气候一号：学生与教师如何探讨气候变化

我是学校棕榈队的成员。我们有个夏令营活动。休息时大家聊起ChatGPT，他们完全不知道它消耗了多少能源、对环境有多不友好。我告诉他们这些后，他们只是敷衍地回应‘好吧’。

I am on our school's Palm team. We have, like, a summer camp. And we were on a break, and we were talking about ChatGPT. And they had no clue how much energy it used up and how bad it was for the environment. And I was telling them that and they're like, okay.

但我还是不理解，手里这个东西怎么会危害环境呢？我当时就说，

But, like, I still don't get it. Like, how is this thing in my hand bad for the environment? And I was like,

哦，各位。

oh, guys.

我滔滔不绝地解释，后来回到教室，他们又向老师和教练转述，我也得再解释一遍。结果这事闹大了，他们都惊叹‘哇，你懂得真多’。不过知道他们现在明白了，我心里确实好受些。

And I went on and on and then we went back to class and then they were telling our teachers and our coaches about it, and then I had to tell them too. And it was this big thing. They're like, wow. You're so wise. But it did make me feel better because now they know.

这是来自俄克拉荷马州皮德蒙特的高中生艾莉森·丹尼。说真的，听到年轻人讨论这些话题令人惊叹。他们懂得很多，而我们时常忘记这点——总以为高中生只关心社交生活。其实他们早已是参与诸多事务的公民了。

That was Allison Denny, a high school student from Piedmont, Oklahoma. Really, it's remarkable to hear young people talking about these things. They know so much, and I think we forget that sometimes. We think that, you know, high schoolers are so focused on their own social lives. They're already citizens engaged in a lot of things.

对吧？

You know?

我和艾莉聊过，非常愉快。阿丽亚娜你说得对，听她谈论对ChatGPT的看法，以及日常生活如何影响更广泛的气候背景，确实既有趣又振奋。能做这样的采访我很幸运。顺便为艾莉打个call——我得替她骄傲一下。

I got to talk to Allie, and I had such an enjoyable time. And you're right, Ariana. Like, hearing her talk about her thoughts on chat GPT and the role that our daily lives play in the the wider climate context was really interesting and invigorating. And, I feel really lucky to do it. So shout out to Allie who well, I'll flex for her for a second.

她属于绿色团队，负责公园清洁和其他各类项目。此外，她还是鼓乐队队长，并参与了棕榈树团队。她非常忙碌。真的很感谢她抽空与我们交谈。我们今天要讨论的话题正是返校及其在气候背景下的意义。

She's on the green team, which does park cleanups and other kinds of projects. Plus, she is the drum major, and she is on the palm team. She's very busy. Really appreciate her taking the time to chat with us. And and that's what we're talking about today is going back to school and what that means in the climate context.

我是库沙·纳瓦达尔。

I'm Kusha Navadar.

我是阿里安娜·布罗修斯，这里是《气候一号》。劳动节已过，夏日将尽。全国各地的孩子们正陆续返校。

I'm Ariana Brosius, and this is Climate One. Labor Day is over. Summer is ending. And all over the country, kids are headed back to school.

没错。削尖的铅笔、打包的午餐、路上行驶的校车，还有教室里7:15、7:25、接着7:30响起的铃声。我曾是高中数学老师，一想到返校，那些鲜活的记忆就涌上心头。

That's right. Sharpened pencils, packed lunches, school buses on the road, the bell that goes off in the classroom at, what, 07:15, then 07:25, then 07:30. I used to be a high school math teacher, so there are very visceral things that come back to my mind when I think of back to school.

我正想说，你听起来对铃声特别烦躁。

I was gonna say, you sound really agitated by the by the bell.

我确实不喜欢铃声。不过也有很多我喜欢的事。结识新学生、遇见新家长、讨论三角形。我特别钟爱30-60-90度的三角形。

I did not like the bell. Yeah. But there are many other things that I liked. Getting meeting new students, meeting new parents, getting to talk about triangles. I love thirty, sixty, 90 triangles.

那里充满机遇，同时也面临诸多挑战。

There's a lot that is there. A lot of challenges too.

没错。除了新学年常见的挑战外，全国各地的教师还在努力探讨如何在课堂上讲解气候紊乱问题。在某些情况下，他们甚至需要考虑是否应该讨论这个话题。

Right. And in addition to the usual challenges of a new school year, teachers across the country are trying to figure out how to talk about climate disruption in their classes. And in some cases, if they even should talk about it.

是的。特别是在当前的政治气候下——请原谅这个双关语。要知道，人为导致的全球变暖在学校里是个敏感话题。

Yeah. Especially in this political climate, if you'll excuse the pun. You know, human caused global warming can be tricky to talk about in schools.

但这个问题必须讨论，因为它正对年轻人造成切实伤害。《柳叶刀》的一项调查显示，60%的年轻人表示自己对气候变化感到非常或极度担忧。

But it's really important to talk about because it's taking a real toll on young people. According to a survey in The Lancet, 60% of young people described themselves as very or extremely worried about climate change.

显然，学生、家长和教师都需要应对相当多的问题。

Clearly, there is quite a bit here for students, parents, and teachers all to deal with.

因此今天，我们将探讨教师如何在课堂引入气候议题，成年人如何帮助孩子处理与气候危机相关的情绪，以及教师如何将气候纳入教学计划。

So today, we're gonna talk about what it's like for teachers to bring climate into the classroom, how adults can help kids deal with the emotions related to the climate crisis, and how teachers can make climate a part of their lesson plans.

玛格丽特·王·阿戈尼亚是'Subject to Climate'的执行董事兼联合创始人。该组织为希望在课堂教授气候议题的教师提供资源和教案。她向同事奥斯汀·科隆讲述了自己担任经济学教师时的一个瞬间。

Margaret Wang Agonya is executive director and cofounder of Subject to Climate. It's an organization that creates resources and lesson plans for teachers who wanna teach climate in their classrooms. She talked to her colleague, Austin Colon, about this moment she had when she was an economics teacher.

每年，外部性和市场失灵单元都是最难教授的内容。这个抽象概念总是让学生困惑不已。他们会说：好吧，我完全听不懂。

Every year, the externalities and market failure unit was the hardest to teach. It's one of those abstract concepts that students just didn't understand. They're like, okay. I don't get it.

嗯。

Mhmm.

你只是在移动图表。直到我遇到一个特定的学生，她实际上是在重修社会研究课程，她需要通过这门课。她并不认为自己是个经济学家。这没有意义。但她真正关心的是她看到的许多不公正现象。

You're just moving a graph around. And it wasn't until I had a particular student who actually was repeating a social studies course, and she needed to pass this class. And she didn't see herself as an economist. This didn't make sense. But what she did care about was a lot of the injustices she was seeing.

具体来说，她也非常关注动物福利和权利。所以我们讨论了肉类的成本，我们制作了整个视频，探讨肉类的真实成本是什么？因为你为从麦当劳买的那个汉堡支付的钱很少。它真的只值那么多吗？我们开始深入探讨这个问题，然后我突然明白，外部性无处不在，而可持续性并不是一个独立的问题。

And specifically, she was also very concerned about animal welfare and rights. So we talked about the cost of meat, and our we did this whole video about what is the true cost of meat? Because you're paying very little for that burger that you are buying from McDonald's. Does it truly cost that much? And we started getting into that, and then this it became a light bulb moment when I understood externalities is everywhere, and sustainability isn't a separate issue.

正是这些让这些概念变得生动起来。我很高兴地说，顺便提一下，她最终开始思考如何在了解市场失灵后改变人们的行为，并在学校开展这些活动，她也通过了这门课。所以这对我来说是一个关键时刻，就像，看，这是我可以从个人生活中带入的东西，不是因为它是额外的负担，而是因为它能帮助学生更具体地理解一个概念。

It's a lot of what makes these concepts come to life. And I am happy to say that, by the way, she ended up thinking about how do we change people's behavior after knowing about market failure and started doing these campaigns at school, and she did pass the class too. So that was like an moment for me where, like, well, here's something from my personal life that I can bring in, not because it's an extra burden, but because it helps my students understand a concept more concretely.

这是个了不起的故事。我是说，当人们能以那种个人方式与一个概念联系起来时，确实能让人深刻理解，不仅是你在教授的课程，还有现实世界的应用。我来自一个教育世家，我母亲特别是一位音乐教育家，所以当我在浏览气候主题的网站时，我非常兴奋地看到有融入气候主题的音乐课程。在艺术课程中融入气候主题可能会很棘手。那么这样的课程是如何开发的呢？

That's an amazing story. I mean, yeah, when people can connect to a concept in that personal way, that really does drive home, you know, not only the lesson you're teaching, but the real world applications. And I come from a family of educators and my mother's a music educator specifically and so when I was looking on subject to climate's website, I was really excited to see that there were music lessons incorporate climate themes. And that can be tricky with the arts to to have climate in those lessons. So how do lessons like that get developed?

是的。作为一名有教育背景的人，我持有的一个观点是，教师最清楚什么在课堂上有效。教师是专家。而很多时候，当我们试图找出教育解决方案时，出于某种原因，我们不去问教师。我们不去看教师们在做什么。

Yeah. So having an educator background, one of the points of views I come in with is that teachers know what work in the classroom the best. Teachers are experts. And oftentimes, when we're trying to figure out education solutions for some reason, we don't ask teachers. We don't see what teachers are doing.

我们带着一种资源匮乏的心态，认为我们需要更多的资源来做这做那。让我们引进专家和顾问，而我认为，我们已经有这些优秀的教师了。问题只是他们没有足够的时间。嗯。所以我们做的是开始寻找那些已经是专家的教师，因为他们是数学、英语、社会研究、音乐等课堂上的教师，就像你看到的那个音乐课程。

We come with a an asset deficit mindset where, like, we need more resources to do x, y, and z. Let's bring in experts and consultants when I see it as a like, we have these wonderful teachers. So the issue was that they just don't have enough time. Mhmm. So what we did was we started looking at teachers who are already experts because they're classroom teachers in math, in English, in social studies, in music, like the music lesson that you saw.

我们首先进行了关于气候基础知识的简单培训，并要求他们思考如何将这些内容与他们已教授的主题联系起来。然后我们协助他们制定教学计划。很多时候，他们确实没有时间去做，比如让我把它变成教案并制作可供所有人使用的幻灯片。作为一名教师，我只来得及为自己准备教案。是的。

And we did simple training on basics on climate and asked them to think about how does it connect to the topics you already teach. And then we work with them to create a lesson plan. Oftentimes, they just don't have time to do, like, let me make it into a lesson plan and create these slideshows that is usable for everybody else. As a teacher, I only had the time to create lesson plans for myself. Yeah.

于是我们开始培训教师团队，采纳他们的教案，与他们合作，然后完成出版相关的工作。主要是为了放大他们已经在课堂上所做的出色工作。

So then we started training cohorts of teachers, taking their lesson plans, working with them, and then doing the publication aspects of it. So just amplifying the amazing work that they're already doing in their class.

嗯。那些教师们开发的课程，是否有科学家进行审核，以确保他们融入的气候部分内容是准确的？

Mhmm. And do those lessons that the teachers develop, do they get checked by any scientists to make sure that the climate portion that they're incorporating is accurate?

是的。我们确实有一个科学家工作组。这也减轻了教师们的压力，有时候这会让人感到畏缩，比如，好吧，我是一名音乐老师或英语老师，从未学过气候变化。

Yeah. So we do have a scientist task force. That also relieves our teachers of sometimes it's just intimidating, like, okay. I am a music teacher or I'm an English teacher. Never been taught about climate change.

而且，是的，我确实参加了基础培训，但外界有很多错误信息。所以我们让教师们知道有一个审核流程，我们有一个科学家工作组负责审核教师们创建的所有课程。

And, yes, I did this basic training, but there's a lot of misinformation out there. So we're we let the teachers know that there's a review process, and we have a scientist task force reviewing all of the lessons that the teachers create.

你能给我们简要概述一下其中一门课程吗？比如音乐课的一节课。

And could you give us just a brief overview of, like, one of those lessons? Maybe for one of the music lessons.

可以。我们所有的课程都有相似的框架。我们采用所谓的‘三个I’方法。总是从探究（Inquire）开始，这是第一步。

Yeah. All of our lessons have a similar framework. We do what is called three i's. So we always start with the inquiry. Inquire is the first step.

因此，学生们正在观察、疑惑、思考并培养好奇心。第二个‘I’代表调查（investigation）。在这个阶段，你学习学科概念和工具——在这里指的是音乐。然后运用这些工具来解答你的探究问题。

So where students are noticing, wondering, and thinking, and developing curiosity. And then the second I is investigation. This is where you're learning your disciplinary concept and tools. In this case, it's music. And then you're using that tool to start to answer your inquiry.

第三步是激励（inspire）。这非常关键，因为你不能仅仅教学生一个问题然后说‘好了，祝解题愉快’。我们不想让学生陷入气候焦虑中。嗯。

And the third step is inspire. This is really important because you just you don't wanna just teach students a problem and then go like, okay. Well, have fun solving it. We don't wanna leave students with climate anxiety. Mhmm.

因此，‘激励’环节就是：现在你打算怎么做？或者，既然我们不想把负担全压在他们身上，那么其他人在采取什么行动？接下来我可以带你们过一遍教案。你刚才特别提到了音乐课。

Therefore, the inspire section is like, okay. Now what are you gonna do about it? Or because we don't want the burden to be just on them, what are other people doing about it? So then I can walk you through the lesson plans. You specifically were talking about the music lesson.

这个课程是关于连奏（legato）和断奏（staccato）的，对吧？

This one is about legato and staccato. Right?

对，没错。

Right. Yeah.

探究的第一步其实是思考：用音乐表达一个想法与用语言表达同一想法有何不同。这是一场讨论，他们开始思考、探索并记录观察。第二步则是：让我们研究如何实现这种表达。

So the first step in the inquiry is actually thinking about how expressing an idea musically is different from expressing the same idea with words. So it's a discussion. They're starting to think and explore, and they're noticings. And then the second thing is like, oh, let's investigate how that's done.

嗯。

Mhmm.

他们实际上会聆听一位气候作曲家创作的两个乐章，观察连奏和断奏如何表现气候影响。这就是他们在学习什么是连奏、什么是断奏的地方，同时也在探究之前的一些疑问，比如为什么有人会选择用音乐而非语言来表达。

And they actually listen to two movements by a climate composer and look at how legato and staccato represents climate impacts. So this is where they're learning what is legato, what is staccato, and they're investigating some of the earlier questions they had, like, why would one choose to express in music rather than in words.

对于可能不了解的人，连奏是指音符持续较长时间或相对较长，而断奏则是非常短促的音符。

And for somebody who may not know, legato is when a note lingers for a long time or a longish time, and staccato is very short notes.

没错。他们正在学习连奏与断奏的音乐效果——何时使用、为何使用。

Yes. Exactly. And, you know, they're learning the musical effects of why you would leverage legato versus staccato. When would you use it? Why would you use it?

这本来就是音乐学习中会涉及的内容。

And this is something you would learn in music anyways.

真希望我高中时也有这样的课程，听起来很有趣。对于那些质疑在科学课堂外引入气候议题必要性的教师，您会怎么说？

I wish I had something like that when I was in high school because that sounds like a lot of fun. And what would you say to teachers who might be kinda skeptical about the need for introducing climate outside of the science classroom?

我想说，如果这只是个单纯的科学问题，我们早就解决了。我们拥有所有技术、所有数据，清楚该做什么且必须去做，但始终未能落实。如果我们继续当前的做法——几乎避而不谈，或仅将其视为科学概念讨论——问题永远无法解决。

I would say that if it were a science problem and just a science problem, we would have solved this already. Right. We have all the technology, all the, like, the data out there. We know what we need to do, and we have to do it, but we haven't done it. So if we continue to do the same thing that we're doing, which is we'll barely talk about it, but if we only talk about it, we treat it as a science concept, then we're not gonna solve the problem.

这是思维模式的转变，是文化层面的变革，因此需要融入所有学科。我们需要英语来沟通，辨别信息真伪；需要社会科学理解社会运动，经济学来权衡利弊与激励措施。

This is a mindset shift. It's a cultural shift, and that's why it touches all subjects. We need English to communicate. We need English to understand what is misinformation out there and what isn't. We need social studies to understand movements, economics to understand trade offs and incentives.

我们需要像音乐一样的艺术来沟通和建立运动。仅仅在科学中教授它并未奏效。

We need art just like in music to communicate and build movements. It hasn't worked to just teach it in science.

没错。教师们正面临一些实际困难。我注意到的一个问题是，气候数据正从政府网站上被移除。这对教师获取准确教学信息产生了怎样的影响？

Right. There are some real difficulties that teachers are running up against. One I noticed is that, you know, climate data is being removed from government websites. And what kind of impact has that had on teachers trying to get accurate information for their lessons?

是的。我们亲眼目睹许多教师创建的教案——我们讨论过这些教案大量引用了联邦气候数据——这就是一个迹象，因为这些教案反映了他们的课堂教学内容。其中许多链接曾一度失效，我们不得不寻找替代信息和数据。作为非营利组织，这正是我们的职责所在。

Yeah. So I mean, we see it firsthand a lot of the lesson plans that are the teachers have created that we talked about leverage a lot of federal data, climate data, and that's one indication because those are lessons that represent what they're teaching a classroom. And a lot of those links were broken at some point, so we had to actually go and find replacement information and data. I mean, we're a nonprofit, and this is our role. Right?

但遗憾的是，大多数教师面临的最大问题是时间不足。我记得自己当老师时也是如此。如果要教的课程缺少数据集，我很可能会改教其他内容，因为没时间寻找那些数据。

But for a lot of teachers, unfortunately, the biggest issue teachers face is that they just don't have enough time. And I remember that being the case when I was a teacher. So if there was a lesson that I was gonna teach and I don't have that data set anymore, I'll likely just teach something else because I don't have that time to go and find that data.

教师总是时间紧迫。我成长过程中常听母亲这么说，一天根本没有足够的时间。你们为想深入了解气候问题的教师提供哪些专业发展支持？

Teachers are always pressed for time. I remember that when I was growing up, my mother would say the same thing. We just not enough hours in the day. What professional development do you offer teachers who want to be more well versed in climate issues?

在气候主题方面，我们自视为一站式服务平台，为教师在不同教学阶段、所有年级和学科的气候教学需求提供便利。专业发展形式多样：正如我们整合资源，我们也整合专业发展机会。有些教师偏好参加可获得学分的课程。

Yeah. Subject to climate, we see ourselves as the one stop shop just to make it easier for whatever a teacher needs at any point of their journey in teaching about climate, all grade levels and all subjects. That looks differently in professional development. So just like we aggregate resources, we also aggregate professional development. There are some teachers who prefer to enroll in a course that you get credit for.

有些教师时间有限，只想阅读关于如何应对气候变化的文章——我们也提供此类资源。包括异步模块、实时网课、线下现场会议等。我们不仅整合这些机会，还自主开发了从零基础（气候变化基本原理）开始的异步学习模块。

There are some that don't have the time and just wanna read articles on how they may approach climate change. So we have that as well. Asynchronous modules, live classes, live sessions in person. So we have aggregated those opportunities. We also do have developed our own asynchronous modules where there's level zero, which is our, like, the fundamentals of climate change.

第一层级是如何将其融入跨学科和年级的教学中。第二层级则是如何创建自己的教案？我们同样提供了这方面的指导。如果你完成了课程，实际上可以向全美教育协会（NEA）提交作业，获得微证书，以表彰你投入时间和精力学习气候变化与气候教育的努力。

Level one is how do I integrate it into across subjects and grade levels. Level two is how do then I how do I create my own lesson plan? So we have that as well. And if you take it, you can actually submit your homework, as you will say, to the NEA, the National Education Association, and get a micro credential to honor your work of taking the time and effort to learn about climate change and climate education.

这真是太棒了，我希望学生和教师们有机会时能利用这些资源，更深入地了解并关注我们共同面临的气候问题。Margaret Wang Agonya是Subject to Climate的执行总监兼联合创始人。Margaret，非常感谢你作客Climate One节目。

Well, that's really cool, and I hope that students and teachers use those resources when they get a chance and become more well versed and connected with the climate issue that we're all facing. Margaret Wang Agonya is executive director and cofounder of Subject to Climate. Margaret, thank you so much for joining us on Climate One.

是的。非常感谢你，Austin。

Yep. Thank you so much, Austin.

接下来我们将探讨：成年人该如何帮助孩子应对诸如气候焦虑之类的情绪。

Coming up, how the grown ups in kids' lives can help navigate feelings like climate anxiety.

父母需要保持在场、诚实面对，既要认可孩子的感受和现实，又不要给他们造成过重负担。

Parents need to be there and honest and validate feelings and reality, but not overwhelm kids.

广告之后，Climate One将继续为您呈现。

That's up next when Climate One continues.

您是否因广告打断Climate One的收听体验而感到困扰？

Are you frustrated by ads interrupting your Climate One listening experience?

那么我们有个好消息要告诉你。我们的Patreon会员可以无广告收听我们的节目。

Then we have good news for you. Members of our Patreon receive ad free access to our show.

每月只需5美元，你既能支持我们重要的气候议题讨论，又能享受完全无广告的Climate One内容。

For just $5 a month, you support our critical climate conversations while also gaining access to Climate One totally free of ads.

Patreon会员还将自动获得Climate One Discord服务器的访问权限，在那里气候爱好者们可以互相交流，并与我们的团队成员互动。

Patreon members also receive automatic access to the Climate One Discord server, where fellow climate enthusiasts can chat with each other and members of our team.

作为对常听播客听众的特别优惠，我们现在为Patreon支持者提供专属折扣。今日使用代码climate pod加入，首月仅需1美元。

As a special offer for frequent podcast listeners, we're now offering Patreon supporters a special deal. Join today using the code climate pod, and you'll get your first month for just $1.

代码是c l I m a t e p o d，无空格。访问patreon.com/climateone即可加入。如今许多孩子在应付作业考试和人际关系的同时，还要面对气候危机正在改变他们未来的现实。

That's c l I m a t e p o d, no spaces. Find us at patreon.com/climateone. In addition to juggling homework and tests and navigating friendships, many kids nowadays are dealing with the fact that the climate crisis is altering their future.

我是艾莉·丹尼，俄克拉荷马州皮德蒙特高中的高三学生。我父亲从事石油天然气行业，他一直教导我气候变化是正常且必然发生的现象。所以我从未对变化本身感到恐惧。但变化的速度和程度让我感到无力——虽然我在尽自己的一份力，但并非所有人都清楚自己能做些什么。

My name is Allie Denny. I am a high school senior in Piedmont, Oklahoma. My dad is in the oil and gas industry, and he's always taught me that the changing of climate is something that's normal and that's supposed to happen. And so I've never really been scared of the change in itself. But I think it's the speed and the rate at which things are changing that makes me feel kind of helpless because I know that I'm doing my part, but not everybody knows what their part can be.

所以问题在于，到底什么才能真正改变现状？我希望更多人能明白，每个人的每个行为都在以或积极或消极的方式影响着这个世界。

And so it's like, what can really change? I wish that more people knew that every single thing that they do impacts our world, like, either positively or negatively. It does have an impact.

你好，我叫莉娅·克里斯蒂安森，是皮德蒙特高中的一名17岁高三学生。对于气候变化这一事实，我一方面感到有些不自在，另一方面又有些愤怒。我不喜欢改变这个概念。

Hi. My name is Leah Christiansen. I'm a senior at Piedmont High School, and I'm 17 years old. I feel, one, a little uncomfortable about the fact of climate change, and one, a little bit mad. I don't like the idea of change.

我更喜欢事物保持原状。所以当发生变故导致改变时，会让我感到不适。至于愤怒的情绪，每当人们对自己行为造成的后果无知无觉时，我就会莫名火大。我还不确定该如何处理这种情绪，仍在摸索中——因为有时情绪会在我心里不断积压，然后突然爆发出来。

I like the idea of things staying the same. And so when things happen to disrupt and cause change, it makes me feel uncomfortable. And the whole mad situation, I whenever people are ignorant to what they're doing, that's why I get kinda mad. I'm not sure how I how I deal with that. I'm still trying to figure that out because I it just bottles up inside me sometimes, and then I have little outbursts.

所以目前我真的不知道该如何应对。迄今为止我能想到的最好方式就是教育大众，因为我深感问题的根源在于人们对此缺乏认知。我相信如果人们了解更多，就不会采取现在这样的行为了。

So I'm not really sure how I should deal with that at the moment. My best way I can figure I'm really trying to figure that out with so far is just educating people because I really feel like it just comes down to people being uneducated about it. If I feel like if people knew more, then they wouldn't act the way they do.

这些情绪对任何人来说都难以承受，无论年龄大小。但孩子们并非孤军奋战。为了了解如何最好地帮助年轻人应对与气候变化相关的心理健康问题，我采访了气候精神病学联盟联合创始人兼主席罗宾·库珀。

These feelings can be overwhelming to anyone regardless of age. But kids aren't in this alone. To find out how to best help young people navigate their climate related mental health issues, I spoke with Robin Cooper, cofounder and president of the Climate Psychiatry Alliance.

我认为孩子们对气候变化的严重后果有着深刻认知，这种认知带来的巨大压力让他们倍感痛苦。他们的情绪反应呈现多元化特征，青少年尤其明显，但年幼的孩子也不例外。他们普遍感到焦虑、恐惧、绝望，甚至产生末日将至的悲观情绪。

So I think that that kids are feeling a lot of distress about what they know about the impacts of climate change and the enormity of what they're feeling. And their feelings are across a whole variety of spectrums, particularly for teens, but younger kids also. They're feeling a lot of anxiety. They're feeling dread. They're feeling fear, and they're feeling a sense of doom and hopelessness.

我将来能否拥有一个宜居的世界？小孩子们会担心：地球会毁灭吗？我会死吗？青少年则忧虑：未来还会有适合生存的环境吗？我该不该、能不能在未来生育子女？

Will there be a world that I will grow into? For little kids, is the world gonna die? Am I gonna die? For teens, will there be a world that's a viable place for me to live in in the future? Should I, could I have children in the future?

我的未来将何去何从？种种末日般的绝望感笼罩着他们。他们感到强烈的愤怒与被背叛感——怨恨成年人留下这些重担却没有保护好他们，同时为眼前发生的一切感到深深的悲哀与痛心。

What will my future be and a lot of doom and feelings of hopelessness? They feel a lot of anger and betrayal. Betrayal that the grown ups in their world have have left them with these burdens and not protected them, and a lot of sadness and grief about what they're seeing.

那可真是不少。

That's a lot.

对年轻人来说，肩上的担子实在太重了。真的太多了。

It's a whole lot for young people to have on their shoulders. Really a lot.

他们没说错。我觉得自己不算年轻人了，但也有类似的感受——我们稍后会讨论成年版的这种焦虑。根据你的观察，平均而言，年轻人生活中的成年人在处理这些问题时的准备有多充分？

And they're not wrong. I think I'm not a young person. I have feelings, similar feelings, which we'll get into kind of the adult version of this in a minute. But from what you've observed, on average, how well equipped are the adults in young people's lives to handle these problems?

这取决于成年人的身份。我称之为'家长俱乐部'——不仅包括父母，还有祖辈、老师、教练、叔叔阿姨等。情况差异很大，关键在于这些成年人是否关注气候变化问题，能否有效应对自身焦虑而不被压垮。虽然参差不齐，但我认为这个'家长俱乐部'需要大量帮助才能引导孩子渡过这片险滩。

Well, it depends on who the adults are, and I'm gonna call it the parent club. Those grown ups that are beyond just their their parents, their grandparents, their teachers, their coaches, their aunts and uncles. It's very variable, and it depends on how connected those grown ups are to the to the worries about climate change, whether those grown ups have been able to face their own worries and deal with them in effective ways so that they're not overwhelming. So it's widely variable, but I think the grown ups, that parent club, need a lot of help in managing to guide their kids through this tough terrain.

是的。我喜欢用'成年人'这个词，它意味着孩子生活中有许多负责任的成人角色，不局限于亲子关系，很多成年人都能影响并帮助孩子应对各类问题。那么，自身存在气候焦虑的成年人该如何与孩子探讨这个问题？他们是否应该先处理好自己的情绪？

Yeah. I like the term grown ups to imply that there are a lot of responsible adults in children's lives. It's not strictly a parent child relationship and that a lot of adults can influence and help kids navigate all kinds of things. So how can adults who themselves have climate anxiety address this issue with the children in their lives? Should they handle it first themselves?

他们是否应该向孩子展示应对这种焦虑的挣扎过程？有哪些具体方法可以实现？

Should they model for the children the struggle of dealing with it? What are some of the ways they can try to do that?

我认为成年人肩负着帮助孩子应对的重要责任。首先，他们必须理解现实问题，同时妥善管理自身的气候焦虑，避免加重孩子的负担。他们需要用实际行动引导孩子，让孩子不感到孤立无援，更像是共同应对的伙伴。你也提到过，超越父母范畴的协作网络非常重要。

Well, I think grown ups have a big responsibility to help kids navigate this. And first, they have to be understanding what the real world issues are and also be enough connected to managing their own climate anxiety so it doesn't exaggerate or spill over to what the kids are burdened with. They have to be able to guide them with things that they are also doing so that kids don't feel abandoned and alone in managing this. That's kind of being partners with them. And you've also said how important it is to think about beyond just parents.

青少年，尤其是在成长阶段，正在经历与父母分离的过程。有时，父母与青少年之间长期存在的紧张关系需要被纳入考量，有时也需要与父母之外的人互动。但这并不削弱父母保持关注、警觉并与孩子同在的重要角色。

Teenagers, particularly developmentally, are navigating separating from their parents. And sometimes then, the ever present tensions between parents and teenagers need to be considered in that mix and sometimes engagement with others than just parents. But that does not diminish the very important role of parents being attentive, alert, and with their kids.

是的。这与许多其他类型的育儿建议相似，对吧？比如在设定界限时，你仍然可以陪伴孩子，坐在他们身边，同时坚持说不。

Yeah. This is similar to so many other kinds of parental advice. Right? I mean, there's a lot of talk about when you're maintaining boundaries, for example. You can still be there, sit with your kid, still say no.

你可以保持友善，但仍然说不。我理解这种与孩子同在的能力，不忽视或淡化他们真实的担忧，然后尝试给予他们适合年龄的答案。这确实很棘手。我自己在生活中也遇到过，有时很难判断孩子能承受多少我们成年人正在挣扎的残酷真相。

You can be kind. You can still say no. So I hear that kind of being able to be there with your kids, not dismiss, not glaze over or gloss over their very real concerns, and then try to give them some, I suppose, age appropriate answers. I mean, that's that feels tricky. You know, I've dealt with this a bit in my in my own life so far, and it's sometimes it's hard to know how much a kid can take of of the real truth that we're struggling with as adults.

我想强调你提到的两点，我完全赞同。首先是气候危机带来的困扰及威胁，青少年和孩子们应对这些时，这些问题叠加在他们正常的成长关系上。青少年与成年人的关系也是如此——他们正在分离但尚未完全独立，因此仍需要父母的参与和保护。

I think you've mentioned two particular things that I wanna highlight that I'm so in agreement with you about. First is that the issues around climate distress and the threats that we're experiencing and the and teens and kids grappling with this is laid on normal developmental relationships as they grow. And that's true with teens and their relationships with grown ups. But they're separating, but they're also not there yet. So they still have a component that very much needs parents to be involved and protective.

另一点是如何根据发展阶段调整信息传递方式。成年人常误将孩子视为小大人，使用过于复杂的语言，忽略了孩子以适合其发展阶段的方式吸收信息的特点。幼儿思维具体，青少年开始有 nuanced（微妙）的理解但仍容易感到 overwhelmed（不堪重负）。父母需要诚实面对并认可孩子的感受和现实，但避免压垮他们，明白有时自己的话可能完全超出孩子的理解范围。

And the other is how to navigate appropriate developmentally attuned responses about information. Sometimes I think grown ups tend to think of kids as little grown ups and talk to them in language that is way too complicated, not adhering to the the the reality that kids bring in information in developmentally appropriate ways. So little kids are very concrete, and teenagers are beginning to understand in a more nuanced ways but still see things in overwhelming ways. So parents need to be there and honest and validate feelings and reality, but not overwhelm kids and know that sometimes what they say can just go right over their head if they're talking in two outstripped ways.

没错。你刚刚触及了所有问题的核心——信任，建立并持续维护这种信任。我们之前聊到你父亲如何向你讲述核战争威胁（非气候问题），那也是个令人恐惧的童年阴影。能分享那个故事吗？

Right. And you've just touched on, a key component of all this, which is trust, right, and building that trust, continuing to maintain that. So when we spoke earlier, you described how your father talked to you about the threat of nuclear war, not climate, but also in a very scary, scary threat when you were a child. So can you share that story?

这个故事至今指引着我的思考，非常个人化。如你所言，当时另一种生存威胁进入了我幼小的认知——我大约七岁，正值核武器发展与国际冲突频发时期。我问父亲：‘我会死于核战争吗？核战争会发生吗？’

It's a story that guides my thinking now, and it's very personal. As you mentioned, it was at the time when this other existential threat was coming into my consciousness as a kid. I was little. Maybe I was seven ish or so, and it was the time of nuclear weapons development and a lot of international conflict. And I asked my father, would I die in a nuclear war, or would there be a a nuclear war?

他说，绝对不行。这种事在你这一生中都不会发生。当时七岁的我如释重负。我父亲保护了我，他做得对。但后来，当我成为消除核冲突的倡导者时，我大概二十五六岁。

And he said, absolutely no. This will not happen in your lifetime. I was enormously relieved at my, what is, seven year old mind. And my father did right by protecting me. But later, when I was an advocate to eliminate nuclear conflict, I was in my mid twenties maybe.

我对父亲说，你怎么能那样告诉我？你怎么能那样说？那不是真的。你并不知道。他对我说，罗宾，我还能怎么办？

And I said to my father, how could you tell me that? How could you tell me that? It's just not true. You don't know. And he said to me, Robin, what was I gonna do?

你那时还是个孩子。我父亲坚持认为他必须保护我免受压倒性的灾难性情绪影响。但他没有做，而我现在会告诉他的是，他没有认可我的担忧。他没有说，是的，这确实是个大问题。

You were a little kid. My father held the position of knowing he had to protect me from overwhelming catastrophic feelings. But what he didn't do and what I would now do and tell him is that he didn't validate my concerns. He didn't say, yes. This is a very big concern.

我也很担心。他当时没有接着说，我们可以为此做些事情，我们可以一起面对这个真实存在的问题。他也没有帮助我看到，即使在那个年龄，我也能理解的细微差别。这让我思考成年人应该如何对待孩子，既要认可他们的感受，陪伴他们，又要保护他们免受那些年幼时无法应对的巨大风险。

I'm concerned too. He didn't then say, we can do things about this, and we can do things together in facing what is really a true thing. And he didn't help me then to see the nuances that I could tolerate even at that age. And that guides me to think about how grown ups can be with kids, validating, being with them, but also protecting them from the enormity of the risk that can't be grappled with when you're that little.

好的，我们已经讨论了很多。让我们给父母和老师们——虽然我们还没怎么谈到他们——提供一些指导，帮助他们在这种情况下关注儿童和学生的心理健康。那么，你会如何帮助父母或教师首先识别孩子是否正在与气候焦虑或悲伤之类的问题作斗争？

Well, okay. So we've covered a lot of ground. Let's give parents and teachers who we haven't really talked about much yet a little bit of a guide to help address the psychological health of children and students, in this situation. So how would you help a parent or teacher identify in the first place that a child is struggling with something like climate anxiety or grief?

这是个很好的问题。你注意到了什么，看到了什么？观察他们是否在适当的发展任务上停滞不前，这些任务本应是他们在当前年龄阶段应该完成的。他们能投入到学业中吗？他们能与朋友相处吗？

It's a really good question. What do you notice and what do you see? Watching to see if they are stalled in appropriate developmental tasks, the things that they should be achieving at the stage and age that they're in. Are they able to involve themselves in schoolwork? Are they able to involve themselves with friends?

他们是否还能从过去喜欢的事物中获得快乐？这是需要密切关注的重要迹象。他们是否正在从适合他们的参与环境中退缩？他们是否闷闷不乐？注意身体信号，因为小孩子和大孩子常常通过身体来表达忧虑。

Are they still experiencing or not pleasure in things that they used to get pleasure from? And that's a big thing to watch for. Are they retreating away from those places of engagement that are appropriate for them? Are they sullen? Watching for physical signs because little kids and bigger kids often express worries physically.

他们的食欲、睡眠或头痛情况有变化吗？是否有情绪爆发？当然，所有孩子和青少年都会周期性地出现情绪爆发，这是学习调节感受和情绪的一部分。但这些情况是否变得更频繁了？

Are they having changes in appetite, in sleep, or headaches? Are there emotional outbursts? And of course, all kids and teenagers have that emotional outburst periodically. That's a part of learning how to regulate feelings and emotions. But are these happening more?

他们用怎样的语言描述这些情绪？他们是否谈论或反复出现关于世界末日的想法？在已进行的调查中发现青少年存在这些强烈情绪，我认为重要的是，虽然青少年有这些广泛而强烈的情绪并不令我惊讶，但他们表示这干扰了日常生活功能。这正是家长俱乐部需要留意的信号。

And what's the language around that? Are they talking and are they are there thoughts that penetrate about doom of the world? And and one of the things that I think is important in the surveys that have been done that have identified these big feelings for teens is that it wasn't surprising for me to know that teens have these extensive big feelings, but they said that it interferes with their daily functioning. And that's something for the grown ups, that parent club to watch for.

嗯。

Mhmm.

是的，这非常关键。这不仅仅是转瞬即逝的念头。那么当你发现学生或身边的孩子存在这些挑战时，你会建议下一步采取什么措施？

Yeah. That's really significant. It's more than a fleeting thought you have. Yes. So once you recognize these challenges in a student or a child in your life, what would you recommend as a next step?

重申一遍，好奇心永远是最好的驱动力。首先要认可他们的恐惧——就像我说的，我父亲当年就没做到这点。是的，这也是我同样担忧的问题。

Again, curiosity is always the driver. Validating their fears. As I said, my dad didn't do that. Yes. This is something of of concern that I have too.

保持诚实，但要根据他们情感承受能力来调节信息量，不要认为我们可以让孩子背负这些重担。要始终强调：我与你同在，我会竭尽所能保障你的安全，让你继承的世界变得更美好。我认为家长俱乐部应该示范如何参与社会行动，成年人的行动方式可以完全不同。

Honesty, but honesty in modulating what is tolerable to their emotional capacities and not assuming that we can burden kids with carrying this. And then always, I am with you. I am here to do everything I can to make you safe, to make the world that you're gonna inherit be better. And I think it's important for the parent club to model ways of engaging in activism and action. And so that activism and action for grown ups can be very different.

昨晚我和一位朋友讨论他12岁的孙子如何承受这些，那个孩子始终把长辈参与社会活动视为指引。我们要支持孩子做力所能及的事：你们高中的社团在开展什么活动？我能为此提供什么帮助？

I spoke to a friend last night wondering how his 12 year old grandson could tolerate it. His grandson always sees their engagement in activism as a guide. And then joining kids in what they can actually do. What's happening in the clubs in your high school? How can I help you with that?

需要我开车送你去参加那些活动吗？我们可以一起带着更小的孩子甚至青少年去吗？现在让我们坐下来给这里有权力的某个人写封信，比如我们的立法者或领导人。我们可以一起完成这件事。

Do you need me to drive you to those events? Can we go together, littler kids or even teenagers? Let's sit down and write a letter now to one of the people who has power here, our legislators, our leaders. We can do that together.

教师的角色与父母可能有何不同？

How might a teacher's role differ from a parent?

这是个非常好的问题。首先，我认为教师在这里是英雄。将气候素养融入对孩子的教育中，并以适当方式贯穿他们的课程非常重要。然而，教师面临的艰巨任务是既要恰当地提供信息，又不能忽视他们所教授的内容可能给孩子带来极大压力——需要在课堂内外留出空间来识别不安情绪、验证这些情绪，告诉他们‘这些内容确实很难，我们一起学习时你会有强烈的感受’。我们要确保有空间关注这些情绪反应。

Really good question. First off, I think teachers are heroes here. It's really important to integrate climate literacy in teaching kids and have that interspersed in appropriate ways throughout their curriculum. And teachers, however, I think, have the difficult task of appropriately providing information, but not ignoring that the content they're teaching can be very, very stressful for making room in the classroom and outside of the classroom to identify upset feelings, to validate them, to say, this is tough stuff, and as we learn it together, you're gonna have big feelings. And let's make sure that we have room to make sure that those are also something that we pay attention to.

帮助孩子掌握这些技巧。现在教孩子通过深呼吸来学习情绪调节相当普遍。有时听起来老套，但‘我们一起深呼吸吧’，因为这能帮助我们大脑中掌管情绪的区域平静下来，从而更好地共同学习。当然，同样要关注那些遇到更严重困难、可能需要额外帮助的孩子。

Helping kids with those skills. I think it's pretty pretty common now for kids to learn about emotional regulation through deep breathing. It sometimes sound corny, but let's breathe together because it helps to settle our emotional places in our brain so we can learn this stuff together. And then again, the same same eyes on kids who are having more severe difficulties and might need additional help.

罗宾·库珀是气候精神病学联盟的联合创始人兼主席。非常感谢您做客《气候一号》并分享这些宝贵建议。接下来，一位教师将回应学生们对地球现状的好奇。

Robin Cooper is cofounder and president of Climate Psychiatry Alliance. Thank you so much for joining us on Climate One and sharing these excellent tips. Coming up, a teacher responds to her students' curiosity about the state of our Earth.

他们确实想更多地了解地球的运行机制是如何失效的，以及这种平衡是如何被打破的？

They do want to know more about how the mechanisms of the planet aren't working and then, like, how is this being disrupted?

广告之后，《气候一号》将继续为您呈现。

That's up next when Climate One continues.

每周，我们的播客都会触及全美50个州及全球各地成千上万关心气候问题的人们，现在我们正接受赞助。若您有意与Climate One合作，将您的信息或产品传达给我们的听众，请联系Multitude，邮箱地址为multitude@multitude.productionsslashads。或者，如果您更愿意赞助某一特定主题的节目，可直接通过邮件联系我们，邮箱是climateone（即one）@commonwealthclub.org。在加利福尼亚州，奥克兰联合学区正通过改用电动校车来减少有害气候的排放。

Each week, our podcast reaches thousands of climate concerned people in all 50 states and in countries across the world, and now we are accepting sponsorships. So if you're interested in working with Climate One to bring your message or your product to our listeners, contact Multitude at this address, multitude@multitude.productionsslashads. Or if you would prefer to underwrite an episode on a specific topic, you can reach out to us directly via email. That address is climate one, that's one,@commonwealthclub.org. In California, the Oakland Unified School District is working to reduce their climate harming emissions by switching to electric school buses.

电动巴士还能改善公共健康，长远来看还能为学区节省开支。但这类项目近期因联邦资金变动而遭遇困难。KALW气候记者Mary Katherine O'Connor实地探访了奥克兰联合学区，亲眼见证了这些新型校车。

Electric buses also improve public health, and they'll help the district save money in the long run. But projects like these have run into trouble with the recent changes to federal funding. KALW climate reporter Mary Katherine O'Connor went to Oakland Unified School District to see these new school buses firsthand.

周五早晨7:30，我在东奥克兰深处与Matteo Hernandez在一起。他对我的麦克风特别感兴趣。

It's 07:30 on a Friday morning, and I'm in Deep East Oakland with Matteo Hernandez. He's really into my microphone.

我叫Matteo。我想玩我的名字Tyler。

My name, Matteo. I wanna play my name Tyler.

他的母亲Elizabeth Samora也在这里。

His mom, Elizabeth Samora, is here too.

Mateo七岁，上一年级。

Mateo is seven and he's in first grade.

一年级啊，好的。我们一边等校车，一边听Mateo不停地聊天。

First grade, okay. We're waiting for the school bus while Mateo chats away.

他从上幼儿园起就一直乘坐这辆公交车。

He's been riding the bus since he was in preschool.

但那时候，他似乎并不喜欢。他的自闭症使他对噪音和气味特别敏感。

But back then, he didn't seem to enjoy it. His autism makes him sensitive to loud noises and smells.

刚开始时，他会说太吵了然后捂住耳朵。

In the beginning, he would say it was loud and cover his ears.

就连伊丽莎白送他上公交车时也注意到了浓重的尾气味道。

And even Elizabeth noticed the heavy exhaust when she walked him to the bus.

而且我也不知道为什么，有时候我会觉得有点头疼。

And I don't know, sometimes I would get like a little headache.

但今年秋天一切都变了，一辆新公交车开始运营。那些刺鼻的尾气和噪音都消失了。我甚至没注意到它开过来，但马特奥发现了。

But that all changed this fall, when a new bus started rolling up. Gone are those fumes and the noise. I didn't even notice it approach, but Mateo spotted it.

当

As

车门关闭，校车驶离路边，听起来更像宇宙飞船而非校车。这是因为它们由电池驱动，而非柴油。全美许多学区都配备了一两辆电动巴士，但奥克兰的情况截然不同。

the door closes and they pull away from the curb, it sounds more like a spaceship than a school bus. That's because it's powered by batteries, not diesel. Lots of school districts across the country have one or two electric buses. But Oakland is a different story.

奥克兰联合学区今天创造了历史。

The Oakland Unified School District made history today.

这是首个将所有校车全部更换为电动车型的学区。

The first school district to swap all of its school buses to electric models.

这确实是个引人注目的进展。

This is a really interesting development.

东湾学区迈出了巨大飞跃。

Huge leap forward for an East Bay school district.

奥克兰联合学区现有74辆电动巴士。我采访了学区交通主任金·雷尼，她告诉我这些巴士减少了排放，更能满足1300名乘坐校车的特殊需求学生。她表示柴油车根本无法提供同等服务。

Oakland Unified now has 74 electric buses. I spoke with the district's transportation director, Kim Rainey. She told me the buses lower emissions and they better support the 1,300 students with special needs who ride the bus. And she says the diesel ones just didn't serve them well.

孩子们原本就乘坐着噪音很大的巴士，这对许多特殊需求儿童已是过度刺激。还要忍受柴油气味和尾烟，车内闷热，引擎声嘈杂喧闹。

And they're riding on a noisy bus, which already amps a lot of special needs kids up. Smelling the diesel coming in, the fumes. It's hot. It's louder. It's noisy.

这是柴油巴士内部的声音。作为对比，这是奥克兰市新巴士的声音。但有个问题。

Here's what it sounds like inside a diesel bus. And to compare, this is one of Oakland's new buses. But there's a catch.

电动巴士的成本约为30万美元。而普通燃油巴士的发动机成本大约在12.5万到15万美元之间。

Bus cost, especially in EVs, about $300. A regular bus, engine bus, is about 125,000 to 150,000.

这个差价很大，几乎是两倍。此外，学区还需要安装充电站，这使得转型成本更高。但加州环境组织的州主任劳拉·迪恩认为，额外的成本是值得的。

That's a big difference around twice as expensive. Plus, districts need to install charging stations, and that pushes the cost to switch even higher. But Laura Deahen, the state director for Environment California, says the extra cost is worth it.

柴油废气会导致呼吸系统疾病，现在还被认为与大脑影响有关，包括多动症和其他行为问题。孩子们正在发育的肺部和身体对污染物更为敏感，他们每天在等校车或乘车时暴露在这种污染水平下，而我们明明有替代方案——清洁的电动校车可以在无污染的情况下安全接送孩子，这种现状简直荒谬。

The diesel fumes can cause respiratory ailments. It's also been linked to impacts to the brain now, including ADHD and other behavioral issues. The idea that children with their developing lungs and their bodies that are so much more vulnerable to the impacts of exposure to pollutants, the idea that they would be exposed to that level of pollution every day while they're waiting at the bus stop or riding the bus is just absurd when we have alternatives: clean electric school buses that can transport children safely without that pollution.

这对司机也很危险。柴油废气会加重哮喘，甚至与癌症和心脏病有关。而且不仅仅是这些巴士不再使用化石燃料的问题。

It's dangerous for drivers, too. Diesel exhaust can worsen asthma and is even linked to cancer and heart disease. And it's not just that these buses are no longer powered by fossil fuels.

校车的一个独特之处在于，放学后它们基本处于闲置状态。这样你就可以利用这些电池的潜在电力，帮助满足社区的用电需求。

One thing that's unique about school buses is that they're really not being used at all after school hours. And so you can then basically plug into that battery potential power, and it can help meet the electricity needs of the community.

所以，比如说在炎热的夏天用电高峰时，这些巴士可以向电网回送电力。此外，电力比柴油便宜得多，而且这些电动巴士的维护成本也低得多。这每年可为奥克兰节省高达44万美元。但前期投入成本很高。

So when, say, the electricity demand spikes on a hot summer day, the buses can provide power, sending it back to the grid. Plus, electricity is a much cheaper fuel than diesel. And these electric buses have far lower maintenance costs. That could save Oakland up to $440,000 a year. But the upfront price tag is steep.

据报道，奥克兰市的车队及充电基础设施五年间耗资超过5000万美元。不过，学区并不需要承担全部费用。以下是劳拉的进一步报道。

Oakland's fleet and charging infrastructure reportedly cost north of $50,000,000 over five years. Now, the school district isn't on the hook for the whole amount. Here's Laura again.

加州一直是联邦基础设施法案下拨资金的主要受益者，这非常棒。

California has been a major recipient of the federal funds that have come through the federal infrastructure law, and that's been great.

拜登总统的清洁校车计划专门拨款50亿美元用于电动校车。全国各学区已获得其中10亿美元，另有20亿美元即将到位。但当特朗普总统上任后，他指示环保局冻结了这笔资金。此后，资金才得以解冻。

Speaker President Biden's Clean School Bus program set aside $5,000,000,000 for electric buses. School districts around the country have already received $1,000,000,000 of that. And another $2,000,000,000 was on the way. But when President Trump came into office, he directed the Environmental Protection Agency to freeze that money. Since then, the money has been released.

但总部位于华盛顿特区的电动校车倡议组织负责人苏·甘德表示，资金延迟造成了损害。

But Sue Gander of the DC based Electric School Bus Initiative says the delays caused damage.

这给各学区带来了巨大压力，经销商也承受重负，更让那些准备扩建生产线的制造商陷入不确定性——还不包括那些错过更清洁、更安静校车体验的孩子们。

It's put a lot of strain on school districts. It's put a lot of strain on dealers, and it puts a lot of uncertainty on the manufacturers who are looking to build out their production line, not to mention the kids who are missing out on these cleaner and quieter rides to school.

清洁校车计划中还有另外20亿美元资金。但环保局尚未说明学区何时或是否能获得这笔资金。他们拒绝了我们的采访请求。在加州，州政府已投资超过10亿美元用于清洁校车，但大多数学区距离全面电动化车队还很遥远。

There's also that other $2,000,000,000 in the Clean School Bus program. But the EPA hasn't said when or if school districts will ever see that money. And they declined a request for an interview. Here in California, the state has invested more than a billion dollars in clean school buses. But most school districts are a long way off from having fully electrified fleets.

在奥克兰，金·雷尼告诉我，更安静、更清洁的校车已初见成效。她收到的校车相关事件报告减少了。回到公交站点的马特奥身边，他的母亲莉兹贝斯也表示看到了改善。

In Oakland, Kim Rainey told me the quiet, cleaner rides are already paying off. She's getting fewer reports of bus related incidents. And back with Matteo at the bus stop, his mom, Lizbeth, says she's seen an improvement too.

是的，总体来说他情况好多了。他参与度更高了，语言能力也在进步，而且更合群了。

Yeah, in general he's doing much better. He participates more. His speech is also getting better. And he's more social.

在奥克兰，我是玛丽·凯瑟琳·奥康纳。

In Oakland, I'm Mary Katherine O'Connor.

玛丽·凯瑟琳·奥康纳最初为KALW公共媒体报道了这个故事。早些时候，我们听到几位学生分享了他们对气候危机的看法和感受。这些学生就读于俄克拉荷马州的皮埃蒙特高中。他们的环境科学老师梅丽莎·刘告诉我，一次北极之旅如何改变了她对气候的认知。

Mary Katherine O'Connor originally reported that story for KALW Public Media. Earlier, we heard a couple of students who shared their thoughts and feelings about the climate crisis. They go to Piedmont High School in Oklahoma. Melissa Lau, their environmental science teacher, told me about how a trip to the Arctic changed the way she thinks about climate.

2018年时，我曾与佛罗里达国际大学的研究团队合作。我在那里待了三十六天，团队驻扎的时间更长。

So in 2018, I worked with a research team from Florida International University. I was there for thirty six days. The team was there for longer.

三十六天。那可是

Thirty six days. That is

没错。我

Yeah. I

真是趟漫长的旅程。

That's a long trip.

这是一次漫长的旅程。我丈夫经常独自在家。不过确实如此。前两周，我待在州的最北端，那里每天都在下雪。

It's a long trip. My husband was was home alone a lot. So but yeah. The first two weeks, I was in the northernmost point of the state. It was snowing every day.

所以根本看不到任何植物，因为它们都被埋在雪下。但后来我们去了郁金香田野研究站，那里仍然远在北极圈之上。随着天气变暖，我们去不同地点收集数据时，能亲眼看到永冻土在逐渐融化下沉，还有湖中冒出的甲烷气泡。

So didn't see any plants because they were under the snow. But then we went to Tulip Field Research Station, which is, you know, still well above the Arctic Circle. What I saw though was as it got warmer, you know, we would go out to the different sites to collect the data. And, you know, you could see the permafrost slumps, you know, as as the permafrost is is also warming up and melting, have it'll it'll slump down. You could see, you know, the methane bubbles in the lakes.

我亲眼目睹了所有这些现象——那些过去只在新闻报导里听说的事情。这让我真切感受到，它是真实的。它它

I saw all of these things firsthand that I was, you know, seeing and and hearing about, you know, in news stories and things like that. And that to me, like, made it real. It It

震撼到你了。

hit you.

是的。这太紧迫了，就发生在当下。2018年那会儿，阿拉斯加就有村庄——直到现在也是——不得不向更内陆迁移。美国境内已经出现气候难民了。

Yeah. Like, it's this is this is urgent. Like, this is happening right now. There are villages in Alaska at that time in 2018 and still that, you know, are having to move further inland. Like, we already have climate change migrants within The United States.

这些都是美国公民。这不是遥远国度发生的事，就发生在我们后院，此时此刻。

Like, these are US citizens. This is not something that's happening far away. This is in our backyard. This is happening here.

这段经历如何改变了你？

How did that experience change you?

那时我在教六年级科学课。你知道，作为课程内容的一部分，我们会讨论环境问题、生态学之类的议题。但那时我意识到，我不能——我不能含糊其辞，而是需要更直截了当地告诉学生们：这就是正在发生的事，现在就发生着，是我们造成的，这是真实的，但我们可以采取行动。这改变了我课堂上的沟通方式，不再容忍某些误解存在。

I was teaching sixth grade science at the time. And, you know, we would talk about environmental things, ecology and things like that as part of our content. But I I realized at that point, like, I can't I can't be not it wasn't I you know, not wishy washy, but it was more like I can't be I need to be more straightforward with my students. Like, I just need to tell them this is what's happening, and this is happening now, and it's us and it's real, but we can do something about it. So it changed my messaging that I was having in the classroom instead of, you know, allowing some misconceptions.

我只是觉得，我不想打这场仗。如果某个学生认为气候变化不是人为造成的，我不会去争论。这根本不值得——不，其实是值得的。

I just like, I'm not gonna fight that battle. Like, I'm not gonna go there if if this student does not think that climate change is happening and it's that it's human and anthropogenic and and and cause. I'm not gonna fight that battle. I like it's just not worth it. It's worth it.

后来它变得值得了。所以我开始思考如何以非对抗性的方式来处理。在俄克拉荷马州生活，难免会遇到矛盾，毕竟农业和化石燃料是我们州的两大支柱产业，而这两者正是人为导致气候变化的主要推手。你知道，这话题很敏感，容易引发争议。

It became worth it. So I had to start figuring out how am I gonna do this in a non confrontational way. Living in Oklahoma, you can you can run into some conflict considering that agriculture and fossil fuels are two major industries in our our state, and those are two big human caused drivers of climate change. You know, it can get touchy. It can get a little sticky.

所以我该怎么做？你的

So how do I do that? Your

新学年刚开始对吧？

school year just started. Right?

是的，现在是开学第四天。

Yes. We're on day four.

第一个教学单元是什么？

What's the first what's the first unit?

所以这是生态系统。然后我们开始探讨人类如何影响这些系统。但我们做的第一个活动叫做‘公地悲剧’。这是第一天的内容。他们彼此还不熟悉。

So it's ecosystems. And then we start getting into, you know, how humans are influencing these systems. But the very first activity we do is called tragedy of the commons. And that's that's day one. They don't know each other.

他们也不太了解我。于是我们进行这个公地悲剧实验，他们要从纸袋里‘钓’金鱼。第一轮不允许交谈。当然，结果就是他们把鱼都拿光了

They don't really know me. So we're we're we're doing tragedy at the commons where they are, you know, fishing for goldfish out of a paper bag. And the first round, there's no talking. And, of course, so and so, like, they took all the fish

现在我们的湖里

and now our lake is

已经一条鱼都不剩了

you know, there's no more fish in

我们的湖。我就说，哦，这可真糟糕。简直像是

our lake. And I'm like, oh, that's a bummer. It's almost like

我故意设计成这样的。

I designed it that way.

然后第二轮，我们开始讨论可能的策略。于是我们展开对话，探讨这些我们共享的公共资源是什么。比如公共公园，甚至我们高中的洗手间——那也是公地。如果它不属于任何人，那就没人会去维护它。

And then the second round, you know, we start getting into like, okay, so let's talk about strategies that you might use. And and and so we have this conversation. Then we talk about what are these common resources that we that we all share. You know, we talk about public parks and, you know, even like the restrooms in our high school, you know, that's a commons. If it belongs to nobody, then nobody is taking care of it.

正如我们之前聊过的，你知道，我曾是一名高中数学老师。所以我对与学生、家长等人交流的体验略知一二。我也知道教师受到的审视似乎在加剧，尤其是疫情以来。就像你说的，你住在俄克拉荷马州——一个连续三届总统选举都支持共和党的州，甚至在那之前也是如此。我想象处于你这样位置的老师可能会羞于谈论气候变化，但你却并非如此。

And as as, you know, we talked before, you know, I used to teach high school math. So I get a little bit about what it's like talking to students and parents and everybody. And and I know that the scrutiny teachers receive seems like it's like grown, especially since the pandemic. And like you said, you live in Oklahoma, state that votes Republican, each of the three presidential elections passed even before then. I imagine that a teacher in your position might be might be shy talking about climate change, but you're not.

为什么？

Why?

有几个原因。其一，我很幸运地联系上了NCSC并开始与他们合作。当时我面临的最大障碍是试图找到适合教学的课程内容。

There's there's several reasons. I, one, was lucky enough to to get into contact with NCSC and started working with them. The biggest hurdle that I was having was trying to find lessons to teach.

那是国家科学教育中心。

And that's the National Center for Science Education.

是的，谢谢。就是国家科学教育中心。他们当时刚开始开发课程，而我想这正是我想参与的领域。要知道，虽然有很多优秀的资源库——比如清洁网络就是个很棒的网站，但它规模太庞大了。我完全不知从何入手。所以我要克服的第一个障碍就是增强对内容的信心，弄清楚从哪里开始、如何分解这些内容——当时我教的是11岁的孩子，现在则是高中生。

Yes. Thank you. So it's the National Center for Science Education. And so, like, they were just starting to develop lessons, and I thought that's what I wanna get in on. You know, there there are great repositories.

所以问题在于，如何在课堂上呈现这些内容？而我认为第二个障碍是行政支持。我必须向学校管理层说明：'我准备开展这个课程，我认为学生们能够接受。'通常学生们确实能处理好这类敏感话题。

Like the Clean Network is a great website, but it's it's huge. It's massive. And it's like, where do I begin? How do I even start? So that was the first obstacle that I had to overcome was to become more confident in just the content and, you know, where do I start and how do I break this down to at the time that I was teaching 11 year olds and now I'm teaching high school.

因此，关键在于如何在课堂上实施？而第二个障碍，我认为是获得行政支持。我必须向校方管理层报备：'我准备开展这个课程，相信学生们能够应对。'事实上，学生们通常都能很好地处理这类敏感话题。

So, you know, how does that look in in the classroom? And then the second obstacle, I think, was administration support. I had to go to my administrators and say, hey, I'm getting ready to do this lesson. I think the students are gonna be fine. And it's usually the students are fine with handling those kind of sticky topics.

但是，你知道，去找行政人员时，我尽量保持尊重，告诉他们，嘿，我是在告知你们正在发生的事情。这是我正在教授的课程内容，以及它对应的课程标准。我只是想提前打个招呼，以防万一，你知道，你们接到家长电话或邮件时不会措手不及。嗯。

But, you know, going to the administrators and trying to be respectful of them and saying, hey, I'm telling you this is what's happening. This is the lesson that I'm doing. And this is the standard it's addressing. I just wanted to give you a heads up in case, you know, you got a phone call or you got an email from a parent that you're not blindsided by this. Mhmm.

所以我在努力建立这种沟通。很幸运我的行政人员态度是：放手去做吧，没问题，你做得很好。

So trying to establish that. And I've been very lucky that my administrators are like, go for it. Do it. You're good. You're good.

你的学生们呢？给我讲讲你的学生吧。他们学习这方面内容时表现如何？有什么变化吗？

How about your students? So tell me a little bit about your students. How are they with learning about this? And how's it changed?

有什么

How's it

过去七年间的变化。我是说，甚至就在最近五六年里，学生们的态度明显转变了——你不再看到那么多否认现象。这种情况更多出现在成年人身上，但我的学生们基本都认同确实存在问题，而且，你知道，我们需要采取行动。区别在于他们对现状的紧迫感认知程度不同。

changed over the past seven changed. I mean, even, like, within the last five, six years, there's just been this shift of you're not seeing the denial so much with within students. You'll you'll see that more with adults, but not so much with my students. They're they're fairly fairly much in agreeance that there's there's something going on, and there's there's you know, we need to do something about this. It's the matter of urgency that they might feel about the situation.

我认为这就是转变所在。我看到的抗拒情绪少了，更多是行动上的迟疑。这可能因为他们没直接感受到与生活的关联，不明白如何直接影响他们。要知道，作为内陆州，我们看不到海平面上升，也看不到这类变化。

And that is, I think, the shift. I'm not seeing as much resistance as maybe I am seeing reluctance to get started. And that could be because they don't see the connection directly to their lives and how it's directly affecting them. Know, being a landlocked state, we don't see sea level rise. We don't see those kinds of changes.

我们不受飓风侵袭，虽然有自己的问题，但主要是干旱。如果你住在...我是说，我们有自来水系统，所以这些问题似乎并不直接影响我们。

We're not hit with hurricanes, you know, we have our own issues, but it's typically drought. And so if you're living, you know, I mean, we've got plumbing and running water, and so that just doesn't really seem to affect us.

当你说开始时，你指的是开始做什么？

When you say getting started, what do you mean getting started on what?

感觉有一种紧迫感需要采取行动。有些事情是我们必须做的。就像，好吧，这是个不错的故事。谢谢分享。但是，缺乏那种我们必须有所行动的紧迫感。

To to feel like that there is an urgency to take action. That there is there is something that we need to do. It's like, well, this is a nice story. Thank you for sharing. But so, like, there's not that urgency of we need there needs to be action.

你看到的另一件事就是大量的焦虑。所以一些冷漠并不一定是因为他们不在乎，而是因为他们不知道从哪里开始。这让人不知所措。你知道，对他们来说，情感上很难接受，比如，你知道，这就是现实。而且，你知道，这是末日。

The other thing that you see is just a lot of anxiety. So some of the apathy is not necessarily just because they don't care, but it's just because it's like, I don't know where to start. It's overwhelming. You know, it is difficult for them emotionally to have to like, you know, this is just how it is. And it's, you know, it's doomsday.

而且，你知道，我们无能为力。一切都结束了。

And, you know, there's nothing we can do. It's it's just all over.

像一种放弃的态度。你提到的那种差异很有意思。我认为那非常关键，学生们似乎在面对这个危机时在想，我能做些什么？而你所说的抵制听起来更多来自成年人而不是孩子。所以考虑到这两点，你如何应对这种差异，同时在你工作中处理这些不同的反应？我想建立关系一定非常重要。

Like a resignation kind of it's interesting you bring up that that that difference. I think that's really key there, how the students, it sounds like they're facing this crisis of what can I do about it? And the the the pushback that you're talking about kinda sounds like it comes more from adults than it does from kids generally. So thinking about those two, how do you navigate tackling that difference, but also just those different offerings in in in your work? Like, I imagine relationship building must be really big.

是的。我是说，那是关键。你知道，我提到过与我的管理人员建立关系，这样他们知道我不是在试图陷害他们，同时也与我的学生和他们的家庭建立关系。你知道，我的家庭受益于化石燃料行业。我有家庭成员在化石燃料公司工作。

Yes. That I mean, that is the key. You know, I was I mentioned relationship building with with my administrators so that they knew that I wasn't trying to throw them under the bus, but also with my students and with their families. You know, my family benefits from the fossil fuel industry. I have family members that have that work for fossil fuel companies.

我有家人拥有矿产权利，所以他们从化石燃料行业获得钻探收益。我与学生们分享这些。你知道，我不是从一个试图妖魔化你家人为了让你有房住、有饭吃所做的事情的角度出发。那不是问题所在。你的父母不是坏人。

I have family that have mineral rights, and so they get drilling benefits from from the fossil fuel industry. I share that with my students. You know, I'm not coming at a place of where I'm trying to demonize what what your family is doing to put a roof over your head and to put food on your table. That's not the problem. Your parents aren't the bad guys.

对吧？问题不在于此。关键是要与他们建立一种关系——我将带领他们开启一场范式转变的旅程，这需要一定的信任。毕竟，人类不会轻易对一个他们不信任、不相信真心为自己着想的人毫无保留。他们会怀疑对方别有用心。

Right? It's that's not the issue. But just trying to establish that relationship with them that I'm gonna take you on a journey of like shifting a paradigm, and that takes some trust. I mean, humans are not just going to, you know, jump in feet first with somebody that they don't trust, that they don't believe has their best interest at heart. They would think that there's some sort of ulterior motive.

因此建立这种信任关系至关重要，对家长也是如此。要让他们明白，我并非带着冲突的立场而来，而是出于关怀的初衷。

So building those relationships is key, but also with the parents, just so that they are aware that, you know, like, I am not coming at this at a a a place of conflict. I'm coming at this from a place of care.

而且每年你都得重新建立这种信任关系。

And every year, you have to rediscover and reengage in that trust building.

百分之百正确。即使我可能通过课间走廊相遇或之前的化学课认识部分学生，现在他们进入我的环境科学课堂后，全新的学生组合会彻底改变课堂动态。所以必须花时间了解这些孩子，以及他们如何作为一个整体协作。

A 100%. I even though I might know some of the students because, you know, passing periods and maybe I had them in my chemistry class and now they're in my environmental science class, you have a new combination of students and that completely changes the dynamic from one hour to the next. And so, you really have to spend time getting to know those kids and how they work together as a unit.

既然你从教二十六年了，我们多聊聊学生吧。对比你刚执教时，现在的学生有什么不同？他们对气候知识的学习热情是更高还是更低了？

So, let's talk about the kids a little bit more just because you've been teaching for twenty six years, right? So compare that to, like, when you first started. How are the students different? Do they have more of an appetite for learning about the climate? Less?

是不是每个学生都不同？

Is it is it every student's different?

每个学生确实都不同，但我确实看到了比过去更强的好奇心。他们渴望了解地球系统的运作机制，以及这些机制如何被破坏。无论是否带着明确的思考过程，他们本质上想知道的是：这原本应该如何运作？而现在又发生了哪些变化？

I I every every student is different, but I do see more curiosity than I have in the past. They they they do want to know more about how the mechanisms of of the planet are working, and then, like, how is this being disrupted? Whether or not they're coming with that conscious thought process, that's what they're that's what they're wanting to know. How is it supposed to work? And then now, how is it different?

因为在当今时代确实很困难。随着人工智能和社交媒体平台的发展，情况变得越来越复杂。现在有大量错误和虚假信息四处传播，而且它们无孔不入。我想

Because it's it's difficult in this day and age. It's getting more and more difficult with AI and with social media platforms. There's just a lot of mis and disinformation out there, and it's just it's more it's just pervasive. I want to

关于这点我想请教你。我当老师的时候，社交媒体那时在课堂上就影响很大。但虚假信息这个问题，我认为尤为关键。

ask you about that. I mean, when I was a teacher, social even back then played a big deal in my classroom. But you the disinformation thing, I think, is so key.

那些错误和虚假信息，手机已经成为他们生活中越来越重要的一部分。他们越来越多地，你知道的，与技术互动而非彼此交流。而越是接触技术，就越容易暴露在这些传播信息的平台和渠道中。

That mis and disinformation, the cell phones are just it becomes more and more a part of their lives. They're more and more, you know, engaging with with technology than they are with each other. And the more that you're engaging in technology, the more you're exposed to these platforms and avenues of which this information is is disseminated.

嗯，我认为这正好引出了你提到的国家科学教育中心的工作。能否谈谈你们如何支持教师应对课堂上这些你提到的类似挑战？

Well, and I think this leads into what you brought up with the National Center for Science Education. Can you tell me a little bit about that that work, how you're supporting teachers who are trying to navigate a lot of the same challenges you're talking about in the classroom?

是的。我们为教师提供完全免费、可获取且经过审核的课程。每节课的设计都以纠正错误认知为导向，同时采取非对抗方式。所有课程都力求避免冲突，只是单纯呈现信息，通过一系列探索和讨论让学生自己得出结论。

Yes. So we have, like, completely free and available and vetted lessons for teachers. But the approach of every single lesson, it's misconception driven, but it is also non confrontational. Like, not low no conflict is the goal with all of these lessons. It is just simply here is the information and through a series of discoveries and discussions that students are coming to the conclusions themselves.

教师自始至终都不会说'这就是事实，你必须这么想'。这种方式毫无对抗性，完全以学生为主导。我们为此付出了巨大努力，所有课程都由教师开发——我们深知同行们的处境。即使得不到校方或社区支持，由于课程的特殊设计，教师仍能非对抗性地向学生传递这些信息和教育内容。

The teacher at no point is ever saying, this is what is happening and this is what you must think. It's very no conflict and very student driven. And so, you know, we've worked really hard with that and the lessons were all developed by teachers that were you know, we know what our colleagues are dealing with. And, you know, if you don't have the support of your administrators, if you don't have the support of your community, you could you still use these lessons because of the way that they're written, that you could still get this message out to your students and the information and the education out to your students with it being non confrontational.

你们希望通过这项工作实现怎样的改变？能谈谈你对未来的愿景吗？

What kind of change are you hoping to see through that work? Tell me about what what your your vision for the future is kind of.

是的。我的希望是，通过为更多教师配备他们所需的资源，使他们获得能力与信心，进而让更多学生在成长为社区公民的过程中掌握必要知识。培养具备科学素养的选民群体是理想状态，你明白吗？因为这正是我们当前迫切需要的。

Yeah. My my hope is, yes, the more teachers that we can equip and empower with with the resources that they need, And then the more students are then equipped and empowered with the information that they need as they move forward into becoming citizens in our communities. To have a scientifically literate electorate is ideal. You know? Because that's that's really what we're what we're needing here.

没错。听起来这显然是门非常充实的课程。祝愿你在本学年剩余时间里一切顺利，感谢你的付出。梅丽莎·劳是来自俄克拉荷马州皮埃蒙特市的高中环境科学教师。梅丽莎，非常感谢你。

Yeah. Well, it it sounds like a very enriching course, obviously. And wishing you the best of luck for the rest of the school year, and thank you for your work. Melissa Lau is a high school environmental science teacher from Piedmont, Oklahoma. Melissa, thank you so much.

是的。谢谢邀请我参加节目，很高兴能和你交谈。

Yes. Thank you for having me. It was nice to talk with you.

以上就是本期节目内容。感谢收听。订阅我们的新闻通讯即可了解团队推荐读物，请前往climate1.org注册。

And that's our show. Thanks for listening. You can see what our team is reading by subscribing to our newsletter. Sign up at climate1.org.

《气候一号》是联邦俱乐部的制作项目。团队成员包括格雷格·道尔顿、布拉德·马什兰、珍妮·帕克、阿里安娜·布罗修斯、科隆和梅根·巴西利奥。主题音乐由乔治·杨创作，我是库什纳瓦达尔。

Climate One is a production of the Commonwealth Club. Our team includes Greg Dalton, Brad Marshland, Jenny Park, Ariana Brosius, Colon, and Megan Basilio. Our theme music is by George Young, and I'm Kushnavadar.