艾伦和莉兹关于第111至120集的跑步闲聊与总结

而且你会获得一点小好处，你是在支持我们

And we'll we'll get a small benefit, you're helping out the

说到这个，咱们回到播客上来。

Speaking of which, back to the podcast.

对。

Yeah.

很多时候，这两件事其实是相辅相成的。

Oftentimes, like, the two things can complement each other.

你知道，有时候一天工作下来，真不想去跑步。

You know, yes, sometimes after a day of work, it's hard to go for a run.

但有时候，忙完一天后去跑个步，就算没达到配速目标什么的，也没关系。

But sometimes once you've done the run after a hard day of work, okay, so like maybe you didn't hit the interval paces or whatever.

我以前的教练总说，身体并不在乎配速，它只在乎你付出了多少努力。

My previous coach used to say your body doesn't really recognize pace, it recognizes effort.

所以只要你肯出力，身体就会变强。

So you get fitter with the effort you put in.

到了比赛那天，希望你休息得好，整个星期都睡得不错，碳水也吃够了，诸如此类的事情。

And on race day, hopefully you're, you know, you're rested and, you know, you've slept well the whole week before and, you know, you've eaten all your carbs and all that stuff.

所以你实际从比赛日得到的，往往会比你预想的还要多，就是因为这些准备。

And so you get more than you think you're gonna get out of race day just because of that.

是的。

Yeah.

这本书详细展示了阿什的成果，以及他是如何通过自己独特的方法，最大限度地发挥潜力，迎接各种艰巨挑战的。

So the book really shows Ash and the results that happen with Ash and his particular individual recipe for maximizing what he can do and taking on incredible challenges.

他能挤出时间去做，还能达成目标。

Being able to fit that in and achieve.

他并不是很快就能实现所有目标，而是持续不断地努力。

And he doesn't achieve all the things that he wants to very quickly and he keeps at it.

所以他有很强的毅力。

So he has some degree of determination.

但他的生活也不轻松，我记得。

But also he doesn't have an easy life, I remember.

因为他还有家人之类的负担，但看起来跑步反而能和这些生活事务相互补充。

Because he's got family and all of that, but it seems that running, you know, running can complement all those things.

也许一开始，他把一半精力放在生活上，另一半放在跑步上，后来可能慢慢调整了重心。

And maybe to begin with, he's putting half of his effort into his life and half of his effort into running, and maybe he ends up tilting that a bit.

我不太确定。

I don't know.

我的意思是，我们并不清楚他生活中还有哪些其他事情在发生。

I mean, we don't know what else is going on in his life.

也许他放弃了其他一些爱好，现在只专心跑步了。

So maybe he's stopped some other hobbies and now he's doing just running.

我以前的教练约翰常说，一个人最多只能把三件事做好。

My previous coach John used to say you can only be good at three things.

这正是他常提的一个观点。

This was one of his things.

他总是反复说这句话。

He would repeat this all the time.

那时候我们还在上学，他当时是我在大学时的教练，总说：你得把时间分给学业——如果你已经工作了，那就是工作，也可能你同时在上学和工作。

So it, because like at the time we were in school, because he was my coach during university, he would say, okay, so you have to do like school, or that could be work if you're working, or maybe you're doing both school and work.

然后还得顾着家人，毕竟人际关系得维系。

Then you have family, because you have to maintain your relationships.

你知道，一个人单打独斗很难真正成功。

You know, you're not really successful on your own.

归根结底，这事儿总得靠团队配合。

It's always kind of a team effort.

还有呢。

And

他说，这样一来，就只剩下一个名额了，你可以选择把这最后一点精力留给跑步，或者留给别的事情。

so he said, then there's one spot left, And so you can choose for it to be running, or you can choose for it to be something else.

他就是这么讲的，当然，这中间也有点弹性空间。

And he kinda said that, and, like, obviously, you know, there's a little leeway for that.

你其实也可以顺便做点别的事，稍微兼顾一下。

You can you can sort of you can sort of, you know, do a few other things on the side.

但他的核心想法其实是

But it it was basically the idea was like,

我希望你能试试

I hope try

要把这个当成头等大事来对待

so to for to make it a priority.

希望对你来说也是这样

I hope so for your case.

是啊，我明白

Yeah, I know.

没错

Yeah.

我有时候确实还兼着好几件事

I've got more than a few things on the side sometimes.

不过他总是提醒我们这一点

But anyway, he always used to remind us of that.

每次我们刚开始越野跑赛季，他都会说这一番话。

It was like that was his speech every time we would start cross country season.

他总跟我们讲，说我们必须得

It was telling us about And how we have to

有一件挺好的事就是读书，它能唤起你以前学过的东西，帮你重新巩固那些你可能已经学过但忘了的内容，这也很棒。

one nice thing is reading the books, it brings back previous learnings and reinforces some of the things that maybe you've already been shown or taught and forgotten, which is also cool.

所有书都是这样。

And that's true for all the books.

我不确定，也许我们接下来该读《追逐卓越》，然后再回过头来读《相信训练日记》，因为你刚才几乎已经提到《追逐卓越》了——阿什就是在追逐自己的潜能。

And I don't know, so maybe we should do Chasing Mastery next and then come back to Believe Training Journal because it's like you almost touched on chasing mastery because it's a little bit, Ash is chasing his potential.

对。

Yeah.

所以这其实有点类似。

So it's a little bit of the same thing.

这样过渡更自然一些。

It's a it's a better segue.

是的

Yeah.

所以《追逐卓越》这本书讲的是马特·弗吉尼亚如何一步步成为最出色的跑者

So Chasing Mastery by Matt Fitzgerald is basically, his his step to becoming the best runner

对

Yeah.

你所能达到的极限

That you can be.

他把这分解成了几个核心支柱

He kind of breaks it down into pillars.

是啊，这书严格来说不是训练指南

Yeah, it's not a training book per se.

它更像是一本关于跑步心态的书，或者

It's more a sort of running mindset book or

没错，差不多就是这样

Yeah, sort of, yeah.

态度和方法，来自马特·菲茨杰拉德这样经验丰富的专家，自然格外有分量。

Attitude and approach, which coming from Matt Fitzgerald has got such a wealth of experience and knowledge.

特别有意思的是，他写过那么多关于实际训练的书。

It's so interesting because he wrote so many books about the actual training.

比如《80/20跑步》《耐力饮食》《像职业跑者一样跑》这些，他都写过了。

Like he wrote eightytwenty and Endurance Diet and, like, all these run like a pro.

他之前那些书讲的都是专业层面的东西，但这本完全不同，反而可能让你收获更多，因为他深入解释了跑步的细微之处，到底什么才叫真正掌握跑步。

Like, he's got all the all the pro stuff, and this one was really different because it was it was you can actually, in a way, get more benefit out of this one Because it's like he tries to explain the nuance of running and what mastering running really is.

因为说到底，

Because it's yeah.

表面上看是时间问题，但其实又不只是时间问题。

I guess it translates to a time on the clock, but it's not the time on the clock.

最基本的一点是，你到底该做什么样的训练才最有效？

I mean, first very basic thing is, you know, what's the best training that you can do?

或者说，什么样的训练才是最好的？

Or what's the best training?

最好的训练就是你实际在做的那一种。

The best training is the one that you do.

你可能会说，对我而言最好的训练是这种节奏训练之类的，但如果你根本不喜欢做，每次一有借口就退缩——天太湿了、冬天来了、有点不舒服——

Can say, the best training is, this tempo for me or whatever, but if you don't like doing that and every time an excuse presents itself you use that oh it's too wet, oh winter's here, Oh, I'm not I'm feeling a twinge.

你总是找理由逃避这些训练。

You know, you excuse yourself from from those things.

你可能拥有理论上最完美的训练计划。

So you can have the theoretical best training.

但如果你不爱做，大概率你坚持不下去。

But if you don't love doing it, you're probably not gonna do it.

所以他强调，第一件事是你要创造一个让你享受训练的环境。

So he says the first thing is you have to be, you have to create an environment where you love your training.

这样你才会去做自己真正喜欢的事。

So you're doing what you love.

对。

Yeah.

他其实提到了一个概念，叫‘艰苦的乐趣’。

And he actually mentions this concept of hard fun.

对。

Yeah.

这个‘艰苦的乐趣’，好吧，你不能一直都觉得训练很痛苦，所以这只是个小插曲。

Which hard fun okay, so you can't always be having hard fun, so that's just, you know, just a little aside.

但他说过，所谓的‘艰苦的乐趣’，就是你要学会享受那种艰苦，比如去体会那些高强度间歇训练的感觉。

But he says, he said hard fun is just you kinda need to learn to enjoy the hard, like feeling those hard intervals.

对，不可能一直都很痛苦，让你讨厌它。

Yeah, it's not hard all the time that you hate it.

而且

And

也不可能一直都很轻松，那样你就得不到任何锻炼效果了。

it's not so easy all the time that you're not getting any benefit from it.

因为很明显，所有的训练指南里都会提到，你需要用不同的配速和强度来训练，这样才能全面提升你的体能。

Because you need to obviously, in all training books, you have a wide range of paces you need to train at all the efforts so that you improve different parts of your fitness.

不过这个‘艰苦的乐趣’的概念，让我想起了约翰对节奏跑的讲解。

But this hard fun idea actually reminded me of of John's description of tempo running.

你知道，因为我大学时跑过步，那时候其实已经有GPS手表了。

So, you know, because we were we were running when I was in university, I mean, there there were GPS watches.

我觉得佳明那时候已经出了一两款，但还没普及，价格挺贵的，而且电池续航特别差。

I think Garmin had already come out with one or two versions, but they weren't like mainstream, and they were pretty expensive, and the battery life was terrible.

所以当时没人真正用得起。

So nobody really had them.

我的意思是，在跑步圈子里，尤其是康科迪亚大学的学生，因为我们当时真的没钱。

I mean, not in the running space and especially not like Concordia students because, you know, we had no money.

所以我们并不是那种首选的对象。

So so we weren't the prime candidates.

我们当时就有一块天美时的手表。

So we had we had, like, a Timex watch.

不过夏天戴那个也还行。

And that's fine in in the summer.

我们经常去跑道上练间歇跑。

We would go and do, like, intervals on the track.

但做节奏跑的时候，一般不会在跑道上。

But when you were doing tempo runs, you were you weren't usually on the track.

你就是找个能持续全力奔跑的地方，路上别有太多红绿灯或者别的干扰因素。

You would just run somewhere where you could run hard for a long time, and you didn't have too much, like, traffic stop signs, you know, all those other things that could get in the way of your running.

有些节奏跑，我们会去约翰特意带我们去的固定地点。

And we used to have so for certain for certain temple runs, we would actually have a specific place that we like, John would bring us.

比如蒙特利尔市中心的萨默赛特环道。

So for example, Summit Circle in Downtown Montreal.

对。

Mhmm.

那是个环形道路，大概在韦斯特蒙特那边吧，周围全是百万美元级别的豪宅，路上从来没什么车。

It's like this circle in I guess it is I don't know if it's Westmount but it's got it's got, like, you know, million dollar homes, and it's like, there's never any traffic.

中间还有一小片公园。

And there's like a like a little park in the middle.

那条路中间还有个隔离带。

And there was this this road that basically had a had a median in it.

我们以前就沿着隔离带跑，一边下去，绕一圈，再从另一边跑上来。

So we would we ran we used to run this section that was like down one side of the median, around the median, and back up the other side.

他总跟我们说，这段路正好是八百米。

And he used to always tell us this is 800 meters.

所以我们就会在那儿练八百米重复跑。不过我也不确定是不是真八百米，反正有时候觉得特别累，比平时跑八百米还费劲。

So we'd go into 800 meter repeats there, but like, I don't know if it was really 800 meters because I don't know, sometimes it felt like a really hard 800 to be doing those, harder than usual.

还有时候我们会进行节奏跑，他就会问我们：那我们怎么知道自己配速对不对呢？

And then other times we would run tempo, and he would say, he would just say like, we'd be like, well, how do we know if we're running the right pace?

因为这确实是我常问的问题。

Because this is always my question.

我老是会想，我怎么知道自己做得对不对呢？

Like, I'm always like, how do I know if I'm doing it right?

他以前的回答是：应该是一种‘舒适的吃力感’。

And he used to say, well, it should be comfortably hard.

你感觉怎么样？

How do you feel?

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

所以现在呢

And and so now

你会跟你的队员说。

you know you say to your people.

就说啊，

Say, well,

我现在会这么说。

now I say this.

是的。

Yeah.

但除了约翰之外。

But apart from John.

应该给七分左右吧，差不多这样。

It should be a seven on 10 or something like that.

这挺有意思的。

That's funny.

但那时候他根本没跟我们提过什么努力程度。

But he didn't even at the time, he didn't even tell us, like, effort levels.

那是因为当时LP指数还没发布吧。

That's because the LP index wasn't out then or something.

他后来才慢慢开始用这个方法，以前他都是用Google表格来安排所有任务，因为Google Docs能让他更新，我们也能看到自己该做什么。

He kind of got into that a little bit later because we used to he used to prescribe everything on a Google spreadsheet because Google was some like, the Google Docs was something that, you know, he could update, and then we could update what we actually did.

对。

Mhmm.

所以他一直用这个系统从

So so he used that from

那就是他所谓的苦中作乐。

So that was his version of hard fun.

对。

Yeah.

他那种苦中作乐，就是那种刚刚好有点难，但还能接受的程度。

His version of hard fun was like comfortably hard.

这让我想起了这一点。

That's what it reminded me of.

问题是，如果你走得太远，就总会停留在中间地带。

I mean, danger is if you take it too far, you'll always be in the middle ground.

初跑者最容易犯这个错误，因为他们每次跑步都只在第三心率区间，觉得：嗯，有点吃力，但还挺有意思。

So you'll be and that's the danger with beginner runners that you're gonna do all your runs in zone three because you'll go, oh yeah, it feels a bit hard, but it's kind of fun.

是的。

Yeah.

所以有时候，你确实需要多安排一些有挑战性的锻炼。

So you wanna have hard Sometimes you should have lots of hard fun.

不是

Not

太好玩。

much fun.

有时候你应该多享受乐趣，少点辛苦。

And sometimes you should have lots of fun and not much hard.

辛苦和乐趣要各占一半。

Always equal quantities of hard and fun.

对。

Yeah.

追求精通其实不仅仅关乎跑步。

And chasing mastery is actually not just about the running.

我的意思是，它确实和跑步有关，但我觉得更重要的是弄清楚怎样才能让你成为当下最好的自己。

I mean, it is about running, but I guess it's about figuring out what makes you the best runner that you can be right now.

所以这种追求精通的理念，并不会因为达到某个年龄或某个成绩就停止，你可以一直去追求它。

And so this idea of mastery, it doesn't like stop when you hit a certain age, or when you hit a certain time, or you know, you can kind of always chase it.

所以这个目标对那些从小就开始跑步、如今已过巅峰期、需要调整方向的人来说，挺合适的。

So it's kind of a good goal for for people that, I don't know, maybe have been running since they were young and, you know, are past their prime and need a different focus.

确实可以这么说。

This could Yeah.

这可以成为

Be the

马特提到过一个他称之为‘有目的的挑战’的概念。

Matt actually talks about something that he calls purposeful challenge.

他说，你可以给自己定个目标，比如跑五公里用二十五分钟。

He says, you know, you can set yourself a goal, like, I don't know, run a five ks in twenty five minutes.

是的。

Yeah.

你会想，总有一天我要跑出这个成绩，因为你设了一个现实可行的挑战。

And you'll think, one day I'm gonna run that because you've set yourself a realistic challenge.

达成之后你会很高兴，但第二天呢？

You'll be happy, but then what about the day after?

那第二天呢，你就会想，我能不能跑进二十三分钟，然后给自己设定一个新的挑战。

Well the day after is you go, well I wonder if I could do twenty three minutes and you reset your challenge.

对，你的期望值总是越来越高。

Yeah, your expectations always higher.

关键其实不在于那个具体的数字。

It's not the number necessarily.

你大概不太同意我这点吧。

You kind of disagree with me here probably.

关键不在于具体数字，而是你面前有一个能带来快乐的挑战。

It's not the number necessarily, but the fact that you have a challenge in front of you that brings you happiness.

如果你有一个有意义的挑战，那才是通往快乐的路径。

If you have a purposeful challenge, that's what leads to happiness.

对。

Yeah.

不过我觉得，所谓有意义的挑战，还得强调它是可以实现的。

I think also though that purposeful challenge, I mean, there's something to be said about it being attainable as well.

你可别把目标定得太高，高到根本够不着，那样就完全享受不到其中的好处了。

You don't want to have it so out of reach that you'll be so far from it that you're never going to get the benefit of that.

我想，这正是‘有目的’这个关键词的用意所在。

I guess that's where the purposeful comes in.

他提到那些——

He talks about those-

你可以说，我要跑出四分钟一英里的成绩。

I mean, you can say I'm going to run a four minute mile.

我以前最快才跑过五分半，现在却要跑四分钟一英里。

I've never run faster than five and a half minutes, so I'm gonna run a four minute mile.

是的。

Yeah.

你大概做不到。

You're probably not.

你得有点现实感。

You've gotta have some degree of realism.

是的。

Yeah.

我觉得这部分讲的是设定现实的目标，而有意识的挑战则是给自己设定一个对你真正有意义的目标。

Well, I think that part is about setting realistic goals and purposeful challenge is more like setting yourself a challenge that means something to you.

所以，你最终的目标完全可以是四分钟跑完一英里，即使你现在只能跑五分半钟一英里。

So actually, your ultimate challenge could be that four minute mile, even though you've, you've only, you're currently running five and a half minutes per mile.

但如果你觉得这个目标对你来说意义重大，它就可以成为一个长期目标。

But, but you know, like if you see that as a, as your, as your, you know, a goal that means something to you, then it can be a long term goal.

也许不是在一个赛季内就能实现。

Maybe not in one season.

是的。

Yeah.

但你可以这么说，好吧。

But you can say like, okay.

我想让自己达到四分钟一英里的水平。

Well, you know, I wanna get to four minutes.

对。

Yeah.

那这个赛季，我看看能不能跑到四分四十五秒左右？

So this season, how about I see if I can run like four forty five?

或者你从五分五十五秒开始，比如先跑到五分十五秒，然后一点点去突破。

Or or you go from five, 5.5 to, I don't know, five fifteen and you chip away at it.

这种一点点去突破的目标，就是那种有意义的挑战。

That's a purposeful challenge to chip away at it.

看看你能做到什么程度。

See how you can do.

对。

Yeah.

《追求精通》里另一件让我特别喜欢的东西是重构思维。

The other thing in Chasing Mastery that I loved is the reframing.

我觉得谈论重构思维这一点非常有力。

I think that's pretty powerful talking about reframing.

这其实是个心态问题。

It's a mindset thing.

我经常拿一个例子来说，就是有人赛前总说自己紧张。

The one I use all the time as an example is people who say they're nervous before a race.

我们

And we

我说，别这么想，你应该觉得兴奋才对。

say, no, no, think about it, it's better to be excited.

你既然选择了来，那最坏能坏到哪儿去呢？

You chose to be here, know, what's the worst that could happen?

不如把这当成一件让人兴奋的事，带着积极的心态去面对。

Better to be excited about it and going with a positive mindset.

是的。

Yeah.

话是这么说，我早就懂了，也听了很多年了。

You know what though, I know that and I've been hearing that for a long time.

我刚在十月跑的那场马拉松，真的特别难熬。

And the marathon that I just did in October was like, I had a really hard time with that.

我当时紧张得不行。

I was actually really nervous.

我怎么也调整不了心态。

And I couldn't reframe it.

紧张到前10公里，我都觉得要把早餐吐出来。

And and I was so nervous that, like, for the first 10 kilometers, I felt like I was gonna vomit my breakfast.

后来呢，我也不明白为什么。

And then, yeah, I, like, I don't know why.

就是怎么也想不通，自己怎么这么放不开。

I just had such a hard time, you know, getting my head around that.

因为你那个一起跑步的伙伴没在身边，所以才这样。

It's because your run buddy, your own buddy wasn't there to

也许就是这个原因吧。

make Maybe you that's why.

我不确定。

I don't know.

是的。

Yeah.

说实话，最后我表现得还不错。

I was I mean, it ended up I ended up doing okay.

我没像之前那几次马拉松那样彻底崩溃。

Like, I didn't fall apart like I had in the last few, you know, the last few marathon.

对。

Yeah.

你的表现比我在芝加哥跑的那次好多了。

Mean, you had a much better marathon than I had at Chicago.

你的配速

Your pacing

非常稳定。

was very even.

只是

Was just

不过我当时紧张得不行。

kind But I was what so nervous.

我真的特别紧张。

I was so nervous actually.

我记得Steph当时在跑半马，但我记不清她具体是什么时候说的了。

I think Steph was there doing the half marathon and I can't remember, like, when she said it.

但有一回，她跟我说，你是不是特别紧张啊？

But at one point, she's like, you're really nervous, aren't you?

我当时就说是的。

And I'm like, yeah.

我确实紧张得不行。

I was so nervous.

那种感觉，真的就是特别紧张。

I felt like yeah.

我就是，嗯，真的。

I I just I yeah.

我不清楚。

I don't know.

我不知道为什么。

I don't know why.

我当时就是，我知道我会……

And I couldn't like, I I know I'll

就直接发给自己吧。

just send this to myself.

你明明懂所有理论，可就是没法实践。

You knew you knew all the theory, but you couldn't practice it.

脑子里像一列脱轨的火车。

It was like a runaway train in my head.

它

It

所以，那感觉挺奇怪的。

was so it was it was strange.

我就觉得抓不住重点，但也说不上来为什么。

It was like I I couldn't get a handle on it, but I don't know.

我也不知道这到底是什么意思，但也许只是说明

I don't know what that means, but maybe it just means that

这事情本身就不简单，可能意味着你需要再多练练。

it's It not an easy thing to probably means you need to do a little bit more racing.

也许这就是它的意思吧。不过你知道，我以为自己已经准备充分了，因为我和你一起跑了半马。

Maybe that's what it means, but you know, I thought I had, you know, I thought I'd covered my bases because I did the half marathon with you.

对。

Yeah.

那场比赛进行得很顺利。

Mean, that went well.

但也许我需要多参加几次比赛。

But maybe I need more racing.

也许今年我参加的起跑线太少了。

Maybe I I didn't have enough starting lines this year.

大部分原因吧，我也说不清楚。

Most of it because, like, I don't know.

这其实是一种逃避行为。

I'm it's avoidance behavior.

我知道，我就是觉得不太想面对这种情况。

I, you know, I I'd like I don't feel like I'm Yeah.

我身体状态很好，所以不想证实自己其实没那么好。

I'm very fit, so I wanna avoid the confirmation that I'm not very fit.

所以我就不报名参加比赛。

And so I don't register for races.

这真傻，因为我其实挺喜欢跑步的。

And it's stupid because, like, I like doing this.

我们得让马特来帮你换个角度看这些问题。

And We'll have to get Matt on and ask him to reframe all of that for you.

是的。

Yeah.

我们确实请过Matt，但那时候我还没遇到这些问题。

Well, we had Matt on, but at the time I didn't have all these problems.

对。

Yeah.

就像我们之前说的，也许你抓得太紧了。

I mean, maybe you're holding it too tight, as we said.

但我认为你今年是有意放松了，比如告诉自己：今年别盯着三小时的马拉松成绩。

But I think you made a deliberate effort this year not to hold it very tight, say, okay, let's not worry about three hour marathons this year.

重点放在跑出一场好比赛，配速均匀，坚持到终点。

Let's worry about having a good race and with even splits and pushing it through till the end.

别太纠结于马拉松的完赛时间，而是让整个过程自然运转。

And not so much worrying about the number on marathon, trying to make the process work.

我觉得你确实做到了。

And I think you did that.

我至少努力这么做了，但我不确定自己到底做得怎么样。不过我觉得大部分时候是成功的，因为训练时我基本都是一个人，主要是因为我晚上要上课，俱乐部也没空。而且你们当时练的马拉松策略和我有点不一样。

I tried to do that at least, but I don't know if I, mean, I think mostly I succeeded because, know, in training I was very I I did a lot of training by myself and that was just because like I'm taking these evening classes and so I'm not available and the club's available and you you were training for a bit of a different marathon with a different strategy a little bit.

所以今年我们其实没怎么一起训练。

So we didn't really train together this year.

我大部分训练都是自己一个人完成的。

And I did a lot of my training by myself.

我训练时特别有意识，比如安排了两分钟最大强度间歇，我就尽量去达到目标配速。

And so I was very, you know, I would go out and So for, let's say, you know, if it was supposed to be the o two max intervals, like, would try and hit the paces.

那些中长距离跑，我也常常按去年我们一起训练时、目标调整过的配速来跑。

And all those medium long runs, I would kind of go out and a lot of times I was mostly almost hitting paces that we were doing together maybe last year when we had like a modified goal.

那时候我们为了能稳稳完成目标，已经把配速都调低了一些。

And were going for, I think we had, we had moderated all our paces just so that we could hit Yeah.

我就是冲着那些配速去跑的，也没太在意具体数字。

Them and get sheet and Yeah.

我跑的时候其实根本没怎么看表，完全是凭感觉在跑。

And so those paces that I was kind of hitting, and I wasn't really, like, I wasn't really checking my watch or anything.

事后我才看到成绩，因为回家后，安德烈会去查我的Strava记录，然后他说：‘你跑得挺快啊。’

It was it would just be after the fact because I'd come home and, you know, Andre Andre left to check my Strava, and he checked my Strava, and he was like, you're running fast.

我就问：‘我跑得多快？’

And I was like I was like, oh, how fast did I run?

他就会念给我听每公里的配速，我一听就说：‘这不就是以前和你一起跑时的配速嘛。’

And he would like, read me the kilometer splits, and I'd be like, oh, well, that would be like what I would be running if I was running with you.

对。

Yeah.

但到了比赛那天，我还是带着很多期待。

But then the race came along, and it's like I still had all these expectations.

不是非得跑进三小时，但过去两年我经历了太多马拉松崩盘，各种原因，成绩都不理想。

Not to run a sub three hour, but I think it was because I've had like over the last two years, just so many crash and burn marathons where, you know, I just didn't do very well for different reasons.

要么训练时受伤，要么跑到30公里后彻底崩溃，感觉特别糟糕。

And mostly it was either I got injured in the training or I would just completely crash in the marathon after like 30 ks and, and you know, just feel really awful.

这次我没觉得特别难受，但可能我潜意识里觉得难受是必然的，赛前紧张大概也源于此——我知道最难熬的部分马上就要来了，得撑过30公里，心率才会飙升。

And I didn't not feel awful for this one, but I I like, I guess I was expecting to feel really awful and maybe that was part of the nerves at the start line was just, just, I just knew that, that the hard was coming and it was like, I had to run 30 kilometers before the heart is gonna come.

所以你也不是特别害怕，就是等着它来，因为有时候它来得太早，那你就会担心这个。

And so you're not that you're dreading it, but you're kind of just waiting for it because sometimes it comes too early and then, yeah, you worry about that.

Anyway，我们接着聊下一本关于焦虑者和战士的书吧。

Anyway, so maybe we should go on to the next book about worriers and warriors.

这个过渡挺自然的。

It's a good segue.

接下来是劳伦·弗莱什曼和罗·麦盖蒂根-杜马斯的《相信训练日记》。

Good segue to Believe Training Journal by Lauren Fleshman and Roe, Roe McGettigan-Dumas.

这其实不是一本正经的书，更像一本训练日记。

So this is not really a book, it's a training journal.

是的。

Yeah.

每个月就几页内容。

Has like a few pages each month.

前面有那么一两页引言，会给你一些信息或者工具。

Has like one or two pages of like preamble, which give you some info or some tools.

从这个角度看，这个日记本内容相当丰富。

So it's a pretty extensive journal from that point of view.

对，关于战士和焦虑者这一点，书中提到有个小测试，因为作者说跑者其实分为两种类型。

Yeah, and so the whole thing about the warriors and the warriors is that at one point there is a quiz because they explain there are two types of runners.

一种是战士，另一种也是战士。

There are warriors and then there are warriors.

根据你回答问题的方式，其实你可能会在两者之间有些重叠。

Based on the way you answer the questions, and like, you know, you can overlap a little bit.

不是非黑即白，非此即彼，而是看你哪一类的特征更多，你就更偏向哪一种。

It's not like you're, you know, it's not like black and white, you're either one or the other, But it's like whichever section you have more of the criteria is basically like where you fall.

焦虑型跑者需要一套不同的应对策略，来面对比赛中的各种困难、不确定性，诸如此类的问题，而战士型则不然。

And worriers need to have a different strategy to deal with, I guess, adversity, unpredictability, whatever, all those things in races, warriors.

没错。

Yeah.

战士型的人反而会为各种事情操心。

So, warriors, they worry about everything.

所以关键是要有个计划，你知道的。

So basically, the trick is to have like a plan, you know?

你要把各种可能的情况都想一遍，然后提前准备好应对方案。

So and you think about all the scenarios and you have

能提前做决定的话，就尽量提前定下来。

Take all the decisions and ask ahead of time if you can.

对。

Yeah.

不是说要把所有决定都提前做死，而是要为可能出现的情况准备好应对策略，这样真遇到事了，你也不会慌，因为心里有数，就能专心执行计划。

Or not that you take the decisions out ahead of time, but you have a plan for if certain things happen so that if they happen, you don't worry about them because you have a plan so you can focus on executing the plan.

而勇士型的人呢，Mhmm。

Whereas warriors Mhmm.

他们通常不太会提前规划，就是直接一头扎进去，看情况再随机应变。

They're a bit more like they don't really plan and they just figure like, I'm just gonna, I'm just gonna dive in head first and, and see what happens.

当然，这么说有点简化了，但大致上就是这种类型的人。

I mean, that's, you know, an oversimplification, but but, you know, they're more of those kinds of people.

所以他们往往准备得不够充分，不是身体训练上的不足，而是在应对各种情况的规划上不够周全。

And so they tend to maybe go in a little underprepared, not underprepared, like physically in terms of training, but under prepared in terms of like scenario planning.

关键是，这两种方式其实都能成功，但战士型的人特别享受在比赛过程中面对并解决各种突发问题。

And the idea is that, you know, it's, you can be successful with both, but warriors for sure, they thrive on sort of having problems to solve during, I guess their race in this case.

而焦虑型的人则容易被压力压垮，所以他们必须提前做好规划，不然就会因为过度担心而动弹不得。

Worriers, it can be overwhelming for them, so they actually need to pre plan, because otherwise they'll be paralyzed by the worrying.

我们其实就是一群整天胡思乱想的人。

We're just a bunch of basket cases.

在我看来，我更倾向于先定一个基本方案，清楚自己打算怎么做，再准备一个备选方案。

I guess from my point of view is I like to have a default plan and have a good idea of what I'm gonna try to do and maybe have a fallback plan.

但也要明白，不可能事事都计划周全，所以别过度规划，保持警觉，现实一点，随时准备应对任何情况。

But basically be aware that I can't plan for everything so let's not over plan and let's stay on your toes and get ready to just be realistic with whatever happens.

所以我没必要担心有没有把所有情况都考虑到，毕竟生活中意外太多，不可能全盘掌控。

So I don't have to worry whether I've got everything covered because I know there are more things in life than I can cover.

我也明白这个道理，但我就是……说不上来。

I know that too but I'm just, I don't know.

我觉得人生的一部分就是失败，跑步就是这样，你可以失败，而这正是跑步特别棒的地方——你可以在某件事上失败，但其实没什么大不了的。

I guess like part of life is failing and in running you can fail, which is one of the great things about running is that, you know, like you can fail at something and it doesn't matter.

对我来说当然在意，但别人根本不在乎。

I mean, matters to me, but it doesn't matter to anybody else.

总不能因为跑不好，我老公就跟我离婚，或者我丢掉工作吧？所以你能在这里冒险，其他地方可不敢这么干。

Like, it's not like, like my husband will leave me or like, I'll lose my job or, you know, so you can, I guess take risks that you can't take anywhere else?

是的。

Yeah.

但话说回来，我也不喜欢失败。

But at the same time, like I don't like failing.

对，就算搞砸了，也没那么严重。

Yeah, and it's less, it's not meaningful, it's not that meaningful if it goes wrong.

没错。

No.

就是挺让人失望的。

It's disappointing.

是的。

Yeah.

你去了，真希望结果能更好些。

You go, I wish it would have been better.

但你为它做了所有准备，而准备的过程本身，也是生活中挺好的一部分。

But you did all the prep for it and the prep itself was kind of a good thing to have in your life.

对，你得学会换个角度看问题。

Yeah, I guess you have to keep it in perspective.

但你知道吗，如果训练很有趣、很顺利，可比赛没按计划进行，这还值得吗？

But you know, like if the training was fun and it went well, and then the race doesn't go as planned, is it still worth it?

我是说，值得的，因为你收获了数月的期待、快乐，和别人一起跑步，跑步时聊聊天、交流跑步的心得。

I mean, it is because you got, you know, months of, of, of hope and like fun and running with people and maybe, you know, sharing thoughts during runs and exchanging ideas about running.

而且你还能收获训练带来的健康和体能提升。

And you get all the health and fitness that comes with the training.

是的。

Yeah.

所有的

All

食物。

the food.

然后，

And then,

对。

yeah.

也许比赛当天没达到预期，但至少你收获了那几个月的其他东西。

And maybe on race day, it doesn't work out the way you wanted, but at least you got all those months of other stuff.

你太在意马拉松当天的表现了，不如多跑些半马，这样你能跑更多次。

You're too worried about how the marathon executes on rest day, you should probably do more halves because you can do more of them.

而且每次比赛的分量也没那么重了。

And then, you know, each one is worth less.

确实如此。

It's true.

确实如此。

It's true.

我的意思是，对我来说，半程马拉松也算个挺难熬的距离。

I mean, I guess, I guess for me, the half is, it also is kind of a hard distance.

我觉得它消耗我的精力，比应该的还要多。

Like, I feel like it takes out of me maybe more than it should.

我拼尽全力跑完半程，但感觉又不像跑全马那样。

Like, I run a hard half, and it's not quite like the marathon.

全马在这方面确实独一无二。

The marathon is unique in that way.

跑完全马后，头半小时我常常懵了，不知道是该躺下、喝水，还是干点别的。

Often after marathons, like, for the first, you know, half hour, don't know if I should lie down, drink water, or I don't know.

我完全能理解。

I can identify with that.

天热的时候，我也不知道该去哪儿，该做什么。

On a warm day, I don't know where to go and what to do.

是的，就是感觉特别糟糕。

Yeah, you just feel kind of like really terrible.

我也有点这种感觉，尤其是在半马之后，只是没那么久而已。

And I feel but I kind of get a little of that in the half marathon as well, just just not for so long.

所以我觉得，你恢复得会快一点。

So I feel like, you know, you get over it a bit faster.

但说实话，我也说不准。

But, I mean, I don't know.

关键是接下来几天，有时候半马带来的影响也跟全马差不多。

It's the days afterwards, I feel like sometimes a half marathon is it's the same effect.

我的意思是，至少下楼梯的时候能好受点，但——

I mean, I can walk down the stairs better maybe, but

也只能勉强走动。

have to just barely.

从全马的疲惫中恢复得更快。

Recover quicker from off marathon snow.

是的，我确实有这种感觉。

Yeah, I do.

但恢复得够快，几周后又能再跑一场。

But yeah, quickly enough to turn around and do another one in a few weeks.

我不确定，不过话说回来，也许值得一试。

I'm not sure, but you know what, maybe it's worth a try.

也许春天我该稍微安排这么一次。

Like maybe that's what I need to do a little of in the spring.

也许我该在春天跑一场半程马拉松。

Maybe I need to do a spring half marathon.

我觉得这更多是心态的问题，你总是想太多。

Yeah, I kind of think it's your mindset a little bit worrier versus worrier.

如果你拿我们过去五年的表现对比，你会发现你有大约一半的时间比我快。

I think if you compared our efforts, I think you would find that over the last five years, you've been quicker than me on on an event 50% of the time.

如果我问你，好吧。

Whereas, if I was to ask you, okay.

别去看它。

Don't look at it.

你跟我说说，你在我跑马拉松或者半马的时候，赢过我几次，反过来我又赢过你几次？

Tell me how many times have have you beaten me in a marathon versus the other way around or or or in a half marathon.

你肯定会说，我大概80%或者75%的时间都赢了，但那可能不是事实。

You'd say, oh, you probably win, like, 80% of the time or 75% of the time, but that's probably not true.

这大概只是视角的问题。

It's probably just perspective.

而且我至少完成过一场三小时以内的比赛。

And the fact that I've been able to do one of the races that was under the three hours.

我

I

也许吧。

mean, maybe.

但是

But

我的意思是，如果你看看多伦多和温格莱斯的比赛，我比你快。

I mean, if you look at if you look at Toronto and wine glass, I was quicker than you.

如果你看看朗格，你比我快。

If you look at Longue, you were quicker than me.

如果你看看马拉松比赛，

If you look at, you know, the marathon

我比你和朗格都快。

I was quicker than you and Longue.

确实。

Absolutely.

你跑的时候都把我甩开了。

You ran you ran away from me.

你跑出了3小时15分。

You you finished in three fifteen.

我跑出了3小时19分。

I finished in three nineteen.

你看，你忘了这一点，因为你的思维方式根本不是这样的。

See, you've forgotten that because your mindset doesn't work like that.

如果我们看看刚跑过的那些马拉松，虽然赛道不同，但我们的训练方式其实差不多，都是一样的套路。

If you take the marathons that we've just run, okay, we were on different courses, but we're basically training the same way, same manner.

差不多吧。

Same ish.

我觉得今年我们的训练方式其实挺不一样的，不过话说回来，你……

Think this year was we were very different in training, but I mean, you

有时候一天练好几趟。

do some in the days.

你跑得比我快。

You were quicker than me.

要是你看看春天我跑伦敦那场的时候，我不确定你当时跑了哪一场，但不管怎样，你那场肯定比我快。

If you take, yeah, if you take spring when I ran London, I don't know what you ran then, but whatever you ran, it would have been quicker than me.

我觉得我那会儿根本没跑，所以不可能比你快。

I think I didn't run anything, so I was not quicker than you.

等等。

Wait.

我那时候有跑过吗？

Did I run anything at

在这一点上？

this point?

只要你愿意来参加，本来可以跑得比我快的。

If you've been bothered to turn up for something, you could have run quicker than me.

有些事啊，关键在心态。

You know, some of it's mindset.

我就当没事一样，继续往前走。说实话，对成绩不算特别满意，但也没关系。

I just shrug it off and keep going, and I kinda feel, I'm not I'm not, like, super, happy with the time, but that's okay.

事情就是这样的。

That's what happens.

继续吧。

Moving on.

是的。

Yeah.

也许只是因为我跑过几个三分钟以内的成绩，所以对我来说没那么重要了。

And maybe it's just the fact that I've got a couple of sub threes in in my repertoire.

可能确实如此。

It doesn't mean as much to me, maybe.

对。

Yeah.

我其实也不清楚自己为什么非得跑进三分钟不可，但就是……说不上来。

I don't even know why, like, I really need this sub three, but it's I don't know.

就是觉得，我离那个目标已经那么近了。

Like, part of me just feels like I was so close.

结果这么多年来，我一直追着它不放。

And then, I don't know, I've been chasing it for so many years.

现在我都快不知道该怎么不去追它了。

It's almost like now I don't even know how to not chase it.

这目标我已经追求太久了。

It's like it's just been it's just been the goal for so long.

如果你放弃了三小时的目标，就没法继续做这个播客了。

You can't keep doing a podcast if you give up if you give up on your three hour,

我们确实如此。

that's we've

那咱们还聊什么？

nothing to talk about.

是的。

Yeah.

你知道吗？

And you know what?

回想一下，十年前我还在以前的俱乐部跑步时，其实我长跑表现更好。

I think, like, historically, when I was running with with my previous club, so this would have been like more than ten years ago, I was better at at longer distances.

那时候长距离才是我的强项。

Like, that was always my thing.

我那时候总是跑得越远，名次就越好。

I was always, you know, the longer the distance, the better I placed.

是的。

Yeah.

后来情况就变了。

Then there was a shift.

不知道为什么，我反而在五公里和十公里上表现更好，相比之下，马拉松和半程马拉松就没那么好了。

And I don't know, for some reason, I became better at like five ks, 10 ks, and comparatively not as good at, you know, marathons, half marathons.

你那场50公里确实跑得我够呛。

Well, you kicked my butt pretty hard at the 50.

没错，但那天特别热。

Well, that's true, but it was hot.

是的。

Yeah.

这对我有利，因为高温对谁都一样，艾伦。

So that's to my advantage because heat is our great equalizer, Alan.

你比我更健康，但我更能扛热。

You're fitter than me, but I can handle the heat better than you.

以前确实如此。

That's been true in the past.

是的。

Yeah.

所以总的来说，我想说的是，追求精通

So anyway, all that to say, chasing mastery

不对。

No.

能让你占优势。

Can give you an edge.

哦，不是。

Oh, no.

我们现在已经不谈追求精通了。

We're not we're not talking about chasing mastery anymore.

不行。

No.

好吧。

Okay.

总之，Believe训练日记能帮你找出自己所有薄弱的地方。

All that to say that the Believe Training Journal can help you identify all the spots where you're weak.

我从Believe训练日记里学到的那些简单要点，我都记在这里了。

The simple phrase, take homes that I got from Believe Training Journal, I've got them written down here.

敢于冒险。

Take risks.

这正是我们刚才在讨论的内容。

So that's just what we're talking about.

对。

Mhmm.

要敢于冒险，但别让自尊心作祟。

Take risks, but park your ego.

别把自己的价值和你将要完成的事绑在一起，专注于过程本身。

Don't don't get your self worth wrapped up in what you're going to do, and focus on the process.

要以过程为导向，因为你可以通过过程来影响结果。

So be process focused because you can work the outcomes of the process.

对。

Mhmm.

你

You

比赛当天，你没法强行控制最终的结果。

can't necessarily work force the outcome on marathon race day.

人们总说要敢于梦想，其中一个关于梦想的引导问题是：如果你不会失败，你会做什么？

They talk about dreaming, like dare to dream, and one of the prompts for like dreaming is the question that you should ask yourself is, what would you do if you could not fail?

也就是说，如果你确定自己不会失败，你最想去做的是什么？

So like like what what is the thing that you'd wanna do if you knew that you wouldn't fail basically?

你知道吗？有时候我们不敢有大梦想，是因为觉得自己不够好，配不上那样的成就。

And you know, because I think sometimes we don't dream big because we figure that we're not good enough to attain it.

但梦想的意义在于，梦想本身是一回事，而实现它是另一回事。

But like the idea of dreaming is, you know, the dreaming part is like one thing, and then attaining it is a different thing.

拥有梦想本身就很有价值，不管最后有没有实现，因为它能一直激励你。

And having the dream is worth having, even like whether or not you attain it in the end, because it can keep you motivated and

就算最后没达成目标，你可能也会收获一些原本得不到的东西。

if you don't attain it, maybe you'll attain something that you wouldn't have otherwise.

对。

Yeah.

所以梦想越大，可能走得越远，虽然不一定能实现，但你知道的。

And so the bigger you dream, maybe the further you'll get, but maybe you won't attain the dream, but you know.

那明年的马拉松目标就是两小时三十分钟。

So next year's marathon goal is two hours thirty.

要知道，哈勒也没比我大多少，她还在跑两小时三十分钟的马拉松呢。

Well, know, Hall is like, not that much younger than me, and she's still running two thirty marathons.

所以这是可能的。

So it's possible.

对吧？

Right?

是的。

Yeah.

但如果你问她最大的梦想是什么，大概会是，你知道的

But if you ask her what her big dream is, it's probably, you know

也许是2小时15分？

Maybe it's 02:15?

对。

Yeah.

好吧。

Okay.

继续吧。

Moving on.

泥巴、汗水和艰辛。

Mud, sweat, and bears.

泥巴、汗水和熊。

Mud, sweat, and bears.

我老是想说泥巴、汗水和啤酒。

I always wanna say mud, sweat, and beers.

我不确定。

I don't know.

是的。

Yeah.

我也是。

Me too.

这就暴露了。

Gives me away.

我想是因为那句‘血汗泪水’吧。

I guess because of blood, sweat, and tears.

啤酒跟泪水倒是挺配。

Beers runs with tears.

你觉得呢？

Do you think?

不，我觉得只是因为你爱越野跑，因为通常终点都有啤酒。

No, I think it's just because you love trail running because they have beer at the end usually.

所以你知道，泥巴、汗水，然后换成啤酒而不是熊。

And so you know the mud and the sweat and then you have beers instead of bears.

那你怎么看？

So what's take on?

嗯，我最大的感触就是亚洲的越野跑非常火爆，而且特别棒。

Well, my big take home from this was like trail running in Asia is huge and amazing.

那边有很多很棒的赛事，好像也有不少UTMB相关的，对。

There are fantastic events, Seem to be a lot of UTMB Mhmm.

在中国举办的赛事。

Events in China.

还有这本书的作者哈丽特·盖伍德，她是个非常了不起的人。她看起来五十岁了，却独自在亚洲各地游荡，进行越野跑。

And Harriet Gaywood, the author of this book, is an incredible person and that she seems to just she's 50 and just trolls around solo in Asia doing

各种超长距离的跑步吗？

All kinds of really long runs?

对，2024年她参加了大量越野赛，都是以非常稳定的配速完成，刚好能赶上每个检查点的截止时间，我觉得这简直是一种超能力。

Yes, super crazy volume of races in 2024 doing these ultra runs at a very steady pace that allows her to hit all the cutoffs and keep and I think that's a superpower.

她完全没有炫耀的心态，就是闷头把比赛跑完。

Has no ego in her pacing and she just gets through it.

所以她的完赛率比别人高得多，几乎从不退赛，因为她跑得慢但稳，完赛后还有体力几周后继续参赛。

And so has many, many fewer DNFs, almost none compared to other people because she goes nice and slowly and gets it done and then has the energy to go again in a few weeks.

听她讲自己的经历，和她聊天，真的太棒了。

And just hearing her story and talking to her was amazing.

我在想有什么收获。

I was thinking about takeaways.

她在书的末尾列了一份必备装备清单，虽然是针对越野长跑的，但我觉得任何山地跑都能参考，这个我们之前好像没怎么聊到。

And so she includes at the back of the book, which actually I don't think we talked about all that much interview, but she has a kit essentials list for, I guess ultra running, but I guess any trail running, you can kinda use this kit.

有些东西确实只适合超长距离比赛，但其他几样，你可能平时也会需要，或者用得上。

Because some of it, yes, it's specific maybe to like really long races, but other things are just things that you probably might wanna have or might need or whatever.

我记下的两个特别值得注意的东西里，有一个是可折叠的碗。

And I guess the the two things that I wrote down that were sort of sort of notable in those lists is one of them was a collapsible bowl.

我平时总会带个可重复使用的杯子，但有时候到了补给站，人家端出鸡汤面，你就会想：好吧，我得先喝完杯子里的可乐，然后他们再把鸡汤面倒进同一个杯子里。

So, you know, I always think to bring one of those little reusable cups, but sometimes you get to aid stations and they have like, like chicken noodle soup, and you're like, okay, so first I have to drink the cola from my cup, and then I have to then they put the chicken noodle soup in my cup.

如果你有个可折叠的碗，就能同时吃喝，不用非得喝完一个才能吃另一个。

And and so, you know, if you have a collapsible bowl, then you can have both and not have to drink one to drink the other afterwards.

总之，我觉得这个可折叠碗的想法真不错。

Anyway, that so I like that collapsible bowl idea.

这种东西我以前根本没想到过。

It's something I never really think of.

她清单里的另一样东西是带充电线的移动电源，专门给手表用的。

The other thing she put in her list was a battery pack with charging cable for your watch.

她写的是给手表和手机用的，没错。

Well, she put for your watch and phone Yeah.

我觉得大多数人要是带移动电源，第一反应都是想着给手机充电，毕竟手机留着备用嘛。

Which I think most people, if they're gonna bring a battery pack, they think of bringing the charging cable for their phone because it's because they want their phone just in case.

因为有些越野跑比赛确实有这项要求。

Because some trail runs actually have it as Yeah.

因为万一出事了，补给站又不一定总能挨得很近。

Because, a mandatory you know, if ever something happens, like there aren't always aid stations very

离得挺远的。

close together.

对。

Yeah.

是的。

Yeah.

所以至少要是你手机有电，就能打电话求助。

So at least if you have your phone and it's working, then you can, you know, you can call someone or you can get help.

至于手表的充电线，我就遇到过手表没电的情况。

But charging cable for your watch, like, you know, this happened to me that my watch dies.

比如说你用手表导航，比赛方提前给了你GPX路线文件，存进手表里，这种时候你肯定不希望手表突然没电。

And let's say you're using your watch for something like navigating, like, let's say there's a race that gave you the GPX file ahead of time and you have that in your watch and because it does happen, then you might wanna make sure that your watch has battery.

所以，我觉得这还挺不错的。

So, yeah, I thought that was that was pretty good.

这些物品有时会根据赛程长短和参赛同伴的不同，被列为赛事装备的必带项。

The those things sometimes are compulsory items in in race kits, depending on how far you're going and who you're running with.

是的。

Yeah.

也许吧。

Maybe.

我其实不太跑特别特别长的距离。

I I guess, like, I don't really run the really, really long distances.

我参加过UTMB周末的OCC赛，那会儿强制携带的救援装备里就包括一条弹力绷带。

I mean, I ran the OCC in the UTMB weekend, and, you know, part of the compulsory rescue was an elasticated bandage.

哦，对啊。

Oh yeah.

哦，没错。

Oh yeah.