医疗行业的无现金、无摩擦未来

讨论让世界持续运转。

Discussion keeps the world turning.

这是圆桌论坛。

This is Roundtable.

医院正在减少漫长的等待时间。

Hospitals are shedding their long waits.

想象一下，只需一眼就能支付医疗费用，或者拥有一个保险钱包，无论家人身在何处，都能为整个家庭提供保障。

Imagine paying for care with just a glance or having one insurance wallet that shields your entire family no matter where they live.

听起来像科幻小说的情景，正在中国诊所成为现实。

What sounds like sci fi is becoming reality in China's clinics.

今天，我们将探讨这些新的数字钥匙，以及它们如何将可能令人压力重重的就诊转变为无排队的互联体验。

Today, we explore the new digital keys and how they're turning a potentially stressful visit into a queue free connected experience.

我们正在北京的演播室现场直播。

We're live from our studios in Beijing.

这是圆桌论坛。

This is Roundtable.

我是史蒂夫。

I'm Steve.

感谢您今天抽出时间与我们分享。

Thank you for sharing your time with us today.

在节目中，我与费费和玉山在一起。

And for the show, I'm with Fei Fei and Yushan.

首先。

Up first.

几十年来，医院体验一直与无尽的等待联系在一起。

For decades, the hospital experience has been synonymous with endless wait.

一种令人沮丧的循环：为了看医生或缴费，你必须在不同的窗口前排多次队；但想象一下未来，你可以不带钱包、卡片，甚至不带智能手机走进诊所，只需看一眼屏幕就能完成整个就诊过程。

A frustrating loop of multiple queues at different windows just to see a doctor or pay for But imagine a future where you can walk into a clinic without a wallet, a card, or even a smartphone and finish your visit with just a glance at a screen.

想象一个保险钱包，它不仅属于你，还能作为你父母、孩子甚至祖父母的共享健康基金，无论他们住在哪里。

Picture an insurance wallet that doesn't just belong to you but acts as a shared health fund for your parents, children, and even grandparents regardless of where they live.

这不仅仅是更新软件。

This isn't just about updating software.

这关乎重新定义医疗护理的温暖——如果我们能这么称呼的话——通过人脸识别、基于信用的支付，以及跨越国界的家庭安全网。

It's about redefining warmth, if we can call it that, of medical care through face scans, credit based payments, and a family safety net that crosses borders.

这些变化将如何带来不同？

How will these changes make a difference?

医院体验和保险体验将如何为我们所有人带来改变？

How will the hospital experience and the insurance experience change for us all?

你知道，我在开场时说医院体验一直与无尽的等待挂钩，可能有点苛刻了，Fei Fei 和 Yushan，因为就我个人经历而言，医院就诊一直很快、很高效，每次我去医院都有很好的体验。

You know, I think I was being a little critical in the opening when I said, you know, the hospital experience has been synonymous with the endless wait, Fei Fei and Yushan, because in my experience, it's been pretty quick, it's been pretty efficient, and I've had a great experience each time I visited the hospital.

我前几天在节目中也提到过这件事。

I was talking about it a couple of days on the show, ago on the show.

但我猜‘无尽的等待’是个相对的说法，因为我习惯了加拿大的医院，那里你可能得等上好几个小时才能见到医生。

But I guess an endless wait is a relative term because I'm used to Canadian hospitals where you can spend hours in there waiting to see a doctor.

嗯，Steve，你知道吗，如果你来北京一家顶级医院，那里挤满了从全国各地赶来求诊顶尖医生的病人，你就会遇到医院里这些排队现象。

Well, you know, Steve, you know, when you if you visit a very top hospital here in Beijing that's crowded with patients coming from across the country to see a top doctor for their sickness, you will encounter these cues in hospitals.

而且很多时候，大厅里、候诊区，甚至医生诊室里都人满为患。

And no matter and and a lot of times is that there are people, there are different big crowds in the halls, in the waiting room, and even in the doctor's offices.

是的。

Yeah.

因此，正是由于这个原因，国家医疗保障局——这一负责监管医疗行业的最高机构之一——已宣布一项计划，旨在未来三年内不仅让医院就诊更加便捷快速，也让通过医保系统的支付变得更加快捷方便。

So now that's why that we're seeing that the National Healthcare Security Administration, you know, one of the top authorities overseeing the medical care sector, is has announced a plan to make not only the the the visits to hospital more convenient and faster and also make the payment, you know, through the health care insurance system faster, more convenient over the next three years, basically.

因此，这也是应对患者在医院支付时常常面临的长时间等待和复杂程序这一挫败感的方法之一，尤其是对于那些前往不同城市甚至不同省份就医的人而言。

So that that is also one of the methods that is trying to tackle this frustration of long waits and complicated procedures that patients often face when paying at hospitals, especially for those who travel to a different city or even different province for that.

是的。

Yeah.

因为每次你去一家医院，医院都有自己的设置。

Because each time you go to a hospital, a hospital will have its own setup.

它们并不都一样。

They're not all the same.

所以当你第一次去医院时，知道该做什么、去哪里以及如何操作，确实可能是一次令人困惑的体验。

So when you're visiting, a hospital, you know, for the first time, knowing what to do and where to go and how to do it can indeed be a confusing experience.

而这一次，有许多新的升级。

And this time, there are many new upgrades.

整个想法是推出一种更 streamlined 的支付系统，包括人脸识别、一码通扫——即一个二维码涵盖所有支付项目，以及移动支付，这将为我节省很多时间，因为有时看完医生后，医生会给你一张处方或一份需要付费的项目清单，然后你必须离开诊室，去另一个楼层的另一个部门缴费。

And the whole idea is to roll out a more streamlined payment system that includes options like facial recognition, one code scanning, so you have one QR code for everything, and also mobile payments which will save at least me because sometimes after you see the doctor and she or he gives you a prescription or rather a list of things you need to pay for before you continue on with the treatment, You have to leave the office and go to another department on a different floor sometimes.

嗯。

Mhmm.

缴费后再回来，重新排队等待医生再次检查。

And pay and then come back and wait in that line again to be checked by the doctor.

如果我们能直接通过手机进行移动支付，即时完成付款，那将是一个巨大的变革。

So if we can just do that mobile payment thing, like pay it instantly on the on the phone, that will be such a game changer.

此外，还有基于信用的支付方式，覆盖从门诊、急诊到住院治疗的所有费用。

And then there are even credit based payment that's covering everything from outpatient visits to emergencies and in patient care.

同时，各地也可以根据自身具体需求推行这些改革。

And also for local areas, They can roll out these changes based on their specific needs.

未来，医院、药房和金融机构也将被鼓励参与这一整体系统。

And hospitals and pharmacies and financial institutions, they will also be encouraged to get involved as part of this whole system in the future.

当然，医疗保障局将通过将这些系统纳入医院评估，密切监控这些系统的效果，确保它们真正改善了患者的体验。

And, of course, the medical health insurance bureau will be closely monitoring how well these systems are working by including them in their hospital assessments, ensuring that they actually are improving the patients' experiences

这正是整个目的所在。

in Which each is the whole point.

没错。

Right.

是的。

Yeah.

好的。

All right.

那么我们来具体谈一谈细节吧。

So let's get into the specific details then.

支付方式，也许我们可以先从这些开始。

The payment methods, maybe we can start with those.

这会带来什么不同呢？

What kind of difference will this make?

首先，通过人脸识别技术，患者无需使用卡片甚至智能手机即可完成支付。

Well, first of all, is with the use of facial recognition that let patients pay without needing a card or even a smartphone.

因为我想起来了，几年前，大概是三五年吧，我们去医院还得自带卡片，比如医保卡。

Because I remembered, you know, back, I don't know, three, five years ago, we need to carry our own card, a health care insurance card, to go to the hospitals.

而且，不同的医院都有自己不同的系统。

And then, you know, different hospitals have their own different systems.

有些医院会要求你去医院登记。

Some of them would ask you to register at the hospital.

他们会给你一张不同的卡。

They will give you a different card.

嗯。

Mhmm.

你在这家医院得出示两张卡。

And you need to present two cars at this hospital.

如果你去另一家医院，那就意味着你得重新申请一张新卡。

And if you go to another hospital, that means you need to apply for a new card.

是啊。

Yeah.

这就是你可以重新设想的其中一个障碍。

And then this is the the one of the hurdles that you can reimagine.

你的抽屉里堆着一堆卡。

You have a stack of cars in your drawer.

是的。

Yeah.

你得知道在什么时候该拿哪一张。

And you have to know which one to take at at which particular time.

不久之前，在圆桌讨论中，我们谈到了大学里的应用程序，学生们抱怨应用程序太多了。

Not long ago on roundtable, we talked about the apps at universities and how students were complaining that there are too many apps.

是的。

Yeah.

这基本上是类似的想法。

It's basically very similar idea.

这里也是类似的概念。

It's kind of a similar concept here.

是的。

Yeah.

特别是考虑到老年患者，他们已经在应对大量注册问题，比如不同楼层、不同大型医院的不同地图和不同的卡片系统。

And especially considering the older patients that they are already struggling with a lot of this registration, you know, different floors, you know, different maps in different big hospitals and different card systems.

如果他们能使用人脸识别技术，只需扫一下脸就能轻松通行。

If they can use this technology of facial recognition, it's very easy for them to just scan their face and just go.

是的。

Yeah.

因为忘记带卡是任何人都可能轻易发生的事，无论年龄大小。

Because forgetting your card is an easy thing for for someone to do no matter how old you are.

你提到忘记带卡真有意思，这让我想起一个轶事：有一次我去北京一家大型医院探望病人，那里人山人海，你必须出示医保卡，也就是他们说的‘挂号’，用来登记入场并进入系统排队等候叫号。

It's funny you mentioned forgetting the card because this just reminds me of an anecdote that once when I was going to was visiting one of the major hospitals here in Beijing and it was full of people and you kinda need to need your insurance card to they call it gua hao, like announce Sort of register register your entrance and get you into the system to wait to be called.

结果我把卡落在了挂号机里，就上楼了。

And I just left my card inside the the registration machine and I went upstairs.

然后我才意识到：天啊，我的卡还留在楼下呢。

And then I realized, oh my gosh, my my card is left downstairs.

而且我

And I

冲了下去。

rushed down.

仅仅五分钟，卡片就不见了。

It was only five minutes and it was already gone.

我慌了，四处询问，对志愿者说：我的卡片五分钟前还在这里。

And I panicked and then asked around and asked the volunteer, my card was right here like five minutes ago ago.

那个女孩告诉我：哦，你去保安室就行。

And the girl told me, oh, you just go to the the security room.

他们那里有。

They they have it.

是的。

Yeah.

我们知道他们在那儿。

We we we know they have it.

当我到那里时，保安问我：‘你有身份证吗？’

And when I got there and the security guy said, oh, do you have your ID card?

我说：‘有。’

Like, yes.

是的，我有。

I yes, I do.

我出示了我的身份证，他们把我的身份证放进了一个箱子。

And I showed my ID card, and they put my ID card into one box.

那个箱子随即吐出了我的门禁卡，因为它成功识别了我的身份证信息。

And that box just spit out my security card because it registered well, it recognized my ID.

那一刻，我作为记者的本能被激发了，我问他：‘你们每天收多少张卡？’

And that's the that's when the reporter side of me got got kicked in, and I asked him, how many cars do you collect every day?

哦，肯定有几百张吧。

Oh, must be hundreds.

他说：‘从我今天早上上班到现在，已经收了三十一张了。'

And he's like, since my shift this morning, thirty one.

是的。

Yeah.

你是第三十一个。

You're the thirty first.

是的。

Yeah.

有一次我把信用卡忘在加油站的支付机里了，我回去取的时候，那人打开盒子，里面大概有500张信用卡。

I left my credit card in a gas station payment thing one time, and I went back to pick it up, and the guy opened the box, and there were probably 500 credit cards in there.

我说，好吧。

I said, okay.

不错。

Good.

我不是唯一一个这么干的人。

I'm not the only one who does this.

嗯。

Mhmm.

总之，今天我们不谈加油站。

Anyway, we're not talking gas stations today.

所以我想说的是，以前在中国的医院，当你需要支付费用时，你得去一个队排队，然后去另一个队排队，再去第三个队排队等待。

So I guess before, the point here is that what previously, at a at a hospital in China, when you wanted to pay for something at the hospital, you'd have to go to one queue, wait, go to another queue, wait, and go to another queue and wait.

是的。

Yeah.

是的。

Yeah.

这些时间加起来是很可观的。

And that time just adds up.

所以这种扫码支付将为人们节省大量时间。

So this will save this one code payment will save people a lot of time.

是的。

Yes.

只需一次扫描，这个码就能处理所有事项，包括医保报销，有些人还有个人医疗账户，里面有钱，也可以用账户里的钱或自费支付。

With a single scan, they can handle the code basically can handle everything from the reimbursement of your medical insurance to, you know, some some some people have their personal medical insurance account and have some money inside, and you can also use the money inside of that account or out of pocket costs.

所以你不需要在不同账户间来回操作，只需一个二维码即可。

So you don't have to go through different accounts but with one single code.

这基本上消除了在这些不同系统间切换的麻烦。

That basically eliminates the hassle of jumping between these different systems.

那信用体系呢？

What about the credit system?

这也是一个巨大的进步。

This is also a big step.

是的。

Yeah.

信用体系允许参保患者先接受治疗，之后再支付医疗费用。

The credit system is something that allows insured patients to pay for medical expenses later, which means that you can get treated first and then pay afterwards.

这是因为你的银行根据事先约定的信用额度，先行垫付费用。

So that's because your bank kind of covers the cost upfront based on an agreement credit limits that's already made prior to this.

这为患者提供了更大的灵活性。

And this really offers a lot more flexibility for the patients.

例如，一些老年人可能觉得在医院付款有困难。

And for example, some elderly people, they may find it difficult to pay at the hospital.

有了信用支付，他们当然可以先接受治疗，等回家后再由家人结算账单。

With the introduction of credit payments, of course, they can receive treatment first and have their family settle the bill later on when they get home.

方便多了。

Much more convenient.

是的。

Yeah.

我觉得这非常聪明。

That's something very smart, I'll say.

也许这项政策中最大或最重要的变化，你可以这么说，是跨省异地就医直接结算。

Maybe the biggest change or the most significant change in this policy, you could argue that, is the cross province mutual medical aid.

这就是它的名称。

That's what it's that's what it's called.

这减轻了医疗费用的负担。

And this reduces the burden of of medical costs.

这是由国家医疗保障局与财政部共同推出的。

It comes from the National Healthcare Security Administration working together with the Ministry of Finance.

他们于今年1月9日刚刚公布了这一计划，旨在加快职工基本医疗保险个人账户在不同省份之间的使用。

They announced this plan very recently on the January 9 to speed up the use of workers' personal accounts of the basic medical insurance across different provinces.

那么，这对家庭会带来什么不同呢？

So what will this what will this difference make for families?

首先，这意味着在我的家庭中，我丈夫在一家公司工作，他拥有这个医疗保险账户。

Well, first of all, that means, for example, in my family, my husband who is working in a company and he has this health care insurance account.

他每月会根据工资向账户中存入一笔钱。

And he has some money input every month based on his salaries.

这笔钱可以用于支付我们孩子或他父母的医疗费用。

And that money can be used to pay the health insurance, for example, for our children or for his parents.

现在我认为，这不仅试图覆盖更多家庭成员，目前政策制定者还希望该账户能够覆盖我的父母。

And now I think not only that is trying to cover more members of the family, for example, right now, the policymakers want that account to be able to also cover the parent my parents.

我丈夫的账户也可以覆盖我的父母，甚至他的祖父母和孙子女，如果他有的话。

My husband's account can also cover my parents and even his grandparents and grandchildren, if he has any.

而且这也希望覆盖跨省的父母或近亲。

And and also that hope to cover parents or close family members outside of the city cross province.

所以这被称为跨省医疗互助。

So that's why it's called cross provincial mutual medical aid.

我的意思是，这会对很多人产生巨大影响，因为事实是，人们长大后搬去其他城市工作，住在那儿，但他们的家人仍留在原籍，依赖他们的医疗保险。

I mean, this is gonna make a big difference for a ton of people, I would think, because the simple fact is is that people grow up and then they move and take work in another city, and that means they live there, and then they still have family members where they're from who would rely on their on their medical insurance.

而最好的一点是，账户的绑定以及这种共享的停止都是自愿的。

And this the best part, I guess, is that the binding of the accounts and also the deter the stopping of this alignment is all voluntarily.

只要你愿意与家人共享你的账户，无论你们之间相隔多远，未来都可以实现。

As long as you you're willing to share your account with your family member, it can be done in the future regardless of geographical distance between you guys.

我们现在看到，像北京、上海和深圳这样的大城市里，有数百万年轻、相对健康的工作者。

And we we now see millions of younger, relatively healthier workers in big cities such as Beijing and Shanghai and Shenzhen.

他们使用。

They us.

我们账户里有大量资金，却很少使用。

We have money just sitting right in the health accounts that we rarely use.

我刚查了一下，就在节目开始前，我的账户里有超过5000元。

I just checked mine, but right before the show, I have over 5,000 in my account.

如果这5000元能帮上我爷爷奶奶的忙，他们总是需要买药和去医院，嗯。

And if that 5,000 can help out with my grandparents who is constantly in need of purchasing medicine and go going to the clinics to Mhmm.

这样的话，总比让钱一直闲着好。

Check out then that's that's a better choice than just letting it sitting there.

所以这相当于让这些被冻结的资金在系统中流动起来。

So that's sort of like helping this trapped money to flow a bit into the system.

而这些钱之所以一直闲着，如你所说，是因为它们在地理上被锁住了。

And the reason it was sitting there, as you put it, is because that money is kind of geographically locked.

嗯。

Mhmm.

因为你在北京，而你的祖父母在国家的另一个地方、另一个省份，以前这笔医保资金是不能跨省使用的。

Because you are in Beijing and your grandparents are in an a different part of the country, in a different province, previously, that health insurance money could not cross borders.

嗯。

Mhmm.

是的。

Yes.

因为，你知道，说到医疗保险体系，它非常复杂。

Because, you know, when it comes to health insurance system, it's very complicated.

尽管我们已经有了全国性的系统，但在实际支付时，它们却有不同的资金池。

We Even though we have this national system ready, but when it comes to, you know, actual payments, they have, like, different pools.

而在此之前，这些资金池通常被限制在县级、市级，有时甚至在省级范围内。

And most of the time, this pool is well, before this, is sort of restricted into a county, a city, and sometimes in provinces.

尽管我们之前有过试点项目，试图让人们到不同地方就医，使他们的医疗费用也能被系统覆盖。

And even though we have pilot programs before trying to make, you know, people go into different places so that they can also their medical treatment can also be covered by the system.

但这种情况通常只发生在同一区域或类似地区内。

But that often happens within the same within a similar some some sort of a region.

例如，在中国许多省份和城市，你可以去不同的医院使用医保支付。

For example, in a lot of provinces and cities in China that you can go to different hospitals and pay with your medical health insurance.

但这仅限于本省范围内。

That's only within the province.

但当涉及到跨省就医时，我这里有一个数据，中国有超过一亿两千万人跨省流动。

But when it comes to cross provincial visits, and I have a figure here, that more than 120,000,000 people are traveling across provinces in China.

嗯。

Mhmm.

这意味着很多人无法使用他们医疗保险账户里的资金。

And that means a lot of them are unable to tap into that money in their, you know, medical health insurance account.

因此，对于跨省就医的情况，特别是那些父母住在农村地区、自己缴纳医疗保险的人群来说。

And so with this cross provincial and especially I think for those that their parents are living in rural areas, that they are paying their own health care insurance.

我认为他们自己每年大约支付400日元。

I think it's about 400 yen a year themselves.

嗯。

Mhmm.

这笔钱不算多，但对一些家庭来说仍是一种负担。

And it's not a lot of money, but it can still means some sort of a burden for some families.

现在，例如，如果他们的孩子在北京工作，孩子可以为父母支付这400日元的费用。

And now, for example, if their their children are working in Beijing, their children can pay for that 400 yen for their parents.

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Right.

这大大减少了繁文缛节，也节省了大量时间。

So this just cuts a a lot of red tape and lot it saves a lot of time as well.

这是对社会保障体系的数字化升级，同时也认识到家庭成员常常分散在全国各地，从而允许他们更高效地使用共同的医疗资金。

It's a digital upgrade to the to the safety net, and it it recognizes too that families are often spread out across the country, and then it allows them to use their collective health funds efficiently.

这减轻了自费压力，使系统更具灵活性，甚至可以说更富人情味。

It reduces out of pocket stress, and it makes the system more flexible, and you could argue it makes it more humane as well.

这不仅关乎政策，更关乎实际的家庭支持。

And it's not just about the policy, it's about practical family support.

对。

Right.

在当今人们常常分散各地的现代时代。

In these modern times where people are oftentimes so spread out.

是的。

Yeah.

我记得在节目开始前看到过数据，截至去年年底，我认为大约有30个省份。

And I remember seeing the data right before the show that, as of the end of last year, I believe, there are about 30 provinces.

我们可以称它们为试点省份，这些省份一直在探索跨省支持，如今新疆维吾尔自治区已有337个协调区域推出了个人医保账户，并实现了跨省互助。

We can call them pilot provinces that has been exploring cross provincial support with 337 coordinated areas in Xinjiang, Uighur Autonomous Region now offering the personal medical insurance wallet and enabling cross provincial mutual aid.

但这并不意味着这30个省份的所有地区都在其本地医疗系统中全面推行这一制度，实际上，仅在这些省份内的一些城市——有时甚至只有一个或两个城市——在实施这项措施。

And that's not saying that these 30 provinces are all or rather the entire area within this provincial governance is all applying this to their own local medical system is that there are only a few cities inside the provinces, sometimes only one or two that's doing this.

这并不意味着目前它已全面铺开，但这就是我们未来的发展方向。

And it doesn't mean that it works on a very much full scale now, but that's where we're heading.

我们正努力在全国范围内推广这一做法，嗯。

We're trying to expand the implementation nationwide Mhmm.

目前。

At this point.

我们一直提到祖父母、父母，但并不仅仅局限于这些群体。

So we mentioned grand we keep saying grandparents, grandparents, or parents, parents, but it's not just it's not just those groups.

是吗？

Yeah?

而且，孩子也可以使用这笔钱。

And also, you can apply children can also try to use that money.

我认为在北京，我们几年前就已经启动了类似的试点项目。例如，我孩子的医疗保险每年大约300到400元，是由我丈夫的医保账户支付的。

I think for us in Beijing, actually, they we've started similar pilot schemes a a couple of years ago, So for example, my children's health insurance, is also about 300, 400 in a year, is paid by my husband's health insurance account.

此外，这些账户里的钱也可以在某些药房购买药品，而不仅限于医院。

And also when it comes to those accounts, the money in that account can also be used to buy medicine at certain pharmacies, not only just hospitals.

而且，现在我认为他那些不住在北京的父母也可以使用他的账户了。

And also, right now, I think his parents who are not living in Beijing can also start tapping into his account.

而且也覆盖了祖父母。

And also covers grandparents.

当然。

Of course.

是的。

Yeah.

药房需要属于这个项目吗？

The pharmacies, do they they need to be part of the program?

并不是所有药房都可以吧？

It it wouldn't just mean every pharmacy everywhere?

不是。

No.

它们还需要在系统中注册，这样你才能用这个账户支付。

It's just sort of they also need to be sort of registered inside the system so that you can pay using that account as well.

关于使用这笔钱，你需要通过个人保险账户来设置，这是必要的。

So in terms of using the money, you set up a personal insurance wallet through and this is this is necessary.

对吧？

Right?

嗯。

Mhmm.

是的。

Yeah.

通过国家统一医保信息平台。

Through the National Unified Medical Insurance Information Platform.

然后，参保人员可以通过该钱包为其家庭成员设置限额，该钱包将被虚拟管理。

And then the person who has the insurance, they can set a limit for their family member or members through that wallet, and then that wallet gets managed virtually.

并且不会发生资金实际转入钱包的情况，这也有助于保障医保基金的安全。

And there's no transfer of funds to the wallet that that occur, and this helps out with the safety of the medical insurance funds too.

这是一个重大举措，因为以前并不是说北京的儿子就不能给云南的父亲转账。

It's a it's a big move because it's not like it's not like the son in Beijing couldn't send money to his father in Yunnan, for example, before.

只是需要进行沟通。

It's just communication is required.

所以，如果父亲在医院需要钱，他必须发短信给正在工作的儿子，而儿子可能无法立即看到这条消息，而这个系统正好消除了所有这些中间环节。

So if the father was at the hospital and needed money, then he has to text his son who's probably working at the time, may not be able to see that message immediately, and then it just it just gets rid of all of that in between stuff.

是的。

Yeah.

而且也让资金流动更加合理。

And also makes the flow make sense.

例如，如果你的医保账户里有5000元，但你很少使用，这些钱也不能用在其他地方。

For example, if you have, for example, 5,000 yuan sitting in your health insurance account and you are not using it very frequently, you can't use it elsewhere as well.

你不能只是想着：我得把这5000元花掉。

You can't just thinking about, I need to spend this 5,000 yuan.

也许我想去药店买点东西。

Maybe I need to buy something from the pharmacies.

但你的父亲，比如在云南，可能因为健康问题需要去医院，经常要从药店拿处方药，而现在他们可以更灵活地使用这笔钱了。

But while your father, for example, in Yunnan know, need to go to the hospital because of some of the medical conditions and need really regular prescriptions from pharmacies, and now they can use that money in more of a financial sense.

但我们还需要确保，要将家人纳入资格范围，比如在云南的父亲本人也必须参加基本医疗保险。

But we kinda need to make sure also that in order to qualify our family members, that father in Yunnan must himself be enrolled in basic medical insurance as well.

你这边要有账户。

That there's account on your side.

家庭成员那边也必须有账户，这样系统才能正常运作。

There are there's also accounts on the family family members' side too You for this to work.

你提到了农村地区以及这些农村地区的医疗服务。

You mentioned rural communities and and health care services in those rural communities.

农村社区经常面临的问题是医疗提供者和设施的获取困难。

One of the one of the issues oftentimes with rural communities is access to providers and facilities.

这项政策对此有影响吗？

Does this policy impact that at all?

有。

Yes.

许多生活在农村地区的人面临医疗提供者和设施短缺的问题。

Many of those living in rural areas face this shortage of health care providers and facilities.

有了这项政策，城市里的家庭成员就可以使用他们的医保资金，帮助农村地区的亲属在附近的城镇或北京、上海、成都等顶级医院获得更好的医疗服务。

And with this kind of policy ready, that means family members in the cities can use their insurance funds to help with their close family members in the rural areas access better medical care in nearby urban centers or even in one of the top med hospitals in Beijing or Shanghai or Chengdu.

是的。

Yeah.

城市扩张时，优质的医疗资源往往会集中在人口最密集的地区，这完全可以理解。

And it's totally understandable sometimes that as the city grows and expands, the better medical resources sort of gather at where the pop the population kind of are the most density has the most density.

因此，与许多大城市相比，农村地区的人口较少。

So regarding rural areas, it's less people comparing to a lot of the major cities.

因此，他们有时面临医疗资源不足的情况，尽管医疗服务是可获得的，但对他们来说成本可能更高。

So they sometimes have this under an underserved case where the health care is even though it's available, it's probably have a higher cost for them.

因此，这项政策旨在提供帮助，同时通过共享账户，让他们能够获得来自大型医院的更高质量的治疗，从而提升他们所能接受的医疗服务质量。

So this is there to help and also to try to enhance the quality of the health care they can receive receive by, you know, just sharing that account and getting better higher quality treatment from major hospitals nowadays.

是的。

Yeah.

我认为这在一定程度上消除了障碍。

Think it sort of removed the barriers Right.

对于这些居民来说，当涉及到自掏腰包时，即使之后可以报销，许多农村地区的居民仍会尽量避免就医，不仅因为路途遥远，也因为费用问题。

For these residents because when it comes to, you know, having money out of their pockets, even though you can get it reimbursed later for a lot of these residents in these rural areas, they'll try to avoid going to the hospitals not only because of the travel time but also because of the money.

因此，我认为通过消除这些障碍，他们能更有信心前往医院接受治疗。

So I think by removing these barriers, they can be more feeling more confident going to the hospital for

他们的教育。

their education.

这是他们无需再操心的一件事。

It's one less thing they have to worry about.

是的。

Yes.

嗯。

Yeah.

现在要把这种类型的方案在全国范围内推行肯定很难，因为刚才我问了关于药房的事，你说对。

Now putting this type of thing, this type of scheme together on a national level has gotta be hard because we well, I asked a moment ago about the pharmacies, and you said, yeah.

药房必须成为这个项目的一部分。

The pharmacies have to be a part of the program.

嗯。

Mhmm.

这意味着所有相关方都需要参与这个项目。

So that means everyone involved needs to be a part of the program.

当你在全国多个省份范围内构建这样一个系统时，这肯定是一个巨大的挑战。

That has to be a serious challenge to put together a system like this when you're talking about multiple provinces all around the country.

嗯。

Yeah.

因为不同的省份有时会有不同的医疗保健法规和各自的本地系统，这当然会给我们目前正试图建立的无缝资金共享和整合带来复杂性。

Because different provinces, they can sometimes have different health care regulations and local systems of their own, which, of course, could complicate the seamless fund sharing and integration we're trying to build at this point.

是的。

Yeah.

而且技术也会是一个巨大的障碍。

And also technology would also be a big hurdle.

你可以想象，要在全国范围内将数十亿人的健康数据存储在某个系统中，并让这些系统跨省份高效且安全地协同工作，这将是一个非常困难的技术挑战。

You you can just imagine having billions of people's dead data on some sort of system across provinces and they need to work together efficiently and also securely, it will be a very difficult technological challenge

还有。

as well.

更不用说统一的全国代码了。

Let alone the one code for all.

就连教我的祖父母信任他们手机上的二维码都很困难。

It's hard enough to teach my grandparents to trust the QR code they have on their phone.

真的吗？

Oh, really?

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Right.

为什么这是嗯。

Why why is this Yeah.

我猜人们也可能滥用资金，以不应该的方式使用它们。

I suppose there would be a risk as well of people using the funds incorrectly or in ways that they that they shouldn't be using them.

是的。

Yeah.

这就涉及到欺诈的风险。

That's there there comes to the risk of fraud.

由于我们之前讨论过的更大灵活性，可能存在滥用甚至虚假索赔的可能性。

Because of this greater flexibility as we discussed, there will be potential for misuse and even fraudulent claims.

这也意味着，我认为，需要严格的监管，以及技术层面的措施。

That also means, I think, strict monitoring regulation and also, you know, technological wise.

嗯。

Yeah.

而且这将会，嗯。

And that's gonna yeah.

审计。

Auditing.

嗯。

Yeah.

定期审计，这也会意味着多很多工作。

Regular auditing, that's gonna mean a lot a lot more work too.

但希望这种情况不会那么频繁发生。

But, hopefully, that's not needed so often.

让人们提高意识。

Getting people to be aware.

你刚才提到了，玉山。

You just mentioned it, Yushan.

你的祖父母仍然不相信二维码。

Your grandparents still don't trust a QR code.

是的。

Yeah.

他们喜欢能拿在手里的东西，比如卡片。

They like something that they can hold in their hands such as a card.

是的。

Yeah.

是的。

Yeah.

没错。

Exactly.

嗯，不是的。

Well, no.

我的意思是，对我们来说，这听起来可能挺可爱的。

I mean, that sounds to us, maybe that might sound like, that's cute.

但对很多人来说，这就是现实。

But that's reality for a for a lot of people.

一种他们可以拿在手里的实体物品。

Something tangible that they can hold in their hand.

他们知道这是我的医院卡。

They know this is my hospital card.

这是我去医院时需要的东西。

This is what I need when I go to the hospital.

嗯。

Mhmm.

试图改变这些习惯，让他们信任不熟悉的东西，将是一个巨大的转变。

Trying to change those habits and trust them in something trust in something that they're not familiar with would be a big step.

是的。

Yeah.

所以我认为，对于这种情况，可能意味着需要更多地宣传这个系统。

So I think when it for that, that probably means more of this publicity of the system.

嗯。

Yeah.

比如志愿者，医院可以告诉他们：你可以信任这个。

Maybe volunteers, for example, hospital telling them that you can trust this.

我们接受这个码。

We accept this code.

别担心这个。

Don't worry about that.

即使你忘记带它去医院，也还有一个备用方案，一个你可以信赖的数字方案，真的。

And even when you forget to bring it to the hospital, there's also a plan b, a digital plan b that you can rely on, like, seriously.

嗯。

Yeah.

嗯。

Yeah.

那医疗系统会怎么做呢？

Does the or what will the health care system do?

我们提到过审计，作为确保一切正常运行的措施之一。

We mentioned auditing as as one of the things to make sure that everything does run as it is supposed to run.

此外，我们还需要关注数据安全和验证流程，因为使用统一的国家平台需要安全的验证机制，以便人们能更信任它，比如人脸识别、基于手机的验证，或者我们之前提到的支付方式。

Also, there is the data security and verification process we kinda need to look up to too because the use of a unified national platform should require secure verification processes so that people can trust it better, like facial recognition or mobile based checks or payment methods like we mentioned earlier.

这一切都是为了确保只有授权人员才能访问和使用这些资金。

That's all to ensure that only authorized individuals can access and use these funds.

这意味着，对于违反这些规则和规定的人，必须设定相应的处罚或后果，任何试图滥用系统或非法获取系统内不同数据的人都将受到惩处。

And it also means for those that offend or violate these rules and regulations, there need to be penalties or consequences that for anyone caught attempting to misuse the system or getting illegal access to different data on that system as well.

人们在讨论这个吗？

Is this something people are talking about?

你有没有注意到你的家庭群聊里有人在谈论这个？

Have you noticed your family group chat, anybody talking about this?

在我看来，这似乎会彻底改变医疗系统的运作方式。

This seems to me like this would be a really significant change in how the health care system works.

你有没有听到你的祖父母、父母，或者任何人与居住在不同地区的人讨论过这个？

So have you heard your grandparents or your parents or anybody discussing this with people living in different parts of the country?

嗯，我觉得我丈夫已经在申请了，因为首先你得在那个系统上注册。

Well, I think my husband is already sort of applying for that because you also need to register and applying first of all on that system.

然后他们就可以共享这个账户或资金。

And then they are able to share that account or money.

但我也不确定。

But I'm not sure.

我还没真去查过他这方面的情况。

I haven't haven't really checked on him on this.

嗯。

Mhmm.

是的。

Yeah.

至于我的祖父母，他们还没有使用这个系统。

And my grandparents, they have not yet tapped into this system

他们还没准备好。

They're to a not ready yet.

嗯。

Yeah.

他们知道，嗯，他们有点了解，但还在观望这项政策如何作为国家政策推进。

They are aware of well, they're sort of aware of it, but they're still waiting to see how it's gonna really push through for as a national policy.

让别人先试试看，然后看看情况如何。

Let other people try it out first, maybe, and and see how it goes.

嗯。

Yeah.

这是大新闻。

It is big news.

这对国家的医疗行业来说是一个重大举措。

It's a big step here for the health care industry, in the country.

这一点是肯定的。

That much is for sure.