#099 乔纳森·斯旺森：扩大Thumbtack规模、十倍授权与设计理想人生

但今年，我们搬迁并扩展到了下一个细分市场，即中小企业。

But this this year, we we moved and expanded into the next segment, which is SMB.

这个国家的中小企业不是十万家，而是三千万家。

There's not a 100,000 SMBs in the country, but 30,000,000.

我不知道其中有多少比例会拥有助手，也许有10%。

Now I don't know what fraction could have an assistant, maybe 10%.

有数百万家牙科诊所、供应链商店，还有各种各样的……

So many millions of dental clinics and, you know, supply stores and just the wild

家政服务类企业。

Home service businesses.

是的。

Yeah.

服务类企业。

Service businesses.

是的。

Yeah.

我的意思是，甚至大型建筑公司也是如此。

I mean, even, you know, large construction companies.

我刚和一家拥有100名员工的大型建筑公司谈过，他们正在寻找一位助手。

I actually just talked to a a large construction company that's got a 100 employees that's looking for an assistant.

所以，中小企业现在是下一个重要领域。

So SMBs is now the the next big segment.

从长远来看，企业级市场才是巨大的板块，比如《财富》500强企业。

And then in the long term, enterprise is the kind of mega segment, this Fortune 500.

目前，我们已经和几家优秀公司开展了企业级试点项目。

So we have some enterprise pilots with a couple great companies going now.

我们才刚刚开始在这块领域投入工作，计划明年大力拓展。

We're just starting work there, and we wanna expand a lot into that next year.

我曾与AIG和摩根大通这样的公司交流过，他们内部有上千甚至多达五千个助手岗位。

You know, I've talked to places like AIG and JPMorgan where they have a thousand or even 5,000 assistants internally.

我们可以提供一种解决方案，为目前尚未配备助手的整个团队层级带来支持。

And we can offer an offering that brings assistance to a whole layer of the team that doesn't have it today.

所以，也许副总裁或高管层有这种支持，但总监们一直希望也能有助手，而现在他们可以了，因为我们提供了不同的定价。

And so maybe, you know, the VPs or c suite have it, but directors always wish they can have assistance, and now they're gonna be able to because we have a different price point.

通过我们的AI生产力工具，他们确实可以将这种支持普及到更多人身上。

And with our AI productivity, they can, like, yeah, bring this to bring bring it to the people.

所以这将是明年的一大重点。

So that's that's gonna be a big focus for next year.

我记得曾经有人说过，任何年薪超过15万美元的人，都应该配备一名执行助理。

I remember somebody saying at some point along the line, like, anybody who has a you know, who earns more than a $150,000 a year should have an EA.

这只是一个大致的参考标准。

Like, just as a rough approximation.

我当时就想，哦，有了Athena，这个标准确实变得大致合理了。

And I was kinda like, oh, like, with Athena, that that does become, like, you know, roughly approximate.

如果你算一下，你每天处理的那些关键但并不有趣、时薪低于40美元的任务，它们的价值是多少的话。

If you're doing a math of kinda, like, however many tasks you do are worth, you know, those those, like, sub $40 an hour tasks that are, like, critical, but not particularly fun.

而且，如果你没有任何AI助手的话。

And, you know, if if you don't have any AUR one.

所以，就是这样。

So that that like that.

是的。

Yeah.

我的意思是，最明显的起点是，如果你有一个能产生收入的业务或场所。

I mean, I think the most the most obvious place to start is if you have a business or a place that can generate revenue.

助理可以成为你的第一个雇员，帮助你腾出更多时间专注于收入增长、你的技艺或你创业的初衷。

An assistant can be kinda your first hire to help you spend more time focused on revenue generation or your craft or the reason you started the business.

大多数人创业是为了打造产品或做他们热爱的事情。

Most people start the business to, like, do build the product or do the thing they love.

但还有很多重要的工作，比如日程安排、行政事务、邮件和会计，你可能并不想做，而助理可以帮助你处理这些。

And there's lots of important work that's like scheduling and admin and email and accounting that you might not wanna do, and so an assistant can help with that.

对于一些资金更紧张的人，我会说，嘿。

You know, for some people who are more cash constrained, I say, hey.

你的助理首先可以帮助你省钱。

Like, the first thing your assistant could help you do is help you save money.

所以，如果你没有很好地追踪财务状况，比如仔细查看你所有的订阅服务，寻找更便宜的商业供应商，这就是该做的方式。

So if you're not tracking your finances well, if you, you know, look through all your subscriptions, like, go go find, you know, alternative vendors for your business, that's the way to do it.

但对另一些人来说，比如双收入家庭，年收入25万美元，生活非常忙碌的人，

But then, yeah, there's other people who are, you know, dual income, have, you know, make 250 k and have a busy life.

对他们而言，这更像是一种奢侈品——能多花点时间陪孩子和家人，那真是太棒了。

And for them, it's more a luxury good of, yeah, I could spend more time with my kids and my family, and that would be awesome.

为了能多陪陪孩子，花每月3000美元是值得的。

And that's worth paying $3,000 a month to spend more time with my kids.

是的。

Yeah.

当然。

Absolutely.

没错。

Yeah.

用钱买回属于你自己的时间，摆脱那些不太有趣的事情。

Buying buying back your own time from the stuff that, yeah, is is less fun.

是的。

Yeah.

我的意思是，我之前和一个人聊过，他说，如果我能雇用自己，会怎么样？

I mean, I was talking to someone who's like, what if I could hire myself?

我会雇用自己吗？

Would I hire myself?

对大多数创始人来说，你会的，因为你相信自己，而且你觉得你足够有能力。

And for most founders, you would because you believe in yourself and, you know, you you think you're capable enough.

我刚刚意识到，如果我雇一个助理，其实我就是在雇用自己，因为我的助理在做我现在做的事情，而这样我就有更多自己来专注于最重要的工作。

And, like, well, I just realized if I hire an assistant, I am hiring myself because my assistant's doing things that I'm doing now, and then I get more of me for the the most important work that I want.

我喜欢这个说法。

I like that.

有些工作我会雇用自己，但不是所有。

I'd hire me for some jobs, but not all

这些工作。

of them.

是的。

Yeah.

他就是这么说的。

He's saying like that.

所以

So

如果你像我一样，我觉得真正吸引我加入雅典娜的原因是，你知道，我刚进入这个圈子时，周围几乎完全围绕着你个人魅力——如果你不介意我这么问的话，我觉得这确实是个值得探讨的问题。我已经跟雅典娜的很多人说过，最打动人的故事或案例，往往都来自你和你的首席执行官罗伯特，以及你们其他一些极其擅长授权的高管。他们不仅在授权的具体操作和技巧上做得好，更在赋予他人自主权、展现勇气、勇于尝试等方面令人钦佩。

if if you're like, something that I think really drew me to Athena is just like, you know, I I came into this orbit when it was, like, a very much a cult of personality around, like, you and, if you'll if you're comfortable with it as, a line of questioning, I think, and I've told so many people at Athena this that, like, the most compelling stories or examples, like, come out of you and your CEO, Robert, and some of your other executives who are, like, unbelievably good delegators, not just in, like, whatever the the mechanics of it, the tactics of it, but in terms of just, like, the agency and the courage and the experimentation and, like, all the different things that you guys try.

所以我很高兴你愿意出来分享这些。

And so I'm excited that you're, like, I don't know, out here talking about it.

我希望我们能花些时间聊聊你和你的家人。

And I'm hoping we can spend some time on, like, you and your family and your of course.

你个人拥有多个执行助理，能讲讲一些相关的经历吗？

Some of the stories of, like, what you do with like, you have multiple EAs personally.

对吧？

Right?

是的

Yeah.

半打

Half dozen.

半打

Half dozen.

好的

Okay.

你或你和你的家人共有六位私人助理？

Six six personal EAs for, like, you or you and your family?

是的

Yeah.

给我家人用的

For my family.

好的

K.

这一切是怎么分配的？

How does this all split up?

比如，告诉我那个对。

Like, tell me what the Yeah.

告诉我乔纳森公司的组织架构。

Let's Tell me the org chart of Jonathan Inc.

是的。

Yeah.

我先说明一下，我是在中西部长大的。

I'll premise this with I grew up in the Midwest.

我父母是在农场长大的。

My parents grew up on farms.

我就是个中西部男孩。

I'm like Midwest boy.

我们家里从来没有过助理。

We did not have assistants in our house.

我们家里没有保洁员，什么都没有。

We didn't have house cleaners, anything like that.

所以我觉得，如果18岁的乔纳森听说我有六个助手，他会说：‘老兄，你到底怎么了？’

So I think if 18 year old Jonathan heard that I had a half dozen assistants, he'd be like, dude, what happened to you?

不过，容我先讲个小故事，然后再谈我们具体做什么。

But, I mean, if I can just divert with a quick story, then we'll talk about what we work on.

对我来说，这部分源于我毕业后在白宫工作过。

For me, this started in part I went down this track in part because I worked at the White House after school.

那是我的第一份工作。

It was my first job.

我当时在西翼办公。

And I sat in the West Wing.

我为总统的经济顾问工作，坐在总统执行助理的旁边。

I worked for the president's economic adviser, and I sat next to the president's executive assistant.

正如你可能想象的，总统的执行助理简直厉害到离谱。

And as you might imagine, the president's executive assistant is freaking insanely good.

这让我对这种执行助理合作模式设定了很高的标准。

And so it just set my bar very high for what this EA partnership could look like.

后来我去Thumbtack时，雇了第一个助理，当时我就想：你知道吗？

And then when I went to Thumbtack, I hired my first, and I was like, you know what?

如果我有一个像总统助理那样出色的助理支持团队，会怎么样？

What if I had an, like, assistant support team that was as good as the president?

我知道我不会成为总统，但也许我能完成更多事情，也许我的生活会变得很棒。

You know, I'm not gonna be the president, but maybe I'll accomplish a lot more things, and maybe my life will be amazing.

于是我有了这样一个想法：我可以做到这一点。

And so I just had this kind of idea that I could do that.

我先是雇了一位在菲律宾的助理。

And I started by hiring first assistant in The Philippines.

他通过Upwork找到的。

He used Upwork.

我想鼓励大家，如果你没有足够的资金来使用Athena，那就自己动手去做吧。

You know, I encourage people, if you don't have the capital for Athena, like, just go do it on your own.

我可以给你一些如何操作的建议。

I can give advice on how to do it.

我在Upwork上雇了一个人，先从一些基础事情开始，比如收件箱、日历、旅行，然后我就开始尝试。

And I hired someone in Upwork and just start with basic things, like inbox, calendar, travel, and then I just start experimenting.

你知道的。

You know?

我就说，嘿。

I'm like, hey.

每周我们都会尝试一些完全新的事情。

Every week, we're gonna try something totally new.

你知道的。

You know?

这周，我想让你帮我尝试交朋友。

This week, I want you to help me try to make friends.

我不太认识工作以外的人。

Like, I don't know many people outside of my work.

比如，我们每周在我家办一次晚餐会，你每次邀请一个新人。

Like, let's do a dinner party at my house every week, and you just invite someone new.

所以我们就会邀请一些随机的创业者，你知道的，就像当时你这样的人。

And so we'd invite random founders, you know, people like you at the time.

我们会邀请到Uber和Airbnb的创始人。

We'd have, like, the founders of Uber and Airbnb.

那时候它们都只是初创公司，而我最好的朋友都是从那里结识的。

These were just tiny startups at the time, and I made all my best friends from that.

我还通过这种方式认识了我的妻子凯瑟琳，你知道，这已经不仅仅是一场晚餐会了。

And I ended up meeting my wife, Catherine, through that, and, you know, it's like it became more than just a dinner party.

但这就是我思考问题的方式：下个月我最重要的个人和职业目标是什么？

But that's how the the way I think about it is just like, what are my top personal and professional goals for the month ahead?

然后我的助手能怎样帮助我实现这些目标？

And then how could my assistant help me possibly accomplish those goals?

而且，你知道的，并不是每件事都能成功。

And, you know, not everything's gonna work.

你需要保持实验精神。

You need to be experimental.

你需要能接受失败。

You need to be okay with failure.

你需要能把任务拆分成子任务，诸如此类。

You need to be able to break up tasks into subtasks and and that sort of thing.

但如果你多做尝试，最终会不断叠加越来越多有效的方法。

But if you experiment enough, you'll just eventually layer on more and more things that work.

那么，随便举个例子，你做过多少次这样的事？

So how many like, just pick any example.

比如，这之所以有效，是因为你非常擅长委派任务，能设定对你有意义的目标，并将其分解为项目和子任务吗？

Like, is this does this work because you are a really good delegate and you're coming up with, like, a goal that's meaningful to you and breaking it down into projects and subtasks?

还是说，你只是灵机一动，而你的执行助理特别擅长将其拆解，不仅知道该做什么，还能弄清楚怎么做？

Or, like, do you have did you just speak a whim and, like, your EAs are really good at breaking it down and figuring out, like, not just what to do, but then how to do it?

哦，这是一种合作关系。

Oh, it's a partnership.

你必须擅长委派任务。

You've gotta be good at delegating.

如果你看看雅典娜最好的助手，他们会恰好为最好的客户工作。

And if you look at the best assistants at Athena, they just so happen to work for the best clients.

这并不是巧合。

It's not a coincidence.

那些懂得委派、愿意实验、善于合作并给予助理大量反馈的客户，他们的助理会变得非常强大，因为他们获得了这种合作关系和投入。

The clients who know how to delegate, who are experimental, who partner, who give their EA lots of feedback, those assistants become superpowered because they're given the partnership and the investment to get there.

所以，是的，我会告诉客户，嘿。

And so, yeah, you know, I will tell clients, hey.

如果你只想出现并期待一切自动顺利，那可不符合现实。

If you just wanna show up and, like, have everything magically work, not how the world works.

但如果你愿意投入时间、投资和尝试，那么事情会变得越来越好。

But if you're willing to put the time in, invest, and experiment, then, you know, it will it'll get better and better.

这有点像风险投资，我们常说的J型曲线。

And it's a little bit like, you know, venture capital, we talk about j curve.

你投入资金，会经历很多亏损，但赢家会不断复利增长。

You invest, you have lots of losses, and then the winners compound.

委托也有一个J型曲线，也就是说，第一次做某件事时，亲自做确实更快更好。

There's a j curve of delegation, which is you know, it literally is faster and better to do something yourself the first time.

很多人会说，我觉得我自己做能更快或做得更好。

And lots of people are like, you know, I I can do this faster or better.

但到了第一百次，就不再更快更好了，因此你必须愿意经历培训、交接、错误、挫折和反馈，最终才能达到复利收益的阶段。

But the hundredth time, it's not faster and better, and so you have to be willing to go through the training, the handoff, the, you know, mistakes, the breakage, the feedback to eventually get to the point of compounding benefits.

那么，你委托过哪些最让人惊讶的事情，以至于别人听说后会觉得很不舒服？

So what are some of the most surprising things that you've delegated that people would be like make them very uncomfortable to hear that you delegated?

哦，太多了。

Oh, well, so many things.

好吧。

Okay.

我先回答你刚才那个我没来得及答的问题，然后再来谈那个。

So the I'll I'll I'll answer your last question, which I didn't get to, and then we'll do that.

所以我得给他们提供协助，我们根据不同的领域进行了分工。

So I have to give them assistance, and we have them broken down by different areas.

是的。

Yeah.

一个人帮我处理工作、邮件、收件箱等事务。

One helps me work, email, inbox, etcetera.

另一个人帮我处理财务。

Another helps me with finances.

比如损益表、资产负债表、天使投资、付款等。

So, you know, p and l, balance sheet, angel investments, payments.

另一个人负责家里的事。

Another helps with home.

比如东西坏了、预订、Thumbtack上的专业人士，诸如此类的事情。

And so, you know, stuff's breaking, booking, Thumbtack, pros, all that sort of stuff.

还有一个专门负责孩子和旅行相关的事宜。

And then we have one for kids and travel.

然后还有一位助理负责统筹管理所有这些事务。

And then there's assistant of staff who sits on top and manages everything.

所以，你知道，你先从一个开始，随着能力提升，再逐步增加更多人。

And so, you know, you start with one, and then as that you get capacity, you add more and more.

关于我们委托出去的疯狂事情，我举两个例子。

In terms of crazy stuff we've delegated, I mean, the I'll give two examples.

有一个，你听说过莎娜·斯旺森的《倒计时》这本书吗？

One, have you heard this, Shanna Swanson book countdown?

她上过乔·罗根的节目。

She was on Joe Rogan's.

我不太清楚。

I don't think so.

这本书主要讲的是，男性睾酮水平在过去三十年里每年下降1%，这导致了生育率降低、精子数量下降等各种问题。

The book is basically about how male testosterone levels have been decreasing 1% every year for thirty years, and that's led to lower fertility, all sorts of sperm count issues and stuff.

如果你有小孩，她的建议是，睾酮水平下降是因为家里到处都是塑料，存在于你的洗护用品和清洁剂中。

And if you have young kids, her recommendation effectively is testosterone is falling because there's plastic everywhere all through your house, in your soaps and detergents.

于是我听了这期播客二十分钟，心想：我得保护好我的儿子们，无论是象征意义上的还是我真正的孩子。

And so I heard twenty minutes of this podcast, and I'm like, well, I wanna protect my boys, both figuratively and my actual children.

于是我给助手发了条消息，说：嘿。

And so I sent my assistant a note and said, hey.

去看了这期播客。

Go watch this podcast.

买这本书。

Buy the book.

读这本书。

Read the book.

找出所有的建议。

Find all the recommendations.

把这些建议整理到一个电子表格里，她会发给我。

Put the recommendations in a spreadsheet, and she'll she'll send to me.

于是她发给我一份清单，列出了大约50样你得从家里扔掉的东西。

And so she sends it to me as a list of, like, 50 things you need to remove from your house.

我觉得，好吧。

I'm like, okay.

然后和我们的保洁员合作，找出家里所有这些东西，把它们扔掉，并订购替代品。

Now work with our house cleaner to find all these things in the house, take them out, throw them away, and order replacements.

然后这个过程重复了几次。

And then there's a couple cycles of this.

这整个项目花了大约六周时间才完全执行完毕，简直疯狂到极点，这种事我们平时绝对不可能自己做，因为

This was, like, a six week project to fully execute and just, like, totally nuts to pull off and the sort of thing that we just, like, absolutely never do on your own because, like

是的。

Yeah.

你就会放弃。

You just give up.

这实在太难了。

You're it's just too hard.

但如果你有人帮忙，他们就能做到。

But if you have someone there to help you, they can do it.

所以这算是一个以健康为导向的疯狂点子。

So that's kind of like a health oriented crazy one.

我个人非常推荐大家为朋友和家人做一些原本你根本做不到的礼物。

A personal oriented one that is that I highly recommend for people is doing gifts to friends and family that you could otherwise not do.

比如我爸爸的80岁生日快到了，就在二月，希望他没在听这个——我有个助手正在梳理他所有Facebook好友，逐个发私信，请求他们分享一段关于我爸爸的难忘故事或回忆，然后把这些内容都收集起来。

So for my dad's 80 birthday, which is coming up in February, you know, hopefully, he's not listening to this, I have an assistant who is going through all of his Facebook friends and DMing all of them and asking for a memorable story or memory with my dad, and then she's collecting all of them.

到了他生日那天，我会送他一本装满几百个这样故事的书。

And then on his birthday, I'm gonna give him a book with, like, hundreds of these things.

收集这些内容花了她好几个星期，但这份礼物将会是我送给他最有意义的一份。

And it's gonna it's taking her weeks to collect all of it, but it's gonna be one of the most meaningful gifts I ever give him.

这个点子我只花了三十秒就想出来了，现在却有个人为它忙活了好几个星期，只为把它真正实现。

And it took me, you know, thirty seconds to come up with this idea, and now I have someone working on for weeks, to actually deliver it.

这就是杠杆作用的超级力量。

And that is, like, super power of leverage.

这太棒了。

That's super cool.

因为我觉得很多人一听到这个就会本能地反感，觉得‘你居然把送礼这件事外包出去’。

Because I think that's you know, so many people I think a lot of times have an averse like, have an aversion to it right off the bat of like, oh, you delegate your gift giving.

这中间有一种很冷漠的方式去做，但也有一种让人惊叹的方式——天啊。

And it's like, does it there's there's like a impersonal way to do that, and then there's the like, holy shit.

如果不是这样，根本不可能做到。

This would be impossible any other way.

这真是个很棒的故事，那么有没有什么方法论可以教你如何培养这种习惯，比如思考：如果我有100倍的时间，我会做什么？

And and that that's a really cool story of, like and so are there frameworks around that of, like, how do you how do you train yourself or come to the habit of thinking, like, you know, what do I do with a 100 x the hours?

我觉得，从更广阔的视角去思考什么变得可能，这本身就是一种极具创造力的行为。

I feel like that's such a creative act to, like, have this broader scope of what becomes possible.

是的。

Yeah.

所以，这是我从自己身上，以及从雅典娜最顶尖的人身上观察到的一个反直觉的领悟：很多人以为，你先有雄心壮志，有无限的愿景，然后你雇个助手来帮你实现它们。

The so this is counterintuitive learning that I've seen in myself and from the best alligators at Athena, which is lots of people think that you have ambition and unlimited vision for all the things you can accomplish, and then so then you hire an assistant, and that's how you accomplish them.

但实际上，因果关系是反过来的。

But the causation is actually the reverse.

当你获得杠杆效应时，生活中所有行政事务和琐事的认知负担都会减轻。

It's as you get leverage, the cognitive load of all of the admin and little things in your life lifts.

而你第一次抬高了视野，心想：哇。

And for the first time, you raise your sights, and you're like, woah.

我有时间做更多事情了。

I have time to do more things.

我可以，是的，我可以给朋友们送更慷慨的礼物。

I could, yeah, I could give more generous gifts to my friends.

我可以开始一项新业务。

I could start a new business.

我可以更有抱负。

I could be more ambitious.

我认为人们的抱负通常受限于他们根据待办事项清单所认为的可能性。

And I think people's ambition is typically hemmed in by what they think is possible based on the tasks on their list.

因此，随着我逐步增加协助，我亲身感受到自己的抱负在不断增长。

And so I felt this personally as I've had layered in more assistance, my ambition just kinda grows.

我就想，哇。

I'm like, woah.

如果我做得越来越多，做所有这些其他事情呢？

What if I do more and more and all these other things?

以前我并没有这种感觉，因为在Thumbtack的时候，你拼命工作，完全被压得喘不过气，心想：我怎么可能再接手新任务？

And I didn't feel that way before because there's times at Thumbtack where you're working so hard, you're just buried, and you're like, I can't possibly take on something new.

你知道，我连今天该怎么安排都还在琢磨。

You know, I'm just trying to figure out today.

所以，我想鼓励大家，就从委托任务开始。

And so there, my encouragement to people is, like, you just start by delegating.

如果你连请帮手的钱都没有，那就从使用CHET GPT开始。

If you don't have enough money for even assistance, start delegating to CHET GPT.

你去问CHET GPT：这是我今天、这周或这个月最重要的两个个人或职业目标。

And you go to CHET GPT and you say, here's my top two personal professional goals today or this week or this month.

我该采取哪些步骤才能真正实现这些目标？

How could what are steps I could take to actually actualize this?

如果你有更多的钱，可以雇一个Upwork上的工人，每小时五美元，这样你就能开始行动了。

And if you got a little more money, you know, hire someone at Upwork for $5 an hour, and that lets you start acting on it.

如果你有更多的钱，就可以和Athena或线下助理合作，你支付得越多，就能获得越多的杠杆效应。

If you got more money, then you could work with Athena or an in person assistant, and you can get more and more leverage the the more you pay.

但我只是想鼓励你，你必须先开始，然后事情会从那里逐步积累。

But I would just encourage you to, like, you gotta start, and then it can compound from there.

是的。

Yeah.

这正是我的杠杆课程，以及扩展这本书等内容的核心所在。

This is, I mean, this is, like, exactly what my my leverage course and, like, expanding the book and stuff is about.

它只是试图让你意识到，职业生涯甚至都不是准确的说法，但你的生活、工作范围，其实是复利增长的，长期来看，无论是通过人、资本、工具、产品还是其他方式，善用杠杆。

It's just, like, trying to see your a career is not even really the right word, but, like, life, your scope of work as, like, compounding and using well leverage over the long whether it's people or capital or tools or products or whatever.

对。

Like Yeah.

想办法今天做一些工作，让你明天更有效率。

Figure out how to do some work today that will make tomorrow make yourself more effective tomorrow.

我认为，Athena 在这一点上比我还见过的任何公司都更清楚。

And, Athena, I think, gets this more than any other company I've ever seen.

它会谈论这一点，建立操作手册，培训执行助理，也培训我们这些客户、用户，不管你怎么称呼我们。

Like, talks about it, builds playbooks, trains EAs in this, trains us, like, you know, as as customers, clients, whatever you call us.

我非常确定，问题出在我自己身上。

Like, I know with certainty, I'm the problem.

我知道，我绝对不属于最擅长委派的前10%，甚至可能连前50%都算不上，但我非常依赖 Athena，也深深感激它们为指导我所投入的所有资源、努力和心血。

Like, I know I'm not in the top 10%, if not 50% of delegators, and I'm, like, lean on Athena and appreciate all the the resources and work and effort gone into, like, coaching me.

你懂的？

You know?

正如你所指出的，假设执行助理一出现就能神奇地完全了解你的一切，知道如何让你的生活更轻松，这是一种错误。

I think it's it's a mistake as you point out to, like, assume that the EA is just gonna, like, show up and magically know everything that they need to know about you and how to make your life easy.

是的。

Yeah.

这是一种合作关系。

We're the it's partnership.

执行助理需要接受培训。

EA needs to be trained.

客户也需要接受培训，你了解得越深入，双方投入越多，效果就越好。

Client needs to be trained, and the better you know, the the more both invest, the better you get.

我认为，对大多数人来说，限制因素是什么？

And I think for so, like, what are the limiting factors for most people?

我会说，第一是相信过上时间充裕的生活、完成更多事情、一天拥有上百小时是可能的。

I would say number one is belief that it's even possible to live a life of time abundance, to accomplish more, to have a hundred hours in the day.

很多人不相信这是可能的，因为他们从未见过或体验过，如果我没有亲身体验，我可能也不会相信。

I think lots of people don't believe that's possible because they've never seen it or experienced, and I probably wouldn't if I didn't experience myself.

但你必须拥有这种信念。

But you have to have that belief.

当你和我这样的人以及其他类似的人交谈时，你会说，好吧。

And, you know, you talk to people like me and others, and you're like, alright.

这确实是可能的，所以我也可以做到。

It actually is possible, so I could do it.

接下来就是欲望了。

You know, the next is just, like, the desire.

你想要那样吗？

Like, do you want that?

你想要生活中拥有更多吗？

Do you want to have more in your life?

你想要减少在事情上花费的时间吗？

Do you wanna spend less time on things?

你想要创办更多企业吗？

Do you wanna start more businesses?

第三点更实际一些，属于战术层面。

And then the third is more practical, like tactical.

你究竟该如何去做呢？

How do you actually go about and do it?

这取决于你的预算。

And that depends on your budget.

你预算越多，就能花得越多，但每个人都有办法开始。

And, know, you the more budget you have, the more you can spend, but there's ways for everyone to get started.

此外，我还想说，有一些限制性的信念。

And then there's also, I'd say, limiting beliefs.

我觉得自己不该让别人只专注于我，这种想法让我感到内疚。

Like, it doesn't feel I feel guilty to have someone just focused on me.

有些人有时确实会这么想。

That's something some people sometimes think.

我告诉人们要反过来想：嘿。

And I tell people to flip that around of like, hey.

当你不委派任务、不放手时，你实际上是在剥夺一个非常渴望这份高薪工作的人的机会。

When you don't delegate and you don't offload things, you're actually withholding a great paying job to someone who desperately is excited to have it.

我们的助手都非常期待能长期与你合作，获得一份高薪工作。

And our assistants are so excited to work with you for years, and have a great paying job.

因此，你委派得越多，就越是在帮助世界上某个心地善良的人。

And so the more you delegate, the more you're helping a good hearted person somewhere in the world.

所以，这是一个限制性信念。

So that's, like, one limiting belief.

另一个是我称之为委派的头号大忌，那就是‘我自己做更快更好’，这之所以是头号大忌，是因为它确实没错。

Another is this I call the cardinal sin of delegation, which is the more you or it's faster and better to do it myself, and it's the cardinal sin because it's true.

但这句话只在第一次成立，到了第一百次就不成立了，所以你必须经历那个J型曲线。

But it's true the first time and not the hundredth time, and so you have to go through that j curve.

然后我认为，人们的第三个错误或限制性想法是，他们不进行长期投资。

And then I'd say the third mistake or limiting thing for people is they don't invest for the long term.

他们以为只要试几个月就行，或者找一个助理试六个月，然后再换一个。

And they think they can just try it for a couple months or, you know, try an assistant for six months and then try a new one.

这就像复利，复利的效果太棒了。

The it's like Inventure, compounding is so good.

复利能带来生活中所有美好的事物。

Compounding gets all the good things in life.

你会赚钱。

You make money.

你建立了关系，并且形成了强大的助手伙伴关系。

You have built relationships, and you build powerful assistant partnerships.

我和我的一位助手已经合作了十多年。

And I've been working with one of mine for over a decade.

她现在就像我的小妹妹一样。

And, like, she's like my little sister now.

她对我的一切都了如指掌。

She knows everything about me.

我爱她。

I love her.

她见证了我所有的起起落落。

She's seen all the ups and downs.

在我收到一亿美元投资条款清单的日子，也在公司面临诉讼、以为要倒闭的日子，她都一直在我收件箱里。

She's been in my inbox during, you know, days where you get a term sheet for a $100,000,000 and days where you're getting lawsuits, and you think the company's gonna die.

是的。

Yeah.

世界上除了我妻子之外，几乎没有其他人亲眼见证过这一切。

And there's not many other people in the world other than my wife who have actually seen all of that.

所以，这种持久性和复利效应是非常强大的。

And so that, you know, that that longevity and compounding is super powerful.

如果你真的想获得巨大的杠杆效应，就必须投身于这场长期博弈。

So you gotta you gotta sign up for the long game if you really wanna get the big leverage.

是的。

Yeah.

我也已经和我的执行助理相处三四年了。

And I think I mean, I'm three or four years in with my EA too.

我亲身经历过这一点，信任至关重要——你要完全信任这个人，把生活中所有信息都交给他，让他们能在各种重要情境下代表你行事。

And, like, I I testified to that and the importance of trust, like, to to to fully trust this person with all the information about your life in such that they can, like, act as you in a bunch of different really important context.

这需要时间、经验和积累，是的。

Like, that comes with time and and reps and yeah.

这种复利效应是其中非常关键的一部分。

That that compounding is a really important part of it.

如果你能再给我一点时间，我想深入探讨一下这个信念。

If you'll indulge me again to, like, double click on the belief.

如果这是第一个限制性信念或障碍，我认为你和罗伯特——几年前也上过这个播客——是我见过的最典型的例子。

Like, if that's the first limiting belief or limiting factor, and, like, I think you and and Robert, who's also been on the podcast a couple years ago, like, are the best examples I've ever seen of this.

你和雷·达利奥也谈过这一点，但我并不认识他。

You and Ray Dalio actually talks about it too, but I don't know him.

那么，你日常生活究竟是什么样的？

Like, what is a day in your life actually?

如果你有多个执行助理为你工作，真正拥有上百甚至两百个小时的一天，会是什么样子？

Like, what does it look like to actually have a hundred or, you know, two hundred hours a day if you got multiple EAs working with you?

当你拥有这么多资源时，你是如何安排一天的？你又是如何决定把时间分配到哪里的？

Like, how do you set up your day when you have all these resources and how do you figure out, like, where to allocate your time?

尤其是，我想象你一定面临巨大压力，要充分利用你花钱买回来的这些时间。

Especially between, like, you know, I imagine there's all this pressure to, like, be productive with all that time that you're paying for to to buy back.

你是如何思考你的休闲时间、生产力和健康的呢？是的。

Like, how do you think about your leisure time and your productivity and your health and, like Yeah.

一个高度杠杆化的人，他的一天是什么样子的？

What is it what does a day in the life of a super highly leveraged person look like?

是的。

Yeah.

我一开始只有一个助手，后来逐渐增加，但一直感到时间不够用。

So, you know, I started with one, get more over time, and I always felt this time constraint.

我想做的事情太多了，时间却根本不够完成所有事。

There's just, like, so much I wanna do and not enough time to get it all done.

最终，我有了足够多的助手，他们帮我处理不同的项目，分担了我生活中的各种事务，当我拥有六个人的时候，这种情况就发生了。

And, eventually, I had enough assistants who were helping me with different projects and offloading all the things for my life that it happened when I got six.

我有那么一刻，突然不知道下午该做什么了。

I had this moment where I was like, I actually don't know what to do this afternoon.

我身边的人已经帮我处理了一切，这就是野心如何膨胀的过程，哇哦。

Like, I've got people handling everything, and that's that's how the ambition expands of like, woah.

明白了。

Okay.

我怎样才能更主动一些？

What can I do to be more proactive?

现在有什么新的、注定要失败的生意可以做？

What's, like, a new a doomed business to start?

我该如何更好地支持我的朋友或家人？

How can I support my friends or family more?

所以，这就是那个轨迹。

So that's the, like that's the trajectory.

在不同的时期，情况都不同。

It's been different in different times.

有时候你会进入高强度工作模式，拼命工作，而你的助手则帮你打理生活、家庭和孩子。

Sometimes you're in intense work mode, and you're, like, working a lot, and your assistant's helping take care of your life and family and kids.

但也有其他时候，我处于更自由的状态，比如每周只安排半天的会议。

And then there's been other modes where I'm more in freedom mode, and, like, I wanna do half a day of meetings a week.

所以只在周二安排会议，其他时间都不开会，我希望你能尽可能为我挡掉一切干扰。

So just meetings on Tuesday, no meetings the rest of the day, and I want you to protect me from as much as possible.

所以请帮我主动屏蔽邮件、消息和电话，替我处理这些事。

So try to protect me from emails, messages, calls, handle them proactively.

在某些情况下，我最先想听到的任务消息，是它已经完成的时候。

And the first I wanna hear about a task is when it's done in some cases.

但要实现这一点非常困难。

And now that is very difficult to achieve.

这就是所谓的，嗯。

That's the, like Mhmm.

我所说的委派的终极境界，就是一种预知式的委派——你和助手已经高度默契，他们能预判你的需求，完成任务，而你只有在任务完成时才会得知。

We I call the nirvana of delegation is, like, this clairvoyant delegation where you've mind melded so much with your assistant that they're able to anticipate the things you want, complete them, and then you only learn about it when it's done.

但你不能一开始就达到这种状态。

And so you can't start there.

你应该从明确的具体任务开始。

You start with, here's the specific task I want.

然后通常会逐步升级到整个项目。

Then you typically graduate to, here's a project.

这是一系列任务的集合。

It's a bundle of tasks.

我想让你找出一些我还没来得及委派的任务。

I want you to figure out some of the tasks that I haven't even delegated.

最终，你会过渡到以目标为导向的委派，比如：

And then eventually, you delegate to goal based delegation where it's, hey.

我想达成的是什么。

Here's what I wanna accomplish.

我想多花点时间陪孩子，或者多花点时间学打网球。

I wanna spend more time with my kids or more time, you know, doing learning tennis.

你能帮我实现这个目标吗？

Can you help me achieve my goal?

再往上一层，我称之为基于流程的委派，即你把自己的内部流程提炼出来并加以委派。

And then the next level I call process based delegation where you actually take your internal algorithm and you export it as you delegate.

这对系统思维型的人通常很自然，但对其他人来说则更困难。

And this is often natural for kind of, like, systems thinkers and so but more difficult for others.

举个例子，如果你希望你的助手帮你策划一场晚宴，当你这么说：嘿。

So as an example, if you wanna have your assistant help you plan a dinner party, if you say, hey.

你能帮我策划一场晚宴吗？

Can you help me plan a dinner party?

有八个新的人想交朋友。

Eight new people wanna make friends.

如果他们是新来的助手，几乎不可能为你办出你想要的晚宴。

If they're their new assistant, it's very unlikely they're gonna deliver the dinner party you want.

但如果你说：嘿。

But if you say, hey.

这是我对于晚宴的想法。

Here's how I think about dinner parties.

我希望埃里克在场。

I want Eric there.

我还希望有另外八个像他那样的企业家。

I want, you know, eight other entrepreneurs who are like him.

我希望涵盖不同行业的人员。

I want it to be a variety of industries.

我希望他们都有相同数量的员工或投资者。

I want them to all have the same number of employees or investors.

我会通过Crunchbase或其他地方来寻找这些人。

You know, I find these people by going on Crunchbase or wherever.

这实际上是一个算法、一套操作手册和详细的步骤。

Here's literally an algorithm and a playbook and a step by step.

如果你导出这个算法、偏好设置，并制定出详细的步骤，那么输出结果就会更贴近你的需求。

And if you export the algorithm, the preferences, you create the step by step, then the output is gonna be much more closely aligned with what you want.

这需要在前期投入更多的努力和工作。

That takes more effort and work up front.

因此，这就是为什么最好的执行助理往往与最好的客户搭配，因为那些愿意投入时间的客户会让他们的执行助理变得更好。

And so this is where, like, the bet the best EAs are paired with the best clients because the clients who invest that time make their EA better.

是的。

Mhmm.

那么，在EA团队扩张的过程中，有没有出现过一些时刻？

So and and were there moments in that, like, scale up of the EA team or, whatever you call it?

比如，你发现某个EA被各种上下文切换压得喘不过气，然后你意识到：好吧，

Like, where you found you were overloading one EA with, like, all the different context switching you were doing, and you found you got unblocked by being like, alright.

我有一个EA负责工作。

I got one EA for work.

我有一个EA负责生活。

I got one EA for life.

我有一个EA负责家务。

I got one EA for home.

我遇到的一个问题是，我总是同时处理太多事情，导致我很难有效优先安排与EA的工作，而他也很难跟上我频繁切换的上下文，因为我本身就已经超负荷了。

Like, that's one of the problems I have is, like, I'm constant I'm juggling too many things, and so I do a bad job, like, prioritizing with my EA, and then, like, it's very hard for him to, like, keep up with all the context switching that I'm doing because I'm already doing more than I should.

做一名执行助理本来就是一份艰难的工作，我们找的都是愿意接受这种挑战的人，但你永远不知道下一刻会发生什么。

I mean, being being an EA is a tough job, and, you know, we find people who are excited for the the challenge, but you don't know what's gonna come.

是的。

It's like Yeah.

今天我可能会被要求帮忙策划一个播客或者一场婚礼。

I'm gonna be asked to help, you know, plan a podcast or plan a wedding today.

我们等着看吧。

We'll find out.

是的。

Yeah.

所以没错。

So yeah.

我的意思是，作为老板，帮助团队了解如何优先处理任务很重要，除非你分享你的优先级，否则他们无从得知你心里的想法。

I mean, I think you as a as a boss, it's important to help your team know how to prioritize, and they don't know the priorities in your head unless you share them.

因此，我认为许多授权者面临的限制是，他们提供的背景信息不够充分。

And so I think the the limit for lots of delegators is they just don't share enough context.

我的意思是，这在与人沟通时也是如此。

I mean, this is true of of talking to.

对吧？

Right?

就像这样，是的。

It's like Yeah.

是的。

Yeah.

这个模型缺乏足够的上下文。

The model doesn't have enough context.

它根本无法运作。

It just can't work.

因此，你需要尽可能多地输出你的思考、上下文、偏好和优先级，以便人类助手或机器助手能够提供你想要的结果。

And so you need to export as much thinking, context, preferences, prioritization as you possibly can so that the human assistant or the machine assistant can deliver the results you want.

而这需要付出更多努力，尤其是在你忙碌的时候。

And that takes a lot more effort, especially when you're busy.

比如你不停地切换任务，总觉得自己没时间。

Like you're jumping between things, and you don't always feel like you have time.

我的意思是，有一个具体的策略，我们经常谈到雅典娜。

I mean, one one tactical thing, we we talk a lot about Athena.

我不确定你平时做多少这样的事，但语音委派比书面委派要强大得多。

I don't know how much you do this is, but is voice based delegation is much more powerful than written delegation.

原因是你可以说话的速度是打字的三倍，所以信息带宽更大。

And the reason is because you can talk three times faster than you can type, so just more bandwidth.

而且你可以在更困难的情况下进行，比如在会议之间走路时，或者从餐桌上突然站起来时。

And you can do it in situations that are more difficult, walking between meetings, you know, jumping up from a dinner.

开车时、锻炼时。

Driving, working out.

是的。

Yeah.

而且你更有可能说出更多内容。

And you're more likely just to say a lot a lot more.

所以如果你开始随意闲聊，就会分享更多关于你真正想要什么的背景信息。

And so if you just start rambling, you just share a lot more context about exactly what you want.

因此，作为委派人，你能做的最有效的战术之一，就是几乎把所有事情都转为语音委派，从而最快地提升效率。

And that's the, like, kind of one tactical thing you can do as a delegator to typically upload, uplevel the fastest is just move to voice based for almost everything.

如果你这样做，你会自然而然地提供更多的背景信息和反馈，甚至自己都意识不到，而这会帮助你的助手变得更好。

And if you do that, you'll give more context and more feedback naturally, and you won't even know it, and that will help your assistant be better.

是的。

Yeah.

如果你只是把它看作一个带宽问题，比如，找到最不费力的方式把所有这些优先事项、偏好和流程——如你所说——外部化出来。

If you're just thinking about it as a bandwidth problem, like, what's the lowest friction way to just externalize all of those, you know, priorities, preferences, process, as you said.

是的。

Yeah.

这在神经层面并不是这样，但确实是一步一步更快。

It's not neurally, but it's like a step a step faster.

这比用拇指打字好得多。

It's a lot better than thumbs.

是的。

Yeah.

没错。

Exactly.

拇指是最差的。

Thumbs are the worst.

你知道的？

You know?

用语音，至少你还在对着空气哼哼，这更好。

Voice, you're still grunting into the air better.

是的。

Yeah.

我的意思是，最终我们会直接用意念融合，实现完全的数字复制，委托会变得疯狂。

I mean, eventually, we'll just mind melt and we'll have full digital replication and, like, delegation's gonna be insane.

对。

Yeah.

我认为中间还有一层，他们好像已经推出了一款面向消费者的版本，就是关于心理打字的比特率。

I think there's even the the there's a step in the middle that they're I think Facebook launched one consumer version already that, like, the bit rate of, like, mental typing.

你可以想象打字时，手腕上的监测器会追踪你的微小动作之类的。

So you, like, imagine typing, and there's, a wrist monitor that's tracking your, like, micro movements or whatever.

是的。

Yeah.

这已经比打字快多了，真是惊人。

It's just already faster than typing, which is wild.

我的意思是，这很酷。

I mean, it's cool.

我的意思是，我们已经试验过一个系统，它会监控你工作时的屏幕，把图像传给大语言模型来识别你可以委托的任务，然后主动将这些任务交给助手，以机器生成的委托方式开始处理。这需要一些时间来完善，但确实已经实现了。

I mean, one thing we're we've trialed that is gonna be it's gonna take us some time to build, but is we built an internal demo of a system that watches your screen as you work, runs the images through LM to find things you could be delegating, and then proactively hands it off to your assistant to start working on as a machine generated delegation.

开发这个系统的人已经和他助手一起试用过，现在他的大部分委托任务都是由机器自动生成的。

The person who built this internally has done it with his assistant, and the majority of his delegations are now machine generated.

挺酷的。

Pretty cool.

现在助手需要判断：这个任务是否相关？埃里克真的需要我帮忙吗？

Now the assistant has to decide is this relevant, would Eric actually want my help with this?

也许他会自己处理，但无论如何，人类始终是最重要的，而且永远都会是。

Maybe he'll do it himself, and, you know, the human is is still paramount and always will be.

但机器能否更自然、更自动地识别出机会呢？

But can the machine kind of identify opportunities more naturally and more automatically?

当然可以。

Definitely.

你知道，以隐私安全的方式实现这一点很困难，所以我们还没有推出，但我认为这正是委派的最终方向。

You know, doing this in a privacy secure way is difficult, so that's why we it's not something we've launched, but that is where I think delegation ultimately goes.

你只是在工作，而有一个机器助手在观察你，它能发现人类可以帮你处理的事情。

You're just working, and there's a machine assistant watching you, and it finds things that the the human can help you with.

是的。

Yeah.

这真的很酷，我的意思是，这很相似。

That is a really cool I mean, that's similar.

Rewind 是一个具有类似功能的产品，但它的数据是本地存储的。

Rewind is a product that has that basically that level of access, but it's stored locally.

所以，是的，我相信这是可以实现的。

So, yeah, it's I'm sure it's doable.

是的。

Yeah.

Rewind 和他们与 Meta 集成。

Rewind and they run-in meta.

真的吗？

Oh, really?

哦，我没注意到。

Oh, I didn't I didn't see

那个。

that.

很棒。

Cool.

那很好。

Good for that.

那是一个非常棒的产品。

It was a really cool product.

是的。

Yeah.

完美的记忆，完美的回忆。

Perfect memory, perfect recall.

是的。

Yeah.

所有数字内容的记忆，而如今至少远程工作者的生活很大程度上都依赖于此。

Of everything digital, which so much of, you know, at least, you know, remote workers' lives are now.

是的。

Yeah.

这完全正确。

That's absolutely right.

你的执行助理所处理的很多工作，还有你的体验，其实也与家庭生活紧密交织，而你也有家庭，对吧？

How has I mean, so much of what your EAs work on and and you experience is also, like, deeply intertwined with family life, and you got, you know, you've got a family.

他们是否也和你一起踏上这种委托的旅程？执行助理会不会感觉像家庭一员，变成一个其乐融融的大家庭？

Like, are they just on this adventure of delegation with you and, like, the EA is gonna feel like part of the family, and it's just, like, a big happy squad?

她们绝对是家庭一员，是团队的一部分。

They are definitely part of the family, part of the crew.

我的一个助手，我们夏天搬到了山里的房子，她来帮我们安顿下来，而且她和每个人都相处得很好。

They you know, one of my assistants, we moved to or we went to a house for the summer in the mountains, and she came to help us set up, and she's connected with everyone.

而且，是的，她也是家庭的一份子。

And, yeah, she's part part of the family.

我妻子也是一个非常擅长委派任务的人。

And my wife is a a very good delegator too.

我的意思是，你问过我们委托过哪些疯狂的事情。

I mean, you asked, like, crazy stuff we've delegated.

我们委托过的最疯狂的一件事是凯瑟琳的主意，就是当你有年幼的孩子晚上睡觉时，他们有时会醒来哭闹。

One of the craziest things we've ever delegated was Catherine's idea, which is we you know, when you have young kids at night, they sleep, and sometimes they wake up and they're crying.

你有婴儿监视器会提醒你，然后你得决定：是进去看看，还是再等等？

And you have a baby monitor that wakes you up, and then you see, should I go in or should I wait?

凯瑟琳说，如果我们不亲自听，而是让菲律宾的助手来听呢？

And Catherine's like, what if we weren't listening, but we had an assistant in The Philippines listening?

我觉得这太疯狂了，但我超喜欢。

And I'm like, that is insane, and I love it.

我们现在请了一位在菲律宾的人，每晚帮我们监控婴儿监视器。

We now have someone in The Philippines who watches our baby monitors at night.

如果孩子需要我们介入，当然我们会过去，他们会打电话叫我们。

And if the kids need intervention from us, of course, we go in, they call us.

但90%的情况下，其实根本不需要介入。

But 90% of the time, actually, don't need intervention.

只是哭一两声，然后自己又睡过去了。

It's just kind of like a cry or they go back to bed.

所以，现在夜间醒来的次数大概只有以前的10%，而且确实有位在菲律宾的人，就像一位家人般的阿姨。

And so, yeah, probably 10% the wake ups at night that we used to have, and it's, yeah, someone in The Philippines who's like, yeah, it's like a auntie who is part of the family now.

这就是黑钻式的委派。

That is Black Diamond delegating.

我不建议每个人都这么做。

Would not recommend that to everyone.

我们有点疯狂，但我认为，这确实是迄今为止我们委托过的最喜爱的事情之一。

We're we are a little crazy, but I think, yeah, it's it's been one of actually the favorite things we've ever delegated.

我喜欢那些能够突破你对可能性认知边界的例子。

I do love those examples that just, like, you know, push your boundaries of, like, the your perception of the possible.

这并不算太疯狂，因为这正是孕育出Harbor这个想法的种子，后来Kevin把它发展成了一家公司。

And that's not so crazy because it's that was the seed of the idea that turned into Harbor, which, like, Kevin took it started as a company now.

对吧？

Right?

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

没错。

That's right.

是的。

Yeah.

是的。

Yeah.

我的意思是，他创业时给我打了电话，说：嘿。

I mean, he called me when he started the business, and he's like, hey.

我读过你关于这个的博客文章，我想我也要开始做这个生意。

I read your blog post about this, and I I'm gonna start the business doing it.

我回复说：太棒了。

I'm like, hell yeah.

这太棒了。

That's awesome.

是的。

Yeah.

他还有一些想法，涉及护士，比如可以让护士或医生打电话进来，这更好。

It's and he has kind of a vision with kinda nurses involved too, so you can have a nurse or a doctor call in, which is even better.

是的。

Yeah.

这真的很酷，是个聪明的点子。

It's a really cool it's a clever thing.

你知道，除非你家里有了新生儿，否则你永远不知道自己愿意为睡眠花多少钱。

And, you know, you never know the price that you're willing to put on sleep until you have a newborn in the house.

然后突然间，你愿意支付的代价就是：天啊。

And then all of a sudden, your willingness to pay is like, oh my god.

完全没错。

Totally.

我的意思是，布莱恩·约翰逊说过，他做的事情成千上万，但他说睡眠是一切的基础。

I mean, you know, Brian Johnson says I mean, he does a billion things, and he says sleep is the foundation of everything.

因为如果你不睡觉，早上就不会锻炼。

Because if you don't sleep, then you don't exercise in the morning.

如果你不锻炼，饮食就不会健康，那么你的健康就会彻底崩溃。

If you don't exercise, you don't eat well, and then now your health is totally destroyed.

所以睡眠是一切的基础。

And so sleep is the foundation of all of it.

我甚至会说，学会管理时间比睡眠更基础，因为人们睡得少并不是因为他们不想睡，而是因为他们没时间。

And I would actually say learning to manage your time is even more foundational than sleep because people don't sleep much not because they don't want to, but because they don't have time to.

他们试图把所有事情都塞进一天里。

They're, like, trying to stuff everything in the day.

他们有工作。

They got work.

他们有家庭。

They got family.

所以，如果你注重健康，学会通过委派来掌控自己的时间，就能获得睡觉的机会，然后所有好事都会随之而来。

And so, you know, if you're health oriented, figuring out how to own your time with delegation then gives you the power to sleep, and then you you know, all the good things come from that.

他们工作到很晚。

They're working late.

他们为未完成的事情感到压力。

They're stressed about the open loops.

是的。

Yeah.

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

所有你必须做的事情都会带来认知负担，压得你喘不过气。你可以把助手看作一种认知假体，它扩展了你的大脑能力，让你不必亲自处理某些事情，还能把这些琐事隔离开来，让你更平静、皮质醇更低、更专注，从而更好地应对更重要的事。

There's this, like, cognitive load from all the things you have to do that weigh on you, and, you know, you can think of an assistant as almost like a cognitive prosthesis that is expanding the scope of your brain to not have to handle certain things and, you know, firewalling it from a bunch of these loops so that it can be calmer, have lower cortisol, more focused, and, yeah, more prepared for more important stuff.

太棒了。

Awesome.

在我们结束之前，我常问创始人的最后一个问题是：请描述一下2050年的Athena会是什么样子。

As we wrap up here, final question that I like to ask founders is, like, give me the 2050 version of Athena.

从未来两到三十年的视角来看，你想象力的极限在哪里？这家公司最终能变成什么样？

What's, like, the most wild kind of, like, limit of possible vision of what this company can become over, like, the limits of your imagination over, like, two to three decades?

我很喜欢这个问题。

Well, I love that question.

我认识一个疯狂的委托者，他是个亿万富翁。

I met a crazy delegator who is a billionaire.

他是一位投资者。

He is an investor.

他有一个由50人组成的私人团队。

He has a personal team of 50.

在这个50人的私人团队中，有58人是执行助理。

The on that personal team of 58 of them are executive assistants.

所有这些执行助理都来自普林斯顿大学。

All of the executive assistants are hired from Princeton.

我问了带领这个团队的人，你们如何决定优先处理哪些事情？

And I asked the person leading the team, how do you decide what to prioritize?

你们有这么庞大的团队。

You have this huge team.

你们到底该做什么呢？

You know, what do you work on?

她回答说，如果我的团队花24小时能为我的老板节省下一分钟，让他明天能多花一分钟陪伴投资、家人或个人兴趣，那这时间就绝对值得。

And she said, if my team can spend twenty four hours to save my principal one minute tomorrow so he can spend one more minute with his investments, his family, his personal interests, it is well worth our time.

当我听到这些时，我心想：哇。

And when I heard that, I was like, woah.

这太疯狂了。

That is insane.

这简直就是目标的象征。

That's, like, hashtag goals.

但我认为，到2050年，这对全人类来说都是可能的：是的，不是每个人都会成为亿万富翁，但你将拥有一个由雅典娜驱动的人类助手，而这个助手将拥有成千上万个机器助手，它们会外出跑腿、检查事务、反复核对、记住一切，而人类仍然作为用户体验、作为你的顾问存在。

But I think that is what's possible for all of humanity by 2050 is, yeah, not everyone's gonna be a billionaire, but you're gonna have a human assistant powered by Athena that and that human assistant is gonna have thousands of machine assistants that are going out and running errands and checking things and double checking and remembering everything, and the human is still there as the UX, as your, you know, as your counselor.

但你的雅典娜助手将管理，是的，也许上千个这样的机器助手，而你则可以，没错，花更多时间陪伴家人，或者创办五家新公司，你将拥有更多关于如何生活的选择自由。

But your Athena assistant's gonna be managing, yeah, maybe a thousand of these machine assistants, and you're, yep, spend more time with your family or start five new businesses, and you'll just have a lot more optionality in, how you wanna live your life.

这太棒了。

That's awesome.

非常感谢你抽出时间，引领方向，并如此出色地展示了有效委派的典范。

Thank you so much for for taking the time and leading the way and being such a shining example of, like, you know, delegation effectively done.

感谢你以及你所创造的一切。

Appreciate you and, everything you built.

我也很感谢你。

Appreciate you too.

感谢你所有的支持，即使你对此很谦虚，你依然是一个优秀而自然的授权者。

Thanks for all the support, and you are a good and natural delegator even if you are are very humble about it.

我正在努力中。

I'm working on it.

我正在努力中。

I'm working on it.

总有一天。

One day.

太棒了。

Awesome.

谢谢你能邀请我。

Thanks for having me.