银河巡航

蒂姆就有一艘。

And Tim had one.

它是什么来着？

It was what?

零食与故事时间。

Snacks and story time.

它负责这类事情。

It does stuff like that.

明白吗？

You know?

简直可爱到爆，萌翻了。

It was super cute, super adorable.

至于我，我设置了一个彩弹区，因为我在寻找喜欢冒险的游客和活跃的游客。

And for me, I had a paintball area because I was looking for adventurous cruisers, active cruisers.

你会拿到这些蓝图，然后消耗资源将这些蓝图转化为实际建造的区域，这些区域位于你停泊区内的船只上。

So you're gonna get these blueprints, and then you're gonna spend resources to take those blueprints and turn them into actual built out areas within the ships that you have in your docking area.

完成后你需要安排一次航行，系统会提供一整份可供选择的航行菜单，这些选项在被消耗后会定期补充，菜单里列出了各种类型的行星。

Once you have that done, you need to schedule a cruise, and there's going to be a whole menu of them out there available to you that are going to get refilled periodically when they get used up, where there is a list of planets of different types.

我们再次审视不同类型的活动，无论是家庭活动、休闲活动还是激烈活动。

And again, we're looking at different types of activities, whether they're family activities, relaxing activities, or active activities.

因此你可以将不同类型的游客与适合的目的地组合匹配，满足他们对旅行类型的需求，无论是冒险、家庭出游还是其他类型。

And so you can combo up the types of cruisers you're sending to different locations with the right locations that are going to scratch the itch that they have for their type of travel, whether it's adventure, family stuff, or what have you.

当你安排好航行后，还需要说服人们登船。

And so once you've scheduled a cruise, you have to convince people to go onto that cruise.

你需要消耗营销点数来吸引合适的游客登船，然后就可以启航了。

So you're gonna spend marketing points to draw in the right types of of guests onto those ships, and then you're gonna launch those ships.

飞船进入太空后，每推进一个回合，你将在航行轨道上前进一格——根据你预订的航线和愿意消耗的燃料量，大多数航程需要推进2到5格。

Once the ships are in space, then each turn that you go ahead, you're gonna advance one space on the cruise track, which is gonna be somewhere between two to five spaces for most of these cruises depending on how much fuel you wanna spend and which cruise you've booked.

你会在每个经停地点停留，然后根据所载乘客类型获得积分。

And you're gonna stop at each of those locations, and then you're gonna get points based on the types of patrons that you have available.

这也让你有机会在各个行星类型的度假村进行设施升级。

And that is also gonna give you an opportunity to put out improvements on the different resorts that you have on those types of planets.

然后飞船会返回地球，下次你可以搭载新的乘客再次出发。

And then it comes back to Earth, and you can send that ship back out again with new passengers next time.

但这就是将飞船送入太空并执行巡航任务的基本流程。

But that's the basic workflow of getting ships out into space and doing cruises.

其中每个环节都需要多个具体操作才能实现。

And each of those requires several actions to actually make them happen.

我很高兴你提到了造船环节以及将飞船送入太空的整个过程。

I'm glad you brought up the the shipbuilding a little bit and the whole arc of getting your ship into space.

我来简单说说造船部分。

I'll talk about the shipbuilding a little bit.

我觉得这个设计相当精巧。

I thought that was pretty neat.

首先你需要购买设计图，这是个需要消耗工作代币的操作。

First, you have to go and pay for your blueprints, and there's an action, a work replacement action.

让我看看。

Let's see.

你可以从蓝图市场上选择两份设计图，它们确实是蓝色的。

You get two blueprints from the from the selection from the blueprint market there, and they're actually blue.

这个设计很巧妙。

It's pretty neat.

这些蓝图会放在你玩家板的侧面。

And those go along the side of your board.

你需要单独执行一个操作来实际建造组件。

You take a separate action to actually build the components.

建造时，你要把蓝图翻过来，背面是彩色版本，填色完成后将其插入驾驶舱——在银河巡航行业我们称之为飞行甲板。

And when you do, you take your blueprint, flip it over, and it has the colored version, and that's filled in and you wedge that in between your they call them the cockpit here, but the PC version of that is flight deck is what we call it in the galactic cruise industry.

这样你就能逐步建造飞船，通常可以建到三节高度。

And then so you can build your ship up to, you know, typically three sections high.

就像克里斯说的，你可以把这些蓝图堆叠起来，然后完成剩下的部分。

So you can you stack up these blueprints, then, like Chris said, then you do the rest.

你在各个航段之间搭载乘客，然后就可以出发了。

You fill it up with passengers between the segments, and then off you go.

所以这也是个需要些步骤的过程。

So that was a bit of a process too.

你必须正确规划好。

You had to plan it out right.

总的来说，这款游戏的主题之一就是你需要将当前行动转化为后续几个行动的筹码。

In general, the theme for this game one of the themes for this game is you had to kinda parlay this action into your next action or next couple actions.

如果操作得当，你就能获得奖励来支付接下来几轮的所有行动。

So if you did it right, you'd get the bonuses to pay for everything that you're gonna do on your next couple turns.

这对我来说有点吃力。

A little bit of a a struggle there for me.

这是我对这款游戏最大的不满，但不止这款游戏如此。

This is the biggest complaint I have about the game, but it's not just this game.

是这类游戏的通病。

It's this type of game.

具体来说就是，你必须反复执行某种循环——需要按顺序完成多个动作（虽然不总是严格按顺序），通过特定序列才能达成游戏的主要目标，而且必须不断重复这个过程。

And that is that when there's a cycle that you have to keep going through and, like, take several actions in order, not necessarily always exactly in order, but there's some sequence you have to do in order to accomplish the main goal of the game, and you have to do it repeatedly.

嗯。

Mhmm.

事实上，我今晚要展示的游戏就不得不经历这种情况。

In fact, I actually had to go through the the game I'm gonna have on the table tonight.

我也会稍微谈谈那个游戏。

I'll talk a little bit about that as well.

但对于复杂的英雄类游戏来说这很常见——它们试图给你目标，却又让目标难以达成，于是你必须建立一套操作序列。

But this is this is not an uncommon thing with complex hero games that are trying to give you goals but make them, like, hard to achieve, then you have to set up a sequence.

不知为何，在这里感觉比其他游戏更显得冗余。

Here, for some reason, it feels even more redundant than I think some other games.

部分原因在于，尽管你在拼合这些拼图碎片，但最终它们更像是一个高级的收集游戏。

Partly, I think it's because even though there are these pieces of the puzzle you're putting together, they ultimately end up being kind of an advanced set collection game.

比如，好吧，我的飞船上有橙色组件。

Like, okay, I've got orange components on my ship.

我需要搭配橙色米宝，然后把它发射到橙色星球上。

I need to get orange meeples to go with it, and then I need to launch it to an orange planet.

总之，你知道，这让人有点疲惫，尤其是在这种长时间游戏的尾声，回合之间要等很久。

And all in, you know, like, they it just gets a little tired, especially by the end of a long game like this where you're waiting a long time between turns.

我发现前几次建造飞船时花了些时间，然后才发射出去。

I found the first couple times of getting to build my ship, that takes a little while, and then I launched it.

哇。

Wow.

挺酷的。

That was cool.

我体验到了那种冒险的乐趣。

I'm getting the fun of that adventure.

现在我又得从头开始了。

Now I gotta start it all over again.

这里就是我开始觉得没劲的地方。

That's where it starts to go downhill for me.

我对游戏循环的第二个小抱怨是，游戏初期很难上手。

The second, minor complaint I have about the the cycle of the game is that the the game is pretty challenging to get going.

你得收集资源，这很困难因为你存储空间不足，行动力也不够强。

You gotta collect the resources, and those are hard because you don't have enough storage and your actions aren't as powerful.

你缺钱。

You don't have the money that you need.

比如，你一开始有些资源，但很快就为了某些发展花光了，而且很难再赚回来。

Like, you got you start with some, but you spend it pretty quickly to some developments out, and it's hard to get more money back.

所以这对我来说其实挺有趣的。

So that's actually kind of fun to me.

很有意思。

It's interesting.

这是个紧缩的经济体系。

It's a tight economy.

游戏的前三分之一，或许一半的进程。

The first, you know, third of the game, maybe half of the game.

但之后会达到一个临界点，所有事情变得过于简单，以至于我失去了继续尝试的动力。

But then it starts to be get to a point where all this stuff starts to get almost so easy that I stop trying.

光是让飞船穿越棋盘，就能自动带回资源。

Like, just by sending my ship across the board, it's bringing resources in.

这让事情对我来说变得更容易了。

It's making things easier for me.

于是我不再真正采取行动去优化这些。

And then I'm no longer really taking actions to try to optimize this stuff.

我只是不断重复着给飞船添加部件然后发射的循环。

I'm just taking actions to redo the cycle of adding more components to a ship and launching the ship.

综合这两点，两种游戏体验都让我开始觉得，我期望游戏能比实际更早结束。

And so both of those things all in, both the gameplays of it for me have have started to feel like I wanted the game to be over earlier than I I than I than it was.

这很遗憾，因为你其实并没有重复太多次这个过程。

And and that's a shame because it's not like you're doing this so many times.

我想我在游戏里大概只进行了四次巡航。

Like, I think I took a a, like, four cruises in the game.

所以并不是因为重复太多次才觉得单调。

So it wasn't like I just did this so many times that it got repetitive.

只是游戏中的乐趣确实不足以让我想要反复玩上很多次。

It's just that it it wasn't really quite fun enough to make me wanna go back and do it more than a couple times in the game.

这款游戏实在太简单了，根本没法长时间吸引我的注意力。

Well, this game was so incredibly easy that it just didn't really keep my my attention for that long.

我发现自己因为得分太多而感到无聊。

I I found myself getting bored with how many points I was scoring.

我并没有这种体验。

I did not experience that.

可能因为我没你得分那么多，但我不觉得重复操作令人不快。

I maybe because I didn't score as many points as you did, but I did not find the repetition to be unpleasant.

至少对我来说完全没有集换式游戏的感觉。

And it certainly to me did not feel like set collection.

事实上，我认为它几乎与集换式游戏相反，因为集换式游戏确实会变得重复无聊，你只是在不断堆砌物品。

In fact, I would say it was almost the opposite of set collection to me because set collection does get quite redundant and boring, and you're just piling thing on top of thing.

你总在试图收集同样的东西。

You're trying to get the same stuff.

而这款游戏中，各种需要组合的部件总是充满变化，感觉...或许用'集换协同'这个词不太准确，但就是把合适的顾客引到合适的地点，然后获得高分和大量奖励。

In this game, it felt like there was always enough variety in the different pieces that you're trying to pull together that it felt I mean, I I maybe the wrong word is, you know, set collection synergies, whatever you wanna call it, but it's getting the right, the right type of patrons to the right type of location and then scoring a lot of points and getting a lot of bonuses.

我觉得这并不无聊。

I did not find that boring.

事实上我觉得非常非常有趣。

I actually found it really, really enjoyable.

尤其让我兴奋的是，随着游戏深入，你可以选择停靠点更多的长途航线，这意味着有更多机会服务不同类型的顾客来得分。

And one of the things that I found particularly exciting was that as you got a little bit more advanced, you could take these longer cruises with more stops, which means you had more opportunities to score with different types of patrons.

我觉得这个设计其实挺酷的。

And I thought that was actually kinda cool.

是啊。

Yeah.

我们这里讨论的是游戏回合的长度和间隔时间。

We're talking about the length and the downtime between turns here.

我猜随着你们对游戏更熟悉，节奏会加快。

This is a game I suspect is gonna accelerate as you become more familiar with it.

你们会发现更高效的行动方式，找到解谜的捷径。

You're gonna see the more efficient actions and find a way through the puzzle.

随着玩家对游戏更熟悉，节奏会越来越快，更像一场竞速。

And as players become more familiar with the game, it's gonna get quicker and faster, and it's gonna become more of a race.

所以当克里斯和我试图追上蒂姆的超快速度和游戏智慧时，这种重复感可能会减少。

So maybe that repetition will get less as Chris and I are trying to catch up to Tim's supreme speed and an intellect with which he plays this one.

等克里斯和我追上后，他就不会做那么多重复动作了。

He won't be doing so many repetitions well once Chris and I catch up.

不过，蒂姆，我确实理解你的抱怨。

But, yeah, I I see your complaint there, Tim.

我自己也有同感。

I still I get that too.

如果在后续游戏中，它还是这么重复和...怎么说呢，像在苦熬，那我可能不会再玩了。

And if it on subsequent plays, if it does stay that repetitive and kind of, I don't know, grindy, then I probably won't be coming back to it.

但如果变成更高效的竞速，快速推进并更快发射物品、获得奖励，那就能感受到其中的刺激。

But if it becomes that more efficient race where we're we're running through it and getting stuff launched quicker and getting those bonus quicker, then I can see the excitement coming through.

是啊。

Yeah.

我最后关于游戏体验的补充是：等待时间确实是个问题。

Last last note for me on gameplay is that downtime is an issue here.

我第一次玩是四人局。

I played it my first play four players.

全是新手，其中一个人有严重的选择困难症，游戏进行得很拖沓。

It was all new players, and one of the guys had pretty significant AP, and it it was it dragged.

不过你知道吗，我们今晚两小时内玩了三个玩家，这还算不错。

But, you know, we played three players in two hours tonight, which isn't too bad.

当然，BGA会处理一些回合间的维护工作之类的。

Of course, BGA handles a little bit of the upkeep between turns and stuff like that.

但我认为如果你熟悉了规则，三到四人游戏大概能在一个半小时到两小时内完成。

But I think that if if you got familiar with this, you're probably playing a three or four player game in, like, an hour and a half to two hours.

我希望实际情况是这样。

I I hope that that's the case.

这样的话或许还能忍受，但确实感觉回合间隔时间相当长。

And then maybe it's it's bearable, but, it it does feel like pretty long time between your turns.

我还有一点小挑剔。

I have one more thing that was a a little nitpicky.

在主版图和玩家版图之间，大概有20个左右的小细节需要追踪注意，他们尽力了。

On the main board and on your player board between those two things, there's maybe 20 different little I don't know if 20 or 15 or so little things, little nuances that you kind of have to track and be aware of, and they do their best.

我们正在努力让主题更突出，减少混乱感。

We're we're coming up on theme to make it thematic and make it so it's not so confusing.

但话说回来，像《盖亚计划》这样的游戏也很复杂。

But again again, games like Gaia Project, it's a complex game as well.

这里需要追踪的内容比其他游戏多得多。

There's you don't have to track as much stuff as you're tracking here.

光是主版图就有20步、21步的设置流程，玩家版图还有更多步骤，规则书简直疯狂。

There's like a a 20 step setup, 21 step setup for the main board, and then you go to your player board, and it's got another, I don't know, the the rule book is just crazy.

13a和14b有蓝色气泡标记，所有这些设置步骤都要完成。

There's blue bubbles in 13 a and 14 b, all these steps you have to take setting things up.

所以需要追踪的内容非常多，各种小方块和小三角标记会随着游戏进程不断填充。

So there is just a lot to track, a lot of little cubes, a lot of little tiny triangles and stuff that gets filled in as a game goes on.

是啊，这款游戏的机制确实非常丰富。

So, yeah, a lot of stuff going on in this one.

我其实有一个观察和一个问题。

I actually have one observation and one question.

回到关于这款游戏中重复性、流程导向玩法的观察点。

Observation going back to the point about the repetitive, kind of process oriented play that's in this game.

我可以做个类比，我觉得很有用因为它们感觉相似——就是《蒸馏》这款游戏（你们知道我很喜欢），它也有那种重复流程导向的玩法，但从不让我觉得乏味，因为每次你都在尝试用略有不同的方式达成目标。

Another comparison that I can make here that I think is useful because they feel similar to me is distilled, a game that you guys know I like quite a bit, where it has that same kind of repetitive process oriented play, but it never feels old to me because each time you're doing some you're trying to accomplish something slightly differently.

你在制作略有不同的产品，这和本游戏中的操作是相同的。

You're creating a slightly different product, which is the same thing you're doing here.

在《蒸馏》中，你酿造不同种类的酒，会带来不同的收益和得分机会等等。

And in distilled, you're creating a different type of spirit, which has different benefits and point scoring opportunities, etcetera.

而在这里，你打造的是略有不同的游轮航线，最终获得类似的成果。

Here, you're creating a slightly different type of cruise and, you know, similar kinds of outcomes.

这就是我的观察。

So that was my observation.

我的问题，这与亚当刚才说的有关。

My question, and this relates back to what Adam was just saying.

Tim，作为唯一实际玩过实体版的人，你觉得在现实中管理这款游戏会不会有问题？比如设置环节和所有配件这些。

Tim, as the one person who's played this game in real life, did you feel like this would have been problematic to manage on the table dealing with things like, you know, the setup and all the pieces.

我们之前讨论过关于如何将新游客放到版图上，以及随之而来的一些维护工作。

And and we had talked one point about how you put new guests out on the board and that there was some some maintenance associated with that.

我很想听听你对现实中管理这款游戏难度的看法。

I'm curious to hear your thoughts on how you felt about how that would be to manage this one in real life.

嗯。

Yeah.

确实有些笨拙的地方。

There's some there's some clunkiness to it.

没错，设置环节很繁琐，但这没关系。

For sure, the setup is heavy, but that's okay.

在大型重度欧式游戏中，我并不介意这一点。

I don't mind that in a big heavy euro game.

就像，特别是如果你想要变化性，他们本可以大幅减少这些变量，这样会更直接明了。

Like, the it is and if especially if you want variability, like, they could have left this without a lot of the variability, and it would have been more straightforward.

但这让游戏每回合都感觉不同。

But that that makes the game feel different every turn.

不过，你可能要花上二十五到三十分钟来设置这个游戏。

But, yeah, you can spend you could probably count on spending, like, twenty five, thirty minutes getting this set up.

我倒不太在意这个。

Doesn't bother me too much.

说到维护，我很幸运有人亲自教我玩这个游戏。

The upkeep, now I was lucky when I got taught this game in person.

教我们玩的那个人在管理方面帮了大忙。

One of the guys that taught it to us or the the guy that taught it to us really helped a lot with the management.

我得告诉你，这里有几处操作特别笨拙，处理起来本可以不必如此麻烦。

And I will tell you there are a couple things that feel exceptionally kind of clunky here that you have to process that I they probably unnecessarily so.

还有每次新旅程结束后，板上会出现的新型游客。

And the the new, the new types of tourists that could come out on the board after every time there's a new tour finished.

这算是游戏的一部分吧。

Like, that that's part of it.

他几乎每回合都要重新熟悉规则。

And he kind of had to refresh himself on the rules almost every round.

比如，等等。

Like, wait.

好的。

Okay.

所以这个被拉起来了。

So this got pulled up.

这意味着我得选这个颜色，但这里没有这种颜色，所以我得选另一个。

That means I gotta pull this color, and there's not one of these colors, so I'll pull this other one.

所以这操作感觉确实没必要这么复杂。

So it it definitely felt unnecessarily complicated to do that.

我确定玩过一两次后就会变得很简单。

I'm sure it gets very easy after you run this game a you know, one or two times.

另一个现场玩时很烦人的点是启动旅程，因为有五个步骤和倒计时要走完。

The other thing that, just kinda got to be a drag in person was launching a tour because, you know, there's, like, the five steps, the countdown you have to go through.

而且还要帮其他玩家完成这些步骤。

And, like, trying to help other players get through that.

每次有人要启动旅程时，我就想：天哪。

I mean, it it just whenever someone was launching a tour, I was like, oh, boy.

又来了。

Here we go.

这又要多花五分钟，好吧。

That's another five minutes added to the turn because okay.

这个图标是干什么的来着？

Then what's this icon do again?

好的。

Okay.

我们得做那个。

We gotta do that.

我们得做这个。

We gotta do this.

我们得做这个。

We gotta do this.

所以，是的，要维护的东西太多了。

So so, yeah, it's it's a lot to maintain.

但是，这就像你把它和Lacerta游戏相比较。

But, this is like you compared it to a Lacerta game.

我认为两者没什么区别。

I don't think there's any difference there.

我觉得玩Lacerta游戏非常相似。

I think playing a Lacerta game is very similar.

这款游戏可能更精简一些。

This one may be more streamlined.

和Lacerta游戏一样，为了主题添加了一些额外机制，或许本不该加。

And in the same way as a Lacerta game, some extra mechanisms added for theme, and maybe they shouldn't be.

也许他们应该去掉部分机制，让游戏体验更流畅。

Like, maybe they should have taken some of those mechanisms out to make the game play more streamlined.

但总的来说，我觉得你玩一两次后，这些都不是什么大问题。

But, you know, all in, I I I think you play this once or twice, and none of that stuff is too too bad to deal with.

好吧，我们来聊聊《银河巡航》的制作和主题。

Well, let's talk about the production and theme of Galactic Cruise.

我想先从制作水准开始说。

I wanna just start with the, you know, the production here.

它给人一种奢华感。

It feels luxurious.

这是Ian O'Toole负责制作的。

It is an Ian O'Toole, production.

如我在节目开头所说，游戏里美术素材不多，但平面设计确实非常奢华。

Not a lot of artwork in the game, as I mentioned at the at the top of the episode, but a really, you know, extravagant graphic design.

可以说玩家版图上元素很丰富。

Would say the player boards have a lot going on.

主版图上也是信息量很大。

The main board has a lot going on.

需要追踪大量图标之类的东西。

There's a lot of icons to track and everything like that.

我认为这能让桌面布置看起来很酷。

And I think that makes for a cool table presence.

而且我觉得在这里效果还不错。

And I think it mostly works here.

考虑到游戏机制的复杂性和需要追踪的内容量，确实有很多东西要处理。

You know, again, considering how complex some of the mechanisms that are and how much stuff you have to track, that's that's a lot going on.

我认为整体运作是可行的。

And I think I think it works.

一旦学会规则，所有游戏参考信息都在玩家版图上，虽然首次游玩时需要解析大量图标。

I think it's once you have been taught the game, everything you need to reference how to play it is sitting right there on your player boards even if it means a lot of iconography to parse on the first play.

先从主题说起，我觉得这个主题非常独特且有趣。

So starting with theme, I think the theme here is pretty unique and entertaining.

在太空中进行巡航的概念本身就很有意思。

Just the idea of doing cruises in space.

这确实充满乐趣。

I mean, that's a lot of fun.

将科幻元素与复古未来主义画风相结合，我认为这个组合非常成功。

You mix some science fiction along with some, you know, retrofuturistic graphics here, and I think that that that is a winner.

就实际制作而言，我对这部分相当满意。

In terms of the actual production, I I felt pretty good about it.

主图版上的内容并没有太多特别有趣的设计。

I mean, I there's not a whole lot going on here that's super interesting on the main boards.

它们很实用，我觉得完全可以接受，除了有太多太多的图标。

They're functional, and I think that's totally fine other than a lot, lot, lot of iconography.

需要解读的图标实在太多了，我认为这是个挑战。

There's so many things you have to decipher in terms of iconography that, you know, I I think that it's a challenge.

但这款游戏的亮点，我早前提过，在于飞船设计——各种蓝图和船舱的多样性。

But where this game shines, and I had alluded to this earlier, was in the spaceships, in the different blueprints, the different cabins on the ships.

我认为这既体现了游戏的幽默感，也展现了制作的乐趣，同时为Ian O'Toole的艺术创作提供了闪耀的舞台。

I think that is both where the sense of humor in this game and the the delightfulness of the production and an opportunity for Ian O'Toole's artwork to shine a little bit.

我觉得这才是真正打动人心的地方。

I think that's where that really comes through.

比如零食故事舱、彩弹舱、游乐舱之类的设计——我的飞船里还搞了个'酒鬼巡航'主题。

Things like the, you know, snacks and story time cabin or the paintball cabin or the fun park cabin or I had a in my ship, I had I was on the booze cruise.

我配备了鸡尾酒廊和蒸馏室，还有其他各种花里胡哨的设施。

I had the the cocktail lounge and a distillery, I think, and some other just all those things.

即便这不是个剧情向游戏，它讲述的故事也很有趣——你能想象这群人登上巡航时的场景。

The story that it tells, even in a game that is not story oriented, is quite fun because you can picture these people going off on the cruise.

谁会想登上配有鸡尾酒吧或蒸馏室的飞船呢？

And who's gonna wanna go on the ship with the the cocktail bar or the distillery?

这和选择零食故事巡航的乘客完全是两类人，对吧？

Well, that's a whole different group than the folks who are gonna wanna go on the cruise with the snacks and story time.

对吧？

Right?

总之乐趣十足。

So just lots of fun.

虽然制作不算炫目，但配合这个妙趣横生的主题，我觉得非常有意思。

I I thought that the production was not particularly flashy or exciting, but I thought it was very fun along with a very fun theme.

所以总结来说，我会反复用'有趣'这个词——虽然我们之前讨论过这个词是否恰当。

So I think overall, I'm gonna say fun a whole bunch of times, and I think we've debated whether that's an appropriate term.

但我想你们都明白我想表达的意思。

But I think you guys get what I'm going for with it here.

克里斯，在座没人质疑过这点。

Nobody here has debated that with you, Chris.

乐趣永远是个合适的词。

Fun is always an appropriate term.

所以这里的生产环节，内容非常丰富。

So the the production here, there's a lot of it.

对吧？

Right?

有很多东西需要追踪。

There's a lot of things to track.

发生了很多事情。

There's a lot going on.

但关于玩这款游戏需要了解的所有信息，它们都以相对简洁的方式呈现。

But for all of the information that you need to know to play this game, it's presented in a relatively clean way.

你只需要知道该看哪里以及发生了什么。

You just have to know where to look and and what's going on.

我认为这个主题非常出色。

The theme I thought was outstanding.

这正是最初吸引我玩这款游戏的原因。

That's what first drew me to the game.

我一年前，两年前看到过这个游戏的图片。

I saw a picture of this one a year ago, two years ago.

我说，嘿。

I said, hey.

你们会支持这个游戏吗？

Are you guys gonna back this one?

看。

Look.

这是一艘中古风格的火箭飞船，克里斯。

It's a it's a mid mod rocket ship, Chris.

你得支持这个。

You gotta back this one.

但正如你所说，克里斯，其中一些风味设计展现了绝妙的幽默感。

But, the some of the flavor there's a great sense of humor, like you said, Chris.

飞船组件设计得令人愉悦。

The ship components are delightful.

议程卡底部都印着些风味文字，我觉得挺幽默的。

The agenda cards, they all have a little bit of flavor text on the bottom of them that are humorous to me.

所以我对这个主题玩得很开心，而且制作工艺相当精良。

So I had a a fun with the theme, and the production is quite nice.

是啊。

Yeah.

虽然我玩实体版已经过去六个月了，但我确实觉得有些在桌游码头没体现出来的元素，在实体桌上显得很高级。

And it's been, like, six months since I played the physical copy of this, but I do think that some of the stuff that didn't probably come through in Board Game Marina does feel premium on the table.

超大玩家版图，巨型主版图，巨型玩家面板。

Huge player huge main board, huge player boards.

当然所有组件都是双层设计的，包括主版图——如果我没记错的话，当你切换到进阶模式时，可以把特殊行动标记嵌进去，整个都是双层结构。

Of course, everything's dual layered, including, if I remember right, the main board where you can inset the the unique action tokens when you put it on the advanced side, I think that was all dual layered.

所以那些部件都能卡扣到位。

So that stuff kinda clipped in place.

感觉他们确实把纸板材料的潜力发挥到了极致。

So everything really did feel like they did the best they possibly could have done with a bunch of cardboard.

所有木质组件都相当厚实。

The wooden components were all pretty chunky.

你知道那些发展齿轮都是又大又厚实的家伙。

You know, those development gears are big, huge, chunky things.

米宝小人上的丝网印刷图案也很精美。

The meeples are nice screen printed, graphics on them.

所以对于一款现代欧式游戏来说，一切都感觉棒极了。

So everything felt great for a modern euro.

这简直就像是顶级中的顶级。

It was kind of like top top tier.

里面有许多精美的内衬设计，包括所有组件，比如你正在组装的船体部件和零件。

The there's like lots of great inserts in here, including all of the components like the ship parts and the ship pieces that you're building.

我在想还有什么呢，就是你要去完成的任务。

And I figure what else is, the the the quests that you're gonna go on.

这些都有精巧的小内衬托槽来固定它们。

Those all have nice little, kind of inserts that they they sit into.

所以不同于从一堆或一个袋子里抽取，你只需要从各自独立的小盒子里取出这些组件——它们都是分类存放的。

So instead of just a stack or a bag that you're pulling out of, you're just taking one of these out of each of the separate little boxes that they get put away with.

我觉得...顺便说一句，这个盒子本身也超级大。

So I think and and this is a huge box too, by the way.

我记得看到过...不确定是否有豪华版和零售版之分，但我朋友买的是Kickstarter豪华版——如果没记错的话。

I I remember seeing I don't know if there's a deluxe version versus a retail version, but I I my friend had the deluxe Kickstarter version or if that's if that's what it was.

盒子虽然庞大，但因为设计了大量内衬和收纳方式，让游戏准备和收拾都变得更轻松。

And the box is massive, but it works because there's so many inserts and so many ways to try to make the gameplay set up and and tear down a little bit easier.

实话说，作为欧式游戏，它给我的感觉非常奢华。

I can tell you in person, it felt luxurious for a euro.

那种质感就像Eagle-Gryphon公司出品、Ian O'Toole负责美术的大作。

It felt like it felt like one of these big Eagle Griffin, Ian O'Toole games.

很明显设计师在众筹和自主生产时，就是以那种视觉标准为目标的，所以他们才聘请了Ian O'Toole。

It's clear that the designers, when they kick started this and self produced this, they had that look and feel in mind, and that's probably why they hired Ian O'Toole.

不过确实...它也确实给人这样的感觉。

But but it it feels like that as well.

好吧。

Alright.

酷。

Cool.

好的，让我们进入最后一个问题和最终感想，那就是：你会要求再玩一次《银河巡航》吗？

Well, let's jump into our final question and our final thoughts, and that is, would you request to play Galactic Cruise again?

绝对会。

Absolutely.

今晚玩这个游戏我玩得很开心。

I had a lot of fun playing this game tonight.

请记住，尽管今晚刚开始玩的时候，我完全不知道该怎么玩。

And bear in mind, this is despite the fact that I started the game tonight feeling like I really had no idea how to play it.

当我观看规则视频时，感觉这会是个相当费劲的游戏。

When when I I watched the rules video, I felt like this is gonna be a really heavy lift.

规则会相当复杂。

It's gonna be a complex rule set.

玩起来可能会有点吃力。

It's gonna be a bit of a slog.

虽然我觉得它的主题和概念非常有趣，但也担心游戏会过于复杂，玩起来太费劲。

And I found the theme and the concept of it very entertaining, but I was a little bit concerned that it was gonna be overly heavy and too much of a slog to play.

但我经历了一个现象，这个游戏和《看板EV》给我的感觉一样——这点我稍后再提。

But I experienced a phenomenon that is the same in this game as it was for me in Kanban EV, which I'll mention again.

那是一款规则极其繁重的游戏。

And that is a game that was incredibly heavy.

我至少需要玩一两局才能真正理解所有不同的运作机制，但同时也能看到这个游戏能带来多少乐趣。

It's gonna take me at least a game or two to get a real concept of all the different working pieces, but at the same time, being able to see how much fun this game could be.

事实上这个预感已经应验了，因为我现在应该是第三次玩《看板EV》了。

And this has actually played out because I've had, I think, my third game now of Kanban EV.

每次玩我都会更喜欢它一点，因为我觉得自己理解得更深入了一些。

And every time I play it, I like it a little bit more because I feel like I'm understanding it a little bit more.

我觉得这款游戏给我的感觉也是一样的。

And this game I felt was the same way.

我觉得有好几件事我完全没注意到。

I felt like there were several things that I just completely missed.

我是说，举个例子，蒂姆，你之前提到的那个机制——当你补充某些议程卡时会获得奖励。

I mean, point you know, case in point was that thing you're talking about before, Tim, where you get bonuses when you refill some of these agenda cards.

好的。

Okay.

我完全忘了这回事。

Well, I completely forgot that.

所以下次我不会再忘记，这样我的游戏策略就能多考虑一层复杂度。

So next time I won't forget that, it'll be one more complexity that I can actually build into my strategy for playing the game.

这样下次玩的时候我会更懂一点，再下次会更熟练一点。

And so next game, I'll understand a little bit better and then a little bit better the time after that.

而且我觉得整体概念足够有趣好玩，我很愿意再玩这款游戏。

And I found the overall concept entertaining enough and enjoyable enough that I would love to play this game again.

其实我很期待在BGA上试试异步模式。

In fact, I'm I'm looking forward to trying this async on BGA.

我唯一有点担心的是之前问过的问题：现实中我会想亲自管理这款游戏吗？

The one thing that I have a little bit of concern about is the question I asked before about, would I wanna manage this game in real life?

比如这款游戏我希望会有朋友买，我就可以依赖他们来维护，提醒我该怎么操作，或是补充不同工人到空格里。

Like, this is one that I I would hope a friend of mine would get, and I could rely on them to manage the upkeep and tell me remind me of how we go about doing this or that or, you know, re, filling the spaces with the different workers.

因为我不确定自己会想负责这些，毕竟看起来确实有点过于复杂。

Because I'm not sure I would wanna be the response the one responsible for doing that because it does seem a little bit overly complex.

但我随时都乐意玩这款游戏。

But I would happily play this game just about any time.

所以我对这游戏的幽默评价是：这大概就像要和塞斯·冈萨雷斯交朋友的感觉。

So my humorous take on this one is this is probably much like the prospect of becoming friends with Seth Gonzales.

它很大。

It's big.

它令人望而生畏。

It's intimidating.

它很复杂。

It's complex.

这值得吗？

And will it be worth it?

所以我确信塞斯·冈萨雷斯绝对值得结交。

So I I'm sure Seth Gonzales is absolutely worth becoming friends with.

首先我无法接触到塞斯·冈萨雷斯，除了在网络上偶尔调侃几句外，平时基本没有往来。

This game I don't have access to Seth Gonzales for one, you know, on a on a regular basis aside from a little jabs on the Internet.

但这款游戏，我期待能异步游玩，希望它能逐渐吸引我。

But this this game, I will look forward to playing it async, and I hope that it grows for me.

我希望自己能慢慢理解规则，拼凑出完整玩法，让一切变得清晰，因为我觉得游戏内容很丰富，主题也足够让我想反复体验。

I hope that, you know, I start to figure this out and put the pieces together and things sort of congeal for me because I think there's a lot here and the theme is enough to keep me wanting to come back to it.

就像你说的，克里斯，我期待在Board Game Arena上异步玩几局。

So like you said, Chris, I'm looking forward to some async plays on board game arena.

希望玩过两三局、四五局后，我就能确定自己是否喜欢它。

And hopefully, two, three, four, five games into this, I I think I'll know whether I'm gonna enjoy it or not.

你提到了我正想说的观点。

You brought up the same point I was gonna bring up.

这不是我会购买的游戏。

This is not a game I'm ever gonna buy.

这里面内容太多了。

There's so much stuff in here.

需要太多准备时间。

So much setup time required.

我没有适合的群体玩这个。

I don't have the group for it.

所以我绝对不会买这个。

So I'm never gonna buy this one.

不过，如果我去聚会时看到这款游戏，而且有足够的自信不会在尝试时出丑，我肯定会坐下来玩一玩的。

But, yeah, if I went to a meetup and saw this one and I'd had reasonable confidence in myself that I wouldn't make a fool out of myself trying to play this one, I'd sit down and play it for sure.

但确实很期待在Board Game Arena上玩几局新游戏。

But, yeah, definitely looking forward to some, some upcoming plays on Board Game Arena.

是啊。

Yeah.

《Collective Cruise》是款非常出色的游戏。

Collective Cruise is an excellent game.

它是一款相当扎实的欧式桌游，如果我在别人架子上看到它，可能会要求再玩一次。

It's it's a really solid euro, and I probably will ask to play it again if I see it on somebody's shelf.

虽然我不觉得这会成为我最爱的游戏，但它确实很棒，有机会玩的话我都会很享受。

But I don't like, I don't think this is gonna be a favorite game for me, but it's a really good game, and I will enjoy it anytime I get a chance to play it.

我觉得这类游戏会随着你技巧提升而变得更有趣，我有几个朋友经常一起玩重度欧式游戏，最精彩的就是这种针锋对麦芒的较量。

I I think this is one of those games where, like, it's gonna get more fun the better you get at it and kind of I've I've got some friends that I play, like, heavy euros with repeatedly, and it tends to be most interesting when it's this head to head battle.

就像是...好吧。

And it's just this like, okay.

这次我要在一两件事上做得比对手更好。

This time, I'm gonna do one or two things a little bit better than my opponent.

这样游戏就变得更有意思了。

And so it becomes more interesting.

但我觉得它确实缺少《Arc Nova》或《Terraforming Mars》给我的那种快乐感，后者能让我体验到丰富的游戏变化。

But I do think that this one doesn't quite have some of the joy of something like Arc Nova for me, where Arc Nova is gonna feel like so much variety that I get to experience in that game or Terraforming Mars.

可能因为我特别喜欢那种包含大量卡牌的游戏吧。

And maybe it's the the big deck of cards that I'm all in on that.

这款游戏，我觉得它的多样性和玩法——建造那些飞船——变化不够充分。

This one, I just feel like the variety and what you're doing, building those ships out, it doesn't change enough.

所以开始感觉有点重复了。

So it starts to feel a little redundant.

克里斯提到了《蒸馏》这款游戏。

Chris mentioned Distilled.

我不得不承认《蒸馏》给我的感觉也有点类似，但它稍微轻松一些。

I can't deny that Distilled feels a little bit like that for me, but it's a little bit lighter.

但在游戏中反复经历相同流程的循环，你知道的，会让人有点疲惫。

But the cycle of going through the same process repeatedly in a game just, you know, it gets a little tired.

不过话说回来，这仍是一款很棒的游戏。

But still, this is a great game.

我认为这是一款杰出的Lacerda游戏。

I think it's an ex I think it's an exceptional Lacerda game.

话虽如此，它并非Lacerda设计的游戏，但很可能比大多数Lacerda作品有所改进。

That to be said, it's not a Lacerda game, but it's probably it's probably an improvement on most Lacerda designs.

它提供了丰富的主题元素。

It gives you a lot of theme.

它设置了一些复杂的触发条件和需要组合的连招，但相比大多数Lacerda游戏更容易理解。

It gives you some complex triggers and, and combos you gotta put together, but it's a little bit more comprehendible than, than most Lacerda games.

我的意思是，我也不确定。

I mean, I don't know.

我只玩过一款Lacerda游戏，所以不该妄加评论。

I've only played one Lacerda game, so I shouldn't talk like that.

我只是隐约觉得从这个角度看它们不会有本质区别。

I just I I have a a sneaking suspicion that they're they're not drastically different from that perspective.

但即便如此，《银河巡航》确实是款非常酷的游戏。

But, that being said, yeah, Galactic Cruise, very cool game.

出色的新手设计。

Great freshman design.

这些设计者创造并通过众筹推出这款游戏，显然投入了大量时间进行开发、试玩，最终打造出一款在同类游戏中既精巧又流畅的作品。

These designers that that created this game and crowdfunded it clearly put a ton of time into developing this and and playing it and and creating a really smart and streamlined game for the weight that it is.

所以值得称赞。

So kudos.

我们会持续关注这些设计师，看看他们未来还有什么新作，但《银河巡航》绝对值得一试，值得关注。

We'll be watching these designers in the future to see, you know, what else they put out, but, Galactic Cruise is definitely worth a play, worth checking out.

好的。

Alright.

那么，关于《银河巡航》的讨论就到这里，接下来我们要聊聊最近在玩的几款游戏。

Well, that will wrap up our conversation on Galactic Cruise, and we're gonna chat about a few games that have been on our table right after this.

欢迎回来。

Welcome back.

你们最近都在玩些什么？

What have you guys had on your table lately?

而且，克里斯，你在上期节目里吊胃口了，这次必须得聊聊那件事。

And, Chris, you teased something in the last episode, so you have to talk about it this time.

哦，让我告诉你。

Oh, let me tell you.

当克里斯吊胃口时，他从不让人失望。

When Chris teases something, Chris delivers.

今晚我就要揭晓了，宝贝。

And I'm delivering tonight, baby.

别担心。

Don't you worry about it.

好吧。

Alright.

最近我玩了很多游戏，因为几周前我和本地游戏小组举办了年度俄勒冈海岸游戏周末，我们玩了一大堆非常有趣的东西。

So I played a lot of games recently because a few weeks ago, I had my annual Oregon Coast game weekend with my local game group, and we played a whole bunch of very fun stuff.

在揭晓重头戏之前，我要先提一款名为《恶魔附身》的巧妙小游戏——我猜你们肯定没听说过，因为它在BGG上几乎查无此游，但这游戏真的超有趣。

The first one I'm gonna mention before I get to my big tease, the big reveal, was a clever little game called Demoniac, which I'm gonna guess you guys have never heard of because it is barely even barely does it even have a presence on BGG, but what a fun game this was.

这款游戏是我的朋友乌拉带来的，她和我一样是恐怖题材狂热粉，尤其对八十年代粗制滥造的恐怖电影情有独钟。

So this is a game that was brought by my friend Ulla, who like me is a huge horror fan and who has a particular soft spot for cheesy eighties horror movies.

我说的是那种特别烂俗的。

And I'm talking cheesy.

不是指弗莱迪·克鲁格或杰森这种大IP。

Now I'm not talking about the big names like Freddy Krueger and Jason.

而是像《篮子里的恶魔》《城堡怪人》《鬼玩人》这类低成本制作的经典作品。

I'm talking about the low budget stuff like basket case, castle freak, evil dead, all those great classics.

懂的人自然懂，而且会爱得要死。

For those of you who know this stuff, you know it and you love it.

不了解的人听了大概觉得匪夷所思。

Otherwise, it's probably gonna sound crazy.

这游戏连包装都设计成八十年代录像带封套的样子，就像那些老电影的出租录像带。

But this game is even designed, the packaging, to look like an old eighties blockbuster video sleeve with one of those movies in it.

《恶魔附身》的核心玩法是：你操控一个角色。

So the idea behind Demoniac is that, you have a character.

每个玩家扮演试图附身人类的恶魔。

Each person is a character who they're trying to possess.

他们就是恶魔本魔。

They're a demon.

目标是把人类角色彻底转化成附身状态。

And they're trying to flip this person over to fully possessed mode.

还有个从驱魔师牌堆里召唤的驱魔师角色，机制会稍有不同。

And there is also an exorcist who comes from a deck of exorcist who is slightly different.

它们拥有不同的力量和不同的弱点。

They have different powers and different weaknesses.

但这里的核心概念是，你需要用卡片排列成一个倒十字架的形状，满足所有必要条件才能附身你试图控制的那个人。

But the idea here is that you have to create a set a tableau of cards in the shape of an upside down cross that meets all the necessities to possess that particular person that you're trying to get to.

你会注意到这些卡片上印有各种心理操控和附身策略，恐怖片粉丝对这些元素会感到非常熟悉。

And you're gonna notice that on all these cards, there's different types of, you know, psychological, possession tactics and various things that are gonna look very familiar to any fan of horror movies.

这些卡片的灵感全部来源于恐怖电影经典元素。

These cards are all based upon things from the horror cinema oeuvre.

当你把这些卡片摆放到位后，就必须针对你案例中驱魔师的弱点发起攻击。

But you get those into the, into place, and then you have to prey upon the weaknesses of The Exorcist in your case.

当某位玩家成功让被附身者堕落，并在其周围正确摆放完所有卡片后，就能成为游戏中最成功的恶魔并获胜。

And then once one person has managed to flip their possessee and put all of the right cards in the right the right positions in the tableau around that person is the winner, the most successful demon in the game.

这是个充满无厘头趣味的游戏，策略性不强，也没有什么复杂的玩法机制。

This is some goofy fun, not a lot of strategy, not a lot of, you know, heavy gameplay.

我们玩这局游戏大概花了十五到二十分钟。

I think it took us about fifteen, twenty minutes to play this game.

老实说，即使在BGG上我也几乎查不到关于它的新信息。

Honestly, I can find almost new information about it here even on BGG.

游戏资料里没有列出设计师或出版商。

It does not list a designer or a publisher.

这是自主发行的作品。

It's self published.

显然这是2023年通过众筹发布的游戏。

And apparently, it was a crowdfunded game released in 2023.

但我要说，如果你是恐怖片爱好者，特别是钟爱八十年代那种骨子里透着廉价感的恐怖元素，又恰巧在哪儿看到这款游戏，它确实能带来相当有趣的体验。

But I will say, if you are a fan of horror, especially if you're a fan of that kind of really deep down cheesy eighties horror stuff and you see this somewhere, it was actually a pretty fun, good time.

特别说明——我现在提起这个是因为我们刚结束十月份的活动。

And especially, I'm throwing this out now because we're just well, we just wrapped up October.

我们刚过完万圣节。

We just passed Halloween.

现在是万圣节过后几天。

It's a couple days after Halloween.

尽管你们稍后才会听到这段内容，但我现在满脑子还是万圣节的氛围。

And even though you'll be hearing this a little bit later, I still have Halloween in my in my mind right now.

所以'恶魔附体'这个主题感觉特别应景。

So demoniac feels particularly appropriate for the season.

克里斯，这看起来真有意思。

Chris, this looks like a a delight.

你提到的所有八十年代元素——搞错的降神会、潜意识暗示场景都齐了。

All the eighties tropes you were talking about, there's a misguided seance, subliminal sites.

有些卡牌的名字既滑稽又精彩，美术风格也很有趣。

Some of the names of these cards are goofy and terrific, and the artwork looks pretty fun.

《恶魔附体》。

Demoniac.

克里斯，我没太明白这游戏怎么玩。

Chris, I didn't really get how do you play the game.

是类似集换式卡牌游戏吗？比如从牌堆抽牌那种？

Is it like a it's like a card game, like almost a set collection game where like, what, drawing cards off a deck or something?

要怎么搭建这个桌面板呢？

How do you how do you put how do you build this tableau?

你需要拿牌出牌，有些牌能让你执行特定行动，比如移除别人的牌，还能影响其他人的桌面板和驱魔师等等。

You you take cards and play cards, and then there are other cards that let you do certain things like remove other people's cards, and you can have impacts on other people's tableaus and and on the The Exorcist, etcetera.

我们终于找到了克里斯愿意玩的深夜卡牌游戏。

We found the one late night card game Chris is willing to play.

这就对了，克里斯。

There you go, Chris.

你得弄一份这个带过来。

You gotta get a copy of this and bring it up.

说起来有点奇怪，我看着它的时候，感觉这游戏玩起来可能会很像《海盐与纸》，那是我相当喜欢的一款游戏。

It it almost in a in a weird way, when I was looking at it, I was thinking I almost feel like this is probably gonna play like sea salt and paper, which is a game I like quite a bit.

事情是这样的。

Here's the deal.

对吧？

Right?

这个在BGG上。

This is on BGG.

它有9.0的评分，是评分最高的游戏之一。

It's got a nine point o rating, one of the highest rated games.

哦，它只有

Oh, it's only

三个评分。

got three ratings.

不是吧。

No.

挺酷的。

That's cool.

挺酷的，克里斯。

That's cool, Chris.

如果你下次聚会能带上你朋友的副本，我很想玩这个。

If you if you can bring your friend's copy, when we all get together next time, I'd love to play this one.

没问题。

Right on.

听起来很有趣。

Sounds fun.

另一款游戏，就是我之前提到的，是Reiner Kinesia的《Rebirth》。

The other game, which was the the one I teased previously, was Rebirth by Reiner Kinesia.

我还好。

And I'm okay.

那么关于《Rebirth》我能说些什么呢？

So what can I say about rebirth?

首先，这据称是《Samurai》的重新实现版本。

So first of all, this is supposedly a reimplementation of Samurai.

克里斯，我在页面上甚至没看到这个说法。

I don't see that on the page even, Chris.

我知道你是这么说的，但它并未被列为重新实现版本。

I know you said that, but it is not listed as a reimplementation.

我完全不同意这个说法。

I totally disagree with that.

我不知道是谁告诉你的。

I don't know who told you that.

有人给你提供了错误信息。

Somebody somebody fed you misinformation.

这是假新闻。

It's fake news.

好吧。

Well, okay.

之前AI告诉我它是，现在又说不是了。

So AI, which told me before that it was, now says that it is not.

我不知道该如何调和这个AI幻觉。

I'm not sure how to reconcile this AI hallucination.

好吧。

Okay.

首先，为什么你不先说说

So first of all, why why don't why don't you tell

你认为它为什么不是？

me why you think it's not?

嗯，好吧。

Well, okay.

因为我理解这是Reiner Kinetics的一款铺砖游戏，类似抽砖块、放砖块。

Because the the I get that it is one of Reiner Kinetics' tile laying games, like draw tiles, play a tile.

他有很多这类游戏，但这款感觉和《武士》差距最大，相比我玩过的他其他同类型游戏。

He's got a bunch of these, but this feels the most distance from Samurai than any of the other of this type of game of his that I played.

最大的区别——为什么这是款杰出游戏而《武士》容易玩腻——在于你必须更讲究战术。

And the biggest difference the biggest difference in why this is an exceptional game while Samurai gets tired quickly is that you have to be so much more tactical about it.

当你试图完成某项任务时，并不能保证我能开始而别人能完成它。

When you're trying to finish something, there's no guarantee that I can start something and somebody else can finish it.

这对我来说是天壤之别。

And that makes all the difference in the world to me.

在《武士》里，每次当我快完成时，感觉都是在给对手做嫁衣。

With Samurai, it feels like every time, if I'm close to completing something, I'm really just setting up my opponents for for, you know, for success with it.

所以对我来说，这就是《重生》最成功的改变。

So to me, that's the big winning change in rebirth.

选择、获得的奖励、所有加成都至关重要。

The the choice, what you get, the bonuses, all matter.

但是，Chris，我必须问你最重要的问题：你玩的是棋盘苏格兰一侧还是爱尔兰一侧？

But, Chris, the most important question I have to ask you, did you play the Scotland side of the board or the Ireland side of the board?

哎呀，老兄。

Oh, man.

我不记得了。

I can't remember.

就是那两个中的一个。

It it was one of those two.

你玩的是那种抽卡绘图游戏吗？就是那种隐藏奖励卡，根据你从牌堆抽的卡来决定大部分奖励的？

Did you play the one where you're drawing drawing, hidden bonus cards that note like, like, that that most of the the bonuses that you were going for based on these cards that you would draw off a deck?

我不...等等，你知道吗？

That I don't oh, you know what?

是苏格兰。

It was Scotland.

我记得是因为我认出了几个城镇的名字之类的。

I remember because I recognize some of the names of the towns and and such.

对。

Yeah.

我当时玩的就是苏格兰版。

It it was Scotland that I was playing.

好吧。

Okay.

有道理。

Fair enough.

不过...呃，算了。

But but well, no.

我想让你来聊聊这个。

I'm gonna let you talk about it.

我提前说一句，爱尔兰那边的棋盘比苏格兰那边的棋盘好多了。

I just wanna get ahead of that and say that Ireland's side of the board, much better than Scotland's side of the board.

要有趣得多。

Much more interesting.

行吧。

Okay.

说吧，克里斯。

Go ahead, Chris.

放轻松些。

Let let loose.

我...我不知道。

I I don't know.

这是指现实生活中的情况吗？

Is that, like, in real life?

我是说，我们在这里对爱尔兰和苏格兰有什么看法？

I mean, what are we saying about Ireland and Scotland here?

我觉得苏格兰可能会对此有意见。

I mean, I feel like, you know, Scotland may take issue with that.

你明白吗？

You know?

那好吧。

So okay.

我真的记不清了。

I don't really remember.

也许我已经把武士游戏的体验从记忆中屏蔽了。

Maybe I've blocked from my memory what the play of samurai was like.

但事情是这样的。

But here's the deal.

这款游戏给我的愉悦感似乎超过了武士游戏——至少比我记忆中的武士游戏体验更好。

This feels like it was more pleasing to me than samurai was or at least my memory of playing samurai.

这其中可能有几个原因。

And there's there maybe is a couple reasons for that.

其中一个众所周知的原因是，我们玩武士游戏时正值午后低迷时段。

One of them was, infamously, we played samurai in the the early afternoon slump.

那是在午餐刚结束的时候。

It was right after lunch.

可能早上喝了太多酒，这从来都不是个好主意。

Probably had too many drinks in the morning, which is always a bad idea.

然后到了下午某个时刻，你就会觉得，呃，有点提不起劲。

And, you know, you kinda get to that point in the afternoon where you're like, meh.

而这次是在晚餐前，大家都显得有点，你知道，兴致勃勃、心情愉悦。

As opposed to this one where it was right before dinner and, yeah, everybody was feeling a little bit, you know, jaunty and happy.

另外这款游戏的视觉效果比《Samurai》赏心悦目得多。

And and the other piece is that this game is infinitely more pleasing to the eye than Samurai was.

我记得看《Samurai》时的反应是：哇。

I remember looking at Samurai and being like, wow.

这个设计太抽象了，看着很不舒服，完全激发不起我的兴趣。

This is just so abstract and so unpleasing to look at that I just I didn't find it exciting at all.

但这些都不是喜欢或讨厌一款游戏的真正理由。

But those aren't really reasons to love or hate a game.

对吧？

Right?

我是说，这些算是氛围营造的部分，但我觉得并没有真正回答问题。

I mean, that's kind of you know, those are some atmospherics about it, but I don't think really answer the question.

不过这款游戏虽然比《Samurai》更让我享受，但最终给我的感觉和Reiner Kinesia风格一样令人不悦。

But I think this game, even though I enjoyed it more than I did Samurai, it really left me with the same feeling of Reiner Kinesia esque ness that I just find unappealing.

这种玩法就是：哦，你在计分区域旁边放了一块板块。

This idea of, oh, I you put a tile next to a space that's gonna score you some points.

哦，但别人放了块更高分的板块在旁边，就把分数抢走了。

Oh, but then somebody else puts an even higher point tile next to it, and that takes it away from you.

于是你又放下一块，就这样不断试图用尽可能多的分数——不是分数，是能量点还是什么专业术语来着——来包围这些区域。

So you put another one down, and you're just trying to surround these things with as many, you know, points as you can, not points, but power points or whatever whatever the right term is.

你只是在试图与人争斗，并足够聪明地获取更多东西，比如围绕城堡的卡片上那些能为你赢得分数的小标记。

And you're just trying to fight people and be clever enough that you can get more, like, little pips on on cards around a castle that's gonna score you points.

这对我来说并不那么令人兴奋。

And that's just not that exciting to me.

主题上并不那么有趣。

It's not that thematically interesting.

也不那么令人愉悦。

It's not that pleasing.

这款游戏在制作上要好得多，看起来也更令人愉快。

This game is much nicer in terms of production, and it's much more enjoyable to look at.

所以尽管我认为其基本机制对我没有吸引力，但我发现玩这款游戏时稍微更有趣一些。

And so even though I think the fundamentals are unappealing to me, I found this one slightly more appealing to play.

我想这就是我能说的全部了。

And I guess that's all I can say about it.

我并不怎么喜欢它，但你知道，如果你在一天中合适的时间问我，我也不会讨厌它。

I didn't I didn't like it that much, but, you know, if you ask me at the right time of day, I won't hate it.

是啊。

Yeah.

当你刚才描述它的时候，听起来确实很像武士游戏，克里斯。

The when you described it there, was like, yeah, that does sound like Samurai, Chris.

但不知为何，这款游戏对我来说比武士游戏好得多。

But for some reason, this works a lot better than Samurai for me.

我喜欢的是，我认为你只有大约三个选择。

I like the, you just I think you have, like, three options.

这是个节奏快的游戏。

It's a speedy game.

它很迅速。

It's quick.

游戏玩法看起来轻松明快，决策简单，整体给人感觉非常畅快。

It seemed like upbeat and quick gameplay, easy choices to make, and just a breezy game.

所以比起《武士》，我更喜欢这一款。

So that's why I like this one better than Samurai.

是啊。

Yeah.

克里斯，关于棋盘爱尔兰区域最令人兴奋的一点是，上面有很多地方能让你立即获得奖励。

Chris, one thing about the Ireland side of the board, which is really exciting, is that there are a lot of places on the board where you just get instant, bonuses.

所以我认为棋盘另一面有两个方面你会更喜欢。

So there there's two thing two things that I think you'd like more about it, the other side of the board.

一是你可以触发所有这些奖励机制。

One is that there's all these bonuses you can trigger.

因此放置选择不仅关乎如何为自己赢得分数。

So one of the placement choices isn't just about setting yourself up for points.

分数很无聊，但为自己争取奖励的过程才有趣。

Points are boring, but setting yourself up to get bonuses, that's fun.

所以这部分设计确实很酷。

So that that's a cool part of that.

另一个特点是有一系列竞速目标。

The other part is that there's a bunch of race goals.

不同于单纯从牌堆顶抽取目标然后独自完成任务，你需要时刻关注其他玩家在棋盘上的行动，因为你们要争夺首个达成目标的资格。

So, like, instead of just drawing goals off the top of a deck and then you're trying to work towards your own individual goal, you are constantly having to pay attention to what other people are putting out on the board because you're competing with them for the first person to get to.

比如，举例来说，建造三座一级城市或其他类型的多个目标。

Like, you know, I I you know, for example, three level one cities or several other types of goals.

这也会引发大量互动。

So that also key leads to a lot of interaction.

话说回来，你对这款游戏反响平平我并不意外。

All that said, I'm not surprised that this wasn't a huge hit for you.

我下次展会可能还是会带上它。

I still might bring it to our next con.

玩爱尔兰那一方。

Play the Ireland side.