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Z世代是我们有史以来最具退休意识和长期投资意识的一代。
Gen Z are the most retirement savvy and long term investment savvy generation we've ever had.
等等。
Wait.
什么？
What?
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
他们比以往任何一代人都更早地开设了退休账户。
They're opening retirement accounts at earlier ages than any generation in the past.
我认为Z世代当时开设退休账户的平均年龄是19岁。
I think the average age of Gen Z opening a retirement account at that point was 19.
所以之后这个年龄可能有所上升，但大概还是在二十岁出头。
So it might have gone up since then, but it's probably, like, early twenties.
你对比一下
You compare
与这个世界相比，
it to the world,
他们到25岁时已经这样了。
they're they're at 25.
Bankless Nation，我们再次邀请到Robinhood的创始人兼首席执行官弗拉德·特内夫。
Bankless Nation, we are once again joined by Vlad Tenev, the founder and CEO of Robinhood.
弗拉德，欢迎再次做客Bankless。
Vlad, welcome back to Bankless.
能和你们在一起总是很愉快。
Always a pleasure to be with you guys.
谢谢。
Thank you.
弗拉德，我们给你安排了整整六十分钟。
Vlad, we've got you in the ring for sixty minutes.
所以我们已经为你准备了大约六十分钟的快速问答环节。
So we've prepped about sixty minutes of lightning round questions for you.
你准备好了吗？
Are you ready?
天哪。
Oh, gosh.
我上场了。
I'm in the ring.
好吧。
Okay.
我准备好了。
I'm ready.
六十分钟会很快过去。
Sixty minutes are gonna come at you fast.
我们先从巨大的财富转移开始。
We're gonna start with the great wealth transfer.
未来几十年，随着婴儿潮一代和沉默一代将他们的资产传承给X世代、千禧一代和Z世代，预计将发生一场巨大的代际资产转移，仅在美国，未来二十年左右就有约7万亿至9万亿美元的财富转移，这是历史上规模最大的一次财富转移。
So there's a massive inter intergenerational shift of assets expected over the coming decades as baby boomers, silent generation pass on their wealth to Gen X, millennials, Gen Z, roughly 70 to 90,000,000,000,000 in The US alone transferring over the next twenty ish years, largest wealth transfer in history.
这在多大程度上指导了Robinhood的战略？
How much of this guides Robinhood's strategy?
你们多久会思考一次这7万亿到9万亿美元的机会？还是说Robinhood的决策更多是由其他因素驱动的？
How often are you thinking about this 70 to $90,000,000,000,000 opportunity, or is there something else that's kind of guiding you at Robinhood?
我们确实经常考虑这个问题。
We think about it quite a bit.
我认为，如果你观察一下，很多公司已经开始谈论这场伟大的财富转移。
And I think I think if you look, a lot of companies have started talking about this great wealth transfer.
当然，过去它只在一些小众圈子里被讨论，比如经济学家之类的人。
And, of course, it was sort of like in niche circles discussed maybe like by economists and stuff like that.
但我认为，你可以追溯到去年我们在Gold活动上推出Robinhood银行服务时，它才真正成为金融科技领域的一个重要话题。
But but I think you can trace back the origins of it being a a big fintech topic to last year when we launched Robinhood banking at our gold event.
我们从最高层面思考Robinhood的定位时，希望服务所有客户，无论是企业还是机构客户，无论是美国本土还是国际用户。
And the way we think about Robinhood at the highest possible level is we want to serve all customers, whether they're business or institutional, whether they're US or international.
Robinhood 应该成为你所有资金和资产得到最佳服务的地方，存入和提取资金都应尽可能简便。
And Robinhood should be the place where all of your money and assets are served best, and it should be as easy as possible to deposit into Robinhood and as easy as possible to withdraw.
但我们也把每一次取款视为系统中的一个机会或缺陷，值得我们去改进。
But we also treat every withdrawal as an opportunity or a defect with the system that we can fix.
当老一辈经历遗产传承、将资金交给年轻一代时，我们认为这是一次巨大的机遇——我们不仅要服务老一辈，还要提供全面的产品和功能，让你把钱和资产放在别处反而处于劣势。
And, you know, we think that we have a huge opportunity as these older generations are having inheritance events and and giving money to younger to not just serve the older generations, but to have all the products and features so that you're at a disadvantage keeping your money and and assets elsewhere.
这真正塑造了我们为平台添加哪些产品和功能的战略方向。
That's really been informing our strategy of what types of products and features we wanted to add to the ecosystem.
显然，信贷和银行业务让我们接触到大量目前存放在支票和储蓄账户中的资产，以及占客户资金使用行为很大比例的消费流动。
Obviously, credit and banking gives us access to a large chunk of of assets out there that are being that are that are being stored in checking and savings accounts and also the the spending flows, which comprise so much of of what customers do with their money.
而今年，我们推出了监护账户、信托账户，并扩展了平台上的资产种类，这帮助我们同时吸引刚收到资产的年轻客户，以及目前持有大量资产的成熟客户。
And then if you look at this year, custodial accounts, trust accounts, expanding the assets that we offer on the platform, that helps us go after both sort of like the youngest customers at the point of of receiving assets, but also wealthier established customers, which is where the the assets currently sit.
我们并不是坐等人们继承财富。
So it's not like we're just sitting there waiting for people to inherit money.
我们正在努力服务父母和祖父母，让他们清楚地意识到，今天使用其他金融平台反而处于劣势。
We're trying to serve the parents and grandparents and make it clear they're at a disadvantage using any other financial platform today.
我认为，当我们迎来财富转移的高峰期时，这一定位将使我们占据有利位置，而我们预计这一高峰期将在八到十年后发生。
And I think that positions us well when we get to kind of the hump of the wealth transfer, which we anticipate will happen in about eight to ten years.
让我们谈谈八到十年后的情况。
Let's talk about eight to ten years from now.
自从你们公司成立以来的过去十五年左右，金融行业已经发生了巨大变化。
Finance has changed a lot in the in the past fifteen or so years since you guys have been around.
到2040年，金融行业会是什么样子？
How is finance going to look in 2040?
它会在哪些方面保持不变，又会在哪些方面有所不同？
In what ways will it be the same versus different?
因为我想我刚才提到金融已经发生了巨大变化，确实如此，在很多方面都是如此。
Because I guess I did just say finance has changed a lot, and it has in many ways.
但在其他方面，它又和过去非常相似。
But in other ways, it's like it's very similar to how it actually was.
2040年的金融会是什么样子？
What does finance 2040 look like?
我们是在做24小时×7天、365天全天候的市场吗？
Are we doing 24 by seven, three sixty five markets?
AI有参与其中吗？
Is, like, AI involved?
我的意思是，哪些方面相同，哪些方面不同呢？
I mean, what's the same and what's different then?
是的。
Yeah.
我认为我们肯定会实现24小时×7天、365天全天候的市场。
I think that we'll definitely have twenty four seven, three sixty five markets.
这一点我们在2022年就已在股票领域开始推动，当时推出了24小时交易，现在整个行业正在迎头赶上。
That's something that we started, like, pushing towards in 2022 on the equity side with twenty four hour market, and now you see the industry catching up.
许多交易所正在规划实现24小时运营，并在周末开放。
A lot of the exchanges are making plans to go twenty four seven and and open on weekends.
我认为技术上已经具备条件，虽然还有一些工作要做，但我相信这件事会比预期早很多发生。
And I think the technology is certainly there and there's some work to be done, but but but I think I think it's gonna happen much before then.
代币化，这是我们一直在推进的另一件事。
Tokenization, which is another thing that we were pushing ahead with.
去年，我们在法国举办了一场活动，推出了大量美国股票的代币化版本。
Last year, we did an event in France where we launched tokenized versions of a large number of US stocks.
我认为我们现在已经有数千个了。
I think we're at well into the thousands now.
我们一直在扩展这一服务，还包括OpenAI和SpaceX股票代币的赠送活动。
We've been expanding that offering and also the OpenAI and SpaceX stock token giveaways.
所以这仍然处于早期阶段，我们还处于旅程的第一阶段。
And so that's still early, and we're still in phase one of our journey.
但我认为到今年年底，股票代币应该会比在经纪账户中购买传统股票更具优势。
But I think by the end of this year, we should be at a point where the stock tokens actually have advantages over over buying traditional stocks in a brokerage account.
我觉得这非常令人兴奋。
And I I think that's very exciting.
你可以想象，如果你能解决私募股权的24小时流动性访问问题，那对我来说是这个问题最难的版本。
And you can imagine if you if you can solve twenty four seven liquid access with private equity, that to me is the hardest version of of the problem.
这让你能够为几乎所有资产提供7x24小时、全年无休的市场。
That that allows you to have twenty four seven, three sixty five markets for pretty much everything.
说到代币化股票产品，就像你所说的，欧洲已经有超过一千种代币化股票上线了。
So talking about the tokenized stocks products around, like you said, over a thousand tokenized stocks live in in Europe.
而且你们几个月前刚刚上线了自己的二层网络测试网。
And also you've got your own layer two that came in test net just a number of weeks ago.
但美国用户目前还无法接触代币化股票产品。
But American users can't touch the tokenized stocks product yet.
随着美国证券交易委员会（SEC）立场的转变，你们距离将代币化股票引入美国还有多近？
With the SEC's posture shifting, how close are you to bringing tokenized stocks into The US?
你是否真的认为，你们所打造的7x24小时链上交易场所，是想挑战纽约证券交易所的模式，还是说你们正在进入加密世界的一种全新模式？
And do you actually think, like, the twenty four seven on chain trading venue is that you you guys are going after the New York Stock Exchange model, or is it just something different that you guys are penetrating into the crypto world?
你们如何定位自己正在构建的这套技术栈？
How do you just kinda position this, like, tech stack that you're building?
我们的技术栈分为两个部分。
There's two parts of the tech stack.
对吧？
Right?
会有中心化金融（CeFi）组件，即股票代币在Bitstamp和其他中心化交易所的可交易性。
There's gonna be the CeFi components, which is the tradability of the stock tokens on Bitstamp and other centralized exchanges.
而且我们显然正在为此做准备。
And obviously, we're we're gearing up for that.
同时，还有去中心化金融（DeFi）方面，如果你想要使用非托管钱包进行交换或参与DeFi协议，我们正在努力让股票代币能够在Robinhood链上，以及最终其他链上运行于DeFi生态中。
And also the DeFi aspects where if you wanna go on your non custodial wallet and and swap or engage with DeFi protocols, we're we're working to enable the stock tokens to be to be on DeFi, on Robinhood Chain, and and eventually other chains as well.
所以我们正在同时推进这两方面。
So we're we're doing both.
而且，是的，我们其实并不认为自己是在针对某个特定的传统金融机构。
And, yeah, we we don't really think about it as, you know, we're we're going after any particular legacy provider.
我认为这只是一个全新的事物。
I I think this is just this is a new thing.
而最接近的类比可能是，在加密生态中，你可以进行抵押借贷、交换等操作，但你所使用的代币通常没有实际的底层效用。
And probably the closest analog is, you know, you can do all these things in the creep up crypto e ecosystem with, like, collateralized lending and borrowing, swapping, but you're you're doing them with tokens that typically don't have underlying utility.
那么，当你真正将它们与现实世界的资产挂钩时，会发生什么？
So what what happens when you actually, you know, have them tied to real world assets?
我认为感觉会非常相似，但 Hopefully 会更好，因为这不仅仅是模因币，而是真正利用技术的力量来交易和交换具有真实基本面价值的资产。
I think it'll feel very similar, but it'll also hopefully feel better because it's not just meme coins, but but you're you're actually using the power of the technology for trading and swapping assets with with real fundamental utility.
关于上线时间，我认为在更大的问题之后，是如何确保我们提供的是人们真正想要的产品。
In terms of when it's available, I think the other thing after the bigger question is, like, how can we ensure what what the product that people want is.
对吧？
Right?
那差距在哪里？
And and and what's the delta?
关于美国，我们已经拥有健全的市场结构。
And the the thing about The US is we already have robust market structure.
我们已经具备交易股票的现有能力。
We have, you know, existing ability to trade stocks.
虽然还不是24/7，但已经接近24/5了。
It's not twenty four seven yet, but it's, like, twenty four five.
我认为在美国，我们最终会实现这样的状态：你可以以最低的手续费交易24.07美元、3.65美元这样的金额，并且这将成为一个大众化的产品。
And I I think we'll get to the end state in The US, which is, you know, you you being able to, you know, trade $24.07, $3.65 at the lowest possible fees, and and it'll be a a mass market product.
事实上，我觉得我们可能已经完成了90%。
In fact, I think we're we're probably, like, 90% there.
因此，目前还不太清楚它的价值点在哪里，消费者是否真的能理解代币化股票与其他产品的区别。
And so it's a little bit less clear what what the value add is and and whether consumers will actually even understand the the the difference between, you know, tokenized stocks and and others.
但我仍然认为，欧盟和美国以外的地区会率先实现这一变化。
But I I still think, you know, EU and and outside The US will happen first.
然后，在某些特定情况下，这种方式可能更有优势，届时这些功能可能会被引入美国。
And then there there may be certain situations in which it's better, and and and you'll see that ported to The US at some point later.
银河公司致力于数字资产与下一代基础设施的交汇点，为机构提供端到端服务。
GALAXY operates where digital assets and next generation infrastructure come together, serving institutions end to end.
在市场方面，银河公司是领先的机构平台，提供现货、衍生品、结构性产品、去中心化金融借贷、投资银行和融资服务。
On the market side, GALAXY is a leading institutional platform providing access to spot, derivatives, structured products, DeFi lending, investment banking, and financing.
凭借超过1600个交易对手，银河公司帮助机构应对市场周期的各个阶段。
With more than 1,600 trading counterparties, GALAXY helps institutions navigate every phase of the market cycle.
该平台还通过主动管理策略和机构级质押及区块链基础设施，支持长期资金配置者。
The platform also supports long term allocators through actively managed strategies and institutional grade staking and blockchain infrastructure.
这种规模是真实的。
That scale is real.
Galaxy平台上的资产超过120亿美元，2025年底平均贷款规模达18亿美元，体现了生态系统内深厚的信任。
Galaxy has over $12,000,000,000 in assets on the platform and averaged a $1,800,000,000 loan book in late twenty twenty five, reflecting deep trust across the ecosystem.
除了数字资产，Galaxy还在为人工智能驱动的未来构建基础设施。
Beyond digital assets, Galaxy is also building infrastructure for an AI powered future.
其Helios数据中心园区专为人工智能和高性能计算而建，已获批的电力容量超过1.6吉瓦，是同类中规模最大的站点之一。
Its Helios Data Center campus is purpose built for AI and high performance computing, with more than 1.6 gigawatts of approved power capacity, making it one of the largest sites of its kind.
从全球市场到为人工智能做好准备的数据中心，Galaxy正在端到端地服务数字资产生态系统。
From global markets to AI ready data centers, Galaxy is serving the digital asset ecosystem end to end.
请访问galaxy.com/bankless了解Galaxy，或点击节目说明中的链接。
Explore Galaxy at galaxy.com/bankless, or click the link in the show notes.
如果你能用与交易加密货币相同的工具和速度交易黄金、外汇和全球市场，会怎样？
What if you could trade gold, forex, and global markets with the same tools and speed that you use for crypto?
这正是 BITGET TRADFI 所实现的功能。
That's exactly what BITGET TRADFI unlocks.
在经历强劲的测试期需求后，包括单日黄金交易量超过一亿美元，BITGET TRADFI 现已向所有用户开放。
After strong beta demand, including over a $100,000,000 in single day gold trading volume, BITGET TRADFI is now live for all users.
在您现有的 BITGET 账户内，您可以交易涵盖外汇、贵金属、指数和商品的 79 种金融工具，所有交易均直接以 USDT 结算。
Inside of your existing BITGET account, you can trade 79 instruments across forex, precious metals, indices, and commodities, all settled directly in USDT.
无需切换平台，也无需法币兑换。
No platform switching and no fiat conversions.
这正是 BITGET 普适性交易所愿景的体现。
This is BITGET's universal exchange vision in action.
加密货币与传统金融并肩共存。
Crypto and traditional finance side by side.
您将获得深厚的流动性、极低的滑点，以及最高达 500 倍的杠杆，让您能够将加密策略应用于宏观市场。
You get deep liquidity, low slippage, and leverage up to 500 x, letting you apply crypto strategies to macro markets.
刚接触传统金融？
New to TRADFI?
从黄金开始。
Start with gold.
黄金兑美元货币对流动性强，受宏观因素驱动，是加密货币与传统市场之间自然的连接桥梁。
The gold USD pair is liquid, macro driven, and a familiar natural bridge between crypto and traditional markets.
立即在 bitget.com 上交易黄金。
Try trading gold on BITGET now at bitget.com.
点击节目说明中的链接获取更多信息。
Click the link in the show notes for more information.
这不是财务建议。
This is not financial advice.
你已经提到去中心化金融了，弗拉德，从自托管钱包和那里的代币化角度来看。
You mentioned decentralized finance already, Vlad, and from the perspective of self custodial wallets and and tokenization happening there.
像 Coinbase 和 Kraken 这样的交易所正在扩展我们在 Bankless 上所说的他们的 DeFi 多层结构，也就是前面看起来是传统金融。
There there are companies like Coinbase and Kraken exchanges that are growing out what we've called on Bankless that their DeFi mullet, which is kind of, you know, finance in the front.
前面看起来整洁漂亮，但后面却是去中心化金融的派对。
It looks nice and clean, but then there's the the DeFi party in the back.
他们正在链上开展借贷产品协议。
So they're doing things with lending and borrowing product protocols on chain.
通过像Morpho这样的协议，为消费者提供CeFi接口或DeFi接口。
So giving access to consumers and their CeFi interface or their their DeFi interface to protocols like Morpho.
甚至连贝莱德也在逐渐接受去中心化金融。
Even BlackRock has been warming up to decentralized finance.
当然，他们在二月推出了BITL基金。
They, of course, have the BITL fund in February.
他们通过在Uniswap上架BITGL，进一步深化了对DeFi的布局。
They actually deepened their push into DeFi by by listing BITGL on Uniswap.
你在Robinhood对去中心化金融的战略是什么？
What what's your strategy at Robinhood for decentralized finance?
因为确实存在一种情况，就像是西部荒野。
Because there's certainly an element where it's kind of the Wild West.
这是无许可的。
It's permissionless.
它是开放的。
It's open.
有很多创新。
There's a lot of innovation.
可能也存在一些令人担忧的事情。
There's some scary things maybe that that goes on.
但另一方面，这些实验非常出色、了不起。
Yet on the other hand, these experiments are incredible, tremendous.
这似乎正是加密货币能为金融带来的、与传统做法不同的关键所在。
It does seem like that's the differentiator between what crypto can bring to finance versus versus what they're doing traditionally.
你的策略是什么？
What's your strategy for this?
是的。
Yeah.
我们的策略是全栈式的。
The strategy is really full stack.
我的意思是，为了让生态系统运转起来，我们需要吸引大量用户。
I mean, in order for the ecosystem to work, we need to bring in a lot of customers.
因此，通过Robinhood应用以及日益增多的Robinhood钱包，我们正在扩大分发渠道，吸引了许多对这些服务感兴趣的用户。
And and so through Robinhood app and increasingly Robinhood wallet, we're growing distribution, and we have customers that are coming in that that have interest in these services.
同时，我们还涵盖了另一端，即CeFi和DeFi的基础设施。
Then we also have the opposite end, which is the infrastructure, both both CeFi and DeFi.
对于DeFi，我们有Robinhood链，你们提到过我们已经发布了它的测试网。
And for for DeFi, we've got Robinhood Chain, which you guys mentioned we launched the test net of.
而且，测试网的进展非常顺利。
And, I mean, the the test net has been going really well.
开发者和应用的参与程度超出了我们的预期。
Like, the the amount of engagement from developers and applications exceeded our our expectations.
一开始，我想，好吧，Robinhood链最坏的情况也只是我们用来将自身产品代币化并提供给客户的链。
And, you know, at the beginning, I thought, okay, Robinhood Chain, worst case scenario is this is like a chain for us to tokenize our own products and offer them to our customers.
对吧？
Right?
即使在这种情况下，我认为它也会成为最大的链之一。
And even in that scenario, I think it becomes one of the biggest chains.
但我们看到，开发者活动和兴趣已经超出了我们的预期。
But what we've seen is the developer activity and interest has exceeded our expectations.
因此，我越来越有信心，人们真的会希望与这条链集成。
So now I'm getting increasingly confident that actually people people are gonna wanna integrate with the chain.
开发者们将希望快速地在上面构建并提供产品。
Developers are gonna wanna build and offer products very, very quickly on it.
于是，问题就变成了如何进行筛选。
And and so then the problem becomes one of curation.
对吧？
Right?
我们会在链上拥有所有这些产品。
We'll have all these products on the chain.
我们也有所有的客户。
We have all these customers.
我们如何确保这些产品中最优秀的能够进入我们的中心化金融和大规模分发产品中，让我们的客户能够轻松地在成千上万看似相似、但实际风险特征和底层动态各不相同的产品中找到适合自己的？
How can we make sure that the best of those products make make its way to our CeFi and large distribution products so that, you know, our our customers can can sort of, like, find their way around the sea of just, like, thousands of of products that on the surface seem very similar, but but might have, you know, different risk profiles, different dynamics underneath.
我们来谈谈预测市场吧。
Let's talk about prediction markets.
这个领域的发展速度简直惊人。
So that's something that has been growing like crazy.
我不知道你是否对这种增长感到惊讶。
I don't know if you've been surprised at the growth.
我们长期以来一直看好多预测市场，但即使是我们，也对过去几年的增长速度感到非常意外。
We've been long time bullish prediction markets, but even we have been very surprised at the growth over the last couple of years.
现在，像我们这样的支持者在Bankless上说，这些是信息市场，对社会有益，是新闻和事件的‘真相机器’，并支持基于权益的投票机制。
Now, proponents, like probably us on on Bankless, say that these are information markets, that these are good for society, that they're truth machines for things like news and events, you know, stake weighted voting around this.
商品期货交易委员会（CFTC）甚至对预测市场持支持态度。
The CFTC is even supportive of prediction markets.
我们刚刚邀请了迈克·塞利格做客播客，他谈到这些属于CFTC完全管辖范围内的‘事件市场’。
We just had Mike Selig on the podcast, and he talked about these being event markets under the full jurisdiction of the CFTC.
但有一群人反对预测市场，对此颇有微词。
But there are there there's a crowd that's kind of anti prediction markets and and some clamoring about this.
有些人说，这不过是另一种形式的赌博。
So Some people say it's, just another form of of gambling.
它并不一定对社会有益。
It's not necessarily good for society.
它会让人上瘾。
It creates, you know, addictions.
它可能助长内幕交易。
It incents maybe insider trading.
因此，预测市场也面临一些批评。
So there's some criticism of prediction markets as well.
你怎么看？
What what's your take?
我对预测市场的最高层面很了解。
I knew the highest level on on prediction markets.
这些东西对社会有益吗？
Are these things good for society?
它们对社会有害吗？
Are they are they bad for society?
批评者在这个问题上有没有忽略什么？
Is there something that the critics are missing here with this story?
我认为它们对社会是有益的。
I think they're they're good for society.
我认为很多人没有意识到的是，预测市场确实存在交易和成交量。
And I think what what a lot of people don't realize about prediction markets is, sure, there's there's trading and and volume that's happening on them.
这些交易的成交量远小于股票市场或期权市场的成交量。
The trading volume is much smaller than it is in equities markets or options markets.
但这些市场还有更广泛的用途，比如作为“真相机器”，作为传统新闻媒体的替代品。
But there's also a much broader use case of these being used as truth machines as being alternatives to traditional news media.
越来越多的美国人正在转向预测市场，以更清晰地了解什么是真实的，或者什么可能发生。
So more and more Americans are increasingly turning to prediction markets to have clarity on what's true or what's likely to happen.
过去，人们会去新闻媒体获取这些信息。
And it it used to be that they would go to news media for this.
但随着新闻媒体的商业模式越来越远离提供真相、提供信息或尽快告诉你可能发生的事情，而更多地转向如何延迟你获取信息，让你只是被娱乐并观看更多广告？
But as the business model of news media has gone further and further away from giving you the truth and giving you the information or what's likely to happen as quickly as possible and more toward how can we delay you getting the information so that you're just like entertained and can watch more ads?
这就留下了一个空白，而原始目的正是如此：比如我想知道某件事，获得真正的信息。
That's opened up a hole for the original purpose, which is, let's say I wanna know something and and get, like, the actual information.
那这种机制是什么？
What what's what's the mechanism for that?
我认为预测市场很好地填补了这一空白。
And and I think prediction markets have filled in that gap quite well.
随着时间推移，你会看到它们在各个领域迅速普及。
And and you'll see over time that they just like proliferate everywhere.
Robinhood 有没有一个专门针对媒体和内容方向的垂直板块？
Is there a wing, a a vertical at Robinhood, part of the the prediction market stack that is leaning towards a little bit more media and content then?
你知道，每个新科技公司都好像想变成一家社交媒体公司。
There's like, you know, every company, like every new tech company kinda wants to become a social media company.
你知道，像萨姆·阿尔特曼和OpenAI就想打造一个社交媒体板块。
You know, like Sam Altman and Opening Eye wants a bit wants to build out a social media arm.
如果Robinhood要成为预测市场的首页，这似乎很合适，我记得好像看到过一些关于Robinhood具有社交功能的内容，比如交易者可以讨论他们的盈亏、头寸和投资组合。
It does seem fitting that if Robinhood is going to be a front page of sorts of prediction markets, and I think I remember seeing something about like social a social element of Robinhood where like traders can, talk about their p and l's and their their positions and their portfolio.
而且我们已经有类似的东西了，比如股票相关的Twitter，叫StockTwits之类的。
And that's you know, we have things like, what's that Twitter for stocks, stock twits or whatever.
是的。
Yeah.
之前就一直存在一个复杂的体系，涉及内容、金融、新闻，以及那些想讨论这些话题的人。
There there has been this complex of things before like content and finance and news and people who want to talk about such such a thing.
如果Robinhood将成为预测市场分发给用户的主要平台，那么它衍生出一个日益壮大的媒体内容板块也就顺理成章了。
It would make sense that if Robinhood is is going to be the place where a lot of prediction market markets get distributed to users, that there's like a growing media content arm out of Robinhood.
你有没有明确地考虑过这个问题，还是说这只是个副产品？
Do you think about this explicitly or is it more of a byproduct?
你是怎么看待这个问题的？
How do you think about this?
是的。
Yeah.
当然。
Absolutely.
你提到的产品Robinhood Social，我们在Hood Summit上发布了，未来几周将向客户推出。
So the the product you mentioned, Robinhood Social, we announced that at Hood Summit, and that's gonna be rolling out to to customers in the coming weeks.
目前已经在内部测试中。
It's already an internal testing.
我认为其中一个主要优势是我们拥有如此多的资产，而预测市场将成为第一等重要的功能。
And one of the, I think, big differentiators is that we have so many assets available, and prediction markets in particular are gonna be a first class citizen.
你可以看到预测市场的交易以及生态系统中用户对这些交易的评论。
So you'll be able to see the prediction markets trades and kind of the the comments around those from from people in the ecosystem.
我坚信用户生成的内容——你不可能手动筛选所有内容，也无法及时捕捉到预测市场中所有突发新闻和新动态。
So I'm a huge believer in in user generated content like the you're just not gonna be able to curate everything and be able to catch all the breaking news and all of the new things that happen with prediction markets.
但如果你有数百万客户都在参与交易，或以其他方式参与市场，那么即使在你人工筛选之前，你也能发现大量精彩内容。
But if you have millions of customers that are all participating, trading, or or just engaging otherwise in the markets, then I think you'll you'll surface a lot of a lot of great things even even before much before you can curate.
我们现在认为，也有空间保留经过筛选的自有新闻内容，这就是我们的媒体部门Sherwood Media的用武之地。
Now we think there is room for curated first party news as well, and that's where Sherwood Media, which is our our media arm comes in.
他们每天都在产出高质量的内容，而且越来越多的内容都整合了预测市场。
And, you know, they're they're churning out content, high quality content on a daily basis, and and more more and more of that has prediction markets integrated.
你们对预测市场的战略是什么？
What's the strategy for prediction markets for you guys?
我知道你们和Call She已经有合作关系了，对吧？
Is this and I I know there's a partnership in place, obviously, with with Call She.
是自己开发？
Is it build your own?
是进一步深化与这家公司的合作？
Is it double down on that partnership?
你们希望提供多种选择吗？
Do you wanna have a variety of options here?
我们与Kalshi以及另一家交易所ForecastX建立了合作关系。
We partner with Kalshi and also another exchange, ForecastX.
从某种意义上说，如果你看看我们为客户提供的一切其他产品，大多数情况下，我们并不拥有完整的全栈服务。
And in a sense, if you look at all of our other products that we offer for customers, most of the time, we don't have the absolute full stack.
对吧？
Right?
在股票方面，我们并不是交易所。
For for equities, we're not the exchange.
对吧？
Right?
我们的部分订单最终会在交易所执行，但我们自己并不是交易所或做市商。
We some of our orders end up executed on exchanges, but we ourselves aren't an exchange or a market maker.
我们与许多其他交易对手合作来完成这些操作，但我们自己负责经纪和清算。
We work with, you know, lots of other counterparties to do that, but we do our own brokering and clearing.
所以，如果你把让股票交易成为可能的过程看作是由三个实体共同完成的，那么我们拥有其中两个——介绍经纪人和清算经纪人，但不是执行场所。
So if if you had if you sort of think of it as three entities helping make your stock trade possible, we we have two of them, the introducing broker, the clearing broker, but not the not not the execution venue.
在加密货币方面，我们则涵盖了全部三个角色。
For crypto, we do all three.
所以我们负责执行、托管和经纪，并且有了Bitstamp的加持，我们现在也拥有了一个交易场所。
So we execute, we custody, we broker, and, you know, with BITGET stamp, we we now have an exchange venue.
对于预测市场，我认为它会像加密货币一样逐步发展。
For prediction markets, I think it'll evolve similarly to how crypto has evolved.
所以我们并不会把100%的订单都发送给Bitstamp。
So we don't send a 100% of our orders to Bitstamp.
我们只发送一部分。
We send a chunk.
Bitstamp与其他所有交易场所竞争，看谁能更好地服务客户。
Bitstamp competes with all of the other venues for who can serve customers the best.
而且，作为Robinhood工程团队的一部分，他们确实有一些优势。
And, you know, they they have certain advantages taking being part of Robinhood engineering.
我们也有一个出色的工程团队，长期专注于高性能产品，但他们作为交易所，仍与所有其他做市商和交易所站在同一起跑线上竞争。
And, you know, we have a a great engineering team and we've just sort of cut our teeth on high performance products, but they compete as an exchange business on a level playing field with all other market makers and exchanges.
预测市场也是同样的理念。
And that's also the idea for prediction markets.
当然，我们预计当自己的交易平台上线后，它们的表现会很好。
Of course, we expect that when we get our own venue up and running, they'll do well.
但归根结底，我们最重视的是确保客户获得最佳的产品体验。
But but at the end of the day, what we prioritize is making sure customers have the best product experience.
“娱乐”这个词在金融语境中越来越频繁地被使用。
The word entertainment is becoming used more and more frequently in a financial context.
对于像婴儿潮一代、X世代这样的年长群体来说，这肯定显得有点荒谬。
For some of the older generations like boomers, Gen X, I'm sure this is like kinda like absurd to them.
现在，当婴儿潮一代进行理财时，他们会去银行。
Now when when boomers go and do finance, they go to a bank.
如果他们想娱乐，就会去看电影。
If they want entertainment, they go to the movies.
这两者一直是分开的。
These things stay separated.
随着时间推移，新一代人成长起来，这两者逐渐融合在了一起。
As time has gone on, as generations have have grown up, this they have been more commingled.
这一切正开始逐渐融合成同一件事。
This is starting to all kind of become the same thing.
这几乎就是Z世代最初了解金融、交易和投资的方式。
This is this is almost how Gen Z is like learning about finance, about trading, investing, finance in the first place.
它就发生在这种金融娱乐的语境中。
It's like in this kind of financial entertainment context.
预测市场绝对是其中的一部分。
Prediction markets definitely is a part of this.
在加密货币领域，我们有模因币。
On the crypto side, we have MemeCoins.
你认为为什么娱乐正成为年轻一代现代金融中如此重要的一部分？
Why do you think entertainment is growing to be such an important part of, like, the modern day finance for younger generations?
此外，这值得鼓励吗？
Also, is this something to encourage?
作为平台，你认为自己在这里的责任是什么？既要负责任地管理金融娱乐这一日益增长且需求旺盛的领域，又要避免过度发展所带来的各种负面后果。
As a platform, what do you think your responsibility is here to responsibly manage the fact that entertainment finance is a growing sector that is in demand, but also avoid any of the, like, toxic adverse consequences that comes with, like, overdoing it.
是的
Yeah.
我对这个有个大胆的看法。
I I have a hot take on this.
我其实不认同娱乐正在推动大量金融活动这一观点。
I actually don't believe in the thesis that entertainment is driving a chunk of like, a a huge chunk of financial activity.
我认为真正发生的是，没人愿意谈论其中不具娱乐性的部分。
I think that what's actually happening is nobody wants to talk about the nonentertaining aspects of it.
而关于这些事情的推文不会走红。
And, you know, tweets about those things don't go viral.
对吧？
Right?
不对。
No.
谈论Robinhood退休业务增长有多快，或者我们的资产中有多少比例投入了ETF等被动工具，或者我们的客户如何多元化并安全地进行长期投资，这些都不是什么有趣的谈资。
It's like not an interesting take to talk about, you know, how fast growing Robinhood's retirement business is or, you know, what percentage of our assets are in passive vehicles like ETFs or, you know, how much our customers are diversifying and investing safely for the long term.
所以最终发生的情况是，这些事情一直在进行。
So what what you end up happening is that stuff is going on.
没人写文章讨论这些。
Nobody's writing articles about it.
这些在推特上也不会走红。
It's not going viral on Twitter.
因此，你会产生一种错觉，天啊，一切都在变成这种投机娱乐的空间。
And so you have the perception that, oh my god, everything is everything is turning into this, like, degen entertainment space.
但实际情况是，我们的注意力只是被这些类型的事情 hijacked 了。
But but what's happening is our attention is just being being hijacked by by those types of things.
所以，我认为这是人类的一种重大逻辑谬误。
And so we just assume I think it's a big logical fallacy that humans have.
他们认为，因为很多人在谈论某件事，那它就是最重要的事。
They assume that because someone's talking about something a lot, then that's, like, the the most important thing.
但确实，我不这么认为。
But, yeah, I I don't think it is.
当我们实际查看我们的活动和平台上的情况时，40%的资产现在都集中在资产类工具中，包括退休账户、ETF和现金。
And when we look at actually our our activities and what's happening on the platform, 40% of assets are now in asset vehicles, which which include retirement, ETFs, cash.
我认为这个比例随着时间推移还会继续增长。
And and I think that's gonna be a growing number over time.
即使看我们最活跃的交易者，比如那些交易期权和期货的人，他们也最有可能同时使用我们的被动型产品，比如Robinhood策略和退休账户。
And if you look at even our most active traders, like the folks that are trading options and futures, those are the people that are most likely to also use our passive products, like Robinhood strategies and retirement.
他们与这些产品的关系表现为多个账户。
And what their relationship looks like is multiple accounts.
他们会把不同的活动分门别类地放在不同的账户里，用于不同的目的。
They bucket their activities into different accounts, use them for different purposes.
即使在个人层面，他们的部分交易可能是投机性的，也可能是系统性的，但他们通常拥有一个更大规模的、更偏向被动管理的投资组合。
And even within an individual, some of their activity might be speculative trading or more systematic trading, but but they typically have a larger portfolio that's, you know, more passive.
从某种程度上说，听到这些真的很好。
At some level, this is really good to hear.
你这里其实提供了一个相反的观点。
You got kind of a sort of a a counter narrative here.
因为如果你仔细听大卫所说的，娱乐金融方面，媒体几乎在说年轻一代正在参与投机活动。
Because if you listen to basically what David was saying, I mean, entertainment finance, it it almost seems like the media is saying that younger generations are engaging in speculative activity.
他们只是在赌博，因为在这个经济环境下他们看不到希望，所以对财务状况不负责任。
They're just gambling because they don't have a hope in this economy, so they're being irresponsible with respect to their, you know, financials.
这就是为什么虚无主义源自中国。
This is why nihilism comes from China.
但你说你实际上并没有看到这种情况。
But you're you're saying you're actually not seeing that.
我的意思是，如果你确实没有看到这种现象，那真是好消息，因为现在有一种流行的说法认为千禧一代、甚至更年轻的千禧一代和Z世代在财务上不负责任，根本不追求长期目标。
I mean, it it to the extent to the extent that you're not seeing that, that's good to hear because there is this popular narrative out there that in millennials and even younger millennials and Gen Z are being irresponsible with their finances, and they're really not looking for long term goals.
但你说这并不是这些人群的典型特征。
But you're saying that's not actually characteristic in the demographic.
你看到的是这些世代、这些年轻群体中的负责任行为。
You're seeing responsible behavior in these in these generations, in these younger age groups.
这是这个故事的一部分吗？
Is that part of the story?
当然。
Absolutely.
对。
Yeah.
实际上，Z世代是有史以来最懂退休规划和长期投资的一代。
Actually, Gen Z are the most retirement savvy and long term investment savvy generation we've ever had.
等等。
Wait.
什么？
What?
对。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
他们比以往任何一代都更早地开设了退休账户。
They're opening retirement accounts at earlier ages than any generation in the past.
我几个月前查过这个数据，你们可以自己去查一下，看看我说得对不对。
I I checked this statistic couple months ago, and you guys can can can look it up and and keep me honest.
但我觉得当时Z世代开设退休账户的平均年龄是19岁。
But I think the average age of Gen Z opening a retirement account at that point was 19.
所以之后这个数字可能有所上升，但大概还是在二十岁出头左右。
So it it might have gone up since then, but it's probably, like, early twenties.
你要是跟全世界比的话，其他国家的人平均要到25岁才开始。
You compare it to the world, they're they're at 25.
所以人们普遍认为，Z世代对长期投资非常敏锐和了解。
So people are generally I I think I think Gen Z is, like, very savvy and very attuned to long term investing.
而且我觉得，如果你看看那些交易员，很多人把主动交易一概归为赌博。
And I think if you look at the traders as well, a lot of people just lump active trading into the gambling bucket.
但事实上，主动交易其实包含很多不同类型。
But in reality, there's, like, lots of different types of of active trading.
有一些人非常系统化，他们一直在寻找定价偏差，他们在Discord聊天群里活跃，你也能在X上看到他们。
And there are folks that are incredibly systematic and are out there looking for mispricings, know, and and they're on the Discord chats and you can see them on x.
但你知道，他们实际上为各种产品制定了合法的策略，比如期货，还有像体育预测市场这样的东西。
But, you know, they they actually have legitimate strategies for all types of products, you know, futures, but also things like sports prediction markets.
所以我想区分一下这种活动：它是有策略、有系统的，而很多人所谓的赌博，其实只是比如，我会因为对本地球队有情感依恋而押5美元。
And so I I would just distinguish that activity, is strategic and systematic from what a lot of people call gambling, which is basically like, you know, I'm I'm gonna put $5 on, you know, my my local team because I have an emotional attachment to it.
我认为这个区别很重要。
I think that's an important distinction.
你认为这背后的原因是什么？
What do you think accounts for this?
所以你是在说，Z世代实际上行为非常负责任，他们是知情的投资者。
So you you're making the the argument that the Gen Zs are actually acting, you know, very financially responsible, and they're they're informed investors.
他们正在以创纪录的数量开设退休账户。
They're, you know, opening retirement accounts and and kind of record numbers.
他们是只是信息更灵通吗？
Are they just, like, better informed?
是不是Robinhood在访问渠道方面提供了什么帮助？
Is there something that maybe Robinhood is providing with respect to access?
让我告诉你我的故事。
I'll I'll tell you kind of my story.
以前设立退休账户非常麻烦、笨拙且困难。
It's just like setting up a retirement account used to be really hard and clunky and difficult to do.
也许他们以创纪录的数量开设账户的部分原因在于，现在变得简单多了。
And part of maybe the theory is as to why they're doing it in record numbers is because, like, now it's just easier.
你不需要再去见理财顾问，填写一大堆纸质表格。
And you don't have to, like, go meet with a financial adviser and fill out all of these paper forms.
你只需要点击几个按钮，就能轻松开设退休账户。
You just click a few buttons and bam, you've got a retirement account.
所以这看起来显而易见。
So it seems really obvious.
是访问便捷性在其中起了作用吗？还是你认为为什么千禧一代会大量开设退休账户？
Is access part of the story, or why do you think Gen Z is is opening retirement accounts in in large numbers?
是的。
Yeah.
我认为访问便捷确实是其中一个重要因素。
I think access is definitely part of the story.
我的意思是，我们看到了我们的退休产品被广泛采用。
I mean, we've seen huge adoption of our retirement product.
经济激励和针对退休的政策导向也起到了很大作用。
The economics and the incentives being pointed toward retirement help quite a bit as well.
如果你看看我们实际激励的产品，对于黄金会员，退休账户能获得3%的公司匹配贡献。
If you look at what products we actually incentivize, I mean, for a gold member, retirement gets you a 3% contribution match.
我不是想听起来像在打广告，因为这不是我的本意，但确实很多人觉得，哦，Robinhood在激励所有这些投机性产品。
Not to make this sound like an advertisement because that's not the intent, but that's actually a lot of people are like, oh, well, Robinhood's incentivizing all these speculative products.
但你看看我们真正激励的是什么——是退休账户。
You look at what we actually incentivize, it's retirement.
我认为这会引起共鸣，因为如果你看看退休账户的税务优势，再看看我们实际上在提供匹配贡献，再加上越来越多的人成为自由职业者，不再有传统的全职工作，而是从事零工或合同工作。
And I think that resonates because if you look at the tax advantages of a retirement account and then you look at, you know, we're basically giving you a match and the increasing trend of more and more people becoming independent contractors, not having traditional full time employment, but, you know, doing gig work or or doing contracting.
我认为这是一个很好的产品，能够填补这一空白，因为这个国家的年轻人对传统的401(k)计划或雇主提供的养老金计划依赖性更小。
I think it's a it's a it's a good product to come fill in that gap because a young person in this country has a little bit less ability to rely on traditional four zero one k's or employer sponsored pension plans.
所以现在存在一个缺口，我认为我们正在努力填补。
So there's a gap that right now, you know, I think we're we're coming to help fill.
是的。
Yeah.
退休资产从几年前的零增长到我们最新季度财报时的250亿美元以上。
And retirement assets have grown from zero a couple years ago to north of 25,000,000,000 as of our latest quarterly earnings.
因此，它一直在迅猛增长。
So it's it's been it's been growing tremendously.
Robinhood策略是我们的一款数字投资建议产品，本质上是一个设置好就不用管的系统。
Robinhood strategies, which is our digital advice product, basically a set in and forget it system.
你存入资金后，技术加上我们作为受托人管理该账户的投资专家团队会代你打理，自该产品发布以来，大约一年内，规模已从零增长到约15亿美元。
You put money in and technology as well as our team of investment professionals managing that on your behalf as a fiduciary, that's grown from zero to about 1 and a half billion in in in about a year since since that was announced.
所以，它也在非常迅速地增长。
So that's been growing very, very quickly as well.
然后你们可能也注意到了Robinhood风投。
And then you guys probably saw Robinhood Ventures.
展开剩余字幕（还有 340 条）
嗯。
Mhmm.
这另一个目标是作为长期工具。
It's it's another it's intended to be a long term vehicle.
对吧？
Right?
你并不是在交易这些个股，而是我们在构建一个私人资产组合。
You're not trading these individual names, but instead we're we're creating a portfolio of privates.
是的。
Yeah.
我认为，互联网上现有的信息，有很多优质的个人理财内容，不仅仅是交易内容，再加上我们提供的工具，确实产生了显著影响。
I I think that I think that the information that you have out there on the Internet, there's a lot of really good personal finance content, not just trading content, as well as the tools that we offer people have have really moved the needle here.
弗拉德，如果你听这个播客，你可能会知道。
Vlad, you'll maybe you'll know if you listen to the podcast.
播客的听众都知道，我和瑞安相比，我是那个更愿意承担风险的人。
Listeners of the podcast will know that I'm the risk taker between me and Ryan.
作为Robinhood的黄金会员，我已经充分利用了我的退休账户激励。
And I will say, as a gold member of Robinhood, I have maxed out my retirement account incentives.
为你感到骄傲。
Proud of you.
太棒了。
That's great.
瑞安，瑞安，你也是用Robinhood退休账户吗？还是你的IRA在别处？
Ryan, Ryan, do you use Robinhood Retirement as well or is your IRA elsewhere?
目前我的IRA在别处。
Right now my IRA is elsewhere.
这主要是因为之前雇主的账户一直没动，要转移出来挺麻烦的，或者说我还没来得及处理。
And it's a product of it being stuck in kind of a previous employer, basically, and it's just hard to kinda get out or I haven't done it yet.
我来跟你说说账户转移的流程。
Well, I will tell you the rollover process.
这方面我们一直在大力投入和改进。
That's something we've been we've been working very, very, very much on.
所以，你应该去看看。
So, yeah, you should, you should take a look.
对。
Yeah.
如果能把所有东西都集中到一个地方，确实很有吸引力。
There is something attractive about getting everything in the same place if that can be done.
也许我们可以稍后讨论一下超级应用这个想法。
And may maybe that's a topic we'll, we'll turn to in a little bit, the idea of a super app.
但是，大卫，我觉得你刚才想说。
But, David, I think you had Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
你有什么想问的吗。
Something you wanted to ask.
我们可以聊聊即使是不到19岁的人的账户。
We can talk about accounts for, you know, even people younger than 19.
有一个新话题是特朗普账户，它被纳入了那项宏伟的法案中，而该法案已经通过，因此我们现在正在推行特朗普账户。
There's the new topic of Trump accounts, which got put into the big beautiful bill and so which which passed, and so we are getting Trump accounts.
对于不太了解的人，特朗普账户是指每个孩子出生时，政府从国库拨出一千美元，由纳税人出资。
For those who aren't familiar, Trump accounts are a thousand dollars of a government comes from the treasury, so paid for by taxpayers.
为2025年至2028年间出生的每个孩子设立投资账户。
Investment accounts for every child born between 2025 and 2028.
账户在孩子年满18岁前无法取出，资金将被动投资于低成本的美国股票指数。
It's locked until they are 18, and it's just passively invested in low cost US stock indexes.
弗拉德，你曾称这太棒了。
Vlad, you have called this amazing.
你为什么如此推崇特朗普账户？
Why are you such a fan of Trump accounts?
我认为我们讨论的许多鼓励参与和长期投资的措施，都是由个人自主选择参与的。
I think a lot of the things that we're talking about for encouraging participation and long term investing are opt in by individuals.
对吧？
Right?
你必须创建一个Robinhood账户。
You have to create a Robinhood account.
你必须主动采取行动。
You have to actually take the initiative.
必须有人带你完成整个过程。
Someone has to walk you through it.
特朗普账户的美妙之处在于，每个孩子出生时都会自动创建一个账户。
The the beauty of Trump accounts is they're created for every child at birth.
此外，财政部会存入一千美元，还有越来越多的慈善家和优秀的商业领袖，比如迈克尔·戴尔和苏珊·戴尔，正在为这些账户追加资金。
And, you know, the the treasury puts in a thousand dollars, and that's supplemented by lots and lots of people, an increasing number of philanthropists and and great business leaders like Michael Dell and and Susan Dell, for example, who are putting additional money behind these accounts.
所以，想象一下，你有一个包含一千美元、可能更多资金的账户，具体取决于有多少其他慈善家最终参与捐款。
So and then, you know, if if you think about what happens, you have an account with a thousand dollars and possibly more depending on how many other philanthropists end up contributing.
你的父母会往里存钱，你的祖父母也会存钱，我们会让这个过程变得非常非常简单，等你18岁时，账户里可能有几十万美元。
Your parents put money in, your grandparents put money in, we make that process really, really easy, then by the time you're 18, you know, you could have 100 hundreds of thousands in that account.
到你30岁时，这笔钱可能增长到一百万美元。
By the time you're 30, it could grow to to a million dollars.
我认为这太棒了，因为它不仅教会了孩子们长期投资的价值和投资的样子，而且在我看来，这也是为数不多的真正由当下向未来提供资金的机制之一。
And and I think that's awesome because not only does that teach kids the value of of long term investing and what it looks like to invest, it it's also, I think, one of the few mechanisms where the present is actually giving money to the future.
对吧？
Right?
未来的世代。
Future generations.
我们所做的一切，你知道，都在不断累积更多的债务。
All of the things that we're doing, you know, we're racking up more and more debt.
这些实际上是我们向未来世代借钱的方式，而我认为这是我想得到的、第一个真正把钱还给未来的方式，这非常了不起。
It's really these are ways we're borrowing money from future generations, and I think this is the first thing that I can think of where we're actually giving money back, and and that's quite amazing.
这一代人其实非常年轻，这一点也令人惊叹。
It's incredible too how how young this generation actually is.
一谈到这个，我就感觉自己像个老头了，因为这显然不是Z世代。
This made me feel like an old man just talking about it because this is not Gen Z, obviously.
也不是Alpha世代。
It's not Gen Alpha.
这是Gen Beta。
It's Gen Beta.
就是，不管那个世代叫什么。
Like, what whatever that generation is.
到目前为止，这个世代几乎还没有被命名。
It's, like, barely labeled at this point.
好吧，大家说
Well, guys said
Alpha世代会受益，因为我觉得这会扩展到所有10岁以下的孩子。
that Alpha will benefit because, yeah, I think this will be extended to, all children 10.
你知道，他们可能不是每个人都能从财政部拿到一千美元，但我认为慈善机构会介入。
You know, they might not all get the thousand dollars from treasury, but I think philanthropy will come
并且，哦，这太棒了。
in and and Oh, that's fantastic.
相当可观的一笔钱。
Quite a chunk.
但我
But I
我没意识到这一点。
didn't realize that.
那么，假设你被选为监护人，会怎么样呢？
What so how like, let's say you you are selected as a custodian.
我不太清楚这具体是怎么运作的，或者监护人会不会被选出来。
I I I don't know how that works or if custodians are going to be selected.
我知道他们确实存在。
I I know they were they are.
我觉得他们是存在的。
I think they are.
但假设Robinhood被选为这些监护人之一。
But Vlad, let's say Robinhood is selected as, one of these custodians.
你过去在为年轻一代提供金融工具方面表现得很好，但这次面对的是有史以来最年轻的一代。
You've been very good historically with kind of, like, providing financial tools to younger generations, but this is, like, the youngest generation yet.
这些实际上是孩子。
These are effectively kids.
你如何与这个年龄段的年轻投资者建立金融关系？
How do you start a financial relationship with young investors at that level?
如果你被选为托管人，Robinhood会如何处理这种情况？
And, like, if you were selected as a custodian, how would Robinhood handle that?
是的。
Yeah.
我的意思是，首先你要明白，新生儿不会去打开他们的智能手机，至少希望在多年内都不会。
I mean, I think the first thing you remember is a newborn is not gonna be opening up, you know, their their smartphone, at least, you know, hopefully not for the, you know, years.
我知道趋势可能正朝着相反的方向发展，
I know the the trends maybe are going in the opposite direction with
你是想说他们会积极交易，
gonna be active actively trading is what you're telling us,
我认为这些账户在初期会由父母来管理。
I think that these accounts will be managed by parents at least at start.
然后我们需要弄清楚，当孩子到了某个年龄时，是否会有相应的金融教育体验？
And then we'll have to figure out, okay, when when the child sir turns a, you know, a certain age, is there an experience, financial education?
我们能教他们一些知识吗？
Can we can we teach them about stuff?
当然，我们希望他们能看到自己的投资组合在增长并了解它，但他们还不能进行交易。
You know, obviously, we'll want them to show we'll want them to see their portfolio growing and learn about it, but they're not gonna be able to to trade it.
所以，我认为儿童投资体验将主要聚焦于教育和金融素养。
So, yeah, I I think the child investing experience is gonna be heavily education focused and financial literacy focused.
而且，这确实是一个令人兴奋的新产品领域。
And, yeah, I think it's it's exciting new product domain.
所以我们得看看它会如何发展。
So we'll we'll have to see how it evolves.
我们来谈谈超级应用。
Let's talk about super apps.
埃隆·马斯克刚刚开始预热X Money。
So x Elon Musk just started teasing x money.
Coinbase 最近在其平台上推出了股票交易功能。
Coinbase just recently introduced stocks on their platform.
这似乎是一场争夺打造金融超级应用的竞赛。
It seems to be a race that there's just a race to build the financial super app.
这场竞赛已经打响了。
The the race is on.
我的问题是，是否真的有可能打造一个满足所有人群需求的金融应用？因为不同人群的行为模式正将金融需求引向截然不同的方向。
My question is, is it really possible to build a finance app that fits the need of every demographic because there's so many different behaviors that are pulling, you know, finance in different directions.
我从一些对话中听到，有些人不喜欢在自己的退休账户旁边看到预测市场的机会。
Some people I've just heard from conversations around just don't like it when they find prediction market opportunities right next to their retirement accounts.
就像有人评论说：别把这些东西放在一起。
So like, don't, don't put these in the same box is like commentary that I've heard.
所以，你的问题是，金融超级应用这个想法真的可行吗？我们真的知道它站得住脚，还是它只是我们虚构出来、大家盲目追求的一个神话？
So, yeah, the the question to you is like, is it real do do we actually know that the financial super app idea is valid, or is it actually just something that like it's a myth that we've created that people are trying to go for?
我觉得这是个好问题。
I think it's a good question.
我的意思是，我对‘金融超级应用’这个术语的理解相当宽泛。
I mean, I take financial super app, the term to be quite liberal.
比如，即使你看Robinhood，我们的功能和特性也并非全部集中在单一应用中。
Like, even if you look at Robinhood, not all of our functionality and features are in one singleton app.
我们有Robinhood银行服务，提供支票、储蓄账户以及信用卡服务。
We have Robinhood Banking, which has your checking and savings and is the home of your credit card.
我们有Robinhood主应用，更侧重于投资和交易。
We have Robinhood main app, which is is more investing and trading focused.
此外，我们还有非托管钱包。
And then we we also have non custodial wallet.
我认为随着时间推移，我们会努力把所有这些功能整合进Robinhood主应用中。
And I think what you'll see over time is we're gonna try to figure out how to insert all of these things into Robinhood main app.
而Robinhood主应用必须变得更加个性化。
And Robinhood main app will have to be much more heavily personalized.
我觉得它目前已经有一定程度的个性化，但还远达不到像社交媒体那样为每个人定制专属首页的程度。
I think it's it's it's reasonably personalized, nothing like, say, a social media app where the home feed is like bespoke for every person.
所以你会看到它朝着更个性化的方向发展，我们将把你最需要的功能呈现在你面前。
So you'll see it evolve to much more personalization so that we put the things in front of you that are most useful to you.
然后我认为我们会继续提供针对性的专属应用，比如如果你只是银行客户，想要一个简洁的体验，我们可以为你提供独立的应用程序。
And and then I think we will continue to have targeted bespoke apps so that, you know, if you're a banking only customer and you want a really clean experience, we'll be able to offer a a standalone app for that.
这些应用都将通过统一的KYC流程和无缝的资金流转连接在一起。
And and these apps will all be linked together with uniform KYC, seamless money movement.
因此，你可以享受到所有功能都集中在同一平台的好处，同时仍能保留专注的使用体验。
So you benefit everything being on from ben everything being on one platform while still keeping, like, the the focused experiences.
简而言之，我认为我们会两者兼顾。
So in in short, I think we'll do both.
我会更宽泛地理解‘应用’这个词，因为我们也不希望把自己局限在只是一个应用里。
And I would take the the term app more liberally because we also don't want to just shoehorn ourselves into being an app.
对吧？
Right?
因为我们还有网页端的产品。
Because we have web properties.
我们有Robinhood Legend。
We have Robinhood Legend.
我认为在未来几个月和几年里，你会看到更多代理能力的出现，这样如果有人想通过第三方工具或代理与Robinhood互动，我们会提供最佳的接入方式。
I think you'll also see in the coming months and years more Agentic capabilities so that if someone wants to engage with Robinhood through third party tools or through agents or or the best place for that.
所以，我们提供的服务将越来越独立于界面。
So, you know, we're we're offering a service that's gonna be increasingly interface agnostic.
谁知道呢，也许五年后，绝大多数交易都将由AI中介完成，我们也希望确保在这个世界中占据领先地位。
And who knows, you know, maybe five years from now, the vast majority of transactions will be AI mediated and we wanna make sure we win in that world too.
在构建金融超级应用方面，至少在我看来，Robinhood已经远远领先于其任何竞争对手。
When it comes to building the financial super app, it seems pretty clear at least to me that Robinhood is pretty far ahead of any of its competitors.
但有一个缺失的功能，你们还没有，但看起来非常简单——实际上我知道你们有这个功能，因为我可以通过一键操作，将资金从我的Robinhood银行账户即时转账到我的经纪账户。
But there's a missing feature that you guys don't have that seems very easy And I actually know that you guys have it because I can transfer money from my Robinhood banking account to my brokerage account with a press of a button and it settles instantly.
所以我可以在自己名下的账户之间转账，但我无法向他人付款。
So I can move money between my myself, but I can't send money.
我无法进行支付。
I can't do payments.
我无法向其他拥有Robinhood账户的人进行正常的转账支付。
I can't do normal payments to another person who has another Robinhood account.
你们什么时候开始做支付功能？
When are you guys working on payments?
Robinhood的用户间转账功能什么时候上线？
When are when are, like, payments between users coming online for Robinhood?
这确实是我们在实验并已经构建过的一些功能。
So that's something we've we've obviously experimented with and we've actually built out experiences for that.
我不知道你是否用过Robinhood现金卡，但在推出Robinhood银行服务之前，我们曾提供过一个与经纪账户集成的消费账户和借记卡。
I don't know if you were a Robinhood Cash Card customer, but we had prior to Robinhood banking, a spending account with a debit card that was integrated into the brokerage product.
实际上，我们正在逐步淘汰这一产品，转而推广Robinhood银行服务。
And we've been phasing this out actually in favor of of Robinhood banking.
但这个产品是在2022年推出的，坦白说，它并没有成功。
But this product launched in 2022, and frankly, it it didn't really work.
它并不受欢迎，因为我们试图为低收入、按周领薪的用户群体提供一种以借记卡为主的消费产品，比如提前两天发薪等功能，但我们的客户群体主要是以信用消费为主、可支配收入相对较高的用户。
It wasn't very popular because we were trying to, like, offer a paycheck to paycheck lower income type spending product focused on, you know, debit primary customers, two day early pay, those types of things to a customer base that, you know, was predominantly credit primary and had a little bit more disposable income.
所以，对于两天提前发薪这类功能，我们的用户并不太看重。
So didn't value two day early pay in those things as much.
因此，我们将重点转向了信贷产品，最终转向了Robinhood银行服务，提供高年化收益率的支票和储蓄账户。
So that's why we we sort of like shifted focus to our credit products and eventually to Robinhood banking with the high APY on checking and savings.
但在Robinhood消费服务中，我们曾提供点对点转账功能，并在测试不同的价值主张，比如：如果降低提现成本，提供即时提现，会不会更受欢迎？
But with Robinhood spending, we had peer to peer, and we were experimenting a little bit with the value props and testing, well, if you lower the cost of the withdrawals, instant withdrawals, could that resonate?
而我们觉得，目前市场上已经有很多类似产品，比如Cash App和Venmo，它们都能连接现有的银行账户。
And where where we felt our philosophy about this is, you know, there there's a lot of products out there, Cash App, Venmo, and they can link to existing banks.
在我们找到一种方法，让我们的点对点转账功能显著优于竞品之前，我们会专注于其他方面。
And until we figure out a way to make our peer to peer offering significantly better, we're we're gonna focus on other things.
我们不希望只是简单地堆砌一些普通功能，指望用户因为身处我们的生态系统而顺带使用它们。
So we we don't wanna just put together, like, more commodity features in front of customers in the hope that we'll cross sell into them by virtue of them being in in our ecosystem.
我们更愿意等到对某个产品有了明确的见解后再推出。
We like to wait until we have a point of view on on a product.
而且，点对点支付功能本身已经相当不错了。
And, you know, peer to peer payments are already pretty good.
我觉得它们并没有变得更好。
I I don't think they're getting much better.
但到目前为止，我们觉得把你的整个银行服务整合到Robinhood上更有机会。
But up until now, we've we felt much more opportunity and getting the rest of your your banking stack on Robinhood.
关于稳定币与银行业务的关系，你有什么看法吗？
Do you have a point of view on Stablecoins as it relates to the banking product in in that case?
那个天才法案已经通过了，你已经有了完整的区块链。
The genius bill passed is pretty you already have you already have an entire blockchain.
把稳定币集成到银行应用里似乎很简单。
It seems pretty easy to put Stablecoins into the banking app.
你们对这个有什么立场或看法吗？
Do you guys do you guys have a position or or an opinion on that?
是的。
Yeah.
我认为关于稳定币，其实涉及两件不同的事情。
So I think there's kind of two separate things when it comes to Stablecoins.
一是钱在我们的生态系统中是如何存储的？
One is how is money stored in in our ecosystem?
二是，这几乎就像是钱如何作为支付渠道进出这个系统一样。
Two is it's almost like how how does money move into and out of it as a payment rail?
至于前者，我认为当前的挑战在于你正在与FDIC保险和收益竞争。
And the former, I think the challenge right now is you're competing with FDIC insurance and yield.
在传统的银行体系中，如果你拥有一个Robinhood账户，你的资金最高可获得高达25万美元的FDIC保险。
So in the conventional sort of like banking system, if you have a Robinhood account, you that money is FDIC insured up up to multiples of $250,000.
我认为这是一个非常有吸引力的价值主张，因为很多人在考虑自己的银行业务时，最关心的是资金的安全性。
And and I think that's that's a compelling value proposition because a lot of people, when they think about their banking, the thing they care most about is that the money is safe.
所以他们不仅关注保险，还会仔细阅读所有条款细节。
So they not only look for the insurance, but they read the the fine print around everything.
当2023年SVB和第一共和银行倒闭时，发生了银行业危机，当时一些稳定币出现了脱锚，这引发了严重问题。
And when when there was a banking crisis back in 2023 when SVB and and First Republic went under, you saw that Stablecoins broke the buck, some of them at least, and that caused a big problem.
这导致大量存款从稳定币中流出，花了许多年才恢复到SVB事件前的资产水平。
It caused a lot of deposit flight out of Stablecoins, and it took many, many years to get to back to the level of of assets in the pre SVB era.
所以我要告诉你们的是，FDIC保险以及对这些静态资产的总体保护，对美国消费者来说至关重要。
So what what I'm telling you is the FDIC insurance and and general protection of those assets at rest is really, really important for The US consumer.
我认为，只有解决了这个问题，消费者才会愿意将相当数量的资金存入稳定币。
And I think we'll have to figure that out for consumers to tolerate nontrivial amounts being stored in Stablecoins.
至于作为资金通道，即稳定币的存入和转出，我们目前已经支持了。
Now as a funding rail, meaning Stablecoin in and out, we already support it.
但我们目前看到的用户使用量很少，因为在美國，很少有商家接受稳定币。
We don't see a lot of customers using it just yet because in The US, very few merchants accept Stablecoins.
而你所要竞争的是像Robinhood金卡那样提供3%返现的工具。
And what you're competing with is things like the Robinhood Gold Card with 3% cash back.
你知道，作为消费者，我在进行稳定币支付交易时，并不会获得3%的返现。
You know, I'm not getting 3% cash back as a consumer making a Stablecoin payments transaction.
因此，目前使用稳定币的人大多是在尝试一些新奇的用途，对吧？
And so the folks using it are mostly testing out novelty use cases, right?
或者是在传统银行系统无法运作的周末进行大额企业支付，而且你也不能直接刷信用卡。
Or it's for large business payments over the weekends where the traditional banking system doesn't work and, you know, you can't just put it on your credit card.
所以我认为你会看到它们，而且你已经看到它们在大额交易中的应用了。
So so I think you'll see them and you've already started seeing them for large transactions.
但对于消费者场景来说，你不会用稳定币给朋友转账来分摊披萨钱，也不会用稳定币支付亚马逊订单。
But for consumer use cases, you know, you're you're probably not sending your buddy, you know, Stablecoin to pay them back for for splitting a pizza and you're you're not, you know, paying for your Amazon order with Stablecoins.
所以我认为我们还需要做更多工作，才能解锁这些消费者应用场景。
So I think we've got more wood to chop to unlock these consumer use cases.
但我得告诉你，我们通过与Paxos的合作已经推出了USDG。
But I will tell you, we've got USDG through our partnership with Paxos.
显然，Robinhood Chain和Robinhood钱包都会是USDG的理想平台。
Obviously, think Robinhood Chain will be a great home for that as will Robinhood Wallet.
因此，我们将继续为机构构建并提供这些服务，随着相关生态系统的不断成熟，最终也会面向消费者。
So we're gonna continue to build and offer these services for institutions and eventually consumers as the ecosystem around them continues to mature.
说到支付、稳定币和银行业，上周有新闻称，交易所Kraken获得了所谓的‘迷你主账户许可’，有人称这是历史性首次。
I mean, related to payments and Stablecoins and I guess, banking, there was news, last week and and some people painted this as a historic first of Kraken, the exchange getting a, what they call it, colloquially, a skinny master account license.
这使他们能够直接向联邦储备银行系统提交电汇交易。
So this gives gives them the ability to submit their their banking license anyway gives them the ability to submit wire transfers directly to Fedwire.
从你的角度来看，这种许可证对Robinhood来说有趣或有吸引力吗？
From your perspective, is that type of a license interesting, attractive for Robinhood?
你们是否已经通过代理银行具备了这种能力，或者这是如何运作的？
Do you do you already have that ability through correspondent banks, or or how does that work?
因为这被描绘成一件历史性且全新的事情。
Because this was painted as something historic and new.
你认为这有用且是新的吗？
Do you do you believe this is useful and new?
我不这么认为。
I don't think so.
我的意思是，今天你们就可以向Robinhood转账和从中转账。
I mean, you can send wires into and out of Robinhood today.
我不太确定。
I'm not exactly sure.
我的意思是，我并没有深入了解它具体允许什么，但在我看来，这可能只是以更低的成本实现这一点的方式。
I mean, I I haven't gone into the details of what exactly it allows, but may it sounds to me like it's just maybe a way to to do that more cheaply.
我当然不会为了更便宜的电汇服务而去申请银行牌照。
I certainly wouldn't get a banking license for more cheaper access to to to wire services.
我认为拥有银行牌照有很多好处，比如我们在2019年曾申请过一个全新的OCC国家银行特许，但后来撤回了。
I think there's a lot of I mean, there there's definitely pros to having a banking license when we've gone down the road back in 2019 where we had a de novo OCC, National Bank Charter application that we pulled back.
我们撤回申请的原因是，当我们审视所有想提供的服务时，发现合作伙伴银行生态系统已经变得非常完善，API日益成熟，服务也日趋完善，现在你可以通过合作银行，而它们实际上会争相争取初创企业和金融科技公司的业务。
And the reason we withdrew that is when we looked at everything we wanted to offer, we saw that the partnership bank ecosystem has gotten so good and is sort of the the APIs are maturing, the services are maturing, and now you can use partner banks, and and they'll actually compete for the business of of startups and fintechs.
所以我们与一些社区银行建立了合作关系。
And so we we partner with some community banks for that.
Coastal银行是我们银行产品和信用卡的合作伙伴。
Coastal Coastal's our partner for the the bank product and the credit card.
你看这些社区银行，它们正在与摩根大通、富国银行和国家银行这些巨头竞争。
And, you look at these community banks, they're out there competing with the big boys, the Chases, the Wells Fargo's, the National Banks.
而大型全球系统重要性银行拥有巨大的规模，因此社区银行找到了服务科技公司的机会。
And what's happened is the big G SIBs have massive scale, And so the community banks have found an opportunity in servicing technology companies.
我认为这是一种绝佳的合作关系，因为它们获得了新业务，而我们则可以专注于自己最擅长的事，不必去应对那些我们根本不需要承担的牌照相关事务。
And I think it's a great relationship because they get new business and we get sort of, like, do what we do best and not have to deal with, you know, the the aspects of having a charter that we that we don't need to deal with.
所以对我们来说，这种合作关系一直非常顺利。
So for us, it's the the partnership's been working great.
当然，我从不把话说死，我们总会重新评估这些事情。
Of course, I can never say never, and we always reassess these things.
但目前为止，我们完全没有成为国家特许银行的打算。
But, you know, so far, no no intent of becoming a nationally chartered bank.
有个令人兴奋的消息。
Some exciting news.
我们即将推出一个新的播客，帮助人们了解加密货币周期，以及如何应对它。
We are launching a new podcast to help people figure out the crypto cycle, how to navigate it.
我认识的最出色的加密货币周期投资者，他的名字是迈克尔·纳托。
The best crypto cycle investor I know, his name is Michael Nato.
他运营着《DeFi报告》。
He runs the DeFi report.
就是这个人，在10月10日价格暴跌前给我发了卖出提醒。
This is the guy that sent me a sell alert before the 10/10 price drop happened.
他的周期分析一直非常精准。
His cycle analysis has been absolutely on point.
我已经关注他好几年了。
I've been following him for years.
今年，我们开始每周录制播客节目。
And this year, we started recording weekly podcast episodes.
每一期我们都会深入探讨他的投资组合、持仓情况、市场结构、入场目标、比特币和以太坊的公允价值，以及我们所处的周期阶段。
Each one, we get into his portfolio, what he's holding, the market structure, entry targets, fair market value of Bitcoin and Ether, and where we are in the cycle.
每周三都会发布新一期节目。
There's new episodes that are released every Wednesday.
每期时长三十分钟。
They're thirty minutes.
节目很短。
They're short.
节奏紧凑。
They're punchy.
我认为这个加密周期比大多数都要难把握，所以我们一起来应对吧。
I think this crypto cycle is harder to navigate than most, so let's do it together.
去订阅这个播客吧。
Go subscribe to this podcast.
在你收听播客的任何平台——YouTube、Apple、Spotify——搜索《DeFi报告》，或者在节目笔记中找到链接。
Search the DeFi report wherever you get your podcasts, YouTube, Apple, Spotify, or find a link in the show notes.
现在有一期新节目正等着你。
There's a new episode waiting for you now.
听起来你们和银行之间有着非常积极的关系。
Now it sounds like you guys have had some very positive relationships with with banks.
银行业与所谓的新型银行和加密行业之间，似乎存在某种摩擦或至少看起来如此。
There is a source of friction or at least it appears that way between kind of the banking industry and let's say, you know, new new banking and and the crypto industry.
而这种摩擦的一部分集中体现在《清晰法案》上。
And some of that friction is culminated in in the Clarity Act.
目前看来，《清晰法案》的推进因稳定币收益归属问题而受阻。
So right now, it seems that the Clarity Act is being held up based on who gets Stablecoin yield.
在银行方面，银行方面认为，发行人和交易所不能留有开放的漏洞，将稳定币收益返还给用户。
And on the bank side, the banks are like, hey, you know, issuers and exchanges can't have an open loophole to give Stablecoin yield back to their users.
而加密行业中的许多人对此表示反对，并阻碍了《清晰法案》的通过，以确保稳定币收益能够传递给消费者。
And many in the crypto industry are pushing back on that and holding the Clarity bill up, you know, such that we make sure that Stablecoin yield passes to consumers.
Coinbase 一直是这一立场的倡导者。
Coinbase has been an advocate of that.
你对《清晰法案》以及围绕稳定币收益的僵局有什么看法？
What's your perspective on the Clarity bill and this hold up around Stablecoin yield?
是的。
Yeah.
这让我觉得很奇怪。
It's strange to me.
我原本没想到会朝这个方向发展，因为表面上看，稳定币收益与《清晰法案》毫无关系。
I I wouldn't have expected it to go in this direction because on the surface, Stablecoin yield has nothing to do with the Clarity Act.
对吧？
Right?
它原本应该是关于加密货币市场结构、代币的安全性以及代币化之类的问题。
It was supposed to be on crypto market structure and security status of coins and things like tokenization.
我们还以为这些问题在《天才法案》里已经解决了。
We thought it was all resolved in the Genius Bill already.
是的。
Yeah.
我认为发生的情况是，《天才法案》让这些利益相关方措手不及，现在他们试图利用这一点，几乎像是一种谈判筹码，来推动解决这些问题。
I think what happened was the Genius Bill caught a lot of these stakeholders by surprise, and and now they're in there trying to, like, use this as a almost like negotiating leverage to to get some of that stuff patched up.
是的。
Yeah.
我觉得我见过不少国会议员，包括参与这项法案的参议员。
I I think that and, you know, I've I've met with a lot of congressional leaders, you know, members of of the senate who are working on this.
我认为最好的结果是先把稳定币问题放一放，先着手处理去中心化金融（DeFi）。
And I think that the best outcome would be to sort of, like, put the Stablecoin issue aside so we can start tackling DeFi.
我担心的是，我们可能会被稳定币问题分散注意力，结果陷入其中，而真正关键的议题如去中心化金融却迟迟无法推进，今年大选前时间本就紧张，事情一旦变得混乱，可能就没时间解决这些问题了。
And and what I worry is that, you know, we could we could end up getting distracted by Stablecoin and then we get stuck on like DeFi and some of these real meaty issues and and there won't be enough time to get that resolved before the election this year when when things start to to get really messy.
我认为我们必须迅速行动，摆脱稳定币问题，以便真正讨论《清晰法案》本身。
I think we've gotta move quickly, get past the Stablecoin issues so that we can actually talk about the Clarity Act itself.
《清晰法案》对罗宾汉、加密货币以及代币化资产的整体概念有什么作用？
What does the Clarity Act do for Robinhood and for crypto and the whole, you know, idea of tokenized assets?
是的。
Yeah.
我的意思是，它明确了什么是加密证券和商品。
I mean, one thing is it just makes it clear what's a crypto security and a commodity.
现在，为了确保我们列出的每一种代币都不是证券，人们耗费了大量精力撰写法律备忘录并获取非常具体的指导。
And a a lot of calories are burned right now writing just like legal memos and getting getting getting very specific guidance on every specific coin that we list to to ensure that it's not a security.
如果我们有一条明确的路径可以遵循，就会释放出许多其他可能性。
And if there was just a paved path that we could follow, that unlocks a lot of other things.
然后还有代币化，这显然能将传统资产——也就是非原生加密资产——上链。
And and then you have tokenization, which obviously would unlock traditional assets, you know, non crypto native assets on blockchains.
目前有一些讨论认为，这甚至是否需要明确界定。
There there's some discussion about whether that even requires clarity.
但关键是，如果这一点被写入正式法律，那么下一届政府就无法仅仅通过更换SEC主席就彻底扭转对整个行业的立场，我认为这确实是一个现实风险。
But, you know, the the benefit of it being enshrined in in in an actual law is another administration can't just come in with a different SEC and completely flip their posture on on the industry, which I think is a real risk.
我的意思是，你已经看到这种情况发生过好几次了。
I mean, you've seen that happen a number of times already.
所以我们必须把其中一些内容真正写进立法里。
That's why we've gotta we've gotta get some some some of this actually enshrined in legislation.
也许我们正站在两条不同未来时间线的分叉口：一条是清晰法案通过，另一条是清晰法案未通过。
Maybe we're at the fork of two different possible timelines in the future, one where clarity passes, one where clarity does not pass.
你认为这会对Robinhood Chain的未来产生什么影响？
How do you think that that impacts the whole Robinhood Chain future?
比如，Robinhood Chain团队和代币化股票团队，我猜他们正屏息等待着清晰法案的进展。
Like, is the Robinhood Chain team and the tokenized stocks team I'm assuming they're just watching clarity with bated breath.
如果法案通过，他们就能招聘更多人。
And if it passes, then they get to hire more.
他们能获得更多的资金。
They get more funding.
你正在加大对Robinhood Chain生态系统的投入。
You're investing more into the Robinhood Chain ecosystem.
如果它没有通过，你就不会那么积极地推进，只是进展没那么迅猛。
If it doesn't pass, you're kind of, you know, not not not not doing that, but just it doesn't move forward with as much gusto.
你是这么看待这个问题的吗？
Is that is that kinda how you you view it?
不是。
No.
这更多不是关于我们是否要大量投资于这条链。
It's less about, you know, do we invest as much in the chain or not?
这条链从设计上就是全球性的，因为它是无许可的。
The chain is a global product by by design since it's permissionless.
没错。
Sure.
所以更关键的是，基于这条链构建的哪些功能可以在美国提供。
So it's more about how much of the things built on the chain can be offered in The US
我明白了。
I see.
而不是只做国际业务。
Versus being international only.
你还记得，在上一届政府时期，也就是泽勒执政时，我们仍然在加密货币上投入了相当多的资金。
And you remember, you know, in the last administration under Gen Zler, we still invested quite a bit into crypto.
但当时的看法是，美国市场至少在一段时间内对这个行业来说会比较困难。
But the view then was, well, it looks like The US is gonna be a challenging market for this at least for a while.
我们必须降低风险，某种程度上像其他人一样，发展更大规模的非美国业务。
We we've gotta derisk and do kind of what everyone else is doing in a sense, which is, you know, having a larger non US business.
因此，我们启动了在欧盟推出业务并实现业务国际化的计划。
So that's where we actually started the initiative of launching in The EU and internationalizing our business.
而现在，我们两者都有了，对吧？
And now we have both, right?
我们正在拓展国际业务，但同时也看到了在美国投资的机会。
We're growing the international business, but we also see opportunities to invest in The US.
所以我认为你会看到这两者之间的转变。
So I think you'll just see shifting between those two.
比如，如果在美国推进更清晰的监管时，不确定性增加，我们可能会在清晰度到来后更多地投资于国际市场。
Like, maybe if there's less clarity in The US while pushing for that greater clarity, we invest more internationally once the clarity comes.
我的意思是，我们显然拥有如此多的客户。
I mean, obviously, we have so much so many customers.
加密货币是一个庞大的业务，在美国占我们收入的近20%。
Crypto's a a big business, close to 20% of our revenue in The US.
所以，我们必须确保为这里的客户提供他们所需的所有工具，以保持竞争力。
So, you know, we we have to make sure we serve customers here with with all the tools that that they need to be competitive.
是的。
Yeah.
我参加过你们在法国戛纳举办的Robinhood活动，当时你们宣布了Robinhood链、代币化股票等，这些都是为我们的客户和欧盟客户推出的。
I was at your guys' Robinhood event in Cannes in France where you guys announced, like, the Robinhood Chain and then the tokenized stocks and everything was like and for our customers and for our EU customers.
作为一名美国公民，我平时并不习惯对欧盟公民能接触到这些科技产品感到嫉妒，但这次真的感觉角色颠倒了。
And as a US citizen, I'm not used to feeling jealousy over EU citizens over their ability to access tech, but it really felt like the shoe was on the other foot.
但这种情况已经开始改变。
But that is starting to change.
我们在SEC和CFTC方面都迎来了新一届管理层。
We have a new administration both on the SEC and the CFTC side.
我们刚刚与CFTC的迈克·塞利格进行了一次对话，他表示CFTC即将批准美国的永续合约。
We just had a conversation with Mike Selig from the CFTC who said the CFTC is about to green light perps in The United States.
这个市场此前一直位于海外。
That's a market that's previously been offshore.
他希望在几周内将永续合约引入美国境内。
Within weeks, he wants to bring perps onshore.
在那次对话中，你们提到要将永续合约引入Robinhood。
In that event, you guys talked about bringing perps into Robinhood.
因此，随着CFTC即将批准永续合约——据塞利格主席所说很快就会实现——你们认为多久能为美国用户开启这项服务？
So with the green lighting of perps by the CFTC, you know, soon TM according to chair Selig, how quickly do you think you can flip that switch for Americans?
那么，这个产品在Robinhood内部实际会是什么样子？
And what what will that actual product look like inside of Robinhood?
很快。
Pretty quickly.
我们已经向客户提供了非永续期货。
We already have nonperpetual futures offered to our customers.
我们大约一年前推出了这项服务，而且增长得非常好。
We launched that about a year ago, and that's been growing really well.
我们有一个非常出色的移动界面，叫做交易阶梯，可以让你非常灵活地与订单簿互动。
And we have a really nice mobile interface called the trading ladder that allows you to kind of very tactically engage with the order book.
所以我认为，许多独立期货产品的体验完全可以很好地迁移到永续合约上。
So I think a lot of the standalone futures experience actually translates very, very well to perps.
我们也在欧盟的应用程序中上线了永续合约，这些产品通过Bitstamp提供。
We also have perps live in The EU in our app there, and those are offered via Bitstamp.
因此，我们实际上已经是一个完整的永续合约产品。
So we're kind of a full stack Perpetuals product.
所以我认为，我们根本不需要花太长时间。
So I I I don't think I don't think it would take us long at all.
关键是确保指导清晰，让我们能迅速向客户推出有吸引力的产品。
It's about just kind of making sure that the guidance is clear and and and we can put a compelling product in front of customers pretty quickly.
我们已经讨论过年轻一代的需求、巨大的财富转移以及所有这些事情。
We've talked about the needs of younger generations, the the great wealth transfer, all of these things.
我要说，代表千禧一代和Z世代，我最大的痛点之一就是无法接触到我想投资的某些成长型股票。
I I will say, you know, maybe speaking on behalf of kind of the millennial generation and also a gen Gen Z, one of the biggest pain points I have is not having access to particular growth equities that I wish I had access to.
对于散户投资者来说，这意味着错过了Stripe、SpaceX和Anthropic这些公司。
So for retail investors, this means missing out on Stripe, missing out on SpaceX, missing out on Anthropic.
我知道你之前提到过Robinhood风投基金，它确实试图在这方面提供一些帮助。
I know you mentioned earlier in our conversation the the Robinhood Ventures Fund, you know, seeks to to help with that a little bit.
但仍然有大量这类私募股权，散户投资者根本无法接触到，因此错失了所有的上涨机会和增长潜力。
But there's still a whole bunch of these private equities that retail investors can't get their hands on, and they're missing all this upside, missing all of this growth.
目前看来，这似乎是结构性问题，公共市场在这方面已经失效。
It seems structural at this point, like public markets kind of failing from that perspective.
这种情况有没有可能改变？我们能否在机会上实现更多民主化？
Is there any chance that that changes, that we get more democratization in terms of opportunities?
为了让散户投资者能够参与这些私营公司，结构性上需要发生哪些改变？
And what structurally has to change for retail investors to have a shot at, some of these private companies?
是的。
Yeah.
我认为Robinhood Ventures是朝着正确方向迈出的重要一步。
I mean, I think Robinhood Ventures is a big first step in the right direction.
对吧？
Right?
通过Robinhood Ventures，我们成功推出了并在一个非常困难的市场中实现了IPO。
We're, you know, through Robinhood Ventures, we we we launched and successfully IPO ed in a very difficult market, by the way.
上周，Robinhood Ventures基金赢得了对Stripe的潜在投资，相关协议已签署，等待交割。
Last week, Robinhood Ventures Fund won, and RVI has signed pending close investment in Stripe.
在过去两轮中，我们已经两次投资了Databricks。
We've invested in Databricks twice in the in the past two rounds.
我们还投资了Boom Supersonic——这家打破音障的喷气式飞机公司，同时也在研发燃气涡轮机；此外还有Databricks、MERCORE、Revolut、Ramp、Airwallex这家金融科技公司，以及Aura。
We've got Boom Supersonic, the sound barrier breaking jet company that's also making gas turbines, MERCORE, Revolut, Ramp, and Airwallex, which which is another fintech company, and Aura.
我现在正戴着这枚戒指。
I'm wearing the ring right now.
所以，
So,
是的，我认为通过IPO筹集的资金，Robinhood Ventures将继续参与更多交易，为散户投资者提供这些公司的投资机会。
yeah, I I think that with the capital we raised from the IPO, Robinhood Ventures is gonna continue to get get into deals and give access to retail for for these companies.
而且你注意到，这是第一个基金。
And then you notice it's it's it's the first fund.
对吧？
Right?
因此，我们预计未来还会有更多基金，我们可以从多个角度解决散户投资私营公司的问题。
So we anticipate that there will be future funds, and we'll we'll be able to really just, hit the investing in private companies for retail problem from from various angles.
因此，我设想一个世界，在这个世界里，如果你是一位正在筹集种子轮或A轮融资的创始人，散户投资者将成为你融资故事中的重要组成部分。
So I I see a world where if you're if you're a founder raising a seed round or a series a, retail is a big chunk of of your fundraising story.
但目前这根本不存在。
And that's just simply not a thing.
如果你想想我们现在所做的事情，我们最初是让散户与机构在IPO准入上享有平等的机会。
And if if you think about what we're doing now, you know, we we started off giving IPO access on a level playing field with institutions to retail.
现在，我相信通过我们的IPO准入产品，我们已成为IPO市场中最大的散户参与者。
Now we're, I believe, the largest retail participant in the in the IPO market through our IPO access product.
Robinhood风投一号基金通常是后期、Pre-IPO阶段的基金，但随着时间推移，我们也会推出更早期阶段的工具，那时风险更高，但潜在回报也大得多。
Robinhood Ventures Fund One is, like, typically later stage pre IPO fund, But but over time, there'll be earlier stage earlier stage vehicles as well where, you know, the risk is higher, but but the potential upside is much greater.
然后你看到了我们在欧洲对私募股权进行代币化的做法。
And then you saw what we did in in Europe with tokenization of privates.
是的。
Yes.
我期望并相信这就是最终形态，但我认为要实现它还有大量工作要做。
My my hope and belief is that that's the end state, but but I think there's a lot of wood to chop to get there.
与此同时，这些封闭式基金产品可能是我们目前能为散户提供的最佳方案，至少在一段时间内是这样。
And in the meantime, you know, these these closed end fund products is probably the best that we were gonna be able to do for retail at least for a little while.
弗拉德，这番对话非常棒。
Vlad, this has been great.
现在，当我们可能要结束这个话题时，Robinhood 在早期发现一些趋势方面取得了巨大成功。
Now as we maybe draw this to a conclusion, of course, Robinhood has had a lot of success in terms of spot of spotting some trends early.
我的感觉是，有两个重要的例子。
I mean, two big ones, I feel like.
一个是零佣金交易模式，迫使整个行业跟随，为一代人实现了股票的民主化。
One is the zero commission trading type thing forced the entire industry to to follow democratized equities for a generation.
第二个是加密货币。
And the second is crypto.
当它还是反主流的选择时，你们就进入了，并且大举投入。
When it was contrarian, you guys went in and you went in big.
你们很早就进入了。
You went in early.
你们在那里也打造了一个非常出色的业务。
You developed a fantastic business there too.
看起来你们的战略一直很一致，就是牢牢把握用户体验，并吸引下一代投资者。
And it seems like the strategy has been consistent, kind of really owning the UX and and capturing this next generation of investors.
你已经这么做了两次。
You've done this twice.
问题是，第三个最大的机会是什么？
Question is what's the third biggest opportunity?
对于Robinhood未来而言，目前最大的机会是什么？
And what are the big opportunities right now for Robinhood moving forward?
是永续合约吗？
Is it is it Perps?
是我们之前讨论过的超级应用这个想法吗？
Is it this this idea that we talked about of a super app?
是国际市场吗？
Is it international?
是所有这些因素的结合吗？
Is it all of these things combined?
Robinhood下一个最大的机会是什么？
What's the next biggest opportunity for Robinhood?
我们已经宣布了很多事情，你可以看到，社交功能即将上线。
A lot of things we've announced already and you can kinda see, well, you've got social coming.
这将彻底改变Robinhood的体验，并增添新的元素。
That's completely gonna transform the Robinhood experience and and add new elements.
预测市场已经发展得相当庞大。
Prediction markets has grown quite big.
我想你已经看到了我们AI产品的些许迹象。
And I think you've seen hints of our AI products.
我们通过Cortex将AI引入产品，带来了极大的实用性，但这才刚刚开始。
You know, we we've introduced AI through Cortex into our products in ways that are extremely useful, but we're just scratching the surface.
我认为我们正在思考一个问题：一个代理如何从交易到管理你的储蓄，乃至处理你非常被动的财务活动，来全面掌控你的财务生活？
And I think that, you know, we're wrestling with the the problem of, like, what is it gonna look like for an agent to run your entire financial life from from trading all the way through to, you know, managing, you know, your your your savings and kind of your extremely passive activities?
它能否看起来很像为你个人财务服务的家族办公室？
And can it look very much like family office for for your financial life?
所以，是的，我认为还有大量创新空间，我们非常期待探索这些可能性，并以真正改善人们生活的实际产品来分享我们的成果。
So, yeah, I think I I think there's gonna be there's just lots of white space for innovation, and we're excited to explore that and and share what we're working on in the form of real products that make people's lives better.
我会把它发过去。
I'll send it there.
弗拉德，你们在这方面做得非常好。
Vlad, you guys are doing a great job on that front.
特别祝贺你们在加密货币领域的努力。
Wanna congratulate you especially for your work in crypto.
我们在这里是你们的忠实粉丝。
You know, we're big fans here.
该结束了。
Gotta end it.
我们就以这个收尾吧。
Let's end with this.
以上内容不构成任何财务建议。
None of this has been financial advice.
当然，你们都知道加密货币是有风险的。
Of course, you guys know crypto is risky.
你可能会损失投入的资金，但我们正朝着西方前进。
You could lose what you put in, but we are headed west.
这就是前沿。
This is the frontier.
这不适合每个人，但我们很高兴你与我们一同踏上Bankless之旅。
It's not for everyone, but we're glad you're with us on the Bankless Journey.
非常感谢。
Thanks a lot.
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