为什么你会害羞（以及如何应对）& 让新年决心更易坚持的更好方法

今天在《你该知道的事》节目中，下次你喝热可可时，试着用橙色的杯子。

Today on Something You Should Know, the next time you drink hot cocoa, try it in an orange mug.

我会解释原因。

I'll explain why.

然后是害羞。

Then shyness.

我们每个人有时都会害羞，对许多人来说，害羞是一个真正的问题。

We're all shy sometime, and for many of us, shyness ness is a real problem.

害羞的人总是像面前一直有一面镜子一样走路。

Shy people tend to walk around like they have a mirror in front of them all the time.

他们更加自我意识。

They are more self conscious.

所以当你更加自我意识时，你会想，天啊。

So when you're more self conscious, you think, oh my god.

我听起来怎么样？

How do I sound?

我看起来怎么样？

How do I look?

所以这就是害羞的人自我封闭的时候。

So that's when shy people shut themselves down.

你的签名能说明什么问题？

Also, what does your signature say about you?

一种更有效、更能坚持的新年决心方法。

And a better way to make New Year's resolutions that really stick.

这是一种行为上的关键转变。

It's a pivotal shift in behavior.

这种方法很简单，意味着你知道自己能做到，而且比普通的新年决心更具体，后者往往更像一个愿望。

It's easy, which means you know that you can do it, but much more specific than the regular New Year's resolution, which tends to be closer to a wish.

像‘要变得有条理’这样的说法，实际上只是‘希望’变得有条理。

Something like to be organized is actually a wish to be organized.

这和你具体要做什么没有任何关系。

It doesn't have anything to do with specific things you're going to do.

今天所有这些内容都来自‘你应当知道的事’。

All this today on something you should know.

‘你应当知道的事’，带来引人入胜的资讯、全球顶尖专家的见解，以及你能在生活中实际应用的实用建议。

Something you should know, fascinating intel, the world's top experts, and practical advice you can use in your life.

今天，由迈克·卡鲁瑟斯带来‘你应当知道的事’。

Today, something you should know with Mike Carruthers.

大家好，欢迎收看，如今许多地区正迎来一个极其寒冷的新年。

Hi, and welcome to what is the beginning of a very, very cold New Year in many parts of the country.

在这种时候，我感到自己相当幸运，因为住在南加州，这里的气温要温暖得多。

It's times like this that I feel somewhat fortunate to be living in Southern California where it is much warmer.

但我曾经生活在寒冷的气候中。

But I've lived in cold weather.

我住过康涅狄格州和佛蒙特州，过去几天那里气温异常寒冷。

I I've lived in Connecticut and Vermont where over the last couple days, it's been extremely cold.

我知道，当我身处那种天气时，没有什么比坐在壁炉前喝一杯热可可更惬意的了。

And and I know that when I'm in that kind of weather, there's nothing better than sitting in front of a fire with a cup of hot cocoa.

如果你也喜欢这样，你可能会感兴趣地知道，如果你用橙色的杯子喝可可，味道会更好。

And if you enjoy that as well, you might be interested to know that if you drink cocoa from an orange mug, it will taste better.

牛津大学的研究人员希望确定颜色如何提升热饮的口感。

Researchers from Oxford University wanted to determine how color might enhance a warm drink.

于是，他们让参与者分别从四种不同颜色的杯子中啜饮热可可：红色、白色、橙色和米色。

So, they had participants sip hot cocoa from four different colored mugs: red, white, orange, and beige.

他们评价说，橙色杯子中的可可味道最美味，风味也最浓郁。

And they rated the cocoa in the orange mug as the most delicious and as having the most intense flavor.

米色杯子是次优的选择。

Beige was the next best color mug.

它让可可尝起来更甜。

It made the cocoa taste sweeter.

研究人员还用不同颜色的杯子测试了咖啡，看看会产生什么影响，结果发现最佳颜色是棕色。

The researchers also tested coffee in different colored mugs to see what that did, and the best color turned out to be brown.

蓝色和黄色的杯子让咖啡尝起来更柔和，因此他们得出结论：这些颜色更适合泡茶。

Blue and yellow mugs made the coffee seem somehow softer, so they determined that those colors work better for tea.

他们还研究了不同颜色容器中的碳酸饮料，发现用蓝色玻璃杯喝碳酸饮料比用红色玻璃杯喝更能解渴。

They also looked at soft drinks in different colored containers, and drinking soft drinks out of a blue glass seemed to be more thirst quenching than drinking out of a red glass.

如果饮料装在粉色杯子或粉色玻璃杯中，人们会感觉它更甜。

And if drinks come in a pink cup or a pink glass, they're perceived as more sugary.

这一点是你应该知道的。

And that is something you should know.

当我想到害羞时，我觉得它似乎是一种负面特质。

When I think about shyness, I guess I think of it as a negative.

你知道，人们常被劝告不要那么害羞，好像害羞是一种问题或性格缺陷，需要被纠正。

You know, people are told, don't be so shy or you're just being shy as if it's a problem or or a character flaw, something to fix.

真的是这样吗？

Is it?

人是天生害羞的，还是后天变得害羞的？

Are people born shy or do we become shy?

你能变得不那么害羞吗？

Can you become less shy?

你有必要努力变得不那么害羞吗？

Should you bother trying to become less shy?

接下来我们将与伯纳多·卡杜奇讨论这些问题。

All of that is what we're about to discuss with Bernardo Carducci.

伯尼是害羞研究学院的主任，也是印第安纳大学东南分校的心理学教授，他撰写了多本关于害羞的书籍，包括《成功闲聊口袋指南》。

Bernie is director of the Shyness Research Institute and professor of psychology at Indiana University Southeast, and he's author of several books about shyness, including The Pocket Guide to Making Successful Small Talk.

嗨，伯尼。

Hi, Bernie.

欢迎。

Welcome.

那我们就开始吧。

So dive in here.

为什么有些人害羞，有些人却不害羞？

Why are some people shy and some people not?

到底什么是害羞呢？

And and what is it exactly?

什么是害羞？

What what is shyness?

是的。

Yeah.

首先，人们需要明白，害羞并不是性格缺陷。

So first and foremost, people need to realize that it is not a character flaw.

它也不是人格上的不足。

It's not a personality deficit.

它当然也不是精神疾病。

It's certainly not a psychiatric disorder.

它仅仅是一种行为倾向。

It's simply a behavioral tendency.

害羞的人做事方式与不害羞的人有所不同。

Shy people tend to do things in a particular way different from non shy people.

他们的思维方式也与不害羞的人不同。

They think in a way that's different from shy people.

当我们谈论害羞或撰写关于害羞的内容时，我们从行为层面谈论身体的害羞，从思维模式层面谈论心灵的害羞。

So when we talk about shyness or write about shyness, we talk about shyness of the body in terms of behavior, shyness of of the mind in terms of the the way that that that shy people think.

这两方面都会对害羞的人产生不利影响。

And both of these things tend to work against the shy individual.

害羞者最大的问题就在于，他们的害羞反而阻碍了自己。

That's the biggest problem that shy people have is that their shyness works against them.

但害羞的人是天生如此，还是后天习得的，或者是什么原因？

But are shy people born that way, or is shyness something you learn or what?

当人们向我询问害羞时，这是第二个最常被问到的问题。

That's the second most common question I get when people ask me about shyness.

我们可以这样理解：是的，害羞确实带有一定的生物性成分。

And the way that we can talk about that is, yes, there is a certain biological component to shyness.

这种成分主要表现为对刺激的敏感性。

And that that component comes primarily in the form of arousal sensitivity.

害羞的人通常对声音、噪音这类刺激更为敏感。

So shy people tend to be a little bit more sensitive to sound and noise and these sorts of things.

但那并不是害羞的主要成分。

But that's not the biggest component of shyness.

害羞的主要成分是心理上的害羞，即害羞的人学会的思维方式。

The biggest component of shyness is shyness of the mind, the way shy people learn to think.

那具体是怎样的呢？

So how is that?

他们是怎么学会这样思考的？

How is it they learn to think?

害羞的人通常会表现出一个典型特征：他们过度自我意识。

What shy people tend to do a characteristic feature of shyness is that shy people tend to be overly self conscious.

当你过度自我意识时，也往往会变得过于苛刻。

And when you're overly self conscious, you also tend to be overly critical.

害羞的人总觉得自己好像随时都有一面镜子摆在面前。

Shy people tend to walk around like they have a mirror in front of them all the time.

他们更加自我意识。

They are more self conscious.

当你更自我意识时，你会想：天啊，我听起来怎么样？

So when you're more self conscious, you think, oh my God, how do I sound?

我看起来怎么样？

How do I look?

我最好什么也不说，因为人们会发现我其实有多无趣。

I better not say anything because people are gonna find out how uninteresting I really am.

所以当害羞的人封闭自己时，这就是思维型害羞的问题所在。

So that's when shy people shut themselves down, and that's the problem with shyness of the mind.

他们学会了这样思考。

They learn to think that way.

但每个人有时都会害羞。

But everybody is shy sometimes.

对吧？

Right?

难道没有一些情境或一些人会让几乎每个人都感到害羞吗？

Are aren't there some situations or some people that make pretty much everybody feel shy?

当然。

Absolutely.

再说一遍，这个问题问得非常好。

Again, one of the that's a great question, by the way.

我们告诉人们的一件事，也是我能给害羞者最重要的建议，就是告诉你，你并不孤单。

One of the things that we tell people, probably the most important piece of information I can give to shy people, is to tell them you are not alone.

我们已经追踪害羞现象近四十年了。

We have been tracking shyness for almost forty years now.

就害羞在普通人群中的普遍性而言，大约占百分之四十。

And in terms of the general pervasiveness of shyness in the general population, it's about forty percent.

所以大约有百分之四十的人自认为是害羞的。

So about forty percent of the people identify themselves as shy.

所以我们说，看看左边，看看右边。

So we say, look to the left, look to the right.

很可能其中一个人就是害羞的。

Chances are one of those individuals is shy.

如果我们再问人们另一个问题：你一生中是否曾经在某个时刻或某种情境下体验过害羞？

And if we also ask people another question, have you ever experienced shyness in your life or in some point or a time or situation?

在我们调查的人中，大约有百分之九十五的人对这个问题回答了‘是’。

And roughly ninety five percent of the people that we've surveyed say yes to that question.

所以我们称之为情境性害羞。

So we call that situational shyness.

你知道，你可能非常自信，但当你在电梯里遇到你最喜欢的电影明星时，你却突然僵住了。

So, you know, you might be pretty self confident, but you meet your favorite movie star in an elevator and now you freeze up.

好的。

Okay.

但你之前说过，害羞会阻碍人们，害羞的人表示他们的害羞让他们无法在某些事情上取得成功。

But but you've said that shyness holds people back, that shy people report that their shyness keeps them from succeeding at things.

但你也说过，害羞并不是性格缺陷。

But you've also said shyness is not a character flaw.

那么，害羞是应该忍受的东西，还是应该去改变的东西？

So is shyness something to live with, or is shyness something to fix?

我不是一个伟大的神。

That's a I'm not a great god.

你很擅长这个。

You're good at this.

当我们谈论害羞时，我把自己称为一个‘成功地害羞’的人。

When we talk about shyness, I talk I I consider myself what I call a successfully shy person.

当我们谈论害羞时，我们说害羞的问题在于它控制了你，而不是你控制自己的害羞。

And when we talk about shyness, we say that the problem with shyness is it controls you instead of you controlling your shyness.

所以，害羞本身并没有错。

So there's nothing wrong with being shy.

问题在于害羞的人不理解自己的害羞，反而采取了适得其反的行动。

The problem is shy people don't understand their shyness and they take action that works against it.

因此，我们在害羞研究学院以及我们的著作、研究和演讲中，努力帮助害羞的人理解他们害羞的本质与动态，从而利用这种理解更有效地应对自己的害羞。

So what we try to do at the Shyness Research Institute and in our writings, in our research, in our speaking is we try to help shy people to understand the nature and the dynamics of their shyness so they can use that understanding to deal more effectively with their shyness.

这样，他们就能开始掌控自己的害羞，而不是被害羞所控制。

So they could begin to control their shyness instead of their shyness controlling them.

这会产生巨大的不同。

And that's a that makes a huge difference.

那么你怎么做呢？

And so how do you do that?

你这样做的方法是帮助害羞的人理解他们害羞的本质和动态，以便他们能采取与害羞相协调的行动，而不是与之对抗。

So the the the way that you do that is to help shy people understand the nature and the dynamics of their shyness so they can take action that works with their shyness against instead of against it.

我所能给出的最好例子之一是，想象害羞的人参加社交活动。

And the biggest example, one of the best examples I can give you is you think about shy people going to a social function.

我们发现，害羞的人的一个行为是他们渴望社交。

That's one of the things that we find that shy people do is they want to be social.

所以他们会去参加派对、去酒吧、去商场、去艺术展览。

So they'll go to parties, they'll go to bars, they'll go to malls, they'll go to art openings.

他们渴望社交。

They'll they want to be social.

问题是，他们的做法完全错了。

The problem is they go at it all wrong.

所以，一个害羞的人如果要去参加派对，通常会想：好吧，派对九点开始。

So what a shy person, if they're going to go to a party, what they'll typically do is they'll think, okay, the party starts at nine.

我打算十点半到。

I'm gonna get there at 10:30.

十点半的时候，那里会有很多人，我可以混在人群中。

At 10:30, there'll be lots of people there and I'll be able to blend in.

没人会注意到我，这样对我就合适了。

No one will notice me and it'll it'll that'll work for me.

但这个策略有问题在哪里。

Here's what's wrong with that strategy.

当你迟到到达时，人们已经形成了小团体。

When you show up late, people are already forming in groups.

因此，对话的主题和深度已经进展了很多。

And so the topics of conversation, the depth of conversation has already moved quite a ways along.

当你迟到到达时，由于派对人多、喧闹，整体的兴奋程度已经很高了。

And when you arrive late, the level of arousal of that party, because it's crowded, all the chatter is pretty high.

所以，如果你是一个焦虑、内向的人，你走进去时会稍微有点紧张。

So if you're an anxious individual, shy individual, you're going to walk into there slightly anxious.

而且，要加入一个已经持续了很长时间的群体对话真的很难。

Plus, it's really hard to break into a conversation that has been going on with a group of people for an extended period of time.

这就像是在比赛开始后才起跑。

So it's like starting a race late.

所以我们告诉内向的人，不要迟到，而是要早到。

And so we tell shy people, instead of showing up late, what you do is you show up early.

如果派对九点开始，你就九点到，这样你就能逐渐适应环境的紧张程度。

If you the party starts at nine, you get there at nine, what happens is you then get to adjust your level of arousal to the arousal of the environment.

所以当你走进去时，由于人还不多，紧张程度很低，你会感觉很自在。

So when you walk in there, the level of arousal is low because there's not a lot of people there yet, so you feel pretty comfortable.

随着紧张程度的上升，你也可以随之逐步适应。

And as the level of arousal rises, you can rise with it.

而且当你早到时，你可以主动开启对话。

And when you show up early, what you can do is you can start the conversation.

再说一遍，我是个成功的内向者。

Again, I'm a successfully shy person.

我每天都在努力克服自己的内向。

I work on my shyness every day.

我尽量提前到达我去的每一个地方。

And I try to be early to literally every place I go.

我们正在进行的这次通话，我已经提前十五分钟在等了。

This call that we've been on here, I've been waiting for this call for fifteen minutes.

我关掉了所有其他事情，只为等你，并思考我要说什么，因为我知道，我们想要的是自然地一起进入这个话题。

I shut everything down so I could wait for you and think about what I was gonna say because I know that what we wanna do is we wanna move into this thing naturally together.

我还以为你要说你等这通电话等了十五年呢。

I I thought you were gonna say you've been waiting for this call for fifteen years.

那也是。

That too.

所以你的意思是，如果你内向，有一些方法可以与你的内向共处，但并不一定非要试图彻底消除它。

So you're saying then if you're shy, there are things you can do to work with your shyness, but it's not something that you necessarily wanna try to eliminate.

不。

No.

再说，害羞一直存在已久。

Again, shyness has been around forever.

而且我们告诉人们，因为它一直存在，所以一定具有某种进化价值。

And be and and we tell people because it's been around forever, it must have some evolutionary value.

这个世界需要害羞的人。

The world needs shy individuals.

我的意思是，想想看，如果每个人都要像特朗普总统那样，总想成为注意力的中心，社交场合会变成什么样。

I mean, just think about how social the situations would be if everybody were like president Trump, you know, wanting to be the center of attention.

如果每个人都这么激进地行事，我们需要的是一些人快速前进，但也需要一些人谨慎行事。

If everybody tried to drive like that, what we need is we need some people to move forward quickly, but we also need some people to move cautiously.

因此，我认为害羞是社会文明得以可能的基础。

So I maintain that shyness makes possible social civilization.

害羞是文明的基石。

Shyness is the cornerstone of civility.

今天节目的嘉宾是伯纳多·卡杜奇。

My guest on the program today is Bernardo Carducci.

他是印第安纳大学东南分校羞怯研究研究所的主任，也是多本关于羞怯的书籍的作者，包括《成功进行简短交谈的口袋指南》。

He's director of the Shyness Research Institute at Indiana University Southeast and author of several books on shyness, including the pocket guide to Making Successful Small Talk.

作为本节目的听众，您知道保持健康需要在饮食中摄入适当的营养素。

As a listener to this program, you know that maintaining your health requires getting the right nutrients in your diet.

但仅靠食物并不总是容易获取所有所需的营养。

And it isn't always easy to get all the nutrients you need from food.

事实上，高达百分之九十的人在至少一种维生素或营养素上未达到美国食品药品监督管理局的推荐标准。

In fact, ninety percent of people fall short of FDA recommended guidelines for at least one vitamin or nutrient.

百分之九十！

Ninety percent!

这就是我想向您介绍我们新广告商Careof的原因——这是一项按月订阅的维生素服务，使用高效优质的成分，根据您的具体需求量身定制。

That's why I want to tell you about our new advertiser, Careof is a monthly subscription vitamin service made from effective quality ingredients personally tailored to your exact needs.

通过Careof，您可以完成一个有趣的在线问卷，轻松了解自己具体需要哪些维生素和补充剂，其建议基于扎实的临床研究。

With Careof, you take this fun online quiz that makes it really easy to figure out what vitamins and supplements you specifically need, and it's based on solid clinical research.

然后，你会收到一个为期30天的个性化维生素包，直接配送到你家门口。

Then, you receive a thirty day supply of personalized vitamin packs shipped right to your door.

与当地药店和健康食品店的类似品牌相比，价格大约低20%。

And it costs about 20% less compared to similar brands at local drug and health food stores.

听好了，你希望保持健康，而现在你可以尝试Careof，首月个性化维生素享受50%折扣。

Look, you want to be healthy, and right now you can try Careof and get 50% off your first month of personalized CareOf vitamins.

只需访问takecareof.com并输入促销码something。

Just visit takecareof.com and enter promo code something.

就是takecareof.com，输入促销码something，首月享50%折扣。

That's takecareof.com and enter promo code something to get 50% off your first month.

摄政时期。

Of the Regency era.

你可能知道，那是《布里奇顿》的故事背景时代，也是简·奥斯汀创作小说的时代。

You might know it as the time when Bridgerton takes place, or as the time when Jane Austen wrote her books.

摄政时期同时也是社会变革、性丑闻频发，或许还是英国历史上最糟糕国王的年代。

The Regency era was also an explosive time of social change, sex scandals, and maybe the worst king in British history.

《粗俗历史》的新一季聚焦于摄政时期，包括舞会、礼服和各种丑闻。

Vulgar History's new season is all about the Regency era, the balls, the gowns, and all the scandal.

在您收听播客的任何平台收听《粗俗历史》摄政时期系列。

Listen to Vulgar History Regency era wherever you get podcasts.

年轻时，这个被称为石狼的五人精英突击队曾反抗占据并统治银河系大多数宜居星球的陨石帝国的压迫统治。

When they were young, the five members of an elite commando group nicknamed the stone wolves raged against the oppressive rule of the Crateroccan Empire, which occupies and dominates most of the galaxy's inhabited planets.

狼群为自由而战，但最终失败，留下无数尸体。

The wolves fought for freedom, but they failed, leaving countless corpses in their wake.

战败且心灰意冷，他们放下了武器，各奔东西，都希望在充满暴力与压迫的宇宙中寻得一丝宁静。

Defeated and disillusioned, they hung up their guns and went their separate ways, all hoping to find some small bit of peace amidst a universe thick with violence and oppression.

在他们巅峰时期的四十年后，每个人都在努力求生，勉强维持生计。

Four decades after their heyday, they each try to stay alive and eke out a living.

但一位故人不会让他们放手，他们的死敌也不会。

But a friend from the past won't let them move on, and neither will their bitterest enemy.

《石狼》是作家斯科特·西格勒创作的《银河足球联盟》科幻系列的第十一季。

The stone wolves is season eleven of the Galactic Football League science fiction series by author Scott Sigler.

把它当作一个独立的故事来欣赏，或者从第一季《新人》开始收听整个GFL系列。

Enjoy it as a stand alone story or listen to the entire GFL series beginning with season one, the rookie.

在您收听播客的任何平台搜索Scott Sigler，拼写为s-i-g-l-e-r。

Search for Scott Sigler, s I g l e r, wherever you get your podcasts.

所以，伯尼，我一直有个问题想问你。

So, Bernie, here's a question I've always wondered about.

害羞的人和内向的人有什么区别？

What is the difference between a shy person and an introvert?

因为你知道，我们用两个不同的词来描述这些情况：害羞和内向。

Because, you know, we have two different words to describe these things, shyness and introversion.

那么，它们到底有什么不同呢？

So, so what's the difference?

这又是我收到的第三常见问题。

Again, the third most popular question I get.

如果你在社交场合看到一个害羞的人和一个内向的人，比如说他们在参加一个派对。

If you see a shy person and an introverted person at a social function, so that let's say they're at a party.

这两个人都会站在边缘位置。

Both of those individuals are going to be standing on the periphery.

他们会靠在墙上。

They're going to be against the wall.

两者的主要区别在于，内向的人靠在墙上是因为他们更喜欢这样。

The big difference is the introverted person is standing against that wall because they prefer to be.

他们试图降低外部刺激带来的兴奋水平。

They're trying to minimize the level of arousal on external stimulation.

所以如果你站得离演讲者太近，你会往后退。

So if you're standing too close to a speaker, you're going to step away.

这就是内向者会做的事。

That's what introverts do.

他们倾向于远离过度的社会刺激。

What they do is they tend to step away from excessive social stimulation.

所以他们喜欢举办派对。

So they like to have parties.

他们喜欢和人在一起。

They like to be around people.

他们确实会社交。

They do socialize.

但他们是以更低调、更安静的方式进行。

They just do it in a more subdued way, in a more quiet environment.

所以他们靠墙站着是因为他们愿意这么做。

So that they're standing against that wall because they want to.

害羞的人靠墙站着是因为他们觉得不得不这么做。

Shy people are standing against that wall because they feel they have to.

他们不知道还能做什么。

They don't know what else to do.

他们想融入人群之中。

They wanna be out there in the mix.

他们想走出去和人们交谈。

They want to be out there talking to people.

事实上，害羞更多与外向性有关，而不是内向性。

In fact, shyness has more to do with extraversion than it does introversion.

害羞的人其实渴望社交。

Shy people want to be social.

他们只是不知道该怎么做。

They just don't know what to do.

害羞的问题在于，他们觉得这阻碍了自己。

And that's the problem with shyness is they feel it holds them back.

他们不得不靠在墙上，因为他们不知道该做什么。

They have to stand against that wall because they don't know what to do.

如果我们这么说，那这里有一些你可以做的事情。

And we say, if that's the case, here are some things that you can do.

这里有一些简单的方法，你可以尝试。

Here are some simple things that you can do.

这里有一些你可以思考、实践的方法，来提升你的自我意识、自信心，掌控你的害羞，而不是让害羞控制你。

Here are some things that you can think about that you can do, that you can practice to build up your self conscious, your self confidence and control your shyness instead of your shyness controlling you.

那这些方法具体有哪些呢？

And what are some of those things?

是的。

Yeah.

所以我们说过，第一件事就是早点到场。

So, you know, we said the first thing we said is show up early.

对吧？

Right?

早点到场。

Show up early.

另一件事是观察那些在社交场合中成功的人与不成功的人之间有什么不同。

The other thing is to look at the kinds of things that people who are successful in a social context do versus people who aren't successful.

所以我们重点关注的是寒暄，因为如果你问害羞的人——我们已经多次这样做过——我们会问：在你的生活中，害羞最成问题的地方在哪里？

So we point out the thing that we focus on is small talk because if you ask shy people, and we've done this many times, we say, where is shyness the biggest problem in your life?

他们会说三个地方：学校、工作，最重要的是人际关系，比如交朋友、约会这类事情。

Well, they'll say three things, school, work, and most importantly, interpersonal relationships, making friends, dating, these kinds of things.

而这一切的关键在于，我坚持从开启对话、建立联系开始。

And the key to all that is I maintain starting a conversation, making that connection.

每一个大的商业交易、每一段重要的亲密关系，都是从一次简单的对话开始的。

Every big business deal, every major romantic relation starts with a simple conversation.

因此，我们专注于帮助人们学会进行闲聊。

And so what we focus on is helping people learn to make small talk.

如果你观察害羞的人和不害羞的人如何进行闲聊，他们会做得非常不同。

So if you look at the way shy people and non shy people make small talk, they do it very differently.

我知道你有五个步骤可以帮助人们进行闲聊。

And and I know you have like five steps to help people make small talk.

那我们来谈谈这些步骤吧。

So let's let's talk about them.

最好的、最简单的方法是从我们所说的共享环境入手，也就是你和他人所处的共同场合。

The best way, the easiest way to get started is to focus on what we call the shared environment, where you are together with other people.

比如，如果你在婚礼或派对上，可以说：‘这里的自助餐食物真不错。’

So for example, if you're at a wedding or a party, boy, that's a nice food buffet that they have here at the reception.

或者看看那个四人座。

Or look at that four arrangement.

天啊，这真有意思。

Man, that's really interesting.

我的天，这场音乐会的队伍也太长了。

Or my god, this line is long for this concert.

所以当你做出这样的陈述——对共同环境的一个简单观察时，你实际上是在告诉对方：我想和你聊聊。

So when you make a statement like that, a very simple observation of the shared environment, what you're really doing is telling the person, you know, I want to talk to you.

你愿意和我聊聊吗？

Do you want to talk to me?

害羞的人常犯的错误是，他们认为开场白必须一鸣惊人，只有一次机会。

The mistake that shy people make is they think that that opening line has to be a knockout punch, that you only get one chance to do that.

因此，由于他们自我批评，会觉得：天啊，说这种关于自助餐或队伍的话也太蠢了。

So because they're self critical, they think, ugh, that's such a foolish thing to say about the buffet or about the line.

这太明显了。

That's just so obvious.

事实上，开场白越简单，效果就越好。

When in fact, the simpler the opening line, the more effective it is.

第二步是个人介绍。

So two is personal introduction.

既然我们知道要聊天了，就需要一些信息。

So now that we know we're gonna talk, we need some information.

所以你要告诉别人你的名字和一些关于你的事。

So you tell people your name and something about you.

比如，你在派对上认识谁，你为什么来这里，这样他们就能开始思考：好吧，我认识罗杰，但这里有一些我可以聊的话题。

You know, who do you know at the party, why you're there, these so now they can begin to think, okay, I know Roger here, but here's some things that I can talk about.

所以提前准备好你的个人介绍。

So prepare that personal introduction ahead of time.

第三步是话题预探。

Step three is pre topical exploration.

我们要抛出一些话题。

So we're going to throw out some topics.

所以你可以根据你对这个人兴趣以及他们开场时所说的内容，抛出一些话题。

So that's when you can toss out some topics based on what you know about the person's interest and things that they said getting started.

然后第四步是话题延伸。

And then step four is topic elaboration.

所以现在，我们开始聊自助餐的食物，接着你就可以谈论餐厅了。

So now, you know, we started to talk about food at the buffet and you begin to talk about restaurants.

到了这一步，你可以说：你知道吗，当我还在佛罗里达的时候，我们去过一家神奇的古巴餐厅，那里有很棒的国际音乐。

And then at this point, you can say, well, you know, when I was in Florida, we went to this magical Cuban restaurant where they had this great international music.

所以现在你可以聊食物。

So now you can talk about food.

你可以聊假期。

You can talk about vacations.

你可以聊佛罗里达。

You can talk about Florida.

你可以聊国际音乐。

You can talk about international music.

第五步是对话结束。

And step five is conversation termination.

当你结束对话时，目标是让对方觉得你们未来还有机会再联系。

When you close a converse conversation, what you wanna do is you wanna end it so that you can extend future contact.

所以你可以告诉对方：我几分钟后就要走了。

So you tell the person, I'm gonna be leaving in a few minutes.

和你聊天真的很愉快。

It's been great talking to you.

我学到了很多东西，这样他们就知道你认真听了，所以要特别提到某一点。

I've really learned something so that they know you were paying attention, so highlight something.

然后可以说：下次我们在派对、音乐会或研讨会上再见面时，我们可以继续聊这个话题。

And then say, you know, if next time we see you at the party or the concert or at our seminar, we can talk more about this.

这是我的名片。

Here's my card.

你有电话号码吗？

Do you have a phone number?

你延续了联系。

You extend the contact.

以上就是这五个步骤。

Those are the five steps.

但有些情况，你提到害羞的人在学校、职场以及社交场合都会遇到困难。

But there are situations, and you mentioned that shy people have trouble at school and at work as well as social situations.

嗯，学校和职场其实不太需要闲聊和开启对话。

Well, school and work is not so much about small talk and starting conversations.

这更多是关于参与、提问、回答问题、举手这些害羞的人讨厌做的事情。

It's much more about participation, asking questions, answering questions, raising your hand, which, you know, shy people hate to do.

嗯，再次强调，人们需要意识到的是，他们总觉得自己一开口别人就会发现他们的无知或者会苛刻地评判他们。

Well, again, what people need to realize is that they think that if they say something, people are gonna find out what they don't know or that people are gonna judge them critically.

但实际情况是，当你在人群中发言、在讲座上提问时，人们并不会认为你知识匮乏。

What really happens is when you speak up in a crowd, when you ask a question at a lecture, people don't think that you're not very knowledgeable.

他们反而会觉得你很勇敢，因为你在做他们自己不愿意做的事情。

What they think is you're brave because you're doing something that they themselves aren't willing to do.

你要为他们创造机会。

And what you do is you create opportunities for them.

所以我们告诉害羞的人要主动站出来，因为你将帮助他人，而不仅仅是自己。

So we tell shy people step up because what you're going to do is you're going to help other people, not just yourself.

他们会对你有正面的评价，而不是负面的。

They're going to evaluate you favorably, not unfavorably.

举个例子，你去参加婚礼，每个人都想跳舞，但没人愿意第一个跳，因为他们觉得大家都在盯着自己、评判自己，直到某个勇敢的人站起来跳舞，然后大家才纷纷加入。

An example is you go to a wedding and everybody wants to dance, but nobody wants to be the first one because they think everybody is looking at them and judging them until some brave soul gets up and dance and then everybody goes out there and dances.

而第一个站出来跳舞的人，大家会感激你，因为是你让大家能玩得开心。

And what happens is the person who went out there first, they admire you for making it possible for them to have a good time.

所以当我参加婚礼时，我总是第一个下场跳舞，因为高中时很多女生都喜欢跳舞。

So when I'm at a wedding, I'm the first one out there to dance because when you're in high school, lots of high school girls like to dance.

但很少有高中男生喜欢跳舞。

Not many high school boys like to dance.

所以我读过的一本书说，如果你是个害羞的男孩，那就学跳舞吧。

So the the book I read said, you know, if you're a shy boy, learn to dance.

愿意去跳舞。

Be willing to dance.

你不需要跳得很好。

You don't have to be good.

你只需要愿意就行。

You just have to be willing.

这一点，可能是任何想认识女孩的高中生能听到的最好建议。

That and that is probably the the best advice any high school boy could hear if he wants to meet girls.

愿意去跳舞。

Be willing to dance.

伯纳多·卡杜奇是我们的嘉宾。

Bernardo Carducci has been my guest.

他是印第安纳大学东南分校害羞研究学院的主任，也是心理学教授。

He is the director of the Shyness Research Institute and professor of psychology at Indiana University Southeast.

这本书名为《轻松交谈的口袋指南》。

And the book is called the pocket guide to making successful small talk.

本集的节目说明中提供了这本书的链接。

There's a link to the book in the show notes for this episode.

如果你热爱布拉沃剧集、流行文化混乱和真诚的观点，那你一定想把《All About TRH》播客加入你的订阅列表。

If bravo drama, pop culture chaos, and honest takes are your love language, you'll want all about TRH podcast in your feed.

由罗克珊和尚塔尔主持，这档节目深入剖析《真实主妇》真人秀以及每个人在群聊中争论的精彩瞬间。

Hosted by Roxanne and Chantel, this show breaks down Real Housewives reality TV and the moments everyone's group chat is arguing about.

罗克珊自2010年起就开始爆料布拉沃的八卦。

Roxanne's been spilling Bravo tea since 2010.

是的，我们曾采访过像卢安伯爵夫人和特蕾莎·吉杜斯这样的主妇界传奇人物。

And yes, we've interviewed housewives royalty like Countess Luann and Teresa Giudice.

精辟的回顾、内幕氛围，毫无废话。

Smart recaps, insider energy, and zero fluff.

在Apple Podcasts、Spotify或你常用的平台收听《All About Terri H》播客。

Listen to All About Terri H Podcasts on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen.

每周更新新集。

New episodes weekly.

嗨，我是《最短最长的时间》的希拉里·弗兰克，这是一档获奖播客，主题是育儿和生殖健康。

Hey, it's Hillary Frank from The Longest Shortest Time, an award winning podcast about parenthood and reproductive health.

我们会讨论性教育、避孕、怀孕、身体自主权，当然还有各个年龄段的孩子。

We talk about things like sex ed, birth control, pregnancy, bodily autonomy, and, of course, kids of all ages.

但你并不需要是个父母才能收听。

But you don't have to be a parent to listen.

如果你喜欢关于人际关系以及——你知道的——月经的出人意料、幽默又感人的故事，那么《最短最长的时间》就是为你准备的。

If you like surprising, funny, poignant stories about human relationships and, you know, periods, the longest shortest time is for you.

你可以在任何播客应用中找到我们，或者访问 longestshortesttime.com。

Find us in any podcast app or at longestshortesttime.com.

每年，人们都会制定新年决心，但每年大多数都会失败。

Every year, people make New Year's resolutions, and every year, most of them fail.

这其中有很多原因。

And there are a lot of reasons why that is.

一个主要原因是，你可能贪多嚼不烂。

A big reason is probably because you bit off too much.

你决定自己的新年目标是更健康、吃得更好、开始锻炼，或者多花时间陪伴家人。

You decided that your resolution was to be healthier or to eat better or start to exercise or spend more time with a family.

这些都是值得追求的目标，但同时也过于宏大和模糊。

All worthy goals, but also very big and very vague.

因此，当我们进入新年的第一周时，这些目标就开始失败并逐渐被遗忘。

So now that we're about a week into the new year, resolutions start to fail and fade away.

这就是为什么我想向你介绍卡罗琳·阿诺德，因为她有一种更好的方法。

That's why I'd like to introduce you to Caroline Arnold because she has a better way.

她没有设定那些常常失败的宏大目标，而是发现了微目标的力量。

Rather than making these big resolutions that often fail, she has discovered the power of micro resolutions.

卡罗琳·阿诺德在华尔街担任科技领导者已有十多年，管理过金融界一些规模最大的软件开发团队。

Caroline Arnold has been a technology leader on Wall Street for more than a decade, managing some of the financial world's largest software development teams.

她曾荣获《华尔街与科技》创新奖，并担任一家领先华尔街投资银行的董事总经理。

She's a recipient of the Wall Street and Technology Award for Innovation, and she serves as managing director at a leading Wall Street investment bank.

她还著有一本书，名为《小行动：用微目标永久改变你的生活》。

She is also the author of a book called Small Move, Using Micro Resolutions to Transform Your Life Permanently.

嗨，卡罗琳。

Hi, Caroline.

欢迎。

Welcome.

那么，什么是微决心呢？

So what is a micro resolution?

我认为这是一种关键的行为转变，能对你的个人或职业生活产生显著影响。

I would say it's a pivotal shift in behavior that will have an outsized impact on your personal or professional life.

它非常具体。

It's highly specific.

它很简单，意味着你知道自己能做到。

It's easy, which means you know that you can do it.

它比普通的新年决心具体得多，而新年决心往往更像是一种愿望，而不是切实的行动决心。

And it's much more specific than the regular New Year's resolution, which tends to be closer to a wish than a resolution to action.

比如‘要更有条理’，这其实只是‘希望’自己更有条理。

Something like to be organized is actually a wish to be organized.

这与你要做的具体事情无关。

It doesn't have anything to do with specific things you're going to do.

而是一种高度针对性的行为改变，你可以调动意志力去推动它实现。

But a highly targeted behavioral change that you can marshal your willpower to push through.

但这种小改变不必须是更大改变的一部分吗？因为如果你只是做了一个小改变，比如不追求整体整理，而只是整理了一个抽屉，那又怎样呢？

But doesn't that small change have to be part of a bigger change because if you just make a small change, well fine, you know, instead of getting organized, you organize one drawer.

你确实整理了那个抽屉，但接下来呢？

Well, you've organized that drawer but that's it and now what?

不，不是这样的。

Well, no.

微目标的一个规则是，它能立即带来回报。

A micro resolution, one of the rules of a micro resolution is it carries it pays off upfront.

你从这个目标中获得的，就是你所能得到的全部。

What you're gonna get is what you're gonna get from that resolution.

所以，如果我想变得更整洁，而我要做的就是在上班前整理床铺，而我以前从没这么做过，那这就是我所能得到的全部。

So if I wanna be neater and what I'm gonna do is make my bed before I go to work and I've never done that before, that's what I get.

那就是我的成功。

That's my success.

如果你告诉自己：好吧，但我并不是100%整洁，你每天都可以这样对自己说，然后觉得自己是个失败者。

If you tell yourself, Okay, but I'm not 100% neat, you can tell yourself that every day and tell yourself you're a failure.

或者你可以告诉自己：我要学会做这一件事，这就是我所获得的回报。

Or you can say, I'm going to learn to do this one thing, and that's what I'm going to get in exchange.

如果我在一段关系中改变了行为，并在某个特定方面让互动变得更好，这就是我今天获得的收益。

If I shift my behavior in a relationship and I have interactions that are better in one specific way, that's a benefit I get today.

不是将来某天的收益，而是今天就能得到的东西。

Not a someday benefit, but something that comes today.

那你要怎么做呢？

So how do you do that?

你怎么把一个宏大的目标，比如我要整理好、我要变健康、我要更健康，变成一个微小的承诺？

How do you take a big resolution like I'm going to get organized or I'm going to get fit or I'm going to be healthier?

你如何将它转化为一个微小的行动？

How do you take that and turn it into a micro resolution?