I think it's bringing fun back to NFTs, and that's what I've been trying for the last couple, like, years.

你懂吗？

You know?

就像，人们喜欢朋克策略。

Like, people love punk strategy.

朋克策略对朋克来说曾经有过高光时刻。

Punk strategy had a moment for punks.

有些人觉得这对CryptoPunks整体来说仍然是弊大于利的。

Some people felt like it was still a net negative for CryptoPunks in general.

有些人觉得这不太好，我听到很多不同的看法。

Some people felt like it was I don't a lot of opinions.

我不同意。

I disagree.

但我理解他们的观点，尤其是那些更注重艺术的人。

But I see their points, you know, especially a lot of the more art focused people.

你知道吗？

You know?

但我觉得如果你反对艺术金融化，那以太坊可能不适合你。

But I think if you're against the financialization of art, maybe ETH is not for you.

我也不确定。

I don't know.

这只是我个人的看法。

That's my personal opinion.

我觉得，从你铸造它的那一刻起，从你在OpenSea上卖掉它的那一刻起，你就在金融化了。

I think, like, you're kind of in like, you're financializing at the second you mint it and the second you sell it on OpenSea.

不过我也理解大家的观点。

But I I see everyone's kind of point.

当然。

But Sure.

我觉得总体来说是好事。

I think it's a net good.

我觉得真正有意思的地方在于，将来可能会有自定义池子。

I think where this gets really interesting too is the eventual idea of custom pools.

我在FWA团队里。

So, I'm in the FWA team.

我一直在聊这个，就是除了这个全球统一的池子，人们也许可以推出自己的池子。

I've been talking about this, but you could instead of just this one global pool, people could potentially launch their own pool.

比如说，我想成为Simulpunk的大户，我想开始处理掉我的30个Punk。

Say, I wanna simulpunk whale, and I wanna start to get rid of my 30 punks.

对吧？

Right?

我可以有自己的Eric Punk池，把30个Punk放进去，按照我认为的价值来定价。

I could just have my own Eric Punk pool, put 30 punks out there back on what's what I think the value is.

这样一来，抽奖的价格自然会上升。

Now the the spinning price obviously goes up.

然后你，我也不确定。

And you I don't know.

Adam可能更了解这里的定制化，但中奖几率会根据你的Punk而有所不同，但每次抽奖，人们都有机会赢得一个Punk。

Adam can probably speak to the customization here, but the odds would vary on your punks, but people would have a chance every spin to just win a punk.

对吧？

Right?

作为Punk持有者，如果你有很多闲置的Punk，你可以通过它们赚取费用。

And as a pungle holder who has a bunch that are just sitting there doing nothing, you could be earning fees on them.

当然，你也可以卖掉它们。

Of course, you could be selling them.

你也可以回购他们的Punk。

You could be buying back their punks.

但我甚至看到有人发推说，比如 Yuga Labs 手里压着一堆 Punk，大概占总量 10% 左右。这些他们其实根本不想卖，因为一旦抛出来会搞砸市场。但他们完全可以通过 FWA，或者搞个自定义池子之类的玩法，让这部分 Punk 产生收益。

But I even saw something somebody tweet about how, like, Yuga Labs is sitting all these punks, like, 10% that they could potentially they really could never sell because it would just look bad on the market, but they could potentially be farming through FWA, through maybe a custom pool, something like that, on those pumps.

所以当你聊到 FWAR 的发布时，事情就变得特别有意思了。我觉得这也会是一种更优秀的 NFT 发行机制，而不是那种传统的、纯粹为了圈钱的方式——比如谁第一个扫光整个系列，谁就赚得最多。

So it starts to get really interesting when you talk about that, FWAR launch, which I think is gonna be a superior NFT launching mechanism as well, versus just, you know, putting it out there cash grab and first person to sweep the collection, you know, gets the most value out of it.

所以说，除了现在这种通用的池子之外，还有很多其他玩法，我觉得这对整个 NFT 领域来说都会非常有趣。

So there's a lot of stuff beyond just, you know, the current, generalized pool that I think is gonna be really interesting for the NFT space too.

我也在尽量把通用池子的设计保持得尽可能简单。

And I'm trying to keep the the general pool as, as simple as possible as well.

比如，显然我在想，也许我们可以设置几个独立的主池，每个池子有价格区间，这样你就只能把特定价格范围内的东西放进去，或者只允许放入像Yuga Labs这样的资产。

Like, there's a and, obviously, I consider, like, oh, like, maybe we have separate main pools that have price bands so you can only put something in in this price range or maybe it's only Yuga Labs kind of assets.

但我认为，主池的设计越简单，对基于它构建的各种应用就越有利。

But I think having the main pool as simple as possible benefits everyone building on top of it.

所以我们看到了像Gotcha Battles、Mega Rip或者是FWAP这样的项目。

And so we're seeing, like, the Gotcha Battles or, the Mega Rip one or FWAP.

它们的核心逻辑都很简单。

They it's simple.

在这个主池上构建很容易。

It's easy to build on this main pool.

基本上有六千个资产。

Everything kind of there's 6,000 assets.

就是一堆收藏品。

It's a bunch of collections.

非常完美。

It's perfect.

然后这些自定义池就解决了问题，比如如果我只想买一个Punk，买家可以进去找只有Punk的池子，然后从那里开始。

And then having these custom pools kind of solves the problem of, like, if I wanna only pull and purchase, like, a punk again, that per purchaser can go in, look for pools that are only punks, and kinda go from there.

那样的话，定价机制在主池里也能正常运作。

And that meant then the pricing mechanism would work in the main pool too.

比如，按照现在的设置，如果池子里只有Punk，那价格就是里面所有东西的平均值。

Like, the way it's set up, if if there's only punks in the pool, like, it will be an average of everything in there.

而且代码已经审计过了。

And so the code was already audited.

其实只要有一个存款人，就能把粒度调得更细，这操作特别简单。

It's really simple to just kind of make it a little more granular just with one depositor.

我们还在继续推进。

And we're still working.

到时候应该已经过了第一次FWAR的发布阶段了。

We'll probably be past the first FWAR launch.

不过用户自定义池子可能还没完全上线，咱们先走着瞧吧。

We'll probably be not past the user pool custom user pools out yet, but, we'll see.

我还在调整细节。

And I'm still tweaking it.

比如，也许这样更合理。

Like, maybe it makes sense.

有人提过，他们其实不想要自定义池的回购选项。

We've had some people say, like, they don't want actually the buyback option for custom pools.

所以也许存在一种情况，就是你把所有 Punk 都存进去。

And so maybe there's a world where you go on to deposit all their punks.

他们不想用ETH来抵押，但他们仍然有动力，因为所有的钱都归他们，因为他们是唯一的存款人。

They don't wanna back them by ETH, but the they're still incentivized because all the money goes to them because they're the only depositor.

所以还在琢磨这个。

And so kinda still workshopping that.

我已经做了几个版本，正在审计中，但还需要再调整一下。

I have a couple iterations done that I'm getting audited, but would they still ID tweaked?

我们看看接下来会怎么样。

And we'll kind of see we'll see what happens.

我对自定义池非常兴奋，因为我觉得它解决了很多主池的问题，尤其是如果用户池的所有费用都回流到主池和代币上。

I'm really excited about the custom pools because I think it kind of solves a lot of the issues from the main one, especially if all the fees from the the user pools flow back to the main pool and flow back to the token.

我觉得这始终是一个很好的小生态系统。

I think it's still kind of always, like, a nice little ecosystem.

但是

But

对。

Yeah.

说说那个实际的代币吧。

Talk about the the actual token.

所以FWA代币，它是在Genesys创建的，但你当时买不到。

So FWA take token, it was created at Genesys, but you could not buy it.

你只能通过实际参与FWA来获得它。

You could only get it by actually participating in FWA.

说说这个代币是怎么诞生的，以及它在应用里扮演什么角色。

Talk about the way that the token came into the world and and its role that it plays in the app.

对。

Yeah.

所以，为什么只能通过参与来获得它，这里面有几个原因。

And so some of the reasons of why you could only get it by participating.

过去两年我大概启动了16个项目，有很多外部因素会导致项目失败，而且很多都不是我的错。

I've launched probably 16 projects over the last two years, and there's so many external factors that go into, like, why a project failed and a lot of them aren't my fault.

我的意思是，你可以说作为机制设计者这是我的错，但其实不是我的错。

I mean, you could say it's my fault as, like, a mechanism designer, but not my fault.

我记得我最早做的代币项目之一叫Top Blaster，当时是6.9%的代币交易费，谁打爆最高、平均买代币花得最多，谁就能拿到全部费用。

And, like, I remember I launched, one of my first token works projects was Top Blaster, and it was, 6.9% of token fees on selling the fees with a crew whoever Top Blasted and paid the most on average for the tokens would get them all.

这个想法挺酷的。

Really cool idea.

我很喜欢。

I liked it.

网站看起来也很棒。

The site looked great.

上线一小时后，特朗普发布了，直接把它砸到归零。

One hour after launch, Trump launched and just nuked it to zero.

可能之前就已经死了，但反正也没机会复活了。

It might have even been dead before, but, like, there was no chance of it coming back.

有个代币被狙击了，叫CABAL。

One of the tokens got sniped, and it was called CABAL.

它是在主网上线的。

It was on main net.

你得说服一个AI代理让你卖出。

You had to convince an AI agent to let you sell.

所以基本上你得公开乞求，它会在推特上发布，然后展示出来。

So you had to basically, like, beg publicly beg, and it would tweet, and it would show.

它会考虑，比如，市场怎么样，代币是不是在上涨？

And it would take it would take into account, like, oh, like, what's the mark like, is is the token trending upwards?

是的。

Is Yes.

你盈利了吗？

Are you in profit?

你持有多久了？

How long have you held?

还有，你的理由有多有说服力？

And it's like, how compelling was your argument?

真的很酷。

Really cool.

而且我觉得，我们在某个市场推出后，行情一度非常火爆。

And, like, I think, like, we launched that in a certain market and it could go crazy.

结果最后市值到了200万美元左右，这其实已经很不错了，但有个狙击手吃进了25%的份额，尝试了大概40次才成功卖出，这也挺厉害的。

Instead, it went to, like, $2,000,000 market cap, which is still great, but someone sniped 25%, managed to sell after, like, 40 attempts, which is still really cool.

那个狙击手居然试了40次才卖出去。

It took 40 attempts to sell as a sniper.

直接把项目方搞死了。

It took projects dead.

所以，因为有人根本不在乎这件事——虽然大家对此会有不同看法——但狙击手和早期参与者之间的界限其实挺模糊的。

And so, like, as a result of someone who didn't really care and I people will disagree with this, but there is a a fine line and, like, it's kinda blurry what a sniper is and what an early participant is.

你懂我的意思吧？

You know?

比如，如果我早期发现了一个产品并买入，而且我是真心看好它，那算不算狙击手呢？

It's like, if I see a product early and I buy it and I am I'm a believer, like, I a sniper?

还是说，我只是一个比较精明的加密货币交易者？

Am I like or I just a savvy crypto trader?

说实话，我也不太清楚。

Like, I don't really know.

所以，我通常不会去责怪那些狙击手。

And so, I usually don't like, I'm not upset at snipers.

我觉得，如果我不了解这个项目，但能从中赚钱的话，我可能也会试着早点买入。

Like, I think, like, if I didn't know what this project was and I can make money, like, I would probably try to buy it early too.

从这个角度来看，我觉得把代币分发给真正了解它并积极参与的人是有道理的。

And so in that sense, I think it makes sense to try to distribute your token to people that actually know what it is and actually are participating.

所以最好的办法就是不让他们买。

And so the best way to do that is to not let them buy.

别让那些没参与进来的人买到。

Like, don't let people buying that aren't playing.

我们本来可以有别的做法。

And there's different ways we could have done it.

我见过有些其他产品，会把购买额度分配给那些参与了项目的人。

We could I've seen some other products pop up that are, like, giving purchase allocation to people that participate in a project.

但我觉得对我们来说，这样做挺合理的，就是说，你可以用ETH或者FWA来兑现，这算是一种购买方式。

But I think for us, it just made sense, like, oh, you can cash out of ETH or you can cash out of FWA, and that's, like, a a way to buy it.

我们还想要激励用户参与，你知道，就是所谓的冷启动问题，怎么去激励、引导协议启动，开始有存款，开始有人来玩。

We also wanna do incentivize activity and try to, like, they call it, like, the obviously, the cold start problem of, like, how do you get incent like, bootstrap protocol to start, like, getting deposits and start getting people to play.

而代币正好把那些小缺口都补上了。

And the token kind of just, like, plugged all those little holes.

而且，有个代币也真的很好玩。

And so, also, it's really fun to have a token.

我觉得如果你在做加密项目，为什么不尽量让它去中心化，自己运转起来呢？

Like, I think if you're making a crypto project, like, why not try to make it as decentralized and work on its own?

这就是我们做这件事的全部原因。

Like, that's the whole reason we're here.

我们本来也可以不发代币，很多平台也没发，但我觉得有代币并让它增值，是更符合加密精神的做法，所以，是的。

And so we could have not had a token and there's a lot of platforms that don't, but I think having a token and accruing value to it is like like the crypto forward kind of way and so Yeah.

那它到底是怎么增值的呢？

How does it actually accrue value?

而且，再说一次，很多这些都是链上的。

And so, again, a lot of this is on chain.

从第一天起，文档里就写了，这完全取决于使用情况。

This has been, like, from day one in the docs and, it's all dependent on usage.

比如，这个代币可能一文不值。

Like, it's the token probably worthless.

谁知道呢？

Like, who knows?

但是，平台的费用都会用来买FWA，然后分给各个参与方。

But, again, the fees from the platform all go to buy FWA and distribute it to, various parties.

所以，一开始所有费用都给了代币持有者，现在呢，100%的协议费用，你知道的，就是那10%的抽成，购买时还有1%的费用，而且我觉得当你拿NFT部分时可能也有1%的费用。

And so, initially, all the fees were going to token works, and now the fees a 100% of the protocol fees, so, you know, the the 10% haircut, there's a 1% fee on purchases, and I think there might be a 1% fee when you take the NFT portion.

但所有这些费用都会用来公开购买FWA，而且每个区块1个ETH，所以它是自动进行的。

But all of those fees kind of go to buying FWA publicly and all it's 1 ETH per block, so it's it does it automatically.

再说，就算我被公交车撞了，它照样能运行，并且把收益分配回系统里。

Again, if I hit by a bus, it'll still work and distributes back into the system.

所以目前我们已经设置好了。

And so right now, we have it set.

我觉得当天有40%分给买家，30%分给存款人，剩下的30%会被销毁。

So I think 40% goes to purchasers that day and 30% goes to depositors that day and 30% is burned.

这个数字我可能记不太准，大概是这个比例。

And I think I could be wrong on this number, something like that.

明白了。

Okay.

所以一直都有动力去做这件事，因为总有资金流入来购买FWA，这些钱会流向那些存入NFT的人或者进行购买的人。

So there's a perpetual incentive to do the thing because there's always flows to buy FWA, and that goes to, like, flowing to people depositing NFTs or doing purchases.

但还有30%会被销毁掉，这就相当于把价值锁进了代币里。

But then 30% is also burned, and so that's, like, put into the pocket of the value of the token.

对，而且这完全取决于大家是否愿意参与进来。

And again, that is this is fully dependent on people participating in in that anyway.

比如大家决定想要拥有这样的NFT，并且实际去使用它。

Like, people deciding that they want one of these NFTs and they're playing.

如果人们停止购买，这一切就都没了，我们也在努力跟这个方向保持一致。

It all goes away if people stop purchasing, like, and we're trying to, like, kind of align with that.

但显然，如果没有交易量，代币就没有回购。

But there's obviously no no buybacks at the token if there's no volume.

所以，为了把这点说清楚。

And so, just to, like, be drive that home.

对，就是这样。

But, yeah.

我觉得持有代币的人基本上都相信这个平台，相信这个协议正在运作，而且能运作得更好，你知道吧，而且关键是100%的费用都用于回购。

I think it's, like, the people that are holding the token kind of believe in the platform and believe that this, like, protocol is working and can work and can work even better, you know, and, like, it's the fact that a 100% fees go to buybacks.

这些费用不是全部用来回购并销毁，但最初那些有点像被铸造出来的排放代币。

They don't go to buy back and burn all of them, but what initially was kind of emissions tokens getting, like, almost minted.

它们完全在领取合约里，但我更愿意称之为排放。

They were fully, like, in the the claim contract, but I'd call it emissions.

现在已经被来自回购的代币所取代，这些代币是根据平台的需求发行的。

It was now replaced by tokens getting emitted from buybacks, like, demand of the platform.

这一切基本上就是自然而然地运转起来了。

It kind of all just, like, works.

而且我还在调整这些数字。

And so we'll, I'm still tweaking all of these numbers too.

我其实想放手不管，但现在还太早了。

Like, that's kind of where I wanna be hands off, but it's too early.

毕竟才一个月，很难说一切会怎么发展。

Like, it's a month in and it's hard to say how everything kinda plays out.

我们现在其实处在一个小小的低谷期。

And we're not really we're in, a little mini kinda bowl.

希望这是低谷的开始，如果非要我预测的话。

Hopefully, it's this is the start of a bowl if I had to, you know, prang.

我五月在23.30美元做的ETH多头，终于，我浮亏了那么久。

My my my ETH long that I made in May right at $23.30, Finally, I've I've been underwater for so long.

三个月后，这笔交易终于赚了3000美元，我立刻平仓了，之前亏得可惨了。

It's finally I made $3,000 on this trade after three months and I closed it immediately and I was down so much.

但我想，其实我持有得够久了，而且我知道它会回来的。

But I was like, I actually like, I held it long enough and I knew it would come back.

所以，再次希望，这是，嗯，一个大行情的开始。

And so, again, hopefully, this is the start of, like, a little The big one.

对。

Yeah.

大行情。

The big one.

但如果真是这样，想想看，拥有这样一个去中心化的协议，通过代币由用户所有，嗯。

But if that's the case, like, think, like, having a decentralized kind of protocol like this that's user owned through the token and Mhmm.

而且，过去两年我们一直在做实验，这挺好的。

It's and it's been nice to like, we've been able to experiment for the last two years.

我们一直在发行代币。

We've been launching tokens.

我们只保留那些有意义的。

We we run with the ones that make sense.

不行的我们就砍掉。

We kill the ones that don't.

有人喜欢这样。

Some people like that.

也有人不喜欢。

Some people don't.

我们运作方式非常透明，不过希望在下一次空投前能出一个爆款。你知道的，前两周我们已经赚了不少钱，现在就是埋头苦干。

We're very transparent with how it works, but, it's nice to like right before a bowl, hopefully, we have a a big winner and like, you know, we we've been we've already made a bunch of revenue in the first two weeks and we're now just kinda like heads down working on it.

我们确实通过代币交易赚钱。

And we do make money off the the token trade.

这就是代币目前还能产生收入的方式，买卖各收1%的手续费归我们，不过这个比例是可以调整的，也可以调低。

That's kind of the where the token works still has revenue is there's a 1% buy sell tax that goes to us, but that's configurable and, like, can go down as well.

不过Eric提到了FWA。

But Eric brought up FWA.

FWA具体是指哪部分呢？

What is this component of FWA?

FWA是什么？

What what is FWA?

对。

Yeah.

其实就是FWA。

So it's it's actually it's FWA.

就像FARE，但把R换成W，因为，好吧。

Like, think of FARE with a w because it's like Okay.

我会一直拿这个开玩笑的。

I'm gonna meme it forever.

所有的梗都玩得很开心。

All the memes are are running great.

挺搞笑的。

It's funny.

是别人叫它FWA的，不是我起的。

People call it I didn't call it FWA.

就像，我为此准备了一根天线。

Like, I had an antenna for that.

人们那样发音，挺搞笑的。

People pronounce it as that, which is funny.

我觉得这很棒。

I think it's great.

所以我就顺着这个来了。

So I kinda run with it.

但不管怎样，FWAir推出了我们通过平台发布的全新NFT。

But anyway, FWAir launches our net new NFTs that are launched in through the platform.

我们首先看到Jack Butcher发布了一个叫Wrappers的系列，有80个NFT。

And so we saw it first with Jack Butcher launched a collection called Wrappers, and so it was 80 NFTs.

我们以0.01的价格支持了他们。

We backed them with point o one.

价格非常低。

It was super low.

基本上就是通过协议来发布 NFT 系列。

And basically launching NFT collections through the protocol.

我觉得这挺有意思的，原因嘛，就像我之前提到的那个 Izuki 的例子一样。

And the reason I think this is interesting is kinda what I said with the I think it was the Izuki example.

比如说，就算你抽到的是普通款包装，你也照样很开心。

Like, if you get a common wrapper, you're still happy.

你会惊呼：天哪。

You're like, oh my god.

我终于拿到了我想要的那个系列。

I finally got the collection that I wanted.

所以我们希望这也能帮助分发。

And so we're hoping that this helps distribution as well.

艺术家在池子里发行有很多问题，我觉得FWAir能解决这些问题。

And there's a lot of pro there's problems with artists launching in the pool that I think FWAIR solves.

首先，你得有资金支持。

And so first, you have to back it.

必须用ETH来支持。

Have to back it by ETH.

很多艺术家做不到这一点，或者他们会说，我只想发布艺术。

And a lot of artists can't do that, or they're like, I kinda wanna just release art.

我不想还得投入ETH。

I don't wanna have to put up ETH as well.

然后，总的来说，分发也是个问题，我觉得就像我们在2021年看到的，很多gas大战，很多这样的，怎么让这些NFT不仅到收藏家手里，还要公平地公开发行。

And then also just distribution in general, I think, is like we saw in 2021, a lot of these gas wars, a lot of these, like, how do I get these NFTs not only in collectors' hands, but also in, like, a fair public distribution.

所以我认为通过FWA发布，它让人们可以进来说，我想支持这些NFT。

And so I think by launching through FWA, what it does is it lets people come in and say, I wanna back these NFTs.

假设有一千个，他们想以0.05的价格出售。

Let's say there's a thousand of them, and they wanna sell them at point o five.

他们说，好的。

They say, alright.

我想让这些以0.05的价格通过FWA发布。

I wanna I want these to launch through FWA at point o five.

有没有人感兴趣？

Is is there anyone interested?

然后收藏家可以进来说，我愿意支持一个、五个、十个，不管上限是多少，他们就会投入0.05个ETH。

And then the collectors can come in and say, will back, you know, one, five, 10, and whatever the limit is, and they put up 0.05 ETH.

当它被完全支持后，这个系列就会发布，那一千个NFT都会带着支持资金进入池子。

When it gets fully backed, the collection is launched, and all of those a thousand NFTs get added to the pool with the backing.

然后假设有人从池子里买了一个NFT，他们可以说，我要ETH或者我要NFT。

And then let's say someone purchases one of these NFTs from the pool, they can say, I want the ETH or I want the NFT.

如果他们选择ETH，NFT就会回到发布合约，然后给到支持它的人。

If they take the ETH, the NFT goes back to the launch contract and goes to the person that backed it.

所以他们说，我想要它，价格是0.05。

And so they said, I want it for 0.0 five.

他们以0.05的价格得到了它。

They got it for point o five.

他们很高兴。

They're happy.

或者说，比如，嘿。

Or let's say, hey.

我是买家。

I'm the purchaser.

我喜欢这个新NFT。

I like this new NFT.

我打算留着它。

I am gonna keep it.

他们留着它。

They keep it.

然后，与之配对的ETH会退还给支持者，但会扣除1%的池子费用，因为这部分真的没法避免。

Then the ETH that it was paired with goes back to the backer minus the 1% pool fee because you can't really avoid that.

如果我们以后推出新池子，我们会让它没有这个费用，但99%的钱会退给他们。

If we ever launch a new pool, we'll make it so it doesn't have that, but 99% of the money goes back to them.

艺术家怎么赚钱呢？

How does the artist make money?

艺术家通过它在池子里积累的费用来赚钱。

The artist makes money by the fees that it accrues while it was in the pool.

所以，就像我之前提到的，你可以存入一个NFT。

And so, like I mentioned earlier, you could deposit an NFT.

它第一次被购买后，你就没机会了。

It gets purchased the first purchase and, like, you are out of luck.

但如果数量足够大，波动性就会趋于平衡。

But with a large enough amount, the variance kind of evens out.

所以平均来说，假设一千个NFT每个0.05，总共能铸造出50个ETH，艺术家应该能拿到大约50个ETH的费用，综合考虑所有因素。

And so on average, let's say for a thousand NFTs at point o five, would mint out at 50 ETH, the artist should get around 50 ETH in fees, all things considered.

这样艺术家就能得到他们期望的全额。

And so the artist gets the full amount that they were hoping for.

支持它的那些支持者有机会，希望如果购买者不拿走的话，他们拿到它的机会更大，而且风险很小。

The backers that backed it get a chance, hopefully, a higher chance of getting it if the purchaser doesn't take it, with a minimal risk.

然后，希望分配真的很好，因为它是给那些从FWA购买的人。

And then, hopefully, the distribution is really good because it goes to people who purchase from FWA.

所以我能拿到什么，其实有点看运气的。

And so there's kind of a a bit of chance of, like, what I actually get.

而且，有可能有人从那里买了之后决定自己留着。

And, there's a chance that someone purchases from there and decides to keep it.

这概率可能比池子里一般的项目要高。

It's probably higher than the average thing in the pool.

所以这对整个生态系统也有帮助。

And so it kind of helps the ecosystem as well.

我们看看会怎么发展吧。

We'll see how it plays out.

再说一次，第一个可能在这个播客播出的时候就会上线了。

Again, the first one will probably launch by this podcast.

这可能会被大家狠狠吐槽，但我觉得会挺好的。所以我们第一个要上线的，应该就是这个周末，是一个测试系列。

This could be hugely dunked on as a result, but I think it's gonna be pretty so the first one we're launching as well, which should be this weekend, is, it's a test collection.

它会有111个NFT，每个价值0.25个以太币，它们差不多算是测试版的NFT。

It'll be a 111 NFTs backed by 0.25 ETH, and they'll act as almost like beta NFTs.

你可以激活它们，获得部署这些自定义用户池的优先权。

You can activate them and get first access to deploy these custom user pools.

所以我们打算让大家以这种方式来玩。

And so we'll kind of, like, let people play that way.

它们是我们做的一些可爱的小毛绒东西。

They're little cute fuzzy things that we made.

所以我们再定价0.25。

And so we'll price another 0.25.

我觉得大家是有兴趣的。

I think the interest is there.

在那之后，第一个艺术家发布将是Sterling Crispin，他做了这个很棒的“拯救以太坊”系列，目标是把以太坊的早期区块备份到以太坊上，保存所有存在的数据，这有点像一种递归的事情。

After that, the first, like, artist launch will be Sterling Crispin who has made this awesome save Ethereum collection, where the goal is to back up the you know, block the early blocks of Ethereum onto Ethereum and kinda save all the data that's that exists, and it's kind of like a recursive thing.

它们是链上的小卡片，上面有在这个领域里的人的脸，都挺酷的。

And they're these on chain little cards that have people's faces that are in the space and they're all pretty cool.

它们也可以作为卡牌游戏来交易。

And they can trade a card game too.

不知道。

Don't know.

到时候看吧。

We'll see.

两个我都挺期待的。

I'm excited for both.

不过我们看看会发生什么。

But we'll kinda see what happens.

我觉得目标就是让大家活跃起来，让人去购买。

I think the goal is to get activity and get people purchasing.

这才是关键。

That's kind of the the key.

比如说，如果又没人买NFT，没人出价，也没人从FWA买东西，那就糟糕了。

Like, if if if no one again, if no one's buying NFTs and no there's there's no one bidding on NFTs and no one's purchasing from FWA, it's bad.

这对整个生态都不好。

It's it's bad for the ecosystem.

所以，我们尽可能激励大家去收藏和购买协议上的NFT，这就是我们的目标。

And so incentivizing as much as we can for people to collect and to purchase NFTs from the protocol, like, that's the goal.

通过这样的Square发布，我们希望把人们真正喜欢的NFT以大家愿意接受的价格加入到池子里。

And so by doing these Square launches, we're hopefully adding NFTs to the pool that people really like at prices that we've seen people are willing to back it at.

所以这对整个生态系统来说应该是件好事。

And so it should be a net positive for the whole ecosystem.

但是

But

对。

Yeah.

我觉得这消除了我们在2021、2022年看到的很多NFT问题。

I think it eliminates a lot of the issues we saw in, like, 2021, 2022 with NFT.

所以，我的意思是，你看到的是很多抢钱行为，首先就是瞬间售罄，然后艺术家直接走人。

So, I mean, what you saw was made a lot of cash grabs, first of all, like instant sellouts and the artist just walking away.

对吧？

Right?

因为艺术家不会立刻收到ETH付款，所以这种情况就避免了。

That this takes that away because the artist isn't getting paid to ETH right away.

对吧？

Right?

他们实际上是通过FWA池子里对NFT的认购来获取版税收入的。

They're getting fees off the backing of the collection essentially in the FWA pool.

而且这些NFT可能要花很长时间才能全部卖完。

And it might take a long time for, like, all these NFTs to sell.

对吧？

Right?

它们被放进了更大的池子里。

They're in the larger pool.

用户得花钱去抽，才能拿到这些 NFT。

People have to spend and land on them and all this stuff.

而且这样对艺术家来说，分发也更合理。

So and then also, it's a better distribution, like, for the artists.

它们会被放进这个更大的池子里。

They're getting put in this larger pool.

有很多使用FWA的用户可能根本不知道那位艺术家，或者他那个规模比较小的Discord社区。

There's a lot of users using FWA that maybe didn't know about the artist that has a smaller, like, Discord community.

这样就少了很多那种急着去抢白名单、搞优先购买权之类的紧张操作了，你懂的。

There's less of, like, just rush to trying to stipe menacing, you know, whitelist and all these things.

所以说，不管怎么说，如果NFT市场不火的话，任何新项目的发行都很难成功，或者说NFT整体也很难卖光。

So I you know, it still requires the NFT market to be hot for any launch to do well or for NFTs in general to sell out.

但我认为这能解决我们在2021年和2022年看到的大部分问题，那时候简直就像IPO狂热一样。

But I think it takes away a lot of the issues we saw with Ments in 2021, 2022, which led to I mean, it was like an IPO like craze.

那段时间骗子太多，圈钱项目泛滥，最终导致流动性枯竭。

It led to too many scammers, too many cash grabs, and eventually just drying up liquidity.

对吧？

Right?

结果就是，NFT在过去四年里一蹶不振，希望接下来能好起来。

And in the end, that that led to the downfall of NFTs for the last, you know, four years until hopefully Mhmm.

现在好像有点回暖了。

Now, seem to be bouncing back a little bit.

但就是这些机制。

But like the mechanisms.

我很想看看它会怎么发展。

I'm interested to see how it'll play out.

你知道，至少现在Robinhood上的NFT看起来挺高的，FWA在以太坊主网上。

You know, NFTs, at least, Robinhood NFTs right now seem pretty high, with FWA on Ethereum mainnet.

事情似乎在回暖。

Things seem to be bouncing back.

所以，新的发布机制也可能是一个很好的催化剂。

So, getting a new launch mechanism could be a nice catalyst as well.

所以肯定。

So definitely

对。

Yeah.

启动机制，我觉得这些词确实很准确。

Launch mechanism, I think these are these are definitely the right the right words.

确实，Pump 做的一件事就是让代币发行过程变得非常统一和标准化。

It does it feels like one of the things that that Pump did is it really homogenized and standardized the the token launch process.

NFT 领域之前也有类似的情况，但都是自愿参与的，比如一万个 NFT 头像，但也就这样了。

And there was somewhat of that in the NFT space, but it was all, like, opt in, like, the 10,000 NFT PFP, but really that was it.

所以我喜欢的是，有一个中心化的地方来标准化 NFT 的发行。

And so what I'd what I like about this is, like, there's one central place to have a standardized launch for an NFT.

这种有序的市场结构让事情更容易扩展，也更容易理解和思考。

And that, like, just orderly market structure makes things more scalable, more easy to reason about, more easy to think about.

我觉得这有潜力，让市场更容易接受和理解。

And I think that has, like, potential just just for just palatability and, like, an understanding in the market.

所以，有一个 NFT 发行平台，不管 NFT 是什么或者做什么，流动性都在那里，我觉得这其实挺看好的。

And so, like, having an NFT launch pad where, like, liquidity is there no matter what that NFT is or what it does, I think it's actually pretty bullish.

Bankless 的听众们，我们为你们准备了一些东西。

Bankless nation, we've built something for you.

隆重推出 Bankless MCP。

Introducing the Bankless MCP.

ChatGPT 和 Claude 在很多事情上都很厉害，但如果你问他们一些加密货币基础之外的问题，比如协议机制、代币经济学，或者上周加密货币圈发生了什么，他们的短板就会开始

Chat GPT and Claude are great at a lot of things, but ask them anything beyond the basics of crypto about protocol mechanics, tokenomics, or just what happened last week in crypto, and the gaps will start

显现出来。

to show.

问题在于上下文。

The problem is context.

而 Bankless 这边，花了将近十年时间，建立了加密货币领域最深厚的资料库之一。

Bankless, on the other hand, has spent almost a decade building one of the deepest archives of crypto data anywhere.

超过2000份播客文字稿，10000篇文章，还有无数与真正在建设这个行业的人的对话。

More than 2,000 podcast transcripts, 10,000 articles, and countless conversations with the people actually building this industry.

现在，我们把所有这些数据整合进了 Bankless MCP。

And now we've structured all of that data into the Bankless MCP.

你可以把它连接到你的 Claude 或 ChatGPT，然后你的 AI 就能借助整个 Bankless 资料库来回答你的加密货币问题了。

So you can go and connect it to your Claude or ChatGPT, and suddenly your AI can answer your crypto queries with the entire Bankless archive behind it.

而且每篇新的 Bankless 文章或每期节目都会自动添加进去，这样上下文信息就能始终保持最新。

And every new Bankless article or episode gets added automatically, so the context keeps staying up to date.

Bankless MCP 仅面向 Bankless 的高级订阅用户开放。

The Bankless MCP is exclusively available to Bankless premium subscribers.

所以你可以去 bankless.com 升级成高级会员，花几分钟时间把 MCP 连接好，然后你会发现，不管你用的是什么 AI 大模型，你问它的加密相关问题质量都会提升一千倍。

So you can go to bankless.com, upgrade to premium, and connect the MCP in just a few minutes, and all of a sudden, your crypto queries to your AI LLM, whatever you use, will get a thousand times better.

快去试试吧。

So go check it out.

节目简介里有相关链接。

There is a link in the show notes.

成为 Bankless 高级会员后，你可以加入我们的 Discord 频道，告诉我你的使用感受。

And once you become a Bankless premium member, you can hop into the Bankless Discord and let me know how you like it.

有个好消息要分享。

Some exciting news.

我们要推出一档新播客，帮大家理清加密市场的周期规律，学会如何应对。

We are launching a new podcast to help people figure out the crypto cycle, how to navigate it.

我认识的最懂加密货币周期投资的人，他叫迈克尔·纳托。

The best crypto cycle investor I know, his name is Michael Nato.

他运营着《DeFi报告》。

He runs the DEFI REPORT.

就是这个人，在10月10日价格下跌之前给我发了卖出提醒。

This is the guy that sent me a sell alert before the 10/10 price drop happened.

他的周期分析一直非常准确。

His cycle analysis has been absolutely on point.

我关注他好多年了。

I've been following him for years.

今年，我们开始每周录制播客节目。

And this year, we started recording weekly podcast episodes.

每一期，我们都会聊他的投资组合、他持有什么、市场结构、入场目标、比特币和以太坊的公允价值，以及我们目前处于周期的哪个阶段。

Each one, we get into his portfolio, what he's holding, the market structure, entry targets, fair market value of Bitcoin and Ether, and where we are in the cycle.

每周三都会发布新一期节目。

There's new episodes that are released every Wednesday.

每期三十分钟。

They're thirty minutes.

时间不长。

They're short.

内容很紧凑。

They're punchy.

我觉得这轮加密货币周期比大多数周期都难把握，所以让我们一起应对吧。

I think this crypto cycle is harder to navigate than most, so let's do it together.

去订阅这个播客吧。

Go subscribe to this podcast.

无论你在哪里收听播客，YouTube、Apple、Spotify，或者查看节目笔记里的链接，搜索DEFI REPORT就行。

Search the DEFI REPORT wherever you get your podcasts, YouTube, Apple, Spotify, or find a link in the show notes.

现在有一期新节目在等着你。

There's a new episode waiting for you now.

Adam，FWA接下来有什么计划？

Adam, what's next for FWA?

我们一会儿结束这个播客之后，你接下来要去忙什么？

When we shut down this podcast here in a bit, what are you gonna go work on?

短期路线图是什么？

What's short term road map?

我刚拿回四个发射项目的合同，所以我得去跟审计师对接，过一遍然后做必要的修改。

I just got the contract back for the four launch stuff, so I kinda gotta, like, come the auditor, go through and make the changes that, need to.

看起来还不错，但他们给了一些建议。

Seemed pretty good, but, they had some recommendations.

就想着赶紧把它弄出去。

Just try to get that out.

然后是FWAR的零号发射，接着希望是一号发射，会和Sterling一起做。

And then FWAR launch zero and then hopefully FWAR launch one, it'll do with Sterling.

另外一件我想尽量放手的事，就是加入主池的那些NFT。

And then another thing I wanna kinda work on and kinda take my hands off as much as possible is the NFTs that are added to the main pool.

我不太喜欢自己可以挑来挑去的感觉。

I don't really love that I can pick and choose.

而且，如果FWA持有者觉得一万个代币对生态系统不好，也许他们应该能够把它们移除。

And just, like, if FWA holders think 10,000 tokens are bad for the ecosystem, like, maybe there's a they should be able to kind of take them out.

所以我在思考这个问题，很多时候其实是在琢磨这些改动，而不是真正去执行。

And so brainstorming that, a lot of it is just, like, sitting on the changes more than actually doing them.

就是，什么感觉是对的，你知道，机制本身，我们要调整这些吗？

That's, like, what feels right, what, you know, the mechanisms itself, like, do we tweak these?

这挺难的，如果我坐下来认真想机制，我反而想不出来，但它们会自然而然地浮现。

And that's kind of a hard like, if I sit down and really try to think about mechanisms, like, I can't, but they'll kinda just, like, come to you.

所以就继续慢慢推进吧。

And so just kinda keep chugging along on that.

挺好的，你知道，我们有一个比较明确的短期路线图，所以总有事情可以做。

It's nice that, you know, we have a pretty, like, solid short term road map, and so it's just always something to work on.

但是，你知道，也得时不时录个播客。

But, you know, gotta throw a podcast in here and there.

对。

Yeah.

说说看。

Talk.

我们很感激。

We appreciate it.

做播客的人也很感谢你时不时地插播一下播客内容。

The podcasters appreciate you throwing a podcast in here and there.

有意思的是，基于以太坊上层构建的各种应用以及其组合性，确实带来了很大的好处。

What's interesting here is just all the building on top and the composability of Ethereum to shine being very beneficial.

比如，我们最近看到不少情况。David，你可能见过 Emblem Vault？简单来说，它能把其他链上的 NFT 打包过来。

Like, we're we're seeing a lot of I don't know if, David, you've seen emblem vault, but essentially, this is a thing that you can wrap NFTs from other chains and bring over.

所以像宝可梦卡牌就是这样搬过来的。

So, like, that's how the Pokemon cards are coming over.

对吧？

Right?

这些大多原本都在 Solana 或者其他链上。

Most of these are on Solana or other chains.

现在你可以把它们打包，转到以太坊上，再放进FWA里。

You can now wrap them, bring them over to Ethereum, put them in FWA.

所以我觉得这会推动跨链和现实世界资产方面的很多创新。

So I think this is driving a lot of innovation around composability across chains and real world assets.

说句实话，我觉得两年之内，FWA里最有价值的资产大部分都会是现实世界资产。

I mean, I have a hot take that in, like, two years, most of the most valuable assets on Fake World Assets are gonna be real world assets.

我的意思是，如果你能把东西推销给那些普通大众——虽然我不喜欢这个词，但只要你能够向他们说明白：

I just think, like, if you can if you can pitch to, like, quote unquote, normies, I hate the term, but if you can pitch to them, hey.

比如说，你可以拿到这个 NFT，但可能他们其实不太喜欢 NFT。

Like, you know, instead of, you can get this NFT, which maybe they don't they don't like NFTs.

他们听过不少关于 NFT 的坏消息。

They've heard bad things about NFTs.

像是大家都想要那个 Punk 系列，我想是吧。

Like, everyone wants a punk, I guess.

但其他 NFT 呢？谁知道它们会走向何方？

But other NFTs, who knows where that's going?

如果你能这样去推销，嘿。

If you can pitch, hey.

你可以花50美元去赢一张价值10万美元的宝可梦卡牌，或者赢一块劳力士，甚至赢一套房子的产权，诸如此类，事情可能会变得很魔幻。

You can spend for $50 and win a $100,000 Pokemon card, or you can win a Rolex, or you can win a title to a house, like whatever, things could get weird.

对吧？

Right?

我也不确定。

I don't know.

我觉得像路易威登或者普拉达这样的奢侈品品牌，可以把正品认证做成代币化。然后这些实物可以存进像 Crypto Collect 这样的保险库。你甚至能参与抽奖，赢走一个路易威登的包。

I think luxury good sellers, like, I don't know, a Louis Vuitton or Prada or something could tokenize authenticity, and we could see those go into insured vaults on crypt collect, like and you could spin and you could win a Louis Vuitton bag.

我是说，具体怎么操作我还真不太确定。

Like, I don't know.

反正随着现实世界资产这一层被代币化，未来能发生的玩法简直太多了。

There's just so many things that could happen with this real world asset layer that are being tokenized.

当然这里面也涉及信任问题。但随着 Crypto Collect 这类平台规模变大、信誉提升，整个系统的可信度也会随之增强。

And, of course, there's an element of trust there, but as someone like Collector Crypt gets bigger, you know, and more trustworthy, like, at the time hardens that stuff.

对吧？

Right?

但是，是的，所有这些新冒出来的东西，都涉及到，而且你可以把它们带到以太坊上来。

But, yeah, all these, like, new things that are popping up, like, involve and and just you could bring them over to Ethereum.

然后，你知道，Adam，我确定你们已经——我之前跟你聊过一点关于去Robinhood的事。

And then, you know, Adam, I'm sure you guys have I've talked to you a little bit about going to Robinhood.

我确定你们对其他链也有计划，但就是能把资产从一条链带到另一条链。

I'm sure you guys have plans for other chains too, but just be able to bring these assets from chain to chain.

因为我觉得，我喜欢以太坊主网。

Because I think, like, I love main net Ethereum.

对吧？

Right?

就像，在我心里，那是我开始的地方，我仍然对它情有独钟。

Like, in my heart, that's that's where I started, and I still got a soft spot for it.

但不可否认，二层链的用户体验要好得多。

But there's no denying, like, the UX of layer two chains is way better.

对吧？

Right?

手续费也更便宜。

Fees are cheaper.

不过，FWA 必须在以太坊主网上线，因为 CryptoPunks 就在那儿。

But, like, FWA had to launch on main net Ethereum cause that's where punks live.

高价值的 NFT 也都聚集在那里。

That's where high value NFTs live.

但如果我们开始慢慢讨论可组合层，以及如何将金库包装后迁移到其他链上，那就会开启一个全新的维度。

But if we slowly start talking about composability layers and wrapping vaults to bring over to other chains, that opens a whole another aspect here.

因为这样一来，NFT就不必只局限在一条链上了。

Because now all of a sudden, NFTs don't have to live on one chain.

我可以把我的Punk（加密朋克）转到Robinhood上去。

I could bring my punk over to Robinhood.

Robinhood上现在也有FWA（真实世界资产）。

There's an FWA on Robinhood.

更便宜。

It's cheaper.

你知道，更快，所有这些好处。

It's, you know, it's quicker, all these things.

所以对我来说，这里潜力无限，远远不止在DEAR主网上购买NFT。

So there's just, like, to me, there's unlimited potential here, that go well beyond just, you know, spending for NFTs that are on the DEAR mainnet.

我也不反对迁移到其他链。

And I'm not against moving to different chain.

我的意思是，就像我说的，主网作为代币和协议的家是有道理的，因为NFT都在那里。

Like, I mean, we're obviously like I said, Mainnet makes sense for the the the home of the token and the protocol because that's where the NFTs are.

而且，就像人们在我们的基础上构建一样，我们也构建在Chainlink和Uniswap v4之上。

But, also, like, I mean, just like people are building on top of us, like, we built on top of, on Chainlink and on Uniswap v four.

所以，只要有Uniswap v4的地方，实际上我觉得在我们部署的链上都不需要Uniswap v4。

And so, like, anywhere there's, like, a a Uniswap v four actually, I don't even think we need Uniswap v four on the chains that we deployed.

我们需要Chainlink，因为我们可以用Layer zero把代币桥接过去。

We'll we'll need Chainlink because you can just we can bridge the token over with, like, Layer zero.