克里斯·詹娜

肖尼，你刚去过拉斯维加斯。

Shawnee, you just went to Vegas.

对吧？

Right?

是的。

Yeah.

肖恩特别喜欢。

Sean loves it.

但我得说一点。

But I will say this.

我最近有个朋友跟我说，他特别喜欢这个主意。

A friend of mine said to me recently, I love this idea.

他说，他说，是的，我知道，当累积奖金达到十亿美元的时候，我就买几张彩票。

He said, he said, yeah, I buy, you know, when the when the mega million or whatever it is, it's like a billion dollars.

我最后总会买上几张。

It's like I end up buying a couple of tickets.

我说，真的吗？

I said, really?

他看起来是最不可能的。

He seemed like the most unlikely.

我的朋友克莱。

My my buddy Clay.

他们说，真的吗？

And they go, really?

你买这么多张彩票？

You buy that lot of tickets?

他说，是的。

He goes, yeah.

你知道我为什么买吗？

You know why I buy it?

我买它是因为买了之后，在车里的那五分钟。

I buy it for that five minutes after I've bought it, and I'm in the car.

是的。

Yeah.

那种感觉，那种感觉和中奖一样好。

And that feeling, that feeling is just as good as winning.

我就是要得到那种感觉。

What would I Just getting that feeling.

这纯粹是为了那种感觉。

Like It's only about the feeling.

那是钱。

That's money

当然，钱是肯定的，但我们追求的是那种感觉。

and whatever is sure, but it's the feeling that we're after.

他就像说，

He's like,

我喜欢那种感觉。

I enjoy that feeling.

是的。

Yeah.

我当时就想，

And I was like,

我觉得挺有意思的是，有人愿意排长队买一张十亿美元的彩票，却不肯买一张五千万的。

that's it's good when we're at the go like, think it's funny that there's people that line up the street to buy a billion dollar lottery ticket, but not a $50,000,000 ticket.

像，这还不够。

Like, that's not enough.

我不会为了五千万就去努力的。

I'm not gonna do enough for 50.

你明白我的意思吗？

Do you know what I mean?

五千万？

50?

不。

No.

我会等到奖金涨到十亿美元再买。

I'll wait till it gets to a billion.

我刚看到有人说，现在AI真的能帮你选号吗？

Isn't I just read somewhere that AI now can really help your your your number picking?

比如，停下。

Like Stop.

是的。

Yeah.

你可以去一些AI工具那里，说：‘给我这周末会中奖的号码’，它们还真能给出一些接近中奖的号码。

You can, like, go on, like, some of these AI things and say, give me the give me the numbers that are gonna win the lottery this this weekend, and they'll actually give you some that get pretty close.

我好像听说过了。

I apparently.

哇。

Wow.

嗯，如果奖金是十亿美元的话，我的意思是，你至少可能赢个一亿美元，如果你

Well, you could well, like, if it's a billion dollars, you I mean, you could win a, you know, a 100,000,000 if you

选几个号码。

have a couple numbers.

对吧？

Right?

是的。

Yeah.

也许吧。

Maybe.

就两个。

Just two.

就两个号码。

Just two numbers.

对。

Yeah.

现在说说你妈妈和你的继父，你的继父——你很快就会意识到，这可不是什么深度新闻报道。

Now now talking about your your your mom and your stepdad, was your stepdad you're you're gonna realize very quickly this is not hard hitting journalism here.

我觉得

I think

好的。

Okay.

继父是个商人，对吧？

The a stepdad was a businessman, perhaps?

不是。

No.

我继父实际上有两家公司。

My stepdad was actually he had two businesses.

我继父和我叔叔开了一家汽车经销商，我继父会搞一些改装套件，然后去汽车经销商那里给汽车贴膜。

My stepdad my uncle had a car dealership, and my stepdad would have a kit, and he would go to the car dealership and stripe the cars.

哦。

Oh.

有人吗

Do anybody

哦，你从来记不住

oh, you never remember

那个阶段吗？

that phase?

是的。

Yeah.

给我来一句吧。

Give me, like, a line.

你把它当成一卷胶带。

You take, like it's like a tape.

像条纹饰边之类的？

Like a pinstripe or something?

对。

Yeah.

像条纹饰边。

Like a pinstripe.

你几个小时就给一辆车贴了条纹。

You pinstriped a car in a couple of hours.

那时候，是用非常细的胶带做的。

And in those days, it was done with a very thin tape.

对。

Right.

我爸爸是圣地亚哥最顶尖的贴胶带汽车师傅。

And my dad was San Diego's premier tape car tape.

然后它等着。

And it wait.

只是在车上贴一块胶带吗？

Would it just be a piece of tape on the car?

是的。

Yeah.

它不会轻易掉下来吗？

And it wouldn't just come off?

是的。

Yeah.

就像《Starsky and Hutch》那样的星形图案。

Like star like Starsky and Hutch.

你知道的，就是那种很大的，

You know, that that that, like, that big,

像猴子一样的弯道线条，没错。

like, monkey swoosh Exactly.

我二十五年前有一辆老款雪佛兰Tahoe，它原厂带有细橙色条纹，我不喜欢。

I had one of my old Chevy Tahoe twenty five years ago because it came with a thin orange, and I didn't like it.

所以我找了个师傅，他在上面加了一层细蓝色条纹。

So I went to a guy, and he put a thin blue over it.

没错。

That's right.

这简直带来了天壤之别。

And it just made all the difference.

没错。

That's right.

你知道吗，你

Know what you're

折腾雪佛兰干嘛。

doing messing around with Chevy.

我的意思是，这车本来该是GMC的。

I mean, that shit should have been a GMC.

那是GMC还没出现的时候。

This is pre GMC days.

你不喜欢专业级的吗？

Did you not like professional grade?

他们有生产吗？

Did they make it?

我有。

I do.

我喜欢专业级产品。

I love professional grade.

我喜欢GMC的所有东西。

I love everything in the GMC.

所以他确实这么做了，而且他还有一家公司，负责在屋顶安装天线。

So he did that, and then he also was a guy who had a company that put antennas on the roof.

好的。

Okay.

真的吗？

Really?

但他确实做了。

But he actually did it.

他手下有几个人为他工作。

Like, he had a had a few guys that work for him.

是的。

Yeah.

所以如果你买了一台电视，是的。

So if you bought a TV Yeah.

记得我们第一台彩色电视，然后他有个公司，你知道的，做广告并派人上门。

Remember we got our first color TV, and then he would have a company that, you know, advertised and came out.

对。

Right.

把你的天线装在屋顶上。

And put your antenna on your roof.

把兔耳朵天线装在屋顶上。

The rabbit ears up on the roof.

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

我明白了。

I gotcha.

所以，我问题背后真正想问的是，那个……

So but, like, my my question behind the question is where did

这是一项生意。

it we was a business

屋顶，对。

Roof right.

聪明。

Smart.

他赚了钱。

He made money.

这种商业兴趣是什么时候开始的？你最早是什么时候萌生这种想法的？

Did that start to how early did the did the did the business interest in you get get sparked?

那种创业式的、富有创造力的念头——接下来我能做点什么？是从什么时候开始的？

That entrepreneurial sort of creative kind of what what what what could I get into next kind of thing starting?

这来自于我的祖母和母亲。

That came from my grandmother and my mother.

我祖母和母亲都在加利福尼亚州拉霍亚开了自己的商店。

So my grandmother and my mother both had their own stores in La Jolla, California.

是的。

Right.

我在圣地亚哥和拉霍亚长大，我母亲直到今天还住在那里。

And I grew up in San Diego and then La Jolla, and my mom still lives there to this day.

她快92岁了，已经90岁了。

She's 90 almost 92.

哦，

Oh,

哇。

wow.

但她最后一间店是一家名为Shannon and Company的儿童用品店，开了45年。

But she had her last store that she had was a children's store forty five years called Shannon and Company.

她的姓氏是Shannon。

Her last name is Shannon.

是的。

Yeah.

我祖母开了一家叫‘拉霍亚蜡烛’的蜡烛店。

And, my grandmother had a candle store called the Candles of La Jolla.

所以，当我12岁的时候，我没有和朋友们去拉霍亚海滩学冲浪，而是去我祖母的蜡烛店工作。

So, basically, when I was 12 years old, instead of going to the La Jolla shores to learn how to surf with all my friends, I was going to my grandmother's candle store and working.

我做的第一份工作是礼品包装。

And the first job I had, I was the gift wrapper.

所以我的祖母

So my grandmother

挺有趣的，对吧？

It's kind of fun, isn't

是啊。

it?

那是最棒的。

It was the best.

而且顺便说一下，我是最棒的礼品包装师。

I'm and by the way, I'm the best gift wrapper.

真的吗？

Are you really?

是的。

Yeah.

永远都是。

Ever.

我喜欢这个。

I like it.

我在意的是，我看过那些日本人的视频。

I care I've watched those videos of the the the Japanese people

我也看过那个。

I saw that too.

是的。

Yeah.

我就想着，我得模仿一下，我是最差的那个。

And I'm like, I'm trying to emulate I'm the worst one.

是的。

Yes.

我

I

我看到了。

saw that.

圣诞节时，我意识到自己是最差的。

At Christmas, I realized I'm the worst.

我太喜欢了。

I love it.

等等，什么？

What what wait.

所以，Kris，你有没有一些特别厉害的技巧，比如隐藏边缘和卷边？

So, Kris, do you have do you have, like, incredible techniques about, like, hiding edges and curling seams?

是的。

Yes.

而且，是的。

And, like Yes.

哦。

Oh.

真的吗？

Really?

有一天，我学会了使用丝带制造机和蝴蝶结制作机。

And I do like, one day, I learned how to use the ribbon maker the bow maker machine.

所以我做蝴蝶结做得非常好。

So I got really good at bows.

所以我有一些隐藏的才能。

And so I have these hidden talents.

他们说我们没有天赋。

Like, they say we have no talent.

哦，我有天赋。

Oh, I've got talent.

是的。

Yeah.

我们有一些很棒的礼品包装天赋。

We've got some great gift wrapping talent.

你家里有专门的包装室吗？

Do have a do you have a wrapping room at the house?

有。

I do.

有。

I do.

哦。

Oh.

礼品包装

The gift wrap

我有一个朋友有一个专门的包装室。

I have a friend that has a wrapping room.

她有成卷的包装纸和抽屉装满的包装纸，非常令人兴奋。

She With is rolls of wrapping paper and drawers of tissue, and it's very exciting.

克莉丝，你能看看一个礼物或者你包装的东西，然后一眼就看出需要多少包装纸吗？

Kris, can you look can you look at a gift or some of you in a wrap, and can you just eyeball it and and go, I know exactly how much paper I need for that.

我以前做得稍微好一点。

I used to a little bit better.

现在呢，如果我对一个礼物实在拿不准，我就直接用透明胶膜包起来，再系个蝴蝶结，完事了。

Now I've you know, I I if I really get confused over a gift, I just cellophane it and put a bow on it, call it a day.

是的。

Yeah.

而且看起来特别可爱。

And it's so cute.

用透明胶膜包装能帮你避免那些讨厌的纸割伤。

Cellophane will help you avoid those terrible paper cuts

没错。

That's right.

包礼物时可能会被纸割到。

Paper cuts you can get from wrapping gifts.

没错。

That's right.

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

但我喜欢那些来自日本的视频。

But I love those I love those videos from Japan.

我知道。

I know.

它们太棒了。

They're so so so Fabulous.

克里斯，还有，是的。

Kris and, like, yeah.

太棒了。

Amazing.

强迫症。

OCD.

等等，克里斯，所以你在说唱的时候学了一些商业知识，然后你心想，等等。

So wait, Kris, so after the after you so you learned some business while you were rapping, you're like, wait.

这到底是怎么做到的？

How did that work?

那你是怎么做到的呢？你妈妈和奶奶都是很棒的商业榜样。

And how did that Well, your mom and your grandma were were great business inspiration.

对。

Right.

是的。

Yeah.

是的。

Yeah.

所以我认为，听我说。

So I think listen.

当你年轻的时候，看到我的母亲当时是一位单亲妈妈，我的祖父母住在街对面，我的祖母帮我一起带大了我。

When you're when you're young and you see your my my mother at the time was a single mom, and my grandmother and my grandfather lived across the street, and I my grandmother helped raise me.

所以当你看到当时你生命中最重要的两个人——我的祖母和我的母亲——每天盛装打扮、准时上班、早上九点到岗、有规律的生活、经营自己的生意、按时支付账单时。

So when you see the two most important people in your life at the time, my grandmother and my mom, get up and get dressed to the nines and go to work every day and get there at 09:00 and have a routine and have a business and pay the bills.

她们对自己的生意和经营方式感到无比自豪。

And they were so proud of their businesses and how they ran them.

我断断续续地在她们两人那里工作过。

I worked for both of them on and off.

在那些日子里，我学到了很多。

And I learned a lot in those days.

我最终被提拔到前台接待顾客，后来又升到了收银台。

I got finally graduated to being on the floor with customers, then I graduated to the cash register.

嗯嗯。

Mhmm.

对。

Right.

我学到了很多。

And I just learned a lot.

那是我人生中最好的学习岁月之一，因为我学到了很多，之后我成为了美国航空的空乘人员，也就是飞行乘务员。

Those were some of the best learning years of my life because I learned so much about and then from there, I became a stewardess for American Airlines, and I was a flight attendant.

当我当空乘人员时，这让我获得了出色的社会洞察力和社交能力。

And when I was a flight attendant, that gave me great social intelligence, social skills.

我不知道你曾经是

I didn't know you were

空乘人员。

a flight attendant.

学习如何管理一个团队

Learning how to run a team

是的

Yeah.

而且在很小的时候就经历了一些非常有价值、很有趣的事情。

And just, like, some really interesting things that were very valuable at a very young age.

我妈妈在泛美航空干了整整三十年。

My mom did that for, like, thirty years at Pan Am.

她真的干过吗？

And She did?

是的

Yeah.

对我来说，小时候能坐着飞机环游世界简直太酷了，我就穿着小西装坐在后面，你知道的，因为我要穿正装才能用免费机票。

It was the coolest thing for me as a kid just flying around the world kind of, you know, in in the back with my little suit on, you know, because I had to Oh my dress up for the free tickets.

是的

Yeah.

是的

Yeah.

你还在坐泛美航空的航班吧，杰伊？

You still fly Pan Am, don't you, Jay?

是的。

Yeah.

那些航班总是在被取消。

I they they keep getting canceled, these flights.

他的西装。

He suit.

还穿着合适。

Still fits in

是的。

Yeah.

你们啊。

You guys.

听起来是这样。

It sounds like yeah.

你知道吗，关键在于，你一直保持着一贯的工作态度。

You know, the thing is, at the heart of it is like this, you've you've had this consistent work ethic.

我确实学到了。

I've learned yeah.

这非常了不起。

That's super strong.

我为他们教给我的东西以及我吸收的内容感到非常自豪。

I'm really proud of how what they taught me and what I was able to absorb.

但更重要的是，我是如何抚养孩子的，他们从这段经历中学到了什么，他们是如何被养育的。我孩子们常开玩笑，他们会跟我说：‘妈妈，夏天的时候，或者他们会讲个故事，说：我妈妈在夏天，当我们本该去度假的时候，我妈妈在上世纪八九十年代，你知道的，那时候……’

But then, even more importantly, how I raised my kids and what they were able to learn from the whole experience and how they were raised and how they it was my kids joke and they say to me, you know, mom, during the summer or they'll tell a story and they'll go, my mom, during the summer, when we were in, you know, supposed to be on vacation, my mom you know, in the old days, like the nineties or the eighties Uh-huh.

我们以前用的是座机。

We used to have a landline.

而且是的。

And Yeah.

随着我们越来越成功，机会越来越多，家里的东西也变得更好了。

On the landline, as we became more successful and had more opportunities, the stuff in the house got better.

电视变得更大了。

The TVs got bigger.

嗯。

Mhmm.

是的。

Yeah.

电话变得更复杂了，我们还在电话上安装了对讲系统。

The phones got more complicated, and we set this intercom system on the phone.

对。

Yeah.

所以你会看到一台大型的固定电话摆在柜台旁边，上面有很多按钮。

So you'd have a big, you know, big land phone landline phone sitting next to all these counters and all the buttons.

而且还有一个装置。

And there was a there was a thing.

克洛伊总是讲这个故事。

And Chloe always tells the story.

我妈妈以前会用对讲系统喊遍整个房子。

My mom used to intercom the whole house.

嗯。

Mhmm.

早上七点了。

It's 7AM.

该起床了。

Time to get up.

把床铺好。

Make your beds.

所以我也是这样带大我的孩子的。

And so I raised my kids like that.

不，不是这样的。

Like, no.

不。

No.

世界不存在。

World's not there.

去拿吧

Go get

躺在床上。

Laying in bed.

生活正在发生。

Life is happening.

起来吧。

Get up.

我们有很多事情要做。

We we've got stuff I to

我喜欢这个。

love that.

我也是。

Me too.

这真的很酷。

That's really cool.

是的。

Yeah.

等一下。

Wait.

那么，在点蜡烛的事情之后，还有在那家店工作之后，发生了什么？

So what happened after the after the candle thing and and working in that store?

在那之后，你接下来的事业是什么，让你想要进一步成为一名女商人？

And what was the kind of the next venture for you after that that made you wanna propel further into being a businesswoman?

我在那里工作，然后为一位朋友在拉霍亚的一家精品店工作，之后又为我妈妈工作。

I worked there, then I worked at a boutique in La Jolla for a friend and then for my mom.

我喜欢生活中有条理。

And I loved having structure in my life.

喜欢有事情做，有衣服穿。

Loved having something to do and to get dressed for.

我母亲和祖母总是告诉我，以我希望被对待的方式向世界展示自己非常重要。

And my mother and my grandmother always told me that it was so important to present myself to the world in a way that I wanted to be.

比如，要打扮得最好看。

Like, look your best.

要表现得最好。

Be on your best behavior.

如果你说不出什么好话，那就干脆别说。

If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all.

你知道的，非常好的礼仪。

You know, really good manners.

嗯。

Mhmm.

嗯。

Mhmm.

对。

Right.

对。

Right.

是的。

Yeah.

我本来就想说，对你来说，我必须先相信自己，才能指望别人相信。

I was gonna I was gonna say that, yeah, you gotta for me, like, I I've gotta believe it before I can expect anyone else to believe it.

所以你得站起来，走出去，展现出你想要成为的样子。

So you gotta get up get up get out there and and look like where you wanna go.

对吧？

Right?

完全正确。

Exactly right.

还有，围绕着一些事情。

And surround you know, couple things.

于是我就去申请了空乘工作，肖恩，来回答你这个问题。

So then I became then I went and I applied to be a flight attendant, Sean, to answer that question.

是的。

Yeah.

从那以后，我嫁给了罗伯特·卡戴珊。

And then from there, I got married to Robert Kardashian.

然后我就开始生孩子了。

That's kinda and then I started having kids.

所以，这就是所谓的《读者文摘》精简版。

So that's the, you know, the Reader's Digest version.

那才是真正的职业。

Was the real job.

也就是，是的。

Which is yeah.

你知道的，当妈妈、照顾孩子，那是在非常年轻的时候。

You know, the kids and the being a mom, that was at a very young age.

但当然。

But Yeah.

你知道吗，在这个过程中，你们可能能够感同身受，或者你们的听众可以思考的一件事是，我的婆婆是第一个这样的人。

You know, along the way, the one thing you guys can probably relate to or think about or your, you know, listeners can think about is my mother-in-law was the first one.

现在这已经成了我们家的座右铭。

Now it's, you know, a mantra in our house.

但我的婆婆，娜娜，总是对她的儿子罗伯特说。

But my mother-in-law, Nana, was always saying, Robert, you know, to her son.

罗伯特，告诉我你的朋友是谁，我就能告诉你你是谁。

Robert, tell you know, show me who your friends are, and I'll show you who you are.

她经常对我们所有人抱怨，如果她觉得我们身边有谁不靠谱、不诚实或者有点怪异，嗯。

And she used to just gripe at all of us about if she thought anybody around us was shady or dishonest or a little creepy Mhmm.

或者，你知道的，任何不对劲的地方。

Or, you know, anything off.

因为我认识她和罗伯特的时候还很年轻，你知道，他比我大十二岁。

She was because I met her and Robert at such a young age, you know, he was twelve years older than I was.

但我学到了很多，因为那时我周围围绕着整个亚美尼亚家族，而我以前从未有过这么庞大的家庭。

But I just learned so much because then I had this whole Armenian family surrounding me that I'd never had a big, big family.

我有一个妹妹。

I had one sister.

我妈妈离婚很久了，直到她遇到我爸爸，那时我13岁，他们才结婚。

So and my mom was divorced for the longest time until she met my dad when, you know, and then got married when I was 13.

但是，是的。

But Yeah.

我大部分人生都是和妈妈、妹妹一起度过的。

A lot of my life, it was me, my mom, and my sister.

所以，周围有这么庞大的亚美尼亚家族，真是太棒了。

So having this big Armenian family around me was very it was so amazing.

我学到的很多东西，我都默默吸收了。

And some of the things I learned, I let it all soak in.

我就像一块海绵。

I was like a sponge.

是的。

Yeah.

你知道吗，我当时就觉得，有这么多人关心我真是太好了，因为他们从我很小的时候就认识我了。

You know, I was like, I love having all these people watching out for me because they met me so young.

嗯。

Mhmm.

他们帮助我成长。

And they were helping me grow up.

对。

Right.

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Right.

一个庞大的社群。

A big community.

是的。

Yeah.

这太棒了。

That's so great.

前面有吗，莎妮？

Was there ahead, Shani.

没有。

No.

我只是想说，我第一份工作是在格伦埃林市中心的一家家具店，我负责接电话。

Was just gonna say, I was just gonna share one of my first jobs was at a furniture store in Downtown Glen Ellyn, and I had to answer the phones.

我一整天都在给亚利桑那州的朋友谢丽打电话。

And all I did all day long was call my friend Sherry in Arizona.

嗯。

Mhmm.

然后账单来了，他们的电话费高达数百美元，这在当时可是巨款，大概有一千美元左右。

And then the the the bills would come, and I they were their their phone bill was, like, hundreds of dollars, which was huge back then, like, probably like a thousand dollar.

那个 guy 就会过来问：‘你一直在给亚利桑那州的谁打电话？’

The guy would The the guy would come and be like, who are you calling in Arizona?

我当时说，那是我姐姐。

I was like, that's my sister.

只是想保持联系。

Just trying to be in touch.

但她是我最好的朋友，结果我就因为这个被开除了。

And but it was my best friend, and I got in so and then I got fired because of that.

天哪。

Oh my god.

这就是我的故事。

That's my story.

这就是我的故事。

That's my story.

我的第一份工作。

My first job.

我喜欢这个故事。

Love that story.

是的。

Yeah.

等一下。

Hang on.

我只是想在图表上看看我要把那个放在哪儿。

I'm just trying to look on the chart where I'm gonna put that.

你

You

知道吗？

know what?

我最早的一份工作

One of my first jobs

是的。

Yeah.

我们当时会做的一些事，我最早的一份工作，我真的很想做点什么。

The things that we will do one of my first jobs, I was really wanting to do something.

我的意思是，我想我一定是特别想赚钱，才会这么有动力。

I mean, this is how, I guess, I don't know, motivated I must have been to make some money.

但因为我妈妈，她并不是那种会随便给钱买衣服的人，而我们那时候也到了特别喜欢衣服、想买东西的年纪，我们都是青少年，一切都如此。

But because my mom, it wasn't like she was, you know, passing out money to buy clothes, and we were getting to the age where we really loved clothes and we wanted to buy things and we're teenagers and all of it.

所以我在我家附近找了一份工作，这样我就能搭校车去上初中或高中。

And so I got a job up the street from my house that I could then get on the school bus and get to middle school or high school.

那是一家甜甜圈店，我的工作是

And it was at a donut shop, And my job

我的意思是

I mean

拿一个糖霜刮刀把地上的糖霜刮干净。

was to take a glaze scraper and scrape the glaze off of the floor.

嗯。

Mhmm.

他们每天早上会给我一点零花钱，还有一些免费的甜甜圈球。

And they would give me free a little money and some free donut holes every morning.

哇。

Wow.

我想我是圣地亚哥最棒的糖霜刮刀手。

And I would was the best glaze scraper in, I think, in San Diego.

我很确定。

Pretty sure.

嗯。

Mhmm.

肖恩，你在这故事里迷路多远了？

Sean, how Sean, how lost are you in this story?

在想这是不是一份糟糕的工作。

Trying to figure out if it's a bad job.

他就像

He's he's like

他拿不定主意这是否是

He can't decide whether it's a

这是一份糟糕的工作？

bad This is a job?

这是我的天职，你们会把我的妆容弄花的。

He's my calling You guys are gonna ruin my makeup.

我做不到。

I can't.

我会把地上的釉料舔干净。

I'll eat the glaze off the floor.

我的意思是，这太不可思议了。

I mean, that's incredible.

嗯，没错。

Uh-huh.

我不需要喷雾，各位。

I didn't need the spray Guys,

这太棒了。

it was amazing.

肖恩自愿承担房间任何部分的糖霜刮除工作。

Sean's volunteering for any sort of glaze scraping in in any any part of the room.

所以如果你以后需要 someone 像这样的人，这些技能不知怎么的，后来对我很有帮助。

So if you ever need anybody who, like, listen, these skills somehow, you know, worked for me later in life.

我不知道。

I don't know.

真难料。

Go figure.

是的。

Yeah.

我们马上回来。

And we will be right back.

现在，回到节目。

And now back to the show.

你会对那些去商学院、拼命想进入顶尖商学院、学习所有商业知识的年轻人说什么？你会给这种传统的商业教育怎样的评价？

What would you say to these young people that are going off to business school, and they're killing themselves trying to, like, top business schools and learn all the business stuff that one needs to like, where would you what what size would you put that sort of, like, the the the traditional business

好问题。

Good question.

在当今社会和商业成功的环境下，有条理地进行。

Structured, you know, in today's society and and and and and climate for for business success.

哇。

Wow.

因为它涉及其中的细节和基础。

The nuts and the bolts of it because

我要说点可能惹麻烦的话了，因为我没上过大学。

I'm gonna get in trouble here because I did not go to college.

嗯。

Uh-huh.

没关系。

That's okay.

这对我来说并不重要，因为我并不是最出色的学生，我不喜欢学校，因为我喜欢社交。

And that wasn't important to me because I didn't I wasn't the most amazing like, I didn't love school because I was social.

这说得通吗？

Does that make sense?

我喜欢社交，享受这种人际互动。

I love being I love the socialization of it.

我觉得，我的一些孩子正在考虑，我们是否要选择在家上学？

I love I think, you know, some of my kids have been trying to decide, do we wanna just do homeschool?

当孩子长大后，我们是否还喜欢这种学校模式？

Do we love, you know, this kind of school as the kids get older?

是的。

Yeah.

我的两个小女儿，肯德尔和凯莉，在高中最后一年选择了在家上学，然后毕业了。

And Kendall and Kylie, my two youngest, went to homeschool the last year of their high school years, and then they graduated.

但没错。

But Yeah.

对我们来说，或者说对我来说，重点一直在于社交，确保孩子有良好的教育，掌握基本的知识。

It wasn't this you know, it's it's always been for us about or for me about socialization and making sure that, obviously, I have a good education, and I know my a b c's.

是的。

Yeah.

你知道，我很聪明，喜欢学习，吸收一切知识。

And, you know, I'm I'm I'm a smart cookie, and I love to learn, and I soak it all in.

是的。

Yeah.

但每个人的学习方式都不同。

But everyone learns differently.

有太多选择了。

There's so many

不同的选择。

different options.

很有趣。

Interesting.

所以我认为，现有的选择非常多。

And so I think the options out there are so vast.

然而，你真的必须追随内心，但也要想想你真正想从事什么。

However, it really you have to follow your heart, but it's also what do you wanna go into.

有些家长、孩子以及普通人普遍认为，如果你获得了教育，那就能为你提供保障。

Some rule of thumb and and thought of some parents and and kids alike and people in general is that if you get that education under your belt, then that's your safety net.

这样你就能在人生中继续前行，而且你已经装备好了自己的工具箱。

Like, that then you can go forward in your life, and now you're set with your you know, you have your tool belt on.

对。

Right.

然后你可以出去尝试各种不同的事情。

And you can go out there and do various things.

我也非常喜欢这一点。

And I I'm not like, I I love that too.

我儿子去了南加州大学。

My son went to USC.

金上大学大概只上了几周。

Kim went to college for maybe a couple weeks.

是的

Yeah.

你知道，考特尼从大学毕业了。

And, you know, Courtney graduated, from college.

你知道，我的孩子一半上了大学，另一半没上。

And, you know, half of my kids did it, and half of my kids didn't.

是的

Yeah.

所以对我而言，情况是参差不齐的，但我认为这真的取决于你是否想当医生、任何类型的医师、外科医生，或者法律行业的人士——这些是必需的。

So it's a mixed bag for me, but I think it really depends on if you wanna be a doctor or, a, you know, physician of any kind, a surgeon, know, medical field, attorney, like That's necessary.

当然。

Sure.

是的

Yeah.

但我认为最终还是要追随你的内心。

But I think it's just going to be what your you know, follow your heart.

那到底是什么，你知道的，对。

What is it that, you know Right.

让你对生活和你的职业充满热情的东西。

That gets you excited about life and what you wanna do with your career.

尽早开始。

And start sooner than later.

是的。

Yeah.

你知道，我正在经历JB的过程，你当初也和你的长子一起经历过，现在我正和我的两个十几岁的儿子一起经历，因为他们到了考虑大学的阶段，我们打算在春假期间进行一次大学参观。

You know, it's I'm going through JB, you went through it with with your eldest, and I'm kind of going through it now with my teenage boys because they're at that point where they're looking at colleges, and we're gonna do a college tour at spring break.

我不断跟他们说，你知道，压力不仅来自父母，你也能感受到来自同龄群体的压力，因为大家都在谈论这件事。

And I keep sort of saying to him, you know, there's there's a pressure not just from the parents, but you can feel it from the peer group as everybody's talking about it.

所以这逐渐形成了一种关于该去哪所大学等等的狂热氛围。

So it builds up this kind of frenzy about where to go and all this sort of stuff.

对。

Right.

我说，你看

I said, look

必须决定你要做什么，是的。

Having to decide what you're gonna Yeah.

从事的职业是

Do as an

我说，你知道吗，老兄？

And I go, you know what, man?

这些学校中的任何一所，你几乎都能获得很好的教育。

Any one of these places, you're pretty much guaranteed of getting a really good education.

你得决定你想要什么样的经历，你想要怎样的人生体验。

You've got to decide what you want your experience to be, what you want your life experience to be.

确实如此。

So true.

对吧？

Right?

而且我敦促你不要陷入其中。

And don't I urge you not to get caught up in that.

我真的觉得这一点正在产生影响，因为我看到这些孩子，他们被卷得太深了。

And I'm really I and I think it's kind of landing because I just I see them I see these kids, and they're getting so wrapped up in it.

是的。

Yeah.

生活很快就会让你变得狭隘。

Life will narrow you like real quick soon anyway.

对。

Yeah.

你知道，这很有趣。

Know, it's interesting.

去上大学吧。

Go to college.

我上大学一个学期后就退学了。

I dropped out of college after one semester.

我当时就想

I was like

你真的吗？

You did?

是的。

Yeah.

对我来说，我想：你知道吗？

For me, I went, you know what?

我环顾四周，看着我所有的同龄人、朋友和一起长大的孩子们，心想：这不是我要走的路。

This is not I looked around at all my peers and my friends and kids I'd grown up with, and I said, this is not where I'm going.

我想去那边，我想投身生活。

I I wanna go over here, and I wanna jump into life.

我12岁就搬到了纽约。

And I moved to New York at age 12.

但对我而言，它带来的影响是：我上了四年学，但没毕业，却依然拿到了博士学位。

But what it does what it did for me, I went for four years and never graduated, but still got a doctorate.

但不管怎样，真是个男孩。

But anyway What a boy.

等等。

Wait.

我们想要这个配方。

We want the recipe for that.

从家具店那里？

From the from the furniture store?

不，但这件事对我而言，就像对很多孩子一样，它让你离开了家。

No, but what it did for me was what it does for a lot of kids is it gets you out of the house.

就是这样。

That's it.

你离开了家，和同龄人在一个完全不同的环境中相处，从而发现真正的自己。

And you get out of the house and you're with your peers in a totally different setting and you find out who you are.

新

New

视野。

horizons.

视野。

Horizons.

而且，而且，是的，抛开学业不谈，从社交角度来说，它对我而言是，哦，我找到了我的人，我找到了

And, and, and yes, academics aside, socially, what it did for me was I was like, oh, I found my, I found my people and I found

肖恩，你觉得那件事有趣在哪里？

Sean, you know what's funny about that?

就像JB，你当时已经是一名年轻演员了。

Like JB, you went, you were working as a young You were already working as an actress.

所以你早就开始社交了。

So you you were already sort of socializing.

你早就这么做了。

You were already doing that.

你实际上已经走出家门了。

You were out of the house in effect.

和同龄人在一起。

With your peers.

是的。

Yeah.

我12岁就去寄宿学校了，所以那时我已经在外面了。

I had gone to boarding school at age 12, so I was already out.

也就是说，我已经离开了家。

Like, I'd already gone.

你知道的。

You know

我的意思你明白吗？

what I mean?

所以我们，是的。

So we Yeah.

那正是

That was

像一所早期的寄宿制大学。

like an early college boarding school.

是的。

Yeah.

是的。

Yeah.

我本该学点能作为备选的东西。

I should I should have studied something to fall back on.

不过，我觉得这一点很重要。

See, I think that's important to note, though.

我认为每个人，我真的相信每个人都需要结构和目标，那就是

I think that that everyone and I I really believe that everybody needs structure and and a purpose That's

就是这样。

what it is.

那就是。

That's what is.

一个社区和社交环境。

A community and socialization.

所有这些，我都喜欢学校的地方。

All of that, I love about about school.

如果你还没准备好跳进一个没有水的泳池——这么说吧，因为你不知道自己接下来要做什么，那这可能是个很好的决定，因为你终会找到方向。

And and if you're not ready to jump off the diving board into the pool with no water in it, you know, so to speak, because you don't know what you're gonna do, then that's probably a great decision because then you'll figure it out.

是的。

Yeah.

因为我上大学时就知道自己要学音乐。

I I because I went to I went to college knowing I was going to study music.

对。

Right.

就是这样。

That's it.

是的。

Yeah.

所以我有明确的目标。

So I had I had a purpose.

是的。

Yeah.

但你说得对。

But you're right.

是这样吗？

Is that correct?

你说得对，Kris，你提到的那些，我真的非常认同。

You're right, Kris, about what you said is like, you don't I love that.

如果你跳进一个没有水的泳池，那可能根本没有必要。

If you're driving, diving into a pool with no water, you probably there's no reason.

不。

No.

而且，Sean，你学的音乐确实帮到了你。

And and, Sean, the music that you studied, it did help you.