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你是如何将疫苗与你儿子的自闭症联系起来的？
How did you link that it was the vaccines to your son's autism?
我在超市结账时，发现自己登上了《时代》杂志的封面。
I was in the grocery store on the cover of Time magazine while I was checking out.
母亲们担心MMR疫苗会导致孩子患上自闭症。
Mothers are concerned that the MMR is causing their child's autism.
到这个时候，埃文的发育里程碑都达到了，但他正遭受着其他我未曾意识到是警示信号的症状。
By this point, Evan's milestones were all there, but Evan was suffering from other things I didn't know were warning signs.
我们现在看到的自闭症——那些不会说话、用头撞墙、吃自己粪便、整天把粪便抹在墙上的孩子——这不仅仅是诊断标准提高的结果。
The autism that we are seeing, the kids that can't speak, that are head banging, that are eating their feces, that are spreading feces on the wall all day long, that's not just better diagnosis.
我们的健康范式正在发生根本性转变。
There is an absolute shift in the paradigm of our health.
你在好莱坞听到关于玛哈的什么看法？
What sentiments do you hear from Hollywood about Maha?
好莱坞里隐藏的保守派比你想象的要多。
There's more conservatives than you would know hiding out in Hollywood.
珍妮·麦卡锡如何看待2000年代初期的健康社区与现在的对比？
What does Jenny McCarthy think about the wellness community from the early two thousands compared to now?
她尝试过的最奇怪的治疗方法是什么？
What about the weirdest treatments she's ever done?
她丈夫唐尼·沃尔伯格在初次见面时是否立即支持她的疫苗 activism？
Was her husband, Donnie Wahlberg, automatically on board with her vaccine activism when they first met?
在医疗自由方面，她对MAHA运动有信心吗？
Does she have faith in the MAHA movement when it comes to medical freedom?
查理·柯克对她意味着什么？她与耶稣的关系立场如何？
What about what Charlie Kirk meant to her and where she stands on her relationship with Jesus?
这次采访确实涵盖了一切，我知道你会把这次采访列为年度最爱之一。
We really do cover everything in this interview, so I know you're going to consider this one a favorite of the year.
珍妮是妻子、母亲、演员、《蒙面歌王》评委，以及纯净美容品牌Formless Beauty的创始人。
Jenny is a wife, mom, actress, judge on the masked singer, and the founder of the clean beauty line, Formless Beauty.
她还是畅销书作家，并在疫苗、健康和育儿问题上直言不讳的倡导者。
She's also a best selling author and outspoken advocate on vaccines, wellness, and parenting.
这是一次必看的访谈，可以在Real Alex Clark的YouTube频道或Spotify上的Culture Apothecary收听。
This is a must watch interview on the Real Alex Clark YouTube channel or Culture Apothecary on Spotify.
请通过在Apple或Spotify上给我们五星好评，帮助我们圆满结束这一年。
Please help us end this year strong with a five star review on Apple or Spotify.
只需告诉我们你为什么喜欢这个播客。
Just telling us why you love this podcast.
如果你是第一次收听，这是一个公开保守的健康与养生播客，由Turning Point USA制作。
If you're new here, this is an openly conservative health and wellness podcast produced by Turning Point USA.
我们肩负着使命，要从身体、情感和精神层面治愈这个病态的文化。
We're on a mission to heal a sick culture physically, emotionally, and spiritually.
Apothecary（药剂师）是过去人们寻求自然疗法的地方，而我们的文化现在正需要这种治愈力量。
And Apothecary was the original place you'd go to back in the day for natural remedies for healing, and our culture could use that right now.
因此，节目取了这个名字。
Hence, the name of the show.
我们的Instagram账号是Culture Apothecary。
We're on Instagram at Culture Apothecary.
你也可以在Real Alex Clark找到我。
You can also find me at Real Alex Clark.
让我们欢迎独一无二的珍妮·麦卡锡来到Culture Apothecary。
Please welcome the one and only Jenny McCarthy to Culture Apothecary.
哪个先发生的？
What came first?
是先疗愈自己还是先疗愈你的儿子？
Was it healing yourself or healing your son?
绝对是先疗愈我儿子。
Definitely healing my son.
或许我应该补充说明，最初是通过排毒疗法开始接触这些的。
Maybe I'll back that up a little bit by saying I started to look into things by doing cleanses.
我当时就想，生完孩子后让我来净化下身体吧。
So I was like, oh, let me, you know, clean up my body after I had a baby.
老实说，更多是出于虚荣心。
And it was more so out of vanity, to be honest.
我当时想，怀孕期间增加的80磅体重该怎么减掉呢？
I'm like, how am I gonna lose the 80 pounds I gained during pregnancy?
确切地说，当时体重达到了212磅左右。
Literally, it was two hundred and twelve or something like that pounds.
你们可以谷歌搜索一下。
You can Google it.
大家搜一下珍妮·麦卡锡怀孕的照片，那是最搞笑的照片之一。
You guys Google Jenny McCarthy pregnant, and it is one of the funniest photos.
我有十七层下巴。
I have seventeen chins.
什么？
What?
哦，我当时胖得惊人。
Oh, I was enormous.
所以之后我参加了Weight Watchers来减掉一些体重。
So then I was I did Weight Watchers after that to lose some of the weight.
好的。
Okay.
我记得那些事。
I remember those.
是啊。
Yeah.
然后我就想，干脆再进一步。
And then I was like, well, let me just go for it to the next level.
那就是排毒。
That would be a detox.
所以我做了这个很棒的排毒疗程，从中收获良多。
So I did this amazing detox, and I learned a lot from that.
后来过了几年，我儿子生病了。
Then a few years went on, my son got sick.
由于他的诊断结果，我直接投身其中。
And he because of his diagnosis, I just dove in.
我奉献了我的全部生活。
I dedicated my entire life.
当他生病时，我意识到这是我的使命——不仅要治愈他，还要向世界传授我是如何做到的。
I knew it was my purpose when he got sick that, okay, it's not only to heal him, but then it's to teach the world how I did it.
能如此迅速地认识到如此重大的使命真是了不起。
That's like a huge mission to recognize quite immediately.
就像，我的工作就是要让所有人都知道。
Like, this is gonna be my my work here is to is to let everyone know.
我能告诉你这件事有多深刻吗？
Can I tell you how profound it really was?
因为在他被诊断出自闭症的那天，我完全震惊了。
Because the day he was diagnosed with autism, I was in shock.
因为那时候——我们说的是2002年——除了电影《雨人》之外，人们对自闭症知之甚少。
Because back then, we're talking 2002, you guys, when there wasn't that much except the movie Rain Man.
当时我们被告知：'你儿子将来得进精神病院'。
And we were told back then, oh, your son's gonna be institutionalized.
那天我不得不带着这样的想法回家：我完美的儿子，那个会笑着喊妈妈、突然停止说这些话的孩子，现在要被送进精神病院了。
So I had to go home that day thinking my son, my perfect son, who was smiling and saying mama and all these things and stopped saying all these things all of a sudden was now gonna be institutionalized.
这完全说不通。
It didn't make sense.
于是我回到家，允许自己像胎儿般蜷缩在床上歇斯底里地哭了一场。
So I went home and gave myself the moment of hysterically crying in a fetal position in bed.
我给了自己大约一小时，然后爬起来走向电脑。
I gave myself about an hour, and then I got up, and I went to the computer.
我当时想，我必须查查看。
And I'm like, I have to just look.
我必须确认是否还有希望。
I have to see if there's hope.
我搜索了自闭症，屏幕角落显示着'康复希望'。
And I googled autism, and in the corner of the screen said, hope for recovery.
我当时想，康复？
And I was like, recovery?
他们在说什么江湖骗术？
What kind of snake oil are they talking about?
为什么他们要用‘从自闭症中恢复’这样的字眼？
What did the why are they using the word recover from autism?
当我点击链接时，发现那是‘世代救援’组织，当时由一群医生、家长和科学家组成的小团队，他们正在治疗许多与自闭症共存的症状——比如癫痫、肠漏症、念珠菌感染、过敏、湿疹等。我们发现如果治愈这些症状，自闭症也会有所改善。
And when I clicked on it, it was generation rescue, and it was a group of doctors, parents, and scientists, small group at this time, who were healing a lot of the comorbid conditions associated with autism that you see with autism, seizures, leaky gut, candida, allergies, eczema, like, all of these conditions that we were finding if you heal those, the autism was getting better.
他们还提到这是疫苗伤害，所以他们称之为‘从伤害中恢复’。
And then they also talked about it being a vaccine injury, which is why they call it you recover from injury.
我用一个很好的比喻，这也是我现在看待自闭症的方式。
I use this great analogy, and that's how I look at, really, autism these days.
这是一种损伤。
It's an injury.
你不是被‘治愈’了自闭症。
You don't become cured from autism.
你从中恢复，就像从损伤中恢复一样。
You recover from it just like an injury.
如果你被公交车撞了，你不会去问别人‘你被公交车撞的毛病治好了吗？’
If you get hit from a bus, you don't go to someone, oh, did you get are you cured from being hit by that bus?
不会。
No.
你会问‘你的伤恢复了吗？’
You'd say, did you recover from your injury?
所以当有人说她治好了她儿子时，我就是这种感觉。
So that's how when people like, she said she cured her son.
我从未说过‘治愈’这个词。
Never once have I said cured.
我一直说的是‘康复’。
I've always said recover.
他们可以恢复丧失的技能。
They can recover lost skills.
他们能够改善许多因免疫系统失调而恶化的健康问题。
They re can recover a lot of their health issues that were, you know, blown up by their immune system.
比如湿疹之类的。
Like the eczema or whatever.
比如湿疹，比如共病症状。
Like the eczema, like the comorbid conditions.
这确实是我走上这条道路的原因。
And so that's really what took me on my path.
那一刻我想回溯一下，因为当我读到那些内容时，我被一种无比神圣的能量击中——至今仍记得坐在椅子上读到疫苗相关内容时的场景，就像是将所有线索串联起来，我意识到这就是我的使命。
And then when in that moment, I wanna back up because when I was reading that, I was hit by the most godly energy in I still remember the moment in my chair when I was reading this and the vaccine and the putting it was like a putting all the connections together that it was my purpose.
当人们谈论上帝，说他们听到上帝、感受到上帝时——那种感觉如此强烈，我全身的汗毛都竖了起来。
When people talk about God, that they hear God, they feel God, this was so powerful that my every hair in my body stood up.
我浑身发冷。
I had the chills.
我开始嚎啕大哭。
I started bawling.
我当时就想：好吧。
I was like, okay.
这是我的使命。
This is my mission.
哇。
Wow.
这是我的使命。
This is my mission.
但我先说，听着，上帝。
But first, I said, listen, God.
然后我进行了这场对话。
And I had this conversation.
我说，我听到了，但我必须先治好我的儿子。
I go, I hear you, but I need to first heal my son.
我需要治好我的儿子，然后我向你保证，我会教会全世界我是怎么做到的。
I need to heal my son, and then I promise you, I will teach the world how I did it.
但请指引我方向。
But lead me there.
要知道，我真的让我儿子——愿他小小的心灵得到保佑——经历了许多人们不曾谈论或尝试的事情。
And, you know, I really put my son, bless his little heart, through so many things that people weren't, you know, talking about or doing.
没有什么想法是太过牵强的。
Nothing was too far fetched.
我并没有做什么插管之类的疯狂举动，但即便只是改变饮食，在当时也被视为一种令人震惊的疗法。
I wasn't, like, hooking up with tubes and crazy stuff, but it was like even changing the diet was considered a shocking therapy back then.
当我上奥普拉节目时，我说我剔除了麸质和乳制品，这带来了很大改善。
When I was on Oprah and I was like, I removed gluten and dairy, and that helped a lot.
肠道和大脑之间确实存在联系。
And there is a connection between gut and brain.
我无法告诉你我因此遭受了多少来自医学界的恶意。
I can't tell you the amount of hate I got from the medical community.
他们对此说了些什么？
What were they saying about
这个？
that?
他们说，听听这个疯子珍妮·麦卡锡在胡说什么，说饮食能改变孩子的自闭症诊断。
They were saying, you know, listen to this wacko Jenny McCarthy talking about how dye can help change your child's autism diagnosis.
太疯狂了。
Crazy.
当孩子感觉不舒服时，他们就会表现得很糟糕。
When a child doesn't feel good, they're going to act bad.
没错。
Yep.
但当他们感觉良好时，肠道和大脑之间确实存在联系。
But when they feel good and and there's a gut brain connection.
基本上，我们现在知道乳制品的问题了。
Basically, you know, dairy is what we've learned now.
它会产生多巴胺效应。
It creates a dopamine effect.
这会使孩子像吸毒一样，尤其是在我们社区。
It makes the child stoned, especially in our community.
一旦消除了那种恍惚感，他们在治疗中就能更专注。
You take away that stoned like feeling, they're more focused in their therapies.
所以家长们发现孩子注意力更集中，学习效果也更好。
So they're finding their child more focused so they can learn.
现在我在《纽约时报》头版看到这个，就觉得，哦，真的吗？
Now I see it on the cover of The New York Times, and I'm like, oh, really?
你还记得吗？
Do you remember?
你们当初为这些事可没少批评我。
You guys beat me up for those things.
我现在看得很淡了。
I look at it, you know, very lightly now.
我不是那种会斤斤计较的人。
I'm not one of those people and go, hey.
我的功劳哪去了？
Where's my props?
一点也不。
Not at all.
我对人们的觉醒心怀感激。
I have gratitude that people are waking up.
我觉得因为这个疫情，这个社群现在壮大了。
I feel like this community has grown now because of the pandemic.
如果说疫情带来了什么，那就是人们不再盲目相信听到的一切，开始质疑并更深入地探究真相。
If there's anything that came out of that pandemic, it really was that people stopped trusting everything they hear and question, maybe I should look into it more deeply.
这就是我一直以来的愿望。
And that's all I ever wanted.
是啊。
Yeah.
你知道的，要自己去做研究。
You know, research for yourself.
所以你花了数十年时间试图帮助儿子康复。
So you spent decades trying to help your son recover.
是的。
Yes.
然后你就说，好吧。
And then you were like, okay.
我觉得我们现在状态不错。
I think we're in a good spot.
终于轮到我了。
It's finally time for me.
就像，现在我需要真正深入挖掘自己的问题。
Like, now I need to really dive deep under the hood for myself.
对。
Yes.
你最开始做了哪些检查？
What were the first tests that you did?
因为我觉得这对刚踏上健康之旅的人真的很有帮助。
Because I think that's really helpful for people who are in the beginning stages of their health journey.
是的。
Yes.
好的。
Okay.
这很棒，因为我的化妆师也在这里，她很年轻。
This is great because I'm my makeup artist who's also here, she's young.
她三十多岁，我当时就说，听着。
She's in her thirties, and I was like, listen.
你需要现在就开始。
You need to start now.
我是说，我会建议人们从二十多岁就开始。
You need to start I mean, I would tell people starting them in their twenties.
你需要做的是几项不同的检测。
What you wanna do is a few different tests.
我的意思是，MTHFR基因突变只是我会首先检测的一项。
I mean, the MTHFR gene mutation is just one I would start with.
MTHFR基因突变，有人说全国40%的人有这种突变却不知道，也有人说比例高达60%。
MTHFR gene mutation is, like, some say forty percent, some say sixty percent of the country has this gene mutation and doesn't know it.
为什么这很重要？
Why is this important?
首先，如果你正考虑要孩子，我敢保证你会想知道自己是否有这种突变，因为它是会遗传的。
First of all, if you are thinking about having kids, I promise you, you wanna know if you had this mutation because you pass it.
母亲会遗传给儿子。
Mother passes it to son.
哦，天哪。
Oh, wow.
所以你必须了解清楚。
So you need to know.
这意味着什么？
And what does it mean?
用外行话来说，有这种突变意味着什么？
What does it mean to have this mutation in layman's terms?
这意味着你的身体无法进行甲基化。
It means your body can't methylate.
甲基化是什么意思？
What does methylate mean?
甲基化就是给身体排毒。
Methylate means to detox your body.
为什么这很重要？
Why is that important?
因为如果我们不把这些涂抹在脸上、摄入体内、吸入的化学物质排出，它们就会与我们的器官结合并滞留其中。
Because if we don't detox these chemicals that we're putting on our faces, in our bodies, breathing in, then we bind them to our organs and hold on to them.
那会怎样？
And what happens then?
我们会得癌症。
We get cancer.
我们还会把它遗传给孩子。
We pass it down to our baby.
是的。
Yep.
那我们怎么排毒呢？
And how do we detox things?
嗯，只要你的甲基化系统正常运转，就能做到。
Well, by having a normal methylation system, you can.
通过出汗排出。
You sweat it out.
通过排便排出。
You poop it out.
通过排尿排出。
You pee it out.
方法多种多样。
You there's tons of different ways.
但如果你有这个基因突变，毒素就会沉积在器官里。
But when you have this mutation, it goes to your organs and stays there.
他们是否发现很多被诊断为自闭症的儿童也携带MTHFR基因突变？是的。
Are they finding that a lot of children diagnosed with autism also have the MTHFR Yes.
确实如此。
They are.
哇。
Wow.
所以现在这就涉及到那个关于泰诺的话题了。
So now this is where that whole Tylenol thing came in too.
这与自闭症中关于泰诺的讨论类似之处在于，泰诺会影响谷胱甘肽。
So what's the what's similar to this whole Tylenol talk in autism is that Tylenol messes with glutathione.
谷胱甘肽是你体内的天然抗氧化剂，它能处理我刚才提到的所有化学物质，并帮助你将它们排出体外。
Glutathione is your body's natural antioxidant that takes all those chemicals I just talked about and helps you excrete them.
它非常棒，是我们体内维持生命最重要的物质。
It's a wonderful it's the most important thing we have in our bodies to keep us alive.
它能带走所有垃圾，就像垃圾清运工一样。
It takes all the gar it's like the garbage man.
就像这样，好吧。
It's like, okay.
我们要把所有这些垃圾都清理出去。
We're gonna take all that garbage out.
如果你有MTHFR基因突变，我们就不会有高水平的谷胱甘肽。
Now if you have an MTHFRG mutation, we don't have the high glutathione.
我的谷胱甘肽水平低得可怜。
My glutathione levels are in the tank.
你可以检测我。
You test me.
你会问，你的谷胱甘肽水平在哪里？
You're like, where's your glutathione levels?
我一点都没有。
I don't have any.
所以我体内充满毒素还有什么好奇怪的吗？
So is it any surprise that I'm so filled with toxins?
我从未给Evan用过泰诺。
Now I never gave Evan Tylenol.
我怀孕时从未服用过泰诺，但我体内的情况与泰诺造成的效果相同。
I never took Tylenol when I was pregnant, but what I did have matched what Tylenol did.
谷胱甘肽水平低下，而泰诺会降低你的谷胱甘肽水平。
Low glutathione, and Tylenol lowers your glutathione.
所以
So do
你认为携带MTHFR基因的孕妇在怀孕期间接受谷胱甘肽注射可以吗？
you think pregnant women with the MTHFR gene like, is it okay to get glutathione injections while pregnant?
这个问题我无法回答
That I can't answer
因为我不是医生
because I'm not a doctor.
好的
Okay.
但我现在会注射谷胱甘肽。
But I get glutathione injections now.
是的。
Yeah.
我每周去一次，有时每周两次注射。
I get I go once a week, sometimes twice a week to get them.
也有可以自己肌肉注射的，但我不太喜欢给自己打针。
There's also ones you can put in your muscle yourself, but I don't really like to shoot myself.
所以我每周去输两次液，因为我和埃文的情况实在太糟糕了。
So I go and just get the IVs twice a week because my me and Evan are so bottom of the basement.
但我会从MTHFR基因突变检测开始，因为它能让你明确方向，同时知道你需要特定的B族维生素。
But I would start with MTHFR gene mutation test because it's just it it sets you on a pathway of knowing then also that you need certain B vitamins.
甲基化B族维生素。
Methylated B vitamins.
如果你有MTHFR基因突变却服用非甲基化的B族维生素，可能会在体内引发焦虑反应。
If you are have MTHFR, you guys, and are taking nonmethylated B vitamins, you are causing possible anxiety in your system.
哇。
Wow.
它正在你的体内造成严重破坏。
It's causing havoc in your system.
很多患有严重焦虑症的人最终服用了甲基化B族维生素后都会惊呼‘天哪’。
There's a huge stress people that have severe anxiety disorders wind up taking methylated B vitamins and go, oh my god.
我没有焦虑了。
I don't have anxiety.
再也不会有压力了。
Don't have stress anymore.
这些人其实都有MTHFR基因问题但之前不知道。
That those are people with MTHFR and didn't know it.
所以先做个检测吧。
So just test yourself.
从这里开始。
Start there.
然后我还会去看功能医学医生。
And then I would also go to a functional medicine doctor.
这些医生会深入探究问题本质，不仅会诊断出你有脂肪肝，还会找出脂肪肝的成因，并制定治疗方案来治愈它。
Those are the ones that look under the hood and really go, not only do you have fatty liver, but we're gonna figure out why you have fatty liver, and we're gonna figure out how to heal that fatty liver.
你知道吗？
You know?
所以我用这个例子来说明，但还有很多其他情况。
So it's it I'm using that example, but there's many other things.
如果你携带MTHFR基因突变，又进入围绝经期却从未处理过这个问题，会发生什么？
And what happens if you have the MTHFR gene and you enter perimenopause and you and you have not dealt with this?
哦，姐妹。
Oh, girl.
噢。
Oh.
不仅仅是MTHFR基因突变的问题。
Not just the MTHFR gene mutation.
如果你体内毒素过载，缺乏某些矿物质和补充剂，你会明显感受到。
If you have a toxic overload, if you are deficient in certain minerals and supplements, you are gonna feel it.
你将在自己体内经历第三次世界大战般的痛苦。
You are going to go through World War three in your own body.
这就是为什么我试图告诉众多女性要未雨绸缪，我还写了一本关于更年期的书，明年年底出版，因为我在书中传授了我的经验以及许多医生的建议，人们总说'她又不是医生'。
That's why I try to tell so many women before you even start and I wrote a menopause book that comes out next year, late next year, because teaching women what I did and a lot of doctors in the book, people always go, she's not a doctor.
你说得对。
You're right.
我说的每句话你都要和医生确认。
Talk to your doctor about every single thing I say.
但根据我的经验，我真希望自己能更早开始准备。
But through my experience, I I wish I would have started a little sooner.
比如多少岁？
Like what age?
我希望自己35岁就开始为围绝经期做准备。
I wish I would have started preparing for perimenopause by 35.
好的。
Okay.
因为38岁
Because 38
因为我二月份就33岁了。
because I'm gonna be 33 in February.
好的。
Okay.
所以35岁就该开始准备了。
So 35, I would get going.
38岁时你的身体会开始激素变化。
38 is when you start to have a hormone shift in your body.
而40岁时你会真正开始经历更年期。
And then 40 is when you do start having real one.
你可能会开始注意到变化，甚至体检报告也会有显示。
You'll start noticing it, maybe even your blood work.
不过血液检查并不总是能反映真实情况。
Blood work is not always telling the truth, though.
医生、功能医学医生、激素医生有时会依赖症状来判断围绝经期，因为血液检查中可能看不出异常。
Doctors, functional medicine doctors, hormone doctors rely sometimes on symptoms when you're perimenopausal because you don't see it in your blood work.
你会说：但我的血液检查结果正常啊。
You'll be like, but my blood work's normal.
然后医生会说：是啊。
You're like, yeah.
但你知道吗？
But guess what?
我晚上睡觉时汗如雨下。
I'm dripping in sweat at night.
我在商场里热得脱衣服，因为不停出汗，或者情绪波动，或者失眠。
I'm I'm stripping inside of malls because I'm sweating, or I'm having mood swings, or I have insomnia.
光是失眠这一项就足以让人发疯。
Like, insomnia alone can drive you mad.
是啊。
So Yeah.
通过补充你缺乏的营养素，比如DHEA激素，真的能带来天壤之别。
By supplementing things that you're deficient in makes all the difference in the world, you guys, going into, like, the DHEA hormone, DHEA hormone.
我有阅读障碍，所以得确认自己说对了。
I'm dyslexic, so I had to make sure I said that right.
但你知道，围绝经期时可以开始激素替代疗法（HRT）。
But, you know, perimenopause, you can start hormone, HRT.
你试过吗？
Did you do that?
真希望我在围绝经期时就做了。
I wish I would've did in perimenopause.
我是直接等到绝经后才开始的。
I started it in directly menopause.
不过
But
我也是这么想的。
that's what I thought.
我记得像马蒂·马卡里博士，FDA的主任，谈到他非常支持激素替代疗法。
I thought like, doctor Marty Makary, FDA director, talks about he's really big on HRT.
我记得他说过，在更年期刚开始出现迹象时，也就是五十岁左右，就应该开始使用。
And I thought that he said that, like, at the first sign of menopause starting, which would be in your fifties, that's when you take it.
但你说的是围绝经期？
But you're saying perimenopause?
围绝经期。
Perimenopause.
我会
I would
如果你有症状的话。
if you're symptomatic.
哦，好的。
Oh, okay.
但现在，再次强调，要听医生的建议。
But now, again, listen to your doctor.
是啊。
Yeah.
没错。
Yeah.
因为我看到的一些报告和研究显示，甚至建议在那之前就开始治疗才能获得最大收益。
Because some reports and some research I've said is says you wanna even start it before that to have the most benefit.
但重申一次，前提是你确实出现了症状。
But, again, only if you're symptomatic.
如果你正遭受痛苦，且血液检查指标强烈表明需要治疗——比如你的孕酮水平低得像在垃圾桶里，而孕酮本应帮助你在夜间入睡。
If you are suffering and your blood work is screaming for it, if you're, like, in the dumpster with progesterone, progesterone helps you get sleepy at night.
抱歉。
I'm sorry.
现在有很多妇科医生在开这类处方。
There's a lot of gyinos out there that are doing the prescribing.
并非所有。
Not all.
别冲我来，妇科医生们。
Don't come at me, gyinos.
记住，我刚写了本书，采访了成千上万的人。
And remember, I've just wrote a book on it, I've interviewed thousands of people.
许多妇科医生没学过现在教的激素替代疗法，因为曾有黑框警告。
A lot of the gynecologists didn't study HRT like they're teaching now because there was a black box warning.
嗯。
Yep.
是啊。
Yeah.
所以当我处于围绝经期时，我的妇科医生问我：'要不要来点百忧解？'
So when I was in perimenopause, my gyno said to me, would you like Prozac?
唉。
Ugh.
这就是我们在我那个古老的十九世纪所得到的建议。
That's what we were offered back in my old eighteen hundreds.
就像我儿子爱说的，我出生在十九世纪。
As my son likes to say, was born in the eighteen hundreds.
顺便说一句，有些医生现在还在这么做，因为你会觉得自己要疯了。
By the way, some doctors are still doing that because you're like, I'm going mad.
我情绪失控了，然后他们就给你开百忧解。
I'm having emotional outbursts and, like, you want some Prozac.
不要。
No.
所以绝对地，一旦进入更年期，我恳求你——除非你有其他诊断，比如确诊癌症之类——无论如何都必须通过医生。
So definitely, as soon as you hit menopause, I beg you, unless you have other diagnosis, if if you're if you've been diagnosed with cancer or something, no matter what, it's gotta go through a doctor.
别随便在网上订购，因为有些人会说'哦我直接找那个鲨鱼男买就好了'。
Don't just order online because there's people that'll be like, oh, I'm just gonna order, you know, through the shark guy.
他叫什么名字来着？
What's his name?
马克·库班有个卖激素的网站，价格很便宜。
Mark Cuban has a sells hormones cheap cheaper.
所以一旦你开始寻找负担得起的激素，这是个好地方，但必须在医生指导下进行。
So it's a great place once you start to find affordable hormones, but you have to have to go under a doctor's guidance.
但让我告诉你们一件事。
But let me tell you guys something.
我们这代人将为你们这代人省去无数烦恼和痛苦。
My generation is going to save your generation so much headache and hell.
为什么？
Why?
因为围绝经期和更年期，我完全没想到它会如此改变生活且如此艰难。
Because perimenopause and menopause, I had no idea it was gonna be so life changing and so difficult.
你真的感觉像是有人闯进来绑架了你的灵魂。
You literally feel like someone came in and kidnapped your soul.
你的性格都会改变。
Your personality changes.
我在书中写过，我相信如果Karen们接受激素替代疗法（HRT），她们就会绝迹。
I believe, and I wrote this in my book, that Karens would become extinct if they just had HRT.
真的会这样。
They really would.
激素替代疗法能让你的大脑冷静下来。
Hormone replacement therapy, it makes your brain on fire cool.
也能让你的身体不再燥热。
Makes your body is on fire cool.
我们节目刚邀请了Mindy Pels医生。
We just had doctor Mindy Pels on the show.
是的。
Yeah.
你认识她吗？
Are you familiar with her?
我们还做了一期关于更年期的节目。
And and we did a menopause episode.
那是我第一次做这类节目，她谈到如何在三十多岁时就为更年期成功做好准备。
That was the first one that I've done, and and she talked about that how you've got to set yourself up for menopause success in your thirties.
没错。
That's right.
确实如此。
That's That's right.
以前从没听说过这种说法。
Never heard that before.
是的。
Yes.
所以我
So I'm
很高兴你这么说。
glad that you're saying that.
这可能是你人生旅程的下一步
This might be your next, like, step in your journey
确实如此。
Sure it is.
等这本关于更年期的书出版后，我会为此开展一系列巡回讲座。
Teaching people a The when the menopause book comes out, I'm gonna be going on a whole tour about that.
我在书中采访了许多杰出的医生。
But I interviewed fabulous doctors in it.
我学到了很多。
I've learned so much.
但这就是我想帮助年轻一代的原因，因为你知道谁被坑了吗？
But that's what I wanna help the younger generation to because guess who got screwed?
婴儿潮一代。
Baby boomers.
是啊。
Yeah.
婴儿潮一代被欺骗了，他们被告知合成激素会致癌。
Baby boomers were lied to and told that it was you know, it's gonna cause cancer when they were talking about synthetic hormones.
生物同质性激素才是你该选择并要求的，但请务必咨询功能医学医生。
Bio identical hormones is the ones you want and ask for, but please see a functional medicine doctor.
好的。
Okay.
所以是生物同质性激素替代疗法。
So bio identical HRT.
生物同质性激素替代疗法。
Bio identical HRT.
好的。
Okay.
不是合成的。
Not synthetic.
合成激素确实存在测试后显示可能致癌的情况。
Synthetics are the ones that it does make sense that they tested and said, oh, this could cause cancer.
你需要的是生物同质性激素。
You want the bio identical ones.
展开剩余字幕（还有 480 条）
是的。
Yes.
想象一下。
Imagine this.
现在是凌晨三点。
It's 3AM.
我穿着浴袍站在厨房里，身上沾满了Zoom派对留下的闪粉，不知怎么事情就失控了。
I'm in my kitchen in a bathrobe covered in glitter from a Zoom party that somehow got out of hand.
然后我意识到我需要一杯圣诞氛围的热饮，但又不想让我的胰腺罢工。
And I realized I need Christmas in a mug, but I also don't want my pancreas to quit on me.
泰勒·杜克斯健康公司的拐杖糖蛋白粉。
Taylor Dukes Wellness candy cane protein.
好的。
Okay.
尝起来就像薄荷奶油，说实话就像北极的奇迹直接送进了你的搅拌机。
It tastes like peppermint cream and honestly like a North Pole miracle delivered straight to your blender.
所有成分都是真正的食物原料，不含乳制品，富含20克胶原蛋白。
It is all real food ingredients, dairy free, packed 20 grams of collagen rich protein.
它确实对你的头发、指甲、关节和肠道有益，基本上能照顾到你整个日渐衰老的成人身体。
It actually does stuff for your hair, nails, joints, gut, basically your whole failing adult body.
你可以把它混入热咖啡、冰沙，甚至是深夜喝的杏仁奶里。
You can mix it into hot coffee, smoothies, even a late night almond milk type of situation.
只要确保是有机的就行。
Just make sure that's organic.
这正是你未曾意识到自己需要的节日升级款。
It is the kind of holiday upgrade that you didn't know you needed.
限量版。
Limited edition.
这玩意儿对人来说就像可卡因一样上瘾。
This is like crack cocaine for people.
我不知道发生了什么，但她的蛋白粉从来没有像这样一上架就被抢购一空过。
I don't know what's going on, but there has never been a protein powder of hers that has just flown off the shelf like this.
一旦售罄，就真的没了。
Once it is gone, it is gone.
没有重播，没有奇迹，只有你抱着一杯遗憾的饮品，后悔没买到泰勒·杜克斯的糖果棒蛋白粉。
There's no reruns, no hallmark miracle, just you in a sad mug of regret without your candy cane protein powder from Taylor Dukes.
现在就去囤货吧。
Go stock up now.
泰勒·杜克斯健康官网。
Taylor Dukes Wellness dot com.
使用优惠码Alex Clark
Use code Alex Clark.
网址是taylordukeswellness.com
That's taylordukeswellness.com.
优惠码Alex Clark
Code Alex Clark.
你有没有遇到过那种朋友或老爸，整天像个人形雾笛一样不停清嗓子，把家里所有人都逼疯。
You ever have that friend or a dad who can't stop clearing his throat like a human foghorn all day, driving everyone in the house crazy.
我表弟给客厅和卧室买了台Jasper空气净化器。
My cousin got a Jasper air scrubber for the living room and bedrooms.
几周之内，噪音全无。
Within weeks, silence.
那位父亲不再像鬼屋走廊般发出怪声了。
The dad stopped sounding like a haunted house corridor.
结果发现那些看似普通的灰尘或干燥问题，实际上是PM2.5颗粒、霉菌孢子、宠物皮屑、家居挥发性有机物的混合体——整个肮脏的室内空气马戏团。
Turns out what felt like normal dust or dryness was actually a cocktail of PM 2.5 particles, mold spores, pet dander, household VOCs, the whole nasty indoor air circus.
你还以为家里很安全呢。
And you thought your house was safe.
Jasper空气净化器的厉害之处在于：
Here's the deal with Jasper air scrubbers.
这是商用级空气净化器，只不过专门设计成适合家庭使用的尺寸。
It's a commercial grade air scrubber, except made to be just the right size for your home.
它采用三重过滤系统：前置过滤器、HEPA滤网和活性炭层，能捕捉灰尘、花粉、霉菌甚至烟雾，以及清洁产品或家具释放的挥发性有机物。
It's three stage filtration, pre filter HEPA activated carbon, which grabs dust, pollen, mold, even smoke, and VOCs from cleaning products or furniture off gassing.
就连你水槽下密封的清洁产品也在释放化学物质，你的孩子、宠物和家人都在吸入这些气体。
Even your capped cleaning products under the sink are off gassing chemicals that your children and your pets and your family is breathing in.
它能自动适应环境。
It adapts automatically.
Jasper智能传感器能感知空气变脏的时刻，比如有人做饭、壁炉开启或花粉飘入时。
The Jasper smart sensors are gonna sense when the air gets dirty, like when someone's cooking or when the fireplace is on or pollen drips in.
它会调高风扇转速，快速净化空气。
It cranks the fan up and scrubs the air fast.
它每分钟可不仅仅是净化一点点空气。
It doesn't just clean a little air in a minute.
它能像工业设备一样循环大量空气，但外形却适合放在客厅，而且外观美观。
It cycles big volumes like an industrial unit, but in a form that actually fits in your living room and looks pretty.
我家里多个房间都刷了漆。
I painted multiple rooms in my house.
你甚至闻不到油漆味，因为我的Jasper空气净化器一直在运转。
You couldn't even smell the paint because my Jaspers were always running.
全年无休地运行它，无论是野火烟雾季节，还是冬天窗户紧闭时。
Keep it running all year round during wildfire smoke season, during winter when windows are shut.
这非常重要。
This is very important.
当孩子的玩具、油漆气味或宠物皮屑让你的空气变成生物危害时。
During those days that your kids toys or painting fumes or pet dander turn your air into a biohazard.
即使你外出度假，也得让Jasper保持开启。
Even when you're vacationing, you gotta leave that Jasper on.
这点尤为重要，因为没有空气流动时污染物会沉积。
This is especially important because stuff collects and settles with no movement.
你将获得真正可呼吸的空气，减少咳嗽和鼻塞，睡眠更深沉，早晨更清醒。
What you get is real air you can breathe, less coughing, fewer sniffles, deeper sleep, clearer mornings.
若想摆脱生活在灰尘爱好者噩梦中的日子，给你的肺部应得的假期，就买台Jasper。
If you wanna stop living in a dust lover's nightmare and give your lungs the vacation that they deserve, get a Jasper.
访问 jasper.co。
Visit jasper.co.
使用优惠码Alex可享折扣
Use code Alex for a discount.
网址是jaspr.co
That's jaspr.co.
Jasper为您带来清新空气
Jasper gives you air.
值得深呼吸
Worth breathing.
这是Alex在jaspr.co的优惠码。
That's code Alex at jaspr.co.
你还有桥本甲状腺炎。
You also have Hashimoto's.
对吗？
Correct?
我
I
确实。
do.
我也是。
So I do too.
管理得怎么样了？
How is managing that going?
你对此采取了什么措施？
What are you doing with it?
我很好奇。
I'm very curious.
我的桥本甲状腺炎在过去一年里好了很多。
My Hashimoto's gotten so much better in this last year.
你知道，红光疗法我也经常提到。
You know, red light therapy I say that too.
说实话，它真的创造了奇迹。
Has done really wonders for it, honestly.
我尝试了纯肉饮食。
I did I went on a carnivore diet.
我不确定这是否有帮助。
I have no idea if that helped.
它在很多其他方面确实帮到了我。
It helped me in so many other ways.
但最近我的检查结果出来时，我简直不敢相信。
But my numbers recently came back where I was like, oh my god.
但我具体实施了什么呢？
But what did I implement?
我采用了红光疗法，大量的红光治疗，这真的对我帮助很大。
I implemented red light, the extensive red light therapy, and that really, really helped me.
你有服用甲状腺药物吗？
Do you take any thyroid medication?
我没有。
I do not.
好的。
Okay.
是啊。
Yeah.
我试过一次，感觉非常怪异不舒服。
I tried it once, and I was I felt very weird and off.
我当时就想，你知道吗？
And I'm like, you know what?
我希望尽可能少服用处方药。
I wanna be on the least amount of prescriptions possible.
所以我坚信一定能找到解决方法，目前看来进展不错。
So I just trusted that there's going to be a way that I can figure this out, and it's looking it's so far, it's looking good.
你尝试过哪些最古怪的养生方法？
What are some of the weirdest wellness things that you've tried?
除了在印第安人的汗蒸屋里和切罗基族印第安人一起生活了十年——真的是每周一都去。
Well, besides living inside of an Indian sweat lodge with Cherokee Indians for ten years, literally, every Monday.
你知道吗？
You know what?
我我不确定现在是否还会觉得它们太奇怪。
I I don't know if I'd call them too weird now.
我想我只是在很早以前就接触到了这些东西。
I think I was just on the forefront of them way back when.
比如结肠水疗？
Like colonics?
天啊。
Oh my god.
我当时在做结肠清洁，家里有家用结肠清洁设备。
I was doing colon I have a colonic home colonic.
什么？
What?
是的。
Yeah.
系统。
System.
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
没错。
Yeah.
所以我觉得那应该算是挺奇怪的。
So I guess that would be considered weird.
所以你现在还是喜欢那个吗？
So still, like, a fan of that?
噢，当然。
Oh, yeah.
比如，我旅行都带着它。
Like, I travel with it.
我简直不敢相信我居然大声说出来了，因为我肯定会在评论区看到这句话。
I'm gonna be I can't believe I said that out loud because I'm gonna hear it in the comments.
但我的消化系统真的超级差。
But I I I have the worst digestion.
现在已经好多了。
It's now gotten a lot better.
但以前每次吃完饭，我都会胀得像怀孕一样。
But, like, every time I eat, I would swell up like I was pregnant.
真的看起来像怀胎九个月的样子。
I literally looked like I was nine months pregnant.
你不觉得那是食物过敏吗？
You don't think that's a food allergy?
哦，是的。
Oh, yeah.
确实是食物过敏，但同时也是小肠细菌过度生长。
It was a food allergy, but it was also SIBO.
哦。
Oh.
我还有念珠菌感染。
I also have candida.
我还有肠漏症。
I also have leaky gut.
我还有乳糜泻。
I also have celiac disease.
所以年复一年，我尝试了每一种该死的方法。
So for years and years and years and years, I was trying every single freaking thing.
直到我的功能医学医生告诉我：听着。
And it wasn't until my functional medicine doctor's like, listen.
你知道你吃的是有机食品。
You know you eat organic.
我知道你饮食很健康。
I know you eat healthy.
直接采用纯肉饮食吧。
Just go carnivore.
我当时就想，我实在吃不下那么多牛肉。
And I was like, I just can't eat all that beef.
感觉量太多了。
It seems like so much.
对女性来说确实太多了。
For women, it's a lot.
肉量真的很大。
It's a lot of meat.
但我当时已经走投无路了，因为我想总不能一直往屁股里塞东西吧。
So I was desperate, though, because I was like, I can't keep sticking stuff up my butt.
是啊。
Yeah.
我的屁股都因为灌肠治疗累坏了。
And my butt is getting tired with the colonics.
于是我想，好吧。
So I was like, alright.
所以我尝试了纯肉饮食，不得不说，它改变了我的生活。
So I did the the carnivore diet, and I gotta tell you, it's changed my life.
你坚持了多久？
How long did you commit?
六个月。
Six months.
哇。
Woah.
完全只吃这个？
Exclusively?
完全只吃。
Exclusive.
哦，是的。
Oh, yeah.
我的化妆师就在那儿。
My makeup artist is right there.
看看她。
Look at her.
她正在那儿点头。
She's nodding right there.
你没坚持住吗？
You didn't fall off?
我没有放弃。
I didn't fall off.
但因为我是更年期后的老太太，我其实还搭配了一个牛油果。
I but because I'm postmenopausal old lady, I actually had an avocado with it.
所以我们需要纤维。
So we need fiber.
所以我买了Ancestry牛肉，就是牛肉、肝脏和肾脏，听起来很恶心，但实际上非常好吃。
So I had I got Ancestry beef, which was beef, liver, kidney, which sounds totally gross, but it was actually really good.
我以为它像混合的，所以就像是
I thought it like a mix, so it's like
磨碎的 对。
ground Yeah.
用它做了肉饼。
Made patties with it.
对。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
所以我会吃那些。
So I would have those.
我大概会吃五个。
I'd have like five.
所以我基本上每天会摄入100克蛋白质和100克脂肪。
So I would basically have a 100 grams of protein and a 100 grams of fat a day.
而且我不会感到饥饿，因为身体进入了酮症状态。
And I wasn't hungry because you get in ketosis.
我的腹部瘦下来了。
My stomach went down.
说真的，我都记不清上次腹胀是什么时候了。
It literally I mean, when's the last time I've been bloated?
我感觉，自从停止后我就一直胀气。
I'm like, I've been bloated since I stopped.
这几乎有点神奇，但你不能永远坚持下去。
It's almost been kind of miraculous, but you can't stay on it forever.
食肉饮食并不适合你的身体长期维持。
The carnivore is not meant for your body to stay on forever.
这就像一次重置。
It's like a reset.
这是一种重置，而我害怕脱离这种状态。
It's a reset, and I was scared to go off of it.
我当时想，哦，不。
I was like, oh, no.
我害怕是因为我对自己的感受非常满意。
I'm scared because I was so happy with how I felt.
我的能量水平，我的脑雾，一切都变得清晰多了。
My energy level, my brain fog, just so much more clarity.
这是激素替代疗法的另一个好处。
That's another thing with hormone replacement.
我真的以为自己要得痴呆症了，各位。
I literally thought I was going through dementia, you guys.
我想，我可能是最年轻的痴呆症患者了。
I'm like, I'm the youngest person to have dementia.
我知道。
I know it.
我在SiriusXM电台做了七年节目时，连完整句子都说不利索。
When I was doing my SiriusXM radio show for seven years, I was having trouble completing sentences.
我当时就像失语了一样，后来发现我需要的只是激素替代疗法。
I was like, I could not speak, and I realized all I needed was HRT.
但重新采用纯肉饮食后，这六个月改变了我的人生。
But to go back on the the carnivore diet, six months changed my life.
重申一次，这不适合所有人。
Again, it's not for everybody.
当我告诉别人我尝试过纯肉饮食时，素食主义者们追着骂我。
I had vegans come after me when I told them I tried to I did the carnivore diet.
再说一次，我其实很想成为素食主义者。
Again, I would love to be vegan.
也许有朝一日我会吃素。
Maybe someday I will be a vegan.
但现在不行。
But No.
别这么说。
Don't say that.
也许有一天会吧。
Maybe someday okay.
我能给你
Can I give you
一个犀利观点吗？
a hot take?
好的。
Okay.
这很有趣。
This is interesting.
你了解"全美妈妈"组织吗，就是Zen Honeycutt那个？
Are you familiar with Moms Across America, zen honeycomb?
当然知道。
Of course.
当然。
Of course.
好的。
Okay.
她刚刚不幸因儿子自杀而失去了他。
So she just tragically lost her son to suicide.
看看你的脸。也许你今天过得不好。
Did you see that?
我看到了。
Yes.
好的。
Okay.
她给一些人发了邮件，她说，伙计们，我在儿子身上发现了最令人着迷的事情。
So she put out an email to some people, and she was like, guys, I found the most fascinating thing with my son.
你知道，由于人们的慷慨和愿意支付丧葬费用等，我们剩下了一些钱。
So, you know, because of people's generosity and offering to pay funeral expenses and things, we had some leftover money.
我得以对他进行了各种检测
I was able to test him and all do all these different tests.
结果发现他是素食主义者，严重缺乏某些矿物质
And we found out he was vegan, and he was so low in certain minerals
难以置信
believe it.
B族维生素
B vitamins.
她说：我毫不怀疑
She was like, there's no doubt in my mind.
这正是引发他焦虑和抑郁的原因
This is what was fueling his anxiety, his depression.
她还说：他同时患有MTHFR基因变异
And she said, he also had MTHFR.
哦，天啊
Oh, wow.
就像是，这是另一回事。
Was like, this is another thing.
就像，素食者不应该有MTHFR基因问题。
Like, no vegan should be MTHFR.
我不认为
I don't think
任何人应该吃素。
anyone should be vegan.
不应该这样。
It shouldn't.
在另一个时空里，我可能会选择吃素，因为这是我听到的部分。
I in another life, I would like to be only because this is the part I have listen.
我来自芝加哥。
I'm from Chicago.
我是个肉食爱好者。
I'm a meaty.
我喜欢吃肉。
I like meat.
所以我可能会尝试素食六个月，结果差点死掉。
So I probably will I did try being a vegan for six months, and I almost died.
这太疯狂了。
That's so insane.
我差点就死了。
I almost died.
我这么说是因为我对杀害任何生命都感到愧疚。
The reason why I say that is because I feel bad killing anything.
比如，我连杀死一只虫子都很难下手。
Like, it's hard for me to kill a bug.
所以我真的...
Like so I I do.
我会感到非常难受，尤其是当我在路上看到可爱的小牛时。
I feel really bad because I then I see a cute little cow on the road.
我就想，天哪。
I'm like, oh my god.
所以是我的心在抗拒，但我的身体需要它。
So it's my heart that has a hard time with it, but my body, I know, needs it.
就像我离不开它一样。
It's just like I need it.
所以
So
你现在的健康养生方式是怎样的？
What is your current wellness routine like now?
我是指包括健身、饮食这些方面。
I mean, and that could be fitness, diet.
我是不是...哦，我把它落在车里了。
Do I have oh, I left it in the car.
我正准备拿出随身带的东西——一个这么大的密封袋，里面装满了我所有的维生素。
I was about to pull out what I carry with me, which is a giant Ziploc bag this big of all of my vitamins.
所以，基本上，在正常的丹尼·珍妮生活中，当我不疯狂时，我会醒来。
So, basically, in a normal Denny Jenny life, when I'm not crazy, I'll wake up.
我会在跑步机上跑大约三十分钟。
I'll go on the treadmill for, like, thirty minutes.
我会做一些举重训练。
I'll do some weight lifting.
然后我会进入我的红外线桑拿房。
Then I'll go in my infrared sauna.
接着我会进入我的高压氧舱。
Then I'll go in my hyperbaric chamber.
然后我会站在红光前使用振动板。
Then I'll go on my vibration board while I stand in front of my red light.
给我们讲讲振动板吧。
Tell us about vibration boards.
它们有效吗？
Do they work?
它们有什么作用？
What do they do?
我不知道。
I don't know.
看，我承认自己不懂的事情。
See, I admit what I don't know.
除了偶尔自问'这感觉对吗'之外，我其实并不清楚。
I don't know other than sometimes I ask myself and I'll just does it resonate as correct?
而我觉得它确实能引起共鸣。
And it I feel like it does resonate.
不过我觉得蹦床对我来说效果也一样好。
I feel like also though the trampoline has done just as well for me.
所以我会做些蹦床运动来促进淋巴循环，因为不运动时我能感觉到淋巴堵塞。
So I'll do some trampoline stuff to get my lymph nodes moving because I can tell ones gets clogged when I don't do it.
蹦床或振动板，选哪个都行。
So trampoline or board, either one.
你怎么知道淋巴结堵塞了？
How do you know your lymph node is clogged?
会疼，会肿。
Pain, swollen.
哦。
Oh.
是啊。
Yeah.
好吧。
Okay.
我是说，我的情况还和今年做的九次手术有关，因为颌骨感染。
I mean, mine also was related to the nine surgeries I had this year for this bone infection I had in my jaw.
天啊。
So Oh my gosh.
我今年夏天刚和一位整体牙医做过一期关于这个的节目。
I just did an episode with a holistic dentist on that too this year this summer.
这可不是开玩笑的。
That's no joke.
太疯狂了。
That's crazy.
这可能会给你带来各种问题，你的
That could be causing all kinds of problems for you, your
整个身体，整个身体。
whole body, a whole body.
如果我也能给你们的世代另一个建议，如果你要做根管治疗，我现在可能会被牙医们讨厌。
If I can give your generation another tip too, if you have a root canal, I'm gonna be hated by dentists right now.
如果他们想给你做根管治疗，别做。
If they wanna give you root canal, don't.
直接把牙拔掉。
Just pull the tooth.
没错。
Yep.
根管治疗，我原以为能维持一辈子。
Root canals, I thought last the rest of your life.
猜怎么着？
Guess what?
其实不能。
They don't.
所以当时是有那种可怕的黑色脓肿，就是里面一团糟的情况吗？
So was there crazy black abscess, like, nutso stuff going on in there?
突然间，我的牙齿开始剧烈疼痛，我简直受不了。
All of a sudden, my I was like, ugh, in pain.
我当时完全懵了，心想这是怎么回事？
I was like, what's happening?
第二天早上我就进了医院，因为是周日，当晚就住院了。
It the next morning I was in the hospital by that night because it was a Sunday.
我疼得实在受不了，必须去医院打吗啡止痛，否则我就要从悬崖跳下去了。
I was in so much pain I had to go to the hospital and ask for morphine, or I was gonna jump off of a cliff.
而且我其实很能忍痛的。
And I'm I can handle pain.
连我丈夫都惊讶地说，哇。
So even my husband was like, wow.
你一定是疼得厉害。
You must really be in pain.
快去看医生吧。
Go to the doctor.
医生说：你是想保住根管治疗过的牙齿，还是只清理感染保住牙齿，或者直接拔掉？
They're like, well, do you wanna save your root canal or just clean the infection and save your tooth or pull it?
我当时想：我看过资料说应该尽可能保留更多真牙。
And I was like, I read that you're supposed to keep as many teeth as you possibly can.
那就清理干净吧。
Let's just clean it out.
于是他们做了清创处理。
So they clean it out.
我去上班了。
I go to work.
一周后，我的脸肿了起来，感染了。
A week later, my face blows up, the infection.
最终我还是拔掉了它，因为洛杉矶的新牙医说感染太严重了。
I wind up pulling it out because the dentist was like the new dentist in LA was like, we it's so infected.
你之前看的是仿生牙医还是
Were you seeing a biomimetic or
整体牙医？
holistic dentist?
不是的。
Time, no.
好吧。
Okay.
于是他拔掉了牙，做了骨移植手术缝合了伤口。
So he pulled it out, then he bone he closed it up bone grafting it.
我完全不知道他没有彻底清理干净。
I had no idea that he didn't clean it out thoroughly.
天啊。
Oh god.
所以现在我正愉快地等待伤口愈合，因为必须等三个月才能做种植牙。
So now I'm on my merrily way as I'm waiting your for it to heal, because you gotta wait three months to get an implant.
我去看了生物牙医，做了CT扫描等全套检查。
I go to a biomedical dentist, okay, to do all this because I get the CT scan and everything.
结果发现根本没清理干净，导致感染扩散到了骨头里。
Turns out it wasn't cleaned out all the way, so the infection grew into my bone.
老兄。
Dude.
这太严重了。
This is so serious.
骨头感染了，感染进骨头会怎样？
A bone infection, which what happens when it gets in the bone?
你的骨头开始分解。
Your bone starts to disintegrate.
你的牙齿都脱落了。
Your teeth were falling out.
我的牙齿都脱落了。
My teeth were falling out.
当我们植入种植体时，又引发了另一处感染。
When we put the implant in, they popped out another infection.
我有牙根空洞。
I had root cavitations.
我做了九次手术。
I had nine surgeries.
我外面长了个囊肿。
I had a cyst kinda growing on the outside.
那些被称为夏泽林增生物，我为此做了手术，因为我的整个面部都感染了。
They're called chazellians growing that I had surgeries on my because my whole face was becoming infected.
真的，如果你看我今年的社交媒体，你会想为什么珍妮全年都戴着墨镜？
It was I literally if you if you look at my social media this year, you're like, why is Jenny wearing sunglasses all year?
因为我眼睛做了八次手术，嘴巴做了九次手术。
Because I had eight surgeries on my eyes, nine surgeries on my mouth.
天啊
Oh my
。
gosh.
别逞强。
Don't cape.
别让伤口裂开。
Don't get a broken out.
只要把你的牙齿
Just put your pull
拔出来。
your tooth.
你的整体牙医有没有告诉你哪个经络连接到你出问题的部位？
Did your dentist, the holistic dentist, tell you what meridian was connected to where your your problem was?
有。
Yeah.
但我完全忘记具体是什么了。
And I totally forgot what that was.
我记得是...嗯，我知道淋巴网为什么和这个有关联。
I think it was well, I know this why this lymph net lymph was connected.
而且你知道，很多自称患乳腺癌的人，医生会建议他们检查口腔感染，因为他们通常确实存在感染。
And, you know, a lot of people that say they have breast cancer, they say go find out if you have a a mouth infection because they usually do have an infection.
各位，这将成为下一波人们认知到经络与口腔密切关联的潮流。
So this is gonna be the next wave, you guys, of people realizing how much the meridians are connected to your mouth.
这可能就是为什么我的肠道问题...就是肠道问题。
So this could lead to why my gut was so the gut.
就是这么回事。
That's what it was.
肠道与之相连。
The gut was connected to it.
所以我觉得这很神奇。
So I It's fascinating.
我对牙齿相关的东西很着迷。
I'm obsessed with the teeth stuff.
没错。
Right.
我很高兴你也对此充满热情，因为我
I'm so glad that you're hype about that because I
觉得这很可悲。
think it's so sad.
所有事情。
Everything.
就像...我知道人们会说，天啊。
It's like the I know people are going, god.
这又是我需要注意的一件事。
It's another thing I have to look out for.
是啊。
Yeah.
但我觉得你们能做的最重要的事情之一就是不要使用氟化物。
But it's gonna be one of the most important things I think you guys can do is and don't use fluoride.
明白吗？
Okay?
尽量去找一位生物医学牙医。
And try to get to a biomedical dentist.
从你刚结婚到现在，你的健康习惯有什么变化？
How has your wellness routine changed from when you first got married?
我以前根本没有健康习惯。
I didn't have one.
我是说，我来自芝加哥，那时候整天就是深盘披萨、香烟之类的。
I mean, I'm from Chicago, so it was like deep dish pizza, cigarettes Oh.
酒。
Booze.
哦，我当时
Oh, I was
Z世代的好莱坞正在让香烟卷土重来。
Gen z Gen z Hollywood is bringing back cigarettes.
什么？
What?
是啊。
Yeah.
奥利维亚·杰德这些人都在抽烟。
Olivia Jade, all these people, they're smoking cigarettes.
不会吧。
No.
确实。
Yeah.
不。
No.
是的。
Yeah.
哦，这让我很难过。
Oh, that makes me so sad.
我知道。
I know.
不。
No.
不。
No.
不。
No.
这太糟糕了。
It's that's terrible.
但是，是的，我曾经是个烟民。
But, yeah, I was a smoker.
我以前喝酒——显然现在不喝了，我已经戒酒了。
I was a drink I don't obviously, I don't drink anymore.
我也不抽烟。
I don't smoke.
我尽可能保持干净——我变成了某种医学上命名的状态。
I I'm as clean as I can pass I I've turned into a there's a name for this medical condition.
我想这叫做毒素恐惧症，我对所有事情都疑神疑鬼。
I think it's toxophobia, but I'm paranoid about everything.
你已经结婚十一年了。
And you've been married for eleven years.
对吧？
Right?
是的。
Yeah.
所以当你第一次见到唐尼时，你们俩在约会之类的。
So when you first met Donnie, you guys are going on dates or whatever.
在疫苗活动方面，他是需要被说服，还是已经支持你的立场了？
Did he take convincing when it came to your vaccine activism, or was he already on board?
他绝对更倾向于站在我这边。
He was definitely more in my camp camp than not.
他只是和我一样对这方面缺乏了解。
He was just not educated about it like me.
明白吗？
You know?
所以他就会带着问题来找我。
So he would just come to me with questions.
随着我们关系的发展，他看到我在做研究、讨论这些事，就像有越来越多的灯被点亮了。
And then as our relationship went on and he saw me working on things and doing my own research and talking about it, it was like, oh, he more lights were being turned on.
但如果非要他选边站的话，他总会倾向于支持我的立场。
But he was always if he had to choose a side per se, he would lean towards, you know, my position anyways.
如果你现在问唐尼，唐尼的立场是这应该由父母决定。嗯。
If you were to ask Donnie right now, Donnie was in the camp of it should be up to the parents Mhmm.
并且自己做研究。
And do your own research.
医疗自由。
Medical freedom.
是的。
Yeah.
就是这样。
That's what it is.
那就是他的立场。
That's that's what that's where he was.
你儿子的诊断现在情况如何？
How is your son doing with his diagnosis now?
非常好。
Amazing.
我这周刚和他一起参加了一个红毯活动，昨天，或者说是两天前。
I just did a red carpet event with him this week, yesterday, two days ago.
我都不知道今天是几号。
I don't know what date is today.
但我们在去的路上坐在车里。
But we were in the car on the way there.
他现在23岁了。
He's 23 now.
他有自己的YouTube频道。
He has his own YouTube channel.
他是个内容创作者。
He's a content creator.
这就是他的生活。
This is his life.
如果你想看看埃文的进步，可以关注Gaming_USA。
Gaming underscore USA if you wanna see how Evan has progressed.
但他当时说，我们能不能分开走红毯？
But he was like, can we just do the red carpet separately?
因为我不想活在你的阴影下。
Because I don't wanna be in your shadow.
我这么说不是想伤害你的感情，但你知道吗，我内心就是希望以埃文·阿舍的身份被人记住，而不是珍妮·麦卡锡的儿子。
And I don't mean that to hurt your feelings, but, you know, there's something inside of me that just wants to be known as Evan Asher and not as Jenny McCarthy's son.
啊。
Aw.
我当时就想，天啊。
And I'm like, oh my god.
我爱你埃文，对不起。
I love you, Evan, and I'm sorry.
他就说，每次我搜索自己名字，看到所有结果都写着‘埃文·阿舍，珍妮·麦卡锡的儿子’，我就觉得——可我就是我啊。
And he's just like, when I Google myself and I see that everything says Evan Asher, Jenny McCarthy's son, I'm like, but I'm me.
我是个独立的个体。
I'm my own person.
这既伤感又甜蜜，因为他渴望拥有自己的自主权。
And it's so sad and sweet because he wants his own autonomy.
是啊。
Yeah.
是啊。
Yeah.
问题是，他真能实现这个愿望吗？
And it's like, will he ever get it?
希望如此。
I hope so.
希望如此。
I hope so.
我说，你知道吗？
I said, you know what?
你要把那个YouTube频道做大做强，埃文。
You make that YouTube page so big, Evan.
你要成为最顶尖的YouTube内容创作者，让所有人都忘记珍妮·麦卡锡是谁。
You become the biggest YouTube content creator out there that no one's gonna they're gonna go, Jenny McCarthy, who?
所以他现在23岁了。
So he's 23 now.
所以，我是说，如果他想要
So, I mean, if he wants to
拥有自己的健康习惯，那就得靠他自己去实现了。
have his own wellness routine, he's on his own to do that.
那他对这方面在行吗？
So is he good about that?
具体是什么情况？
What does it look like?
这可怜的孩子被洗脑得太厉害了。
The poor kid is so brainwashed.
不过是以最好的方式。
It's in the best way possible.
但当他的朋友来访时，他就会说：你不能吃那个。
But when his friends come over, he'll be like, you can't eat that.
你喝汽水？
You drink soda?
我就说：埃文，你不能因为别人的选择而羞辱他们。
I'm like, Evan, you can't shame people for their choices.
明白吗？
Okay?
我教他不要对身边的每个人太苛刻，包括他可能交往的女朋友。
I taught him to not go hard on everyone around him, including girlfriends he might date.
他会说：天啊。
He'd be like, oh my god.
她居然吃麸质食品。
She eats gluten.
你懂我意思吧？
You know what I mean?
他会去参加《自闭症也有爱》这个节目吗？
Would he ever go on that show Love on the Spectrum?
你知道，大概不会。
You know, probably not.
嗯。
Yeah.
不会。
No.
他不想展示自己生活的这一面。
He doesn't want that part of his life showcased.
是啊。
Yeah.
这很合理。
That makes sense.
对。
Yeah.
他其实有着非常私人的一面，那些私人生活部分。
He's got a he's got a actually very personal side to him, the private stuff.
但他的游戏和内容创作方面，他希望
But his gaming and his, you know, content, he wants
达到
to be as
前所未有的高度。
big as ever.
这才是他想要公开的部分。
That's when he wants public.
不过你知道，他每天早上醒来都会吃自己准备的小维生素。
But, you know, he wakes up every morning and takes his takes his own little vitamins.
他大概每天要吃15到20颗。
He takes, like, probably fifteen to 20 a day.
他还练瑜伽。
He does yoga.
他啊，你知道的，他他他都懂。
He's he's you know, he he he knows.
你知道，他去看牙医时，都不用含氟的。
You know, when he goes to the dentist, fluoride free.
对吧？
Right?
就像，他会说好吧。
Like, he'll Okay.
他可是健康生活的王者。
He's a wellness king.
我所有的年轻观众都在问什么？
All of my young audience like what?
如果你是个善良的23岁年轻人，他绝对是最贴心的孩子，表现非常出色，但我希望能帮他找到世上最棒的女朋友。
If if you are a kind 23 year old and, like, he's the sweetest kid ever, and he's doing amazing, but I want him to find him the nicest girlfriend ever.
各位要是认识什么可爱的23岁女孩，不妨悄悄私信他，好吗？
You guys slim slide into his DMs if you know any sweet 23 year old girls, will you?
你是怎么将疫苗与你儿子的自闭症联系起来的？
How did you link that it was the vaccines to your son's autism?
好的。
Okay.
在他接种MMR疫苗前的两三天，我在杂货店结账时，看到《时代》杂志封面上有一则消息。
So two, three days before his MMR appointment, I was in the grocery store on the cover of Time magazine while I was checking out.
角落里有一小段文字写着：母亲们担心MMR疫苗会导致孩子患上自闭症。
's a little blip in the corner that says, mothers are concerned that the MMR is causing their child's autism.
我感觉就像有人在我肚子上打了一拳。
And I felt like someone punched me in the stomach.
这就是所谓的母亲直觉——一种非常真实的存在。
This is where you call mother's instinct being a very real thing.
我当时就想，天啊。
And I was like, oh my god.
天啊。
Oh my god.
我突然有种强烈的预感
I just got a hit.
就像，我了解这种直觉
Like, I know these hits.
每当我产生这种直觉时，通常都是对的
And when I feel these hits, I'm usually right.
所以我回家后就和当时的丈夫商量，我说：听着
So I went home, talked to my husband at the time, and I was like, listen.
这个预约就在两天后。
This appointment was in two days.
我对这件事感觉不太好。
I don't feel good about it.
我不想这么做。
I don't wanna do it.
就像，埃文的...我只是...我对这件事有种非常强烈的预感。
Like, Evan's I just I I have such a strong feeling about it.
他说，我们不如先和医生谈谈。
He's like, let's just talk to the doctor.
我们去和医生谈谈吧。
Let's talk to the doctor.
于是我们去赴约了，而我当时已经像车灯前受惊的鹿一样不知所措。
So we go to the appointment, and I was already a deer in headlights.
我说，听着。
I was like, listen.
我刚在《时代》杂志上看到很多妈妈都在担心。
I just read in Time Magazine that all these moms are concerned.
她们指责说接种疫苗后孩子出现了急剧变化。
They're pointing the finger saying something happened drastically after the shot.
而到这个时候，埃文之前的所有疫苗接种都是按计划进行的。
And by this point, Evan has been on target for all of his shots.
埃文的发育里程碑都达标，但他正遭受着一些我不知道是预警信号的问题。
Evan's milestones were all there, but Evan was suffering from other things I didn't know were warning signs.
比如什么？
Like what?
湿疹、双耳感染、在医院接种乙肝疫苗后出现黄疸，这些看似微小的问题可能扰乱免疫系统，为接种MMR疫苗后出现全面免疫系统失调埋下隐患。
Eczema, double ear infections, jaundice after the hep b shot in the hospital, like, little things that might dysregulate one's immune system, priming it for full blown immune immune system disregulation when an MMR happens.
于是我对医生说，我非常害怕。
So I said to the doctor, I'm terrified.
我们能不能不接种？
Can we just not do it?
能不能等等？
Can we wait?
能不能分开接种MMR疫苗？
Can we separate the MMR?
如果能分开接种我还能接受，但我真的非常害怕，这是母亲的直觉。
I'd like, I'd be alright if we can separate it, but I just I'm terrified, and I have a mom's instincts.
结果他说：别像那些迷信的蠢妈妈一样。
And he goes, don't be one of those quack mothers that are believing all that.
这不是真的，珍妮。
It's not true, Jenny.
你得相信医生。
You gotta trust the doctors.
我说，我觉得不舒服。
And I said, I don't feel comfortable.
当你接种MMR疫苗时，必须专门为那一针签署免责声明。
Now Now when you get the MMR, you have to sign a waiver specifically for that shot.
我说，我不会签的。
And I said, I'm not signing it.
而我当时的丈夫——我不怪他。
And my ex husband at the time and I don't blame him.
自那以后他已经向我道歉了，所以我不希望任何人因此攻击他，因为我爱他。
And since then, he's he's apologized to me, so I don't want anyone giving hate because I love him.
我们现在相处得很好，大家听着。
We get along great, everybody.
但他当时说，我要签这个疫苗同意书。
But he was like, I'm gonna sign the shot.
我要签这个。
I'm gonna sign this.
珍妮，你到房间外面去。
Jenny, you step out of the room.
我当时哭着走出房间，做了个祷告，心想：求求了，但愿是我错了。
And I was, like, crying, stepped out of the room, said a prayer, and was just like, please just let me be wrong.
没过多久他就第一次发作了。
And it wasn't long after that that he had his first seizure.
当你看到他发作时，那一刻你是什么感受？
What were you feeling in that moment when you saw him having a seizure?
嗯，我以为他要死了。
Well, I thought he was dying.
我以为他要死了。
I thought he was dying.
当你不了解癫痫发作是什么样子时，那种感觉就像呼吸受限一样。
When you don't know what a seizure looks like, it's like there's limited breathing.
他的眼睛翻白，头向后仰，全身抽搐。
The eyes are rolling in the back of the head and convulsing.
我在他的婴儿床里发现了他。
And I found him in his crib.
那天早上喝咖啡时，我心里隐约觉得埃文今天睡得有点久了。
Something in me that morning while drinking coffee was like, boy, Evan is kinda sleeping in a little bit.
其实只比平时晚了十分钟。
Only by ten minutes.
然后我从餐桌站起来，开始沿着走廊狂奔。
And then I stood up from the table, and then I started running down the hallway.
推开门就看见他正在抽搐。
Opened up the door, and he was convulsing.
我抱起尖叫的他冲进客厅，把他放在地上，一边拨打911对着电话那头大喊快点，一边把他送往医院。
I picked him up screaming, running in the living room, laid him on the ground, calling 911, screaming at them to hurry up, and brought him to the hospital.
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