玛格丽塔·古齐·文森蒂：从米兰成长到代表美国队参加奥运会的历程

你好，欢迎收听《率先达到15分》，这是美国击剑协会的官方播客。

Hello, and welcome to First to 15, the official podcast of USA Fencing.

我是您的主持人布莱恩·温德尔。

I'm your host, Brian Windell.

在本节目中，您将听到我们所热爱的这项运动中一些最具启发性、最有趣且才华横溢的人士的分享。

And in this show, you're going to hear from some of the most inspiring, interesting, and insanely talented people in this sport we all love.

《率先达到15分》面向整个击剑社群，也适合那些刚刚接触击剑、想了解这项运动的人。

First of 15 is for anyone in the fencing community and even for those just checking out fencing to see what it's all about.

无论您是奥运选手或残奥选手、新手、资深运动员、击剑家长、粉丝，还是这个精彩社群中的任何人，这个播客都为您而设。

So whether you're an Olympian or Paralympian, a newcomer, a seasoned veteran, a fencing parent, a fan, or anyone else in this wonderful community, this podcast is for you.

好了，让我们进入今天的节目。

With that, let's get to today's episode.

祝您收听愉快。

Enjoy.

好的。

Alright.

今天的嘉宾是玛格丽塔·古齐·温辛特，她是一位世界杯金牌得主、圣母大学的教练，如今已获得2024年巴黎奥运会的参赛资格。

Today's guest is Margarita Guzzi Vincinte, a World Cup gold medalist, a coach at Notre Dame, and now an Olympic qualifier for Paris twenty twenty four.

玛格丽塔在每一场对决中都真正体现了击剑的精神。

Margarita really embodies the spirit of fencing in every single bout.

因此，我们非常期待与她聊聊她的成长历程、一路遇到的挑战，以及她正在变为现实的梦想。

So we're excited to chat about her journey, any challenges she's faced along the way, and the dreams she's turning into a reality.

欢迎你，玛格丽塔。

So welcome, Margarita.

非常感谢你们邀请我来这里。

Thank you so much for having me here.

我真是太兴奋了。

I'm so, so excited.

是的，这太棒了。

Yeah, this is great.

我们现在正在四月全国锦标赛现场，所以能亲自与你交谈真是太好了，而我们通常在这些节目中做不到这一点。

We're here at the April NAC, so it's great to talk with you in person, which we can't always do on these.

我对你的成长故事非常着迷。

I'm fascinated by your origin story.

你出生在米兰，还曾代表意大利参加国际比赛，对吧？

You were born in Milan and you even represented Italy at the international level, right?

在搬到美国，为宾州州立大学击剑并最终成为美国公民之前。

Before moving to The United States, to fence for Penn State and eventually becoming an American citizen.

那么，你能告诉我们你是如何开始接触击剑的吗？

So, can you tell us how you first got started in fencing?

因为你的击剑起步并不是像我们许多选手那样在美国的俱乐部开始的。

Because it wasn't at a club in The US like a lot of our fencers.

而是在米兰。

Was in Milan.

当然。

Absolutely.

让我来讲讲我的故事。

So, here's my story.

小时候，我尝试过很多不同的运动，非常活跃且极具竞争力。

So, as a young kid, I tried a lot of different sports and was very, very active and very competitive.

我记得有一晚和爸爸妈妈吃晚饭时，我们聊起了各种运动，想找出哪种运动适合我。

I remember during a dinner, one night with my dad and my mom, we were talking about different sports and tried to figure out what kind of sports would click with me.

我爸爸提议说：‘你为什么不试试击剑呢？’

And my dad mentioned, why don't you try fencing?

我们家族里有一位非常出色的击剑运动员。

We have this very talented fencer in our family.

他是你的曾曾祖父。

He is your great great uncle.

他当年在奥运会上赢得了三枚金牌和一枚银牌，你可能会喜欢这项运动。

He won three gold medals back in the days in the Olympic games and a silver medal, and you might like it.

不妨去试试看。

Just take a stab at it.

我不是在开玩笑。

No pun intended.

果然如此。

Sure enough.

我记得那是一个周末的晚餐夜。

You know, I remember this was during a weekend, dinner night.

所以到了星期一，我兴奋极了。

And so remember on Monday, I was so excited.

我说，走吧。

I was like, let's go.

我们去找找离家近的俱乐部吧。

Let's let's try to find out a club close to our house.

因为我们住在米兰市中心，离大教堂附近就有一个俱乐部，步行距离很近，大约十五到二十分钟。

And since we live in the center city of Milan, there was a club near the Duomo, which was very close walking distance, about fifteen, twenty minutes walking distance.

接下来我记得，我走进了俱乐部，立刻爱上了那里的氛围、同伴和教练们。

And so next thing I remember, I just walk into the club, and I just fell in love with atmosphere, with the peers there, with the coaches.

果然，这么多年过去了，我依然在这里练剑。

And sure enough, I'm still here fencing after so, so many years.

所以你骨子里就流淌着击剑的血液吧，我之前真没意识到这一点。

And so you've got, like, fencing in in your blood then because I didn't realize that about you.

我知道你在意大利练过击剑，但我不知道你家里还有奥运冠军。

I knew you had fenced in Italy, but I didn't know you have, like, an Olympic champion in your in your family.

是的。

Yeah.

我的意思是，不是每个人都能这么说，但这确实很酷。

I mean, not many people can say that, but it's a very cool thing to have.

能成为下一代站在奥运赛场上的人，对我们家族来说意义非凡。

And so to be able to then be the next generation on now the Olympic strip is something very special for our family.

所以当你回想起那个俱乐部，现在你在威斯康星州的Etaba练剑，还去过美国其他好几个击剑俱乐部，意大利的击剑俱乐部和我们这个国家的俱乐部有什么不同吗？

So when when you think back on that club and now you fence at Etaba in in Wisconsin and you've visited several other US clubs, like, are Italian fencing clubs different from US fencing clubs, ones we find in this country?

我想主要区别在于它们的建造方式。

I guess what the major difference is, like, probably the way they're built.

它们大多数都很古老，因此承载着深厚的历史。

They're ancient, most of them, so they have the history.

我长大的地方是米兰的索恰达·德·乔尔迪纳俱乐部。

So the the place where I grew up was, Socitada De Giordina, Milan in Milan.

这个俱乐部的历史可以追溯到几百年前。

That club dates back to hundreds of years.

所以美国的许多俱乐部都非常新。

So a lot of clubs here in The United States are very new.

尽管如今，我们更喜欢那种现代感。

Although nowadays, we want that modern feel.

对吧？

Right?

每次我回到米兰，见到朋友并去那里击剑时，走进这些老旧的建筑，看到古旧的门，一切看起来都很脆弱，但这就是那种感觉。

So every time I'm back in Milan and I see my friends and I go fence there, it's very strange to walk into this old buildings and then very antique doors and everything seems very fragile, but that's the feeling.

对吧？

Right?

老实说，我喜欢美国这里如此现代的氛围，我们在各个方面都遥遥领先——无论是工具还是其他东西，我认为许多欧洲国家仍然缺乏这些。

And I honestly like how here in The US, we're so modern and we're so just ahead of everybody in terms of everything that we have, the tools, and and I think a lot of the European countries are still missing that.

很有趣。

Interesting.

是的。

Yeah.

那么，你在意大利的早期训练是如何塑造了你今天在 Strip 上依然使用的击剑风格的呢？

So how did that early training in Italy shape the fencing style that you still employ today out there on the Strip?

我觉得我的风格非常国际化，因为我的第一任教练是意大利人。

I feel that I have a very international style because I received my first training was from Italian.

对吧？

Right?

所以那是一种意大利风格。

And so it was an Italian style.

后来我搬到美国，那里有一位俄罗斯教练。

And then I grew up into moving to in The United States, and then I had a Russian coach there.

所以我也学到了一点俄罗斯风格。

So I got also a little bit of Russian style.

而如今，我有一位埃及教练，他精通埃及、法国和俄罗斯的风格。

And nowadays, I have an Egyptian coach who has had Egyptian, French, as well as Russian style.

所以现在我的风格非常国际化。

So now it's a very international style.

这是一种多种技术的优秀融合，我认为这让我在击剑台上独具特色。

It's a it's a good blend of different techniques, which I think makes me unique and different on the strip.

这在比赛中可以成为优势。

Which that can be an edge out there.

对吧？

Right?

当然。

Absolutely.

当然。

Absolutely.

所以你在宾夕法尼亚州立大学获得了2010年的NCAA冠军。

So twenty ten NCAA championships at Penn State.

你当时是大一新生。

You were a freshman.

那是你第一年。

It was your first year.

我也是第一学期。

My first semester too.

第一学期。

First semester.

是的。

Yes.

我之前没意识到这一点。

I didn't realize that.

好吧。

Okay.

那么，对于那段经历，你记得些什么呢？当时你刚进入NCAA赛场，虽然那些练击剑的人知道你，但你对NCAA来说绝对是新人？

So what do you remember about that experience and going out and getting the the championship as someone who those who are falling fencing knew, but you certainly were new to the NCAA scene?

当然。

For sure.

我的意思是，这是一段远超我想象的经历。

I mean, it was an experience that was beyond my imagination for sure.

那个学期发生了太多事情。

It was a lot happening that semester.

正如我所说，那是我的第一个学期。

As I said, it was my first semester.

所以搬到美国，搬到一个新国家，但我对这次搬迁感到害怕。

So moving to America, moving to a new country, but I was scared of the move.

我只是很好奇，非常渴望真正来到这里。

I was just, intrigued, very, very eager to actually move here.

唯一可能让我担心的是语言障碍，因为英语是我的第二语言。

The only thing that was probably worried me was the language barrier, potentially a language barrier because English was my second language.

我在学校学的英语，所以我并不是天生就会说的。

I learned it in school and so I was never really born with that.

所以被扔进一个全新的环境，面临着很多新的挑战和需要探索的新事物。

So to be thrown into a brand new environment was a lot of new challenges, lot of new things to discover.

我只在心里告诉自己：好吧，尽你所能，全力以赴，然后看看会发生什么。

And all I put to to my mind was, okay, do your best, offense the best that you can, and then see what happens.

果然，仅仅三个月内，我就积攒了足够的积分，获得了参加地区赛的资格。

And sure enough, you know, in just a span of three months, I got enough points to qualify for regionals.

我在地区赛中表现优异，因此成功晋级全国大学生体育协会（NCAA）赛事。

I did really well at regionals, and therefore, I qualify for NCAA.

下一刻，我就站在了最高领奖台上，赢得了NCAA冠军。

And next thing I knew, I was just standing on the highest podium step and then winning NCAA.

所以，过去是这样，现在当然也是这样，竞争依然非常激烈。

So and back in the days, I mean, and nowadays too, of course, the competition was still very high.

我们队里有奥运选手，或者即将成为奥运选手的人，所以这个赛场一点也不轻松。

We had Olympians that or people that would have become Olympians, so the field was not easy at all.

NCAA的关键在于一场比赛一场比赛地打，不要被压垮，因为参赛的击剑选手太多了，你必须把一切分解成小块来应对。

The key with NCAA was just taking every match at a time, not getting overwhelmed because it's such a vast field of fencers that you have to really take everything in chunks.

对吧？

Right?

无论一场比赛发生什么，你都必须忘记，然后专注于下一场比赛。

And whatever happens in one match, you just have to forget and move on to the next match.

不管好坏。

Good or bad.

对吧？

Right?

你不能让情绪左右你在下一场比赛中的表现。

You can now let your emotions really dictate how you're gonna do in the next match.

所以你要保持专注在当下。

So that way you just hate you have to stay focused on the present.

到那时，你已经在国际青少年级别取得过成功了。

And by that point, you had already had success at the junior level internationally.

那么，NCAA有什么不同呢？

So what was different about the NCAA?

感觉不一样吗？

Was it a different feel?

因为你要为宾州州立大学的队友们负责，所以感觉压力更大了吗？

Did it somehow feel like the stakes were even higher because you had your Penn State teammates to worry about?

当我向别人解释大学击剑时，我会说，除非你上大学并在那四年里亲身体验，否则你永远无法感受到那种氛围，只有当你身处赛场时才能真正体会到。

It's definitely when I explain to people about collegiate fencing is something that you will never experience unless you are in college and during those four years, it's really something that you will see when you are there on that field.

所以比赛本身总是相同的。

So the game is always the same.

对吧？

Right?

这是一场五分制的比赛。

It's a five touch bout.

当然，如果你打到顶尖水平，就会参加锦标赛，那时就是十五分制的比赛。

And then, of course, if you get to the top, you get to fence for your championships, and it's a 15 touch bout.

但到了那个阶段，每一场五分制的比赛都不只是为你自己而战，而是为你整个团队而战。

But every five touch bout at that point is not only for you, but if it's for your entire team.

对吧？

Right?

你不仅在为自己赢，争取在成绩榜上留下名字，更是在为学校争取积分。

You're not only trying to win for yourself and putting your name on the board, but you're really trying to gather those points for your school.

因此，回报也大得多。

And so the reward is much bigger.

你身后的人群如此庞大，原本作为个人运动的击剑，突然间变成了一项团队运动，这是非常独特的，也只有在大学阶段你才能真正体会到。

The crowd behind you is so huge, and it becomes from the individual sport that it is, fencing, it all of a sudden becomes a team sport, which is something unique, and that's where you really experience at the collegiate level.

好的。

Okay.

你能告诉我们，你为什么决定为美国队参赛，并在2019年成为美国公民吗？

Can you tell us about the decision to fence for The US and become a US citizen in in 2019?

这个过程是怎么发生的？

How did that process happen?

当然。

Sure.

所以让我们回到我被邀请来美国的时候。

So let's actually go back to when I was offered a possibility to come to United States.

当时我代表意大利参加击剑比赛。

So I was fencing for Italy.

我是青年国家队成员，那时宾夕法尼亚州立大学击剑队主教练找到我，看到了我的击剑技术和天赋，同时也非常欣赏我在赛场内外的表现。

I was on the junior national team, and then the Penn State fencing head coach approached me and saw my fencing skills and talents, and he was also very appreciative of my behavior on this on and off the strip.

于是他向我提供了全额奖学金来美国。

And so he offered me a full ride to come to The United States.

我的条件是：我当然愿意来，因为我对击剑感兴趣，同时也希望选择一个很好的专业。

And my condition was I will come, of course, because I'm interested in fencing, and I also wanna have a really good major.

我想主修预医学。

I wanna major in premedicine.

我未来想从事医疗行业。

I wanna be in the medical field down the road.

如果这两个条件都能满足，我就同意。

So if these two conditions are met, I'm in.

果然，我收拾好行李，就启程前往美国了。

And sure enough, I then packed my bags, and then off I was to the to The United States.

你一下子来到了宾夕法尼亚州中部。

And you're in Central Pennsylvania all of a sudden.

是的。

Yeah.

没错。

Exactly.

在快乐谷。

In Happy Valley.

所以，从一个米兰的城市人，突然来到他们说的中西部地区，这种转变很不错。

So it was a nice shift from being a city person from Milan to in kind of, they say, the middle of

荒无人烟的地方。

nowhere.

是的。

Yeah.

中心县。

Center County.

对吧？

Right?

就是这样。

There you go.

不过我发现，美国这里的人非常友好、善良，因此我很容易就建立了一个社交网络，一群像家人一样关心我、照顾我的朋友。因为我是个独生子女，父母当然还在米兰，我唯一的亲属联系就是住在波士顿的叔公，当然我经常能见到他。

Although I found that people here in America are so friendly, so nice, and so it was very easy to build a network, an extended family of friends and people that really cared about me and really looked after me because being an only child, my parents were, of course, in Milan, and the only family connection I had was my great uncle in Boston, which, of course, I got to see him very often.

但那还是离宾夕法尼亚州和宾州州立大学有点远。

But, it was still a little far away from from Pennsylvania and from Penn State.

但不管怎样，后来我就开始参加NCAA击剑比赛了。

But anyhow, so I was then able to fence, you know, NCAA.

我取得了很好的成绩，对自己的职业生涯非常满意。

I did really good results, I was very happy with my career.

在宾州州立大学学业结束时，我决定申请绿卡和所谓的‘杰出人才’身份。

And at the end of my Penn State years, I decided to apply for a green card and what's called an extraordinary ability.

所以我确实获得了绿卡。

And so I was granted actually the green card.

非凡能力。

An extraordinary ability.

我觉得这很准确。

I think that's accurate.

对吧？

Right?

是的。

Yeah.

其实挺不错的，我觉得。

It's it's actually pretty good, would say.

我非常喜欢这一点。

I love that.

是的。

Yeah.

这实际上是他们设立的类别之一。

It's actually one of the categories that they have.

你知道，如果你是研究人员、运动员、音乐家，或者任何能为美国带来独特价值和积极贡献的人。

You know, if you are a researcher, if you are a sports person, if you are a musician, somebody that brings something different, something good to The United States.

他们一直在寻找人才，对吧？希望把他们带到我们的国家。

They're always looking for talents, right, to take to our country here.

没错。

Exactly.

正所谓人多力量大。

The more the merrier, as they say.

于是我拿到了绿卡，之后我知道自己只能耐心等待了，因为整个过程非常漫长。

And so I got that, and then I knew that it was just a waiting game at that point because it's a very long process.

实际上，从拿到绿卡到成为公民，需要五年时间。

It takes five years actually from the time you get your green card to become a citizen.

所以我只能等着，对吧？

And so I just had to wait it Right?

与此同时，持有绿卡期间，我无法参加国际比赛，因为如果你想代表美国或其他任何国家参赛，必须拥有该国的护照。

And in the meantime, having a green card, I could not compete internationally because you need to have a passport, a US passport if you want to compete for United States or same for any other country.

而且

And

所以那时你无法代表任何国家参赛吗？

So you couldn't compete for any country at that point?

没错。

Correct.

我正处于一个过渡期，不能再代表意大利参赛。

I was in a transition period from having to not compete for Italy.

对吧？

Right?

因为当你从一个国家转到另一个国家时，必须等待一段时间，而我的文件还没办妥，所以还不能代表美国参赛。

Because you have to wait when you transfer one country to the other and not being able to compete for The United States yet just because my paperwork wouldn't allow me to.

所以我只能耐心等待。

And so I just had to wait it out.

然后到了2019年，终于轮到我了，我最终获得了公民身份。整个过程非常顺利，因为移民局办公室知道我希望能尽快代表美国参赛，所以我在密尔沃基办理面谈和入籍手续的那家办公室，一收到总部发来的文件，就立刻打电话给我，为我安排了私人面谈和私人宣誓仪式，因为他们希望我尽快成为美国公民，只要文件一到手就行。

And then finally, in 2019, I got my turn up and then I was granted finally my citizenship and it was very very neat how everything worked out because the Immigration Service office knew that I wanted to be able to compete for United States as soon as possible so the office in Milwaukee where I actually end up going to to do my interview and my naturalization process as soon as they receive the paperwork in hand from the main office, they decide to actually call me up and they actually had a private interview and then a private ceremony just for me because they wanted me to just be an American citizen as soon as possible, as soon as they had the paperwork.

到那时，你已经等了很久了。

You'd waited long enough at that point.

没错。

Exactly.

他们说：不。

They say, no.

我们一拿到文件，就让你成为公民。

We're gonna make you a citizen as soon as we get it.

那一刻，你拿到了美国护照。

And so that moment, you know, you get your American passport.

那时你有没有考虑过奥运会？

At that point, are you thinking about Olympics?

你有没有考虑过入选世界队？

Are you thinking about making the world team?

你脑子里在想什么？

What what's what's going through your head?

在

At

那时，我感到非常兴奋能重返国际赛场，因为我曾经见证过、经历过，也感受过。

that point, I'm thinking I'm so thrilled to be back on the international scene because I've seen it, and I've done it before, and I felt it before.

我喜欢在那些赛道上表演，看到所有这些国际击剑选手。

And I love performing on those strips, you know, and and seeing all these international fencers.

我迫不及待地想回到那个赛场，展示我自上次以来学到了多少，以及我进步了多少。

And I just couldn't wait to just be able to be back into that field and just show how much I've learned since the last time I was there and saw how much I'd improved.

所以对我来说，就是一种感觉：让我们回去，尽我所能，好好表现，看看我能走多远。

And so for me, it was just a feeling of let's get back and then just do the best I can and perform and then see how far I could I could go.

是的。

Yeah.

可能很想弄清楚，我到底成长了多少。

Probably eager to find out, like, how much have I grown.

对吧？

Right?

就像在那个水平上检验自己，这之前你根本做不到。

Like, test yourself at that level, which you really couldn't have done.

显然，结果很好。

And obviously, it it worked out well.

所以我们得聊聊巴黎。

So we had to talk about Paris.

你知道，你已经获得了奥运会资格。

You know, you qualified for the Olympics.

你能分享一下，那一刻对你意味着什么吗？

Can you share, like, what that moment means to you?

还有，当你第一次得知时，是你的教练阿巴斯告诉你的吗？

And also, like, when you first found out, was it your coach, Abbas, who told you?

你是怎么得知自己入选队伍的？

Was it how did you find out that you had made the team?

入选奥运代表队是难以置信的时刻，尤其是第一次的话。

Making an Olympic team is an is an unbelievable moment, especially if it's your first time.

今年对很多人来说，这都是第一次入选队伍，所以一起前往巴黎。

And this is the first time for many of us this year actually making the team and so going altogether to Paris.

因此，我们将分享同样的经历、同样的感受，而有一支庞大的团队一起完成这一切真是太好了。

So we are gonna be sharing the same experience, the same feelings, and it's good that we have this big group to do it with.

我们知道积分规则以及积分是如何分配的。

We knew what the points were and how they were allocated.

所以在最后几场锦标赛之前，我们就清楚自己需要做什么才能锁定席位。

And so going into the last few tournaments, we knew what we needed to do to be able to basically lock our position.

所以这并不令人意外。

So it it didn't come as a surprise.

这只是大量努力的结果，是日复一日的训练、比赛和良好表现的回报。

It was just a a result of a lot of effort and then a lot of just days in and out worth of training and and competitions and good results.

因此，我们所有人都知道，那一刻终将到来。

And so we just knew all of us knew that that moment was coming.

所以这并不是我第一个发现，或者我的教练第一个发现。

So it wasn't just, oh, I discovered first or my coach discovered first.

我们都清楚会发生什么。

We all knew what was going to happen.

所以我们已经为那一刻做好了准备。

And so we were just ready for that.

是的。

Yeah.

任何人都可以进去算一算，对吧，然后弄清楚。

Anybody can go in and do the math, right, and figure it out.

我们的资格赛体系完全是基于成绩的。

The way our qualification system works, it's completely merit based.

你可以说，这完全取决于你在击剑道上的表现。

You could say it's all about your performance on the strip.

这正是我如此热爱这个国家的原因之一。

That's one of the things that I love so much about this country.

所以你努力工作，然后就会因为你的努力得到回报。

So you work hard, and then you get rewarded for your hard work.

对吧？

Right?

你有实力，然后就能获得奖励。

You have merit, and then you you get the prize.

在许多其他国家，尤其是欧洲，情况并非如此。

In several other countries, especially in Europe, that's not the case.

也许他们只会为一两名选手保留这个体系，其余的选手则由教练挑选。

Maybe they'll keep this system for one or two players, and then the remaining players will be chosen by the coach.

这可能会因政治环境的不同而产生好或坏的影响。

And this can play good or bad depending on what the politics look like.

我们可以就此展开一个完全不同的讨论，但我真的非常高兴我们这里拥有这种基于功绩的制度，我绝不希望改变它。

And so we can get into a totally different conversation there, but I'm really, really happy that we have this meritocratic system here, and I wouldn't change it for anything.

是的。

Yeah.

太棒了。

That's awesome.

你觉得什么时候才会真正意识到，或者已经意识到自己是一名奥运选手了吗？

When do you think it's gonna sink in or maybe has it already that you're an Olympian?

每天早上醒来，我都觉得自己能做自己热爱的事情。

Every day that I wake up, I just think that I'm able to do what I love to do.

这不仅仅是因为我要去参加奥运会，更是因为我每天都能为一直以来梦想的事情训练，因为我能享受这项我们许多人热爱的运动，而并非每个人都有这样的机会。

And it's not just because I'm going to the Olympics, but because I'm able to train every day for something that I've always dreamed about and because I'm able to just enjoy the sport that so many of us love, and not everybody has the same opportunity to do that.

所以，我能拥有健康的身体，能创造如此美好的回忆，我对此充满感激。

So the fact that I'm just an able body and I'm just able to to create excellent memories, it's just something that I'm so thankful for.

是的。

Yeah.

其中一个回忆是2023年11月在莱加诺。

And one of those memories was November 2023 at the Leggano.

我这么说对吗？

Am I saying that right?

Leggano。

Leggano.

嗯。

Yeah.

差不多了。

Close enough.

好的。

Okay.

但我觉得自己问对人了。

But I figured I was asking the right person.

你现在在意大利，这再完美不过了。

So you're in Italy, which is perfect.

对吧？

Right?

而且你在那里赢得了金牌。

And you win a gold medal there.

对你和你的职业生涯来说，那一刻是什么样的？

What was that moment like for you and your career?

那简直难以置信。

That was unbelievable.

首先，利尼亚诺离米兰大约十五到二十分钟车程。

So first of all, Lignano is about maybe fifteen, twenty minutes from Milan.

所以它就在我的家乡旁边。

So it was really next to my home city.

因此，有那么多朋友和家人专程过来观看我的表演。

And so I had so many friends and family members that just came over there to just watch me perform.

我永远不会忘记那一刻，当进入前四强时，四位决赛选手在公众面前介绍自己的作品。

I will never forget this moment when it was the top four, and the top four finalists were introducing what they were presented in front of the public.

那时已经没有意大利人了。

So there was no more Italian left.

观众席上全是意大利人。

The crowd was full of Italians.

当他们逐一介绍每一位选手时，轮到我的名字时，整个观众席瞬间沸腾了，他们非常支持我，感觉她虽然代表美国，但体内仍流淌着意大利的血液。

And so when they were going through every single player and presenting such and such, such and such, when they came to my name, the whole crowd exploded in and just they were they were so supportive, and they were feeling like, well, she might be representing America, but she still has Italian blood.

所以我们一定会为她加油，而且会非常大声地呐喊。

So we are gonna be cheering on her, and we'll be we're gonna be very loud.

我记得我的对手们看着我，一脸困惑：这里到底发生了什么？

And I remember my opponents looking at me like, what's going on here?

我只是笑着说：嗯，我想我有几个朋友。

And I just said, well, I guess I have a few friends

天啊。

Oh my gosh.

是啊。

Yeah.

他们说：等等。

They're like, wait.

你是带了整个观众团来吗？

Did you bring in your crowd or something?

我太喜欢了。

I love that.

是啊。

Yeah.

而且，事实上，一些我根本不认识的人也在为我加油，因为他们听说了我，然后那天他们对一切都充满热情。

And, actually, people that I didn't even know were were cheering on me just because they heard about me, and then they just were so passionate about everything that day.

这绝对是一个永远不会消失的回忆。

So it's definitely a memory that will never go away.

当你赢得四分之一决赛并知道自己进入半决赛时，你已经有一枚奖牌了。

When you win the the quarterfinals and know that you're in the semifinals, you've got a medal.

但接着你继续前进，最终赢得了金牌，那一刻是什么感觉？

But then to go on and actually get gold there, like, what was that moment like?

现在你站在赛场上，仿佛有一群主场观众在支持你。

Now you're on that stage with a kind of home crowd in a sense behind you.

当你出场并最终赢得全部比赛时，那是一种怎样的感觉？

What was it like when you went out and just won the entire thing?

正如我所说，你总是要一次只看一场比赛，一次只关注一个动作。

It's always, as I say, you just get a look at one match at a time and one touch at a time.

所以对我来说，关键是完全活在当下，不管是什么轮次。

So to me, it was being very present in the moment, and it didn't matter what round it was.

我只是知道自己想表现好，也知道只要我继续像那天那样击剑，我就能走得很远。

I just knew I just wanted to do well, and I just knew that if I kept fencing the way I was fencing the day, I would go far.

所以轮次并不重要。

So it didn't matter what round it was.

对我来说，更像是，好吧。

So for me, it was more like, okay.

这只是另一场比赛，我会尽我所能发挥最好。

It's another match, and I'm gonna perform the best I can.

然后一切都会在最后水到渠成。

And then everything will check out at the end.

事实上，确实如此。

And in fact, it did.

是的。

Yeah.

结果还不错。

That worked out.

那是其中一个高光时刻。

That was one of the the highs.

我们能谈谈你遇到过的任何低谷或挑战吗？你又是如何克服它们，才走到今天的？

Can we talk about any lows, any challenges that you've faced that you've been able to overcome to get to where you are?

我总觉得问这个问题很有趣，因为并不是每次比赛都能赢。

I always think it's it's interesting to ask that question because it's not always just winning every single tournament.

对吧？

Right?

当然。

For sure.

当然。

For sure.

事实上，我喜欢说，有时你从失败中学到的东西比从胜利中更多。

It's actually what I like to say is that you can learn more from defeats than from victory sometimes.

所以在我整个职业生涯中，我经历过很多次失败。

So throughout my career, I've I've had many defeats.

对吧？

Right?

比赛没有按照你期望的方式进行。

Competitions that don't go the way you want to.

你太早被淘汰了，无论出于什么原因，你的期望都没有实现。

You lose way too early in the day, and then your expectations are not met for whatever reason.

我认为，能够重新投入工作，从这些低谷中站起来，才是真正塑造你品格的时候。

And I think that being able to just go back to work and get up from those low moments is where you really build your character.

那时你才会成为一个更强大的运动员，也才能真正让自己的心态为下一次做好准备。

That's when you become a stronger athlete, and that's where you really make your mind better for the next time.

所以击剑，大家都知道，被称为‘物理的象棋’。

So fencing, they call it the physical chest as everybody knows.

因此，很多事情实际上都取决于你的思维、心态以及你控制情绪的能力。

And so so much is really dependent on your mind and in your mindset and how you can control your feelings.

是的。

Yes.

身体素质出色、技术精湛固然重要。

It's important to be physically really good and technically awesome.

但归根结底，尤其是在击剑比赛中，最终决定胜负的是谁拥有最坚韧的意志，谁能承受住每场比赛中必须面对的巨大压力。

But at the end of the day, especially in epi, it boils down to who has this toughest mind out there, who can really withstand all the pressure that you have to go through every single tournament.

对吧？

Right?

多年来，无论是在国际、国内、海外还是全国性的击剑比赛中，我都学会了要珍惜这些时刻，并从中汲取经验。

And so I've learned over the years of my fencing international, domestic, abroad, nationally, that you really have to take those moments and learn from them.

每一次失败，实际上都会为你下一次前进多提供一寸力量。

And every single defeat will actually give you an extra inch to go further the next time.

因为正如我之前所说，一旦你能够跌倒后重新站起来，那就是你塑造品格的时候。

Because once you like I said before, once you're able to stand up when you fell, that's where you build character.

因此，对我来说，我会把这些经历视为我击剑旅程中的小小前进动力。

And so for me, I actually take those sets back as actually small pushes forward for my fencing journey.

我非常喜欢这一点。

I love that.

我认为这是一种很好的心态。

I think that's a great outlook.

而且这对年轻击剑手来说也是极好的建议，这让我想到另一件事，我想问问你：如果有人在俱乐部来找你，说‘我怎样才能像你一样？’，你有什么建议吗？

And actually, that's great advice too for younger fencers, which brings me to something else I'd like to ask you about, which is what is your advice for young fencers starting out if someone were to come up to you at the club and say, you know, how do I be like you someday?

你有没有一句简短有力的话想送给他们？

Do you have some little sound bite that you'd like to give them?

当然有。

Absolutely.

首先，你必须热爱这项运动。

First of all, you need to love the sport.

你要享受其中的乐趣。

You need to have fun with it.

对吧？

Right?

每天早上醒来，你都得期待着要做点什么。

When you wake up in the morning, you gotta look forward to something to do.

那可能是你的工作。

That could be your job.

那也可以是你喜欢的运动。

That can be a sport that you play.

那可能是你爱的家人，但你必须热爱它。

That can be loving a family member, but you need to love it.

对吧？

Right?

你得觉得实现某些目标不是一种负担。

You need to feel that it's not a burden to achieve certain goals.

所以，只要你享受每一个细节，你就会发现自己每次都在进步。

And so by just enjoying every single bit of it, you will find yourself improving every time.

此外，我强烈建议，因为在俱乐部里，你将遇到各种不同水平和不同技能的人。

Also, I would highly highly suggest because in a club, you have all different levels and all different skills.

尽量找一个比你经验稍多的人搭档。

Try to pair up with somebody that has a little more experience than you are.

试着把这个人当作导师，他 hopefully 能够引导你应对击剑带来的起起落落。

Try to use that person as a mentor, and that person hopefully will be able to guide you through the ups and downs that fencing brings.

因为正如我们之前所说，很容易只看到冠军或即将参加奥运会的人，然后觉得他们一切都那么顺利。

Because as we said before, it's very easy to just look at a champion or look at somebody going to to the Olympics and say, well, everything is going so well for that person.

他们轻松取得了所有成就，而我却做不到。

That person has it easy, achieved everything and but I can't.

其实不然，我们都曾经历过同样的阶段。

Well, no, we we were all in the same shoes.

我们所有人都是从新手开始的。

We all started as beginners.

我们都曾表现得平平无奇。

We all were decent at it.

然后我们突然开窍了，也许是由于某人的一句鼓励，也许是我们的教练为我们做了什么，又或许是我们的家人或社交圈给了我们支持。

And then something clicked with us, maybe because it was a good word from a person, maybe something that our coach did for us, maybe something that our family or our network did for us.

因此，通过找到身边合适的人，我认为他们能帮助你真正达到下一个阶段，无论那是什么阶段。

And so by being able to find the right people around you, I think they can help you really achieve the next levels, whatever they are.

对你来说，那就是老板，菲德尔，对吧？

And for you, that's a boss, Fidel, right?

你的教练。

Your coach.

他有什么特别之处？你们之间的这种关系为什么如此融洽？

What's special about him and how does that connection work so well?

因为我见过你们俩的互动，显然你们双方都从这段专业关系中获益良多。

Because I've seen how you two interact and it's obviously you both are getting something out of that professional relationship.

当然。

Sure.

我认识阿巴斯已经十多年了，他不仅是一位优秀的教练和老师，更是一位杰出的导师和朋友。

I've known Abbas for over a decade now and, he's just a not only a great teacher, a great coach, but also a great mentor and friend.