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嗨。
Hi.
欢迎回到《Eat Your Crust》播客。
Welcome back to Eat Your Crust podcast.
我是Crystal。
I'm Crystal.
我是Jisoo。
And I'm Jisoo.
我最近有点怀旧，我在想是不是因为我们年纪越来越大了。
I've been feeling kind of nostalgic lately, and I wonder if it's because we're getting older.
好吧。
Okay.
我得承认，还记得我们做那期关于我满30岁的节目吗？
I have to admit that remember when we made the episode about me turning 30?
我觉得在那期节目里，我算是比较乐观的。
And I feel like in that episode, I was relatively optimistic.
随着这一年过去，我感觉自己越来越难受了。
As the year has gone on, I feel like I've been feeling dirty harder.
现在真的成真了，感觉更强烈了。
It's hitting more now that it's real.
对。
Yeah.
没错。
Exactly.
而且这让我陷入了一些小小的怀旧漩涡，甚至让我在日常生活中变得更加反思。
And it's been sending me down, like, little nostalgic rabbit holes or maybe even makes me feel a bit more reflective in my day to day.
所以当我回想过去，疫情前的时代时，想到了一个话题。
So one of the topics that came up as I was thinking of the past, pre COVID era.
所以我们觉得聊聊疫情前的生活和现在疫情后的生活对比会很有趣。
So we thought it would be pretty fun to chat about what life was like in our pre COVID era versus now in the post COVID era.
说实话，很多都不一样了。
Honestly, a lot is different.
有时候我们做的事情会让我想起疫情前的时光。
And sometimes we do things where it reminds me of pre COVID era.
是的。
Yes.
我完全同意。
I totally agree.
我觉得疫情之后，很多事情都在慢慢变化，又回到了疫情前的样子。
And I think after COVID happened, a lot of things have kind of been changing and going back to how it was in the pre COVID era.
对。
Mhmm.
所以随着慢慢恢复，加上我们年龄的增长，我觉得尤其是这个夏天，感觉特别像疫情前。
So then with the slow recovery and also with our age changing, I feel like this past summer especially has felt very much like pre COVID again.
天哪。
Oh my god.
等等。
Wait.
我完全懂你的意思。
I totally get what you mean.
而且我觉得，可能有一部分原因是，我们很多朋友在大学期间或毕业后分散各地，现在都回到了湾区。
And I actually think part of it could be that a lot of our friends who dispersed during college or after college have come back to the Bay.
所以现在我们在湾区的人比过去很长一段时间都要多。
And so now there's a bigger chunk of us in The Bay than there has been in a long time.
对。
Right.
所以我们就能更常聚在一起，而且我觉得我们也更想频繁地见面。
So we've been able to like hang out more and I guess we've wanted to hang out more frequently.
这还是个很大的问号。
Big question mark there.
而且也许现在我们都是三十岁了，感觉像是新阶段的开始，新十年的开始。
And maybe also now that we are all 30, it feels like the start of something new, the start of a new decade.
我觉得从某种意义上说，这也让我深深感受到青春易逝，因为转眼间，我们的整个二十几岁就过去了。
I think in a sense, it has also very much reminded me how fleeting youth can be because in the blink of an eye, our entire twenties are over.
谁能说我们的三十岁就不会这样呢？
And who's to say that that's not gonna happen with our thirties either?
对。
No.
三十岁在某种意义上感觉像是一个新的开始。
Being 30 has felt like a fresh start in a sense.
这也让我想在真正变成大叔之前，多享受一下我们的青春。
It also makes me wanna enjoy our youth a little bit more before we become actual unks.
我很高兴你对三十岁有这样的感觉。
I'm glad you feel that way about being 30.
再过四个月，你可能就会
Just give it, like, four more months and you might
像我一样了。
be like me.
天哪。
Damn.
嗯，也许我们可以从回想疫情前我们觉得特别典型的事情来开始这一集。
Well, maybe we can start this episode thinking back to what we associate with being very much a pre COVID thing to do.
对我来说，就是下班后经常出去玩，或者下班后的欢乐时光。
For me, hugely hanging out after work and or happy hours after work.
疫情前，那绝对更常见。
Pre COVID, that was definitely way more common.
有时候我甚至会和同事一起出去玩。
Sometimes I would even hang out with my coworkers.
我们会说，嘿。
We'd be like, hey.
你想去街角那家酒吧吗？
Do you wanna go to, like, the bar down the street?
待一会儿。
Hang out for a bit.
然后我会说，好啊。
And I'd be like, okay.
现在我就想，哎，我得回家了。
Now I'm like, yo, I gotta go home.
我大概下午三点就走了。
I'm like leaving at 3PM or something.
根本没时间磨蹭。
There's no time to dilly dally.
天哪。
Damn.
我觉得我某种程度上同意你的看法。
I think I agree to a certain degree.
我在想是不是因为那时候的工作时间更固定。
And I wonder if it's because work schedules felt more rigid back then.
所以我觉得疫情后，大家下班时间更灵活了。
So I think post COVID, people are a little bit more flexible with their leaving time.
我感觉我很多同事，有时候下午两点半就走了，最晚也就五点。
I feel like a lot of my coworkers leave sometime between honestly 02:30 some days to like five at the absolute latest.
但疫情前，我以前工作的那家公司，办公室里所有人都是九点半之前到，最早五点半才走，经常待到六点。
But pre COVID, everyone at my office at the company that I used to work for at the time was in before 09:30, would stay till earliest 05:30 and oftentimes stay till 6PM.
天哪。
Oh my god.
我觉得待到六点可能更多是跟我那家公司有关，而不是当时的工作文化。
I think staying till 6PM was maybe more associated with my company and not like the work culture back then.
但我觉得那时候大家至少都会待到四点半或五点。
But I feel like back then everyone stayed until at least 04:30 or five.
所以下班后去喝一杯或者一起出去喝酒就特别容易，因为大家都知道，四点半或五点的时候大家肯定都还在办公室。
So then it's so much easier to like meet up for happy hour or like all go out for drinks after work because it was a given that everyone was in the office by 04:30 or like 5PM still.
太对了。
So true.
天哪。
Oh my god.
你想听点疯狂的事吗？
Do you wanna know something crazy?
对。
Yeah.
疫情前，我其实是个合同工。
So pre COVID, I was actually a contracted worker.
嗯。
Mhmm.
不是全职员工。
So not a full time employee.
而且那时候，至少对我这个职位来说，公司发的笔记本电脑。
And one of the things back then, at least for my particular role, my company issued laptop.
它连接了公司所有的在线网盘和资源什么的。嗯。
It was connected to all of my company's online drives and resources and stuff Mhmm.
只能在办公室用。
Only at the office.
哦。
Oh.
如果我没连上公司的Wi-Fi，对。
If I was not on the company Wi Fi Yeah.
我连邮件都收不到，更别说云端硬盘那些了。
I could not access email even or cloud drives and stuff like that.
这真是有利有弊，你知道吗？
It was like a pro and a con, you know?
一下班，我就……对。
If I left work, I just Yeah.
真的就完全没法碰工作了。
Literally couldn't access work anymore.
嗯。
Mhmm.
对。
Yeah.
我就只能朝九晚五地待在办公室，不然什么都干不了。
I had to just be at work from nine to five or else I can't get anything done.
那也太夸张了。
That's crazy.
我觉得从某种意义上说这也是好事，因为下班就是下班了。
I guess it is good in a sense because when you clock out, you clock out.
就像，你懂的。
Like, you Yeah.
真的得把工作留在工作场所，但你也被迫得待满八个小时才能开始干活。
Truly have to leave work at work, but you're also being forced to, like, stay the full eight hours or something to, like, be able to do your work in the first place.
对。
Yeah.
确实挺离谱的。
It was truly crazy.
现在回想起来，我就想，谁会觉得这是个好主意啊？
Thinking back on it now, I'm like, who thought that was a good idea?
不是所有合同工都这样，但不知道为什么我们团队就是这样。
Not all contracted workers had that set up, but for some reason my team did.
我想我们只是没来得及申请权限，所以没法在外面访问。
I guess we just didn't get around to asking for permissions to be able to have that outside access.
而且我觉得那时候那种权限管得严多了，申请起来也麻烦，所以我们可能干脆就没去弄。
And I think back then those kinds of permissions were a lot stricter a little harder to go through, so we probably just didn't bother to do it.
我就得在手机上的个人日历里看自己的日程，这样才能知道某个时间有没有空，万一临时有会议变动什么的。
I would have to follow my calendar on my personal calendar app so I could see if I'm busy at certain times in case there 's, like, a meeting change or something last minute.
对。
Yeah.
这种事经常发生。
Which happens all the time.
对。
Yeah.
所以那是个聪明的办法，能绕过这个问题。
So that's a smart way to get around that.
是的。
Yeah.
回想起来，那绝对是疫情前的事了。
Thinking back, I'm, that is some pre COVID shit for sure.
说实话，回头看，疫情前我们的事业都还处于早期阶段。
I guess honestly looking back, we were quite early in our careers pre COVID.
疫情来的时候我们大概才24岁吧？
We must have been what, 24 when COVID hit?
天哪。
Oh my god.
我们是不是更年轻一点？
Were we younger I think?
大概23岁？
Like 23 maybe?
22岁？
22?
对。
Yeah.
可能吧，我们大学毕业的时候是22岁。
Maybe like well, we were 22 when we graduated college.
哦。
Oh.
然后两年后疫情就来了。
And then COVID hit two years after.
所以疫情来的时候我们大概23岁，快24岁了。
So we must have been like 23 on the cusp of turning 24 when COVID hit.
天哪。
Oh my god.
你说得对。
You're right.
我们都老了。
We're so old.
但我觉得因为当时我们职业生涯刚开始，再加上疫情前的文化，在家办公真的感觉像是一种巨大的特权。
But I think because we were so early in our careers, also the pre COVID culture at the time, work from home just felt like such a huge privilege.
确实是这样。
It did.
我觉得现在人们每周至少在家工作一天或更多已经很常见了。
I think it's more common now for people to work from home at least one plus days a week.
但那时候，我一个月才有一天能在家工作。
But back then, I would get like one work from home day a month.
而且那还是因为我有预约或者有什么特殊原因，才被允许在家工作的。
And it was because I had an appointment or like because I had some sort of reason or some sort of special thing that allowed me to work from home.
否则的话，每周五天都得去办公室，每周都是如此。
And otherwise, it was in the office five days a week, every week.
对。
Yeah.
在家工作这个概念当时甚至都很陌生。
Work from home was such a foreign concept even.
就像，哦，这真的可以吗？我都不知道还能这样。
It's like, oh, is this even like a I didn't know you could do that.
对。
Yeah.
我不知道软件工程师会怎么看这个，因为我知道不仅在科技行业，可能软件工程师特别明显，
I don't know how, like, software engineers would feel about that because I do know not only in tech, but maybe software engineers specifically
嗯。
Mhmm.
他们会有更多的灵活性，而且我们以有更多在家工作的日子而闻名。
Get a little bit more flexibility and we're known to have more work from home days.
但对于更传统的职位，我觉得面对面交流的重要性被特别强调。
But for, like, a more traditional position, I feel like the face time being important was very emphasized.
对。
Yeah.
哥们，我以前工作的那家公司，CEO兼创始人基本上把她的办公桌放在前门旁边。
Dude, the company that I used to work for, the CEO and founder would have her desk basically right next to the front door.
实际上，我当时想，CEO的桌子挨着CFO的桌子，再挨着CMO的桌子。
Actually, I was like, the CEO's desk next to the CFO's desk next to the CMO's desk.
然后如果你想早点走，就得从他们所有人的办公桌旁边走过去才能到门口。
And then if you wanted to leave early, you would have to walk by all of their desks to go to the front door.
我记得那真是太尴尬了。
And I remember it was just so awkward.
感觉六点之前走会特别不好意思。
Like, would feel terrible leaving before 6PM.
那也太夸张了。
That is crazy.
那时候我也是，我上下班都坐公交。
Back in those days as well for me, I would take, like, a bus to and from work.
因为堵车，如果我坐晚一点的车，比如五点或者更晚，回家的时间基本上要翻倍。
Because of the traffic, if I took a later bus, later as in 5PM or later, the time to get home would basically double.
本来三四十分钟的路程，会变成一个半小时，甚至两个小时。
It would turn from, like, thirty to forty minutes up to, like, an hour and a half, maybe even two hours.
天哪。
Oh my god.
所以我总是尽量赶下午四点的公交，那是能坐的最早一班。
So I would always try to take the 4PM bus, which was the earliest one available.
但我早走总觉得特别不好意思，因为好像就我一个人站起来，说，嘿。
But I always felt so bad leaving early because I would be, like, the only one getting up, like, hey.
我得赶这趟公交。
I gotta catch this bus.
其他人还都坐着干活呢。
Everyone's still sitting down working.
我就想，我先走了，然后在车上干活吧，因为车上有Wi-Fi。
I'm like, I'm gonna go and I'll work on the bus, I guess, because there's Wi Fi on it.
但结果呢，我上去就睡着了。
But, no, I just went on and, like, slept.
哥们，那也太爽了吧。
Dude, that's the life.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得堵车也是一个好例子。
I guess traffic is a good one too.
我觉得通勤的交通现在还是很糟糕，而且可能还会更糟。
Like, I feel like commuter traffic, it's still bad now and maybe potentially getting worse.
但那时候，周一到周五早上七点到九点简直糟透了，每天都是。
But at the time, it was like Monday to Friday, 7AM to 9AM was absolute shit, like, every day.
下午四点到六点也很糟糕，每天都是。
And like four to 6PM terrible every I
我觉得有时候甚至延长到晚上七点。
think it even extended to like seven sometimes, 7PM.
因为大家都差不多时间下班。
Just because everyone was, yeah, like, leaving at the same time.
但现在平均来说，大家的工作时间更灵活了，我觉得交通高峰也分成了不同的时段。
But nowadays, with more flexibility on average, I feel like there's different waves of traffic.
对。
Yeah.
对我来说，很多交通其实从下午两点半或三点就开始了，然后会有点起伏。
Like, a lot of traffic actually starts at around 02:30 or 3PM for me, and then it kind of, like, ebbs and flows a bit.
五点钟的时候确实还是很堵，但现在我觉得结束得更早了，大概六点半左右就慢慢散了。
It does still really get bad at that 5PM mark, but it tapers off earlier now, I think, towards, like, 06:30 ish.
说实话，我觉得疫情带来的工作安排灵活性真的是个很大的福气。
I feel like the flexibility that we have gotten in our work schedule from COVID happening has been such a big blessing, honestly.
当然疫情很糟糕，但我很高兴偶尔在家办公变得更正常了。
Of course COVID was terrible, but I am so happy that working from home occasionally is way more normalized.
人们有灵活的工作时间也变得更正常了。
People having flexible schedules is way more normalized.
而且，我觉得像Zoom会议之类的也变得更普遍了。
And also, I guess in a sense like Zoom meetings and stuff are more normalized too.
因为记得以前很多会议，如果我那天去不了或者得在家工作，我回想一下。
Because I remember a lot of meetings before, if I couldn't make it in or like had to work from home that day I'm trying to think back.
我觉得那时候远程接入会议没那么有保障。
I feel like there was less of a guarantee that I could dial in to, like, a meeting remotely back then.
我明白了。
I see.
我觉得以前开会你得亲自到场。
I think you had to, like, physically be there for a meeting.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得以前拨号参加会议更像是那种，你知道的，当某人在另一个州或另一个国家的时候才会这么做。
I think dialing in did feel like it was more when you know someone's in a different state a different country or something like that.
不过这种灵活性不仅对我们有好处，我觉得很多父母从中受益更多，因为你知道，他们得去接孩子，现在下午两点半左右离开变得更容易被接受了，因为他们得去接孩子并带他们回家。
Not only is that flexibility good for us though, I feel like I've seen a lot of parents benefit from this so much more because, you know, like they have to go pick up their kids and now it's way more acceptable to just get up and leave around 02:30 because they have to get their kids and bring them home.
然后他们可以在家灵活地完成一天的工作，而不是只能让孩子自己想办法。
Then they have the flexibility to finish the workday at home rather than having to just let their kids figure it out.
或者我
Or I
猜甚至不用付日托或课后班的费用，我听说那些费用挺高的。
guess even like having to pay for that daycare or like after school, which I heard the costs are pretty crazy.
所以我觉得这对父母来说肯定更有帮助。
So I'm sure it's like more helpful for parents as well.
对。
Yeah.
而且我注意到早上的交通高峰更明显了。
And I've noticed in the morning there's more obvious waves of traffic.
早上六点到七点有一波早高峰，是那些早起的人。
There's the early morning six to 7AM rush for the early morning people.
然后八点到九点又有一波车流，因为都是送完孩子的父母。
And then there's traffic again around eight to nine because it's like all the parents after they drop off their kids.
对。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
不过我觉得交通高峰这个问题确实很真实。
I think the waves of traffic is very real, though.
以前我记得，通勤高峰时段某些Caltrain列车真是挤得不行。
In the past, I remember certain Caltrain trains were just so packed during commuting hours.
具体时间我记不清了，但以前我能随口说出我坐的是哪几班Caltrain。
I don't remember the times anymore, but I used to be able to like rattle off which Caltrain times I was taking.
那些车次，我全程都是站着的，整整一个小时。
And those trains, I was always standing the entire hour right now.
现在我偶尔去旧金山办公室的时候坐BART，不坐Caltrain了。
And now I take BART when I occasionally go to the SF office and no longer Caltrain.
但我好奇现在是不是还那么挤，或者稍微好一点。
But I wonder if it's just as packed now or maybe just slightly less busy.
等等。
Wait.
BART怎么样？
How is BART?
BART还行。
BART is okay.
挤吗？
Is it packed?
倒也不算挤，不过我坐的是稍微晚一点的车，大概九点半到办公室，所以不用赶九点那班了。
I wouldn't say it's packed, but I do take a slightly later train to get into the office at, like, 09:30, so I'm no longer trying to do the, like, 9AM.
等等。
Wait.
九点半已经很早了吧。
09:30 is plenty early.
确实。
That's true.
说实话对我来说还是觉得挺早的，但可能很多人还是想九点前到办公室。
It honestly still feels early for me, but maybe for a lot of other people, they want to still get into the office by nine.
九点半那班确实没那么挤，不像沙丁鱼罐头。
Definitely less sardine like at the 09:30AM one.
我记得有段时间我确实坐过BART去旧金山，嗯。
I remember I did take BART up to SF for some stints Mhmm.
而且总是特别挤。
And it was always really packed.
我总能找到座位，因为我的站是较早的站之一。
I always managed to get a seat because my station was one of the early stations.
对。
Mhmm.
但是，等我们到旧金山的时候，可能没那么挤，但人很多，大多数人站着，所有座位都满了。
But, like, by the time we got into SF, maybe not, like, sardine like, but lots of people most people are standing and, like, all the seats are filled.
是的。
And Yeah.
所以，我很好奇，因为我已经很多年不用去旧金山上班了，所以我想知道东湾那边的BART现在怎么样。
So, yeah, I'm curious because I haven't had to work in SF for many years now, so I wonder how the BART is on that East Bay Side.
哦，对。
Oh, yeah.
我觉得东湾那边总是更拥挤。
I feel like the East Bay Side is always way busier.
其实挺搞笑的，因为我在旧金山上的那个BART站，我坐的是半岛方向，就是往西到戴利城那边的车。
It's hella funny actually because the BART station that I get on at in SF, I take the Peninsula Side, I guess, like the westward train down to, like, Daly City area.
每次我上那趟车，虽然有点挤，但也没到疯狂的程度。
And every time I get on that train, it's, like, kind of busy, but not crazy.
比如，我总能找到座位。
Like, I can always get a seat.
对。
Mhmm.
然后我看向站台对面的东行列车，那里的人还是肩并肩挤在一起。
And then I look across the station to the eastward train, and it's, people are shoulder to shoulder still.
我看到那些骑自行车的人，带着他们的大自行车。
Like, I do see all of the biking people with their, like, huge bikes.
我就想，天哪。
I'm like, damn.
那趟东行列车也太挤了吧。
That eastward train's so busy.
对。
Yeah.
说实话，很多人都是从东边过来的，因为……对。
Honestly, a lot of people are coming from the East Side because I Yeah.
站点太多了。
There's so many stops.
好像一直延伸到，我觉得现在到圣何塞了。
It's like all the way from I think now San Jose.
从圣何塞开始。
It starts from San Jose.
是吧？
Right?
然后一路往上，经过奥克兰，再到旧金山。
So then all the way up, like, through Oakland and then to SF.
所以人特别多。
So a lot of people.
那边的交通选择更好，不像半岛这边，你得在戴利城、密尔布雷或者SFO机场下车。
It's just a better transportation option there Versus the Peninsula side, you have to get off at, what, Daly City, Milbray, SFO Airport.
对。
Yeah.
而且半岛这边有两条线路，Caltrain和BART，挺方便的。
And also because there's two options in Peninsula, the Caltrain and BART, which is nice.
这样分散一些。
Spreads it out a little bit.
对。
Yeah.
说到旧金山，我确实觉得，我们之前也提过。
But speaking of SF, I do feel like and we touched on this earlier.
疫情前，我下班后经常在旧金山多待一会儿。
Pre COVID, I would just hang out in SF after work for a lot longer.
嗯。
Mhmm.
我会联系那些也在城里工作的人，然后就说，嘿。
I would hit up people who are also working in the city at the time, and then it'd be like, hey.
我大概五点下班。
I'm gonna get off work at, like, five.
你想见面吗？
Do you wanna meet up?
然后我们就出去，自己搞个欢乐时光或者吃个晚饭，就在城里待到天黑，然后坐BART回家。
And then we would go out, have our own happy hour or, like, eat dinner, literally hang out in the city until it got dark, and then we would BART home.
对。
Yeah.
现在想想，我就在想，我为什么把那么宝贵的时间浪费在外面？
Thinking on that now, I'm like, why did I waste such precious time outside?
我觉得确实有明显的变化，但我甚至不知道该怎么准确描述它。
I feel like there's been a visible change, but I don't even know how to quite place or describe it.
也许那时候在家时间没有现在这么被看重，因为我觉得疫情之后，我更加珍惜待在家里的时光，喜欢独处，或者能在自己家里做各种事情。
Maybe it felt like home time was less valued than we currently value it in a sense, because I feel like with COVID happening, I have gotten a massive appreciation for being at home and like being alone or like being able to do things within the confines of my own house.
但那时候，出门跟别人一起玩感觉更酷、更有趣，也更珍贵。
But back then, it felt way more cool and fun and like precious to be out and like be hanging out with other people.
对。
Mhmm.
我觉得疫情一来，明显有个变化，餐厅和酒吧突然就开始萧条了。
And I think when COVID happened, there was like a noticeable shift where restaurants and like bars just suddenly started dying out.
当然，那时候大家都没法出门。
Obviously, people weren't able to go out back then.
是的。
Yeah.
但就算到了2023年初，我还是觉得旧金山有点死气沉沉的，不像现在这样。
But even in, like, early twenty twenty three, I felt like SF was still a little dead versus how it is now.
现在下班后出去喝一杯的人明显多多了。
There's definitely way more people going out and, like, grabbing drinks after work.
哦，对。
Oh, yeah.
比如我们最近在旧金山，城里那些背着背包的人又回来了。
Like, we were in SF recently, and the people with the backpacks in the city are back.
对。
Yeah.
我以前也是那些人中的一员。
I used to be one of those people.
那些科技人群靠在吧台上。
The tech crowds leaning up against the bar.
他们回来了。
They're back.
出去吃晚饭什么的。
Going out for dinner or whatever.
是的。
Yeah.
说实话，我确实很享受那段时光，和朋友一起玩，下班后一起闲逛。
To be honest, I did enjoy those times having fun with friends and hanging out after work.
但现在我觉得自己再也无法想象那样频繁地外出了。
But now it's just like I couldn't fathom doing that so much anymore.
对。
Mhmm.
是的。
Yeah.
也许一部分原因是疫情前后的变化，但也可能跟年龄有关。
Maybe part of it is the pre COVID, post COVID shift, but maybe also part of it is, like, age.
我也不确定。
I don't know.
对。
Yeah.
确实。
That's true.
说实话，回想起来，跟朋友出去喝酒几乎成了一种爱好。
Honestly, looking back, it almost felt like going out and grabbing drinks with friends was a hobby.
如果现在有人问我空闲时间喜欢做什么，我觉得我有一长串喜欢做的事情，而且每周都会安排时间去做。
If someone were to ask me now what I like to do in my free time, I feel like there's a long list of things that I enjoy doing and I prioritize in my weekly schedule.
但那时候，出去玩就是清单上的头等大事。
But back then, going out was like the number one thing on the list.
对。
Yeah.
而且那时候也更普遍，你知道吗？
It was also just more normalized, you know?
是的。
Mhmm.
感觉非常随意，甚至可以说有点不用太当真的那种。
It felt so casual and honestly even non committal in a way.
就像，哎，你要是没事，今天有空的话，就出来一起吧。
Like, oh, if you're free, know, if you have time today, come out with us.
我们都准备去喝一杯。
We're all gonna go have drinks.
没关系，来不了也没事。
It's okay if you don't.
我们下周可能还会再聚一次。
We'll probably do it again sometime next week.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得以前团队聚餐更随意，也更频繁。
Team dinners were a lot more casual, I think, slash frequent.
现在感觉，可能也跟我所在的团队性质变了有关，但协调大家的时间真的挺费劲的，因为每个人都有自己的安排，不是所有人都住在同一个城市，各种原因吧。
I feel like nowadays and maybe it's also a shift in the nature of the team that I'm on, but it feels like a lot of effort to coordinate so that everyone can make it because everyone's got their own schedules, not everyone lives in the same city, all of that kind of stuff.
这让我想到。
It makes me think.
我们之前聊过，现在人们不再被固定在同一个办公室，朝九晚五，周一到周五都得待在那儿。
We talked about earlier of how people are no longer tied to, like, literally be in the same exact office from nine to five Monday to Friday.
嗯。
Mhmm.
但随着这种变化和灵活性的引入，工作文化也有很多东西跟着变了。
But with that changing and with the flexibility being introduced, there is a lot of things that change with like the work culture too.
对。
Yeah.
因为不能保证某人总在同一个办公室，所以你不能随便搞这些活动了。
Because it's not guaranteed that someone is gonna be at the same office all the time, you can't just casually do these things anymore.
你得提前预订或安排，这样大家才能调整接送孩子的时间或者个人事务来参加。
You have to book it or schedule it in advance so that people can rearrange their pickup schedules or like their personal things to show up to these things.
说得太对了。
So true.
还有一件事也变了，至少我们公司现在对出差管得更严了。
Another thing that kind of changed, at least my company is a little more strict on, like, travel now.
出差、团建之类的活动。
Travel and off sites and things like that.
预算卡得更紧了，但我觉得疫情之前，大家可能一年会搞两次团建。
They're a little more tight with the budgeting, but I feel like before COVID, it used to be like people would try to do an off-site two times a year maybe even.
对。
Mhmm.
说实话，这对团队凝聚力什么的真的挺好的。
And it was really good honestly for team bonding and all that.
但现在，这些活动要获批就难多了。
But nowadays, it's just like a little harder to get those things approved.
所以我觉得这个变化挺有意思的。
So I feel like that has been an interesting shift.
是的。
Yeah.
我完全能理解。
I can definitely see that.
对我来说也有点遗憾，因为当时我是合同工，不能参加团建活动。
It's also a little sad for me because since I was a contractor at the time, I wasn't allowed to attend off sites.
我是在疫情期间才转成正式员工的。
I became a full time employee during COVID.
对。
Mhmm.
所以现在我就想，唉。
So now I'm like, damn.
我怀念那种黄金时代。
I miss, like, the golden era.
兄弟，我完全懂你的意思。
Dude, I know exactly what you mean.
就像你听到一些故事，说以前团队预算特别充足。
It's like you just hear stories about times where teams were like flush with budget.
而且我觉得我参加过很多工作午餐或晚餐，他们就会说，天哪，我们一起去迈阿密的时候多开心啊，在船上喝得烂醉之类的。
And I feel like I've been at many work lunches or dinners where they're like, my god, wasn't it so fun when we all went to Miami and then like we got so drunk on that boat and blah blah.
我坐在那儿听着，心里想，唉。
And I'm sitting there listening like, damn.
我们公司现在绝对做不到这样。
Our company could never do this right now.
公司现在就是，哎，等等。
The company is all we're like, oh, wait.
你们都能远程办公吗？
Like, you guys can all work remotely?
别闹了。
Come on.
我们可以让你在家办公，但所有的乐趣都没了。
We'll give you work from home, but we're taking away all the fun.
对。
Yeah.
不过我觉得灵活办公也有个代价，以前我特别烦必须早上九点到办公室，其实那时候是周一到周五九点到六点。
I think another trade off though with the flexibility is I think I used to feel a lot of angst about having to be in the office from nine to well, low key back then nine to six Monday through Friday.
因为那种烦躁，我周末就拼命安排各种活动，能塞多少塞多少。
And because of that angst, I would pack my weekends with as much as I could possibly pack it with.
所以那时候就是，周五晚上出去玩。
So then it was like Friday night, we go out.
周六，我和朋友一起吃午饭。
Saturday, I get lunch with a friend.
周六晚上，我们出去玩。
Saturday night, we go out.
周日早上，稍微恢复一下。
Sunday, slight recovery in the morning.
然后周日下午，我还会安排点活动。
And then Sunday afternoon, I would also plan something.
然后我就会经历最严重的周日恐惧症。
And then I would get the worst Sunday scaries ever.
因为我很害怕又要回到办公室待五天，对。
Because I would just dread that five days in the office again Yeah.
还有那时候我每天要忍受的漫长通勤。
Along with the brutal commute that I used to do back then.
但现在我觉得一周里灵活多了，工作日和周末的界限几乎没那么分明了。
But I think because there's more flexibility in the week now, there's less of a separation almost between the weekday and the weekend.
周末还是挺好的，我周末依然感觉很棒，但周日不再那么让人沮丧了。
It's still nice to have a weekend, and I still feel great on the weekends, but it's not so depressing on Sundays anymore.
哦，我明白了。
Oh, I see.
我也觉得那段时间我累多了。
I also feel like during those times, I was a lot more tired.
哦，是的。
Oh, yes.
完全同意。
Totally agree.
对。
Yeah.
你知道吗，现在想想，我们周末确实经常出去玩。
You know, now that I think about it, we did go out a lot on the weekends.
我觉得我们几乎每个周末都出去。
I think we went out like almost every weekend.
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而且我还记得那段时间我特别容易累。
And I also remember feeling a lot more tired during these times.
除了朝九晚五待在办公室，通勤真的消耗了我很多精力。
In addition to just being in the office nine to five, the commute really took a lot of energy out of me.
对。
Mhmm.
就算不是每次都是我开车，光是坐在车里一个多小时就已经很累了。
Even if I might not have been driving every single time, just like sitting in a vehicle for an hour plus is still very tiring.
兄弟，我可一点都不怀念那些日子，因为我大概六点多就要起床，然后赶加州火车，到了车站还得走一段路。
Dude, I do not miss those days because I would wake up at, like, six something and then catch the Caltrain up, and then from the Caltrain station, like, walk and shit.
所以单程通勤大概要一个半小时。
So it must have been, like, a one point five hour commute one way.
天哪。
Dude.
而且我记得每个工作日的晚上都像是在为第二天做准备，不像现在，通勤时间短了，办公室进出时间也灵活了，我晚上还能做点别的事，而不是只为了第二天早起赶路。
And I just remember thinking every weeknight just felt like a preparation for the next day versus now with a shorter commute, more flexible in and out times in the office, I can do stuff on the weeknight that isn't just preparation for, like, getting up and commuting the next day.
对。
Yeah.
所以这可能也减少了周日晚上的焦虑。
So maybe that also contributes to less Sunday scaries.
我觉得这也有帮助，因为我说过很多次了，我不是一个早起的人。
I feel like it's also helpful because as I've stated many times, I'm not a morning person.
所以对我来说，能先醒来是很有帮助的。
So it's helpful for me to be able to like wake up.
如果我有早会，可以在家先开完会，然后再准备去办公室。
Maybe if I have an early meeting, take that meeting at home then like get myself ready to go to the office.
是的。
Mhmm.
这比之前那种方式更适合我的日程，以前我得拼命早起，赶在会议开始前到办公室。
That just works for my kind of schedule way better than before where I'd have to like fight to wake up early in my books early and then make it to the office before that meeting started.
简直一团糟。
Just like a mess, I guess.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得从某种意义上说，疫情让人们在工作中谈论个人时间安排和个人偏好变得正常了。
I guess in a sense, what was normalized because of COVID was talking about your personal schedule and personal preferences at work.
嗯。
Mhmm.
因为我觉得以前，除非你有医生预约什么的，朝九晚五的工作时间就是压倒一切的。
Because I feel like back then, unless you had a doctor's appointment or something, the nine to five is just so it takes priority over anything.
对。
Yeah.
而现在呢，人们更愿意说，比如，我早上有个会，所以我会晚点到。
And then now, like, people are more open to talking about, like, oh, I have an early meeting, so I'll just come in after that.
或者说，我得去接孩子，或者我得出去办点事，含糊地提一下预约，这都没问题。
Or, like, I have to pick up my kid and do this, or I have to step out for vague reference to appointment, and it's, like, totally fine.
天哪。
Oh my god.
确实如此。
So true.
哦，哥们，我其实有个挺搞笑的故事，是疫情前的，因为那时候在家办公还不常见。
Oh dude, I actually have a pretty funny story about pre COVID because work from home wasn't so common.
有一阵子，我在面试新工作。
At one point, I was like interviewing for new jobs.
当然，我当时没告诉公司里的任何人。
Of course, I didn't tell anyone at my job at the time.
明白。
Mhmm.
有一天，我得去城里面试，我当时就想，靠。
So there was this one day I had to, like, go up to the city for an interview, and I was like, fuck.
那可是工作日。
It's, like, a weekday.
我该怎么办？
What am I gonna do?
所以我就跟我经理说了。
So I basically told my manager.
我就说，嘿。
I was like, hey.
我昨晚食物中毒了。
I got food poisoning last night.
今天能在家办公吗？
Can I work from home today?
不想你知道的。
Don't wanna you know?
对。
Yeah.
在办公室会很难受什么的。
It'll be tough in the office or whatever.
然后他就说，哦，好的。
And he was like, oh, yeah.
当然可以。
Of course.
需要什么就跟我说。
Let me know if you need anything.
我就说，好的。
I was like, yeah.
然后我就进城去面试了。
So then I, like, go up to the city and I interview.
我觉得最好笑的是第二天我去办公室，大家都说，天哪，听说你昨天食物中毒在家休息了。
And I think the, like, funniest part was the next day, I go into the office and everyone's like, oh my god, I heard you got food poisoning and it kept you home yesterday.
因为大家都在办公室，所以所有人都知道了。
Because everyone knows because everyone's in the office.
对吧？
Right?
所以，对。
So Right.
显然，他们会说，哦，某某今天怎么没来？
Obviously, they'd be like, oh, why isn't so and so here today?
我就说，是啊。
And I was like, yeah.
对。
Yeah.
太难受了。
It was so bad.
他们又问，你在哪儿吃坏肚子的？
And they're like, where did you get food poisoning from?
我们得知道，好避开那家餐厅。
We need to know so we avoid that restaurant.
我就说，天哪。
I was like, oh my god.
我也不知道。
I don't know.
糟糕。
Shit.
然后我好像随便说了一家山景城挺火的餐厅。
And I think I named, like, some random restaurant in Mountain View that's actually pretty popular.
然后大家就说，哦，好吧。
And then people were like, oh, okay.
那我得离那家远点。
I'll have to stay away from there.
我当时就想，哎呀，坏了。
I was like, oh, shit.
我是不是不小心害了人家。
Did I just like my bad.
感觉我让那家店少了20个客人。
Like, I just lost that establishment, like, 20 customers.
所以
So
现在我每次路过那家餐厅，都会想起这件事。
every time I walk by that restaurant nowadays, I think about that.
太搞笑了。
That's so funny.
等等。
Wait.
是哪家餐厅来着？
What restaurant was it?
好像是山景城的Sushi Tomi还是什么的。
It was sushi tomi or something in Mountain View.
哥们，那家店超火的。
Dude, that place is hella popular.
天哪。
Oh my god.
太有意思了。
That's so funny.
我当时就想，完了。
I was like, shit.
我是不是该选个别的餐厅？
Should I have chosen a different restaurant?
但当时脑子里就蹦出这么一家。
But it was the only one that popped in my head.
你其实可以说像Jack in the
You really could have said like Jack in the
Box之类的。
Box or some shit.
你说得太对了。
Well, you're so right.
哥们，那时候想找个正当理由在家办公，真是个大挑战。
Dude, having to come up with a legitimate excuse to work from home back then, that was a true challenge.
最大的考验。
The biggest test of all.
如果你想多次这样做，我觉得你得换着不同的理由来。
If you wanted to do it like multiple times, I felt like you had to rotate through different reasons.
哥们，对。
Dude, yeah.
现在想想，我当时真该说发烧了什么的。
Now that I think about it, I should have just said like I got a fever or something.
因为万一第二天还得回去面试呢？
Because like what if I had to go back to interview the next day?
我当时在想
What was
什么呢？
I thinking?
你就像，这是那种四十八小时的食物中毒。
You're like, it's a forty eight hour type of food poisoning.
现在说实话，在家工作根本不需要什么理由。
And now it honestly doesn't take much to work from home.
我觉得我听过同事说过很多有趣的理由。
I feel like I've heard very interesting reasons from coworkers.
他们就说，我得做一些特别琐碎的事，五分钟就能搞定。
They're like, I had to do very menial tasks that takes five minutes.
然后我就居家办公了，我就觉得，挺有意思的。
So then I worked from home and I'm like, interesting.
说实话，我觉得我也挺幸运的，因为我们办公室和团队都很灵活。
Honestly, I think I'm lucky too because my particular office and team are all very flexible.
所以我觉得特别好笑，因为在我心里，还有在我们朋友圈子里，我们经常开玩笑说我早退、迟到，对。
So it's just really funny to me because I guess in my mind and in our friend group we often joke that I leave work early and I, like, go in late and Yeah.
那基本上就是我的风格。
That's just kind of, like, my style.
所以有时候挺搞笑的，因为我迟到的时候，可能都到午饭时间了。
So sometimes it's funny because I'll get in late and maybe it's, like, lunchtime.
嗯。
Mhmm.
但到了一两点的时候，办公室就开始空了。
But then by, like, one or two, the office starts emptying out.
然后，比如我的团队负责人路过，她说：我要走了。
And then, like, my team leader or something walks by, she's like, I'm gonna head out.
马上要堵车了。
Traffic's about to get really bad.
你也应该回家。
You should go home too.
我心里想，我才刚到呢，不过好吧。
And I'm like, low key, I just got here, but okay.
我觉得我和办公室的同事都在互相鼓励早点走。
I feel like me and my coworkers in the office, we stay encouraging each other to leave.
我们会说，天哪。
We're like, oh my god.
你就该走。
You should just go.
就是，也不是彼此的经理什么的。
Like or, like, not each other's managers or anything.
我们就说，回家吧。
We're like, go home.
我觉得这样挺自由的。
It's just, like, so freeing, I guess.
而且我觉得大家都没那么累了，因为可以避开堵车，我觉得堵车真的特别消耗人。
And I think everyone's like less tired because they can plan around traffic, which I just feel like traffic really sucks the soul out of you.
但我想说点有点小心眼，或者说，我也不知道，有点过分的话。
But can I say something that's kind of petty slash, I don't know, borderline?
我不想说邪恶，但我知道这些想法不太好。
I don't wanna say evil, but I know these are, like, not good thoughts to have.
但是，好吧。
But Okay.
某种程度上，我们经历了疫情前两年的工作，那时候通勤特别辛苦。
In some ways, we had the two years of pre COVID work where we did the brutal commute.
我们当时是朝九晚五，一周五天，几乎不能在家办公。
We did the, like, nine to five, five days a week, the minimal working from home.
所以在我看来，那是先决条件，你知道的，就是能享受这些的前提。
So in my mind that was the precursor, you know, that's like the prereq to be able to enjoy these things.
但有很多年轻员工从来没经历过那种日子。
But there's a lot of younger workers that never had to do that.
他们非常习惯在家办公。
They're very used to the working from home.
对他们来说，这就是他们进入职场时的常态。
Like to them, this is the normal that they like entered the workforce with.
有时候我看到年轻同事说的一些话，我就会想，哎，你真是不知道珍惜现在有的，哪怕你从来没经历过以前那种糟糕的通勤和糟糕的工作时间。
Sometimes when I see younger coworkers say things where I'm like, oh, you're very, like, not appreciative of what we have now even though you didn't ever have to do the shitty commute and, like, the shitty hours back then.
我明白了。
I see.
这让我心里有点不是滋味。
It makes me feel a certain type of way.
我就想，天哪。
I'm like, damn.
你根本不知道以前有多糟糕。
You don't even know how fucking bad it was.
尤其是他们抱怨现在的工作生活的时候。
Especially when they complain about how work life is now.
哦。
Oh.
我就觉得，我们现在已经够好了。
I'm like, we have it so good now.
哥们，你就是那种爱抱怨的老顽固。
Dude, you're the grumpy get off my lawn.
哥们，我知道。
Dude, I know.
我有
I have
我现在手里就拿着那根完整的拐杖。
like the full cane in my hand right now.
而且它还在晃。
And it's getting shaken.
我明白你的意思。
I get what you mean.
确实，就像在说，你们根本不知道以前是什么样子。
It's definitely like, oh, you guys don't know what it was like back then.
对。
Yeah.
当然。
Sure.
我们虽然没经历过那么久，但也熬过一段时间。
We didn't live through it that long, but we still had to go through it for a while.
所以，是的。
So Yeah.
我们熬过来了。
We endured it.
对。
Yeah.
而且可能当你跟那些年轻的同事聊天时，他们会说些像‘哦，是啊’这样的话。
And also maybe it's when you talk to these coworkers that are young, them saying shit like, oh, yeah.
我因为疫情错过了毕业舞会，或者我因为疫情错过了大学里的几年，我就想，哥们，你太年轻了。
I missed prom because of COVID or like, I missed certain years of college because of COVID, I'm just like dude, you're so young.
想到自己这么老，我心里真难受。
It kills me inside how old I am.
也许这就是工作中的一个好处。
Maybe that's one pro at work.
我身边年轻人不多，至少在我周围直接接触的人里不多。
There's not many young people around me, At least immediately around me.
有时候我确实会看到一些年轻人，但我绝不会跟他们互动，因为他们不跟我一起工作。
Sometimes I do see some young people but I would never interact with them just because they don't work with me.
对。
Yeah.
但我特别想有个Z世代的同事。
But I'm itching for a Gen Z coworker.
但我会后悔吗？
But will I regret it?
听起来好像有些不好的地方。
It sounds like there's some downsides to it.
说实话，我也就是开玩笑说说。
I mean, honestly, I guess I say it in jest.
这是一种健康的文化冲击。
It's a healthy culture shock.
你懂吧？
You know?
它提醒我，我已经不再二十多岁了。
It reminds me that I'm no longer in my twenties.
不再年轻了。
No longer youthful.
除了工作，我还想聊聊我们在疫情前几乎每个周末都出去疯玩的事。
Besides work, I do wanna talk more about how we fucking went out, like, every single weekend pre COVID.
那真是太疯狂了。
That was insane.
现在回头看，我就在想，我那时候是怎么撑过来的？
And now looking back, I'm like, how did I survive?
我们是怎么做到的？
How did we do that?
然后周一我们还得直接去上班。
And then we would go to work right after on Mondays.
对。
Yeah.
那确实挺疯狂的。
That was pretty crazy.
我觉得很大程度上是因为我们有钱了，那种兴奋感。
I think a lot of it was just like the excitement of us having money
或者我也不知道。
or I don't know.
大概就是因为钱吧。
Probably like money.
对吧？
Right?
对。
Yeah.
有钱出去玩，有钱做各种事情，吃顿饭什么的。
Money to go out, the money to do things, get dinner.
还有就是我们都满21岁了，有些人快到毕业才满21岁，所以他们在大学里少喝了一年的酒。
Also like being 21 plus, like some people didn't turn 21 until closer to graduation, so they kind of missed a year of drinking out in college.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得就是
I guess it's just
像是自由，加上到了成年人的年纪，再加上有钱，所有这些加在一起。
like freedom slash being old enough to be adults slash having money, all of that combined.
而且大家都回到了家乡，比如。
And everyone being back in our, like, hometown, for example.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得这对我们所有人来说也是一件大事。
I think that was a big thing for all of us too.
我觉得也挺有意思的，因为回想起来，以前聚会从来不是问题，但疫情之后，聚会反而成了问题。
I think it's also funny because if you think back, hosting was never really an issue, But only after COVID did hosting become an issue.
哦，等等，是。
Oh, it was wait.
就像，我们需要有空间的人，因为我们不太出门了。
Like, oh, we need people who have space because we're not going out as much.
我们现在更多是在家里聚。
We're, like, hanging in more.
哦，那倒是真的。
Oh, that's true.
那时候更像是先喝点酒，然后再出门那种。
It was more of like a pregame and then we go out type of thing back then.
那喝酒热身是什么？
So the pregame is what?
大概两小时吧？
Maybe like two hours?
对。
Mhmm.
就算挤在某个小地方也没关系。
Doesn't matter if we're like cramped in some sort of space.
反正那只是个过渡的地方。
It's just like a transitory area anyway.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得那时候只有我和詹姆斯在组织聚会。
I think me and James were the only people that hosted back then.
等等。
Wait.
确实是这样。
That is true.
你们几乎每次都在组织。
You guys hosted pretty much like a 100% of the time.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得这就是为什么组织聚会不是问题，因为只有一个地方可以去。
I feel like that's why hosting wasn't an issue because there was only one spot you could go.
那也是真的。
That's true too.
我觉得当时我们很多人也还在考虑要住在哪里。
I think also a lot of us were still figuring out where we wanted to live.
比如，很多人还住在家里。
Like, a lot of us still lived at home.
后来大家才慢慢搬到城里去住。
And then eventually people started moving out into, like, the city.
天哪。
Oh my god.
你知道吗？
You know what?
那时候拼车也更容易，因为我们大多数人刚大学毕业。
It was also easier to carpool back then because most of us were immediately out of college.
我们不是住在家里附近，就是住在家里。
We're either living, like, near home or at home.
对。
Mhmm.
然后我们就拼车去你那儿。
And then we would carpool to your place.
说实话，那会儿真的挺开心的。
It was honestly very fun.
我觉得当主人还有个好处，就是大家最后都会回到你那儿拿车什么的。
I guess you also get the plus of when you host, everyone comes back to your place to, like, get their cars and stuff.
对。
Mhmm.
所以等大家都回到我们家，我只需要打扫一下然后睡觉就行了。
So then when everyone came back to our place, all I had to do was, like, clean and then sleep.
就不用再开车回家了。
Like, I didn't have to do an extra drive back home.
是的。
Yeah.
还记得以前吗，我们有时候还会投票决定是出去还是待在家里。对。
Remember, like, in the past, we would also sometimes vote on if we were actually gonna go out or if we would just stay in Yeah.
还有喝酒？
And drink?
但现在我觉得几乎总是待在家里。
But now I feel like it's almost always stay in.
就像，我们连投票都不投了。
Like, we don't even vote.
就是，嗯，算了，就待在家里吧。
It's just a, yeah, let's just stay in.
对。
Yeah.
就像每晚的结尾都是待在家里。
It's like the end of every night is to just stay in.
有时候我们会出去吃个晚饭，喝第一轮酒什么的，但最后总是回到家里。
Sometimes we'll go out and, like, get dinner and, like, a first round of drinks or something, but we always end up back home.
或者，对。
Or Yeah.
感觉我们都不打算再出门了。
It's like we don't even plan to go out anymore.
我们，对。
We Yeah.
就直接说，好吧。
Just straight up like, okay.
这次聚会就是，我们就在家待着，对。
This session will be a we're just gonna hang out Yeah.
在里面做这些事情。
Inside and do these things.
说实话这样挺好的，还能省不少钱。
It's honestly very nice and helps save a lot of money.
确实。
True.
但我想了想，这可能跟年龄有关。
But I have to imagine that's probably more age now that I think about it.
因为年轻的时候，总想出去，比如跳舞什么的？
Because when you're young, you wanna go out and like did we dance?
我刚想说你想出去跳舞，但我不确定我们那时候是不是真的跳过舞。
I was gonna say you wanna go out and dance, but I don't even know if we really danced back then.
我觉得我们就是出去逛逛。
I think we just went out.
我觉得我们就是点了些烈酒。
I think we just ordered fat shots.
唉，要是能回到年轻时的肝脏就好了。
Oh, to have a young liver.
对。
Yeah.
好。
Okay.
我不记得之前在播客里有没有提过这件事，但这件事深深印在我脑海里。
I don't remember if I mentioned this on the pod before, but this is a memory that is ingrained deeply into my brain.
我记得大概是疫情开始后的第二或第三周，当时封锁正式开始了。
I think it was maybe week two or three of COVID when lockdown was officially happening.
有一天周六早上我醒来，心里想，天哪，我们不用出门了。
I woke up one day on like Saturday morning and I was like, oh my god, we don't need to hang out.
而且至少一两个月都不用出门。
And it's like, we won't need to hang out for like at least a month or two.
对。
Yeah.
我不用见我的
I don't need to see my
朋友。
friends.
那太疯狂了。
That's crazy.
我是说，我不能说这不可理解，因为当我们大学毕业后有很多计划，比如找工作之类的，总是很有趣很兴奋。
I mean, I can't say it's unrelatable because when we had a lot of plans immediately after college graduation and getting jobs and stuff, it was always very fun and exciting.
对。
Mhmm.
但在2020年初，我确实感到非常不堪重负，因为日历上排得太满了。
But in early twenty twenty, it got to a point where I was feeling very overwhelmed with how much was actually like booked on the calendar.
我记得当时想，事情太多了。
And I remember being like, there is so much happening.
我真不知道我的身体怎么能撑过所有这些活动。
I don't know how my body is physically going to make and survive all of these events.
而且不只是喝酒的聚会，还有很多要开车去这个城市、那个城市，简直太疯狂了。
And it wasn't all drinking plans, but it was a lot of driving to this city and then driving to that city and just too much craziness.
然后
And then
疫情一来，我就想，天哪。
when COVID hit, I was like, oh my god.
我再也不用去参加这些活动了。
I don't have to go to these things anymore.
天哪，确实。
Dude, yeah.
说实话，我当时还挺高兴的。
It was honestly, I was very happy about it.
我当时就想，天哪。
I was like, oh my god.
我可以一个人待差不多一个月。
I can be alone for like a month.
对。
Yeah.
结果后来拖了好几年。
And then it dragged on for years.
不过说实话，那时候我和家人住在一起。
To be fair, I was living with my family at the time.
所以我觉得那也有帮助。
So I feel like that helps.
其实也不是说完全没有社交。
Like, it it wasn't like I was getting zero social exposure.
我还是每天都能见到人，而且都是家人，就是那种我习惯一起住、经常见的人。
I was still, you know, seeing people day to day, and it was like family, so it's people that I'm used to living with slash seeing a lot.
所以那可能对整体情况有帮助。
So that probably helped overall.
不过我觉得，因为我当时住的是公寓，所以感觉确实挺压抑的。
I think because I was living in an apartment at the time though, it did feel very, like, depressing.
而且我的公寓采光也不好，因为当时租的时候，我们想的是，应该很快就能结束了吧。
Like my apartment also didn't get a ton of sunlight because when we had leased it, we were like, well, it's probably gonna be over soon.
对。
Yeah.
就想着，咱们就在城里住着，享受一下生活，之类的。
You know, let's just live in the city and enjoy and blah blah blah.
但结果并没有很快结束，我们只能一直待在那个狭小的一居室里。我觉得即使到了2021年，疫情的影响还是很大。
But it was not over soon and we just had to stay in that cramped one bedroom for a But long I think since even in 2021, there was still like a big impact from COVID.
我们搬到了独栋房子里，那里有花园，阳光也更充足。
We moved out to our single family home and there was a garden and more sunlight.
所以这带来了很大的不同。
So that made a big difference
对。
Mhmm.
在心理健康方面。
Mental health wise.
但我不确定。
But I don't know.
新冠疫情夺走了很多生命，而且，你知道，我们俩都知道那是一件可怕的事情，影响了很多家庭。
COVID took a lot of lives and, you know, we both obviously know it was like a terrible thing that impacted many families.
但幸运的是我们没事，所以我们才用比较轻松的方式谈论它。
But since luckily we were okay, we are talking about it in a more light hearted way.
但从大局来看，那并不是一件好事。
But grand scheme, it was not a positive thing.
确实是这样。
That is true.
我觉得当时整个世界的氛围都很低落。
I think the overall vibe in the world was like pretty down.
这是很重要的一点。
That was a big thing to it all.
而且我记得，那时候我特别庆幸自己跟家人住在一起，因为如果我是独自一人，而整个世界又那么压抑，发生了那么多事情，就很容易陷入更深的黑暗。也许对我来说，当时没见太多人反而是好事，因为那段时间可以自己反思，不用去搞那些，怎么说来着，作秀式的表态？
And I remember that was like an extra big factor why I was thankful that I was living with my family at the time because then it's like, if I were just alone and, you know, the world is pretty depressed right now and there's a lot of things happening, it's much easier to like fall into even deeper darkness during Maybe that it was like, to me, good that we didn't see a lot of people as well because then it felt like time where you could reflect on your own and not have to like, what's it called again, like virtue signalling?
对。
Yeah.
感觉就像所有人都被关起来，被迫进行自我反思。
It was almost like everyone was locked away and forced into like self reflection.
你懂我的意思吗？
Do you know what I mean?
懂。
Yeah.
不过我记得，因为当时发生的事情太多了。
I do remember though, because there is so much happening.
对吧？
Right?
比如政治紧张局势，还有每天看到死亡人数的统计。
Like, the political tensions and seeing the statistics on the number of people dying every day.
而且我觉得，对于任何有祖父母的人来说，他们要么独居，要么没法见到孙辈和自己的孩子，也缺乏社交互动。
And I think also for anyone who had grandparents who are either living by themselves or maybe just not being able to get visited by like grandkids and their own kids and just have like social interaction.
看着老人因为得不到所需的社交互动而迅速衰老，那也让人很难受。
That was also very hard like watching older people deteriorate quickly because they weren't getting the social interaction that they needed.
在情感上和精神上，那真的让人承受了太多。
It was just a lot emotionally and mentally.
我觉得人们当时情绪更脆弱。
I think people were more emotional.
我记得在某些场合，对话都带着火药味，因为我们每天在新闻上看到的坏事太多了。
I remember feeling like conversations were more charged in certain spaces because we were just reading about so much bad things on the news.
是的。
Yeah.
也许我们没有明说，但空气中就是弥漫着紧张的气氛。
Maybe we weren't explicitly talking about stuff, but there was just a lot of tension in the air.
确实。
For sure.
对，也许这就是为什么很多会议都变得有点尴尬。
Yeah, maybe that's why a lot of meetings were a little awkward.
是啊，兄弟。
Yeah, dude.
我在工作中经历过的最疯狂的会议就是在疫情期间。
The craziest meetings that I've ever experienced during work were during COVID.
对吧？
Right?
就像现在，开线上会议什么的，已经不像疫情期间那么尴尬了。
Like, nowadays, when you have, like, online meetings and stuff, it's not as awkward as it used to be in COVID.
确实。
True.
而且我在疫情期间社交能力直接掉了差不多一半。
I also straight up just lost, like, 50% of my social skills during COVID.
好吧。
Okay.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得我花了很长时间才重新适应和别人一起出去玩。
I think it took me a long time to, like, be okay with hanging out with people again.
我同意。
I agree.
我记得疫情后我们第一次一起出去玩的时候。
I remember one of the first times we all hung out after COVID.
当时还戴着口罩，在别人家的后院，然后我们都在那儿聊天。
And we it was, like, masked and in someone's, like, backyard, and then we were all kind of, like, chatting.
我记得当时感觉自己在强迫身体去走社交的流程，但已经不太记得怎么放松地、享受地去做这件事了。
And I remember feeling like I was forcing my body to go through the motions of socializing, but I didn't really remember how to do it in a relaxed and enjoyable way anymore.
我有点像，我的身体是吉祥物，而我是里面那个试图控制它的人。
I was kind of like, my body was the mascot and then I was like the person inside trying to control it.
其实，我的疫情结束经历可能和你有点不一样，因为我和我们的朋友阿维一起搬到了纽约。
Actually, I did have maybe a bit of a different COVID ending experience than you because I moved to New York with our friend, Avi.
那差不多是疫情的尾声，事情开始谨慎地重新开放。
And that was, like, kind of the tail end of COVID where things were starting to cautiously open back up.
而且我们搬到纽约后，那里可以说是美国最城市化的城市之一。
And since we moved to New York, it's, like, one of the most city cities in The US.
所以我们确实花了很多时间在外面，去各种地方，也让自己多社交。
So we did actually spend a lot of time outside, you know, going to places and socializing ourselves, I guess.
我觉得我错过了湾区的那种转变。
I think I missed that shift in the bay.
那湾区当时感觉怎么样？
So how did it feel in the bay?
我在回想当时在湾区的过渡期是什么感觉，但说实话，疫情期间我特别紧张，以至于我不想出门，我真正担心的是把病传染给詹姆斯的妈妈。
I'm trying to think back to how the transition was when I was in the bay, but honestly, I was pretty paranoid during COVID to where like I didn't wanna go out and my fear actually was getting James's mom sick.
哦，对。
Oh yeah.
因为我们经常去看她。
Because we would go and see her.
所以我尽量保持警惕，不太出门，也不怎么和人接触，但我觉得这正是我的问题所在。
So then I tried to be like pretty vigilant about like not going out too here and like not having interaction, but I feel like that was my downfall.
哦，天哪。
Oh no.
我的社交能力彻底废了。
My social skills were just killed.
我觉得我的自信心受到了很大的打击。
I felt like my self confidence took a big hit.
我当时那些爱好对健康也没什么好处。
The hobbies that I had at the time were not conducive to like being healthy.
我觉得我把很多情绪都发泄在食物上，吃很多零食，也不太锻炼。
Like, I think I took a lot of my emotions out on, food and eating, snacking a lot, and not doing a ton of working out.
所以那段时间对我来说不太好。
So not a very good time for me.
但我在想，如果我在旧金山有更多朋友，也许会有个更固定的隔离小圈子，情况会不会不一样。
But I wonder if it would have been different if I had more friends that lived in SF, maybe like a more of a quarantine, like, pod Mhmm.
而且不用在见家人和见朋友之间来回折腾。
And didn't have to juggle that with, like, seeing my family.
对。
Mhmm.
因为在纽约，你大概不用担心把病传染给父母，因为他们远在美国的另一边。
Because in New York, it's like you probably didn't have to worry about getting your parents sick because they were like all the way across The US.
是的。
Yeah.
但如果我必须在见家人和见朋友之间做权衡和取舍，我可能更倾向于优先考虑家人。
But if I had to balance and like prioritize between seeing like family versus seeing friends, I lean more on the side of like prioritizing family.
我觉得过渡期有点艰难。
I feel like the transition was a little rough.
但后来情况越来越放松，好像生病的人也越来越少了。
But when it got more and more relaxed, it seemed like people were getting less sick.
特别是疫苗出来之后，大家都打了疫苗，情况就开始好转了。
Like definitely when the vaccine and stuff came out and everyone was getting vaccinated, things started to look up from there.
对。
Mhmm.
天哪。
Oh my god.
是的。
Yeah.
有道理。
That makes sense.
而且，你走了之后，大家都搬到旧金山来了。
And also, like, everyone moved to SF after you left.
旧金山。
SF.
天哪，太惨了。
Dude, brutal.
但也许从某种角度来说，这是件好事。
But maybe in a sense, it's like a good thing.
比如说，如果我的朋友都住在旧金山，对我来说可能太疯狂了。
Like, maybe it would have been too crazy for me to have all my friends living in SF.
对。
Yeah.
随时都能出去，比如每天都能约饭，就在手边。
Being able to go out all the time, like do daily dinners, like at my fingertips.
我觉得那对我来说会太多了。
Like, I think that would have been a lot for me.
所以这是天意。
So it's God's calling.
他当时说，留在半岛，但我会把你的朋友都还给你。
He was like, stay in the peninsula, but I'll give you back all your friends.
没关系。
It's okay.
最后一切都挺好的。
It all worked out in the end.
对。
Yeah.
说实话，回顾疫情前的时代，还有疫情对我们具体的影响，让我对2026年现在的状况感到非常感恩。
Honestly, all of this reflecting on the pre COVID era and also how COVID specifically was for us has made me feel very grateful about how things are currently in 2026.
明白。
Mhmm.
我觉得我们已经找回了疫情前很多好的东西。
I think we have gotten back a lot of the good things from the pre COVID era.
比如，经常和朋友聚会，下班后一起吃个晚饭，同时也保留了疫情时期很多好的习惯。
So, like, hanging out a lot with friends, maybe grabbing dinner after work, but also kept a lot of the good things from the COVID era.
所以，保护好自己的个人时间，工作上更灵活一些，总的来说就是生活更平衡。
So protecting your personal time, having more flexibility at work, and overall just having a more balanced life.
谢谢你，Crystal，坐下来和我们一起回味过去五六年的生活点滴。
Thank you, Crystal, for sitting down and enjoying a little bit of nostalgia of our last five, six years of life or so.
各位听众朋友们，如果你们注意到疫情前或疫情期间有什么变化，一定要在Instagram上联系我们，账号是eatyourcrustpod，我们也有邮箱eatyourcrustpod@gmail.com。
For any of our listeners out there, if there are any changes that you notice from the pre COVID era or the COVID era, then definitely hit us up on Instagram at eatyourcrustpod, and we also have email eatyourcrustpodgmail dot com.
别忘了在Apple Podcasts、Spotify或者任何你听播客的地方关注我们。
And don't forget to follow us on Apple Podcasts or Spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts.
我们每隔一周的周三早上更新新一期节目。
We upload new episodes every other Wednesday morning.
感谢收听。
Thanks for listening.
别忘了吃你的面包皮哦。
And don't forget to eatyourcrust.
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