36. 第一印象和最后印象，哪个更重要？

我可以坦白告诉你，你的屁股宽得像一英里。嘿，我是安吉拉·达克沃斯。

I can be honest and tell you that your butt is a mile wide. Hey. I'm Angela Duckworth.

我是史蒂芬·杜伯纳。

I'm Steven Dubner.

你正在收听的是《没有愚蠢的问题》。

And you're listening to no stupid questions.

今天节目探讨：第一印象和最后印象哪个更重要？嘿。

Today on the show, are first impressions or last impressions more important? Hey.

最近怎么样呀，笑脸符号？然后对方回复：邮件写得不错。另外，

How are you doing, smiley face? And then the person is like, good email. Also,

智慧从何而来？

where does wisdom come from?

随着年纪增长——可能完全是错觉——但我觉得自己变睿智了。安吉拉，有位听众提出了这个问题，我特别感兴趣是因为它涉及我最喜欢的一项关于结肠镜检查的研究。说真的，谁会不爱结肠镜研究呢？

As I get older, maybe total delusion, but I feel like I'm getting wiser. Angela, the following question came from a listener, and one reason I'm so interested is that it involves one of my favorite ever pieces of research, which has to do with colonoscopies. I mean, who does not love colonoscopy research?

我马上要做这个检查了，别吓我。

I'm about to have one, so don't scare me.

感谢分享

Thanks for sharing

这个。我50岁了，这个年龄就该做一次检查。

that. I'm 50. You're supposed to have one when you're 50.

是的。我们感谢你的警觉性。

Yep. And we appreciate your vigilance.

嗯。

Mhmm.

总之，这封邮件来自一位名叫萨姆·科恩的听众，他恰好是一名护理专业的学生，他想知道：第一印象和最后印象哪个更具影响力？

So, anyway, this email is from a listener named Sam Cohen who happens to be a nursing student, and he wants to know this. Are first impressions or last impressions more impactful?

这问题太棒了。好吧，你是在想结肠镜检查的研究。说实话，关于结肠镜检查的研究其实只有一项。

What a great question. Alright. You're thinking about the colonoscopy study. I mean, honestly, there's only one colonoscopy study.

医学文献中有许多关于结肠镜检查的研究，但据我所知，心理学文献中只有一项。

Well, there are many colonoscopy studies in the medical literature, but only one in the psychology literature that I'm aware of.

没错。就是社会科学家会知道并关心的那项著名研究——丹尼·卡尼曼及其同事关于峰值与终点的研究。

Exactly. That social scientists would know about and care about, and that's the famous Danny Kahneman and colleagues study about peak and end.

峰值终点理论。对。你能给我们讲讲峰值终点理论，以及结肠镜检查如何阐释这一理论吗？

The peak end theory. Yeah. So can you tell us about the peak end theory and how colonoscopy works to illustrate that?

丹尼·卡尼曼和他的同事们做了一项研究，研究中每个人都接受了结肠镜检查。参与者是随机分配的。

So Danny Kahneman and his colleagues did a study where everybody in the study is getting a colonoscopy. You are randomly assigned.

这些是本来就要做结肠镜检查的人。

These are people who are already going to be getting colonoscopies.

是的。我们认为这是与医生合作的项目。

Yes. We think it was a collaboration with physicians.

要是有些我们能报名参加的实验，做完就能做个结肠镜检查就好了。

If only there were experiments that we could sign up for for which we get a colonoscopy.

你被分配到了结肠镜检查组。

You've been assigned to the colonoscopy condition.

先生，我宁愿选择化疗。

I would prefer the chemotherapy, please, sir.

是啊。我更倾向于高脂饮食组。总之，这项研究随机将已预约结肠镜检查的患者分为两组：一组按常规进行结肠镜检查——据文章所述和我了解的情况，由于整个过程的机械操作，这本身就是相当不愉快的体验；另一组实验组则需要在体内多留置一会儿探查设备，比常规时间稍长。

Yeah. I'm gonna prefer the high fat diet one. And so, anyways, this study randomly signs patients who are already signed up for colonoscopy to either get colonoscopy as usual, which I am told, and as they say in the article, is a pretty unpleasant experience because of the mechanics of the whole thing. And the experimental condition is where the exploratory equipment that they have to put into you is held there for a little longer than would necessarily be the case.

你的直觉可能会说，哦，那是实验的糟糕版本。

And your instinct might say, oh, that's the bad version of the experiment.

没错。因为你会承受更多疼痛。但这个实验的巧妙之处在于，虽然确实更痛，但由于结肠镜前端只是静止在直肠内，这种疼痛程度比结肠镜检查时器械移动带来的痛感要温和得多。

Right. Because you get more pain. But what was so clever about this experiment is that, yeah, it's more pain. But because you're just having the tip of the colonoscope to sitting there in the rectum, it's a more moderate level of pain than when it's moving around during the colonoscopy itself.

我想他们可能会将其描述为轻微不适与较强不适的对比。

I think they would probably just call it a mild discomfort compared to a greater discomfort.

是啊。我是说，我实在无法想象结肠镜前端就那么杵在里面的感觉。

Yeah. I mean, I can't imagine what it's like to have the tip of a colonoscope just sitting there.

好吧，一两周后你回来给我们详细说说。

Well, you'll come back in a week or two and give us the details.

这个发现之所以有趣，是因为经历了带有额外中度疼痛的延长手术的患者，实际上对整体体验的不适评分更低。其重要性在于当时卡尼曼正在发展一个关于记忆自我与体验自我的理论——他说体验自我只是逐刻感受：我有多快乐？我有多悲伤？

So the reason why this is interesting is that patients who underwent the extended procedure with the additional moderate level of pain actually rated the overall experience as less unpleasant. And the reason why this was so important is that Kahneman was at the time developing a theory where there is the remembering self and the experiencing self. And he says the experiencing self is just experiencing moment by moment. How happy am I? How sad am I?

我有多焦虑？我有多饿？但记忆自我正在整合这一切，并将其压缩成一个记忆。他提出一个理论，当记忆自我处理信息并将一连串时刻压缩成一个印象时，有两件事会占据额外权重：一是体验的峰值，即高潮和低谷；二是结束点。

How anxious am I? How hungry am I? But the remembering self is consolidating all of that and collapsing it into a memory. And he had the theory that when the remembering self processes information and collapses a whole string of moments into one impression, two things are going to take additional weight. One is the peak of the experience, so the high and the low points, and the other is the end points.

因此这项著名研究证实了一个假设：当我们评估整体体验时，结束阶段会占据不成比例的权重。既然知道了结肠镜检查的研究结果，如果有机会向医生提要求，我会请求什么？

And so this famous study affirmed the hypothesis that the end of an experience takes disproportionate weight when we evaluate the overall experience. Now knowing the colonoscopy study, what will I ask for if I had the chance to ask my doctor?

你会说：请给我做卡尼曼式结肠镜检查。

You say, give me the Kahneman colonoscopy, please.

没错。卡尼曼特制版。有趣的是，尽管这个发现很可靠，但我不想承受额外的痛苦。

Exactly. The Kahneman special. So what's interesting is that even though this finding is a sturdy finding, I don't want the extra pain.

不过，既然你没有结肠镜检查的经验，我们得看看经历之后你是否会改变主意。但假设我们想脱离结肠镜检查的范畴——我认为应该如此——把话题拉回山姆询问的第一印象或最后印象。想象一次家庭度假。

Although, since you're inexperienced in colonoscopies, we'll have to see if maybe you'll change your mind after you have them. But let's say that we wanna take it out of the realm of the colonoscopy, which I think we probably should. And let's say we wanna steer this back toward what Sam is asking about the first impression or the last impression. Imagine a family vacation.

好的。

Okay.

假设你是有孩子和配偶的家长，去度家庭假期，你更倾向于哪种选择：美好的开始还是美好的结束？为什么？

Let's say you are a parent with kids and a spouse or whatnot, and you go on a family holiday, what would you rather have of the two? A great beginning or a great ending, and why?

天啊。我想我会选择美好的结束，因为我确实认为峰终效应是成立的。所以尽管我对结肠镜检查心存矛盾，但如果假期是四天，我宁愿第一天糟糕而第四天美妙，而非相反。

So oh gosh. I think I would like to have a great ending because I do think the peak end effect does hold true. So regardless of my ambivalence and my colonoscopy, if the vacation were, say, four days, I would rather have a terrible first day and a wonderful fourth day than the opposite.

这很合理，正如你描述的，持久留存的是记忆。所以你自然希望那是积极的回忆。

That makes sense because as you were describing, the lasting thing is the memory. So, of course, you want that to be the positive one.

是的。整个记忆会被最后时刻渲染，而不是中间点什么的。

Yeah. The whole memory is gonna be colored by the last moments more than, like, the midpoint or something.

我必须说，自从多年前读过那篇论文并采访过合著者之一唐纳德·雷德尔迈尔后，我就一直在生活中、与家人的交谈以及与陌生人的偶遇中运用峰终理论。每当好事发生时，我就会立即停下。

I have to say, ever since I read that paper years ago and interviewed Donald Redelmeyer, one of the coauthors about it, I have tried to apply the peak end theory all the time in my life in interviews with my family and random encounters with strangers. The minute something good happens, I just stop.

所以你就直接离开？是的。了解到这个理论后，首先让我想到生活中许多似乎利用峰终理论的仪式。比如甜点——为什么我们最后才吃甜点？

So you just leave? Yeah. When I learned about this, it made me think, first of all, of so many rituals that are part of our lives that seem to capitalize on the peak end theory. So dessert. Why do we eat dessert last?

为什么不一开始就吃？还有，我不知道你最近做多少瑜伽。

Why don't we eat it first? And I don't know how much yoga you're doing these days.

非常多。

So much.

好的。那么摊尸式（Savasana），你知道最后那个尸体姿势吧？当然。坐在那里完全放松感觉太棒了。我认为每节瑜伽课以摊尸式结束是有道理的。

Okay. So Savasana, do you know this corpse pose at the end? Of course. It feels so good to be sitting there and completely relaxing. And there's a reason I think that every yoga practice ends with Savasana.

所以下次你犹豫要不要练瑜伽时，至少记忆会被这个体验染色。

So the next time you think, do I wanna do yoga? Your memory is at least colored by that.

但让我们挑战这个观点。我觉得你已经成功说服了大家——最后印象确实强大。不过我们来聊聊第一印象，这方面可是有成堆的陈词滥调。

But let's challenge this notion. So I think you've done a pretty good job persuading everybody. The last impressions are really powerful. But let's talk about first impressions. I mean, there's this whole mountain of cliches about that.

对吧？比如『第一印象没有第二次机会』之类的。回到那个度假例子：如果你和家人抵达四天度假地时第一印象极差，这难道不会定下难以扭转的基调，使得任何最终印象都无法挽救整体体验吗？

Right? You never get a second chance to make a first impression and so on. And let's go back to that vacation. If you show up with your family to this place where you're vacationing for four days and your first impression is terrible, doesn't that set a tone that will be impossible to recover from and from which no final impression is possible to save the experience?

没错。强调最后印象具有不成比例的权重，并不代表第一印象出于不同原因就不重要。第一印象可能比体验中点或其他时刻更具分量。一个原因是第一印象具有路径依赖性——假设四天假期第一天就很糟糕。

Yeah. To argue that last impressions take on disproportionate weight does not say that first impressions don't matter disproportionately also for different reasons. First impressions can carry more weight than the midpoint or some other point in experience. So one reason is that a first impression has this kind of path dependency. So say you have a really bad first day of that four day vacation.

现在所有人情绪低落，第二天你们开始争吵。接着因为第二天的争吵，即使第三天阳光明媚也彻底变成灾难。就像起步没走好，之后一切都每况愈下。

Everybody's now in a sour mood. Now you're all fighting on day two. And then because you were fighting on day two, day three is a total catastrophe even though the sun comes out. You get off on the wrong foot as it were, and then everything kind of goes downhill from there.

你知道，当我最初读到Sam提出的这个问题——第一印象和最后印象哪个更具影响力时，我的第一反应是像我们现在这样试图解答它。但更深层的第二反应是，作为一个写作者的视角来看待这个问题，即两者都重要。我认为在我所有创作中，无论是书籍、文章、播客脚本还是其他，我投入在开头和结尾的精力可能是其他部分的3到10倍。因为多年写作经验源于我作为读者的体会：开头极其重要，结尾也极其重要。

You know, when I first read this question from Sam, are first impressions or last impressions more impactful? My initial impulse was to try to answer it like we're trying to do now, but my my second impulse and the deeper one was to view it as I do as a writer, which is to say, well, both. I think for everything I've ever written, whether it's a book, an article, podcast script, whatever, I'd probably spend three to 10 times more effort on the beginning and the end than on anything else. Because my experience as a writer was informed years and years and years ago by my experience as a reader, which is that the beginning really, really matters. The ending really, really matters.

还有一种观点散见于各处——我不确定源自《塔木德》还是莎士比亚——优秀的开头若写得巧妙，会蕴含些许结局的意味。所以我怀疑Sam是否在寻求非此即彼的答案，而事实上答案应该是兼而有之的。

And there's also a notion expressed in various places. I don't know where I got it from. Maybe the Talmud or Shakespeare that the best beginnings have a little bit of the end in them if the writing is good. So I do wonder if maybe Sam is pursuing an either or choice when the answer, in fact, should be an and answer.

'两者兼得'往往是人生多选题的标准答案。这个问题的设定方式，就像我们遇见某人、翻开书、开始阅读文章、收听播客或观看电影时——只要回想这些经历就会清晰意识到，最初时刻确实至关重要，因为人们会迅速形成判断。Nalini和Body等人关于'薄片分析'的研究（或许你们在《魔鬼经济学》里讨论过）就印证了这点。

Both and is usually the answer to check off and the great multiple choice of life. The way that this question was framed, it's like when we are meeting another person or when you open a book or you start an article or you start listening to a podcast or watching a movie, it's so clear to us when we just think about those experiences how the very beginning it does matter a lot because you are very quickly coming to judgments. And there was this research on thin slicing by, among others, Nalini and Body. Maybe you did a Freakonomics episode on this.

没有。但我在马尔科姆·格拉德威尔的《眨眼之间》里读到过薄片分析理论。

No. But I read about thin slicing in one of Malcolm Gladwell's books, Blink.

对。这个理论认为人们能在瞬间形成非常快速的印象，甚至未必能用语言表述，只是毫秒间产生的直觉好恶，而这些快速判断可以预测后续更深思熟虑的评价。

Yeah. This is the idea that you can come to very quick impressions, and they're not even necessarily verbally articulated ones, but just gut feelings of, like, good or bad in milliseconds, and that these very quick impressions can be predictive of later judgments that are much more deliberative and so forth.

这正支持了第一印象的重要性——因为对于电影、书籍或人而言，如果第一印象不佳，可能根本不会有最终印象，或者最终印象就紧接在第一印象之后形成。

That's an argument in favor of a strong first impression because in some cases, like with a movie or a book or a person, if the first impression is not a good one, there will be no opportunity for a final impression or the final impression will be one second after the first impression.

没错。希望这种情况少发生在人际交往，多出现在Netflix选择上。想象一个求职面试，若你对候选人的第一印象是积极的，丹尼尔·卡尼曼会提醒我们：确认偏误即将生效。在接下来58分钟的面试里，你只会不断验证自己最初的正面印象。

Right. Hopefully, less with people and more with, like, Netflix. So imagine there's a job interview, and your first impression of a candidate is a positive one. Well, Danny Kahneman would remind us that then confirmation bias is gonna kick in. And then for the last fifty eight minutes of the hour long interview, you're just going to be confirming your own positive impression.

所以判断存在路径依赖，不仅是人生事件的路径依赖。

And so there's a path dependency in judgment and not just a path dependency in life events.

我想到支持第一印象更重要的另一个论据：根据认知漂移理论，如果我们的注意力未被持续吸引——无论是登录的网站、互动的人还是阅读的文章——一旦认知稍有偏离（可能永远无法挽回），其负面价值远大于中段或结尾时的注意力分散，因为你可能根本坚持不到后面。这场讨论恰恰说明这个问题（或许大多数问题）具有极强的领域特异性。

The other argument I could see in favor of stronger first impression is because the way cognitive drift works, if our attention is not kept and captured, whether it's a website that I log in to, a person that I'm engaging with, an article I'm reading, and my cognition drifts a little bit, perhaps never to be recaptured, the negative value of that is much greater, I would argue, than it is toward the middle or end, again, because you may not get there. So I think this conversation is illustrating how incredibly domain specific this question and probably most questions are.

确实。虽然存在领域差异，但我们也在指出跨越不同领域的普遍趋势——首尾印象都至关重要。

Yeah. It might be domain specific, but we're also pointing to some seemingly universal trends here across these different domains. First and last impressions matter a lot.

确实。但如果是一个人，尤其是你想或需要与之保持长期关系的人，比如你在工作中遇到的新同事、社交圈里的某人或姻亲，这将是一段持续的关系，但第一印象却糟糕透顶。相比你非常想读却第一章就让人失望的书，从糟糕第一印象中恢复的机会似乎要大得多。

Yeah. But if a person, especially someone that you want or need to have an ongoing relationship with, let's say you meet a new person at work or someone in your social circle or an in law, and this is going to be a relationship, but it's a terrible first impression, The opportunity to recover from that seems much greater than the opportunity to recover from a book that you really wanted to read, and the first chapter was terrible.

然后你再也没碰过那本书。对，我觉得这个观点很准确。顺便说，第一印象还会引发另一种现象——光环效应。如果因为你风趣幽默而对你产生良好第一印象，我可能还会下意识认为你逻辑缜密且工作努力。

And you never go back to it. Yeah. I think that's right. And there's another thing that happens with first impressions, by the way, the halo effect. If I have a positive first impression of you because you're witty, then I might also assume that you are logical and hardworking.

这些都是'哦这人可能很优秀'的衍生效应。再次引用伟大的丹尼·卡尼曼或至少转述他的观点：我们极度渴望认知连贯性，想要快速对他人或情境做出符合内在逻辑的判断。所以如果我认定'史蒂文是好人'，那么所有正面特质都会在我对你的认知拼图中自动归位。这些现象在招聘面试或择偶等长期关系选择时都值得警惕。

These are all spillover effects of, oh, this person's probably great. And, again, to quote the great Danny Kahneman or to at least paraphrase him, we have this very strong need for coherence that we wanna come to an evaluation of another person or a situation quickly that makes a lot of internal logical sense. So if I think, Steven, good, then all of the, like, other attributes that are good would all start to make sense in my little picture of you. All these are things to be mindful of. If, for example, one is interviewing candidates to hire or dating someone for a long term relationship.

我儿子所罗门五六岁时，养成了追问人物评价的习惯。他常问运动员，有时是历史人物，读到某个人就会问：'是好人吗？'他只要定性判断。比如'乔治·华盛顿？好人吗？'

When my son, Solomon, was about five or six, he got into this habit of asking about people. Often, were athletes, sometimes figures from history, but he would read about somebody and say, good guy? He just wanted the judgment. Like, George Washington. Good guy?

'O·J·辛普森？好人吗？'然后你得解释'他曾是伟大橄榄球员，后来发生了那些事'。但他坚持要把人分门别类，这种需求恰似光环效应的心理机制。

OJ Simpson. Good guy? And it's like, well, he was a great football player, then this other stuff happened. But he wanted to put people in one basket or the other. It was like an appetite for what the halo effect does.

我知道有个光环效应失灵的典型案例——连环杀手泰德·邦迪

I know one example of the halo effect gone wrong is Ted Bundy, the serial killer

等等。没错。继续。

Wait. Yes. Go on.

他看起来如此正常且英俊，以至于受害者和长期接触者都难以将表象与罪行联系起来。他创造了完美的第一印象，而最终印象却截然相反。

Who was so normal seeming and good looking that his victims and even the people that he was with for a long time had a really hard time putting together the reality of it. He made great first impressions, and the last impressions were quite the opposite.

就像魔术戏法。视线被引导向某处时，后裤袋的钱包正被扒走。顺便说，不止所罗门这样。你知道我和心理学家詹姆斯·格罗斯合作很多，我们理论中有个观点是：无论处于何种情境，我们都会对关注的事物立即形成评价——往往无需太多意识参与。

It's like a magic trick. Your eye goes one way, and then your back pocket is being pickpocketed. By the way, it's not just Solomon. I do a lot of work, as you know, with this psychologist James Gross. And one part of our theory is that whatever situation we're in and whatever we pay attention to, immediately and without a lot of conscious awareness, we come to evaluations.

这是好是坏？尤其对我而言是好是坏？每次打开邮件时，我本能就会判断'这是好消息还是坏消息'？说实话，意识到这点后，我写邮件时都尽量确保从开头就传递积极情绪，比如'嘿'这样的开场。

Is this good or is this bad? And in particular, is this good for me? You know, every time I open an email, it's just like, is this a good email or is this a bad email? Is this gonna be a good news or bad news? Honestly, mindful of that when I write emails, I try to make sure that the valence is positive right from the go, like, hey.

你最近怎么样？笑脸符号。然后对方回复说，邮件写得不错。接着邮件正文可以继续展开。

How are you doing? Smiley face. And then the person is like, good email. And then the rest of the email can follow.

但你不觉得需要高潮结尾吗？在你告知要解雇他们之类的事情后，难道不需要在结尾也放个笑脸符号版本吗？

But don't you need the peak end? Don't you need the version of the smiley face at the end after you've told them that you're firing them or whatnot?

对，对，没错。就像我在烧毁村庄时那样。我确实也尽量用笑脸和积极语气来结尾。

Yeah. Yeah. That's right. That I'm burning the village. I do try to end with smiley faces and positive also.

所以是的，两者兼顾。

So, yes, both and.

关于第一印象和最后印象的讨论，让我联想到我们此刻谈论的出生与死亡。某种程度上，世界见证你的到来——那是第一印象。世界会想：嘿，这位看起来充满活力、乐观又精力充沛。

The discussion of first and last impressions reminds me a little bit as we're speaking now of birth and death. In a way, the world sees you coming in. That's the first impression. And the world thinks, hey. This one looks pretty lively and optimistic and energetic.

而当你离开时，世界又会想：多么不知感恩的人啊，明明度过了八十一年美好时光，为何如此郁郁寡欢？你觉得世界会这样评判我们吗？

And then on the way out, the world is like, what an ingrate. They had eighty one good years. Why are they so morose? Do you think the world judges us like that?

你知道，我父亲去世时，最后篇章实在太过漫长。整整六年日复一日的身体煎熬，智力严重衰退，几乎全身瘫痪。我当时就在想，如果认真看待峰终定律，这似乎不是构建人生的最佳方式——生命最后六年竟充斥着痛苦与困惑。我知道医生兼作家阿图·葛文德对此思考良多。

You know, when my father died, it was really a very long last chapter. Six years of just daily suffering physically, and he's very intellectually compromised, mostly paralyzed. And I was thinking, if you take Peak End seriously, it doesn't seem like the best way to architect a human life. The very last six years are gonna be mostly moments of pain and confusion. I know Atul Gawande, the physician and writer, has thought a lot about this.

我们必须找到方法，在理解人类判断与体验的这个特性后，能更明智地分配时间。特别是如你所说，如何思考人生的漫长故事，以及我们希望最后篇章成为什么模样。

There has to be a way that understanding this feature of human judgment and experience that we might be able to be a little wiser in how we allocate time. And in particular, like you say, how to think about the long story of life and what we want the last chapters to be.

几个月前我们在这档节目里讨论过，为何不为活着的人致悼词？为何不在生前就庆祝生命？虽然这并非我们的原创观点，但我很高兴分享：有位朋友的朋友来信说，他父亲近期离世前，家人预知死亡将至，他们真的这样做了。在Zoom时代这更容易实现，世界各地认识逝者的人都能连线，共同重温珍贵回忆——这简直是峰终理论的终极实践。所以我认为，即便你是离场者而他人留在原地，领悟终局的力量也极具意义。

You and I had a conversation on this show months ago about why we don't have eulogies for the living, why we don't celebrate the lives of people before they die. And it's not like we invented this idea, but I I'm really happy to report that a friend of a friend wrote to say that his father recently died, and it was known that the death was coming. And that they actually did this, and in the age of Zoom, it was easier to do because everybody from around the world who knew this person could be on the line with him, and they were all able to relive their favorite memories together. It was the ultimate in peak end theory. And so I think there's really a lot to be said for appreciating how powerful the end is even if you are exiting at the end and others are being left behind.

是啊。我参加过一场Zoom上的70岁生日会，当时主持人说「想发言的人可以开始了」。我记得自己心里想着：我不想说话，不想取消静音。但内心有个声音说：如果此刻不说，更待何时？

Yeah. I went to a 70 Zoom birthday party, and there was this time where they said, oh, if you wanna say anything, go ahead. And I remember thinking to myself, I don't wanna say anything. I don't wanna unmute. And then something inside of me said, well, if not now, then when?

毕竟这是70岁生日派对。所以我畅所欲言后感觉特别好。再次希望未来还有更多生日，但我觉得这是我们可以付诸实践的一点心理智慧。如果结局重要，那么每当我们想到可能接近终点时，都应该让那一刻变得美好。

It is a 70 birthday party after all. So I said my piece, and I felt so good that I had. And, again, hopefully, there'll be many more birthdays, but I think that this is a little bit of psychological wisdom that we could actually put into practice. And if the ends matter, then anytime that we're even thinking that's possibly close to the end, We should make it a good moment.

那么根据我们在这里学到的内容，结合Sam的问题，你认为结束节目的恰当方式是什么？

So based on what we've learned here, based on Sam's question, what would you say is an appropriate way to end the show?

天啊。你说过每个好的开始都带有一点终结的意味，而作为作家，我一直认为每个好的结局都带有一点开始的意味。

Oh my goodness. Well, you said that every good beginning has a little bit of the end in it, and I've always thought as a writer that every good ending has a little bit of the beginning in it.

所以你是说我们应该再聊聊结肠镜检查，Blaine Lee。

So you're saying we should talk some more about colonoscopies, Blaine Lee.

《无蠢问题》后续内容中，Steven和Angela将探讨智慧是否与年龄存在关联

Still to come on no stupid questions, Steven and Angela discuss whether wisdom has any correlation

人类能像蜕皮一样摆脱我们这些老细胞是件好事。Steven，我们收到听众Yvonne的邮件。如果你不介意，我来读一下。

with age. It's a good thing that humanity sloughs off the old cells like us. Steven, we got an email from a listener named Yvonne. And if it's okay with you, I'm gonna read it.

有请Yvonne。

Bring on Yvonne.

好的。大家好。我最近在听一个叫《死亡医生》的播客。其中关于处理医疗失误的集数里，受访者说：‘我们经常混淆聪明与智慧’。她将智慧定义为不仅知道该做什么，还知道怎么做以及是否该做。

Okay. Hi, all. I've been listening to a podcast called doctor death. And in an episode on dealing with medical errors, the interviewee said, quote, we often confuse being smart and being wise. And she defines being wise as not only knowing what to do, but how to do it and whether to do it.

我在科研中也发现类似问题。有些学生书本知识很渊博，却想不出好实验方案，缺乏成为研究者的那种特质。所以我想知道，智慧是可以教授的吗？还是只能通过经验获得？这是个很棒的问题。我自己也经常思考这个问题，但想听听你们的看法。

I found similar issues in science research. I have very book smart students who can't think of good experiments and don't have that thing that makes you a researcher. So I'm wondering, is there a way to teach wisdom, or is it only something that comes with experience? This is a great question. I think about this question a lot myself, but I wonder what your thoughts are on it.

嗯，我明白你为什么来找我了，毕竟我是各种智慧的源泉嘛。

Well, I see why you brought it to me since I'm such a font of wisdom of all sorts.

你确实如此。

So you are.

从邮件中我了解到，伊冯娜本身是位研究者，她带着这些学生，试图教会他们区分有价值与无价值的研究项目。但有趣的是，这个问题呼应了我们不久前关于弗林效应和全球智商提升的讨论——更高的智商是否意味着更多智慧、更高情商，或许还有更多同理心。在我看来，伊冯娜谈论的内容更接近创造力而非智慧，不过或许我们该先定义什么是智慧。

And it sounds I gather from the email that Yvonne is a researcher herself, and she's got these students. She's trying to teach them what's the difference between a worthwhile research project and not. But it's interesting. This question echoes a conversation you and I had not long ago about the Flynn effect and the global rise of IQ and whether higher IQ translates into more wisdom and more emotional intelligence, more compassion perhaps. So to me, it sounds like Yvonne is actually talking about something closer to creativity than to wisdom, but maybe we should start with a definition what wisdom is.

智慧这个词可以有多种定义方式。史蒂文，你如何定义它？

Wisdom is a word that people can define in many different ways. How would you like to define it, Steven?

邮件里她似乎提到，智慧不仅是知道该做什么，还包括如何做以及是否该做。这里有个更正式的定义来自《牛津英语词典》：具备或运用健全的判断力和洞察力。这与伊冯娜的说法很接近。能够真实判断何为正确或恰当，以良好的判断力和审慎为特征，与愚蠢相对。

Well, in the email, it sounded like she said it was not only knowing what to do, but how to do it and whether to do it. Here's a much more formal definition from the OED, having or exercising sound judgment or discernment. That's actually pretty similar to what Yvonne said. Capable of judging truly concerning what is right or fitting. Characterized by good sense and prudence opposed to foolish.

再次强调，这并不令人意外。坦白说，自古就有大量关于智慧的建议，但我觉得它们往往过于阳春白雪——既显得显而易见又难以企及。我真正用过的智慧箴言都更具可操作性。比如我最喜欢的一条出自犹太典籍《先贤伦理》，其中引述多位拉比层层转述的智慧：

So again, nothing very surprising. I'll be honest with you, There is this whole universe of wisdom advice, obviously, since the beginning of time, and I usually find it a little bit too high brow for my taste because it all sounds both obvious and unattainable at the same time. So the pieces of advice about wisdom that I have made use of are more actionable. For instance, one of my favorite wisdom sayings comes from, the Jewish text sometimes translated as ethics of the sages, and it basically cites a bunch of old rabbis talking about what other old rabbis said about what some other old rabbi said.

这确实是拉比的专长。请继续。

Seems to be what rabbis do. Yes. Go on.

确实是老少拉比都热衷的活动。比如这段中，拉比本佐玛问道：何为智者？答案是向所有人学习的人，正如《诗篇》所言'我从所有师长处获得智慧'。换言之，世间无人无处不可汲取智慧。

It is a favorite activity of rabbis, young and old. So for instance, from this one passage, Benzoma, that was the rabbi. Benzoma would say, who is wise? The answer, one who learns from every person as is stated in Psalms, from all my teachers have I grown wise. In other words, there is no one from whom nowhere from which you cannot gather wisdom.

有趣的是，《诗篇》据传由包括大卫在内的十位长者所著——这位父亲要不要玩个圣经育儿问答？

Now interestingly, Psalms was supposedly written by 10 elders, including David, who was the father of wanna play biblical parenting quiz?

天啊，我完全不知道。

Oh my god. I have no idea.

既然谈论智慧，谁是最智者呢？

Well, we're talking about wisdom. Who's the wisest of all?

我不知道，斯蒂芬。

I don't know, Stephen.

我恰好有个同名的儿子。

I happen to have a son by the same name.

现在我感觉更糟了，因为我记不起你儿子的名字，显得我很无知。

Now I feel even worse because I can't remember the name of your son, and I'm ignorant.

话说有位叫所罗门的王，是大卫的儿子。

So there's a king named Solomon who was the son of David.

好的。谢谢你，所罗门。

Okay. Thank you, Solomon.

所以当我们想到智慧，你知道的，所罗门的智慧。

So when we think of wisdom, you know, the wisdom of Solomon.

哦，对。那个婴儿的故事。

Oh, yes. The baby story.

没错。给不了解的人讲讲：有两个妇人，各有一个婴儿，其中一个婴儿死了，另一个妇人指控对方偷走了活婴。于是两个妇人，一个活婴一个死婴，来到所罗门王面前。

Yeah. So for people who don't know the baby story, there were these two women, each had a baby, and one of them died, and the other accused the one of stealing the live baby. And so there were two women, one live baby, one dead baby, and they came before king Solomon.

她当时是这么说的。

She said she said as it were.

智者所罗门王就说：好办，把孩子劈成两半就行了。顺便说，我儿子确实叫所罗门。

And king Solomon, the wise, said, okay. It's an easy solution. We'll cut the baby in two. No problem. And by the way, like I said, my son is named Solomon.

我们过去常开玩笑说，他与圣经中同名人物有个共同点——当他的妹妹出生时，他也曾表示想把婴儿撕成两半

We used to joke that he had this in common with his biblical name in that when his younger sister was born, he too expressed the desire to tear a baby into two

把婴儿劈成两半。

To cut the baby in half.

其实这不是真的。他对妹妹相当友善。但不管怎样，所罗门王说，我们把孩子切成两半吧，这样就能解决问题。而那位发出最痛苦哀嚎、喊着不要的女人——

That's actually not true. He was quite kind to her. But, anyway, king Solomon said, we'll cut the baby in two. That'll solve the problem. And the woman who cried out with the greatest pain and distress and said, no.

“不，别这么做。”所罗门就说：“啊，这才是真正的母亲。把孩子给她吧。”这就是他获得智慧名声的由来。

No. Don't do it. Solomon said, ah, that's the mother. Give her the baby. So that's how he got a reputation for being wise.

但有趣的是，根据圣经记载，所罗门之所以拥有如此智慧，是因为上帝问他想要什么。他没有选择宏伟的圣殿或玛莎拉蒂这类浮华之物，而是祈求智慧。上帝对此深感欣慰，便将世间所有智慧赐予了他。历史上流传着诸多智慧典范，但我认为人们对如何真正获取智慧的理解仍非常粗浅。在大众文化中，我们被灌输的似乎只有：年长者睿智，年轻人愚笨。

But interestingly, the reason that Solomon has such wisdom as the Bible tells it is because God asked him what he wanted. And rather than saying big flashy things like temples and Maseratis, He said he wanted wisdom, and God was so impressed with that that he gave him all the wisdom there was. So we have these wisdom models throughout history, but I think that I have a very rudimentary understanding of how one is actually meant to acquire wisdom. I think in the popular culture, all we really are told is that older people get wise, and young people are stupid.

正如谚语所说：老而睿智，少而轻狂。

Old and wise, young and foolish as the expression goes.

是否有任何实证研究表明年龄与智慧水平确实存在关联？

Is there any empirical evidence that says that age is actually connected in any way to the level of wisdom?

我加入了一个邮件列表服务——这说法听起来就很有九十年代的味道。

So I'm on this listserv that feels like a very nineteen nineties expression.

确实如此。

Sure does.

总之，这个列表主要讨论道德心理学。由于我并非专业道德心理学家，大多时候只是旁听。但伊戈尔·格罗斯曼参与了讨论，他是位道德心理学家。有人问他：我们会随着年龄增长变得更智慧吗？关于年龄驱动智慧的因果关系，有什么证据？

But, anyway, it's all about moral psychology. And mostly, I'm just listening because I'm really not a moral psychologist by training. But Igor Grossman is on this thread, and he is a moral psychologist. And he was asked by somebody else on this thread, do we get older and wiser? What's the evidence about the causality of age driving wisdom?

伊戈尔说过，关于年龄与智慧之间并无确凿证据，因为几乎所有严谨研究都是横向对比的。他还补充说，这些不同研究的证据和方法论五花八门。我觉得这挺有意思，因为伊戈尔可能是研究年龄与智慧最著名的学者。他承认就连自己掌握的也是横向数据。所以当你看到快照中65岁群体在智慧量表上得分高于25岁群体时，你根本无法判断这是年龄使然，还是出生年代差异所致，亦或是65岁与25岁人群在问卷应答方式上的不同。

And Igor said there is zero conclusive evidence about age and wisdom because virtually all of the robust studies are cross sectional. And he added that the evidence and the methodology of these different studies, they're all over the place. Now I found this kind of interesting because Igor is probably the most prominent person who has done research on age and wisdom. He's just acknowledging that even the evidence that he has is cross sectional. And so when you see in a snapshot that the 65 year olds are coming out higher on a wisdom scale than the 25 year olds, you don't really know whether age was causing that or whether it was being born in a different decade or maybe the kind of response that a 65 year old would give on a questionnaire versus a 25 year old.

但我认为智慧至少会随经验增长。人们认为智慧不同于智力的原因在于，智慧关乎在需要权衡取舍、无法通过逻辑推理得出明确答案的复杂人生抉择中做出判断。在我看来，在其他条件相同的情况下，人生阅历越丰富，应对这类艰难抉择的能力理应越强。

But I think wisdom does grow with experience at least. The reason why people think about wisdom as being different from intelligence is that wisdom is about being able to make very complex life choices where there are trade offs and that there's not an obvious answer that can be arrived at through logic and reason. And it would just seem to me like the more life experience you have, the better you would be, all things being equal, about making those difficult life choices.

这正是我一贯的认知，也合乎情理。不过我得说，如果那些本该累积成智慧的人生经验，实际上教会你的是错误认知呢？

That is exactly what I've always told myself and what makes sense. Although I have to say, what if your experience that is supposed to accumulate into wisdom is actually teaching you the wrong lessons?

你可能随着年岁增长反而越来越愚蠢。

You could grow more and more foolish with age and experience.

完全可能。或者视野变得越来越狭隘。

Absolutely. Or more and more narrow in your view of things.

我们都了解确认偏误——这种心理通常在几分钟内就会显现。比如你自认为能判断某个求职者是否合适，之后整个面试过程都在验证这个直觉。这种偏误作用时间很短。但想象一下，经过数十年人生历练，你可能会形成诸如'男性特质''成功法则''对话技巧'这类日益僵化的狭隘认知。我最近思考'思维定式'这个概念时突然意识到，用马车车轮陷入车辙来类比，对现代人可能不太直观了。

We both know about confirmation bias, and that's usually played out over the course of minutes where, like, you think you know whether this person's gonna be a good candidate or a bad candidate for hiring, and then you spend the rest of the interview just confirming your intuitions. Okay. That plays out over a very short but you can imagine that over the decades of your life, you begin to have these ossified views of, like, what men are like or how to succeed or how to have a conversation. And these are, like, more and more narrow. I was thinking about the idea of being in a cognitive rut, and it dawned on me that ruts with wagon wheels and the like are probably not an accessible analogy right now.

但若能想象泥泞中越陷越深的车辙——那种难以挣脱的轨迹——就能理解持续数十年的确认偏误如何让人变得越来越愚昧。

But if you could go back to that visual of a rut in the mud that gets deeper and deeper, and it's very hard to get out of that groove. So one could imagine a kind of confirmation bias that plays out over decades making you into more and more of a fool.

没错。我能想象那种错误经验造成的伪智慧：假设我是个总靠吼叫让孩子听话的家长，这种方法30%有效，70%无效。但我可能会认定'这就是育儿之道'——而通过行为示范'传承'给子女的所谓智慧，就是做个整天吼叫的家长，因为'这招管用'。我可能根本接触不到真正能增长智慧的其他模式。

Yeah. I can imagine the wrong kind of experience that makes you think you're wise is like, imagine I'm a parent, and I yell at my kids a lot to get them to do what I want them to do. And 30% of the time, it works. 70% doesn't, but 30% of the time it does. So I might assume that, hey.

若我想把智慧传给子女（这种吼叫行为本身就是在示范），我可能会认定持续吼叫才是智慧家长的表现，因为这是有效的管教方式。而实际上可能让我更睿智的其他模式，我根本无从知晓。

This is the way to be. And if I want to pass on the wisdom to my children, which I am inevitably doing by modeling this behavior, then I may decide that the wise parent is the one who yells at their child all the time because that's the way to make it work. I don't have a different model that might, in fact, make me more wise.

虽然我们总说年轻人愚钝、长者睿智，也直觉认为某些经验或许有益——但不得不说，并非要美化年轻人，他们有时确实具备更清醒的洞察力，尤其在当今历史背景下。看着我女儿们对性别、性取向、种族、民族、社会平等议题的敏锐认知，我觉得人类像新陈代谢般淘汰我们这些老细胞是好事。等我们逝去，由他们接手世界。届时他们的子女又会为父辈的局限而愤慨。这大概就是...

You know, even though we talk about the young being foolish and the old being wise, and we both have this intuition that some experience or practice might be helpful, I have noticed that not to romanticize young people, but they sometimes do see things with a clarity of perspective, especially around now historically where I see my daughters growing up with a sensitivity to gender, sexuality, race, ethnicity, issues of social equality. I just feel like it's a good thing that humanity sloughs off the old cells like us. We'll die, and then they'll take over. And then their children will be outraged and indignant about how limited their parents are. And I don't know.

我确实认为这是我们进步的一部分。随着年龄增长会带来经验，而经验有时能让我们在这些难题上做出更好的决策。但我也觉得，人有时会陷入思维定式，这或许就是为什么年轻人在思考问题时常常能比我们更出色。

I do feel like that's part of how we get better. So, yes, with age comes experience. With experience sometimes can come better decision making about these hard things. But I also feel like sometimes you do get into these ruts, and maybe that's why young people can sometimes just be so much better than we are at thinking about stuff.

我最近读到一本书，不知道你是否熟悉，但我想和你分享一下，可能对伊冯娜也有帮助。这本书由两位作者合著，其中巴里·施瓦茨是斯沃斯莫尔学院的心理学家——你应该认识他，另一位肯尼斯·夏普是该校的政治学家。书名叫《实践智慧》，他们提出了一个会引起很多人共鸣的观点：每个人都想在某种程度上取得成功，但同时也想在某种程度上做正确的事，而平衡这两者有时很困难。

So I did come across this book. I'm not sure if you're familiar with it, but I'd like to tell you about it a little bit, and maybe this would prove useful for Yvonne as well. It's written by two authors, one of whom I know you know, Barry Schwartz, who's a psychologist at Swarthmore, and Kenneth Sharp, who is a political scientist at Swarthmore. And it's called practical wisdom, and they make this argument that I think would resonate with a lot of people, which is that everyone wants to succeed on some level, but we also wanna do the right thing again at some level. And sometimes the balancing the two can be hard.

他们认为平衡之道在于运用智慧——实践智慧。书中提出了智者行为的六个关键特质：第一，智者清楚所从事活动的正确目标。比如你是为了自我提升还是帮助他人。第二，智者懂得即兴发挥，平衡冲突目标，并根据具体情境灵活解读规则与原则。

And the way to balance, they argue, is by exercising wisdom, practical wisdom. There are six key qualities that they offer of how a wise person can or should behave. First is a wise person knows the proper aims of the activity she is engaged in. I think of that as are you there to promote yourself or to help other people and so on. The second one, a wise person knows how to improvise balancing conflicting aims and interpreting rules and principles in light of the particularities of each context.

我觉得这个观点极具洞见，因为像伊冯娜、我或者你可能认为的智慧，很大程度上体现在应对那些你完全没有预料到的事情上。

I thought this was incredibly insightful because a lot of what I think someone like Yvonne or I and maybe you would think about as wisdom is responding to things that you certainly hadn't planned.

巴里可能想强调的另一点是：当你面临需要智慧做抉择时，通常存在冲突和权衡。比如我可以诚实地说'这条牛仔裤让你的臀部看起来有一英里宽'（谢谢啊），因为诚实很重要。

And the other element of that that I think Barry would wanna underline is that when you are confronted with a decision that requires wisdom, there's usually a conflict. There's usually a trade off. Like, I can be honest and tell you that your butt looks a mile wide in that pair of jeans. Thanks. Because honesty is important.

或者我也可以选择善良而不说同样的话。这就形成了两种美德之间的权衡冲突。所以当不清楚哪种美德在当下情境更重要时，你必须为意外情况即兴发挥。

Or I could be kind and not same thing. And then there's a trade off or a conflict between two virtues. So, yeah, you have to improvise for the unexpected, especially when it's not clear which virtue is the one that is higher in that situation.

《实践智慧》第三条法则：智者具有洞察力，懂得解读社交语境，能超越非黑即白的规则看到灰色地带。巴里，恕我直言，这似乎有点显而易见。

Wisdom rule number three from practical wisdom. A wise person is perceptive, knows how to read social context, and knows how to move beyond the black and white of rules and see the gray in the situation. That seems kinda obvious to me. No offense, Barry.

但说来容易做来难，对吧？人类思维偏爱非黑即白的规则，而要辨别深浅不一的灰色需要太多功夫。

Easier said than done, though. Right? I think the human mind loves black and white rules, and seeing the gradations of gray is so much work.

强有力的辩护。第四条智慧法则：智者懂得换位思考，从他人视角看问题，从而理解对方的感受。如果你认同这点，可能得稍微修正你对年轻人的评价——我认为年轻人未必都具备这种特质。

A stout defense. Wisdom rule number four, a wise person knows how to take on the perspective of another, to see the situation as the other person does, and thus to understand how the other person feels. This is perspective taking. Now this is one where if you agree with it, I would think you would have to revise a little bit what you said about younger people because I think younger people don't necessarily have this characteristic in spades.

哦，关于换位思考这点。你觉得他们以自我为中心？

Oh, of taking on the perspective of others. You think they're egocentric?

要知道，你总是告诉我们大脑仍在发育中，尚未形成某些调控机制，也缺乏特定的换位思考能力。

Well, you're the one that's always telling us about the brain still being in formation, doesn't have certain governors in it yet, doesn't have certain perspective taking abilities yet.

我认为青少年的前额叶皮层功能确实尚未达到最佳状态。但就理解他人视角的能力而言，我不确定青少年在这方面更逊色。不过我要说，他们耗费大量精力试图让我们理解他们的立场。他们常因自己的观点未被倾听或尊重而感到沮丧。

I think that adolescents don't have the best and highest functioning prefrontal cortexes around. But in terms of the ability to take the perspective of another person, that I am not sure that teenagers are worse at. I will say this. They spend a lot of their energy trying to get us to understand their perspective. I think they're often frustrated that their perspective isn't being heard or respected.

正因为他们在这方面需要付出巨大努力，所以无暇顾及理解我们的视角。

And because they have to work so hard at it, they don't have as much time to understand our perspective.

确实如此。他们对理解我们的视角兴趣缺缺，更关注同龄人的看法。但无论如何，任何年龄段的换位思考都非易事。就像我清晨醒来时，只能从自己的视角看见天花板和窗户。即便只是瞬间，要真正代入他人视角都是极其深刻的难题。

That's true. I mean, they're just less interested in that perspective and much more interested in the perspective of their friends. But, anyway so at any age, this is hard. I can only wake up in the morning and see the ceiling and my window from my exact standpoint. And, like, it's a really, really profoundly difficult problem to take anybody else's press, even for a millisecond.

实用智慧的第五条准则让我震撼：智者懂得让情绪成为理性的盟友，依靠情绪感知情境需求，使其辅助判断而不扭曲判断。我认为这是智慧的最高境界。

The fifth rule of practical wisdom, this one blew me away. A wise person knows how to make emotion an ally of reason, to rely on emotion, to signal what a situation calls for, and to inform judgment without distorting it. I think that is black belt wisdom stuff.

因为多数人视情绪为理性之敌？

Because most people think of emotion as the enemy of reason?

不仅是理性之敌。当人们处于强烈情绪中时，甚至不会将情绪与理性视为两种可调控的力量。我们大多完全被情绪支配，未能将其视为情境需求的信号，更遑论使其成为理性决策的助力。

Not only as the enemy of reason, but I think most people, when they're experiencing strong emotions, they don't even think about emotion and reason as being two separate manipulatable forces. Most of us just fall so prey to the power of emotion that we don't think about it as a signal of what the situation calls for and then to make that an ally of your reason and proceeding.

就像直觉感受。巴里倡导的或许是学习如何让情绪与直觉成为盟友，同时更娴熟地解读这些近乎生理性的非语言感受，以应对人生重大抉择。

Like, if you have a gut feel, maybe what Barry is advocating for is learning how to make emotion and gut feel an ally, but also to get more skilled at interpreting these nonverbal feelings that are almost physiological about making hard choices in life situations.

本书最后关于实用智慧的里程碑式观点是：智者必是经验丰富者。实用智慧如同工艺，匠人需通过正确经验来培养。这让我们回归'年龄与经验孕育智慧'的观点，或许暗示智慧确实随年龄或至少随经验增长。

The last landmark of this book, practical wisdom, is as follows. A wise person is an experienced person. Practical wisdom is a craft, and craftsmen are trained by having the right experiences. So here, we're getting all the way back to the idea age and experience leads to wisdom. So perhaps this does suggest that there's more wisdom with age or at least experience.

没错。正如亚里士多德所言，没人仅因年岁增长就成为匠人。勇敢需通过勇敢行为来锻造。任何想掌握技艺的人，都会寻求向经验丰富的匠人学习——无论是阅读其著作，或是更理想地，观摩其实践并效仿之。

Yes. And nobody becomes a craftsman just because you got older. You have to do brave things to become brave, as Aristotle said. And any of us who wanted to learn a craft would probably look for an experienced craftsman to learn from, either reading their book or even better by watching them practice their craft and then doing likewise.

我确实觉得随着年龄增长，最大的好处或许是彻底的自我欺骗，但我感觉自己正变得更睿智。安吉，我感觉再过几年，我积累的智慧就要爆发了。我想这就是我离开这个世界的方式。接下来

I do feel that as I get older, the biggest upside is maybe total delusion, but I feel like I'm getting wiser. I'm feeling like, Angie, in a few years, I'm just gonna explode with all the wisdom I'm carrying around. I think that's the way I'm gonna go out of this world. Coming

广告之后，我们将对今日对话进行事实核查。

up after the break, a fact check of today's conversation.

而

And

现在开始今日对话的事实核查。在本集前半段，史蒂文和安吉拉基于诺贝尔奖得主心理学家丹尼尔·卡尼曼的峰终定律，探讨了重要印象的形成。他们辩论了结局的重要性及相应开端的意义，却几乎未讨论峰终理论中的峰值部分。安吉拉和史蒂文表示只记得心理学文献中一项重要的结肠镜检查研究。但在1993年原始论文发表三年后，卡尼曼再次开展了评估结肠镜检查患者不适感的研究。

now here's a fact check of today's conversations. In the first half of the episode, Steven and Angela ground their discussion about significant impressions in Nobel Prize winning psychologist Dani Kahneman's Peak End Rule. In doing so, they debate the importance of endings and the corresponding significance of beginnings, but they spend almost no time discussing the peak part of peak end. Angela and Steven say that they only remember one major colonoscopy study from psychological literature. But three years after the original 1993 paper, Kahneman conducted another study that again assessed the discomfort of colonoscopy patients.

这次他与同事唐纳德·雷特尔迈尔发现，受试者不仅根据检查结束时的感受，还会依据最剧烈疼痛时刻（峰值时刻）来评估患者体验。套用史蒂文和安吉拉的假期比喻，旅行中途的情感强烈时刻——比如车祸这样的惊吓或求婚这样的惊喜——对整体体验的影响可能不亚于甚至超过难忘的结局。随后史蒂文讲述了所罗门判案的故事。虽然他的概述基本准确，但有个细节有误：他说所罗门王将孩子判给了表现出最剧烈痛苦的妇女。

This time, he and his colleague Donald Rettlemeier found that subjects evaluated the patient experience based on the moment of most intense pain, the peak moment, in addition to their feelings at the end of the procedure. When applied to Steven and Angela's vacation analogy, an emotionally intense moment in the middle of a trip, say something frightening like a car accident or something thrilling like an engagement, can color your experience just as much, if not more, than a memorable ending. Later, Stephen shares the story of the judgment of Solomon. While his summary is mostly accurate, there is one detail that he gets wrong. He says that King Solomon gave the child to the woman who cried out with the greatest greatest pain and distress.

然而在故事中，只有一位母亲痛苦哀求，另一位并未反对所罗门将孩子劈成两半的判决。悲痛的母亲恳求所罗门不要杀害婴儿，宁愿把孩子让给对方。所罗门由此明智判定想要保全孩子的是生母，而接受半具婴儿的则是冒牌货。事实核查到此结束。

However, in the story, only one mother cries out in distress. The other doesn't contest Solomon's decision to cut the child in half. The distraught mother begs Solomon not to kill the baby and to instead give the other woman the child. Solomon then wisely ascertains that the woman who wants to save the child is the true mother, and the woman who is fine with half a baby is a fraud. That's it for the fact check.

《无蠢之问》由Freakonomics Radio与Stitcher联合制作。本期节目由我丽贝卡·李·道格拉斯制作，隶属于Freakonomics Radio电台网络。团队成员包括艾莉森·克雷格洛、格雷格·里彭、马克·麦克拉斯基、詹姆斯·福斯特和艾玛·特雷尔。主题曲为《And She Was》——传声头乐队作品。

No stupid questions is produced by Freakonomics Radio and Stitcher. This episode was produced by me, Rebecca Lee Douglas. No stupid questions is part of the Freakonomics Radio network. Our staff includes Alison Craiglow, Greg Ripon, Mark McCluskey, James Foster, and Emma Terrell. Our theme song is And She Was by Talking Heads.

特别鸣谢大卫·伯恩与华纳查普尔音乐。如有问题想在未来节目中探讨，请发送邮件至nsq@Freakonomics.com。若您想深入了解史蒂文或安吉拉提及的研究、专家或书籍，可访问freakonomics.com/nsq查看今日节目中所有重要参考资料链接。感谢收听。

Special thanks to David Byrne and Warner Chappell Music. If you have a question for a future episode, please email it to nsq@Freakonomics.com. And if you heard Steven or Angela reference a study, an expert, or a book that you'd like to learn more about, you can check out freakonomics.com/nsq, where we link to all of the major references that you heard about here today. Thanks for listening.

我家狗在叫。抱歉。它马上会停。

I got a barking dog. Sorry. She'll stop.

刚才是你即兴发挥，还是他全程自主反应？

Did you just do that rough, or was that all him?

是我们两个人一起。

It's been both of us.

《魔鬼经济学》广播网络，揭示万物隐藏的一面。

The Freakonomics Radio Network, the hidden side of everything.

Stitcher。

Stitcher.