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你好，欢迎回到《建筑暖通空调科学》播客。
Hello, and welcome back to the Building HVAC Science Podcast.
我们一直在努力连接暖通空调和建筑性能领域的专业人士，最近我们有幸参加了AHR博览会的播客专区。
We're working hard to connect HVAC and building performance professionals, and we recently had the opportunity to be at the Podcast Pavilion at the AHR Expo.
今天这一期是在拉斯维加斯举办的2026年AHR博览会第一天上午九点现场录制的。
So this episode today was recorded 9AM on day one of the AHR Expo in Las Vegas, AHR twenty twenty six.
我和埃里克抓住机会，实时捕捉了这个行业的真实氛围。
And Eric and I had a chance to capture the real spirit of the industry in real time.
我们邀请到了两位很棒的嘉宾，来自路易斯安那州扎卡里市休斯机械公司的克里斯·法布雷和大卫·科内特。
We had a couple of great guests join us, Chris Fabre and David Cornette of Hughes Mechanical from Zachary, Louisiana.
他们从商业维修和施工两个角度分享了各自的见解。
And they shared their perspectives from the commercial service and construction sides of the trade.
他们谈到了承包商的学习方式如何从早期的播客、论坛和Facebook群组，发展到今天这种高度互联的社交媒体生态——而你现在正在听的，正是其中一部分。
They dove into how contractor learning has evolved from early podcasts and forums and Facebook groups to today's hyper connected social media ecosystem, which you're listening to right now.
对吧？
Right?
克里斯和戴夫坦诚地聊了他们被叫去处理安装错误的系统时的经历，如何在应对这些挑战中提升了诊断能力，以及为什么测量工具如今成了必不可少的帮手。
Chris and Dave talk candidly about being called into fixed improperly installed systems and how they had forced growth, sharpening their diagnostic skills, and and why the measurement tools have become indispensable.
从风量测试到无线探头，他们谈到现代仪器如何把维修从凭感觉猜，变成了靠数据做决策。
From airflow testing to wireless probes that reflect on how modern instrumentation has transformed troubleshooting from guesswork into data driven decision making.
我们还聊了聊HVAC战术奖的亮点，比如约翰·帕斯托雷洛这样的行业元老，以及应用程序和工作流程如何融入数字工具，提升技工的表现和沟通效率。
We also touched on the highlights from the HVAC Tactical Awards where industry legends like John Pastorello and the growing role of apps workflows in integrated digital tools and technician performance and communication.
最后我们讨论了承包商的责任感、Better HVAC的使命，以及如何通过名录和认证资质，帮业主找到那些坚持持续学习、诚信做事、注重实际效果的专业人士。
And we wrapped up with a discussion about contractor accountability, Better HVAC's mission, and how directories and verified credentials can help homeowners find professionals committed to continuous learning, ethical work, and measured results.
希望你们喜欢这期节目。
We hope you enjoy this episode.
大家早上好。
Good morning, everyone.
对于之后收听录音的朋友们，欢迎来到《建筑暖通科学播客》。
And for those of you listening later on our recorded, welcome to the Building HVAC Science Podcast.
我是埃里克·凯撒。
I'm Eric Kaiser.
坐在我左边的是比尔·斯波恩。
Bill Spohn over here to my left.
今天我们是面对面录的。
We're actually in person today.
没错。
We are.
我们现在正在AHR展会上向大家直播。
Are coming to you from the AHR Expo.
今天是展会第一天，上午九点，地点在拉斯维加斯的2026年AHR展会。
So this is being recorded day one, 9AM at the AHR Expo twenty twenty six in Las Vegas.
比尔，你来这儿多久了？
And, Bill, how long have you been here?
我算了一下，大概三十七年了，每年都来。
I think it's about thirty seven years I've been coming to this event.
三十七年。
Thirty seven.
如果你没看出来，我确实有点儿那样子。
Case you can't tell, I sort of look that way.
但我真想知道，以前在这展会上我到底走了多少路。
But I'd really like to figure out how many miles I've walked on this show for before.
我以前在Back Rack Instruments干了十年，后来又去了Testo Instruments，还待过几年Superior Valve。
I used to work for Back Rack Instruments for ten years and Testo Instruments and actually Superior Valve for a couple years.
所以我有制造商那边的经验，现在则站在了另一边——我和Eric一起经营的Tru Tech Tools，专门卖暖通空调和制冷用的工具和检测仪器。
So I do have like some manufacturer experience and I'm sort of on the other side of the table where Tru Tech Tools, our business that Eric and I work at, we sell tools and test instruments for HVACR.
所以我们经常来拜访我们的供应商。
So we come and visit with a lot of our vendors.
你这次列了多少家要拜访的？
How many do you have on your hit list?
上次我数了数，名单上有59家，可能还有些没来得及加进去。
I think I have 59 last time I looked at my list and there's probably some on there that I don't have put on yet.
所以我们在这儿要见的人可真不少。
So a lot of people to visit while we're here.
我这里有62个，不过其中一些是行业里认识的朋友。
And I have like 62, but some of them are like friends, friends you made in the industry.
我希望这个播客能帮大家更好地连接起来，一起解决问题。
And I really I hopefully this podcast helps people kind of unite, figure things out together.
这正是我们做这个播客的目标之一。
That's like one of the goals of our podcast.
我回想了一下，大概从2007年就开始来这儿了，没你那么久，不过你提到过记录步数。
I try to think, I think I've been coming here since 2007, so not quite as long as you, but you mentioned logging miles.
对。
Yeah.
你来这儿的时候，还没人戴这种能自动计步的手环呢。
You've been coming here a couple years before we had these things on our wrist that would keep track of that.
没错。
Right.
那时候你得自己回头算步数。
So you'd have to go back and do some math.
我会的，我一定会的。
I would, I would.
现在，如果你像我一样了解比尔，你就知道他对做表格有多着迷。
Now, if you know Bill as well as I do, you know he loves a good spreadsheet.
所以很有可能他会回去把这一切都算清楚，也许有一天会把这些信息公布出来。
So it's entirely possible that he could go back and figure all this out and may put that information out there someday.
不过，也许这些年我的步幅变短了。
Although perhaps my gait has shortened over the years.
我不
I'm not
确定。
sure.
或者至少我有点犹豫。
Or at least I wobbled.
不过我们今天确实请了两位新朋友，就是从现场观众里直接邀请上来，加入我们的。
But we've got some newer actually, two people we pulled out of the crowd, literally, to join us here today.
我的意思是，我们是朋友。
I mean, we're friends.
没错，我们确实是。
We've We are.
我们认识很多年了。
We've we've known each other for many years.
我们只是碰巧遇到你们。
Well, we just ran into you.
是的。
Yeah.
这太棒了。
That's so great.
真是太好了。
That's that's awesome.
再说一遍，这个行业真正看重的是什么。
Again, what it's about in this industry.
要不要介绍一下？
Wanna introduce?
这位是来自休斯机械公司的克里斯·法布雷和大卫·科内特，他们来自路易斯安那州卢扎卡里亚的哪个区域？
So we've got Chris Fabre and David Cornette from Hughes Mechanical in which part of Lou Zachary, Louisiana?
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
就在巴吞鲁日郊外。
Just outside of Baton Rouge.
明白了。
Okay.
那边天气又热又潮湿，对吧？
So down there where it's hot and humid.
我们离开那里的时候比现在冷，到这儿之后反而更暖和了。
It was colder there when we left and when we got here.
今年的天气真的有点反常。
Well The weather's been a little weird this year.
我们在巴吞鲁日登机的时候，温度才25度。
It was like 25 degrees when we got on the plane in Baton Rouge.
这在路易斯安那州可太不正常了。
That seems very wrong for Louisiana.
是的。
Yeah.
我们以前从没想过要像北方人那样，得天天排水、做这些事，这个冬天确实挺特别的。
We were not used to having to, drip water, do the things that people up north do, and and it's definitely been interesting this winter.
但南路易斯安那那边的人说，只要
But South Louisiana is saying, if
你要是不喜欢现在的天气，
you don't like the weather,
等十五分钟，准变。
just wait fifteen minutes, it's gonna change.
这说的就是实际情况。
I mean, is what's happening.
好像
It seems
最近 everywhere 都是这样。
to be true everywhere lately.
是的。
Yeah.
真是够疯狂的。
It's been wild.
前几天我给内特发了个图表。
I sent Nate a graph the other day.
气温是72度，大概三十分钟后就跌到了42度。
It was 72 And then I think thirty minutes later, had dropped to 42.
天啊。
Wow.
气候带的说法真是靠不住了。
So much for climate zones.
就在巴吞鲁日，气温才四十多度。
Just but we had in Baton Rouge it was in the forties.
而离它六十英里外的新奥尔良，东南方向，气温还保持在七十多度。
In New Orleans, which is 60 miles southwest, southeast, was still in the seventies.
天气突然就急剧升温了。
There was just that hard sheer climb with the weather.
简直太疯狂了。
It was pretty crazy.
你们平时都怎么应对的？
What do you guys do?
我是休斯机械公司的商业服务经理，做暖通空调已经九年了。
So I'm the commercial service manager for Hughes Mechanical, and I have been doing HVAC right at nine years now.
我们主要做VRV系统，这是我们的核心业务。
And we focus primarily on VRV, VRF is our mainstay.
大卫负责我们商业项目的安装管理。
David is our commercial install management.
是项目经理，还是项目？
Project manager or project?
项目管理。
Project management.
对。
Yeah.
项目管理。
Project management.
所以我们负责商业安装，对接分包商和总包，天天在邮件里来回争执，
So we handle the install, commercial projects, dealing with subcontractors, general contractors, a lot of arguing through emails, the
都是些琐碎事儿。
fun stuff.
我们昨天还聊到这个。
We were talking about it yesterday.
他每天的烦恼程度都是持续不断的，因为我负责南方的售后服务。
He has a daily annoyance level that is just constant because I do service in the South.
冬天的时候，根本不会出什么大问题，哦不，我的锅炉又坏了。
In the wintertime, it doesn't get really, oh no, it's my boiler's down.
所以冬天我们稍微轻松一点，到了夏天就彻底乱套了。
So we slack off kind of bit in the wintertime and then in the summer it is just insanity.
我这边有忙有闲，但他总是处于烦躁状态。
But I get peaks and valleys and he's just kind of always annoyed.
你还记得以前听过休斯机械的一些项目吗？
Remember hearing about some projects at Hughes Mechanical.
那些项目简直离谱得不行。
They're pretty far out there.
他们实在搞不定的时候才会打电话找我们。
Like, they call you when they can't figure it out.
我们经常接到其他公司的返工请求，因为他们安装不当或者调试没做好。
We get a lot of callbacks from other companies that installed it or installed improperly or didn't commission properly.
这让我们变得更好了，因为我们不得不找出问题出在哪里。
And it's made us better because we had to figure out what was wrong.
我们并不是最完美的。
It's not that we are the end all.
外面确实有更厉害的团队。
There's better times out
没错。
there.
是的。
Yeah.
所以我们被迫从别人的错误中吸取教训。
But we've been forced to learn from others' mistakes.
所以
So
你们在哪里
where do you
你们平时都在哪儿学习呢？
do some of your learning?
最早的时候，我们之前也聊过，我刚进入这个行业时，布莱恩刚失去了他的暖通空调学校播客和Facebook群组。
So originally, and we were discussing earlier, when I got into this industry, Brian had just lost the HVAC school podcast and the Facebook group.
当时我和现在为布莱恩工作的老科比，会私下发消息交流，听那个播客，听你讲话，也听老格鲁姆伯格曼的节目。
And me and, old Colby that works for Brian now, actually, We would PM in units and listening to the podcast and listening to you, listening to old grumpy Bergman.
那些最早期的内容，真的非常基础，现在的人真该回头再去听听。
And the early early days of that, and people should really revisit it, were, like, super, super fundamental.
现在的内容更偏向技术细节，更聚焦，但伯格曼当初说的‘你首先是个清洁工’这个理念，从一开始就深深影响了我。
Now it's more technical, more focused, but the Bergmann's premise of you're a janitor first has stuck with me from the beginning.
明白了。
Got it.
如果东西不干净，叶片不干净，线圈不干净，气流都不通，就别急着接压力表。
If it's not clean, if the blades aren't clean, the coils aren't clean, you don't have the airflow, don't put gauges on it.
昨晚我们参加了一个活动，埃里克，你来给大家说说那是怎么回事吧。
We had took part in an event last night, and Eric, you could describe what it was.
昨晚的活动确实有种谦逊成长、边学边做的感觉。
It did have a lot of that humble growing learning feeling to it at an event last night.
昨晚是第六届暖通空调战术奖颁奖典礼，主要表彰蓝领技术工人。
So last night was the sixth annual HVAC Tactical Awards show, which really honors the blue collar trades.
这个活动的特色就是蓝领工人穿上燕尾服出席。
Its claim to fame is blue collar goes black tie.
如果有人参加过，或者看过直播，他们也在YouTube频道上同步直播。
And if anybody's ever gotten to go to that or even watch it live, they do stream it live on their YouTube channel as well.
看到一群蓝领工人站上舞台，因为日常的辛勤工作而受到认可，还向别人传授经验，真的很棒。
It's a pretty cool event to see a bunch of blue collar people get out there, get honored for what they do in their day to day life, what they're showing other people how to do.
社交媒体让这个行业变得更加平等，确实带来了巨大改变。
The social media aspect of the trade has been a bit of an equalizer and it's been a Oh, big for sure.
我觉得，这对很多人来说是个关键转折点，让他们能学到新东西，了解全国各地的动态。
Inflection point, I think, for a lot of people to learn new things and see what's going on around the country.
虽然我们经常跑遍全国各地参加各种活动，但听很多人说的一句话是：我们这儿的情况太独特了。
As much as we go around the country a lot to different events, one of the general themes I hear from people is my area is so unique.
在某种程度上确实如此，但我觉得很多人其实都经历过类似的事，不同地区之间的相似之处比大多数人想象的要多得多，只是他们没机会了解而已。
And to some extent, that's true, but I think a lot of people get to experience things and it's a lot more similar across different geographical regions than a lot of people realize because they don't get to
看不到那么多地方的情况。
see It's lot geographies.
你说得对。
You're right.
真的相似多了。
It's a lot more similar.
问题在于，以前没有社交媒体，也没有现在这么强的连接性，比如路易斯安那州拉法叶市的人，离我们也就一个半小时车程。
The problem is that before we had social media and we had the connectivity that we have now is somebody over in Lafayette, Louisiana, an interesting example, an hour and a half away from us.
他们是由一个师傅带出来的，而那个师傅又是跟更早的师傅学的，用的都不是最佳做法。
They got trained by a guy who got trained by a guy before him and they weren't using best practices.
他们一直就这么干，根本不知道还有别的方法。
And that was the way they'd always done it, and they didn't they didn't know any better.
他们可不是笨人。
They weren't idiots.
他们只是不了解这个流程。
They were ignorant of the process.
现在有了这么广泛的传播，你在社交媒体上经常能看到，哦，你根本不用那样做。
And now that we have this big outreach, and you see it all the time on social media, oh, you don't have to do that.
你当代理的时候没必要那样做。
You don't have to do when you're per agent.
你根本不需要这么做。
You don't need to do this.
我这么做过，从来都没出过问题。
I've done this and it's never been a problem.
确实出过问题。
It has been.
只是你没看到而已。
You just haven't seen it.
对。
Right.
走错路了。
On the wrong way.
或者你做得还不够多。
Or you haven't done it enough.
是的。
Yeah.
最糟糕的情况就是听到别人说，我们一直就这么干的。
Biggest, the worst thing you can hear is we've always done it this way.
好吧。
Okay.
其实还有很多别的办法。
Well, there's other ways to do things.
只要你能完成任务
As long as you finish
要是后面还加上一句‘而且效果还不错’，那就算了
that sentence with we've always done it that way with good results, then it's
是的，完全正确。
Yeah, absolutely.
但你是怎么证明这些好结果的呢？
But how are you proving those good results?
没错。
Right.
而且现在，我们再次提到True Tech，已经能够获得价格更亲民的工具了。
And now that we have, again, we'll plug True Tech, we have the ability to get tools that are affordable.
以前一个风量测量仪要一万美元。
I mean, it used to be $10,000 for a kite.
现在想测气流，一千美元以内就能买到。
If you wanted to measure airflow, you can get them under 1,000 now.
风机门、风管泄漏测试——所有这些在项目完成后用来验证效果的工具，价格都降下来了，你终于可以确认气流是否达标。
Blower doors are down, duct leakage test, all the tools that you need to really test out once you've actually completed the project and go, oh, the airflow is good.
我只需要把手放在出风口感受一下就行。
Let me just hold my hand at the vent.
技术真实的气流网格。
The tech truth flow grid.
对。
Right.
是的。
Yeah.
对于住宅系统来说，这彻底改变了气流检测的方式。
For residential systems, that is a game changer for Just airflow
压力计是什么？
the manometer is what?
六千八百美元？
$6,800?
是的。
Yeah.
但不到一千美元就能买到超高精度的压力计，很多人还没意识到这款产品的价值。
But it's a super high resolution manometer for under a thousand dollars, and people don't understand the value of that product.
还以为要一千美元呢。
Like, oh, it's a thousand dollar.
明白了。
Okay.
以前要五万，甚至十万。
They used to be 5, used to be 10.
是的。
Yeah.
现在用这些工具，能比以前快得多地解决实际问题。
You can solve real problems with those tools now much faster than we could before.
对。
Right.
你觉得这些工具和检测设备的演进，对技术人员的日常业务有多大影响？
So how do you think that evolution of tools and test instruments, how much has that impacted like your business from a technician standpoint, day to day?
我最早买了一套燃油喷射探头，就是带两个温度夹、两个压力探头和两个空气探头的Job Link套件。
I bought the first set of fuel piece probes, the job link kit with the two temp clamps, the two pressure and the two air probes.
我跟吉姆说，只要能集成起来快速测量，我就买一套这种探头。
Because I told Jim, I said, whenever you can get that integrated and measure quick, I'm gonna buy a set of these probes.
他后来真给集成好了，我就买了，现在我们至少有十几套了。
And he got it integrated and I bought them, and now we have a dozen sets easily.
技师们一到现场，把设备全部部署好，我就会接到电话。
And the guys will show up, they'll deploy everything, and I'll get a phone call.
他们说：我这边测出温度是这个，压力是这个，空气流量也是这个。
And they're like, well, I got this temp and I got this pressure and I got this.
我就跟他们说，别光看单个数据，要从整个系统来看。
And I'm like, so look at the system as a whole.
我刚入行的时候，用的是那种老式现场仪表，上面插着一个K型热电偶。
Because when I started, we had a field piece meter with a k type thermocouple stuck in it.
你得跑到通风口那儿，把探头贴在管路上固定好。
You go stick it in the vent, you'd tape it to your line set.
现在不一样了，能实时看到整个系统的全部数据，不用再一个点一个点地去测了。
And now you have the ability to get the entire system as a whole and look at it live instead of, let me get a measurement here.
让我在这儿测一下。
Let me get a measurement here.
这些数据是分开记录的，时间上不连贯。
And they're separated by time.
它们是分开的，你知道的，有现场仪表、特福斯，市面上有十几种不同的设备。
They're separated, you know, it's the field piece, the testos, there's a dozen varieties out there.
但能这样全面掌握系统状态，简直太厉害了。
But it's that is an insane ability.
回到战术奖和社交媒体的关联，我们刚才聊到了这个。
Going back to the Tactical Awards and the social media connection, we riffed off into.
昨晚最有意义的时刻之一，就是看到制冷技术公司的约翰·帕斯托雷洛获得终身成就奖。
But one of the most meaningful aspects last night was to see John Pastorello of Refrigeration Technologies get the lifetime achievement award.
是啊。
Oh, yeah.
那太棒了。
Oh, that's awesome.
他确实配得上这个奖。
Was truly deserved.
他是个非常特别的人。
He's such a unique individual.
我们几年前就请他上过播客，但他的故事至今依然动人。
We've had him on the podcast a number of years ago, but his story still holds true.
来自暖通学校和Kalos的布莱恩·奥尔为约翰做了非常动人的介绍。
And Brian Orr from HVAC school and Kalos gave a very nice introduction to John up there.
他为人特别谦逊。
Very humble man.
如果你们能找到他们， Refrigeration Technologies 的展台或者 Viper 的展台，记得去看看。
If you can find them, people that are here, Refrigeration Technologies, look for that booth or Viper.
Viper 是他们的品牌名称。
That's sort of their their brand name, Viper.
人真的特别好。
Super nice guy.
约翰真的特别随和。
Like John is just the nicest.
而且知识特别渊博。
And a wealth of knowledge too.
是的。
Yeah.
他们的产品也做得很好。
Make great products as well.
他们的产品确实很棒。
They do make great products.
不过我认识约翰大概已经有十五年了。
But John, I've known him for fifteen years probably now.
他一直都很乐于帮忙。
And he's always been helpful.
你要是有什么问题，他都会帮你解答。
If you need a question like he would answer it.
我看到这家公司还在延续这种传统。
And I see that company carrying that on.
现在他的儿子接手了，正在全力经营。
His son is taking that over now and really running that.
我觉得约翰昨晚宣布，这将是他的最后一次AHR了。
I think John announced last night this was gonna be his last AHR.
是的。
He did.
他把这称作告别演出。
He called it a swan song.
对。
Yeah.
更棒的是，他在最后一次活动上还拿到了那个奖项。
Which is really cool that he got that award at the last one too.
他离开后，展会里肯定会少了很多他的身影，但他确实为这个行业留下了深远的影响。
And he's gonna be missed around the show quite a bit, I'm sure, but has definitely left a legacy in this industry.
是的
Yeah.
昨晚我们还看到了其他几个很棒的奖项颁发。
We got to see some other great awards given last night.
年度女性奖颁给了来自丹佛的梅根·麦金托什。
Lady of the trade went to Megan McIntosh
对。
Yes.
她来自丹佛，做得非常出色。
Out of Denver, who does a great job.
她的公司主要专注于大麻产业。
Their business focuses on the cannabis industry.
机械环境方面。
Mechanical environments.
是的
Yeah.
机械环境。
Mechanical environments.
非常严苛的环境。
A very tough environment.
是的。
Yeah.
要求极高的一种环境。
Very demanding environment.
这个行业要求特别高，因为温室里的条件每小时都在变，你得时刻跟进调整。
A very demanding industry because there's literally hourly changes in those grow rooms that you have to manage and come into that.
我不是很了解。
I'm not super familiar with.
面积很大，湿度和灯光控制都很复杂，灯光本身产生的热量就得算进负载计算里。
Very large areas with humidity, lighting control, and it's so much light that you're having to factor the lights themselves into your load calculations.
对。
Yeah.
这些是LED灯，但依然散发出大量的热。
Which is, I mean, they're LED lights and they're still pumping out Sure.
大量的热量。
Lots of heat.
热能。
Heat energy.
我对这个不太了解。
I'm not super familiar.
路易斯安那州还没完全合法化。
We haven't legalized it totally in Louisiana yet.
不过，我还是通过社交媒体向别人学习经验。
But just again, from social media, I get to learn from others' experiences.
我们有个VRVVRF的Facebook群组。
We do the VRVVRF Facebook group.
我经常看到别人遇到的问题，每次去现场看到类似情况时，
I get to see others' problems that whenever I go onto a site and I see something like,
说实话，我觉得
man, I just think
我好像记得有这么回事。
I remember something about that.
就是我们这种互动能力。
And it's just that interaction ability that we have.
在安装方面，我能看到别人是怎么装的。
And on the install side, I get to see how other people install it.
我们能学到不少点子，比如他们怎么布线、用哪些产品，这些真的帮了我们大忙。
We get to see, get ideas of, okay, they ran their lines like this and they use these products and it's really been a help for us.
社交媒体确实为人们打开了成百上千个交流的渠道。
I mean, social media has really opened up hundreds of doors for people to interact.
其实我们就是通过社交媒体认识的，七年后的今天，我们居然在一块儿工作了。
I mean, that's how we met actually on social media and what seven years later, we're working together.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
戴夫，你以前是做什么的？
What's your background, Dave?
我一开始在一家公司做更换滤芯和皮带的工作，后来一步步升到了服务经理，之后跳槽到休斯公司，每天都很感恩。
Went to work for a company, just changing filters, belts, worked my way up to a service manager and left there, came over to Hughes and it's been a blessing every day.
我的意思是，这真是家绝佳的公司。
I mean, they're just the best company to work for.
他们真的特别照顾我们。
They really take care of us.
他们不仅投资我们的培训，还关心我们的家庭和生活。
They really invest in not only our education, but our families, our lives.
所以，这真是家特别棒的公司。
So they've just been an awesome company to work for.
他们派我来这儿，我其实早就想来十五年了，现在真的太棒了。
They sent me here and I've been wanting to come here for fifteen years and this is amazing.
我太兴奋了。
I'm so excited.
可活动还没开始呢。
And it hasn't even started yet.
我知道，我知道，但我现在过得特别开心。
I know, I know, but I'm having the time of my life.
是的。
Yeah.
展会地板再过四十五分钟才开放，你现在已经乐不可支了。
And they don't even open the show floor for another forty five minutes and you're already having the time of your life.
当然了。
Oh yeah.
我只是说，我们正在
I'm But just we're having a
和一群很棒的人待在一起。
gonna hang out with good people.
是的。
Yeah.
我的意思是，没错。
So I mean, yeah.
展会还没正式开始，就已经有不少精彩的对话在发生了。
There's a lot of good conversations happening even before the show.
你最期待什么？
What are you looking forward to?
我先问大卫吧。
I'll start with David.
你在这次展会上最期待什么？希望收获些什么？
What are you looking forward to at this show most and what do you hope to take away?
就是看看所有
Just viewing all the
新推出的产品，认识一些在社交媒体上关注的人，把网上的名字和真人对上号，顺便建立联系。
new products that are coming out, meeting people that have follow on social media, see, put faces to names in real life and just making connections.
现在真是个令人兴奋的时刻。
It's an exciting time.
克里斯，你呢？
What about you, Chris?
你希望从这次活动里收获些什么？
What are you looking to take away from this?
这是你第一次来吗？
Is this your first time?
这是我第二次来了。
This is my second one.
这是
This is
你的第二次
your second
了。
one.
我确实参加过，当它和暖通空调学校的课程安排在一起时，效果最好。
I did, when it winds up being in with the HVAC school is when it's the best.
对。
Yep.
我第一次参加的是第一家暖通空调学校。
Because my first one I went to was the first HVAC school.
我们那时候是周四到周五，或者周五到周六连着上。
And we did that like Thursday, Friday or Friday, Saturday.
是的。
Yeah.
然后AHR展览从星期一就开始了。
And then AHR started on Monday.
所以我们一直跟着安排走。
So we just tracked it through.
对我来说，参加这些展会，第一是为了见见平时打交道的那些人。
For me coming to these shows, one, it's to meet meet with the people that I've been dealing with.
而且很多东西都是我们平时看不到的。
And a lot of it is looking at things that we don't see.
上次我来的时候，参加了丹讲的一堂水暖热水供暖课。
So last time I came here, I sat through a a hydronics hot water heating class with Dan.
丹。
Dan.
丹。
Dan.
那真的挺有意思的，因为我们平时根本不做那种地暖或散热器式的水暖系统。
And that was really cool because we don't do any hydronic heating baseboard style, things like that.
如果有锅炉，那通常是用于大型商业项目，功率在五百万到五千万英热单位之间，而不是小型住宅那种。
If there's a boiler, it's probably five to 50,000,000 BTU in a big commercial application, not in a smaller residential style.
是的。
Yeah.
所以我特别喜欢看这些我们平时接触不到的东西。
So I like seeing stuff that we don't get to see.
这总是挺有意思的。
That's always interesting.
丹是个特别棒的演讲者，这么多年积累了很多精彩的故事。
And Dan's a fantastic He's speaker and got so many great stories from over the years.
事实上，去年他在战术奖颁奖典礼上获得了终身成就奖。
In fact, last year he won the lifetime achievement award at the Tactical Awards.
哇，真的吗。
Oh, wow.
他获此殊荣实至名归。
He was honored with that and a very well deserving person of it.
他当时亲自到场了。
And he was in attendance.
他今天可能也在展会现场，但当时确实出席了。
He's he may be here at the show today, but he was attending.
他可是写过关于热水供暖领域权威著作的人。
I mean, literally wrote the book on hydronic heating.
是的
Yeah.
很多呢
Many of them.
一直在运转
Pumping away.
没错
That's Yeah.
对
Yeah.
关于水暖最棒的书之一
One of the best books on Yeah.
绝对是水暖领域
Hydronic heating for sure.
他还写了很多关于蒸汽系统的书，帮行业里很多人重新掌握了蒸汽技术
And he wrote a lot of steam books as well that has helped the industry and many people in the industry remember how to do steam.
他的网站是什么？
His website is?
Eatinghelp.com。
Eatinghelp.com..com.
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
他的女儿艾伦一直在维护这个网站。
His daughter Aaron has continued that website.
丹已经不太管这个网站了，但他的女儿艾伦现在还在继续运营。
Dan has kind of retired from running that, but his daughter Aaron continues that website on today.
上面还有一些论坛。
They've got some forums on there.
有很多丹写的书，内容都非常精彩。
A lot of Dan's books, just a lot of unbelievably great information.
展开剩余字幕（还有 480 条）
如果有人想学习这方面的知识，这个网站是个非常好的资源。
If somebody needs to go learn that or be able to pick that up, it's a great resource.
很不错。
Nice.
有个问题想问一下
Question for
你这边，休斯公司做住宅项目吗？
you, does Hughes do residential work?
做。
Yes.
是的。
Yeah.
我们大概三七开。
We're probably thirty, seventy.
七三开。
Seventy, thirty.
是的
Yeah.
我们主要做商业项目，但依然有不少住宅客户找我们做风机门测试。
We do primarily commercial, but we also, we still have quite a few residential customers that we do blower door testing.
实际上，我们还为其他公司提供第三方风机门和风管泄漏检测服务。
Actually we do third party, the blower door and duct leakage for others.
有些公司不想自己投资设备，但又必须拿到合格认证，因为他们的项目入住率很高。
People that don't want to invest in it and they gotta get COAs because there's good occupancies.
是什么让你开始做这种更全面的建筑检测的？
What got you into doing the more comprehensive testing for the building aspect?
跟克里斯·休斯争论来的。
Arguing with Chris Hughes.
明白了。
Okay.
嘿，这个
Hey, the
最好的
best
东西
things
都来自市场。
come from the market.
他错了。
He's wrong.
他肯定在这儿附近转悠呢。
He's gonna be wandering around here somewhere.
我肯定他跟史蒂夫在技术展台那儿。
I'm sure he's with Steve at the tech booth.
是的。
Yeah.
但光靠‘他说、她说’是行不通的。
But he said, she said doesn't work.
如果你拿出工具去做测试，答案自然就出来了。
If you break out tools and you do testing, the answer is there.
所以别再争论回风口太小、风管太细这些事了。
So arguing about undersized returns, undersized ductwork.
我们根本得不到足够的风量。
We're not getting enough airflow.
我们这个行业在住宅领域最大的问题，就是我用了个100平方英寸的回风管。
The real biggest problems in our industry in the residential side are, I got a 100 square inches of tunnel return.
用一个一英寸的褶皱过滤器，这还凑合。
It's fine with a one inch pleat.
或者说，没错，如果条件完美、长度合适，七英寸的柔性风管也能处理150立方英尺每分钟的风量。
Or, I mean, yeah, a seven inch flex will do a 150 CFMs if it's perfect and it's about that long.
只要你配个足够大的风机，确实可以。
It will if you put in a big enough blower on one.
对。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
没错。
Yeah.
这正是商业项目有趣的地方。
Which is the fun part about commercial.
我们一般要等到静压达到五英寸左右，才会触发安全保护。
We don't trigger safeties till we get about five inches of static pressure.
我们就直接往上加。
We just bump it up.
那你在商业项目中也会遇到类似的问题吗？比如风管尺寸和过滤器尺寸这些？
So do you find similar problems with duct sizing and filter sizing and things like that on commercial?
是不是
Is that a
在一定程度上吧，不像住宅项目那么严重，但确实也会发生。
To an extent, I mean, not as bad as the residential side, but I mean, it happens.
一些老建筑经过改造后，一直有问题。
Older buildings where they retrofitted, retrofit, they had problems.
他们说，哦，这儿原来装的是五吨的设备。
They're like, oh, we had a five ton in here.
我们就换成了七点五吨的。
We'll put a seven and a half.
我们有个超市，原来装了四台五吨的机组，一直有除湿问题。
We got a grocery store that had four five ton units, and they were having humidity issues.
所以他们换成了四台，呃——
So they replaced them with four sorry.
他们原来有四台五吨的。
They had four fives.
换成了四台十吨的，但没对风管和回风口做任何调整。
They put replaced them with four tens and didn't do anything to the ductwork or the returns.
我猜这也没帮他们解决湿度问题。
I bet that helped their humidity issues.
我猜这确实改变了他们的湿度问题，只是没按他们想的那样。
I bet it changed their humidity issues, maybe not in the way
他们以为会是另一种结果。
they thought it was going to.
因为我们对超市的了解，那里有大量的免费制冷。
Because of our background at the grocery stores, you have a lot of free cooling.
是的。
Yeah.
大量的免费制冷。
A lot of free cooling.
工程师通常会按每平方英尺一到两冷吨的标准来设计空调容量，你知道的，就是这种常规做法。
And the engineers will size that building for the usual one b two US square foot, you know, that kind of thing.
但他们没考虑到敞开式的冷柜和货架。
But they don't take into account open cases, open racks.
还有人员带来的热量。
Human element.
所以你只好把热空气送进去，人为增加负荷，只为让空调系统多运行一会儿，好除湿。
So you wind up putting hot air into them, putting a false load just so you can get your HVAC equipment to run longer to dehumidify.
你根本不是在用再热方式除湿，你只是在加热空气。
You're not even reheat dehumidifying, you're heating the air.
这有点像再热除湿的过程。
It's kind of a reheat
在空间里确实是这样。
while you're in the space, Yes.
虽然不是在风管里，但还是属于我们说的那个最大的‘风管’里。
It's not in the ductwork so much, but it's still in that, what we call the biggest duct in the Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
没错。
Yeah.
我们的换热材料、制冷剂和空气都不按人的想法来，它们只服从物理规律。
Our heat transfer materials, refrigerants and air don't obey human logic, they obey physics.
是的。
Yes.
不幸的是，这正是我们的播客需要科学视角的原因。
Unfortunately, that's why we have the science aspect to our podcast.
没错。
Yep.
所以我们特别注重通过科学工具传递知识，帮助做出明智的决策。
And that's why we're so into getting the scientific information through the tools to make good decisions.
你是说，人们在学校里应该更重视物理学吗？
Are you saying that people should pay attention to physics more while they're in school?
或者至少现在就应该重视。
Or at least now.
而且也更容易理解。
And it's easier.
我们刚才还在谈工程思维的问题。
We're talking about engineering mindset just beforehand.
是的，没错。
Yeah, yeah.
那你来说说你对这个视频的看法吧。
So tell us about what you think about that video.
《工程思维》这个YouTube系列太棒了。
The Engineering Mindset, great YouTube series.
我会把视频推荐给团队里的每个人，他讲解得特别清楚，从最基础的概念开始，一直讲到完整的内容。
Like I I send it to all my guys, the way he explains everything from just the basics, like the absolute basics all the way to finish whatever he's talking about.
真的是个很棒的系列。
It's just a great series.
他做得非常出色。
He does great work.
他的自动动画效果特别棒。
His auto animations are awesome.
他用动画把复杂的东西拆解得特别清楚，解释得明明白白。
He does really good animation for breaking it down and explaining it.
你不需要是物理学家或化学家。
You don't have to be a physicist or a chemist.
不好意思，蕾切尔。
Sorry, Rachel.
但你得认真听那些能打动你的人，善用各种材料和资源。
But you have to listen to them and listen to the ones that speak to you and use materials and media.
我们之前提过好几次史蒂夫·罗杰斯。
Like we mentioned Steve Rogers a couple times.
现在有个克里斯在他们那儿工作。
Chris works for them now.
另一个克里斯。
Other Chris.
是的。
Yeah.
另一个克里斯。
Other Chris.
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
而且
And
他们很擅长解释物理原理，并且开发出能从物理数据中提取信息的工具。
they do a good job explaining the physics and producing tools that you can extract information with the physics from.
我已经好几年没做过鼓风门测试了。
So I haven't done a blower door test in some years.
科比以前在我们这儿工作，但他搬去佛罗里达了。
And Colby, who used to work for us, that one he moved to Florida.
他现在和布莱恩一起，以前都是他负责我们所有的鼓风门测试。
He's working with Brian, was doing all our blower doors.
所以我们现在只剩一个人还持有相关执照。
So we have one guy that still has his license on it.
所以我们请他来帮忙，因为我们好一阵子没做过这种测试了。
So we brought him in because we hadn't done one in a little bit.
我们还有一套全新的技术型鼓风门检测设备，带他们的微压计和手机应用，全套都在。
And we have a brand new in the box tech blower door kit with their little manometer and app and everything.
之前从来没用过。
Had never used it.
我就说，行吧。
So I said, okay.
我们办公室附近有个小附属套房。
We have a little mother-in-law suite near our office.
我说，咱们过去设一下设备。
I said, let's go set it up.
打开电源。
Turned it on.
看了个YouTube视频，学怎么操作。
Watched the YouTube on how to do it.
打开了设备。
Turned it on.
它提示说：把这根颜色的软管插到这个接口，那根颜色的软管插到那个接口，点下一步，做这个，做那个。
It said, plug in this color hose to this port, color this color hose to this port, hit next, do this, do this.
我以前用过老式的 Retro Tech 设备，我觉得是另一个办公室的人偷偷拿走了。
And having had Retro Tech equipment for years that I think my other office stole from me.
咱们别在这儿提这事了。
We won't talk about that here.
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
萨姆可能会生气，但管不了那么多了。
Sam might get mad at me, but whatever.
App 里的操作指引和设备、压力计之间的配合很顺畅。
The walkthrough in the app to do the equipment, the test flowed in the tech between the app and the manometer.
它直接就正常运行了。
It just worked.
我以前从来没用过这设备。
I had never used the equipment.
我把它组装好，打开电源，走了一遍流程，完事了。
I put it together, turned it on, ran it through and done.
这真得给它们点个赞。
And that was kudos to them.
就像我说的，史蒂夫、克里斯还有他们团队为此花了好几年时间不断打磨。
Like I said, that Steve and Chris and all of them have been working on that for years to really refine it.
我觉得这
I think that's
现在很多应用之所以成功，很大一部分原因在于流程设计。
a big part of what's happening now with a lot of apps is the workflow.
流程已经被内置进去了。
Workflows are being built in.
帮你记起那些忘了的事。
Helps you remember what you forgot.
这个说法我从布莱恩的播客里学来的，可能你以前从来没听过。
And I'm stealing this from Brian's podcast, but it's something you maybe never learned before.
你看看 Measure Quick 就知道了。
I mean, you've seen it with Measure Quick.
对。
Yeah.
刚推出的时候还挺笨拙的。
It was a little clunky when it started.
没错。
Right.
现在改进多了。
It's gotten a whole lot.
现在有了不错的入门引导和完整操作流程，方方面面都更顺手了。
It's got nice little starting points and work throughs and all that.
你刚才提到了工作流程。
You mentioned workflows.
你觉得这种工作流程对现场的技术人员有帮助吗？让他们每次都按同样的步骤来，避免遗漏什么？
Do you find that workflows like that are a benefit to the technicians in the field so that they go through the same steps every time and don't miss something?
这样真的有好处吗？
Is is that beneficial?
当然有，毫无疑问。
Oh yeah, for sure.
我的意思是，不可能让五个人做同样的工作，却各有各的做法。
I mean, it's, you can't have five different people doing the same job five different ways.
这样行不通。
It doesn't work.
你得确保每次都能得到一致的结果。
You probably have get
或者说是可重复的信息。
the same answers out of it every time or repeatable information.
没错。
Right.
对。
Right.
每次做测试都得用同样的方法，结果才有效。
You have to do a test the same way every time for the results to be valid.
说到应用程序。
And speaking of apps.
是啊。
Oh, yeah.
我听说了。
I heard.
是的。
Yeah.
你听说了。
You heard.
你今天早上听说了吗？
Did you hear just this morning?
是啊，听说了。
Oh, yeah.
对，有这事儿。
Yeah.
早些时候有个人跟我推销来着。
Some guy was shilling it to me earlier.
没错。
Right.
你说得对。
You're right.
没错。
Right.
所以 True Tech Tools 现在推出应用了。
So True Tech Tools now has an app.
几周前在暖通空调制冷研讨会上低调上线了。
It was soft launched at the HVACR symposium a couple weeks ago.
现在可以下载了。
It's available for download now.
在苹果App Store和安卓应用商店搜索True Tech Tools就能找到。
You'll find it under True Tech Tools at the iOS App Store and the Android Play Store.
目前还处于最小可行版本阶段。
It's in, call it minimum viable product mode.
能用。
It works.
用起来挺顺的。
Works well.
欢迎提反馈。
Feedback's welcome.
不过我们后续还会推出很多很棒的功能。
But we plan to have a lot of great things planned for it.
太棒了。
Awesome.
对。
Yeah.
让它能搜索。
Make it searchable.
我是想说，要能搜索还能筛选。
That's searchable and filterable is the I'm trying to say.
就像在亚马逊上买东西。
Trying to buy something on Amazon.
如果你不知道型号，出来的结果能有九千条。
If you don't know the SKU, you're gonna get 9,000 results.
要能一层层往下钻，比如像Master Car那样，我想找一个接触器。
Something that you can drill down through, like Master Car kind of style of I want a contactor.
我要单极的。
I want one pole.
我就想要这个保险库，没错。
I want this vault Right.
你在采购时做筛选，我指的就是这种功能。
When you're trying to sort, that's what I'm looking for in purchasing that.
你瞧这个。
Look at that.
实时反馈真不错。
Good feedback live.
就是这样。
There you go.
对。
Right.
对。
Right.
对。
Right.
你听说过Better HVAC吗？
So have you heard of Better HVAC?
知道。
Yes.
知道。
Yes.
知道。
Yes.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得我加入了他们的Facebook群组。
I think I'm on the Facebook group.
是的。
Yeah.
他什么Facebook群组都加入。
He's on every Facebook group.
真够狠的
Mean,
里面不是有个加拿大人吗？
he's Isn't there a Canadian guy in there?
有这人。
There is.
对。
Yes.
克里斯在Facebook群组里挺有名的。
Chris is kind of famous for Facebook groups.
他这样，确实有点过分了。
He's, that's pretty bad.
是啊。
Yeah.
所以这个Better HVAC到底是做什么的，比尔？
So what is Better HVAC, Bill?
Better HVAC 其实是个承包商目录，加入的承包商要承诺持续学习、公开分享、诚信做事。
Better HVAC, basically it's a directory for contractors who will take a pledge to learn continuously, share openly, and do ethically.
这个诚信标准还包括做测量、记录数据，并把这些信息分享给客户。
And that ethical does include making measurements and recording measurements and sharing them with your customer.
所以，只要你签了这个承诺，客户就能在目录里找到你，还能看到你的资质证明。
So it's a directory where after you take that pledge, consumers, customers can find you and you can display your credentials.
目前我们正在开发这个平台，它是由凯文·哈特和凯文·R共同发起的。
And right now we're working on it was co founded by Kevin Hart, Kevin R
哈特，就是那个加拿大人，不是那个喜剧演员。
Hart The Canadian, not the comedian.
对，就是这样。
There you go.
谢谢你补充这一点。
Thank you for adding that.
现在你可以访问 betterhvac.org，了解一下这个平台的具体内容。
And you can go to right now betterhvac.org and see what it's all about.
但说到底，我们希望消费者能找到那些整理好个人简历、清楚表达自己理念和工作方式的承包商和专业人士。
But basically, we're hoping to have consumers find contractors, professionals, individuals that have put together their resume, what they feel is important, how they do their work, and be found.
目前我们已经听说有十几个人加入了。
And we're already starting to hear around a dozen or so people.
我确实推荐过一些人去找达斯汀·科尔。
I've actually sent people to Dustin Cole.
太好了。
Perfect.
他离我们这儿有两小时车程。
He's a couple hours away from us.
但当我们遇到真正有问题的房子时，这种情况越来越少了。
But when we have people that have a real problem house, it's less and less of what we do.
我们用这些工具来解决自己遇到的问题。
We use the tools to fix problems that we have.
但当你从整栋房子的角度来看时，有些人不得不把客户转介绍给达斯汀，因为他为人正直、有原则，而且非常聪明。
But when you talk in a house as a whole, some of those people have to gladly turn over to Dustin because he's ethical, moral, and a smart guy.
是的。
Yep.
我是在那个Better HVAC平台上找到他的。
And the I found him on
Better HVAC那个平台。
the Better HVAC thing.
我特意确保他上了那个平台，这样我就能把链接发给需要的人。
I just made sure he was on there so I could send somebody the link.
对。
Yeah.
就这么简单。
And that's it.
其实，早在2018年，我妹妹想在堪萨斯州威奇托找人干活。
Like it, I actually, back in 2018, my sister was trying to find someone to do work in Wichita, Kansas.
她跟我说：‘比尔，你认识不少做暖通空调的，你在这展会上转了这么多年，确实认识不少人。’
And she said, hey, Bill, you know a lot of people in HVAC and with all those years walking around this show floor, I actually do.
但我一时想不起哪个我信得过的人，可以介绍给亲戚
But I couldn't think of someone up the top of mind that I trust sending a relative
对
And
这正是关键所在
that's what this is all about.
靠你的资质来建立信任
It's about building that trust through your credentials.
现在你可以把来自‘Rewiring America’和BPI，也就是能效认证机构的徽章添加到个人资料里
You can actually add badges now from Rewiring America to your profile and BPI, Billing Performance Institute.
我们还在继续增加其他徽章
And we're working on adding other badges to that too.
太棒了
Awesome.
这样能展示你的专业资质，让消费者知道该找谁合作
That allow you to show off what your credentials are and give consumers an idea of who they can work with.
他们会吗
Will they
免费注册，免费使用。
free directory, free to join and free to use.
你能不能让他们在个人主页上附上一些案例研究之类的？
Will you have the ability for them to have any case studies linked or anything like that under their As
你的个人资料里能加多少就加多少，案例研究这个想法不错。
much as you can under your profile, case studies is a good idea.
我还没
I hadn't
想到这一点。
thought of that.
不过，我们有个板块，用户可以留下评价或投诉，但我们明白，承包商不希望收到随意的投诉。
But there is a section where someone who uses them can either give a testimonial or a complaint, but we sort of understand contractors like complaints just can't come randomly.
投诉必须有凭据。
They have to come with evidence.
是的。
Yes.
他们必须证明确实存在这个问题，或者当时的情况出了状况。
So they have to show that there actually was a problem with it, with the situation.
现在目录里大约有三百人，我们目标是到年底扩展到一千人。
But around 300 people in directory now, we're looking to build that to a thousand by the end of the year.
我这边的人不多。
There's not a lot by me.
我觉得达斯汀在上面。
I think Dustin's there.
克里斯·休斯虽然现在可能在北边一千四百英里外，但名字还在目录里。
Chris Hughes is still listed there even though he's, I think 1,400 miles north now.
对。
Right.
所以克里斯·休斯，如果你在听，该去更新一下你的资料了。
So Chris Hughes, if you're listening, you need to go update your profile.
是的。
Yeah.
随着公司不断成长，我们会看看整体往哪个方向发展。
That's, we're gonna see what direction we go as a company as a whole, as we keep growing.
希望我能更专注于住宅业务这块。
Hopefully I can focus some more strictly on the residential side.
现在我这边有八个。
Right now I've got eight.
应该是七个或八个。
I think it's eight, seven or eight.
你那边是七个。
You have seven.
七个。
Seven.
对。
Yeah.
技术人员。
Techs.
在路易斯安那州的夏天，你根本没有多少空闲时间。
And summertime in Louisiana, you don't have a lot of free time.
所以如果能在淡季和冬天多接些项目，那就更好了。
So it would be nice to be able to fill in the shoulder seasons and winter with more projects and whatnot.
你在做商业项目和住宅项目时，遇到的主要区别是什么？
What sort of different challenges do you find between doing commercial and residential?
你大约70%是商业项目，30%是住宅项目，这两个领域在实际操作中有哪些不同的挑战或特点？
So you're about 70% commercial, thirty What percent are some of the different challenges or differentiators you find between those two areas of the market?
比如商业项目，我们面对的不是分体式空调，而是大型设施的整套系统。
So let's say with commercial, we're talking not a split system on a strip model, like a larger facility.
商业客户只关心设备能不能正常运行。
Commercial, the customer wants it working.
住宅客户则更在意：这到底哪里出问题了。
Residential, this is what's wrong.
好吧，我再去拿三个报价。
Okay, well, I'm gonna get three more quotes.
我们不是最便宜的，也不是最贵的，但我觉得我们的价格很合理。
Now we're not the cheapest, we're not the most expensive, but we're feel that we're fair in our pricing.
但做商业项目时，我更在意的是客户的需求。
But with commercial, I'm also the people that are listening.
我个子大，不想钻到阁楼里去。
I'm a large man and I don't need to be in an attic.
所以。
So
说不定你根本就进不去阁楼。
Maybe you don't even fit in an attic.
有时候是进不去。
There's times he doesn't.
我确实进不去。
I don't.
商业项目的话，我们会用到设备间。
Commercial, we get mechanical rooms.
我得把东西吊到屋顶上，然后去采购。
Well, I need to put something on a roof and go buy it.
我们会租一台吊车。
We'll go hire a crane.
虽然活儿更大，但我觉得反而更轻松，因为能用的设备更先进，进出也更方便。
It's bigger work, but I find it easier because of the scope of the equipment that we get to use and the access that we have.
走进那种混凝土地板、有空调的设备间，那种感觉真没得说。
There's nothing like walking into a concrete floored conditioned air handler room.
你一进去就心里一紧：哎呀，这下麻烦了。
You're like, oh, no.
今天我得在里面干活，天气还挺暖和。
I have to work it inside today in this Mhmm.
温度六十八度，刚刚好。
Like 68 and nice.
也许需要除湿。
Maybe dehumidified.
在路易斯安那州，这很重要。
It's an important thing in Louisiana.
除湿是个难题。
Dehumidification is a challenge.
如果你跟住户说，他们五吨的设备其实三吨就够了，他们肯定觉得根本行不通。
When you tell somebody residentially that their five ton unit should be a three, oh, it'll never work.
根本降温不了。
It'll never cool.
明白了。
Okay.
那就会出现霉菌和湿腐的问题。
Well, you've got mold and mildew problems.
再看看空调机组内部，简直就是个霉菌和生物滋生的温床。
And then you look at the inside of your air handler and it's a mold farm, biological growth farm, whatever.
我们从来没觉得舒服过。
We've never been comfortable.
原因就在这儿。
Here's why.
我们经常接到电话。
We get calls.
要舒服的话，得配个165的设备。
We got a 165 to be comfortable.
对。
Yeah.
每隔几周就有人打电话来，说空调有问题，来看看。
We get calls every other week, come look at our AC.
他们觉得得换大一点的。
We think we need to upsize it.
现在用的是三吨的。
We've got a three ton.
我们想换到五吨的。
We wanna go to a five.
但我们不会这么做。
And we won't do it.
不行。
No.
当您和客户谈这个的时候，您会怎么跟他们说？
What do you have to tell a person when you have that conversation?
或者您会怎么
Or how do you
面对那些坚持要换更大设备的客户，您会怎么跟他们解释，让他们明白其中的道理？
approach that conversation with a person when they're just insistent they wanna go bigger to try to educate them?
这真的很难，因为要讲清楚静压、气流、焓值变化这些专业内容，让客户真正理解我们系统设计的初衷，并不是一件简单的事。
It is difficult at best because there isn't a very simple work through of static pressure and airflow and change in enthalpy and all the things that you need to really understand what we're trying to do with the system as a
整个系统。
whole.
所有这些物理知识。
All those physics things.
我上学时根本没认真学过的那些物理内容。
All the physics things that I did not pay attention to in school.
是的。
Yeah.
但这确实是个挑战。
But it's just a challenge.
然后我们再回到商业应用这边。
And then again, we'll go back to the commercial side.
设备会稍微大一点。
You get a little bit bigger equipment.
有再热、预热，还有可以精确调控的变风量系统，这些要是能用在住宅里就好了。
You have reheat, you have preheat, you have variable airflow that you have real control over that I would love to have a residentially.
当然，物理原理没变，但设备的使用方式、实现方法，还有控制系统这些，都完全不同。
So the physics aren't changing of course, the equipment How you're changes doing a it, how you get to do it, the control systems, things like that are very different there.
我们刚开始聊的时候就提到过你们公司的发展，也简单谈了谈业务流程和规范。
Talked before we started here about your company's growing and we talked a little about business procedures and processes.
这些流程是你们一直就有的，还是后来才慢慢采纳的？你觉得有哪些好处或者弊端？
So was that something you always did in a business or is it something you'd latched onto and what are the benefits or downsides you've seen?
我们遇到的问题其实都一样，这是我第三段职业生涯了。
The problem we have had is the same, this is my third career.
我以前在IT行业干了十四年。
I was an IT professional for fourteen years.
做过工业自动化和控制系统，后来才转行做暖通空调。
I did industrial scale and control work and then I got into HVAC.
我待过不同的公司，接触过各种各样的人。
So I've been through different offices, different people.
如果从客户来电到服务完成没有一套清晰的流程，那肯定会乱成一锅粥。
If you don't have a workflow from the call come in till the call is completed, it's gonna be chaos.
幸运的是，我们办公室有一位女士专门负责接听来电、安排预约和调度人员。
And fortunately, we have a lady at the office that handles incoming calls and booking and moving guys around.
我们用的软件还不错，能安排日程、处理工单这些事。
We have a decent piece of software that lets us schedule and do our ticketing and all that.
所有事情都让那位女士统一处理，而不是由我来管。
And getting everything to go through that one lady instead of me.
哎，我得接个电话。
Oh, I gotta call.
我这就把这个人安排上去。
I'm just gonna put this person on there.
结果对面的特拉维斯也说，我把这个人派给那个人，可我们俩根本没沟通。
And then Travis across the way goes, oh, I'm gonna put this guy on this guy, and neither of us communicated.
结果就答应了同一个或两个客户，让同一位技工在同一时间上门，这就出问题了。
Now we've promised one customer or two customers the same technician at the same time, and that becomes an issue.
所以得有明确的流程，让每件事都有章可循。
So having those funnels, those paths for everything
这些流程都是事先定好的。
Those are predefined.
没错。
Right.
对。
Yeah.
让每个人清楚自己在流程中的位置。
And then letting people know their place in the world.
没错。
Right.
所以你们在人力资源部门想找的是一台克隆机？
So what you're looking for at HR then is a cloning machine?
如果我正急着把自己从一线岗位上撤下来，不是离开这个行业，而是脱离现场操作。
If I am rapidly trying to get myself further away from the field, like in the field, not out of the career.
但我尽可能多地培训，把经验传给团队里的其他人，至少能部分复制我的能力。
But I am training as much as I can and trying to pass on knowledge and educate as much as I can with my guys to try to replicate partially some of myself at least.
这个话题挺有意思，昨晚在战术奖颁奖晚会上，也经常提到教育这方面的问题。
That's an interesting topic, and it was actually one that came up quite a bit is the education part at the Tactical Awards last night.
我觉得这真的特别重要。
And I think it's really important.
那你怎么
How do
找到时间，或者腾出时间来把经验传给下一代呢？
you find that time or build that time in to pass that knowledge along to the next generation?
我那个小马蒂肯定受不了，但我根本不在乎花了多少时间。
So my little Marty will hate it, but I just don't care about the hours.
我属于固定成本。
I'm a fixed cost.
我每年的开销是固定的数字。
I cost x number of dollars per year.
除非是安排好的，或者客户特别大，我一般不加班。
I don't really work any overtime unless it's scheduled or even if it's big enough customer, I guess.
所以我会安排我的人去干他们不熟悉或没做过的工作，我自己也一起上。
So I will schedule my guys to go do a job they're not comfortable with or haven't done, and I put myself on it as well.
然后我们就会为这项工作计费。
And then we bill out the time on the job.
我不收。
I don't.
但这是一项长期的投资。
But it's a long play on the project.
如果我得亲自跑每一个活儿，那我们就要亏钱了。
It's if I have to go out on everyone, then we're losing money.
但只要我能让他们熟练上手，以后就不必再亲自出马，我就能把精力放在别处。
But if I can get them comfortable on doing a job, and then I don't have to go on that anymore, I can have focus elsewhere.
迟早你会从每第二个活儿都去，变成每第三个、每第十个，直到最后……
Sooner or later, you're going on every other one and then every third one and then Correct.
越来越少亲自出马，把机会慢慢交给他们，帮他们成长，建立信心。
Every tenth one and so on and so forth down the line, passing that along, building them up, building their confidence.
这跟老一辈那种‘我教了他，他就会抢我饭碗’的想法完全不一样。
And it's not the old school mentality of, if I teach this guy how to do it, they'll take my job.
我希望他们能。
I want them to.
如果他们不接手你的工作，你就没法脱身去做别的事了，对吧。
Well, if they don't take your job working, you're not gonna be able to go anywhere else or do anything else Correct.
帮助公司发展。
Help the company grow.
没错。
Right.
我和大卫一直都是这样做的。
And I've been, and David's been the same way.
以前只有我们俩能处理X项目，这意味着你永远都离不开工作。
We've been the only guy that could work on X, which means you're never really off of work.
所以这关系到工作与生活的平衡，也要培训其他人，比如布鲁斯、乔纳森，或者任何其他人——当Aon那边有需求时，
So it's about work life balance also and training others to Bruce or Jonathan or whoever else, we get a call for an Aon.
现在我们有不止一个人能处理Aon的活了，这太棒了。
We have more than one person that can look at an Aon now, and it's awesome.
举个例子，你觉得现在的情况怎么样，
Just an example, but How are you finding, and
我们经常听到，新一代的年轻人进入这个行业挺不容易的。
we hear a lot about this, that new generations are having challenges coming into the trade.
你在当地有感受到这种现象吗？
How are you finding that in your area?
你有没有遇到真正愿意学手艺的人？
And how are you finding people that are really interested in learning?
这个还是让大卫来回答吧，他最近招了两三个刚入行的建筑工人。
I'm gonna defer to David on this because he's picked up two or three guys on construction that are in there.
我希望他们是一点经验都没有的新人。
I want them green off the street.
我不想要那些已经有
I don't want them with
为什么这么说？
why is that?
我想亲自教他们正确的做法。
I wanna I can train them the right way.
我们有一套标准流程，做事都按规矩来。
We have processes of how we do things and we do things by the book.
技校确实不错。
Trade school's great.
我不是在贬低技校。
It's I'm not bashing trade school.
它能让人拿到盖着自己名字的证书，机会很好。
It's a great opportunity for people to go get a certificate with their name on it.
他们还能在那儿考取环保认证。
They can get their EPA while they're there.
但我更喜欢边做边学。
But I'm more of a hands on learner.
我没上过技校。
I didn't go to trade school.
我是靠犯错学的，烧坏东西之后才明白：这事儿不能再干了。
I learned by burning things and going, oh, don't do that again.
我现在特别擅长向客户道歉。
I've gotten really good at apologizing to customers.
你看，我把你的鼓风机给烧坏了。
Look, I burnt your your blower motor up.
我接线接错了。
I wired it wrong.
真的很抱歉。
I apologize.
我给你换一个新的。
I'm gonna get you another one.
对不起。
I'm sorry.
你是怎么弄明白的
You figured out how
把那股神秘的烟给弄回去
to put that magic smoke Yeah, back
我是试过的。
I mean, I've tried.
就是不行，怎么都不行。
It's just, it will not, it won't.
所以呢，从街上招些新人，然后慢慢带他们起来。
So, but yeah, getting them green off the street and training them up.
你们从街上招来新人的时候，有没有特别看重他们哪方面的性格或态度？
So when you get them green off the street, is there like a personal characteristic, like in their attitude, their approach to things?
你们会看中什么样的人，觉得值得雇用？
What do you see there that makes you say like, that's one I'd like to employ?
就是有股想把自己变好的劲头。
A drive to just better themselves.
就这么简单。
That's it.
如果你真有心想要提升自己，你自然会愿意花力气去做——认真学习、投入时间、听播客、翻手册，我就是那种会偷手册的人。
I mean, if you have a drive to better yourself in life, you're gonna give effort into doing just that, learning, putting in the time, listening to podcasts, reading the manuals of things like I'm a manual thief.
每本手册我都会拿走。
I steal every manual.
只要工地上有多个设备，肯定有一本手册是我随身带着的。
If we have multiple units on a job site, one of those manuals has come with me.
就是利用空闲时间多看看手册，这股想变好的劲头最重要。
It's just reading the manuals in your downtime, the drive to better yourself.
要是能让他们都养成这个习惯，我们团队肯定差不了。
And if I can get those guys to do that, then we're going to be in great shape.
我现在带的一帮人，全是零经验进来的，但我们现在接VRV项目接得风生水起，不但赚钱，活儿也干得漂亮，自己都看得上眼。
I've got a crew of guys right now, guys that no experience came in and we're knocking out VRV projects left and right and doing it profitable, doing great work, work that we're actually proud of.
现在市面上装VRV设备的太多了。
There's a lot of VRF, VRV equipment that gets installed.
等装完一看，天哪，简直惨不忍睹。
You go look at it after the fact and you're just, oh God, that's atrocious.
我一直在这些家伙心里种下一种观念：哪怕我们没拿到维护合同，或者其他什么生意，我也希望下一家公司掀开天花板的板子，往上看一眼，然后说：我想去这家公司上班，因为他们做事靠谱。
I instilled in these guys when even if we don't get the contract for the maintenance or whatever else, I want the next company to be open up the the ceiling tile, look up there and go, I want to go work for that company because they do things right.
所有东西都得垂直，都得水平，都得按标准来
Everything's plumb, everything's level, everything's the way
本来就应该这样。
it should be.
这其实也关系到我们招聘的流程。
So that goes towards a process for hiring then.
没错。
Yeah.
说白了，不管这流程是记在心里还是写在纸上，我们在招聘时都有套固定的做法。
And more or less, I mean, whether it's in your mind, whether it's written down, we use a process for hiring at tools.
我们看重的是人的特质，会找人去深入问他们过去经历过哪些事。
We look for characteristics and we have people and we ask a lot of questions about their experiences.
他们是怎么应对各种突发情况的。
They handle different situations.
等他们真正动手干活的时候，表现出来的就是这样的水准。
That's what is going to end up being when they're let loose to do the work.
在服务方面，我们一直以认真做事、规范流程著称。
I would say service side, we have a reputation for trying to do good work and doing right processes.
我最近招的新人，我觉得史蒂文是最新的一个。
And my most recent pickup, I think Steven is the newest.
史蒂文是我最近招的新人。
Steven's my newest pickup.
没错。
Yes.
对。
Yeah.
他之前在一家建材供应商那儿，跟前台的人聊天时说，自己有点想换个工作。
And he was at a supply house and he was talking to one of the desk guys and he's like, man, I'm kinda wanting to move along.
那人就对他说：那你得给我们打个电话。
And that guy said, well, you need to call us.
然后那个柜台的人打电话过来说，你们得雇了这个人。
And then he called, that counter guy said, you need to hire this guy.
他给我或者给特拉维斯打了电话，说你们一定要雇了这个人。
He called me or called Travis and said, you need to hire this guy.
因为他做事的口碑也很好。
Because he had a good reputation for doing work as well.
没错。
Yep.
他融入得特别好，喜欢组装赛车，很有机械思维。
And he's meshed really well, builds race cars, got real mechanical mindset.
我发现，一个人的爱好往往决定了他能干得多出色。
I find that your hobbies will dictate a lot of how good you are gonna be.
这是个好问题。
That's a great question.
确实如此。
Yeah.
你平时空闲的时候都做些什么？
Like what do you do on your downtime?
我玩《使命召唤》。
I play Call of Duty.
明白了。
Okay.
没关系，这没问题。
No, that's fine.
我不是在贬低《使命召唤》。
I'm not knocking Call of Duty.
我自己也差不多就那样。
I'm only a little bit myself.
这中间是有套路的。
There's a process to that.
那你平时有什么业余爱好吗？
But do you have extracurricular activities?
再说，木工和手工制作这类活儿。
Again, carpentry, craftsmanship stuff.
这说明你很有机会把事情做得很好。
And that kinda lets you know that there's a good chance to
至于我，是做松木赛车。
Or in my case, building pinewood Derby cars.
我有一辆得动手做。
I have one I have to build
我特别想在这上面做到最好。
really wanted to excel at that.
我得在下周末之前把那辆车做完？
I have one I have to get built for next weekend?
我觉得是下周末。
I think it's next weekend.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得是下个周末。
I think it's next weekend.
你得把它建好。
You have to get built.
等一下。
Wait a minute.
等等。
Wait.
这有点像
That's kinda like
我们赞助了童子军，给他们买了一条滑车赛道。
We sponsored the Boy Scouts and bought them bought them a pinewood Derby track.
真漂亮。
Beautiful.
你得建一条赛道。
You gotta build a track.
不是，不是。
No, no.
去年我们就搞过这个了。
We've been at that last year.
好吧。
Okay.
他们已经有了。
They already have it.
已经建好了。
It's built.
去年我们比过，但每年我都被拉去带一辆车，跟孩子们和一些本地人比赛。
We raced last year, but every year I get roped into showing up with a car and racing it against the kids and some local.
我从物理学和我的机械工程背景中学到两点：关于这种车，你得打磨车轴，还要处理三个地方。
So two things I learned about physics and my background's in mechanical engineering, but even had to like learn that about the cars that you need to polish the axles and take the three things.
把车轮的边缘磨平。
Take the edge off the wheels.
你得让其中一个轮子悬空。
You gotta can't one of them.
然后把其中一个轮子抬起来。
And then lift one of them off.
这样只用三个轮子着地，减少摩擦。
It's only on three wheels to eliminate the friction.
对。
Yes.
比尔把钉子车赛的全部秘诀都抖出来了。
Bill just Bill just gave away all the secrets of Pinewood Derby.
别被他骗了。
And don't let him fool you.
他其实都是上亚马逊查好，直接买现成的。
He looks it all up on Amazon and buys them pre done.
你得把大部分重量放在后轴稍后一点的位置，但别太多。
And you want most of your weight just behind the rear axle, but only slightly.
对。
Yep.
我都懂这些。
I learned all that.
我不清楚是怎么学会的，那时候还没互联网呢。
I don't know how because the internet wasn't around that Right.
是我儿子那时候参加这个比赛的时候。
When my son was doing that.
我一直觉得，我先随便聊聊关于松木赛车的事。
I have always thought so I'm just gonna riff on Pinewood Derby here for a minute.
我一直觉得松木赛车应该分两个组别。
I've always thought there should be two classes in Pinewood Derby.
一组是童子军自己做的车，另一组是大人们做的，让他们在另一边比，让大人也玩自己的比赛。
There should be scout built cars, and then there should be all the adults and let them go race over here and let the adults have their own race.
下周末，我觉得就是下周末，他们童子军团在一座天主教堂举办活动。
Well, we we so next weekend, I think it's next weekend, they have their scout troop is at a Catholic church.
所以神父也在做一辆车。
So the priest is building a car.
当地警察局长也在做一辆车。
The local police chief's building the car.
当地消防队长也在做一辆车。
The local fire chief's building the car.
我们也在做一辆，好像还有别人也在做。
We're doing one, and I think there's somebody else.
所以最后就变成我们这些大人在比了，哦，这可不是……
So it'll be just kinda us the big boys Oh, that's not
我喜欢这个想法。
I like that.
因为我当童子军的时候就记得，我爸爸陪着我。
Because I can remember being in scouts, and I can remember I had my dad.
你得亲手把这辆车做出来。
You gotta build this car.
车开过来的时候，漆面是珍珠白的。
Car shows up, and it's got a pearl paint job on it.
这都是专业人士做的。
Professionals.
放在纸箱里，看起来 Scout 根本没碰过。
In a shoebox, and it looks like the scout has never touched it before.
我当时就想，这比赛我肯定赢不了。
And I'm like, I'm I'm not winning this race.
刚才谁在那儿捣乱来着？
So who was heckling us a little while ago?
有个人就在你视线里，从那边经过。
Someone like it's in your line of sight going this way.
他们是谁都放得进来的。
I mean, they let anybody in.
真的吗？
Do they?
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