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我是安德鲁·奥索金，DealBook的创始人。
This is Andrew Osorkin, the founder of DealBook.
每年，我都在纽约市举办的DealBook峰会上采访全球政界、文化界和商界最具影响力的领袖人物。
Every year, I interview some of the world's most influential leaders across politics, culture, and business at the DealBook Summit, a live event in New York City.
在今年的播客中，你将听到我与帕兰提尔和Anthropic公司的CEO加文·纽瑟姆，以及查理·柯克的遗孀埃里卡·柯克毫无保留的对话。
On this year's podcast, you'll hear my unfiltered conversations with Gavin Newsom, the CEO of Palantir and Anthropic, and Erica Kirk, the widow of Charlie Kirk.
你可以在任何播客平台收听DealBook峰会的内容。
Listen to DealBook Summit wherever you get your podcasts.
爱在当下，爱在永恒。
Love now and forever.
爱。
Love.
比任何事物都更强大。
Was stronger than anything.
为了爱。
For the love.
爱。
Love.
而我爱你胜过一切。
And I love you more than anything.
爱。
Love.
这里有爱。
There's love.
爱。
Love.
这里是《纽约时报》，我是安娜·马丁。
From The New York Times, I'm Anna Martin.
这里是《现代爱情》。
This is Modern Love.
每周，我们都会为您带来受《现代爱情》专栏启发的故事。
Each week, we bring you stories inspired by the Modern Love column.
我们谈论爱情、欲望、心碎以及关系中所有复杂的纠葛。
We talk about love, lust, heartbreak, and all the messiness of relationships.
当克莱尔·科里还是蒙大拿州农场里的小女孩时，她就梦想着坠入爱河。
When Claire Corey was a young girl growing up on a farm in Montana, she dreamed about falling in love.
我们住在一个单宽拖车里。
We lived in a single wide trailer.
空间有点拥挤，所以我睡在沙发上。
It was a little bit crowded, so I slept on the couch.
我常常望着窗外的满月，景色非常美丽。
And I would often look out the window at the full moon, and it's very beautiful.
我会看着月亮划过天空。
And I would watch the moon sail across the sky.
作为一个无可救药的浪漫小孩，我幻想着在某个地方，同一轮月亮下，有属于我的那个人。
And me being the hopeless romantic child that I was, I envisioned that somewhere out there under that same moon was the man for me.
就在克莱尔大学毕业不久后，她订婚了。
Just after she graduated college, Claire got engaged.
但就在婚礼前夕，她的未婚夫取消了婚约。
But then right before the wedding, her fiance called it off.
之后，她花了数年甚至数十年的时间试图维系各种感情关系，但都以失败告终。
After that, she spent years, decades even, trying to make various relationships work, but none of them did.
最终，她不再为此烦恼，决定专注于事业。
So eventually, she stopped worrying about it and decided to focus on her career.
五十岁生日后，她回顾自己的人生，感到心满意足。
After her fiftieth birthday, she looked back on her life and felt happy.
你知道吗，你会想，哇。
You know, you think, wow.
我的人生已经走了这么远，而前方仍有很长的路要走。
I've come a long way in life, and I still have a long way to go.
这种感受促使克莱尔给现代爱情专栏投稿，说她终于坠入了爱河——但不是和某个男人。
That feeling led Claire to write into the modern love column, saying she'd finally fallen in love, but not with some guy.
相反，她爱上的是生活本身。
Instead, it was a love for life itself.
她以为自己的爱情故事已经结束了。
She thought maybe her love story was over.
但后来
But then
发生了一连串最不可思议的离奇事件。
The most improbable bizarre series of events occurred.
其中一些离奇事件令人恐惧。
Some of those bizarre events were scary.
她的健康状况急转直下。
Her health took a dramatic turn.
但有些美好远超她所能想象。
But some were beautiful beyond anything she could have ever imagined.
今天，我们将为你讲述克莱尔爱情故事的后续。
Today, we tell you the rest of Claire's love story.
请继续收听。
Stick with us.
嘿。
Hey.
我是约翰·蔡斯。
It's John Chase.
还有玛丽·井原。
And Mari Uihara.
来自《纽约时报》旗下产品推荐服务Wirecutter。
From Wirecutter, the product recommendation service from The New York Times.
玛丽，现在是送礼季了。
Mari, it is gift giving time.
今年我们有很多很棒的礼物清单。
And we have so many great lists this year.
有什么简单易选的礼物
What's an easy gift
价格在50美元以下的？
for someone like under $50?
在我们50美元以下的礼物清单里，我特别喜欢这套来自日本的水彩套装。
In our gifts under 50 list, I really love this watercolor set from Japan.
这些非常非常漂亮的颜色。
These beautiful, beautiful colors.
小孩能玩，大人也能玩。
It's something that kids can do, adults can do.
我很喜欢这个。
I love that.
有什么好玩的东西能让我爸爸喜欢呢？
What's, like, something fun that my dad is gonna enjoy?
我们在'给爸爸的礼物'清单上有这些定制版Funko公仔。
We have these custom Funko Pops on our gifts for dads list.
你可以定制一个和你爸爸相似的小摇头玩偶。
You can custom make a little bobblehead toy in the likeness of your dad.
它们完全就是搞笑的。
They're totally unserious.
它们就是些有趣的小玩意，人们真的很喜欢。
They're just silly and fun, and people really love them.
这太搞笑了。
This is so hysterical.
我以前从没见过这些东西。
I had never seen these before.
它们太棒了。
They're amazing.
我得承认，我自己也有点想要一个。
I have to admit, I sort of want one myself.
查看Wirecutter为你自己和所有其他人准备的礼物推荐，请访问nytimes.com/holidayguide。
Check out all of Wirecutter's gift recommendations for yourself and everyone else at nytimes.com/holidayguide.
等等。
Wait.
我们还得聊聊黄油加热器。
We still have to talk about the butter warmer.
克莱尔·科里，欢迎来到《现代爱情》。
Claire Corey, welcome to Modern Love.
非常感谢，我真的很珍惜这次机会。
Thank you so much, and I really appreciate this opportunity.
那么克莱尔，我们今天要聊聊你的爱情故事。
So, Claire, we're here to talk about your love story.
故事充满曲折。
There are twists.
情节跌宕起伏。
There are turns.
事情发展完全出乎你的预料。
Things do not go as you expect.
但我想从最开始说起。
But I wanna start at the beginning.
当你还是个孩子时，就梦想着坠入爱河。
When you were a kid growing up, you dreamed about falling in love.
给我描绘一下那时的情景吧。
Paint a picture of that for me.
嗯。
Yeah.
我是七个孩子中的老大，我们在蒙大拿州的一个小农场长大。
So I'm the oldest of seven children, and we grew up on a little farm in Montana.
所以我记得早年脑海里经常浮现关于浪漫的种种幻想。
So I remember a lot of thoughts of romance that were rolling through my brain in those early years.
我和妹妹骑着用树枝做的假马，其实就是我们的树枝马。
And my sister and I, we were out on our fake horses that we had made out of sticks, our stick horses basically.
当然啦。
Of course.
我们俩都带着各自的丈夫一起骑马。
And so we both had husbands along for the ride.
我丈夫叫吉姆，她丈夫叫史蒂夫。
And mine was Jim and hers was Steve.
所以我曾幻想有一天，我会和吉姆一起开着卡车兜风，从此过上幸福的生活。
And so I just imagined that one day, you know, I was gonna be riding around in a truck with Jim, and we were gonna have a happily ever after.
我是说，我知道多年后你二十多岁时，确实和一个男人有过短暂婚约。
I mean, I know that years later, when you were in your twenties, you did have a brief engagement to a man.
他的名字不是吉姆。
His name was not Jim.
他叫罗杰。
His name was Roger.
但那次婚约没有结果。
But that engagement didn't work out.
告诉我，你喜欢罗杰什么？
Tell me, what did you love about Roger?
噢，罗杰简直太有趣了。
Oh, Roger was just a ton of fun.
他总是笑个不停，而且随时准备去冒险。
He was always laughing, and he was always up for adventure.
他非常风趣幽默。
He was very funny.
而且我们从事的领域截然不同。
And we were in very different fields.
他是工程专业的，而我学的是心理学。
He's in engineering, and I was in psychology.
但我们互相支持着读完了研究生。
But we supported one another through grad school.
所以，我觉得我们真的很般配。
And so, know, I thought I felt like we were really good together.
我们的感情非常稳固。
We were really solid.
你知道，我原本相信我们会白头偕老。
You know, I I believe that we would grow old together.
这种确信是从何而来的呢？
Where did that certainty come from?
好问题，因为显然我错了。
Good question, because apparently I was wrong.
我们的婚礼原定在五月举行，为此我们做了大量准备。
So our wedding was scheduled in May, and we had spent a lot of time preparing for that.
所以一切都安排妥当了。
And so we had everything lined up.
到了三月份，罗杰半夜醒来，他说：‘我做不到’。
And at the March, Roger woke up in the middle of the night and he said, I can't do this.
我问：‘你什么意思？做不到什么？’
I said, what do you mean you can't do what?
他说：‘嗯，我不能结婚。’
And he said, well, I can't get married.
‘我无法完成这场婚礼。’
I can't go through with this wedding.
于是我们开始了许多，可以说，关于原因的痛苦的讨论。
And that began a whole lot of, shall we say, painful discussions about why.
而我始终没能得到一个真正合理的解释
And I never got a really good answer as
直到
to
一年后我们在公园重逢——当时我正打算卖掉那件婚纱。
why until a year later when we actually met in a park because I was going to sell the dress.
最后我把婚纱送给了别人。
I actually ended up giving it to somebody.
我们在公园见面时我问：'你想看看那件婚纱吗？'
But we met in a park and I said, Do you want to see the dress?
当我拿出婚纱时他惊呼：'天啊'
And so I pulled the dress out and he said, oh my gosh.
他说：'太美了'
He said, it's so beautiful.
接着问道：'知道我们当初缺了什么吗？'
And he said, do you know what we were missing?
我当时就说，不知道。
And I was like, no.
他说，我们缺少的是魔力。
And he said, we were missing the magic.
我们没有那种魔力。
We didn't have the magic.
你知道他说'我们缺少魔力'是什么意思吗？
Did you know what he meant when he said we were missing the magic?
你觉得这个说法有道理吗？
Did that track for you?
确实有道理。
It it did.
在某种程度上，是的。
I to some degree, yes.
我是说，某种程度上我还在试图理解到底哪里出了问题。
I mean, to some degree, I was still trying to understand what had gone wrong.
但是，是的，我确实理解了。
But, yeah, I I did.
因为在那段时间里，我其实遇到了唐。
Because in between that time, I actually had met Don.
好的。
Okay.
唐是谁？
Who's Don?
他是谁？
Who's he?
我去参加了一个培训，培训师是一个叫唐的人。
So I went to a training, and the trainer was a man named Don.
我记得自己是个害羞的人，但在培训中我还是主动找他请教了一个问题。
And so I remember I'm a shy person, but I did approach him at the training to ask him a question about something.
我们简短地聊了几句，当时没多想，但觉得他是个非常有趣的人。
And we had a brief little conversation and I didn't think much of it, but I thought, well, wow, that's a really cool guy.
但我记得那次培训持续了几天。
But I think the training was a couple of days.
培训结束后，我记得他对我说了些什么，他问：'嘿，改天要不要一起吃个饭？'
And so when the training ended, I remember he said something to me and and he said, hey, do you wanna, get together for dinner sometime?
我们有很多共同点。
And we had a lot in common.
我们在相似的领域工作。
We work in similar fields.
我们之间有种非常深刻的联结。
We just had a very deep connection.
我常对人们说那是我生命中最美好的时光。
And I've often said to people that it was the best days of my life.
当这一切发生时，你在想什么？
And what were you thinking as that was happening?
你当时就感觉那是最美好的日子吗？
Did you feel like those were the best days?
我当时心里想的是，哦，现在我明白了。
What I thought to myself was, oh, now I understand.
这就是为什么我和罗杰的关系没有结果。
This is why the relationship with Roger didn't work out.
因为实际上，真正适合我的人，那个命中注定的人其实还在那里，只是我还没遇见他。
Because actually, the real person for me, the real the man who really was the one for me was still out there, I just hadn't met him yet.
就这样，那段恋情开始了，那是一场美妙的恋情，但也是一段短暂的恋情。
And so that's how that romance began, which was a wonderful romance, but was also a brief romance.
你能告诉我为什么结束了吗？
Can you tell me why it ended?
为什么你们不再联系或见面了？
Why did you guys stop being in contact or or seeing each other?
很多事情让情况变得复杂。
It was complicated by a lot of things.
你知道，我经常出差，还有工作要忙，所以最终因为缺乏沟通和书信往来就结束了。
You know, I was traveling a lot and I had my job and so it ended basically by lack of communication and letters.
要知道，那还是在电子邮件和手机出现之前的年代。
You know, again, this is in the days before email and cell phones and that kind of thing.
我记得给他写了封信，倾诉我有多受伤。
So I remember writing him a letter and saying how hurt that I was.
之后我陷入了深深的抑郁。
And I then was very depressed.
那时候你有尝试重新开始约会吗？还是说...
Did you try to get back out there dating wise at this time, or was that
这完全不是优先考虑的事？
not at all a priority?
没有。
No.
确实没有。
It was not.
我当时心碎得根本无法振作。嗯。
I was way too brokenhearted Mhmm.
甚至想都不敢想。
To even think about that.
而且，你知道吗，我曾以为我终于找到了与罗杰关系失败的完整原因。
And, you know, here I thought that I had found the answer to the whole reason why my relationship with Roger hadn't worked out.
而现在我真的找到了一段如魔法般美好的感情。
And now I really had found a relationship that was magical.
然后它结束了。
And then it ended.
我真的觉得，这种事怎么会在我身上发生两次？
And I really felt like, how could this happen to me twice?
这两次心碎接踵而至，几乎是无缝衔接
These two heartbreaks relatively close to each other, almost back to back
从宏观角度来看。
in the in the grand scheme.
你是否感到心变得坚硬了？
Did you feel your heart harden?
你当时是不是觉得，就这样了。
Were you like, that's it.
我，我不要再这样下去了。
I'm I'm not doing this anymore.
这不值得。
It's not worth it.
我会说那时候还没有，我还没准备好结束。
I would say at that time, no, I was not ready to be done.
大概又过了十年左右吧。
It took probably another decade or so.
你知道吗？
You know?
而在那些年间，我确实遇到过一些真正的好男人，但关系都没能长久。
And in the intervening years, you know, I did have some men in my life who were truly good men and but the relationships didn't last.
我想大概到我四十五岁左右时，我才真正开始问自己：你究竟想在这里得到什么？
I would say maybe by the time I was in my mid forties and I really started asking myself, what are you trying to do here?
回首往事，我意识到自己的人生轨道在那时发生了转变——从原本追求婚姻、家庭和安居的未来，转向了更注重事业发展、而非感情生活的方向。
Looking back, I can see that my life shifted tracks at that time from a future that was about creating marriage and a family and a home to my being more of a career person, focused on my career and not so much a relationship.
你当时是如何说服自己接受这个新版本的人生未来的？这个可能找不到伴侣的版本？
What were some of the things you were telling yourself that made you okay with this new version of your future, this version where you wouldn't find someone?
你是怎么慢慢接受这个现实的？
How did it become alright?
嗯，因为我必须问自己：你的人生到底缺失了什么？
Well, because I had to ask myself, what are you missing in your life?
你看，我生活中其实有很多美好的事物，我的人生进展得非常顺利。
You're, you know, I have a lot of good things in my life and my life is going along very well.
确实，我心里有种空落落的感觉，总觉得需要一段感情来填补。
And yeah, I sort of had this empty spot in my heart or this empty place in my heart where I felt like a relationship would fill it up.
但我转念一想：你的人生真的缺少什么吗？
But I thought, is something really missing in your life?
当我开始环顾四周时，我发现：我对自己的现状和身份都非常满足。
And as I started looking around, I thought, I'm very content with where I am and who I am.
不，其实我什么都不缺。
And no, there's really nothing missing at all.
感觉就像我多年来一直用头撞墙，试图弄清楚如何让这段感情发生。
And it felt like I had been beating my head against a wall for years, trying to figure out how to make this relationship thing happen.
在某个时刻你会想，等一下，为什么你总在撞墙呢？
And at some point you think, wait a minute, why are you beating your head all the time?
你知道，这真的值得吗？
You know, is this really worth it?
当你不撞墙时，你错过了什么？嗯，你错过了生活。
And what are you missing when you're not beating your head and well, you're missing living.
你错过了生命本身。
You're missing life itself.
但...你有没有感到孤独过？
Did did you ever feel lonely, though?
没有。
No.
真的吗？
Really?
真的。
Really.
是啊。
Yeah.
我从未感到孤独。
I've never felt lonely.
也许是因为我有很多兄弟姐妹和朋友。
And maybe that's because I have a lot of siblings and friends and things.
不。
No.
我不曾感到孤独。
I did not feel lonely.
我是否曾为生活中缺少伴侣而感到遗憾？
Did I miss having a romantic partner in my life?
是的。
Yes.
你知道，我只是想明确表示，这个过程并不容易。
You know, and I just want to be clear that this was not an easy process.
我放手的每件事物上都布满抓痕。
Everything I let go of has claw marks all over it.
所以我可以说，这种关于圆满浪漫关系的想法上布满抓痕。
So I can say that this idea of fulfilling romantic relationship had claw marks all over it.
在我能够放手之前，它已经被撕成碎片了。
It was clawed to pieces before I could let go of it.
是啊。
Yeah.
确实如此。
So yeah.
当你终于放下这个布满抓痕的东西时，是否感到解脱？
And when you did let this claw marked thing go, was it liberating?
是的
Yeah.
绝对是的
Absolutely.
我意识到这其中有一种自由，确实感到如释重负
And I realized that there is a freedom in that and that I I did feel liberated.
因为我想着，嘿
And because I'm like, hey.
不需要再寻找任何人了
Don't need to be looking for anybody.
但要把希望重新放回篮子里并关上篮子很难
But it was hard to put hope back in the basket and shut the basket.
希望
Hope.
对拥有浪漫的希望，对拥有我一直梦想的那种圆满关系的希望
Hope of having a romance, hope of having that fulfilling relationship that I'd always dreamed of.
我只是把它塞进篮子，然后合上盖子。
And I just stuffed it in the basket and shut the lid.
但时不时地，你知道的，希望——
And but every now and again, you know, hope.
它总是不断涌现。
It just keeps coming.
它会，你知道的，从篮子里探出头来
And it would, you know, stick its head out of
朝我挥手。
the basket and be waving at me.
我就说：快回去！
I'm like, get back in there.
把盖子关紧。
Shut that thing.
当你开始接受余生都将单身这个事实，把对浪漫伴侣的希望永远封存起来时，你是否回顾过自己的人生并重新评估它？
When you hit this kind of coming to terms with being single for the rest of your life, kind of putting hope in the basket for the rest of your life, this hope for a romantic partner, you know, did you take a look back on your life at this at that point and and assess it?
如果是这样，你看到了什么？
And if so, what did you see?
嗯，我记得我50岁那年也是我第一次去欧洲旅行的时候。
Well, I remember the year that I turned 50 was also the first time I ever traveled to Europe.
我哥哥和他妻子当时住在德国，我和妈妈一起去了欧洲。
And my brother and his wife were living in Germany and my mom and I went to Europe.
那是我一直以来的梦想。
And that was a dream that I'd always had.
然后我记得当时在想，我的生活其实很充实。
Then I remember thinking that, you know, my life was very full.
一切都很好。
Things were good.
而且我期待着一个充满可能性的未来，虽然不一定是那种可能性——因为希望还是要放在篮子里，明白吗。
And I was looking forward to a future that, you know, that seemed wide open with possibility, you know, not the possibility necessarily, because again, hope is, you know, stay in the basket hope, all right.
但那个未来是继续工作，直到有一天退休，然后考虑退休后要做什么。
But a future of, you know, continuing to work and, you know, someday I was gonna, you know, retire and what was I gonna do then.
而且，你知道，我为自己设定了目标，比如还清房贷之类的。
And, you know, I had goals for myself, pay off my house, you know, those kinds of things.
50岁是一段美好的时光。
50 was a beautiful time.
然后就在你刚满52岁不久，嗯。
And then just after you turned 52 Mhmm.
你发现自己患有一种罕见的乳腺癌。
You found out you have a rare type of breast cancer.
是的。
Yes.
那一刻对你来说是什么感受？
What was that moment like for you?
嗯，它永远改变了你的生活。
Well, it changes your life forever.
这一点毫无疑问。
There's no doubt about it.
这是乳腺癌中最具侵袭性的一种类型。
It's the most aggressive form of breast cancer.
它被称为炎性乳腺癌。
It's called inflammatory breast cancer.
那时我就明白，我的生命正在缩短。
And so I knew then that my life was contracting.
随之而来的变化是，我的生活视角从展望未来十年或更久，变成了只能一天一天地过。
And what happened was my life went from looking a decade or more ahead to looking a day at a time.
克莱尔，当你得到这个诊断时，这对你意味着什么改变？
Claire, when you got this diagnosis, what did that change for you?
你知道吗，这非常有意思，因为我从中更了解了自己。
You know, it's really interesting because I learned a lot about myself.
你永远不知道在这些情况发生前自己会如何应对。
You really don't know how you'll react until those situations happen.
所以我对自己说了几句话。
So I said a couple things to myself.
嗯，我打算继续工作直到无法继续为止，继续锻炼直到无法继续为止，就这样坚持做我正在做的事直到力竭。
Well, I'm just gonna keep working until I can't anymore, and I'm gonna keep exercising until I can't anymore, And I'll just keep doing what I'm doing until I can't anymore.
所以，他们把化疗时间安排得让我的虚弱期正好在周末。
So, you know, they scheduled chemo in such a way that your down days would be on the weekend.
这样我就能继续工作，先去化疗然后上班，到了周末身体开始虚弱，等到周日下午就逐渐恢复。
So I was able to continue working and I'd go to chemo and go to work and then, you know, come down on the weekend and get by Sunday afternoon, was coming back up.
我是说，你说这些...
I mean, you're saying all of
说得好像这只是个日常流程。
this like it's just a routine.
你看，我做这个，我做那个。
You know, I'm doing this, I'm doing that.
但这过程中肯定有艰难的部分吧。
But there had to be hard parts of this.
哦，当然有。
Oh, yeah.
这其中确实有艰难的部分。
There are hard parts of it.
炎性乳腺癌是个恶魔。
Inflammatory breast cancer is a beast.
这是个挑战。
It's a challenge.
我要这么说。
I will say this.
患炎性乳腺癌时，乳房会肿大。
Inflammatory breast cancer, your breast enlarges.
癌细胞会让乳房变成紫色。
The cancer turns the breast purple.
它硬得像石头一样。
It was hard as a rock.
我能感觉到它逐渐变硬。
I could feel it turning hard.
这很丑陋。
It's ugly.
而你每天都要带着它四处走动。
And you have to walk around with it every single day.
于是你开始意识到，今天就是你拥有的一切。
And so you start to realize that today is all that you've got.
如果今天就是我拥有的一切，那我最好让今天过得精彩。
And if today is all that I've got, then I damn well better make this a good day.
因为我不会放弃我现在拥有的一切。
Because I'm not giving up what I got right now.
于是我发现，我已经爱上了生活本身。
And so what happened is that I realized that I have fallen in love with life itself.
我记得那天得知自己病情已进展到第四阶段。
And I remember the day that I found out that I had progressed to stage four.
我回到家，推开了家门。
I came home and I opened the door to my house.
我环顾四周看着所有的物品，心想，哇，将来得有人来把这些东西都处理掉。
And I looked around at all my possessions, and I thought, wow, somebody's going to have to come in and give all of these things away.
于是我开始环顾所有我会想念的东西。
And so I started to look around at all the things that I was going to miss.
我想，哇，我真的很会想念那个日出。
And I thought, wow, I'm really going to miss that sunrise.
我会想念那个日落。
I'm going to miss that sunset.
我会想念工作中的同事们。
I'm going to miss my colleagues at work.
我会想念看着侄女侄子们长大的时光。
I'm going to miss my nieces and nephews growing up.
这对我来说至今仍是难以释怀的事。
That's still a hard one for me.
我会想念这些平凡的日常时刻——当你散步时看到一朵美丽的花，或是偶遇某个人。
I'm going to miss just these everyday moments of where you're taking a walk and there's a beautiful flower and you run into somebody.
诸如此类的事情太多了。
Just so many things like that.
我有个朋友被诊断出患有炎性乳腺癌，她已经去世了。
I had a friend who was diagnosed with inflammatory breast cancer, and she's passed away now.
但她对我说，如果能回到过去改变这一切，她也不愿意改变。
But she said to me, If I could turn back time and change this, I wouldn't.
她说，这段经历给予她的太多了。
She said, It's given me too much.
我哭着不停问她，你怎么能这么说？
And I'm crying and crying and saying, how can you say that?
我确信自己永远不会那样想。
I'm sure I'll never feel that way.
但若能回到过去，我也不会改变这一切。
But if I could turn back time, I wouldn't change it.
它给予我的太多了。
It's given me too much.
它让我懂得了珍惜生命。
It's given me an appreciation for life.
你知道，我九月份出院时，由于各种原因，他们一直没让我洗澡。
You know, I got out of the hospital in September, and for various reasons, they hadn't let me take a shower.
天啊，我回到家后，
And, oh my god, I came home.
立刻冲进浴室洗澡。
I jumped in the shower.
我能自己开车去上班了。
I was able to get in my car and drive my car to work.
嗯。
Mhmm.
我当时想，这是我人生中最美好的一天。
And I thought, this is one of the best days of my life.
明白吗？
Know?
我洗过澡了。
I'm showered.
通勤。
Commute.
嗯。
Mhmm.
是的。
Yeah.
嗯哼。
Uh-huh.
对。
Yeah.
所以我并不是不会对事情感到沮丧、难过或伤心，是的。
And so I it's not like I don't get frustrated or upset or sad about things Yeah.
因为我确实会这样。
Because I do.
但我已经能更平静地接受生命终将结束的事实。
But I've become more at peace with knowing that my life will end.
但这也让我更自由地去感受我有多热爱生命，多珍惜活着。
But that also gives me the freedom to know how much I love this life and how much I love being alive.
我愿意倾尽所有为之奋斗，因为我如此深爱着它。
And I'm willing to fight for it with all I got because love I it so much.
稍后回来时，克莱尔的生活将迎来完全出乎意料的爱情转折。
When we come back, Claire's life takes a totally unexpected turn towards romance.
请继续收听。
Stay with us.
克莱尔，在你三十多岁到四十多岁时一直渴望能遇到真爱。
Claire, all through your thirties and forties, you were hoping you'd fall in love.
而到了五十多岁时，你却要面对晚期癌症。
And then in your fifties, you're facing terminal cancer.
听起来你确实遇到了真爱，只是方式出乎意料。
And it sounds like you did find love, just not how you expected.
你找到了对生活的这份热爱。
You found this love for life.
我感觉我现在都能想象出新闻标题了。
And I feel like I can see the headline now.
就像是'女子与生活坠入爱河'，这会是你的故事的美好结局。
It's like woman falls in love with life, which would be a beautiful end to your story.
嗯。
Mhmm.
只不过这并不是你故事的结局。
Except it's not the end to your story.
对吧？
Right?
是的。
Yes.
确实如此。
That is correct.
所以我的心完全被填满了。
So my heart was completely full.
我想说这句话。
I wanna say that.
因为我找到了对生活的热爱。
Because I have found a love for life.
但在我人生中最意想不到的时刻，当我对自己身体不满意、无法想象会有人觉得我有吸引力时，更别说是浪漫伴侣了，却突然且非常意外地，我再次邂逅了爱情。
But at the most unexpected time in my life, when I don't feel good about my body and I cannot imagine that anybody is gonna find me attractive, it certainly is a romantic partner, suddenly and very unexpectedly, I did find romance again.
而这个人恰好是唐。
And it happened to be Don.
恰好是我们之前听说过的那个男人，唐。
It happened to be a guy we've heard about before, Don.
多跟我们说说唐对你而言是谁。
More about us who Don is to you.
唐是27年前曾与我有过一段感情的人。
So Don was a person that I had a relationship with twenty seven years ago.
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分手时我彻底心碎了。
And I was completely heartbroken when it ended.
但我后来继续生活并释怀了，而且我是那种总能与人保持朋友关系的人。
But I had gone on and made my peace And with I'm a kind of person who always stays friends with people.
我们在相似领域工作，彼此生活有交集，但交流不多，大概一年几次。
And so we work in similar fields, and we were in one another's orbit, but we didn't talk very much, maybe a couple times a year.
我确实记得确诊癌症后给他打过电话告知这个消息。
I do remember I called him when I found out that I had cancer and let him know.
那么唐是什么时候重新出现在你的生活中的？
So when did Don come back into the picture?
比如，在你确诊后多久？
Like, how long after your diagnosis?
另外，我想提醒听众们注意，每次我提到他的名字时，你都会露出那种让你整个人都亮起来的美丽笑容，这笑容也感染了我。
Also, I just wanna note for the listeners out there that every time I say his name, you smile in this beautiful way that lights you up, and it's lighting me up too.
在你确诊后多久，他重新走进了你的生活？
How long after your diagnosis did he reenter your life?
嗯，那是一年前的事了。
Well, it was one year ago.
那时候，我已经进入四期阶段，四期转移性乳腺癌。
And by this time, I'm well into a stage four situation, stage four metastatic breast cancer.
这种状况可不太适合写在交友资料上，你懂吧？
And so that's not exactly the kind of thing you put on your dating profile, you know?
有点棘手。
A little tough.
事情是这样的，他当时要去凤凰城参加一个会议。
Had happened was he was going to be in Phoenix for a conference.
他说，'哦，天哪，我们真该一起吃个晚饭'。
He said, Oh, well, geez, we ought to get together for dinner.
你知道，我已经很久没见过他了。
You know, I haven't seen him for a long time.
于是我们就见了面，吃了顿不错的晚餐，就这样。
And so we did, and we had a nice little dinner, whatever.
当我向他道别时，我真心觉得这可能是我最后一次见到他了。
And when I said goodbye to him, I honestly thought to myself, I'll probably never see him again.
我想这就是结局了。
I think that this is it.
但后来发生了一件非常奇怪的事。
But then this really weird thing happened.
这事说起来有点尴尬。
It was kind of a little bit embarrassing.
当时我公司正在举办员工圣诞派对。
So my employer was having the employee Christmas party.
多年来我都是独自参加每一场公司活动。
And I have gone alone to every single employee event for years.
于是我想，你知道吗？
And so I thought, you know what?
这次我想找个能让我开心同行的人一起去。
I want to go with somebody that I would enjoy going with.
我只想能有一次和别人一起参加员工圣诞派对。
And I would like to just go once to the employee Christmas party with somebody.
我记得当时开车上班时，突然想到要邀请他和我一起去。
And I remember I was driving to work and it popped into my head to ask him to go with me.
然后我就想，不行不行不行不行。
And I was like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
因为他甚至都不住在同一个州。
Because he doesn't even live in the same state.
但这个念头一直萦绕在我心头。
But it just kept bugging me and bugging me.
所以我必须承认，我感觉自己像个高中女生，就像在萨迪·霍金斯舞会上那样，你知道的，就是打电话邀请男生陪你参加舞会的那种感觉。
And so I have to say that I felt like a high school girl, you know, at the Sadie Hawkins dance or whatever, you know, when you call and you ask the guy to go with you.
于是我给他打了电话，说我一直想找个人陪我参加圣诞派对，你愿意和我一起去吗？
And so I called him up and I said, you know, I've always wanted to go to the Christmas party with somebody and would you go with me?
派对就在几周后举行。
And it's in a few weeks.
他说，好啊，当然可以。
And he said, yeah, sure.
我们玩得非常开心。
And we had this great time.
这是你期待的一切吗？
Was it everything you'd hoped for?
我喜欢很多闪闪发光的东西，圣诞节时这些特别多。
I like a lot of glitter and sparkle and you get a lot of that on Christmas.
我们的员工圣诞派对在一家非常漂亮的酒店举行，那里到处都是灯光和闪闪发亮的装饰。
And our employee Christmas party was held at this really lovely hotel and it was full of all the lights and all the sparkle.
我就是，怎么说呢，特别喜欢那种氛围。
And I just, I don't know, I'm just a fan of that kind of thing.
所以能和他一起去那个美丽的地方，拥有这样的经历真的很开心。
And so it was just really fun to go with him and to be in this beautiful place and to have this experience.
第二天我们还一起吃了早餐。
And the next day we met up for breakfast.
于是他开始对我说，他年纪比我大，自己也有不少健康问题。
And so he starts saying to me, he's older than I am and he'd been having a few health issues of his own.
然后他说，我想我要搬家了。
And he said, I think I'm going to be moving.
我说，哦。
And I said, oh.
他提到了几个可能去的地方，亚利桑那是其中之一。
And he mentioned a few possible places, and Arizona was one of them.
我说，那你为什么还要去其他地方呢？
And I said, well, why would you wanna go anywhere else?
我当时其实是在跟他开玩笑。
And I was kinda joking with him, you know.
结果大约一个月、六周后，我听说，我要搬去亚利桑那了。
Well, about a month, six weeks later, I hear, well, I'm gonna move to Arizona.
你听到这个消息时是什么反应？
How did you react when you got that news?
这消息简直太棒了。
That's kinda like great news.
是啊。
Yeah.
我当时，呃，我震惊了。
I was well, I was shocked.
我完全惊呆了，因为我不确定他是不是认真的。
I was completely shocked because I wasn't sure he was really serious.
你知道吗？
You know?
我说，好吧，听着。
I said, well, look.
我会帮你找房子，我会一直支持你。
I'll help you look for a place and I'm here for you.
于是他租了房子，但人还没搬过来。
And so he rented a house and he wasn't here yet.
他说，你能帮我去拿钥匙吗？
And he said, look, could you go pick up the keys for me?
我说，哦，好的，我去拿。
And I said, oh, yeah, I'll do that.
然后我有了个主意，我说，你知道吗？
And then I got this idea, and I said, you know what?
我应该给他准备些东西，等他来的时候用。
I should get him a few things for when he gets here.
这真是太贴心了。
That is so sweet.
就是，你知道，当你刚搬进去什么都没有的时候，
That, you know, you know, when you move in and and you don't have anything,
你懂的。
you know.
对吧？
Right?
克莱尔，你
Claire, you
手头有很多事要忙
got a lot going on.
你手头有很多事要忙
You got a lot going on.
你有全职工作
You have your full time job.
你还要接受治疗
You have your treatment.
你还要照顾自己的健康
You have your own health.
这意味着当你看到这间空房子时，你心里想着：你知道吗？
It means something that you saw this empty house, you were like, you know what?
在我满满的日程中，我觉得我应该出去给他买个搅拌机之类的东西
Amidst my full schedule, I think I'm gonna go out and buy him a blender or whatever you got him.
你知道吗？
You know?
嗯，差不多就是那样。
Well, it was kinda like that.
后来我表弟也对我说过，哦，是啊。
And my cousin has said to me since, oh, yeah.
想想看，在一个男人搬进去前帮他布置房子，你觉得这很单纯对吧？
Know, going to fix up a guy's house before he moves in, yeah, you think that's just platonic, right?
但事实就是我在情人节那天，在他空荡荡的浴室里挂浴帘。
But it did come to pass that I was putting up a shower curtain in his vacant bathroom on Valentine's Day.
太离谱了。
No way.
而且他当时根本不在城里。
And he wasn't in town.
我对自己说，这有多疯狂？
And I said to myself, how crazy is this?
但事情确实就这么发生了。
And so but that is exactly what happened.
很明显你和唐正在以朋友的方式重新联系。
It's clear you and Don are reconnecting in a friendship way.
你们是什么时候开始变得浪漫的？
When did you start when did it start to become romantic?
有没有某个时刻让你意识到，这不仅仅是两个老朋友重新走进彼此的生活？
Was there a time you can point to where you were like, oh, there's more here than just two old friends, you know, coming back into each other's lives?
讽刺的是，大概在我那篇关于单身的文章发表后一两周。
Well, ironically, it was about a week or two after my story was published, which is, you know, about being single.
但我们突发奇想去了一个叫'蝴蝶仙境'的地方，应该是这个名字。
But we got this idea to go to this it's called the Butterfly Wonderland, I think is what it's called.
我们去了那里，那真是个美妙的地方。
But we went and it is actually it's just such a lovely place.
到处都是蝴蝶，美极了。
And there's just butterflies everywhere and it's beautiful.
那里有鲜花和绿植。
There's flowers and greenery.
与亚利桑那州其他地方相比，这是个非常郁郁葱葱的地方。
It's a very lush sort of place compared to everywhere else in Arizona.
然后我感觉能量场开始转变。
And I felt felt this energy start to shift.
我内心在问自己：这是怎么回事？
And I'm like saying to myself, what is happening here?
到底发生了什么？
What is going on?
确实有什么事情正在发生。
There is something happening.
此刻我感觉有扇门正在打开，而我将无法关上它。
And I now I felt like there was a door starting to open and I wasn't gonna be able to shut it.
换作以前的我可能会说，考虑到所有复杂因素和可能的一团糟——因为这确实会很麻烦——我不会跨过那扇门。
And perhaps the old me would have said I'm not walking through that because of all the complications and the messiness of it because it was gonna be messy.
说实话，我们可能都处在生命的最后阶段了，因为他比我年长。
Truthfully, we're both in the probably the final seasons of our life because he is older than I am.
而且，当然，我患有第四期癌症。
And, of course, I have stage four cancer.
所以那扇门打开了，我觉得我必须走进去。
And so the door opened, and I felt like I had to walk through it.
当你说感受到能量转变，就像有扇门打开了时，你们是否进行了我们所说的那种明确关系的对话？
When you say you felt the energy shift, like there was a door opening, did you have what we call a kind of like define the relationship conversation?
你有没有在长椅上转向他，明确表示'有些事正在发生'？
Did you turn to him on that bench and say, clearly, something's happening.
我们应该谈谈这件事。
We should talk about it.
唉，我真希望我能说自己当时那么成熟。
Well, I wish I could say I was that mature.
但显然，我并没有。
But apparently, I'm not.
这些东西从来不会影响到我。
This stuff never gets to me here.
我们没有，是的。
We didn't yeah.
而且，没有。
And and no.
我还在上高中。
I I'm still in high school.
所以我们没有在养老院谈话，但我感觉到了，也知道了。
So we didn't have a conversation on the pensioner, but I felt it and I knew it.
但后来，一两天之内，我们确实谈了。
But later, within a day or two, we did.
我说，好吧，我们看看，如果...如果我们能坚持九十天的话。
And I said, well, let's just see you know, if this if we can make it ninety days.
所以他一直开玩笑说我们继续坚持。
So he keeps joking with me that we keep okay.
又是九十天，再一个九十天。
Ninety more days and ninety more days.
我说，那要是九十天后我们都不跟对方说话了呢？
I said, well, what if we're not speaking to each other in ninety days?
所以我说，要不我们就试试看会怎样。
So I said, well, let's just give it a go and see what happens.
你懂吗？
You know?
你们大多数晚上都一起吃晚餐吗？
Do you guys eat dinner together most nights?
嗯。
Mhmm.
嗯。
Mhmm.
确实。
Do.
他在给你做饭吗？
Is he cooking for you?
因为你...是啊。
Because you Yeah.
说来惭愧，我一次都没给他做过饭。
And I I'm kind of ashamed to say that I've never cooked for him once.
不过...没有。
And but no.
他最近经常下厨。
He's been cooking a lot.
是啊。
Yeah.
唐都给你做什么吃的？
What does Don what does Don make you?
噢，我最爱他做的邋遢乔三明治。
Oh, I love his sloppy joes.
好吃。
Yum.
还有波兰香肠配酸菜。
And then kielbasa and sauerkraut.
我忍不住
I can't help
我要过来蹭饭。
I'm coming over.
波兰风味，懂吗？
Polish, you know?
所以，是的。
So, yeah.
所以他做的这两样是我的最爱。
So those are my two favorites that he makes.
但他还会给我做早餐，帮我剥橙子，这些我说不清的好。
But And then he makes me breakfast and peeling oranges for me and I things like can't explain it.
我不知道这事是怎么发生的
I don't know how this happened.
就在我们六月份复合后，我已经有个预约要去殡仪馆安排我的葬礼
Right after we got back together in June, I already had an existing appointment to go to the mortuary and make my funeral arrangements.
天啊
Oh my gosh.
我们才刚刚复合
And so we had barely gotten back together.
我说，呃，我在殡仪馆有个预约
And I said, well, I've got an appointment in the mortuary.
不
No.
你想和我一起去吗？
Do you wanna come with me?
殡仪馆约会
Mortuary dates.
是啊。
Yeah.
所以我们第一次约会就是去殡仪馆。
So pretty much our first quote date was going to the mortuary.
告诉我他还带你去吃了晚餐之类的。
Tell me that he also took you to, like, dinner or something.
不能只有殡仪馆约会吧。
It wasn't just mortuary dates.
比如告诉我你们还去了不错的意大利餐厅。
Like, tell me that you also went to, like, a nice Italian restaurant.
其实我们确实去过。
We've you know, in fact, yes.
好吧。
Okay.
我姐姐们都说：只有你才会这样。
We've had my sisters are like, only you.
这就是你的行事风格。
That's just the way that you would roll.
是吗？
Yeah?
我是说，我在想，你知道，这是你早就预约好的事情。
I mean, I'm I'm thinking about how, you know, you this was an appointment that you had on the books.
就像，你单身时自己处理这些事情时就预约好了。
Like, you had made this appointment when you were single and handling this stuff yourself.
而我真正敬佩的是，你某种程度上是在告诉他：这就是我的生活。
And the thing I really look up to is it's you're kind of telling him, like, this is my life.
这些事我本来就在做。
I was already doing these things.
基本上，欢迎你加入我的旅程。
You are welcome to come along for the ride, basically.
而我觉得他那边了不起的是，他就这样接受了。
And the thing that I find remarkable from his end is he's like, yeah.
我在那里。
I'm there.
我们曾有过大约六周相对正常的日子，但随后一切都崩溃了。
And that's one of the things that we had about six good weeks of things being relatively normal, and then it all crashed.
我得了严重的流感，接着就被送进医院，癌症也恶化了。
And I got really sick with the flu, and then next thing I was in the hospital and the cancer has progressed.
从检查报告来看，我的情况非常糟糕。
And I'm looking really bad on paper.
他一直在医院陪着我，睡在椅子上，这让我很不安。
And he was staying in the hospital with me and sleeping in a chair, and that bothered me.
我说，不，我不想让你睡在椅子上。
I'm like, no, I don't want you sleeping in a chair.
但我姐姐从外地来了，于是我对他说，回家睡一晚自己的床吧。
But my sister came from out of town, and then I said to him, go home and sleep in your own bed for one night.
因为到那时，他已经连续四五晚都在医院陪着我了。
Because by now, he'd been at the hospital with me for probably four or five nights.
于是他回家了。
So he went home.
那天我的脑部核磁共振结果出来了。
And that was the day that the results of my brain MRI came back.
当时我和姐姐在医院花园散步，她说：‘你的核磁共振结果出来了。’
And my sister, we were out walking in the garden at the hospital and she said, your MRI came back.
我从她脸上的表情就明白了。
And I saw from the look on her face.
她说：‘是的，你脑部有个病灶。’
And she said, yeah, you've got a lesion in your brain.
这是我最不愿听到的消息。
And that was the last thing that I wanted to hear.
我觉得自己什么都能承受，除了脑转移。
I felt like I could deal with anything but brain metastasis.
我问：‘Dawn怎么说？’
And I said, well, what does Dawn say?
因为我大概猜到她应该已经告诉他了。
Because I kind of figured she had told him already.
我们当时正站在窗边往外看。
And we were standing and looking out the window.
我记得电梯门开了，他就站在那里。
I remember the elevator door opened, and there he was.
就像，他回来了。
Like, he came back.
在你人生的中年阶段，你做了很多努力来摆脱对浪漫伴侣的渴望。
You did so much work in the sort of middle part of your life to move on from your desire to have a romantic partner.
而现在你拥有了这个。
And now you have that.
你有了唐。
You have Don.
你有了一个浪漫伴侣。
You have a romantic partner.
我就是想知道，重新开启那种可能性并让它实现，是什么感觉？
I just wanna know, like, what does it feel like to to open back up that possibility and to let it be fulfilled?
那到底是什么样的感觉？
What what does that feel like?
一方面，这有点可怕，因为你再次敞开心扉。
Well, on the one hand, it's kinda scary because you're opening your heart again.
但我也认为，你知道，带着封闭的心生活是不值得的。
But I also think that, you know, it's not worth it to walk around with a closed heart.
那种安全感和归属感的重要性怎么强调都不为过，我想这是我们所有人都在寻找的，而我可能大半辈子都在寻找这种感觉。
It's It's hard to overstate the importance of that feeling of safety and belonging that I think that we all look for and that I'd probably been looking for for so much of my life.
当找到它时，有点像...就像在旋转木马上转圈，想着刚才发生了什么？
And to find that, it's a little bit of a you know, like you're swirling around on a merry-go-round going, what just happened here?
这也让人很难理解。
It's hard to get your head around too.
我的生活与八个月前、一年前已经大不相同了。
My life is very different than it was eight months ago, a year ago.
这种不同是因为它完全颠覆了我习惯的生活方式。
It's very different because it's a whole different way than I've been used to living.
虽然我们没有同居，但我们在一起度过了大量时间。
And we're not living together, but we spend a heck of a lot of time together.
说实话，我们曾开玩笑说如果他待太久我会窒息。
And I honestly thought we had this joke that I would be smothered if he was around too much.
所以他一直问我：'你需要独处时间吗？'
And so he kept asking me, you know, do you need some alone time?
'你需要独处时间吗？'
Do you need some alone time?
令我震惊的是，我发现自己完全能接受他在我这儿，或我去他那儿。
So much to my utter shock and surprise, I have found that I really I'm okay with, you know, him being here, you know, or me being at his place or whatever.
老实说，我对自己如此享受这段关系感到有些惊讶。
I gotta tell you, I'm a little surprised at how much I've enjoyed it.
前几天晚上我还说：'我可能回家就忘记吃饭了。'
The other night I said, well, I just would have come home and forgotten to eat.
他当时就说，不不不，我们得做点不一样的——我要给你做Sloppy Joes（美式肉酱三明治）
And he's like, no, no, we have to make different I'm making you Sloppy Joes
而且你确实吃了。对。
and you are eating Yeah.
我觉得，能与人分享生活中的起起落落，真的是种莫大的快乐。
It's just been a real joy, I think, to share with somebody the ups and downs.
仅仅是有人能共享生活这件事，就比我原先想象的有趣得多。
And just to share in life with somebody, it's way more fun than I actually thought.
你知道，对大多数情侣来说，开始一段关系或处于恋爱初期阶段——就像你和唐纳这样——很重要的一部分就是共同规划未来。
You know, a big part of for most couples, a big part of starting a relationship or being in the early stages of relationship, like you and Donar, is talking about the future.
没错。
Right.
还有你们将要共度的所有时光。
And all the time that you're gonna spend with them.
嗯哼。
Mhmm.
你和Don怎么样？
What about you and Don?
你们会讨论未来吗？
Do you talk about the future?
你知道，目前我对治疗反应良好，一切进展顺利。
You know, right now I'm responding to treatment and things are going well.
但情况可能瞬息万变。
That can change very quickly.
我非常清楚这一点。
I'm very aware of that.
希望不会，但确实有这个可能。
I hope it doesn't, but it could.
当然，你知道他年纪不小了，他的健康状况也可能急转直下。
And certainly, you know, he's not a young person and his own health could change very quickly.
事实是我们不知道未来会怎样——如果还有未来的话。
The truth is that we don't know what kind of future we have, if any.
所以我发现自己并不太在意谁去倒垃圾这类小事。
And so I find that I'm not very troubled about who's taken out the trash kind of thing.
我们并不是在建立一段要持续几十年的关系，因为我们很可能没有几十年。
It's not like we're building a relationship to last through decades because we're not likely to have decades.
所以实际上，重要的是当下。
And so really, it's about today.
最近有没有某个时刻，你们在一起时让你觉得，哦，这就是那种魔力。
Was there a recent moment where the two of you were together and you felt like, oh, this is this is the magic.
就像是，这就是它该有的样子。
Like, this is this is what it is.
是的。
Yeah.
嗯，我想说这样的时刻其实很多，而且可能并不是你预期中的那些。
Well, I'd say there's quite a lot of those moments, you know, and maybe they're not the ones that you'd expect, you know.
但你知道吗，我们一起看过一些美丽的日落，也目睹过月升，看着满月升起真是美极了。
But, you know, we've seen some beautiful sunsets together and watched the moon rise, which was just beautiful watching a full moon rise.
然后，你知道，我在想，我希望有更多时间进行更多对话，更多时间来做这些事。
And then, you know, I think about, like I want to have more time for more conversations and more time to do this.
我觉得一起做这些我称之为普通情侣会做的事情很美好。
And it was nice to do, I guess, what I call sort of normal couples things together.
是的。
Yeah.
这对我来说是一次非常新奇的体验。
It was just a very new experience for me.
是啊。
Yeah.
我猜当你最初被诊断出来，开始思考自己的死亡时，那对你来说有某种特定的样子。
I I'm gonna assume that when you were first diagnosed and you started thinking about your own death that looked a certain way to you.
然后你遇见了
And then you meet
唐。
Don.
而且
And
过去几个月里，随着事情的发展和深化，你对离世的想象肯定有些不同了。
over the past few months, as things have grown and deepened as much as they have, that picture of your passing must look a little different.
我想知道，这种想象对你来说有变化吗？
And I wanna know, like, has it changed for you?
如果有的话，是怎样的变化？
And if so, how?
你知道，我认为自己是现实乐观主义者。
You know, I consider myself realistically optimistic.
所以我保持乐观，会接受他们提供的每一种治疗方案。
And so I'm optimistic and I will take every single treatment that they offer me.
我会全力以赴，但同时也保持现实。
I will do everything, But I'm also realistic.
我知道可能会有那么一天，当所有治疗方案都用尽时，我希望自己能优雅地接受这个事实。
And so I know that the day may come when there are no more treatments available and that I will have to gracefully, I hope I can gracefully accept that at that time.
我曾说过，希望诸神在我离开这个世界时能对我仁慈些。
And I've said, I hope the gods will be kind to me as I leave this world.
我也觉得我不想让任何人失望。
I also feel that I don't wanna let anybody down.
特别是我的家人，现在还有唐，说实话，因为死亡这件事，你懂吗？
My family in particular, and now Don, frankly, by dying, you know?
我感觉，哎呀，我要让他们经历很多痛苦。
And I feel like, oh geez, I'm going to put them through a lot.
所以我确实和他谈过这件事，他说，我会和你一起面对，无论如何我都会陪着你。
And so I do talk to him about it and he says, I'm in it with you and I'll be there regardless.
从我被诊断出癌症的第一周起，我就一直对自己说，已经有数百万其他女性面临过乳腺癌，如果她们能挺过来，我也能做到。
One of the things that I've said to myself since I was first diagnosed with cancer, literally the first week, well, there is millions of other women who've been faced with breast cancer and if they got through it, I can do it too.
有数百万其他女性接受过化疗。
There's millions of other women who've had chemo.
如果她们能挺过来，我也能做到。
If they got through it, I can do it too.
或是手术、放疗。
Or surgeries, radiation.
有许多女性正带着四期转移性乳腺癌生活。
There are, many women living with stage four metastatic breast cancer.
如果她们能做到，我也能。
If they're doing it, I can do it too.
同样真实的是，也有许许多多女性因四期转移性乳腺癌去世。
And what's also true is that there are many, many women who have died from stage four metastatic breast cancer.
如果她们经历过，那么我也能面对。
And if they did it, well, I can do it too.
我只希望能优雅地面对这一切。
And I just hope that I can do it gracefully.
而且...我真的希望不会让任何人失望，因为我确实很想继续活下去。
And and I hope that well, jeez, I really hope that I won't disappoint anybody and let anybody down because I really do wanna keep living.
克拉拉，我觉得这恰恰体现了你的为人——当我们谈论你自己的生死时，你最先想到的却是别人。
Clara, I I do think it speaks to the kind of person you are that when we're talking about your own mortality, the first thing that comes to mind for you is other people.
是你所爱的人们。
It's the people that you love.
我只想说，唐能成为你爱的那群人中的一员，他非常幸运。
And I just wanna say I think Don is very lucky to count himself in that group of people who you love.
你知道，当你给《现代爱情》投稿时，其实是在你和唐重逢之前。
You know, when you wrote in to modern love, it was actually before you and Don had reconnected.
我想现在读起来会有不同的感受，因为我们知道了你投稿后发生的事。
And I I think it might have a different feeling now that we know what happened after you wrote it.
所以我希望你能为我们读一下。
So I I wonder if you could read it for us.
我很乐意朗读。
I will happily read it.
好的。
Yeah.
没问题。
Yeah.
谁能预料到之后会发生什么？
Who knew what was coming after this?
终于找到了那份魔力。
Finally finding the magic.
自童年起，我就渴望爱情。
Since childhood, I yearned for love.
有一次，我距离婚姻仅剩数周，却突然分崩离析。
Once, I came within weeks of marriage before it abruptly fell apart.
他说我们之间缺少魔力，不得不承认，他是对的。
He said we were missing the magic, and admittedly, he was right.
有过几个男人来了又走。
A few men came and went.
如今59岁的我患有四期转移性乳腺癌。
I'm now 59 with stage four metastatic breast cancer.
我依然没有伴侣，却已与生活陷入了一场奋不顾身的恋爱。
I still don't have a partner, but I've fallen desperately in love with life.
绝美的风景无处不在。
Exquisite beauty emerges everywhere.
猫咪蜷在膝头，收银员投来意外的微笑，阳光在湖面跳跃闪烁。
My cat on my lap, a cashier extending an unexpected smile, sunlight skipping across a lake.
我珍惜每一天，尽情感受世界的壮丽。
I use each day to soak up the world's splendor.
还没到时候呢，我轻声对上天说。
Not yet, I whisper to the heavens.
我深爱着这里的一切。
I love it here.
啊，经过这番交谈，我对这件事有了全新的深刻理解。
Oh, that that there's such a new depth to it after our conversation.
我的意思是，这实在太了不起了。
I mean, it's just remarkable.
蕴含的意义如此丰富。
There's so much.
我理解上下文和历史背景，也包括出版时你还不知道的后续章节内容。
I understand the context and the history and also the chapter that comes after it, which you did not know when this was published.
这真是太了不起了。
It's just remarkable.
是的。
Yes.
克莱尔、科里，非常感谢这次对话。
Claire, Corey, thank you so much for this conversation.
我真的非常、非常感激。
I'm I'm really, really grateful.
我也是。
Well, I am as well.
能与你交谈真是件愉快的事。
It's a delight to speak with you.
本期《现代爱情》由艾米·珀尔和戴维斯·兰德制作。
This episode of Modern Love was produced by Amy Pearl and Davis Land.
本期节目由我们的执行制片人Jen Poyant负责剪辑。
It was edited by our executive producer, Jen Poyant.
制作管理由Christina Joseph负责。
Production management by Christina Joseph.
《现代爱情》主题音乐由Dan Powell创作。
The Modern Love theme music is by Dan Powell.
原创音乐由Pat McCusker、Dan Powell、Rowan Nemisto和Marion Lozano共同创作。
Original music by Pat McCusker, Dan Powell, Rowan Nemisto, and Marion Lozano.
本期节目混音由Daniel Ramirez完成，录音棚技术支持来自Maddie Masiello和Nick Pittman。
This episode was mixed by Daniel Ramirez with studio support from Maddie Masiello and Nick Pittman.
特别感谢Mahima Chablani、Nelga Logli、Jeffrey Miranda和Paula Schuman。
Special thanks to Mahima Chablani, Nelga Logli, Jeffrey Miranda, and Paula Schuman.
《现代爱情》专栏由Daniel Jones编辑。
The Modern Love column is edited by Daniel Jones.
Mia Lee担任《现代爱情》项目的编辑。
Mia Lee is the editor of Modern Love Projects.
如果你想向《纽约时报》投稿散文或微型爱情故事，我们的节目说明中提供了投稿指南。
If you wanna submit an essay or a tiny love story to The New York Times, we've got the instructions in our show notes.
我是安娜·马丁。
I'm Anna Martin.
感谢收听。
Thanks for listening.
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