85 - Endo Voices 赞助 Endodontic Practice Partners 的 Terryl Propper 医生：数十年来的领导力启示

欢迎收听《内科学之声》，本节目由美国牙体牙髓病学会倾情呈现。

Welcome to EndoVoices brought to you by the American Association of Endodontists.

在这里，我们与领域内的顶尖专家一起，推动牙体牙髓治疗技术与科学的发展，提升患者护理的最高标准。

The show where we are advancing the art and science of endodontics and promoting the highest standards of patient care with today's top experts in the field.

接下来，有请您的主持人，约翰逊医生。

Now here's your host, Doctor.

马库斯·D。

Marcus D.

约翰逊。

Johnson.

欢迎来到2026年美国牙体牙髓病学会年会。

Welcome to AAE twenty twenty six.

我们此刻身处美丽的盐湖城，今天有幸与我最欣赏的一位嘉宾面对面交流。

We're here in beautiful Salt Lake City, and I'm sitting down with one of my favorite people.

我说的是真心话——如果没有你，我这个播客主持人的位置可能根本不会存在，约翰逊医生。

And I mean that very sincerely because my position here as podcast host would probably not be even around if it was not for you, Dr.

泰瑞尔·普罗珀

Terryl Propper.

能和你坐下来聊聊，真是难得的机会。

And it's just an amazing opportunity to sit down with you.

你在牙髓病学领域的职业生涯非常出色，现在又拓展到诊所运营和DSO这类领域。

You've had a remarkable, just career within Endodontics, now stepping into the space of, practice and, DSO and things of that nature.

非常高兴你能来到这里。

So, it's just a real pleasure to have you here.

感谢你参加我们的播客。

Thank you so much for joining us on the podcast.

马库斯，这完全是我的荣幸。

Marcus, it is completely my pleasure.

我一直看着你在AAE里一步步成长。

I feel like I've seen you rise through the AAE.

我想不到还有谁比你更适合主持《EndoVoices》这个播客了，你把它做得这么成功，我所在的EPP公司也特别自豪能成为赞助方。

I couldn't think of anybody better to be the host of the podcast Endo Voices, and you've made it the success that it is, and EPP, my company, is so proud to sponsor.

医生

Dr.

谢谢你这么说。

Thank you for that.

这真的让我很感动。

You know, it means a lot.

我们只是想打造一个平台，让会员，甚至非会员，都能看到牙医不只是专业过硬、充满热情，更是有血有肉的人。

We just wanted to create a platform where we can engage our membership and even those beyond the membership, in a different space and allow them to see that in the dentist, yes, we are very passionate and we're knowledgeable, but we are humans.

我们每天做的事，背后有太多细节和动态，但更重要的是，我们想聊聊人性、领导力和成长。

And there's so many aspects and just dynamics of what we do on a day to day basis, but case in point, we also want to talk about the humanity, the leadership, the growth.

所以，和你聊这个话题再合适不过了。

And that's why it makes sense to have this conversation with you.

我们可以从2016年你担任AAE主席说起，聊聊那段经历，然后顺着他往下聊。

We can go back to 2016 when you were AAE president and kinda just talk about that experience, and then from there, just fill in the gaps.

能当上AAE主席，是我人生中最闪亮的时刻之一。

Well, getting to be AAE president was one of the highlights of my life.

那一年特别艰难。

It was a difficult year.

当时没有执行总监，但AAE的全体员工都挺身而出。

We were without an executive director, and the AAE staff rose to the occasion.

而且我们那年取得了非常出色的成果。

Always And we had a terrific year.

做领导不是看你准备好了没有，而是看你愿不愿意担起这个责任。

You know, being in leadership is not about being ready to lead, it's about being willing to lead.

我一直都愿意承担，每次当领导我都学到了东西，这样的经历我可不少。

And so I've always been willing, I've always learned from every leadership experience I've had, and I've had a lot of them.

我人生中最艰难的一段经历，就是疫情期间领导田纳西牙科协会。

The worst experience of my life was leading the Tennessee Dental Association during COVID.

那会儿简直是盲人带盲人。

It was like the blind leading the blind.

我们根本不知道前路在哪儿。

We didn't know where we were going.

当你身为领导者，却不知道方向在哪，没有愿景，只能在黑暗中前行，这真的非常艰难。

When you're a leader and you don't know where you're going and you have no vision and you're leading in the dark, it's really challenging.

博士。

Dr.

听起来你把这份重担担得相当出色。

Does sound like that's a burden that you carry very well.

你一直保持沉着冷静，而作为根管治疗师的经历，可能也为你打下了一些基础——毕竟我们常开玩笑说，根管治疗也是在黑暗中操作，对吧？

You've maintained your poise, but being prepared, being an endodontist probably help prepare you just a little bit because sometimes we say that we do endodontics in the dark, right?

我们真正能看到的，只有影像上的那点东西，然后从那里判断自己是否成功。

All we can really see is that what we're doing on the imaging, and from there, we understand if we have success or not.

但很多时候，我们只能靠经验、靠文献，靠前人的积累，来摸索前进的方向。

But lots of times, we're just leading by fill, leading by the literature, and understanding what has come before us to help us know where we're going.

作为领导者，你之前所经历的一切，都会塑造你成为怎样的人，而我有幸遇到过很多榜样。

Well, what comes before you as a leader helps to shape who you are as a leader, and I had so many role models.

我在AAE的第一次领导经历，是加入了专业与公共事务委员会。

My very first leadership experience in the AAE was I was a member of the professional in public and professional affairs committee.

我身边那些领导者都为我指明了方向。

And, I mean, I had leaders who showed me the way.

诺亚·希维安、吉姆·古特曼、唐·艾伦、肯·纳梅罗、奇普·西蒙、马丁·莱文。

Noah Shivian, Jim Gutman, Don Aaron, Ken Namero, Chip Simone, Marty Levin.

我一辈子都在观察他们的一举一动。

I watched them my whole life.

我一直在看那些走在前面的人，也得到了很多女性导师的指导。

I've watched the people who came ahead of me, and I've had a lot of female mentors.

马库斯，我们必须承认，已经走了很远，但AAE里还需要更多女性担任领导角色，也需要让更多人参与进来。

And I have to say, Marcus, we've come a long way, but we need more women in leadership at the AAE, and we need to get more people involved.

我觉得年轻人不太敢参与，是因为觉得自己经验不够。

And I think young people are hesitant to get involved because they don't have the experience.

但要想成为领导者，你得主动为自己创造领导的机会。

But in order to be a leader, you have to position yourself to lead.

你说得对，这话真的很有深度。

I think you said that, and it's so profound.

我们或许该稍微回溯一下，了解一下你是如何走上领导之路的。

And we should probably just backtrack a little bit to understand your journey into leadership.

我记得你当了至少四年全科牙医，之后才开始参与纳什维尔牙科学会，再后来逐步进入田纳西牙科协会。

So I believe you practiced at least four years as a general dentist, and then became involved, maybe the, Nashville Dental Society, and then from there progressed into the Tennessee Dental Association.

能不能简单聊聊这段经历，还有那些引导过你的导师？正是他们让你成为今天这样富有远见的领导者。

So maybe just kind of talk about that and those mentors that guided you in a sense so that you're the profound leader that sits before us today.

我从高中开始就一直在领导岗位上，一直到大学、牙科学校，再到根管治疗专科学校。

Well, I've been in leadership positions my whole life, from high school to college to dental school to endo school.

所以当我当上AAE主席的时候，这对我来说是水到渠成的事。

And so when I got to be president of the AAE, it was a natural for me.

但我真正投身领导工作的核心原因，是我喜欢变化。

But the main reason that I lead is I like change.

我不喜欢一成不变。

I don't like status quo.

我热爱变化。

I love change.

不是每个人都同意我的观点，但我就是喜欢变化。

Not everybody agrees with me, but I love change.

如果你不改变，就会变得僵化。

And I think it you're stale when you don't change.

我喜欢处于一个能让人愿意追随的位置。

And I like being in a position to have people follow.

但我明白，真正的领导力并不发生在会议室里。

But what I've learned is that leadership doesn't take place in the boardroom.

对。

Mhmm.

领导力发生在会议室之外，在那里你建立关系，了解同事，并在会议之外赢得追随者。

It takes place outside the boardroom where you develop relationships and you get to know your colleagues and you gain followership outside the boardroom.

我经历的每一次经历都让我成长，我总是观察、倾听，并向那些比我早走一步的人学习。

So every experience I've had has let me grow, and I always observe, listen, and learn from the people ahead of me who have done it before.

我并不是每次都成功。

I haven't always succeeded.

对。

Mhmm.

失败和成功一样，能让你学到很多。

Failure teaches you a lot as much as success.

就像一次失败的根管治疗，会让你知道下次该避免什么。

Just like a failed root canal teaches you what not to do the next time.

确实如此。

That's so true.

我当了四年全科牙医。

So I was a general dentist for four years.

我知道这不适合我。

I knew it wasn't for me.

我申请了美国牙科协会的希伦布兰德奖学金，进了最终候选名单，但没拿到。

I applied for the Hillenbrand Fellowship at the American Dental Association and I was a finalist, but I didn't get the fellowship.

天啊。

Oh, wow.

但我还是得到了一份在哪个机构的工作

But I did get a job at the Which you

一份工作，没错。

a job, that's right.

是通过面试流程获得的。

Through the interview process.

于是我成了美国牙科协会的市场助理主任，这段经历让我学到了很多关于管理、诊所运营和市场营销的知识，后来我还长期担任协会演讲团成员和成功团队的一员。

So I was the assistant director of marketing for the ADA, and that taught me so much about management, practice management, and marketing, which I spoke for the ADA on their speakers bureau and as part of their success team for many, many years.

这些经历一路下来，都为我后来的成就打下了基础——也许我特别自豪的一件事，就是成为田纳西牙科协会一百五十年来首位女性主席。

So all these experiences along the way prepared me for the, maybe another thing I'm really proud of is being the first female president of the Tennessee Dental Association in one hundred and fifty years.

这真了不起。

That is impressive.

确实如此。

Yeah.

而且实至名归。

And well deserved.

而且我觉得，这特别打动人心，真正说明了一件事：你从来都不会真正输掉。

And, you know, I think that it's just so poignant and it really indicates that you never really lose.

对吧？

Right?

不是赢，就是学到东西。

You either win or you learn.

你当年申请希尔伦布兰德职位的时候，虽然符合条件，但没成功，可你还是找到了属于自己的成功之路。

And so when you went up for the Hillenbrand and you're a qualified applicant, but weren't successful in that endeavor, nonetheless, you still found space to find success.

这恰恰体现了你的韧劲，和你不断寻找机会的本事。我觉得很多年轻人，尤其是年轻的牙医，可能会因为看不到通往领导岗位的明确路径而感到沮丧。

And so I think that just speaks to your tenacity and your ability to keep pushing beyond and looking for opportunities, and I feel that many times individuals, or should say the younger dentists, they may be a little discouraged because they may not see a direct pathway into leadership.

但我要说，像你这样的人特别难得，你让我直接叫你名字，主动给我们机会，让我们按自己的节奏成长，同时又能亲眼看到领导力是怎么培养出来的。

But I tell you it was very nice to have individuals like yourself who invited me to call you on a first name basis and really allowed us to step into leadership and grow at our own pace, but still see how it was done.

你看，马库斯，新患者推荐就像诊所的血液，年轻领袖则是美国牙体牙髓协会未来的血液。我们的董事会和理事必须在各自地区发掘年轻人才，把他们引入AAE。

Look, Marcus, just like new referrals are the bloodline to your practice, young leaders are the bloodline to the future of the AAE, and our directors on the board of trustee on the board of directors need to identify young leaders in their districts and feed them into the AAE.

所以我当主席的时候，重新启动了领导力发展会议，你就是第一届的成员，对吧？

So when I was president, we brought back the leadership development conference, which you were a member of the first class, weren't you?

我玩得特别开心。

I had a lot of fun.

没错。

Yes.

那是2016年、2017年的事了。

That was, yeah, 2016, 2017.

对。

Yes.

那段经历为你现在的位置打下了基础。

And that set you up for where you are now.

你后来进了董事会。

Been on the board of directors

是啊。

Yeah.

现在还主持这个播客。

Hosting this podcast.

但发现年轻领袖对咱们行业的未来至关重要。

But identifying young leaders is very important to the future of our profession.

我同意。

I agree.

我甚至还想再进一步说。

And I would even take it a step further.

领导力很重要，但我们也需要这些人回来传授经验。

Leadership matters, but also we need those to come back and and educate.

你说得对。

You're right.

你说得对。

You're right.

我觉得，有时候我们牙体牙髓科医生可能会觉得自己还没准备好去教导下一代，怕说‘我的临床水平其实没想象中那么好’，或者被学生问的问题逼得不得不去深入研究。但归根结底，这都是一个共同体，不该有评判。

And I think that's where sometimes we as endodontists may feel that maybe we're not ready or at that level to teach the next generation for fear of like saying, I'm not as sound clinically as I thought I was, or these questions that they're asking me are now kind of pushing me to go and research a little bit deeper, but it's all just a community, and there should be no judgment.

所以，我完全赞同你的看法——要重视领导力，主动回身发掘人才，也希望我们

So I I agree wholeheartedly with you about leadership, reaching back, finding that talent, and hopefully we

并且推动它向前发展。

can And pushing it forward.

额外的压力。

Extra stress.

是的。

Yeah.

另一点是，你要抓住你所获得的机会。

The other thing is you have to take advantage of the opportunities you've given.

就像你说的，我没拿到希伦布兰德奖学金——那是为期一年的牙科管理项目，但我看到了另一个方向的机会，我这一生一直都是这样做的。

Like you said, I didn't get the Hillenbrand Fellowship, which is a year long dental administration fellowship, But I saw an opportunity to go in a different direction, and that's happened my whole life.

所以你必须坚持不懈，抓住出现的每一个机会。

So you have to be tenacious and take advantage of opportunities that are presented.

确实如此。

Indeed.

不过我不想太强调性别，但我现在特别喜欢这件粉色西装外套。

Now, not to be too gender specific, but I'm loving the pink blazer right now.

太棒了。

It's amazing.

那些没能到场的朋友，像往常一样，你们打扮得得体又时尚，看起来特别出色。

For those of you who can't be present, see, as always, you're very well put together, stylish, but you look amazing.

我想再深入聊聊你作为女性领导者的真实经历，以及你是如何发现并吸引其他女性加入这个行列的。

But I do wanna kinda dig a little bit deeper into your experience as a woman in leadership and also looking for other women to inspire and to kinda bring into the fold as well.

回过头看，那些曾经让你感到疲惫甚至望而生畏的挑战，最终都是可以克服的，当时都有哪些呢？

And what were some of the challenges that were surmountable in the long run, but at the the time they may have seemed a little bit fatiguing and just daunting?

说实话，AAE高层里女性本来就不多。

Well, know, there are not that many women that are involved at the AAE at the leadership levels.

但现有的女性都非常投入、能力强、才华出众。

But the women that are are very committed, and they're very able, and they're very talented.

所以我一直说，我不想被人称为‘女性领导者’。

So I've always said that I don't wanna be known as a woman female leader.

我希望别人记住的是，我是一个值得信赖的领导者，而信任是靠一点一滴建立起来的。

I wanna be known as a trusted leader, and you have to build the trust.

我父亲以前总跟我说，马库斯，现场的朋友们听了肯定要笑，因为这话他讲过太多遍了。

My father always told me something, Marcus, and the people in the audience that are observing are gonna laugh because they've heard this so much.

我父亲一直告诉我，你得先当出纳，才能当银行行长。

My father always said to me, you have to be the bank teller before you're the bank president.

我那时候真不懂这话的意思，直到我开始参与美国牙体牙髓病学会的工作。

And I didn't really understand what that meant until I became involved with the AAE.

在主持了十五个委员会、参与了那么多项目之后，我才明白，得先了解协会的运作，才能站上顶端，真正管好它。

And after chairing 15 committees and being on so many, you have to learn the workings of the association before you can rise to the top and know how to run it.

但我觉得，说实话，

But I think that there are, you know, come on.

现在有一半的根管治疗住院医师是女性。

50% of the endodontic residencies are women.

一半的牙科学校学生是女性，我们的领导层也该反映这个比例。

50% of the dental schools are women, and we need to reflect that leadership in our association.

我们正在一步步实现。

And we're getting there.

是的，我们

Yes, We

我们有一些非常出色的领导者，也有不少女性正在崭露头角，我希望自己能像桑迪·麦迪逊、琳达·莱文和克拉拉·斯帕达福雷激励我那样，激励到她们

have some very strong leaders, and we have some females that are coming up the pike, and I hope that I have inspired them as Sandy Madison and Linda Levin, and Clara Spadafore inspired And

我们刚刚结束了由弗拉克博士担任的精彩任期

we just finished amazing presidency under Doctor.

现在则期待着卡茨博士接任主席职位

Flake and looking forward to, you know, obviously presidency now with Doctor.

其实我刚加入的时候，PPRC的主席是德罗齐耶，后来是卡茨，再后来又回到德罗齐耶，因为卡茨后来进了董事会

Katz, who was actually the chair of the PPRC when I was coming in into the, actually it was the Deroziers and it was Katz and then it was the Deroziers because Katz went on to the board.

但不管怎样，这个群体里的每个人都非常支持彼此，真的让人感动

But anyhow, just that it's amazing community of individuals who are very supportive.

我们得好好感谢AAE的工作人员，他们真的让我们的表现看起来这么出色

We always have to give a lot of credit to the AAE staff because they really make us look as good as we do.

或者说是他们实际在背后撑起了这一切

Or they do.

比我们自己想的还要好。

As good as we think we do.

但幕后那些由肯·瓦德尔卡等人领导的运作，真的非常了不起。

But the inner workings behind the scenes under the leadership of Ken Wadelka and and so on and so forth, it's it's quite impressive.

看到这些真是令人惊叹。

It's amazing to see it.

我记得肯申请担任协会执行总监的时候。

I remember when Ken interviewed to be executive director of this association.

那一年我当主席，协会当时没有执行总监。

And the year I was president, we were without an executive director.

所以特里娜·安德烈森·科

So Trina Andreessen Coe

特里娜真棒。

Love Trina.

还有凯瑟琳·罗斯

And Catherine Rouse

Catherine我也特别欣赏。

Love Catherine.

她们俩是我最得力的帮手。

Were my right hand people.

我们和AAE的全体同事紧密合作，度过了非常成功的一年，最终在琳达·莱文的领导下，任命肯·韦德卡为执行总监。

And we we joined arms with the rest of the AAE staff to have a very successful year and placed, Ken Wedelka as executive director, I believe, under Linda Levin's, administration.

他表现得非常出色。

And he has been stellar.

我还想特别提一下，说到领导力发展项目，我觉得应该是‘高级领导力协会’。

And one thing I do wanna credit, you know, just the staff with is when we talk about that leadership development program, I think it's the, Association for Advanced Leadership.

他们做得特别棒，总能帮我们聚焦成长，直击痛点，同时让我们明白，没有压力，就达不到钻石级的水准。

They do a phenomenal job coming in and really getting us to focus on growth and hitting those pain points, but understanding that, you know, without pressure you can't rise to that diamond level.

我觉得AAE在培养年轻领袖方面做得很好，不过像今天这样的对话，或许也能吸引更多人参与进来，受到鼓舞。

And I think the AAE has done a great job of fostering those young leaders, but again, having a conversation like this, maybe we'll invite some more people to come out and and feel inspired.

在领导力发展方面，各地区负责人其实可以发挥很大作用，比如推荐本地区的人选。

Well, in the leadership development, the directors can do a lot by nominating people from their district.

研究生项目负责人可以通过推荐他们认为有潜力的学生，发挥很大作用。

The grad program directors can do a lot by nominating grad students that they think will be successful.

对。

Mhmm.

但我想提醒观众的是，当领导意味着肩负重任，你必须为发生的好事和坏事都承担责任，因为并不是所有事情都是积极的。

But I think one thing that I wanna leave the viewers with is that being a leader has a lot of responsibility, and you have to be accountable for the good things and the bad things that happen because not everything is positive.

那些追随你、仰赖你领导的人，必须信任你，相信你的愿景是为了协会的整体利益，而不是为了你自己。

And I think that the people that follow you, that look to you for leadership have to trust you and have to have confidence that your vision is for the good of the association and not the good of yourself.

很多领导者追求职位带来的特权和聚光灯，但这些领导者永远无法像无私的领导者那样取得真正的成功。

Because there are a lot of leaders who take leadership positions for the perks and for the spotlight, but those leaders are never as successful as the selfless leaders.

我完全同意你的看法。

I would agree with you wholeheartedly.

你对自身领导风格的把握非常到位。

I think you have a great pulse on your leadership style.

你还能在变化和挑战出现时灵活应对，我觉得你更偏向于服务型领导。

I think that you have been able to also incorporate the ability to be nimble when changes or challenges may arise, But I would classify you more along the space of a servant leadership.

我觉得你总是先支持身边的人，然后再带头行动。

You know, I think that you invest in those around you, and then you go ahead and take the lead.

但我见过你明确说：‘现在得戴上领导的帽子，强硬一点，才能把目标达成。’

But I have seen you be able to say, hey, I gotta put my strong leadership hat hat on and be a little bit more coercive to get the goal.

但作为领导者，共识很重要。

But consensus is something that as a leader

你是那种注重共识的领导者。

consensus leader.

但我得说点实在的。

But let me tell you something.

我向来直言不讳。

I'm not afraid to call it like it is.

没错。

That's right.

而且我做事很果断。

And I'm fierce.

我不怕冲突，我根本无所畏惧。

I'm not afraid of conflict, and I'm not I'm I'm fearless.

我有几个下属正在听这个播客，他们会告诉你，真正激励我的是帮助他们成长，变得更好，发挥出最大的潜力。

And I have a couple of my staff members are here observing this podcast, and they will tell you that what gives me fuel is empowering them to get better, to be better, to do the very best that they can do.

他们总拿我开玩笑，说我总是用言语和声音施加压力。

And they always make fun of me because I'm demanding in kind of a verbal, vocal way.

所以他们知道，我对他们有要求，而且要求很高，但只要他们告诉我‘我觉得这条路不太对’，我也会认真听。

And so they know that I demand a certain level of I have expectations, high expectations, but I am not afraid to listen to them when they tell me I don't think we should go in that direction.

如果你能讲出充分的理由，我非常愿意调整方向。

So I'm very amenable to change if you make a good case for it.

没错。

Yes.

你确实看透我了。

But you're absolutely right about me.

你把我看得一清二楚。

You have got me nailed.

我是个注重共识的领导者。

I'm a consensus leader.

我想听听每个人的看法。

I wanna hear everybody's opinion.

每个人的意见都有价值。

There's nobody's opinion that's not valuable.

真正激励我的，是让身边的人得到成长，受到鼓舞，并激发出他们最大的潜力。

But what fuels me is empowering people, inspiring people, and and trying to get the best out of the people that work with me.

我觉得你的履历已经清楚地说明了这一点。

And I think your resume clearly shows that.

不过，我们也想聊聊更柔和的一面——不是说领导力不温柔，而是我们知道你是一位杰出的临床医生，这方面我们可以多说说。其实我读到你的一些临床经历时，发现患者们常常因为你的厨艺和烹饪特长而对你产生共鸣。

But, you know, we also wanna touch on, the softer sides and not say that leadership is not soft, but we know that you have been a phenomenal clinician and we can talk about that, but I think what was really interesting is when I was just kind of reading a few points about your clinical experiences that the patients often would resonate with you along the lines of cooking and your culinary skills.

所以，谈谈你怎么把个人特质融入临床工作，让患者感到放松，同时也为其他医生和社区人士建立起联系吧。

So talk about how you can, how someone can incorporate their personality into the clinical setting to really put their patients at ease, but also that's a connector for referring doctors and just other people in the community.

你说到一个非常关键的营销要点了。

You've hit on a really important marketing point.

你在曼哈顿行医，那可是竞争最激烈的地方之一。

So you practice in Manhattan, one of the most competitive geographies.

你所在的楼里可能就有二十位根管治疗医生。

You probably have 20 endodontists in your building.

差不多吧。

I pretty much.

我们很快就要再加一位了。

You know, it's we're adding a new one soon.

所以。

So

在我多年为美国牙科协会讲授营销和管理的历程中，我一直强调，你得认清自己的优势，并且充分发挥它们。

So in all my years all my my years of lecturing for the ADA on marketing and management, I've always said you have to identify your strengths and play to them.

同时，你也得清楚自己的短板。

You also have to know what your weaknesses are.

我曾经在一个有八位根管治疗医生、三个分诊点的诊所工作过。

So I was in a practice with eight endodontists, three locations.

于是我决定，我的专长就是做完根管治疗后，再给患者一个食谱。

And I decided that my niche was going to be that I do a root canal and a recipe.

明白了。

Okay.

所以我的病人总是……

So my patients would always

向我讨要。

ask me.

他们做完根管治疗离开时，总会问我讨食谱。

They always ask me for a recipe when they left after they had the root canal.

所以我一直跟人说，你得搞清楚自己的独特优势。

So I always tell people, you have to identify what's your niche.

你打算怎么跟楼里其他十个根管医生区分开来？

How are you gonna differentiate yourself from the other 10 endodontists in your building?

我和我的病人关系一直很好。

And I had a great relationship with my patients.

事实上，有时候我觉得这手术挺枯燥的，所以我就想办法让自己和患者在做手术时打发时间，这样时间就过得快多了。

In fact, sometimes I found the procedure to be boring, and so I kind of entertained myself and my patients during the procedure, which made the time pass.

患者们总是给我特别好的评价，因为他们的根管治疗不仅有趣，还帮他们摆脱了疼痛。

And patients always gave me such good reviews because their root canal was not only fun, but it also got them out of pain.

帮他们摆脱了疼痛。

Got them out of pain.

这太棒了。

Well, love that.

只要你能把热情——哪怕是两种热情——结合起来，让患者离开时带着一段想跟人炫耀的经历，我觉得这才是我们该专注的方向。

Anytime you can combine passion, well, two passions, and then have the patients leaving with an experience that they want to boast about, I think that's what we have to focus on.

我们已经看到了太多技术进步。

We've seen so many technological advances.

看看我们身处的这个漂亮环境，到处都是技术，临床应用的突破，应用科学的发展，但千万别忘了患者。

We look around this beautiful space that we're in and we see all the technology, the advances in the clinical applications, the applied sciences, but we can't forget the patient.

那我们该怎么拥抱这些技术、人工智能，还有那么多降低根管治疗门槛的工具，同时依然把患者放在核心位置呢？

So how do we still embrace all of this technology, the AI and so many various aspects that really reduce that entry level into us being able to do good endodontics, but keep the patient at the center.

我们治的可不是一颗牙，对吧？

Well, we're not treating a tooth, right?

我们治的是病人。

We're treating a patient.

如果你想让病人反复推荐你，那是因为他们的全科医生信任你、合作过、了解你，知道病人在你这儿一定能有好结果。

And if you want repeat referrals, you know, the patient is sent to you because their general dentist trusts you, has worked with you, knows you, and knows the patient's going to get a good outcome.

但我认为现在的软技能有点欠缺，因为没人教。

But I think the soft skills are somewhat lacking now because they're not taught.

你学的是技术。

You're taught the technical.

没人教你怎么沟通。

You're not taught how to communicate.

没人教你该怎么跟病人说话。

You're not taught how to talk to a patient.

也没人教你怎样让病人下次需要根管治疗时，第一个就想找你。

You're not taught how to get that patient to ask for you when they need another root canal.

所以这正是我的强项，每次做完根管治疗，我都会问病人，史密斯太太，这次治疗比您预期的好还是差？

And so that was a forte I had because when I was finished with the root canal, I always said to the patient, Mrs.

史密斯太太，这次治疗比您预期的好还是差？

Smith, was that better than you expected or worse than you expected?

不害怕，而且

Not afraid And

他们总是怎么说的？

of what did being they always said?

结果都比预期的好。

It was better than expected.

他们总是说，效果远超预期。

They always say it's much better than expected.

每次都比预期好。

It's always better.

然后我会问，您回去见牙医的时候，会跟他说吗？

And then I said, well, when you go back to your dentist, will you tell them that?

这为我建立了一种口碑传播的文化。

And what that did was it built a culture of referrals for me.

所以我有这么多回头客，因为他们对我感觉特别温暖、放心。

So I had so many repeat patients because they felt warm and fuzzy for me.

是的。

Yeah.

我觉得这正好可以让我们转到谈谈EPP相关的商业层面。

And I think that's a nice transition for us to maybe talk about the more business aspect with EPP.

我知道你们通过文化、导师制，还有真正可持续的增长，打造了一个强大的品牌，甚至可以说，是如何实现规模化的问题。

I know you guys have built a strong brand based on culture, mentorship, and really sustainable growth, if we can even say that, to how to scale.

归根结底，我们确实充满热情，想好好治疗患者，也都喜欢帮助别人，但同时我们也想过上好的生活，能养家糊口。

I think that at the end of the day, yes, we're passionate, we want to treat patients, we all love helping individuals, we also want to have a lifestyle, we want to be able to provide for our families.

经济因素很重要，生意本身也很关键。

The economics does matter, the business is important.

所以，也许我们可以稍微聊聊，是什么让你对EPP领域或者DSO领域产生了兴趣，还有Dr.

So maybe we can, you know, just kind of delve a little bit into what spawns your interest into, you know, the EPP space or DSO space and Dr.

再进一步来说

Taking it to the next

这真的很有趣。

It's very interesting.

顺便恭喜你。

And congratulations, by the way.

谢谢。

Thank you.

你是创始管理合伙人，对吧？

You're the founding managing partner, correct?

没错。

Right.

医生

Dr.

这很有意思，我在纳什维尔的一家合伙诊所里做了三十年根管治疗，2019年才退休。

It's very interesting because I practiced endodontics for thirty years in Nashville in a group practice, and I retired in 2019.

我和其他几位合伙人共同创立了根管治疗实践合伙公司。

And I co founded Endodontic Practice Partners with a couple of other co founders.

最有趣的是，我两边都体验过——既是医生，也是经营者。

And what's been really interesting is to be on both sides of the chair.

是的。

Mhmm.

我做了三十年的私人诊所，从零开始建设，后来又转向了商业运营。

So I've experienced private practice, building a practice, for thirty years, and then going into the business aspect.

在经营诊所期间，我一直兼任管理合伙人，早就接触过业务方面的事。

So when I was, part of my practice, I was the managing partner, I always had the business side.

现在的根管治疗医生往往不了解这一点。

This is something that endodontists today don't get.

他们知道怎么做根管治疗。

They know how to do a root canal.

但他们不懂怎么经营一家企业。

They don't know how to run a business.

医生。

Dr.

确实如此。

Very true.

这正是我擅长的领域。

And it's where I excelled.

是我的强项之一。

Was one of my strengths.

所以创办牙髓病实践合伙企业对我来说水到渠成。

And so founding Endodontic Practice Partners was a natural for me.

我一直对牙科管理很感兴趣。

You know, I was interested in dental administration.

我骨子里就是个管理者。

I'm an administrator by heart.

我热爱商业。

I love business.

我喜欢做预算。

I love budgets.

我喜欢管理团队。

I love managing people.

所以成立EPP对我来说水到渠成，我们的发展节奏一直很稳、很扎实。

And so EPP was a natural for me, and, we have slow and measured growth.

但我最自豪的，还是公司的文化。

But what I'm most proud of is the culture of the company.

公司的文化始终围绕着我们的医生们。

The culture of the company is still about our doctors.

我们公司有一位我特别欣赏的成员，今天就坐在这里旁观，她是我多年的好友。

One of my very favorite members of our company is sitting here observing today, who who is one of my dear friends.

我想她会告诉你，EPP非常平易近人。

And I think what she'll tell you is that EPP is very approachable.

我们还足够小，能给每个人提供细致入微的关怀。

We're still small enough to give very personal attention.

我们虽然增长缓慢，但能在牙科支持服务这一领域工作，真的很有意思。

We're growing with measured growth, but it's been very interesting to be on the specialty support side of dentistry.

马库斯，我经常被人问到这个问题。

I get the question a lot, Marcus.

你以前是美国牙体牙髓病学会的主席。

You were president of the AAE.

那你怎么会去为一家DPO工作，还参与创办了DPO？

Now how can you go work for a DSO cofound DSO?

其实这很简单。

Well, it was easy.

你知道为什么吗？

You know why?

因为我喜欢变化，不喜欢一成不变。

Because I like change, and I don't like status quo.

对。

Yeah.

而且诊所的运营模式正在变化。

And the practice models are changing.

你是打算继续沿用八九十年代的做法，还是跟着趋势走？

So you're gonna stay how we practiced in the eighties and nineties, or you're gonna move with the flow?

就像衣服的潮流一样，总有个来回摆动的过程。

Because everything just like clothing, it there's a pendulum.

它会回摆，但私人执业者始终有他们的位置。

It'll swing back, and there's always a place for private practitioners.

大约有23%的根管治疗师加入了某种组织或联盟。

About 23% of endodontists are members of some kind of affiliation.

这个数字在增长，但仍有33%的根管治疗师选择自己开诊所。

So the number's growing, but there's still 33% of endodontists who go open a private practice.

哪些人不加入？

Who do not?

哪些人加入了？

Who do.

是那些人。

Oh, who do.

对。

Yes.

没错。

Yeah.

说到各种执业模式，我一直以来都特别倾向于开独立诊所，再请几位助理来帮忙。

You know, when we do talk about the various practice models, you know, was very keen on having just a solo practice and maybe having associates to help support that.

我确实看到了一些变化。

And I have seen a shift.

不过纽约的情况很不一样。

New York is a different animal though, you know.

总的来说，我们这里还是有很多诊所保持独立运营。

By and large, we still have a lot of practices that operate autonomously.

但我们也看到，DSO正在改变这个格局。

But we are seeing that the DSO is changing that landscape.

我觉得一些担忧集中在私募股权这一块，不过我们或许可以聊聊这个。

I think some of the concerns are around the private equity component, but maybe we can discuss that.

在管理层对这个模式很熟悉的地方，这种做法可能更容易被接受；但对于一线临床医生来说，怎么在引入私募股权的同时，依然把患者放在首位，这确实有点让人困惑。

It's it's probably more welcomed in a space where it's well understood from the management side, but someone who's a practicing clinician, it it can be a little bit confusing as to how you're able to still bring in the private equity, but still position the patients as the priority.

话说回来。

Well, look.

加入DSO并不适合每个人。

Being a member of a DSO is not for everybody.

你得有正确的心态。

You've gotta be in the right frame of mind.

你得处在职业生涯的合适阶段，而且得有

You've gotta be in the right part of your career, and you've got

这一点很关键。

That's key.

这一点很关键。

That's key.

但有趣的是，我们大多数合作伙伴都是48岁。

But very interesting is that the majority of our affiliates are 48 years old.

这正是我们的平均年龄。

That's our average age.

你可能会觉得自己也快到这个年纪了。

You would expect you might be approaching that.

我就是。

I am.

我就是这个年龄。

I'm that.

但愿镜头别拍得太清楚，让我显得真快到这岁数了。

Now let's hope that the camera doesn't make sure that I'm approaching it.

但我确实就是。

But but But I am.

你

You

你知道吗，支持型组织的出现是因为学生债务太高了。

know, Support organizations came about because of high student debt.

没错。

Sure.

因为根管治疗师并没有接受过如何当老板或首席执行官的培训。

Because endodontists aren't trained to be business owners and CEOs.

但你想想，你是个根管治疗师，同时也是临床医生。

But when you look at it, you're an endodontist, You're a clinical practitioner.

你也是个首席执行官。

You're a CEO.

你还是个心理学家。

You're a psychologist.

你还是个人力资源专家。

You're an HR expert.

你身兼多重身份。

You're all of those things.

DSO的职责就是帮你分担管理事务，让你能专心搞临床工作。

And what a DSO is supposed to do is relieve you of the management chores so you can focus on the clinical.

但有些人就是喜欢管事，享受经营诊所的那些环节。

But some people enjoy the management of the practice and the business aspects of the practice.

所以我觉得DSO，特别是EPP，一直在根据会员的反馈调整——他们想要什么、喜欢什么、不喜欢什么，我们都在跟着变，好满足他们的需求，让他们更满意。

So I think the DSOs, especially EPP, is evolving as our members give us feedback, what they're looking for, what they like, what they don't like, and we're evolving with them to give them what they need to be happy.

因为满意的合作伙伴才会介绍朋友来加入。

Because happy affiliates refer their friends.

是的。

Yes.

对吧？

Right?

没错。

They do.

确实如此。

They do.