布罗克利和莱迪韦尔，由哈娜·萨奇主持

这个BBC播客由英国境外的广告支持。

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside The UK.

那是2009年，我们在德国的山区。

It's 2009, and we're in the German mountains.

一名男子把自己绑在了全球最危险的赛道上的一辆汽车里。

A man straps himself into a car on the world's most dangerous racetrack.

他低声对自己说。

He whispers to himself.

是时候把我的睾丸放在仪表盘上了。

It's time to put my balls on the dashboard.

当他启动引擎时。

As he starts the engine.

十五分钟后，他被送进救护车，失去意识。

In fifteen minutes, he's in an ambulance, unconscious.

十五年后，他成了亿万富翁。

In fifteen years, he's a billionaire.

这是托托·沃尔夫，F1最具权势的车队老板，也是《极速求生》中的明星人物。

This is Toto Wolff, Formula One's most powerful team boss and the breakout star of Drive to Survive.

本周《好与坏的亿万富翁》，讲述托托·沃尔夫如何赚到他的亿万财富。

This week on Good Bad Billionaire, how Toto Wolff made his billions.

在您收听BBC播客的任何平台都能收听。

Listen wherever you get your BBC podcasts.

她对我说：‘在墓地的门口见我。’

Meet me at the gates to the cemetery, she said.

听起来像是某种哥特式恐怖小说的开头，但汉娜·萨奇却约我在伦敦东南部刘易舍姆区的墓地门口见面。

Sounds like the start of some sort of gothic macabre novel, but Hana Sutch is meeting me at the gates to the cemetery in the borough of Lewisham in Southeast London.

我乘火车到达了莱迪威尔车站。

I've come in by train to Ladywell Station.

汉娜，这确实是你的地盘。

Hana, this is very much your home territory.

是的。

Yeah.

我喜欢称这里为我的自然家园。

This is my naturehood, as I like to call it.

今天，我带你逛逛大布罗克利区。

And today, I'm gonna take you on a wander around Greater Brockley.

我们将讨论即使生活在城市环境中，发现绿色空间的乐趣，因为哈娜，你创建了一个名为Go Jauntly的应用程序，它能让人轻松找到附近的步行路线。

And we're gonna discuss the joy of finding your green spaces even if you live in an urban environment because, Hana, you set up an app called Go Jauntly, which is a really simple way of connect people being able to connect to a local walk.

可能只有两英里、三英里。

It might only be two miles, three miles.

嗯。

Mhmm.

今天，我想我们走四英里左右。

Today, we're gonna do four, I think.

是的。

Yeah.

我们会把这段路程拉长一点，这样我就能多和你待一会儿。

We're gonna we're gonna stretch this one out so that I get to spend as much time with you as possible.

但没错，Go Jauntly 的理念其实是帮助城市居民走出家门，享受家门口的自然风光。

But, yeah, the idea behind Go Jauntly was really to help urban city dwellers get out and about enjoying nature on their doorstep.

但很早我就意识到，伦敦实际上有 47% 的绿地，我希望每个人都能尽可能多地体验这些地方。

But very early on, I realized that London is actually 47% green space, and I wanted everyone to experience as much of it as possible.

如果你想要在地图上跟随我们的路线，但又没有这个应用，那就是这里。

If you want to follow us on the map, if you don't have the app, this is.

我们现在位于 OS Explorer 162 号地图上，覆盖格林威治和格雷夫森德，包括刘易舍姆、莱德威尔、布罗克利等区域。

We're on OS Explorer one six two, which is Greenwich and Gravesend, and it includes Lewisham, Ladywell, Brockley, all of those.

所以网格坐标是 TQ 371749，或者用 what3words 来说，我们位于 junior foam crust。

So grid reference, t q three seven one seven four nine or on what three words we are junior foam crust.

太棒了。

Amazing.

好的。

Right.

那你就要丢下我了。

You're gonna leave me then.

所以是一条环形步道。

So a circular walk.

你们应用里规划的大多数步道，是否都容易到达，并能安全地带你回到起点？

And are most of the walks that you plan on your app, are most of them easy to access and then get you back safely to where you started?

我们提供多种多样的步道。

We have a wide variety of walks.

我个人特别喜欢环形步道，因为如果你从火车站、公交站出发，或者开车前来，这种路线非常方便。

I definitely personally prefer circular walks because they're really helpful if you're starting and ending at a train station, a bus stop, or perhaps you've like taken the car.

但我们也有直线步道。

But we do have linear walks.

只要直线步道的终点有继续前行的去处，我觉得这就很有帮助。

So as long as there's an onward place to go at the end of the linear walk, I find that's really helpful.

我们马上要穿过这条主干道，走人行横道，然后进入一个公园，前面有一段平缓的上坡。

We're just gonna cross this main road at a pedestrian crossing and head up into a park, a gentle rise ahead of us.

往上走。

Up.

我们出发吧。

Here we go.

我认为公园和绿地的好处是，你可以全程走在柏油路上。

I think the the good thing about parks and green spaces is that you can go all along tarmac.

当我们规划路线时，我们会尽量告诉用户预期的地形情况。

And when we create our walks, we try and let people know, like, what terrain to expect.

因为如果你是午休时散步，而且在上班，可能不想把鞋子弄得太脏。

Because if you're going on a lunchtime walk and you're at work, you might not be able to get all of your shoes really muddy.

所以你不需要买登山靴、登山裤或登山杖。

So you don't have to buy walking boots or walking trousers or poles.

我已经被训练得习惯性地穿上登山裤和登山靴了。

I'm sort of conditioned to still put my walking trousers on and my walking boots.

但你也可以是去开会。

But but you could be going to a to a meeting.

你也可以是去酒吧。

You could be going to the pub.

你可以做任何事，穿着七分长度的鲱鱼纹大衣，牛仔裤一穿，说走就走。

You could be doing anything, and you've got a three quarter length herringbone coat, you got jeans on, and away we go.

是的。

Yeah.

我觉得在过去，很多徒步类应用

And I think in the past, like a lot

主要针对的都是那些已经体能良好、自信的山地徒步者，但这类人并不是大多数。

of the sort of walking apps that were out there, they were really sort of targeted at you're already fit, confident hill hikers, and that's not the majority of people.

所以我觉得它必须尽可能地平易近人。

And so I think it needs to be as accessible as possible.

我们正在迅速爬升高度。

We are gaining height rapidly.

风在我们身后渐渐变强。

The wind is picking up behind us.

右边有个儿童游乐场，正前方有秋千，还有几张长椅，但只需稍作停顿，回头向南望去，那就是肯特郡了。

There's a a children's playground to the right, a swing ahead of me, couple of benches, but just a pause and look behind towards the south, and that would be Kent.

阳光刚刚穿透云层。

The sun is just breaking through the the clouds.

周围有一些房屋，但还有很多绿色的草地。

We've got houses around, but a lot of green grass.

我能看到前方山坡顶部以北的景色。

And I can just see over the brow of the hill ahead of us to to the north.

我能看到伦敦城市的塔楼。

I can see the towers of the city of London.

是的。

Yeah.

今天我们实际上还会看到两个绝佳的景观。

We're actually gonna have two incredible views today as well.

所以这是第一个。

So this is the first one.

就在那边，你能看到你提到的南方。

And just over there, can see to the south you mentioned.

那是布莱斯山田野，我们稍后会到达那里。

That's Blythe Hill Fields, which will will end up later.

太好了。

Oh, great.

说句‘哦，是的’当然很容易。

It's all very well to sort of say, oh, yeah.

我 setup 了一个应用，好像只要打个响指就能完成，但实际上这是一个庞大的商业项目。

I set up an app as if it's something you can click your fingers and do, but it's a big business venture.

你需要一些技术专长。

You need some tech expertise.

这一切是怎么开始的？

How did it all start?

我的背景是数字产品、设计和开发。

So my background is in digital product, design and development.

在我的职业生涯中，我曾为谷歌、Xbox 和耐克等公司提供过服务。

I worked with the likes of Google, Xbox, and Nike agency side for much of my career.

所以科技是我感到非常有把握的领域。

So tech is something that I felt really confident about.

把你的技术专长转化为……我想这么说，我特别喜欢这个说法。

The the thought then of turning your tech expertise, I'm going to call it I love that.

我要造一个新词。

I'm gonna make up a word.

你把方向转向步行，这个想法是从哪儿来的？

You know, directing it towards walking, where did that come from?

天哪。

Oh, god.

我们还有多久？

How long have we got?

时间随你用，哈娜。

We've got as long as it takes, Hana.

所以我觉得值得分享一下，其实我直到二十多岁才开始喜欢散步。

So I think it's probably worth sort of sharing that I actually wasn't a lover of walking until, like, my mid twenties.

我是在人生的很后期才接触到步行的。

And it I came to it sort of very late on life.

小时候我们根本不会做这种事。

It just wasn't something we do as children.

我遇到了我丈夫，他来自诺森伯兰的田野地区。

I met my husband who's from the Fields Of Northumberland.

有一天，他带我回老家见他父母，然后带我去散步。

And one day, he took me back home to meet his parents and then took me for a walk.

我当时就想：这是什么？

And I was like, what's this?

为什么要去散步？

Why are going for a walk?

我记得我对公公说：乡下到处都是粪便。

And I remember saying to my father-in-law, the countryside is covered in poo.

因为他们家周围都是养羊的农场，情况就是这样。

Because they were surrounded by sheep farms and that's just what it was like.

但我记得散步结束后，坐在火炉旁，突然想到：你知道吗？

But I remember at the end of the walk, sitting by the fire and going, you know what?

我感觉棒极了。

I feel pretty amazing.

是的。

Yeah.

这是我生活中想要的东西。

And it's something that I wanted in my life.

然后，几年后，我有了一个儿子。

And then, you know, fast forward a couple of years, I had a son.

我们在城市里长大，我真的很希望他们能与自然世界建立良好的联系。

We're growing up in a city, and I really wanted them to have a good relationship with the natural world.

于是我意识到这里存在问题。

And so I realized there was a problem.

我有婴儿车，有孩子，需要换尿布。

I had a pram, had a kid, needed to change nappies.

他想去公园，但其实不知道哪里有适合的路线，能方便推婴儿车、有厕所和咖啡馆之类的设施。

And he wanted to go to the park, but actually didn't know where to go that would be accessible, pram friendly, toilets, cafes, things like that on route.

所以我发现，很多平台都特别难用，而这个问题其实是我能解决的，于是就有了今天的我。

So what I found was that a lot of the platforms were, like, really hard to use, and this was something that actually I could problem solve, and here I am today.

是的。

Yeah.

我们右边有网球场，人们在冬天的天气里打网球，还有户外健身器材也被使用着。

We've tennis courts on our right hand side, and people are out in the winter weather playing tennis, and also there's outdoor gym equipment being used.

每当看到人们使用市政设施时，我都特别高兴。

I'm always so thrilled when people are actually using stuff that's been put there by the council.

那座城市景观和金丝雀码头闪烁的塔楼，其不断闪烁的灯光现在更加明显了。

And that view of the city and the blinking tower of Canary Wharf, the light on it that keeps flashing is now much more evident.

今天真是个美好的日子。

And it's a really lovely day.

没你想象中那么冷。

It's not as cold as you might expect.

一群带着婴儿和婴儿车的妈妈们坐在左边的咖啡馆外，还有更多遛狗的人，一只蓬松毛发的小博美犬正朝我们走来。

A whole group of moms with babies and prams outside the cafe on the left and more dog walkers, little Pomeranian with its fluffy hair sticking out coming towards us.

我认为，我们真的需要占据空间，使用公园、绿地和墓地非常重要。

I think, you know, we really need to take up space, and it's really important to use parks and green spaces, cemeteries.

这些地方属于我们，也能帮助我们连接身边的自然与文化遗产。

They belong to us, and they also help connect you to sort of, like, the nature and heritage around you.

但关于希利菲尔德，还有很多令人惊叹的 facts，比如奥克塔维亚·希尔，她是国家信托基金的创始元老之一。

But there's loads of amazing facts about Hilly Fields, including Octavia Hill, one of the National Trust's original founders.

她发现有人发起运动想把这里改造成住宅区，但她奋力抗争，最终为我们保住了这片土地，如今我们每天都能享受它。

She found out that there was a campaign to try and turn this into housing, but actually she fought to save it for us, and now we get to enjoy it every day.

我应该提一下，我们身边有一位秘密特工，那就是你的丈夫利亚姆，他正在拍照。

I ought to mention we have a secret spy with us, and that's your husband, Liam, who's taking photos.

这些照片将会发布在 Instagram 账号上，账号是 BBC Rambling。

Those will be available on the Instagram page, which is at BBC Rambling.

正是利亚姆让你走出家门，进行了一次真正意义上的徒步旅行。

So it was Liam who got you outdoors for a proper what you would consider a real walk.

一次真正的散步。

A proper walk.

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

没错。

Exactly.

比如，我妈妈说我在九个月大的时候就开始走路了，但我不觉得我真的那样做过。

Like, my mom tells me that I started walking at nine months, but I don't think I really did.

我其实是在二十多岁中期才开始走路的。

I actually started walking in my mid twenties.

我不太喜欢健身房。

I'm not really a fan of the gym.

我不想进健身房，但我乐意每天出去散步。

I don't wanna go to the gym, but I'm happy to go for a walk every day.

恭喜你，利亚姆。

So congrats, Liam.

太好了。

Yay.

默默庆祝。

Silently celebrating.

是的。

Yeah.

作为伴侣，他还要承受很多，我想，尤其是当伴侣是个——我讨厌这个词——创业者的时候。

He also has to go through quite a lot, think, as the partner of a, I hate this word, but entrepreneur.

他得承受我忙于各种事情、四处奔波的负担，还要跟着我、拍照片。

He has to sort of carry that burden of me being busy doing all sorts of things like this and then tagging along and taking photos.

那我们来聊聊商业方面吧，因为我对这个很感兴趣，从产生想法，到意识到‘我可以帮助像我这样的人’，

Well, let's let's talk a bit about the business side of it because I find this intriguing and and the leap from having the idea and going, right.

再到真正实现它，并让它不仅仅局限于伦敦，对吧？

I could help people like me to actually making it happen and spreading it so that it's not just in London, is it?

不。

No.

不仅仅在伦敦。

It's not just in London.

坦白说，克莱尔，我完全低估了开发这样一个应用程序所需的复杂性、精力和辛勤付出。

And to be honest with you, Clare, I completely underestimated the complexity and energy and, like, hard work and graft that would be required to create an app like this.

我们没有得到风险投资或亿万富翁科技精英的资助。

We're not funded by VCs or billionaire tech pros.

这完全是靠我们四人团队自筹资金、自力更生，试图通过科技向善来帮助社会。

It's literally us, a team of four, self funded, bootstrapped, trying to help society through tech for good.

在早期阶段，我参加过一些会议。

And there were some meetings that I had sort of very early on.

我不会点名，但那些人是这个领域的大型机构。

And I won't mention any names, but they were sort of big players in this field.

他们几乎都告诉我，我永远不会成功。

And they pretty much told me I'd never be a success.

我根本不可能做出一款人们愿意下载的应用。

I'd never be able to create an app that people would want to download.

我怎么敢踏入这个领域？

And how dare I step into the space?

我真的觉得，那些对话，可以说，为我注入了动力。

And I really feel like, you know, some of those conversations, I guess, put the fuel in the fire, shall we say.

这并不容易。

And it's not easy.

这里更复杂的是，我不但要让人们下载一款应用——这本身就很困难，我实际上还试图让他们改变一生的行为习惯。

The thing that's extra complex here is that not only am I trying to get people to download an app, is really hard and really difficult, I'm actually trying to get them to sort of change behaviors of a lifetime.

我试图让那些从不走路的人多走走路。

I'm trying to get people who don't walk to walk more.

所以当你把这些因素——包括追求可持续发展、实现盈利——结合起来时，这确实是一个巨大的挑战。

So when you blend those things together, including trying to be sustainable, trying to make money, yeah, it was a big challenge.

但你怎么平衡它对社会有益的这一面呢？

But How do you balance the the side of it that is for the good of society?

所以我猜，为了让某些步行路线免费开放，同时维持商业运营，你们必须推出订阅服务，对吧？

So I assume making certain walks free to access and the business side of it, means you've gotta have subscriptions, haven't you?

是的。

Yeah.

所以这款应用可以免费下载，大多数功能和大部分步行路线也都是免费的。

So the app's free to download, and it's free to access most of the features and most of the walks.

这对我们来说非常重要，因为我们不想为步行设置新的门槛。

And that's really, really important to us because we didn't wanna create a new barrier to walking.

但我们也很清楚，必须支付账单等开销。

But we also knew that we had to pay the bills and things like that.

因此我们提供了一项可选的高级订阅服务，用户订阅后可以解锁一些额外的步行路线和功能。

So we've got an optional premium subscription, and then you get to access some extra walks, some extra features.

但我们的大部分收入来自于与合作伙伴的合作，比如伦敦交通局、威尔士交通局、国家名胜古迹信托基金，以及英国各地的35个地方政府，共同为所有人提供免费的步行路线和活动。

But most of our revenue comes from working with partners, people like Transport for London, Transport for Wales, and the National Trust, and 35 local authorities across The UK to bring free walks, free walking activities to everyone.

我们刚刚到达一个三角点。

We're just reaching a trig point here.

所以我认为我们现在大约在海平面以上50米，而且我们正接近伦敦唯一的巨石阵。

So we're I think we're about 50 meters above sea level now, and we're also approaching London's only stone circle.

我不知道伦敦还有巨石阵。

I did not know London had a stone circle.

当然，它不是埃夫伯里或巨石阵那样的规模，但这是一个完美的小型直立石圈，还有由两块塔状石头组成的入口。

And, okay, it's not it's not Avebury or Stonehenge, but it is a perfect small circle of upright stones and a gateway of two tower stones.

在至日时，这里非常受欢迎。

It's very popular at the solstices.

实际上，每个周末，你几乎都能看到儿童派对、健身活动等各种事情在这里进行。

And actually, every weekend, you can pretty much see children's parties, exercise, all sorts going on around here.

而且中间还有一个日晷。

And there's also a sundial in the middle as well.

我猜如果你站在入口两侧，那边应该就是西方，可以看到日落。

I'm assuming if you stood with this gateway either side of you, that must be west over there and you see the sunset

是的。

Yeah.

通过那些树木之间的缝隙。

Through that gap in the in the trees.

太好了。

Great.

是的。

Yeah.

所以这是一片完全隐蔽的小树林，我以为自己在这里住了五年，有一天突然想：那边到底有什么？

So this is like this completely hidden little woodland that I think I lived here for like five years, and then one day I was like, what's beyond there?

我们去看看吧。

Let's have a look.

结果发现这是一个非常美丽的小小自然保护区。

And it's like this really pretty little nature reserve.

而且它真的非常小。

And it's really tiny.

如果你有小孩，这里是个绝佳的地方，因为整个区域都是封闭的。

Like, if you've got little ones, this is a really great place because it's all enclosed.

你可以让他们自由奔跑。

You could let them run around wild.

这在如今的父母中其实并不常见。

It's kind of not something that a lot of parents are sort of used to nowadays, really.

你提到小时候并不常走路。

You said walking was not something you did as a child.

你认为为什么会这样？

Why do you think that was?

我有混合的背景。

I'm from a sort of mixed heritage background.

当我的妈妈来到英国时，她一心想要为自己创造更好的生活，诸如此类。

And when my sort of mom came to The UK, it was very much about trying to sort of build a better life for herself and things like that.

我认为玩耍和户外活动根本不是我们常做的事。

And I think play and being outdoors, it just wasn't something that that we did.

我 definitely 认为这就是原因

And I definitely think that's why

我不喜欢泥巴。

I don't like mud.

这好像是被灌输的。

It was like taught.

这好像是

It was like

是天性与教养的结合。

a nature nurture thing.

是的。

Yeah.

但现在，有趣的是，我们在这里左转了。

But now, funnily enough, we've turned left here.

然后走这条小路。

And go through this path here.

是的。

Yeah.

嗯，

Well

哦，如果没有这个苹果，我根本找不到这儿。

Oh, I wouldn't have found this without the apple.

你

You

我知道。

I know.

这里泥泞得很，前几天我来探路时想往上走，结果滑倒了。

So this is really muddy, and I slipped over the other day trying to go up there when I was checking out the route.

克莱尔，你上吧？

You're go for it, Clare?

好的。

Yep.

好的。

Okay.

把你的砖块戴上。

Put your bricks on.

你已经有了。

You have.

哦，我明白了。

Oh, I see.

这里是最滑的地方。

Here's the really slippy bit.

是的。

Yeah.

我只是觉得有点后悔。

I regret you just I think

这是因为这是黏土。

it's because it's clay.

好了。

There we go.

你妈妈是在哪里长大的？

So where did your mother grow up?

我妈妈是在香港长大的。

So my mom grew up in Hong Kong.

嗯哼。

Mhmm.

她就是在那儿认识我爸爸的，之后他们搬回来了。

That's where she she met my dad, and they moved back here.

他当时在海军服役，所以经常不在家。

He was in the navy, and so he was away a lot.

我觉得那一定非常艰难，她得为自己建立一个新生活。

And I think it was probably really challenging, and she she needed to build this life for herself.

但我觉得她的童年相当艰难。

But it was quite a difficult childhood, I would say.

我父母的婚姻也没持续多久。

And my parents' marriage didn't last very long.

是的。

Right.

我小时候搬了很多次家。

And I moved around a lot.

我小时候经历的那些事情，导致我从来没有真正花时间在公园或绿色空间里，之类的地方。

And all of those kind of things that happened when I was a kid resulted in the fact that I just was never really spent time in parks and green spaces or things like that.

这根本就不是我们文化中会做的事情。

It just wasn't just wasn't something we do culturally.

我们实际上正往这个方向走，所以现在要朝莱德韦尔去，也就是经过我们之前待过的地方。

We're going down this way actually, so we're gonna head off towards Ladywell now, which means kind of going past where we were earlier.

你觉得希利菲尔德怎么样？

What did you think of Hilly Fields?

很喜欢。

Loved it.

我觉得很棒。

I thought it was great.

所以我们现在直走，这里有个小通道可以直接通到Ladywell Fields。

So we're going straight on here, and there's like this a little cut through that takes you through to Ladywell Fields.

这个空间有多大？

How big is this space?

实际上挺大的。

It's actually quite big.

它被分成三个区域，但沿着Ravensbourne河延伸。

There's, like, split into three sections, but it follows the Ravensbourne River.

哦，听起来像是吹叶机。

Oh, sounds like leaf blowers.

就是这个声音。

That's what it is.

我觉得远处那个是什么？

I think what is that in the distance?

不可能是割草机吧。

It can't be strimmers.

我们走进了一个住宅区。

We've walked into a a residential area.

如果不是跟着这个应用，我根本不会知道要走这条路。

I now I wouldn't have known to go this way unless we were following the app.

除非我跟着你，哈娜，

Well, unless I was following you, Hana,

说实话。

to be honest.

右边是Ladywell塔，在这个小型住宅区里显得有点格格不入。

So on the right is actually, Ladywell Tower, and it kind of looks a little out of place in in this little, housing estate.

这个区域实际上，我手头有这次步行的所有详细资料，所以你可以，

So this area was actually and I've got all of the facts facts on on on the walk, so you can,

比如，复述一下

like, retell

关于这个水塔的事。

me about the water tower.

但你看到的这座高高的砖结构建筑是拉德韦尔水塔，大约一百二十年前，它曾是一个更大区域的一部分，当时人们在这里生活和工作。

But so the the tall brick structure you see is Ladywell Water Tower, and it was once part of a much bigger place where people lived and worked around a hundred and twenty years ago.

它被称为圣奥拉夫联合济贫院，建在一片名为斯拉格雷夫农场的土地上。

It was called the Saint Olafs Union Workhouse, and it was built on what was known as Slaggrave Farm.

所以这里以前全部都是农场吗？

So this was all a farm?

这里现在都是新房子，嗯，应该是七八十年代建的，是的。

That's brand new houses here, well, brand new, probably built in the seventies, eighties Yeah.

那时候这里不会有任何建筑。

Wouldn't have been here.

这里以前全是农田。

This was all farmland.

是的。

Yes.

完全正确。

Exactly right.

它本质上就像一家医院和济贫院，有独立的居住区、洗衣房、教堂，这就是为什么这里会有这么一座大型水塔。

It was essentially like a hospital and a workhouse, and there were sort of separate living blocks, laundry, a chapels, which is why there's a big water tower here.

他们从一口深井中取水。

And they drew water from a deep well.

而且，是的，其他所有建筑都被拆除了，随后建起了这个小型住宅区。

And, yeah, they were all of the kind of other buildings were sort of demolished, and then this little sort of, like, housing estate was built.

它体现了维多利亚时代的历史。

It speaks to its Victorian past.

这座水塔本身有着绿色的门和绿色的顶盖，顶部全部是绿色的。

And the water tower itself with its green door and its green hat, it's got the top section of it as all green.

是的。

Yeah.

它显然已经被改造成了一栋房子。

It's clearly been turned into a a house.

是的。

Yeah.

它们是公寓。

They're flats.

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

想象一下得爬楼梯去那套房子。

Imagine having to go up the stairs for that one.

是的。

Yeah.

所以我们现在直走，这里有个小通道。

So we're going straight on here, and there's like this a little cut through.

我们现在正进入布莱斯山地公园。

We're just heading into Blythe Hilly Fields now.

如果你觉得山地公园的景色已经很好了，那这个更值得一看。

And if you thought the Hilly Fields view was good, check this out.

哦，我能看到它逐渐展开，尤其是伦敦碎片大厦的绝佳视角，我一直觉得它看起来像是亚瑟王时代的比武帐篷，顶部似乎还没完工。

Oh, I can see it starting to unfold and a particularly good view of the shard, which I always think looks like, you know, these Arthurian jousting tents that the peak was almost unfinished.

我觉得碎片大厦的顶部就是那样的。

I feel the top of the shard is is like that.

我们还能看到Walkie Talkie大楼和小黄瓜大楼。

And we see the walkie talkie and the gherkin.

是的。

Yeah.

还有播放按钮。

And the play button.

哪个是播放按钮？

Which one's the play button?

我不知道那是什么。

I don't know what it is.

但你有没有注意到顶部有个三角形？

But do you see there's like a triangle at the top?

想不起那栋楼的名字了，但它看起来有点像播放按钮。

Can't remember the name of the building, but it looks a bit like a play button.

哦，这太聪明了。

Oh, that's very clever.

我还不知道呢。

I didn't know that.

奶酪擦丝器？

The cheese grater?

奶酪擦丝器。

The cheese grater.

是的。

Yeah.

然后往右转，我们可以看到金丝雀码头。

And then round to the right, we can see Canary Wharf.

天啊。

God.

它们看起来有点像哥谭市。

They just look kind of it looks like Gotham Gotham City.

确实像。

It does.

真的很像，尤其是在这里，绿色的树木正在发芽。

It really does, especially up here in the green, the budding trees.

我们停下来向一支经过的葬礼队伍致意，棺材被放在一个玻璃马车里，由两匹戴着羽饰的黑色弗里斯兰马牵引，棺材两侧写着悼词。

Just pausing out of respect to a a funeral cortege going past her and the coffin being born in a glass carriage drawn by two black Frisian horses with plumes on their heads and dad and flowers written alongside the the coffin.

哦，看。

Oh, look.

你知道吗，你第一次给我看这张地图时，说有176步，我当时想，天啊，这得走多久啊。

You know, when you first showed me this map and it was like a 176 steps, was thinking, oh, that's a lot to get through.

但我们进展不错。

But we're making good progress.

是的。

Yeah.

所以这个应用提醒我们注意这里有一个小型社区花园，这真是个隐藏的宝藏。

So the app is telling us to look out for a small community garden just here, and this is like a real hidden gem.

其实我在疫情期间发现的，因为那时候不能走太远。

And I actually discovered it during COVID because you couldn't walk very far.

我记得有一天只是觉得，我得出去透透气。

And I remember one day just being like, I need to get out.

我感觉被困住了。

I feel trapped.

然后偶然发现了这个美丽而由本地人维护的社区花园。

And then happened upon this really beautiful, locally maintained community garden.

我觉得穿过这里去墓地会是个非常棒的路线。

And, I just thought it would be a really lovely place to kind of cut through onto the cemetery.

真美。

Lovely.

太可爱了。

So It's adorable.

小径两侧铺着木柴，穿过各种灌木和植物，还有一张小长椅。

It's got logs on either on either side of a wood chip path going through various shrubs and plants, a little bench.

是的。

Yeah.

而且一年四季都有令人惊叹的植物。

And you've got amazing plants through the season as well.

还有许多小精灵和雕刻装饰。

And there's all these little gnomes and like carvings.

甚至还有一个小池塘，春天时你能看到青蛙在这里产卵。

And there's even a little pond and like in spring and stuff, you can see frogs spawn in there.

所以这是一个非常宜人的地方。

So it's just a really lovely space.

有很多小长椅。

There's lots of little benches.

你可以坐下来静静思考。

You can sit down and just ponder.

那是2009年，我们在德国山区。

It's 2009, we're in the German Mountains.

一名男子把自己绑在了世界上最具危险性的赛道上的一辆赛车里。

A man straps himself into a car on the world's most dangerous racetrack.

他低声对自己说

He whispers to himself

是时候把我的睾丸放在仪表盘上了。

It's time to put my balls on the dashboard.

当他启动引擎时。

As he starts the engine.

十五分钟后，他被送进救护车，失去意识。

In fifteen minutes, he's in an ambulance, unconscious.

十五年后，他成了亿万富翁。

In fifteen years, he's a billionaire.

这就是托托·沃尔夫，F1最具权势的车队老板，也是《极速求生》中的焦点人物。

This is Toto Wolff, Formula One's most powerful team boss and the breakout star of Drive to Survive.

本周《好坏亿万富翁》，揭秘托托·沃尔夫如何赚取他的亿万财富。

This week on Good Bad Billionaire, how Toto Wolff made his billions.

在您收听BBC播客的任何平台都可以收听。

Listen wherever you get your BBC podcasts.

我们上次穿越了主路1号，现在又回到了我们出发的墓地。

We've crossed the main Road 1 last time and back into the cemetery where we started.

但在墓地最远端，那只话多的鹦鹉刚刚落在了我们头顶的树枝上。

But at the furthest edge of it, the very chatty parakeet has just landed in the branch above us.

但利亚姆，到目前为止，他在这次散步中一直保持沉默。

But, Liam, he's very much been the silent partner so far in this walk.

我能问你一个问题吗？

Can I ask you?

当哈娜第一次提出这个想法时，你的反应是什么？现在你怎么看？

What was your reaction when Hana first pitched this idea, and what do you think now?

我觉得这个想法很棒。

I love the idea of it.

当时我根本没想到它会发展成现在这样庞大而惊人的事业。

I didn't, at that time, ever think that it was gonna grow into the huge mammoth amazing beast that it is now.

所以我非常愿意参与。

So I was more than up for it.

作为一名设计师，我非常乐意帮助可视化整个项目，并想出各种方法来实现你的

And being a designer, I was more than happy to help visualize it all and come up with ways to make your

在贡献中发挥了积极作用

played an active role in contributing to

它。

it.

是的。

Yeah.

你们现在一起工作吗？

And do you work for well, do you work together now?

是的。

Yes.