完整循环：宫殿修复、粉盐、跟踪前伴侣

讨论让世界持续运转。

Discussion keeps the world turning.

这是圆桌会议。

This is Roundtable.

你正在收听圆桌会议。

You're listening to Roundtable.

我是雍虎灵，和史蒂夫以及玉顺一起主持。

I'm Yong Huling, joined by Steve and Yushun.

接下来，我们非常兴奋地推出圆桌会议的一个新环节，我们将揭示本周故事中隐藏的模式。

Coming up soon, we're excited to unveil a new segment of Roundtable where we find out a pattern hiding hiding in this week's stories.

你目前还看不到，因为我们还没有把所有碎片都摆上桌面。

You can't see it yet because we haven't laid all the pieces on the table.

但一旦我们完成，一些意想不到的事情就会开始浮现。

But once we do, something unexpected starts to merge.

所以，请大家欢迎我们全新的环节——圆满循环。

So everybody, please welcome our brand new segment, the full circle.

三个故事。

Three stories.

一个联系。

One connection.

这就是全循环。

This is the full circle.

欢迎来到全循环的第一期。

Welcome to the first edition of the Full Circle.

在这一环节中，我们会回顾本周《圆桌派》往期节目中的三个故事，并尝试找出它们之间一个令人惊讶的共同点。

In this segment, we look back at three stories from our previous episodes of Roundtable this week, and we try to draw a single surprising connection between them.

为了增加趣味性并使其成为一个真正的谜题，我们特意挑选了三个看似毫无关联的故事，这正是关键所在。

To make it fun and to make it a genuine puzzle, we deliberately pick three stories that seem to have nothing to do with one another, and that's the whole point.

关键。

Point.

史蒂夫，你愿意为我们指出本周的这三个故事吗？

Steve, would you do the honor of pinpoint these three stories this week?

嗯。

Yeah.

所以我回顾了我们这一周的圆桌讨论，看了我们报道过的那些故事，发现有一些故事似乎能联系起来，但我心想，这并不符合‘全循环’这个环节的宗旨。

So what I did was I looked back at our week of roundtable to see the stories that we had covered, and I saw some stories that kind of fit together and I thought, well, that's not really the point of this exercise for the full circle.

所以我按照你说的，挑选了三个看似完全无关的故事。

So I tried to choose three stories like you said that have seemingly nothing, nothing connecting them.

这是我选的第一个。

So this is the first one I chose.

这是周一的。

This is from Monday.

所以玫瑰盐，或者有些人称之为喜马拉雅岩盐，是一种天然岩盐，其粉红色来自于微量矿物质如铁。

So the rose salt or some people will call it Himalayan rock salt is a type of natural rock salt when it comes to the pink color results come from trace amounts of minerals such as iron.

这是周一的。

So this is from Monday.

嗯。

Yeah.

这则故事是关于喜马拉雅粉盐的。

And this was about Himalayan pink salt.

从这个故事中我们了解到，当然，我们知道它美丽的颜色和纯净的传说，它变成了一种人人都想购买的潮流健康产品，但后来的实验室检测揭示了存在问题。

And what we learned from that story was that, of course, we know about its beautiful color and its story of purity, and it became kind of this trendy item that everybody wanted to buy, this health item, but then they conducted lab tests that revealed there was a problem.

标志性的粉红色来自铁氧化物等矿物质，而一些品牌的产品中还含有铅和砷等重金属。

The signature pink hue comes from minerals like iron oxide, and then some brands contained heavy metals like lead and arsenic.

我们进一步探讨了，正是让这种盐看起来（或不像）普通盐的特性，也可能使它变得不安全。

And then we explored how the very thing that made it look or not look like ordinary salt was also what could make it unsafe.

我记得听完那期节目后，我把家里剩下的所有粉盐都扔掉了，因为我知道在中国，玫瑰盐仅被批准用于工业用途。

I remember that after listening to that episode, I thrown away all of the pink salt that we still have at home for a really long time because I learned that in China, rose salt is approved only for industrial use.

是的。

Yeah.

没错。

That's right.

我记得有人说，他们花了那么大的力气去避免这些化学物质，结果却又把它们重新摄入了。

And I remember people were saying that they spent so much effort on getting out of these chemicals and then they're putting them back again.

嗯。

Yeah.

嗯。

Yeah.

所以这是我选的第一个故事。

So that was the first story I chose.

那是周一的事。

That was from Monday.

现在我选的下一个故事来自周二。

Now the next story I chose is from Tuesday.

嗯。

Yeah.

养心殿。

Yang Xin Dian, the Hall Of Mental Cultivation.

不是。

No.

想到这栋建筑里发生过的所有历史，真是令人感慨。

Thinking about all the history going on inside of this Yeah.

就在这座殿堂里。

In this hall.

实际上，养心殿更像是故宫博物院内部的一个庭院。

Well, actually, the Hall Of Mental Cultivation is more of a yard inside the palace museum.

所以，这是来自周二的故事，讲的是北京紫禁城里的养心殿。

So that was from Tuesday, and that story was about the Hall Of Mental Cultivation in Beijing's For Bidden City.

我们谈到，经过十年的修复关闭后，重新开放时并没有展示一个光鲜亮丽的新建筑，而是展示了一处保护人员辛勤工作保留下来的原貌——每一道裂缝、每一处污渍、每一片腐朽都被保留了下来，因为这些瑕疵正是这座建筑数百年历史的真实见证。

And we talked about how after a decade of being closed for restoration, the big reveal wasn't a shiny new building or anything like that, but it was a place where conservators had really worked hard to preserve every crack and every stain and every bit of decay because those flaws were the true evidence of the hundreds of years of history of that building.

这对许多历史爱好者来说绝对是个好消息。

That is absolutely a good news for a lot of these history lovers.

我完全能理解，因为故宫博物院有年票，你知道的。

I can totally see because Palace Museum, they have annual pass, you know.

我完全能理解为什么人们会购买年票，一遍又一遍地来到这里，去欣赏这些令人着迷的细节。

I can totally see the reason why people are buying annual pass to go to this place again and again to see a lot of these fascinating things.

所有这些细节，历史留下的微小痕迹，也是中国在修复历史遗址、艺术、建筑时所遵循的原则。

All of the details, the little mark of history, and this is also the principle of restoring historical sites, art, buildings, and architectures here in China.

也就是说，你应该将其重建为几百年前的样子。

That is, you're supposed to rebuild it to what it looked like hundreds of years ago.

因此，这一直是核心理念，而养心殿的修复工作做得非常好。

So that has always been the point, and the whole of mental cultivation restoration has done a really good job.

是的。

Yeah.

这就是我选择的第二个故事。

So that was my second story that I chose.

现在，第三个故事也来自周二，我们当时谈到了对前任的纠缠。

Now, the third one also came from Tuesday where we talked about the stalking of the ex.

追溯性嫉妒是指你去浏览他们的社交媒体，看到照片里有个男人，你的大脑就开始想：他是谁？

Retroactive jealousy is when you go to their social media sites and you see there's some dude in the picture, and your brain starts thinking, who's that?

她和他在一起时更快乐。

She was happier with him.

看看她有多开心。

Look how happy she is.

结果发现那是她的同事。

Now it turns out that was her coworker.

还是不对。

Still not okay.

嗯。

Yeah.

是啊。

So, yeah.

所以我们谈到了回溯性嫉妒，就是那种想要在网上窥探伴侣前任、了解他们过去关系的冲动，我们讨论了为什么我们会沉迷于这些来自过去的数字幽灵，以及它们如何伤害我们当前的关系，诸如此类的问题。

So we talked about retroactive jealousy, and that's where it's the urge to kind of cyber stalk your partner's ex and find out about their past relationship, and we discussed why we get obsessed with these digital ghosts from the past and how they can hurt our current relationships and things of that nature.

对。

Yes.

社交媒体的特性让情况变得更糟。

The nature of social media just make it worse.

嗯。

Yeah.

关系的本质是不同类型的嫉妒，以及不太依赖对方，但最终目标是能够看到彼此的优点，并因为彼此而成为更好的自己。

The nature of relationship is different types of jealousy and a little bit of not relying on the other party, but the the destination is being able to find the good in each other and find a better version of yourself yourself because of each other.

但那是

But that's

人们并不会这么做。

not what people do.

没错。

That's true.

人们要花很长时间才能达到那个境界。

People would take a really long time to go to that destination.

但现在我觉得是时候揭示这个秘密了。

But now I think it's time to reveal the secret.

史蒂夫，这三个故事彼此毫无关联。

Steve, these three stories have nothing to do with each other.

这里的联系是什么？

What what is the link here?

我们有一种昂贵且可能不健康的盐。

Well, we have an expensive, potentially unhealthy salt.

我们有一座拥有数百年历史的宫殿，还有一种因伴侣旧的Facebook照片而彻夜焦虑的状况。

We have a centuries old palace, and we have midnight anxiety spiraling over a partner's old Facebook photos.

现在看起来这里似乎没有任何关联，但我找到了。

Now it seems like there's no connection here, but I found it.

我们一起来看看它是什么吗？

Shall we find out what it is?

好吧。

Alright.

当我意识到这一切都关乎我们与那些本不该存在之物的关系——与缺陷、污染和杂质的关系时，我恍然大悟。

It hit me when I realized that that all these are about our relationship with what's not supposed to be there, with the flaw, with the contaminant, with the impurity.

而讽刺的是，我们对这些情况有着三种截然不同、近乎矛盾的反应。

And the funny ironic truth is we have three completely different, almost contradictory reactions to it.

首先，我们从粉盐开始。

First, we'll start with the pink salt.

杂质就是产品本身，而我们的反应堪称一场精心策划的欲望示范。

The impurity is the product, and our reaction is a master class in curated desire.

我们不仅仅是购买它，而是主动渴望它，因为我们被灌输并推销了一个精彩的故事，将缺陷转化为身份象征。

We don't just buy it, we actively want it because we've been told and sold a brilliant story that turns a flaw into a status symbol.

由铁氧化物等微量矿物质带来的美丽粉红色，被描绘成天然、未加工的状态，几乎像一种荣誉徽章，而我们深信不疑。

The beautiful pink color from trace minerals like iron oxide is framed not as contamination but as natural, unprocessed, almost like a badge of honor, and we believe it.

我们愿意支付溢价，因为在深层心理上，我们认为自己渴望这种特殊的杂质，它让我们感觉与大地相连，也让我们觉得自己足够聪明，能够拒绝纯净的白盐。

We pay the premium because on a deep level we think that we want this special impurity and it makes us feel connected to the earth and it makes us feel smart enough to reject sterile white salt.

这是一种令人震惊的讽刺，因为正是我们陷入其中、被教导去渴望的特征，也几乎构成了危险的源头。

This is devastating irony because it's the very characteristic that we're caught in, that we're taught to crave, and it's almost the source of danger as well.

接下来，第二点，精神修养的大厅。

Now, second, the hall of mental cultivation.

这里的杂质是真相，但在这里，我们努力维护它，这可以说是极具吸引力的反面。

The impurity there is the truth, but here we fight to preserve it, and this is kind of the fascinating flip side.

十年来，修复师们并不将腐朽视为敌人。

For a decade, conservators didn't see decay as the enemy.

他们将其视为客户。

They saw it as kind of the client.

腐烂的梁木、被虫蛀的丝绸墙板、剥落的灰泥。

The rotten beams, the insect board silk wall panels, the crumbling plaster.

这些在翻新中并不是需要抹去的缺陷。

These weren't flaws to be erased, in a renovation.

它们是历史的物证。

They were the forensic evidence of history.

一个完美修复、闪闪发亮的新霍尔庄园，就像一个历史谎言。

A perfectly restored gleaming Newhall would be kind of like a historical lie.

它会像一个主题公园的布景。

It would be like a theme park set.

因此，真实性与价值恰恰存在于这些不完美、这些杂质之中。

So the authenticity, the value lies precisely in those imperfections, in those impurities.

最后，过度纠结于伴侣的过去。

And finally, obsessing over your partner's past.

这种杂质就是幽灵，就是那个X，我们折磨自己，试图抹去这个X。

The impurity is the ghost, the x, and we torment ourselves trying to erase that x.

但这里的杂质是心理上的。

But here the impurity is psychological.

它指的是过去的关系，而我们的大脑常常将其视为我们纯粹排他性关系中的污染物。

It's the existence of a past relationship where our brain often interprets it as a contaminant in the pure exclusive narrative of us.

正如我之前提到的，我们陷入事后的嫉妒，并非因为当前存在威胁，而是因为我们被一段无法掌控的历史所困扰。

We engage in retroactive jealousy, as I mentioned before, not because of a present threat, but because we're haunted by a history that we can't control.

因此，我们不断浏览这些数字痕迹——旧照片、残留的评论，并用它们构建出一个竞争对手。

So we scroll through these digital traces, these old photos, these lingering comments, and we use them to construct a rival.

这些常常被理想化的幽灵，我们把过去当作自己完美爱情故事中的瑕疵或杂质，试图在心理上将其彻底清除。

Often idealized ghosts, we treat the past like it's a flaw or an impurity in our own perfect love story, something to be mentally scrubbed away.

但这样做，我们却拒绝了眼前那个层次丰富的人——你的伴侣，正是他们的过去杂质，塑造了他们如今的模样。

But in doing so, we're rejecting the layered person right in front of you, your partner, whose past impurities and all help to shape who they are.

所以，这个完整的循环就是一种精彩的人性矛盾：作为消费者，我们轻易地购买了伪装成高端产品的危险杂质，而我们又是历史学家。

So the full circle is this brilliant human contradiction where consumers, where we easily buy a dangerous impurity disguised as a premium, We're historians.

我们 painstakingly 地保存着这种破坏性的杂质，视其为我们最神圣的证据；同时我们又是恋人，为这种无害的杂质而痛苦不堪，仿佛它是我们关系中的致命缺陷。

We're painstakingly preserving a destructive impurity as our most sacred evidence, and we are lovers, agonizing over a harmless impurity as if it is a fatal flaw to our relationship.

关系。

Relationship.

掌声。

Bravo.

掌声。

Bravo.

干得好，史蒂夫。

Great job, Steve.

这就是三者之间的联系。

And that's the connection between the three.

这或许也是世界上许多事物之间的联系。

And it might be the connection among a lot of things in the world.

我们看到，作为人类，我们试图清除生活中的杂质。

We get to see that as humans, we try to remove the impurities in our lives.

但当我们发明人工智能时，却抱怨它们生成的作品太过完美，因为不够真实。

But when we invented artificial intelligence, we complain about the work that they create are too perfect in the sense that they're not real enough.

杂质有时也是生活中所需的复杂性。

Impurity is sometimes also the complexity we need in life.

它可能是我们个性的一部分。

It can be the personality we have.

我认为这个《全循环》首期特别酷的地方在于，我们看到了人们对杂质的不同反应。

And I think what's really cool about this first edition of Full Circle is that we see people's reaction towards impurity being different.

当你在一段关系中时，你会因为对方身上的某种特质而爱他们，但在这段关系的不同阶段，你又可能因为同样的特质而恨他们。

And when you're, yes, in a relationship, you love someone for something they have, you can easily hate it for this exact character they have in different stage relationship.

是的，这就是杂质的讽刺之处，我认为人工智能就是一个很好的例子。

Yeah, it's the irony of impurities, and I think AI is a great example.

我记得，你记得那个第一个AI生成的视频出来时的情景吗？威尔·史密斯在吃意大利面之类的，画面太糟糕了，人们因为它的不完美而愤怒。

I remember, do you remember when that first AI made video came out, Will Smith eating spaghetti or something, and it was so bad, and people got angry because of how imperfect it was.

是的。

Yes.

但现在，人们却因为人工智能太过完美、毫无瑕疵而感到愤怒，这也让人不安。

But now, people are angry at AI because there are no impurities, because it's too perfect, and that makes people upset too.

我们在日常生活中不断遇到这种纯净与杂质的问题，却很难说哪一种是对的或错的，因为我们其实两者都需要。

We've been, like, coming coming across these kind of purity and impurities so constantly in our daily lives and we cannot really tell that which one is right or wrong because we kind of need them both.

这让我想起了我们常喝的瓶装矿泉水，因为它含有营养成分，含有微量矿物质。

And that actually reminded me of the bottled mineral water that we often just drink because it has nutritional value because it contains trace minerals.

但在某些情况下，你需要的是完全纯净、不含任何微量元素的水，比如用来清洗伤口，根本不需要那些矿物质。

But in certain situations, what you need is purified water without any kind of, like, completely pure and contains no trace elements at all because maybe you you you need to clean your wounds or something and it doesn't need that kind of minerals.

然而，问题是，如果一个人长期饮用这种纯净水，身体最终会缺乏必要的微量元素。

And that problem is, however, is that if a person drinks this kind of purified water for a long time, the body will end up lacking essential trace minerals.

所以这是一个不断反复的过程，我们处于一种既需要又不需要的境地。

So it's constant back and forth, and we are in a situation of we need and we don't need.

我们想要，又不想要。

We want and we don't want.

我们喜欢，又不喜欢。

We like and we don't like.

这都是相对的。

It's all relative.

是啊。

Yeah.

还有什么最后的想法吗？

Any final thoughts?

是啊。

Yeah.

我觉得一切都回归到那些不纯粹的东西。

And I think it all comes back to the stuff that's not pure.

添加剂、疤痕或历史。

The additive or the scar or the history.

无论是在我们的盐、纪念碑还是心中，这种缺陷才是真实价值所在，或许也是真实危险或真实戏剧性的根源，它就存在于那里。

Whether it's in our salt or our monuments or our hearts, that flaw is where the real value lies or perhaps the real danger or perhaps the real drama, that's where it lives.

但你知道，这让我开始思考超越盐、宫殿和前伴侣之外的事情。

But, you know, it got me thinking beyond salt and palaces and ex partners.

它让我意识到，我们与那些不完美事物之间最基本的人类关系其实非常复杂。

It made me think about how our most basic human relationship with things that aren't perfect is rather complex.

如果我们买衣服前看到上面有污渍，就会希望打折。

If we see a stain on a t shirt before we buy it, we want a discount.

如果车上有一道划痕，你肯定不会愿意付全价，这很公平，因为市场就是这样运作的。

If there's a scratch on a car, well, you wouldn't think of paying full price, and that's fair because that's the marketplace and that's how that works.

但当我们把同样的眼光转向自己和自己的生活时，就会看到完全不同的故事。

But then if we turn that same lens on ourselves and on our lives, we see a different story.

如果我们脸上有个痣，可能会觉得是需要去除的瑕疵；如果伴侣的笑声太大，也许会觉得烦人；如果乌云密布，就会因这一天不完美而情绪低落。

If we have a mole on our cheek, we might see a flaw to be removed, or if our partner's laugh is a little bit too loud, maybe you find it annoying, or if the rain clouds roll in, feel down because the day isn't perfect.

但如果我们改变一下视角呢？

But what if we changed our perspective?

如果我们改变看待这些事情的方式呢？

What if we changed the way we looked at that?

如果脸上那颗痣正是让你成为你的关键呢？

What if the mole on that face is the thing that makes you you?

如果那爽朗的笑声正是你所爱之人毫无掩饰的喜悦之声呢？

What if that loud laugh is the unfiltered joyous sound of the person you love?

如果阴雨天正是听一首忧伤歌曲、喝一杯热饮、穿上那双你从没机会穿的雨靴的完美借口呢？

And what if the rainy day is the perfect excuse for a sad song or a hot drink and those rain boots that you never get to wear?

所以，有时——并非总是——但有时，只要我们仔细观察，就会发现那些我们认为是缺陷的东西，恰恰正是让事物、他人或我们自身变得更加美好的原因。

So sometimes, not always, but sometimes, if we look hard enough, we can find that what we thought were the imperfections are actually the very things that make it or them or us even better.

而这，正是《圆满循环》的第一期。

And that is the very first edition of Full Circle.

希望你也喜欢。

Hope you enjoy it as well.

你也可以自己进行这种思维体操：在圆桌讨论中找出三个你喜爱的故事，看看它们之间是否也存在某种隐藏的联系。

And you can play this mental gymnastics yourself, find out three stories that you enjoyed on roundtable, and figure out perhaps there is this hidden link between them as well.

非常感谢你的收听。

And thank you so much for listening.

我是牛红林，和Steve、Yushun在一起。

I'm Niu Hong Lin with Steve, and Yushun.

我们下次再见。

We'll see you next time.