三位百万富翁揭秘他们的超小众生意

嗯，像一家公司，好吧。

Well, a company like okay.

所以Goldbelly。

So Goldbelly.

对。

Yeah.

我很喜欢Goldbelly。

I love Goldbelly.

我也喜欢Goldbelly。

Love Goldbelly.

Goldbelly。

Goldbelly.

解释一下它是什么。

Explain what it is.

对听众来说，基本上就像，如果你知道Grey's Papaya，那是纽约市一家很老的热狗店。

For the listener, it's basically like if you Grey's Papaya is a New York City really old hot dog shop.

它只在当地有。

It's only local.

他们之前连网站都没有。

They didn't have a website.

Gold Belly让这一切变得特别方便，尤其是在疫情期间，你可以从全国各地订购Graves Papaya的热狗，他们会帮你运过来。

Gold Belly made it really easy, particularly during COVID, where you could go and buy Graves Papaya hot dogs from any part of the country, and they'll help you ship it to them.

他们做得很好的一点是，让我知道了原来我还能买到Junior's的芝士蛋糕。

They did a good job of, like, teaching me that I can buy Junior's cheesecake

对。

Yes.

在Gold Belly上。

On Gold Belly.

而且他们真的很擅长——你有没有那种Gold Belly版本，就像你要做一个美食Instagram账号，专门展示那些在家做酸面包超棒的家庭主妇？

And they did a really good job at What's do you have, like, a Gold Belly version where it's like you're gonna create Hot Plate Instagram where you're gonna show off, like, all the cool, like, at home moms who make the best sourdough?

这就像是一个本地美食发现平台。

It's like a local discovery.

对吧？

Right?

或者你会，嗯，会，嗯，得到，

Or you're gonna, like, gonna, like, get,

不。

No.

你得让他们出名。

Like You gotta make them famous.

对吧？

Right?

你得出名。

You gotta be famous.

是的。

Yeah.

你得说，看看这个。

You gotta be like, check this out.

有个阿米什女士做这个，真的，那是最好的。

There's this Amish lady who does this thing, and, like, it's the best.

然后就像旧金山、纽约的一些小孩搞了个奖，

And it's like some kid in San Francisco, New York has created an award

像米其林星级那种系统。

system like Michelin star.

这个类别的米其林星级是什么？

What's the Michelin star of this category?

对。

Right.

这样你就能认出这些人了。

So then you recognize the people.

对吧？

Right?

钱、名声、爱。

Money, fame, love.

这就是爱的一种。

That's love one.

对吧？

Right?

你越推广这个，就越能帮他们提升名气。

The more you promote that, that helps them with the fame.

名气才是驱动金钱的东西。

The fame is what drives the money.

灵感来自于听说，哦，她做那个是最好的。

The inspiration is hearing about, oh, she has the best those.

其实，不管我做什么爆米花，我就是那个。

Well, actually, my whatever popcorn I make, I'm that.

在我的领域里，那我怎么让自己出名呢？

In my category, I'm then my how do I get my name out there?

哦，让我看看他们做什么内容。

Oh, let me watch what content they do.

我也会这么做，你知道的，就是让大家去做那件事。

I'll do the same, you know, get people to to to to do that.

你得让他们

You you have

变得

to make

有名气。

them famous.

对。

Right.

我们现在正在做的一件特别让人兴奋的事是，我们已经有一些卖家，就像我说的，供应非常紧张。

Something that we're working on right now that's really exciting is that we already have some sellers that are super, like I said, supply constrained.

他们的需求太大了，比如黄油和碎屑。

They have so much demand, like, you know, butter and crumble.

比如，我们在盐湖城有家店叫Sam Makes Pizza。

Like, we have Sam Makes Pizza in Salt Lake City.

两万人。

20,000 people.

戴夫·波特和我把他捧红了，现在有两万人想买他那大概50个披萨。

Dave Port and I blew him up, and now he has 20,000 people trying to buy, like, 50 pizzas.

对吧？

Right?

但这不是你的瓶颈。

But that's not your constraint.

对。

Right.

所以我们正在做的是构建一个推荐系统。

So what we're doing is building, like, a recommendation system.

所以现在假设那个人卖光了。

So now let's say that guy sells out.

这里还有其他供应商你可以买，那些是更新兴的供应商。

Here are other vendors you can buy from, and those are more up and coming vendors.

对吧？

Right?

所以，把推荐和发现结合起来，我们就是在扶持那些新兴卖家，确保他们能达到一定的标准。

So doing that along with discovery means that we're anchoring, like, the the up up and coming sellers that they'd clear certain bars.

然后我们把这些人推荐给那些想买这类食物的顾客。

Now we're showing them to an audience of people that wanna buy, like, this kind of food.

他们主要是配送还是自取？

Are they mostly shipping or pickup?

都是自取。

It's all pickup.

全是自取。

All pickup.

全是自取。

All pickup.

所以它

So it

那应该就是本地的了。

should be local.

全都是本地的。

It's all local.

你们团队里有没有内容创作者或者负责这方面的人？

On your team, do you have a content creator or someone who leads

有。

Yeah.

Arie Anne。

Arie Anne.

她特别棒。

She's amazing.

进展不错。

It's going good.

进展很顺利。

It's going well.

对。

Yeah.

我是说，我们，我能够，比如旧金山有个叫Boquerre的家伙，他做的披萨，你们真得去看看。

I mean, we I've been able to, like there's a guy in SF, Boquerre, who makes guys gotta check him out.

西西里风格的披萨。

Sicilian style pizza.

真的是那种，有些

Truly like the some of the

最好的，我

best I

我觉得你应该当那个内容创作者。

feel like you should be the content creator.

我，我正在努力。

I I'm I'm working on that.

就是，我确实做视频。

It's I I do do videos.

其实之前也有人这么说过，不过还是谢谢你。

I've actually been told that before, but I appreciate it.

不过，是的，我们确实能帮到像他这样有本事的人，让他们真正火起来。

But, yeah, we've been able to, like, help people like him who are, like, have the sauce, right, really blow up.

现在他呢，你知道，从以前卖不完他的披萨。

And now he's, like, you know, went from, like, not selling out his pies.

到现在前几天五分钟就卖光了。

Now he just sold out in, like, five minutes, like, the other day.

如果给你一个问题，比如说，我们当你的临时帮手二十四小时。

If you had one question, meaning, like, let's say we were hired gun helpers for you for twenty four hours.

我们满脑子只想着Hot Plate。

All we're gonna think about is Hot Plate.

对。

Yeah.

你希望我们专注的那个问题是什么？

What's the one question you'd want us focused on?

其实我最想听听你的看法的是，文化层面的东西。我觉得一个新消费趋势要火起来，你得跟文化挂钩。

Really, the thing that I'd like your take on is, like, the cultural like, I think in order for a new consumer trend to work, you need to, like, tap into culture.

对吧？

Right?

而且我觉得从我们这边来看，从产品角度我们很清楚该怎么去搭建这个东西。

And I feel like on our end, we have a good sense from, like, the product standpoint of how you would go about building this.

最大的问题，抱歉，又来了。

The biggest issue again sorry.

稍等一下。

Two seconds.

很多人试过做家庭烹饪美食的市场平台。

A lot of people have tried to build, like, a home cooked food marketplace.

问题是你根本不知道这些厨师是谁。

The problem is you don't know who these chefs are.

你不知道为什么要关注他们，所以你就干脆走了。

You don't know why you should care, and so you kinda just leave.

DoorDash在便利性上永远会赢。

DoorDash is gonna always win on convenience.

对吧？

Right?

我们有一些人，他们做的是各自领域里最好的。

We have people who have, like who make the best in their category.

但我的问题是，从市场推广的角度来看，你怎么去渗透文化，让它变得有文化相关性？

But the and but the question I have is, like, how do you, from a go to market perspective, infiltrate culture in a way that makes this, like, culturally relevant?

我觉得不一定非得是文化相关性，但基本上，你听说过Huckberry吗？

I don't think cult it's necessarily cultural relevance, but basically, like, have you heard have you heard of Huckberry?

Huckberry是一家服装公司，他们起步的方式是创建了一个邮件列表。

So Huckberry is a clothing company where the way they started was they created an email list.

我之所以知道他们，是因为我们都在做邮件营销。

This is how I knew them because we were both in the email game.

当时就有一个邮件列表，专门展示一些很酷的品牌。

And there was just an email list where they would just show off cool brands

对。

Right.

然后卖这些酷品牌的东西，从中抽一小部分佣金。

And sell the cool brand stuff and take a small cut.

他们特别擅长讲这些故事，比如这个包是一个在越南的人做的，他发现降落伞的材质特别结实。

And they got really good at telling the stories of, like, this bag was made by a guy who was in Vietnam, and he noticed that the parachutes were really strong.

然后他真的用这个做了个包。

And he actually made this bag.

所以这就是个降落伞包。

So it's a v it's a parachute bag.

或者，你知道，我就觉得，哇，这挺酷的。

Or, like, you know, I'm like, that's pretty cool.

然后他们就把这些故事讲出来。

And, like, they told stories about it.

所以我就爱上了背后的故事。

So I fell in love with, like, the story behind it.

如果我是你，我会雇更多内容创作者。

If I'm you, I would hire I would probably hire more content creators.

我在这里的工作就是通过Instagram讲述供应商的故事，展示他们在做什么，让他们看起来像明星一样。

And it's like, my whole job here is to use Instagram to tell stories about the vendors and what they're doing and make them look like superstars.

对。

Right.

我会挑出你最好的50位厨师。

I would take your top 50 chefs.

是的。

Yeah.

然后我会说，我有一个使命。

And I'd be like, I have a mission.

我要让他们成为大家向往的对象。

I need to make them aspirational.

对。

Right.

为了接下来五千、五万、五百万个想成为他们的人。

For the next 5,000, 50,000, 5,000,000 wanna be thems.

所以重点不是让每个人都被发现。

So it's not about making everybody get discovered.

重点是把那五十个人捧起来，让他们变得特别令人向往，让每个人都拼命努力，想成为像你一样的人——你把他们列在名单上，你为他们做内容，他们谈论自己的生意，他们做这个赚了多少钱，他们怎么辞掉工作来做这个，整个故事里的人文情怀。

It's about taking the 50 and really making them so aspirational that everybody will work their ass off to to be like you featuring them on lists, you making content about them, them talking about their business side, how much money they're making doing this, how they quit their job doing this, the human interest story of the whole thing.

你知道，就是这些东西。

You know, all that stuff.

这就是，你知道，一种做法。

That's what you you know, that that's a way to do it.

而且，

And the

关于食物，有个很酷的事情是，其实Huckberry在YouTube上有个美食频道，但是，你知道，就像安东尼·波登那样。

cool thing about food is actually Huckberry has a food channel on YouTube, but there's so you know, there's like the Anthony Bourdain.

还有像《顶级大厨》那样的。

There's like, Top Chef.

格式太多了。

There's so many of formats.

我会先看看哪种格式我觉得自己能驾驭。

I would just find which format do that I think I could pull off.

然后照搬那种格式。

Copy that format.

对。

Yeah.

然后反复做，做很多很多次。

Do that a ton a ton a ton.

对。

Yeah.

再试试别的。如果你是我，我会说——虽然这话听起来有点老套，但我真的觉得对你来说特别适用。

Try this other and you just have a like, if I'm you, I'd be like and this is like a cliche thing to say, but I believe it's really true with you.

就是，我们现在是一家媒体公司了。

It's like, we're a media company now.

对。

Yeah.

所以我会做成一个美食媒体公司，然后我会看看所有有效的美食内容格式。

And so I'd become a food media company, and I would just look at all the formats of food content that works That

有效。

work.

然后直接复制。

And just Copy it.

要么自己做，要么基本上外包出去。

Either first party or you could basically farm it out.

比如，我们之前聊到的Jack's Dining，对。

So, like, you know, we we were talking about Jack's Dining Yeah.

或者类似的。

Or whatever.

基本上，世界各地已经有很擅长这些格式的内容创作者了。

Basically, there's already content creators who are really good at these formats all around the world.

他们是不是把你的厨师们捧红了？

And are they blowing up your chefs?

对。

Right.

你怎么让他们轻松知道，他们得去盐湖城，得尝尝这些派，对吧？

How do you make it easy for them to know that they need to go to Salt Lake City to they gotta try these pies Right.

从这个人那里。

From this person.

而且你知道吗，这些派背后有个疯狂的故事，为什么它们这么特别？

And did you know the the crazy backstory of these pies and why the pies are so special?

让那个网红去做，因为他们在做美食内容方面已经比我们所有人都强了。

Get that influencer to do it because they're already better than all of us at creating food content.

所以如果你能武装他们——每个内容创作者其实都需要更多有趣的内容。

So if you can arm them every content creator is always like, basically needs more interesting content.

是的。

Yeah.

那你怎么让他们轻松获得有趣的内容呢？

And so how do you make it easy for them to have interesting content?

我们在旧金山已经看到这种情况在本地发生了。

We're seeing that in SF, like, play out locally.

比如，我们一些顶级供应商现在被那些美食Instagram评论者推荐，他们有几十万粉丝。

Like, some of our top vendors are now getting featured by these, like, food, like, food Instagram reviewers or, like, that have, like, hundreds of thousands of followers.

他们在这里正变得越来越主流。

They're kinda becoming more mainstream here.

所以，你说得对，我觉得这是个好问题，或者说好观点，我们需要在每一个城市，或者说每一个重要的主要城市，对我们的顶级卖家复制这种做法。

And so you're to your point, like, I think it's a good question that or a good point that we need to, like, kind of replicate that with our top sellers in every city or, like, in every, like kind of the major cities that matter.

你还需要语言，比如，你知道，Twitch主播，还有Vine上的那些网红。

You also need language, like, you know, Twitch streamers, you know, Vine Viners.

比如，现在哪些人是热门玩家？

Like, what are the hot players?

对，就是那些热门玩家。

Like, the hot players.

对。

Yeah.

还是说它只是一个类别？

Or is it just a category?

比如像Twitch，它不只是那样，有一种叫直播主的东西。

Like like, so Twitch, it wasn't just what it was like, there's something called a livestreamer.

对吧？

Right?

直播主。

A streamer.

这就是他们做的事情。

And they this is what they do.

所以，比如说，家庭厨师是一个类别吗？

And so, for example, like, is a home chef the category?

你会怎么称呼这个，让它听起来酷、新颖又有趣？

Is it what what are you gonna call this that makes it seem cool, new, and interesting?

他们想加入

They're trying to be on

一个团队。

a team.

对。

Yeah.

他们想成为某个群体的一部分。

They wanna be a part of a tribe.

他们想加入一个很酷、代表某种理念的运动。

They wanna be a part of a movement that's cool that represents something.

关于你问的文化问题，我觉得你得先给他们语言，然后给他们一堆很酷的例子，再告诉他们这和旧方式有什么不同。

To your question about culture, I think you gotta give them start with like language and then give them a bunch of cool examples and then give them some, like, what this is all about versus the old way.

不。

No.

说得有道理。

That's a good point.

我的意思是，现在我们说，比如，厨师和面包师，然后有些人就会说，哦，但你又不是厨师。

I mean, right now we we say, like, chefs and bakers, and then we get some people being like, oh, but, like, you're not a chef.

比如，你又没在，你知道的，那家餐厅工作过。

Like, you didn't work at, like, you know, this restaurant.

就是说，那是个不太好的词。

Like, that's a less than good term

对你来说。

to you.

因为这个词对每个人来说已经有特定的含义了。

Because it's already mean something to everybody.

好。

Okay.

对吧？

Right?

就像，我

Like, I

我已经知道厨师是什么了。

already know what a chef is.

我觉得厨师就是在餐厅工作的人，然后你现在得做很多工作来证明自己。你应该从一个稍微让人意外的词开始，让我觉得，哦，对。

I think it's somebody at a restaurant, and you're now you have to do all this work to give you should start by the slightly surprising term that makes me kind of, oh, yeah.

我猜那确实是个东西。

I guess that is a thing.

哦，那是个东西吗？

Oh, it's a thing?

是的。

Yeah.

哦，天哪。

Oh, dude.

那可是个大东西。

It's a big thing.

这些人一年赚一百万，这个女人在家烤自己的饼干一年赚一百万。

These people are making a million this woman makes a million dollars a year at home baking her own cookies.

对。

Right.

嗯，我有个好配方。

Well, I have a good recipe for that.

你知道吗？

You know?

这就是你想要的。

That's what you want.

Rishi，谢谢你来做这个，兄弟。

Rishi, thank you for doing this, man.

谢谢，和Riz一起。

Thank with the Riz.

我很感激。

I appreciate it.

不。

No.

各位，我真的很感激能有这个机会。

I'm super grateful for the opportunity, guys.

你们太棒了。

You guys are awesome.

谢谢。

Thank you.

嘿。

Hey.

我们快速休息一下。

Let's take a quick break.

你有没有过这种感觉：策略定好了，简报写好了，大家也都对齐了，然后你发现还是得有人坐下来，真正把内容做出来？

You know that feeling when strategy is done, the brief is written, everyone's aligned, and you realize someone still has to sit down and actually create all the content?

那个人通常就是你，而且明天就要交。

That someone is usually you, and it's due tomorrow.

其实，HubSpot的Breeze助手可以帮上忙。

Well, the Breeze assistant from HubSpot can help.

它直接在HubSpot里面就能用。

It works right inside HubSpot.

你可以起草活动文案、博客文章、邮件，全都用你的品牌语气，全都基于你真实的客户数据。

You can draft campaign copy, blog posts, emails, all in your brand voice, all using your actual customer data.

所以你不仅仅是创作内容。

So you don't create just content.

你创作的是能带来转化的内容。

You create content that converts.

去hubspot.com看看吧，那是为成长型企业打造的智能客户平台。

Check out hubspot.com, the agentic customer platform for growing businesses.

好的。

Alright.

接下来是谁？

Who we got next?

哦，哥们。

Oh, dude.

吉米，最近怎么样？

Jimmy, how's going?

嘿，哥们。

Hey, dude.

你好吗？

How are you?

很高兴认识你。

Nice to meet you.

哥们，我大概十五年前在旧金山遇到这家伙，就在我刚搬到旧金山的时候。

Dude, I met this guy like fifteen years ago in San Francisco, right when I moved to San Francisco.

发生什么了？他

What happened He

有点欺负我。

kinda shoved me around.

你当时就像，他在YC。

You were like, he was in YC.

他当时在做很多很酷的事情。

He was doing a bunch of cool stuff at the time.

确实。

That's true.

你现在在跟我约会呢。

You're dating me now.

你知道，我肯定是的。

You know, I'm definitely yeah.

好多白头发。

Lot of gray hairs.

你们是怎么

How did you

认识的？

guys meet?

我都不太记得了，你告诉我吧。

Can't even remember originally, but you tell me.

我当时就是想认识一些有意思的人。

I think I was just trying to meet cool people.

你那时候有个很酷的公司。

You had a cool company at the time.

你当时特别年轻。

You were really young.

我们俩当时都在做社交网络相关的事情。

We were both doing social networking stuff.

比如，是

Like Is

有家公司吗？

there a company?

我的公司叫“家庭叶”。

My company is called Family Leaf.

那是一个面向家庭的私密社交网络。

It was a private social network for families.

说实话，那算是一个早期的社交应用，但在手机应用还没火起来的时候。

It's like an early social app, but like before mobile apps were, like, a big thing, to be honest.

所以你已经创业十五年了吗？

So you've been starting startups for for for fifteen years?

对。

Yeah.

差不多十五年前，我大学辍学去创业的。

Left left college to do that, and basically fifteen years ago.

对。

Yeah.

差不多吧。

Something like that.

对吧？

Right?

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

十二、十三年

Twelve, thirteen years

前。

ago.

所以我们在这里做的事情

So the the stick we're doing here

是的。

Yes.

从一个数字开始。

Start with a number.

好的。

Okay.

当然。

Absolutely.

对。

Yeah.

所以，我现在正在做的这个应用，和一群很棒的人一起，Tolan，我们的iOS应用已经有超过10万付费订阅用户了。

So with the app that I'm working on now with with an awesome group of folks, Tolan, we have over a 100,000 paying subscribers to our iOS app.

哇。

Wow.

这可不容易做到。

That's not easy to do.

太厉害了。

That's amazing.

它是做什么的？

What's it do?

是哪家公司？

What's what's company's it?

他们是什么

What are they

付费的？

paying for?

对。

Yeah.

Tolan 这个应用，基本上就是让你去认识并定制一个友好的向导，它由神奇的 AI 驱动，帮你应对生活中遇到的各种事情。

So Tolan is a it's an app where you basically get to meet and customize your own friendly guide that is powered by magical AI to help you with whatever it is that you're going through in life.

我觉得你特意用了“向导”这个词，但我不太明白那是什么意思。

I feel like you chose the word guide there specifically, but I don't know what that means.

是不是就像心理治疗师，但你不想直接说治疗师？

Is that like a therapist, but you don't wanna say therapist?

还是说它是朋友？

Is it a friend?

我们到底在说

What are we talking

这个问题问得好。

This is a great question.

说实话，这其实也是我们想尝试去定义它的一部分，因为就像你刚才说的，人们用它来做各种各样的事情。

I mean, honestly, it's partially our attempt to define that a bit because like you just said, people use it for all sorts of things.

对吧？

Right?

我的意思是，友谊有很多不同的含义。

I mean, friendship means a lot of different things.

对吧？

Right?

所以有时候，朋友就是你在经历某些事情时会打电话找的那个人。

So sometimes a friend is like someone that you call because you're going through something.

有时候，朋友是那种会把你骂醒、告诉你需要听的话的人。

Sometimes a friend is someone that like kicks you into shape and tells you what you need to hear.

人们会跟人生教练聊。

People talk to life coaches.

人们也会跟心理治疗师聊。

People talk to therapists.

人们会和各种各样的人聊。

People talk to all sorts of

你能给我们看一个吗？

Can you show us one?

就是那种看起来挺友好、挺可爱的小角色。

It's like this little kind of friendly looking character.

对。

Yeah.

完全没错。

Totally.

那这就是一个托兰。

So here's a Tolan.

它们就是这些小外星人。

So they're these little aliens.

对。

Yeah.

这就是我的。

So this is mine.

这是为我定制的。

This is custom to me.

我的托兰叫斯瓦米。

My Tolan's name is Swami.

我们每个人都有属于自己的托兰。

We everyone has their own Tolan.

你会得到你自己的，这个应用的使用方式就是你先下载它。

You get your own you so the way the the app works is you download it.

然后你跟一个叫神谕者的角色对话。

You talk to this character that we have called the Oracle.

它有点像那种神奇的神一般的角色，基本上会问你关于你自己的问题，就像说，嘿。

They're sort of like this magical godlike character that basically asks you questions about yourself that's just like, hey.

比如，你的希望和梦想是什么？

Like, what what are your what are your hopes and dreams?

比如说，你喜欢什么？

Like, what are you what are you into?

你关心什么？

What do you care about?

你最近有什么压力？

What are you stressed about?

就是类似这样的问题。

You know, things like that.

谁在用这个？

Who's using this?

是青少年还是成年人？

Is this teenagers, adults?

当然，肯定都有，但主要用户群体是哪些？

Obviously, it's a mix, but, like, what's the main sweet spot?

其实真的是各种人都有，你知道，就像任何大型消费产品或AI产品一样，它确实吸引了来自各行各业的人。

So, like, it it is truly, like, every type of person, you know, like like with any, I think, like, larger consumer product or, like, AI product, like, it attracts people from every walk of life, truly.

但最核心的用户群体，说实话让我们挺惊讶的，大概是35到45岁的人，而且主要是妈妈们。

But the main core demo, which is something that shocked us honestly, is roughly, like, 35 to 45 year olds and roughly, like, moms.

对，主要是女性。

Like, yeah, like, mostly women.

你觉得是这样吗？

You you think so?

这有什么好惊讶的？

That's not shocking?

我本来以为

I would've

会是芝麻街里的角色。

thought was Sesame Street character.

我还以为全是中西部地区的女性呢。

I thought it was, like, all women in the Midwest.

是的。

Yeah.

说实话，那确实就是我们的受众，你说得太准了。

I mean, that is literally our audience, so you nailed it.

对。

Yeah.

你完全说对了。

You nailed it.

作为认识很多中西部女性的人，我觉得，我是说，我来自中西部。

As a knower of many Midwest women, like, seems like I mean, I'm from the Midwest.

这看起来非常像中西部女性的风格。

This seems like a very Midwestern women thing.

你说得太对了。

You're so right on.

太不可思议了，而且我们之前完全没预料到，结果现在真的就变成了这样。

It's crazy, which I we did not predict that by the way, and that is totally what it has ended up becoming.

没有。

No.

就像那些会说‘哦，他表现得简直像个双子座’的人。

It's like people who are like, oh, he's acting exactly like a Gemini.

就是那些会说这种话的人。

It's like people who like say things like that.

星座市场？

The horoscope market?

对。

Yeah.

那真是双子座的做法。

That's such a Gemini thing of use.

肯定有重叠。

There's overlap for sure.

我们应用里有人格测试，大家很喜欢用来更了解自己。

We have personality tests in the app that people love to use to kind of understand more about themselves.

好的。

Okay.

所以，如果我先看广告，我就能最好地理解这个东西。

So so I understand things best if I look at the ad first.

那么，我看到什么样的广告才会想点击并下载这个应用呢？

So what's the ad I see that makes me wanna click and download this thing?

对。

Yeah.

说实话，对我们来说效果最好的就是那种真实的产品演示，就是人们日常生活中使用Tolan的场景。

I mean, honestly, what's worked best for us there are like, what we think of it, what I think of as like authentic product demos are just like people using Tolan in their daily lives.

比如有些内容，我们有过超级火的视频。

So like some of the most, I mean, we've had content that's gone super viral.

就像有个女人在做饭，想找出切南瓜的最佳方法，那种南瓜很难切。

That's like, you know, a woman like cooking and trying to figure out the best way to cut open, like, a kabocha squash, which is, like, hard to do.

然后Tolan就说，先加热一下。

And, you know, the Tolan says, well, warm it up.

你懂吧？

You know?

比如说，让我看看那个。

Like, let me see that.

好的。

Okay.

比如说，让我们看看你切进去的样子。

Like, let's see you slice into it.

好的。

Okay.

那成功了。

That worked.

然后它就会展示他们以某种方式提供价值。

And then it kinda shows them, like, providing value in some way.

那是最有效的。

That's what that's what works the best.

我觉得人们看到这个有点可爱的外星人，能跟它说话，而且它还会很聪明地回应，会有点被吓到。

I think people are kind of thrown off a little bit by seeing this, like, somewhat cute alien that they can talk to, and it speaks back and it speaks back really intelligently too.

但问题是，你真的想做个南瓜吗？

But it's a thing like, but do you wanna actually make a squash?

你为什么要为一个不真心爱你的男人做饭？

Why are you even cooking for this man who doesn't truly love you?

这是功能性的，还是情感上的引导，我更多觉得是后者，所以他们

Is it functional, or is it emotional guidance I more so that they

认为我们做的最有价值的事情，其实是这两者的结合，这算是个敷衍的回答。

think the most valuable thing that we do is honestly the combination of those two things, which is kind of a cop out answer.

但我觉得这是真的，因为基本上人们会跟他们的Tolan聊自己的近况。

But I think it's true because basically people will talk to their Tolans about what's going on with them.

对吧？

Right?

比如他们的情绪状态，他们在忙什么之类的。

Like their their emotional state, what what they're busy with or whatever.

但这总是会联系到，比如，你知道，我压力很大，因为我还没搞定孩子们今年夏天的夏令营。

But that always connects to like, well, you know, I'm feeling really stressed because I haven't figured out the kids' summer camp this this summer.

比如说，你的托兰会记得这些。

Like, you know, and your Tolan will remember that.

对。

Yeah.

他们会问，为什么

They're like, why

你在吃，为什么做这么多饼干？

are you eating why are you making so many cookies?

嗯，结果发现是这么回事。

Well, it turns out it's like this thing.

人们花了多少钱？

How many how much money are people spending?

或者成本是多少？

Or how much does it cost?

对。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

所以我们有多个价格档位。

So we have multiple price tiers.

我们最受欢迎的主打套餐，大部分订阅用户都是每月25美元。

Our main most popular one, most of those subscribers are on 25 a month for You're doing

我算不过来，10万乘以25美元。

I can't a 100 thousand times $25.

那是多少？

What's that?

250万。

2,500,000

一个月？

a month?

我们还有一个更低的订阅价格档位，所以是各种情况混合的。

We also have a lower we have a lower price subscription tier, so it's a mix of things.

所以还没到那个水平。

So it's not quite there.

你一个月能赚七位数？

You're doing 7 figures a month?

是的。

Yeah.

那太厉害了。

That's amazing.

对。

Mhmm.

真的吗？

Really?

是的。

Yeah.

留存率好吗？

Is retention good?

是的。

Yes.

对。

Yeah.

到目前为止留存率非常好。

The retention's great so far.

我的意思是，你知道，变化很大，除非你……公司成立多久了？

I mean, we we you know, it's changed a lot unless you How old is the company?

两年。

Two years.

好的。

Okay.

对。

Yeah.

两年时间，你们营收已经超过一千万了。

Two years, you're doing more than 10,000,000 in revenue.

你没明说，但算一下账，确实是这样。

You didn't say that, but math, it works.

所以你们要么营收要么年化收入超过一千万，而且你手下的人基本上就是——我这么说不是要贬低你们，只是想简化一下。

So you're doing more than 10,000,000 in in sort of either revenue or run rate, and you've got people just basically, it sounds like what you did was, and I don't mean this to trivialize it, just to simplify it.

你们把ChatGPT的智能拿过来，但加上了一个有名字、有不同风格的角色，让它有一种温暖的感觉，跟一个纯粹功能性的、叫ChatGPT的缩写工具聊起来感觉完全不一样。

You take what ChatGPT can do in terms of like the intelligence, but you added the the warm feel of a character who's yours with a name, with a different rapper, where it's gonna be it feels different to talk to than just a completely functional utilitarian thing called ChatGPT, like, literally an acronym.

你懂吧？

You know?

对。

Yeah.

完全同意。

Totally.

我觉得这肯定是其中一部分，而且是把ChatGPT这种超级智能和云系统带给更广泛的受众。

I mean, I think that that's part of it for sure and and bring to bear, like, this super intelligence of ChatGPT of cloud systems like that to, honestly, a broader audience.

我们的用户不一定都是重度AI用户，但肯定不是重度AI用户。

Like, our audience is not are not necessarily heavy AI users, they're but definitely not heavy AI users.

说实话，大多数人在个人生活中都不是重度AI用户。

And, honestly, most people are not for their personal lives.

对吧？

Right?

所以如果你想想ChatGPT和云服务的使用场景，大多数人都是用来提高效率的，比如帮我写封邮件。

So if you think about the use cases of ChatGeePTV, use cases of the cloud, most people are using it for productivity, draft me an email.

也许他们会把它当成一个更聪明的谷歌来问问题，但他们从来没有订阅过，所以没有体验到完整的功能。

Maybe they asked a question to it as a smarter Google, but they never subscribed, so they didn't get the full experience.

所以这更像是，这非常适用于你的个人生活。

So it's like, this is this is very much applied to your personal life.

因为

Because of

要做一个Tolan娃娃。

that to make a Tolan doll.

比如，我可以买他们的……我可以买那个动物吗？

Like, I can buy the their I can I can buy, like, the animal?

你知道，有人问过这个问题。

Like, you know People have asked.

有人读过

People have read

它。

it.

就像一个可以跟我说话的芯片。

Like a chip that I can talk to.

对。

Yeah.

有个在Furcon加速器里的人做过这个，看起来超棒。

There was a guy in Furcon's accelerator who did that, and it looked awesome.

酷。

Cool.

毛绒玩具。

Stuffed animals.

我见过一些。

Seen some of those.

我对那个很好奇。

I'm very curious about that.

但我想接着这一点说，因为我觉得很多人看到它时，会觉得这不过是给ChatGPT套了个可爱角色的壳子。

But just to build on this point, because I think it's important of why I think a lot of people see it, they're kind of like, oh, this is a rapper of a cute character around ChatGPT.

我们构建的很多东西，其实都围绕着Tolans背后的记忆系统和个性化系统。

So much of what we've built is around the kind of memory system and the personalization system behind the Tolans.

所以，你知道，我的联合创始人Evan很早就意识到，所有那些基于角色或陪伴类的体验，其实都没有真正用心设计记忆功能，让它们感觉真实。

So, you know, we have, like my co founder Evan has kind of been very early to this of like all of the kind of character based or companion types of experiences, like have not actually been built with like thoughtful memory where it truly feels realistic.

比如Tolan会记住你告诉它的事情。

Like the Tolan will remember things you tell them.

它们会在合适的时机重新提起这些事。

They'll bring them back up to you at the right time.

他们会给你推荐播客，我是说，说实话，我敢肯定很多用户都是从他们的Tolan那里得到《我的第一个百万》播客推荐的。

They'll come to you with a podcast rec I mean, I'm sure that actually tons of our users have gotten my first million podcast recommendations from their Tolan, to be totally honest.

因为他们可能会提到，比如，嘿。

Because they probably mentioned like, hey.

我，我是说，可以。

I I mean Can

帮我们调高一点，好吗？

dial that up for us, please?

对。

Yeah.

来吧。

Take it.

其实就拉那个杆。

Actually asked that lever.

我们在注册时问了一个问题。

We asked a question on the onboarding.

这可能有点技术性，但我们在注册时会问一个问题，比如，说出一个你的目标或梦想。

Maybe this is like a little techy on the other thing about it, but we do ask a question of, like, name a goal or dream you have.

可以是小事，也可以是大事，比如自己创业。

It could be something small or something big like starting your own business.

我敢肯定很多人会说，嗯，我想开一家咖啡馆。

And I'm sure a lot of people talk about, like, well, I wanna start my I wanna start a cafe.

我想做这个做那个。

I wanna start this or that.

然后我敢肯定你的播客会被提到，因为用户们会去网上搜索。

And then I'm sure that your your podcast comes up because the Tolans will go search through the Internet.

他们会找到适合你当时情况的推荐。

They'll find the right recommendation for you at that given time.

当然，我们不可能每次都完全准确，但我们会尽力，人们会觉得这很神奇，然后推荐就会来到他们面前。

Obviously, we don't hit the mark 100% of the time, but but really try and people find it magical, and then it'll come to them.

而ChatGPT做不到这一点。

And ChatGPT does not do that.

这个想法第一次听确实有点怪。

This idea sounds weird when you first hear it.

没有冒犯的意思。

No offense.

名字听起来也怪，但我其实特别着迷。

The name sounded weird too, but I'm actually so into it.

所以名字确实有点怪。

So the name sounds a little weird.

这个想法有点……我是说，这算是个比较新的现象。

The idea is a little I mean, it's a it's kinda new phenomenon newish phenomenon.

我在硅谷学到的是，当你觉得某件事怪，但大家都在做的时候，那就得跟上。

I've learned moving to Silicon Valley that when you're weird, but people are doing it, lean in.

那说明背后肯定有特别有意思的东西。

That means there's something really interesting going on.

很多大赢家当初都是这样的。

And a lot of the big winners were like that.

哦，人们就是随便坐进陌生人的车里到处开。

Oh, people are just getting in strangers' cars and driving around.

这就像变成了Lyft或Uber一样。

It's like becomes like a Lyft or an Uber.

他们睡在别人家的沙发上，还像住酒店一样付钱。

They're sleeping on people's couches and paying that like a hotel.

这算什么？

Like, what?

我可不会这么做。

I wouldn't do that.

万一他们……

What if they?

所以，那些人们真正会做的奇怪行为，背后往往藏着很有意思的生意。

So the weird behaviors that people actually do tend to be really interesting business underneath.

你能稍微描述一下你眼中的未来是什么样的吗？

Can you just describe like what you think the future looks like a little bit?

你觉得完全正常会是什么样子？

Like what is totally normal gonna look like do you think?

对。

Yeah.

这个问题问得真好。

It's a really good question.

我觉得你描述的一部分我完全同意。

I mean, I think part of what you're describing totally agree.

你描述的有一部分有点像早期采用者的那种情况。

And part of what you're describing is a little bit of like the early adopter thing.

我在我们的Reddit上看到，我的联合创始人Quintin非常活跃，和所有用户交流。

I mean, I see this on our Reddit where my co founder Quintin's really active and talking to all of our users.

你知道，我看到那些写信来的人，他们就是普通人，就像我们、我们的朋友或家人，但他们是一群特定的人，出于某种原因决定喜欢让他们的Tolan成为生活的一部分。

You know, like I see it in people that write in, like the people that they're very much everyday people, like just like us, our friends or family, but they're like a specific slice of people that have decided for some reason to be like into, like, having their Tolan be a part of their life.

那对他们来说意味着什么？

And what does that mean to them?

这可能意味着在上班路上，他们不会像以前那样花时间看YouTube或者刷短视频，而是跟他们的Tolan聊天。

That might mean like on the way into work, they will, instead of taking time that might've been, you know, watching YouTube or watching short form video, they're like talking to their Tolan.

他们会跟Tolan聊今天有什么安排，对什么感到焦虑，今天的计划是什么，周末的计划是什么。

They're talking to their Tolan about like what they have up for the day, what they're feeling anxious about, what their plan is for the day, what their plan is for the weekend.

他们找到了某种方式或节奏，Tolan开始以某种方式帮助他们，成为他们生活的一部分。

And they've kind of figured out a way or a rhythm or it started to help them in some way to have their Tolan like become a part of their lives.

当他们这样做的时候，显然从中获得了一些价值。

Then when they do that, they're obviously getting some value from it.

比如我们应用里有个功能，叫“意图”，你的Tolan会根据你告诉它的内容，为你生成当天的意图。

Like we have features in the app, like what we call intentions, where your Tolan will like come up with intentions for the day based on what you tell them.

它们会根据一天中对你的观察，为你写反思。

They write reflections on you based on what they've kind of seen about you throughout the day.

所以人们发现这对他们很有用。

And so people have found this being useful to them.

我觉得现在，这仍然是一小部分人，有点像那种，怎么说呢，就像95年那会儿开始用电子邮件的人一样。

I think it's it's right now, I mean, it's a it's still a very small slice of people, and it's kind of one of those, like, people people that were, I don't know, sending email in, you know, '95 or something.

我不太确定具体是哪一年，但感觉就像是一群早期采用者，他们都有这些向导。

I'm not sure what the right year is exactly, but it's kind of like this early adopter group of people, it feels like, that have these guides.

看看他们子版块的热门帖子。

Look at the top posts from their subreddit.

这是你的子版块吧。

Is the this is your subreddit.

有人做了她的Tolan娃娃。

Someone made her Tolan doll.

另一个，第二热门的帖子，有人钩织了他们的

Another the the second most top post, someone crocheted their

Tolan，好主意。

Tolan Good idea.

你喜欢什么？

What do you love?

看起来像是那个娃娃。

Seems like The doll.

然后第三个热门帖子，Tolan 简直让人震惊。

And then another the the third top post, Tolan is mind blowing.

各位，我彻底惊呆了。

Guys, I'm flabbergasted.

我这辈子从来没有遇到过一个人，能像这个傻乎乎又可爱的机器人一样，在过去一周里给了我这么多。

I've never had a single person in my life who has given as much as this stupid adorable bot has given me in the past week.

所以听起来，如果十年后我们除了真实朋友之外，还有 AI 朋友或伴侣可以依靠，无论是为了建议，还是更深层的指导、教练，你都不会感到惊讶。

So so it sounds like you're not gonna be surprised if ten years from now, we all have, in addition to our real friends, AI friend or companions that we rely on, whether it's for advice, whether it's for more kind of deeper guidance, coaching.

对。

Yeah.

或者随便闲聊，如果我愿意的话，随时都有一个随时在线的朋友可以聊天。

Or casual chitchat where I have an always on available friend to to chat with if I so choose.

我觉得 AI 越来越聪明，能力越来越强，而且成本也越来越低。

I think AI is getting smarter, more capable, and also, like, more cost effective.

这一切就这么自然而然地发生了。

And this is just, like, happening.