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一个精心打造的衣橱取决于那些能够很好搭配且经久耐用的单品。
A thoughtfully built wardrobe comes down to pieces that mix well and last.
这就是Quince的出色之处。
That's where Quince shines.
优质面料注重日常必需品的设计，穿着舒适自然，并且能随季节更替而可靠使用。
Premium fabrics consider design in everyday essentials that feel effortless to wear, and they're dependable as the seasons change.
Quince拥有我喜爱的日常必需品，品质持久耐用。
Quince has everyday essentials I love with quality that lasts.
轻盈的羊绒毛衣、短袖蒙古羊绒Polo衫、100%皮马棉T恤，以及欧洲亚麻混纺针织面料。
Lightweight cashmere sweaters, short sleeve Mongolian cashmere polos, tees in 100% Pima cotton, and European jersey linen.
这些是真正能实现四季通穿的多功能单品。
These are the versatile pieces that make a wardrobe that actually work season to season.
Quince直接与顶级工厂合作，省去中间商环节，因此你支付的不是品牌溢价或高端零售店的费用，而是纯粹为优质服装买单。
Quince works directly with top factories and cuts out the middleman, so you're not paying for brand markup or fancy retail stores, just paying for that quality clothing.
他们只与符合严格工艺标准和道德生产规范的工厂合作。
And they only partner with factories that meet the rigorous standards for craftsmanship and ethical production.
伙计们，你们听过我之前提到的赢家故事吧？我回家过节时，就是用Quince买了很棒的夹克和毛衣。
Guys, you heard me talk about the winner when I was going home, how I used Quince to get an awesome winner get up their jackets and sweaters when I went home for the holidays.
但我住在佛罗里达，现在该为我的衣橱开启新一季的升级了。
But I live in Florida, so now it's time to start that next evolution of the year for my wardrobe.
我正在查看他们的衬衫。
I'm checking out their shirts.
我正在浏览他们的T恤，他们的网站导航非常有趣，选择多得惊人。
I'm checking out their tees, and their website is super fun to navigate with so many options.
所以你们现在就得去Quince看看。
So you gotta go to Quince and check it out right now.
访问 quince.com/crypto101，享受免费配送和365天无理由退换。
Go to quince.com/crypto101 for free shipping and three hundred and sixty five day returns.
整整一年时间让你打造衣橱并爱上它，你一定会的。
That's a full year to build your wardrobe and love it, and you will.
现在也已登陆加拿大市场。
Now available in Canada too.
别再将就那些不耐穿的衣服了。
Don't keep settling for clothes that don't last.
去 quince，quince.com/crypto101 获取免费配送和365天无理由退换。
Go to quince, quinse.com/crypto101 for free shipping and three hundred and sixty five day returns.
Quince.com/crypto10one。
Quince.com/crypto10one.
好了，各位。
Alright, everyone.
欢迎回到 Crypto One Zero One 播客。
Welcome back to the Crypto one zero one podcast.
希望无论你身处何地，此刻都是美好的早晨或夜晚，你来对地方了，这期内容绝对精彩。
We hope everyone is having a fantastic morning, evening, because no matter where you're coming in from, you're certainly in the right place, and this is gonna be an exciting one.
今天我们邀请到了约翰·克布拉特。
We are joined here by Johann Kerbrat.
他是罗宾汉公司加密货币部门的负责人。
He is the head of crypto over at Robinhood.
他是个老面孔，也是我们节目的老朋友，而Robinhood作为一个整体，我们在这里经常提到，无论你是在社区里，还是在听我们的简报。
He's a familiar face, a friend of the podcast, and Robinhood as a whole is a group that we talk about pretty frequently over here, whether you're in the communities, you're listening to the rundowns.
甚至，即使我们在其他播客上，也喜欢引用他们所做的事。
Heck, even if we're on some podcasts, we like to reference what they're doing.
他们一直是推动加密货币以新颖和创新方式前进的主要动力和力量之一。
They've been one of the big driving factors and and forces pushing crypto forward in new and innovative ways.
所以，Johann，很高兴你再次回来。
So, Johann, it's good to have you back.
感谢你抽出时间。
We appreciate your time.
而且今天这期节目也非常特别，因为我们有一位特别的联合主持人，那就是超级制作人Tito，他今天也将加入我们。
And this is also a very special episode because we have a special cohost, on today, and that's gonna be super producer Tito joining us as well.
所以，你们两位，欢迎你们，这将是一期令人兴奋的播客。
So both of you guys, welcome, and it's it's gonna be an exciting podcast.
谢谢。
Thank you.
很高兴见到你。
Good to see you.
好久不见了，非常高兴能来到这里。
It's been a while, so excited to be here.
是的。
Yeah.
自从我们上次聊天后，发生了很多事情。
A lot has happened since we last chatted.
我的天，真难以置信。
I mean, it's hard to believe.
我觉得差不多两年了，我们刚才在节目开始前简单聊了聊。
I think it's been almost two years, and we were just catching up a little bit before the podcast started.
我跟你说，过去两年里变化真的很大。
And I'll tell you what, a lot has changed in the last two years.
从Robinhood这边看，从加密货币这边看，各种事情都在发生。
Looking at Robinhood side, looking at Crypto's side, all sorts of stuff going on.
我的意思是，当你看看你们一直在推动的代币化努力、新的加密资产时，真是挺有趣的。
I mean, when you look at the tokenization efforts that you all have been making, new crypto assets, it's funny.
我感觉每周都会收到新通知，说又有哪种加密货币被添加到我的Robinhood账户了。
I feel like I'm getting a new notification every week of, oh, this crypto has been added to my Robinhood access.
最近，你们一直在谈论Robinhood链，还有其他很多事情在发生。
Just lately, you know, you all have been talking about Robinhood Chain, and there's a lot of other things going on.
但期间有起有落，今天我们将在播客中讨论这两个方面。
But there have been ups and downs, and we're gonna talk about both ends of that during today's podcast.
因为虽然创新层出不穷，取得了大量进展，加密行业在你们这一端也随着整个业务的发展而大幅增长，但最近，我认为加密货币市场进入了一段相对低迷期，这影响了各种加密产品，包括你们在Robinhood所做的一切。
Because while there has been a ton of innovation and a ton of steps forward and the crypto industry over on your end has grown substantially as the whole business has, You know, more recently, I think crypto has been in a bit more of a slump, and, you know, that has effects on all kinds of crypto products, including what you've been doing over at Robinhood.
所以今天我准备了很多好问题，甚至可能有些棘手的问题要问你。
So got lots of good, maybe even some hard questions to go at you with today.
但在深入讨论之前，我们已经很久没见了，你能先简单介绍一下自己，以及你在Robinhood的具体工作吗？
But before we get too deep into it, again, it's been a while, can you just introduce yourself and really what you do over at Robinhood?
是的。
Yeah.
正如你所说，我叫约翰。
So like you said, I'm Johann.
我在Robinhood负责加密货币业务。
I did the crypto business at Robinhood.
我已经在公司工作了五年。
I've been at the company for five years.
我最初加入时是加密团队的工程负责人，后来在我的职业生涯中升任了该部门的负责人。
Initially, joined as a eng lead for the Crypto Group and then moved to the the the head position a bit later in the in my career here.
但我们的重点确实是所有与加密货币相关的事物。
But, yeah, our focus is really everything related to to to crypto.
从你可能最熟悉的现货交易业务，到我们现在拥有的Bitstamp交易所和在欧洲进行的代币化业务，这些都属于我管理的团队。
So from the spot trading business that you're probably the most familiar with to the Bitstamp product that we have now with the exchange and tokenization that we are doing in Europe, all of this is kind of in in the groups that I manage.
我们的目标是确保加密货币对每个人都是可访问的，并且真正利用区块链和加密技术来推动和改变金融体系，使其更快、更便宜、更普及，而不仅仅局限于那些有资源的人。
And, you know, our goal is to make sure that crypto is accessible for everybody and that we actually use blockchain and crypto technology overall to kind of grow and change the financial system so that it's a lot faster, a lot cheaper, and a lot more accessible to to everyone, not just people that have access, for example.
是的。
Yeah.
这一直很酷，因为Robinhood最初主要只是一个传统的金融经纪账户，人们可以进来。
And it's it's been cool because Robinhood originally started out as primarily just a traditional financial brokerage account where people could come in.
他们可以交易股票。
They could trade stocks.
你知道，它当时有点不同，也很创新。
You know, it was a bit different and innovative.
你知道吗？
You know?
我想这是一个很好的切入点：如果你还不了解Robinhood，我可以这么说，它是全球增长最快、领先的交易所或经纪公司之一。
I guess this is a good kind of point to lean into where if you haven't heard about Robinhood, they are, you know, what I would say is one of the fastest growing and leading exchange or brokerages in the world.
但Robinhood变得如此受欢迎的原因是，你们思考的是：如何吸引年轻一代？
But the way that Robinhood became so popular is that you all said, how can we appeal to, I think, the younger generations?
如何吸引更懂科技的人群？如何重新设计经纪公司的运作方式、外观和使用体验？
How can we appeal to people that are more tech savvy, and how can we kind of reinvent reinvent the way that brokerages are done and looked at and used?
而这其中一个美妙之处在于，它在移动设备上的用户体验要友好得多，我认为大多数用户都在移动端，而且一直如此，但你们也通过Legend软件和程序逐步扩展到了网页浏览器。
And, you know, one of the the beautiful parts of this is that it's a much more user friendly experience specifically on, like, mobile devices, which is where I believe the bulk of the users are and have been, but you guys have been expanding over into the the web browsers through the Legend software and programs.
看到这一切真的很棒，我记得很久以前，那时候……
And it's been cool to see again, I remember when I was, like, way back.
我的意思是，可能还是我在上大学的时候。
I mean, it probably was at some point while I was still in college.
你们开始添加加密货币了。
You guys started adding crypto.
我记得，是的。
And I remember Yeah.
狗狗币、比特币和以太坊都被允许交易了。
Dogecoin was allowed for trading and Bitcoin and, like, Ethereum.
当时只有极少数几种加密货币，人们可以交易这些资产。
And there's, like, a very, very few select cryptos and people could could trade these things.
如今，加密货币已经发展成为业务中非常重要的一部分，这很合理，因为加密货币的总市值已经增长到数万亿美元。
And it's ballooned into a much more major part of the business, and it makes sense because crypto's grown into the trillions of dollars in total market cap here.
在我们深入细节之前，我想先做个简短的免责声明，因为接下来我们会聊到很多精彩内容，我觉得这集会是那种我必须提前说明的一集。
Before we get too into the deep into the weeds, you know, I wanna give a quick little disclaimer because we're gonna be talking about a lot of, like, juicy information, and I just feel like this is gonna be one of those episodes where I need to throw it out there.
所以，快速说一下，各位。
So real quick, everyone.
我们在这里说的任何内容都不会构成财务建议。
You know, nothing that we say here is ever gonna be financial advice.
我们不是你们的财务顾问，所以不要把它当作建议。
We're not your financial advisers, so do not take it as such.
这些只是我们的观点，几个家伙在讨论这里发生的事情。
These are just our opinions and a couple of guys talking about what's going on here.
所以在开始之前，我觉得有必要明确这一点。
So it's I think it's important to kind of let that be known before we begin.
但让我们先从宏观层面聊聊市场，因为过去大约六个月，加密货币一直处于相当严峻的熊市，我觉得是这样。
But let's just kick things off high level about the market because for the past, man, six or so months, crypto's been in a pretty gnarly, I would say, bear market.
对吧？
Right?
比特币从12万美元跌到了6万美元。
Bitcoin's fallen from 120,000 down to 60,000.
以太坊也下跌了。
Ethereum has fallen.
比特币的跌幅大约为50%。
It's about a 50% move down for Bitcoin.
以太坊的跌幅超过60%。
Ethereum, it's over 60% to the downside.
Solana的跌幅约为70%。
Solana is about 70% to the downside.
许多这些山寨币的跌幅甚至可能超过70%。
A lot of these altcoins can be at, if not more than 70%.
人们感到有些沮丧，也有些困惑。
And people are, I think, a little bit frustrated, a little bit confused.
他们感受到了痛苦。
They feel the pain.
感觉山寨币的表现可能相对于一些大盘币来说更差。
It feels like alts have maybe underperformed in relation to some of the to some of the large caps.
你对当前发生的事情怎么看？你是如何分析的？
What do you make of what's going on right now, and how are you looking at it?
是的。
Yeah.
说实话，这确实是一个艰难的市场。
You know, I think it's a tough market for sure.
我们已经连续几个月看到这种情况了。
We we've been seeing that for for a few months now.
这种周期我们以前也见过，你知道的。
So we've seen that before, like, you know, these cycles.
我不确定自己是否真的相信大家常说的比特币四年周期，但我认为我们确实见过这样的周期——在重大事件后，人们可能会失去信心。
I don't know if I really necessarily believe in the four year cycle that everyone talks about on on Bitcoin, but I think we've seen these cycles where, you know, there's maybe a lack of trust after a big event.
比如在十月份的事件之后，许多衍生品平台出了问题，价格突然迅速下跌。
In that case, you know, following the the ten ten event where, you know, a lot of derivative platform had issues, and suddenly the price really moved quickly.
从那以后，我们就进入了这个略显疲软的熊市。
That's since then that we've seen this issue with a bit more of a bear market.
对我们来说，我们思考的问题就是继续专注于过去五年多来一直坚持的事情，也就是构建客户可以在当前市场或未来下一波行情中使用的工具，确保当行情再次到来时，我们能提供他们所需的所有功能。
And, you know, for us, what we think about it is just to focus on the same thing that we've been focusing for the past five plus years is, you know, building the tools that our customer can use to trade either on the on on this current market or in the future next wave, and and basically just focusing on making sure that we will have all the feature that they will want when, you know, the wave come back.
基于这一点，我们会看看会发生什么。
And, you know, based on that, we'll we'll see what happen.
但总体来看，我们从这个市场中看到的只是些许疑虑。
But overall, what we we've been seeing from from this market is just, like, there's a bit of doubts.
你知道，这个市场非常复杂，充满了各种微观环境，比如这个周末又发生了什么。
You know, it's also a pretty complicated market with all the microenvironment, you know, what happened this weekend again.
而且，我认为人们现在还不太确定该往哪里投资，也不确定加密货币是否一定是他们需要的选择。
And, you know, I think people are just not quite sure where to invest yet and, you know, if crypto is the right place necessary for for them.
所以，对我们来说，重点仍然是全力构建正确的工具。
So, you know, on our side, for us, it's just going to be a big focus on building the right tools, basically.
而且，你们仍在这么做，我觉得这很好。
And, like, you're still doing that, which I think is good.
你们依然专注于构建正确的工具，我们在加密领域常说一句有点老套的话，但熊市确实是建设者的市场，很多重要的工作都是在那时完成的。
Like, you're still focused on building the right tools, and we always have maybe a little bit of a cheesy saying over here in crypto, but the bear markets are really builders markets, and that's where a lot of the the big work gets done.
我知道罗宾汉在去年下半年之前对加密货币下了不少赌注。
I know Robinhood has made some big bets on crypto, you know, kinda leading into the second half of last year.
当时有很多热情。
There was a lot of excitement.
我认为现在仍然有很多热情。
I still think there is a lot of excitement on it.
但考虑到市场在过去六个月左右的变化，这些因素是否因为市场或其他正在发生的情况而有所改变？
But given how the market has shifted maybe over the last six months or so, does any of that change at all given the market or maybe other circumstances that are at work?
没有。
No.
我认为这正是罗宾汉的美妙之处。
I I think that's really the the beauty of Robinhood.
你知道，我刚加入罗宾汉时，对你提到的这一点还有些犹豫。
And, you know, initially, I joined Robinhood, I was hesitating a bit to your point.
你知道，它当时主要是一个经纪平台，我当时想，他们真的会认真对待加密货币吗？
You know, it was mostly a brokerage platform, and I was like, oh, you know, are they really going to be serious about about crypto?
但当你思考Robinhood在加密货币领域的故事时，你知道，它始于2018年，那正是历史上最大的熊市之一，当时人人都认为比特币、以太坊等将永远消亡。
But when you think about the story of crypto at Robinhood, you know, it started in 2018 in one of the biggest bear market actually where, you know, everyone thought that Bitcoin and Ethereum and everything was was dead forever.
因此，这家公司的创始人真的相信加密货币。
So the the company, the founders actually believed in it.
他们相信将各类资产的可及性带给用户，并最终让用户自己决定哪些资产适合他们的投资组合。
They believed in the idea of bringing accessibility to all type of asset to you to to the customers and giving the choice to the customer at the end of the day to invest in what they think is proper for their for their portfolio.
这种精神也贯穿了我们当前这个相对低迷的市场阶段。
And so that is kind of the same spirit that we have during this, like, slower market.
自从去年以来，我们的路线图根本没有任何改变。
We haven't even changed our road map at all since, you know, last year.
我们只是专注于实现去年六月活动上宣布的所有功能。
We are just focusing on shipping what we've been announcing last year at the June event.
比如代币化方面，我们已经从最初六月宣布的200种股票代币扩展了规模。
So everything around tokenization, for example, we've been expanding from 200 stock tokens that we announced initially in June.
现在我们拥有了超过2000种，而且我们认为，在欧洲，人们对资产种类的日益丰富感到非常兴奋。
Now we have more than 2,000, and, you know, we think that in Europe, people are pretty excited about having more and more diversity of assets.
我们一直在推出Robinhood链的测试网。
We've been launching our Robinhood Chain test net.
我们还一直在为交易者开发高级功能。
We've also been focusing on advanced feature for traders.
现在，如果你使用我们的智能交易所路由服务，你可以在Robinhood上以低至三个基点的费用进行交易。
So now you can trade on Robinhood for as low as three basis point if you use our our smart exchange routing service.
所以，过去几个月我们大力推动的这些产品，我们仍在继续开发，加密领域还有更多内容即将推出。
So, you know, all these products that we've been really pushing on in the past few months, we are still working on it, and we have a lot more to come on the crypto side.
而且，我们会利用这段技术层面相对平静的时期——比如每秒查询量减少等——来专注于夯实基础，当下一波高级交易者或大额交易潮到来时，我们就能做好准备。
And, you know, we are gonna take that period of time where it's maybe a bit more quiet on the on the tech side where, you know, there's a lot less maybe query per second and all these things to actually focus on the foundation that we can build And and when the next wave of big advanced advanced traders are coming or big volumes are coming, we'll be ready for it.
你知道什么是奇怪的吗？
You know what's wild?
有多少人在步入三十岁后，突然觉得一切都比以前更难了？
How many guys hit their thirties and suddenly everything feels harder than it used to?
你的精力下降了，专注力也不如从前，健身进展也停滞了。
Your energy dips, the focus isn't there anymore in gym progress stalls.
对话几乎总是会转向睾酮的话题。
The conversation almost always turns to testosterone.
所以我花了很多时间深入研究这个问题，不只是看标题新闻，而是查阅实际的研究、成分和数据，并与那些走过TRT道路的人交流。
So I've spent a lot of time digging into this, not just the headlines, but actual studies, ingredients, research, and talking to people who've gone down the TRT road.
一旦你真正了解了传统的TRT包含什么，就会发现它涉及终身注射、抑制身体自然生成、影响生育能力，这些都会让男性三思而后行。
And once you really understand what traditional TRT involves, it includes lifelong injections with needles, shutting down your body's natural production, fertility concerns, and it really makes guys pause.
这就是为什么我一直关注Mars Men。
That's why I've been paying attention to Mars Men.
它被设计为TRT的替代方案，无需注射，不含合成物质，仅由一系列经过充分研究的成分组成，比如通卡阿里、锌和硼，用于支持健康的睾酮功能。
It's designed as a TRT alternative, not injections, not synthetics, just a stack of well researched ingredients like Tonga Ali, zinc, and boron that are used to support healthy testosterone function.
我了解过这些成分背后的科学依据，也亲自认识一些使用它的人，他们都说自己的能量状态非常平稳。
I've seen the science behind these ingredients, and I personally know guys using it who say they love how steady their energy feels.
没有高峰，没有低谷，也不用打针。
No spikes, no crashes, and no needles.
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After checkout, make sure you tell them that Crypto $1.00 1 sent you.
你知道吗，这挺有意思的。
You know, it's funny.
刚才你还说，你几乎有点不敢加入，觉得这主要是个传统的金融股票经纪平台，可能这让你有些犹豫。
A second ago, you were, like, talking about how you're almost nervous to join, or you're like, you know, this is primarily a traditional financial kind of stock brokerage platform, and maybe that that was a hesitation for you.
我总是会看Robinhood的所有财报电话会议，最近几个季度的数据显示，加密货币贡献了Robinhood总收入的大约五分之一，也就是20%。
I always go through all of Robinhood's earnings calls, and I was looking at the past couple quarters, and crypto represents about a fifth, about 20% of Robinhood's total revenue.
你说你加入了这个平台，但当时基本上什么都没有。
And so you said, you know, you joined this thing, and it was basically nothing.
现在，在某些季度，加密货币的收入已经占到总营收的五分之一，甚至接近四分之一。
Now it represents around a fifth at some quarters pushing a quarter of of all of the revenue over there.
我是说，你是怎么把这么大的事业从无到有建立起来的？
I mean, how do you build something like that up?
我的意思是，这是一家庞大的公司，如今加密货币的收入已经占到整体营收的五分之一左右。
I mean, this is just a gigantic company, and now it's pushing around a fifth of the overall revenue.
从一无所有到取得巨大成功，从零到一百，你觉得最关键的推动因素是什么？
What have been the biggest factors to kind of get you from nothing to everything, from zero to a 100?
是的。
Yeah.
我的意思是，有很多因素，这主要得益于Robinhood平台本身的优势，以及我们能够用来构建加密业务的坚实基础。
I I you know, I mean, there is a lot of things that have been depending on just the beauty of Robinhood and the foundation that we were able to use to actually build a crypto business on.
所以最初几年，我们确实抓住了一些机会，比如你提到的上线狗狗币，那段时间我们在2021年看到了大量的交易量。
And so initially, the first few years, we we had some chance with, for example, listing Doge, to your point, where we saw a lot of volume in in 2021.
但我们也必须给予公司CEO弗拉德及其联合创始人们极大的赞誉，因为他们长期以来一直坚信，我们需要消除人们进入市场——不仅仅是加密市场，而是任何市场——的门槛。
But we also, I think, need to give a lot of credit to to the CEO of the company, Vlad, and his cofounder as well, where for a long time, they are just believing in this idea that we need to remove barrier to entry for for people to access the markets, not just crypto markets, but any markets.
如果你想想罗宾汉的投资者，其中很大一部分人是投资新手。
And if you think about the investor on Robinhood, a very large portion of them are brand new to investing.
但我们所构建的用户界面、用户体验、教育工具以及整个系统，正是帮助消除这样一种观念：投资和管理财务太过复杂。
But what the UI, the UX, the education tools, and all the system that we are building are are helping with is that, basically, we are removing this idea that investing and directing your finance is too complicated.
这并不适合你。
It's not for you.
这应该由理财顾问来完成。
It's it should be just done by a financial adviser.
相反，我们赋予你自主做出决策的权力。
Instead, we are make we are giving you the power to make the decision for yourself.
因此，你看到的是，人们从少量资金开始，试探性地参与，慢慢理解市场动态，然后逐渐投入越来越多的个人资金。
And so slowly, what you see is people starting with a little bit, testing the water a little bit, you know, trying to understand what's going on, and then slowly putting more and more of their own finance.
这同样也发生在我自己身上。
And it it's something that happened for me as well.
我十年前刚搬到美国时就开了我的Robinhood账户，现在想想。
Like, I I opened my Robinhood account when more than ten years ago, I think now, and I was just moving into The US.
我当时就觉得，这太棒了。
I was like, oh, this is awesome.
我可以自己管理我的投资。
I can actually self direct my investment.
我不必去跟银行家打交道。
I don't have to talk to a banker.
我不必打电话。
I don't have to pick up the phone.
你知道的。
You know?
我就是那种特别讨厌打电话咨询财务顾问的人。
And I'm one of these, like, guy who hates picking up a phone to talk about, you know, just your your financial advisement adviser.
所以我认为，这正是帮助我们成功打造全新经纪业务和加密货币业务的关键因素之一。
So I I think that's been really one of the key factor that helped us really build on top of, you know, the the entire brokerage that we had, brand new crypto business.
但另一点是，创始人坚信我们应该投资于技术。
But the the other thing is there was this strong belief from the founder that we should invest into the technology.
我认为这与一些竞争对手形成了鲜明对比，他们推出了加密业务，但在2021年又关闭了。
And and and I think it's a big differentiator from some of our competitors where you saw some of them, you know, they they they launch crypto business, and they shut it down in 2021.
是的。
Yep.
然后他们又重新推出了。
Then they launched it again.
这给他们带来了困难，一是没有足够的时间来建立基础，真正开发出围绕它的所有功能。
And and that just creates, one, difficulties for them to build on top of it because they don't have that time to actually build a foundation and and really build all the feature that are around it.
所以他们通常会使用第三方服务。
So what they do, usually, they use a third party.
因此在功能、成本等方面都存在很多限制。
So you have a lot of limitation on term of features, in term of cost, and all these kind of things.
其次，这也限制了团队只能专注于交易本身，而无法涉足更多领域。
And two, it also doesn't allow the team to work on more than just the the trading aspect.
因此，我认为对我们来说，得到CEO的大力支持，并确保始终将加密货币纳入我们的考量，这为我们赢得了正确的定位。
And so I think for us, having the strong support from, you know, the the CEO and making sure that crypto is always something that we think about has been the right push to put us in in that seat.
而且，去年让我们感到兴奋的是，我们首次真正推动并使用加密货币，不仅仅用于资产交易。
And and, you know, I think last year, what was exciting for us is that for the first time, we were really pushing and using crypto for for not just trading of assets.
例如，我们推出了质押服务。
We we launched staking, for example.
我们推出了股票代币的代币化资产。
We launched the tokenized assets for for stock tokens.
我们现在拥有所有这些美国股票和ETF的代币化版本。
So we we have all these US stocks and ETFs that are now tokenized.
我认为这对我们的团队来说也非常令人兴奋，因为这是我们首次将加密技术用于加密世界之外，而是通过引入区块链的所有创新来改进传统金融体系。
And I think that's really also exciting for our team because for the first time, we use the crypto technology for more than just the crypto world, but we are actually improving the traditional finance system by bringing all the innovation of of blockchain.
因此，透明度、默认的可分割性、即时性——这些目前在传统金融市场上仍然缺失的特性。
So, you know, transparency, fractionalization by default, instance element, all these things that are still missing right now in the in the TRI FI market.
是的。
Yeah.
它们是。
They are.
你提到了一些不同的产品，我们接下来会深入探讨其中几个。
And, you know, you mentioned a couple of different products in there, and we're gonna get into a couple of those as we kind of move on.
当你在讲述这些时，我想到一点，你提到其他公司也曾尝试过类似的事情。
One of the thoughts that I had as you were going through those and you made the reference that, like, other companies have tried to do this.
有些公司关闭了这些业务。
Some of them close it down.
有些公司则坚持了下来。
Some of them keep it up.
我们注意到的一个趋势是，Robinhood 不仅在加密货币领域，甚至在普通经纪体验方面，都成为了潮流引领者。
One of the trends that we've noticed is that it feels like Robinhood has been a trendsetter in not just crypto, but I think in the average brokerage experience.
我们经常看到的情况是——这并不是在恭维，而是我们确实在其他播客或内部讨论中提到过：你们推出某项功能后，过几个月，甚至一年左右，其他券商就会跟进，无论是加密功能还是其他任何功能。
What we often see, and this isn't just to glaze, but this has, like, actually been something that we talk about on other podcasts or rundowns in, you know, some of our other communities, is that you all will launch something, and then it feels like maybe a couple months later, maybe a year or so later, you see another brokerage try to do it, whether it's different crypto features or, you know, whatever it may be.
然后突然间，它就出现了，就像这样：嘿。
And then all of a sudden, it comes, and it's like, hey.
你们正在将股票代币化。
You guys are tokenizing stocks.
我认为这一直是一个很好的例子，你们作为一家主要的经纪账户，率先宣布要这么做。
I think that's been, like, one of the great examples is you guys have come out as a primary brokerage account and said, we're gonna do this.
你们在欧洲各地提供了数千种这样的资产。
You have thousands of them that are across and available throughout Europe.
你们谈到要创建自己的区块链，以及在那里进行大量的其他代币化工作。
You talk about creating your own chain, you know, doing a lot of other tokenization work over there.
然后你开始看到其他经纪公司，甚至可能是竞争对手，也不得不跟进。
Then you start seeing other other brokerage and maybe competitors, dare I say, dude as well.
这会不会让你感到沮丧？
Does that ever get, like, frustrating?
你们会不会回头看看背后的团队，说：‘这些人又来了？’
Do you ever, like, look to the team in the background and you're like, these guys are doing it again?
你知道，我觉得这是一个很有趣的问题。
You know, I think it's a it's an interesting one.
我们并不太关注其他人在做什么，是的。
We we don't necessarily spend a lot of time not looking what the other Yeah.
他们正在推出什么，或者是否在试图追赶之类的。
Are launching or if they're trying to catch up or whatever.
我认为我们更兴奋的是，我们推出的任何产品，都希望确保有独特优势，并且在某些方面比竞争对手做得更好。
I think what we are more excited about is any product that we launch, we wanna make sure that there's a differentiator, and we wanna make sure that it's it's better at some level than than what the competition is doing.
所以，有时候我们并不是第一个推出产品的。
So, you know, sometimes we are not the first one to launch a product.
比如质押或其他类型的产品，我们肯定不是第一个。
You know, I think, for example, staking or or other type of products, we we were definitely not the first one.
但我们花了很多时间与客户交流，主动接触他们，进行用户研究，观察他们对界面和用户体验的反应。
But what we did instead is spending a lot of time with customer, coming to them and, you know, doing user research, seeing how they react to the UI and UX.
他们理解自己在做什么吗？
Did they understand what they were doing?
我们需要增加更多教育内容吗？
Do we need to add more education?
所有这些方面，我们都在努力让体验变得非常独特。
All these kind of things and and really trying to make the experience pretty unique.
我认为，这正是Robinhood的秘诀所在：有时我们为推出一个产品所花的时间可能比竞争对手还要多，但我们相信，用户的界面、体验、一致性以及整体感受会更好。
And and I think that's kind of the secret sauce for for Robinhood is sometimes we we probably spend a bit more time than what the competitor will do to launch a product, but we think that the UI, UX, coherence, and and the experience overall for the customer is is is better.
我们在所有推出的产品中都能看到这一点，比如加密货币；再比如我们的信用卡，其奖励机制非常独特，卡片设计也极具特色。我们试图解决一些现有问题——比如某些信用卡只对精英开放，而我们则让所有人都能轻松获得。
And you see it across all the the products that we've launched, like, just crypto, but if you think about our credit card, for example, with with the the reward that is pretty unique, the design of the card that is really unique, You know, we we try to to take an existing problem where some of these cards are only allowed for the elites, and we actually make it more accessible to everybody.
此外，我们还试图融入那种难以模仿和比较的秘诀。
And on top of that, we try to bring the the the the secret sauce where we are going to give something that is very hard to to to match and and to compare.
但我认为，这也充分体现了所有在这里工作的团队的卓越贡献。
But I I also think, you know, it's a big compliment for all the team that are working here.
当我们看到有人试图复制我们刚刚推出的产品时，这说明我们确实击中了目标，而且让他们也足够兴奋，以至于想要模仿打造。
Like, when we see someone trying to do the exact same thing that we just launched, it it it means that we we actually hit the target and that it made them excited enough to actually try to build as well.
因此，看到竞争对手如何反应，并努力从他们手中争取更多市场份额，总是很有意思的。
So, you know, I will say it's it's always interesting to see how the competition react and and to work towards, like, grabbing more market share from them.
是的。
Yeah.
你们的口号是让金融惠及所有人，你们确实做到了。
Democratize finance for all is your guys' slogan, and you definitely you definitely do that.
作为信用卡持卡人，当你们推出这张卡时，我记得布兰登也记得，我是最早被选中的用户之一。
As a credit card holder, I when you guys rolled that out, remember Brendan remembers, I was one of the first people I got, I got selected.
我拿到了卡，而当时所有人都还在排队等候。
I got it, and everybody was still on the wait list, you know, waiting for it.
我感到很荣幸。
And I felt I felt honored.
这是一种特权。
It was a privilege.
那里的用户界面体验真的非常棒。
And then the UI experience there was was really awesome.
奖励计划也很酷。
The rewards program's cool.
有个问题。
Question.
你之前提到过，说我们并没有真正改变我们的路线图。
You you mentioned earlier, you said we haven't really changed anything to our road map.
所以问题的第一部分是，在当前这个构建者市场中，如果你们没有做出改变，那你们正在加倍投入什么？
So the kind of the first part of the question is if you haven't changed while we're in this build builders market, what are you doubling down on?
然后第二部分是，我对你们如何看待那些长期身处加密领域、已经多年从事建设的人非常感兴趣。
And then the kind of the second part to that is I'm really interested in in your take on somebody who's been in the crypto space for so long, somebody who has been building for years.
AI这一叙事已经渗透到不仅仅是加密市场，而是整个股票市场。
The AI narrative that has just penetrated not just the crypto market, but the entire, you know, stock market as a whole.
我们在梳理过程中发现，IGV软件股的交易方式与比特币非常相似。
And we found it interesting on our rundown how kind of the IGV software stock is traded similarly to Bitcoin.
所以比特币可能从根本上被裹挟进了这一叙事之中。
So maybe Bitcoin's gotten wrapped up in that narrative fundamentally.
你对此有什么看法？
Do you have a take on that?
AI是如何没有影响你们的路线图，或者让它变得更快、更好的？
And how has AI not affected your road map or made it affected, made it faster, made it better?
作为这个领域的资深人士，你对此有什么看法？
What's your thought on that just as a, you know, somebody who's a veteran in the space?
是的。
Yeah.
我的意思是，AI可能是过去几年中最令人兴奋的进展，它正在以多种方式彻底改变我们的工作方式。
I mean, AI is probably the most exciting thing in the past few years where it it's really changing the way we are working in a lot of ways.
起初，我们专注于将这些工具引入公司内部，确保每位员工都能开始使用这些工具，理解AI，这确实带来了一种全新的工作方式。
So initially, we we focused a lot in bringing the tools internally, making sure that everyone at the company can start using these tools, can start understanding AI, and and it's really different way of working now.
比如，你可以让完全不懂技术的人通过聊天代理查询非常复杂的数据库并执行复杂的查询。
Like, you know, for example, you can have someone who's not technical at all querying very complex databases and making very complex queries through just a chat agent.
这真正改变了我们的产品经理、合规团队或法律团队的工作方式，赋予了他们更多的自主权，说实话，也让一切变得更高效。
So that really changed the way that our product manager or or compliance or legal teams are are working, and it really gives them a lot more autonomy, and it just makes everything faster, to be honest.
他们不再需要不断找数据科学家或工程师来获取技术答案。
Like, they don't have to constantly talk to a data science person or an engineer to to get some technical answer.
这已经是一个巨大的变化。
So that's been a big change.
工程团队也是如此。
Same thing for engineering.
现在我们有很多工具帮助工程师更快地开发。
Now we have a lot of these tool that are helping engineer build faster.
你可以把它当作一个辅助代理，帮你写代码或写查询，甚至有些代理可以直接编写代码并将其部署。
So, you know, you can use it as a kind of an agent on the side that helps you write code or write queries, and you can even have, like, some agents, like, just writing the code itself and and shipping it.
这带来了巨大的突破。
So that that has been a huge unlock.
我们现在看到大量代码是由AI编写的、由AI审查的、由AI部署的。
We see a lot of our code now being written by AI, being reviewed by AI, being deployed by AI.
所有这些都真正改变了我们交付产品的方式和速度。
So, you know, all of that is really kind of changing the way we are we are able to ship and the pace we are able to ship at.
我认为这对我们来说非常令人兴奋。
And I think that's pretty exciting for us.
我曾经是一名工程师。
You know, I used to be an engineer.
有时候，你可能会花很多时间去修复一个小bug或问题，或者一些你之前不知道、必须先学习才能编写代码或做类似事情的东西。
Sometimes the amount of time you will spend just on fixing a little bug or problem or or something that you didn't know, you had to learn before you could really code or anything like that.
现在这些问题基本解决了，你可以专注于真正复杂的难题，比如如何设计一个特殊的系统，如何让它们彼此通信，以及所有这些类似的事情。
Now it's it's kind of solved, and you can just focus on really the complex problem and really thinking about how are you going to architect a special service, how are you going to make them talk to each other, and and all of these kind of things.
因此，这已经成为一个重要的差异化优势。
So that has been a big differentiator.
我们也在大力开发面向客户的AI工具。
We're also focusing a lot on building AI tools for customers.
我们为此做了一些演示。
So, you know, we we made some demonstration of that.
我们有一个情绪交易工具。
We have a vibe trading tool.
我们有一个助手，可以为你提供关于投资组合的信息。
We have an assistant that gives you, like, information about your portfolio.
所有这些在Robinhood都是独一无二的，因为我们拥有大量关于你的投资组合、风险偏好以及你历史行为的数据。
All of this is pretty unique to Robinhood because we have this all this data that we have about your portfolio, about your risk appetite, about your, you know, what you've been doing historically.
而且，我觉得我们将能够做一些非常独特的事情，你会喜欢的——我不知道你有没有看过十一月的活动，但我们确实能够根据客户的具体情况定制响应类型。
And, you know, I think we'll be able to do something that is pretty unique, and and you will like, I don't know if you saw the the event in in November, but we were really able to customize the type of response based on the on on the customer.
所以当你问助手时，比如‘我是不是在某种产品上配置过重？’或者‘在X Y Z情况下你会怎么做？’
And so when you were asking, like if you're asking to the assistant, like, am I too heavy on one specific type of products, or what will you do for x y z situation?
这种个性化的回答是非常独特的。
Having this kind of personalized answer is is is pretty unique.
在我们这边，特别是在加密货币方面，我们也非常关注我们的API。
And on our side, on the on the crypto side, we're also focusing a lot on our API.
我们有一个加密货币API，你可以使用它来查询并构建任何你想要的东西。
We have a a crypto API that you can use, and you can basically query and, you know, build anything that you want around it.
这个周末我玩了一下，用云服务和我们的API创建了一个小型交易机器人，效果非常惊人。
I was playing this weekend over creating a small, like, trading bot with Cloud and, you know, using our API, and it was pretty incredible.
我想我大概只用了四十五分钟就让东西跑起来了。
Like, I think in maybe forty five minutes, I had something up and running.
然后我可以告诉智能体继续优化这个交易机器人。
And then I could say to the agent to keep, like, optimizing the the trading bot.
所以最终，我弄出了一个相当复杂的系统，直接通过Robinhood API进行加密货币交易。
And so at the end of the day, I had something, like, pretty sophisticated that was directly querying the Robinhood API to to trade on crypto.
我认为，这类事情会越来越多：智能代理将接管你日常需要处理的基本任务，帮你执行并不断优化，让你更深入地思考自己的投资组合和理财策略。
And and I think, you know, that's the kind of thing that we are going to see more and more is agents that are going to take over kind of the basic tasks that you're looking at and being able to execute it for you and and making it better and making you think about your your, you know, your portfolio and your investment a bit more.
所以，根据你刚才说的，我理解你是通过Claude创建了一个交易算法或交易机器人，然后将其集成到了你的Robinhood账户中，是这样吗？
So I guess in line with what you just said, it sounded like you were saying that you created a, you know, trading algorithm or trading bot through Claude, and then you were able to integrate that into your Robinhood account.
对吗？
Is that true?
是的。
Yeah.
在加密货币方面，我们构建了一个专属API。
For the for the crypto side, we we have an API that we built.
我们之前很少提及这个产品，所以它并不是最受欢迎的。
We've never talked too much about it, so it's it's it's not the most used product.
但如果你访问docs.robinhood.com，就能看到如何创建你自己的API密钥的所有详细信息。
But if you go on docs.robinhood.com, you will see all the the details to to create your own API key.
你会看到所有可用于下单、查看交易历史以及其他类似功能的端点。
You will see all the endpoint that you can use to to place orders, look at your history, all these kind of things.
因此，我们认为这越来越重要，因为我觉得这就是未来对某些管理员而言的发展方向。
So it's something that we we think is more and more important because I think that's where the the world is going for some administrator.
他们希望有更多这样的算法为他们工作，基本上就是这样。
They will wanna have more of this, like, algo working for them, basically.
这太有趣了。
So that's fascinating.
我的意思是，人们似乎可以创建更复杂的积累策略，而不仅仅是简单的定期定额投资，比如每天或每周买一点比特币。
So, I I mean, it seems like people could create more complex strategies of accumulation as opposed to just a simple dollar cost average where it's like, oh, every single day, I'll buy every single week, I'll buy a little Bitcoin.
人人都知道这一点，但我认为其中可以有更多的细微差别，比如：
Like, everyone knows that, but I think that there can be a bit more nuance to it where it can say, hey.
每当价格低于200日移动平均线，或者RSI低于30时，我就想买入。
Every time there is every day that we're beneath the two hundred day moving average or every day that the RSI is extended below a 30, I wanna be buying.
是否有可能实现这种更复杂的触发条件，从而形成持续的买入机会？
Is that mean is it possible to make more complex triggers like that into, like, consistent buying opportunities?
我的意思是，这正是使用云服务的美妙之处。
I I I mean, that's that was a beauty for me of using cloud.
我未必是最复杂的交易员，但我实际上能够创建所有这些不同的策略。
It was just like I I'm not necessarily the most sophisticated trader, but I was actually able to create all these different strategies.
你知道，在启动机器人之前，他会进行分析，以判断市场是处于熊市还是牛市。
You know, right before launching the bots, he will do an analysis to understand if it's in a bear market or in a bull market.
每小时它都会重置，以确保分析仍然准确。
Every hour, it will just reset to make sure that the analysis is still good.
你还能构建更多功能。
And there is so much more you could build.
比如，我还没做过，但你可以连接到某个平台，接入新闻，更好地了解世界正在发生什么。
Like, I haven't done it, but you could connect to x and connect to news and understand a bit more, like, what's going in the world.
但对我们来说，非常重要的是这个基础层：一旦机器人或客户想要做出决策，他们就能通过API实际下达订单。
But I think for us, what's very important is, I think, this foundational layer where once the bot or once the customer wants to make a decision, they are able to actually place the orders through the API.
所以，你知道，云服务提供了一种方式来实现这一点，或者无论你用的是什么云服务。
And so, you know, Cloud has a way to to do it or Cloud or whatever, I'll go you're you're using.
但我觉得，我花在这件事上的时间，相比2017年左右我刚开始在不同平台之间做套利的时候，简直少了很多。
But I I think just the time that it took me to do that compared to the first time I did that in back in 2017 or something when we're when I was doing arbitrage between different platform.
你知道，可能只花了十分之一的时间，甚至更少，而且结果也比以前复杂和精细得多。
You know, it took me, like, maybe tenth of the time if even, and the the the the result is so much more sophisticated than it used to be.
这非常有趣，因为我们正处在一个每个人都谈论智能体和人工智能如何帮助我们的时代。
That is fascinating because we're in a world where everyone's talking about agents and AI and how they can help us.
我喜欢这种努力，某种程度上是在主动拥抱这一点，说：嘿。
And I like that there's, you know, some effort here to kinda lean into that and say, hey.
让我们看看这些东西到底能做什么。
You know, let's let's see what these things can do.
所以我对此很感兴趣。
So I'm interested.
我们团队里有两个分析师，他们对这方面研究得非常深入。
You know, we have two guys on the team, two analysts that are just so in the weeds on that.
有时候他们想跟我讲这些，但我完全听不懂。
And sometimes they're trying to talk to me about it, and it goes over my head.
而其他时候，我会觉得，我们竟然已经发展到可以做到这些事情的地步，简直难以置信。
And then other times, I'm like, it's almost unbelievable that we've gotten to a point where you can do some of these things.
所以如果你正在听，注意一下人工智能正在发生的变化。
So if you're listening out there, pay attention to what's happening with AI.
我认为，它的扩展速度以及成长和成熟速度，比许多人的预期都要快。
I think it's scaling faster, and it's it's growing and maturing faster than a lot of people expected.
而且你几乎可以拥有，就像你所说的，一个能够与你并肩工作的智能代理，它最了解你，能够以一种非常稳定、近乎机械的方式帮你处理一些基础琐碎的任务或其他事情，我认为这很有用，因为很多错误往往源于人类的决策，尤其是在金融市场中。
And you can almost have, like you said, this agent, this partner that can work alongside you, knows you best, and is able to just help you with basic menial tasks or or other things in a very just, I don't know, like, consistent robotic way, which I think is useful because a lot of error tends to come through, like, human decisions, especially in the financial markets.
所以是的。
So yeah.
我的意思是，是的，如果你是听众，继续关注这一点。
I mean, yeah, if you're a listener out there, continue to keep an eye out on that.
我想回到我们之前提到的一个话题，那就是代币化股票的问题。
I wanna go back to a talking point that we had a little bit earlier, which was on the tokenized stock setting.
因为‘代币化’这个词，以及现实世界资产这个概念，每周都在我们的节目和社群中被频繁提及。
Because the world token the word tokenization, the whole idea of it, real world assets, this stuff is thrown around weekly on our shows and in our communities.
每个人都喜欢这么做。
Everyone loves to do it.
你知道，他们总是喜欢举例子，比如拉里谈论token化市场规模可能达到万亿美元，还有政界不同人士、银行、资产管理公司等都在谈论这个话题。
You know, they always like to use the example, oh, Larry thinks talking about how there can be trillions of dollars in tokenized market cap, and, you know, different people in politics are talking about it, and banks and asset managers and all these other things.
但你们一直是主要推动者之一，一直在说：嘿。
But you all are are have been, like, one of the primary drivers saying, hey.
我们实际上将推出数千只代币化股票，目前主要集中在欧洲。
We're actually gonna launch thousands of tokenized stocks, which is primarily across Europe now.
所以我的问题是，你能简单给我们介绍一下到目前为止进展如何，以及情况是怎样的吗？
So my question was, can you just walk us through maybe how that's gone so far and what that looks like?
是的。
Yeah.
我的意思是，我们在扩大股票数量方面一直面临大量需求。
I mean, we we we've been having a lot of demand on expanding the the number of stocks.
你知道，很多人其实对开始使用这项服务感到兴奋，但最初我们只有两只股票，这让他们感到沮丧。
You know, I think a lot of people were actually excited about starting to use it and got frustrated by the fact that, you know, we only had two on one at the beginning.
因此，这是我们关注的重点，我认为代币化系统的美妙之处在于，我们构建了一个能够适用于任何类型资产的引擎。
So that was a lot of our focus, and think that's the beauty of the tokenization system is we built this engine that could actually work for any type of assets.
我认为，这在回顾过去金融工具的构建方式时是非常独特的。
And that, I think, is pretty unique when you think about the way that financial instruments were built back in the days.
对我们而言，欧盟的公开股票可以说是实现我们愿景的初始步骤。
And really, for us, public stocks in the in the EU were kind of like the the step zero of, like, the vision that we have.
我们希望扩展到远远不止美国市场。
So we wanna expand to way more than just The US markets.
我们希望未来能够连接任何类型的交易所，因为目前仍存在一个大问题：连接一两个交易所很简单，但当你想接入更多交易所时，就变得非常困难。
We wanna be able to make it connecting to any type of exchange in the future because one of the big issues that you're still seeing is that it's very simple to connect to one or or two exchanges, but then it's very hard when you wanna get access to to a lot more.
例如，作为一个美国人，如果你想在伦敦交易所或新加坡交易所购买股票，会很困难且复杂。
So for example, as an American, if you wanna buy on the London exchange or on the Singapore exchange, it's it's hard and and difficult.
在其他国家也是如此，如果你想获取美国股票或欧洲股票，同样非常困难。
And same thing in other countries where if you actually wanna get access to US stocks or to European stocks, it's it's very difficult.
因此，我认为代币化的美妙之处就在这里。
And so I think tokenization is kind of the beauty here.
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这就像是我们有了一个层，可以让所有这些类型的资产变得可访问。
It's like we can have this this layer that will make accessible all these type of assets.
无论你身在何处，只需一个自托管钱包，就可以交易和持有这些资产。
And then no matter where you are, you just need a self custody wallet, and you can trade, and you can hold this asset.
你仍然能获得股息收益。
You will still get the dividend proceed.
你仍然能获得公司行动后的权益。
You will still debt you'll still get what's what happened after a corporate action.
所以，再次强调，这消除了进入壁垒，提高了可及性，从而增加了市场的流动性。
So so it just, once again, like, removes the barriers to entry and increase the accessibility and, therefore, the liquidity in the market.
但同样的系统也可以用于其他任何东西。
But the same system can be used for anything else.
我们可以设想一个房地产被代币化的世界。
Like, we could see a world where, you know, real estate is tokenized.
你和云一起构建的代理也可以被代币化，因为它非常优秀，或者其他原因。
The agent that you're building with cloud is tokenized because it's very good or whatever.
你知道，这里有着真正无限的可能性，我认为这正是让我们兴奋的地方，因为现在这仅仅是个开始。
You know, there there is, like, really unlimited possibility, and I think that's really what we we get excited about because right now, it's just, like, the first step.
是的，正如你所说，目前仅限于欧盟。
And, yeah, to your point, it's it's just in the EU.
我们正在努力让更多这类资产开放。
We are working into opening these assets more and more.
我认为，你会看到你提到的那些竞争对手不断在此基础上构建更多功能，因为这将变得高效得多，大幅降低每个人的成本，最终不使用代币化进行交易将毫无意义。
And I think, you know, you will see a lot of these competitors that you were mentioning building more and more on top of it because it's just going to be so much more efficient and reduce the cost for everybody that at some point, it will just not make sense for you to not use tokenization to to trade.
我只是想插一句，布兰登，我想看看你能带我们深入到什么地步，关于你认为代币化能走多远，因为你们现在正在推出信用卡。
I I just to jump in, Brendan, I I wanted to see how far down the rabbit hole you could take us with where you think the tokenization could go because, again, you're rolling out credit cards.
我仔细研究了你们的房贷申请流程，那是一个与……合作的项目，不是Robinhood房贷公司，而是你们的合作伙伴。
I went down and and went through your mortgage application process, which, was a partnership with the, you know, it wasn't the Robinhood mortgage firm you're partnering.
但这是否属于你们的路线图？也许你不能透露，但你们是否在考虑：如果我们能让人们把房贷上链，那能不能也把车贷上链？
But like, is that is that something that's tied into your roadmap and maybe you can't speak on it, but is that what you're looking for of like, hey, if we can get people partnered with their mortgages and bring it on chain, can we do car loans and bring it on chain?
我们能不能把信用卡也上链？
Can we bring credit cards and bring it?
这是否就是未来的发展方向？
Is that is that where it the puck might be going?
你们有在考虑这一点吗？
Is that something you guys are thinking about?
是的。
Yeah.
当然，我们的目标是做更多事情。
Definitely, the the idea is to do a lot more.
我认为我们并不一定非要将抵押贷款直接上链之类。
And I think it's not necessarily like we wanna offer mortgage on chain or or something like that.
但例如，如果你上链，用你的资产作为抵押将会变得越来越容易。
But for example, using your asset as collateral is going to become more and more easier if you go on chain, for example.
比如，如果你想用一点点抵押物，比如你投资组合中的一点股票，来申请抵押贷款或小额贷款，通常会很困难。
Like, if if you try to get a mortgage with just a little bit or or a small loan with just a little bit of collateral that is, I don't know, your your stock on your portfolio, it it's often fairly difficult.
他们会要求大幅折价。
They they take an haircut.
有很多规则。
There's, like, a lot of rules.
但在链上，你现在其实可以相当容易地实现很多这些功能。
But on chain, you can actually do a lot of this pretty easily currently.
目前，这更多是针对加密资产，而不是其他任何东西，但你可以想象一个世界，在那里代币化资产将更容易被用作抵押品来借款。
Like, right now, it's more for for crypto asset than than for anything, but you can see this world where tokenized assets are going to be a lot more easy to to pledge against, to borrow against, to have as collateral.
我认为这将彻底改变整个系统的运作方式，因为所有东西都将变成智能合约。
And I and I think that's going to be, frankly, like a game changer for for how all the system works because you will remove a lot like, everything is a smart contract.
对吧？
Right?
因此，你将能够大幅减少申请抵押贷款或贷款时所需的大量工作。
So you will be able to remove a lot of the work that is happening when you apply for mortgage or for loan.
由于你能通过区块链访问该特定钱包或客户的完整历史记录，因此你可以更快地完成信用评估。
You will be able to do underwriting a lot faster because you will have access to all the stories through the blockchain of this specific wallet or customer.
所以，事情实际上应该会得到优化。
So things should actually be optimized.
成本应该会更低，我认为这正是它的美妙之处。
The cost should be smaller, and I think that's that's kind of the beauty of it.
在一个适用于美国股票和ETF的世界里，我不明白为什么它不能适用于你身后的一幅画，或者你车库里的一辆车。
And, you know, in a world where it works for US stocks and ETF, I don't see why it wouldn't work for, you know, the piece of art that you have behind you or for, like, the car that you have in your garage.
所有这些类型的资产都应该能够被代币化，并在去中心化金融世界中越来越广泛地使用。
Like, all these type of assets should be able to be tokenized and used more and more in the DeFi world.
我认为人们对代币化的一个误解是，他们会问：我为什么要用它？
I think one of the misunderstandings that people have about tokenization is they go, why do I need to use it?
我为什么不能直接正常地去做呢？
Why can't I just go and and do it normally?
但事实上，事情并没有那么简单。
When in reality, it's not quite as simple as that.
回到股票的类比。
Know, going back to the stock analogy.
对吧？
Right?
对于许多欧洲人来说，他们无法直接购买并获得美国股票的敞口。
For a lot of those people that are in Europe, they can't just go and buy and get exposure to US stocks.
你知道，在美国，获得美国股票的渠道可能更容易一些，但即使是全球股票，如果你在美国，也能通过各种ETF和产品获得大量投资机会。
You know, maybe in The States, it's a little bit easier to obviously get access to US stocks, but even global stocks, if you're in The US, you get a lot of access through different ETFs and different products.
但对于世界其他地区和全球金融体系来说，这并不容易。
But to the rest of the world, the rest of the global financial system, it's not as easy.
因此，对于许多欧洲人来说，如果他们想获得美国股票的敞口，尤其是单个股票，这并不容易。
And so for a lot of the people in Europe, if they wanna go and get, you know, exposure to US stocks, it's not as easy, especially, like, individual pieces.
所以，这项技术的意义在于：嘿。
And so what this does is this is saying, hey.
过去，这可能很困难，甚至根本不可能，但现在突然变得可行了，我认为这带来了许多改变。
Previously, this was difficult, maybe not even possible, and now all of a sudden, it's possible, which I think does a lot of things.
我再次认为，这增加了流动性，吸引了新的资本，并创造了一个全新的潜在市场，让以前可能希望获得敞口的人也能参与进来。
I would argue again that that increases liquidity, that brings new capital in, you create a whole new addressable market of people who previous probably would have wanted exposure.
如果你回顾过去几十年，美国股市和金融体系就像是黄金标准。
If you look at the last couple of decades, like, The US stock market and financial system is, like, the golden bar.
是的
Mhmm.
这就是人们想投资的东西。
That's what people wanna be invested in.
它是世界上最大的。
It's the largest in the world.
它为其他一切设定了标准。
It sets the standard for everything else.
许多大型科技公司和基础设施公司都集中在这里。
It's where a lot of the big growth in tech companies and infrastructure companies just are.
我认为代币化正是做到了这一点。
And I think tokenization does that.
它在问：我们如何为那些此前毫无机会或机会极其有限的人提供途径？
It's saying, how can we give people who have had no opportunity or very limited opportunity to do this?
现在，我们正在为他们创造获得敞口的方式。
And now we're creating a way for them to have exposure.
我认为，正如蒂沃所提到的，这项技术还可以应用于许多其他领域，我们会继续看到它的各种形式，对此我感到非常兴奋。
And I think, Tivo, to your point, there's a lot of other areas that this can go into, and we'll continue to see different forms of it, and I'm excited about it.
我们还需要继续跟进。
And we'll have to just continue to track.
有没有具体的时间表？
Is there any date?
我不知道你是否能透露这个信息。
I don't know if you're allowed to say this.
有没有一个时间点，比如我们什么时候能在北美获得访问权限，或者其他大洲的地区什么时候能获得访问？
Is there any date as to, like, maybe when we can expect to get access to that in The US or maybe when, like, different parts of, like, other continents can get access?
是的。
Yeah.
目前还没有具体日期。
No dates right now.
我们目前正在全力以赴地推进，这目前是我们的首要任务之一。
We're we're just working pretty hard on it, and and that's one of our our top priority at at this point.
而且正如你所说，你完全正确。
And and I think to your point, you were absolutely right.
我想我还可以补充更多，比如24/7的特性。
I think I could even add more, like, for example, the twenty four seven aspect.
你知道，如果你想想欧洲，它距离纽约已经有六个小时，距离加州则有九个小时。
You know, if you think about Europe, it it's already six hours from New York or nine hours from from California.
当你已经吃过晚饭之类的，要一直活跃在整个市场上是相当困难的。
It's pretty hard to be, like, active on the entire market when, you know, you you had dinner or something like that.
是的。
Yeah.
你还要考虑周末的问题。
You also have the questions of weekends.
你知道，代币化带来了24/7的交易特性，看看上个周末甚至更早的周末发生了多少事情。
You know, tokenization bring you this twenty four seven trading aspect, and look at all the thing that happens on on weekend, like, even last weekend.
这对市场产生了影响。
That has an impact on the market.
对吧？
Right?
那为什么你不能交易它呢？
So why should you not be able to to trade it?
我认为这就是代币化真正会改变事情的地方。
I I think that's where tokenization is really going to to to change things.
至于你提到的可访问性，完全正确。
And then to your point on accessibility, like, 100%.
还有很多国家，人们仍然很难开设经纪账户，也无法充值，因为他们没有平台所使用的相同支付方式，而我们正在构建的产品可以简化所有这些问题。
The amount of countries that is still, you know, very difficult to open a brokerage account, to fund the account because they don't necessarily have the same payment method that the the platform is using, All of this can be simplified with with what we are building.
我很好奇。
I am curious.
周末交易这个事情要怎么运作？
How is the trading on weekends thing going to work?
这挺有趣的。
It's funny.
我有个朋友跟我聊起这事，他说：他们是怎么做到的？
I just had a buddy who was talking to me, and they go, how do they make this possible?
我说，其实你们刚开始在工作日提供24小时交易时，我也问过自己同样的问题。
And I said, you know, I I asked myself the same question when you all started adding twenty four hour trading during the weeks.
我当时就想，半夜也能交易，但股市交易所明明是关闭的。
And I was like, you can trade in the middle of the night, but the stock exchanges are closed.
这既不是盘后交易，也不是盘前交易。
Like, that's after the after hours, and it's before the morning hours.
这到底是怎么做到的？
Like, how is that possible?
我当时想，我也不知道。
And I was like, I don't know.
这可能是个值得去问他们的问题。
That's probably a good question to to talk to them about.
你们所推动的‘24/7’交易——不是24/5，而是真正的24小时不间断交易——其底层架构是基于代币化构建的，还是仅仅是一种不同的金融科技形式？
Is the backbones of this, you know, for '24 not even twenty four five, but twenty four seven trading, which is what you all are pushing for, is the backbones of that built through tokenization, or is the backbone of that just like a different form of, like, financial tech?
我们构建的代币化平台是基于区块链技术的。
Well, so so what we are building on tokenize is is using blockchain technology.
对于我们在美国推出的$24.05服务，目前并没有使用区块链。
For for $24.05 that we have in The US, it's it's not currently using blockchain.
嗯。
Mhmm.
我们拥有庞大的分销网络。
And it's just we we have, you know, this this large distribution.
我们有众多做市商与我们合作。
We have all these market makers that are working with us.
因此，我们能够通过ATS来实现这一点。
And and so they are able to we're we're able to do that through through an ATS.
但我认为，对于24/7交易来说，问题还是一样的。
But I I think for twenty four seven, it's going to be same question.
最初，只会有一些流动性提供者和客户在使用，但随着时间推移，它会逐渐成为常态，并在日常交易中变得越来越重要。
You know, initially, it's going to be, like, just a few liquidity providers and customer using it, but slowly, it's going to become more and more the norm and become more and more important for for every day.
所以，如果你在市场中，你就得适应并开始在周末也使用这项技术。
And so if you if you are in the market, you will have to kind of adapt and and start also utilizing the the technology over the weekend.
我认为这就是为什么我们分三个阶段推出我们的股票代币产品。
And and I think that's, you know, why we launched our stock token product in three phases.
我们的某些竞争对手直接进入了去中心化金融领域。
Some of our competitor went straight to DeFi.
我们希望分阶段进行，以确保平台上有足够的流动性和需求。
We wanted to have these different phases to make sure that we would have enough of our liquidity and demand on the platform.
第二，我们正在努力让Bitstamp支持股票的7x24小时交易。
Two, we were working to have Bitstamp to support twenty four seven the the trading of stocks.
第三，我们希望开放去中心化金融功能。
And three, we wanted to open DeFi.
对我们来说，这确实是通过设立这三个里程碑，确保产品能安全推出，一旦上线，人们就能使用它，而无需担心周末会发生什么。
So, you know, for us, it was really this this idea of creating these three milestone to really make sure that we could roll out the product safely And that when we will have it online, basically, people will will be able to to utilize it and not have to worry about what will happen during the weekends.
但是，是的。
But Yeah.
这正是我非常兴奋的一点。
That's one of the things that I'm I'm very excited about.
我认为你听到一些人会问，为什么我要使用代币化资产而不是其他方式？
I I think what you're hearing from some folks that are saying, like, why would I use tokenized asset versus x y z?
因为我们目前还没有在这些资产上完全实现加密技术的所有优势，但我相信，一旦这些优势变得越来越明显，你就不得不使用它。
It's because we don't have yet all the the benefits of the crypto technology on on these assets, but I think once it's going to become more and more obvious that you will have to use it.
否则，你几乎就会处于劣势。
Otherwise, you are at a at a disadvantage almost.
另一个我总是觉得好笑的例子是，当你试图在美国一家券商和另一家券商之间转账时。
One other example that I I always laugh when you try to transfer from one brokerage in The US to another one
是的。
Yeah.
这个过程简直荒谬至极。
This insane process.
你知道的？
You know?
这需要好几天。
It takes days.
你根本不知道发生了什么。
You don't really have any you don't really know what's happening.
你只能希望它能成功。
You you hope that it works.
你知道的？
You know?
这简直是一种奇怪的情况。
It's it's kind of this weird situation.
想象一下用加密货币来处理这种情况。
Imagine this using crypto.
对吧？
Right?
你可以看到区块链上的转账过程。
You you can see the blockchain transfer.
你可以看到链上发生的事情。
You can see what's happening on the chain.
可能只需要一分钟，甚至更短。
It will take maybe a minute if even.
这就是我们日常几乎所有事情都习以为常的世界。
That's the kind of world that, you know, we are used to for almost everything else.
对于支付来说，你知道的，你只要停下手机就行了。
For payments, you know, you just stop your phone.
你不会等上十分钟之类的。
You don't wait, like, ten minutes or whatever.
所以我认为，未来人们也会希望所有金融工具——包括股票、ETF、基金等等——都能有这种体验。
And and so I I think people are just going to want that in the future for also all their financial instrument, including stocks, including ETF and and their funds and etcetera.
我们之前讨论的很多内容，以及我最近一直在关注的一个重要基础，就是Robinhood链。
Well, a big backbone of of a lot of the stuff that we've talked about and something that I've been tracking lately in regards to all of this is the Robinhood Chain.
对吧？
Right?
我们刚开始之前就在聊这个。
We were just talking about this right before we we began.
天啊，你们已经达到了一千四百万笔交易，我认为部署了一百八十万份合约。
Man, you guys are up to 14,000,000 transactions, I think 1,800,000 contracts deployed.
我的意思是，你能跟我们说说这方面的情况吗？
I mean, what can you tell tell us about this?
是的。
Yeah.
我们非常兴奋。
We we are super excited.
你知道，对我们来说，我们原本认为这条链将成为一个基础平台，用来推出我们想发布的所有产品，把越来越多的Robinhood功能迁移到这条链上，从而获得我们刚才提到的所有好处——比如7x24小时运行、即时结算等等。
You know, I think for us, what we thought that this chain will be is is a backbone to kind of launch all these products that we wanted to to launch and put more and more of Robinhood on this chain so that we cannot get all these benefits that we just talked about around twenty four seven and instant settlement and all these things.
所以我们刚刚在共识大会上于香港推出了这条链，那大概是两三周前的事。
So we just launched the chain in Hong Kong in at consensus, and that was, what, like, two two or three weeks ago.
因此，看到目前为止如此高的采用率，真的非常令人振奋。
And so being able to see this level of adoption so far has been really cool.
所以我们把一些股票代币放在上面，让人们开始测试并了解它的运作方式。
So we we put some of our stock tokens on it so that people can start testing it and and seeing how it works.
我们看到了许多项目被创建出来，而这些项目和我们没有任何关联。
And and we've seen, like, a bunch of projects that have been created that, you know, we don't have any affiliation with.
我们甚至没有提供赞助或任何支持。
We didn't even sponsor or anything.
只是有人在推特上或通过邮件把他们的链接发给我，看到人们用它构建的东西真的非常有趣。
It's just people sending me on Twitter their link or or through email, and it's been really fun to to see what people are building with it.
我认为，一个专门服务于金融系统的区块链这一理念，正在得到人们的强烈共鸣。
And I I think this idea of a chain that is going to be dedicated to financial system is is actually resonating with people very well.
这真的非常酷。
So so that's been really cool.
而且，如果任何听众想在链上构建项目，文档已经在线提供了。
And, yeah, if if anyone listening wants to to build on the chain, the documentation is online.
访问起来非常简单。
It's very simple to access it.
我们还和Arbitrum合作举办了一场黑客松，奖金高达一百万美元。
And we're also doing a hackathon with Arbitrum where we are putting a price of 1,000,000.
所以，有很多东西可以构建。
So, you know, a lot of things to build.
我认为这对我们来说才刚刚开始，但这是一个非常令人兴奋的开端。
I think it's just the beginning for us, but it's it's a very, very exciting beginning.
我最期待的是，当我们能够介绍那些构建在链上、用户将能访问的所有功能时。
And what I'm the most excited about is when we're going to be able to talk about all the features that we are building on top of the chain that people will be able to to access.
我想，这正是我们所有人都非常感兴趣的地方。
That's, I think, what we're all really interested about.
你知道的。
You know?
我想尽量多从你这里挖点信息，但我当然不想让你为难，因为等那些功能发布时，我们还需要你再来做客。
I wanna squeeze as much out of you as I can, but I don't I certainly don't wanna get you in trouble because we need to have you back on when that stuff does come out.
所以，这里会有一个恰到好处的推拉平衡。
So there's gonna be a healthy balance of push and pull here.
但说到这个，关于新产品的主题、新创新，我们这边——我和蒂沃——都是忠实用户，其中一个特别引起我们注意的是RVI，我不确定你能透露多少关于它的信息。
But but, you know, kind of in regards to this, you know, rolling on the themes of new products, new innovations, one of the big ones that stood out to us over here, again, me and Tivo were, avid users, But one of the big ones was RVI, and I'm not sure how much you can talk into this.
这可能稍微偏离了加密货币的主题，但看起来确实非常创新。
It's a little bit maybe outside the theme of crypto, but it seems really innovative.
因为对于不熟悉这个新RVI产品的人来说，它本质上允许非合格投资者也能投资私人公司，这非常有趣。
Because for people who aren't familiar with the new RVI Product, it is essentially allowing people to get access to private companies without being an accredited investor, which is fascinating.
它的运作方式就像一个由多家不同私人公司组成的投资组合或指数。
And so what it is is it's like a portfolio or an index of a bunch of different private companies.
我想大概有十家左右吧。
I think it's, like, close to 10 or something like that.
你可以像买卖股票一样，直接交易这个投资组合的份额。
And you can go and you can get access to this as if you're trading a stock or you're just trading shares of this thing.
但同样，它里面全是私人公司的股权。
But, again, it's filled up with privately traded companies.
比如Databricks就是其中之一，还有其他几家也在其中。
Like Databricks was one, and there's a handful of others that were inside of there.
你能跟我们谈谈这个吗？
What can you talk to us about this?
因为人们又开始推测，回到代币化的话题，人们推测说，嘿。
Because people have theorized again, going back to tokenization, people have theorized that, hey.
我们实际上可以通过代币化来获得对非上市公司投资的敞口。
We can actually get exposure to or to privately traded companies through to through tokenization.
这看起来像是朝着这一目标真正实现迈出的第一步。
And this seems like it's kind of the first step towards that actually becoming a reality.
是的。
Yeah.
这正是我们的初衷。
That was kind of the idea.
我们认为私募股权极其重要。
We think private equity is extremely important.
我们认为这是区分不同类型人群的一个关键差异点。
We think it's one of this, like, big differentiator between, you know, type of people.
基本上，如果你是高净值或超高净值人士，就可以接触到这些投资机会。
Basically, if you're high net worth or ultra high net worth, you can get access to some of these deals.
即便如此，过程也很复杂。
And even then, it's complicated.
你需要认识相关的人，还有各种其他因素。
You need to know the people and all these things.
但至少你不再受限于合格投资者门槛，只要你年收入达到20万美元，或者净资产达到100万美元，就能参与。
But at least you don't have this accredited investor limit, you know, as long as you make 200 k a year or or you have 1,000,000 net worth, you have access to it.
是的。
Yeah.
但对于其余人口——占绝大多数的人来说，即使他们有渠道，也无法投资，即使他们清楚自己承担的风险。
But for for the rest of the the population, which is a very, very large percentage, they they actually can even even if they had access, they can't even invest in it, even if they know the risks that they are taking.
所以我们一直觉得这非常不公平。
And and so I we always thought it was really unfair.
这些公司通常能取得成功，是因为广大用户和客户的使用，但这些用户却无法分享公司成长的红利，只能等待公司上市。
These companies are usually getting success because of the usage of all these these people and all these customers, but they are not able to to ride the the wave with the company, and they just have to wait for the company to go public.
如今，公司在上市前需要更长的时间，因为从私人市场融资变得更加容易。
And nowadays, company takes more and more time before going public because it's easier to raise capital on on private market.
因此，如果我们真的想改变人们的投资方式，真正让所有人都能参与，我们就需要消除一些这些障碍。
So so it's really something that we think that if we really wanna change the way people are investing and if we really wanna make it accessible to everybody, we need to remove some of these barriers.
我们认为代币化是一种方法，但仍然存在合格投资者的限制。
We do think tokenization is one way to do it, but there is still this accredited investor limit.
所以，我们在加密货币领域还有很多工作要做。
And so, you know, there are still some work for us to do on the crypto side.
但Robinhood的创投产品，我认为非常有趣。
But the the Robinhood venture product, I think, is is extremely interesting.
对我们来说，这一步是朝着金融民主化、惠及所有人这一理念迈进的又一进展。
And and, you know, I think for us, it's one more step into this idea of democratizing finance for all.
而且，希望我们很快也能在加密货币领域做更多事情。
And, you know, hopefully, we can do more on the crypto side pretty soon as well.
这正是投身加密领域有趣的一部分。
And it's part of the fun of, you know, being being in in the space of crypto.
它进展得太快了，尤其是Robinhood。
It moves so fast, but specifically of Robinhood.
你们总是不断突破界限，推出这些新功能。
It's just you guys are always pushing the limits and rolling out these new things.
对于加密货币社区以及我们的工作来说，有一件事是我们会维护一个安全交易所列表，一直在追踪比如——
And one of the things for the crypto specific community and and what we do is we have, like, a safe exchanges list, and we're always trying to keep track of, you know, hey.
你可以去哪里，无论你是想把资产转移到冷钱包还是留在交易所，并进行监控。
Where can you go and, you know, whether you wanna offload it to a cold storage or keep it on exchange and monitoring that.
你们总是不断推出新的选项和新的加密货币。
You guys are always kind of rolling out new options and new cryptos all the time.
对我们来说，当看到Robinhood发布的推文时，我们会说，嘿。
And to us, I guess, you know, to us, when we see a tweet go live from Robinhood, it's like, hey.
这看起来有点随机。
It seems kind of random.
哦，好吧。
Like, oh, okay.
今天，你知道，这个已经上线了。
Today, you know, this is available.
狗狗币和各种网络今天都已上线。
Dog with hats available and then can networks available today.
对你来说，这显然不是随机的。
And, obviously, it's not random to you guys.
所以我很好奇，你们的流程是怎样的？
So just interested, you know, what's the process?
是更多依靠与团队的关系吗？
Is it more of relationships with the teams?
是炒作吗？
Is it hype?
是市值，还是各方面都有？
Is it market cap or a little bit of all?
你们决定上线不同代币时，背后有哪些考量？
What goes into you guys deciding and rolling out different tokens?
是的。
Yeah.
我们有一个相当完整的上架框架。
We have a pretty long listing framework.
因此，我们有多支团队会定期会面、讨论并分析我们上架的每一个代币。
And so we have multiple teams that meet and discuss and analyze every single token that we launch.
我们会从安全、技术层面进行分析，比如如何托管它，合规与法律团队也会投入大量时间，运营团队也是如此。
So there is analysis around security, the technology side, you know, how can we custody it, compliance and legal, obviously, are spending some time on it, operation as well.
我们希望确保有足够的流动性以及做市商的支持，以应对需求，并确保买卖价差不会过大。
We want to make sure that we have enough liquidity and support from market makers to support the demand and making sure the spreads are not too wide.
所有这些因素都构成了我们的决策过程的一部分。
All these kind of things kind of are part of the decision process.
此外，您提到的一些点，比如我们客户的需求、线上看到的需求、交易量、市值等，这些也都在考虑范围内。
And then some of the point you mentioned as well, like, you know, the demand that we're getting from our customers, demand that we're seeing online, like, what are the volume, market cap, like, these kind of things.
说实话，上架某些资产确实需要一些时间。
And, you know, it just takes a bit of time, to be honest, to list some of these assets.
所以我们现在有了一个固定的节奏。
And so we have this, like, regular cadence now.
我们内部做了大量工作，以确保能够更快地支持资产，因为客户最常提出的请求之一就是希望获得更多的加密资产访问权限。
We've done a lot of work internally to make sure that we can support assets in a faster way because it's still one of the top requests that we get from our customer is to get access to more type of crypto.
因此，当我们上线一种加密资产时，随之而来的工作会多很多。
And so when we list a crypto, there's a lot more work coming into it.
你知道，在转账过程中，我们会进行所有反洗钱检查。
You know, there is all the anti money laundering checks that we we do during, like, transfer.
我们希望客户能够将资产转账到他们的冷钱包中。
We want a customer to be able to transfer to their cold storage.
对于某些资产，我们希望提供质押服务。
For some of these assets, we wanna offer staking.
因此，任何新的上线都需要一些时间，这基本上就是目前普遍发生的情况。
So any new listing takes takes some time, and and that's kind of what's what's happening in general.
嗯。
Mhmm.
是的
Yeah.
我的意思是，现在有太多事情在发生了。
I mean, there's just so much going on.
到了一天结束时，很难把所有这些都捕捉到。
It's hard to capture all of it at the end of the day.
你知道，无论从哪个角度看，真的有成千上万件事，尤其是现在你几乎涉及金融的各个领域——你可以交易加密货币，交易金属，交易期权和杠杆，现在还能做空和做多。
You know, no matter which way you look at it, I mean, truly is a million things, especially when you're dealing in pretty much all areas of finances at this point, because you can trade cryptos, can trade metals, you can trade options and leverage, and you can short now, and you can go long.
有这么多不同的事情需要跟踪，这使得跟上进展变得有点困难。
And there's so many different things to kinda keep track of, which makes it, I guess, somewhat difficult to keep up with.
但你知道，我们之前一直在关注的是加密货币是如何迅速扩张的，因为不断有新产品推出，而且这一直是一个巨大的推动力。
But, you know, one of the things that we were going through was just following, I guess, how crypto has ballooned because there's only these new products, and it's been such a big push.
我注意到的一件事是，从2024年到2025年，加密货币的年收入下降了大约30%到38%。
One of the things I did notice was that the year over year crypto revenue fell by about 30% or 38% from 2024 to 2025.
你知道，这让我有点难以接受，因为我一直主张基本面和技术面之间存在严重脱节，也就是说，基本面实际上已经改善了很多。
And, you know, I think it's a little bit hard for me to digest because I'm someone who's been advocating that there has been a strong disconnect from the fundamentals and the technicals, meaning that it seems as if the fundamentals have gotten so much better.
你知道，无论你是从监管角度，看有多少加密公司正与证交会陷入麻烦，还是看实际建成了什么、活跃用户数量，或是所有其他指标，比如整体增长。
You know, whether you're looking at it from regulations and how many crypto companies are getting in trouble with the SEC or what's actually been built or the amount of active users or all these other metrics, like total growth.
我觉得我们取得的巨大进步和我们目前所处的位置之间存在一种脱节。
And I I feel as if there's this disconnection between the massive leap that we have taken forward and where we're at right now.
因为许多加密货币的价格已经跌到了几年前的水平，尽管实际上已经取得了巨大进展。
Because a lot of cryptos have fallen to places that they were maybe years ago despite how much progress has actually been made.
我会把Robinhood也包括在内，我再次觉得，在所取得的成就与过去几个月里我们看到的贬值之间，存在着明显的脱节。
And I would loop Robinhood right in there with that where I just, again, feel that there's a disconnect between how much has been accomplished and what we've seen in terms of depreciation over the last several months or so.
可能最主要原因是什么？
What maybe contributed this, like, the most?
是什么导致了这种情况，为什么会发生？
Like, what contributed the most to this and why did it happen?
那么，你打算如何应对这种38%的年同比下滑？
And I guess, how do you plan on getting it back from maybe a 38% year over year drop?
嗯，你知道，宏观环境才是真正发生的事情。
Well, you know, the macro environment is really what happened.
当我们审视我们的市场份额时，我们对自己的地位仍然感到非常有信心。
When we look at our market share, we still feel very good about our position.
你知道，我们并不觉得这是Robinhood独有的问题，这才是我们真正担心的。
Like, you know, we we don't feel like it's it's something specific to to Robinhood, and that's that's really what we we worry about.
你知道吗？
You know?
我认为归根结底，如果客户对另一种资产感到兴奋，或者想暂时退出市场，那是他们自己的决定。
I think at the end of the day, if customer are excited about another type of asset or if they want to step back from the market for a bit, that's something they can decide.
但你知道，我们的CFO昨天刚提到，二月份的交易量相比一月份有所上升。
But, you know, our CFO actually told yesterday that we've seen an uptick in February in terms of volume compared to January.
所以我们正在看到一些复苏的迹象。
So we are seeing a bit of a rebound.
总的来说，就像我在采访一开始说的，我们关注的是打造产品，确保我们拥有市场上人们所需的所有工具。
And overall for us, you know, what I was saying at the very beginning of the interview was what we focus on is building and making sure that we have all the tools that people are looking for in in the market.
实际的交易量数字，我们能控制的不多，因为归根结底，宏观因素就是宏观因素。
The the actual volume number, it's it's less something that we can control because at the end of the day, like, you know, the macros are are the macros.
但作为这个领域的建设者，我们更关注的是为这个领域带来实际用途。
But I think as a builder within the space, what we are focusing on more is, like, bringing utility to the space.
我认为代币化资产就是一个能够真正改变加密货币使用方式的例子。
I think tokenized assets, for example, is something that can really change the way that crypto is being used.
当你看到这些真正发生时，我相信你会看到这些资产重新回升。
And when you will see that actually happening, I think you will see also some of these assets coming back up.
是的。
Yeah.
我的意思是，我们完全同意，因为我们也一直在说，宏观、宏观、宏观因素。
I mean we totally agree because, again, we've been saying it, what, on the rundown, the macro, the macro, the macro.
所以我们完全同意你的观点。
So we we totally agree with you.
我想说一点，取决于你们能透露多少，因为你们已经推出了预测市场，而我们的团队在这方面一直走在前列，尤其是布赖恩和乔差不多一年前就提出了预测市场将迎来超级周期。
I will I will say one point depending on how much you can say because you guys have rolled out the prediction markets, and we've been really ahead of the game, our team, you know, especially with Brian and Joe calling, like, prediction market super cycle almost a year ago at this point.
你们是否看到加密货币与预测市场之间存在某种关联？那些喜欢冒险的个体，无论是出于娱乐目的参与预测市场，还是更严肃地押注体育赛事、选举或宏观环境变化？
Is there any is there any correlation that you see from the crypto to the prediction markets of that, you know, that high risk individual that likes to, you know, maybe take take some whether it's for fun, the prediction markets, you know, whether it's sports or something more serious like elections and what's going on in the macro environment.
你有没有看到成交量方面的相关性？
Is there any correlation there for volume that you see?
没有。
No.
目前，我们还没有看到任何替代效应，比如人们因为想在预测市场交易而停止交易加密货币，或者其他类似的情况。
At this point, we haven't seen any cannibalization, like, people stopping trading crypto because they wanna trade something else on prediction market or or anything like that.
我们实际看到的是，人们同时使用多种工具来实现他们的策略。
What we actually see is people using multiple of the instruments at the same time for enabling the strategy.
所以我们看到人们在购买期货或预测市场产品的同时，也在购买现货。
So we see people buying futures or buying prediction markets and also buying spot.
而且我认为，预测市场整体是一个非常棒的产品。
And and I think, you know, prediction market overall is a is an amazing product.
我认为很多人在投资策略上变得更加自如了，因为以前他们必须选择某个特定的资产或股票。
I think a lot of people are actually getting more comfortable into some of their investment strategy because before they will have to pick a specific asset or pick a specific stock.
而预测市场为我们提供了更多实现策略的选项。
With prediction market, it gives us it gives them more option to actually realize our strategy.
所以，比如说，你想投资人工智能，而不是去挑选那些与人工智能紧密相关的公司。
So, you know, let's say you wanna invest in AI instead of trying to pick one of the AI companies that are very linked to it.
你可以直接在预测市场上使用关于人工智能的合约。
You can just use a contract on prediction market about AI.
我认为这使得很多人投资起来容易多了。
And I think that's making it a lot easier for some people to to invest.
总的来说，在加密货币方面，我们的客户仍然非常活跃，而且我认为我们的用户在比特币上总体是净买入的。
And overall, on on crypto, we we still see our our customer actually engaged, and I think overall, we our user on net buy on on Bitcoin.
所以，你知道，这表明我们不应该在这件事上花太多时间，而应该更多地关注我们为客户构建的工具。
So, you know, it's something that really shows you that it's it's something that we shouldn't spend too much time on, and we should be more focusing on on the tool that we are building for for the customers.
预测市场让我感到震惊。
The prediction market shocked me.
我的意思是，能够启动一个年收入达数亿、甚至上千亿美元的业务，总合约交易额大约有100亿美元左右，而且能在短短一年左右的时间内做到这一点。
I mean, the ability to spin up a business that is doing hundreds of millions in revenue, billions of dollars, I think it's something like almost $10,000,000,000 in total contract volume or something, and the ability to spin this up in what feels like maybe a year or so.
我不确定这个数字是否准确，但能够如此迅速地启动这样的业务，真是不可思议。
I'm not sure if I'm I'm spot on with that number, but, I mean, the ability to spin that up is crazy.
我的意思是，我简直难以用语言来形容，因为它增长得太快了。
Mean, I mean, I'm hard having a hard time even putting words to it because it ballooned so fast.
预测市场一直存在并持续增长，但我认为它整合得非常好。
And prediction markets have been around and they've been growing, but just how well I think it was integrated.
对吧？
Right?
我看到网上有不同的反应，有些人说，你不该把这和经纪账户混在一起，等等，但我就是不明白为什么不可以。
And I've seen mixed responses online of some people saying, oh, you shouldn't mix this with the brokerage account or this and that, but I just don't understand why not.
我认为，如果你能有一个集所有功能于一身的平台，对人们会更有好处。
I think the more of you could that you can have an all in one platform for everything, I think the more it benefits people.
是的。
Mhmm.
这让我想起了过去。
That feels like the old days.
就像你刚拿到iPhone的时候，每件事都有一个独立的小应用或功能。
Like, when you first got an iPhone and there was a different little app or feature for everything.
然后就像互联网一样，情况也是如此。
And then it was like, what and the same thing with, like, the Internet.
我们为什么要做这么多事呢？
It's like, why are we doing all this?
我为什么要去不同的网站买尿布？
Why do I have to go to a different website to buy diapers?
我为什么要去不同的网站买衣服？
Why do I have to go to a different website to buy clothes?
我为什么要去不同的网站买电子产品零件？
Why do I have to go to a different website to buy tech parts?
我为什么要去不同的网站买家具？
Why do I have to go to a different website to buy furniture?
你想想，为什么我们不能把生活的各种方面——不管是购物、投资还是别的什么——都集中在一个地方呢？
You know, why can't we just do a lot of our different aspects of life all in one place, whether it's shopping or or investments or whatever it is?
我觉得这很合理，因为再次强调，你把它们整合得越多，对人们来说就越方便，尤其是当这种整合是以更规范、更合规的方式进行时。
And I just think that it makes sense because there's again, yeah, the the more you kind of collect it altogether, I think the more convenient it makes it for people, especially when it's in a much more, like, regulated compliant way.
因为如果有人想做，他们一定会去做。
Because the odds are if someone wants to do it, they're gonna do it.
对吧？
Right?
如果有人想赌博，他们会去赌场。
If someone wants to gamble, they're gonna go to a casino.
他们会使用VPN。
They're gonna put on a VPN.
他们会去一些可疑的离岸网站。
They're gonna go to some sketchy off shore place.
你知道，这根本阻止不了任何人。
You know, that's not gonna stop anyone.
如果有人想赌博或做其他事，他们总会找到办法。
If someone wants to go gamble or do things, they're gonna do it in one way or another.
所以我也说不准。
So I don't know.
我的意思是，我完全支持。
I mean, I'm all for it.
预测市场很酷。
And the prediction markets are cool.
我喜欢它们的发展方式。
I like how they've evolved.
我认为它们可能需要更多的监管，比如如果能阻止一些内部押注和交易，我觉得它们会处于一个非常好的状态。
I think that they need probably a little bit more regulation in the sense that if you could stop some of the insider betting and and trading on that, I think it'd be in a really good spot.
但是
But
即使只是从信息收集的角度来看，你知道，这是我们每周节目关注的重点，比如：
Even just from information gathering, you know, that's something that we focus on on our weekly episodes of like, hey.
让我们看看人们都在哪儿，钱流向了哪里。
Let's see what people are you know, where's the money going.
比起新闻头条，人们在重大事件上真正投了钱，这更容易说明问题。
It's a lot easier to have a news headline versus where are people putting their actual money for bigger events.
但我们现在正好到整点，约翰。
But we're on top of the hour here, Johann.
所以在结束之前，我们想请你分享一个最后的想法，关于你在Robinhood上的加密货币以及你们未来的方向。
So we wanna leave you with one final thought of, you know, your your crypto at Robinhood and where you guys are going before we wrap here.
非常感谢你抽出时间。
We do appreciate your time.
所以，请说说你的最后想法。
So final thought from you.
不。
No.
关于预测市场，你说得完全对。
You know, just on the prediction market, you're totally right.
这是我们增长最快的一项业务之一。
It's one of our fastest growing business.
而且正如你所说，我们正在大力工作，筛选特定的合约，确保我们不会上线那些在某些DeFi平台上被滥用的合约。
And and I think to your point, like, we we are doing a lot of work to lease specific contracts and make sure that we don't lease some of these contracts that are being a bit more abused on some of the DeFi platform.
对我们来说，真正的兴奋点在于这个超级应用的理念——你可以将所有金融工具集中在一个平台上，并享受我们十多年来不断打磨的用户体验和界面设计。
And I think for us, really, the the excitement is around this idea of this super app where you can have all your financial instrument in in one place and where you can benefit from the UX and UI that we've been polishing for for for a decade plus more.
至于加密货币方面，我们对今年正在构建的一切都感到非常兴奋。
And, yeah, on the crypto side, you know, really excited about everything that we are building this year.
我觉得这才刚刚开始。
I think it's it's just the start of the year.
你知道，现在才三月，我们还有大量功能待发布。
You know, we are we are barely at the March, and and we have so much more to ship.
所以我们非常期待，希望下次我们再来时能聊聊这些新功能。
So we we're excited, and hopefully, we can talk about some of these new features next time we're here.
我们肯定得再聊一次。
We're definitely gonna have to.
听起来你们这里正在筹备很多东西，我觉得最好的部分还在后面。
It sounds like there's a lot in the works here, and I think the best really is yet to come.
无论这是否意味着要等待市场状况好转——我相信我们都认为，好转只是时间问题。
And whether that's maybe waiting for the market conditions to get better, which think we all believe that it's just a matter of time until conditions do get better.
我们经历起起落落。
We go through ups and downs.
这很正常。
It's normal.
你知道，当市场上涨时，一切都会受到影响；当市场下跌时，同样也会受到影响。
You know, everything tends to get affected when everything goes up, and everything also gets affected when it goes down.
朋友们，这不过是金融市场的正常现象，加密货币也不例外。
Guys, it's just a normal part of the financial markets, and crypto is no exception to that.
同样的道理，无论是新产品推出，还是《清晰法案》出台，诸如此类的事情。
It's the same thing, you know, whether there's gonna be new products coming, whether there's gonna be the Clarity Act, you name it.
还有很多其他事情正在筹备中，值得讨论。
There's all sorts of other things in the pipeline to talk about.
所以，约翰，我们非常感谢你抽出时间。
So, Johann, we really appreciate your time.
人们想要关注你或Robinhood的话，可以通过哪些渠道参与？
Where can people get involved they wanna follow you or Robinhood or anything?
在哪里能最好地做到这一点？
Where are the best places to do that?
是的。
Yeah.
X 是一个很好的平台。
X is a great place.
你可以通过我的名字找到我，那里会发布我们所有的最新动态。
You can find me with my name, and you will see all the news we are launching.
也欢迎就区块链相关的一切随时与我联系。
And feel free to reach out anything around the chain as well.
我们正在与许多开发者合作。
We are working with a lot of, developers.
如果你有任何想在区块链上构建的东西，尽管联系我。
So if there's anything you wanna build on the chain, don't hesitate to reach out.
太棒了。
Awesome.
再次感谢您加入我们。
Well, once again, thank you for joining us.
感谢您的时间，这也将为本期节目画上句号，各位。
We appreciate your time, and that's gonna bring us to a wrap on this episode, everyone.
感谢大家参与本周的《加密货币入门》播客节目，我们下周同一时间、同一地点再见。
Thank you all for joining this week's episode of the Crypto one zero one podcast, and we'll see all of you at the same time, same place next week.
保重。
Take care.
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