BS 214 第十七届年度回顾特辑

大家好，我是卡拉·戈尔丁秀的卡拉。

Kara here from the Kara Goldin Show.

如果你还没有使用Ironclad来管理合同，你可能正在让数百万美元的收益溜走。

If you're not using Ironclad for contracts, you could be leaving millions on the table.

Ironclad的AI能立即提取出关键信息——续约日期、定价条款和义务，让你在机会溜走前迅速采取行动。

Ironclad's AI instantly surfaces what matters, renewal dates, pricing terms, and obligations, so you can act quickly before opportunities slip away.

这就是为什么OpenAI、欧莱雅、Salesforce等众多知名品牌都信赖它。

That's why they're trusted by great brands like OpenAI, L'Oreal, Salesforce, and so many others.

前往ironcladapp.com/podcast，发现你合同中隐藏的节省空间。

Find the savings hiding in your contracts at ironcladapp.com/podcast.

网址是ironcladapp.com/podcast。

That's ironcladapp.com/podcast.

欢迎收听《大脑科学》，这档播客探讨神经科学的最新发现如何帮助我们解开大脑如何塑造人性的谜团。

Welcome to Brain Science, the podcast that explores how recent discoveries in neuroscience are helping unravel the mystery of how our brain makes us human.

这是第214期，我是您的主持人，甘纳·坎贝尔医生。

This is episode 214, and I'm your host, doctor Ginger Campbell.

本集计划于2023年12月15日发布，这一天正好是《脑科学播客》第一集于2006年12月15日播出的第十七周年纪念日。

This episode is scheduled for release on 12/15/2023, which is the seventeenth anniversary of episode one of the Brain Science Podcast on 12/15/2006.

我想首先感谢您的收听，无论您是新听众，还是从一开始就陪伴我的老听众。

I wanna start by thanking you for listening, whether you are new or have been with me from the beginning.

如果您是第一次听这个节目，本集内容可能会有些信息量过大，但它能帮助您了解我们今年探讨的广泛主题。

If you are new to the show, this episode might be a little overwhelming, but it will give you a sense of the breadth of topics that we explored this year.

一如既往，您可以通过邮箱 brainsciencepodcast@gmail.com 向我反馈意见。

As always, you can send me feedback at brainsciencepodcast@gmail.com.

您也可以在 brain science podcast dot com 上找到完整的节目笔记和文字稿。

You can also find complete show notes and episode transcripts at brain science podcast dot com.

由于这集可能会比较长，我会尽量将我的公告缩减到最少。

Because this is likely to be a long episode, I will try to keep my announcements to a minimum.

请听到最后，那里有关于脑科学未来的重要公告。

Please listen to the end for an important announcement about the future of brain science.

通常我会按时间顺序做年度回顾，但今年我会稍微调整一下方式。

Usually, I do my year end review in chronological order, but this year I'm gonna mix things up a bit.

我将首先回顾上个月与凯文·米切尔就他的新书《自由代理人：进化如何赋予我们自由意志》的对话。

I'm gonna start by reviewing last month's conversation with Kevin Mitchell about his new book, Free Agents, How Evolution Gave Us Free Will.

这场对话引发了大量反馈，既有正面的，也有负面的，这并不奇怪，因为米切尔挑战了众多神经科学家和哲学家的主流观点——他们认为自由意志是一种幻觉。

This conversation generated a lot of feedback, both positive and negative, which is not surprising given that Mitchell challenges the current mainstream position of many neuroscientists and philosophers who argue that free will is an illusion.

无论你对这一重要问题持何种立场，我都鼓励你阅读米切尔的这本书。

Whatever your position on this important issue, I encourage you to read Mitchell's book.

我这样说的一个原因是，米切尔方法中的许多细节和严谨性，部分由于时间限制，部分由于访谈形式本身的特性而被忽略了。

One reason I say this is because much of the detail and rigor of Mitchell's approach was lost partly due to time constraints and partly due to the very nature of the interview format.

例如，书中详细讨论了为何被用来支持‘自由意志是幻觉’这一对立观点的证据受到了质疑，书中对此进行了详尽阐述，并提供了大量参考文献。

For example, the book includes a discussion of why the evidence that has been used to support the opposing view that free will is an illusion has been challenged, and this is discussed in detail in his book with ample references.

要找到论证‘自由意志是幻觉’的书籍并不难。

It's not hard to find books arguing for the position that free will is an illusion.

其中一本备受关注的是罗伯特·塞巴斯基的新书《决定论：无自由意志的生命科学》。

One that's getting a lot of attention is Robert Sebalsky's new book, determined, a science of life without free will.

几个月前我与米切尔交谈时，他期待能与塞巴斯基公开辩论，我希望到这篇评论发布时，相关链接能已上线。

When I talked with Mitchell several months ago, he was looking forward to publicly debating Sebalsky, and I am hoping links to this will be available by the time this review is posted.

一些听众认为米切尔的论点相对简单，但在我看来，这正是它的魅力所在。

Some listeners objected to the relative simplicity of Mitchell's argument, but to me, this is part of its appeal.

核心观点非常清晰。

The key ideas are straightforward.

从科学角度来看，进化没有目的或目标。

From a scientific standpoint, evolution doesn't have a purpose or a goal.

它只是反映了宇宙不断变化的特性，以及某些变化得以保留而其他变化消失的事实。

It just reflects the constant changing nature nature of the universe and the fact that some changes persist while others disappear.

自由意志意味着做出有意义选择的能力，米切尔认为，这种能力随着生命的出现而演化出来。

Free will implies the ability to make meaningful choices, and Mitchell argues that this ability evolved with the emergence of life.

即使是单细胞生物也具有能动性，因为它们会做出简单的选择，比如靠近食物、远离威胁。

Even single celled life forms have agency because they make simple choices like going toward food and away from threats.

它们也有一个目标，那就是活下去。

They also have a purpose, which is to stay alive.

从进化的角度来看，随着生命变得越来越复杂，生物所能拥有的能动性或自由意志水平也随之提升。

From an evolutionary point of view, as life became more complex, so did the level of agency or free will that organisms could enjoy.

据我们所知，人类拥有前所未有的能力来反思自己行为的后果。

As far as we can tell, humans have an unprecedented ability to reflect on the consequences of our actions.

有人可能会说，这也赋予了我们前所未有的责任感。

One could argue that this also gives us an unprecedented level of responsibility.

米切尔论点的第二个关键要素，是反驳‘一切均由底层物理规律决定’这一假设，即我们的宇宙是决定论的主张。

The second key element of Mitchell's argument attacks the assumption that everything is determined by low level physics, which is the claim that our universe is deterministic.

在我看来，许多人将决定论视为一种高度科学的立场，而非哲学立场，这颇具讽刺意味，但我猜这源于关于量子力学含义的持续争论。

To me, it is ironic that many consider determinism to be a highly scientific position rather than a philosophical one, but I guess this comes from the ongoing debate about the meaning of quantum mechanics.

量子力学使科学家能够对亚原子层面本质上是概率性的过程做出高度精确的预测。

Quantum mechanics gives scientists the ability to make highly precise predictions about essentially probabilistic processes at the subatonic level.

人们常开玩笑说，真正理解量子力学的人寥寥无几，但现实是，即使那些理解它的人，也可能对它的真正含义存在分歧。

It's often joked that few people really understand quantum mechanics, but the reality is even those who do may disagree with what it really means.

因此，如果一个人倾向于决定论观点，他很容易找到一位物理学家来支持这一立场。

Thus, if one is inclined to a deterministic view, one can easily find a physicist to support that position.

但我也想指出，米切尔并非唯一一位考虑替代路径的神经科学家。

But I would also like to point out that Mitchell is not the only neuroscientist to consider the alternative approach.

迈克尔·古扎尼加也对无确定性对道德能动性的影响进行了大量论述。

Michael Guzaniga has also written extensively about the implications of indeterminacy to moral agency.

我对物理学的了解，除了基础内容外，主要来自我广泛阅读的面向大众的书籍。

My own knowledge of physics beyond the basics is limited to my extensive reading of books intended for general audiences.

我一直觉得量子力学的标准解释令人不满意，因此我特别欣赏卡洛·罗韦利的著作《理解量子革命》。

I've always found the standard interpretations of quantum mechanics unsatisfying, which is why I appreciate Carlo Rovelli's book, Making Sense of the Quantum Revolution.

罗韦利的量子力学关系性解释，与我过去二十年从神经科学中学到的许多观点不谋而合。

Rovelli's relational interpretation of quantum mechanics resonates with much of what I have learned from neuroscience over the last twenty years.

对我来说，重要的是并非所有物理学家都相信宇宙是无确定性的；只要这种观点是成立的，就无法以物理学为依据否定自由意志。

To me, it is not important that all physicists believe that the universe is indeterminate because as long as it is a viable position, one cannot argue against free will on the basis of physics.

反对自由意志的另一个主要论点，是假设我们有大量实验证据表明我们的行为由大脑中的无意识过程决定。

The other main argument against free will is the assumption that we have overwhelming experimental evidence that our behavior is determined by unconscious processes in the brain.

例如，利贝特著名的实验中，受试者被要求移动手指，并记录他们感受到移动冲动的时刻。

For example, Labbe's famous experiments where people were asked to move their fingers and to note when they felt the urge to move.

这项实验显示，在受试者感受到移动冲动之前，脑电图中就已经出现了所谓的‘准备电位’。

This experiment showed a so called readiness potential in the EEG before they felt the urge to move.

自从这项实验首次开展以来，无数科学家和哲学家对其进行了分析和解读，其中许多人对主要结论提出了质疑。

Since this experiment was first done, it has been analyzed and interpreted by countless scientists and philosophers, many of whom challenge the main conclusions.

首先，实验结果高度依赖于实验设计。

For one thing, the results are highly dependent on the experimental design.

问题不在于大脑中是否存在无意识过程，因为显然存在。

The issue is not whether there are unconscious processes going on in the brain, because clearly there are.

关键问题是，这些无意识过程是否决定了我们的行为，从而剥夺了我们的有意识选择。

The key question is whether these are what determine our actions depriving us of conscious choice.

显然，这个问题的答案超越了单纯的求知欲，关系到个人责任等关键社会概念。

Obviously, the answer to this question goes beyond any intellectual curiosity to key social concepts like personal responsibility.

因此，重要的是你要知道，并非所有人都认同我们的行为是由超出我们控制的无意识力量驱动的。

So it is important that you know that not everyone agrees that we are driven by unconscious forces beyond our control.

除了米切尔书中讨论的内容外，我还推荐另一本新书《探寻无意识心灵的真相》，作者是本·纽尔和大卫·尚克斯。

Besides the discussion in Mitchell's book, I also recommend another new book, Searching for the Truth about the Unconscious Mind by Ben Newell and David Shanks.

纽尔和尚克斯认为，无意识在行为中的作用被严重夸大了。

Newell and Shanks argue that the role of the unconscious in behavior has been highly exaggerated.

我稍后会在谈到与路易斯·佩索阿的对话时再回到这个问题。

I will come back to this later when I talk about my conversation with Luis Pessoa.

显然，自由意志的问题非常重要，甚至可能比理解大脑如何产生意识更为重要。

Clearly, the question of free will is important, probably even more important than understanding how the brain generates consciousness.

因此，我鼓励你们阅读凯文·米切尔的著作《自由个体：进化如何赋予我们自由意志》。

That's why I encourage you to read Kevin Mitchell's book, Free Agents, How Evolution Gave Us Free Will.

现在让我们回到今年年初，当时我与阿拉巴马大学的分子生物学家盖伊·卡德韦尔进行了两次对话。

Now let's return to the beginning of the year, which started with two conversations with molecular biologist Guy Caldwell from the University of Alabama.

第204期是一期重播节目，内容是卡德韦尔医生的访谈。

Episode two zero four was an encore episode featuring Doctor.

卡德韦尔早在2009年就曾首次做客《大脑科学》节目。

Caldwell's first appearance on brain science back in 2009.

我实际上是在一场帕金森病研讨会上听到盖伊的演讲，于是邀请他来到《大脑科学》节目，谈谈他与著名线虫C.

I actually heard Guy speak at a conference on Parkinson's disease, and I invited him I invited him on Brain Science to talk about his work with the famous roundworm, C.

elegans的研究工作。

Elegans.

自从我第一次与卡德威尔博士交谈以来，分子生物学在神经科学中的重要性日益增加。

Since I first talked with doctor Caldwell, molecular biology has become increasingly important in neuroscience.

因此，我邀请他回到节目中，参与第205期的访谈。

That's why I asked him to come back on the show for episode two zero five.

这两次对话有很多重叠之处，因此我将聚焦于核心观点，而不单独讨论这两期节目。

There's quite a bit of overlap between these two conversations, so I'm gonna focus on the key ideas without discussing the episodes separately.

根据盖伊·卡德威尔的说法，首先，分子生物学是什么？

According to Guy Caldwell first of all, what is molecular biology?

根据盖伊·卡德威尔的说法，分子生物学是研究和分析产生DNA、RNA以及构成细胞的蛋白质的分子。

According to Guy Caldwell, molecular biology is the study and analysis of the molecules that produce DNA, RNA, and the proteins that are the components of the cell.

换句话说，分子生物学就是研究生命分子的科学。

In other words, molecular biology is the study of the molecules of life.

分子生物学不应与基因工程混淆，尽管如今许多分子生物学家在研究对象时会通过操控基因来进行基因工程。

Molecular biology should not be confused with genetic engineering, even though today, many molecular biologists do genetic engineering when they manipulate the genes of whatever they are studying.

卡德威尔指出，整个生物技术领域都是从分子生物学中发展起来的。

Caldwell pointed out that the whole field of biotechnology has emerged from molecular biology.

他还表示，他依然认为，学习分子生物学是进入其他生物学或医学领域的最佳基础之一。

He also says that he continues to believe that studying molecular biology is one of the finest backgrounds to launch into other fields of biology or medicine.

因为正如他所说，在生物学中，一切皆与DNA相关。

Because as he said, in biology, everything is DNA.

分子生物学发展出的一项关键工具是使用绿色荧光蛋白来标记细胞内的特定细胞或蛋白质。

One of the key tools that molecular biology has developed is the use of green fluorescent protein to tag specific cells or proteins within a cell.

当我们2009年首次对话时，卡德威尔的导师马丁·查菲刚刚因这项突破性技术分享了2008年诺贝尔奖。

When we first talked back in 2009, Caldwell's mentor, Martin Chaffee, had just shared the 2008 Nobel Prize for this groundbreaking technique.

自我们上次对话以来，出现的另一项工具是光遗传学。

Another tool that has emerged since we first talked is optogenetics.

分子生物学家可以实际操控他们研究的细胞的基因，使其通过特定波长的光被开启或关闭。

Molecular biologists can actually manipulate the genes of the cells they want to study so that they are essentially turned on and or off by specific wavelengths of light.

与卡德威尔博士的对话也凸显了模式生物这一概念。

Talking with doctor Caldwell also highlights the idea of a model organism.

模式生物是指用于模拟人类疾病或生理特征的非人类物种。

A model organism is a nonhuman species that is used to model some aspect of human disease or physiology.

随着分子生物学家学会利用我们与其他物种共享的基因，模式生物的使用变得越来越精细。

The use of model organisms has become increasingly sophisticated as molecular biologists have learned to take advantage of the genes we share with other species.

这正是分子生物学成为二十一世纪神经科学不可或缺工具的原因之一。

This is one reason why molecular biology has become an indispensable tool of twenty first century neuroscience.

卡德威尔博士的工作涉及使用C。

Doctor Caldwell's work involves using C.

秀丽隐杆线虫作为研究帕金森病的模型，这种疾病涉及关键脑结构——基底神经节中多巴胺神经元的丧失。

Elegans as a model for studying Parkinson's disease, which involves loss of dopamine neurons in critical brain structures called the basal ganglia.

C。

C.

秀丽隐杆线虫具有几个独特的特征。

Elegans has several unique features.

首先，每条线虫的发育方式都完全相同。

First, every worm develops exactly the same way.

这可能是它被选为首批进行基因组测序的生物之一的原因，它也是第一个被完全绘制出神经连接图谱的生物。

This may be one reason why it was targeted as one of the first organisms to have its genome sequenced, and it was the first to have its entire wiring diagram determined.

这个项目花了大约十年时间，需要通过电子显微镜照片逐个追踪神经元，工作极其繁琐。

That project took about ten years and required the tedious work of tracing neurons via photographs from electron microscopy.

这一成就具有里程碑意义，同时也说明，即使在生物体短暂的一生中其神经连接保持不变，仅知道连接图谱仍留下许多未解之谜。

This was a landmark achievement that also illustrates that knowing the wiring diagram leaves many unanswered questions even when an organism's organism's connections remain unchanged during its short life.

C.

C.

秀丽隐杆线虫是研究帕金森病的良好模型，因为它透明，且仅有八个多巴胺神经元。

Elegans makes a good model for Parkinson's disease because it's transparent, and it only has eight dopamine neurons.

它的透明性使得研究人员能够利用绿色荧光蛋白可视化多巴胺神经元。

Its transparency allows the dopamine neurons to be visualized using green fluorescent protein.

秀丽隐杆线虫约有50%的基因与人类相似，考虑到整体情况，这个比例并不高，但人们认为它拥有与80%至90%的人类神经系统相关基因同源的基因。

C elegans shares about 50% of its genes with humans, which isn't much, all things considered, but it is thought that it has genetic homologs for 80 to 90% of the human genes associated with neurologic diseases.

这意味着研究人员可以将人类基因导入C.

This means researchers can put human genes into C.

秀丽隐杆线虫并获得重要成果。

Elegans and get important results.

有了这些独特特性，研究人员可以操控基因，并让线虫接触各种物质，包括可能的潜在治疗方法。

With these unique features in place, researchers can manipulate the genes and expose the worm to a wide variety of substances, including those that might be potential treatments.

对C.

Experiments with C.

Elegans的实验还发现了之前未知与帕金森病相关的基因。

Elegans have also uncovered genes that were not previously known to be involved in Parkinson's disease.

除了讨论为什么我.

Besides talking about why I.

C.

C.

Elegans是研究帕金森病的理想模型之外，我们还谈到了这种方法如何与全基因组关联研究和计算方法相辅相成，以确定哪些基因变化真正具有临床相关性。

Elegans is a great model for studying Parkinson's disease, we talked about how this approach can complement gene wide association studies and computational methods to determine which genetic changes are actually likely to be clinically relevant.

卡德威尔称这是一种预测性临床前模型。

Caldwell called this a predictive preclinical model.

你可能也听说过个性化医疗或精准医疗这个术语。

And you may have also heard of the term personalized medicine or precision medicine.

这指的是我们每个人都可以根据自身的基因组成来定制医疗方案。

This refers to the idea that each of us could have our medical care tuned to our particular genetic makeup.

这目前仍主要是一个梦想，但进展迅速，尤其是在癌症治疗领域。

This is still mostly a dream, but rapid progress progress is being made, especially in the area of cancer treatment.

让我们回顾一下与盖·卡德威尔对话中的关键观点。

Let's review the key ideas from our conversations with Guy Caldwell.

首先，使用所谓的模式生物，如秀丽隐杆线虫和果蝇，有助于取得关键发现，这些发现是实现个性化医疗梦想的重要组成部分。

First, working with so called modeled organisms like c elegans and fruit flies contribute to key discoveries that are an important part of making the dream of personalized medicine a reality.

这就是为什么理解神经科学需要从多个层面入手，从分子层面一直到整个人体。

This is why understanding neuroscience requires approaching the subject at many levels, ranging from the molecular all the way up to the whole person.

另一个关键观点是，所有生命都使用相同的构建模块这一事实的重要性。

Another key idea is the importance of the fact that all life uses the same building blocks.

这正是现代生物学和现代神经科学成为可能的原因。

This is what makes modern biology and modern neuroscience possible.

这些构建模块正是分子生物学家所研究的对象。

These building blocks are what molecular biologists study.

我想那位医生。

I think that Doctor.

卡德威尔的故事说明，如果你对神经科学充满热情，就可以利用自己的独特背景找到贡献的方式。

Caldwell's story illustrates that if you're passionate about neuroscience, you can use your particular background to find a way to contribute.

它也提醒我们，跨学科方法对当代神经科学有多么重要。

It also reminds us how important interdisciplinary approaches are to contemporary contemporary neuroscience.

接下来，我们有第206期节目，嘉宾是西班牙穆尔西亚大学最小智能实验室的帕科·卡尔沃。

Next, we have episode two zero six with Paco Calvo of the Minimal Intelligence Lab at the University of Murcia in Spain.

卡尔沃是《植物智慧：植物智能的新科学》一书的作者。

Calvo is the author of Planta Sapiens, the new science of plant intelligence.

他在书中开篇描述了一项实验，让含羞草植物被麻醉或进入睡眠状态。

He begins his book by describing an experiment in which a mimosa plant is anesthetized or put to sleep.

这意味着植物停止了对环境的反应，通常可以测量到的电活动也消失了。

This meant that the plant stopped responding to its environment and that the electrical activity that can usually be measured disappeared.

他指出，即使是细菌，也能被同样的分子诱导进入睡眠状态。

He pointed out that even bacteria can be put to sleep by the same molecules.

这是因为关键的信号分子几乎和生命本身一样古老。

This is because the key signaling molecules appear nearly as old as life itself.

鉴于我们与植物之间这种古老的联系，我们思考为什么我们通常对植物行为的可能性视而不见。

Given this reminder of our ancient connection to plants, we consider the question of why we generally seem to be blind to the possibility of plant behavior.

最明显的原因是，植物的生活节奏要慢得多。

The most obvious reason is that plants are living on a much slower time scale.

卡沃提到了我们天生对运动做出反应，但他忘记提及书中提到的一个关键点：我们通常不把植物视为潜在威胁，因为它们很少主动攻击。

Calvo alluded to the fact that we are wired to react to motion, but he forgot to mention a key point that he had in the book, which is that we don't generally see plants as potential threats since they rarely attack.

研究植物行为显然需要延时摄影，尽管这实际上是由达尔文开创的，他还告诉我们达尔文很久以前为展示植物行为所做的一些创新实验。

Studying plant behavior obviously requires time lapsed photography, although it was actually pioneered by Darwin, and he tells us some of the innovative things that Darwin actually did to demonstrate plant behavior a long time ago.

无论如何，卡沃指出，考虑植物具有智能行为的可能性，挑战了人类独有的根深蒂固的假设。

Anyway, Cavill points out that considering the possibility of intelligent plant behavior challenges deeply ingrained assumptions that humans are special.

他说：‘智人’无处不在。

He said, quote, sapiens is all over the place.

‘智人’与生命之树本身息息相关。

Sapiens has to do with the tree of life itself.

任何生命形式都必须是智人，否则它就不会存在，”结尾。

Any form of life has got to be sapien, otherwise, it wouldn't be here, end quote.

反对植物智能最明显的论点可能是它们缺乏神经元。

The most obvious argument against plant intelligence might be that they lack neurons.

但随着人工智能或计算机智能越来越多地融入我们的日常生活，这一观点似乎不再那么有说服力。

But as artificial or computer intelligence has become more and more a part of our daily lives, that seems less convincing.

卡布尔指出，神经元并非信息处理所必需的。

Kabul pointed out that neurons are not required for information processing.

他说：”身体本身也是一种信息处理过程，”结尾。

He said, quote, the body itself is also about information processing, end quote.

但无法在植物细胞中测量动作电位或电压尖峰，因为电压尖峰仅仅是细胞膜两侧带电离子的交换。

But action potentials or voltage spikes can't actually be measured in plant cells because voltage spikes simply represent exchanges of charged ions across cell membranes.

当然，植物的时间尺度要慢得多，电压也小得多。

Of course, the plant time scale is again much slower and the voltages are much smaller.

正如我之前提到的，植物使用与动物相同的分子。

As I mentioned before, plants use the same molecules as animals.

这些分子在动物体内被称为神经递质。

The molecules are called neurotransmitters in animals.

植物也有基于褪黑素的昼夜节律，而这种褪黑素与动物体内的分子相同。

Plants also have circadian rhythms based on melatonin, and this melatonin is the same molecule that we see in animals.

当然，考虑到这些分子在真菌甚至细菌中也存在，它们在植物中出现并不令人惊讶。

Of course, the presence of these molecules should not be surprising given that they are present in fungi and even bacteria.

许多这些分子通过植物所谓的维管系统进行传递。

Many of these molecules are transmitted by the so called vascular system of the plant.

正如卡维尔博士指出的，科学家们往往忽视了信息也可能在传递的可能性。

And as doctor Calvell pointed out, scientists tend to be blind to possibility that information is also being transmitted.

那么，如果我们声称植物具有智能，这究竟意味着什么？

So if we're gonna claim that plants are intelligent, what would that mean?

我们如何判断一个动物是聪明的？

How do we conclude that an animal is intelligent?

我们观察它们的行为。

We look at their behavior.

人们普遍认为，植物所表现出的任何行为都仅仅是反射性的。

It is generally assumed that whatever behaviors plants do have is merely reflexive.

要使行为具有智能性，它必须具有适应性和灵活性。

In order for behavior to be intelligent, it has to be adaptive and flexible.

它必须受到过去经验的影响，而不是由基因决定的。

It has to be influenced by past experience, not genetically determined.

它必须是主动的、前瞻性的和可预测的。

It has to be proactive, anticipatory, and predictive.

卡维尔指出了这一点的重要性。

Cavill pointed out why this is important.

如果你是一株行动缓慢的植物，你的行为必须适应未来可能出现的条件。

If you're a slow moving plant, your actions have got to fit the conditions that are going to exist in the future.

这方面最简单的例子就是预测太阳的位置，这属于目标导向的行为。

The easiest example of this would be predicting where the sun is gonna be, which would be goal directed.

这可能是智能行为最简单的例子，因为某些植物种类能够预测太阳的位置，值得注意的是，并非所有植物都能做到这一点，只有那些高度依赖日照量的植物才具备这种能力。

This is probably the simplest example of intelligent behavior because some species of plants can predict where the sun is going to be, and it's interesting to note that not all plants can do this, just the ones that are highly dependent on the amount of sunlight they receive.

卡尔霍指出，驯化后的植物相当愚钝，这让我想起，科学家们直到开始研究动物在野外环境中的行为——那里它们的智慧对生存至关重要——才真正认识到许多动物有多么聪明。

Calhoe pointed out that domesticated plants are rather dumb, and this reminded me that scientists did not really appreciate how smart many animals were until they began to study them in wild environments where their intelligence was needed for survival.

最后，他提到了具身认知的概念。

Finally, he mentioned the idea of embodied cognition.

他说：‘我们需要意识到，对于植物而言，身体和环境与大脑同样重要。’

Quote, We need to realize that the body and the environment are equally important as the brain in the case of plants, end quote.

他提到了具身、嵌入、延展和被动这四个方面。

He mentioned the four embodied, embedded, extended, and inactive.

具身认知实际上是我最喜爱的话题之一。

Embodied cognition is actually one of my favorite topics.

关于具身认知的近期节目包括第193期、第198期和第200期。

Recent episodes about embodied cognition include episode one ninety three, one ninety eight, and episode 200.

现有证据明确支持这一结论：植物展现了具身认知，依据的简单定义是，认知意味着选择而非反射。

The evidence clearly favors the conclusion that plants demonstrate embodied cognition based on the simple definition that cognition implies choice over reflex.

一个尚未解决的问题是，植物是否具备关联学习的能力。

One topic that remains unresolved is the question of whether plants are capable of associative learning.

这当然要求更高，更接近意识而非智能的问题。

This, of course, is a higher bar closer to the question of consciousness than intelligence.

《植物智人：植物智能的新科学》一书由帕科·卡沃撰写，其中深入探讨了查尔斯·达尔文的贡献、植物的电活动、我们通常视为神经递质的各种分子的作用，以及植物在没有神经元的情况下如何交流。

Plantasapiens, the new science of plant intelligence by Paco Callow also contains an extensive discussion of the contributions of Charles Darwin, a discussion of the electrical activity in plants, the role of various molecules that we think of as neurotransmitters, and a discussion of how plants communicate in the absence of neurons.

当以足够的严谨性进行研究时，可以清楚地看出植物是智能的。

When studied with sufficient rigor, it becomes clear that plants are intelligent.

令人遗憾的是，这一令人着迷的发现几乎被围绕植物意识问题的争议所埋没。

It seems a shame that this fascinating discovery has been virtually buried in the controversy that swirls around the issue of plant consciousness.

与其助长这种争论，我更希望研究人员专注于植物智能，以及这些发现能教给我们什么。

Rather than fueling that fire, I would like to see researchers focus on plant intelligence and what those discoveries can teach us.

《植物智人：植物智能的新科学》一书由帕科·卡沃确实包含对植物意识这一争议性观点的详细讨论。

Plantasapiens, the new science of plant intelligence by Paco Calvo does contain a detailed discussion of the controversial idea of plant consciousness.

我建议你收听第206期节目，听听我对这一话题的思考。

I encourage you to listen to episode two zero six to hear my reflections on that topic.

接下来，我将稍微跳到第208期节目，嘉宾是赞德·范德林登，他著有《为什么错误信息会感染我们的思维以及如何建立免疫力》。

Next, I'm gonna jump ahead slightly to episode two zero eight featuring Zander Vander Linden, author of Why Misinformation Infects Our Minds and How to Build Immunity.

这正是我不认为心理学可以被神经科学取代的原因。

This is an example of why I don't think psychology can be replaced by neuroscience.

在今天的回顾开头，我提到了心理学研究中的一些问题，但最终，我们大多数人还是想知道为什么我们会这样行动，而这正是心理学家试图理解的。

At the beginning of today's review, I alluded to some of the problems with psychology research, but in the end, most of us do want to know why we act the way we do, which is what psychologists are trying to understand.

你肯定注意到了最近虚假信息和阴谋论的蔓延。

No doubt you have noticed the recent spread of misinformation and conspiracy theories.

根据范德林登的著作《防骗》，好消息是我们确实可以对此问题采取行动，尽管所使用的技术似乎正变得越来越复杂。

According to Vander Linden's book, Foolproof, the good news is that there really is something we can do about this problem, even though the techniques being used do seem to be becoming more and more sophisticated.

关键原则是增强我们的意识，提高识别操纵手段的能力。

The key principle is to build our awareness and our ability to recognize manipulative techniques.

研究阴谋论是个不错的起点，因为在这里更容易识别这些原则。

Studying conspiracies is a good place to start, because this is where the principles are more easily recognized.

范德林登用单词‘conspire’中的字母作为记忆辅助。

Vander Linden uses the letters in the word conspire as a mnemonic.

第一个c代表自相矛盾的思维，o代表过度怀疑，n代表恶意意图，s代表一定有什么不对，p代表受迫害的受害者，i代表对证据的免疫，r代表重新解释随机性。

The first c is for contradictory thinking, o is for overriding suspicion, n is for nefarious intent, s is for something must be wrong, p is for persecuted victim, I is for immunity to evidence, and r is for reinterpreting randomness.

那些接受阴谋论的人往往具有相似的心理特征，并且常常同时相信多个相互矛盾的理论。

Those who embrace conspiracy theories tend to have similar psychological traits and often believe in multiple contradictory theories.

我过去从不认真对待阴谋论，因为即使有人相信登月是伪造的，也并不会真的造成什么影响。

I never used to take conspiracy theories seriously since it doesn't really matter if someone believes that the moon landing was a hoax.

然而，如果他们拒绝接种疫苗，尽管科学证据表明疫苗是预防严重传染病的最佳方式，这可能会导致他人丧生。

However, if they refuse to be vaccinated, despite the scientific evidence that vaccines are the best way to prevent serious infectious diseases, this can cost the lives of others.

作为一名医生，我感到有责任指出，疫苗是医学史上最重要的发现之一。

As a physician, I feel compelled to say that vaccines are one of the most important discoveries in medical history.

当一个人决定不接种疫苗时，他的选择会影响周围的人——不仅因为群体免疫需要高接种率，还因为总有一些人无法接种疫苗，或免疫系统太弱而无法有效响应。

When someone decides not to be vaccinated, their choice affects those around them, not just because herd immunity requires a high level of vaccination, but because there will always be those who can't be vaccinated or whose immune systems are too weak to respond properly.

这是一个关于科学和公共卫生的问题，而不是政治问题。

This is an issue of science and public health, not politics.

鉴于阴谋论在疫苗犹豫中所起的作用，我想更好地理解它们是如何运作的。

Given the role that conspiracy theories have played in vaccine hesitancy, I wanted to have a better understanding of how they work.

范德林登博士提到了他团队开发的那些互动游戏。

Doctor Vanderlinden mentions the games his groups have developed.

其中一个游戏要求玩家创建并传播一个阴谋论。

One of these games tasked the player with creating and spreading a conspiracy theory.

在书中，他描述了这个游戏，以及它如何似乎能让人对阴谋手段产生一定程度的免疫力。

In the book, he describes this game and how it appears to generate at least a partial immunity against conspire tactics.

接下来，他探讨了传播错误信息的一般性技巧。

Next, he moved to the basic techniques that are used to spread misinformation in general.

与有证据支持的事实不同，错误信息更容易通过更具新颖性、使用道德语言、情感语言和更具挑衅性的方式传播。

In contrast to facts backed by evidence, misinformation is easily spread by being more novel, using moral language, using emotional language, and being more provocative.

一个人可能会传播某些内容，因为他们会说：‘如果这是真的，那该多有趣啊。’

A person might spread something because they say, oh, this would be interesting if it was true.

其他技巧包括虚假二元对立、找替罪羊、利用情绪制造对立，以及伪造专家。

Other techniques include false dichotomies, scapegoating, using emotions to polarize, and fake experts.

他在访谈中举了所有这些例子。

He gave examples of all of these in the interview.

现在，我刚刚给你列了一个相对枯燥的清单，你可能根本记不住，所以我建议你访问网站‘Inoculation Science’，那里有视频和三个你可以尝试的游戏。

Now, I just gave you a relatively boring list that you're probably not really gonna remember, so I suggest that you go to the website, Inoculation Science, where there are videos, and there are three different games that you can try out.

接下来，我将回顾两期 featuring 来自马里兰大学的路易斯·佩索阿的节目。

Next up, I'm going to review two episodes featuring Luis Pessoa from the University of Maryland.

我们最早在2014年初讨论过他的著作《从互动到整合：认知情感大脑》。

We first talked back in early twenty fourteen about his book, The Cognitive Emotional Brain From Interactions to Integrations.

这本书的核心观点是，将大脑视为拥有独立的情绪和认知系统或模块的观点已经过时，因为情绪和认知在每一个层面都紧密交织。

The key idea from this book is that seeing the brain as having separate systems or modules for emotion and cognition is obsolete because emotion and cognition are deeply intertwined at every level.

《认知情感大脑》是为学生和科研人员撰写的，但我认为这些原理对每个人都至关重要。

The cognitive emotional brain was written for students and working scientists, but I think these principles are important for everyone to understand.

我们的对话聚焦于大脑的两个部分：杏仁核和丘脑的枕核。

Our conversations focused on two parts of the brain, the amygdala and the pulvinar nucleus of the thalamus.

杏仁核位于内侧颞叶，靠近海马体。

The amygdala is in the medial temporal lobe near the hippocampus.

要想象杏仁核的位置，只需从耳朵方向向内指一下。

To visualize the location of the amygdala, just imagine pointing in from your ears.

丘脑位于脑干的最顶端，而枕核是其最大的核团。

The thalamus is at the very top of the brain stem, and the pulvinar is its largest nucleus.

杏仁核的复杂程度远超主流媒体对它的描绘。

The amygdala is more complex than you might imagine from its portrayal in mainstream media.

它可以被划分为多达12个部分，但我们主要讨论了两个核心部分：外侧杏仁核，它几乎像皮层一样，与大脑皮层区域高度连接；以及中央或更内侧的杏仁核，它更原始，连接到控制自主功能（如呼吸和血压）的脑干。

It can be divided into as many as 12 parts, but we talked about the two main parts, the lateral amygdala, which is almost cortex like and highly connected to the cortical regions of the brain, and the central or more medial amygdala, which is more primitive and connects to the brain stem, which controls autonomic functions, automatic autonomic functions like breathing and blood pressure.

你可能因为杏仁核与恐惧及其他负面刺激的关联而听说过它，但杏仁核的功能远不止于恐惧。

You've probably heard of the amygdala because of its connection to fear and other negative stimuli, but the amygdala is about much more than fear.

它还参与注意力功能，如唤醒和警觉，以及价值表征，这意味着它参与了简单的决策过程。

It's involved in attentional functions such as arousal and vigilance as well as value representation, which means it's involved in simple decision making.

这里的关键观点是，认知在你到达皮层之前就已经开始了。

The key idea here is that cognition begins before you get to the cortex.

情绪和认知在大脑中的发生位置是无法分离的。

Emotion and cognition can't be separated in terms of where they occur in the brain.

另一个关键观点是，杏仁核确实会对正面和负面刺激都做出反应，这再次印证了我的核心观点：它并不仅仅关乎恐惧。

Another key idea is the fact that the amygdala does respond to both positive and negative stimuli, returning to my key idea that it's not just about fear.

值得注意的是，杏仁核的反应会追踪知觉反应。

It's interesting to realize responses of the amygdala track perceptual responses.

这意味着杏仁核正在影响我们所看到的内容以及我们所关注的事物。

That means that the amygdala is influencing what we see and what we pay attention to.

但同样重要的是要认识到，杏仁核并不是单独运作的，而是你可能认为的脑部注意网络中的一个重要组成部分。

But it is also important to realize that the amygdala is not acting alone, but it is an important part of what you might think of as the brain's attentional network.

我们还讨论了丘脑的板内核，而核只是神经元的集群。

We also talked about the pulverine nucleus of the thalamus, and nucleus is just a cluster of neurons.

丘脑位于脑干的最顶端，也就是说，在大脑本体的底部。

The thalamus is located at the very top of the brain stem, which is to say at the base of the brain proper.

长期以来，人们一直认为它是大脑与身体之间主要的中继站，但皮索博士。

It has long been thought to be the major relay station between the brain and the body, but Doctor.

皮索博士及其同事对这一观点提出了挑战。

Pisoa and his colleagues have challenged this view.

他特别质疑了所谓的标准假设，即存在一条所谓的‘低通路’，感觉信息从外围快速传至丘脑，再经由丘脑直接到达杏仁核，其假设是这条通路更快，且基本上是无意识的。

He has specifically challenged what is called the standard hypothesis, which is that there is a so called low road by which sensory information goes rapidly from the periphery to the thalamus through the thalamus straight to the amygdala, the assumption being that this is faster and also essentially unconscious.

对这一观点的挑战基于与所有这些基本要素相悖的研究。

The challenge to this is based on research that goes against all these basic elements.

首先，有证据表明，杏仁核在注意力和意识中的作用比我们原先认为的更为重要；其次，研究表明，涉及皮层的通路比最初假设的要快，因此从速度角度来看，我们并不需要这条所谓的低通路。

First, there is evidence the amygdala is more involved in attention and awareness than we thought, and second, it has been shown that the pathways involving the cortex are faster than was originally assumed so that we don't need this low pathway from a speed standpoint.

最后，解剖结构并不支持丘脑仅仅是一个中继站的观点。

Finally, the anatomy just doesn't support the idea that the thalamus is a mere relay station.

它与皮层的许多区域，包括各种感觉区域和额叶，有着广泛的连接，而且这些连接是双向的。

It has extensive connections to many parts of the cortex, including the various sensory areas and the frontal lobes, and these connections go in both directions.

这些证据被融入了佩索阿的多波模型中，该模型表明杏仁核接收的信息不仅来自丘脑，还来自皮层的多个区域。

This evidence is incorporated into Pessoa's multiple waves model, which reflects that the amygdala receives information not just from the thalamus, but also from various parts of the cortex.

我们之所以关注丘脑枕，是因为它是最大的丘脑核团，负责处理视觉信息，而视觉是研究得最广泛的感官系统。

The reason we focused on the pulvinar is that it's the largest thalamic nucleus, and it processes visual information, and vision has been the most extensively studied.

那么，如果丘脑枕不是中继站，它的功能是什么？

So what is the function of the pulvinar if it's not a relay station?

首先，它只对有意识感知的刺激产生反应。

First, it responds only to stimuli that are consciously perceived.

佩索阿表示，它有助于增强对生物体重要的信号。

Pessoas said that it helps amplify signals that are important to the organism.

它与几乎整个大脑皮层都有广泛连接，这一点对于这一功能尤其重要。

The fact that it has extensive connections to virtually the entire cortex is particularly relevant to this function.

佩索阿还表示，我们不应再将丘脑枕核及其他丘脑结构视为被动的中继站，而应将其视为他所说的‘通信中枢’，因为它连接了大脑皮层和脑干。

Pessoa also said that instead of thinking of the pulvinar and the rest of the thalamus by implication as a passive relay, we should think of it as what he called a, quote, central hub of communication, end quote, because it connects both the cortex and the brain stem.

让我们回到杏仁核，简要讨论一下它在视觉处理中的作用。需要记住的关键观点是，杏仁核与大脑所有视觉区域之间都存在双向的广泛连接，从初级视觉皮层到联合皮层皆是如此。

Returning to the amygdala for a few minutes, in terms of its role in visual processing, the key idea to remember is that it has extensive connections in both directions to all the various visual areas of the brain, ranging from the primary visual cortex to the association areas.

它在决定我们看到什么以及关注什么方面起着关键作用。

It has a key role in determining what we see and what we pay attention to.

这让我回到本集最重要的观点：大脑的情绪过程与认知过程在每一个层面上都紧密交织。

This brings me back to the most important idea of this episode, which is that the emotional and cognitive processes of the brain are deeply intertwined at every level.

这就是为什么这本书被称为‘认知情感脑’。

That's why this book is called the cognitive emotional brain.

书中还有一些重要主题我们没有时间讨论，比如前额叶皮层中的情况——越来越多的证据表明，认知与情绪过程并未像长期以来假设的那样被分隔开来。

There were a few important topics in the book that we didn't have time to discuss, such as the what happens in the prefrontal cortex where there is mounting evidence that cognitive and emotional processes are not segregated as has long been assumed.

此外，我们也没有谈到网络理论，我曾多次与奥洛夫·斯彭斯探讨过这一理论。

And also, we didn't talk about network theory, which I have explored several times with Olof Spawns.

波松和斯彭斯认为，网络理论对于理解我们大脑的复杂功能至关重要，因为没有任何一个区域能孤立地完成其功能。

Poisson and Spawns share the opinion that network theory is essential for understanding the complex functions of our brain because no one section can carry out its function in isolation.

因此，我重新播放了2014年对路易斯·佩索阿的采访，以帮助新老听众为他的新书《知觉、认知与情感如何交织》做好准备。

So I replayed that 2,014 interview with Louis Pessoa to prepare listeners, both old and new, for his new book, The How Perception, Cognition, and Emotion are Woven Together.

如果你是常驻听众，可能不会觉得这个观点令人惊讶，但佩索阿提醒我们，主流的大脑功能观点仍主要停留在模块化和还原论的框架中。

If you are a regular listener, you may not find this idea surprising, but Pesso reminds us that the mainstream view of brain function remains largely modular and reductionistic.

事实上，这两种观点在某种程度上是相互交织的。

In fact, the two ideas are entangled in their own way.

反对这种观点的证据早在2006年我启动这个播客之前就开始积累，我曾与许多嘉宾讨论过这些证据。

The evidence against this viewpoint began accumulating before I started this podcast in 2006, and I've talked with many guests about this evidence.

一个关键的发现是，单个神经元可以参与多个网络，即使那些主要负责特定功能（如感觉或运动）的大脑区域，也可能包含执行其他任务的神经元。

One key discovery was the realization that individual neurons can participate in multiple networks, and that even areas of the brain largely devoted to particular activities, such as sensory or motor functions, can contain neurons that do other things.

当我2014年第一次与皮索特博士讨论他的书《认知情感脑》时，我惊讶地发现，杏仁核不仅参与情绪，还参与决策。

Back when I first talked with doctor Pissot about his book, The Cognitive Emotional Brain, in 2014, I was surprised to learn that the amygdala is involved not just in emotion, but also decision making.

但如果你考虑到没有大脑皮层的动物仍需做出诸如何时靠近、何时逃离的决定，这一点其实很合理。

But this actually makes sense if you consider the fact that animals without a cortex still have to make decisions such as when to approach and when to flee.

一个始终挥之不去的过时观点，就是将边缘系统视为大脑的情感系统。

One outdated idea that just won't go away is the idea of the limbic system as the emotional system of the brain.

诺亚在《纠缠的大脑》中对此进行了精彩的阐述，但他告诉我，他其实不太愿意在书中提及这一点，担心会助长这一错误观念的延续。

Noah addressed this eloquently in The Entangled Brain, but he told me that he was actually reluctant to mention this in the book for fear of helping perpetuate the problem.

边缘系统这一观点过时的主要原因，在于情感在大脑中并非被严格隔离。

The main reason that the idea of the limbic system is outdated is the very fact that emotion is not tightly segregated in the brain.

当然，杏仁核以及构成边缘系统名称的那些解剖结构也参与其中。

Sure, the amygdala is involved as well as the anatomical locations that spawn the name limbic system.

但正如我们一再强调的，情感与认知——比如决策——在大脑的每一个层面都深度交织。

But as we have emphasized, emotion and cognition, think decision making, are deeply entangled at every level of the brain.

请记住，每一个参与情感处理的大脑区域，也都承担着其他功能。

Just try to remember that every part of the brain that is involved in emotion does other things as well.

这正是从模块化还原论的大脑功能观，转向包容新兴证据的观点的含义。

This is what it means to move from a modular reductionist view of brain function to one that encompasses the emerging evidence.

佩索特强调的一个挑战，是需要开发新的工具和技术，以便我们能够研究大脑功能真正的复杂性与动态特性。

One challenge that Pesoet emphasized was the need for new tools and techniques that allow us to study the true complexity and dynamic nature of brain function.

这些技术正在其他领域得到发展，这凸显了现代神经科学的跨学科性质。

These techniques are being developed in other fields, which highlights the interdisciplinary nature of modern neuroscience.

佩索阿强调，这也意味着来自广泛领域的人士都有机会为神经科学做出贡献。

Pessoa emphasized that this also means there are opportunities for those from a wide variety of fields to contribute to neuroscience.

回顾过去，佩索阿还提出了另一个值得注意的观察。

In retrospect, Pessoa made one other observation worth noting.

近年来，人们发现一些原本被认为属于无意识的过程，实际上涉及一定程度的注意和觉知。

There's been a trend toward discovering that processes that have been presumed to be unconscious actually involve some level of attention and awareness.

这在很大程度上取决于实验的设计方式以及测量方法。

Much depends on how experiments are designed and how things are measured.

我认为，这正是佩索阿强调需要保持谦逊、并认识到我们对大脑真实运作机制了解甚少的原因之一。

I think this is one reason why Pessoa emphasized the need for humility and appreciation for how little we really know about how the brain really works.

《知觉与情感如何交织》是路易斯·佩索阿写给普通读者的第一本书，我强烈推荐给所有背景的听众。

The How Perception and Emotion are Woven Together is Louis Pessoa's first book written for a general audience, but I highly recommend it to listeners of all backgrounds.

最重要的是，这本书非常适合与刚开始对大脑如何运作感兴趣的人分享。

Best of all, this is a great book to share with someone who's just getting interested in how the brain works.

如果你刚接触脑科学，路易斯·佩索阿的《纠缠的大脑》将为你提供关于知觉、认知和情感如何交织在一起的精彩概述。

If you are new to brain science, the entangled brain, how perception, cognition, and emotion are woven together by Luis Bessoa will give you an excellent overview.

花朵三天就会凋谢。

Flowers die in three days.

来自MeUndies的配套内裤？

Matching underwear from MeUndies?

这是一份持久的礼物。

That's a gift that lasts.

MeUndies为情侣和朋友设计了配套图案，相同的可爱设计，但根据每个人的体型提供不同剪裁，全部采用其标志性的超模态面料，触感异常柔软。

MeUndies creates matching prints for couples and friends, same adorable designs, and different cuts for each of you, all made from their signature ultra modal fabric that feels impossibly soft.

MeUndies的配套图案已售出三千万件，拥有九万零五条五星评价，是完美的礼物之选。

With 30,000,000 pairs sold and 90,005 star reviews, MeUndies matching prints are the perfect gift.

情人节是2月14日，所以别再拖延了。

Valentine's Day is February 14, so don't wait.

前往meundies.com/comfort，使用代码comfort，享受独家折扣，最高可达50%。

Get exclusive deals up to 50% off at meundies.com/comfort, code comfort.

那就是 meundies.com/comfort，优惠码 comfort。

That's meundies.com/comfort, code comfort.

第二十集是我自2007年第八集以来首次对神经递质进行的评述。

Episode two ten was my first review of neurotransmitters since episode eight back in 2007.

不幸的是，这一集并没有像我预期的那样对新听众友好。

Unfortunately, this episode did not turn out to be as accessible to new listeners as I had intended.

即便如此，仍有一些关键观点非常值得了解。

Even so, there are a few key ideas that are definitely worth knowing.

尽管大脑信号传递的关键在于被称为动作电位的电信号尖峰，但每次尖峰的最终结果都是释放一种称为神经递质的信号分子，神经元可以根据它们释放的神经递质来区分。

Even though the key to signaling in the brain is the electrical spike known as an action potential, The end result of each spike is the release of a signaling molecule called a neurotransmitter, and neurons may be identified by what neurotransmitter they release.

比如我们和盖伊·卡德威尔讨论过的多巴胺神经元。

An example of this is the dopamine neurons we talked about with Guy Caldwell.

这也正是神经元之间的间隙，即突触，如此重要的原因。

This is also why the gap between neurons, known as the synapse, is so important.

神经递质释放后，会穿过突触，与所谓的突触后神经元上的受体相互作用。

After the neurotransmitter is released, it crosses the synapse and interacts with the receptors on the so called post synaptic neuron.

突触后神经元会整合所有传入的信号。

The post synaptic neuron integrates all the incoming signals.

它可能会产生自己的动作电位，但如果传入的信号是抑制性的，它可能被阻止放电。

It might generate its own action potential, but if the incoming signals are inhibitory, it might be prevented from firing.

需要记住的关键点是，真正决定后续发生什么的是受体。

The key idea to remember is that it's actually the receptors that determine what happens next.

这就是为什么像多巴胺这样的分子，不仅在大脑的不同区域有不同的作用，甚至在大脑之外也能调节血液循环和血压。

That is why a molecule like dopamine can have different actions, not only in different parts of the brain, but also outside the brain where it helps regulate circulation and blood pressure.

把多巴胺称为‘奖励分子’完全扭曲了它复杂的作用。

Calling dopamine the reward molecule completely distorts its complex role.

多巴胺是几种自单细胞生命出现以来就存在的古老信号分子之一。

Dopamine is one of several ancient signaling molecules that have been around since the emergence of single celled life.

正是受体复杂性的增加，才使得复杂生物乃至大脑得以演化出来。

It was the increasing complexity of the receptors that allowed complex organisms and even brains to emerge.

当我们谈到我最近对分子生物学家塞思·格兰特的采访时，我会再回到这个话题。

I will come back to this when we talk about my most recent interview with molecular biologist Seth Grant.

尽管它们很复杂，但受体只有两种基本类型：离子型（配体门控）和代谢型（G蛋白偶联）。

Despite their complexity, there are only two basic types of receptors, ionotropic and or ligand gated and metabotropic g protein coupled.

要区分它们很容易：离子型受体实际上是离子通道，当配体（即神经递质）与细胞膜上的受体蛋白结合时，通道会打开或关闭。

It's easy to remember which is which by remembering that the ionotropic receptors are actually ion channels that are opened and closed when the ligand, that is to say the neurotransmitter, interacts with a receptor protein in the cell membrane.

由于这是直接作用，因此发生速度相当快，大约在十分之一毫秒的量级。

Since this is a direct effect, it can occur fairly quickly on the order of a tenth of a millisecond.

相比之下，代谢型G蛋白偶联受体则通过一个或多个所谓的第二信使，间接开启或关闭通道，甚至改变基因表达。

In contrast, the metabotropic g protein coupled receptors use one or more so called second messengers to kick off everything from indirectly opening and closing channels to changing gene expression.

尽管实际的突触传递仅延迟至约0.5到3毫秒，但其实际效应可能要晚得多，尤其是在基因调控的情况下。

And while the actual synaptic transmission is only slowed down to about point five to three milliseconds, the actual effects may occur much later, especially in the case of gene regulation.

如果你想了解我关于谷氨酸和GABA等特定神经递质的讨论，请回听第210期节目。

I send you back to this episode two ten if you want to hear my discussion of specific neurotransmitters like glutamate and GABA.

最重要的原则是，每种神经递质都有多种复杂功能，这些功能取决于它结合的是哪种受体以及这些受体位于何处。

The most important principle is that each neurotransmitter has many complex functions that are determined by which receptors it binds to and where those receptors are located.

用单一作用来描述任何神经递质都是不准确的。

It is an accurate to describe any neurotransmitter by a single action.

再强调一遍，不要把多巴胺当成‘奖励分子’，尽管它在大脑的奖赏回路中很重要，但它的作用远不止于此。

Again, don't think of dopamine as the reward molecule because although it is important in the reward circuits of the brain, it's not the only thing it does.

真正关键的是受体。

It's really all about the receptors.

在第二十一集中，我们采访了分子生物学家塞思·格兰特。

In episode two eleven, we talked with molecular biologist Seth Grant.

从一开始，这个播客就是一档以书籍为核心的节目，但令人惊讶的是，出现次数最多的嘉宾竟是分子生物学家塞思·格兰特。

From the beginning, brain science has been a book focused show, so it is surprising that the guest who has appeared the most is molecular biologist Seth Grant.

第二十一集是他第六次做客。

Episode two eleven was his sixth appearance.

我即将对这一集做个回顾，这实际上是听众第一次听到这个回顾——因为我在做第二十一集时正要搬家，大概是在我刚到新西兰后录的开场和结尾，结果不知怎么搞的，我漏掉了这一集的正式回顾。

I'm about to do a review of this episode, which actually is the first review anyone will have heard because when I was doing episode two eleven around the time I was moving to I think I I recorded it just the intro outro after I came here to New Zealand, and somehow I managed to leave out this actual episode review.

对此我深表歉意。

So I apologize for that.

现在补上。

Here it is now.

每次与塞思·格兰特交谈都令人深受启发，因为他的研究不仅令人着迷，而且他非常擅长让所有人都能理解。

It's always inspiring to talk with Seth Grant because not only is his work fascinating, but he's extremely good at making it accessible to everyone.

在这集中，我们回顾了他三十年的职业生涯，其中包括在1992年帮助创建了第一只转基因小鼠。

In this episode, we looked over thirty years of his career, which include helping to create the first transgenic mice back in 1992.

这之所以重要，是因为人类和小鼠共享许多相同的基因，包括大多数编码神经系统蛋白质的基因。

The reason this is important is that humans and mice share many of the same genes, including most of the genes that code for the proteins of the nervous system.

通过转基因小鼠，我们可以引入已知与人类疾病相关的基因突变，不仅研究它们如何影响小鼠的行为，还能开发技术来研究单个突触层面发生的变化。

With transgenic mice, it's possible to introduce gene mutations that are known to be associated with problems in humans, and explore not only how they affect behavior in mice, but also develop techniques to study what is happening at the level of the single synapse.

遗传学最基本的原理是：基因编码蛋白质，而蛋白质是生命的基础工具。

The most basic principle of genetics is that genes code for proteins, and proteins are the machinery of life.

因此，格兰特很早就对突触的蛋白质组学产生了兴趣。

So early on, Grant was interested in the proteomics of the synapse.

他希望识别出突触中的所有蛋白质，而他开始研究时，仅发现了10种蛋白质，且普遍认为所有突触都是相同的。

He wanted to identify all the proteins in the synapse, and he started at a time when only 10 had been identified, and it was assumed that all synapses were identical.

格兰特做出了两个令人惊讶的发现。

Grant made two surprising discoveries.

其中一个发现是，突触实际上包含数千种蛋白质。

One was that synapses actually contain thousands of proteins.

最令人惊讶的是，许多对突触功能至关重要的蛋白质也存在于单细胞生物中，比如真菌。

And most surprising of all, many of the proteins that are critical to synapse function are present in single celled organisms, like fungi.

这意味着这些蛋白质的出现早于神经系统的进化。

This means that the proteins came before the evolution of the nervous system.

当我2008年第一次和他交谈时，这个发现让我震惊不已。

This was the discovery that blew me away when I first talked to him back in 2008.

格兰特还赞赏其他科学家的发现，即寒武纪大爆发可能是由两次全基因组复制所引发的，这为脊椎动物的进化提供了工具包。

Grant also appreciated the discovery made by other scientists that the Cambrian explosion was probably triggered by two duplications of the entire genome, which provided the toolkit for the evolution of vertebrates.

在第101期节目中，我们讨论过一些实验，这些实验直接利用了这一概念，通过创建敲除DLG基因的小鼠来研究这些基因——它们编码突触中的支架蛋白。

Back in episode one zero one, we talked about experiments that made direct use of this concept by creating knockout mice for the so called DLG genes that code for scaffolding proteins in the synapse.

不出所料，敲除这种基因最古老的形态会导致死亡，而敲除第二古老的形态则会导致严重的学习和记忆缺陷。

Not surprisingly, knocking out the most ancient form of this gene caused death, while knocking out the second oldest one caused severe learning and memory deficits.

敲除这两个最新基因中的任何一个，都会产生相反但同样有趣的影响。

Knocking out either of the two newest genes had opposite and lesser, but equally interesting effects.

在过去几年里，我多次和格兰特讨论他的后续实验。

Over the last several years, I've talked to Grant about his follow-up experiments.

在第137期节目中，他描述了一项研究，揭示了大脑中蛋白质的基因表达呈现出类似日历的模式。

In episode one thirty seven, he described a study that revealed gene expression of proteins in the brain follows a pattern that is like a calendar.

我建议你去听一下那期节目，了解详细内容。

I encourage you to listen to that episode for the details.

在第150期节目中，他介绍了小鼠的首个突触体。

In episode one fifty, he described the first synaptone of the mouse.

目标是绘制全脑突触后突触中蛋白质的多样性图谱。

The goal was to map protein diversity among post synaptic synapses throughout the brain.

这张图谱描述了两种主要蛋白质：BSD95和SAP102，但仅凭这两种蛋白质，他们就识别出了37种不同类型的突触。

The map describes two of the main proteins, BSD 95 and SAP one zero two, but using just two proteins, they identified 37 different types of synapses.

考虑到实际上已知的蛋白质大约有一千种，可能的组合几乎是无限的。

Given that there are actually about a thousand known proteins, the possibilities are literally endless.

最近，在第176期节目中，格兰特描述了PSD95在整个生命周期中的分布变化。

Most recently, in episode one seventy six, Grant described the distribution of PSD 95 changes throughout the lifespan.