在演艺圈成名的残酷一面——扎克·布拉夫 - #1107

但与此同时，随之而来的也有些副作用。

And then at the same time, there's there's some side dishes that come along with it.

几乎每个有幸拥有爆款作品的人都会遇到这种情况。

That happens to almost everyone that's lucky enough lucky enough, blessed enough to to have a breakout hit.

如果回顾历史，那些人能获得全新机会的情况其实非常少见。

And it's very if you look at the cases in history, it's it's rare that those people get a whole new array of of opportunities.

对。

Mhmm.

布莱恩·克兰斯顿就是个完美的例子。

Brian Cranston is an a perfect example of someone who did.

他演过《中年男子的奇妙冒险》，就是那个角色。

Did Malcolm the Middle and was was that guy.

直到他演了下一个角色。

Until he was the next guy.

直到《绝命毒师》出现，之前这个项目被所有电视台拒绝过，据我所知，是AMC接手后，布莱恩·克兰斯顿才真正涅槃重生。

Until he and until Breaking Bad that was passed on by as I understand, the lore was passed on by, like, every network and and until I think AMC made it, and Bryan Crasson was reborn.

但这确实会发生，因为观众爱上了这个深入人心的角色，就再也看不到你作为其他角色的可能性。

But they that happens, of course, because people fall in love with with this beloved character, and they don't see you as as another thing.

对。

Mhmm.

你其实很难抱怨，毕竟你是极少数幸运到能获得这种机会的人。

You can't hardly complain because you were one of the extraordinarily lucky people who got an opportunity like like that.

但你肯定还是会忍不住遗憾，心想：真希望别人也能认真看待我演的其他角色。

But you do I'm sure every but you can't help but bemoan like, oh, I wish I could I wish I could be taken seriously as something else.

我很幸运，早就有了自己想发展的导演事业，可以拍自己的电影，做自己想做的东西。

I I was lucky that I had my directing career that I really wanted to pursue, so my own movies and make my own stuff.

但最近几年，我终于接到了几个完全跳出JD这个角色限制的戏份。

But in the last couple years, I've been finally getting a couple of parts that are outside the box of JD.

这还得感谢比尔，他一直是我最大的支持者。

Something actually through Bill again, who's been my biggest champion.

他让我在他和文斯·万格的剧《坏猴子》里演了一个小角色，虽然只出现了几集，但那个角色和JD完全不同。

He gave me a small part on Bad Monkey, his show with Vince Vong, And I was only in a couple episodes, but the part was so different.

我收到了大量正面反馈，这让我重新找回了自信，之前我甚至开始怀疑，自己是不是真的就只能演喜剧角色，或者一辈子只能演JD这类人物。

And I got so much positive feedback for it, and it it it really gave me a newfound confidence in my own ability that I had sort of gone like, maybe I am just, you know, a comic maybe I am just a sort of JD kind of guy.

其实我心里清楚，我还有更多可能性。

I mean, I knew I had more Mhmm.

我身上有更丰富的层次，而《Bad Monkey》里那个小角色带来的反响给了我信心，之后我就去拍了这部独立电影，刚入选特柳赖德电影节，我在里面演一个完全颠覆以往的角色——一个失去女儿的缉毒警。

Colors in me, but the response to that little arc on Bad Monkey gave me confidence and in a in a way, and then I went and did this independent movie that just got into Tribeca where I'm a 180 degrees from anything I've ever done playing this narcotics cop who lost his daughter.

这个故事是真实发生的。

It's a true story.

这部电影叫《Clean Hands》，今年夏天会在特柳赖德电影节上映。

And so that movie is called Clean Hands, and it's gonna be at Tribeca it's a Tribeca Film Festival this this summer.

当然，我特别希望能接更多这样的角色，但我也真的没什么可抱怨的。

But so, yeah, I would love to do more and more of that, but I can't complain.

我已经足够幸运了。

I've had I've I've been so lucky.

对。

Mhmm.

这挺有意思的。

It's interesting.

我想知道，有多少人会像你这样，对自己的成功产生一种类似斯德哥尔摩综合征的感觉。

I wonder how many people get what you had, which is a kind of almost like a kind of Stockholm syndrome for your own success.

有时候，人们因为做某件事而成功了。

So sometimes people get successful for doing a thing.

但其他人不愿意调整自己对这个人的看法。

Other people don't want to have to update their worldview about that person.

所以当这个人偏离了原来的形象，他们就不舒服。

So they don't like it when they deviate.

我觉得我们在日常生活中也常看到这种现象。

I think we see this in our personal lives.

比如一个人一直是个派对达人，然后突然说：我要注重健康了。

Somebody is the party guy or the party girl, and then say, I'm focusing on my health.

别人就会觉得：这不对啊，我得重新认识你了。

It's like, this isn't I I have to change who I think you are.

我以前也是这样，有时候你身边那些真心为你好的人，看到你做出这种积极的生活改变，会特别开心；但那些自己不愿改变的人，就会因为你的变化而显得格外刺眼。

I used to be, and, like, it can sometimes cause a little bit of obviously, people that are in your life that are wanting the best for you are very happy that you're making this positive lifestyle change, but maybe people who don't want to make that change too, their their behavior gets thrown into harsh contrast.

是的。

Yeah.

但外界的压力，你刚才说的这点特别有意思——你开始意识到，自己可能也曾经是镜子里的那个人。

But the pressure from the outside, what's interesting about what you said, was that you started to see yourself potentially in that through the looking glass thing.

也许我确实就是那样的人。

Like, well, maybe I am maybe I am just that.

也许我就是靠那种形象才被喜欢的，天啊，我还能再有比那更好的状态吗？

Like, maybe that is like, you know, lots of other people seem to like me in that, and fuck, I ever gonna have a better hit than that thing before?

我不禁想，那些想彻底改变生活的人，是不是也面临同样的困境？

And I wonder whether it's the same thing with people who just want to change their lives.

有人想摆脱过去的自己。

Somebody wants to go from being that thing.

可别人都在说：你以前不是挺爱玩的吗？不是挺会闹的吗？

It's like, well, everyone else is telling me that, I am like, I was the fun, like, party girl or whatever.

现在我就只是个妈妈了，这听起来没那么酷，或者说没那么吸引人。

And now I'm, like, I'm just a mom, and and I'm that's not as exciting or whatever.

也许别人不这么想，也许我根本就不太适合这种生活，但不是这样的。

Maybe people don't Maybe I'm not made for this as opposed to no.

那是他们自己的问题。

That it's their it's their problem.

别人得学会调整对你的看法，因为你是一个在不断成长和变化的人。

It's that person's issue to try and update their view of you as an evolving and changing person.

顺便说一句，这在演戏和生活中都一样——只要你变了，身边的人也得跟着变。

By the way, that is true in both acting and in life, that if you change who you're being, the people around you have to change who they're being.

如果我和你演一场戏，突然我决定冲你大吼大叫，只要你是个有点儿水准的演员，你自然会做出不一样的反应。

If I'm in a scene with you, and I'm all of a sudden decided to do a take where I'm fucking screaming at you and yelling in your face, if you're even a halfway decent actor, you're gonna react differently in the scene.

生活中也一样，如果我彻底改了，不再喝酒、不再熬夜、开始健身，作为朋友的你，也会不自觉地调整和我相处的方式，因为你别无选择。无论是演戏还是生活，我们都能主动改变自己，而别人只能跟着调整对我们的反应。

In life, if I totally change my life and I'm not drinking anymore and I'm not going out late and I'm going to the gym and and you as my friend are going to shift your way of being around me because you have no choice, We can we can both in acting and in life shift choose to shift who we're we're being, and then people can't help but react differently to us.

对。

Mhmm.

对。

Yeah.

个人成长领域的专家乔·哈德森提到，如果你换一种方式出现，对方的固有模式通常只能维持五到七次互动。

Joe Hudson, personal growth wizard, talks about how if you show up in a different way, the other person's patterns can only usually exist, in his estimation, for about five to seven interactions.

哇，真的吗。

Oh, wow.

所以你和伴侣之间通常有一套固定的吵架模式。

So there is a a typical way that you and your partner fight.

对吧？

Right?

他们可以扮演受害者，你就得扮演施暴者。

They get to play the victim and you get to play the bully.

他们可以扮演施暴者，你就得扮演救世主。

They get to play the bully and you get to play the savior.

不管是什么固定的相处模式，我都会向你抱怨，让你觉得委屈；或者你告诉我该怎么做，我就顺从你。

Whatever the accepted trade is, I'm gonna complain to you and you're gonna feel aggrieved, or you're going to tell me what it is that I need to do, and I'm gonna appease you.

不管是什么情况。

Whatever it is.

总有一种互动模式。

There's a a kind of exchange.

就像一种默契的配合。

There's a dance.

有一种固定的互动方式。

There's a dance move.

是的。

Yeah.

对吧？

Right?

就像打网球。

A tennis.

我先把球打过去。

It's like I'm gonna hit the ball over there.

你得

You're gonna

以某种特定的方式回击回去。

hit it back in a particular way.

是的。

Yeah.

然后如果真发生了，尤其是他之所以这么说，是因为在参加过霍夫曼课程、内在家庭系统，或者他那个类似的‘突破者’周末静修营之后，你的人生发生了巨大的转变。

And then if that happens, especially after and the reason that he said this was after going and doing something like the Hoffman process, our internal family systems, or Groundbreakers, which is his equivalent, a weekend retreat, or you you make a really big change in your life.

这种转变可能发生在很短的时间内，也可能需要更长的时间。

Perhaps it's over a short period of time or a longer period of time.

但只要第一次互动发生了，对方就会把球打过网来。

But if this first exchange occurs, the person serves the ball across the net.

如果你不回击，等这种不回应的情况重复五到七次之后，对方就再也坚持不了自己的模式了。

If you don't hit it back, after between five and seven times of that not happening, the other person can't keep doing their pattern.

他们就撑不住了，我的意思是，当然也有可能有些人天性冷漠，能一直我行我素。

They just simp I mean, I'm sure that there's some degree of sociopathy that you're able to get to where you just you just do your thing.

外面疯子多的是，他们就是会一直这么干下去

Oh, there's enough crazy people out there that will just fucking keep doing

你那些已经进化了的、所谓的文艺复兴式行为模式

your your evolved, you know, renaissance patterns.

但如果你以一种不同的方式出现，我试过几次，发现这真的特别准，简直有点吓人

But, yeah, that you if you show up in a different way, and I've tried to test this, and it really does seem to be, like, scarily true.

纳瓦尔·拉维坎特说过一句话，大意是：我们总以为能改变别人，其实不能

There's a line, Naval Ravikansk, got where he says, we think that we can change other people, but we can't.

我们总觉得自己改变不了自己，其实可以

We think we can't change ourselves, but we can.

想改变别人的行为，最简单的方法不是告诉他们该怎么做

And the changing of other people, the easiest way to do that, I think, in terms of behavior change is not by telling them what to do.

而是你自己先做出不一样的改变

It's just by doing something differently yourself.

然后坚持下去

And sticking to it.

对。

Yes.

没错。

Yes.

因为如果你又回到原来那种状态，哦，我明白了。

Because if you then fall back into the go, ah, I see.

是的。

Right.

这就像训练狗狗一样。

It's kinda like it's kinda like training your dog.

就像我那个新泽西口音的狗，如果你训练它的时候，它一哭你就放它出来，那你就完蛋了。

If you don't as my Jersey accent dog, if you don't the second if you're training your dog, the second they're crying and you let them out, you're fucked.

你搞砸了。

You fucked it up.

要坚持住。

You know, hold the line.

你必须坚持住。

You have to hold the line.

就我个人的经验来说，我之前都不知道有人已经把这量化到了五到七次。

And in terms of my experience, I didn't know that someone had sort of quantified it to five to seven times.

这挺有意思的。

That's interesting.

但如果你想要改变自己的行为模式和处事方式，就必须坚持住。

But if you're gonna shift your patterns and shift your way of being, you have to hold the line.

你得顶住，不管多难都不能放它出来，不管它怎么叫都不行，不然那些人就不会回到原来和你相处的方式了。

You you have to you have to not let the dog out of the crate and and not no matter what, no matter how hard they're crying because because other than than than than you've then those people aren't gonna shift their way of being back with you.

是的。

Yes.

是的。

Yes.

我一直对那些双刃剑式的东西特别感兴趣，你有没有发现哪些这样的模式？

What have been the patterns that have been the I'm pretty fascinated by things that are double edged swords.

很多时候，一个人最大的优势，其实是某种黑暗面的光明面。我认识瑞安·加西亚，WBC世界冠军，他特别偏执，简直到了极致。

Most times, someone's greatest strengths are the light side of something that's kinda dark, that I had Ryan Garcia, WBC World Away champion, and he's obsessive, incredibly obsessive.

这种偏执曾让他在职业生涯的某个阶段大量饮酒、疯狂派对，很难摆脱这些习惯。

And that's caused him at some point in his career to drink a lot and party an awful lot and to struggle to get away from it.

但同样也是这种偏执，让他成为了一个极度专注的运动员。他跟我讲过一个故事，说他小时候在拳台上跟一个人打，那人总能用一记特定的拳击中他。

It's also caused him to be an absolutely, like, microscopically focused athlete who would spend told me this story about how when he was a kid, he had a fight in the ring with some guy, and this guy kept on catching him with a particular shot.

瑞安回家后，在卧室里花了两个小时反复琢磨：他为什么总能打中我？他到底在做什么？

And Ryan went home, and he spent two hours in his bedroom thinking about why was he what was he doing?

他到底在做什么？

Why was he catching me with that shot?

他到底在做什么？

What was he doing?

他到底在做什么？

What was he doing?

他到底在做什么？

What was he doing?

然后他下楼告诉爸爸：让那孩子明天再来。

And then he went downstairs and told his dad, he's like, tell the kid come back tomorrow.

他问：你确定吗？

He's like, you you sure?

你刚被揍得挺惨的。

You just got beat up pretty bad.

那感觉可不怎么好。

Like, that that didn't look like a good experience.

但他坚持说：明天让他再来。

And he's like, bring him back tomorrow.

他这才明白，对方是先踏步再出拳，那种节奏打乱了瑞安的步点。

And what he'd realized was that there was the guy was stepping and then jabbing, and that offbeat was throwing Rein off.

他心想：明白了。

And he was like, okay.

所以当他这么做的时候，我就先退一步，然后用右拳反击。

So when he does this thing, I'm gonna step, then I'm gonna hit him with the right.

结果呢，整场比赛就这么结束了，因为他花了两个小时反复在脑子里重演那场打斗，根本停不下来。

And sure enough, the the whole game was over because he'd spent two hours replaying this fight in his head because he couldn't not do it.

是的。

Yeah.

但这种执着、对细节的专注、高度警觉的特质，也让他在人际关系上遇到大问题，跟孩子相处困难，还沾上了 Substance，整个人总是紧张不安，提心吊胆的。

But that same skill of the obsession, of the attention to detail, of the hypervigilance also gave him the challenges of overbearing problems with his relationships, problems with his kids, problems with substances, like, very out there, anxious sort of Yeah.

整天绷着一根弦。

Like, on edge thing.

我对这个很感兴趣。

I'm interested in

我的情况也差不多，就是没动手打过人。

Mine's similar without the beating the shit out of anybody.

对。

No.

我有强迫症，小时候特别严重。

I I I have OCD, and I I I had it bad as a kid.

我小时候就是那种会反复敲击东西的孩子，那时候我会在脑子里做一种算术，比如门把手或者这瓶水，我得数着碰它多少下，不然家里人就会出事。

I was I was one of those kids who had obsessive tapping, and you do this math in your head as a child where or I should say I did where I you know, it could be a doorknob or it could be this water bottle, and you say, oh, I have to I have to touch this a certain amount of times or something bad could happen to my family.

甚至当我长大一点，我也觉得这简直太荒谬了。

And then even as a young person, I said, that's crazy.

当然了。

Of course.

但为了保险起见，这就有点像一种迷信。

But just to be safe, it's kinda like a superstition.

成年人其实都能理解。

Adults can relate.

帕斯卡的赌注。

Pascal's wager.

强迫症者的赌注。

The obsessive's wager.

是的。

Yeah.

这就是它的名字吗？

Is that what it's called?

你知道帕斯卡赌注是什么吗？

You know what Pascal's wager is?

不知道。

No.

简单说吧，我不确定上帝是否存在，但不信上帝的代价是下地狱，而信上帝的回报可能是上天堂。

But Basically, that I don't know whether God is real or not, but the cost of not believing in God is hell, and the potential benefit of believing in God is heaven.

明白了。

Okay.

想象一下，一个八岁孩子心里也在算这笔账：我在打赌呢。

Now imagine that in an eight year old's mind going, I'm wagering.

我不想让家人出事。

I don't want my family to be harmed.

不确定有没有用，但反正试试也没损失。

Not sure if it's gonna do anything, but I might as well.

我的大脑在告诉我，如果我不能准确地重复六次，我家可能会出事。

My brain is telling me that something bad could happen in my family if I don't hit this six times correctly.

我知道这很荒谬，但为了安全，为了大家的安全——

I know that's crazy, but for safety, for everybody's safety,

我应该这么做。

I should do it.

我们再做一遍，为了安全。

We'll do it again for safety.

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

没错。

Yeah.

这慢慢就成了我自己的情况，说实话，我那时候挺严重的，但很多大人和孩子的情况比我还糟。

And that becomes you know, I I I had it pretty I had it bad, but, know, lots of adults and children have it way worse.

但我被诊断出有这个毛病，从此就一直焦虑不安。

But I was diagnosed with that, and it made me an anxious I was anxious.

我父亲脾气特别暴躁，那真的让人害怕。

My father had a real temper, and that was scary.

不过他也有很多温柔的一面，带我接触艺术，还特别幽默，总能逗得人哈哈大笑。

And I think I was he was also he also had a lovely side and introduced me to the arts and and could be and was hilarious.

他让我学会了欣赏幽默。

He introduced me to humor.

但他确实脾气火爆，让我一辈子都提心吊胆，生怕他突然发火，爆发出来。

But he did have quite a temper that I think put me for the rest of my life on on edge of when something bad was gonna happen, when he would randomly explode.

对。

Mhmm.

这确实影响了我整个童年，到现在作为成年人，我还是常常处于一种挥之不去的焦虑状态。

And that certainly affected my whole childhood, and and and I I I still feel it as an adult, just a sort of resting anxious state.

对。

Mhmm.

不过，这对我写东西和搞喜剧帮助特别大。

Now that has been great for for me in terms of writing and and comedy.

说真的，我有时候都觉得不可思议，明明这么焦虑，却还能站在那些压力巨大的领导岗位上，事情总出问题，随时都可能崩盘，但我特别庆幸自己学会了怎么还是能站出来，去面对这些特别难的事。

It's but it's amazing that I I sometimes I I find it crazy that I can operate at this in in these very anxious leadership positions where so much is on the line and and there's always a problem, and there's I I am so grateful that I've figured out how to just still step into the ring and and and and and do the really hard things,

就算心里根本不想干，对吧？

like Despite not feeling like it?

是的。

Yeah.

明明知道这事儿肯定特别难，会让我恐慌、难受、焦虑，肾上腺素飙升，可这反应根本跟问题的严重程度不匹配。

Despite like, gosh, I this is gonna be hard, and I'm gonna experience panic and discomfort and anxiety and adrenaline surges that aren't necessarily normal for for the level of the problem.

是的。

Yeah.

有强迫症和焦虑倾向的人，经常会在没什么大事的时候，突然像刚躲过一场车祸那样心跳狂飙，这正是引发恐慌发作的原因。

I mean, an OCD anxious person will often have an adrenaline surge that is like you just almost got into a car accident, and that's what leads some people to panic attacks.

就像指针直接冲到红色区域，还一直卡在那里，然后恐慌就来了。

That's sort of like the needle going into red and staying in red, and then there's a panic attack.

但所有这些经历，我觉得反而促成了我的幽默感，让我总在脑子里转个不停，也催生了一些还不错的文字，你知道的。

But but all of that has contributed to, I think, humor and and and and being in my head a lot, and and maybe some good some decent writing that that's that's come out of that, you know.

还有对细节的敏锐关注。

But an attention to detail.

对吧？

Right?

绝对是那种近乎偏执的细节控。

Definitely obsessive attention to detail.

没错。

Correct.

我刚才在想的是——

And what I was trying to think about is

凌晨两点，我一个人坐在《急诊室的故事》片场，只为拍一个根本没必要拍的手机特写镜头。

Me sitting there, it's on on Scrubs at two in the morning for an insert shot of a phone that there's no reason I should be there for.

其实别人完全能搞定，但我就是怕剪辑时发现，手机的画面不是我脑子里想的那个样子。

These people can handle it, but I do not wanna get to the editorial editorial and see that that's not the frame I pictured of the phone.

这确实有点偏执，但这就是我做事的方式。

That's that's that's definitely obsessive, but it it I I it's how I make stuff.

大多数人根本不知道自己的睾酮水平是多少。

Most people have no idea where their testosterone levels sit.

但如果我告诉你，有个解决办法呢？

But what if I told you there was a solution?

一种比高中霸凌者还快发现你睾酮低的方法，而且还不用花光你所有的零花钱。

Something that identifies low t faster than a high school bully, and it won't cost you all your lunch money.

这就是Function的用处，它提供超过160项实验室检测，包括对你的全套激素水平的深度分析。

That's where Function comes in, gives you access to over 160 lab tests, including a deep dive into your full hormone paddle.

所有结果都会由专业医生审核。

Every result is reviewed by clinicians.

任何异常指标都会被标记出来，还会给你清晰的解读和个性化的应对方案，告诉你下一步该怎么做。

Anything out of range is flagged, and you get clear explanations with a personalized protocol with actionable next steps.

所以一旦发现问题，你就清楚该采取什么行动。

So if something's off, you know exactly what to do about it.

不管你只是需要多去健身房，还是想在车里把《洛奇》的音乐放得更大声，Function都会告诉你，你的睾酮水平和其他各项指标到底怎么样。

Whether you just need to go to the gym more, or you need to play Creed louder in your car, Function will tell you exactly where your testosterone, and everything else stands.

通常这种级别的检测要花几千块，但用Function，一年只要365美元。

Normally, this level of testing would usually cost thousands, but with Function, it's $365 a year.

每天花一美元，告别胡乱猜测，开始真正了解自己的身体状况。

That's $1 a day to stop guessing with your health and start knowing.

现在下单还能再减25美元，最终只要340美元。

And right now, you can get $25 off, bringing it down to $340.

赶紧用我和我团队同款的血液检测套餐，通过下方链接或访问 functionhealth.com/modernwisdom，结账时输入代码 modern wisdom，立省25美元。

So get the exact same blood panels that I do and save $25 by going to the link in the description below or heading to functionhealth.com/modernwisdom using the code modern wisdom at checkout.

说到底，我一直在想，这么做最终能达到什么效果？

I think ultimately, what what I was thinking about was what is the outcome that that achieves?

对吧？

Right?

因为我们现在讨论的，是整个过程。

Because we're we're talking about process.

这是一种对细节的过度关注，一种高度警觉的状态，总倾向于提前预判问题的发生。

It's a degree of, detail focus, orientation, hypervigilance, bias toward seeing problems as potentially before they've even Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

焦虑本质上就是源于不确定性。

Playing you know, anxiety is all about uncertainty.

对。

Yeah.

我对未来会怎样发展感到不确定。

I'm uncertain about how the future might unfold.

如果我能设想出所有可能的发展路径，就能提前预知所有潜在的灾难。

So if I can think about all of the different ways that it might unfold, I will know all of the different potential catastrophes.

你通常不会焦虑于事情可能顺利的那些方式，而是焦虑于它可能出错的方方面面。

You're not you're not usually anxious about all of the ways it might go right, anxious about all of the ways that it might go wrong.

对。

Yeah.

如果我能

And if I can

但作为一个晚上睡不着、盯着天花板、反复琢磨明天那场重头戏的电影导演，这虽然对身心都不健康，却让我几乎提前预想到了所有可能出错的地方。

But as a filmmaker who can't fall asleep at night staring at the ceiling, obsessing about the big scene you have tomorrow, it's not healthy, but it for for mind and body, but it is helpful in that I've probably foreseen everything that could possibly go wrong.

没错。

Yep.

没错。

Yep.

所以你已经做好准备了。

So you're prepared.

我半夜两点还发消息问大家：你们有没有下单那个什么什么，大家都睡了，可我还在不停地确认。

And I've got texts going out at two in the morning being like, did you guys And and, you know, everyone's asleep, but I'm gonna start going like, you did order the blah blah blah.

对吧？

Right?

你懂的。

You know?

就是这样。

Like Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

我的情况也一样，说的就是这个人。

I mean, it's the dude, it's the same for me.

这部剧里，我特别在意‘Doctor Jordan Peterson’这个名称，得在‘b’后面加个句号，我就想确认一下这没问题。

It's the same for me with this show that noticing doctor Jordan Peterson should have a full stop after the b, and, you know, I just wanna make sure that it's okay.

我们有没有确认过，那个需要签字的授权书已经拿到了？就是用来办那件事的。

And did we check that we have we got the release form that's signed for the thing that's gonna get the thing?

所以我想到，很多人有这种特质——专注、较真，这其实挺常见的。

So what I'm thinking is lots of people who have that malady strength Mhmm.

他们往往能因此取得很大的成功。

End up in situations where they they can be very successful.

我最典型的例子就是埃迪·霍尔，某种程度上说。

So my favorite example of this is, to a degree, Eddie Hall.

他是2017年和2018年的世界最强壮男人。

So he's World's Strongest Man 2017, 2018.

英国人，身高一米九一。

British dude, six foot three.

赢得冠军后站在领奖台上，他把奖杯高高举起，说：‘奶奶，这个奖是给你的。’

By the time that he won, he's on the winner's podium, and he puts this trophy in the air, and he says, Nana, this one's for you.

他奶奶刚去世不久，他赢得这个头衔后就宣布退役了。

His grandma died recently, and he sort of won this title, and he retires there.

这是他退役时拿到的第一个冠军头衔，尽管他这一生都在拼命打拼。

His His first title when he retires, although he's worked his life together.

他说，如果当时没退役，我现在早就死了，离婚了，跟孩子也没了关系。

He says, if I hadn't retired at that point, I would be dead, divorced, with no relationship to my kids.

他身高一米九一，体重四百磅，用了大量兴奋剂，血压高得离谱，连高血压都算不上了。

He was four hundred pounds at six foot three on so many PEDs that his blood pressure was so far off the charts that forget hypertension.

那简直是天崩地裂的血压。

This was like galactic tension.

他训练太拼命了，跟妻子的关系彻底崩了。

And he was working so hard with his training that him and his wife, the relationship was just completely short.

孩子都见不到他。

And his kid didn't see him.

一切都开始瓦解。

So everything was falling apart.

我想到这个，就觉得，让他成为世界顶尖的这种执着和对细节的极致关注，也带来了副作用——那些生理上的次生影响。

And I think about that, and I go, well, the level of obsession and attention to detail that led him to be the best in the world also had these side effects that came along with it, physiological ones that were second order side effects.

但更直接的代价是：根本没心思顾及妻子，没时间陪孩子，不经营关系，也不关心自己内心的平静。

But the first order side effects of just not paying that much attention to my wife, not paying that much attention to my child, not nurturing my relationships, not thinking about the peace inside of my own brain.

在我看来，那些在很多事上真正成功的人——不是所有事，但至少是很多事——都付出了远超常理的专注和细节把控。

And as far as I can see, the people that are really successful at lots of things, not everything, but at lots of things, are paying an unreasonable level of attention to detail.

我想厘清的是，你这一路走来，到底从这种极致专注里收获了什么。

That is where the I'm trying to net down what is the what's the, like, corn that's being grown out of this thing for you across your career.

就是一种不合理的、过度的细节专注。

It's like an unreasonable level of attention to detail.

确实如此。

Sounds like that.

我总在想自己的表现、明天可能发生的事、今天已经发生的事、该吸取什么教训，还有我们为什么做出这样的决定？

In my own performance, in what's going to go on, in what might happen tomorrow, and what did happen today, and the lesson I need to learn, and why is that why are you why have we decided?

我不明白你为啥要装这个补光灯。

Because I don't understand why you brought that fill light.

哦，是为了让光从墙上反射回来。

Oh, it's for the bounce off the wall.

明白了。

Right.

这就是我。

That's me.

为什么？

Why?

为什么？

Why?

为什么？

Why?

为什么？

Why?

是的。

Yeah.

而且，确实，这种对细节的过分执着让你成就了这么多了不起的事。

And, yeah, that unreasonable level of attention to detail has allowed you to do all these great things.

对。

Yes.

当人们看到他们想要的结果时，我真希望我能参与一部播上几十季、连续播九年，然后还重启回来、再搞出新名堂的剧。

And when people look at the outcome that they want, I would love to be on a show that gets run for gazillion gorillion seasons and the last for nine years and then comes back and it gets into the other thing.

我想啊，我确实想，好吧。

I would like to I would I would okay.

这些事儿也都是跟着一起来的。

This stuff does come along for the ride too.

是的。

Yeah.

你不仅在工作中会半夜两点还醒着给别人发消息，纠结昨天拍的手机照片，这种状态还会渗透到你的私人生活里。

You are also going to, not only in the professional life, be awake at two in the morning texting people about the fucking phone shot from yesterday, but then it's also gonna bleed over into your personal life as well.

是的。

Yeah.

你根本甩不掉它。

You know, you can't it off.

你不能一边要求自己在某个领域 obsessively 和反复琢磨，一边又说在感情关系里就别这样，不行。

You can't just say, oh, I I want you to be obsessive and ruminative in this domain and not my relationships no.

不行。

No.

不行。

No.

那完全是另一回事，我得变成另一个人才行。

That's a totally different I should be a different person.

我得像杰基尔博士和海德先生、蝙蝠侠和布鲁斯·韦恩那样切换身份。

I should Jekyll and Hyde, Batman and Bruce Wayne.

我对这个问题特别着迷：人们为了拥有那些优势，到底付出了什么代价。

I'm kinda I'm kinda fascinated by that sphere of question, the price that people pay in order to have the strengths that they've got.

我不明白那些大家庭的人是怎么做到的。

I don't know how peep people do do this with big families.

我真的搞不懂他们是怎么撑下来的。

I don't know how they do it.

我没有家庭。

I don't have a family.

我没有孩子。

I don't have children.

是的。

Mhmm.

我现在甚至都没有伴侣。

I don't have a currently even have a partner.

你知道吗，像我这样工作的人，经常得长时间离家外出。

I, you know, I I we when you're doing what I do, you often will have to go away for long periods of time.

我其实也很想要那样的生活，但就我个人而言，可能别人更擅长平衡和处理这些事。

So I I I would love to have that stuff, but that's probably for me personally, other people are very good at managing and figuring it out.

在好莱坞，当然有很多人有配偶，有家庭。

Obviously, in Hollywood, there's plenty of people with wives and husbands and families.

但我自己一直还没能拥有这些。

I I have yet to have that happen.

所以对我个人来说，其中一个代价就是过于专注事业了。

So I think personally for me, one of the costs has been just obsessively being career focused.

对。

Mhmm.

创作是我最重要、最热爱、也最能让我感到满足的事。

And it it being the most important thing to me, the thing I love the most, the thing I get the most gratification out of is is creating.

我想，这可能让我错过了经营家庭和感情的机会。

And I think that the cost has probably been giving watering the the the seeds of of of having a family and a relationship.

这其中有多少是你的主动选择呢？

How much of that's been a conscious choice?

我知道自己可能会付出这个代价，但还是会继续专注于事业。

You know, I'm I know that I'm gonna pay this price potentially, and I'm gonna continue to focus on the career.

这并不是一个有意识的决定。

It's not been a conscious choice.

我只是觉得，如果我把对事业的那份专注和投入，用在经营一段关系或组建家庭上，

It's just been, you know, I do think I If I'd put the level of attention and intention and focus into having a relationship in a family that I put into my career,

我就会拥有完全不同的生活。

I'd have a different My kingdom.

那我可能就像《圣经》里的雅各了。

Well, just have a different I'd be like Jacob in the Bible.

我想可以说，我基本上是全身心扑在事业上——虽然我也有过一些很棒的感情，但过去二十五年，我确实一直专注于工作。

But I I I have I think it's safe to say I just kinda went all in on, I mean, I've had some wonderful relationships, but I I I have been through for the last twenty five years completely career focused.

只要不是在拍东西，我就是在写东西；只要不是在写东西，我就在想办法和别人合作。

And when I'm not making something, I'm writing something, or when I'm not writing something, I'm trying to collaborate with someone.

我最开心的时候就是动手做东西的时候。

I I am the most happy when I'm making stuff.

所以一旦闲下来，我就坐不住。

So when I'm not, I don't idle well.

我没法儿就那样瘫在沙滩上，盯着大海发呆——嗯，也许能撑一周吧。

I don't I don't I don't sit, you know, on a beach and and and just stare at the ocean well, maybe for like a week.

是的。

Yeah.

人们总说要培养好的工作习惯，但很少有人提到该怎样培养好的休息方式。

I think about people talk about developing a good work ethic, but very rarely do people talk about developing a good rest ethic.

我真希望有这么一本书。

I would like that.

要是你写了这本书，

If you got that book,

我一定读。

I'll read it.

恐怕不行。

I'm afraid not.

我的意思是，你看，老兄，这事儿是这样的

I mean, look, dude, this is

我明白，这算是我的一种焦虑症吧，但一想到马上要放长假，我就特别紧张。

I I get I'm this is part of my neuroses, but I go I actually get anxious when I know I'm gonna have a lungs time off.

没错。

Yep.

对你来说，工作是不是一种安全感？

Does work feel like safety to you?

我觉得只有在合作和创作的时候，我才最像自己，最自在。

I just feel like I'm most myself, I'm most in my element when I'm collaborating and creating.

可一旦没在做这些，我就觉得心里空落落的。

And and when I'm not, I I don't feel fully fulfilled.

哪怕是我自己写东西，一个人对着电脑待很久，我也提不起劲来。

Even when I'm writing my own stuff, which is spending a lot of time alone with the computer, I'm not I don't enjoy it.

因为你需要那种协作的感觉。

Because you want the collaboration.

根本没有什么协作。

There's no collaboration.

太孤单了。

It's lonesome.

挺让人沮丧的，毕竟你肯定也写作吧。

It's depressing because some days are I'm sure you write.

你知道的，有些时候你就是会觉得，

You know, some days you're just like,

我真差劲。

I suck.

太糟了。

Fuck.

对。

Yeah.

我真不行。

I suck.

我也有过这种感觉。

I had that.

第二天你再看一遍，就会觉得其实写得并不怎么样。

And the next day you read it and you're like, actually, that's not good.

是的。

Yeah.

我会搞定的。

I'm gonna get it.

我醒来了。

I woke up.

昨晚睡得好多了。

Had a better night's sleep.

我还记得，我刚开始做直播的时候，有这么一条评论。

I I remember this this comment when I first started doing live stuff.

我刚结束在澳大利亚、新西兰和巴厘岛的巡演，简直太棒了。

I just finished this live tour around Australia and and New Zealand and Bali, and it was so so sick.

我三年前刚开始做现场演出时，有人留言给我一条建议。

And when I first started doing live three years ago, someone commented with a piece of advice.

他们说，每次站上舞台，我脑子里总有两个声音，响得一样大。

And they said, when I'm on stage, I always have two voices that are equally loud in my head.

一个让我像阿波罗，另一个让我像西西弗斯。

One makes me Apollo, and the other makes me Sisyphus.

一个说：你太厉害了，继续坚持下去。

One says, you're amazing, and you can keep going.

另一个说：你太差了。

And the other says, you suck.

赶紧放弃吧。

You should quit immediately.

我觉得特别有意思，同一个表演里，不同的部分其实都在互相拉扯——你要表达什么，总得先写下来，除非你打算即兴发挥。

And I just think it's so funny that when you have different elements of the same performance, right, in in in order to say a thing, you need to write the thing first unless you're gonna ad lib it.

所以有时候你坐下来写东西，就会觉得自己这写作水平简直烂透了。

And and that means that some days you sit down to write and you're like, I fucking blow as a writer.

但另一些时候，你坐下来写，又觉得自己的写作简直太棒了。

And other days you sit down to write, and you're like, I'm great as a writer.

但在每一个阶段，那些比较自我苛责、天生容易过度敏感的人，总会觉得：这还能再好一点。

But at each different juncture, someone that tends to be a little bit more self critical, someone that's got this predisposition toward hypervigilance, gonna be like, that could be better.

总能变得更好。

It could always be better.

没错。

Yeah.

这种心态容易让人变得不知感恩，每次都会有一点点的挑剔和不满。

And that tends itself toward a kind of ingratitude, like micro in ungratefulness each different time.

因为你总能看见——比如我特别喜欢那个手机镜头的画面。

Because you can always see I mean, I love that shot of the phone.

那真的太棒了。

It was great.

但要是再多半小时就好了，要是能再拍完下一个二十秒的镜头，再稍微调整一下就好了。

But, oh, if we just had another half hour, if we'd we've been able to get that next one twenty d in and we've just been able to, you know, adapt it a little bit more.

正因如此，人才会变得过分注重细节，追求一种远超常人的极致品质。

And, but this is what pushes somebody to be unreasonably detail oriented and to get to a level of quality that is so beyond.

市场、地位、金钱和赞誉，从设计上就决定了颁奖礼上只能有一个赢家。

And the market and status and and and money and acclaim by design, there can only be one winner at an awards ceremony.

任何时候，最好的东西都只能有一个，对吧？

There can only be one best anything, right, at a time.

市场奖励那些不断逼自己、永不停歇的人。

The market rewards someone that is going to continue to push and push.

我不确定。

I don't know

人们是怎么进入这个行业，却没抱着全力以赴的心态的呢？

how people enter this business without having the mentality that they're gonna go all in at it.

我跟那些刚入行的年轻人说，好吧。

Because what I tell young people who I see starting out is like, okay.

但你得全力以赴，把你所有的本事都使出来，因为在这个圈子里，身边几乎所有人的努力程度都超乎想象。

But make sure you're you're gonna go a 100% of what you have because every in this town, every single person around you not every single person.

这里成千上万的人都在拼了命地干，比你想象的还要拼命。

There's hundreds of thousands of people here that are that are gonna work really, really, really hard.

如果你不这么做，人家连饭都不带你吃。

And they're gonna have you a lunch if you don't.

没错。

Absolutely.

如果你去试镜，剧本都没背熟，也没下足功夫，不找朋友对词，也不请教练指导，现在这么多自拍试镜，连灯光、摄像、背景都随便应付，那纯粹是在敷衍。

If you're going to audition and you don't have it memorized and you didn't work on it as hard as you possibly could and work with your friends or work with a coach or or in this case, there's so much self taping, Get a good lighting setup and a good camera and and a nice backdrop, and and you're just phoning it in.

你知道有多少人为了这个角色在豁出去拼命吗？

Do you know how many fucking people are going all out for that same part?

这根本就是白费劲。

It's basically pointless.

你不仅浪费了别人的时间，更是在浪费自己的时间。

You are wasting everyone's time, especially yours.

遇到那些做事敷衍的人真的挺让人震惊的，我就懂这一行，但看到有人这么不认真，简直不可思议。

It's crazy when you come across people that are that are trying I mean, I I only know this profession, but it's crazy when you come across people that are doing it half assed.

你到底在搞什么？

It's like, what are you?

你这样下去肯定会被淘汰的

This is you you you're gonna get blown out

根本没戏。

of the water.

这完全是赢家通吃，只有一个角色能选一个人来演。

It was very much a winner takes all thing where the only one person can play the role.

没错。

Right.

就一个角色，只能由一个人来演，就是片场那个该死的AC。

Only one person can be this particular the fucking AC, right, that's on set.

就一个名额。

There's only one.

也许实际上并没有。

Maybe there's not, actually.

但只有一个首席灯光师。

But there's only one number one AC.

对吧？

Right?

不过有三台摄像机。

Well, three cameras.

三台。

Three.

明白了。

Okay.

你懂我的意思吧。

You know what I mean.

你懂我的意思吧。

You know what I mean.

只有一个摄像头，而不是空调系统。

There's only one a camera versus AC.

这就对了。

There we go.

谢谢。

Thank you.

是的。

Yeah.

你可以继续往上层推进。

You could continue to go up the stack.

通常每项大事都只由一个人负责。

Typically, there's only one person for each big thing.

对吧？

Right?

如果你觉得这意味着自己还没准备好全身心投入，或者从个人角度还没想清楚，那也正常。

And you go, well, if that means that I'm not prepared to go all in on that one or think about it in a personal standpoint.

你接下来要去约会了。

You're gonna go out dating.

那个人，除非你选择开放关系，否则只会和一个人谈恋爱。

That person, unless you go polyamory, that person is only going to be in a relationship with one person.

如果你不能以最好的状态出现——足够用心、时刻想着对方、有条理地回复、主动做点什么、表现得体贴入微，那对方很可能会被更细心、更放松的人吸引，比如对方可能想：‘我今天是不是发消息太多了？’

And if you are not showing up in the best possible way, being attentive, thinking about them, replying in an orderly manner, doing stuff, being thoughtful, somebody that's just a bit more thoughtful or a bit more chill like, even the thoughtfulness of, like, I I probably text them a bit much today.

我是不是该稍微收敛一点，别那么频繁联系？

Like, I should I can I can chill out for a little bit?

荷尔蒙和神经化学物质已经开始起作用了。

The hormones are fucking neurochemicals are kicking in.

你肯定会输的。

You will be beaten.

是啊。

Yeah.

对吧？

Right?

总会有人更愿意用心对待。

There will be somebody that's prepared to be more thoughtful.

所以，不管努力的最优策略是什么，如果你不肯全力以赴，别人一发力就超过你了，那你也就输了。

So whatever the optimal strategy is with regards to effort, if you're not prepared to give it everything, the person that will just gets out ahead, and that means that you've lost.

没错。

Absolutely.

确实如此。

Absolutely.

这行当太靠运气了，我总觉得就像抽彩票一样。

And this is a career path that is so much luck, but I often think of it as like a it's all a complete lottery.

如果你长得特别特别出众，那你就握着一堆彩票。

I think if you're really, really preposterously good looking, you have a lot of lottery tickets.

如果你是个特别有天赋的演员，你也握着一堆彩票。

And if you're a really fucking talented actor, you have a lot of lottery tickets.

如果你两者兼具，那你就攥着一大把彩票，但归根结底还是彩票，因为我认识不少特别棒的演员，可没人知道他们是谁。

If you're both, you have a shit ton of lottery tickets, but it's still a complete lottery because I know plenty of people that are wonderful actors, and that you don't know who they are.

是的

Yeah.

还有很多人长得漂亮、演技也好，但大家根本不知道他们是谁。

And I and plenty of people that are beautiful and good actors, and you don't know who they are.

对

Mhmm.

这是一份特别特别有挑战的职业，我非常清楚自己有多幸运。

It's it's very, very challenging career, and I'm very, very present to to being lucky.

是的

Yeah.

你这一路见过多少人，明明很有潜力却始终没火起来？

How many people have you seen across your career that you just you can't believe that they never made it?

太多了。

Plenty.

真没想到。

Wow.

很多。

Plenty.

我能马上想到几个，真不明白为什么他们还没机会爆发。

I can I I I can have a couple people that come right to my mind who who I'm like, why have why has their number not come up yet?

那个人长得特别美，蓝眼睛，是我认识的最出色的演员之一。

That person is gorgeous and has blue eyes and is one of the best actors I know.

他们偶尔能接到一些活儿。

You know, they might get work here and there.

是的。

Yep.

但他们还没成为家喻户晓的名字。

But they're not a household name.

他们从来不是剧集的主角。

They're not they're not not a lead on a show.

你去看看纽约的舞台剧就知道了。

Just go watch New York theater.

我的意思是，你去伦敦会看到一些这辈子见过最棒的表演，可那些演员里，有些人就是没法把这份才华转化成电视剧或电影里的机会。

I mean, you'll see some of the best acting, and and London, of course, you'll see some of the best acting you'll ever see in your lifetime, and some of those people don't can't or have yet to convert that to to TV or film.

你知道吗？你的肠道控制着你的能量、恢复能力，还有你吸收食物的效率，而让这一切正常运转的关键营养素，其实就是膳食纤维。

Did you know your gut controls your energy, your recovery, how well you absorb everything that you eat, and the one nutrient that keeps it all running properly is fiber?

结果发现，百分之九十五的美国人根本摄入不够，这也就是我特别推崇Momentous的纤维plus的原因。

Well, it turns out that ninety five percent of Americans don't get enough of it, which is why I'm such a huge fan of Momentous's fiber plus.

大多数纤维补充剂都只有一种成分，只能解决一个问题。

Most fiber supplements are a one trick pony, one type of fiber solving one part of the problem.

而纤维plus是三效合一的配方，同时应对消化、肠道屏障健康和血糖稳定这三个方面。

Fiber plus is a three in one formula built to tackle digestion, gut barrier strength, and blood sugar stability all at once.

我每天都吃这个。

I use this every single day.

光靠饮食很难摄取到足够的纤维。

It is kinda hard to get enough fiber just through food alone.

最棒的是，Momentous提供三十天无理由退款保证。

And best of all, Momentous offers a thirty day money back guarantee.

所以你可以买下来，连续试用二十九天。

So you can buy it, try it every single day for twenty nine days.

如果你不喜欢，他们会全额退款。

And if you don't love it, they will just give you your money back.

而且他们支持国际配送。

Plus, they ship internationally.

现在通过下方链接或访问 livemomentous.com/modernwisdom 并在结账时输入代码 modern wisdom，首次订阅最高可享三五折优惠，还附带三十天无理由退款保障。

Right now, you can get up to 35% off your first subscription and that thirty day money back guarantee by going to the link in the description below or heading to livemomentous.com/modernwisdom and using the code modern wisdom at checkout.

你觉得人们该怎么面对这种不确定性呢？因为这种事几乎不是你能掌控的。

How do you think people should reckon with the because that's a kind of uncertainty that's almost outside of your control.

对吧？

Right?

你没法强迫别人给你一个机会。

That you can't make somebody give you a chance at something.

你当然可以尽最大努力为自己创造有利条件，但也完全能理解为什么有人会变得愤世嫉俗或心怀怨恨。

You can stack the deck in your favor as much as possible, but can understand why people become bitter or jaded or resentful.

没错。

Absolutely.

如果你已经全力以赴了，却还是没成功，当然会感到心灰意冷。

If you're giving a 100% and you're still not it's it's of course, you're gonna get jaded.

这里没人欠你什么，我自己没得到想要的东西时，也得不断提醒自己这一点。

It's it's there's no no one owes you anything in here, and and and I have to remind myself that too when I don't get stuff.

你知道的。

You know?

每当遇到竞争激烈、我特别想要的机会时，我依然会拼命准备。

I I I still read for things when I'm when I'm when it's competitive and I want it.

我之前还参加过一个面试，要求背一大段独白。

And so I I had a fucking I auditioned for something that had a huge monologue.

那独白足足有两页纸长。

It was like a two page monologue.

就像我说的，因为我经常从面试官的角度看别人的试镜录像，所以我会想：有多少人会把这段独白背得滚瓜烂熟，然后表现得无可挑剔？

And just like I'm saying, because I I look at a lot of audition tapes from the other side of the table, if if I'm not you know how many people are gonna memorize the shit out of this monologue and crush it?

既然你都不打算认真做，我干嘛还浪费时间？

Why am I even gonna waste the time if you're not gonna do it?

所以那一周，我一直在背这段独白。

So for like a week, I worked on memorizing this monologue.

遛狗的时候，我也在心里反复默念这段独白。

I was walking the dog, memory walking on the monologue.

连洗碗的时候，我都盯着那段独白看。

I was fucking doing the dishes, looking over at the monologue.

然后我就去试镜了。

And I went in there.

我录了一段，发挥得特别好。

I laid a tape down, and I crushed it.

我当时特别为自己感到骄傲。

I was so proud of it.

结果连复试都没进。

Didn't even get a callback.

连句‘干得不错’都没人跟我说一句。

Didn't even didn't even get a, hey, good job.

滚蛋吧，兄弟。

Fuck you, dude.

剧播出来后，我看了那个演员演的，心里就想：我比他强多了。

And the show came out, and I saw the guy do it, and I went, I was so much fucking better than that.

虽然我有点自大，但说实话，我没拿到角色，可我确实拼尽全力了。

In my egotistical But but, you know, I didn't I didn't get it, but I fucking brought it.

我百分百投入了。

I brought a 100%.

但这不意味着你每件事都能得到。

That doesn't mean you're gonna get everything.

他们根本不需要我。

They didn't they didn't want me.

他们要的是他。

They wanted him.

是的。

Yeah.

我一直在想，这会不会就是为什么人们会有这种想法，挺有意思的。

I wonder whether this is one of the reasons that people have such a this is interesting.

我觉得现在孩子们最想从事的职业，第一是做YouTuber，第二是当网红。

I think the number one desired job of young kids is YouTuber, and number two is influencer.

天哪。

Oh god.

真的吗？

Is that true?

太糟糕了。

Horrendous.

是的。

Yeah.

孩子们，如果你们在听，别追求那种表面光鲜的东西。

Kids, if you're out there, you you don't want the smoke.

我跟你说真的。

I'm telling you.

光是这么长时间盯着屏幕，就能把你拖垮。

The sheer amount of screen time alone will kill you.

我一直在想，也许有人喜欢这个行当，是因为孩子们根本不清楚自己会陷入什么样的境地。

But I I I wonder whether one of the reasons that people like that I mean, why kids don't necessarily know what they're getting themselves in for.

可能年纪大一点的人觉得这主意不错，是因为在这个圈子里，你就算不火，也没人会直接告诉你：你不配干这个。

One of the reasons that maybe older people might like the idea of it is that there's kind of no rejection in the world of you can become not popular, but no one's telling you that you don't get to do the thing.

你是说当YouTuber或者网红？

You mean as YouTuber influencer?

对。

Yeah.

没错。

Yeah.

如果你自己单干，或者是个小团队，你就是那个站在镜头前的人。

If you're creating you're just a solopreneur or a small unit, and you're the guy that's in front of the camera or whatever.

这完全是属于你自己的事。

Like, it's your thing.

你想做多少就做多少，发再多两页的独白到网上都没人管你。

You can do it as much as you you can send an unlimited number of two page monologues and put them on the Internet.

就算别人压根不会选你，你依然是主角，这世界根本不需要谁批准。

And you are the star even if that wouldn't have been picked up by somebody else, and no one it's a permissionless world.

这挺有意思的。

That's interesting.

很明显，

There's clearly

人们会根据视频一段时间后的播放量来判断它到底行不行。

people weighing in on whether it works or not by how many views it's getting after a certain amount of time.

对。

Yep.

但这算不上真正的拒绝。

But that's not that's a sort of a soft rejection.

没错。

Correct.

对。

Yes.

正是如此。

Exactly.

这正是我在想的。

That's exactly what I'm thinking.

是的。

Yeah.

特别有意思，因为我们小时候根本没这回事。

It's so interesting because we didn't have that growing up as a thing.

对。

Mhmm.

那时候并没有

It wasn't a

职位。

position.

现在有些YouTube上的人甚至在做小品秀，一段一段的，完整的制作。

Well, think about some people on YouTube now are even doing sketch shows, increments of sketch you know, full productions.

比如谢恩·吉利斯，吉莉安·凯布斯，是的。

Like, Shane Gillis, Gillian Keibes Mhmm.

以前他做的那个东西，现在他都在做轮胎了，那会儿他就是瞎玩儿。

This thing before, he's now doing tires, that's that was him just fucking about.

你看，其实不需要那么大张旗鼓，现在有更小、更精简的方式了。

Like, you don't need there's no there's a much smaller, tighter thing.

完全正确。

Absolutely.

是的。

Yeah.

完全正确。

Absolutely.

我觉得很多人靠着自己在YouTube上的特定领域内容，过得相当不错。

And I think there's a lot of people making a great living being whatever their niche YouTube thing is.

我会深陷在这些人的视频里，真有不少人是我特别喜欢看的，比如那些关于房车的视频，你知道的……

I go down the rabbit hole on these people, and I I I I've got some people that I just love to watch, and I'm not even like, I've been going down the rabbit hole on, like, these RV RVs or, you know

就是玩房车生活的人吗？

Like van life people?

对。

Yeah.

没错。

Yeah.

那些带人参观自己房车的房车爱好者。

Recreational vehicle people that are giving tours of their vans.

那种生活我肯定不会过，不过我喜欢开着房车去露营。

It's not a life I would ever lead, although I love to go camping in an RV.

我从来没想过要一辈子住在房车里，但我对这些视频特别着迷，算法一直在推给我这些人拍的房车参观内容。

Would never I I don't wanna live full time in RV, but I'm fascinated by these I've the algorithm has been sending me these people giving tours