潜入51区

欢迎回来，年轻的侦探们，来到科学之谜的世界。

Welcome back, young detectives, to mysteries of science.

这是一档始终在破案的节目。

This is the show that's always on the case.

从档案中，我们找回了一份绝密文件——51区。

From the archives, we've recovered a top secret file, Area 51.

它只是一个布满灰尘的沙漠基地，还是小绿人着陆的跑道？

Is it just a dusty desert base or a landing strip for little green visitors?

真相确实在外面，而且不会长期对我们隐藏。

The truth is definitely out there, and it won't stay hidden from us for too long.

所以系好安全带。

So buckle up.

这是一场外星人谜团，即将起飞。

This is an extraterrestrial mystery, and it's about to take off.

把我传上去。

Beam me up.

你好，欢迎来到《科学之谜》。

Hello, and welcome to Mysteries of Science.

我叫丹，是《科学与自然》杂志的编辑，这本月刊由《The Week Junior》团队制作。

My name is Dan, and I'm the editor of Science and Nature, which is the monthly magazine from the team behind The Week Junior.

我是迈克尔，代理副主编。

And I'm Michael, the acting deputy editor.

在这个播客中，我们调查奇异的生物、怪异的事件和神秘的地点。

On this podcast, we investigate strange creatures, weird events, and mysterious places.

说到神秘地点，今天我们要调查的可能是地球上最神秘的地方。

And speaking of mysterious places, today, we're going to investigate perhaps perhaps the most mysterious place on planet Earth.

我要告诉你那是什么地方吗？

Should I tell you what it is?

一个叫做爱德华兹空军基地的地方。

Somewhere called Area 51.

你听说过这个地方吗？

Now have you ever heard of that place?

你可能没听说过，因为它是美国内华达沙漠中一个非常保密的军事基地。

Well, you might not have done because it's a very secretive military base in The US in the Nevada Desert.

没人确切知道那里在进行什么，但人们认为它可能与外星人有关。

No one quite knows what goes on there, but they think it might have something to do

与外星人有关。

with Alien.

哇。

Wow.

所以，去Area 51，直接到Area 50，然后左转。

So Area 51, go straight to Area 50, turn left.

如果你到了Area 52，那就走过了。

If you get to Area 52 You've gone too far.

没错。

Absolutely.

如果你看到了Area 49，那就还没走到。

You see Area 49, you've not gone far enough.

所以你有一个充满神秘事件的顶级机密地点。

So you've got a top secret place with strange happenings.

我认为，这绝对是一个真正超乎想象的谜团。

This I think we're set for a really truly out of this world mystery.

让我们看看能否偷偷潜入，弄清楚真相。

Let's see if we can sneak in and get some answers.

这里是《科学之谜》。

This is Mysteries of Science.

所以，迈克尔，在介绍中你跟我们讲了一点关于51区的事。

So, Michael, in the introduction, you told us a little bit about Area 51.

你说它是一个美国军事基地。

You said it was a US military base.

那里到底发生了什么？

What actually goes on there?

嗯，丹，我不能告诉你，但希望我们的专家嘉宾能告诉我们。

Well, Dan, I can't tell you, but, hopefully, our expert guests can.

那我们为什么不欢迎一位写过一系列关于爱德华兹51区并试图回答这个问题的书籍的作者呢？

So why don't we say hello to somebody who's written a series of books about Area 51 trying to answer that very question?

嗨。

Hi.

我是朱莉·布克斯鲍姆。

I'm Julie Buxbaum.

我是《爱德华兹51区档案》系列丛书的作者，这套书面向青少年读者。

I'm the author of the Area 51 Files, which is a series of books for middle grade readers.

欢迎来到节目，朱莉。

Welcome to the show, Julie.

请告诉我，《爱德华兹51区档案》讲的是什么？

Please tell me, what are the Area 51 Files about?

《爱德华兹51区档案》深入挖掘了爱德华兹51区的秘密。

The Area 51 Files digs into the secrets of Area 51.

在第一本书中，一些外星人失踪了，斯凯和她的朋友们必须解开外星人失踪之谜。

In the first book, some aliens go missing, and Skye and her friends have to solve the mystery of the missing aliens.

在第二本书《大冲水》中，它探讨了太空垃圾和环绕我们大气层的大量碎片这一真实存在的问题。

In the second book, The Big Flush, it tackles the very real problem of space junk and all the debris that is floating around our atmosphere.

目前有三万件太空垃圾在我们的大气层周围环绕，确实有一些组织专门负责追踪这些太空垃圾。

There are 30,000 pieces of space junk currently circling our atmosphere, and there are actual organizations whose jobs it is to track that space junk.

在《大冲水》中，一个巨大的太空马桶正朝51区驶来，斯凯和她的朋友们必须拯救基地，甚至可能拯救整个内华达州，免受一个巨型太空马桶的威胁。

And in the big flush, a giant space toilet is headed towards Area 51, and Sky and her friends have to save the base and perhaps the entire state of Nevada from a giant space toilet.

在系列的第三本书《朋友还是UFO》中，我们的星球上可能有也可能没有一个52区。

And in the third book of the series, Friend or UFO, there may or may not be an Area 52 on our planet.

听起来太棒了。

Sounds brilliant.

所以，朱莉，告诉我们，这些书的灵感是从哪里来的？

So tell us, Julie, where did the idea for these books come from?

我热爱51区。

I love Area 51.

我喜欢任何能让你提出‘如果呢？’这个问题的谜团。

I love any mystery that makes you ask the question, what if?

但这个书的创意实际上并不是我想到的。

But the way I came up with this book idea actually did not come from me.

它来自我九岁的儿子。

It came from my nine year old son.

嗯，当时他九岁。

Well, he was nine at the time.

在疫情期间，我的孩子们经常问我一些我无法回答的问题。

And during the pandemic, my kids used to ask me all sorts of questions I didn't have answers to.

作为父母或监护人，当孩子问我们答不上来的问题时，会感到非常不安。

And as a parent or guardian, it's deeply uncomfortable when our kids ask us questions that we don't know the answers to.

我的孩子们在家待了大约一年。

And my kids were home from school for about a year.

我住在洛杉矶。

I live in Los Angeles.

那段时间，他们不断问我各种我无法回答的问题，比如：我们什么时候能回学校？

And during that time, they had all sorts of questions for me that I couldn't answer, like, When are we going back to school?

或者我们什么时候能见到爷爷？

Or when are we gonna see grandpa?

每次他们问我这样的问题，我都感到非常不安。

And it was deeply uncomfortable every time they asked me a question like that.

有一次吃晚饭时，我儿子卢卡说：妈妈，我有个问题要问你。

And one time at dinner, my son, Luca, said, mommy, I have a question for you.

我说：好的，卢卡，我有答案。

And I said, okay, Luca, I have an answer.

所以我真的很担心他会问什么。

So I was really worried about what he was gonna ask.

他说：妈妈，你认为51区会发生什么？

And he said, Mommy, what do you think happens at Area 51?

这个提问的有趣之处在于，他没有问我：51区会发生什么？

And what was interesting about the question is he didn't ask me, What happens at Area 51?

他问的是：你认为51区会发生什么？

He asked, What do you think happens at Area 51?

就在那一刻，我豁然开朗，决定回答他的问题。

And I had this moment where it all came to me, and I decided to answer his question.

我决定为他写一本完整的书，而我确实这么做了。

I'd write him an entire book, and that's what I did.

现在这已经发展成一个系列，我已经写了三本书来回答关于我对Area 51所发生事情的看法。

And now it's an entire series, and I've written three books answering the question about what I think happens at Area 51.

就在这里。

Right there.

让我们为孩子们提出的问题热烈鼓掌，因为他们常常向我们的听众提出一些最难回答的问题。

That's let's have a great shout out for the questions that kids ask because they quite often ask our listeners ask us some of the most difficult to answer questions.

显然，朱迪的书是虚构的，讲述的是Area 51可能正在发生的事情，但朱莉，我感兴趣的是，你在写书的过程中对真实的Area 51了解到了什么？

Obviously, Judy's books are fictional about things that might be happening at Area 51, but what I'm interested, Julie, to learn is what did you learn about the real Area 51 while you were writing your books?

我的研究中发现的一个有趣事实是，直到2013年6月25日，中央情报局才首次承认Area 51的存在，我认为这非常有趣，毕竟它已经存在了很长时间。

I mean, one interesting fact that I came up with in my research was it wasn't until 06/25/2013 that the CIA even acknowledged the existence of the very 51, which I think is super interesting considering it's been around for a very long time.

这确实很有趣，而且令人怀疑——他们直到最近才正式承认它的存在，尤其是因为我以为关于Area 51的传闻早在2013年之前就已经流传很久了。

That is interesting and suspicious, if I might add, that they wouldn't officially acknowledge that it existed until relatively recently, especially because I thought Stories of Area 51 had been going on way before 2013.

我小时候确实听说过这些事，我的童年可是在2013年之前很久了，这可能让你惊讶。

Well, I certainly heard them about them in my childhood, and that was I mean, it might surprise you to know, but my childhood was way before 2013.

所以，是的，这非常神秘。

So, yeah, it's very mysterious.

而且，我想向朱莉提一个后续问题。

And, yeah, I would like to ask Julie a follow-up question then.

这些围绕着这个神秘而隐秘的军事基地的谜团，究竟是从什么时候开始的？

When did all these mysteries surrounding this strange and secretive military base start?

1947年7月8日，如果你查阅当时的报纸《记录报》，会看到一则新闻标题，称在新墨西哥州罗斯威尔地区的一处农场捕获了一架飞碟。

On 07/08/1947, if you look at the newspaper, Record, there's a headline that references capturing a flying saucer on a ranch in Roswell in the Roswell region of New Mexico.

后来，他们更正了报道，说那并不是飞碟，而是一个气象气球。

Later, they corrected the record, right, and said it wasn't a flying saucer, but it was a weather balloon.

但这一事件点燃了全国的想象力，许多人坚信，那架飞碟如今就藏在 Area 51 后面高度机密的门后。

But that sort of ignited the national imagination, and many, many people believe that that flying saucer now lives in Area 51 behind highly classified doors.

是的。

Yes.

罗斯威尔事件，有趣的是，这是我写的第一篇关于科学的神秘现象文章

Roswell incident, which funnily enough was the very first mysteries of science article that I wrote

在科学

in science

和《自然》杂志上。

and nature magazine.

是的。

Yeah.

大概是在第12期吧。

Back in issue 12, I think it was.

太棒了。

Fantastic.

如果你喜欢神秘事件以及科学和奇异现象相关的问题，那么杂志里还有大量内容可供阅读，其中包括许多我们尚未制作成播客的主题。

Well, you know, if you like mysteries and other questions about, science and strange happenings, then there's plenty more to read inside the magazine, including many that we haven't done podcast episodes of yet.

好的。

Okay.

所以我们了解到，51区是一个美国军事基地，而美国政府直到2013年才正式承认其存在。

So we've learned that Area 51 is a US military base, which the US government did not officially recognize the existence of until 2013.

但有些人认为，他们可能从1947年就开始隐藏飞碟、UFO（不明飞行物）了。

But some people think they may have been hiding flying saucers, UFOs, unidentified flying objects, maybe as far back as 1947.

如果我们能跟一个去过那里、亲眼见过51区的人聊聊，听听他描述一下那里的情况，甚至带我们去看看，那该多好。

If only we could speak to somebody who'd who'd been to the area, and seen Area 51 and could tell us a little bit more about what it what it's like and kind of take us there.

嗯，丹，我们运气不错，因为说来你可能不信，科学与自然团队的一名成员确实去过51区。

Well, Dan, we're in luck because believe it or not, a member of the Science and Nature team has been to Area 51.

真的吗？

No way.

这太诡异了。

That's spooky.

简直就像我们事先策划好的一样。

It's almost as if we planned it.

你好。

Hi.

我叫戴夫·卡尔塞尔顿。

I'm Dave Calselton.

我是《周日少年》和《科学与自然》杂志的艺术总监。

I'm the art director of The Week Junior and Science and Nature magazine.

你好，戴夫。

Hello, Dave.

真没想到会在这里见到你。

Fancy seeing you here.

非常高兴欢迎你来到《科学之谜》，并向我们的听众介绍你。

Very pleased to welcome you to Mysteries of Science and to introduce you to our listeners.

那么，跟我们讲讲你是怎么去到51区的吧。

So tell us your story of how you ended up going to Area 51.

那是很久以前的事了。

Well, it was a long time ago.

我觉得那时候手机还没发明出来。

I don't think mobile phones had been invented at that point.

没有。

No.

那是二十多年前，我去美国度假的时候。

It was about twenty plus years ago on a holiday to America.

我从旧金山去了拉斯维加斯。

Went from San Francisco to Las Vegas.

我当时和我的女朋友——现在是我的妻子——在一起，她说，拉斯维加斯三天就够了。

I was with my girlfriend, now my wife, and she said, you only need three days in Las Vegas.

我突然意识到，你至少需要几个星期。

And I suddenly realized that you need at least a couple of weeks.

于是我给当时工作的公司打了电话，问：我能多留一段时间吗？

So I phoned up my company I was working for at the time and said, can I stay?

他们说：当然可以。

And they said, yeah.

没问题。

No problem.

我们有时间做一件我一生都想要做的事，那就是寻找51区。

And we had the time to do something I'd always wanted to do my whole life, which was try and find Area 51.

但是

But

你能离入口多近？

how close can you get to the entrance?

我的意思是，这是一个高度保密的军事基地。

I mean, like, this is a this is a high security military base.

所以，你能直接走到那里吗？

So, you know, can you can you walk right up there?

周围有很多安保吗？

Is there lots of security around?

嗯，我们一开始没找到。

Well, we missed it initially.

你会沿着ET公路行驶，然后有一条小土路通向格里姆湖。

There's you travel along the ET Highway, and there's a little dirt road which leads you to Grim Lake.

上面并没有说不能走这条路，它只是通向别处。

It doesn't say you can't go down it, it just leads off.

它看起来像一条拖拉机小路，直到你看到巨型十八轮卡车从相反方向呼啸而过，你才会意识到这根本不是一条小土路——后来我才知道，这其实是伪装成土路的加固混凝土路面。

It looks like a a tractor path until you see until you see 18 wheeler juggernauts bombing along it the other way and you think this isn't a little dirt road and actually I found out it's reinforced concrete that's made to look like a dirt road.

他们不希望你走这条路，但并没有明令禁止，而你确实可以走，沿着这条路开两到三英里都没问题。

They don't want you to go down it but they don't actually say you can't and because you can, and you can go down it for two or three miles.

你必须停下的地方是一个小小的检查站，但那里没人值守，只有一块牌子写着：请勿再向前。

Where you do have to stop is a little tiny checkpoint which no one guards, but there's a sign that says do not come any further.

如果你跨过这条线，将动用致命武力。

Deadly force will be put into action if you step across this line.

而且我猜还会被判一年监禁。

And I think there's a year of imprisonment.

他们还有吉普车在该区域巡逻。

And they've got guys in jeeps that patrol the area.

他们还在周围的灌木丛和树木里安装了声音监测设备。

They've got sound equipment in the shrubs and trees all around the area.

他们有直升机从51区那边的山丘飞过来，如果你继续前进，它们会非常具有威胁性地盘旋在你上方。

They've got helicopters that will come over the the hill from Area 51 and look very threatening at you if you go.

所以我没有继续。

So I didn't.

我们掉头回去了。

We turned around.

事实上，说实话，我们甚至都没走到那一段。

In fact, to be really honest, we didn't even get up to that bit.

我总觉得我已经看得够多了。

I kind of felt I didn't I'd seen enough.

我本该走下去的，但我们沿着路开了没多远，就犹豫了。

I should have gone down it, but we went a little bit down the road and thought, I don't know.

当时我不确定哪些是合法的，哪些是非法的。

I don't know what's legal and what isn't at the time.

当时网上几乎找不到什么信息，所以我甚至觉得我走过的那段路都已经违法了，于是我就退缩了。

It was all, there wasn't much information on the Internet that I could find, so I thought I even thought going along the bit I did was illegal, so I I chickened out.

但下次，我一定要走到检查站。

But next time, I'm gonna get to the checkpoint.

公平地说，我觉得我可能也会退缩。

To be fair to Dave, I think I probably would have chickened out too.

这听起来非常明智。

It's that sounds very sensible.

我的意思是，如果我看到牌子上写着‘使用致命武力’，我肯定会立刻跑掉。

I mean, I think if I had seen a sign saying as soon as I saw the sign saying deadly force will be used, I would've I would've hightailed out.

是的。

Yeah.

当然。

Definitely.

在我看来，他们肯定有什么东西想隐瞒，我相信我不只是这么想。

It sounds to me, you know, like they've definitely got somewhat something to hide, and I don't I'm sure I'm not the only one.

为什么要有这么高的安保等级？

Why all of that high security?

正如人们所说，无风不起浪。

As they say, there's no smoke without fire.

如果你没什么可隐藏的，为什么要这么高的安保措施？

Why all that high security if you've not got something to hide?

这还不是全部。

And that's not all.

原来，他们在51区周围有很多不想让你看到的东西。

It turns out there's a lot of things they don't want you to see around Area 51.

我注意到一个有趣的现象：从我们酒店望出去，可以看到拉斯维加斯机场，有很多飞机从一家名为Janet Airways的公司起飞。

What I did find interesting was from our hotel, we looked at the airport, Las Vegas Airport, and there was a there's a lot of planes taking off from a company called Janet Airways.

我之前了解到，Janet Airways的航班会从拉斯维加斯运送人员前往51区，并降落在世界上最大的跑道之一上。

I found out earlier that Janet Airways, there is people that are going to Area 51 from Las Vegas, and they land in Area 51 on what is one of the world's biggest runways.

所以我不明白他们为什么不直接在那里降落，但肯定有原因。

So I don't know why they don't just land there, but there's gotta be a reason.

于是我试着拍几张飞机的照片，但很快就被赶走了。

So I went to take a few photographs of the planes, and I was shooed away pretty quickly.

我想是因为他们不希望我拍到登机的工作人员，而不是每个人都能看到的飞机本身。

I guess because they didn't want me taking pictures of the personnel getting on the plane rather than the actual plane that everybody can see.

工作人员还是外星人？

Personnel or alien l?

对。

Yeah.

人员外星人。

Personnelian.

好太多了。

Very much better.

这太神秘了。

That is super mysterious.

我的意思是，我们越深入，谜团就一个接一个地堆积起来。

I mean, like, the deeper we get in here, the mysteries just keep on piling on top of each other.

我在想，这些航班上到底是谁或什么在上面。

I mean, I wonder who or what could be on these flights.

他们不想让我们看到什么？

What don't they want us to see?

是外星人吗？

Is it extraterrestrials?

是吗？

Is it?

如果外星人存在于或围绕着51区，你认为可能会有一些迹象、线索，或者一些奇怪的事件发生。

Well, if there are extraterrestrials in or around Area 51, you think there might be some some signs, some clues, maybe some strange events going on.

戴夫，这说得通。

Dave That's fair enough.

你看到什么不寻常的东西了吗？

Did you see anything out of the ordinary?

嗯，有。

Well, yes.

任何听过电影《第三类接触》的听众——这是我最喜欢的科幻电影之一——都会记得有一个关于奶牛的场景，我就不剧透了。

Any any listeners that have ever seen the film Close Encounters, one of my favorite sci fi films of all time, will know there's a scene with cows, and I won't give it away.

但当我们沿着公路行驶时，周围什么都没有，看不到其他车辆。

But, when we were traveling along the road and there was nothing there, there was no other cars, you don't really see any other cars.

长时间都看不到任何东西。

You see nothing for a long time.

当我们靠近时，我注意到地平线上有一个小点。

I noticed a little dot on the horizon as we got closer.

那是一头死牛倒在路中央，这有点奇怪。

It was a dead cow had collapsed in the middle of the road, which is kind of weird.

我以前从未在路中间见过牛，但更奇怪的是，周围没有其他牛。

I've never come across a cow in the middle of the road before, but weirder because there was no other cow.

它附近没有任何牛。

It was anywhere near.

没有其他？等一下。

No other wait a minute.

高度保密、秘密飞行、路中央的死牛，这个地方直到2013年才被正式承认存在。

High security, secretive flights, dead cows in the middle of the road, the place that wasn't officially there until 2013.

我能说什么呢？

What can I say?

我们该如何揭开这一切的真相？

How are we going to get to the bottom of all of this?

我认为我们需要请出播客的老朋友，一位专业的UFO调查专家。

Well, I think we need to bring in an old friend of the podcast, an expert UFO investigator.

我叫尼克·波普。

My name's Nick Pope.

我曾经在英国国防部工作，其中一项职责就是调查UFO现象。

I used to work for the Ministry of Defense, and one of my postings involved investigating the UFO phenomenon.

我现在住在美国，从事自由撰稿、新闻报道和电视工作。

I now live and work in The United States and do a mix of freelance writing, journalism, and TV work.

是的。

Yeah.

欢迎回到节目，尼克。

Well, welcome back to the show, Nick.

长期听众可能还记得尼克在我们之前关于UFO的那期节目中出现过。

Longtime listeners may remember Nick from our UFO episode.

尼克，我相信你曾为英国政府调查过不明飞行物。

Nick, you have investigated unidentified flying objects for the British government, I believe.

美国政府让你进过51区吗？

Have the US government let you have a look inside Area 51?

我曾经到过51区附近，但即使是我也没能进去。

I've been right up to Area 51, but even I couldn't get in.

所以我非常重视安全措施，绝不会考虑非法闯入。

So I I took the security very seriously, of course, and wouldn't dream of of trespassing.

任何人都不应该这么做。

No one should.

但你可以走到大门附近，甚至相当接近，有时还能拍到51区边缘的照片。

But, you can go you can go right up to the gate or fairly close, and you can get some pictures sometimes of of, the edge of of where it is.

但不行。

But, no.

尽管我在英国为政府工作过，但至今还没有收到邀请。

Despite having worked for the government, in The UK, I have not yet received my invitation.

但如果美国政府有人在看，并想邀请我去参观一下，我非常乐意，而且我不会说出去。

But, if anyone from the US government's watching and wants to invite me in for a a little tour, I'm I'm up for it, and I won't I won't let on.

我保证。

I promise.

我敢肯定他们正在观看。

I'm sure they are watching.

是的。

Yeah.

他们肯定在听这个播客。

They're definitely listening to this podcast.

好吧。

Okay.

所以你还没进去过，尼克，但告诉我们，你对51区了解多少？

So you've not been inside, Nick, but tell us, what do you know about Area 51?

Area 51 出现在几部电视纪录片中，甚至也在电影里出现过。

Area 51 has featured in several TV documentaries and actually in movies too.

人们普遍认为，如果外星人曾经造访过地球，那么这里就是他们存放所有证据的地方，比如坠毁的宇宙飞船之类的。

It's generally thought to be a place where people think that if we've been visited by aliens, this is where they take all the proof, the crashed spaceships, that sort of thing.

有些人声称，政府正在试图逆向工程这些外星技术。

And people some people claim that the government is trying to reverse engineer this alien technology.

换句话说，如果我们拥有这些坠毁的飞船，就试图弄清楚如何把它们重新组装起来，让它们自己飞起来，最终，我想，赋予人类星际旅行的能力。

In other words, if we've got these crashed spaceships, try and figure out how can we put them back together again and make make them fly ourselves and and ultimately, I suppose, give humans the capability to to have interstellar travel.

现在，我不知道这是否是真的。

Now I don't know if that's true or not.

我的意思是，这只是一个有趣的谣言，但我确实没有看到任何确凿的证据。

I mean, it's a fun rumor, but I've certainly seen no no hard and fast evidence of that.

尽管如此，Area 51 是真实存在的。

Having said that, Area 51 does exist.

它是一个非常真实的区域。

It is a very real area.

它非常大。

It's huge.

它位于美国内华达州，面积达数百平方英里，是美国政府测试和研发大量秘密原型飞机的场所。

It's it's hundreds of square miles in the state of Nevada in The United States, and it's where the United States government has test flown and developed a lot of its secret prototype aircraft.

多年来，像隐形战斗机和隐形轰炸机这样的武器首次都是在那里研发和试飞的。

So over the years, things things like the stealth fighter and the stealth bomber, they were developed and flown there for the first time.

对，迈克尔。

Right, Michael.

一个有趣的想法。

An interesting thought.

它正在慢慢渗透进来。

It's slowly filtering in.

我突然想到了。

It's occurring to me.

所以你知道，有时候最简单的答案才是你应该寻找的，因为它往往更正确。

So, you know, like, sometimes the simplest answer is the one you should look for because it's the one that is often more right.

所以我在想，如果51区是他们测试超级秘密、超级先进战斗机的地方，那也许就能解释为什么会有这么多关于不明飞行物、夜间奇怪天象的传闻，而且这些现象往往发生在人们不希望你看到的时候。

So I'm thinking if Area 51 is where they test their super secret, super advanced self fighter jets, then maybe that would explain all this talk of unidentified flying objects, strange things in the sky, at odd times of night that people don't want you to see.

你觉得呢？

What do you what do you think?

你这个观点很有说服力，丹，但我还不确定。

You make a compelling case there, Dan, but I I don't know.

我仍然坚持我对外星人的幻想。

I'm still holding on to my my dream of aliens.

你觉得呢，尼克？

What do you think, Nick?

你觉得丹说得有道理吗？

Do you think Dan's on to something here?

我认为在航空史上，曾多次出现过这种情况：尖端科技的全新原型侦察机被飞行员误认为是UFO，因为飞行员会说：‘我们没有任何这种飞机。’

I think there have been several times in aviation history where, absolutely, the cutting edge of technology, brand new prototype spy planes have been seen by pilots mistaken for UFOs because the pilots say, well, we haven't got anything like that.

但当然，他们未必被允许了解这些保密项目。

But, of course, they're not read into those classified programs necessarily.

我认为，航空航天技术通常比公众所知的技术领先十年、十五年，甚至可能二十年。

And I think it's generally true that aerospace technology runs ten, fifteen, or maybe twenty years ahead of what people will know about.

因此，在任何给定时间，天上飞行的某些东西很可能看起来像是来自科幻电影。

So there'll be things flying at any given time that probably do look like they come from a sci fi movie.

如果你看到了，你可能会想，哇。

And if you see them, you might think, wow.

那是外星人。

That's aliens.

没错。

Bingo.

那就是

That's

了。

it then.

案件终结。

Case closed.

我认为现在是时候拿出那个古老的神秘度量仪了。

I think it's probably time to wheel out the old mystery o meter at this point.

别急，丹。

Not so fast, Dan.

什么点？

What what point?

故事还有另一个转折，是我们还没提到过的事情。

There's another twist in the tale, something that we haven't spoken about yet.

有一位名叫鲍勃·拉扎尔的举报人，声称他曾在那里工作，并参与了外星科技的逆向工程。

There was a particular whistleblower called Bob Lazar who claimed to have worked there and and worked on reverse engineering or back engineering alien technology.

什么？

What?

等等。

Wait.

我们离真相这么近了。

We were so close.

有人声称在51区工作，并参与过外星科技的研究。

Somebody who worked at Area 51 claimed to have been working on alien technology.

我的意思是，给我讲讲更多细节。

I mean, tell me more.

这简直让我震惊了。

This is blowing my mind.

我的意思是，好吧。

I mean okay.

首先，他说的是真的吗？

First thing, was he telling the truth?

我需要知道他有什么证据。

I need to know what evidence he had.

那牛呢？

And, what about the cow?

你该怎么解释这件事？

How do you explain that?

我后来发现，Area 51周围有很多农田，但我没看到其他牛。

I've since discovered that there was a lot of farmland around Area 51, but I didn't see any other cows.

所以我告诉我妻子，这就是外星人存在的证据。

So I told my wife that's proof of alien existence.

神秘的牛。

Mystery cows.

好吧。

Like okay.

嗯。

Yeah.

也许路上出现神秘的牛可以作为外星人的证据，但我总是认为，最简单的解释通常才是最好的。

Maybe mystery cows in the middle of the road could be evidence of a of aliens, but I always think that the simplest explanation is usually the better one.

如果附近有个农场，你可能会想，那头牛可能是从农场跑出来的。

And if there was a farm nearby, you know, you might think that cow might have come from the farm.

我只是这么说一下。

Just saying.

没错。

True.

但戴夫确实说他没看到其他牛，所以你永远说不准。

But Dave did say he didn't see any other cows, so you never know.

也许这真的和外星人有关。

Maybe maybe this does have something to do with aliens.

你知道的，我们每天都和戴夫一起工作，但有时候你并不太了解你的同事。

Well, you know, we work with Dave every day, but sometimes you don't know much about your colleagues.

所以，戴夫，你真的相信外星人吗？

So, Dave, do you actually believe in aliens?

我不信。

I didn't.

我不相信外星人。

I I don't believe in aliens.

我想要相信外星人，但在亲眼见到之前，我做不到。

I want to believe in aliens, but I until I see one, I can't.

但利蒂高速公路沿途到处都是贴纸，从你看到路牌的那一刻起，上面就贴满了UFO和外星人面孔的贴纸，你还会看到人们在路边留下小型模型，或是在山中用石头堆出大眼睛外星人的形状，又或是岩石上刻有UFO的轮廓，这些都暗示着你走对了路。

But, there's lots of Leeti Highway, from the moment you see the sign, it's covered in stickers of UFOs and alien faces, and you see people have left little models on the side of the road, or they'll make rock formations in the mountains of bug eyed aliens, or there'll be, the outlines of UFOs etched into rocks, you you get an indication that you're on you're on the right lines.

你正走在正确的路上。

You're going along the right road.

还有一封非常著名的邮箱，属于一个叫史蒂夫·梅德林的人，他拥有一家靠近51区的农场。

And there's a very famous mailbox belonging to a guy called Steve Medlin, and he owns a farm near Area 51.

它已经逐渐成为UFO爱好者的朝圣之地。

And it's kind of become a a mecca for UFO enthusiasts.

人们去那里，就是希望在那里能看到UFO。

They go they go there just to that is supposed to be the place that you will see the UFO.

我没看到。

I didn't.

我只看到邮箱上贴满了贴纸和涂鸦。

I just saw lots of stickers and scribbles on a mailbox.

好吧。

Okay.

所以是E。

So E.

T。

T.

戴夫提到的E高速公路，就是通往51区的路。

Highway, which Dave mentioned there, is the road to Area 51.

我想除了路上有一头牛躺着，还有邮箱上的贴纸之外，戴夫，你旅行中还看到其他什么特别的东西吗？

And I guess aside from a a cow lying in the middle of the road and some stickers on a mailbox, was there anything else that you saw on your trip, Dave?

还有什么能帮助我们解开这个谜团的线索吗？

Anything else which might help us solve this mystery?

我是不是听说那里有个叫小艾利旅馆的地方？

Am I right in thinking there's a there's a place people go to there called the Ailey Inn?

是的，有这么个地方。

There is.

它离格鲁姆湖路不远，小艾利旅馆是一家提供茶点、蛋糕的旅馆，墙上贴满了基地的照片、UFO和军用飞机的图片。

It's not far from the Groom Lake Road, and the Little Ailey Inn is an inn where you can get a cup of tea, cakes, look at alien merchandise and lots of pictures of the base on the wall and pictures of UFOs and military aircraft.

拉切尔这个小镇本质上是一个房车公园，专门为那些痴迷于UFO并希望靠近基地的人提供住宿。

And this little town of Rachel is a trailer park essentially for people that are obsessed with UFOs that want to be near the base.

事实上，基地的人经常去那里吃午饭，他们会受到像我这样的访客的盘问，但他们什么都不会告诉你。

In fact, people from the base often go there for lunch, and they get questioned by visitors like me, but they don't they don't tell you anything.

这太棒了。

This is great.

所以，抱歉，外星人。

So alien sorry.

所以戴夫是我们这里的外星人通讯员，他做了调查记者应该做的正确事情。

So Dave is our alien correspondent here, and he's done just the right kind of thing that an investigative reporter would do.

他去了那个叫小外星人的地方，听起来是个非常可爱的地方。

He's gone to the little alien, which sounds very lovely place to go.

你知道，如果有传言流传，你就该去那里，找那些从基地去吃午饭的人，他们或许会不小心透露些什么。

You know, if there's rumors flying about, that's where you want to go to to meet the people who go there for lunch from the base, and they might maybe let something slip.

那么，戴夫，你发现什么了吗？

So did you find anything out, Dave?

你觉得在51区发生着什么？

What do you think goes on there at Area 51?

据我所知，那是一个秘密军事基地，他们在测试一些不想让任何人看到的东西。

Well, from what I'm led to believe, there's well, it's a secret military base, so they're they're testing things they don't want anyone to see.

而且很多设施都在地下。

And a lot of it is underground.

我认为地下有一些很有趣的东西。

I think there's some I think there's some fun stuff underground.

我不认为那是外星科技。

I don't think it's alien tech.

我认为那是高度机密的军用飞机，但它们自带一种神秘氛围，使得这个地方非常令人兴奋，尽管正如我所说，你其实看不到什么，但这并不重要。

I think it's top secret military aircraft, but it's just got it's got this mythos and vibe about it that just is makes it a very exciting place even though, like I said, there's you don't really see anything, but that doesn't matter.

这可能是我去过的地方中最棒的一个，那种什么也看不到却充满兴奋感的体验。

It's probably one of the best places I've been to, the sheer excitement of seeing nothing.

所以戴夫不认为51区有外星科技，但如果你还记得，我们另一个悬而未决的线索人物——尼克·波普告诉我们，曾有个叫鲍勃·拉扎尔的人在51区工作，并声称见过外星科技。

So Dave doesn't think there's alien tech at Area 51, but if you remember, one of our other cliffhangers, our friend Nick Pope, told us that there was a man called Bob Lazar who worked at Area 51 and claimed to have seen alien technology.

是的。

Yes.

没错。

That's right.

所以，你知道，我支持戴夫的调查报道，也欣赏那种什么都没看到却依然充满兴奋的感觉，但这个人可是内部人士。

So, you know, I'm all for Dave's investigative re reporting and for, you know, the sheer excitement of seeing nothing, but this is actually a man on the inside.

这才是你该去的地方。

This is where you wanna go.

如果他真知道些什么，那么如果说有人知道的话，那肯定就是他了。

And so if he knows anything, then well, if anyone knows anything, he does.

可惜，这只是一个故事。

Well, sadly, it was just really a story.

从技术上讲，它尚未被证伪，但也没有被证实。

I suppose, technically, it it has not been disproven, but neither neither has it been proven.

目前，美国在 UFO 问题上正发生一些有趣的事情。

There are now some interesting things happening in The United States with regards to UFOs more generally.

例如，NASA现在实际上参与了美国政府对这一现象的更广泛研究。

So for example, NASA is now actually part of a wider US government study into this.

他们一直寻找外太空的生命，但从未真正关注可能造访我们的生命。

They always looked for life out there but never really for life that might be visiting us down here.

这种情况已经改变了。

That's changed.

国会还就UFO现象举行了听证会，一些举报人也站了出来，但要厘清事实与虚构之间的界限非常混乱。

There are also congressional hearings on on the ufo phenomenon and some other whistleblowers have come forward, but it's all very confusing trying to untangle fact from fiction.

我只是，嗯，处于一种冥想状态。

I was just, like, a a meditative.

是的。

Yeah.

你知道，我只是在想，这有点令人失望，可能吧。

You know, was just kinda thinking, that's that's somewhat disappointing, possibly.

是的。

Yeah.

那么，这是否意味着我们可以完全排除爱德华兹空军基地是隐藏外星技术的地方这一说法？

So does this mean that we can completely rule out the idea that Area 51 is a place where they're hiding alien technology?

我不知道关于爱德华兹空军基地藏有外星技术的传闻是真是假。

I don't know whether the rumors about alien technology at Area 51 are true or not.

但如果我们真的获得了外星技术，我想这正是我们会把它藏起来的地方。

But if we did ever acquire alien technology, I suppose that is exactly the sort of place that we would take it.

因为你想要弄清楚它是如何运作的，以及我们能否自己制造出类似的东西？

Because you would want to try and figure out how does this work, and can we build any of this ourselves?

而且你很可能希望秘密进行，以免对手抢先一步。

And you'd probably want to do that in secret to stop an adversary getting there first.

当然。

Absolutely.

所以我们不知道爱德华兹空军基地是否有外星技术，但假如政府真的拥有几艘宇宙飞船需要隐藏，他们会把它们藏在哪里呢？

So we don't know if there's alien technology at Area 51, but but if the government did have, you know, a few spaceships to hide, where would they put them?

显然，爱德华兹空军基地是藏匿它们的绝佳地点。

Well, obviously, Area 51 be a great place to stash them.