Episode 99: 2026 Food and Beverage Trends with Brian Choi of The Food Institute

Brian，很高兴再次见到你，欢迎来到我们的播客。

Brian, so excited to see you again, and, welcome to our podcast.

是的。

Yeah.

很好。

Great.

谢谢你们邀请我。

And thanks for having me.

我对今天的讨论特别期待。

Super excited about today's discussion.

Brian，我想问你一个问题。

Well, Brian, I I, just wanna ask you.

你现在在哪儿连线呢？

Where are you calling from?

拉切尔那边冷得要命。

Rachel's up there where it's freezing.

积雪有好几英尺厚。

There's, like, feet feet of snow.

在亚特兰大，我们可没这情况。

Here in Atlanta, we don't have that.

我在新泽西北部，确实下了不少雪。

Well, I I'm in Northern New Jersey, so we did get hit with, you know, quite a bit of snow.

大概有十六英寸吧。

Think about 16 inches.

是的。

Yeah.

差不多连续两天都被大雪困在家里了。

So we were snowed in for pretty much a couple of days.

我们两个孩子可高兴了。

Our our our two kids, they loved it.

他们还得去上学。

They had to go to school.

所以是放了雪假，对吧？

Got a snow day, right, out of it.

是的。

Yeah.

不过好在雪都清理干净了，终于能把车开出去，重新上路了。

But glad glad it's been, you know, been cleared out and we can finally take our car outside and and drive again.

所以。

So

对。

Yeah.

真厉害。

Wow.

天哪。

Man.

是的。

Yeah.

我们昨天过了土拨鼠日，你知道的，就是那个传统，嗯。

Well, we had the groundhog, you know, yesterday, Groundhog Day or Mhmm.

结果嘛，也不意外，还得再熬六个星期的冬天。

Ended, you know, we, of course, no surprise, have six more weeks of winter.

所以我对这个结果一点都不惊讶。

So I wasn't too surprised about that.

这冰就是不肯化。

The ice is just not going away.

是的。

Yeah.

希望天快点暖和起来。

Hopefully, it'll warm up soon.

对。

Yeah.

亚特兰大那边也下了雪。

We did have snow in Atlanta.

想特别提一下这场雪。

Just wanna give a shout out to snow.

我们这儿在

Here in the

周末的时候。

weekend.

雪量没到十六英尺，大概十六英寸吧。

It was not 16, feet, maybe 16 inches.

所以。

So

太棒了。

Awesome.

好的。

Alright.

布莱恩，我先开个头，聊聊2026年吧。

Well, Brian, I I just wanted to kick us off, and just, talk about 2026.

当你展望今年的前景时，消费品和零售行业的领导者们最忽视的那个宏观信号是什么？

And, when you look at your outlook going forward this year, what is the single macro signal, that CPG and retail leaders, are still underestimating?

为什么现在这个信号比以后更重要？

And, why does it matter now rather than later?

确实如此。

Yeah.

不是的。

No.

这个问题问得太好了。

That's that's such a great question.

我是个数据控。

I I'm a data guy.

你知道的。

You know?

以前做投资银行的时候，我总是盯着数据，因为数据从来不会骗人，它总能指向真相。

I you know, when I did investment banking privately, I'm always looking at numbers, and, the data always points to where the truth is.

对吧？

Right?

所以呢，作为一家媒体公司，我能看到其他很多媒体平台在说什么。

And so it's one thing, you know, I I you know, being a media company, I see what a lot of the other media platforms, you know, what they're saying.

大家普遍很乐观，我觉得这挺好。

There's a lot of optimism, which is I think it's great.

乐观总是件好事。

It's always great to be be optimistic.

但我最关注的那个数据点，是消费者的真实状态。

But the one data point, I'm hyper focused on where the consumer is.

我们之前也跟你们聊过，就是看消费者对自己财务状况的感受，以及他们对未来六到十二个月美国经济前景的看法。

And this is something that, we've we've spoken to you guys about just looking at, you know, how the consumer is feeling about their own financial situation and how they're feeling about, you know, the prospects of The US economy over the next six to twelve months.

如果从长期来看，这个数字其实挺低的。

And, you know, it's it's pretty low, you know, if you look at a long term perspective.

我记得以前在华尔街和做私募的时候，密歇根大学消费者信心指数每个月都稳稳地在100左右，那才是常态。

Like, I remember, you know, back when I was working, you know, in my Wall Street days and private equity days, it was normal to see the University of Michigan consumer confidence around a 100 consistently on a month to month now you know, month to month basis.

现在大概在50左右。

Today, that's around 50.

对吧？

Right?

如果从几十年的长期趋势来看，消费者信心一旦持续落在50附近，通常就意味着经济低迷。

And if you cut look at the long term perspective of consumer confidence over multi decades, whenever the the consumer confidence was consistently around the 50 range, it usually signaled a depressed growth.

你明白吗？

You know?

我觉得这就是关键点。

And, you know, I think that is the one thing.

你知道，美国经济有三分之二靠消费者驱动。

It's you know, The US economy is two thirds of the other consumer.

所以，我觉得很多食品饮料公司都忽略了消费者手头有多紧。

And so, I think the one thing that a lot of food and beverage companies are overlooking is how financially strapped the consumer is.

即使在今天，我刚看了些新闻头条。

Even in today's you know, I was reading the headlines.

百事公司打算把乐事和墨西哥卷饼这些薯片的价格下调15%，因为销量上不去，消费者一直在抱怨价格太高。

Pepsi, you know, planning on cutting, their price on Lay's and Burritos, potato chips by 15% because volume growth, there's not you know, and consumers have been complaining about about prices.

这可是个不小的举动，要知道，百事可是全球最大的快消品公司之一，这说明他们对消费者现状真的挺担忧的。

Like, that's that's a that's a pretty big step that, you know, one of the largest CPG companies what their what, you know, what the the concerns that they have around the state of the consumer.

对吧？

Right?

所以我觉得最关键的就是，得先搞清楚消费者现在到底是什么情况，然后食品饮料公司才能据此制定策略。

So, so that's the one thing I think I'm, it'd be it'd be really good to just focus on where the consumer is, and then for food and beverage companies to kind of strategize around where the consumer is.

对吧？

Right?

不管是走性价比路线，还是调整定价，或者真正提升消费者感受到的价值，都得围绕消费者的需求来。

Whether it's, you know, going more the value route, may maybe it's more about, you know, maybe it's a cost adjust adjustment, or really delivering that perceived value.

对吧？

Right?

我觉得这就是最关键的一点，我们后面在播客里还会继续聊这个话题。

I think that's the one thing, which, you know, I know we'll be we'll be, talking about later in the in the podcast.

但消费者确实特别看重性价比。

But, yeah, consumers are value obsessed.

如果非得用一个词或者两个词来形容2026年的消费者，那就是‘看重性价比’。

If there's one word, or two words that I was I would say, in 2026, the consumer is value obsessed.

这点毫无疑问，布莱恩。

No question about it, Brian.

那我们不妨就这个点再深入聊聊。

So let's build on that for a moment.

你知道，我们在凯度经常讨论美国市场的两极分化，K型经济，以及品牌该如何调整策略。

You know, we, at Kantar, we're talking a lot about the bifurcation of America, the k shaped economy, and how brands need to think and act differently.

我们甚至已经整理出专门的章节和操作指南，尤其是在应对Z世代时，这一点尤其关键。

We have, like, chapters and playbooks on that, and I think it's especially important with Gen Z.

Z世代的消费能力，跟我们X世代相比，大概只有三分之一左右。

I mean, Gen Z's purchasing power versus, like me, Gen X, is about one third less.

他们就是没那么多钱，你知道的。

They just have you know?

所以，很多快消品类的潜在市场规模实际上变小了，但我们还是希望它们能提升销量。

So, subsequently, the addressable market of a lot of CPG categories is just less, but we still want them to grow units.

那你们那边给食品饮料品牌提了哪些建议？这个话题现在可太热了。

So kinda what's what are you kinda seeing and sharing over there to food and beverage brands on this, like, such a hot topic?

是的。

Yeah.

说到Z世代，他们行为背后的影响因素特别有意思，我们都清楚，我有两个孩子。

So, you know, as it relates to Gen Z, they, what's really interesting when you look at the behavior patterns of what is influencing behavior and we all know that, you know, I have two kids.

他们花大量时间在设备上——说出来有点不好意思。

They are spending a lot of time kind of ashamed to admit this.

他们一直在刷手机。

They're on on devices.

对吧？

Right?

所以，他们深受媒体和社交媒体的影响。

So they're influenced by media, by social media.

你知道吗，我们孩子还是对K-pop和《恶魔猎人》着迷得不得了。

You know, our kids are, they they're still obsessed with k pop demon hunter k pop demon hunters.

对吧？

Right?

所以，他们主要受媒体影响，这一点很明显。

So so a lot you know, they're influenced by by by by media.

尤其是针对Z世代，真正能打动他们的，是出现在他们日常最常使用的那些媒介里。

And so particularly around Gen Z, what really moves moves the needle is, connecting with that demographic in the mediums in which they spend a lot of their time.

对吧？

Right?

跟我们父母那一代不一样，他们不是特别在意价格、价格、价格。

They're not really necessarily, like, you know, with my with my parents, they're it's all you know, they're very focused on price, price, price, price.

对吧？

Right?

他们经常去好市多。

You know, they're going to Costco.

他们去山姆会员店，价格才是决定购买的关键。

They're going to Sam's Club, and price is the the the main, determining factor.

但对Z世代来说，他们深受自己关注的网红影响。

But with the Gen Z demographic, they are very much influenced by the influencers by which they by which they follow.

对吧？

Right?

所以对他们来说，购物决策的考量不止是价格。

And so for them, the calculus on on purchasing behavior is not just about price.

没错。

Yes.

价格当然重要，但他们更希望和产品产生共鸣，不管是食品、饮料，还是餐饮门店。

Price is important, but they they need to feel connected with the product, whether it's a food product, whether it's a beverage product, whether it's a food service, you know, establishment.

他们需要的是一种超越价格和性价比的深层连接。

They need to be feel connected in a deeper way than purely of that, like, a price or value, criteria.

所以说，这事儿挺有意思的。

So, you know, it it's it's very it's very interesting.

再往下看，Gen Alpha这一代受这种影响更明显。

If you go even further down, the Gen Alpha, they're even more they're even more influenced, you know, by that.

每个年龄段的消费者都不一样。

So, every demographic is different.

针对每个群体，策略都得完全不同，这确实很有挑战性。

The strategy has to be very different for each of the demo, demographic cohorts, and it's it's it's challenging.

对吧？

Right?

你得面对三四个甚至五个完全不同的消费群体。

It's it's like you have, you know, three, four, five different consumer groups.

得根据每个群体的具体需求，制定专门的营销策略。

You need to have a have a very specific strategy to to to target, each of those demographics depending on their consumer needs states.

不过，食品饮料行业一向能应对这种挑战，我相信到2026年，企业们都能快速适应。

So, but, yeah, you know, it's with food and beverage always rises to to the challenge, and, you know, I'm sure the companies will be able to adapt, quite quickly in 2026.

也许就一点建议，布莱恩。

Maybe just one build, Brian.

我们看到的一个亮点是，去年在奥兰多举行的CAGNY展会上，所有快消品公司都提到了高端化，真的挺明显的。

One bright spot that we see, especially from the CAGNY presentations last year where all the CPGs present down in Orlando, premiumization, man.

也就是说，高收入群体正在推动整个经济的60%。

I mean, like, that upper income consumer is driving, you know, 60% of the economy.

当时现场的氛围非常积极。

There was a lot of positivity there.

今年我们还会继续关注这个趋势，但说实话，这确实是个亮眼的方向。

We'll be back again this year covering that, but I I I that is a bright spot.

没错。

Yes.

我完全同意你的看法。

So I I I agree with you.

他们确实在持续消费，但我想提一点，这一点在媒体上几乎没人讨论过。

They are they're continuing to spend, but I would say and this is something that I haven't really seen a lot of media attention on.

对。

Mhmm.

他们也越来越受价值的影响。

They are being also more influenced by value.

对他们来说，价值的定义不一样。

Value for them is a different definition.

对吧？

Right?

你知道，对于美国中部和低收入群体来说，他们对价格非常敏感。

You know, for for Middle America, lower income consumers, they're extremely price conscious.

但就连高收入消费者，也越来越受到Bites的影响。

But even that upper echelon of the consumer, they are also more and more being influenced by by Bites.

比如你看沃尔玛，再看好市多，增长最快的消费群体之一就是高收入人群。

When you look at Walmart, for example, when you look at Costco, they're one of the fastest growing consumer demographics is that upper income consumer.

五年前、十年前，他们根本不会去沃尔玛购物。

You know, five, ten years ago, they they weren't shopping at Walmart.

他们也不怎么去好市多。

They weren't they weren't really shopping at Costco.

对吧？

Right?

但现在我们看到，就连这个群体也在寻找一种所谓的价值感。

But now we're seeing even that demographic, finding, I would say, perceived value.

对吧？

Right?

如果你能在好市多以八折买到高端葡萄酒，这种价格优势就会改变他们的消费行为。

If you can buy a higher end wine at a Costco at 20% discount, that that moves that that causes behavioral change.

所以，我觉得2024年主打的是对价格的敏感度。

So, you know, if I were to if I would I would say 2024 was about value consciousness.

而2025年，一直到2026年，我前面提到的那个词——价值执念，会更明显。

2025 and and going into 2026, I I you know, that that term I I used it earlier, value obsession.

目前，价值，尤其是感知到的价值，正在驱动所有消费群体。

We're seeing value and specifically perceived value being driving all consumer demographics, you know, right now.

至于最顶层的1%，他们当然不会受这些影响，想怎么买就怎么买。

Now the top 1%, obviously, they're not you know, they're doing whatever.

对吧？

Right?

他们大部分财富都挂在股市上，这一点我想再强调一下，尤其是高收入群体。

They have, so one other point I wanted to make about this upper, you know, the upper, the top end of the consumer range, a lot of their wealth is tied up in the stock market.

没错。

Mhmm.

现在股市已经接近历史最高点了。

We are near all time highs.

标普500指数今早刚突破七千点，我想是这样。

S and P 500 just crossed, I think, 7,000 this this morning.

对吧？

Right?

你看债券市场，收益率都在下滑。

When you look at the bond market, the its yields are down.

你懂的。

You know?

所以我的意思是，现在的资产价格已经完美定价了，我们正处在美国历史上最长的一轮牛市之一，甚至可能是有史以来最长的。

So my my point is asset prices are priced to perfection right now, and we are coming on one of the longest bull markets in US history, if not the the longest.

那我为什么要提这个呢？

So why do I bring that up?

如果市场出现任何一点波动，资产价格可能会下跌。

If there's any sort of volatility that that starts to creep up in in in in the markets, we might see asset prices go down.

对吧？

Right?

我不是在预测市场会崩盘，但如果股市真的下跌，这部分消费者的心态肯定会受到更大冲击。

And so if I and I'd say I'm I'm not I'm not predicting a a a crash in the markets, but if asset prices at the stock market, you know, goes down, you know, the psychology of of that end of the consumer will be even more impacted.

对吧？

Right?

所以这是我最关注的一点。

And and so that's the one thing I would I would keep definitely keep an eye on.

看看股市的价值，看看债市的表现，还有房地产价格，你也得留意。

Look at look at the value of the stock market, look at the value of the bond market, look at, you know, real you know, even real estate prices.

如果咱们看到市场开始有点下滑，那会对高端消费者的行为产生巨大影响。

Like, if we start to see that ship ship down a little bit, it's gonna cause a huge change in behavior amongst that kind of top end of the consumer.

所以，这确实会是挺有意思的一年。

So, yeah, it's a it's a it's it it it'll be an interesting year.

你知道的。

You know?

我觉得正确的做法，也是更稳妥的策略，就是做最坏的打算，但保持乐观。

It'll be, you know, I think this the right strategy or the prudent strategy, prepare for the worst, but be optimistic.

要乐观，但也要更灵活应对。

You know, be optimistic and but be much more agile.

对吧？

Right?

我觉得，即使在2026年这么早的阶段，市场已经开始出现一些变化了。

And, I think we're starting to see some shifts in the market right now even at this early stage in 2026.

布莱恩，我想聊聊2026年，因为你之前也提到过，这是挑战者品牌崛起的一年。

Brian, I wanna talk a little bit about, 2026 because you've also used the term, it's the year of the challenger brand.

是的

Yeah.

我们能不能聊聊挑战者品牌，它们现在在结构上比老牌品牌强在哪里？

And, can we talk a little bit about challenger brands and what they are doing structurally better than incumbent brands right now?

是的

Yeah.

这是个好问题。

That's that's question.

是的

Yeah.

我和我们的共同朋友桑尼·坎塔尔在冬季幻想展上见面时，正在做一场关于2026年宏观趋势的演讲。

We, I was with, our our mutual, friend, Sunny Kantar, at the Winter Fantasy Fair Show, and we were delivering a presentation on the macro trends in in 2026.

我们一开始就说，今年是挑战者品牌之年。

And, you know, we we led with that this year being the challenger brand.

挑战者品牌通常规模比那些大牌巨头小得多。

So challenger brands are companies that are generally a lot smaller than than the big incumbent brands.

它们非常灵活，能根据消费者的需求快速调整和转型。

They're very agile, in terms in terms of, you know, shifting and pivoting depending on where the consumer is.

它们在营销和数字媒体方面更懂行，清楚知道自己目标人群是谁。

They're usually much more savvy savvy with with, you know, marketing, digital media, understanding, like, who their their target demographic is.

第四，它们和消费者建立了更深层次的连接。

And fourth, they're connecting with their consumer in a deeper in a deep in a deeper way.

所以我们在这个研究所发现的是，消费者的偏好正在发生变化。

So what we're finding here at the institute is that consumers are tired of is is changing.

巴里，你和我以前在播客里也聊过这个话题。

Barry, you and I have spoken about this, you know you know, in on on previous podcast.

创新的节奏，取决于消费者的需求，他们追求新东西的速度，比父母那一代快多了。

So the innovation cycle, where the consumer is, they're looking for it's it's almost like they're looking for something new at a faster pace than than, you know, their their their parents or their in the older generations.

他们想要新的口味。

They want new flavors.

他们希望有更多样化的选择。

They let they want a lot more variety.

而现在市场上大公司提供的东西，根本满足不了消费者对变化、创新、新口味和刺激的无尽渴望。

And what the market is offering right now in terms of the big and company, it's it's not satisfying their insatiable desire for change, for innovation, for new flavors, for excitement.

对吧？

Right?

但新兴品牌恰恰提供了这些。

The challenger brands are offering that.

比如他们推出的 Goodles 这类产品。

You know, they're offering, products, and I I bring up, like, for example, Goodles.

对吧？

Right?

就是那种更健康的通心粉奶酪品牌。

And, you know, the the the the better for you mac and cheese brand.

对吧？

Right?

凯洛格的通心粉奶酪，到底垄断这个市场多少年了？

How many decades has Kraft Mac and Cheese really dominated that that segment of the market?

对吧？

Right?

而且那本来就是种安慰食品。

And and it was comfort food.

说实话，我自己有时候也会吃。

And and, you know, I I sometimes, you know, consume consume that as well.

但如果有个更好的品牌，用料更健康、品质更高、风味更有创新，那作为消费者，我和其他人就会想：嘿。

But if there's a better brand that is is is healthier, it's better quality, you know, ingredients, offers more flavor innovation, you know, that's causing me as a consumer and the consumer at large to be like, hey.

我宁愿多花点钱，买一个不仅更健康、还能带来新口味体验的产品。

Like, you know, I'll I'd rather be, paying a little bit more, but, you know, for a product that is not only better for me, but it also, you know, adds a little bit more flavor innovation.

对吧？

Right?

所以这只是其中一个例子。

So they're just one, you know, one example.

还有另一个，比如 Simple Mills。

You know, another, you is know, Simple Mills.

他们去年被Flowers Food收购了，是一款更健康的饼干。

They got bought up by Flowers Food, you know, last year, a better for you cracker.

对吧？

Right?

你明白吧？

You know?

他们真正抓住了目标人群，尤其是家庭中的女性，那些希望给孩子提供更健康零食的妈妈们。

And, you know, really, they they they connected with their target demographic, you know, families, especially female, you know, female, like, that females that that are in families and they wanna, you know, wanna feed their kids kids better better a better for you snack.

这些正是正在挑战行业巨头的新兴品牌。

Like, these are these are the challenger brands that that are out out competing the big incumbents.

对吧？

Right?

我的观点是，消费者已经准备好接受改变了。

And so, the consumer is ready for change is my point.

我觉得新兴品牌正在抓住这个机会，提供了更高的感知价值。

And and challenger brands are, I think, rising to the occasion, and they're they're delivering a better perceived value.

我说的是‘感知到的价值’。

And I I said perceived.

对吧？

Right?

因为消费者愿意多花点钱，只要产品能带来不一样的体验。

You so because consumers are willing to pay a little bit more if it if it offers a differentiated experience.

现在这些新兴品牌正是这么做的，真的很让人振奋。

That's what challenger brands are are are are are doing right now, and it's exciting.

这正是我今天在食品饮料行业看到的最令人兴奋的一点。

And that's one of the the the the exciting things I I I see in the food and beverage industry today.

我同意。

I agree.

去年Banquet做了一项研究，显示新兴品牌虽然只占了1%的销售额，却贡献了至少40%的增长。

I mean, mean, last year, Banquet had a really good study about, you know, 1% of revenues coming from challenger brands in this country, but at least 40% of the growth.

真的没想到。

Like, woah.

怎么回事？

What's happening?

我觉得这简直让人震惊。

And I find it just shocking.

现代苏打水根本不是那两大巨头发明的。

I mean, that modern soda was not invented was not invented by the two juggernauts.

我到现在还有点难以置信，布莱恩。

I mean, I just I'm still kinda wrapping my head around that, Brian.

我不太确定。

I don't know.

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

不是。

No.

没错。

Absolutely.

而且很多因素其实都是慢慢积累起来的。

And and and a lot of it was, like it it was it's a culmination of things.

对吧？

Right?

这不是单靠某一个原因，我觉得是因为那些大公司多年来一直赚得盆满钵满，所以他们就觉得，嗯……

It's not just one thing that's you know, I think because they you know, the big incumbents have just been so profitable for so many years and so many decades, they're like, hey.

我们干嘛要改配方呢？

Why do we need why do why do we need to change the formula?

但消费者，尤其是从新冠疫情开始，我觉得那是个转折点，消费者突然意识到……

But the consumer, as we've seen, really since COVID, I would say the COVID was a you know, a defining moment, you know, for for consumers where it was like, yeah.

他们开始想，天啊。

They're like, wow.

我到底在干嘛？

What what what am I what am I doing?

我这一生到底在忙些什么？

It's it's it's what am I doing with my life?

我该怎么养活我的家人？

How am I feeding my family?

我想感觉更好一些。

I wanna be I wanna be, you know, feeling better.

我想吃得更健康。

I wanna be eating healthier.

我想少喝点酒。

I wanna be drinking less alcohol.

这确实是个关键转折点，消费者开始认真思考：

So that really was, like, the I I think a a key moment that consumers were really thinking about, hey.

他们想改变。

They wanna change.

他们想变得更好。

They wanna change for the better.

对吧？

Right?

再加上新一届政府推动的MAHA运动，你也知道，

Then you have even, you know, with the new administration, you know, the the the focus on the whole MAHA movement.

对吧？

Right?

而且我知道我们待会儿还会聊到新的膳食金字塔，但这也正在深刻改变产品的生产方式，还有餐饮服务场所——比如开始用牛油替代植物油，

And and and it's you know, that's also I know we're gonna be talking about that later with the new food pyramid, but that's also causing significant change in, in the way products are manufactured, in in the way food service establishments, like, you know, shifting out seed oils in, you know, with with beef tallow.

我们看到这种趋势越来越多，消费者也确实想要这样的产品。

Like, we're seeing more and more of that, and consumers want that.

挺有意思的。

It it's interesting.

我之前看到一个广告，那家餐饮店在宣传说：

Like, I was I was looking at one commercial, and the food service establishment were they were promoting, hey.

我们特地推出牛油炸薯条。

We have specifically beef tallow fries.

对吧？

Right?

所以他们用这个，是因为消费者在往这个方向走。

And so they're using it because it's moving the consumer.

消费者对这个挺好奇的。

Consumers are curious there.

比如说，

Like, hey.

也许不只是味道更好，还跟新的膳食指南更吻合。

Maybe, you know, not only does it taste better for them, but maybe, you know, they're it's kind of aligning with the new food pyramid.

对吧？

Right?

这算是一种更健康的产品。

And it's a it's a quote better for you, you know, type of type of product.

这是多种因素共同作用的结果，真正推动了这场变革，让它成了焦点。

So it's a combination a culmination of factors, right, that's, you know, really, really kind of driving driving this change and bringing it to the forefront.

这点毫无疑问。

No question.

我再补充一点，然后Rachel，该你提问了。

Just one last build on that, and then, Rachel, let's get you in here for a question.

我觉得这件事宣传得还不够。

I just don't think it's being publicized enough.

我是说，新的膳食指南，政府政策都已经跟上了。

I mean, the new food pyramid, I mean, government policy is following that.

但好像没多少人在讨论这个。

I don't think enough people are talking about that.

比如SNAP，这在快消品行业挺重要的。

For example, snap snap, which kinda matters in the FMCG world.

没错。

Absolutely.

饮料领域也一样重要。

It matters for beverages.

我的意思是，现在至少有二十个州，比如佛罗里达，都已经这么做了。

I mean, snap now in at least 20 states, big ones like Florida Mhmm.

得克萨斯州这些地方，直接告诉你含糖饮料和其他饮品对健康有害。

Texas, they are they're basically telling you soda and other Yeah.

产品对健康有危害。

Products are hazardous for your health.

没错。

Yes.

你根本买不到这些产品。

And you cannot buy them.

这在我们国家历史上可是头一回。

I mean, that's never happened in the history of this country before.

想想这事儿，真有点不可思议。

And I just like, that's a bit wild to think about.

所以我总觉得，那食物金字塔，有些人就随便应付一句，哦，是吧。

So I just think the food pyramid, some people are just kinda like, oh, yeah.

等一下。

Hold on a minute.

这其实影响着资金的流向，你知道的。

Like, it's influencing, like, you know, financial flow.

总之，Rachel，我就想提一下这件事。

So, anyway, Rachel, I just wanted to mention that.

对。

Yeah.

我倒是很想接着聊一聊这个新版的膳食金字塔。

I mean, I'd love to build on that and talk a little bit more about the new food food pyramid.

也许我们可以问问Brian，你觉得大型快消品公司应对这个变化最大的难点会在哪儿？

And maybe we can talk a bit to Brian of where do you think the real friction point will be for large CPGs trying to respond to this.

是的。

Yeah.

这问题确实挺复杂的。

It's it's it's such a it's a complex question.

每家公司都有自己的不同策略。

Every company has a different different strategy.

我觉得那些更支持特朗普和RFK的公司，还有他们的管理层，其实一直走在变革的前列。

I would say that the companies and the leadership of these companies that are more aligned with, you know, with Trump and and and RFK, they've been they're you know, they've been more, like, leading the change.

还有一些食品饮料公司立场没那么明确，它们现在就在观望，想着……

I think there are other food and beverage companies that, are less aligned, and, they're, you know, they're thinking, okay.

可能它们在关注中期选举的情况。

Maybe, you know, they're they're looking at sort of, like, the midterm elections.

对吧？

Right?

比如，万一政权转向民主党那边，新政府会多大力度推动实施，或者鼓励大家向这个新食物金字塔靠拢，这些都会影响它们的决策。

Like, with the with, you know, with the potential shift, you know, to the democratic side and, you know, what that will mean in terms of, like, how aggressive, you know, a new administration, if that were to come come to pass, would be on on implementation or sort of, like, encouraging kind of more more shifts in in towards that kind of the the the new new food food pyramid.

所以我觉得，董事会里头其实正在悄悄算这笔账。

So I think there is a there is a math there's some math happening, like, you know, within board board board rooms, you know, on that.

我想强调的一点是，这个新食物金字塔已经被左右两派都高度政治化了。

The of you know, I think the the the one point that I I that I wanted to make is that this whole new food permit has been highly politicized, both from the right and the left.

你看看旧版膳食指南和新版膳食指南的核心内容，大部分其实是一致的。

When you look at the core components of the old food permit versus the new food the new food permit, the majority is pretty consistent.

对吧？

Right?

所以我觉得，消费者和食品饮料公司都该意识到，新版和旧版膳食指南的相似之处远多于差异。

So, you know, I think it's important for, you know, for consumers and for, you know, food and beverage companies to recognize that there's a lot more similarity than differences you know, within within the food per you know, food pyramid.

对吧？

Right?

还是建议每天摄入大约2000卡路里。

It's still a 2,000 calorie around, 2,000 calorie diet.

还是强调吃真正的食物。

It's still, you know, emphasizing, you know, real food.

对吧？

Right?

真正的蛋白质。

Real protein.

它更强调减少超加工食品，限制饮酒，多吃水果蔬菜，每天吃两到四份，或者三到五份。

It's emphasizing, you know, less ultra processed foods, you know, limiting alcohol, eating eating, you know, you know, fruits and vegetables, like, two to four servings or three to five servings.

所以，其实相似的地方远多于不同之处。

So there's a lot more similarity.

至于争议点，比如左派那边，他们不认为红肉饮食和高脂饮食能算得上真正的健康饮食。

Now where there is some contention or disagreements, you know, for those that are on on the left, they don't they don't believe that a red meat diet, you know, and a full fat diet is something that, like, you know, is consistent with the with with that with the, quote, healthy healthy diet.

美国心脏协会和其他一些独立机构也持这种观点。

And this is, you know, from the American Heart Association and other independent organizations as well.

他们更倾向于植物性蛋白，还有用种子油替代其他油脂。

They they lean more towards kind of plant, you know, plant protein, the use of seed oils rather than.

这背后其实是理念的差异，也涉及对数据和科学证据的不同解读。

Again, it's it's it's it's a difference in philosophy and also, you know, interpreting the actual data and the scientific evidence.

对吧？

Right?

所以这是其中一点。

So that is one.

第二个是，巴里，你刚才提到过这个。

A second one is, you know, Barry, you you you mentioned this.

在新的食品标准下，他们对超加工食品的关注简直到了极致。

The alt the the it they're hyper focused at ultra processed food under the new food food permit.

对吧？

Right?

他们声称超加工食品对健康有害，并且把这种危害和慢性病直接联系起来。

So, you know, they're they're they're making the claim that ultra processed ultra processed foods, it's it's detrimental to your health, and they're making the link to chronic disease.

他们把超加工食品和慢性病的关系说得非常明确。

Like, the they're they're making a strong connection to chronic diseases.

对吧？

Right?

那我会把所有加工食品都归为坏的吗？

So, would I classify all all, you know, processed foods as bad?

不会。

No.

对吧？

Right?

但很多人觉得，根据新规定，所有加工食品都被一概归为‘不健康’一类。

But there is perception that under the new under the new guidelines, they're putting all processed foods in sort of, like, a, quote, bad category.

对吧？

Right?

我觉得这种说法不公平。

And so which I I I don't think is I I don't think is fair.

对吧？

Right?

这也是一个有争议的点。

So that's also a point, you know, point of contention.

是的。

But yeah.

不对。

No.

我觉得这更多是政治问题。

I I I think, I think it's more about politics.

媒体上很多说法其实跟政治有关，而不是事实本身。

A lot a lot of the rhetoric around media is more about politics and what's actually real.

再强调一下，呃。

And and, you know, again, just emphasizing, hey.

其实相似的地方比不同之处多得多。

There's more a lot more similarities, you know, than than differences.

我还忘了提一点，就是新的膳食金字塔对全谷物的重视程度降低了。

One other point I I forgot to mention is that under the new food pyramid, if there is less, emphasis on whole grains.

对吧？

Right?

如果你还记得旧的膳食金字塔，底座是全谷物，大概建议每天吃五到七份。

So if you remember the the, the old food pyramid, you had the base was, like, whole grains, you know, whether it was five to seven surfing, that's about the the number.

现在他们说，呃。

They're now saying, hey.

减少摄入，多吃点蛋白质，或者真正的食物。

Reduce that and eat more protein, or real protein or real food.

对吧？

Right?

这也算是一个转变。

That's that's also, like, a a shift as well.

所以你看，新膳食金字塔把整个结构给翻过来了，挺有意思的。

So, you know, it's interesting how they inverted the under the new food pyramid, inverted the the pyramid.

对吧？

Right?

我觉得这其实是一种表态。

I think it was a statement.

但我还是要强调一下。

But, again, I I I I emphasize, hey.

其实旧版和新版金字塔之间的共同点，远比差异多得多。

This is there's a lot more similarities than than differences between the old and the new pyramid.

所以

So

但确实很有趣。

But totally interesting.

这个观点特别有意思。

That's a really interesting point.

其实，新旧金字塔之间的相似之处远多于差异，我觉得这是个非常独特的见解。

Just there are there are more similarities than differences, which I think is a really, really unique point.

另外，新的食物金字塔也契合了当下消费者越来越关注健康与养生的趋势，正如你之前说的，布莱恩，这确实是重点。

Then the other thing too is the new food pyramid is also in line with kind of the wave of shoppers and consumers we see that are focused on their health and their wellness, which is a a big focal point, as you said too, Brian.

比如那些新兴品牌，它们之所以能成功，很大程度上是因为透明的配料表和新颖的成分，而且很多产品都更注重健康和养生。

Like, challenger brands, so much of what they're what they're winning on is transparency of ingredients and new unique ingredients, and many of them are, have a healthier sort of wellness profile.

所以，我觉得这些趋势正在慢慢汇聚在一起。

And so, there's a lot converging there, I think.

是的。

Yeah.

挺有意思的是，我还没看到像百事公司这样的企业的相关数据。

It it'll be interesting to see, and I have yet to see data, you know, for for companies like like Pepsi.

他们推出了全新的Naked薯片。

You know, they came out with their with their new naked chips.

对吧？

Right?

比如去掉食用色素，包装也少点花里胡哨的，这会挺值得关注的，因为——

So picking up you know, taking out the the food dyes and and keep keeping the packaging more, you know, less kinda flashy with kinda it'll it'll be interesting because,

你

you

说实话，不管是之前的政府还是现在的政府，大多数美国人根本就没怎么遵循过那个食物金字塔。

know, let's be honest, like, between the between even under the old like, the previous administration and and this administration, a lot of consumers really they didn't really, most most Americans didn't really follow the food pyramid.

是的。

Yeah.

你知道的。

You know?

对吧？

Let's right?

所以这大概不是你日常生活中特别在意的事。

So It probably wasn't it's not a top of mind thing in your day.

你知道，年初的时候大家谈新年决心，这种话题挺不错的。

You know, it's it's great it's great to talk about at the beginning of the year, people making New Year's resolutions and, you know, whatever.

但说实话，消费者的习惯很少会因为年份更替或政府更迭就发生巨大变化。

But, like, you know, consumer behavior rarely changes dramatically from from year to year or administration of issues.

所以。

So

但是。

but

像多力多滋这种零食的配方如果真有调整，我在想……

with the with the changes in in the in the formulation of products like a Doritos chip, I'm I'm wondering.

我正等着看实际效果会怎么样。

I'm I'm I'm waiting to see what the actual results are.

对吧？

Right?

消费者，尤其是年轻人，特别容易被颜色吸引。

Consumers are especially kind of the young demographic, they they're moved by colors.

对吧？

Right?

他们也被包装吸引，比如那种花里胡哨的包装。

They're moved by packaging, like flashy pack you know, packaging.

所以我很好奇，这个点其实没怎么被公司或者媒体认真讨论过，你知道的。

And so I'm wondering if if, yeah, it's it's I don't think this is this this point is really, really, talked about a lot, you know, with within companies or, like, in in media.

比如多力多滋辣奶酪味薯片，颜色稍微改一点点。

Just a small shift in the color from, like, a, you know, like, the the Doritos hot nacho chips.

如果是普通薯片，这变化看起来不大，但如果你面对的是个五岁、八岁的小孩，他们看到两种不同颜色，就会有明显反应，你知道的。

If it's a plain chip, I it it might seem like a small change, but, you know, when you're when you have, like, a five you know, like, a 10 year old or an eight year old and they see two different like, they don't you know, they're moved by that.

对吧？

You know?

他们就喜欢这种颜色。

They like those colors.

对吧？

Right?

你懂的。

You know?

至于味道，他们早就习惯了那些成分，你知道的，就是那些被认为不健康的配料。

And the taste they're used to the taste of, you know, of these ingredients that that, you know, that are perceived as as being unhealthy.

咱们走着瞧吧。

So we'll we'll see.

这事儿可不小。

It's it's a big deal.

我觉得这事的影响会比大多数公司和高管想象的要大得多。

I I think this is gonna be a lot a bigger deal than most companies and and executives.

他们觉得会有影响，但嘛，咱们还是走着瞧吧。

They they they think it will have, but, you know, we'll see.

我不确定你们对此有什么看法。

I don't know if you guys have any opinion on that.

是的。

Yeah.

这确实是一个转型期。

I mean, it's a it's a it's a transition time.

我认为，任何大型快消品公司最关键的就是要紧紧跟住消费者，了解他们的需求。

I think the the key for any big CPG is really to be very, very in tune with their consumer and follow their consumer.

如果他们能紧跟消费者，注意到变化，再加上AI技术能精准定位到每个人，那这就成了一场真正的战略博弈——得确保能服务好不同层次、不同世代的消费者，就像你刚才说的，布莱恩。

So if they're following their consumer and they're seeing shifts and with with AI and and and the the ability to, like, pinpoint down to that individual person, I think it's just gonna be a real strategic, you know, game to be able to ensure they're servicing all of their consumers at all different levels of kind of that wellness journey and generations as you as you pointed out too, Brian.

所以。

So

是的。

Yeah.

没错。

Absolutely.

巴里，你之前在食品研究所的网络研讨会上谈过整个酒精行业，对吧？

And and, and, Barry, you were on a on a on a webinar previously at you the Food Institute talking about the whole alcohol industry.

没错吧？

Right?

这真是巨大的转变。

Like, what a huge shift.

这根本不是什么一时潮流。

This is this is this is not a this is not, like, a a fad.

这是年轻一代饮酒习惯的根本性转变。

This is a generational shift in in consumption of of of alcohol.

年轻人群根本不再喝酒了。

And that young you know, the young demographics, they they are not drinking.

他们正在远离父母和祖父母那一代人常喝的那些产品。

They are they they're shying away from, you know, from, you know, the, the, you know, the products that the parents and grandparents, you know, they they consumed.

所以，这确实是个巨大的变化。

And so, you know, it's, it's it's it's a big it's a big change.

你知道的吧。

You know?

最终会怎样我们还得走着看，但企业必须精准锁定自己的消费者，灵活调整产品、宣传和沟通方式，贴合这些目标人群。

And, we'll see how this ultimately kinda where it ultimately shakes out, but, companies really need to be hyperfocused on who their consumer is and being able to adapt products and the messaging and the communication to those to those, target demographics.

布莱恩，我想为我们的对话做个收尾。

Brian, I wanted to just finish us off in our conversation.

当你把健康趋势、成本压力和风味全球化联系起来的时候，

And, you know, when you connect, like, health evolution, value pressure, flavor globalization?

到2026年，一个成功的食品或饮料产品应该是什么样子？

What does a winning food or beverage product actually look like in 2026?

这是个好问题。

That's a great question.

我觉得关键在于不能搞一刀切。

I I think it's it's not it's it's a strategy of you can't have the one size fits all.

对吧？

Right?

其实没有哪一款产品是万能的。

I don't you know, there's no one product.

总的来说，你得找一种对健康更有益的食品或饮料，不过这个说法本身挺宽泛的。

Like, I I would say in broad strokes, you're looking for a food and beverage product that is better for you, again, like, that's a very loose term.

对吧？

Right?

我觉得这会是一个关键方向，食品饮料行业必须重点关注这一点。

But I think that's that's gonna be a a key, a a key sort of a a focus that should be a key focus for for, for food and beverage.

消费者看重的是 perceived value，但不同人对价值的理解不一样，有些人觉得价格低就是值，

It's gonna be one of perceived value so that not you know, for the you know, for some consumers, that might be a lower price point.

另一些人则希望产品比市场上现有的多点什么。

For another, it it might be adding a little bit more than what is currently out, you know, out there in the marketplace.

可能是健康功效，也可能是独特的风味，或者来自全球的口味创新。

So so whether it's a health component, maybe it's a, you know, different type of flavor or global flavors.

第三点，消费者想要的是体验。

And and I would say three, like, consumers want experience.

对吧？

Right?

他们早就厌倦了千篇一律的东西。

Like, they're tired of the same old same old.

对吧？

Right?

当我看看那些公司时，咱们不妨换个角度，看看餐饮服务这一块。

And and and, you know, when I look at, you know, companies like, you know what you know, let's let's even shift to the kind of food service side.

你看看Kava在做些什么，他们可是在颠覆传统，你说是不是？

When you look at what, you know, what what Kava's doing, they are disrupting that's you know?

而且他们的价格并不便宜。

And and and and it's not it's not cheap.

你知道的。

You know?

他们的定价比Chipotle还要高。

They have a higher price point than a Chipotle.

对吧？

Right?

但他们推出了新口味。

But they're offering new flavors.

用的食材也更健康。

They're offering better for you sort of ingredients.

你知道的。

You know?

而且他们的创新能力真的特别强。

And and, yeah, their their innovation pipeline is just amazing.

时不时就推出新的限时新品。

Like, they're coming up with new flavors, like LTOs all the time.

关键是要跟上消费者变化的步伐。

And so it's being able to, you know, innovate at the pace of where your consumer is.

不同人群的需求可能不一样，但消费者都期待新鲜感。

And that might mean different different things depending on the target demographic, but consumers want innovation.

他们希望在吃喝中也能感受到这种体验。

They want to experience that in what they're eating and drinking.

所以，总的来说，这就是食品饮料公司在2026年成功的秘诀。

So I would say those in in very broad strokes are, you know, the winning formula for food and beverage companies in 2026.

Brian，今天这场对话真的很棒。

Well, Brian, this has been a great conversation.

很高兴今天能邀请到你，非常感谢你参与我们的节目。

I'm really happy to have had you on today, and, thanks so much for joining us.

是的。

Yeah.

谢谢你们邀请我。

Thanks for having me.

谢谢你，Brian。

Thank you, Brian.

和你们聊天特别开心。

Was great chatting with you guys.

另外，谢谢。

And, yeah, thank you.

好的，巴里。

Alright, Barry.

和布莱恩的这次对话真是受益匪浅。

Well, really insightful discussion with Brian.

很高兴请他来做客。

I'm so happy to have him on.

我们最近刚和食品研究所合作过他们的网络研讨会和播客项目，能继续合作确实很棒。

I know we were recently a part of The Food Institute's webinars and and podcast opportunities, so it's it's great to, to collaborate with them for sure.

接下来给大家分享我们的五大要点。

So here for our audience is our top five.

第一，我们谈到了消费者展望和价值导向，随着2026年逐步推进，这一点越来越明显。

Number one, we talked about the consumer outlook and the value mindset, that we're seeing as we move further into 2026.

布莱恩提到消费者信心疲软，他认为这一点被快消品和零售业的领导者们严重低估了。

And Brian, was talking about weak consumer confidence, and he believes it remains underappreciated by CPG and retail leaders.

我们谈到了密歇根大学消费者信心指数徘徊在50左右，而历史平均水平是100。

We talked about the University of Michigan confidence index hovering near 50 versus the historical norm of a 100.

消费者正承受着经济压力，正如布赖恩所说，他们越来越注重性价比。

Consumers are under financial pressure, increasingly value obsessed is what Brian said.

现在的性价比要么体现在更低的价格上，也可能体现在能让人觉得物有所值的质量上。

And value now means either lower prices, but also it could mean quality that justifies the cost.

这一点我们在凯度经常提到。

So we always talk about that at Kantar.

我们一直强调，性价比不只是价格低，这一点在2026年还会持续下去。

It's it's always value beyond price, and and that's certainly, continuing into, 2026.

我们还简单聊了百事公司对乐事薯片和零食的降价，这其实反映了我们当前所处的现实。

And we talked a little bit about PepsiCo's price cuts on Lay's chips and snacks really reflecting the reality that we're in.

第二点，我们讨论了Z世代、Alpha世代和年长消费者之间的差异。

Number two, we talked a bit about demographic differences between Gen Z, Gen Alpha, and older shoppers.

消费者的行为正变得越来越分散。

Consumer behavior is increasingly fragmented.

从年龄来看，Z世代的购买力大约比X世代低三分之一，但他们的影响力依然很大，尤其受到社交媒体、创作者社群以及品牌真实性的影响，而不仅仅是价格。

By age, Gen Z has roughly one third less purchasing power than Gen X, but remains highly influential, particularly driven by social media and and the kind of creator community and the importance of brand authenticity beyond just price.

所以对这一代人来说，价值就体现在这些方面。

So that's where the value is for the that generation.

而年长的消费者更倾向于通过好市多、山姆会员店这样的渠道来省钱。

And then older consumers prioritize savings through channels like Costco, Sam's Club.

再来看年轻一代，比如我儿子这一代，属于Alpha世代。

And then you have your younger consumers like my my son's, Gen Alpha.

他们天生就是数字原住民，这进一步说明，针对不同群体制定精准的营销策略，远比一刀切的广告更重要。

They're more digitally native, reinforcing the need for just sharply differentiated strategies by cohort rather than broad one size fits all marketing.

第三点，我们谈到了高端化与性价比的结合。

And number three, we talked about premiumization meets value.

高收入群体的消费依然占到总支出的六成左右，但就连他们也在重新定义‘性价比’，思考这对他们来说到底意味着什么。

So upper income consumers still account for somewhere around 60% spend, but even this group is redefining value and the importance of what value means to them.

高收入消费者现在越来越多地转向沃尔玛和好市多，去买那些他们觉得物有所值的高端商品，比如打折的高端葡萄酒，我们就举过这个例子。

High income shoppers are increasingly turning to Walmart and also Costco for premium items at perceived deals, like discounted high end wines was one of the examples that we talked about.

不过，消费能力与资产市场紧密相关，在当前这个资产主导的经济中，高端需求很容易受到市场波动的影响。

However, spending power is closely tied to, asset markets, in this asset economy we're in, leaving premium demand vulnerable to volatility in those markets.

所以，面向高端消费者的品牌必须保持灵活，准备好应对持续的变化。

So brands targeting premium consumers must stay agile and prepare for, you know, continued shifts.

Brian提到的第四点，他说2026年将是挑战者品牌的元年。

Number four that Brian talked about, he talked about, this year, 2026, as the year of the challenger brand.

我本来觉得过去三年已经是挑战者品牌的时代了，但他根据他们观察到的所有趋势，坚信今年情况会更明显——这些品牌会继续超越老牌企业，行动更快，创新更大胆、更激进，也在数字和社交媒体上与消费者建立更紧密、更真实的连接。

I mean, I thought the last three years were the challenger brand years, but he really believes that based on everything they're seeing, more of the same this year, they're gonna continue to outpace incumbents, move faster, innovate more boldly, more daring, and connecting maybe better and more authentically on digital and social channels.

他举的谷歌的例子特别典型，想想卡夫的通心粉和奶酪，现在发生了什么变化。

And certainly his Google's example is a fantastic one as you think about kind of, you know, Kraft and mac and cheese and what's happening there.

很多这类挑战者品牌，其实更受Yuka用户的青睐。

And so many of those challenger brands, they're just preferred by Yuka.

这个应用正在发生深刻的变化。

And that, you know, that app is really changing.

它确实正在改变人们的购物方式。

It's certainly changing how people shop.

所以我觉得，这其实是个很好的提醒，说明挑战型品牌的发展势头还在继续。

And so, I just thought that was a, you know, a good reminder that this momentum with challenger brands continues.

然后第六点，或者该说第五点吧，他最后提到了饮食指南和相关政策。

And then number six, just kinda or I should say, number five, just, kind of rounding up here is he talked about, you know, dietary guidelines, you know, policy.

我们聊了聊新的食物金字塔，结果很明显，真正天然的食物、在家做饭才是赢家，也就是蛋白质、水果和蔬菜这些，同时消费者对超加工食品、糖分的兴趣确实在下降，这也跟政府的策略息息相关。

We discussed, you know, the new, food pyramid and how, you know, who wins here is kinda real food, cooking at home, which is sort of, you know, preferred with that narrative, protein, fruits, and vegetables, and, you know, definitely reducing the consumer interest in ultra processed foods and sugar and then how that's relating to government strategy.

你懂的。

You know?

现在连SNAP项目都开始禁止购买含糖饮料了，哪怕是零卡路里的调味饮料，因为里面有人工添加剂——这在那些大州可是个重大转变。

Now we have SNAP, which, for example, is banning soft drink consumption even, like, you know, zero flavored soft drinks because of the artificial ingredients, which is a real sea change in in very big states.

这么说吧，现代健康、食物金字塔，还有消费者的需求，都迎来了一个新时代。

And so, it's a it's a new day, if you will, for modern health, the food pyramid, and customers want change.

他们确实更想要健康的选择。

They definitely want healthier.

他们也期待新的口味。

They want new flavors.

他们想要来自全球的灵感和实实在在的创新，围绕更健康的生活方式。

They want global inspiration and visible innovation, around better for you.

食品和饮料领域现在有很多动向，他们确实做得非常到位。

So plenty going on in food and beverages, and and, certainly, they do a great job covering it.

太棒了，巴里。

Awesome, Barry.

好了，这期节目到这里就结束了。

Well, that does bring us to the end of this episode.

感谢来自食品研究所的布莱恩参与我们的讨论。

Thank you to Brian, from The Food Institute for for joining our discussion.

希望你们喜欢本期节目。

We hope you enjoyed our show.

一如既往，感谢收听卡特尔零售声音片段播客。

And as always, thanks for listening to the Kantar Retail Sound Bites podcast.

我们也非常希望你们能在收听的平台给我们打分和留言评价。

And we'd love for you to rate and review us on wherever you're listening.

那太好了。

That would be fantastic.

你们随时可以在LinkedIn上联系我和拉切尔，特别要感谢维多利亚负责制作和推广我们的播客，让这一切成为可能。

You can always reach out to, Rachel and I on LinkedIn, and especially wanna thank Victoria for producing and marketing our podcast and really just making it happen.

谢谢大家，我们两周后再见。

So thank you, everyone, and we'll see you in two weeks.