MegaETH 主网已上线！以太坊扩展的下一个时代

我认为这就是L2能够保持其价值主张的地方。

I think that's where L2s can maintain a value proposition.

有些体验、用户流程或应用之所以能高效运行或成为可能，正是得益于无需拥有分布式验证者集所带来的特性。

There are experiences or user flows or apps that are only performant or possible because of, like, the properties that come alongside not having, like, a distributors validator set.

这些应用不应该被强行迁移到所谓的全部归于L1或封闭验证者集的架构中。

Those should not go to, like, you know, quote unquote, like, all to l ones or, like, closed validator sets.

它们应该走向最合理的归宿，也就是这些本身在某种程度上更中心化的序列器架构——在‘中心化’这个词的直接敏感含义上确实更中心化。

Those should just go to their most logical conclusion, which is, like, these, like, you know, somewhat centralized sequencer architectures that they are more centralized in, like, the immediate sensitive resistance term of the word.

我们团队中绝对没有人会说Megaieve比Solana更去中心化。

Like, By no means is anyone on our team going to say that Meggieve is more decentralized than Solana.

这纯粹是假新闻。

That's just fake news.

也许多年以后，会出现不同的权衡，人们愿意接受这些变化。

It may be many years in the future, may just become different trade offs that become things people are willing to make.

对吧？

Right?

也就是说，嘿。

Which is, like, hey.

那些掌权的人除非给我离开的机会，否则根本跑不掉。

The the guys in charge can't really rug unless they give me a chance to leave.

对吧？

Right?

几天时间，安全委员会，某种变体。

A couple days, security council, some sort of variation.

但我认为至少我的结论是：以太坊L1需要以负责任的方式扩展。

But I think the takeaway I have at least says, ETH L1 needs to scale in a responsible manner.

对于以太坊通过负责任扩展未能覆盖的那部分市场，这些应该由L2在杠铃理论中承接。

And for that portion of the market ETH does not capture by scaling responsibly, those should be captured by l twos in the barbell thesis.

对吧？

Right?

这就是我认为以太坊的设计选择为世界创造最大价值的方式。

And that's the way that, like, I think Ethereum's design choices create the most value for the world.

对吧？

Right?

比如，既包括经济价值，还有就是。

Like, both economic value, but also, hey.

我们需要让用户上链。

We need to get users on on blockchains.

或者也许不用，但这是我直觉上的想法。

Or or maybe not, but I think that's my gut feeling.

我们来谈谈这个杠铃策略吧。

Let let's talk about that that barbell.

正如我们所讨论的，L2真正擅长的是提供卓越的功能。

As we are talking about, like, really what what are l twos really good for is delivering exceptional features.

上周在Mega ETH生态系统中发生了一些事情，我认为这凸显了Mega ETH为市场带来的卓越功能。

And there's something that was going on in the Mega ETH ecosystem last week that I think kinda underscores what the exceptional features that Mega ETH are bringing to the market.

你们做了一次压力测试。

You guys did a stress test.

所以，这是对Mega ETH的压力测试。

So the stress test, of Mega ETH.

你们发布了一堆关于压力测试的数据。

You guys published a bunch of data about about the stress test.

你能给我们讲讲这个压力测试是为了什么吗？

Maybe you can kinda walk us through what that what was that stress test for?

你们希望从中了解到什么？

What were you hoping to learn?

你们学到了什么？

What did you learn?

有没有发现什么有趣的东西？

Anything cool that you saw or noticed?

总的来说，这次对Mega ETH能力的压力测试给你们带来了什么？

And overall, what did this, test, this stress test of Mega ETH capabilities do for you guys?

是的。

Yeah.

你知道吗，我先打个简单的比方。

You know, I'll I'll start with, like, a small analogy.

对吧？

Right?

过去几周对所有利益相关方来说都相当紧张，市场啊，诸如此类。

The past couple weeks have been, like, quite intense for all stakeholders, right, market, blah blah blah.

我记得在压力测试期间或之前几天，有人问我，事情进展得怎么样？

And I remember during the stress test or a couple days before the stress test, someone asked me, like, know, how are things going?

你们推出产品怎么这么慢啊，诸如此类。

You know, you guys are taking a while to launch, blah blah blah.

这些都是很合理的观点。

And all very valid points.

我的体会是，我其实感觉很棒，因为你知道，我不会编程。

And my takeaway was kinda like, I'm actually feeling great because, you know, I can't code.

我不是开发者。

I'm not a developer.

过去两年里，我只能打电话给雷和团队其他成员，说：兄弟们，相信我。

And for the past two years, I just had to get on calls with Lei and the rest of the team and just like, take trust me, bros.

这系统运行得非常快，拥有难以置信的计算能力，能应对极端的活动量。

Like, this trains really fast, it has, like, unbelievable compute, and it can handle crazy levels of activity.

我心里想：理论上说得通，但实际在哪呢？

And I'm just like well it makes sense on paper but where is it?

我们亲眼看到了，真的太棒了。

And we saw it and that was really awesome.

确实，当时有相当高的活动量，当然这不是自然产生的活动，所有的交易都是我们自己做的。

Genuinely there was a level of activity, obviously this is not organic activity, We made all of the transactions ourselves.

我记得，像以太坊和Solana这样的链，我会去交易什么的。

But I remember, like, you know, chains like ETH and SOL, I would and then, you know, I would go trading and stuff.

当有很多人玩这个游戏时，游戏就崩溃了。

Like, when there was a lot of people playing the game, the game broke.

那时候，我根本没法进行兑换。

And it's just like, you know, I couldn't do swaps.

我什么都做不了。

I couldn't do anything.

我记得2021年的时候，市场下跌时，我不得不拿出投资组合的6%来退出仓位。

I remember back in '21, you know, I'd have to spend, like, 6% of my portfolio on on to exit the position during a market downturn.

天哪，真是服了。

It's like, oh, Jesus Christ.

我只是在操作500美元。

Like, I'm just doing $500.

而且我希望自己未来能做得更好，因为这简直太疯狂了。

And like, that's like, well, I hope I do well in the future because, you know, it's just craziness.

但我们基本上实现了每秒海量的交易，同时还能让玩家玩这些链上低延迟游戏。

But we we basically, like, you know, an insane amount of transactions per second, and we did it while letting people play these games, which were, like, low latency games on chain.

所以我们有AzurXmons，他是Pseudoswap的创始人。

So we had, AzurXmons, who's the founder of Pseudoswap.

他打造了一个完全在链上的宝可梦游戏。

He built a fully on chain Pokemon game.

我们的团队把交叉点游戏搬到了链上，并部署到了主网。

Our team took the crossroad game, made it on chain, put it onto the main net.

人们在我们对链进行大量垃圾信息发送的同时，还能玩这些游戏。

And people were able to play these things while we were just doing a egregious amount of spam on the chain.

我喜欢

I like

这个词。

the word.

‘ egregious ’这个词。

Egregious word.

没错。

It's true.

确实如此。

It is true.

而且达到了某种不恰当的程度。

And it's somehow inappropriate levels.

交易数量过多。

Inappropriate amount of transactions.

这个

The

区块浏览器崩溃了。

block explorers died.

它们崩溃了。

They died.

它们说，请停止这样做。

They were like, please stop doing this.

但，是的，这真的很酷。

But, yeah, like, it was cool.

这确实很酷，它让我明白了MegaEve为何合理，也让我们看到了它为何合理。

It was genuinely cool, and it made it it made me feel like what make MegaEve makes sense, and we're seeing why it makes sense.

而且我们在做这件事的同时，手续费还比使用EFTA或那些老旧的一层链（如MegaEve）低了五到六倍。

And we did this while also having fees, like, you know, five, six times lower than chains like MegaEve that use EFTA or, like, old l one chains that were, like, just, like, way more expensive.

所以从非技术的角度来看，感觉非常好。

So it it felt great from a, like, nontechnical point of view.

我们所做的事情很有道理，人们也能感受到。

It felt like what we're doing makes sense, and people could feel it.

但也许雷有一些实际的数据。

But maybe Lei has some, like, actual data.

实际上，在我们让雷发言之前，你能给那些没看这个压力测试的人一些数据吗？

Well, actually, before we get to Lei, can you give us some numbers for people who weren't watching this stress test?

也许你可以把这些数据转换成气体消耗量，比如吉加气体之类的估计值，当然可以。

And maybe you can convert this to, you know, amount of gas, like, gigagas, you know, estimates or Sure.

每秒交易量对我来说仍然有效。

Transactions per second is still valid to me.

是的。

Yeah.

是的。

Yeah.

你们可以访问 stress.megayouth.com。

You guys can go on stress.megayouth.com.

对吧？

Right?

好的。

Okay.

我们那里有回溯性的数据。

We we have, like, the the retroactive information there.

我们在七天内完成了114亿笔交易。

We had 11,400,000,000 transactions in seven days.

这比

So that's more than,

七天内114亿笔交易还要多。

like 11,400,000,000 transactions in seven days.

是的。

Yeah.

是的。

Yes.

平均每秒处理15,500笔交易。

Average TPS was 15.5 k per second.

我们达到了每秒55,000笔交易的峰值。

We hit the peak TPS trans peak TPS of 55 k.

平均Mega Gas为1.6。

The average mega gas was 1.6.

所以，确实挺厉害的。

So, yeah, it was it was pretty cool.

等等。

Wait.

等等。

Wait.

平均Mega Gas为1,600。

Average mega gas was 1,600.

1.6。

1.6.

0.6吉加气。

Point six giga gas.

1.6吉加气。

1.6 giga gas.

是的。

Yes.

对。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

是我的错。

My bad.

好吧。

And and okay.

然后，你们都知道，我们之前都见过测试网的数据。

And then so how you know, we've all seen numbers from, like, test nets before.

对吧？

Right?

或者，比如我本地运行这些系统，声称达到了每秒十亿笔交易之类的。

Or, like, I'm running these things locally, and I achieved, you know, billion transactions per second, whatever.

这个环境在多大程度上模拟了我们上线后实际会遇到的情况？

How closely does this environment emulate what we will actually see post launch?

因为那才是真正的衡量标准。

Because that's kind of the benchmark.

对吧？

Right?

你们在所谓的前期展示这些数据时，

You guys show these numbers in, you know, kind of, you know, pre.

这是一方面。

That's one thing.

但你能维持这些数字吗？

But can you can you sustain these numbers?

我会说可以，因为如果我们打开开关，这正是我们将在主网上运行的东西。

I I would say yes because if we flip a switch, it's exactly the thing we're gonna run-in main network.

服务器、相同的IP地址、相同的配置、相同的管理员密钥。

Servers, same IP address, same configuration, same admin keys.

所以一切都完全一样，我有点不好意思，因为我们确实有点过度刷链了。

So exactly the same everything is the same like I feel bad because we're kind of spamming the chain a bit too much

这是主网压力测试，不是测试网压力测试，完全没错，就是主网。

This is a main net stress test not a test net stress test Totally yes exactly the main net

我相信我们每天花费了200个ETH，并且进行了循环利用。

We spent I believe 200 ETH a day which we recycled.

对吧？

Right?

我们正在获取ETH，别担心。

We're getting the ETH, don't worry.

我们没有破产。

We didn't go bankrupt.

但这一切都是

But it was was all

从一个口袋掏出来，放进另一个口袋。

real from one pocket and putting it into another pocket.

没错。

Bingo.

没错。

Bingo.

是的。

Yeah.

但确实如此。

But yeah.

所以，当用户使用这条链时，他们必须支付ETH。

So, like, when users use the chain, they had to use pay ETH.

现在，嗯。

Now Mhmm.

它非常低。

It's very low.

它非常便宜，所以完全没问题。

It was very cheap, so it's totally fine.

实际上，它就跟维护一样。

And, effectively, it it was the same as maintenance.

对吧？

Right?

它是

It is

等等。

Wait.

等等。

Wait.

每天200个ETH，这会怎么样？

With the 200 ETH per day, what's that going to?

这是不是把每笔0.0001美分的代币转账累计起来，乘以总数后，正好相当于每天200个ETH？

Is that all the cumulative average token transfers of 0.0001¢ just adding up when you multiply that, it's like equates to 200 ETH per day?

是的。

Yeah.

大约如此。

Approximately.

哇。

Wow.

我们说的是Gas费。

We're talking about the gas fees.

对吧？

Right?

所以，为了完成110亿笔交易，每天的Gas费高达200个ETH。

So like it's 200 ETH per day of gas fees to make the 11,000,000,000 transactions happen.

没错。

Exactly.

对。

Yep.

是的。

Yeah.

200乘以当前价格是多少？

How was 200 was 200 times whatever the current price is?

这110亿笔交易的总经济成本是多少？

How how much what was the total economic cost of the 11,000,000,000 transactions?

经济成本是指成本基础吗？

Economic cost as in the cost basis?

或者

Or

是的。

Yeah.

就像发送110亿笔交易在Mega ETH上持续七天，这应该花费多少？

Just like how much how much did sending 11,000,000,000 transactions on Mega ETH over seven days, how much should that cost?

是的。

Yeah.

那么代币转账是多少？

So the token transfer is what?

每笔交易0.01美分，我们可以快速计算一下。

0.01¢ per transaction, and we can do a quick calculation.

我的意思是，每天200笔乘以当前SAT的ETH价格，大概是每天40万美元左右。

I mean 200 per day times the SAT current price of ETH is, you know, 400 k per day, something

我觉得大约是100万美元。

like $1,000,000, I would say.

七天内是110万美元？

$1,100,000 over seven days?

我想是的。

I think so.

让我查一下。

Let me check.

所以是3个零，1BK11.4M。

So 3Zeros, 1BK11.4Ms.

是的。

Yes.

1,140,000.00。

1,140,000.00.

是的。

Yes.

他们刚做了这件事，还说我不可能做到。

They just did that and said I would never be able to do that.

这里有个量化笑话，但我就不说了。

There's a quant joke somewhere here I'm not going to make.

这和其他链相比怎么样？

Does that, compare to other chains?

我认为我们实际上有一个对比。

I think so we have actually a comparison.

我认为我们在交易成本上是最便宜的之一。

I think we are among the the cheapest to transact on.

我认为我必须强调一点：当你没有人使用，或者用户数量很少的时候，构建和运行一个低成本的链其实很容易，但当你需要支撑平均每秒500笔交易时，要持续保持这种低交易成本就非常困难了。

And I think I do want to highlight something which is it's actually pretty easy for you to build a chain and run a chain that is cheap when no one's actually using it or or when the the number of users is small, but it's actually pretty hard for you to sustain that, low transaction cost when you are pushing to, what, On average, point five k transactions per second.

这全是市场动态。

It's all market dynamics.

对吧？

Right?

因为如果你的链只能支撑比如一千TPS，那么一旦需求超过一千TPS，最高出价者就会决定Gas价格。但在我们的情况中，由于链的实际容量更大，我们更担心的是会压垮我们的基础设施合作伙伴，所以我们并没有全力冲刺。正因如此，即使在每秒15,500笔交易的情况下，基础费用和Gas费也从未波动。

Because if your chain can only sustain, say, a thousand TPS, then the moment you like, the moment the demand goes beyond thousand TPS, then the the top payers are going to decide, the the gas price, but in our case because the chain has actually the chain has more capacity, we we really worried about like breaking our, infrastructure partners, so we didn't really go full throttle, but and that's the reason even at 15.5 k transactions per second, yeah, like, the base fee the the gas fee never never fluctuate.

雷，很多这些压力测试，我觉得其实都是你学术研究的延伸。

Lei, a lot of this, the a lot of this the stress test, I feel like it's just downstream of a lot of your just academic work.

我觉得这个压力测试，同时也是对雷的知识和他的计算机科学博士学位的考验。

Like, I feel like this this stress test is also a stress test of Lay's knowledge and his PhD in computer science.

白皮书。

White paper.

没错，就是这样。

That's what yeah.

那么，作为这场测试的直接成果，你个人有什么感受呢？

They so, like, how how do you feel as just, like, kinda, like, your your personal journey, like, downstream of this test test?

这场压力测试对你意味着什么？

What does this stress test mean for you?

这太棒了，顺便说一句，所有的功劳都要归于我们的总设计师埃隆，他拥有计算机系统领域的真正博士学位。

It's, it's amazing and also by the way, all the credit goes to our mastermind, Elon, who holds a real PhD in, in computer systems.

我的专长更多是共识机制，可惜在MegaEth中并没有用到。

My my expertise was more like consensus, which unfortunately, is not used in MegaEth.

但不管怎样，是的。

But, anyway, yeah.

我说过，功劳归他。

I said it goes to him.

是的。

Yeah.

我个人感到非常兴奋，因为我一直被大量私信激励着，人们说：天哪。

I I personally feel pretty excited, but because I'm just very motivated by all the DMs flowing in telling me that, oh my god.

这条链是真实的。

The chain is real.

是的。

Yeah.

而且

And

我当时就想，没错，它是真实的。

I was like, yeah, it is real.

它已经真实存在一年了，但无论如何，我非常高兴，因为我觉得这很棒，而且我也感到更加安心了，因为我们现在有了一个真正的端到端压力测试。

It's been real for for a year, but, yeah, anyway, I'm just very happy that, I think it's a nice I also feel pretty much reassured because we now have, like, a real end to end stress test.

我觉得你们问的问题都非常到位，比如：这个压力测试的背景是什么？

I think you you guys were asking perfect questions like, hey, what's the what's the setting of this stress test?

对吧？

Right?

对吧？

Right?

我现在感觉很安心，因为这正是我们将用于主网的相同服务。

And, I feel pretty comfortable right now because, it's exactly the same service that we're gonna run our main net on.

我的意思是，部署完全一样。

I mean, it's the exact same deployment.

我们不会做任何重新部署，这就是主网，所以这是一个很好的验证。我认为这让我能睡得更好，而且我认为它也对我们下游的基础设施合作伙伴进行了压力测试，因为它暴露了一些基础设施问题。

We're not gonna do any redeployment or anything it is the mainnet so it's a great validation I think it lets me sleep better at night and also also I think it kind of stress tested our downstream, infrastructure partners because I think it it highlighted some, issues with, the infrastructure.

我认为其中一些，比如区块浏览器，没能跟上节奏，我们现在正在开发新的RPC方法，专门帮助他们在未来面对类似的大规模公开流量时更容易应对。

I think some of them, I think the block explorers, they failed to keep up, and we're now literally working on new RPC methods tailored to make them make their lives easier when they try to handle such low spikes in the future when it goes, like, really public.

我们还在与我们的应用团队——Mafia——合作，因为他们也运行着索引器。

And, we're also working with, our app teams, the Mafia, because, they also run indexers.

他们对这些交易进行后处理，这也有助于他们发现其流程中的潜在瓶颈。

They they post process those transactions, and, it also help them identify the the potential bottlenecks in their pipelines.

所以我认为，这整个生态系统进行的是一次极其有意义的演练。

So I think it's in general, I think it's extremely meaningful exercise for the entire ecosystem.

我只是非常高兴。

I'm just very happy.

MegaEat 拥有什么样的关键秘诀，能真正实现这样的吞吐量？

What, what's the secret sauce that MegaEat has that really unlocks, this throughput?

比如，MegaEat 拥有什么其他区块链没有的独特优势，才能在七天内处理 110 亿笔交易？

Like, what is the unique thing that MegaEat has that other blockchains, doesn't have that allows 11,000,000,000 transactions over seven days?

对。

Right.

对。

Right.

所以我认为，我们之前讨论过很多我们的优化措施，比如并行化、JIT 编译以及点对点网络的改进。

So I think, yeah, we have been talking about a lot of our optimizations, for example, parallelization, JIT compilation, and the the peer to peer network improvements.

但我觉得我们一直没怎么谈过的是我们新的状态树设计。

But I think something we have not been we have not been talking a lot about is our new state trie design.

我们称之为SOT，小认证大树状结构。

We call it SOT, small authentication large trie.

你可以把它看作是以太坊Merkle Patricia树（通常称为Merkle树）的直接替代品。

Think of it as a direct replacement of Ethereum's Merkle Patricia Trie or commonly known as the Merkle Tree.

对于任何EVM链，或者任何希望作为二层网络接入以太坊的链来说，你都需要一个能够验证整个链状态的树结构。

So the thing is with any EVM chain or with any chain that you want and hope to, like, settle onto Ethereum as the layer two, you need a tree that authenticates to the entirety of the chain state.

这里的链状态基本上是指账户余额列表、账户细节列表，每个人拥有多少钱，每个人拥有多少ERC-20代币。

And here, chain state is basically the the list of balances, the list of account nuances, how much money each person have, how much ERC 20 tokens each person has.

对吧？

Right?

这些状态需要被简洁地压缩成一个哈希值，这个过程就是我们所说的管理或更新状态树。

So these states need to succinctly go into a single hash and this process is what we call managing or updating the state trie.

在我们优化之前，状态树的管理占到了区块构建时间的90%以上。

And before our optimization, state trie management takes more than 90% of block building.

换句话说，如果你花了七天时间处理这114亿笔交易，那么你将花费整整70天来管理状态树。

In other words, if you spend seven days processing those 100 sorry, 11,400,000,000 transactions, you would spend seventy, seven zero, days on managing the state tribe.

换句话说，你只有10%的时间在执行交易，而90%的时间都在做事后管理。

So in other words, you are kind of only spending 10% of the time running the transactions and 90% of the time, like, doing post hoc management.

所以，我们所做的——我认为这与其他链的做法相比非常有趣——是彻底重新设计了数据结构。

So what we did, I think which is pretty interesting compared to what other chains have been doing, is we completely redesigned the data structure.

我想，在我们之后，许多团队也意识到了这个瓶颈，他们尝试优化存储这个状态树的数据库，但似乎很少有人真正尝试彻底重构并重新设计数据结构本身，对吧？

And I think many teams have kind of identified this bottleneck after we did, and I think what they did was they tried to optimize the database that stores this state tribe, but they I think not many of them has tried to re just revamp and redesign the data structure itself, right?

数学结构和存储这些数据的物理数据库之间是有区别的，对吧？

So there's the difference between the mathematical structure and also the and the, the physical database that holds these data, right?

我认为大多数人只是在物理介质上重新排列数据，但对我们来说，我们直接彻底重新设计了数学结构。

I think most people are, like, rearranging the data in the physical medium, but, for us, we just completely redesigned the mathematical structure.

我们优化的目标是：好吧。

And, what we optimized for was okay.

很多人试图改进数据库，但我们的目标始终是：干脆彻底去掉数据库。

So many people are trying to improve the database, but our goal has always been that, let's just get rid of the database.

我认为我们的状态树非常独特的一点是，它占用的空间非常小，因此你不需要频繁更新数据库。

So I think something that's very unique about our StateTry is it takes so little space that you don't have to constantly update your database.

对，因为你不需要把它存储在数据库里。

Right, because you don't have to store it in a database.

你只需要把它放在电脑的主内存中，通常最多也就128到56吉字节，就这样。

You can just fit it in the the main memory of your computer, which usually goes at most maybe 128 to 56 gigabytes, and that's it.

因此，它完全消除了在State Street和数据库之间不断重新排列数据的潜在瓶颈，现在只需要一次快速的内存读取。

So it alleviates the potential bottleneck of constantly reshuffling data from the State Street to the database completely, and, now it's just a very quick memory read.

所以我认为，这可以说是我们的一个独门秘方——彻底重构了以太坊的Merkle Trie状态数据结构。

So I think this, I would say, is one of the secret sauces, like just a complete revamp of the Ethereum Merkle Tri state Tri data structure.

雷，你是如何做到在保持完全EVM兼容性的同时实现这一点的？

Lei, you've done this in a way that still preserves full EVM compatibility?

非常好的问题。

Very good question.

极其敏锐的问题。

Extremely sharp question.

所以我觉得，要描述的话，可用的术语太多了，反而不知道该选哪个。

So I I think there are too many words, like, to to describe, too many terms to to choose from.

所以我不敢声称完全兼容以太坊，因为我觉得有人曾对我提出过质疑，但我们实现的是：你可以直接将你在其他链上部署的任何字节码移植过来，无需修改。

So I I would not claim if Ethereum compatibility because I think some someone kind of comment shot at me, but what we achieved was, okay, so you can port whatever you can just deploy whatever bytecode you have on any other chain as is.

它可以在以太坊上运行。

It runs on Ethereum.

这里的唯一区别是我们调整了汽油费用模型，某些操作码会稍微便宜一些，某些则会稍微贵一些；其次，状态路径的计算方式现在也不同了。

The only difference here is we are tweaking the gas model, so some opcode runs a bit cheaper, some opcode runs a bit more expensive, and second, the state route is now computed differently.

换句话说，对于相同的状态——即相同的账户列表和相同的余额列表——区块头中的状态根哈希将与你保持原状时的哈希值不同。

So in other words, for the same state, we you can imagine as for the same list of accounts and the same for the same list of balances, the state route, the hash that exists in the block header will be different from what it would be if you remain that.

但好消息是，几乎没有任何应用依赖于状态根的具体计算方式。

But the good news is almost, I would say, no application depends on the particular way to compute the state route.

而且，是的，我会说它是兼容的，因为它是字节码级别的兼容，但可能有人会持不同意见。

And, yeah, so I would say it's I would say it's compatible because it's byte code level compatible, but, people may disagree.

所以我只能尽可能描述我所能描述的内容。

So I I describe what I can describe.

嘿，Bankless 族群。

Hey, Bankless Nation.

我是大卫。

It's David.

如果你正在听这个，那是因为你在收听免费的Bankless播客频道。

If you're hearing this, that's because you are listening to the free Bankless podcast feed.

你知道吗

Did you

有一个付费的Bankless RSS频道吗？

know that there is a premium Bankless RSS feed?

付费频道包含我为个人研究而进行的额外访谈，以及一些关于加密行业更深入的问题，我希望通过这些问题获得答案，以便在Banklist Ventures以及我自己的个人投资组合中成为更知情的投资者。

The premium feed has extra interviews that I do for my own personal research and just deeper questions that I want answered about the crypto industry, questions that I want to answer so I can be more informed as an investor both at Banklist Ventures and also just in my own personal portfolio too.

此外，付费频道没有广告，这意味着如果你选择收听付费频道而非免费频道，每年可以节省大约二十个小时的时间，因为你直接支持了Banklist。

Also, there are no ads, which means if you listen to the premium feed instead of the free feed, you'll get about twenty hours of your life back every year because you choose to support Banklist directly.

所以，如果你有兴趣获取额外内容，同时跳过广告

So if you're interested in getting extra content all while skipping the ads

或者你只是欣赏我们

or you just appreciate what we

如果你喜欢我们所做的，并希望我们继续下去，我们非常感谢你注册Banklist高级服务，详情链接在节目说明中。

do here and want us to keep doing it, we'd appreciate it if you signed up for Banklist premium, and there is a link in the show notes to get started.

祝2026年一切顺利。

Cheers to a good 2026.

如果你能用与交易加密货币相同的工具和速度来交易黄金、外汇和全球市场，会怎样？

What if you could trade gold, forex, and global markets with the same tools and speed that you use for crypto?

这正是Bitget TradFi所实现的功能。

That's exactly what Bitget TradFi unlocks.

在经历强劲的测试期需求后，包括单日黄金交易量超过一亿美元，Bitget TradFi现已对所有用户开放。

After strong beta demand, including over a $100,000,000 in single day gold trading volume, Bitget TradFi is now live for all users.

在你现有的Bitget账户中，你可以交易涵盖外汇、贵金属、指数和商品的79种金融产品，所有交易均以USDT直接结算。

Inside of your existing Bitget account, you can trade 79 instruments across forex, precious metals, indices, and commodities, all settled directly in USDT.

无需切换平台，也无需法币兑换。

No platform switching and no fiat conversions.

这正是Bitget通用交易所愿景的体现。

This is Bitget's universal exchange vision in action.

加密货币与传统金融并肩而行。

Crypto and traditional finance side by side.

你将获得深厚的流动性、低滑点，以及最高达500倍的杠杆，让你将加密货币策略应用于宏观市场。

You get deep liquidity, low slippage, and leverage up to 500 x, letting you apply crypto strategies to macro markets.

对传统金融还不熟悉？

New to TradFi?

从黄金开始。

Start with gold.

黄金兑美元货币对流动性强，受宏观因素驱动，是加密货币与传统市场之间自然的桥梁。

The gold USD pair is liquid, macro driven, and a familiar natural bridge between crypto and traditional markets.

立即在bitget.com交易黄金。

Try trading gold on Bitget now at bitget.com.

点击节目说明中的链接获取更多信息。

Click the link in the show notes for more information.

这不是财务建议。

This is not financial advice.

好的。

Okay.

通过这种优化和信任测试，我们了解到，Mega ETH 能够在七天内以仅200万美元或100万零11万美元的低廉成本处理110亿笔交易，这告诉我，链上手续费并不是Mega Ease可行的商业模式。

So with this optimization, with this trust test, we learned that Mega ETH can sustain 11,000,000,000 transactions over seven days for the low low cost of $2,000,000 or $1,000,001,100,000, which tells me that chain fees is not a viable business model for Mega Ease.

我的意思是，你们能每秒处理110亿笔交易，这确实很厉害。

Like, I don't think, like, it's cool that you guys can do 11,000,000,000 transactions per second.

但我认为，你们在可预见的未来不太可能实现每秒持续110亿笔的自然交易量。

I don't think you guys are getting to a sustained level of organic 11,000,000,000 transactions per second anytime soon.

因此，这意味着Mega Eats系统的经济可持续性不会来自链上手续费。

So that implies that, like, economic sustainability for the Mega Eats system is not going to come from chain fees.

如果不是来自链上手续费，那它会从哪里来呢？

So if it's not gonna come from chain fees, where is it going to come from?

是的。

Yeah.

所以这个我可以接手，Ron。

So I can take this, Ron.

我认为普遍的想法是，各方利益存在根本性的不一致。

I think that the the general thinking was there's this fundamental, like, misalignment of interests.

对吧？

Right?

因为作为Meggief，我们希望随着用户增多，我们的用户基础变得越来越有价值，我们就想提高费用，因为存在供应商锁定效应，我们可以赚更多钱。

Because as Meggief, we want as we get more users and our box base becomes, I could say, more valuable, we want to charge more fees because vendor lock in, we can make more money.

但我认为这是短视的行为，因为Mega的增长方式是让每个人都能以尽可能低廉的成本使用Mega。

But I think that's actually short term thinking because the way MEGA grows is by letting everyone come and use MEGA for as cheap as humanly possible.

我认为这正是Solana能够为用户提供如此良好价值主张的主要原因之一。

I think that's one of the main reasons why Solana was actually able to provide such a good value proposition for users.

对吧？

Right?

比如，你知道，Pump最初是在Blast生态系统里。

Like, you know, pump is initially in the blast ecosystem.

但一旦有一千人开始在Blast上发行模因币，Blast可能就会变得昂贵。

But the second there's a thousand people launching Meme Coins on Blast, Blast maybe would get expensive.

再说一遍，我不记得Blast的具体配置了，但如果你使用FDA和其他一些声明，大致就是这种情况。

Again, I don't remember the exact Blast configuration, but that's more or less what happens if you use the FDA and a couple other statements.

我认为我们的观点是：我们希望尽可能便宜。

I think our opinion was, hey, we want to be as cheap as possible.

我们希望随着时间推移越来越便宜，这样能吸引更多用户，而不是越成功用户越少。

We want to get cheaper over time so we can get more users as opposed to get less users as we become more successful.

在这种情况下，我们基本上认为，必须找到一种方法，让DAS保持一致并以成本价运行。

And in that scenario, we basically said, well, we need to more or less find a way to make DAS consistent and run it at cost.

对吧？

Right?

并不打算从中赚钱。

Not really make any money on it.

我认为第二个问题是：那么，作为一条链，我们如何赚钱呢？

I think the second point is, well, okay, how do we make money as a as a chain?

对吧？

Right?

你知道，我觉得那个时代——为了拥有代币而发行代币，就这么完了——已经过去了。

You know, I think, like, the era of, like, you know, launch a token for the sake of having a token and just, like, that's done.

所以你得建立某种真正的商业模式。

So you kinda need to build some sort of, like, real business model.

我们最终把重点放在了稳定币上。

And we kinda came down to stablecoins.

在那之前，我想我们现在就是这样的。

Before I think this has that's what we have now.

我们计划在未来开发更多自有应用程序。

We plan on building more first party applications in the future.

但总体的想法是，嘿。

But a general thinking is, hey.

我们一直在研究稳定币。

We have worked on, you know, stablecoin.

比如，我们开发了许多应用程序，或者帮助许多创始人打造了很棒的应用。

Like, we worked on building a bunch of apps or facilitating a bunch of founders to build cool apps.

我们如何找到一种双赢的方式，能够从他们的成功中获利，同时又不至于通过高昂的费用损害他们的用户，或者以任何形式干扰他们的经济模型。

How do we find a way to, like, a win win where we can, you know, earn off of their success, right, without necessarily, like, a, hurting their users by having fees that are expensive, or b) in any way shape or form messing with their economics.

而答案就在于Sablecoins中隐藏的TIBO收益。

And the answer there is the hidden tax of TIBO yields that come in Sablecoins.

每个在链上持有美元的人，尤其是在Genius之后，都没有获得这些美元的收益。

Everyone who has a dollar on chain, especially after Genius, is not getting the yield for that dollar.

所以，如果你在以太坊L1上持有USTT或USDC，某处有人正在为你代为获取TIBO收益。

So if you're holding USTT or USDC on Ethereum L1, someone, somewhere is internalizing a TEBO yield on your behalf.

我们基本的想法是：我们会推出一种原生稳定币USDM，当应用程序使用USDM时，我们就获得其对应的TIBO收益。

What we basically said is, hey, we're gonna have this native stablecoin, USDM, and when applications use USDM, we earn the TEBO yield for that.

这些收益会进入负资产负债表。

That goes into the negative balance sheet.

这样做使我们能够推动链的发展，并以不损害最终用户的方式重新投资于链上生态。

What that does is it allows us to grow the chain, reinvest into the chain in a way that doesn't necessarily harm end users.

有人可能会说，最终用户理应获得这些收益，但我想你得问问自己：人们为什么选择加入你的链？

One can argue that end users should be getting their yields, but I think then you just have to ask yourself, what kind of reasons are people coming onto your chain for?

进行稳定币套利的人不应当在负收益的情况下进行套利。

Someone who's stablecoin farming should not be stablecoin farming on negative.

他们不应当把稳定币存放在Mega Eve上。

They should not be parking their stablecoins on Mega Eve.

他们应当把稳定币存放在EFL1上。

They should be doing that on EFL1.

EFL1比Mega更安全。

EFL1 is more secure than Mega.

你选择使用Mega是因为上面有酷炫的应用程序。

You're coming on the Mega because there's cool apps on Mega.

你选择使用Mega是因为你想在Mega上做一些独特的事情。

You're coming on the Mega because you want to do something unique on Mega.

而不得不承受这种你本来也赚不到的隐性税收，我认为这是一个非常合理的权衡。

And then having to deal with this hidden tax, which you wouldn't have been earning anyways, I think is a very reasonable trade off.

所以Mega的盈利方式就是通过这些TIBO收益。

So the way Mega makes money is via these TIBO yields.

这对应用没有害处。

It doesn't hurt apps.

这对用户也没有害处。

It doesn't hurt users.

事实上，情况恰恰相反。

And in fact, it's the opposite.

如果应用变得更加成功，Mega 就能赚更多的钱，而用户也能保持低廉的费用。

If the app becomes more successful, Mega is able to earn more money, and users are able to maintain cheap fees.

所以我们认为这是一种真正的、近乎共生的关系。

So we think it's this real it's this almost like symbiotic relationship.

再说一遍，不管好坏，我们都会在 Mega 上不断尝试新技术和新业务拓展。

Again, I think for better or for worse, we keep experimenting and trying new things with Mega, both on the tech side as well as BD side.

也许这会彻底失败。

Maybe it'll be a complete failure.

我希望不会，但这是有可能的。

I hope not, but it's possible.

我们一般的看法是，有个著名的爱因斯坦名言，大概是说，疯狂就是重复做同样的事情却期待不同的结果。

Just our general thinking is there's this famous, like, Einstein quote, I think, which is, like, definition of madness is to try the same thing twice and expect a different result.

所以我们最终得出结论：我们必须尝试新事物，因为除此之外，我们还能做什么呢？

And we just kinda came to the conclusion, well, we have to try new things because I well, what else are we doing here?

对吧？

Right?

所以，至少在经济模式上，我们就是这样思考的。

So, yeah, that's the way we're at least thinking about economics.

我觉得这很有道理。

I think it makes sense.

对吧？

Right?

这有点像TVL或AUM类型的收入结构，是被动的、在后台运行的，仍然能为用户提供价值，但摩擦更少。

It's sort of a a TVL or AUM type of revenue structure, right, that's passive, that's in the background, that still provides, you know, users value but with less friction.

还有另一个可能构成三脚凳的支柱，即L2乃至整个区块链通常可以收费的领域，也就是区块排序，即MEV。

There is one other leg of maybe a three legged stool of where l twos and even chains in general can charge, let's say, for their service, which is block ordering, so MEV.

如果你看看Solana这样的项目，这就是Solana产生收入的方式。

And this is if you look at kind of Solana, for instance, this is how Solana makes generates the revenue that it generates.

那MEV呢？

What about MEV?

你们是完全不考虑这个了吗？

Is that, like, off the table from you guys?

你们完全有能力运行序列器来收取这笔费用。

Like, you'd be perfectly positioned running the sequencer to collect that.

Base就在收取这笔费用。

Base collects it.

你知道，现在很多L2都在收取这笔费用。

You know, a lot of the l twos collect it today.

为什么不说这一点呢？

Why not mention that?

这会是收入模型中的一个因素吗？

And, like, is that a factor in the revenue model?

是的。

Yeah.

确实是。

It is.

而且，没错，我们确实深入思考过这个问题，因为就我个人而言，我认为整个团队从根本上都不认同微观期权这种模式。

And, yeah, we actually have thought a lot about it because me personally, and I think the team by extension fundamentally disbelieves is, microscopic opt options.

而所谓的微观期权，本质上就是以以太坊一层那种基于交易费和优先费用的排序方式，你可以理解为，对于每一个区块，你实际上都在进行一场拍卖。

And the micros microscopic options basically is what Ethereum layer one style, tip based, priority fee based ordering because you can kind of think of it as for every block, you are literally doing an auction.

从支付最多的人到支付最少的人，你调整交易的顺序。

And from the person from the people who pay the most to the people who want to pay the least, you kind of alter the transactions.

对吧？

Right?

这本质上意味着，每一个区块、每12秒，你都在运行一场拍卖，来决定二层——哦，抱歉，是在以太坊一层上的区块排序。

It's literally like every single block, every twelve seconds, you are running an an auction to decide what's the, the block ordering on the layer two oh, sorry, on on Ethereum layer one.

但我认为，对我们来说，这从根本上行不通，因为我们的区块间隔非常短，在我们的场景中，微区块——抱歉，是迷你区块层级的区块间隔只有10毫秒。

But I think what it fundamentally breaks for us is because our block, interval is so small, because in our case, the the blocking interval is ten milliseconds at the micro block sorry, at the mini block level.

想象人们能在如此低的延迟下进行拍卖是不切实际的，比如我是一名纽约的交易员，而排序器实际上位于东京，那么我发送出想为这个区块支付多少费用的意图，就需要大约六十到一百毫秒的时间才能到达东京的排序器。

It's not it's not constructive to imagine that people can run auctions at such latency because, say, I'm a trader in New York and that the sequencer is literally is in Tokyo, then it takes me about sixty some almost, I think, one hundred milliseconds to even have my, like, intention of how much I want to pay for this block transmitted to the Tokyo sequencer.

因此，在这种精细粒度下运行拍卖完全行不通。

So, like, running auctions as at this kind of fine granularity completely breaks down.

所以我们试图实现的目标，我认为我们称之为邻近市场，是放弃那种必须在每个区块都精确选择排序偏好微观选项的做法，而是以更粗的粒度进行，比如每月、每周或每季度一次。

So what we are trying to achieve, what we're trying to do here, I think we call it the proximity market, is instead of microscopic options where you have to panoply pick your ordering preference every block, you do it on a much coarser granularity like every month or every week, every quarter or so.

因此，你在这个时间间隔内运行这些选项，决定哪些人可以获得与排序器 colocated（同地部署）的席位。

So you run those options at this kind of interval and decide a bunch of people that will have the the seat to collocate with the sequencer.

一旦做到这一点，他们就可以使用任何他们想要的算法，在这些种子上运行，这些种子本质上是紧邻排序器的虚拟机。

And once you do that, then they can take whatever algorithm they want to run and run them on these seeds, which are basically virtual machines that are right next to the sequencer.

我们从云服务商那里获得的延迟数据已经低至一毫秒。

So the quotes we get from our cloud provider is down to, one millisecond.

如果人们希望进一步优化，甚至可以将延迟降低到一百微秒甚至几十微秒，我认为这已经达到了纳斯达克级别的高频交易水平。

And, if people want to optimize, they can even get down to a 100 or even tens of, microseconds, which I think is right there with Nasdaq level, high frequency trading.

是的。

Yeah.

所以，这正是我们想要收集所谓的MEV的方式，但同时，为了让我们也能获得一部分MEV，我们确实希望将其重新分配给社区。

So this is kind of how we want to, like, collect, quote, unquote, MEV, but, also, I think, for us to collect part of the MEV, we really want to redistribute it to the community.

我们非常希望将这些收益再投资到生态系统中，但这个话题应该由Namiq来重点阐述。

We really want to reinvest in the ecosystem, but that's kind of a topic that Namiq should, should highlight.

但从技术设计的角度来看，我们的目标是每周或每月提供一些半长期的选项，以决定谁能与排序器同机部署。

But I think on just on the technical design, our goal is to have just kind of semi long term options every every week, every month to decide who can collocate with the sequencer.

此外，这也有助于激励人们迁移到排序器附近，因为采用十毫秒区块间隔的目的是为了构建高效的流动性市场。

And also, it helps incentivizing people to move next to the sequencer because the the reason for you to have a ten millisecond block interval is for you to build efficient liquid markets.

对吧？

Right?

如果那些真正负责市场流动性的顶级参与者仍留在世界的另一端，远程做市，那么十毫秒区块间隔的意义何在？

What's the need of what's the what's the purpose of ten millisecond block interval if people are if those really high facilitators, which are really the people who are responsible for market liquidity, are going to stay at, the opposite side of the world and just remotely market make.

对吧？

Right?

他们应该来到排序器这边。

They should come to the sequencer.

所以，我认为这既是一种激励结构，也是一种在实时交易中实现高效优先级分配的更实际方式。

So this, I think, is both an incentive structure and also, I think, a more practical way for us to have, like, efficient priority allocation when you have real time trading.

是的。

Yeah.

这个设计的迷人之处在于，它或许正是把不便明说的部分公开化，直接建立一个处理这种问题的机制。

What's fascinating about that design is, I guess, it's it's maybe also in the spirit of saying the quiet part out loud, right, and just creating a mechanism for handling this.

因为当你观察那些极高TPS的链，甚至是区块时间极短的链时，你可能会发现，社会层面最终还是会趋向于这种模式。

Because when you look at very high, you know, TPS chains and including high very high block time chains, you could see it sort of collapsing to that sort of thing anyway at the social layer.

比如，我有时会看Solana，以及其中发生的大量机房集中现象。

Like, sometimes I look at Solana and the amount of colocation that is happening.

对。

Yes.

那就是阿姆斯特丹。

It's Amsterdam.

对于不了解的人，阿姆斯特丹是许多Solana验证节点集中部署的巨大枢纽。

For those that don't know, Amsterdam is a massive hub that many of the Solana validators are located in.

这就像我不知道具体占网络的百分比是多少，但如果你想获取最大MEV，这里就是你要去的地方。

It's kind of like I don't I don't know enough to say it's like what percentage of the network it is, but it is the place if you wanna collect the max MEV.

所以你会看到很多验证者和运行Solana基础设施的人集中在这里，但他们很少公开谈论这一点。

And so you see a lot of validators, people running salon infrastructure, co located there, but they don't really talk about that so much.

对吧？

Right?

这并没有被公开宣传。

It's not it's not advertised

在营销材料里也不会提到。

in the marketing material.

对吧？

Right?

而与Mega Eth不同的是，你们只是直接把潜台词说出来了，设计了一个机制来应对这一点，也就是：靠近排序器确实非常有价值。

So whereas with Mega Eath, you're just sort of saying the quiet part out loud, which is like and designing a mechanism for it, which is to say, hey, it's really valuable to be co located next to a sequencer.

就是这样。

It just is.

而且明确地将其出售。

And also explicitly selling it.

是的。

Yeah.

这是一种透明的方式，可以将类似莫洛赫类型的问题在某种程度上进行拍卖。

And here's a transparent way to actually, like, take a Moloch type problem and sort of auction it at some level.

当然，听众可以想象这类事情可能出错的各种方式，但至少你迈出了一步，使其透明化、进行拍卖，并创建一种机制将收益回馈给社区。

Of course, listeners can imagine different ways that this type of thing can go wrong, but at least you're taking a step of making it transparent, auctioning it, and creating a mechanism to feed this back to the community.

而且有一件事我真的很喜欢这一点。

And there's something like it's something I really like about that, actually.

对。

Yeah.

透明性非常重要，因为作为独立交易员，我认为我们的机制实际上可以赋能更多独立、好奇的交易员，因为作为独立交易员，你绝对不知道该如何在复杂的VPS和服务器提供商中选择，以获得对S4HANA或链验证器的最低延迟。

The the transparency part is really important because I think as an independent trader, I think our mechanism could actually empower more independent, curious traders because you, as an independent trader, definitely don't know how to navigate the the maze of which, VPS, which server provider I should use to get the minimum latency to S4HANA or to a chain validator.

对吧？

Right?

所以，是的。

So Yeah.

我觉得这很简单，你

I think it's simply, you

你知道，这些是颇具争议的决定，但我们认为它们是有道理的，因为这回到了超级代币持有者身上。

know, these are controversial decisions, but we think they make sense because it goes back to mega token holders.

对吧？

Right?

比如，如果最终目标是我们试图构建以超级代币持有者为核心价值的系统，我认为这在某种意义上是公平且去中心化的。

Like, if the bottom line is, is we're trying to build systems as value, like mega token holders, I think it's like fair, it's decentralized in its own way.

它本质上是将这些私有价值捕获机制转变为某种公共品。

It basically like turns these private value capture options and turns them into almost like a public goods of sorts.

所以价值会回流到每一位利益相关者那里。

So the value goes back, you know, to to every stakeholder.

之所以不值得提及，是因为你需要用户。

The reason why it's not worth mentioning because you need users.

对吧？

Right?

除非人们在使用Mega，除非有人们愿意参与的应用程序，否则没人会参与邻近市场。

Like, no one's gonna participate in proximity markets unless people are using Mega unless there's apps that people wanna participate in.

Darren和Ryan之所以在MegaEve上，不是因为他们在听了我们的一期播客后感到内疚，而是因为那里有他们想做的事情。

There's a reason why, like, Darren and Ryan are on MegEve, not because, you know, they feel guilty after a podcast episode of us, but because there's something you wanna do.

实际上，我不认为邻近市场会在Mega上线的第一天就成为一个精彩的故事，因为我们得先花大量精力确保所有应用都能上线。

And, you know, that basically means that, like, realistically speaking, I don't think proximity markets are gonna be this amazing story in the first day of Mega being live because we're gonna do a lot of the hard work of making sure that all of our apps go live.

我们要找到这些应用的PMO。

We find PMO of some of these applications.

随着时间推移，如果MegaEase序列器运行良好，人们真的会希望聚集在一起。

And over time, people actually want to collocate if the MegaEase sequencer.

到那时，我们不再告诉他们：‘嘿，把钱汇到银行账户，你就能坐在东京的MegaEve旁边，或者我们当时在的任何地方’，而是重建了一个系统：根据其他所有人的情况，以代币和Mega代币计价，告诉你需要支付多少费用，从而构建出结构性的经济机制和福利，让任何选择持有代币的人都能受益。

And when that happens, instead of, telling them, oh, yo, send send some money to a bank account and you can sit next to MagEve in Tokyo or wherever we are at the time, we've rebuilt a system where you're like, this is how much it costs based on everyone else, denominated in tokens and mega tokens, and you create structural economics and benefits anyone who's choosing to hold the token.

所以我们觉得，这是一种更诚实的做法。

So we just think it's a bit more of an honest approach.

再说了，咱们走着瞧吧。

Again, well, let's see what happens.

我确实理解，MegaEase 的核心目标是打破出售区块空间的商业模式，这迫使你们必须更有创意地寻找价值捕获的方式。

I I do appreciate just the understanding that the whole point of MegaEase is to collapse the business model of selling block space, which forces you guys it's a forcing function to get a little bit more creative about how to capture value.

所以，你们在创建 USDM，出售机柜托管服务。

And so, you know, creating a USDM, selling colocation.

还有其他计划吗？

Is there anything else?

是像这样，等好点子出现，就随便试试看哪个能成吗？

Is it kind of just like as good ideas come in, we'll throw spaghetti at the wall and see what sticks?

还是说，你们已经规划了第三或第四个产品？有什么想法吗？

Or like, is there you guys have, like, a a third or fourth product lined up or any any thoughts there?

是的。

Yeah.

我的意思是，我们普遍认为，嘿。

I mean, I think that, like, our our general opinion is, hey.

让我们看看EVM，从端到端的角度出发，找出哪些问题我们可以从第一性原理重新构建。

Let's look at the EVM and say end to end where are there problems that we can rebuild from first principles.

所以埃隆和雷做过这件事，或者至少他们尝试过，用MagEve作为区块链，对吧？

So Elon and Lei did that, or at least they tried to with MagEve, right, as a blockchain.

他们打造了一个性能极其出色的区块链。

And they've built like an unbelievably high performing blockchain.

对吧？

Right?

我们Mega在前进过程中所做的，是继续把MagEve做得更好，同时尝试识别EVM或当前我们对区块链整体理解中的其他瓶颈，并开发第一方应用来解决这些问题。

What we're doing as, you know, Mega, as we move forward is continue to make MagEve really good, but then also try and identify additional bottlenecks within the EVM or just the general, like, how we understand blockchains to be today and try build first party applications to solve for those problems.

对吧？

Right?

所以，我觉得我们对这个设计空间的很多方面都非常感兴趣。

So, you know, I think we're really interested in, like, you know, a lot of a lot of that design space.

其中很多内容将在未来几个月内陆续公布。

A lot of it is, you know, to be announced over the following months.

但我觉得我们的普遍看法是，我们已经构建了这个出色的区块链。

But, yeah, I think our general opinion is, you know, we've we've built this great blockchain.

我们在该链上支持了众多应用，并将继续在该链上支持更多应用。

We've facilitated applications on this chain, and we're gonna continue to facilitate applications on this chain.

已经两年了。

It's been two years.

我们有一些认为会令人兴奋的应用。

We a few apps that we think will be exciting.

关于Mega Eve上的应用，已经有很多争议，未来也还会持续出现关于Mega Eve应用的争议。

There's been a lot of drama about apps on Mega Eve, and there'll be lots of drama in the future about apps on Mega Eve.

我们不会停止在链上推出酷炫应用的努力。

We will not stop trying to have cool applications on the chain.

我们也不会停止与这些应用合作，去创造独特的东西。

We're not going to stop trying to work with those applications on doing something that's unique.

每当我们推进构建第一方应用或第一方体验时，我们都认为这对MegaEth及其代币持有者整体而言是净收益。

And anytime we progress into building first party applications or first party experiences, we think it's because it's net positive for MegaEth and MegaEth token holders as a as a general group.

我们来谈谈MegaEth的应用策略吧，因为我觉得MegaEth令人耳目一新的一点是，在区块链的早期阶段，根本没有什么应用策略。

Let's talk about, yeah, MegaEth's app strategy because the other thing that I think is refreshing about MegaEth is, like, back back in the old days of blockchains, the there was no app strategy.

那时候讲究的是可信中立，就是别插手应用层。

It was like credible neutrality, like, don't touch the app layer.

应用层上出现什么都好，但我们不想参与其中。

Whatever emerges on the app layer is great, but we don't want to have a hand in that.

而MegaEth采取了一种完全不同的做法，就是不，不，不，我们要尽可能积极地直接培育自己的应用层，我觉得这种做法很新颖。

And Mega ETH has kind of just taken a very different approach, which is like, no, no, no, no, we are going to directly foster our own app layer as aggressively as possible, which I which I find refreshing.

Namic，你能大概给我们讲讲MegaEth在孵化自身应用生态系统方面的理念吗？

Namic, maybe you can kinda just, like, walk us through what the Megaeth philosophy is with, like, incubating its own app ecosystem.

当然可以。

For sure.

如果一个应用，总体的想法是，我们绝不能陷入一种局面，即只有一堆在其他链上重复出现的应用。

If an app like, the general thinking is, like, we cannot end up in a situation where we just have a bunch of repeat applications that exist on every other chain.

原因有两个。

And there's two reasons.

首先，如果应用都一样，那为什么有人会来使用这条链呢？

First is like, well, why would anyone come and use the chain if it's the same apps?

这是最基本的一点。

So that's the basic one.

但第二点是，如果我们花了过去三年时间拼命打造这个东西，结果上面却根本不可能出现任何新东西，那意义何在？

But then the second one is like, okay, what is the point of us spending the past three years of our lives trying to build this thing if there's literally nothing new that can exist on this train?

我脑子不够用，没法只靠欣赏Lei所面对的复杂技术问题来获得乐趣。

It's just like, I'm not smart enough to be able to just enjoy the complex technical problems that Lei is facing.

而这就是他享受生活的方式。

And that's how he enjoys his life.

但任何东西都得有个存在的理由。

But like, need to exist for a reason.

所以我们做的就是，直接去寻找创始人，说服他们辞掉当前的工作，勇敢创业，去打造一些酷炫的东西——老实说就是这样。

So what we did is we basically just started trying to find founders and convince founders to quit whatever they're doing, take the entrepreneurial plunge, and build cool shit, to be frank.

一切都还顺利吗？

Is everything cool?

不。

No.

有什么真的很酷吗？

Something's really cool?

当然。

Sure.

有没有创始人在上线前就破产了？

Did some founders not be able to did they go bankrupt before they were able to go live?

是的。

Yeah.

有没有创始人觉得其他链或其他机会更有吸引力？

Did some founders decide there's another chain or another opportunity that's more enticing?

完全如此。

Totally.

所以这些事情都发生过。

So all of these things have happened.

但我们保持谨慎乐观，非常兴奋，因为最终我们将上线一些我们认为很酷的应用程序。

But we are cautiously optimistic and we're quite excited because at the end of the day, we're going live with applications which we think are cool.

在接下来的几个月里，Mega Eve 将推出一系列我这辈子，甚至在加密领域都从未见过的独特流程。

And we have a bunch of unique flows that I have not had in my life, let alone in crypto, that will be on Mega Eve in the months that follow.

因此，普遍的看法是我们应该寻找创始人，并与这些创始人合作开发独特的应用。

So the general opinion is that we should find founders, we should work with these founders to build unique apps.

我们之前没有自己的链，但五天后我们就会拥有一个链。

We didn't have a chain we'll have a chain five days from now.

但在 Mega Eve 历史的绝大部分时间里，这些应用创始人根本没有可用的链。

But for the vast majority of the history of Meggy, there was no chain for these app founders to use.

因此，这自然引发了一个问题：好吧。

So it naturally created, like, this question, like, okay.

你知道，我们想做这件事。

Like, you know, we wanna do this.

我们很兴奋，但也存在一些根本性的瓶颈。

We're excited, but there's, like, fundamental bottlenecks.

我们无法像希望的那样快速迭代。

We aren't able to iterate as fast as we'd like.

我们还不了解许多依赖关系。

Bunch of dependencies that we're not aware of.

但我真正期待的是，尽管如此，我们仍然能够推进并推出一批酷炫的应用。

But what I'm really excited for is now that we and we we we're still able to push through and get a bunch of cool apps.

你们中的一些人可能知道，这取决于你的喜好。

Some of you know, depends on what you like.

游戏、消费级DeFi、借贷。

Gaming, consumer DeFi, lending.

如果这是你感兴趣的，我可以开始给你列举一些应用吗？

I can I can start naming you apps if that's what you like?

但我真正兴奋的是，我们将拥有主网，并能大力推动更多独特的人来开发独特应用。

But what I'm really excited about is the fact that we will have a main net, and we will be able to double down on getting way more unique people to try build unique apps.

因为我的总体观点是，加密领域正面临严重的人才流失问题。

Because my general opinion is that we have a massive brain drain issue in crypto.

你知道，除非你是因为Maggie的原因才来，或者抱歉。

You know, unless you're in Maggie's because or sorry.

除非你是因为对分布式系统或系统设计有深刻而真实的兴趣才进入加密领域。

Unless you come to crypto because of, like, deep, deep, genuine interest in, distributed systems or, like, systems design.

对吧？

Right?

你知道，我进入加密领域是因为，呃，我不想造势，但你知道，去银行化这个前景。

Like, you know, I came into crypto because of the you know, I don't wanna be a pump, but, like, you know, the promise of going bankless.

对吧？

Right?

我进入加密领域是因为我不喜欢必须受一个掌控我的主权机构摆布的想法。

Like, I came into crypto because I did not like the idea of having to deal with, like, a sovereign who has control over me.

我喜欢那种无需许可的点对点网络系统。

I like the idea of permission from the systems peer to peer networks.

我认为，很多本可以来构建优秀应用的创始人上个周期做不到，是因为用户体验太差了。

I think a lot of those founders that could have come and built awesome apps couldn't do it last cycle because the UX was garbage.

而这一轮，他们都转向了人工智能。

And this cycle, they just left to AI.

对吧？

Right?

这对加密应用来说真是个很糟糕的处境。

And that's just kind of like a really shitty situation for for crypto applications.

也许答案是这其实并不重要。

And, like, maybe the answer is it doesn't actually matter.

我们只需要像Aave这样全球性的借贷平台，然后就可以收工了。

We just need something like Aave, which is the global lending, and we can call it a day.

但我认为还有一个巨大的设计空间尚未被探索。

But I think there is a massive design space which just hasn't been explored.

而这些创始人已经不在了。

And its founders have been they don't they're not here anymore.

所以我们必须主动去做工作。

So we have to do proactive work.