505 | Civolution | 评论

大家好，欢迎来到One Stop Co-op Shop，这里是桌游资讯与评测的一站式平台。

Hello, and welcome to One Stop Co op Shop, your one stop for board game news and reviews.

本周，游戏设计师彼得·古苏斯和迈克尔·凯利将共同评测一款合作类游戏，并展开相关的设计讨论。

This week, game designers Peter Goussous and Michael Kelly will review a cooperative game and have a related design discussion.

嗨。

Hey.

我是彼得，我和迈克在这里。

It's Peter, and I'm here with Mike.

大家好。

Hey, everybody.

欢迎收听One Stop Co-op Shop播客。

Welcome to the One Stop Co op Shop podcast.

这期是评测节目，我们要聊的是《Civolution》。

It's a review episode, and we are talking about Civolution.

这是单人模式，至少在我的评测中，它也包含竞争模式。

It's solo mode, and at least for my review, it's competitive mode as well.

我非常兴奋，因为我正在把你培养成一个欧洲风游戏爱好者，迈克。

I am super excited because I'm making you a euro gamer, Mike.

这才是关键所在。

That that's the bottom line here.

也许是我让你成了欧洲风游戏爱好者，因为是我买了这款游戏，也是我把它给了你。

Maybe I'm making you a euro gamer because I'm the one who got this game, and I'm the one who gave it to you.

这没错。

That is true.

好吧，就这样吧。

That alright.

我们就按你的方法来吧，这样你就会继续玩欧洲风游戏了。

We'll we'll go with your way because that way you'll keep playing euro games.

这会让我很开心。

That'll make me happy.

下周，我们会进行一个相关的设计讨论，谈谈Automa整体以及各种实现方式。

And then next week, we'll have a related design discussion talking about just Automa in general and different ways of doing them.

我相信我们过去已经讨论过这个话题了，但这是一个值得反复探索的深刻而丰富的主题。

I'm sure we've talked about that in the past, but it's a deep and varied topic to explore over and over.

是的。

Yeah.

通常，当我们对同一主题进行多次设计讨论时，第一次会非常笼统，然后我们会逐渐聚焦。

Usually, when we have multiple design discussions on the same thing, the first one's very general, and then we, like, narrow in.

我有一些非常具体的想法，想在下一期讨论我的Automa，所以我对此非常期待。

I've got some very specific things that I want in my Automa to talk about next episode, so I'm pretty excited about that.

另外，这一期我们将进行一次盲选排名。

Also, episode, we're gonna have a blind ranking.

哦，这次是你制作的吗？

Oh, are you you making it this time?

我本来打算做一个，但还没实际动手。

I was gonna make one, but I didn't actually do it yet.

好的。

Okay.

如果你做了一个，那我们这期结尾和下期结尾就各有一个了。

Well, if you make one, then we might have one at the end of this episode and the end of next

如果你已经做了一个，我们就直接用你的。

If you already got one, we'll just do yours.

没问题。

That's fine.

但这些都留到下一次再说。

But that's that's all coming next time.

但在我们开始点评《Civilution》以及讨论我们最近玩的一些游戏之前，我想为我们的Patreon做个推广。

But before we get into our review of Civilution and discussing some games we've been playing, I'd like to do a little plug for our Patreon.

我们的Patreon是 patreon.com/1stop。

So we have a Patreon at patreon.com/1stop.

截至十二月，我们现在为赞助者提供了100个独家视频。

As of December, we now have a 100 exclusive videos for patrons.

实际上，我觉得这个月我又做了两个。

Actually, think I did two more for this month.

所以现在有102个独家视频为赞助者提供。

So a 102 exclusive videos for patrons.

其中包括额外的视频，补充到我的2025年最佳40款游戏列表中。

That includes a bunch of extra videos to add on to my top 40 games of 2025 list.

我还额外做了一个关于我的20款热门众筹游戏的视频，这些游戏即将推出，非常有趣。

Had I an extra one that's my top 20 crowdfunding games, which are upcoming, so that's really fun.

还有另一个视频是我列出的第41到55款游戏。

And then another one that was my 41 to 55 games.

所以它们还不够好，没能进入正式榜单。

So they're not quite good enough to get on the real list.

是的。

So, yes.

但我们非常感谢我们的赞助者。

But we appreciate our patrons.

你们帮助我们维持频道的运营。

You help us keep the channel going.

这周，我们要感谢克莱·斯图尔特和尼克·松本。

And this week, we are thanking Clay Stewart and Nick Matsumoto.

所以，克莱和尼克，非常感谢你们的支持。

So Clay and Nick, thank you so much for your support.

感谢我们所有的赞助者。

Thanks to all of our patrons.

即使 Patreon 不在你的预算内，你也可以订阅 YouTube 频道，为播客留下评价，这些都能帮上忙，我们非常感激。

And even if Patreon is not in your budget, you can still subscribe to the YouTube channel, leave a review for the podcast, any of that kind of stuff helps out, and we really appreciate it.

是的。

Yeah.

如果你在 Discord 上，就能听到一些精彩的内容，比如我最近的名字被放进了一个众筹活动，基本上是说：我同意迈克的观点。

Mean, if you're on the Discord, you get to hear wonderful things like how I got my name on a crowdfunding campaign recently, basically saying, I agree with Mike.

所以我的话出现在了那个 Kickstarter 页面上。

So that that was my quote on the the Kickstarter page.

是的。

Yeah.

这是最棒的。

This is the best thing.

所以这是为新的《小英雄》众筹活动做的，这个活动从本视频发布起就已经上线了。

So this is for the the new small time heroes campaign, which is live as of this video.

而且有趣的是，就在我要和彼得开始录制之前，我刚刚玩了他们寄给我的两个新角色之一的原型。

And actually, funny enough, literally before I got on to record with Peter, I was playing the prototype they sent me of one of the two new heroes.

所以，虽然在播客发布时还做不到，但肯定在下周之后，我会对这些新角色做一些预览，它们看起来很棒。

So, not by the time the podcast goes up, but certainly the week after, I will have a preview with some of these new characters, which look great.

但关于这个新活动，彼得，如果你没听到的话，他真的很喜欢《小英雄》——我不会告诉你他具体放在了哪个位置，但我和他在我们的年度最佳游戏播客里都特别喜欢它。

But, yeah, for this new campaign, Peter, if you didn't hear, really likes won't I tell you exactly which place he put it in, but he really likes small time heroes and so did I for our top games of the year podcast.

他们说，哦，我们该怎么……这 literally 就是他们告诉我的话。

And they were like, oh, how do we and and this is literally what they told me.

他们说，哦，我们想一箭双雕。

They were like, oh, we wanted to kill two birds with one stone.

所以他们在页面上放了一条引言，是彼得的，写着：‘我同意迈克说的每一句话。’

So they have a quote on the page that's Peter, and when it says, I agree with everything Mike said.

迈克说了什么？

What did Mike say?

在页面上根本找不到。

Nowhere to be found on the page.

所以你知道，他们本想用一个价格获得两个引语，结果只得到了半句引语。

So, you know, they were trying to get two quotes for the price of one instead, you know, they kinda got half a quote.

那就是

That's

嗯，我觉得他们确实写了类似‘这款游戏很棒’这样的话。

Well, I I do think they said they also put, like, this game's great or something like that in there.

我不觉得他们写了。

I don't think they did.

我

I

哦，那是杰里说的。

Oh, that's what Jerry said.

也许你知道吗？

Maybe You know what?

也许他们加了。

Maybe they added.

也许他们确实加了。

Maybe they did add it.

不管怎样，我们认为这个游戏很棒。

Anyway, we do think the game is great.

回去玩《Small Time Heroes》吧。

Go back Small Time Heroes.

但那不是重点。

But that's beside the point.

我会支持《Small Time Heroes》，因为我知道你会弄到一份，但我自己已经有一份了，我要去

I'm gonna back Small Time Heroes because I know you'll get a copy, but I got my own copy and I'm gonna go

回到是的。

back to Yeah.

是的。

Yeah.

不知道他们会否给我们寄两份《Small Time Heroes》的

Don't know if they'll send us two copies of the

不会。

No.

我也不觉得他们会寄，不过没关系。

I wouldn't imagine they would, which is fine.

我很乐意为这款游戏付费。

I I happily pay for that game.

我买了第一份，也会再买一份。

I paid for the first copy, and I'll pay for another copy.

所以，如果你想知道是哪一集，是我们在年度最佳游戏中的第二集，也就是前半部分。

So, yeah, if you wanna know which episode, it's episode two of our top games of the year, meaning in the top half.

对。

Yes.

我们会给你这一点提示。

We'll we'll give you that much of a clue.

不。

No.

不。

No.

并不意外。

Not surprising.

对我而言，多次英雄已经登场了。

Multi time hero has landed for me.

但是，迈克，我们来聊聊最近玩的其他游戏吧。

But, Mike, let's talk about what else we've been playing lately.

我要从一款游戏开始说起，我们可能两周后会评测它，那就是《Boss Battler QR》。

And I'm gonna start with a game that we're probably gonna review in two weeks from now, which is Boss Battler QR.

《Boss Fighter's QR》。

Boss Fighter's QR.

或者叫Boss Fighter's QR。

Or Boss Fighter's QR.

基本上，你是在抽卡。

Basically, you are taking cards.

我的意思是，它玩起来很像《Splay the Spire》或者《Small Time Heroes》这样的游戏。

Well, I mean, it plays a lot like a game like Splay the Spire, game like Small Time Heroes.

所以我觉得在这里讨论很合适，因为我们刚聊完《Small Time Heroes》，那种游戏就是把卡牌正面打出，每回合通常进行三次行动。

So I think it's appropriate to be talking about here, since we just got done talking about Small Time Heroes, where you're just playing cards out in front of you, you're doing a certain amount of actions, usually three on a turn.

但和那些游戏不同的是，这里的每张卡都只对应一次行动。

Now, unlike those games, really every card is one action.

我从没见过需要更多代价的卡。

I've never seen one that's more expensive.

有时候，它们会让你多进行一次行动。

Sometimes, they'll let you do an extra action.

所以你一回合可能会获得两次行动。

So you might get two actions in an turn.

现在，这款游戏的独特之处在于，当你打出一张牌时，需要扫描二维码，它会自动帮你完成这张牌的大部分效果。

Now, because it's run and and the unique part about this one is you do scan a QR code when you play a card, and it kinda does a lot of automating for you of what that card's supposed to do.

你仍然需要做出选择。

You're still making choices.

你手中仍然持有实体卡牌，但很多复杂的计算工作都由系统自动处理了。

You still have a hand of physical cards, but it's doing a lot of the background mathy stuff for you.

但由于这个机制，这款游戏的一个独特之处是，Boss可能拥有隐藏的特性。

But one of the unique things about this game because of that is there might be hidden traits that the boss has.

它可能会提示：‘你刚打出这张牌？’

And it might say, oh, you just played this card?

受到一些毒伤。

Take some poison damage.

或者你刚打出这张牌？

Or you just played this card?

那么你现在被诅咒了，或者其他类似的效果。

Well, now you're cursed or whatever else.

所以它在推理部分做了一些其他游戏都没有的独特玩法。

So it does some fun stuff with the deduction part that none of those other games really offer.

那么目前就先说到这里。

So that's gonna be it for now.

我不会剧透太多评测内容，但如果你喜欢《Small Time Heroes》或《杀戮尖塔》这类游戏，我想你也会喜欢《Boss Battle or QR》，除非你不喜欢游戏中有应用程序。

I'm not gonna spoil too much of the review, but if you like games like Small Time Heroes or Slay the Spire, I think Boss Battle or QR, you will like as well, unless you don't like apps in your game.

我们看看两周后彼得能不能正确说一次这个名字。

And we'll see if in two weeks, Peter can say the name correctly once.

这是Boss Fighter QR。

It's boss fighter QR.

因为你是在和老板的麦克风战斗。

Because you're fighting boss's mic.

公平地说，这确实是一款打Boss的游戏。

It is a boss battler, to be fair.

我的意思是，你说得也没错。

I mean, you're not wrong.

好吧。

Alright.

所以这是彼得一直在玩的《Boss Fighter QR》。

So that's Peter, one that he's been playing, boss fighter's QR.

而我要聊的是目前正在众筹的一款游戏。

And the one I'm gonna talk about is on crowdfunding now.

这是他们最新的作品，自从我们上次听到这些人的消息已经过去一段时间了，这是来自我们朋友萨德勒兄弟的最新作。

It is the latest, and it's been a little while since we've heard from these guys, the latest from our friends, the Sadler brothers.

布雷迪和亚当推出了一款新游戏，名为《Malice Light Adventures》，目前正在众筹。

Brady and Adam have a new game called the malice Light Adventures on crowdfunding.

其实，你知道吗？

Actually, you know what?

我想还是算了。

I'm thinking no.

现在不是了。

It is not now.

算了。

Never mind.

我这周做了一个关于它的视频，你现在可以去看它实际运行的样子，但我也不确定。

I did a video of it this week, so you can go see it in action now, but I'm not sure.

可能要到一月或二月初它才会正式上线。

It might not be until the January or early February that it is actually live.

但没错，《光明之恶冒险》确实是一款萨德勒兄弟的游戏。

But, yeah, so the Malice of Light adventures, this is very much a Sadler Brothers game.

如果你看过或玩过《祭坛任务》或《街头大师》，你就知道这款游戏想呈现什么风格。

If you have seen or played Altar Quest or Street Masters, you've seen a lot of what this game is going for.

而且，如果你看过他们早年为幻想飞行公司制作的游戏，比如《特伦纳思英雄》或《战锤秘境：冒险卡牌游戏》，也能在里面看到很多相似的元素。

And, also, if you've seen games they worked on, with Fantasy Flight back in the day, Heroes of Terenath or Warhammer quest the adventure card game, it's got a lot of that in there too.

这简直就是所有这些元素的大杂烩。

It's it's like a whole mishmash of all of them.

而且它基于布雷迪·萨德勒创作的奇幻小说系列。

And it is based on the fantasy book series by Brady Sadler.

我觉得现在已经有两本书出版了。

I think two books are out for that now.

我正在读第一本，实际上还挺享受的。

I'm in the middle of reading the first one and actually enjoying it quite a bit.

它就像我所说的，是一种混合体，你有类似《Terenath英雄》的机制，角色拥有某些独特的行动卡，每张卡执行特定类型的动作，每回合选一张。

It's got it it is, like I said, a very much a mix because you have sort of the Heroes of Teranoth thing where you have, like, action cards for your character that are somewhat unique but do these specific types of actions, and you pick one a turn.

但同时也有类似《Street Masters》的机制，你可以移动并每回合使用一张卡。

Then But you have kind of the street masters thing where you can, like, move and do, like, one card play a turn.

但作为一款终极任务类游戏，它还加入了爆炸骰子这样的机制。

But then as an ultra questist mechanic too, it's got out there, you know, exploding dice.

每个骰子都会带来某种效果。

Every die gives you something.

没有完全失败的机制。

There are no full on misses mechanic.

它具有极高的可扩展性，你可以任意组合地图、场景、首领和英雄。

You know, it's got tons of modularity, like you can mix any maps and scenarios with any bosses, with any heroes.

所以如果你喜欢他们的游戏，我相信你一定会喜欢这一款。

So if you like their games, I'm sure you're gonna enjoy this one.

我预览时最大的担忧是，你可以在视频里看到我更详细地谈到这一点，那就是——这通常是他们游戏面临的问题：平衡性还不够好。

The one big concern with my preview, and you can see me talk about it more in the video, is that and this is, you know, something that often their games have challenges with, is that the balance is not quite there yet.

我认为在某些玩家人数下，游戏太简单了，而且升级也太过容易。

It's way too easy, I think, at certain player counts, and you can level up too easily.

如果他们能解决这个问题，或者像他们一贯做的那样增加可调节性，提供一些让游戏变难的选项，并明确告诉你应该把难度设到什么程度，给出清晰的指引，

And if they can fix that or, you know, just add modularities like they like to do and give you ways to make the game harder and make it kinda clear how hard you should make it, give you some clarity and, like, direction for that.

我觉得这款游戏会非常出色。

I think it could be awesome.

我玩的时候确实很享受。

I certainly enjoyed playing it.

但如果他们不再继续开发这款游戏，

But if they don't, they don't get more development on it.

它可能会像《Ultra Quest》一样，最终版本对我来说并不是完全成功的作品，因为有些地方感觉不太对劲。

It could be another one like Ultra Quest that in the final version was not a complete hit for me just because some things didn't feel quite right.

所以我们拭目以待。

So we shall see.

但这个项目很快就会启动众筹。

But that will be on crowdfunding soon.

这就是《光明之恶意冒险》。

That is the Malice of Light Adventures.

太棒了。

Awesome.

好的，迈克。

Alright, Mike.

想开始我们的特色评测《Civolution》吗？

Wanna get into our feature review of Civolution?

是的。

Yeah.

那么，彼得，这个游戏的主题是什么？

So, what's the theme, Peter?

实际上，我们来看看你知不知道这个主题，因为它太疯狂了。

Actually, let's see if you know the theme because it's insane.

你知道这个主题是什么吗？

Do you know what the theme is?

我真不知道这个主题是什么，但我觉得这是一款轻量级的文明游戏。

I actually have no idea what the theme is, but it is a civilization light game, I would say.

这里的‘轻量级’不是指游戏本身重量轻，而是指棋盘上几乎没有冲突。

And not light in the fact that the weight of the game is light, but light in the fact that there's not really a lot of conflict on the board.

你更多的是在世界各地探索，发展你的文明，建造农场来养活人民，狩猎获取食物，探索不同区域以了解周围的情况。

You're really more exploring around the world, building up your civilization, building farms to feed your people, hunting for food, exploring different areas to see what's around.

所以，如果你想要一款‘地图上的人偶’类型、充满战斗的游戏，那就不是这个。

So if you want a Dudes on a map game where you're fighting, it is not that.

如果你想要一款大量升级科技树的游戏，那也不一定就是这个。

If you want a tech tree game where you're leveling up a lot, like, it's not that necessarily.

不过，我将在我的评测中稍微谈一下这一点。

Although, I will talk about that a little in my review.

但这确实是一款以文明为主题的游戏。

But it is a civilization themed game.

你就像地图上四处游走、不断扩张的一个部落。

Like, you're definitely like a tribe on the map running around and expanding.

所以这就是我所理解的主题。

So that's the theme as I know it.

但根据规则书，这到底是什么，迈克？

But what is it from the rule book, Mike?

这有点难解释，但你就像正在修行的神明，练习着创造属于自己的世界和文明，引导着你的人类，或者不管那些外星人是什么。

So it's it's a little hard to explain, but you're like gods in training, and you are like practicing making and creating your own world and civilization and like shepherding your humans or, you know, whatever aliens they are.

你努力成为最优秀的神明，以便赢得创造自己世界的特权。

And you're trying to be, like, the best god so you can actually win the privilege to create your own world.

所以这几乎就像《Populous》如果……

So it's almost like Populous if you

我正想说，你玩过《Populous》吗？

I was just about to say, have you ever played Populous?

没有。

No.

没有。

No.

你并没有像在那款游戏中那样从地面上升起山脉。

You're not raising mountains out of the ground like you were in that game.

但你可以塑造地形或引发飓风，就像《Populous》那样。

But shaping the land or causing hurricanes like Populus.

而且，你们之间其实并不是对抗关系。

And also, you're not really against each other.

这更像是一种友好的竞争，本质上是一种教育性的体验，就像你在神学校里学习一样。

It it's supposed to be kind of a friendly competition, and it's supposed to be like an educational thing like you're in god school, basically.

这简直是个疯狂的窃贼。

It's a wacky thief.

无论如何，从机制上讲，这是一款斯蒂芬·菲尔德的游戏，我相信彼得和我都会在评测中详细讨论这个机制。

Anyway, mechanically, this is a Stefan Feld game, and I'm sure Peter and I will both get into this mechanic in our review.

但你会掷骰子并将它们放在你的棋盘上，根据不同的点数，然后使用两颗骰子。

But you are rolling dice and placing them on your board with their different values, and then you spend two dice.

如果你去观看我频道里的实况视频，就会更清楚了。

And if you go watch my playthrough video on the channel, this will make more sense.

但骰子点数的组合会决定你用这两颗骰子执行什么行动，比如移动你的角色或收集食物，所有这些都属于文明发展的内容。

But the intersection of the values gonna determine what action you do with those two dice, moving your people around or collecting food, all those kind of civilization things.

当你差不多用完骰子后，就需要执行一次重置操作，就像很多游戏中那样，把骰子收回来重新掷。

Then after you have kinda run out of dice, you have to do this reset action like in a lot of your games where you pull your dice back and reroll them.

当重置次数足够多时，就会结束一个时代，而这款游戏共有四个时代。

And when there have been enough resets, you will finish one of the eras, and the game is four eras long.

每个时代结束后都会进行计分，这些计分目标会不断变化，最后在游戏结束时还会进行最终计分。

And you get scoring after each era, and these are kinda changing scoring goals and then scoring at the end of the game.

你还会将卡牌和标记放入这个小小的开发区域，这有点像科技树的机制。

You're also slotting cards and chits into this little, like, development area, which is kind of the tech tree ish aspect.

所以这确实是对文明类游戏的一种奇特演绎，但我们还是来深入看看吧。

So it's it's definitely an odd take on, civilization games, but let's get into it.

彼得，你先说说你的第五点吗？

And, Peter, you wanna start with your number five?

或者，哦，我想我们应该说，如果你之前没听过，谢谢收听。

Or oh, I guess we should say, if you haven't listened before, thanks.

我们的风格是，每个人都会谈谈游戏中五个关键方面或令人印象深刻的地方，无论是好、坏还是居中，最后我们会分享最终想法。

Our style is that we're each gonna talk about five key aspects or things that stand out about the game, good, bad, or something in the middle, and then we'll end with our final thoughts.

所以，彼得，第五点。

So, Peter, number five.

好的。

Alright.

我的第五点是游戏的主要机制。

So my number five is the main action in the game.

但你可能想不到，我最初列清单时，这个根本没进我的前五。

And believe it or not, when I originally made my list, this didn't even make my list of five things.

这说明我觉得它在我心中的优先级非常低，就是骰子激活系统以及伴随的迷你机制。

That's how low I feel like this is in a priority for me, and that's the dice activation system and the mini that goes along with it.

这几乎是你列表里的第五名了。

That's your number five almost off the list.

差点就更高了

Almost and it would higher

对我来说是更高，但对我来说更高。

for me, but it's higher for me.

是的。

Yeah.

这是因为，虽然我觉得骰子的机制很酷，而且觉得你能通过代币上下调整一点也很有意思。

And that's because for me, while I think it's cool what the dice do, and I think it's neat that you're like mitigating, there's chits that let you go up or down one.

有一些方式可以给你免费的骰子，而你确实是在使用这些骰子。

There's ways to give you, like, a free dice, and you're using the dice.

你基本上是在取两个数字的交集，就像迈克说的，来选择你的行动。

You're basically taking the intersection of two numbers, like Mike said, to pick your action.

老实说，是的，在某种程度上它确实影响了你的行动和你所做的事情，但对我来说，其他方面对你所做的事情影响更大。

Honestly, yes, to some degree it shapes your actions and what you're doing, but the other things are more impactful for me for what you're doing.

我经常为骰子设计很多变通方法，或者与骰子配合使用。

Like, I do a lot of workarounds for the dice, or working with the dice.

我觉得这为游戏增添了一种有趣的随机性。

I think it adds a cool element of randomness.

我之前和杰里讨论这个游戏时，把它和《奥丁盛宴》做了比较，那款游戏在行动上完全没有随机性。

I I compared it to Feast for Odin when I was talking about this game with Jerry earlier, where there's no randomness in the actions.

某种程度上，我觉得正因为如此，游戏会变得乏味。

And to some degree, I feel like it gets stale because of that.

我认为骰子在这里确实带来了一些东西——你无法总是做自己想做的事，必须解开谜题，想办法让骰子发挥作用。

I think the dice do add something here with the you can't always do exactly what you wanna do, or you have to work out the puzzle to figure out how to make the dice work.

但我觉得，在我思考这个游戏时，还有些东西重要得多、影响也大得多；对我而言，骰子只是我必须应对和调整的部分，并不是我玩这个游戏时首先想到的东西。

But there are things I think that are so much more important and so much more impactful when I think of this game that the dice for me are something that, yes, I have to work with and mitigate, but they're not the thing I think of when I think of playing this game.

我觉得你是个疯子，不过这挺酷的。

Well, I think you're a madman, but that's cool.

我们来看看第五项。

Let's see this number five.

我的第五点是关于单人模式，因为我经常玩单人模式，也玩过竞技模式。

My number five is where I talk about the solo mode because I played this one a lot solo and also competitively.

这对我来说完全是优点。

And this is a full pro for me.

这将在我们下周的设计讨论中提到，但我知道，对于所有这类单人模式，总会有一些小抱怨。

This is gonna go into our design discussion next week, but I think there are know, for all these kind of solo modes, there's always gonna be some some little complaints.

我认为这个问题最大的一点是，游戏结果可能有点波动。

I think the biggest one for this one is that it can be a little swingy.

当你需要移动他们的工人时，得掷好几次骰子。

And when you have to move their workers, it, like, takes a few die rolls.

这其实没那么烦人。

It's, like, not it's not that annoying.

这并不复杂。

It's not complicated.

它不像机器人或硬币游戏的机器人那样，但你确实得掷几次骰子，琢磨一些事情，还要看一个小小的圆形图表。

It's not like a root bot or a coin game bot, but you do have to roll some dice and figure out a few things and like look at a little circular charty kind of thing.

但除此之外，我觉得它玩起来非常流畅。

But besides that, I think it plays super smoothly.

你所做的就是为他们翻一张牌，这张牌会告诉你他们要采取什么行动。

What you're doing is you are flipping a card for them, and it's gonna tell you what action they're taking.

而且它在基本层面上相当智能，因为你有一些主要得分目标之类的设定。

And it's pretty intelligent in a in a basic way because you have things that are being the primary score, like, kind of goals.

我的意思是，每轮它都会给你额外加分，而且他们的很多卡牌都会围绕这些核心得分目标来设计。

I mean, it'll score you extra points each round, and a lot of their cards will key off of what those core scoring goals are.

所以他们会智能地与你竞争这些关键得分点。

So they are intelligently competing against you for these key things that are going to score a lot of points.

但你只需翻牌即可，如果每张牌上都有两个不同颜色的小圆圈的话。

But you just flip the card, and if they if each of the cards has these two different colored, like, little circles on them.

当你集齐足够数量的两种颜色时，他们就不会执行这张牌的效果，而是跳过回合并弃掉所有手牌。

And when you get enough of both colors, then they actually don't resolve the card and they skip their turn and they discard all their cards.

因此，结算非常快，回合也很迅速，尽管存在一些轻微的波动性和对AI行为的考量。

So very quick to resolve, very quick turns, like, with minor swinginess and figuring out what they do, concerns aside.

我认为这个单人模式非常扎实，因为对手仍然像一个玩家一样行动。

I think this is a really solid solo mode where they are still acting as a player.

有时候单人模式为了模拟玩家会变得过于复杂，但我觉得这里并非如此。

Because sometimes those can get way too complicated, the solo mode, to try to sort of imitate a player, and I do not think that is the case here.

我很喜欢单人玩法。

I like the solo play a lot.

是的。

Yeah.

我的第四点是Automa，和迈克刚才说的非常相似。

And my number four is the Automa, so very similar to everything Mike just said.

但我还想补充几点。

But I will add in a couple things.

第一，有简单和困难两种模式，而困难模式就是，卡片左边和右边不同。

Number one, there are easier and harder modes, and basically, the harder mode is, you know, there's a left side of the card and a right side of the card.

左边是蓝色，右边是红色。

The left side's blue, the right side's red.

其实没什么关系。

Doesn't really matter.

只是红色那一边更难。

Just the red the red side is harder.

右边更难。

The right side's harder.

所以你刚开始玩的时候，用的是所有蓝色的简单模式，而游戏中有四个时代。

So when you first play it, you're playing with all the blue easy sides, and then there are four ages in the game.

到了第四个时代，如果你把难度调成红色，就会稍微难一点。

During the fourth age, if you add in make it red, then that'll be a little bit harder.

然后你可以选择在两个时代、三个时代或四个时代都使用红色模式，如果你足够勇敢的话。

Then you can do it for two ages, three ages, four ages, if you're really that brave.

但说实话，这对机器人行为的影响其实不大。

But honestly, doesn't really do a whole lot to affect what the bot is doing.

大多数时候，它只是给机器人更多分数而已。

It's really just giving them more points most of the time.

往上推进一格，稍微多给一点分数，这里或那里加一点。

Moving up a track, maybe a little bit more, giving them a few more points here or there.

这通常不会改变他们的行为。

It doesn't often change what they're doing.

所以，我觉得这并没有那么令人满意。

So I I did not find that to be as satisfying.

但我要说的是，Automa 和这个机器人表现得非常好。

But what I will say, the Automa and the bot does really well.

正如迈克所说，它模拟了一个玩家。

It simulates a person, as Mike said.

如果你想要玩这个游戏，想独自玩，只关心自己的部分，而大多数最好的游戏都是如此——我只关注我自己的行动，让机器人稍微干扰一下，但不要完全妨碍我。

If you wanna play this game, you wanna play it solo, you only care about your side, which most of the best games have is, like, I just care about what I'm doing, and let's let the bot, you know, interrupt me a little bit, but not totally get in my way.

正如迈克所说，这个机器人非常简单地做到了这一点。

The bot does a great job of that, as Mike said, very, very simplistically.

我自己在 Automa 中喜欢的一些功能，这个版本没有，但我们下周再聊这些。

There are some things I like in Automa myself that this doesn't have, but we'll talk about those things next week.

但如果你只是想要一个简单、能有效阻挡的系统，它确实能完成任务。

But if you just want something simple that blocks and it it does its job.

老实说，这对我来说就是关键所在。

Honestly, that that's the bottom line for me.

我会经常独自玩这个游戏，可能比玩多人模式的次数还要多。

I will play this game solo quite a bit, probably more than I'll ever play at multiplayer.

我可能已经独自玩得比将来任何一次多人游戏都多了，因为我认为这款游戏很难凑齐人一起玩，人多时耗时更长，即使独自玩也相当费时。

I probably already have played it more solo than I ever will play at multiplayer just because I think it'll be a hard game to get to the table because it's longer with more players, and it's a fairly long game even solo.

但我足够喜欢它，所以还是会不断把它拿出来玩。

But I enjoy it enough that I keep getting it to the table.

所以Automa系统在我排名中排第四，高于骰子激活系统，因为我觉得Automa相当不错，它会让我不断把这款游戏拿出来玩。

So the Automa is high on number four on my list, higher than the dice activation system because I think the Automa is pretty good and it's gonna keep getting it to the table for me.

这就是我的第四点：Automa系统。

So that's my number four point, the Automa.

我会继续为每一个排名理由辩护，说明它为什么比骰子系统更好

And I'm just gonna keep justifying every number why it's better than the dice by the

好的，兄弟。

Alright, man.

对。

Yes.

所以我的第四点直接呼应了彼得刚才说的，因为彼得说得对。

So my number four does go directly to something Peter just said because Peter's right.

没有像不同派系那样的机制，或者改变终极目标的方式，除了给它们更强的行动能力。

There are no, like, different factions or ways to alter the Ultima besides giving them stronger activations.

但我认为，我的第四点——得分的多样性，在游戏中确实很不错。

But I do think that my number four, the scoring variety is quite good in the game.

所以，正如我之前提到的，游戏中每个时代——也就是每个大的整体回合——都会随机抽取一个令牌。

So as I mentioned already, you're going to get a random token for each era in the game, each of, like, the big overall rounds.

在那个时代结束时，你会因为拥有大量这类物品而获得大量分数，尤其是在前几个区域。

And at the end of that era, you get a ton of points for having, especially in the first couple areas, a ton of points for having more of those things.

不过，这些物品在游戏结束时还会再次计分。

Now those things also get scored again at the end of the game.

比如你在某些科技轨道上的位置有多高，或者你在地图上推进了多远，这类因素。

It's it's stuff like how high you are in certain tech tracks or how far you've advanced around on the map, those kind of things.

但至少我发现，我会因为这些分数影响巨大而频繁调整自己的玩法，去追逐这些基于错误的得分机制，尤其是在游戏前半段，这些分数非常宝贵，确实会在很大程度上左右我的策略。

But I I find at least that I change my play quite a lot because these points are so impactful to try to chase down those error based scoring things, which means, especially the first half of the game when they're so valuable, it really does control my play a bit.

我最喜欢欧式游戏的一点，就是每局游戏都有不同的体验。

And one of the things I like best about Euros is having variety play to play.

你知道，这款游戏没有不同的派系——这可能是我最喜欢的欧式游戏设计方式，也没有不同的Automa派系，但它确实让每局游戏的目标都大不相同。

You know, this one doesn't have, different factions, which is maybe my favorite way for Euros to do it or different Automa factions, but it does have really different things you're going for game to game.

甚至在游戏结束时，一些其他标记的得分也会比平常高出一倍。

And even at the end of the game, some of the other tokens are gonna score more than usual, double what they usually would.

所以我觉得这款游戏会引导你走向不同的方向，真正改变了你对卡牌的重视程度，以及对地图控制的在意程度。

So I just feel like the game pushes you in different directions, and it really changes how much you care about cards, how much you care about map presence.

它在很多方面都会改变你的玩法。

It it changes your play in quite a lot of ways.

不过我不想把这一点夸大其词。

Now I don't wanna oversell this.

它是我排第四的游戏，因为到最后，你可能什么都得做一点，而每件事都能给你带来分数。

It is my number four because in the end, like, you're probably gonna do a little bit of everything and everything scores you points.

所以这并不是说你在玩一个完全不同的游戏，或者遵循完全不同的策略。

So it's not like you're playing a completely different game and following completely different strategies.

但作为一个文明类游戏，我不介意这样。

But for a civilization game, I don't mind that.

我想稍微发展一下科技树。

I I wanna be doing a little bit of tech tree.

我想稍微做一些扩张。

I wanna be doing a little bit expansion.

我觉得，如果我真的可以只玩卡牌，完全不碰筛子机制，也不获取任何食物，却依然能赢，那会很无聊，因为游戏竟然允许这种胜利路径。

Like, I think it'd be boring if I could literally just do cards and not do any sieve stuff and not to get any food and somehow win because the game, like, allowed that as a victory path.

所以，是的，这些得分目标，我特别喜欢第四项。

So, yeah, the scoring goals, number four, like them a lot.

好的。

Alright.

我完全同意你的每一个观点，只是你会把掷骰子排在第一，而它是我排在第五的。

I'm just gonna follow you on every point, except you're gonna have dice rolling as number one, and it was my number five.

我排第三的是什么？

So my number three What?

你排第三的真的是得分吗？

Is your three number really the scoring?

我排第三的是目标，包括个人目标和事件类目标。

My number three is the goals, both the personal goals and the event based goals.

迈克没怎么谈个人目标，所以我来稍微说一下。

So Mike didn't talk much about the personal goals, so I'll get into that a little bit.

但首先，关于事件类目标，我完全同意迈克的说法。

But first, the event based goals, I agree with what Mike said wholeheartedly.

游戏中有两件事你其实不太在意。

There are two things that you don't really care as much about during the game.

我还发现，我特别注重前两轮的得分，因为它们能给你很多分数。

And then what I also find is I really try to focus on that first and second round scoring because they score you a lot of points.

所以我认为这很有影响力，有点像《盖亚计划》中的情况。

And so I do think it's impactful, kinda like it is in Gaia Project.

这让我想起了《盖亚计划》，因为它为你提供了这一轮需要完成的目标，以及在这一时代需要专注的事情。

This reminds me of Gaia Project a lot because it gives you goals to do for that round, things to focus on for that one era.

此外，你还有长期目标，也就是终局目标。

And then you also have long term goals, which are the end game goals as well.

所以，是的，我想关注这些终局目标，但一旦我得分了钻石或完成了某条轨道，随着游戏进行，我就不太在意它了，而早期我可能会全力投入以在该轨道上获取大量分数。

So, yes, I wanna focus on those end game goals, but once I score diamonds or I score one of the tracks, I care less about it as the game goes on, whereas I really may have focused on it hard early to get a bunch of points in that track.

因此，正如迈克所说，我认为这很好地引导了你该往哪个方向发展。

So I do, like Mike said, think this is a great job of, like, guiding you on which way to go.

但除此之外，你还会获得个人目标。

But in addition to that, you get personal goals as well.

游戏开始时你会获得一个。

You start off with one at the beginning of the game.

在每个时代的开始，你还可以免费获得一个。

You can get one for free at the beginning of each era.

你还可以通过骰子操作，在自己的版图上达成这些目标。

There are ways in your dice manipulation to get those goals as well on your board.

这些目标可能是把一些人放在洞穴旁边，或者把一些人放在山里，或者其他类似的事情。

And they may be things like get some people next to a cave, or get some people in the mountains, or whatever else.

因此，它们也在一定程度上决定了你这一轮想做什么。

So they're also dictating a little bit what you wanna do in the round.

所以，这些不同的目标之间存在着一种拉扯，把你往不同的方向牵引。

So there's a pull between a lot of these different things that are pulling you in different ways.

天哪。

It's like, oh, man.

我真的很想拿到这个金芯片，因为金芯片的大小只有普通芯片的一半。

I really wanna get this gold chip scored because gold chips are, like, half the size of normal chips.

所以你可以在一轮中结算两次，而且它们不会像其他一些卡牌那样随着等级提升而变得更贵。

So you can score them twice in a round, and you don't have to they're not, like, more expensive as you go up, which some of these other cards get more expensive as you go up.

因此，这是一种很好的方式，既能获得终局得分，又能升级你的一些标记物。

So it's a good way to score end game scoring points, plus it lets you upgrade some of your chits as well.

当你完成这些目标时，你会提升你的行动能力。

As as you complete these goals, you're upgrading your actions.

所以，一个在游戏初期只能提供三个骰子操作机会的行动，现在能提供六个。

So an action that might have given you, you know, three dice manipulation things at the beginning of the game now gives you six.

这种短期和长期目标如何深刻影响你的决策，真的非常巧妙，我觉得很多游戏都缺少这种设计。

So it's really just neat how these short term and long term goals really do dictate a lot of what you're doing, and I think some games are missing that.

我之前提到过《奥丁盛宴》中的《旅程》，这是我非常喜爱的游戏，但我发现每次玩时我都会采取相似的策略，而这款游戏却给了我不同玩法的理由。

Again, I was talking about Journey for Feast for Odin, which is a game I love love love, but I do find that I tend to play similarly each time I play, whereas this one gives me reasons to do things differently.

即使抛开骰子操作，这一点也深深印在我的脑海中，因为我必须利用骰子机制来实现这些目标。

Again, this sticks out in my mind even above the dice manipulation, because I have to use that dice stuff to figure out how to make these goals work.

这不是反过来的。

It's not the other way around.

并不是说，我只是按骰子显示的去做。

It's not like, well, I'm just doing whatever's on my dice.

不是的。

No.

我正在做一些事情，目的是达成这些目标。

I'm doing things to try to get to these goals.

这就是为什么这一点让我印象如此深刻。

So that's why that one sticks out of my mind.

这是第三点。

That's number three.

是的。

Yeah.

而且它还让我在达到第三点之前，想起我们2025年最佳游戏榜单。

And it also makes me before I get to my number three, it makes me think of just calling back to our top games of 2025 list.

你和我一样喜欢《奇妙生物》，但你主要的抱怨是，你追求的目标卡其实都可以互换。

What you you you loved wondrous creatures just like I did, but your one of your big complaints was that the objective cards you're going after really are interchangeable.

比如，这一局黑色比红色强，下一局红色又比黑色强。

It's like, okay, this game, black's better than red, but the next game red's better than black.

谁在乎呢？

Like, who cares?