第745集：富兰克林邓普顿加密首席投资官谈机构下一步动向

八月是整理衣柜的好时机，把夏天没用过的东西清理掉，为秋天的衣橱做准备，再升级一下那些你每周都会穿的基础款。

August is a good time to clean up the closet a little bit, get rid of the summer stuff that you didn't use, prepare for your autumn wardrobe, and upgrade the basics that you'll actually reach for every week.

这就是我喜欢Quince的原因。

That's why I like Quince.

他们做的衣服数量不多但质量更好，摸起来很有质感，却没有奢侈品牌的溢价。

They make fewer better pieces that feel premium, but don't come with the luxury markup.

对我来说，我最常穿的是那条100%欧洲亚麻抽绳沙滩裤，还有配套的衬衫。

For me, the piece I keep coming back to is the 100% European linen drawstring beach pants with the matching shirt.

我喜欢在海边度假时穿它们，因为很方便。

I love wearing them on beach vacations because they're easy.

它们透气又舒服，看起来也很得体，不会让人觉得我刻意打扮。

They're breathable, comfortable, and they look put together without feeling like I'm trying too hard.

白天随便一穿，去水边玩也行，晚上稍微打扮一下也合适。

Throw them on during the day, wear them by the water, or dress up a little bit at night.

这就是我真正会用的百搭单品，因为它很实用。

That's the kind of staple I actually use because it has versatility.

这正是Quince做得好的地方。

And that's really what Quince does well.

他们专注于日常单品，比如超柔软的有机棉T恤和高级木兰花羊绒毛衣，这些衣服既能应对日常上班，也能穿去晚餐约会。

They specialize in everyday pieces that work harder like ultra soft organic cotton tees and premium magnolia and cashmere sweaters that can go from a casual workday to dinner out.

如果你的基础款开始显得旧了，Quince让你轻松升级，高级牛仔和定制休闲裤只要60美元起，而且版型和面料质量都是奢侈品牌级别的。

If your basics are starting to feel worn out, Quince makes it easy to upgrade with premium denim and tailored chinos from just $60 with the fit structure and quality fabrics you'd expect from a luxury designer brand.

Quince所有商品的价格都比同类品牌低50%到80%。

Everything at Quince is priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands.

他们直接与道德工厂合作，省去中间商，所以你付的是高品质的钱，而不是品牌溢价。

They work directly with ethical factories and cut out the middleman so you're paying for high quality, not brand markup.

而且不只是衣服。

And it's not just clothing.

Quince已经成了从酒店级床品、浴室必需品到高级厨具和旅行必备品的首选。

Quince has become a go to for everything from hotel quality bedding and bath essentials to premium cookware and travel must haves.

各位，你们听我讲了很多次了，我一直告诉你们要去quince.com看看，因为那个网站真的很有趣，选择特别多。

Guys, you've been hearing it for so long now how I tell you you have to go to quince.com because the website is so fun for all the options that they have.

这个网站特别好逛，价格也超划算。

It's a great website to go click around and the prices can't be beat.

升级你的日常，下载Quince应用，享受专属优惠。

Upgrade your everyday, download the Quince app for app exclusive offers.

访问quince.com/crypto10one。

Go to quince.com/crypto10one.

享受免运费和365天退货，现在加拿大和英国也有哦。

Get free shipping on your order and 365 returns now available in Canada and The UK too.

网址是quince.com/crypto10one。

That's quince.com/crypto10one.

别再等别人允许你创业了。

Stop waiting for permission to start your business.

你的想法离实现只差一步，Shopify能帮你轻松搞定。

Your idea is one step away, and Shopify can make it easy to make it happen.

我们Crypto One Zero One就是这么做的，用Shopify卖我们的书，之后一切都很顺利。

That's what we did at Crypto one zero one and use Shopify to sell our book, the rest is history.

我喜欢Shopify的地方在于，它把创业中最让人害怕的部分都解决了。

The thing I like about Shopify is it takes the scary part out of starting.

你不需要坐在那里琢磨网站、支付、结账、库存这些琐碎的事情，这些往往在还没开始之前就把人吓退了。

You're not just sitting there trying to figure out a website, payments, checkout, inventory, all these little things that stop people before they even launch.

说到建一个网店，我觉得最大的问题就是流程太繁琐。

When I think about building a storefront, the biggest thing is friction.

你希望顾客一进你的页面，就喜欢上你的产品，然后能顺利下单，不会卡住。

You want someone to land on your page, like what you're selling and be able to buy without getting stuck.

这正是Shopify厉害的地方。

That's where Shopify is huge.

Shopify的结账系统就是为了帮助更多顾客完成购买而设计的。

Shopify checkout is built to help more customers finish their purchase.

而且当顾客再次光顾时，他们的信息已经保存好了。

And when they come back, their details are already saved.

一键就能搞定。

One tap and they're done.

最棒的是，Shopify 支持全球数百万家企业，从你熟知的大品牌，比如美泰和Gymshark，到刚刚起步的小企业。

The cool part is Shopify powers millions of businesses worldwide from huge brands that you know, like Mattel and Gymshark to small businesses just getting started.

所以无论你是想打造下一个大品牌，还是推出你的第一个产品，基础设施都已经准备好了。

So whether you're building the next big brand or launching your first product, the infrastructure is already there.

一旦这部分搞定，你就可以专注于真正的工作：打造品牌、吸引关注、把顾客带到你的店铺，这样生意才能成长。

Once that part is handled, can focus on the real work, building the brand, getting attention, and bringing people to your storefront so the business can grow.

当有人真正下单的那一刻，你的想法就变成了现实。

That moment when someone actually buys, that's when the idea becomes real.

有了Shopify，你的想法和真正的生意之间没有任何障碍，所以去实现它吧。

With Shopify, nothing stands between your idea and a real business, so go make it one.

今天就在shopify.com/crypto10one开始你的免费试用。

Start your free trial today at shopify.com/crypto10one.

这是shopify.com/crypto10one的免费试用。

That's a free trial at shopify.com/crypto10one.

好的。

Alright.

各位加密国度的好公民们，欢迎回到东方峰会。

All you good wonderful citizens of Crypt Nation, welcome back to the Out East Summit.

现在我们就在东方现场。

Now we are inside East.

显然，外面有点乱。

Obviously, things got a little crazy out there.

但我们非常高兴请到了Seth Ginns，他是Franklin Crypto的首席投资官，也就是CIO，Franklin Crypto是Franklin Templeton的子公司。

But look, we are so excited to have Seth Ginns, who's the CIO, chief investment officer of Franklin Crypto, which is a subsidiary of Franklin Templeton.

我说得对吗？

Is that the right?

没错。

That's right.

好的。

Okay.

这个背景信息是对的。

That's the right context.

赛斯，感谢你来到我们的加密峰会。

Seth, thank you for joining us here at the crypto.

谢谢你们的邀请。

Thanks for having me.

不客气。

You bet.

我们从哪里开始呢？

Where do we start?

这个话题有很多不同的切入点。

There's so many different ways to go with this.

我一直很想和你聊聊，因为你确实涉及投资的很多不同方面，从链上流动性策略开始。

I've been dying to talk to you because, again, you do so many different aspects of investment from liquids on chain strategies.

你知道，我肯定你也在交易ETF、不同的收益产品，但如果我们能先从你的简单介绍开始，让我们的观众了解你，为什么你是这个职位的最佳人选？

You know, I'm sure you're trading the ETFs, different yield products, but if we could kinda just start with a quick overview of who you are so that our audience knows, why are you the guy for the job?

当然，当然。

For sure, for sure.

其实我的背景是传统的股票投资。

So my background is actually traditional equities.

我做公开股票投资做了十八年。

So I was doing public equities investing for eighteen years.

哇，真的吗。

Oh wow.

2012年我开始接触加密货币，我一直觉得，如果这能成为机构级别的资产类别，我就想成立一只基金。

Got into crypto back in 2012, and my view was always, look if this becomes an institutional asset class, I wanna launch a fund.

不错。

Nice.

不过机构基础设施的完善花了一段时间。

And it took a while for the institutional infrastructure to come together.

有意思的是，我在上一个十年末看到了这些基础设施逐渐成型，那时候富兰克林也开始涉足加密货币，所以我想你可能请过桑迪·考尔来聊，桑迪在推动富兰克林进入加密货币领域方面确实起了很大作用。

What's fascinating is I saw that coming together at the end of last decade, and that was when Franklin started to move in crypto as well, so I think you may have had Sandy Call on So as Sandy really instrumental in helping to bring Franklin to crypto.

托尼·佩科拉也是，他在那个时期对富兰克林进入加密货币领域也起到了非常关键的作用。

Tony Pecora as well, very instrumental in helping to bring Franklin to crypto around that time.

2019年的时候，我说，你知道吗，我们开始看到机构基础设施的成型，是时候推出基金了，于是加入了CoinFund，在那里推出了我们的流动基金。

2019 I said, you know what, we're starting to see that institutional infrastructure, it's time to launch a fund, joined CoinFund, launched our liquid fund there.

我们建立了RIA，真正打造了行业内首批机构级管理公司之一，然后在今年年初，我和我的合伙人Chris Perkins从CoinFund分拆出来，被富兰克林邓普顿收购了。

We built the RIA, so really built one of the first institutional quality managers in the space, and then at the beginning of this year my partner Chris Perkins and I spun out of CoinFund, and we were acquired by Franklin Templeton.

被富兰克林坦普顿收购后，现在能做什么，是作为独立公司或留在CoinFund时做不到的？

What is being acquired by Franklin Templeton now allow you to do that you couldn't do as a standalone firm, you couldn't do at CoinFund?

有什么，怎么说呢，我觉得可以叫福利吧，跟富兰克林合作的好处？

What are kind of, I don't know, I would call it the perks, right, of working with Franklin?

布莱斯，我们非常关注的一件事是，今年在我们看来是传统金融和加密货币融合的一年。

So Bryce, one of the things that we were really focused on, this is the year in our view when traditional finance and crypto converge.

当然。

Sure.

我们谈论这个已经很久了，但就在今年年初，你开始看到关于纽约证券交易所和纳斯达克的新闻，势头正在积聚。

We've been talking about this for a long time, but just at the start of the year you start to see headlines about New York Stock Exchange and NASDAQ and the momentum building.

我们的看法是，听着，随着这种融合的发生，我们将需要大量资源，尤其是作为流动基金，但总的来说，当你考虑投资于一个所有传统金融都将被动员起来的领域时，竞争会很激烈。

And our view was listen, as this convergence happens, we're going to need a lot of resources, particularly as a liquid fund, but in general when you think about investing in a space where all of traditional finance is going to be mobilized, that's a lot of competition.

当然。

For sure.

所以我们说，你知道吗，来到像富兰克林这样的地方非常有意义，这是一个传统金融巨头，已经表现出愿意投资加密货币，无论市场是强是弱，而且顺便说一句，你知道在市场低迷时投资回报最好，对吧？

So we said, you know what, it makes a lot of sense to come to a home like Franklin, a traditional finance juggernaut that has shown a willingness to invest in crypto, whether the markets are strong or the markets are weak, and by the way, you know the returns are best when you invest when the markets are down, right?

而且还有一个有趣的不对称性，当市场低迷时，但你能看到基本面在汇聚，不同的合作伙伴关系在形成，你看看现在每周都在发布的公告，很明显我们正处于一个甜蜜点，价格仍然低迷，虽然我得说它们开始有点回升了。

And there's also this interesting asymmetry where when the markets are down, but you can see the fundamentals coming together, you see different partnerships coming together, You look at the announcements that are happening on a weekly basis right now, and it's clear we're right in one of those sweet spots where you have prices still down, although I'll tell you they're starting to tick up a little bit.

有点回升，是的。

A little bit, yeah.

而且基本面非常强劲，简直好得离谱。

And you have fundamentals just off the charts positive.

我

I

觉得我们可以聊的太多了。

mean there's so much we could talk there.

也许我们可以讨论的一件事，这次峰会我们没怎么谈，但过去我们谈了很多，就是《清晰法案》。

One of the things to maybe discuss, we haven't talked a lot about it at this summit, but we've talked a lot about it in the past, is the Clarity Act.

对。

Yep.

看起来这个概率在30%到40%之间波动。

Which it seems like those odds are fluctuating between 3040%.

目前是53%，或者说53%。

53% as of now or 53.

这倒是新消息，好吧。

That's a that's a new that's a new okay.

所以事情正在往好的方向发展。

So things are are moving in the right direction.

我注意到，你知道，财政部长斯科特·贝森特说这已经到了一码线了。

I saw, you know, secretary Scott Besson said this is on the one yard line.

就在今天早上，他们宣布道德条款已经敲定了。

Just this morning, they had a an announcement that the ethics provision had been settled on.

你觉得接下来会发生什么？

What do you think about, you know, what's gonna happen?

很明显，这就像抛硬币一样，结果难料，我不知道你有没有强烈的看法，通过还是不通过，但如果真的通过了，会发生什么？

Clearly, it's a coin flip, so we don't don't I know if you have a strong view, pass or not pass, but what happens if it does pass?

关于这个，我想说两点。

So there there are two things that I'll say here.

第一，我觉得白宫能找到它同意的道德条款，这是一个非常积极的进展。

One is I I think the White House finding ethics language that it could agree to was a very positive development.

现在的问题是，我们能不能让足够多的民主党人支持，让法案通过。

Now there's a question of whether we're going to get enough Democrats in line to get it passed.

这是另一回事，但我认为昨晚通过的可能性确实大幅上升了，这对整个领域来说是一个非常令人鼓舞的进展。

That's separate, but I think the odds of passage did go up materially last night, and that's a really encouraging development for the space.

但如果我们退一步看，我觉得真正的问题是，我们是否需要明确的条款才能通过？

But if we step back, I think there's really a question of do we need clarity to pass?

简短的回答是，有这些条款当然很好，但即使没有，我觉得我们的处境也还不错。

And the short answer is it's a really nice to have, but I think we're in an okay position even without it.

哦，好的，我喜欢这个观点。

Oh okay, like that take,

这观点挺大胆的。

that's a hot take.

但我觉得真正重要的是让它进入投票环节，因为如果不投票，我们就处于一个未知的领域，悬而未决。

But I think what's really important is having it come to a vote because if it doesn't come to a vote, I think we're in this unknown area, we're in this limbo.

如果投票并且通过了，那就太好了，对吧？

If it comes to a vote and it passes, amazing, right?

我们就上了快车道，进展会很快。

We're in the HOV lane, We're moving quickly.

重新向历史高点迈进。

Moving back towards all time highs.

我们大家都堵在路上，看着旁边的快车道飞驰而过，对吧？

All of us came out here sitting in traffic watching watching the HOV lane just going by, right?

如果通过了，我们就在快车道上了，对吧？

If it passes, we're in the fast lane, right?

如果没通过，好在很多市场参与者已经有了明确的替代路径，但他们不想走那条路，除非他们知道不得不走，因为他们更愿意走那条有明确法案通过的路径。

If it doesn't pass, what's great is there's already a clear path forward for a lot of market participants, but they don't want to take that path unless they know that they have to, because they'd rather take the path with Clarity Passing.

所以我觉得现在，如果它不进行投票，我们就有点像是在原地等待，有点像是遇到了减速带。

So I think right now, if it's not coming to a vote, we're in a little bit of a holding pattern, it's a little bit of a speed bump.

如果它进行投票的话

If it comes to a vote

意思是如果它进入参议院议程。

Meaning if it gets on the Senate floor.

如果它进入参议院议程并进行投票

If it gets on the Senate floor and it comes to a vote

然后我们就能看清每个人的立场，他们到底是怎么想的

And we see how the cards lie with everybody, what they're

我觉得不管怎样，如果通过了，那是最好的情况，但即使没通过，也比现在这样不进行投票要好。

I think either way, it passes, that's the best case, but even if it doesn't pass, that's a better situation than the one that we're in with it not coming to a vote.

我喜欢这个观点，这真是个大胆的看法，我之前还没听过这种说法。

I like that, that's a hot take, and I haven't heard that one yet.

而且你看，你在Franklin Crypto做了各种不同类型的投资。

And look, so you're you're doing all sorts of different kinds of investing at Franklin Crypto.

给我们介绍一下你们提供的产品和服务吧。

Walk us through what products and services y'all offer.

我知道你之前在CoinFund做主动管理。

I I know you from your background at CoinFund as an active manager.

我知道富兰克林有个Easy Peasy，是一个多资产的市值加权指数。

I know Franklin has Easy Peasy, which is a multi asset sort of market cap weighted index.

我觉得它是被动型的。

I I believe it's passive.

我想你们还有其他主动策略。

I think you guys have other active strategies.

给我们全面介绍一下，还有你们的客户群体是谁。

Just walk us through the whole gamut and who your clientele are.

好的，我知道这

Yeah, so I know that's

是个大话题，所以。

a big bite to chew there, so.

所以我们提供的产品和策略覆盖了全方位的领域。

So we offer products and strategies that cover the full gamut.

我觉得新富兰克林加密公司初期核心关注的领域是主动策略。

I think the areas that are going to be the initial core focus for the new Franklin Crypto are active strategies.

主动策略。

Active strategies.

原因在于，虽然我们也有很大的被动业务，但就富兰克林加密公司本身而言，

And the reason why, and again we have a very big passive business, I'm just saying within Franklin Crypto specifically That's

这才是让你兴奋的地方。

what gets you hyped up.

而这正是关键，你刚才问到了我们的客户群体。

And that's really where, so you asked about our clientele.

客户群体是全球最顶尖的资产配置者。

Clientele the most sophisticated allocators in the world.

从中央银行、主权财富基金，到大型养老金、捐赠基金、保险公司，再到高净值家族办公室，应有尽有。

That is everything from central banks and sovereign wealth funds to big pensions, endowments, insurance companies, through to high net worth family offices.

所以这就是全方位的，而现在人们所寻求的，有一批投资者参与加密货币可能已经十年了，很多时候是从风险投资开始的，然后可能直接接触一些比特币。

So that that full gamut and what people are looking for right now, there's a cohort of investors that have been involved with crypto for probably a decade in many cases, oftentimes starting on the venture side then maybe getting a little bit of direct Bitcoin exposure.

但我们开始看到下一批人的兴趣，这批人之前说，你知道吗，我想要监管的明确性。

But we're starting to see interest from that next cohort, the cohort that said, you know what, I wanted regulatory clarity.

对吧？

Right?

我想要一个支持这个领域的政府，这样我就不用担心监管风险了。

I I wanted an administration that was supportive of the space where I didn't have to think about regulatory risk.

相反，我可以专注于投资机会。

Instead I could focus on investment opportunities.

是的，监管风险对于大银行来说真的很难承受。

Yeah, the regulatory risk is really hard for a big bank to underwrite.

真的很难。

Really hard.

他们可以处理信用风险，可以处理久期风险。

They could do credit risk, they could do duration risk.

监管风险，他们连碰都不想碰。

Regulatory risk, they don't even wanna sniff out.

没错。

That that's right.

而且，你知道的……

I and, you know

现在大家都在谈论人工智能，但真正重要的人工智能是那种能帮你节省时间、帮你做出更明智的决策、并且减轻你工作负担的。

Everybody is talking about AI right now, but the AI that actually matters is the kind that saves you time, helps you make smarter decisions, and takes work off your plate.

如果你在经营电商业务，发货就是那种要么让你顺利推进、要么让你完全停滞的事情之一。

And if you're running an e commerce business, shipping is one of those things that can either keep you moving or completely slow you down.

这就是我喜欢ShipStation的原因。

That's why I like ShipStation.

它是一个为电商业务打造的端到端订单履行平台，其人工智能基于全球数十亿次发货的几十年真实发货数据进行训练。

It's an end to end order fulfillment platform built for e commerce businesses and its AI is trained on decades of real shipping data from billions of shipments across the world.

所以，与其同时应付一堆不同的工具，ShipStation能帮你保持掌控。

So instead of juggling a bunch of different tools, ShipStation helps you stay in control.

它能在库存不足时提醒你，推荐最佳的承运商和费率，自动化任务，并帮助你在业务增长时节省时间。

It can alert you when your stock is low, recommend the best carrier selections and rates, automate tasks, and help you save time as you grow.

你还能获得跨销售渠道的库存同步、自动比价、品牌退货门户，以及与会计和CRM软件的集成，所有这些都在一个地方搞定。

You also get inventory syncing across sales channels, automatic rate shopping, a branded returns portal, and integrations with accounting and CRM software all in one place.

如果我在经营电商店铺，这正是我想要的工具，因为一旦订单开始涌入，你肯定不希望物流成为拖后腿的环节。

If I were running an e commerce store, this is exactly the kind of tool I'd want because once the orders start coming in, you don't want shipping to be the thing that's holding you back.

超过一百万家商家已经信任ShipStation来优化和扩展他们的物流。

Over 1,000,000 businesses have trusted ShipStation to optimize and scale their shipping.

你越早切换，就能越早开始节省时间和金钱。

The sooner you switch, the sooner you start saving time and money.

今天就注册ShipStation，在shipstation.com输入代码crypto，即可免费使用六十天。

Get started with ShipStation today and get sixty days free at shipstation.com with code crypto.

网址是shipstation.com，代码crypto。

That's shipstation.com, code crypto.

Shipstation.com，代码crypto。

Shipstation.com, code crypto.

税费和费用另计。

Taxes and fees apply.

你知道什么最拖慢团队进度吗？

You know what slows teams down more than anything?

不一定是人员预算，甚至也不是工具本身。

It's not always the headcount budget or even the tools themselves.

而是工作流程只存在于某个人脑子里，从来没有被真正记录下来。

It's when the way work gets done lives in someone's head and never actually gets documented.

然后新人加入、新平台上线，或者有同事离职，突然每个人做同一件事的方法都不一样了。

Then someone new joins, a new platform gets rolled out or a teammate leaves and suddenly everybody's doing the same process in a different way.

这正是今天的赞助商Scribe要解决的问题。

That's exactly the problem today's sponsor, Scribe, was built to solve.

Scribe是一个工作流AI平台，财富500强中有94%的公司都在使用它。

Scribe is a workflow AI platform trusted by 94% of the Fortune 500.

它能实时捕捉工作流程，并自动生成一步步的操作文档，方便团队审阅和分享。

It captures workflows as they happen and turns them into step by step documentation your team can review and share.

你就像平常一样操作，Scribe 会边做边生成指南，自动捕捉每一次点击、每一步操作和截图。

You just do the process like you normally would and Scribe builds the guide as you go, capturing every click, step, and screenshot automatically.

因为我们的团队是远程办公，我确实遇到过好几次需要向同事重复解释同一个设置或流程的情况，总觉得这些第一次就该记录下来。

With our team being remote, I have definitely had moments where I've had to explain the same setup or process more than once to a colleague, and it always feels like something that should have been documented the first time.

有了 Scribe，原本可能需要花几个小时编写和整理的内容，不到一分钟就能准备好分享。

With Scribe, what could take hours of writing and cleanup can be ready to share in under a minute.

Scribe 还会自动从截图中隐去敏感信息，比如姓名、邮箱和账号。

Scribe also automatically redacts sensitive information like names, emails, and account numbers from screenshots.

管理员可以在整个团队中强制执行这一功能，确保没有任何遗漏。

Admins can enforce that across the team so nothing slips through the cracks.

另外，任何按照流程操作的人都能获得实时的屏幕指导，准确显示在实际工具中该点击哪里。

Plus, anyone following the process can get real time on screen guidance showing exactly where to click inside the actual tool.

Scribe 不仅仅是记录工作流程，它还会利用 AI 提出改进建议，帮你发现冗余步骤，找到简化或自动化的机会。

Scribe doesn't just document workflows, it uses AI to suggest ways to improve them, helping you spot redundant steps and opportunities to simplify or automate.

想看看 Scribe 能为你的团队带来什么，就访问 scribe.how/crypto101，并提及 crypto one 01，即可在特定套餐上免费享受第一个月的 Scribe capture 服务。

To see what Scribe could look like for your org, head to scribe.how/crypto101 and mention crypto one 01 for your first month of Scribe capture free on select plans.

这就是Scribe，scribe.how/crypto10one。

That's Scribe, scribe.how/crypto10one.

不知道你怎么样，但我经常不知不觉就到饭点了。

I don't know about you, but dinner sneaks up on me all the time.

打开冰箱才发现，肉都没准备好。

I'll open the fridge and realize I have no protein ready.

这时候我可不想跑去超市，临时买点肉，还得碰运气看还剩什么。

And at that point, I'm not trying to go to the store, make a last minute grocery run, and gamble on whatever meats or burgers are left at the store.

所以Omaha Steaks是个很好的冰箱储备选择。

That's why Omaha Steaks is a great freezer move.

就像家里有个信得过的肉铺，最需要的时候随时有好肉。

It's like having a trusted butcher at home and quality protein when you need it the most.

Omaha Steaks用一百多年的时间赢得了好口碑。

Omaha Steaks has earned its reputation with over a hundred years.

和全国厨房里信赖的牛肉一样，直接送到你家门口。

It's the same beef trusted in kitchens across the country, shipped straight to your door.

牛排馆的品质，却不用花牛排馆的价钱。

Steakhouse quality without the steakhouse prices.

你的家人会以为这顿饭花了好几个小时，但其实没有。

Your family will think dinner took hours, but it didn't.

只要几分钟。

Just minutes.

如果你还没试过，那个完美汉堡套餐是最合适的入门选择。

And if you never tried them, the burger perfection flight is the perfect place to start.

你会得到20个优质牛排汉堡，由五种不同的牛排部位制成。

You get 20 premium steak burgers made from five different cuts of steak.

四个菲力牛排汉堡、四个纽约客牛排汉堡、四个肋眼牛排汉堡、四个牛胸肉汉堡和四个西冷牛排汉堡。

Four filet mignon burgers, four New York strip burgers, four rib eye burgers, four brisket burgers, and four sirloin burgers.

各位，这简直就是汉堡界的山寨币篮子。

Guys, this is the altcoin basket of burgers right here.

如果我和布莱恩在节目里，我们会把这些对半分，因为你知道我们夏天多喜欢烧烤。

If me and Brian were on the rundown, we would be divvying these up fifty fifty because you know how we like to grill in the summer.

所以你得到的不仅仅是一盒汉堡，而是不同的风味、不同的口感，还有真正的牛排馆级别的多样性，你可以放在烤架上烤，或者在工作日快速烹饪。

So you're not just getting a box of burgers, you're getting different flavor profiles, different textures, and real steakhouse style variety you can throw on the grill or cook up fast during the week.

今天就到omahasteaks.com试试汉堡完美套餐吧。

Try the burger perfection flight at omahasteaks.com today.

20个优质牛排汉堡只要79.99美元，使用促销码beef还能再减35美元。

That's 20 premium steak burgers for just $79.99, plus get $35 off with the promo code beef.

在omahasteaks.com结账时输入促销码BEEF，立减35美元。

That's omahasteaks.com promo code BEEF for $35 off at checkout.

条款适用，详情请见网站。

Terms apply, see site for details.

就像你说的，现在Clarity就是抛硬币决定。

Like you're saying, coin toss right now on Clarity.

这对机构来说很难拿到投资委员会上去讨论，对吧？

That's really hard for an institution to bring to investment committee, right?

嗯，确实有抛硬币的成分，而且，顺便说一句，我可以随便说，我觉得如果通过了，我们就在快车道上，我觉得我们还是在前进。

Well, there's a coin toss in, and by the way, can say as much as I want, I think we're in the fast lane if it passes, I think we're still moving forward.

如果没通过，那跟大型机构现在进入加密领域、在监管事件前下第一笔大赌注是完全不同的情况。

If it doesn't pass, that's different from being a big institution and making your first big bet on crypto right now going into that regulatory event.

完全同意。

Totally.

所以我们希望有策略能配合那些客户，他们说，我们在寻找进入这个领域的入口，我们在寻找一种开始参与的方式，来逐步学习，了解这里正在发生什么。

So we want to have strategies that align with clients who are saying, we're looking for our entry to the space, we're looking for a way to start getting engaged, to come up the learning curve, to understand what's happening here.

我们非常关注的一点是，加密货币就像人工智能一样，是一项关键的赋能技术。

One of the things that we really like to focus on is crypto is a key enabling technology just like AI.

是的。

Yes.

而且它实际上与人工智能非常互补，我认为很多首席投资官、很多首席信息官都在说，我们理解人工智能如何融入我们的投资组合，或者我们理解人工智能如何融入我们的技术栈。

And it's actually quite complementary to AI, and I think you have a lot of chief investment officers, you have a lot of chief information officers, they're saying, we understand how AI comes into our portfolio mix or we understand how AI comes into our tech stack.

对于加密货币，我们感觉它与人工智能相辅相成，我们感觉它很重要，但不确定具体如何。

Crypto we have a sense that it dovetails with that, we have a sense that it's important, but we're not sure exactly how.

所以我们想做的就是成为那个向导，成为那个信息灵通的加密原生助手，陪伴他们踏上这段旅程，帮助他们弄清楚如何投资加密货币，如何与人工智能敞口互补，以及如何在他们的业务中实施加密货币。

So what we'd like to do is be that guide, be that well informed crypto native aid in coming on that journey, helping them figure out how to invest in crypto, how it complements their AI exposure, and how to implement crypto as well within their businesses.

我很喜欢。

I love it.

这涵盖了主动流动性、风险投资以及富兰克林有专长的多个不同领域，同时我们依然会专注于其他所有方面。

And that's across active liquid, that's across venture, that's across a bunch of different areas where Franklin has expertise, and then we're still going to be just as focused on all of the other areas.

我们有很棒的代币化技术。

We have great tokenization technology.

对，我正想说这个。

Yeah, I was gonna say.

我们还有你提到的那些ETF。

We we have the the ETFs as you noted.

没错。

Right.

这些都是整体的一部分，构成一个全面的产品组合。

It's all part of it, a comprehensive product suite.

太厉害了，而且我觉得，这场对话可以延伸到很多不同的方向。

That's incredible, and I again, this conversation could splinter in so many different directions.

我觉得对很多正在看的人来说，这个话题非常相关。就是，布莱斯、赛斯，你们知道的，我们看到了加密货币这个领域。

I think for a lot of people that are watching, it's hyper relevant is, alright, Bryce, Seth, you know, we see the crypto complex.

我们已经持有比特币了。

We already own Bitcoin.

我们已经持有以太坊，可能还买了一点索拉纳，不管是通过ETF还是其他产品持有的。

We already own Ethereum, maybe a sprinkle of Solana, whether we own it in the ETF through a shaked product or we own it.

好。

K.

但是，为什么还有上百万种其他加密货币呢？聪明钱是怎么考虑在这些资产中配置的？

And but why is there a million other cryptocurrencies, and how does the smart money think about allocating across that universe?

对。

Yeah.

你们会看一些指标吗，比如现金流或者收入？在加密货币里这些是什么样的？

Are you looking at certain factors like cash flows or revenues, and what does that look like in crypto?

你们会看TVL或者增长率这些数据吗？

Are you looking at how much TVL or growth rates?

你是怎么做的？

How do you do it?

说来也挺有意思的。

So it's funny.

就像我们之前聊到的，我一开始是做基本面股票的。

As we talked about earlier, I grew up on the fundamental equity side.

对。

Sure.

做基本面股票，你得预测基本面会怎么走。

And fundamental equities, you're modeling out where you think fundamentals are gonna go.

你得考虑怎么估值，通常就是看可比公司。

You think about how you're gonna approach valuation, that's typically looking at comparables.

你得想清楚针对那个行业，你的估值方法是什么。

You think about what your valuation methodology is going to be for that particular sector.

如果是高增长的公司，可能就用市销率来估值。

So if it's high growth, maybe it's a revenue multiple.

如果增长率稍微低一点，可能就用未来十二个月的市盈率，对吧，都是基于对未来的预期。如果涉及资产负债表，就用企业价值除以EBITDA。

If it is slightly lower growth than that, maybe it's next twelve month PE, right, all on future expectations of If balance sheet is in play, it's EV to EBITDA.

好的。

Okay.

对，所以有不同的方法。如果是资产型投资，比如非常规页岩油，通常你会看价格对资产净值。

Right, so there are different ways if it's an asset play, like unconventional shale, oftentimes you looked at it on a price to net asset value.

对，所以传统市场有很多不同的估值方法，加密货币也很类似。

Right, so lots of different ways of valuing in the traditional market, very similar in crypto.

在加密货币领域，我们同样看重强劲的基本面。

So in crypto again, what we like to see is strong fundamentals.

我们看重收入产生、强劲的收入增长，这些价值体现在代币上，然后我们可以模拟出我们认为价值会如何变化，收入增长会是什么样子，应该以什么倍数交易，这样我们就有了目标价。

We like to see revenue generation, strong revenue growth, that value captured in the token, and then we can model out where we think that value is going to go, what we think that revenue ramp is going to look like, what multiple that should trade in, and that gives us a price target.

那我们是不是只投资那些有收入并且价值体现在代币上的项目呢？

Now do we only invest in things that have revenue and value capture in the token?

不是，因为有些项目还没有收入。

No, because this Prerevenue.

没错，所以如果你在2012年投资特斯拉，那是个买入的好时机。

That's right, so if you were investing in Tesla in 2012, it was a great time to buy Tesla.

那时候是他们最不赚钱的时候。

They were the least profitable they'd ever That's been

而且顺便说一句，接下来的九年里，有时候有30%的流通股被做空。

and by the way, for the next nine years you had it sometimes 30% of the float short,

对吧？

right?

亚马逊也一样，对吧？

Amazon, the same thing, right?

当他们还只是零售业务的时候，那是买入的绝佳时机，但他们并不盈利。

When they were just a retail business, it was a fantastic time to buy them, but they weren't profitable.

对。

Right.

而且当时也不清楚他们会不会盈利，对吧？

And it wasn't clear that they were going to be profitable right?

直到他们推出了AWS，然后是广告平台，所以Netflix又是一个例子。

Until they started AWS, and then the ad platform, and so Netflix another example.

所以你必须对可能发生的事情、未来可能的样子保持开放的心态，然后应用那个基本框架。现在关于加密货币有趣的是，还有一个额外的维度，那就是我们会不会得到监管的明确性？

So you have to have an open mind around what can be, what the future could look like, and then apply that fundamental framework based on Now what's interesting about crypto is there's kind of an added dimension which is, are we gonna get regulatory clarity?

创始人能不能通过回购让代币捕获价值？

Are founders going to be able to allow the token capture value through buybacks?

现在我们看到有一个政府允许创始人这样做，你开始看到越来越多的创始人。

And now we're seeing an administration that's letting founders do that, and you're starting to see more and more founders.

我现在告诉你，我认为有更多的大团队、大市值团队在考虑改变他们的代币经济模型，以积累更多价值，这是我以前从未见过的。

Tell you right now, I think there are more large teams, large market cap teams that are thinking about changes to their tokenomics that could accrue more value than I've ever seen before.

这真的很令人鼓舞。

That's really encouraging.

这几乎让加密货币在某种程度上更像股票了，

It's almost like making crypto more equity like in a sense,

而这在过去是令人害怕的。

and having Which was scary in the past.

对，因为如果你那么做，Gary Gensler 就会找上门来。

Right, because if you did that, you'd get Gary Ginnsler

来

to get

敲你的门。

at you knocking on the

没错。

door.

百分之百。

100%.

所以最终能有这样一个真正有价值的新资产类别，是件好事。

And so it's good that like at the end of the day, you're having a new asset class with real value.

是的。

That's right.

而不只是那些模因币，那些还会继续存在。

Whereas not just the meme coins, and those will still exist.

那些会是可交易的机会。

Those will be tradable opportunities.

在合适的时期，那会是阿尔法，你可以看资金费率或期权市场的偏斜，你仍然可以交易那些，但对于你的长期核心投资组合，拥有能复利的东西，对。

That'll be alpha during the right period that you could look at funding rates or skew on the options market, you could still trade those, but for your long term core investment portfolio, having things that compound Yeah.

他们的现金流。

Their cash flow.

顺便说一句，在传统股票世界里，他们的业务每六到十二个月就会从极度盈利变成极度亏损。

So And by the way, their business is in the traditional equities world that go from wildly profitable to wildly unprofitable like every six to twelve months.

我正想说，超大规模数据中心就是一个很好的例子。

I was gonna say the hyperscalers is a great example.

它们曾经是最大的自由现金流机器。

They were the most large free cash flowing machines.

现在它们即将变成负自由现金流。

Now they're about to be negative free cash flow.

而且你知道，这就像

And you know, it's the

而且还有企业价值，是的。

most And there's still enterprise value, Yeah.

所以，其中一些企业，你可以说不是超大规模企业，但很多时候，这些企业的价值确实在于遥远的未来，而且今天它们几乎就像模因股票一样。

So, and some of those businesses, you could say not the hyperscalers, but oftentimes they're businesses where it really is about something way out in the future, and it almost is a meme stock today.

它们是根据一种叙事来交易的，那就是如果你能获得监管的明确性，如果你能为它们的行业获得所有这些条件，它们可能会变成什么样子。

It's trading on the narrative of what can be if you get regulatory clarity, if you get all of these for their sectors.

所以我们在加密货币中看到的情况，与我们在传统股票市场中看到的情况有相似之处。

So what we're seeing in crypto is it rhymes with what we've seen in the traditional equities What

你怎么看以太坊？它是除比特币之外市值最大的资产。

do you make of, so Ethereum's kind of the largest market cap asset outside of Bitcoin.

上面构建了很多不同的智能合约应用，但它表现不佳。

There's a lot of different smart contract applications built on it, but it struggled.

我记得我看到过一张图表。

I think I saw a chart.

它的价格和五年前一模一样。

It's at the same exact price as it was five years ago.

你知道的，有些大涨，有些大跌，但看起来他们也在尝试更多地获取价值。

You know, some big ups, some big downs, but it seems like they're trying to also break into a little bit more value capture.

现在以太坊的情况怎么样？

What's the skinny on Ethereum right now?

你看，我觉得我们一开始就谈到，2026年显然是传统金融和加密货币融合的一年。

I mean look, I think we started out by talking about how '26 is very clearly the year where traditional finance and crypto are converging.

传统金融喜欢那些已经存在很久的企业。

Traditional finance loves businesses that have been around for a long time.

对。

Right.

有长久生命力的。

That have longevity.

他们管那叫什么，林迪效应？

What do they call that, Lindy effect?

林迪效应，而且你能确定你的业务放在那里不会出问题，不会出现停机。

Lindy effect and where you can be sure that you're not gonna put your business there, and then it's gonna have downtime.

对。

Right.

对吧？

Right?

所以那些已经存在了一段时间的第一层链，不管是ETH还是SOL，它们在机构化进程中占有特殊地位，因为它们有那种Lindy效应，有那种长久性，我觉得ETH就是最好的例子。

So the L1s that have been around for a while, whether it's ETH, whether it's SOL, they hold a special place in the enter, in the institutionalization of because the they have that Lindy, because they have that longevity, and I think ETH is the poster child for that.

它不会消失的。

It's not going away.

它正在消失。

It's going away.

它有RWA，有稳定币，什么都有。

It's got the RWAs, the stablecoins, it's all there.

那里是稳定币数量最多的地方。

It's the place where you see largest number of stablecoins.

正如你提到的RWA，而且顺便说一句，手续费已经降下来了。

RWAs as you noted, and by the way, fees have come down.

手续费确实降下来了。

Fees have come down.

而且手续费，我不仅是在付

And fees have I've not only been paying

2021年高峰期一笔交易要1000美元

$1,000 for a transaction at the peak of the 2021

牛市的时候。不过不只是周期性变化，随着网络升级，手续费也降下来了。

bull It's not only that cyclicality though, but they've come down with network upgrades.

对。

Right.

对吧？

Right?

所以现在这条链性能更好，成本应该更低，而且已经有十多年的历史了。

So you have a chain now that's more performant, that should be lower cost, and that has a decade plus of longevity.

我觉得这对传统金融现在进入加密货币领域来说，是一个非常强大的组合。

I think that's a really powerful combo when you think about traditional finance coming in right now to crypto.

在目前可投资的流动性资产里，你觉得听众们应该把大部分时间花在哪些方面？

Of the investable liquid universe right now, where should listeners be spending most of their time, do you think?

而且，不是要点名具体项目，但有没有哪个主题是你公司或者你个人特别感兴趣的？

And again, not to do single name callouts, but is there a theme that your firm is particularly or you personally are particularly interested in?

我觉得我们看到的领域，可以分成两大类。

So I think the areas where we're seeing, there are two buckets that I would call out.

一类是某些主题性的垂直领域。

One is some thematic verticals.

好的。

Okay.

比如任何跟市场基础设施相关的。

So anything that's market infrastructure.

好的。

Okay.

对，比如借贷，比如债务，比如那些用于这些融合应用的L1链。

Right, so that could be borrow lend, that could be a a debt, that could be an L1 that is being used for these convergence applications.

刚才一下子想到了很多。

A lot just came to mind right there.

所以这是一个领域。

So that's one area.

支付是另一个领域，对吧？

Payments is another, right?

我们有一些支付链，还有一些新的正在推出。

We have some payment chains, there's some new ones coming out.

这些地方跟支付是相邻的。

They're places that are adjacent to that.

AI和加密货币是另一个有很多有趣机会的领域。

AI and crypto, another area where there are a lot of interesting opportunities.

所以我会把那些有实际采用的垂直领域放在一个篮子里，然后另一个是不分垂直领域的，但你能看到良好的营收增长，以及代币的价值捕获。

So I would put those, the verticals with real adoption in one bucket, and then I'd say the other is kind of vertical agnostic, but where you're seeing good top line growth, and where you're seeing value capture in the token.

我很喜欢。

I love it.

我觉得这只会不断扩大，而且顺便说一句，那

And I think that's just gonna expand out, and by the way that's

我祈祷它真的会这样。

I'm praying it does.

我

I'm

祈祷。嗯，这就像，你可以把它想象成几乎是深度的，对吧，去中心化的物理基础设施，但把那个范围再扩大很多，对吧？

praying Well it and that's like, think of that as like almost deep in, right, decentralized physical infrastructure, but opening that aperture a lot more, right?

你知道，我的合伙人们已经听我讲过很多次了。

And you know my partners have heard me talk about this a lot.

我觉得用不了两年，就会有分析师专门研究加密和医疗、加密和AI、加密和消费，就像股票基金里有消费分析师和医疗分析师一样，对吧？

I think we're not more than a year or two away from having analysts that cover crypto and healthcare, crypto and AI, crypto and consumer, just like an equity fund has a consumer analyst than a healthcare analyst, right?

是的。

Yeah.

所以我觉得这种专业化会变得很重要，因为一旦基础设施成熟了，重点就会转向投资应用层。

So I think that specialization is going to become important because once you mature the infrastructure, then it becomes about investing in the application layer.