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我是詹娜·费舍尔，我是安吉拉·金西。
I'm Jenna Fischer, and I'm Angela Kinsey.
我们曾一起在
We were on
《办公室》剧组共事，而且是最好的朋友。
the office together, and we're best friends.
现在，我们专门为你们制作了这个终极办公室情侣播客。
And now we're doing the ultimate office lovers podcast just for you.
每周，
Each week,
我们将深入探索《办公室》的世界，带来独家访谈、幕后细节和大量闺蜜故事。
we will dive deeper into the world of the office with exclusive interviews, behind the scenes details, and lots of BFF stories.
我们是办公室女孩6.0版。
We're the Office Lady six point zero.
嘿，大家好。
Hey there, you guys.
我们想在重看《纸牌屋》的过程中休息一下，和大家分享一些非常有趣的内容。
We wanted to take a break in our The Paper rewatch to share something really fun with you.
我们和埃德·赫尔姆斯在他的播客《Snafu》中聊天，度过了非常愉快的时光。
We had a great time talking with Ed Helms on his podcast, Snafu.
是的。
Yes.
埃德有一个播客，非常有趣。
Ed has a podcast, and it's a lot of fun.
就像安吉说的，这个播客叫《Snafu》，去年我们是他的嘉宾。
Like Ang said, it's called Snafu, and we were his guests last year.
但如果你错过了，我们今天想把它带给大家。
But in case you missed it, we wanted to bring it to our feet today.
让我告诉你，如果你喜欢深度探讨，你一定会爱上《Snafu》。
And let me tell you, if you love deep dives, you are going to love snafu.
事情是这样的。
Here's what happens.
在每一集中，埃德都会深入探讨历史上一个混乱的时刻。
On each episode, Ed does a deep dive of a snafu moment from history.
所以我们讨论了这一点，但当然，我们也聊了很多关于我们在《办公室》共事的时光。
So we discussed that, but then, of course, we also talk a lot about our time on the office together.
让我觉得特别有趣的是，埃德选来和我们分享的那个混乱时刻发生在一艘船上。
You know, it was very funny to me that the snafu moment that Ed picked to share with us takes place on a boat.
而且，安吉拉，我简直不敢相信我们居然没提到，他在《办公室》里的角色安迪特别喜欢船。
And, Angela, I can't believe that we did not bring up the fact that his character on The Office, Andy, loves boats.
我知道。
I know.
我的意思是，
I mean,
真是错失良机啊。
what a missed opportunity.
安迪·伯纳德喜欢船，而且他还在自家那艘43英尺长的塔尔坦单桅帆船上经历过好几次混乱时刻。
Andy Bernard loves boats, but he also had several snafu moments on his family boat, the old 43 foot Tartan Sloop.
我们接下来
And we're going
要谈谈掉进海里的东西。
to talk about things falling in the ocean.
安迪出过一次岔子。
Andy had a snafu.
是他的手机还是笔记本电脑？
Was it his phone or his laptop?
记得它直接滑进了‘是’。
Remember that it just slides into Yes.
嗯，能和埃德重聚真的很开心。
The Well, listen, it was really fun to catch up with Ed.
所以我们希望你们喜欢听我们在他播客里的对话。
So we hope you enjoy listening to us on his podcast.
下周，我们将回归《办公室女郎6.0》，继续我们的《纸张解析》系列。
And next week, we'll be back for an all new episode of Office Lady six point zero as we continue our The Paper Breakdown.
现在我明白为什么他们称之为‘断箭’了。
Now I know why they call it broken arrows.
因为当你这么说：你知道吗，我们有32个断箭。
Because when you say, you know what, we have 32 broken arrows.
如果你说我们有32枚丢失的核武器，你就会想：等等。
You're like, oh, if you say we have 32 lost nuclear weapons, you're like, wait.
停一下。
Stop.
什么？
What?
再说一遍？
Say again?
委婉语让困难的事情变得容易多了。
Euphemisms make hard things a lot easier.
嘿。
Hey.
我是埃德·赫尔姆斯，节目《Snafu》的主持人，这个节目讲述的是历史上最伟大的失误。
I'm Ed Helms, host of Snafu, a show about history's greatest screw ups.
今天，我有幸邀请到我最爱的两位人类——安吉拉·金西和詹娜·费舍尔。
Today, I am joined by two of my all time favorite humans on the planet, Angela Kinsey and Jenna Fischer.
当然，你们知道她们是《办公室》里的安吉拉·马丁和帕姆·贝斯利，我们曾在剧中剧外一起度过了许多欢笑的岁月。
Of course, you know them as Angela Martin and Pam Beasley from The Office where we spent many years making each other chuckle both on and off camera.
如今，她们共同主持广受喜爱的《办公室女士》播客，深入剖析《办公室》的每一集、每一集，以她们独特的方式带来洞见、温暖、真情与幽默。
These days, they cohost the wildly beloved Office Ladies podcast where they deep dive into every episode, every single episode of The Office with their very own distinct brand of insight, warmth, heart, and hilarity.
安吉拉和詹娜，你们能来我真是太兴奋了。
Angela and Jenna, I am so psyched you're here.
嗨，埃德。
Hi, Ed.
嗨，埃德。
Hi, Ed.
见到你们真好。
It's so good to see you.
我现在激动得直拍手，因为我们有视频了。
I'm getting jazz hands right now because we've got a video going.
是的。
Yeah.
就只是
Just
想让气氛更热闹一点。
wanna jazz it up a little.
让气氛更热闹一点。
Jazz it up.
好了。
Alright.
好了。
There.
我想问一个非常关键的问题，我相信我们所有的听众和观众现在都很想知道：你们每天有多想念和我一起工作的日子？
Let me ask a a very, I think, very pressing question that all of our listeners and viewers are probably wondering right now, which is how much do you miss working with me on a daily basis?
天啊。
Oh my gosh.
我非常怀念《办公室》。
I miss The Office a lot.
我知道。
I know.
我的意思是，我们现在的工作就是看这部剧，它总是勾起我们一起工作的许多回忆，你知道有多少花絮吗。
I mean, we spend our days, our job now is watching the show and it always just brings up so many memories of working together and you know how many bloopers there are.
是啊。
Oh yeah.
有很多，因为我们整天都会一起笑个不停。
There's so many because we would just laugh all day together.
我们就是这样的。
That's what we did.
埃德，我只是怀念和你一起胡闹的日子。
Ed, I just miss, I miss being silly with you.
就像我们会互相逗乐，我走过你身边时，我们会突然编出一个新的声音。
Like we would get Like so I would walk past you and we would just make up a new noise.
哦，天哪。
Like, Oh
我的天。
my god.
就像所有幕后的那些事，那段时期的整个生活体验，都有一种 overarching 的感觉，令人惊叹。
It's like all the stuff off camera, the the life experience of that whole time period, which was just had this kind of larger umbrella feeling of like, wow.
我们都是伟大事物的一部分，这真的非常特别。
We're all part of something really great, and that's, like, super special.
但同时，我们在片场也经历了许多平凡而温馨的时刻，聊彼此的生活和家庭，或者只是静静地坐在房车里，等待摄像机准备——我觉得粉丝们往往不了解的是，我们拍剧的真实体验，其实是由这些琐碎而细微的瞬间交织成的一幅完整画卷。
But then we're also having these really mundane, lovely moments on the set just talking about each other's lives and families and, like, I don't know, just the little those little quiet moments is or sitting at our trailers, like, waiting for a camera setup or it's like that that's, I think, something that, like, fans don't always understand is that, like, our experience of making the show is actually this whole tapestry of mundane small moments of just experiencing each other.
我的意思是，这是一种亲密感，一种持续相伴的亲密感。
I mean, it's an intimacy, you know, of togetherness, of constant togetherness.
如果我能回到过去，重历一个时刻，比如我得到一个神灯精灵，可以许一个愿望，那我会选择回到过去，一整天都拍摄会议室的场景。
And I think if I could go back and relive a moment, like if, you know, I got a genie in a bottle and I could use a wish, it would be to go back and shoot a conference room scene all day.
因为当我们看到剧本或排班表上写着要
Cause when we would see those on the script or on the call sheet and we would be like, Oh God, we got
在
to be
会议室里待上一整天，我们就会想，天啊，这又要
in the conference room all It's gonna
变得很枯燥。
be a slog.
一整天，整整一天。
Day, all day.
但正是这些日子造就了你所说的那些时刻，
But those were the days that created the moments you're talking about,
埃德。
Ed.
完全没错。
Totally.
那些小小的笑声、分享、一起流汗的时刻，所有这一切。
Those little laughs, the shares, the sweatiness together, all of it.
我也觉得，因为我们没有在很大的片场，你知道，没什么干扰。
I also think because we weren't on a huge lot, you know, there was no distraction.
你知道，人们不会跑去食堂。
You know, people didn't walk off to a commissary.
我们就只是在一个小小的泡泡里，在这个狭小的空间里一起发挥创意。
We were just all in this little bubble, this tiny space where we got to be creative together.
这让我有点想起你早期和即兴表演团体或独幕剧团队在一起时的那种氛围，因为那时候没有别人。
It kinda reminded me a little bit of that energy you have in your early days with your improv group or your one act play because there was no one else.
没有什么闪亮的东西吸引你去分心。
There was no shiny object to go off and look at.
就只有我们自己。
It was just us.
就像对啊。
Like Yeah.
我特别喜欢你弹班卓琴的时候，克里德会带着他的吉他来，我们在停车场一起闲逛。
I loved it when you would play your banjo and Creed would bring in his guitar, and we'd hang out in the parking lot.
你知道的吧？
You know?
是的。
Yeah.
你提到会议室的场景真有意思，因为那些时刻特别特别，因为大多数时候我们并不都在一起。
And it's funny you bring up those conference room scenes because those were particularly special because most of the time, we're not all together.
对吧？
Right?
大多数时候，我们只是和一两个其他角色演一些小场景，而这正是我们工作的主体。
Most of the time, we're just doing little scenes with, like, one or two other characters, and, and that's that's the bulk of our work.
但每次剧本围读都是一段特别的时刻。
But then the table read was always a special moment.
每个周二早上都是围读下周的剧本，或者下下周的。
Every Tuesday morning was a table read of next week's script and or two weeks.
我记不清具体时间了。
I forget the timing.
但后来
But then
哦，是一周。
Oh, it was one week.
是的。
Yeah.
是一周。
It was one week.
一周。
Week.
是的。
Yeah.
通知时间不到一周。
It was less than a week's notice.
是的。
Yeah.
但那些时刻，还有那些会议室场景，正是所有人聚在一起的时候。
But those are the moments those and some of those conference room scenes were were like, that's where everybody's together.
就像，所有人都在，那些场景有一种特别的氛围，嗯。
Like, everybody's and those had a really special energy, like Mhmm.
有一种微妙的活力。
Like a just a a little buzz to them.
而且就像你说的，当他们一整天都在那里时，气氛就会变得有点沉闷，开始慢下来。
And when in and like you said, when they when they were all day long, that's and they get a little dull and they start to slow down.
每个人都只是在硬撑。
Everybody's trying to just hang in there.
那正是最有人情味的闲逛时刻。
That's like some of the just most human hangout.
埃德，你加入这个节目时有着非常独特的经历，因为你实际上是在斯坦福德加入的。
Ed, you had a really unique experience joining the show because you actually joined in Stamford.
所以你并不是从德温特·米夫林斯克兰顿办公室开始的。
So you didn't start off in the Dunder Mifflin bullpen of the Scranton Dunder Mifflin bullpen.
然后你才过来的。
And then you came over.
你这样慢慢融入这部剧的感觉怎么样？
What was that like for you to kind of like soft launch into the show?
你之前和约翰合作过，和拉希达合作过，也和奇普合作过。
Like you worked with John, you worked with Rashida, you worked with Chip.
是的。
Yeah.
抱歉，珍娜。
Well, sorry, Jenna.
今天由我来提问。
I'll be asking the questions today.
不。
No.
忘了我们正在录哪个播客了。
Forgot whose podcast we were doing.
不。
No.
我喜欢这个问题。
I love the question.
我总是跟别人说，正是因为你说的这些，我们的加入才如此温和。
I always tell people, like, that was such a gentle entry for us because of exactly what you're saying.
你知道的，拉希达和我加入的时候，这部剧正火。
Like, you know, Rashida and I started at a time when the show was hot.
那是第三季，而你们已经创造出了这么棒的作品。
It was season three, and and you guys had already just kind of, like, created this incredible thing.
所以我们很紧张，但同时也被编剧和你们所有人热情地接纳了。
And so we were intimidated, but also felt kind of so warmly welcomed both by the writers and and all of you.
大家的氛围都特别好。
Everyone's energy was so lovely.
这太暖心了。
That's so sweet.
事情本可能走向另一个方向。
It really could have gone the other way.
我敢肯定，很多其他节目更竞争激烈，感觉新来的人必须证明自己。
I'm sure a lot of other shows, there's, like, more it's more cutthroat, or it feels more like, the new people, like, let's not let's let them they have to prove themselves.
但我真的感觉，我所有的紧张和焦虑都很快消失了，因为你们所有人从一开始就非常友善，这充分证明了你们和你们营造的氛围。
But I just felt so like, all of my butterflies and anxiety just washed out so quickly because everyone all of you were so lovely right out of the gate and which is a testament to to all of you and the vibe that got created.
那是合作的。
It was collaborative.
不是竞争的。
It was not competitive.
完全对。
Totally.
片场根本没有那种奇怪的、以自我为中心的竞争，这太棒了。
There was not like a weird, like, ego competitiveness going on on that set, which was so great.
当然。
Absolutely.
对。
Yeah.
一直以来，我们都说，从编剧室到摄制组再到演员，这是一次真正的创意合作。
It was always you know, we always say it was a real creative collaboration from the writers room to the crew to the cast.
我们所有人齐心协力，打造了一部让我们感到自豪的作品。
We're all working together to create a product that we were proud of.
我觉得，当你观看时，你也能感受到这一点。
And I think, I mean, I think you feel that when you watch it.
我觉得人们之所以一直喜欢它，是因为你看到的是一群人玩得非常开心。
And I think that's why people keep enjoying it is you're seeing a group of people having a great time.
那里有一种真实的温暖感，我认为这种感觉透过镜头传递了出来。
There's a warmth there that's real, and I I think that comes through the camera.
好的。
Alright.
首先，这是我问所有嘉宾的问题。
Well, first, this is something I ask all of my guests.
在你自己的生活中，有没有发生过什么失误、误会，或者彻底的崩溃，可以算作一场大乱子？
Is there a moment in your own life, a mishap, a misunderstanding, a full blown meltdown that that would qualify as a snafu?
我的确马上就想到了一个。
Mean, I have one that immediately comes to mind.
是什么事啊，女士？
What is it, lady?
八十年代，我刚从印度尼西亚搬到德克萨斯州达拉斯。
I had just moved from Indonesia to Dallas, Texas in the eighties.
明白吗？
Okay?
1984年。
1984.
我在雅加达住了十二年。
I had lived in Jakarta for twelve years.
我不知道美国高中到底是什么氛围。
I didn't know what the heck an American high school vibe was.
天哪。
Oh my god.
而且我在一半的课程里还比别人高一个年级。
And I was I was also, a grade ahead in half my subjects.
所以我前四节课去初中，然后我妈妈来接我。
So I would go to the junior high for the first four classes, then my mom would pick me up.
我在车里吃午饭，开车去高中，而我就像这个大高中里一个小小的身影。
I'd eat lunch in the car, driving to the high school, and I was I was like this tiny little thing in this big high school.
我是个局外人，非常想融入其中。
I was such an outsider and I really wanted to fit in.
我是个刚从印度尼西亚搬来的新生，根本不知道我该去烫头发、涂很多眼线。
And I'm a freshman who's moved from Indonesia who doesn't know, like, I'm supposed to get a perm and wear a bunch of eyeliner.
我还不知道这些。
I don't know that yet.
是的
Yeah.
德克萨斯州的高中氛围非常独特，尤其是在八十年代。
Texas has a real real specific high school vibe, especially in the eighties.
是的
Yeah.
八十年代的达拉斯。
Eighties Dallas.
那确实是一种氛围。
That's a vibe.
好吧。
Okay.
第一天的第一节课，英语课。
First class of the day, English class.
我身后有个超帅的男生，看起来很运动型。
Super hot dude behind me, like athletic dude.
我坐在桌旁，桌上的铅笔滚到了右边的地上。
And I'm at my desk, and my pencil on the desk rolls off to the right on the ground.
我弯腰去捡它。
I lean over to get it.
我没有考虑到自己的体重和环绕式书桌的承重之间的平衡。
I don't calibrate my weight versus the wraparound desk weight.
哦，不。
Oh, no.
整个桌子翻了过来，压在我身上，我的双脚乱蹬，而坐在我后面的帅哥惊呼着，赶紧过来扶我。
The whole thing flipped over on me, pinned me to the ground with my feet akimbo and the hottie dude behind me is like, oh my gosh, like goes to pick me up.
他们说：‘你的手臂。’
And they were like, your arm.
我说：‘我没事。’
And I'm like, I'm fine.
我没事。
I'm fine.
我没事。
I'm fine.
我的手臂，我以为我胳膊断了。
And my arm, I thought I broke my arm.
这个故事最后那个帅哥约你出去了吗？
Does this story end with the hottie asking you out?
因为你刚刚描述的就像青少年电影里所有的相遇桥段一样
Because you've also just described like every meet cute in a teen I'm movie from the
我现在就告诉你，那些相遇桥段都是假的。
gonna tell you right now, those meet cutes are a lie.
好吧。
All right.
詹娜，你有个简短的吗？
You got a quick one, Jenna?
有。
I do.
所以这不是学校里的乌龙，而是青少年的乌龙。
So it's it's not a school snafu, but it's a teenage snafu.
我曾经特别喜欢住在隔壁的一个男孩，我想给他留下好印象，就是那种想炫耀一下、吸引他注意的方式。
I had a big crush on one of the guys who lived in my neighborhood and I kind of wanted to like just impress him, you know, like in that way where you want to peacock a little, maybe catch their eye.
于是我买了一件新的Esprit上衣。
So I had gotten this like new Esprit top.
你还记得Esprit吗？
Do you remember Esprit?
哦，是的，
Oh yeah,
当然记得。
of course.
我超爱Esprit。
I loved Esprit.
是个很酷的品牌。
Very cool brand.
而且超爱Esprit。
And loved Esprit.
对此非常自豪。
Very proud of it.
我还有一条特别的配套发带。
And I had like this special like matching ribbon for my hair.
于是我穿上它，打算出去取邮件。
So I put this on and my idea was that I go out and get the mail.
这样就有理由出门了，我特意计算好了时间。
So it would be a reason for me to like walk So I timed it out.
我坐在那儿，看着他回家，然后穿着我的Esprit上衣骄傲地走出去。
I like sat and like watched him arrive home and I proudly walked out in my esprit top.
我走到信箱前，一看，哦，什么都没有。
And I went, I looked in the mailbox and like, oh, there's nothing there.
但你知道，我装作一副若无其事的样子。
But you know, I'm really looking as if, you know, okay.
他在看着我，对吧？
And he is watching me, right?
就像我吸引了他的目光。
Like it's, I caught his eye.
我进屋后，我妈问：你在干什么？
I get inside, my mom says, What are you doing?
我说：哦，没什么。
And I said, Oh, nothing.
我只是去拿邮件。
I was just going to get the mail.
她说：宝贝，你没穿裤子。
And she said, Sweetie, you're not wearing any pants.
闭嘴。
Shut up.
不是。
No.
没错。
That's right.
什么？
What?
没错。
That's right.
我忘了。
I forgot.
我当时太专注于我的精神上衣了，以至于忘了穿裤子，各位。
I was so into my esprit top that I forgot to put on the bottoms of the outfit, y'all.
任何裤子都没穿吗？
Like any bottoms?
我的意思是，我穿了内裤，但没穿裤子。
I mean, had on like undies, but I didn't have on pants.
我是这样穿的，这件衣服挺长的，有点像牛津衬衫。
This is the way put on this like long it was kind of like an Oxford shirt.
是的
Yeah.
懂吗？
Know?
所以它垂下来，甚至超过了我的内裤。
So it hung down even past my underwear.
哦，这很有八十年代风格。
Oh, this is very eighties.
不。
No.
我当时就像《风险投资》里的汤姆·克鲁斯，穿着那件大号牛津衬衫，没穿裤子就走出来了，然后我躲在家里整整四年，再也没跟他讲过话。
I was like I was like Tom Cruise in, Risky Business just walking out in my big Oxford with no pants on, and then I hid in my house for the next four years and never spoke to him again.
天哪。
Oh, boy.
太丢人了。
That's so embarrassing.
你们这可真是够乱的。
Those are some major snafus, you guys.
嗯哼。
Mhmm.
没错，就是这样。
That's that's that's yeah.
这可是大事。
That's big stuff.
这个可能更大。
This one might be bigger.
但愿如此。
I hope so.
安吉拉和珍娜，你们准备好深入今天这场混乱了吗？
Angela and Jenna, are you ready to, dive into today's snafu?
我太兴奋了。
I'm so excited.
太兴奋了。
So excited.
我正在喝一口我的冰茶。
I'm having a sip of my iced tea.
我很好。
I'm Alright.
安顿好了。
Settling in.
准备好迎接你的I
Get ready to get your I
我喜欢这种混乱。
love a snafu.
我爱你。
I love you.
我喜欢这个播客。
I love this pod.
我最喜爱的三件事即将同时发生。
So three of my favorite things are about to happen all at once.
太棒了。
Awesome.
我爱安吉拉，我的闺蜜。
And I love Angela, my BFF.
给你。
There you go.
四件事。
Four things.
这里真是富足得不得了。
This is just a abundance of riches right here.
确实如此。
It is.
今天的混乱事件带我们登上1965年停泊在日本沿海的提康德罗加号航空母舰。
Today's snafu takes us aboard the USS Ticonderoga, a massive aircraft carrier stationed off the coast of Japan in 1965.
这艘船造得就像在为一部冷战动作片试镜一样。
This thing was built like it was auditioning for a Cold War action movie.
外表坚固，到处都是战斗机，完全是上世纪中期的酷炫猛男。
Tough exterior, fighter jets everywhere, total mid century badass.
想象一下唐·德雷珀和《壮志凌云》中的麦德林生了个孩子，那孩子就是一艘船。
Picture of Don Draper and Maverick from Top Gun had a baby, and the baby was a a boat.
好吧。
And Okay.
它就像一直不停地抽烟一样。
It, like, chain smoked all the time.
我的意思是，这艘航空母舰就是这样的。
Like, that's what this that's what this aircraft carrier was like.
纯粹的美国军事气场。
Pure American military swagger.
不幸的是，这种气场即将摔个大跟头。
Unfortunately, that swagger was about to trip into a colossal face plant.
所以发生的事情，在军事术语中被称为‘断箭’事件。
So what happened was what is what is known in military circles as a broken arrow incident.
你们有人知道这个词是什么意思吗？
Do either of you know what that term means?
有部电影叫《断箭》吗？
There was a movie called Broken Arrow?
是的。
Yes.
确实有这么一部电影。
There was.
我不知道。
I don't.
你知道那部电影讲的是什么吗？
Do you know what the movie was about?
这可能会有所帮助。
It might get it might help.
我感觉没啥劲。
I feel like meh.
好吧。
Okay.
感觉像有人从火车上跳下去了。
Feel like a guy jumped off a train.
也许电影里就是这么演的。
Maybe that happened in that movie.
但所谓‘断箭’事件，就是指我们丢失了一枚核装置。
But, a broken arrow incident is that that's when we lose a nuclear device.
天哪。
Oh my goodness.
真的发生过。
Has happened.
我猜那枚核装置是在火车上。
I guess the nuclear device was on the train.
是的。
Yeah.
好吧。
Okay.
是的。
Yeah.
好吧。
Okay.
随便吧。
Whatever.
放手吧，让一切随风，安吉拉。
Let go let it go, Angela.
我觉得约翰·特拉沃尔塔演过那部电影。
I feel like John Travolta was in that movie.
我再也想不起其他细节了。
I can't remember anything else about it.
但无论如何，‘断箭’这个术语指的是我们丢失核导弹、核炸弹或
But, anyway, the term broken arrow, that refers to any time we lose a nuclear missile or a bomb or
我
I
某种核装置的情况。
device of some sort.
这种情况在历史上发生过很多次，多到你根本不想知道。
And it happens How It has happened throughout history numerous like, way more than you want to know.
我的意思是，发生这么多次，他们不得不给它起个代号。
I mean, enough times, they had to have a code name for it.
丢失一枚核武器听起来完全疯狂，事实也的确如此。
Well, losing a nuclear weapon sounds completely insane, and it is.
但我之所以特别想把这个故事讲给你们听，是因为它有一种熟悉的基调——性格冲突、令人困惑的沟通失误、可疑的领导决策。
But part of why I wanted to bring this story to you guys in particular is that it has kind of a familiar flavor, clashing personalities, baffling miscommunication, questionable leadership choices.
基本上，这就像一部经典的工作场所喜剧，只是不是
Basically, this is a classic workplace comedy, except instead
由迈克尔·斯科特负责。
of Michael Scott was in charge.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
而不是隔间，我们身处一艘位于太平洋中央的千英尺军舰上。
And instead of cubicals, we're on a thousand foot warship in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.
而不是纸张卡住，我们面对的是氢弹。
Instead of paper jams, we're dealing with hydrogen bombs.
嘿，大家好？
What's up, guys?
我是坎迪斯·迪拉德·巴塞特，你可能通过《华盛顿郊区的主妇》或《交易者》最新一季的阵容认识我。
I'm Candice Dillard Bassett, and you may know me from my time on the Real Housewives of Potomac or as a part of the latest cast of the traders.
我是迈克尔·阿塞纳尔特，《我不能约会耶稣》这本《纽约时报》畅销书的作者。
And I'm Michael Arsenault, author of the New York Times bestseller, I Can't Date Jesus.
在我们的播客《Undomesticated》中，我们不只是把那些安静的话大声说出来。
On our podcast, Undomesticated, we don't just say the quiet parts out loud.
我们把一切都摊在厨房的桌子上，邀请你进入这场混乱。
We're putting it all on the kitchen table and inviting you into the chaos.
如果你准备好接受大胆的观点、真诚的对话和一点乐趣，那就来加入我们吧。
If you're ready for bold takes, real talk, and a little fun, come join us.
收听并关注《Undomesticated》和《Odyssey》播客，你可以在任何播客平台找到它们。
Listen to and follow Undomesticated and Odyssey podcast available wherever you get your podcasts.
1965年12月5日，在日本琉球群岛附近的海域，美国海军军官正在执行一项名为‘剃头’的常规训练演习，地点在提康德罗加号航空母舰上。
On 12/05/1965, just off the coast of Japan's Ryuku Islands, US naval officers were running through a routine training exercise called the crew cut on the USS Ticonderoga.
一架A-4天鹰攻击机正被推上电梯，准备运送到飞行甲板。
An a four e Skyhawk, an attack fighter jet, was being wheeled into the elevator to be taken up to the flight deck.
所以，稍作停顿。
So quick pause.
你们是容易紧张的乘客吗？
Are you guys nervous flyers?
我不是，但不知为什么，想到在航空母舰上起降就让我吓得要死。
I I am not, but I will say that for some reason, the idea of landing or taking off on an aircraft carrier scares the bejesus out of me.
就像我不确定是因为跑道太短，还是因为它被海水包围，或者它一直在移动，又或者甲板上有三十个人像在开派对一样随意挥舞着荧光棒，为战斗机助兴。
It's like I don't know if it's the tiny runway or just the fact that it's surrounded by water or that it's constantly moving or that there's, like, 30 people on deck just casually waving around glow sticks like it's a rave for fighter jets.
我只是觉得，这对我来说完全就是一副不淡定的氛围。
I just it this is very unchill vibes for me.
还有，像那种短跑道，他们不是会用一根缆绳来抓住飞机并把它拉停吗？
How Also, like like, with the short runway, don't they have, a like a cable that catches the plane and jerks it back?
我的意思是，如果着陆时需要一根缆绳来抓住飞机，我就不知道了。
I mean, if you need a cable to catch your plane on a landing, I don't know.
要是没抓住缆绳怎么办？
What if you missed the cable?
我曾经被邀请参加过类似的事情。
I got invited to do something like that.
他们邀请我坐进驾驶舱，参与一次特殊的飞行任务。
There was like, they invited me to be like in a cockpit for like a special flying mission thing.
我当时就想，我再也不想看了。
And and I was like, I don't need to read anymore.
这事儿对谁都没好处。
Like, this is not gonna go well for anyone.
你只会看到一个女人在所有人身上吐。
You're just gonna have a lady throwing up on everyone.
在这次短发演习中，飞行员道格拉斯·韦伯斯特中尉本应只是起飞、绕飞一圈，然后再次降落，这是一次常规训练，用于练习货物的装卸。
For this crew cut exercise, the pilot, lieutenant Douglas Webster, was simply supposed to take off, fly around for a bit, and then land again, a routine drill to practice loading and unloading cargo.
但几乎立刻，事情就失控了。
But almost immediately, things went off the rails.
当天鹰战机被推上升降机时，它突然开始向后滑动。
As the Skyhawk was being positioned on the elevator, it suddenly began rolling backward.
甲板上的机组人员疯狂挥手，大喊让韦伯斯特踩刹车。
The crew on the deck started waving frantically, shouting for Webster to hit the brakes.
有些人甚至跑到飞机后面，试图阻止它滑动。
A few even ran behind the aircraft trying to stop it from rolling.
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英勇，但并不现实。
Heroic, but not exactly realistic.
天鹰式飞机是海军较轻的机型之一，但其起飞重量仍有24,500磅。
The Skyhawk was one of the Navy's lighter planes, but it still had a takeoff weight of 24,500 pounds.
这可不是一辆失控的购物车。
So this was not a rogue shopping cart.
这简直就是带翅膀的坦克。
This is, like a tank with wings, basically.
不知为何，韦伯斯特完全没有意识到周围发生的混乱，就在一瞬间，天鹰式飞机从航母侧面翻落，撞穿了安全网，坠入了大海。
Somehow, Webster didn't catch on to all the chaos going on around him, and in a split second, the Skyhawk rolled off the side of the carrier, tore through the safety netting, and vanished into the ocean.
如果你是甲板上一名机组人员，只是站在那里眼睁睁看着这一切，你会怎么做？
What would you do if you're a crew member on this flight deck and you're just, like, standing there watching this?
骂脏话，一些诅咒。
Explitives, some cursing.
谁会被开除？
Who's getting fired?
有人要被开除了？
Someone's getting fired?
是的。
Yeah.
肯定的。
For sure.
我会说，我们得告诉别人。
I would be like, we gotta tell somebody.
你有没有过，就是坐在马桶上，手机在口袋里，然后掉进马桶里？
Have you ever, like, gone to sit down on the toilet and your phone's in your pocket and then it falls in the toilet?
天哪。
Oh my god.
那可是我最糟糕的噩梦。
That's my worst nightmare.
那种情况的版本。
Version of that.
那从来都没发生在我身上。
That's that's never happened to me.
谢天谢地。
Thank god.
你从来没把手机掉进马桶里过？
That's never you've never dropped your phone in the toilet?
没有。
No.
我从来没掉过。
I never have.
天哪。
Oh my gosh.
我以前做过这事。
I've done this before.
我从来没把手机掉进游泳池或者任何有水的地方。
I've never dropped your phone in a swimming pool or something in a pool of water.
但那和我想起来的事情不一样。
Well, but that's different than it's reminding me of.
好吧。
Okay.
但每次我进机场的洗手间，比如机场的小便池，我都会把手机放进口袋，就是出于这个原因。
But I every time I go into an airport bath, like, urinals in an airport, I'm I'm just like, I pocket my phone for that exact reason.
我太担心了，因为如果我的手机掉进公共小便池，那就再也拿不出来了。
I'm so tear because if, like, my phone goes into, like, a public urinal, it's staying there.
不行。
Like, no.
我不会去捞的。
I ain't getting it out.
完了。
It is done.
再见，手机。
Goodbye, phone.
我在想，是不是因为当它掉进海里时，就彻底消失了。
I wonder if if it was because, like, when it dip when it falls into the ocean, like, it's gone.
就像，你根本看不到任何东西。
Like, it ain't you can't see anything.
嗯嗯。
And Mm-mm.
我只是在想，有没有人想过要问问甲板上的船员：飞机去哪儿了？
I I just wonder if it went through anyone's head to just pull one of those, like, like, the the the crew on the deck is like, where where's the plane?
有人会问：什么飞机？
Somebody's like, what plane?
你在说什么？
What are you talking about?
什么？
What?
飞机？
Plane?
根本就没有飞机。
There was no plane.
什么？
What?
不知道。
Don't know.
根本就没有飞机。
There was no plane.
我不确定。
I'm not sure.
抱歉。
Sorry.
还有其他飞机。
There's other planes.
你知道吗？
You know what?
但这里根本没有飞机。
But there was no plane here.
这儿这儿是另一架飞机。
Here here's the here's the other play.
你怎敢这样？
How dare you?
自信的人。
The confident.
你怎敢问我这个问题？
How dare you ask me that?
你就是得带着十足的自信来反驳。
You just gotta come in with, like, full the confident rebuttal.
什么？
What?
你怎敢这样？
How dare you?
两分钟前这里还有一架飞机。
There was a plane here two minutes ago.
不。
No.
他们是什么？
They're what?
我会知道的。
I would know.
我在这里等着。
I I was waiting here.
是为了防止它滚动。
Was to stop it from rolling.
于是机组人员立即行动，呼叫附近船只展开全面搜救行动，但这不仅仅是为了找到仍被困在飞机里的深受喜爱的道格拉斯·韦伯斯特中尉，正如飞机所显示的那样。
So the crew sprang into action, calling nearby ships to launch a full search and rescue operation, but it wasn't just about finding the beloved lieutenant Douglas Webster who was still inside the plane as it's saying.
天哪。
Oh my god.
那是谁？
Who is that?
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
埃德。
Ed.
飞机里有个人。
There's a guy in the plane.
我们没告诉他他还困在飞机里。
We didn't tell him he was still in the plane.
我以为他已经
I thought he was
哦。
oh.
哦，不。
Oh, no.
是的。
Yeah.
哦，不。
Oh, no.
我
I
知道。
know.
剧透警告。
Spoiler alert.
他没有成功
He did not make
做到。
it.
哦。
Oh.
他没有被救回来。
He was not recovered.
这太糟糕了。
That's terrible.
我知道。
I know.
他是唯一的机组人员吗？他是飞机上唯一的人员吗？
Is he the only crew was he the only crew member and the person in the plane?
是的。
Yes.
他是唯一遇难的人。
He's the only one who who perished.
天哪。
Oh my goodness.
机上还有别的东西。
There was also something else on board.
一枚一百万吨当量的核弹。
A one megaton nuclear bomb.
是的。
Yeah.
作为参考，这枚核弹的威力是投在广岛的原子弹的70倍，用德伦·米夫林公司的方式来比喻，就像有人弄丢了一张极其重要的便利贴，而这张便利贴还能瞬间蒸发一座城市。
For reference, that's 70 times more powerful than the bomb dropped on Hiroshima, which to put it in Dunder Mifflin terms is like someone misplacing a really important Post it note if that Post it note could also vaporize a city.
所以这架巨大的飞机，带着这枚超级核弹，还有这个可怜的人，一起坠入了悬崖。
So this whole enormous plane with the super duper nuke and this poor man just go over the edge.
是的。
Yes.
他们直接就从悬崖边掉了下去。
They go they just go right over the edge.
我喜欢你刚才说的那个词——超级核弹。
And I love the term you just said, super duper nuke.
感觉就是这样
It feels like it
我认为这可能是专业术语。
I think that I believe that's the technical term.
是的
Yeah.
你们负责装载这个超级核弹吗？
Do you guys load the super duper nuke?
哦，当然了。
Oh, yeah.
它已经准备就绪了。
It's ready to go.
随后展开了紧急搜寻，但遗憾的是，飞行员和飞机都从未被找到。
So a frantic search followed, but, tragically, neither the pilot nor the aircraft was ever recovered.
他们唯一找到的东西是他头盔，独自漂浮在海面上，这真让人毛骨悚然。
The only thing they found was his helmet bobbing alone on the surface of the ocean, which really sends chills down your spine.
所以事情是这样的。
So here's the thing.
提康德罗加号当时并不是在进行一次普通的巡航。
This was not just a casual cruise that the Ticonderoga was on.
它刚结束在越南的战斗任务，正前往日本进行必要的休整与补给，而就在这时，不可避免的掩盖行动开始了。
It had just wrapped up combat duty in Vietnam and was en route to Japan for some much needed rest and refueling, and that's when the inevitable cover up begins.
让我们先分析一下当时的舆论影响。
So let's break down the optics for a second.
美国航空母舰刚从战场归来，却意外在靠近日本海岸的地方丢失了一枚核弹，而日本这个国家对核武器有着非常特殊的情感。
The US aircraft carrier, fresh from war, accidentally drops a nuclear bomb just off the coast of Japan, a country with, let's say, a very specific set of feelings about nuclear bombs.
这又是1965年，距离二战结束没过多久。
This is again, it's 1965, so not too much time has passed.
另外，我们还签署了一项条约，承诺不会将核武器带近日本海岸。
Oh, and just for some added detail, we had signed a treaty promising we wouldn't bring nukes anywhere near Japanese shores.
所以，是的，这件事肯定不会被轻易接受。
So, yeah, this was not gonna go over well.
这艘船距离日本海岸线是否超过200海里？
Was the ship more than 200 nautical miles off the coastline of Japan?
天哪。
Oh my god.
你是谁？
Who are you?
你这种
What kind of
这是个非常具体的问题。
This is a very specific question.
我之前
I had
我刚看到，每个国家对其海岸线外200海里内的海域都拥有管辖权和主权。
just read that I had just read that every country is responsible and has ownership of the first 200 nautical miles off their shoreline.
如果这起事件发生在日本200海里范围内，那就是严重违规，因为你不是在公海上。
If this was within Japan's 200 nautical miles, that is a very big breach because you're not an open ocean.
是的。
Yeah.
我相信它完全在日本的管辖范围内。
I believe it was well within Japanese jurisdiction.
这看起来非常糟糕。
It was a very bad look.
因此，为了避免负面影响，海军试图掩盖此事。
And so, of course, to avoid the bad look, the navy, tried to cover it up.
他们守口如瓶。
They zipped it up tight lipped.
但正如我们所知，军事秘密最终总会泄露到公众舆论中。
But as we all know, military secrets have a way of slinking into the public zeitgeist eventually.
你们是好的保密者吗？
Are you guys good secret keepers?
你们值得信赖吗？
Are you trustworthy?
锁起来。
Lock it up.
锁起来。
Lock it up.
是的。
Yeah.
但这个秘密我保守不了。
But not I this is not a secret I could keep.
是的。
Yeah.
我会成为举报人。
I would be a whistleblower.
我擅长保守你的秘密、安吉拉的秘密，或者朋友和家人的秘密，还有我自己的秘密。
I'm good at keeping your secrets or Angela's secrets or friends and family secrets, my own secrets.
但如果是你们军方，让我保守‘我们在海里弄丢了一枚核武器’这个秘密，我是不会做的。
But I'm not going to keep your, we lost a nuclear weapon in the ocean secret for you if you're the military.
我就像是那个负责写这份报告的女士一样。
Like I'm going to be the lady who is writing a report on that.
海军在长达十五年多的时间里，以惊人甚至令人恐惧的能力掩盖了这一事件。
The Navy was spectacularly or perhaps frighteningly able to conceal this incident for over fifteen years.
直到1981年，五角大楼才公开了这一事件。
It wasn't until 1981 that the Pentagon disclosed the incident.
《华盛顿邮报》在一份核事故报告中仅用三句话轻描淡写地报道了此事。
The Washington Post reported about it in a mere three sentences buried in a nuclear accidents report.
然而，五角大楼的人也没有费心说明炸弹确切的下落。
However, the folks at the Pentagon also did not bother explaining the details of where exactly the bomb was.
他们最初声称炸弹距离陆地超过500英里。
They first stated that the bomb was more than 500 miles from land.
够模糊了吧？
Vague much?
他们还向所有人保证，由于炸弹位于水下16000英尺处，因此没有危险。
They also assured everyone that the bomb posed no danger since it was 16,000 feet underwater.
但在1989年，环保组织绿色和平组织与海军专家威廉·阿尔金一起曝光了更多海军文件，揭示这枚炸弹实际上是坠落在琉球群岛以西仅70英里的地方，而非之前声称的500英里。
But in 1989, the environmental group Greenpeace, alongside naval expert William Arkin, exposed more naval documents revealing that the bomb was dropped only 70 miles off the coast of the Ryukyu Islands as opposed to the 500 they had said before.
他们还指出，这一事件违反了日本严格的反核政策，并暴露了越南有关核武器的一些重大海军机密。
They also pointed out that this incident violated Japan's strict anti nuclear policies and exposed some serious navy secrets about nuclear weapons in Vietnam.
迫于无奈，五角大楼在同年1989年的一份声明中最终承认了这一巨大失误的全部真相。
With no other choice, the Pentagon finally admitted the whole truth about this gigantic snafu in a statement that same year in 1989.
这是否给美国和日本政府造成了外交问题？
Did this create a diplomatic issue for The United States and the Japanese government
是的。
Yeah.
1989年？
In 1989?
是的。
Yeah.
当然。
For sure.
感觉这些国际事件总是伴随着某种形式的作秀——我们必须这样回应，因为协议要求我们这么做，所以我们必须发表声明，必须说我们很愤怒，然后美国必须做出外交解释并承认责任。
It feels like these international incidents are there's always some measure of just sort of posturing of, like, we have to respond this way because protocol demands it of us, and so we must make these statements, and we must say these thing we must say that we're outraged, and then The US must respond with their, like, diplomatic explanation and acceptance of responsibility.
这一切都像是精心编排好的。
It's like, it's so choreographed, all these things.
整个事情的运作方式真是令人难以置信。
It's very wild how it all works out.
我总是忍不住想，真的有人会对此感到个人层面的愤怒吗？
And then I always wonder, like, does anyone actually take this personally?
如果日本在表达愤怒，‘他们怎么敢？’
If, like, Japan is expressing outrage, like, how dare they?
有没有哪位日本官员真的在个人层面上气得发疯，还是这仅仅是一种宏大的制度性情绪？
Is there any, like, Japanese official who's, like, genuinely pissed, like, at a personal level, or is it just sort of, like, grand institutional emotion?
我也很好奇。
I'm also curious.
那颗超级核弹后来怎么样了？
What what happens to a nuclear a super dupe nuke?
超级超级核弹？
Super duper nuke?
一个超级超级核弹。
A super duper nuke.
它会被加压吗？
Does it get pressurized?
离岸70英里的水有多深？
How deep was the water 70 miles off?
这是个很好的问题，绿色和平组织对此有很多说法。
This is a great question, and Greenpeace had a lot to say about this.
好的。
Okay.
所以当五角大楼在1989年承认此事时，实际上是在回应《新闻周刊》的一篇文章，随后日本媒体转载了这个故事，自然在日本国内引发了巨大震动，这完全合理。
So when the Pentagon admitted this in 1989, they were actually responding to an article in Newsweek, and then Japanese papers picked up the story, which, of course, caused quite a stir throughout Japan itself, rightfully so.
尽管五角大楼确认这枚炸弹不会造成危害——它并未被激活，要真正激活它必须经过一整套复杂的程序——但它仍沉在16000英尺深的海底逐渐腐蚀，这意味着它最终可能分解并开始释放严重的污染物。
Though the Pentagon confirmed that the bomb would not be harmful, it hadn't been armed, and you have to go through a whole bevy of procedural elements to actually arm it, it was still 16,000 feet underwater decaying, which meant it might eventually break down and start to emit serious pollutants.
然而，美国发言人声称这不会对自然世界造成任何伤害。
Yet US spokespersons claimed this wouldn't cause any harm to the natural world.
无论如何，可以说他们正处于风口浪尖上，至少和那枚炸弹内部的核材料一样烫手。
Either way, it was safe to say they were in the hot seat, at least as hot as the nuclear material inside that bomb, shall we say.
因此，尽管许多人对这起重大事故感到愤怒，但更多人感到愤慨的是，这艘船本就不该搭载这枚炸弹。
So while many were rightfully mad about the big kerplunk, more were outraged because, in fact, the ship shouldn't have had the bomb on it in the first place.
是的。
Yes.
事故发生时，日本禁止核武器，而两大强国之间似乎存在一项不成文的协议。
At the time of the incident, Japan had a ban on nuclear weapons, and there was apparently an unspoken agreement between the two world powers.
日本官员故意不询问美国舰船所载货物，而美国方面也从不主动透露任何信息。
Japanese officials would intentionally not ask The US ships what they were carrying, and The US wouldn't volunteer any info either.
这是一种典型的‘不问，不说’式的情况。
It was one of those sort of, like, don't ask, don't tell kinds of situations.
嗯。
Mhmm.
那么到底发生了什么？
So what happened exactly?
这一事件引发了日本通过外交渠道对美军在作战中使用核武器的进一步质疑。
The incident fueled further questions about the use of nuclear weaponry in US combat via diplomatic inquiry from Japan.
它也让人质疑我们在安全协议和标准方面的遵守情况，尤其是在涉及高威力武器和在航空母舰上移动飞机时。
It also called into question how we adhere to certain protocols and standards for safety, especially when it involves high powered weapons and moving planes around aircraft carriers.
而且，你知道，这巩固了长期以来对美国公众隐瞒真相的传统。
Plus, you know, it solidified the long standing tradition of lying to the American public.
自1950年以来，已经发生了多达32起‘断箭’事件。
Since 1950, there have somehow been a whopping 32 Broken Arrow incidents.
这其中包括盗窃事件。
This includes theft.
等等。
Wait.
等等。
Wait.
是的
Yeah.
举手。
Raising hands.
32个超级核弹？
32 super dupe nukes?
超级消失了？
Super Gone?
超级核弹发射器。
Super duper nukers.
32个超级核弹。
32 Super duper nukes.
核武器。
Nuclear weapons.
哎哟哎哟哎哟。
Oy oy oy.
现在我知道为什么他们称之为‘断箭’了。
Now I know why they call it broken arrows.
因为当你这么说的时候，你知道吗？
Because when you say, you know what?
我们有32个断箭。
We have 32 broken arrows.
你会想，哦，你可以说我们有32枚丢失的核武器。
You're like, oh, you can say we have 32 lost nuclear weapons.
你会想，等等。
You're like, wait.
停一下。
Stop.
什么？
What?
再说一遍？
Say again?
委婉语让困难的事情变得容易多了。
Euphemisms make hard things a lot easier.
哦，
Oh,
天啊。
man.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
32个。
32.
这就是为什么格雷格把我们所有出镜的人都叫作糖果袋。
That's why Greg called all of our talking heads candy bags.
你知道的吧？
You know?
我忘了这件事。
I forgot that.
他说他每次给我们一大堆额外的独白时，总是觉得不太好意思。
He said that he always felt bad giving us pages and pages of extra monologues.
所以他想，不如给它们取个有趣的名字。
So he was like, I'll name them something fun.
于是我们就叫它们糖果袋。
So we named them candy bags.
我超爱那些。
I loved those.
我超爱拍那些访谈片段，还想着要编出新的俏皮话，还有糖果袋的各种不同版本，所有那些访谈的变体。
I loved doing those talking heads and, like, coming up with, like, new riffs and, like, the candy bag alts, like, all the different versions of of our talking heads.
就像能一窥编剧们的头脑一样。
Like, just it was like getting a window into the writers' brains.
嗯嗯。
Mhmm.
我只是记得特别喜欢这些笑话的幽默逻辑，总是想着怎么让它们更夸张。
I just remember loving the math of those jokes and, like, always trying to think about how to heighten them.
他们得把我从那些访谈里赶出来。
And they'd have to kick me out of those talking heads.
但说到你的观点，把所有额外的工作称为‘糖果袋’。
But to your point, naming all the extra work a candy bag.
这是一种技巧。
It's a trick.
确实让这些工作更容易接受了。
Definitely made it go down easier.
而且把我们的失误称为‘穿帮镜头’，也让它们听起来有趣多了。
And also calling all our screw ups bloopers makes them sound fun too.
比如，哦，
Like, oh,
那是个失误。
that was a blooper.
就像那是一支断掉的箭。
Like that's just a broken arrow.
我的意思是，就连‘snafu’这个词听起来都有点搞笑。
I mean, even the word snafu is kinda funny.
Snafu？
Snafu?
伙计们，这只是一个失误。
Guys, it's just a snafu.
哎呀。
Oopsie.
哎呀呀。
Oopsie doozy.
是的。
Yeah.
这32起断箭事件包括盗窃、意外引爆，以及完全丢失，比如从提康德罗加号后部滚落的那一起。
So these 32 broken arrow incidents include theft, accidental detonation, and just straight up loss, like the one that rolled off the back of the Ticonderoga.
就像
Like
是的。
Yeah.
我不知道，哪种情况最让我困扰。
I don't know, like, which one bothers me the most.
我不确定是我们丢失了一些，还是被偷了，或是意外引爆了。
I don't know if it's that we lost some, that they were stolen, or accidentally detonated.
这三种情况都发生了。
Like, they're all three of those.
我不知道哪种更糟。
I don't know which one's worse.
我觉得盗窃是最可怕的。
I feel like theft is the scariest.
盗窃。
Theft.
是的。
Yeah.
我也是。
I do too.
下次你觉得自己笨手笨脚把东西弄掉了的时候，想想看，美国海军曾经把一枚完整的氢弹掉进海里，然后十五年里一直用沙子盖着，结果他们居然逃过了惩罚。
The next time you're feeling clumsy for dropping something, just remember that the US Navy dropped an entire hydrogen bomb into the ocean and then kicked sand over it for fifteen years, and they got away with it.
所以这里的教训是，撒谎。
So the the lesson here, guys, is lie.
如果你搞砸了，就撒个谎。
If you mess up, lie about it.
因为十五年就这么过去了。
Because then fifteen years will go by.
这就是教训。
That's the lesson.
这就是关键所在。
That's the takeaway.
十五年过去了，结果根本没人真正在乎。
Fifteen years will go by, and then it's like nobody really gets in trouble.
会有点虚张声势，政府们生气了，互相甩些外交辞令，但其实根本算不上什么事。
There there's a little bit of saber rattling and, like, people get, like, the like, governments get mad and exchange sort of diplomatic, you know, zingers at each other, but it's not really, like, a thing.
所以，是的，我想这就是教训。
So, yeah, I guess that's the lesson.
你们觉得这里还有其他有价值的教训吗？
Do you think there are any other valuable lessons here, guys?
我觉得这还有第二部分。
I think there's a second part to that.
那就是撒谎加时间。
It would be lie plus time.
给它点时间。
Give it time.
让你的谎言持续很久。
Lie for a long with your lie.
我觉得你说的是要把你的谎言深深藏在心里，很久很久，守住这些秘密。
I think what you're saying is hold your lies deep inside of you a really long Hold those secrets.
不是别人的秘密，是你的秘密。
Not other people's secrets, your secrets.
把它们深深藏起来。
Hold them deep.
让它们从内部吞噬你。
Let them devour you from the inside.
真是个积极的信息。
Such a positive message.
我知道。
I know.
没错。
Snap.
哦。
Oh.
好吧。
Alright.
但说真的，这里有什么积极的启示吗？
But see in all seriousness, is there any, like, positive takeaway here?
比如，有没有一种方式可以解读或看待这件事，给我们一些好的教训？
Like, is there a is there a way to frame this or look at this that, like, gives us a a good lesson?
是的。
Yeah.
谢谢，绿色和平组织。
Thank you, Greenpeace.
阿门。
Amen.
谢谢。
Thank you.
我喜欢这个。
I love it.
为某些事情挺身而出并让他人负责，做得好。
Way to stand for something and hold people accountable.
天哪，你在这里真是太好了，否则我们可能根本不会知道。
Like, goodness you're around because maybe we would have never known.
对吧？
Right?
因为他们似乎一直在对这件事发出警告。
Because they seem like they were really sounding the alarm on this.
是的。
Yep.
他们很生气，是的。
They were pissed Yeah.
对所有这些事情。
About all this stuff.
是的
Yeah.
他们很生气。
They were pissed.
嗯哼。
Mhmm.
他们不会让这件事就这么被掩盖过去。
They were not gonna let this just be swept under the rug.
很难相信，尽管五角大楼这么说，但很难相信一枚核导弹只是在海底慢慢腐烂，就完全无害。
It is hard to believe, like, despite what the Pentagon said, it's it's like it's hard to believe that a nuclear missile just decaying on the bottom of the ocean is, like, completely harmless.
确实很难相信。
It's kinda hard to believe.
这完全不合逻辑。
It doesn't make any logical sense.
我的意思是，这对海洋和周围的生态系统会有什么影响？
I mean, what is that gonna do to the ocean and the ecosystem around it?
这可能会杀死几只海星。
It's probably gonna kill a couple of starfish.
它会摧毁一些珊瑚礁。
It's going to take out a few coral reefs.
我还要说，现在泄漏的东西，我不是说就是这枚核弹，但有很多研究都谈到了我们鱼体内的物质。
I would also say that what is leaking there I'm not saying it's this one nuke, but there are all these studies about what's in our fish.
鱼里有各种可怕的重金属？
There's like all like all kinds of scary heavy metals in the fish?
嗯。
Mhmm.
我的意思是，你会拿一枚脏硬币放进一杯水里，让它过夜，然后第二天喝那杯水吗？
I mean, would you take a dirty penny and put it in a glass of water and let it sit overnight and then drink that glass of water the next day?
你不会的。
You wouldn't.
你不会的。
You wouldn't.
我的意思是，拜托。
I mean, come on.
它肯定在下面产生了一些影响。
It's doing something down there for sure.
我能稍微回溯一下吗？
Can I just bring us back for a little callback here?
我认为，与其叫‘断箭’，不如称它们为脏硬币。
I think instead of Broken Arrow, they should be called a dirty penny.
谢谢你，安吉拉。
Thank you, Angela.
我喜欢
I like
用脏硬币来形容你们这些人。
dirty pennies to account for you guys.
是的。
Yeah.
没错。
That's right.
现在告诉我你们在忙什么，以及我们需要留意什么。
Now tell me what you guys are up to and what what we need to look out for you.
《办公室女郎》接下来有什么内容？
What's What's next on Office Ladies?
顺便问一下，你们已经做了多少集，还剩多少集？
How many episodes have you done and how many are left by the way?
我们已经看完了《办公室》的每一集，并且为我们收集到的每一位演员和工作人员的幕后细节和冷知识，为每一集都做了分享。
Well, we have watched every episode of The Office and we have given you all the behind the scenes details and trivia that we have collected from cast and crew members for every single episode.
而且我们每周三还会推出新的剧集。
And we still have new episodes coming out every Wednesday.
太棒了。
Amazing.
我们还有一个完整的《办公室》重看库，每周一播放。
We have our whole Office rewatch library that is playing on Mondays.
每周三，我们都会带来全新的内容，有趣的新料，深入探索办公室的世界以及我们最棒的友谊。
And on Wednesdays, we have all new material, all new fun stuff, diving deeper into the world of the office and our best friendship.
超级有趣。
It's super fun.
来和我们一起放松吧。
Come hang out with us.
是的。
Yeah.
我很想。
I'd love to.
你在开玩笑吧？
Are you kidding me?
詹娜，跟他们说说你的剧。
Jenna, tell them about your play.
说说你的剧吧。
Tell me about your play.
我正在芝加哥的古德曼剧院演出一部名为《阿什兰大道》的剧作。
I am doing a play at the Goodman Theatre in Chicago called Ashland Avenue.
这是由李·柯克创作的世界首演剧目。
It's a world premiere written by Lee Kirk.
你可能听说过他。
You might have heard of him.
哦，是的。
Oh, yeah.
我丈夫娶了这位编剧，没什么大不了的。
My husband married to the writer, No Big Whoop.
这太酷了。
That's so cool.
该剧将于9月6日开始预演，9月15日正式开幕，门票可在goodmantheater.org购买。
And starts previews on September 6 and it opens on September 15 and you can get tickets at goodmantheater.org.
我真的很兴奋。
I'm really excited.
这将是我大约八年来的首次重返舞台。
This will be my first time back on stage in about eight years.
你知道，戏剧是我最初的热爱，所以我非常兴奋。
And you know theater is my first love, so I'm really excited.
这太棒了，珍娜。
That is so cool, Jenna.
我为你和利感到无比兴奋。
I'm so excited for you and Leigh.
这真是太棒了。
That is just awesome.
谢谢你。
Thank you.
这是古德曼剧院成立一百周年。
And this is the Goodman Theater's one hundredth year.
所以这是他们的百年庆典季，我们将以《阿什兰大道》拉开序幕。
So this is their centennial season and we'll be kicking it off with Ashland Avenue.
没什么大不了的。
No big deal.
不过也没什么大不了的。
No big deal though.
安吉拉也有些有趣的新闻。
And Angela's got some fun news as well.
是的。
I do.
你知道吗，我丈夫埃德是个厨师兼面包师，他是自学成才的，非常重视让全家一起下厨、一起烘焙，认为厨房是我们家的心脏。
So you know Ed, my husband's a chef and a baker and he's self taught and he's really big about getting the family in the kitchen and cooking together and baking together, and that the kitchen is the heart of our home.
多年来，他一直在研发食谱，我们一直一起做饭。
He's been making recipes, and we've been cooking together for years now.
他终于把我们全家最爱的食谱整理成了一本食谱书。
And he's finally put all of our favorite family recipes into a cookbook.
这本书叫《你也可以做》，因为这正是他经常对我说和孩子们说的话。
It's called You Can Make This because that's what he says to me and the kids all the time.
他总说，你们都能做出这道菜，而且你们真的可以。
He's like, you guys can make this, and you really can.
所以这本书将在十月出版，真的非常棒。
And so we have that coming out in October, and, it's really great.
它是一本
It's a
很棒的烹饪书。
great, great cookbook.
恭喜你。
Congratulations.
这太酷了。
That's so, so cool.
谢谢。
Thank you.
我很兴奋要告诉你们，我的另一本书《超级无敌烤箱》将在一年后出版。
I'm excited to tell you about my book coming out in a in another year called Super Duper Nuker.
不是
Not
真的。
true.
嘿。
Hey.
你们是最好的，我真的很开心能见到你们，和你们稍微待一会儿。
You guys are the best, and, I am just so, so happy to see you and hang out with you, a little bit.
每次有机会见到你们，都是最棒的。
Every every time I get a chance to see you, it's just the best.
谢谢你们的到来。
Thanks for coming on.
哎呀。
Aw.
谢谢你邀请我们，埃德。
Thanks for having us, Ed.
你太棒了。
You're awesome.
我们爱你。
We love you.
《Snafu》由iHeart播客和Snafu Media联合出品，Snafu Media是Film Nation Entertainment与Pacific Electric Picture Company的合作项目。
Snafu is a production of iHeart Podcasts and Snafu Media, a partnership between Film Nation Entertainment and Pacific Electric Picture Company.
我们的后期制作工作室是Gilded Audio。
Our postproduction studio is Gilded Audio.
我们的执行制片人包括我、埃德·赫尔姆斯、迈克·法尔博、格伦·巴兹纳、安迪·金、惠特尼·唐纳森和迪伦·法根。
Our executive producers are me, Ed Helms, Mike Falbo, Glenn Bazner, Andy Kim, Whitney Donaldson, and Dylan Fagan.
本集由艾莉莎·马丁诺和托里·史密斯制作。
This episode was produced by Alyssa Martino and Tori Smith.
我们的视频剪辑师是杰雷德·史密斯。
Our video editor is Jared Smith.
技术指导与工程由尼克·杜利负责。
Technical direction and engineering from Nick Dooley.
我们的创意总监是布雷特·哈里斯。
Our creative executive is Brett Harris.
标志和品牌设计由The Collected Works提供。
Logo and branding by The Collected Works.
法律审核由丹·威尔士、梅根·哈尔森和卡罗琳·约翰逊负责。
Legal review from Dan Welsh, Megan Halson, and Caroline Johnson.
特别感谢艾萨克·邓汉、亚当·霍恩、莱恩·克莱因以及iHeart Podcasts的全体同仁，尤其感谢威尔·皮尔森、卡莉·利伯曼、妮基·伊托、内森·奥托斯基和亚历克斯·科拉尔。
Special thanks to Isaac Dunham, Adam Horn, Lane Klein, and everyone at iHeart Podcasts, but especially Will Pearson, Carrie Lieberman, Nikki Itor, Nathan Ottoski, and Alex Corral.
趁我现在有空，别忘了买我的书《史上最伟大失误的权威指南》。
While I have you, don't forget to pick of a my book, The Definitive Guide to History's Greatest Screw Ups.
现在任何书店都能买到。
It's available now from any book retailer.
请访问 www.snafubook.com。
Just go to www.snafubook.com.
感谢收听，我们下周见。
Thanks for listening, and see you next week.
嗯，女士，我觉得我学到了很多东西。
Well, lady, I felt like I learned so much.
我之前根本不知道有过这么多断箭事件。
I did not know how many broken arrows there had been.
而且我超爱埃德的播客。
And I love Ed's podcast.
这是它的第四季了。
This is its fourth season.
真的太棒了。
It's just so great.
确实如此。
It really is.
我们喜欢深入探讨。
We love a deep dive.
我喜欢学习新东西。
I love learning new things.
而且埃德非常有魅力，真是双赢。
And plus Ed is so charming, so it's a win win.
你知道吗，他还写了一本书，叫《Snafu：史上最糟糕失误的权威指南》。
You know, he also wrote a book called Snafu, The Definitive Guide to History's Greatest Screw Ups.
这本书是《纽约时报》畅销书，这里有一段关于它的简介。
It's a New York Times bestseller, and here's a little blurb about it.
埃德·赫尔姆斯带你以荒诞有趣的方式了解历史上最大的失误，并配有生动的插图。
Ed Helms brings you an absurdly entertaining look at history's biggest blunders, complete with lively illustrations.
嗯，我们每人有一本，非常棒。
Well, we each have a copy and it's terrific.
确实很棒。
It's terrific.
我们会把链接分享在我们的动态里。
And we'll share a link to it in our stories.
谢谢大家收听。
Well, thanks for listening, everyone.
我们下周再见，届时将为您解析《纸牌屋》第六集。
We'll see you next week as we break down episode six of The Paper.
下次见。
See you next time.
感谢您收听《办公室姐妹》。
Thank you for listening to Office Ladies.
《办公室姐妹》由Odyssey出品，由珍娜·费舍和安吉拉·金西制作。
Office Ladies is a presentation of Odyssey and is produced by Jenna Fischer and Angela Kinsey.
我们的高级制片人是马特·比格尔。
Our senior producer is Matt Beagle.
我们的音频工程师是萨姆·菲弗，联合制片人是艾恩斯利·巴比科。
Our audio engineer is Sam Pfeiffer, and our associate producer is Ainsley Bubbico.
Odyssey的执行制片人是利娅·里斯·丹尼斯。
Odyssey's executive producer is Leah Reese Dennis.
《办公室姐妹》由比尔·舒尔茨混音和母带处理。
Office Ladies was mixed and mastered by Bill Schultz.
我们的主题曲是克里德·布拉顿的《Rupper Tree》。
Our theme song is Rupper Tree by Creed Bratton.
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