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我是梅根·拉皮诺。
Megan Rapinoe here.
本周在《深入一点》节目中，我们将打开听众来信，回答你们的问题，比如：作为运动员最大的遗憾是什么，苏的漂亮开衫是从哪里买的，以及我们喜欢怎样的旅行方式？
This week on a touch more, we're opening up the mailbag and answering your questions like, what's our biggest regret as athletes, and where does Sue get her great cardigans, and how do we like to travel?
请关注《深入一点》最新一期节目，您可以在播客平台和YouTube上收听观看。
Check out the latest episode of A Touch More where we get your podcasts and on YouTube.
本周《净值与放松》节目，我们邀请到了全能演员、导演兼活动家索菲亚·布什。
This week on Net Worth and Chill, we're joined by Sophia Bush, the powerhouse actor, director, and activist.
从《篮球兄弟》中的突破性角色到成为投资人，索菲亚完美掌握了将才华转化为持久财富的艺术，同时从未妥协过自己的价值观。
From her breakout role on One Tree Hill to becoming an investor, Sophia has mastered the art of turning talent into lasting wealth while never compromising her values.
她坦诚分享了二十多岁时犯过的财务错误，以及如何在好莱坞男性主导圈中学会谈判。
She gets real about the financial mistakes she made in her twenties and how she learned to negotiate in Hollywood's boys club.
我们深入探讨了她如何按照自己的方式建立财务独立。
We dive deep into how she's building financial independence on her own terms.
准备好聆听这场关于金钱、权力的直白对话，了解在保持真我的同时实现财富自由的真正含义。
Get ready for an unfiltered conversation about money, power, and what it really means to get rich while staying true to yourself.
您可以在任意播客平台收听，或在youtube.com/yourrichbff观看视频。
Listen wherever you get your podcasts or watch on youtube.com/yourrichbff.
欢迎收听《流行乐开关》。
Welcome to Switched on Pop.
我是创作歌手查理·哈丁。
I'm songwriter Charlie Harding.
查理·普斯是旋律天才、钢琴巫师兼制作大师——他曾在伯克利音乐学院专攻音乐制作（需要说明的是，我是该校的副教授）。
Charlie Puth is a melody savant, a wizard on the piano and a master of production, which he studied at Berkeley College of Music, where full disclosure, I'm an associate professor.
普斯最初凭借2015年的《See You Again》等歌曲崭露头角。
Puth first broke out with songs like twenty fifteen's See You Again.
哦，等再见面时我会告诉你一切。
Oh, I'll tell you all about it when I see you again.
随后又以2018年的歌曲《Attention》震撼全球。
And grabbed the world by the collar with his 2018 song, Attention.
你只是想要关注。
You just want attention.
你并不想要我的心。
You don't want my heart.
在最新专辑《Whatever's Clever》的宣传期间，普斯以'普斯教授'的头衔分享了不少音乐知识。
Now in the rollout to his latest album, Whatever's Clever, Puth has been sharing some musical knowledge under the honorific Professor Puth.
音乐学家Nate Sloan博士——真正的教授——上次与普斯对话是一年前。
Musicologist, Doctor Nate Sloan, the real professor, last spoke with Puth a year ago.
但我想请普斯回来接受挑战，看他是否真的配得上这个头衔。
But I wanted to bring Puth back to challenge him and see if he's really earned the title.
同时也想聊聊他最新单曲《Changes》中闪亮的八十年代风格。
And to hear about the shiny eighties sound all over his latest single, Changes.
以下是我与查理·普斯的对话。
Here's my conversation with Charlie Puth.
查理，感谢你参加《Switched on Pop》节目。
Charlie, thank you for joining me on Switched on Pop.
非常感谢
I appreciate
它。
it.
这是我的荣幸。
It's my pleasure.
谢谢你为我们弹奏钢琴。
And thank you for playing some piano for us.
是啊。
Yeah.
你
You
有一首新歌叫《变化》。
have a new song out called Changes.
是的。
Yes.
我想听听看。
I wanna take a listen to it.
我还想了解你正在经历的一些变化。
And I wanna hear about some of the changes that you're going through.
好的。
Okay.
我喜欢这些音箱。
I love these speakers.
我用这些混音。
I mix these on.
我把'哦'混在一起了。
I mix the Oh.
是啊。
Yeah.
哦，有意思。
Oh, interesting.
对。
Yeah.
这正是它应有的翻译方式。
This is exactly how it should translated.
NS-10音箱。
NS tens.
对吧？
Right?
没错。
Yeah.
这些是当代Aventone版的NS-10音箱。
These these are the contemporary Aventone versions of the NS tens.
著名的雅马哈NS-10音箱已经停产了。
The the famous Yamaha NS tens are out of production.
哦。
Oh.
好吧，行。
Well, Okay.
嗯，它们听起来一模一样。
Well, they sound exactly the same.
上次你参加《Switched on Pop》节目时，和我的同事Nate聊了《Hero》这首歌，相比之下那是个相当简约的作品。
So the last that you were on Switched on Pop, you chatted with my colleague Nate about the song Hero, which in contrast is a quite sort of minimalist production.
而我觉得在《Changes》这首歌里，所有元素都满溢而出。
And I feel like here on Changes, everything is overflowing.
背景里甚至有个福音合唱团。
There's literally like a gospel choir in the background.
是啊。
Yeah.
你觉得Maxima的制作如何支撑了这首歌的主题？
How do you feel like this Maxima's production is supporting the message of the song?
这首歌很符合我当下的生活状态。
Well, this song aligns with my life right now.
之前我总想着：最好赶紧发首歌。
And before I was like, better put a song out.
但我心底有个声音在说：不行。
And I in the back of my mind, was like, no.
你根本还没想清楚要做什么。
Don't have any idea what you're doing yet.
你完全不知道未来会发生什么。
You have no idea what's coming.
你必须先好好生活，别急着做音乐——这就是整张专辑诞生的过程。
You have to live life first and not rush the music and that's how this whole album came about.
我不得不更深入地审视自己，然后旋律就自然而然地出现了。
I had to take a closer look at myself and then melody happened after.
所以这张专辑最初其实与音乐毫无关联。
So this album started from a very non musical place.
有哪些变化？
What are the changes?
嗯，最明显的变化就是《Congratulations》这首歌里我要当爸爸了。
Well, the obvious changes are that I'm gonna be a dad in Congratulations.
谢谢。
Thank you.
太激动了。
So exciting.
在三月份。
In March.
但变化中蕴含着许多深层次的改变。
But there's a lot of changes loaded into changes.
这首歌其实是关于一段友谊的终结。
The song is actually about the end of a friendship.
这让我确信，人们第一次听歌时其实不会认真听歌词——就像我一样。
And it just affirms to me that, like, people, like, don't really listen to the lyrics, like, on first listen, like me.
比如我从来不会在第一次听歌时就关注歌词。
Like, I never listen to the lyrics on first listen.
我是那种会把歌词研究七遍的人。
I'm a I'm a lyrics seventh person.
歌词对我来说是第十首。
Lyrics a hundred and tenth for me.
它们变得如此基础和重要。
They become so essential and important.
是啊。
Yeah.
但这需要时间，就像，我被旋律、副歌、以及所有那些甜蜜的小点缀所吸引。
But it takes a second, like, I'm so brought in by melody, by hooks, by all of the little sweet air candy and things you put in there.
然后当歌词击中你时，你会恍然大悟。
And then it's like, once the lyrics hit you, you're like, oh.
对某些人来说，歌词是第一位的。
For some people, lyrics are first.
没错。
Yeah.
你说得对。
You Right.
牛排
The steak is
三分钟就好。
done in three minutes.
但对我来说，这更像是厚切肉。
But for for me, it's like, it's a a really like thick cut.
我无法——这是块厚切牛肉，需要时间腌制。
I can't it's a thick cut of beef and like it takes time to marinate.
是啊。
Yeah.
对。
Right.
没错。
Right.
但这首歌其实讲的是友谊的终结，你不知道它为何结束，可能是好事，也可能是坏事。
But the song is actually about the end of a friendship and you don't know why it ends, but it might be a good thing, it might be a bad thing.
你确实不知道原因。
You you don't really know why.
嗯。
Mhmm.
这首歌是个巨大的问号，而'变化'本身是个非常多层次的概念。
The song is a big question mark and changes is a very multilayered kind of thing.
也许这就是为什么这首歌里也有这么多不同的声音。
Maybe that's why there's so many sounds in the song too.
这里展现的是一个成长的过程，我是这样理解第一句歌词的。
There's a there's a there's a growing up which is happening here and how I heard that first line.
让我先播放一小段听听。
And let me just play it for a second, actually.
那段歌词讲的是'事情已经变了'。
That verse is about the things have changed.
已经和过去不一样了。
It's not how it used to be.
你通过不断重复‘tuck’这个词让它变得有趣。
And you make it fun by repeating the tuck and the tuck and the tuck.
我很伤心，但真的如此吗？
I'm sad, but am I really not?
这常常是我们必须表现出的情绪，就像‘嘿，好久不见’时那样。
Which is often the emotion that we have to put on when it's like, hey, I haven't seen you in a while.
我们进行着寒暄，而你则强颜欢笑。
We're doing the small talk and you're like putting the smile on.
是啊。
Yeah.
就好像，我们真的认识彼此吗？
It's like, did we ever know each other?
真的吗？
Really?
嗯。
Yeah.
但这首歌听起来很欢快，所以它不必——甚至根本不算悲伤。
But it's a happy sounding song, so it doesn't have to be all it's it's not even sad.
我只是...我不会用‘悲伤’来形容它。
I I just I wouldn't describe it as sad.
也许我之前说错了。
Maybe I was wrong saying that.
它更像是某种忧郁的情绪。
I it's more like melancholic in a way.
令人怀旧的。
Reminiscent.
令人怀旧的。
Reminiscent.
是啊。
Yeah.
是啊。
Yeah.
这首歌深深融入了八十年代成人流行音乐的音效，我觉得。
The song leans heavily into the sounds of, I think of like, adult pop music of the nineteen eighties.
没错。
Yeah.
五系里的磁带。
Tate cassette in the five series.
正是如此。
Exactly.
你的车里闻起来像洒了的咖啡。
Your Car smells like spilled coffee.
想到菲尔·柯林斯、彼得·加布里埃尔这些人。
Thinking of Phil Collins, Peter Gabriel Yeah.
莱昂纳尔·里奇。
Lionel Richie.
我想到的是像休·帕顿和特雷弗那样的制作风格。
I think about the productions of like Hugh Patton and Trevor
号角。
Horn.
绝对。
Absolutely.
最近八十年代风格确实很火，但更多是作为一种元素存在。
The eighties have been really big recently, but maybe kind of more as like an element.
我想到了那个‘嗯哼’。
I think of the Mhmm.
也许是《Blinding Lights》里的军鼓和合成器音效。
Maybe the snare drum and synths on Blinding Lights.
或者《Kiss Me More》采样版的‘当然’。
Or Kiss Me More sample Sure.
混入了奥莉维亚·纽顿-约翰的风格。
Interpolates Olivia Newton John.
但是
But
这就像...你确实在追求一种如今很少听到的声音。
this is like, you're really going for a sound that actually I don't hear a lot today.
嗯，我觉得我创作的任何作品都必然源自某些东西。
Well, I think anything I make is always going to be derived from something.
任何人创作的作品都是如此——无论是整体音效还是歌词，在我看来总有可以借鉴之处。
Anything that anyone makes is gonna be whether it be the overall sound like the lyric, it might be there's always something to borrow from in my opinion, that is.
但我甚至不会把这首歌描述为...我觉得大多数人很容易直接称它为完全的八十年代制作，但如果我们仔细分析，它更像是音乐人和制作人在九十年代转型期的探索。
But I wouldn't even describe this song as a I think it's very easy for most to like call it a complete eighties production but I think if we were to really zoom in on it, it's almost like the point in time where producers and musicians were trying to figure out where to go in the nineties.
比如，如果这是1989年10月发布的，而这里有一款全新的设备和一个品牌，还有2009年9月的型号——虽然我觉得它其实是87年推出的——但这台鼓机。
Like, if this came out in October 1989 and there's a brand new piece of gear and a brand in the and and a 09/2009, which I think came out in '87, but this Drum machine.
鼓机，对。
Drum yeah.
一台鼓机，就像新设备一样，而且
A drum machine like new pieces of gear and
是啊。
Yeah.
Pro Tools的前身是Sound Tools。
Pro Tools formerly sound tools.
就像你可以更数字化地录制东西，然后通过模拟调音台处理，突然就有了更大的动态余量。
It's like you could record things even more digitally and like run them through the analog desk and you had more headroom suddenly.
在我看来，1990年的唱片和1989年的唱片确实有本质区别。
It's there's a real difference between a 1990 record and a 1989 record, in my opinion.
清晰度差别太大了。
So much difference of clarity.
绝对如此。
Absolutely.
你听听这些唱片，有些我认为它参考的作品，就会觉得‘哦，听起来格局小了些’。
You listen to this, some of the records that I think this references and you're like, oh, it feels smaller.
冲击力没那么强。
It punch as hard.
而这纯粹是因为技术变革。
And it's just because of changes in technology.
举个例子，听听麦当娜的《Get Into the Groove》，然后和《is a》比较一下
To bring up an example, listen to Get Into the Groove by Madonna and compare it to is a
像谜一样。
Like a mystery.
祈祷。
Prayer.
像祈祷一样。
Like a prayer.
《Like a Prayer》和《Oh》分别是什么时候发行的？
When did Like a Prayer come out versus Oh.
《Get Into the Groove》呢？
Get Into the Groove?
《Into the Groove》是85年的。
So Into the Groove is '85.
《Like a prayer》是1989年。
Like a prayer, 1989.
3月19日，没错。
March 19 Yes.
89年。
'9.
哦
Oh
天啊。
my god.
我脸上都起鸡皮疙瘩了。
I got, like, face chills.
这类歌曲的歌词内容根本不重要。
These are one of those songs that, like, didn't even matter what they wrote in the verse.
副歌部分简直太棒了。
The chorus is just so good.
我是说，它基本也是从那里开始的，这点我很喜欢。
I mean, it basically starts right there too, which I love.
好的。
Okay.
先在脑海里记住这段，然后听《Okay》。
So, like, copy that in your mind and then listen to Okay.
像祈祷一样。
Like a prayer.
太多了
So much
更宽广、更干净、更清晰。
wider, cleaner, crisper.
你完全可以在调音台上塞进更多乐器。
You could fit more instruments literally into into the board.
他们更懂得如何用好老设备了。
They figured out how to use the older equipment better.
《Changes》可不像1981年的唱片。
Changes is not like a 1981 record.
这更像是1989年和2026年的唱片风格。
It's more of like a 1989, 2026 record.
因为我觉得2020年的音乐听起来和2026年完全不同。
Because I feel like music in 2020 sounds completely different than 2026 in my opinion.
那么具体有哪些不同呢？
Well, what are some of those differences?
实际上我感觉音乐变得更湿润了。
I actually feel like things have gotten a little wetter.
混响更多了。
More reverb.
就像...
Like, there was
2020年有首TikTok热曲。
this TikTok song in 2020.
像是'在我房间里跳舞'那种感觉。
It was like dancing in my room.
我不确定。
I don't know.
我不原谅自己。
I don't forgive me.
我不记得歌手是谁了。
I don't remember who the artist was.
我记得鼓声非常非常干涩。
I remember the drums being really, really dry.
对。
Right.
这位艺术家是347 Aiden。
The artist is three four seven Aiden.
现在你听到的是Conan Gray和Olivia Rodrigo的歌。
And now you hear a a Conan Gray song and Olivia Rodrigo song.
因为我不确定，整首歌都浸透了混响效果。
It's drenched in reverb because I don't know.
这就是你如何通过风格化手法释放情感的。
It's just stylistically how you get the emotion out.
你从这些时代汲取了哪些最具代表性的声音元素？
What are some of the sounds of these eras that you're drawing from
嗯。
Mhmm.
哪些是你最想尝试的共鸣音色？
That are most resonant that you wanted to play with?
我觉得林鼓永远是标配。
Oh, mean, I think the Lind drum is forever a staple.
前几天我在听John Merritt的《New Light》，他制作过一张没有署名的唱片。
I was listening to New Light by John Merritt the other day, and he had a record he produced with no ID.
那首歌的底鼓部分——我猜应该用了真鼓组加上房间麦克风，然后叠加了林鼓底鼓、军鼓和拍手音效。
And the base of that, there there I'm assuming there's a real drum kit probably with the room mics and then there's a Lynn kick and snare and a Lynn clap.
那张专辑发行于2019年，然后你听听看——那首Prince的歌叫什么来着？
That record came out in 2019 and then you listen to the the what's what's the Prince song?
1999年。
1999.
99年的歌，其实是82年发行的，你听到的Lynn拍手声只是稍作处理，或许根本没变。
'99, which came out in '82, and you hear the same Lynn claps just processed a little bit differently, or maybe they're not.
我喜欢听2025年发行的歌，然后找出它与八十年代音乐的相似之处。
I like hearing a song that came out in 2025 and and drawing the similarities to, like, something that happened in the eighties.
嗯。
Mhmm.
甚至像罗德·斯图尔特的《你觉得我性感吗》这样的唱片。
Even records from, like, if you listen to Do You Think I'm Sexy by Rod Stewart.
那首歌进入了迪斯科时代，但你能感觉到制作人在思考，我们要进入一个新时代了。
That's going into the disco era, but you can feel the producer trying to figure out, like, we're going into a new era.
我们该何去何从？
Where do we go?
突然有了这么多新设备。
There's all this new equipment.
我们还要用真军鼓吗？
Are we still are we gonna use a real snare?
还是要把这个新到的Lynn设备混进去用？
Are we gonna blend it with this new Lynn thing that we just got?
没错。
Like Right.
你能感受到这张唱片正迈向九十年代，而我希望《变化》这首歌能让人感觉是在走向2026年。
You can feel this record going into the nineties, and I wanted changes to feel like it was going into 2026.
我是说，《变化》这张专辑对我来说和《关注》完全不同，后者完全没有混响效果。
I mean, Change is such a different record for me than Attention was, which is just no reverb.
你就是
You just
这是我有史以来最喜欢的作品之一。
One of my favorite productions of all time.
我教这个。
I teach it.
我昨天教了两遍。
I taught it twice yesterday.
我超爱这首歌。
I love that song.
嗯，很多人都喜欢。
Well, a lot of people do.
这是副歌下沉的终极范例。
It's the ultimate example of the down chorus.
它完全颠覆了你的所有预期。
It is the thing that defies all your expectations.
第一次听的时候，我
The first time I heard it, I'm
心想，啥？
like, what?
我想这个灵感来自威肯的《Can't Feel My Face》。
I guess I got the idea from I Can't Feel My Face from The Weeknd.
哦，是的。
Oh, yeah.
我绝对不是那种反高潮式骤降音效的发明者。
I definitely wasn't the inventor of the anti climactic drop.
但是，但是
But But
它之所以有价值，是因为能抓住人们的注意力。
it earns it because you're grabbing someone's attention.
嗯，对于
Well, for
有段时间很多歌曲都采用反高潮骤降音效，但都集中在渐进浩室音乐里。
a while there, a lot of songs had the anti drop but it was all in progressive house music.
没错。
Right.
2014年前后那些渐进浩室音乐你随便听。
You'd listen to anything from like progressive house like 2014.
有首歌叫Martin Garrix的《Helicopter》。
There's a song called Martin Garrix Helicopter.
里面那些合成器音色美极了。
And it's just like these beautiful synths.
还有Nicky Romero标志性的强烈侧链压缩效果。
And the heavy Nicky Romero side chain.
是啊。
Yeah.
明明很干，却又带着湿意，但侧链让它显得干燥。
And just dry, but like also wet, but the side chain makes it feel dry.
对我来说，那就像是一个巨大的落差。
To me, that was an that that was like a like a big drop.
不过我们再多聊聊那些声音吧，我们得到了林德鼓。
Let's talk more about some of those sounds though that are so we got we got that Linde drum.
这种1989年末、八十年代末的风格还有其他标志性声音吗？
Any other characteristic sounds of this sort of 1989, late eighties thing?
可能这个叫什么来着？
Probably what's this called?
是克拉维节奏吗？
The clave?
对。
Yeah.
如果你在变化的最顶端演奏，是的。
If you play the very at the very top of changes Yeah.
就像一点小点缀。
It's just like a little perk.
声音非常轻。
It's really quiet.
你听听Gap乐队的歌。
You listen to gap band.
从这首歌里得到了加入那个元素的灵感。
Got the idea to put that in there from from this song.
他们会把它放在小军鼓上。
And they would they would put it over the snare drum.
里斯利兄弟也经常这么做。
Risley Brothers did that a lot too.
当然，后来纳斯还采样了这段声音。
And then, of course, Nas would later sample it.
我当时就想，哇。
And I was like, wow.
同时有小军鼓和克拉维节奏。
A snare and a clave at the same time.
我得加段克拉维节奏。
I gotta put a clave.
没错。
Yeah.
我的歌里就有克拉维节奏。
And my song boy has a clave.
我超爱克拉维节奏。
I love clave.
DOC有首歌叫《够不够放克》，里面用了很多克拉维节奏，因为Doctor J喜欢在节奏网格里加克拉维。
There's a song by the d o c called is it funky enough that has many claves because doctor j loved putting claves on the grid.
对。
Right.
我要... 你知道，其中有件事就是
I'm going And you know, one of things that
让我意识到我们正处在一个充满黑暗音乐的时代。
makes me realize we've been living in an era of a lot of sort of dark music.
很多时候为了给人声留出空间，就会过滤掉主要的音乐背景，是的。
A lot of in order to make room for the vocal, oftentimes just filtering out all of the main music bed Yeah.
而且它还在水下。
And it's underwater.
嗯。
Mhmm.
《变化》则完全相反。
Changes is the exact opposite.
克拉维节奏是明亮的。
The clave is bright.
所有元素都向前推进。
Everything is forward.
它直接怼在你脸上。
It's right in front of your face.
对。
Yeah.
因为——再说一次，现在做这种音乐的艺术家不止我一个，但我觉得当某种声音很罕见、只有少数艺术家在尝试时，这特别让人兴奋。
Because and again, I'm not the only artist doing this right now, but I just I I think it's exciting when I don't hear something and I only hear a few artists doing it.
比如奥黛丽·霍巴特现在做的音乐就很有冲击力。
Like, Audrey Hobart is making music right now that's like very in your face.
合成器的音量几乎和她的唱声一样大。
The synths are like almost as loud as her vocals.
嗯。
Mhmm.
她太棒了。
She's wonderful.
这里的音效非常酷。
Very cool sounds on here.
但你得告诉我《Changes》这首歌的改动。
You gotta tell me though about the changes in Changes.
当然。
Sure.
发生什么事了？
What's going on?
那里有什么变化？
What are the changes there?
哦，你是指核心改动？
Oh, you mean the core changes?
哦，对。
Oh, yeah.
如果你有首歌叫《Changes》而你是Charlie Puth，人们当然想听这些变化。
If you have a song called Changes and you're Charlie Puth, people wanna hear about the changes.
其实Bloodpop——就是和我一起做这张专辑的人——特别有意思，他会在我加载音效时设计游戏。
Well, it's Bloodpop is so who I made the record with, is so funny because he'll be designing a game while I'm loading up sounds.
比如他会把电脑放这儿，真的在写游戏代码，就像《堡垒之夜》那种，他自己版本的《堡垒之夜》。
Like, he will have his computer here and just be literally writing code for a game like a like Fortnite, like his own version of Fortnite.
他是
He was
比如，我现在正在做这个游戏。
like, I'm making this game right now.
他是个天才。
He's a genius.
但他会说，好吧，我们开始工作吧。
But he'll be like, okay, let's get to work.
所以他会把游戏窗口放在这边写代码，然后在窗口另一边打开Ableton，我觉得他是故意这样做的，以免过度思考。
So he'll put the game window over here for all the code and then he'll pull up Ableton on the other side of his window and he'll just I think he does it on purpose so he doesn't overthink.
他就直接拖放采样。
He'll just drag and drop samples.
然后
And
这是一个非常笨拙但良好的变化开端，我听到的完全没有力度变化。
it was a very good clunky start of changes and I heard nothing had velocity.
听起来就像是他正在拖放并处理的采样，我还听到了吉他声。
It just sounded like drag and drop samples that he was like manipulating and and I heard that guitar.
我当时就想，糟了。
And I was like, uh-oh.
需要加几个挂留和弦。
Needs a couple of suspended chords.
那里的不和谐音。
The dissonance there.
然后当我那么做时，他站起来说了声‘好吃’。
And then when I did that, he stood up and was like, yum.
他喜欢东西时就会说‘好吃’。
He says yum when he likes things.
他站了起来，而我不知道这些和弦的名字。
And he stood up and I don't know the names of these chords.
然后他说，为了前副歌部分，有些地方需要改变。
It's And then he was like, some something has to change for the, pre chorus.
我显然很喜欢菲尔·柯林斯。
And I love Phil Collins, obviously.
菲尔总会在前副歌部分转到小调二级和弦，尤其是在他个人专辑《对不起，我得走了》里。
And Phil always went to the minor two for pre chorus, especially on his own Sorry I Must Be Going.
而且Blood也不知道这些和弦的名字。
And Blood doesn't know the name of the chords either Yeah.
但我之前弹错了。
But I was playing something wrong before.
我当时弹得很糟糕，他就说‘不行’。
I was doing something lame, like he was like, no.
需要让人感觉还没结束。
It's like it needs to feel like you're not done yet.
嗯。
Mhmm.
我当时就想，那种‘还没结束’的感觉听起来是什么样的？
And I was like, what is what is feeling like like you're not done yet sound like?
然后
And
我然后然后然后我就开始即兴演唱，连歌词都没写，实际上只是在对着麦克风咕哝。
I and and and I just started playing without a lyric written, and then I'm just mumbling things into this microphone actually.
然后我就本能地表现得像是陷入了某种状态。
And I just instinctually was just like, in a lot.
然后他站起来说，发生了一些变化。
And he stood up and was like, there's been some changes.
真的，事情就是这样发生的。
That's that that's literally how it went.
我当时就问，发生了一些变化？
I was like, there's been some changes?
我们就说，是啊。
We're like, yeah.
你结婚了。
You got married.
发生了一些变化。
There's been some changes.
然后我唱道，发生了一些变化，然后他就说，不对。
And I sang it like, there's been some changes in And he was like, no.
要唱得像有50人的合唱团在你身后那样。
Do it like like a 50 person choirs behind you.
发生了一些
There's been some
变化。
changes.
发生了一些变化。
There's been some changes.
然后当我那样做时，我们俩就开始了，然后我们几乎是一气呵成地写出了整段副歌。
And then when I did that, we both set off and then we wrote the whole chorus in like one shot.
你最近一直在努力将钢琴独奏重新带回流行音乐中。
You've been working hard recently in bringing back the piano solo into pop music.
嗯。
Mhmm.
我喜欢这张唱片里的钢琴独奏。
I love the piano solo on this record.
它让你想起布鲁斯·霍恩斯比的风格，就是那种感觉。
It reminds you Feels very in the language of like Bruce Hornsby, the way it is.
哦，是的。
Oh, yeah.
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那正是我们当时在听的。
That's exactly what we were listening to.
我们当时听了很多东西，但
We were listening to a bunch of stuff, but
这些变化很不错。
Those are some good changes.
我想我们实际上把它发给了布鲁斯·霍恩斯比。
The I think we actually sent it to Bruce Hornsby.
我们把这首歌发给布鲁斯·霍恩斯比后，他听了并通过我们的联系人回复邮件说，这太棒了，但我不知道还能添加什么。
We sent the song to Bruce Hornsby, and he heard it and wrote an email back from our contact and and he said, this is wonderful but I don't know what I could add to this.
听起来已经完成了，这让我有些失望，因为我本想请布鲁斯·霍恩斯比参与改编。但后来我意识到，这正体现了真正的音乐素养——懂得何时该退后。
This sounds done, which I was disappointed because I was like, oh, I wanna put Bruce Hornsby on changes but that was I I realized that's like true musicianship when you know when to stay back.
嗯。
Mhmm.
他的意思是：我为什么要重新弹奏这段钢琴部分？
He was like, I why would I replay this piano part?
听起来已经完成了。
It sounds done.
所以这算是他给予的非常美好的称赞。
That so that was a very nice compliment from him.
部分原因在于它精准捕捉了那个时刻的音色特质，那种清脆明亮的质感，很有雅马哈钢琴的感觉。
Part of it is just that it it captures a bit of the tone of that moment, that really crisp bright, feels like a Yamaha piano.
你还记得那些CD吗？
You remember the the what are the CDs?
谜乐团？
Enigma?
那是专门为让人放松而创作的音乐。
It was music made to make you relax.
里面有宏大的合唱团声效。
It was like big choirs.
哦，《纯粹心境》。
Oh, Pure Moods.
《纯净心境》？
Pure Moods?
是《纯净心境》吗？
It was it Pure Moods?
哦，没关系。
Oh, that's okay.
我觉得是《纯净心境》
Pure Moods was the I think
就是《纯净心境》。
it was Pure Moods.
我们是从哪儿听到《谜》的？
Where did we get Enigma?
不是。
No.
不是。
No.
不是。
No.
那是...那是唱片的名字。
That's the that's the name of the record.
《纯净心境》是那张合辑专辑的名字，而你想到的是《谜》乐队的《回归纯真》。
Pure Moods was the album, the compilation album, and you're thinking of Return to Innocence by Enigma.
《谜》。
Enigma.
这首歌的创作初衷是，就像你下班开车回家时听的音乐。
It's made to, like, you're driving back from work music.
对。
Yeah.
正是这种感觉开启了整张专辑的创作。
That's what kind of kicked off this whole record.
它并非特指某一首歌，也不是布鲁斯·霍恩斯比的某首作品，而是那种在科技尚不发达年代，唱片带给人的感觉——那时你无法实时知道十万人在做什么。
It's not a song specifically, not a Bruce Hornsby song specifically but just the feeling of what those records did when there was a little less technology, you didn't know what a 100,000 people were doing at once.
当你打电话说'八点见'，对方就真的会在八点等你。
When you called somebody and said I'll be over at eight and you were expected to go over at eight.
那时没有短信。
There were no text messages.
虽然也有科技，但手机像砖头一样笨重。
It's just there was technology but they were like bricks of cell phones and Sure.
那时生活还有些许宁静。
There was a bit of peace.
现在唯一的宁静时刻，就是飞机上没有WiFi，你不得不关机的时候。
The only peace you have now is when you don't have WiFi on your airplane and you have no choice but to turn off.
其实那个年代我们也不得不关机——这些我都经历过。
We also had no choice to turn off back then and I lived through that too.
但我也见证了科技曙光，以及它给音乐带来的积极影响。
But then I also saw the dawn of technology and how that affected music in a good way too.
不过我现在做的音乐，应该说这张专辑，是让你放空思绪的音乐。
But the music I'm making now, this album I would say kinda is turn your mind off music.
合唱团开始演唱了。
It's got that choir going.
是啊。
Yeah.
那些合唱团的人在唱歌。
That choir people singing.
合唱团直到最后才出现。
That choir came at the very, very end.
它最初其实是AI生成的。
It actually started out as AI.
有个叫Replay的程序，我对着它唱...我可以构建...我不是唯一能做到的人，但我可以...我可以从这里开始构建吗？
There's a program called Replay, and I sang into I I just I I I can build I'm not the only one who can do this, but I can I can build out the I start up here?
改变，改变，再改变。
Changes, changes, changes.
我通过调整自己的声音，让它听起来像合唱团里的很多人。
And I kind of manipulated my voice to sound like a lot of people in a choir.
生活中的改变。
Changes in a life.
人生的变迁。
Changes in a life.
打个哈欠，让声音听起来更开阔些。
Just yawn and like, you know, make your voice a little wider.
改变我们的人生。
Changes our life.
然后翻倍，再返回
And then double that, go back and
我们生活中的变化。
Changes in our life.
接着我把所有人声单轨都通过合唱效果器处理，听起来就像合唱团。
And then I took every mono vocal track and ran it through this choir setting and it sounded like a choir.
对。
Yeah.
然后我们找了个真正的合唱团，叠录在
And then we got a real choir and layered it on top of
假合唱团上面。
the fake choir.
听起来真的很像
Really sounds like
合唱团。
a choir.
我本来打算去掉AI合唱部分，但它产生了特别效果。
And I I thought I was gonna take out the AI choir, but it just did something.
就像Steely Dan当年录长笛时做的那样——有种升华感。
It like lifted a it's like what Steely Dan used to do when they recorded a flute.
他们会在长笛音下面垫个正弦波。
They would put a little sine wave under the flute.
真奇妙。
Fascinating.
嗯。
Mhmm.
本节目由Odoo赞助播出。
Support for this show comes from Odoo.
经营企业本就不易，何必再用十几个互不兼容的应用给自己添麻烦？
Running a business is hard enough, so why make it harder with a dozen different apps that don't talk to each other?
隆重推出Odoo。
Introducing Odoo.
这是您唯一需要的商业软件。
It's the only business software you'll ever need.
这是一个全功能集成平台，让您的客户关系管理、财务、库存、电商等工作更轻松。
It's an all in one fully integrated platform that makes your work easier CRM, accounting, inventory, ecommerce, and more.
最棒的是？
And the best part?
Odoo能以极低成本替代多个昂贵平台。
Odoo replaces multiple expensive platforms for a fraction of the cost.
这就是为什么已有数千家企业选择转型。
That's why over thousands of businesses have made the switch.
您还在等什么？
So why not you?
立即免费试用Odoo，请访问odoo.com。
Try Odoo for free at odoo dot com.
网址是0d00.com。
That's 0d00.com.
本节目由Odoo赞助播出。
Support for this show comes from Odoo.
经营企业本就不易，何必再用十几个互不相通的软件给自己添堵？
Running a business is hard enough, so why make it harder with a dozen different apps that don't talk to each other?
隆重介绍Odoo。
Introducing Odoo.
这是您唯一需要的商业软件。
It's the only business software you'll ever need.
这是一个全功能集成平台，让您的工作更轻松。
It's an all in one fully integrated platform that makes your work easier.
涵盖客户关系管理、财务、库存、电商等全方位功能。
CRM, accounting, inventory, ecommerce, and more.
最棒的是？
And the best part?
Odoo能以极低成本替代多个昂贵平台。
Odoo replaces multiple expensive platforms for a fraction of the cost.
这就是数千家企业选择转型的原因。
That's why over thousands of businesses have made the switch.
您还在等什么？
So why not you?
立即登录odoo.com免费试用。
Try Odoo for free at odoo.com.
网址是0d00.com。
That's 0d00.com.
拥有智能家居是个很酷的想法，但前景有点令人望而生畏。
Having a smart home is a cool idea, but kind of a daunting prospect.
你得决定买哪些设备，如何把它们全部连接起来。
You have to figure out which devices to buy, how to connect them all together.
这一切都太复杂了。
It's all just a lot.
但在Vergecast的两周里，我们正试图简化这一切
But for two weeks on the Vergecast, we're trying to simplify all
。
of it.
我们要
We're gonna
花些时间回答你们关于智能家居的所有问题，然后我们会逐个房间探索一栋真实的房子，我自己的房子，
spend some time answering all of your questions about the smart home, and then we're gonna go room by room through a real house, my real house,
并尝试找出
and try to figure out
如何让它变智能，以及如何让所有这些智能化变得合理。
how to make it smart and how to make all of that smart make sense.
所有这些内容及更多精彩，尽在Vergecast，你可以在任何播客平台收听。
All of that and much more on the vergecast wherever you get podcasts.
本特别系列由家得宝赞助播出。
This special series is presented by The Home Depot.
你给我们展示了很多非常有趣的音乐，真的非常有趣。
You've been showing us a lot of really fun some really fun music.
在网络上，你一直以普斯教授的身份出现。
On the Internet, you've been going as Professor Puth.
是啊。
Yeah.
现在穿得有点像了。
Now Kinda dressed like it now
也是。
too.
非常帅气。
Very handsome.
谢谢。
Thanks.
我们想确认你是实至名归获得这个头衔的。
We wanna confirm that you've properly earned this title.
你知道，我同事内特拥有博士学位，他是南加大的教授。
You know, my colleague Nate has PhD, he's a professor at USC.
没错。
Yeah.
我在纽约大学和伯克利音乐学院任教。
I profess at NYU and at Berkley College of Music.
虽然我们的机构没有赋予我们任何权力，但通过播客的力量...嗯哼。
Our institutions have bestowed zero power upon us, but with the powers of podcasting Mhmm.
我们要确保你已经通过了《流行切换》的资格考试。
We wanna make sure that you've passed your Switched On Pop qualifying exam.
哦，天哪。
Oh, boy.
这就是我失败的地方。
This is where I fail.
我考试太差了。
I'm so bad at taking exams.
我在伯克利总是考不及格。
I always fail tests at Berkeley.
我爱伯克利，但考试从未考好过。
I love Berkeley, but I never did well on the test.
让我们看看能否通过这次表现赢得普斯教授的认可。
Let's let's let's see if we can come out of this earning professor Puth.
好的。
Okay.
那我们先从简单的开始。
So let's start with an easy one.
好的。
Okay.
你能用降B大调演奏一个2-5-1和弦进行吗？
Can you play a two five one in the key of b flat major?
如果我这里有足够空间的话。
So if I have enough room here.
二五
Two five
一。
one.
非常好。
Very nice.
在小钢琴上。
On the little piano.
太棒了。
Excellent.
嗯哼。
Mhmm.
我们能转到F调吗？
Can we go to key of f?
再来个2-5-1进行，但你能加上一个副属和弦和一个三全音替代吗？
Another two five one, but can you add a secondary dominant and a tritone substitution?
你从F大调2级开始。
Where you start to so a two f major.
这就是2-5-1进行。
That's the two five one.
现在，什么
Now, what
你在里面加了副属和弦吗？
did you add secondary dominant in there.
我不知道怎么把二级变成属七和弦。
I don't know what a secondary make the two a two seven.
什么是二七和弦？
What's a two seven?
像是用二属和弦替代小和弦，改成二五和弦
Like like a two dominant instead of a minor, make it Two five.
然后三全音替代降到降B
Then tritone sub down to b flat.
哦
Oh.
没关系
It's okay.
好的
Okay.
好的
Okay.
不
No.
把这个保留在这里
Keep this in here.
我想让人们知道
I want people to know.
我...我生疏了
I I'm rusty.
老实说我现在甚至不太记得怎么记谱了
I don't I honestly don't really even know how to write music down anymore.
哇。
Wow.
在最近的一个TikTok视频里，我写了实际的音符
On a recent TikTok video, I wrote the actual notes of
这首歌的，就是k a b c a。
the song, like, k a b c a.
这个就像是，
This one was like,
你没写。
you didn't write.
这个就像是，你为什么不直接写那个，它到底叫什么来着？
This one was like, why didn't you just write the, what is it even called?
不是手稿，是乐谱？
Not manuscript, the Sheet music?
乐谱。
The sheet music.
你为什么不直接把乐谱写下来呢？
Why didn't you just write the sheet music down?
我真是太装了。
And I'm so cap.
我当时想，哦，不是所有人都懂这个的。
I was like, oh, not everyone understands that.
所以
So
是的。
Yeah.
其实我不知道怎么写，我转录速度很慢。
I actually don't know how to write I'm it slow at transcribing.
好吧。
Alright.
那我们就开始你的普斯教授系列吧。
Let's do so your Professor Puth series
嗯哼。
Uh-huh.
你谈到拥有多种键盘的重要性，因为每种键盘都有其独特的声音。
You talk about how it's essential to have many different keyboards because they each have their own different voices.
嗯。
Mhmm.
好的。
Alright.
场景。
Scenario.
对。
Yeah.
你被困在荒岛上。
You're on a desert island.
嗯。
Mhmm.
有一台发电机只能给Fender Twin Reverb音箱供电。
There is a generator that can only power a Fender Twin Reverb amp.
好的。
Okay.
你可以选择Rhodes钢琴、Warlitzer或者CP 70。
And you can choose either a Rhodes piano, a Warlitzer, or a CP 70.
选哪个？为什么？
Which one and why?
Rhodes。
Rhodes.
Rhodes Rhodes 77。
Rhodes Rhodes 77.
我们来听听声音。
Let's hear the sounds.
那些是Rhodes。
Those are Rhodes.
我们能
Can we
听听Whirley吗？
hear the Whirley?
Whirley会很有Bill Withers那种倚靠的感觉。
The Whirley would be it's very Bill Withers kinda lean on.
在CP里？
In the c p?
你仅凭音色就能演奏出完全不同的风格
You play totally different stuff just by the sound
钢琴的音色中，你却选择了罗德电钢琴
of the piano, and you've chosen the Rhodes.
说说你的选择理由
Defend your decision.
它与所有元素都能完美融合 嗯
It just blends with everything Mhmm.
比其他任何乐器都出色
Better than anything.
我可以告诉你，比如有首艾米·怀恩豪斯的歌叫《中场休息》
You could I just tell you, like, there's a song called Halftime by Amy Winehouse.
对
Yeah.
象征我们
Symbols we
让我们被贝斯声谦逊包围
get us, humble by the bass.
用普通钢琴做不到这点 这就是那种特定风格的歌曲 但罗德琴就能做到
You can't do that with It's just the and that's because that's that kind of song, but, like, just the roads.
这就是你的标志性音色？
That's your sound?
它的音域宽度和温暖质感就像水一样流动
There's something the width of it, the warmth of it just can it's kinda like water.
就像嗯哼那样。
It's like Mhmm.
你可以发现它适用于任何场合。
You can it goes with everything.
就像蓝天一样，如果你能理解的话。
It's like a blue sky, if that makes sense.
因为有时你想要阴天，有时又渴望秋天的氛围。
Because sometimes you want a cloudy sky, sometimes you want your autumn vibe.
这就像是你的那种秋日情调，但更像是Keisha Cole唱片里的感觉。
This is like your that's your autumn vibe, but like, this is this is like on Keisha Cole records.
这是Isley Brothers唱片里的风格。
This is on Isley Brother records.
这是我的唱片风格。
This is on my records.
这是属于每个人的。
This is on everybody.
看吧，这就是纽约的天气。
Like, that's New York weather for you right there.
十月。
October.
我们现在在哪里？
Where we are right now?
我告诉过你了。
I told you.
有人在打电话。
Someone's on the phone.
我告诉过你了。
I told you.
棕色石屋里别穿泥鞋。
No no muddy shoes in the brownstone.
好吧。
Alright.
百老汇即将上演Puth的音乐剧。
Puth the musical coming up on Broadway.
这家历史悠久的纽约爵士俱乐部Mhmm。
This storied New York jazz club Mhmm.
就是你最近举办小型私密演出的地方。
Is where you recently played a small set of intimate shows.
是的。
Yeah.
那真的很难形容。
That was very hard to describe.
危险边缘问题。
Jeopardy question.
哦，什么是蓝调音符？
Oh, what is blue note?
什么是蓝调音符？
What is a blue note?
什么是蓝调音符？
What is a blue note?
我不知道。
I don't know.
我没有联觉能力，所以真的不知道颜色是什么。
I'm not synesthetic, so I don't really know what colors are.
比如那边那个粉色流行标志，对我来说听起来不像C大调和弦。
Like, the the the pink pop sign there, like, doesn't sound like a c major chord to me.
对我来说蓝调音符就是
It's just a a blue note to me is just
一个位置。
a place.
通常在布鲁斯音阶中，吉他手们会特别讨论介于大三度和小三度之间的那个音符，称之为蓝调音符——这在钢琴上是无法实现的。
Oftentimes, in the the blues scale, guitarists, especially, will talk about the sort of the note in between the major third and the minor third as the blue note, which we can't do on the piano.
你看，当我听到大三度时，我得思考一下。
See, when I hear major third, like, I have to, like, think.
就是那个大三度。
Like, the major third.
但我其实知道它是什么。
But, like, I know what it is.
只是不像识别和弦那样能瞬间反应，这对我来说很奇怪。
It's just, like, it's not as instantaneous as, like, calling out the chord, which is so weird for me.
在所有你可能演出的场馆中...
Out of all of the venues that you could have played at Mhmm.
你本可以在巨型场馆演出。
You could have played Giant Arenas.
嗯。
Mhmm.
你却选择了蓝调酒吧，那个小爵士俱乐部。
You chose the Blue Note, small jazz club.
为什么呢？
How come?
因为我可能再也不会有这样的机会了。
Because I probably won't have a chance to do it ever again.
而且为了让一小群人记住他们喜欢的演出，这种体验在大型场馆里根本无法复现。
And for a small group of people to remember what they heard, they like, it just won't translate in an arena.
大型场馆很棒，能在那演出我也非常开心，但我希望人们能获得更私密的体验——比如踩效果器时不小心撞翻别人的尼格罗尼酒。
Arenas are amazing and I'm super happy that we can play those too, but I wanted people to have a very intimate experience and you get that by, you know, hitting the pedal and then accidentally hitting someone's Negroni.
同时你还能闻到厨房飘来的食物香气。
At the same time, like, you can, like, smell the food being made.
看着厨房员工在人群中穿梭。
Like, the kitchen staff is running in between.
服务生忙着记录每个人的点单。
The the servers are taking everyone's orders.
就像...我需要这种氛围，这就是我的竞技场。
It's like you, I needed that for This is the arena.
这就是《此处禁言》的场馆版。
This is the arena version of We Don't Talk Here.
这是蓝调版本。
This is the blue note version.
跳向玫瑰丛。
Jumping down to the rose.
是啊。
Yeah.
向着玫瑰丛。
Down to the rose.
只是这声音让我想起它与场地很相配。
It's just it it just reminded me the sound matched the venue.
储藏室爵士乐机构。
Storage jazz institution.
如此多的
So many of
顶尖乐手都在那里演出过。
the best players have played there.
哦，我从未去过。
Oh, and I've never been.
你能相信吗？
Can you believe that?
哇哦。
Woah.
我从未有过变革性的体验。
I'd never been transformative.
好的。
Okay.
最带感的奇数拍歌曲是哪首？
What is the grooviest song in an odd meter?
哦。
Oh.
太高了。
Too high.
太高了。
Too high.
这是史蒂夫·汪达的歌。
The the the it's on the Stevie Wonder.
我
I
会弹这些歌。
know how to play the songs.
我不知道《Too high》的歌名。
I don't know the names of Too high.
这首歌叫《Too High》吗？
Is it called Too High?
这是奇怪的拍子吗？
Is this a weird meter?
其实不算。
Not really.
不。
No.
这不是什么奇怪的节拍器。
This isn't a weird meter.
我是说，比如Radiohead的《15 Step》。
I mean, like, 15 Step by Radiohead.
我不知道这首歌。
I don't know it.
我不
I don't
不怎么听Radiohead的歌。
listen to a lot of Radiohead.
那首挺有意思的。
That's a fun one.
给我科普下。
Educate me.
这首曲子。
This track.
15步。
15 steps.
嗨，Groovy。
Hi, Groovy.
这太棒了。
This is amazing.
我从没听过这个。
I've never heard this.
是啊。
Yeah.
这是《In Rainbows》专辑里的。
That's off of In Rainbows.
但我其实不会刻意听很多音乐——我脑子里一直在循环Metallica的唱片。
But I don't literally listen to a lot of music with trying to I'm listening to Metallica records in my head.
哦，有意思。
Oh, fun.
就是那首《For Whom the Bell Tolls》。
The the for whom the bell tolls.
那也是四四拍的。
That's four four timing too.
哇。
Wow.
我猜我对那些怪异的玩意儿没兴趣？比如Tool乐队？
I guess I'm not really turned on by weird Maybe tool?
如果我们想停留在金属乐领域？
If we wanted to stick in the metal world?
这个我不知道。
I don't know that.
那是什么？
What's that?
哦，比如，侧面的。
Oh, like, lateralis.
这这可能是小学的
This is this is probably elementary school on
这张唱片。
this record.
感觉像在启动《托尼霍克职业滑板》游戏。
I feel like I'm turning on Tony Hawk pro skater.
好吧。
Alright.
我们开始吧。
Let's go.
科恩乐队的《Blind》怎么样？
What about blind by Korn?
他们，就像开头那样，有一段间歇。
Do they, like it starts they they have, a break.
然后他们就突然重新进入状态。
And then he's they just come back into it.
那个808鼓机。
The eight zero eight.
哦，对。
Oh, yeah.
这里有个808鼓点。
There's an 808.
这张唱片真酷。
That's a cool record.
你绝对想不到这张唱片里会有808鼓机的声音。
You would never expect this record to have an 808 in it.
不。
No.
很多金属唱片和新金属唱片里都有808鼓机的声音。
A lot of metal records and new metal records had eight zero eights in them.
它来了。
It drops.
它
It
就在这之后出现。
comes right after this.
四，一，二，
Four, one, two,
三。
three.
那那没关系。
That's that's okay.
我我超爱那张唱片里的鼓声。
I I love the drum sound on that record.
它是
It's
比如，这很有趣。
like That's fun.
听起来他们只是支了一个麦克风，在车库里随便录了一下。
It sounds like they just put up one microphone and just record it in a garage or something.
什么是共振峰偏移？你能不用技术手段演示一下吗？
What is formant shifting and can you demonstrate it without the use of technology?
共振峰偏移就像...如果我的声音原本是这样，然后你听到泛音...我我做得不太好，有时候会出现一种泛音效果，别人可能做得更好，但这种泛音会让声音产生一点立体感。
Formant shifting, like, my if my voice was like this and then you hear the overtones and it's I I can't do it as well, sometimes there's an overtone that like, someone else could do it way better, but there's a there's an overtone that happens and, like, it stereoizes it a little bit.
就像是，
Like, the
元音位置的偏移。
the shifting of the vowel placement.
对。
Yeah.
实际上有时候当我...在修正一个没唱准的音时，但我很喜欢这个演唱表现
It actually sometime when when I'm, like, correcting a note that I really didn't hit, but I really like the performance
嗯。
Yeah.
如果我本该唱到这里却唱到了这里，用Melodyne软件拖到正确音高时，有时候
If I'm supposed to be here and I'm here and I'm in the Melodyne and I drag it up to here, sometimes
会让声音听起来有点假，所以我得去调整共振峰参数...这就是
it'll make it sound a little so I have to bring I have to go to the foreman toll and That's the
我能描述的最好方式了。
best way I can describe it.
在你的《普茨教授》系列中，你谈到了《每个人都想统治世界》这首歌里的磁带机润色技术。
In your Professor Putz series, you talk about tape machine sweetening in the song Everybody Wants to Rule the World.
嗯。
Mhmm.
听听这首歌。
Listen to this song.
为什么《每个人都想统治世界》会让你感到鼓舞和情绪激动？
Why does everybody wants to rule the world make you feel inspired and emotional?
因为这首歌被调高了音调
It's because the song is pitched
用的是磁带机。
up with a tape machine.
在过去，他们称这种技术为音频润色。
Back in the day, they call this sweetening the audio.
你现在可能在想，查理，人们为什么要这么做？
You might be thinking to yourself right now, Charlie, why do people do this?
我要告诉你，观众朋友，当你加快或放慢音乐或音调时，科学证明这会让你的情绪产生不同感受。
I will tell you, viewer, when you speed music or tones up and down, it's scientifically proven to make you feel different emotionally.
这是所有音乐基本都调谐到的基准音。
This is the tone all music is basically tuned to.
但当你把音调调高时，它会带你进入爱的频率。
But when you pitch it higher, it brings you to the love frequency.
它被调高了。
It was pitched up.
嗯。
Mhmm.
你说有科学依据证明528赫兹这个频率能让人产生不同的情感体验，被称为爱的频率。
You say that it was scientifically proven to make you feel differently emotionally that the frequency five twenty eight is the love frequency.
这个说法已经被本·乔丹等音乐人彻底揭穿了。
This idea has been wildly debunked by musicians like Ben Jordan.
爱的频率完全是胡扯吗？
Is the love frequency totally baloney?
怎么回事？
What's going on?
老兄，我也不知道。
Man, I don't know.
怎么舒服怎么来呗。
It's whatever feels good.
没那么严重。
It's not that serious.
只是音乐而已。
It's just music.
好像我们觉得世界已经够严肃了。
It's like we're so the world's serious enough.
我们就是来享受美好时光的，享受这三分钟、四分钟、五分钟的放松。
We're just here to have a good time and to have a three minute, four minute, five minute break.
我刚查了一下。
I just looked it up.
它就是这么说的。
That's what it said that it was.
我只是想激励人们创作音乐。
I'm just trying to inspire people to make music.
谁是流行音乐史上最被忽视的人物之一？为什么？
Who's one of the most overlooked figures of pop history and why?
流行音乐中最被忽视的人物之一罗德·坦伯顿，因为Heatwave乐队明显是R&B组合，但他与昆西一起堪称将R&B融入流行的教父级人物，巧妙地将R&B元素渗透进流行音乐。
One of the most overlooked figures in pop, Rod Temperton, because Heatwave, obviously, an r and b group, but he brought I believe he was, like, the godfather with Quincy of bringing r and b into pop, sneaking r and b into pop.
乔治·本森的《Just Give Me the Night》。
George Benson, just give me the night.
那是张流行唱片，但B段部分却截然不同。
That's a pop record, but with a like completely different like a a b section.
比如你听塔米亚的《You Put a Move on My Heart》。
Like, you listen to You Put a Move on My Heart by Tamiya.
我想开头是这样的。
I think that's how it starts.
也许我只是想让你明白。
Maybe I just want you to understand.
这些就是典型的罗德式和弦。
Just Those are such rod chords.
我起了些鸡皮疙瘩。
I get little chills.
这真是太美妙了。
That's like so lovely.
Heatwave乐队的《你所做的只是拨号》。
And All You Do Is Dial by Heatwave.
Heatwave。
Heatwave.
就像一分钟内。
Like a minute in.
好的。
Okay.
一样。
Same
和《你触动我心》这张R&B唱片用的是同一个调，由同一个人创作，但当你听《颤栗》这张流行专辑时，虽然用了同样的和弦，却伪装成了流行音乐。
key as the You Put a Move On My Heart record written by the same guy, R and B records, but then you listen to Thriller, which is a pop album, and it's all those same chords, but disguised as pop music.
嗯哼。
Mhmm.
所以我觉得他真的被低估了。
So I think he's really underappreciated.
好的。
Okay.
最后一个问题。
Final question for you.
嗯哼。
Mhmm.
你正在经历变化。
You're going through changes.
是的。
Yes.
你要当爸爸了。
You're gonna be a dad.
嗯。
Mhmm.
你能用大调唱儿歌再用小调唱一遍吗？
Can you sing any major key children's song in a minor key?
哦。
Oh.
你是我的阳光，我唯一的阳光。
You are my sunshine, my only sunshine.
听起来像《屋顶上的小提琴手》。
Sounds like Fiddler on the Roof.
但当你写作卡壳时，这些练习很有帮助。
But those are good exercises to do when you're stuck on on writing.
比如用小调唱歌。
Those like sing songs in minor keys.
我有时会这样做来重新激发灵感。
I'll do that sometimes to just reinspire the brain.
我觉得你以压倒性优势通过了资格考试。
I feel like you have overwhelmingly passed your qualifying exam.
你现在有资格进入教授职位的下一阶段——提交你的论文。
You are now qualified to move on to the next stage of professorship, which is submitting your dissertation.
截止日期是3月6日。
The due date is gonna be March 6.
你可以提交很棒的作品。
You can submit Great.
无论什么聪明的点子都交给我们委员会。
Whatever is clever back to our committee.
一点也不忙。
Not busy at all.
但我会提交些东西。
But I I would submit something.
我的经验教训就是不要过度思考。
My my lesson would be don't overthink things.
我的意思是，你不需要了解所有技术细节，因为人们听音乐时也不懂那些技术。
I mean, you don't have to, like, know all the technical stuff because people don't know all the technical stuff when they're listening to music.
他们只是想感受些什么。
They just want to feel something.
他们需要从疲惫的生活中喘口气。
They want a breather from the exhausting thing that is life.
我们在为人们制造幻想。
We're making fantasies for people.
他们想感受变化。
They wanna feel the changes.
他们想要感受变化。
They want to feel the changes.
这样收尾很完美。
And that's a good way to bookend it all.
谢谢你，查理。
Thank you, Charlie.
非常愉快。
It's been a pleasure.
我们很感激。
We appreciate it.
谢谢。
Thank you.
谢谢。
Thank you.
《Switched on Pop》由Reyna Cruz制作，Alyssa Sopp编辑，Brent McFarlane负责音效设计，Iris Gottlieb绘制插画，主题音乐由Arc Iris的Jossi Adams和Zach Tenario创作。
Switched on Pop is produced by Reyna Cruz, edited by Alyssa Sopp, engineered by Brent McFarlane, illustrations by Iris Gottlieb, theme music by Jossi Adams and Zach Tenario of Arc Iris.
我们是Vox Media播客网络成员，由《Vulture》出品，隶属于《纽约杂志》。
We're a member of the Vox Media Podcast Network, a production of Vulture, which is part of New York Magazine.
您可在nymag.com/pod订阅。
You can subscribe at nymag.com/pod.
细心的听众可能注意到上周片尾提到本周会有针锋相对的环节。
Now keen listeners who paid attention to last week's credits heard that we were gonna go tit for tat this week.
我觉得我们算是做到了，不过你们可能期待的是其他内容。
I think we kinda did, but you might have been expecting something else.
我保证针锋相对特辑很快就会上线。
I promise you that tit for tat episode coming up real soon.
我们下周会再回来。
We'll be back again next week.
在此之前，感谢您的收听。
And until then, thanks for listening.
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