本集简介
双语字幕
仅展示文本字幕，不包含中文音频；想边听边看，请使用 Bayt 播客 App。
感谢您选择卢克的英语播客。
Thank you for choosing Luke's English podcast.
如需收听更多包含特定词汇和发音教学的剧集，享受无广告收听体验、访问高级社区并支持本播客，请前往 teacherluke.co.uk/premium 注册 LEP 高级会员。
For more episodes with specific vocabulary and pronunciation teaching, plus ad free listening, access to the premium community, and to show your support for the podcast, sign up to LEP Premium at teacherluke.co.uk/premium.
您正在收听卢克的英语播客。
You're listening to Luke's English podcast.
如需更多信息，请访问 teacherluke.podomatic.com。
For more information, visit teacherluke.podomatic.com.
你好。
Hello.
您正在收听卢克的英语播客，这是我和堂弟奥利弗最近的一次对话的第二部分。
You're listening to Luke's English podcast, and this is part two of the conversation I had with my cousin Oliver recently.
好的。
Right.
刚才我们稍微休息了一下。
So we've had a little short break there.
我们继续吧。
Let's let's move on.
奥利，拿那个非斯帽。
Ollie, take the Fez.
好的。
Okay.
让我在这儿挑一个。
Let me pick one out here.
好的。
Okay.
模拟与数字。
Analogue versus digital.
模拟与数字。
Analogue versus digital.
所以
So
假设我们谈论的是音乐，是的。
let's say if we're talking about music Yeah.
录制音乐。
Recording music.
那么，什么是模拟，什么是数字？
Well, what is analog and what is digital?
你应该了解这个。
You should know about this.
你是那种做广播和声音录制的人。
You're the sort of you're the broadcasting sound recording guy.
是的。
Yeah.
这真的很难。
That's really difficult.
我应该懂这个。
I should know that.
所以模拟信号是连续的，真实地反映了
So analog is when it's just a kind of it's continual and it's a true reflection of
我觉得这基本上是一种传输数据的方式，对吧？
I think it's a way of sending data, basically, isn't it?
对吧？
Right?
例如，模拟数据以波的形式传输，而数字数据则以二进制代码，即零和一的形式传输。
So for example, analogue data comes through in waves, whereas digital data comes through in binary code, naughts and ones.
是的，没错。
Yeah, that's true.
没错。
That's true.
我觉得数字信号能比模拟信号承载更多的数据。
And somehow I think that you can fit a lot more data through a digital signal than you can through an analog signal.
其实这更多是关于如何存储数据，而不是如何捕捉数据。
Well, it's it's actually more about how you store that data than how you capture it.
这是因为，
This is how because,
你知道，MP3是一个数字文件。
you know, you can an m p three is a digital file.
你可以存储大量的数据，而黑胶唱片是模拟的。
You can store masses of data on there, whereas a a vinyl disc is analog.
对。
Right.
当播放时，唱针会划过唱片表面，直接读取刻在表面的那些波形。
And has a capture, you you the the needle runs across the surface and and it it directly reads whatever that those waveforms are that are scratched into the surface.
也许我们应该缩小范围，谈谈黑胶和数字的区别。
Maybe we should just narrow this down and talk about vinyl versus digital.
好的。
Okay.
对。
Right.
所以我们是在讨论听黑胶唱片和听MP3播放器上的音乐。
So we're talking about listening to music on a vinyl record or listening to music on an m p three player.
是的。
Yes.
好的。
Okay.
我们可以这么做。
We can do that.
优缺点。
Pros and cons.
那我们先从黑胶唱片说起。
So let's start with vinyl.
你第一时间觉得哪一个更优选？
Which one immediately comes to your mind as being preferable?
嗯，单从便利性来说，应该是数字音乐吧？
Well, just for sheer convenience, is that is digital?
是的。
Yes.
但黑胶唱片是一种真实的再现。
But vinyl is a true reflection.
你可以稍微刮擦它。
You can kind of scratch with it.
所以马歇尔·麦克卢汉说，当一种技术被取代时，只有在被取代的那一刻，你才能意识到它的优势所在。
So Marshall McLuhan says that when one technology gets superseded, it's only when at the point at which it gets superseded, you recognise what its strengths are.
好的。
Okay.
这就像是，当另一种技术取代了旧技术时，我们才意识到旧技术的所有优点。
So that's like when, for example, another technology replaces a previous one, at that moment we realise all the good things about the previous one.
没错。
That's right.
直到CD取代黑胶唱片之前，人们还在说：‘唉，黑胶唱片真烦人，又大又容易刮花，唱针还会跳，我们需要找点更好的东西。’
So up until the point where CDs replaced vinyl, people were going, oh, I I can't you know, vinyl is so annoying, they're so big, they they get scratched, the needle jumps, we, you know, we need to find something better.
然后CD出现了，突然取代了黑胶，人们开始说：哦，但黑胶其实更好，音质更棒。
And then CDs come along and suddenly they replace vinyl and people start going, oh, but vinyl was better, the sound quality was better.
没错。
Exactly.
你可以刮擦唱片，你知道的。
You could scratch the records, you know.
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
它们要好得多得多。
It it they they were much much better.
比如，如果你听《佩珀军士》的黑胶版，
Like, if you listen to Sgt.
它的音质比CD版本好上一倍。
Pepper on vinyl, it sounds a 100% better than it does on the CD version.
是的
Yeah.
你可以加快或减慢播放速度。
You could speed them up and slow them down.
使用黑胶唱片时你能有更多的控制权。
You have more control with vinyl.
是的
Yeah.
是的
Yeah.
是的
Yeah.
黑胶唱片开始播放时那种沙沙声让人感到非常愉悦。
There's something very pleasant about the crackling sound that you get at the beginning of a vinyl record.
是的
Yeah.
但它们真的更好吗？
But are they really better?
这就是关键。
So this is the thing.
基本上，模拟音乐带有美好的怀旧情感，但说实话，数字音乐就是更好，不是吗？
Basically, analog has nice kind of nostalgic associations, but let's be honest, digital is just better, isn't it?
真的吗？
Really.
嗯，我们失去了 vinyl 带来的一些东西。
Well, know, we've lost something that we had in vinyl.
你失去了即兴发挥的感觉。
You lose your spontaneity.
那种从唱片收藏中取出一张唱片，放到唱机上，把唱针放上去，就这么简单的感觉。
And that sense of, you know, getting a record out of your record collection, placing it on your record player, putting the needle on the record, and that's it.
那就是你正在听的唱片。
That's the record that you're listening to.
是的。
Yeah.
就是这样。
That's it.
你知道，切换起来要难得多，很难停下这张唱片去换另一张。
Know, it's much harder to switch, to stop that record, to switch to another one.
因为当我回家后，你知道，我在电脑上听音乐时，很少只是让音乐一直播放。
Because when I get home, you know, when I listen to music on my computer, I rarely just let the music play.
我总是在不停地切换。
I'm always fiddling around.
就像总是想播放下一首。
It's like playing the next Or
你很少会完整地听一张专辑。
you rarely put a whole album.
如果是新专辑，你通常只会挑自己喜欢的几首歌听，不会给它时间在你心里慢慢展开。
If a new album, you kind of pick the tunes you like most, and you don't get give it time to kind of develop in your mind.
是的。
Yeah.
当我们用黑胶唱片听音乐时，其实别无选择。
And and when when we had music on vinyl, you had you had no choice really.
你只能把所有歌曲都听一遍。
You just had to listen to all of the songs.
是的。
Yeah.
艺术家拥有更多控制权。
The artist had more control.
是的。
Yeah.
这意味着你可能会接触到稍微更有趣一些的音乐。
And and that meant that you were exposed to slightly more interesting music perhaps.
但另一方面，有了数字音乐，我们现在能更容易地分享音乐，因此大多数人电脑里的音乐数量都超过了以往黑胶唱片收藏的总量。
But then again, with digital, now we can share music a lot more easily, and so you have most people have more music now in their computers than they ever did before in their vinyl collections.
是的。
Yeah.
而且它更易获取，因为就在你指尖可及之处。
And it's a lot more accessible because it's just there at your fingertips.
所以也许我们现在接触到的音乐比以前更多了，但我们在听音乐的方式上，是否还和以前用黑胶唱片时一样呢？
So maybe now we actually get exposed to more music than we did before, but do we listen to it in the same way as we did when we had vinyl?
确实如此。
That's true.
我觉得如今更多是关于分享音乐，而不是体验音乐。
I think it's more about sharing music than it is about experiencing it these days.
对我来说，最好的情况是，有人拥有一个很棒的黑胶唱片收藏，并且有足够的时间把所有这些黑胶唱片都导入电脑。
You know what's the best for me is when someone has got a fantastic collection of vinyl records and they've got enough time to put all of those vinyl records into their computer.
所以他们把唱机连接到电脑，进行数字化处理。
So they hook up their record player to the computer They digitize.
然后把所有黑胶唱片都数字化。
And they digitize all the vinyl.
这太棒了，因为你仍然能听到黑胶唱片的沙沙声，仍然能感受到温暖的模拟音质，但你却可以把它们存在你的MP3播放器里。
And that's brilliant because you still get the crackle of the vinyl, you still get the warm analog sound, but you've got it on your m p three player.
好的。
Okay.
这正是我最喜欢的。
That's my favourite.
所以，好吧，答案就是：模拟音乐，但以数字技术的形式呈现。
So, okay, that's the answer, sort of like analog music but in the form of digital technology.
对。
Right.
下一个。
Next.
钟表时间 versus 该怎么说呢？
Clock time versus how do you say that?
体验时间。
Experiential time.
钟表时间与体验时间。
Clock time versus experiential time.
对。
Right.
现在是你选了这个。
Now you chose that.
这到底是什么意思？
What's that all about?
嗯，时间就像是钟表将一天均匀地划分为秒、分、小时，而且它不会停止。
Well, time is is kind of how the clock very regularly divides up the day into seconds and minutes and hours, and it doesn't stop.
它不会加快。
It doesn't speed up.
它也不会变慢。
It doesn't slow down.
它只是以一种恒定的方式持续前进。
It just continually marches on within a regular way.
嗯。
Mhmm.
而主观时间是你个人对时间流逝的体验。
Whereas experiential time is your personal experience of how time passes.
好的。
Okay.
所以你知道，当你在等一个人，处于稍微不舒服的境地，有点不耐烦时，那段时光会显得比你真正享受时——比如——漫长得多。
So you know, if you're waiting for someone and you're in a slightly uncomfortable situation, and you're a bit sort of impatient, that time seems to last last a lot longer than say when you're really enjoying yourself or you're Mhmm.
你正在演奏音乐，完全沉浸其中。
You you're playing music and you're lost in that music.
不知不觉间，时间就过去了。
And before you know it, you know, time has passed.
所以有时，当你亲身体验时，时间似乎会变慢或变快。
So sometimes it feels like as you experience it, time seems to slow down or speed up.
没错。
Exactly.
而时钟则像一种标准化的、固定不变的时间速率。
Whereas the clock is like a regular kind of standardized speed of time.
所以人们常说，当你玩得开心时，时间过得飞快。
So like they say that time flies when you're having fun.
是的。
Yeah.
但当你感到无聊，比如等公交车时，你会真的在数分钟、数秒，感觉时间怎么也走不快。
But when let's say when you're bored, when you're waiting for a bus, you're literally counting the minutes or counting the seconds and you it just can't go any faster.
太慢了。
It's so slow.
所以对于钟表时间，我总觉得有点像是个奴隶，
So So clock time, you kind of feel like you're a slight for me, I feel a bit of a slave to
钟表时间。
Clock time.
钟表时间。
Clock time.
而且，你知道，我会比以往更频繁地看表，把一天分成若干段，那种浪费时间的感觉，诸如此类的事情，都是由人类对钟表时间的观念强加给你的。
And that, you know, you're I I thought of looking at the my watch more than I ever used to and dividing days up into segments, and feeling like I'm the idea of wasting time, all that kind of stuff is forced upon you by this human notion of clock time.
我觉得这对我来说是
I think that it's I
我更倾向于体验式时间。
prefer experiential time.
但问题是，为了真正组织起任何事情，为了让人们以同步的方式做事。
But the thing is for us to actually organise anything, for people to do things in a synchronised way.
例如，如果你在办公室工作，如果你想确保开个会，并且希望每个人都在同一时间到达，你就得使用钟表时间，不是吗？
For example, if you work in your office, if you want to make sure that you have a meeting and you want everyone to arrive at the meeting at the same time, you have to use clock time, don't you?
你不能只说，你感觉到了时间就来吧，因为那样每个人都会在不同时间到达。
You can't just say, come when, you know, you feel like it's time to come because then everyone will arrive at different times.
是的。
No.
但以前，你会挨个去找每个人，召集他们，然后问：嘿，你有空吗？
But previously, would you would kind of go to each person, gather them, and say, oh, have you got time?
我们会都聚在一起。
And, you know, we'll all gather.
比如，以前是怎样的呢？
Like, an example of of being Previously?
准时开会对我来说并不能很好地说明钟表时间有多好。
When Being a meeting on time isn't a great example for me of of how great clock time is.
真的吗？
Really?
我并不一定想要开会。
I don't necessarily want meetings.
我不想被安排做别的事情。
I don't want to be I'm gonna be doing something else.
这可不是开会。
It's not a meeting.
比如说，这是一场音乐活动。
Let's say it's like a a music event.
而且，你知道，你
And, you know, you
我同意。
I agree.
它确实很有价值。
It has definitely has value.
我同意。
I I agree.
它 definitely 很有用，
It's definitely useful,
但它并不是一个问题，关于时间是否有价值或是否有用。
but it doesn't I think it's I think it's it's not a question of whether time has value or is useful.
但我觉得，我们如果没有规律的同步，就根本无法组织这个世界。
But I think it's like, we couldn't we couldn't really organize the world without regular synchronized
不。
No.
不是现在这种组织方式。
Not the way it's organized now.
没错。
That's true.
我不知道怎么能用一种灵活伸缩的方式来组织时间，
I don't know how it could be organized with with a kind of flexible stretch
比如日出日落。
of sun up and sundown.
人类在有钟表之前就存在了。
Like, humans existed before we had clocks.
这正是我要说的重点。
That's that's the point.
我认为时间早就存在了。
Think that time existed.
在我们出现之前，时间就已经存在了。
Time time has existed before we did.
是的。
Yes.
但我们过去并不像现在这样精确到秒地划分时间。
But we didn't used to divide it up second by second to that extent.
过去要宽泛得多。
It used to be much broader.
真的吗？
Did it?
对。
Yeah.
过去用的是摆钟和袜子。
Used to have pendulums and socks.
这并不是
This isn't
你的论点并不是反对时间。
this is like Your argument is not against time.
这跟你有多忙、工作中有多少事情要处理有关。
It's against how busy you are, how many things you have to do at work.
是的。
Yeah.
但时间本身并不是这里的敌人。
But it's not Time is not the enemy here.
它是
It's
不。
No.
但真正的问题在于，这种对时间的细致划分会让人们变得多么焦虑。
But it's it's it's how kind of how anxious that that degree of detailed division of time makes people.
所以你的意思是
So you're saying that
你以前可能只有三小时一大块的时间。
You just had, you know, three hour chunks, maybe.
是的。
Yeah.
我觉得这跟我有关。
I think it's about me.
你说得对。
You're right.
是的。
Yeah.
我认为你的论点并不是针对时间本身，而是因为你有很多事情要完成。
I think that I think your your argument is not with time itself, but more the fact that you have many things to achieve
没有足够的时间。
Don't have enough time.
在你的工作日里。
In your working day.
你就是没有足够
You just don't have enough
时间。
time.
是的。
Yeah.
所以你不能真的怪时间，不行。
So you can't really blame time No.
但你很忙。
But you busy.
这是钟表时间。
It's clock time.
这就是区别。
That's the difference.
这就是区别，因为钟表时间和体验时间，你必须加以区分，而不仅仅是时间。
That's the difference because time the clock time and experiential time, you have to distinguish rather than just time.
这正是关键所在。
That's the whole point.
我看到两个方面。
There are I two see.
你知道吗？
You know?
我明白了。
I see.
但你必须理解，体验时间是时间的一种完全主观的版本。
But you have to understand that experiential time is utterly subjective version of time.
但时间是主观的。
But time is subjective.
一切都是。
Everything is.
这就是重点。
That's the point.
作为人类，我们体验着一切。
As human beings, we are experiencing everything.
是的。
Yeah.
但你可以有一个时钟在运行，无论谁看这个时钟，它显示的时间基本上都是一样的。
But you can have a clock running and no matter who looks at the clock, their clock is pretty much always gonna be showing the same time.
我们所有人在这个房间里，尽管各自有着不同的主观体验，但都能同意这个时间是以某种特定的速度在流逝。
We can all agree in the room, even though we all have our own different subjective experiences, we can all agree that that time is running at that certain speed.
这对所有人来说都是一样的。
That's the same for all of us.
所以时间存在于我们的感知之外，对吧？
So time exists outside of our perception of it, doesn't it?
就我们所知。
As far as we're aware.
就我们所知，是的。
As far as we're aware, yeah.
就我们所能断言某事物是否真实而言，我认为时间是非常具体的。
As much as we can make a statement that something is real or not, we know we we I'd say that time is pretty concrete.
好的。
Okay.
所以我们俩都在看着钟。
So we're both staring at a clock.
是的。
Yeah.
对吧？
Right?
而你正等着一个紧急电话，想知道你的宝宝是不是要出生了
And you're waiting for a really urgent phone call to find out whether or not, you know, your baby's being born
是的。
Yeah.
或者类似的事情。
Or something.
而我却只是很享受地看着钟。
And I'm just we've got really enjoying the clock.
听点音乐什么的。
Listen to music or something.
是的。
Yeah.
你对这种体验的感受会和我不一样。
And your experience of that will be different to mine.
所以对我来说，时间会感觉比对你来说过得更慢。
So it will feel like it's the the time is running more slowly for me than than it is for you.
是的。
Yeah.
因为你会完全沉浸在音乐里，而我会 literally 每一秒都在等待这个电话，想知道我的孩子是否出生了。
Because you you'll you'll just be lost in the music, whereas I will be, like, literally hanging on every moment waiting for this phone call to hear about Yeah.
我的孩子出生了。
My child that's been born.
我觉得这种钟表时间的概念打断了我们生活的节奏，让我们普遍更加焦虑。
I I feel like the the kind of clock this notion of clock time sort of interrupts the flow of our lives and makes us generally more anxious.
焦虑。
Anxious.
我觉得不是时间本身，而是这段时间很特别，
I think that it's not the time It's a cool time,
不是吗？
isn't
是吧？
it's it?
只是因为事件发生了。
Just the fact that events happen.
不是时间导致的，而是事件发生了。
It's not that they hap it's not that time does that.
只是事件发生了，而这些事件的严重性会让你感觉时间过得更慢。
It's just that events occur, and depending on the seriousness of those events, that means that you sort of feel like time is moving more slowly.
并不是时间本身的流逝，而是这段时间内发生事件的重要性，你知道的？
It's not the passing of time itself, it's more the significance of events which occur within that time, you know?
总之，这是一场关于时间的奇怪而深刻的哲学对话，我认为从来没有人真正彻底弄清楚过‘时间是什么’这个问题。
Anyway, this is a weird, extremely deep philosophical conversation about time, and I don't think anyone has really ever got to the bottom of the whole what is time question.
没有。
No.
让我最后说一点，
Let me say one final thing,
对吧，米奇？
right, Mitch?
是的。
Yeah.
如果你有一所房子里没有任何钟表，连续三天你不看钟，只是做自己的事，
If I if you have a house with no clocks in it, you don't look at the clock for kind of three days, you're just doing your thing.
我可能会，
I'd probably
比那些有各种数字钟表不断提醒你‘已经过了三小时’、‘两小时’的屋子更放松。
more relaxed than a house that has various digital clocks that remind you, oh, three hours have passed, two hours
已经过去了。
have passed.
我觉得这完全取决于我有什么事要做。
I I I think it purely depends on what I have to do.
所以，比如，等等。
So for example, if Wait.
等等。
Wait.
稍等一下。
Hold on a second.
你没有任何安排。
You have no appointment.
没有。
No.
如果我不。
If I no.
如果，那正是关键所在。
If well, that that that's the thing.
如果我没有预约的话
If if I have no appointments
是的。
Yeah.
如果我没什么事可做，没什么目标要达成，是的。
If I have nothing to do, nothing to achieve Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
关于我最终会不会某天死去呢？
About if am I going to die at some point eventually?
我们都会死。
We're gonna die.
所以基本上，唯一的因素就是我待在一个房间里，而你可以去任何地方。
So basically, the only factors are that I'm in a room and I can You can anywhere.
我只是待在一个房间里，比如说。
I'm just in a room, let's let's say.
好的。
Okay.
我没有什么要达成的目标。
I have nothing to achieve.
我完全没有任何责任。
I have no responsibilities at all.
我没有什么要达成的目标。
I have nothing to achieve.
没有任何任务。
No tasks.
而我在这间房间里会待多久呢？
And I've got, let's say, how many how much time I'm spend in this room?
这有关系吗？
Does it matter?
你在这里稍微改变了条件。
You you slightly changed the parameters here.
好的。
Okay.
你知道，我只是在一个房间里。
You know, I'm just in a room.
我只是想排除所有其他因素，只剩下我和时间。
I'm just I'm just trying to cut out all of the other factors, so it's just me and time.
你在做你想做的事。
You You're doing what you want.
这并不是我所要表达的
This that's not what I'm
不。
No.
我还没完成呢。
I'm just I I haven't finished yet.
我只是想弄清楚当前的情况。
I'm just trying to establish the situation.
是的。
Yeah.
好吧，假设这样。
Let's say, okay.
我住在一个舒适的房子里。
I'm in a nice house.
嗯。
Mhmm.
我没有任何责任，也没有任何截止日期要赶。
And I've got nothing I don't have any responsibilities or no deadlines to meet.
我不用去见任何人。
I don't have to go and see anyone.
不。
No.
我已
I've
什么都没有，你只是你
got nothing things you just you
为自己设定好你想做的事。
set yourself to do that you want to do.
好的。
Okay.
行。
Alright.
所以你可能会想录一首歌或者一个播客，例如。
So you might want to record a tune or a podcast, for example.
行。
Alright.
好的。
Okay.
所以，基本上，我们正在消除所有外部义务。
So basically, we're eliminating all external obligations.
我更倾向于哪一个？
Which one would I prefer?
我是更喜欢墙上挂钟，还是不挂钟？
Would I prefer to have the clock on the wall or not to have the clock on
墙上？
the wall?
这在心理上会不会让人对时间产生略微不同的感受？
Does it not psychologically give a slightly different feeling to that time?
我想，如果我不挂钟，是的，我可能更倾向于不把钟挂在墙上。
I guess if I didn't have the clock, yeah, I'd probably prefer not to have the clock on the wall.
但如果我们再引入另一个因素，比如第三天午餐时间，也就是1点，你必须去和女友共进浪漫午餐，对吧？
But if we introduce one other factor into this, which is that, let's say on the third day at lunchtime, at 01:00, on the third day, you have to go and meet your girlfriend for a romantic lunch, right?
你更希望有钟表还是没有？
Would you prefer to have the clock or not?
我会对她说，你出发时给我打个电话。
I'd say to her, call me when you're leaving.
啊，对。
Ah, right.
好吧，你有点耍赖了。
Okay, you're kind of cheating.
因为我觉得，如果我有什么目标要达成，说实话，我们都有这样的事情。
Because I think that if I had something to achieve, and let's face it, we all have things.
但你更注重实际，而不是
But you're being practical rather than
但我们都有外部的责任。
But we all have external obligations.
是的，是的，是的。
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
你无法将它们排除在外，所以我认为问题不在于时钟，也不在于时间，而在于有些事情会超出我们的控制，我们需要时钟来衡量这些事情何时发生。
You can't factor them out, so I think it's not clock, it's not the time, it's the fact that stuff is gonna happen beyond our control, and we need the clock as a way of measuring when those things are going to happen.
我们用时钟来某种程度上控制这些事，但真正的原因不是时钟本身，而是某些外部事件会发生，而你无法真正控制它们，你的日子因此被这些事件所定义。
We use the clock as a way of controlling that somehow, but it's not the clock, it's the fact that something external is going to happen which you can't really control, that you're you're then your day is defined by that event.
我们需要时钟来将我们的主观时间与他人衡量他们一天的标准时间对齐。
We need a clock to measure our our experiential time to the time the standard time that everyone else is judging their day
所以这关乎协调。
So it's about coordination.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
所以这是
So it's
展开剩余字幕（还有 480 条）
事实上，我们所有的组织方式都是基于时钟，而不是时钟只是帮助我们这一点。
the fact that it's actually the the fact that we based all all of our organization upon the clock rather than the fact that, you know, the clock helps us
我认为这是在组织我们自己。
I think it's organize ourselves.
我们因为时钟而以某种方式组织了自己。
We've organized ourselves in a way in a certain way because of the clock.
我认为是外部的义务决定了我们需要一个标准时间来协调所有事情。
I think it's external obligations dictate the fact that we need a standard time to coordinate everything by.
我们之所以这样安排事物，是因为我们有钟表。
We've organised things in such a way because we have clocks.
并不是说
It's not that
我不这么认为。
I don't think so.
是的。
Yeah.
当然我们有。
Of course we have.
我认为时钟仍然将时间视为一个恒定的东西。
I think that clocks still have time as a constant thing.
它一直都在那里。
It's always been there.
但在我们拥有时钟之前，我们并不会以这种方式安排事物。
But we didn't used to arrange things in the same way before we had clocks.
这讲的是时钟。
This was about clocks.
所以如果你认真想想，想想在没有这些复杂机械装置（如摆钟）之前，社会、村庄等是如何运作的。
So if you think about seriously, think about when free clocks, had obviously societies and villages and stuff before you had kind of these complex machineries with pendulums and such like.
是的。
Yeah.
好的。
Okay.
人们仍然能够见面，显然如此。
People still managed to meet, obviously.
但那些住在一起的家庭。
But they Families who lived together.
你有农民种植庄稼。
You had farmers who who made crops.
但文明的效率较低。
But civilisation was less effective.
可能效率更低。
It was less efficient, possibly.
因为
Because
然后
And then
它也更缺乏全球性。
it was less global.
它没有跨越这么大的距离和所有这些。
It was less across this large distances and all that.
然后我们发明了钟表，这是一种追踪和标准化时间的方式，这使我们能够协调各种事务。
And we we then invented the clock, which was a way for us to track time and standardize time, and that allowed us then to coordinate things.
所以人们的生活水平可能确实提高了。
So the general standard of living did probably do.
我觉得钟表是个好东西。
I think the clock is a good thing.
我喜欢保留钟表，但我认为你这里的问题在于外部义务。
Like to keep the clock, but I think your issue here is with external obligations.
问题是，你因为这些外部义务而感受到的压力，这种压力让你必须遵守钟表的时间。
It's about And the pressure that you feel to observe the clock as a result of having these external obligations, that's
其实这并不是关于义务，而是关于我希望达成某些目标。
what It's not actually about obligations, it's about my desire to achieve things.
钟表的流逝以一种可量化的形式告诉你时间过去了多少，这让我感到焦虑，因为我觉得自己还没有达成所有想实现的目标。
And the clock part the passing the clock tells you in in a quantifiable way how much time has passed, and I find that makes me anxious because I feel like I haven't achieved everything I want to achieve.
所以，是的，这相当个人化。
So, yeah, it's it's quite personal.
那我要说的是，当你有这种感觉且没有具体的义务要履行时，干脆别看钟表，把钟表藏起来。
What I would say then is when you feel like that and you you don't have a a specific obligation to meet, just just don't look at the clocks, like hide your clocks.
对。
Yeah.
但你视频播放器上就有一个钟表。
But you've got a clock there on your on your video player.
你这是
You're
对。
right.
把它藏起来。
Just hide it.
我们现在就该这么做，因为它可能让你紧张，我这就
We should do that now because it's probably making you nervous I'll right
我跟你说，手机也会让你焦虑。
tell you what, mobile phones make you anxious as well.
但我们就不深入谈这个了。
But we won't go into that.
手机也会让你感到焦虑。
Mobile phones make you anxious too.
想想你需要什么，把手机关掉会让人感觉很解脱。
Think what you need Putting your phone off is quite liberating.
把手机留在家里，出门走走。
Leaving it behind and going out of the house.
哦，真的很解脱。
Oh, Very liberating.
类似的情况。
Similar kind of thing.
我最近几乎从不关手机。
I rarely turn my phone off these days.
我应该更经常这么做。
I should do it more often.
没错。
Exactly.
但你知道，我女朋友，如果她给我打电话，我想能联系上。
But, you know, my girlfriend, you know, if she was to call me, I want to be available.
是的，确实如此。
Yeah, it's true.
但你处在一段异地恋中。
But you are in a long distance relationship.
没错，你也是。
That's true, so are you.
是的，没错。
Yeah, true.
好吧。
Okay.
我想说的是，当你有机会的时候，别管时间了，把钟表都藏起来。
What I would say is when you have the opportunity, I would say forget about the clocks and hide the clocks.
你知道法国是这样的。
You know that France.
在法国就是这样做的。
That's what do in France.
当你去法国度假时，就是这样做的，我觉得在那里这样做非常健康。
That's what you do when you go on holiday to France, and I think it's a very healthy thing to do when you're there.
费兹，这里要讨论的事情太多了，我觉得我们关于钟表的对话
Fez, got too many things to discuss here, and I think our conversation about clocks
可能会被跳过或中断。
May get dropped and cut.
我不知道是不是这样，但我也不确定。
I don't know if it but I don't know.
人们总是问，你们会剪辑这些内容吗？
People always say, do you edit these?
我通常会说，不要删，因为我无法判断哪些内容是有价值或有趣的，哪些不是。
And I sort of say, no, don't, because I can't decide which things are valuable or interesting or which things aren't.
我认为，如果内容非常严肃且充满愤怒，可能会冒犯到别人，是的。
I think sometimes if it's very serious and angry, if it would be offensive to people Yeah.
比如真正具有冒犯性的东西，不是指那些脏话，而是
Like really offensive, not just something about swear words, but
实时传道者。
Real time evangelists.
但确实，我不知道，如果是真正非常冒犯的内容，我就会考虑删掉。
But yeah, I don't know, just really really offensive stuff, then I would consider editing that.
是的。
Yeah.
或者如果根本听不清，比如三个人同时说话，完全听不清楚，让学生听下去会非常打击士气，那我就会剪掉。
Or if it was impossible to hear, so if three people were talking all at the same time, and it was just impossible to hear and it would be very demotivating for the students to listen to, then I would cut that.
但如果是我认为真正有趣的关于时间的哲学讨论，是的。
But if it's what I consider to be actually quite an interesting philosophical discussion about time, Yeah.
我认为这对人们来说完全是合理的，嗯
I think that that's a perfectly valid thing for for people Well
也许可以听听这些问题是相当零散的。
maybe to listen these are quite sort of chunked up questions.
你可以把这些归类成几个不同的部分。
You can maybe just group these into separate
我可能可以从这个内容制作好几集节目。
I probably could make several episodes out of this.
是的。
Yeah.
所以我按主题把它们分组。
So I Group them by theme.
我们还是继续吧。
We should probably just press on.
好的。
Yes.
我们可以把这些都做一遍，我可以把这做成两个播客，因为我的听众们，哦，是的。
And we could do all of these, and I could make this into two podcasts because my listeners Oh, yeah.
他们非常喜欢这种内容。
They they love this kind of stuff.
真的吗？
Do they?
就是我们随意闲聊。
Where we just ramble.
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
好的。
Okay.
好的。
Okay.
我的意思是，当我不确定我们是否像那样有趣的时候
I mean, when when I don't know if we're being as funny as as
我能提个请求吗？那些认同我时钟时间观点的人，是的？
Can I can I actually make a a plea that people who agree with my clock time perspective Yeah?
我想知道我是不是一个人有这种焦虑。
I'd like to know whether I'm alone in this anxiety.
我担心听众们让
I'm concerned that the listeners let
知道。
you know.
我希望他们能告诉你。
I'd like them to let you know.
我担心听众们并不真正理解你对
I'm concerned that the listeners don't really understand what your position is on
时钟的立场。
clocks.
我觉得他们会的。
I think they will.
这正是我的观点。
That's my point.
你的观点是，你厌恶时间的流逝，因为它让你感到一种压力，担心自己无法完成所有事情。
Your your point is that you resent the passing of time because it means that you feel there's a pressure that you're not gonna achieve everything.
是的。
Yeah.
但我厌恶时钟提醒我时间正在流逝，并将它量化。
But I resent clocks reminding me that the time how much time is passing and quantifying it.
你刚说已经过去一小时了，就是这种感觉。
You've just that's been a whole hour, you know, that kind of thing.
是的，你知道的。
Yeah, know.
是时钟。
It's Clocks
钟表很有用，但同时也很让人烦闷和压力山大。
are very useful, but at the same time, they're deeply annoying and stressful.
是的。
Yes.
对。
Yeah.
我发现，当我压力特别大的时候，总是和钟表脱不了干系。
I do find I'm most stressed when like the clock is always involved when I'm really stressed.
对。
Yeah.
这就对了。
There you go.
是的。
Yeah.
就像是，喂。
It's like, hello.
我觉得你可能是在写东西的时候
I think you might be it's like when you're trying to write
你要迟到了。
You're gonna be late.
是的。
Yeah.
没错。
Exactly.
你可能
You might
会迟到。
be late.
我觉得你没有时间做那件事。
I think you that you don't have time for that.
得了吧。
Come on.
钟不一直都是这样吗？
That's what the clock's always doing, isn't it?
钟很少会有点温柔，但有时候钟会跟你说：嘿，别担心，放松点。
The clock is rarely kind of going although sometimes the clock says to you, Hey, don't worry, relax.
你没事的。
You're okay.
就待在床上吧。
Just stay in bed.
你有一个小时呢。
You've got a whole hour.
可以做任何你想做的事。
Can just do whatever you like.
挺特别的，但对。
Unusual, but yeah.
没错。
That's true.
有时候它们真的很友好，但大多数时候，时钟就像
Sometimes they're, really nice, but most of the time, the clock is, like
紧盯着你。
On your case.
你知道的，是的。
You know, you yeah.
好吧。
Okay.
你确实有两个小时才需要去开会，但你知道，也许你现在就应该开始工作了。
You do have two hours to before you have to go to the meeting, but, you know, maybe you should start working now.
哦，不。
Oh, no.
我刚才说两个小时了吗？
Did I say two hours?
我是说一小时五十九分钟。
I meant one hour and fifty nine minutes.
实际上，这么说的话，抱歉，是一小时五十八分钟。
Actually, saying that, sorry, one hour and fifty eight minutes.
哦，天啊。
Oh, god.
时间，哦。
Time, Oh.
我觉得这个时钟有点像，你知道的，当你在微软Word里开始写文档或信件的时候，是吧。
I feel like the clock is a bit like, you know when you start writing a document or a letter on Microsoft Word Yeah.
然后那个小纸夹或者小狗出现了，打招呼，看起来你在写信。
And that little paper clip or the dog arrives, hello, it looks like you're writing a letter.
你知道的，有点像那样，不是吗？
You know, it's a bit like that, isn't it?
时钟好像在说：嗨。
The clock sort of goes, hello.
它看起来像是你今天打算完成点什么。
It looks like you were trying to achieve something today.
我提醒你一下，你在加拿大只剩下八个小时了。
Can I just remind you, you've only got eight hours left in in Can
我提醒你，你正在
I remind you that you're
离死亡更近了七分钟？
seven minutes closer to death?
是的。
Yeah.
没错。
Exactly.
我提醒你一下，你每走一步都在不断更接近死亡吗？
Can I just remind you that you're constantly getting closer and closer to death at every step?
你有限的时间
Your finite time
在这颗星球上正在耗尽。
upon this planet is expiring.
我觉得这很有压力。
I find that stressful.
好的。
Okay.
我们现在应该开始聊点更轻松的话题。
We should start now talking about something slightly more lighthearted.
好的。
Okay.
好的。
Okay.
麦当劳和汉堡王。
McDonald's versus Burger King.
哦，皇堡对比巨无霸。
Oh, Whoppers versus Big Macs.
是的。
Yeah.
我早就知道了。
I know already.
我非常清楚我对这件事的看法是麦当劳。
I know exactly what I think about this is McDonald's.
真的吗？
Oh, really?
我确实想要芝士汉堡。
I do want the cheeseburgers.
汉堡王一塌糊涂。
Burger King is crap.
好吧。
Okay.
下一个。
Done next.
下一个。
Next.
好的。
Okay.
汉堡王更贵，而且根本就是糟糕透顶。
Burger King's more expensive, and it's not as it's just it's just horrible.
是的。
Yeah.
好的。
Okay.
我觉得我同意这一点。
I think I agree with that.
就像你在某个廉价音乐节上买到的那种汉堡一样。
It's like the sort of burger you get at some cheap music festival in
它只是把自己包装成一种。
a It was dressing itself up as sort of
我们是汉堡之王。
We're the king of burgers.
它们是吗？
Are they or not?
而且，Whopper 也是对阴茎的另一种说法。
And also, Whopper is also another term for a cock.
是的，没错。
Yeah, exactly.
为什么会这样？
Why is that?
把一个 Whopper 放进嘴里有什么好的？
What what is good about putting a Whopper in your mouth?
好吧。
Okay.
我们继续说食物的话题。
Still on the subject of food.
红酱和棕酱。
Red sauce versus brown sauce.
哦，是的。
Oh, yes.
对我来说，是红酱。
For me, it's red sauce.
嗯，我们可能应该解释一下。
Well, we should probably explain.
在普通的英式咖啡馆里，你会得到三种酱料。
This is in your average English cafe, you get three types of sauce.
主要是两种，也许主要是两种，可能有三种。
Well, mainly two, maybe mainly two, possibly three.
这两种是红酱、棕酱，也许还有一种黄酱。
The two are red sauce, brown sauce and maybe a kind of yellow sauce.
这正好体现了我们在食物上的讲究。
And this just shows how sophisticated we are about food.
红酱当然是番茄酱。
Red sauce of course is tomato ketchup.
棕色酱是
Brown sauce is
HP酱，很常见。
HP sauce, common.
它的正式名称是HP酱，但大多数人只叫它棕色酱。
Its actual name is HP sauce or or most commonly, it's just called brown sauce.
它是一种略带辣味的番茄酱。
And it's kind of slightly spicy version of ketchup.
而黄色酱其实就是芥末。
And then yellow sauce is just kind of it's just mustard.
芥末。
Mustard.
是的。
Yeah.
所以红色酱和棕色酱的区别。
So red sauce versus brown sauce.
你说的是红酱，对吧？
And you're saying red sauce, are you?
是的。
Yeah.
我觉得红酱更适合搭配各种食物，尤其是配薯条。
I think red sauce is more you know, you can put it on more different types of foods, better with chips.
我还听说它还挺健康的。
It's sort of supposed to be quite healthy for you as well, I I heard.
是的。
Yeah.
真的吗？
Really?
是的。
Yeah.
我以为它含糖和盐都很高。
Thought it was full and salt.
是的。
Of Yeah.
还有番茄。
And tomatoes.
好的。
Okay.
我更喜欢红酱而不是棕酱。
I I tend to go for red sauce more than brown sauce.
我总是记得我们小时候的事。
I always remember it when we were growing up.
明白吗？
Okay?
因为我小时候从没吃过番茄酱。
Because I never we never had ketchup when I was a kid.
是的。
Yeah.
每当我来你家的时候，是的。
Whenever I came to your house Yeah.
我的意思是，我们来访时，你把番茄酱放在所有东西上。
I mean, when we visited, you had ketchup on everything.
是的。
Yeah.
你真是个番茄酱成瘾者。
You're a real ketchup addict.
我以前是个番茄酱狂人。
I was a ketchup freak.
对。
Yeah.
现在还是。
Still am.
而且，是的，我觉得你一定偏爱红酱。
And, yeah, I think that you you must be a red sauce.
是的，我喜欢红酱。
Yeah, I like red sauce.
但我现在吃得没有以前那么多了。
But I don't eat it as much as I used to.
我的饮食品味变得更加讲究了。
I've become more sophisticated in my culinary habits.
你的味觉变得更加丰富了。
You've become more sort of a greater palate.
是的，我的味觉提升了。
Yeah, I've developed my palate.
就像绘画一样。
As in painting.
哦，我明白了。
Oh, see, I see.
好的。
Okay.
而且，听这个的人，比如意大利和法国的人，他们会想，哦，番茄酱。
And also, people listening to this, like, know, have people in Italy and France and stuff listening to this, and they'll be like, oh, ketchup.
是的，但他们也会想，哦，棕色酱汁，他们肯定没有这个。
Yeah, but they'll also be like, oh, brown sauce, bet they don't have that.
他们会说，我根本不知道那是什么。
They'll be like, I don't even know what it is.
对。
Yeah.
而且而且
And and
而且听起来像垃圾。
and also it sounds like shit.
有可能。
It could be.
你知道的，棕色酱汁。
You know, brown sauce.
我喜欢我们称它为褐色酱汁的方式。
I love the way that we call it brown sauce.
我们用颜色来定义它，而不是用成分。
We we we define it by the color, not by the ingredients.
或者用味道。
Or the taste.
我们甚至不知道里面有什么。
We don't even know what's in it.
嗯，褐色的。
Well, brown.
我们不知道。
We don't know.
褐色酱汁。
Brown sauce.
不过我们做得挺好的，是的。
Well, we do it well, yeah.
如果你看一下配料的话。
If you look at the ingredients.
但你知道布朗酱里苹果在最上面吗？
But do you know of the top of the apples in brown sauce?
醋。
Vinegar.
是的。
Yeah.
洋葱。
Onions.
是的。
Yeah.
我觉得你不知道。
I think you don't know.
我不知道。
I don't know.
我不知道。
I don't know.
我也不知道。
Nor do I.
我不知道它为什么是棕色的。
I don't know why it's brown.
不。
No.
它里面有个管子。
It's it's it's got a tube.
我本该知道的。
I probably should know.
不管怎样，我喜欢棕色酱汁。
Anyway, I like brown sauce
红翼。
Red wings.
红酱更胜一筹。
Red sauce wins.
但吃英式全餐时，棕色酱料更合适。
But brown sauce when you have a British a full English breakfast.
哦，我明白了。
Oh, I see.
对。
Yeah.
我看到糖果了。
I see candy.
这很好。
That's good.
是的。
Yeah.
下一个是一本书。
Next one is book.
一本普通的传统纸质书和亚马逊Kindle相比。
A book like a normal traditional book in your hands versus an Amazon Kindle.
哦。
Oh.
嗯，你知道的，我是个书迷。
Well, I'm I'm a I'm a book geek, as you know.
是的。
Yeah.
正如你之前的播客所证实的，我经常在伦敦地铁上消磨大量时间。
I spend, you know, as a as your previous podcast will testify, I spend a lot of time on the London Underground.
嗯。
Mhmm.
我读很多书。
And I read a lot.
我喜欢书籍，因为显然封面有艺术设计，而且纸质书也比较结实。
And I like books because you obviously, there's the artwork on the front, and they're quite kind of robust.
你可以在浴缸里读它们。
You can read them in the bath.
你可以随便扔来扔去。
You can chuck them around.
是的。
Yeah.
你可以把它们带到海滩上。
You can take them onto the beach.
你可以把它们送给朋友。
Give them the you can give them to a friend.
对。
Yeah.
你可以把它们传阅。
You know, you can pass them around.
还有不同的字体，这也很好。
There's different kind of fonts as well, which is nice.
如果你不同意作者的观点，就把书扔到地上。
Throw the book onto the floor if you disagree with what the writer has said.
是的。
Yeah.
你也可以把它们收藏起来。
You can also you can store them.
你知道，它们颜色很鲜艳。
You know, they're quite colorful.
它们作为家里的装饰品非常漂亮。
They're not they make quite nice ornaments in your house.
你可以看到你面前所有不同的
You can see in front of you all the different
你读过的书。
books you've read.
书架上是非常漂亮的装饰。
Very pretty decorations on your shelves.
话虽如此，我最近读的两本书是《史蒂夫·乔布斯传》和村上春树的《1Q84》。
How how having said that, the last two books I read was the Steve Jobs biography and also Murakami's I one q 84.
对。
Right.
这两本书都很厚，随身携带很重。
Both big tomes, heavy books to carry around with
我。
me.
是的。
Yes.
而Kindle会方便得多。
And Kindle would have been way more convenient.
我以前在播客里聊过这个话题，那一集叫《冰淇淋集》吧。
I've talked about this on the podcast before in an episode called the, I think, the ice cream episode.
我在那一集中已经很清楚地表达了我的观点。
And, I stated my case in that episode quite clearly.
最终偏向哪一边？
It came down on which side?
书。
The book.
我自己更喜欢书，但也许这只是因为我没有Kindle。
I I prefer the book myself, but maybe this is just because I don't own a Kindle.
也许我只是因为没有Kindle而生气。
Maybe I'm just angry that I don't have one.
也许你只是反应过激。
Maybe you're reactionary.
但你知道，我并不是说我不喜欢，但我看过亚马逊Kindle的广告，广告里通常是某人带去海滩度假的包。
But, you know, I don't I just don't but I've seen adverts for the Amazon Kindle, and there's like, the advert would be like a like a someone's bag, like their bag they're taking on holiday to the beach.
是的。
Yeah.
包里放着太阳镜、一些防晒霜，还有亚马逊Kindle，静静地躺在包顶上。
And there's, some sunglasses, some some some suntan lotion, and an Amazon Kindle like nestled in the top of the bag.
这就像在试图说服我，把那东西带到海滩上是个好主意。
It's like, don't try and convince me that that's a good thing to take to the beach.
别跟我说亚马逊Kindle适合接触沙子、海水和防晒霜。
Don't try and tell me that the Amazon Kindle is a good thing that should be put in contact with sand, salt water, and suntan lotion.
是的。
Yes.
这简直就是灾难的配方。
It's it's a recipe for disaster.
我认为你别轻信广告里说的那些话。
I think that you don't don't don't believe what they tell you in the adverts.
别把Kindle带到海滩上。
Don't take a Kindle onto the beach.
你不会玩得开心的。
You're you're not gonna enjoy yourself.
你根本没法放松，因为你总会担心：Kindle没事吧？
You're not gonna be able to relax because you're gonna be like, oh, is the Kindle okay?
你知道，别让沙子沾到它上面。
You know, don't get any sand on it.
你知道，就是这种事。
You know, that kind of thing.
所以我觉得这完全是胡说八道。
And so I think that's nonsense.
我知道Kindle确实有不少优点，比如如果你在学英语，可以随时划词查字，只要在Kindle上看到不认识的单词，点一下，如果你下载了词典应用或者在线，它就会直接告诉你这个词的意思。
I know that there are good things about the Kindle, like the fact that you can if you're learning English, you can scan through the words, and if you find a word that you're reading in the Kindle, can click on it, and if you've downloaded a dictionary application, or if you're online No, it just tells you what it You can find out the definition of
如果你在学西班牙语，那确实会很有用。
that If find you to learn Spanish, that would be quite useful.
没错，没错。
Exactly, exactly.
所以Kindle确实有不少优点，但说实话，我们看书的时候，根本不想在互联网上瞎折腾，就想安安静静地读书，对吧？
So there are various advantages, but let's face it, what we want to do when we read a book, we don't want to fart around on the Internet, we just want to read the book, right?
是的。
Yeah.
所以，当你手里拿着一本普通的传统纸质书时，你可以随意摆弄——可以折角、可以在书上做笔记、可以带去海滩、可以打喷嚏在上面，想怎么对待都行。
So have a normal traditional book in your hands, you can play with you can bend the book, you can fold over the corners, you can write notes on it, you can take it to the beach, you can sneeze on it, whatever you want to do.
而且你不必担心会把它弄坏。
And you don't have to worry about breaking it.
对我来说，这已经足够成为我继续保留纸质书的理由了，尽管如果我把去年买书的所有钱省下来，可能都够买一台Kindle了。
That for me is enough of a reason to just keep the book, even though if I just saved all the money that I'd spent on books over the last year, I probably could have forwarded Kindle.
Anyway，威廉王子和哈里王子。
Anyway, Prince William versus Prince Harry.
哦。
Oh.
如果真打起来，哈里会赢吗？
In a fight, in a physical fight, who would Harry.
哈里在身体对抗中会赢，因为他是个红发男，对吧？
Harry would win in a physical fight because he's He's he's ginger, isn't he?
这让他更厉害吗？
Does that make him harder?
这让他不仅更难对付，理论上也更容易被讨厌。
Makes him well, it makes him harder, but also easier to hate in theory.
真的吗？
Really?
是的。
Yeah.
这有点种族歧视吧？
That's a bit racist, isn't it?
嗯，确实如此。
Well, yeah.
这有点‘红发歧视’。
It's a bit gingerist.
红发歧视。
Gingerist.
对。
Yeah.
红发人总是受欺负。
Gingers get a hard time.
这简直就像人们觉得可以对红发人种族歧视一样，这很奇怪。
It's kind of it's almost like you're allowed to be racist against gingers, which is a strange thing.
是的。
Yeah.
但哈里更尖锐一些，更容易犯公开的错误。
But Harry's a bit edgier, a bit more kind of prone to making public mistakes.
我觉得他更坚强一些。
I think he's a bit more tough.
别以为威廉也那么强硬。
Don't get the impression that William is that tough.
他是个
He's a
有点儿说真的，说真的，如果可以的话，我宁愿不打架。
bit sort of like, you know, actually, actually, I'd rather not fight if it's all the same to you.
而哈里可能会说，好吧。
Whereas Harry would be like, right.
进来吧。
Come on in.
你知道的，他有点
You know, he's a bit
更倾向于
more in
虽然他不是这么说的，但我想象他会说：来吧，你这坏蛋。
although that's not how he speaks, but I imagine Come on you rotter.
我非得给你点颜色看看？
I'll give you what for?
类似这样的话。
Something like that.
而且，哈里看起来能喝得比威廉多。
Also, Harry looks like he could drink more than William.
是的。
Yeah.
确实如此。
He does.
他看起来会一口气摆上好几杯酒，一饮而尽，而威廉只会喝一杯葡萄酒。
He he looks like he would line up a load of shots and just knock them back, whereas William would have a glass of wine.
威廉会说：‘我觉得凯特不会同意我喝伏特加的。’是的。
William would be like, I don't think Kate would approve if I if I drank vodka Yeah.
哈里。
Harry.
哈里会说：‘来吧，威廉。’
And Harry's like, come on, William.
别这么胆小。
Don't be such a wuss.
来吧，伙计。
Come on, bull.
把这些，快点，马脸。
Get these get these come on, horse face.
把这瓶伏特加灌下去。
Get this vodka down your throat.
是的。
Yeah.
我同意。
I I agree.
所以哈里赢了。
So Harry wins.
哈里才是最棒的，即使
Harry's Harry's the best even
不过哈里的名字确实比威廉好听，
though he's Harry's a better name than William, really,
对吧？
isn't it?
威尔斯。
Wills.
威尔斯。
Wills.
哈利。
Harry.
其实，他的名字是亨利，哈利。
Actually, his name's Henry, Harry.
是吗？
Oh, is it?
他的全名，真名是亨利。
His full name, his real name's Henry.
像国王亨利那样？
As in King Henry?
就像国王亨利那样，但他的绰号是哈利。
As in King Henry, but his nickname is Harry.
是的
Yeah.
这就像他的非正式名字是哈利，但他的真名其实是拉斯特。
This is like his sort of his informal name is Harry, but his actual Rusty.
拉斯特。
Rusty.
弗利比。
Fluffy.
毛茸茸的球。
Fluffy balls.
好的。
Okay.
吉布森对芬德。
Gibson versus Fender.
你能解释一下吉布森对
Can you explain what Gibson versus
芬德和吉布森都是吉他制造商。
Fender Gibson and Gibson and Fender both are guitar manufacturers.
这些是最受欢迎的吉他类型。
And these are the most the most popular types of guitar.
所以要么是吉布森。
So it's either Gibson.
大多数人要么买吉布森，要么买芬德。
Most people will either buy a Gibson or a Fender.
还有其他吉他制造商，比如伊巴涅兹、马丁等等，但吉布森和芬德基本上是最著名的两个品牌。
There are other guitar makers like Ibanez and Martin and other things like that, but Gibson and Fender are basically the most the two most famous ones.
吉布森，比如枪与玫瑰乐队的斯拉什、吉米·佩奇都用过吉布森莱斯·保罗，尼尔·杨也是。
Gibson, like Slash from Guns N' Roses, Jimmy Page played a Gibson Les Paul, Neil Young.
皮特·汤森德用过很多种吉他，但他在七十年代初以使用吉布森SG而闻名。
Pete Townsend played lots of guitars, but he famously played a Gibson SG in the early seventies.
还有其他人吗？
Anyone else?
克莱普顿最初弹奏吉普森，后来转用了芬达。
Clapton started playing Gibson, and then he moved to Fender.
而且，最近它们变得非常普遍，比如诺尔·加拉格演奏的是吉普森吉他。
Also, they've recently become quite commonplace, like people like Noel Gallagher playing He's Gibson guitars.
诺尔·加拉格弹的是吉普森。
Noel Gallagher played Gibson.
还有很多其他著名的吉普森吉他手。
And there are lots plenty of other famous Gibson players.
芬达的话，大概是吉米·亨德里克斯，他用的是芬达斯特拉托卡斯特琴。
Fender, probably Jimi Hendrix, the Fender Stratocaster.
他也演奏过飞行V琴。
He did play Flying V as well.
吉普森飞行V琴。
Gibson Flying V.
但他最著名的吉他还是芬达斯特拉托卡斯特。
But his most famous guitar was the Fender Stratocaster.
像亨德里克斯那样。
As Hendrix.
我的意思是，克莱普顿其实也是个芬德乐手。
I mean, Clapson was a Fender guy really as well.
最终。
In the end.
但我认为他最好的吉他演奏是在吉普森上完成的。
But his best guitar work was at Gibson, I think.
是的。
Yeah.
这可能是真的。
That's probably true.
是芬德。
It's Fender
我无法选择。
I couldn't choose.
我无法选择。
I couldn't choose.
我拥有一把吉布森Les Paul。
I own a Gibson Les Paul.
是的。
Yeah.
我非常喜欢它。
And I love it.
但事实上，我总是想要一把芬德。
But actually, I kind of always want a Fender.
说到贝斯吉他，芬德是王者。
When it comes to the bass guitar, the Fender is the king.
那是真的。
That's true.
因为芬德贝斯
Because Fender bass
这其实是个奇怪的现象，根本没有吉普森贝斯。
That is a strange oddity, actually, that there aren't really Gibson bass guitars.
你可以广泛地选择。
You can very widely.
你买不到吉普森SG贝斯。
You can't get Gibson SG basses.
它们是
They're
不受欢迎的。
not popular.
没错。
No.
它们确实不太受欢迎，但芬达做的贝斯就是最好的。
They're not really very popular, but but Fender just make the best basses Yeah.
确实如此。
They do.
显然。
Apparently.
但在电吉他方面，芬达会生产Telecaster、Stratocaster和其他型号吗？
But in terms of electric guitars, will Fender make the Telecaster and the Stratocaster and others?
吉普森生产了吉普森SG、Les Paul、Les Paul Junior和其他一些型号。
Gibson made the the Gibson SG, the Les Paul, the Les Paul Junior, and some other things.
三三五，就是f音孔。
The three three five, which is the f holes.
爵士风格。
Jazz style.
是的。
Yeah.
你知道，列侬在《Let It Be》里就用过一把那种琴。
Which, you know, Lennon on Let It Be played one of those.
对。
Right.
好的。
Okay.
是的，我。
I yeah.
无法选择。
Can't choose.
两个都不错。
Both good.
我都想要，拜托。
I want both, please.
我想要两个。
I want want both.
吉普森和奥夫登。
Gibson and Offender.
茶还是咖啡。
Tea versus coffee.
哦。
Oh.
所以我以前更喜欢茶，但咖啡更像一种毒品，你知道吗？
So I was I was more tea, but coffee is more of a drug, you know?
是的，没错。
Yes, it is.
早上起来。
Get up in the morning.
就只是起来。
Just up.
如果让我一辈子只能选一种，我现在会选择咖啡。
Coffee now, if I had to for the rest of my life, if I had to only have one of them, it would be coffee.
对。
Right.
它很实用，真的，你只能喝咖啡。
It has a practical Really, you only have coffee.
我只会喝茶，我爱所有的茶。
I would only have tea I love every tea.
它让我放松，我觉得对我有益，对我的灵魂也好。
It relaxes me, I think it's good for me, good for my soul.
是的。
Yeah.
我觉得如果不加牛奶，茶是健康的。
I think it's healthy if you don't have milk.
但咖啡，如果我喝太多，就睡不着。
And but coffee, if I drink too much, I can't sleep.
早上喝吧。
Drink it in the morning.
早上喝，它能让我清醒。
Drink it in the morning, it wakes me up.
没错。
That's true.
它确实能让我感到很舒畅。
It does give me a nice buzz.
我是夜猫子，所以晚上不需要喝咖啡。
I'm a night owl, so I don't need coffee in the evening.
真好。
Nice.
我不是早起的人，所以我确实需要在
I'm not an early bird, so I do need it in
早上喝。
the morning.
但你呢。
But you.
嗯，我早上不需要咖啡。
Well, I don't need coffee in the morning.
我没事，我很好。
I'm okay I'm okay.
我可以自己提供能量，但早上有时确实需要提神一下，而咖啡正好能做到。
I can provide my own energy, but I do need a kick sometimes in the morning, and coffee does the job.
是的。
Yeah.
所以咖啡有点像燃料。
So coffee is a bit like fuel.
所以某种程度上，就像早上的咖啡，下午的茶。
So in a way, like, the morning coffee, in the afternoon tea.
也许这样想挺好的。
Maybe that's a good way of thinking.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得这样很公平。
Think that's fair.
我们不能，也不会被拒绝。
We can't we wouldn't neither are being rejected.
关于 Bayt 播客
Bayt 提供中文+原文双语音频和字幕，帮助你打破语言障碍，轻松听懂全球优质播客。