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NPR新闻首先为您带来的是放慢快节奏世界并理解它的方法，这正是科技领袖们说他们现在所需要的。
Up first from NPR News is your way to slow down a fast moving world and make sense of it, which is just what tech leaders say they need right now.
本周的重大新闻之一是科技领袖们表示他们希望放慢人工智能的发展速度。
One of the big stories this week is that tech leaders say they want to slow down AI development.
此外，中东地区的最新冲突可能会进一步推高油价。
Also, the latest fighting in The Middle East could push oil prices even higher.
从《Up First》开始您的一天，了解您需要知道的一切。
Start your day with what you need to know on Up First.
在NPR应用或任何您收听播客的地方收听。
Listen on the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts.
这里是TED广播时间。
This is the TED Radio Hour.
每周，开创性的TED演讲。
Each week, groundbreaking TED Talks.
我们现在的工作就是大胆梦想。
Our job now is to dream big.
在TED大会上发表。
Delivered at TED conferences.
为了带来
To bring about
我们想看到的未来。
the future we want to see.
在世界各地。
Around the world.
为了理解我们是谁。
To understand who we are.
从这些演讲中，我们为你带来会让你惊喜的演讲者和想法。
From those talks, we bring you speakers and ideas that will surprise you.
你永远不知道会发现什么。
You just don't know what you're gonna find.
挑战你。
Challenge you.
我们真的得问问自己，为什么这件事值得关注？
We truly have to ask ourselves, like, why is it noteworthy?
甚至能改变你。
And even change you.
我真的觉得自己像是变了一个人。
I literally feel like I'm a different person.
是的。
Yes.
你有这种感觉吗？
Do you feel that way?
值得传播的想法。
Ideas worth spreading.
来自TED和NPR，我是Manoj Zamorodi。
From TED and NPR, I'm Manoj Zamorodi.
你是那种幸运的人吗，从小就清楚自己长大后想做什么？
Were you one of those lucky people who knew exactly what you wanted to be when you grew up?
大提琴家约书亚·罗曼就是其中之一。
Cellist Joshua Roman was.
你知道吗，我大概十岁的时候有过一个阶段。
You know, I went through a phase when I was 10 or so.
那时候想过一些类似的事情，比如，哦，我可以当战斗机飞行员或者消防员，反正都是些英雄角色。
A few of these kinds of things was like, oh, I could be a fighter pilot or a firefighter or it was always something heroic.
世界上跑得最快的人。
The fastest man in the world.
但前提是我摔断了胳膊，再也不能拉大提琴了。
But only if I break my arm and can never play the cello again
哦，哇。
Oh, wow.
然后我就去参加滑雪巡逻队。
Then I'll join ski patrol.
就是那种想法。
It was that sort of thing.
他
He
大部分时间都在练大提琴。
has always spent most of his days practicing his cello.
这真的很耗费精力。
It's pretty all consuming.
这是一种练习，不只是练琴，还包括和朋友坐在一起共同做事的练习。
It's a practice, not just practicing the cello, but the practice of sitting with a friend and working on something together.
我觉得别人可能会去探索和投入的事情，我也会去做，但那些总是放在次要位置。
All of the things that I think other people might explore and really get into, I would do that, but it was always kind of on the side.
我从来没有在任何事情上比在大提琴上投入更多。
I never put more effort into anything than I did into the cello.
是一见钟情，还是慢慢喜欢上的？
Was it love at first sight, or was it more of a slow burn?
说实话，我不记得我第一次拉大提琴是什么时候了。
You know, I don't remember my first time playing the cello.
那时候我才三岁。
I was three years old.
但我记得UPS的送货员站在门口，我们家有一扇玻璃门和一扇木门。
But I do remember the UPS lady at the front door, and we had one of those glass doors and a wooden door.
木门开着，她穿着棕色短裤站在那里，抱着一个比我还大的箱子，我特别兴奋。
And the wooden door was open, And she was standing there in her brown shorts with this box that was bigger than me, and I was so excited.
对，我从来都不记得自己有不爱大提琴的时候，所以从有记忆起，它就一直和我分不开。
And, yeah, I I don't remember ever not loving the cello, so it's been inseparable since memory began.
在俄克拉荷马城长大，音乐和信仰就像一枚硬币的两面，也是他们家的立身之本。
Growing up in Oklahoma City, music and faith were two sides of the same coin and what his family stood for.
到13岁时，约书亚每天练五小时大提琴，经常和父亲一起在教堂里练。
By the age of 13, Joshua practiced cello five hours a day, often at church alongside his father.
我小时候，家里非常虔诚。
When I was growing up, it was it was very religious.
我们经常去教堂。
We went to church all the time.
我爸爸是音乐总监。
My dad was the music director.
他是保罗·大卫·罗曼牧师。
He's reverend Paul David Roman.
我从小到大几乎每天都去教堂，音乐就是献给上帝的。
We were at church almost every day of the week, my whole life, and music was a service to God.
我就是这么看的。
That's how I saw it.
后来，约书亚去学了音乐。
Eventually, Joshua went on to study music.
他加入了西雅图交响乐团。
He joined the Seattle Symphony Orchestra.
这是他在拉肖斯塔科维奇的大提琴曲。
This is him on cello playing Shostakovich.
22岁时，他就成了乐团的首席大提琴手，是史上最年轻的。
At 22, he was their principal cellist, their youngest ever.
24岁时，他离开乐团去追求独奏生涯，与世界各地的交响乐团合作演出，2009年还在卡内基音乐厅通过YouTube直播，由马友友介绍出场。
At 24, he left to pursue a solo career, playing with orchestras around the world, live streaming on YouTube from Carnegie Hall in 2009, introduced by Yo Yo Ma.
偶尔，我会遇到一些非凡的年轻音乐家，比如约书亚·罗曼就是其中之一。
Occasionally, I get to meet an extraordinary young musician, such as the case with Joshua Roman.
网上有成千上万的粉丝，周游世界，与大提琴相伴的生活正是约书亚从小就一直期盼的。
Tens of thousands of fans online, traveling the globe, life with his cello was exactly what Joshua had hoped for ever since he was a little kid.
大概六岁的时候，我就跟所有人说，这就是我这辈子要做的事。
By the time I was six or so, I was telling everyone this is what I'm gonna do for the rest of my life.
我就是知道。
And I just knew it.
这不是个问题。
It wasn't a question.
也不是什么需要考虑的事。
It wasn't a consideration.
就是，我注定要做这件事。
It was just that was what I was gonna do.
毫无疑问。
No question.
我觉得很多人，或者我不代表很多人。
I think a lot of people or I won't speak for a lot of people.
我只代表我自己说，我很羡慕你那么小就有这么清晰的目标。
I'll speak for myself, which is that I'm envious that you had that clarity at such a young age.
你知道，你可以想象，这是我经常被人提起或问起的事情，我觉得这有利有弊。
You know, you can imagine that's something that I I get told a lot or asked about quite a bit, and I think it cuts both ways.
对我来说，这很好。
For me, it's been great.
这很好，但这也让我的整个生活都围绕着它转，我的时间总是很有限。
It's been great, but it's also been something my whole life has revolved around, and my time has always been limited.
因为你的投入。
Because of your commitment.
因为我的投入。
Because of my commitment.
正是对技艺的那份执着，让约书亚·罗曼得以专注，最终成为世界闻名的古典音乐家。
That commitment to his craft gave Joshua Roman the focus to become a world famous classical musician.
但和数百万其他人一样，2020年疫情来袭时，他的生活发生了转变。
But like millions of other people, in 2020, his life shifted when the pandemic happened.
不仅仅是因为他无法巡演或举办音乐会，还因为约书亚感染新冠后，他的身体彻底变了。
Not only because he couldn't tour or play concerts, but because after Joshua got COVID, his body completely changed.
他一直以来视为理所当然的健康，变得脆弱不堪。
His health, which he had always taken for granted, became fragile.
而他的老朋友——大提琴，仿佛他们再也不认识彼此了。
And his old friend, the cello, it was like they hardly knew each other anymore.
今天节目里，我们将与大提琴家、TED演讲者约书亚·罗曼共度一小时，聊聊那场几乎让他放弃大提琴的身份危机，以及他如何重新思考生活和音乐的方式，从而重新爱上两者。
Today on the show, an hour with cellist and TED speaker Joshua Roman, an identity crisis that nearly ended his passion for his cello and how he had to rethink his approach to life and music so he could love both.
但首先，让我们回到约书亚平常的一天。
But first, let's go back to a typical day for Joshua
哇哦。
Oh, wow.
那是2018年，在这一切发生之前。
In 2018 before all that happened.
疫情前，我的一天排得满满当当。
A typical day pre COVID was packed.
一切都非常紧张。
It was all super intense.
所以我以前每天练习六到十个小时。
So I used to practice anywhere from six to ten hours a day.
我总是在追求进步，努力让自己变得更好，无论是拉大提琴还是学什么技能，或者更内省地学习冥想，但一切都像以每小时一百英里的速度在跑。
I was always reaching, striving to make myself better, whether at the cello or some skill or more reflective, learning meditation, but it was all a 100 miles per hour.
你
You
知道，我所谓的放松就是报名参加一个十天的内观静修课程。
know, my idea of relaxing was to sign up for a ten day silent Vipassana meditation course.
你确实很接地气，但我不会说那是什么都不做的放松。
And you're really grounded, but I I wouldn't call it relaxing in the sense of not doing anything.
这就是我用来休息的方式。
And that's what I would do to take a break.
我会早起。
And I would get up early.
我会去跑步。
I would run.
疫情前一年，我又把一英里跑进了六分钟以内。那时候我到处奔波，忙得不可开交，大概80%的时间都在演出，所以我决定不想再住在纽约了。
I I got my mile under six minutes again the year before the pandemic while I was bouncing around, I had been so busy, gone about 80% of the time playing concerts that I decided I didn't wanna bother living in New York anymore.
所以2019年，我把所有东西都存了起来，头六个月就住在酒店和寄宿家庭里，同时演出。偶尔需要多住一晚，或者去我姐姐家凑合一下。
And so in 2019, I left everything in storage, And I just for the first six months, I just lived in hotels and host family homes while I played the concerts that I had, and occasionally, I needed to add an extra night or crash at my sister's.
所以有很长一段时间，我就像个流浪者一样到处漂泊。
So I'd spent a long time kind of just roaming, being a a kind of nomad.
我觉得大概过了八九个月，疫情就来了。
And it had been, I think, eight or nine months of doing that when the pandemic hit.
大家好。
Hi, everyone.
真是难忘的一天。
What a day.
真是特殊的时期。
What a time.
所有音乐会都在3月12日左右被取消了。
All the concerts were canceled that March 12 or whatever it was.
从现在到五月的演出都被取消了。
Concerts that have been canceled between now and May.
这样也好。
It's for the best.
我接到经纪人的电话，把我未来所有的收入都取消了，除了大概一场演出。
Got a phone call from my manager that wiped out the entire future income that I had except for, I think, one concert.
我立刻进入了音乐创作的状态。
I immediately went into a musical response mode.
欢迎来到《大提琴的咆哮》。
Welcome to cello bellow.
开始在Facebook上每天做直播。
Started doing daily livestreams on Facebook.
我当时在做这个叫音乐日记的项目，会录一些多轨的大提琴作品。
I was doing this project called the musical journal, and I would record these multitrack cello things.
每到一个地方安顿下来，我做的第一件事就是搭好录音设备，我的小型移动工作室，然后录一段音乐日记。
When I would get somewhere and unpack, the first thing I would do is set up my recording equipment, my little mobile studio, and record an entry into the musical journal.
那时候，音乐对我来说就是这样的存在。
And that was that was what music was doing for me at that point.
它是一个表达的出口。
It was an outlet to serve.
现在回头看，我觉得我当时真的忽略了自己和大提琴之间的私人关系。
Looking back, I think that I was really ignoring my personal relationship with the cello.
我觉得我当时把大提琴当成工具，想从中榨取所有好处，用这种方式去影响别人。
I think I was using the cello as a tool, trying to extract all the the good that I could from it in a way that would make an impact for other people.
但我并没有真正考虑这听起来怎么样。
But I wasn't really considering what does this sound?
这个练习对我意味着什么？
What does this practice mean for me?
我当时就是一门心思往前冲。
I I I was on a mission
就是这样。
And that was it.
然后我们来到了2021年1月。
And then we get to January 2021.
没错。
That's right.
和我们大多数人一样，你感染了新冠。
And like the vast majority of us, you got COVID.
你当时在哪里？
Where were you?
我当时在佛罗里达州的杰克逊维尔。
I was in Jacksonville, Florida.
那是唯一一场没被取消的音乐会。
The one concert that wasn't canceled.
而且我一直想说，杰克逊维尔交响乐团在安全措施方面做得非常好。
And I just I will always say for the record, the Jacksonville Symphony did a great job with their safety protocol and measures.
其他人都没感染新冠。
No one else got COVID.
他们取消了第二场音乐会。
They canceled the second concert.
我们演了第一场，第二天早上醒来，我发现我闻不到味道了。
We played the first concert, and I woke up the next morning, and I had a I couldn't smell.
连薄荷糖的味道都闻不到。
Couldn't smell the Altoids.
天哪。
Oh, man.
我把鼻子凑到盒子里，什么都闻不到。
Stuck my nose in the box, and I couldn't smell a thing.
我当时就想，这可不太妙。
I was like, this is not good.
所以我就去做了检测。
So I took the test.
然后呢，你知道，那时候只要一确诊，整个音乐会就得取消，我当时就有点不知所措。
And then, you know, in those days, you would cancel the whole concert, and I was just kind of stuck.
而且我完全不知道这病会对我造成什么影响，但从一开始，整个过程就特别煎熬。
And I had no idea what it was gonna do to me, but from the very beginning, it was an ordeal.
因为，真的很难回想起来，这挺奇怪的，毕竟也没过多久。
Because, like, it's really hard to remember, which is so weird because it's not that long ago.
但我觉得，你知道，想起来并不愉快。
But I think, you know, it's not fun to think about.
不过咱们得提醒自己，对有些人来说，得新冠根本不算什么。
But but let's just remind ourselves that for some people, it was no big deal to get COVID.
但对另一些人来说，那可是天大的事。
And for others, it was an extremely big deal.
你的症状是怎么发展的？
How did your symptoms progress?
你是什么时候意识到，哎呀，糟了。
And at what point did you realize, like, oh, nuts.
这不太妙。
This is not good.
很奇怪，因为我并不觉得自己得了很严重的新冠。
It was weird because I didn't feel like I had such a bad COVID.
我是说，这很奇怪。
I mean, it was strange.
我没有的是那种典型的流感症状。
I didn't what I didn't have is the extreme regular flu like symptoms.
我基本上只有新冠带来的那些奇怪症状，而传统的生病症状不多。
I basically had the weird stuff that COVID brings and not a whole lot of traditional sick stuff.
我没有。
I wasn't.
我呼吸很困难。
I had a lot of trouble breathing.
这确实是个问题。
That was a thing.
而且我累得不行，那种累我以前从来没经历过，不是因为做了什么才累，也不是困的那种累。
And I had incredible fatigue, which was like nothing I'd ever experienced where it wasn't being tired because I had done something or being sleepy.
感觉就像身体里灌了铅一样，连抬个胳膊都特别费劲。
It's this feeling like I'm wearing weights inside of my body or something that I just lifting an arm can be so difficult.
胳膊就像有千斤重，脑子也有类似的感觉。
It just feels like it weighs a thousand pounds, and the brain would have similar things.
我脑子特别迷糊，思维很混乱。
I was really struggling with brain fog.
连看书都很难。
It was very difficult to read.
那种感觉真的很奇怪。
And it was very strange.
我没觉得自己生病了。
Didn't feel sick.
我感觉自己像是被什么东西附身了，好像被什么奇怪的东西缠上了。
I felt like I was inhabited by something else, like I'd been possessed with some weird thing.
然后这种感觉就一直没消失。
And then it just didn't go away.
我非常非常幸运，我的家庭医生对长新冠有所了解，也足够了解，不仅建议我可能得了这个病，还告诉我说你需要额外的帮助，因为我不是这方面的专家。
And I'm very, very lucky that my primary care doctor knew about and understood enough about long COVID both to suggest that that might be what I had and also to say you need to get extra help because I'm not an expert in this.
我们回来的时候，约书亚收起了他的大提琴，不确定自己还会不会再拿起它。
When we come back, Joshua puts away his cello, unsure he'll ever return to it.
那大概是最低谷的时候。
That was probably the lowest point.
日程上什么都没有。
Nothing on the calendar.
对自己能康复毫无信心。
No confidence in my ability to recover.
那时候我对音乐的意义产生了信仰危机。
Crisis of faith about what music meant at that point.
那真是一段非常黑暗的时期。
It was it was a really dark time.
更多内容来自我和约书亚·罗曼的对话。
More from my conversation with Joshua Roman.
我是马努莎·扎莫罗迪，你正在收听NPR的TED广播时间。
I'm Manousha Zamorodi, and you're listening to NPR's TED Radio Hour.
我们稍后回来。
We'll be right back.
这条消息来自NPR葡萄酒俱乐部，该俱乐部已为NPR筹集了超过175万美元。
This message comes from the NPR wine club, which has generated over 1,750,000 to support NPR.
无论是购买几瓶还是加入俱乐部，请访问nprwineclub.org/podcast了解更多信息。
Whether buying a few bottles or joining the club, learn more at nprwineclub.org/podcast.
购买者必须年满21岁。
Must be 21 or older to purchase.
在我们回到节目之前，先说一个小提示。
A quick note before we get back to the show.
最近很多听众在问怎么支持公共广播，其实有一件超级简单、完全免费的事情可以做，而且真的只需要两分钟。
These days, many listeners are asking how they can support public radio, and there is a super easy, totally free thing you can do, and it literally takes two minutes.
打开你现在听的这个播客应用，给这个节目打个分、写个评论。
Go into the podcast app where you're listening right now and rate and review this show.
就这么简单。
That's it.
这样做能帮助更多人发现TED Radio Hour，对我们来说帮助非常大。
Doing that helps other people find TED Radio Hour, and that helps us tremendously.
谢谢大家。
Thank you.
这里是NPR的TED Radio Hour。
It's the TED Radio Hour from NPR.
我是Manouche Zamorodi。
I'm Manouche Zamorodi.
这期节目我们请到了大提琴家约书亚·罗曼。
We are spending the hour with cellist Joshua Roman.
26岁时，他的事业已经蒸蒸日上，忙得不可开交。
By age 26, he had a flourishing and frenetic career.
30岁时，他已经走遍全球，在世界最大的舞台上演奏。
By 30, he was traveling the globe, playing the world's biggest venues.
但当疫情来袭，约书亚患上了新冠后遗症，一切都停滞了，包括他演奏心爱的大提琴时一直感受到的那种快乐。
But when the pandemic hit and Joshua developed long COVID, everything ground to a halt for him, including the pleasure he'd always gotten from playing his beloved cello.
我面临着再也无法演奏这些美妙音乐的可能。
I was facing the possibility of never playing this beautiful music again.
下面是他登上TED舞台的演讲。
Here he is on the TED stage.
2021年1月，我感染了新冠，不幸的是，我从未完全康复。
In January '21, I caught COVID, and unfortunately, I never fully recovered.
即使在初次感染后，我仍然难以阅读，我就知道出问题了。
I could tell something was wrong when I continued struggling to read even after my initial infection.
有时候连简单的句子都读不懂了。
Sometimes even basic sentences wouldn't make sense.
几周后，我从生病前那次旅行回来。
A few weeks later, I was returning from the trip I'd been on when I got sick.
到家后，光是走上楼回卧室这个简单的动作，就让我彻底垮了。
And when I arrived home, the simple act of walking up the stairs to my bedroom completely laid me out.
我才走到一半，就瘫倒在楼梯平台上，起不来，连坐都坐不起来。
I only made it halfway before falling to the floor on the landing, unable to continue or even to lift myself to a sitting position.
我在那儿躺了半个小时，又沮丧又哭。
I was there for half an hour frustrated and crying.
那后来呢？之后发生了什么？
So so what happened next after that?
嗯，最后我还是到家了。
Well, eventually, I made it home.
嗯，到家了。
Well, home.
我到了纽约，去了我之前住的那个地方。
I made it to New York to the last place that I had been staying.
虽然只有两场音乐会，但我觉得它们特别重要，所以我还是保留了那两场演出。
And I only had two concerts, but they felt so important, so I kept those concert dates.
然后
And
哇，真的吗？
Oh, wow.
那真是太疯狂了。
That was wild.
你知道，当然，我和我的经纪人为此谈了好几次。
You know, of course, my my manager and I had a big several conversations about it.
我能不能撑下来？
Am I gonna be able to do this?
我努力练习，终于能演奏辛辛那提的大提琴协奏曲了。
I worked my way up to playing the Cincents cello concerto.
这是一首大提琴独奏与管弦乐队合作的曲子，只有大约二十分钟长，这很不寻常。
It's a it's a solo cello with orchestra piece, and it's only about twenty minutes long, which is unusual.
那些著名的大提琴协奏曲通常都有三十分钟甚至四十分钟长。
The big cello concertos, the famous ones are thirty or even forty minutes long.
但这首只有二十分钟，而且很多孩子都会学这首曲子。
But this one was only twenty minutes long, and it's one that a lot of kids learn.
所以我大概十二三岁的时候就学过它了。
So I had learned it when I was 12 or 13 or something.
我也不太记得了。
I don't know.
如果说有哪首曲子能让我即使在长新冠的情况下也能达到自己期望的演奏水平，那一定是这首。
And if there was any piece that was gonna be able to perform at the level that I expected myself, even with long COVID, it was gonna be that piece.
所以我把它练好了。
So I got it ready.
那真是疯狂。
It was nuts.
一开始，我只能拉两到五分钟。
At first, I could only play two to five minutes.
后来慢慢能拉到二十分钟，虽然能拉完，但为了这二十分钟，我得休息很久很久。
And eventually, got up to twenty minutes, and I could do that, but I would have to rest so much to be able to just play the cello for twenty minutes.
所以那场演出之后，我确实需要好好恢复。
So when I did that performance, I definitely had to recover.
但就在那之后，我第一次和埃德加·迈耶还有泰莎·拉克合作。
But right after that, I was working for the very first time with Edgar Meyer and Tessa Lark.
有些音乐会之所以能办成，全靠录像。
The only way some concerts went on was that they were videotaped.
所以我们就在埃德加家里录，把工作分散到一周里完成，这样我才能撑下来。
And so that's what we did at Edgar's house, and we were able to spread out our work over the course of a week so that I could manage it.
直到我硬撑着完成这两件事之后，我才真正彻底垮了。
And it wasn't until after I pushed through those two things that I truly, truly just crashed.
那大概是最低谷的时候。
That was probably the lowest point.
日程上什么都没有。
Nothing on the calendar.
对自己能否恢复毫无信心。
No confidence in my ability to recover.
对音乐的意义产生了信仰危机，甚至怀疑自己是否还想继续下去。
A crisis of faith about what music meant at that point and whether I wanted to continue at all.
那真是一段非常黑暗的时期。
It was it was a really dark time.
我放弃了坚持了三十多年的日常练习习惯。
I abandoned the daily practice routine that I've been cultivating for over thirty years.
我把大提琴放进琴盒，就再也没动过。
I put my cello in its case, and I left it there.
多年来潜伏在心底的疑虑全都浮出了水面。
Doubts that had been lurking for years came to the surface.
我职业生涯的大部分时间都陷入了一种“赶场”的心态，等着电话响，不敢拒绝任何机会，完全没有意识到疲惫已经渗透了我的身心。
I've been stuck in a gig mentality for much of my career waiting for the phone to ring, afraid to say no to any opportunity, and completely unaware of the exhaustion that ran through my body and spirit.
我一直希望自己做的事情有意义。
I've always wanted to feel like what I do matters.
但经过几十年的努力，想把每个音符都拉准，让每个乐句都清晰有力，我却因为疲惫而看不到这种可能性。
But after decades of ambitious effort to play every note in tune, make every phrase clear and powerful, I was having trouble seeing that possibility through my fatigue.
连拿起琴弓都困难，更别说好好练琴了，我甚至觉得这一切都没有意义了。
With the difficulty I had even lifting the bow, let alone putting in a decent practice session, I lost hope that it mattered.
你说你把大提琴放进琴盒，就再也没动过它。
You say you put your cello in its case and you left it there.
那次休息持续了多久？
How long did that break last?
我记不清了。
I don't imagine.
大概两个半月，差不多三个月吧。
It was like two and a half months, almost three months.
哦，天哪。
Oh, wow.
那可能是你休息最久的一次了。
That was probably the biggest break you'd taken
绝对是。
By far.
基本上是你这辈子最长的一次。
Ever in your life, basically.
因为我小时候有人告诉我，海菲茨说过——我从来没去查证过，因为我不想知道——
Because my rule was somebody told me when I was a kid that Heifetz said, I've never looked this up because I don't wanna know.
如果我一天不练琴，我自己知道。
If I miss a day of practice, I know.
如果两天不练，评论家们就知道了。
If I miss two days, the critics know.
如果三天不练，全世界都知道了。
If I miss three days of practice, the whole world knows.
甚至在我六岁的时候，这种观念就已经深深灌输给我了。
And even as like a six year old, that was the mentality that was drilled into me.
所以将近三个月的时间简直难以想象。
So almost three months was inconceivable.
你觉得你的大提琴对此有什么想法？
What do you think your cello thought of this?
我开始觉得它们真的是你的生活伴侣了。
I'm starting to think of them truly as your life partner.
我可以告诉你，它们不太高兴。它叫米奇，它已经被放进柜子里好几次了。
They're not happy about I can tell you, Midge is her name, and she she had been put in the closet a few times.
很遗憾这么说，但总是因为我有另一把大提琴要演奏。
I'm sorry to say, but always because I had another cello that I would be playing.
从来不是因为我不拉大提琴了。
It was never me not playing the cello.
但大提琴有个特点，如果一段时间不拉，它们会变得僵硬。
But there's something about cellos when they don't get played for a while, they get stiff.
很难发出声音。
It's hard to get a sound.
声音会很少。
You don't have a lot of sound.
这木头拉和不拉的时候变化这么大，真是挺不可思议的。
It's kind of crazy how much this wood changes when it's played and when it's not played.
所以她很不高兴，但我的手指也差不多没了茧子，我想任何弦乐演奏者都能理解我的意思。
So she was very unhappy, but also my fingers I did I had pretty much lost my calluses, which is something I think any string player will understand what I'm saying with that.
我的茧子几乎全没了。
I had pretty much lost my calluses.
在那段不拉琴的日子里，你想念拉琴吗？
When you were in the midst of that of not playing, did you miss it?
你想念米奇吗？
Did you miss Midge?
你想念吗？不。
Did you did you No.
开始想了吗？不。
Start think no.
没有。
No.
我开始想我还能做别的事情。
I started thinking about other things I could do.
我是说，那时候我其实不太了解自己。
I I mean, that was it was not I don't think I was very in touch with myself.
而且，你知道，我们之前聊过，我很小就知道自己要做什么，很多人觉得这很棒，但另一面也很真实，就是其他所有事情都被推到一边，因为我知道自己该做什么。
And, you know, we talked about earlier, I knew from such an early age and people a lot of people look at that and think that's awesome, but that flip side is real, that there are all of these other things that just got pushed to the side because I knew what I was supposed to do.
所以我不会让任何可能推翻那个故事的事情变成现实。
And so I wasn't gonna let anything that would that would counter that narrative become real.
所以当我把大提琴收起来的时候，那些被压下去的怀疑一下子涌了上来，那是我第一次真正说出那些一直存在心里的话。
So when I did put the cello away, I was flooded with those doubts that had been shoved down, and it was the first time that I'd truly voiced those things that had always kind of been there.
我想试着理解，为什么你不知道音乐能不能行。
I wanna try and understand that why you don't know if music is gonna do it.
因为身体上，我觉得自己不行，因为，哇，我这辈子都没给其他事情一个机会。
Because physically, I don't feel able because, wow, I haven't given the rest of the world a chance in my life.
是不是因为你还受着新冠后遗症的影响，然后你就觉得，我真是累得要命。
Was it that you still had long COVID and you were just like, I'm just so damn tired.
我就打算这么耗着，不去想清楚。
I'm just gonna sit in this not knowing.
具体是哪种情况呢？
Like, what exactly?
你知道吗，这真的说到点子上了。
You know, this is getting this is cutting to the quick of it.
我小时候是在教堂里长大的。
When I was a kid, I grew up in a church.
音乐是献给上帝的。
Music was a service to God.
我能够有非常大的抱负去服务，在那个地方，有些东西科学有时候说不清楚，但那里赋予了它们意义。
I was able to have incredible ambition to serve in this place where there's meaning attributed to those things which can't be articulated sometimes by science so well.
所以，其实就是精神层面的东西。
So spirituality, really.
我十六七岁的时候就离开了教会。
And I I left the church when I was 16 or 17.
而到了我们说的那个时候，天哪，我已经有二十年不是基督徒了，但我还没想明白，如果不是通过上帝和耶稣，音乐要怎么拯救世界，就像我小时候以为的那样。
And at the point that we're talking about, it had been, gosh, twenty years of not being a Christian, but I hadn't yet figured out how music was gonna save the world if it wasn't through God and Jesus the way that I had thought when I was a kid.
所以我之前做的很多服务，其实都是机械性的。
And so a lot of what I had done for service was kind of, like, automatic.
而在那一刻，所有积累的东西一下子压在我身上，我不知道自己还能不能相信音乐能拯救人，因为我不再相信最初给我这个信念的那个体系，而我还没找到新的。
And in this moment, all of that that had been building up just came down on me, and I I didn't know if I could believe anymore that music would save people because I didn't believe in the construct that had given me that in the first place, and I hadn't yet found a new one.
所以新冠几乎逼着你面对这个困惑，然后你就干脆不弹了。
So COVID almost forced you into confronting this confusion and that you just stopped playing.
百分之百。
A 100%.
它完全逼着我去面对一件我早该面对的事情。
It totally forced me into facing something that I could have faced a long time ago.
在那些非常黑暗的日子里，你接到了一个朋友的电话。对。
In in those very dark days, you got a call from a friend Yeah.
那件事后来改变了你的处境。
That ended up changing things for you.
他们说了什么？
What did they say?
比如，我知道你现在很挣扎，但你愿意考虑一下，就为我们这些朋友演奏一次吗？
Like, I I know you're struggling right now, but would you consider playing just for us friends?
我觉得特别有意思，因为我有个朋友请我在她的夏至派对上演奏。
It's so it's so funny to me because I had this friend who asked me to play for her summer solstice party.
然后，你知道，我答应了。
And, you know, I said yes.
那时候，我其实都不太确定自己还要不要继续做大提琴手。
I I at that point, I wasn't really sure if I was even going to continue a career as a cellist.
我心里想，大不了到时候取消就行了。
And I think I had in the back of my mind, I can just cancel.
没事的。
It's fine.
她会理解的。
She'll understand.
但后来我一直拖着，没真正去想这件事。
But then I procrastinated actually thinking about it.
所以到最后我也没法拒绝了。
And so I couldn't say no anymore.
实际上，我是在派对前一天才重新拿起大提琴的。
And that is actually when I picked up the cello, was the day before this party.
那也是我重新把米奇拿出来开始演奏的原因。
And that's why I took midge out again and started playing.
就在那一刻，我的人生彻底改变了。
And that's the moment where everything changed for me.
几乎每个大提琴手的胸口，都会有一块皮肤因为琴身接触而留下痕迹。
There's there's a place on probably most, if not every, cellist's chest that has marks on the skin from where the cello touches it.
对我来说，那个位置就在胸骨上，稍微偏左，靠近心脏，想想还挺神奇的。
And for me, it's right on the breastbone, slightly to the left, close to the heart, which is kinda crazy.
当我那么久没碰大提琴，开始弹巴赫前奏曲的时候，我觉得自己对振动特别敏感。
And when I started playing the Bach prelude after not having touched the cello for so long, I think I was extra sensitive to the vibrations.
你能感觉到整把大提琴都在振动。
You can feel the whole cello vibrating.
你用膝盖夹着它。
You're holding it with your knees.
它贴着你的胸口。
It's against your chest.
有时候你的头会轻轻碰到琴头。
Sometimes your head is touching the scroll a little bit.
你在手上也能感觉到。
You feel it in your hands.
我知道那种振动能让大提琴苏醒过来。
I know that that vibration wakes the cello up.
这是我们都知道的事情。
This is something that we we know.
这是研究振动对乐器的影响的。
It's studied the effect that vibrations have on the instruments.
我觉得那是很长时间以来，也许是很多很多年来，唯一一次我让自己去感受手触碰大提琴、大提琴靠在我胸口和膝盖上时带来的振动，那种感觉让我一下子清醒过来。
And I think that was one of the only moments in a long time, maybe the only moment in many, many years that I let myself feel the vibrations from my hands touching the cello and the cello leaning against my chest and against my knees just waking me up.
我开始哭了起来，因为那是我真正需要的东西。
I I started crying because it was something that I really needed.
很快我就感觉到，这就是我一直缺失的东西。
Pretty immediately, I felt that here is the thing that I've been missing.
那是我自己与音乐和大提琴之间的私人连接，其他所有东西都必须从那里出发。而我之前一直专注于为别人演奏音乐，以至于我都没有意识到，这几乎有点讽刺。
It's my own personal connection to the music and to the cello that all of the other stuff has to come from that, that I'd been so singularly focused on putting music out there for other people that I wasn't you know, it's almost ironic.
我甚至没有真正把这件事做好，因为我没有让自己成为其中的一部分。
I wasn't even really doing that as well as I could because I wasn't letting myself be a part of the equation.
我一直试图消失。
And I was trying to disappear.
我试图让自己成为一个完美的、空空的容器，只为音乐而存在。
I was trying to make myself a perfect empty vessel for music.
但事情根本不是那样的。
And that's just not how it works.
被音乐真正打动，身体感受到振动，情感上感受到那一刻的脆弱被触碰，这是我从未有过的体验。
And being moved literally, feeling the vibrations and emotionally feeling the vulnerability that I had in that moment be touched in a way that I hadn't experienced before.
这让我明白，音乐本身就有力量，而且是必不可少的。
That showed me that music is on its own powerful and necessary.
从那一刻起，我一直在层层剥开自己，而这一切都源于那个最基本的点——我必须被击垮，跪倒在地，才能放下骄傲，让自己变得脆弱，去感受音乐的美。
And all of the layers that I've been peeling back since that moment come from that basic element of I had to be taken down to my knees before I let go of pride and and let myself be vulnerable and experience the beauty of of music.
当那层纱被揭开后，你眼前看到的是什么？
With that veil pulled away, what did you see in front of you then?
因为那看起来、听起来都和你之前所在的地方不一样。
Because it looked different, it sounded like, than where you'd just been.
非常不一样。
Very different.
非常不一样。
Very different.
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我当时并不确定该怎么处理这件事，但我知道我不会放弃大提琴，事实上，大提琴是我的伙伴，是我生命的一部分，我只是需要和它建立一种更健康的关系。
I wasn't immediately sure what to do with it, except that I knew that I wasn't gonna quit the cello, that in fact, the cello is my partner and my life, and that I just needed to have a healthier relationship with it.
我觉得开始去探索这些问题——我和音乐、和大提琴的关系是什么？音乐的力量是什么？
And I think setting out to explore that, what is my relationship with music, with the cello, What is the power of music?
这些问题在某种程度上成了我的框架。
Those have become my structure in a way, those questions.
这让我去做了一些非常具体的事情。
And it's led me to do very specific things.
比如，有一段时间我意识到——我想那是几个月之后——我意识到当我并不想练习的时候，我需要停止练习。
Like there was a point that I realized, and I think it was many months after but there was a point that I realized I needed to stop practicing when I didn't want to practice.
即使现在，我自己听到自己这么说，都觉得非常奇怪。
And that's just so weird for me to even now for me to hear myself saying.
但每当我感到有练习的冲动时，我开始问自己：这是因为我真的想练习，还是因为我觉得我应该练习？
But whenever I would feel the urge, I started asking myself, is this because I really want to practice or is this because I feel like I should practice?
我发现当我开始这样做的时候，我在演奏时反而更能集中注意力在大提琴上了。
And I discovered that when I started that, I actually started being able to keep my mind on the cello more when I was playing.
比如，我的思绪不再像以前那样经常飘走了。
Like, my mind wasn't wandering off like it used to sometimes.
我不再只是机械地演奏。
I wasn't just playing by rote.
我全身心投入其中。
I was there.
这花了一点时间，但现在确实如此。
It took a little while, but now that's that's very true.
而且，我发现自己真的很喜欢拉大提琴，也很喜欢练习。
And also, I found that I really love playing the cello and that I really love practicing.
而且不仅仅是这个区别。
And it's not just this is the difference.
不只是为了在某件事上变得更好。
It's not just about getting better at something.
而是享受做这件事本身。
It's about just enjoying doing it.
还有一个矛盾或者说讽刺的地方，就是我觉得我现在拉得比以往任何时候都好。
And another paradox or irony or whatever you want to call it is that I think I'm playing better than ever.
而且我经常不准备就去上台什么的。
And I show up unprepared and stuff.
你可能会想，如果我说不练就不练，那结果肯定很糟糕。
You'd think that's what would happen if you said I'm not going to practice unless I want to.
但事实并非如此，其实没那么差。
But no, it's not really bad.
这其实源于我内心深处的信任，我正在学着信任自己。
It's at my core, I trust I'm working on trusting myself.
练习的本质就是信任。
Practicing is about trusting.
就像任何其他关系一样，信任的关键在于建立信任，而不是不断去验证。
And just like in any other relationship, trust is a matter of building the trust part, not the verify part.
而我之前一直太执着于那些小细节了。
And I had been so focused on all of the little checkboxes.
我练音阶了吗？
Have I done my scales?
我做了这个吗？
Have I done this?
然后也许我就可以放松下来，相信自己了。
Then maybe I can relax and trust myself.
但我其实从来没有真正练习过相信自己。
But I hadn't ever actually practiced trusting myself.
因为那做起来很吓人。
Because that's scary to do.
万一失败了怎么办？
What if you fail?
确实很吓人。
It's really scary.
嗯，那是另一回事。
Well, that's the other thing.
我意识到我会失败。
I realized I'm going to fail.
没关系。
That's okay.
这会是其中的一部分。
That's gonna be part of it.
我会想办法让人们感受到我现在感受到的东西，而这会让我在其他方面失败，那些我以前会认为是失败的方式。
And I'm gonna somehow find a way to let people experience this thing that I feel right now, and it's gonna make me fail in other ways, ways that I would have considered failure before.
但也许现在，那才是真正的重点。
But maybe now, that's actually the point.
我真的可以说到做到，真正去付出一些东西。
That truly, I can put my can put my bow where my mouth was and and really do this thing of of truly giving something.
接下来，看看约书亚·罗曼带来了什么，他的首张个人专辑，以及一段专为你即兴创作的曲子，亲爱的听众。
In a minute, what Joshua Roman went on to produce, his debut solo album and a piece improvised just for you, dear listener.
这里是NPR的TED广播时间。
It's the TED Radio Hour from NPR.
我是马努什·扎莫罗迪。
I'm Manoush Zamorodi.
请继续收听。
Stay with us.
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Whether you buy a few bottles or join the club, all purchases support NPR programming and help fund quality reporting.
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购买者必须年满21岁。
Must be 21 or older to purchase.
这里是NPR的TED广播时间。
It's the TED Radio Hour from NPR.
我是马努什·扎莫罗迪。
I'm Manouche Zamorodi.
今天的节目里，我们请到了大提琴家约书亚·罗曼，聊聊长期新冠如何改变了他的人生和他对音乐的态度。
On the show today, cellist Joshua Roman and how long COVID changed his life and his approach to music.
你经历了很多，但这也让你走到了一个意想不到又挺美好的地方——你的首张个人专辑。
So you went through a lot, but it has brought you to sort of this unexpected and kinda wonderful place, your debut solo album.
我
I
闭上眼睛，只是一瞬间，那一瞬间就消失了。
close my eyes only for a moment and the moment's gone.
专辑里有古典曲目，也有原创作品。
It includes classical pieces, original compositions.
你还翻唱了一些更现代的音乐，而且在里面你不仅拉大提琴，还弹吉他，还唱歌。
You also do covers of more contemporary music and features you on guitar as well as cello, and you sing.
没错。
That's right.
跟我们聊聊这张专辑，以及制作它的过程吧。
Tell us about the album and and the process of putting it together.
嗯，这一切都是从那个时刻开始的，我一直在试图弄明白。
Well, it's it all started with that moment and trying to figure it out.
但有一个催化剂，是我的一个朋友，他当时在普林斯顿大学音乐会系列中负责一个项目，现在还在做。
But there was a catalyst, which was a friend of mine who ran still runs a series at the Princeton University Concert Series.
那个项目当时是新的，叫做“音乐疗愈”。
And it was new at the time called Healing with Music.
哦，对。
Oh, yeah.
我听说过。
I'm I'm familiar.
好的。
Okay.
太好了。
Awesome.
基本想法就是，你知道，你会听到艺术家演奏那些帮助他们度过健康旅程的音乐。
So the basic idea, you know, you hear artists playing music that has helped them through their health journeys.
想到要上台说‘我不好’，真的挺吓人的。
And it was very scary to think about that, to be up on stage saying, I'm not okay.
那时候我已经办过几场音乐会了，当然，我们跟主办方都说了，确保后台所有人都知道。
I had played a couple of concerts at that point, and of course, we told everyone, the presenters, to make sure that everyone backstage knew.
但我不会上台就说‘我得了长新冠’之类的。
But I wasn't going out on stage and being like, I've got long COVID.
哦，你没有。
Oh, you weren't.
直到那一刻，我才打算说‘演出后我会很累’。
I'm gonna be tired after this, until this moment.
明白了。
I see.
我朋友达莎的提议是，办一场音乐会，主题就是‘我有点问题，但音乐能帮到我’。
This proposal from my friend Dasha was come do a concert where the whole point is something's wrong, and here's how music helps.
我面临的一个挑战是，尤其是古典音乐，现在对我来说很难，因为从认知上讲，它没那么简单了。
One of the challenges I face is that, especially classical music, is is hard for me now because cognitively, it's not it's not that simple.
这确实挺费神的，会消耗我很多精力，但它一直是我理解自己、对自己更温柔的核心。
It's it's actually pretty taxing and can take a lot out of me, but it has been the center of me understanding my relationship with myself and being kinder to myself.
所以我开始回想这段旅程中对我有意义的曲子，那场音乐会上的所有曲目最终都成了这个项目的一部分。
So I started thinking about the pieces that had meant something to me on this journey, and all of the pieces that were on that concert ended up being a part of the project.
我会站在舞台上，用语言和音乐讲述我的故事，这个想法就来自那次经历。
And this idea that I would be on stage and I would tell my story in words and music came from that experience.
那又是揭开了一层，当然我在表演，但我不是在用表演来隐藏什么。
That was another layer being peeled back of, sure, I'm performing, but I'm not I'm not performing to hide in a way.
我不是想让自己显得无懈可击。
I'm not trying to be bulletproof up here.
我在向人们展示一些对我个人真正重要的东西，不只是因为我选了它显得重要，而是因为它真的触动我。
I'm showing people something that really matters personally to me, not just something I've picked because it seems important, but because, like, it truly affects me.
那确实不一样。
And that that was different.
这对我来说特别有意思，因为我从来没想过这会是我首张专辑该有的样子。
It's it's so interesting to me because it's not what I ever would have said I I I should have done as a debut album.
然而，我觉得十二岁的我对此一点都不会感到惊讶。
And yet, I think 12 year old me would not have been surprised at all.
对十二岁的我来说，这太合理了，当然，这就是你会放进专辑里的音乐。
It would have made so much sense to 12 like, of course, that's the music that you had put on an album.
而且，十二岁的我根本不知道音乐流派和界限应该是什么。
And I like, 12 year old me didn't know what musical genres and boundaries were supposed to be.
只是
It was just
合得来的东西自然就合得来。
Things that fit together fit together.
你说的这些，其实就是脆弱。
I mean, the what you're talking about is is vulnerability.
没错。
Exactly.
有人可能会想，哦，那他的音乐听起来会很忧伤或者难过吧。
And and and one might think, oh, that means he's going to sound wistful or sad.
但不是。
But no.
情况并非如此。
That is not the case.
这是充满喜悦的。
This is joyous.
我的意思是，确实有悲伤，但有趣的是，当你把这一切放在一起，它其实就是生活。
I I it I mean, there's there's there's sadness, but what's interesting actually is when you put it all together, it's just life.
有一个时刻，你知道，我后来在录制的时候，专门为这个项目写了一首曲子。
There's a moment you know, I did write a piece specifically for the project much later when it came time to record it.
这个曲子的想法是，它要表达我的经历。
And the idea was this is gonna be the piece that's about my experience.
我非常希望它能有一种起伏的感觉，像旅程一样，有点像《指环王》里的那种风景。
And I've I've really desperately wanted it to have this up and down, feel the journey, kind of Lord of the Rings landscape.
同时，它应该是一首为大提琴独奏而作的五分钟的曲子。
At the same time, it was supposed to be a five minute piece for solo cello.
我真是个傻瓜，但那段曲子我就是写不出来。
And I'm such a doofus, but I I couldn't get that piece out.
我一直试一直失败，所以我就开始每天即兴演奏，看看会发生什么，怎么才能找到感觉。
I kept trying and failing, and so I started improvising every day to see what would happen and how I would get there.
其实挺有意思的，但我并没有写出我脑子里想的那种史诗感的东西。
And it was really fun, but I wasn't making this epic that I had in mind.
就在我进录音棚前的那个周末。
And it was the weekend before I was walking into the studio.
那段曲子我还是没完成。
I still didn't have that thing done.
甚至都不太清楚它会是什么样子。
Or even really know what it was gonna be.
最后我干脆彻底放弃了。
And so I finally just totally gave up.
然后我说，好吧。
And I said, alright.
不管出来什么，那就是作品本身。
Whatever's coming out is the piece.
然后，它好像立刻就自己显现出来了。
And like, it just kind of it just kind of showed itself immediately.
很快，那些好玩的即兴练习就变成了我写过的最不加掩饰、最欢快的作品之一。
And very quickly, those fun improv sessions evolved into one of the most unabashedly joyful compositions I've ever written.
我没法强迫自己写出我想要的那首曲子。
I couldn't force myself to write the piece that I wanted.
但当我放手，只是去演奏的时候，我得到了我需要的那首曲子。
But when I let go and just played, I came away with the piece that I needed.
我给它起了和我项目一样的名字，叫“免疫”。
I gave it the same name I've given my project, immunity.
这本来是一场欢快的庆祝，一直想从我身体里迸发出来，而我却一直试图压抑它，把它变成严肃的东西。
Here was this joyful celebration that was just dying to burst out of me, and I'd been trying to restrain it and turn it into this serious thing.
这……我到现在也不太明白，不过实际上，很多宗教、灵性和哲学体系里都有这种悖论的概念，我觉得这真的很真实。
It was it was so I still don't quite understand except that a lot of, actually, a lot of religions and spiritualities and philosophies have this idea of the paradox, and it's I think it's it's really real.
你知道吗？
You know?
我们不必非得是非此即彼的。
It's we don't have to be all one or the other.
我想也许弗洛伊德会说，你失去了自我，或者你……
I guess I'm also thinking that maybe, Freud might say you lost the ego or or that you
嗯，那听起来不错。
Well, that sounds nice.
确实。
It does.
但这让我想起了我经历产后抑郁的那段日子。
Well but it just reminds me of being having honestly postpartum depression.
而从中得到的一个结果就是，我失去了过滤，想到什么就说什么。
And and the one thing that came out of that was that I lost my filter and just kinda said what I thought.
哇。
And Wow.
那是我事业起飞的时候。
That's when my career took off.
那是什么感觉？
What was that like?
哇。
Wow.
你知道，不得不去面对那些黑暗。
You know, having to go to the darkness.
然后做事情是因为你想做，那种感觉无比自由。
And then doing things because you want to, and it's incredibly freeing.
生活也更有乐趣，而且奇怪的是，反而更轻松了。
And life is more pleasurable and and oddly easier.
对。
Yes.
我觉得这一点我好像不太能说清楚。
I think that's something that I I don't feel like I can articulate it very well.
对我来说，这又是一个悖论，嗯。
It's it's another for me, it's another one of those paradoxes where Mhmm.
在音乐和生活中，理解到足以放手，光是这句话就够让人琢磨的，但理解和放手确实是相辅相成的。
In music and in life, understanding enough to be able to let go is like even just that sentence is a weird thing to chew on, but they they go together, understanding and letting go.
你觉得你本质上又变回了原来那种音乐人吗？
Did do you think you essentially came back to being the same sort of musician?
还是说你已经大不一样了？
Or or are you very different?
不。
No.
天哪。
Oh my gosh.
我是说，根基还在那里。
I mean, there's you know, the roots are there.
我会说，有些东西被解锁了。
I would say that something has been unlocked.
你知道吗，这么多年来我一直在围着某个东西打转，想靠技巧、靠投入、靠坚持、靠蛮力去够到它。
Something you know, it was like I was circling something for so many years trying through skill, through dedication, through commitment, through brute force, trying to get at something.
而那些技巧，并不是没用的技巧。
And all of those skills, they're not useless skills.
它们挺好的。
They're they're good.
它们有帮助。
They help.
它们能帮上忙。
They help do the thing.
但它们本身不是那个东西。
They just weren't the thing.
它们只是工具，当你有了那个东西的时候，它们能派上用场。
They were just tools that help when you have the thing.
所以我还是同一个人，只是越来越不怕做自己了。
So I'm the same person with less and less fear of being who I am.
所以我想利用我们剩下的时间，请你为我们演奏一些音乐，好吗？
So I would love to use the time that we have left together to ask you, would you play some music for us?
我很乐意。
I'd be happy to.
和你一起的是谁？
Who is this with you?
因为我知道你之前……这是
Because I know you were This
这是辛迪。
is Cindy.
哦，辛迪。
Oh, Cindy.
哇。
Woo.
辛迪。
Cindy.
那就是辛迪喜欢的反应。
That was that was the response Cindy likes.
再来一首。
One piece back.
哦。
Oh.
辛迪身材很有曲线。
She's got curves, Cindy.
你和辛迪在一起多久了？
What how long in you have Cindy you and Cindy been together?
哦，哇。
Oh, wow.
两年半了吧？
Two and a half years?
其实我们一开始分分合合的，所以不太好记。
Actually, we're a little bit on and off at first, so it's hard to remember.
嗯，你之前是和米奇在一起的。
Well, you were with Midge before.
对，我之前是和米奇在一起。
So I was with Midge.
好的。
Alright.
那跟我说说，你和辛迪现在打算为我们做点什么？
So so talk to me about what you and Cindy are gonna do for us right now.
嗯，我觉得我能做的事情有很多，但考虑到我们刚才聊的内容，最合适的可能就是即兴来一小段，说说现在的情况。
Well, I think there are a lot of things that I could do, but probably the most appropriate thing given our conversation is just to play a short little what's happening right now.
我也不知道会是什么。
And I have no idea what that's gonna be.
所以这就是今天的状态。
So this is this is today.
太棒了。
That was amazing.
哦，谢谢。
Oh, thank you.
那真的很轻柔。
That was very gentle.
那是你即兴发挥的吗？
That just came out of you?
是的。
Yes.
那是一种轻柔的感觉。
It was a gentle something.
我很喜欢。
I loved it.
你。
You.
这正是我今天需要的，让我平静下来一点。
It was what I needed to bring me down a little bit today.
我不是说那种伤心的感觉。
Like and I don't mean, like, sad.
我的意思是，就是深呼吸一下。
I mean, like, just, like, take a deep breath.
我觉得可能我也是这样，你知道，分享这个故事，我们一直在聊的这些，总是很难。
I think probably me too, you know, sharing sharing this story, what we have been speaking about, it's always hard.
我现在分享这些还是会感到焦虑，而能有这么简单又让人踏实的东西。
I still feel anxious sharing these things and having something that was just so simple and grounding.
所以就是这样。
So there we are.
那是约书亚·罗曼。
That was Joshua Roman.
他的专辑叫《免疫力》。
His album is called Immunity.
你听到的这些选曲来自他的唱片公司bright shiny things。
The selections you heard come courtesy of his record label, bright shiny things.
你可以在ted.com上看到他的演讲和所有TED表演。
You can see his talk and all of his TED performances at ted.com.
非常感谢你今天收听我们的节目。
Thank you so much for listening to our show today.
如果你喜欢这期节目，或者从中有所收获，请在Spotify上给我们留言或评分，或者发邮件到tedradiohour@npr.org。
If you enjoyed it, got something out of it, please leave us a comment or a rating on Spotify or email us at tedradiohour@npr.org.
我们每一条评论都会看，也很喜欢听到你的声音。
We read every comment, and we love hearing from you.
本期节目由Matthew Cloutier制作，由Sanaa Zmashkinpur和我编辑。
This episode was produced by Matthew Cloutier and edited by Sanaa Zmashkinpur and me.
我们在NPR的制作团队还包括James Salahusi、Rachel Faulkner White、Katie Monteleone、Fiona Giron和Harsha Nahada。
Our production staff at NPR also includes James Salahusi, Rachel Faulkner White, Katie Monteleone, Fiona Giron, and Harsha Nahada.
我们的执行制片人是Irene Noguchi。
Our executive producer is Irene Noguchi.
我们的音频工程师是Patrick Murray和Simon Jensen。
Our audio engineers were Patrick Murray and Simon Jensen.
我们在TED的合作伙伴是克里斯·安德森、罗克珊·海拉什和丹妮拉·瓦拉雷佐。
Our partners at TED are Chris Anderson, Roxanne Hylash, and Daniela Valarezzo.
我是马努什·扎莫罗迪，你收听的是NPR的TED广播时间。
I'm Manoush Zamorodi, and you've been listening to the TED Radio Hour from NPR.
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