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你好。
Hello.
欢迎来到专辑俱乐部。
Welcome to the album club.
我是本。
I'm Ben.
我是安德鲁。
And I'm Andrew.
今天我们要继续我们的自由人系列第二部分。
And today we're doing part two of our Libertines series.
自由人同名专辑。
The Libertines self titled.
第二张专辑。
Second album.
是的。
Yeah.
不如第一张好，但还是很扎实。
Not as good as the first, but solid.
是的。
Yeah.
我觉得这是一张非常非常好的专辑。
I think it's a really really good album.
我觉得第一张专辑太棒了，所以对我来说，这张不如第一张。
I think that first album is so good that it's it's not as good as the first album for for mine.
对很多乐迷来说，确实如此。
For for a lot of fans, it is.
它同样出色。
It's as good.
对于那些是通过这张专辑认识The Libertines的人来说，这张显然更好，因为那里有情感因素。
For people who got into The Libertines with this album, it's better obviously because that's the sentimental part of it.
但对我来说，如果我要就这张专辑说一个核心观点，那就是那些出色的歌曲
But I mean for me, my key theme if I was going to make one point about this album, it would be that the great songs
是的
Yeah.
都非常出色。
Are really good.
它们属于The Libertines最优秀的作品之列。
They're up there with the best work that the Libertines did.
大概有三四首顶级歌曲，但我认为还有很多歌曲达不到那个水平。
There's about three to four top notch songs, but I think there's a lot of songs that just are not up to that.
所以你要么有这些出色的歌曲，要么就是一些还行、不算太差的歌。
So you've either got these amazing songs or these songs that are, you know, okay, not too bad.
我觉得我们过去已经讨论过这一点。
I think they've we've talked about it in the past.
你总会遇到一些有四首支柱歌曲的专辑，我认为这张专辑大概也有它的四首。
You get these albums with four pillars, and I think this album's probably got its four.
这里那些伟大的专辑。
The the great albums here.
我们可能得自己造些词出来
We might have to make up your own words
为了那个。
for that.
四首非常强劲的歌，然后其他一些就比较平庸。
Four really strong songs and then the ones that sort of wash between.
而第一张专辑，我觉得只有一首歌，我
Whereas the first album, like, don't I think there's only one album, one song that I'd
哦，你觉得《Tell the King》是这样？我觉得那是他们最好的歌之一。
Oh, you you thought that about Tell the King, which I think is one of their best songs.
不。
No.
我不觉得它有多好，对我来说，它只是填充曲目，相比之下《Radio America》才真的很棒。
Didn't like, I thought it was alright, but I don't think it was like, for me, that was filler compared to Radio America, which I thought was great.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
我不会把它们中的任何一个称为。
I wouldn't call either either of them.
但，是的，我仍然认为你有更好和更弱的曲目，但我认为高质量歌曲和低质量歌曲之间存在着相当大的差距。
But, yeah, I I still think you got your better and your weaker tracks, but I think there's there's quite a large gulf between the the high quality songs and the lower quality songs.
我想另一点是，尽管他们内部矛盾重重，却还是成功推出了第二张专辑。
And I guess another thing about this is the fact that they managed to get a second album out with all the strife that was going on.
是的。
Yeah.
这真是一个很好的观点。
It's a really it's a really good point.
我记得你在上一次提到过，你会把这些乐队比如六枪手当作主要的，还有像说谎者这样的乐队。
I remember you saying that in the last one, you kind of think about these bands like the Six Pistols being the main one and bands like The Liars.
是的。
Yeah.
然后你会想，哇，如果他们出了第二张专辑，那一定会很棒。
And then you think, wow, if they did the second album, it would be amazing.
是的。
Yeah.
但很多时候，事实并非如此。
But quite often, it's not.
是的。
Yeah.
而且这几乎是一种‘假如’的假设。
And it's almost that what if.
这些人确实经历了那些事。
These guys did actually go through.
根本不存在什么‘假如’。
There is no what if.
是的。
Yeah.
这是他们制作的专辑。
This is the album that they made.
而且它非常扎实。
And it's like it's it's it's solid.
这是一张非常好的专辑。
It's it's really good album.
如果性手枪乐队的后续作品能达到这个水准，我就觉得理所当然了。
It's what I would expect like, if the Sex Pistols are the follow-up, I'd expect it to be this standard.
是的。
Yeah.
没那么好，但还是相当不错。
Like, not as good, but still pretty good.
对。
Yeah.
另一张专辑是可遇不可求的奇迹。
The other one's lightning in the bottle.
对吧？
Right?
是的。
Yeah.
就是这个时候、这个地方，还有所有这些因素。
It's just this time and a place and all these things.
这一切完美地汇聚在一起，成就了这张专辑。
This perfect storm coming together for this album.
这当然有很多压力，我们稍后会谈到。
This, I mean, there's a lot of pressure, obviously, and we'll go into this.
其中关键的一点是，当时发生了许多事情。
One of the key parts is that there was a lot that went on.
这就像一部肥皂剧，主要发生在两位核心词曲作者卡尔·巴雷特和皮特·道蒂之间。
It was like a soap opera between mainly the two key songwriters, Carl Barrett and Pete Dougherty.
是的，最终他们走进录音室，完成了录制。
And yeah, it just culminated in them actually getting into the studio and recording.
是的。
Yeah.
然后他们几乎再也没有录过任何东西，直到2012年左右？
And then they pretty much never really recorded anything again until, you know 2012?
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
我只是在想我自己的顺序。
I think I was just thinking in my order.
那你来说说你的顺序吧。
Give your order then.
好的。
Okay.
自由人乐队的首张专辑，是的。
The Libertines first album Yeah.
然后是《Down in Albion》和Babyshambles，是的。
Then Down in Albion, Babyshambles Yeah.
其中很多歌曲是在2003年期间创作的。
Which a lot of the songs were written during this 2003.
然后是The Libertines的第二张专辑，接着可能是第三张专辑。
Then the second Libertines album, and then probably the third Libertines album.
在我接触到《Shotters Nation》的时候，我回头听了那张专辑，还有《Dirty Pretty Things》。
At a time where I got into Shotters Nation, I was listening back to it and that and dirty pretty things.
《Dirty Pretty Things》很有趣，它就像是The Libertines的精炼版。
Dirty pretty things is interesting, it's like a tight version of The Libertines.
就像这些歌曲都非常紧凑，而The Libertines和Babyshambles都不是一支严谨的乐队。
Like it's just like the songs are really tight and The Libertines weren't a tight band and Babyshambles weren't a tight band.
所以看到The Libertines如果作为一支严谨的乐队会是什么样子，就体现在《Dirty Pretty Things》里了。
So it's interesting to see what The Libertines would sound like as a tight band and its dirty pretty things.
是的。
Yeah.
这大概就是我们之前讨论过的。
And that's sort of I guess we we spoke about that.
卡尔给乐队带来的正是某种程度的自律。
That's what Carl brought to the band was actually a bit of discipline Yeah.
还有一定的专业精神，比如准时参加演出。
And a bit of professionalism and turning up to gigs Yeah.
以及准时去录音室。
And turning up to the studio.
而且我真的很喜欢《Put a Madre》这首歌，新出的那首。
And actually, I really like the Put a Madre song, the new
新歌。
The new one.
是的。
Yeah.
听起来很棒。
It sounds great.
像是有一点
Like, there's sort of a little
我们做得稍微多一点
bit We of do
那样
that as
范围更广一些。
a lot wider.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
我的排序大概是这样的：首先是The Libertines的第一张，然后是Babyshambles的《Up, Down and Albion》第二张。
Yeah, my my order probably goes, Libertines the first one, Babyshambles up, down, and Albion second.
The Libertines的第二张是第三张。
Libertines second one third.
《Dirty Pretty Things》的首张专辑排第四。
Dirty Pretty Things first album fourth.
然后可能是《Shot Us Nation》，接着是《Libertines》的新专辑。
Then probably Shot Us Nation and then the new Libertines album.
哦，这两张专辑的顺序非常容易互换。
Oh that's very interchangeable those two.
然后我觉得《Baby Shambles》的第三张，接着是《Dirty Pretty Things》的第二张。
And then I think the third Baby Shambles and then the second Dirty Pretty thing.
是的。
Yeah.
还有几张特别棒的，比如《The Grace Wastelands》。
And there's a couple of really good, The Grace Wastelands.
对。
Yeah.
可能是Pete Doherty和Pete Tuckety最棒的个人专辑。
Probably the best Pete Dover, Pete Tuckety solo album.
是的。
Yeah.
我是说，我还没深入听他们的作品，但他们的风格完全不一样。
Like, I've I haven't delved in too deep to them, but they like, they're a different sound altogether.
他真是个天才词曲作者。
He's just a genius songwriter.
是的。
Yeah.
不仅如此，他还捕捉到了那种氛围，而这种能力现在太稀缺了。
Not only that, but, like, he captures the atmosphere, and that's, like, such a missing art.
而Dirty Pretty Things就没做到这一点，没捕捉到那种氛围。
And that's what dirty pretty things didn't do, was capture the atmosphere.
他们只展现了一个排练得非常熟练、配合紧密的乐队，是的。
They captured a a really well rehearsed tight band Yeah.
有一些非常棒的歌曲，但缺少了那种有组织的混乱感。
With some really good songs, but it missed the organized chaos.
是的。
Yeah.
正如我在上一期所说，我真的很喜欢卡罗巴，
As I said in the last episode, I really do like Carbara,
也十分敬佩他。
and I got a lot
我对他充满敬意。
of respect for him.
他为了维持这支乐队、持续巡演、推出第二张专辑，甚至重返乐坛制作第三张专辑，所经历的一切，
And just the professionalism and what he actually went through
是的。
Yeah.
简直需要圣人般的耐心和非凡的专业精神。
To to actually keep this band together, to keep them touring, to actually do a second album, to even get back and do a third album.
这 guy 真的有圣人般的耐心和极高的专业素养。
Like, it's the guy has just the patience of a saint and just such professionalism.
而且面对皮特在网上扔给他的所有脏话和这些事，他从未反击过，从未，你知道的，降到那个层次。
And with all the shit that Pete's thrown at him going online and all this stuff, he's never bitten, he's never, you know, dropped to that level.
他从未对皮特说过太刻薄的话。
He's never sort of really been too harsh on on Pete.
他只是始终保持着绝对的风度。
He's just He's acted with absolute class.
是的。
Yeah.
这说明了很多问题。
And it says a lot.
比如，你知道，他显然非常有才华。
Like, you know, obviously, he's very talented.
也许没有皮特那么有才华，但更有风度。
Probably not as talented as Pete, but a lot more of a class act
比皮特强。
than Pete.
如果他单飞并组建自己的乐队，我认为他会比《Raise a Light》更成功。
He would have been like, if he went solo and did his own band, I reckon he would have been bigger than Raise a Light.
是的。
Yeah.
但愿如此。
Let's hope.
他确实单飞了。
Well, did.
他和卡洛斯与杰克尔乐队一起单飞，还出过一张卡尔·巴雷特的个人专辑。
He went solo with Carlos and The Jackals, and he did a Carl Barrett solo album as well.
这两张专辑都不算特别出色，但那时已经有点太晚了。
Neither of them were that amazing but by then it was just a bit too late in the piece.
对吧？
Right?
是的。
Yeah.
它的相关性，你知道，是在
The relevance of of, you know It was
二零一零年代后期。
a late two thousand and tens.
是的。
Yeah.
我想，皮特在宝贝沙巴尔乐队中延续了那种小众氛围。
And I guess one of the other parts of it, Pete kept that cultishness with Babyshambles.
他保留了从自由人乐队带来的那种边缘元素。
He kept that fringe element from from The Libertines.
而小报则想大肆炒作
And the tabloid wanted to hit
我这里只谈音乐。
I'm just talking about the music here.
宝贝沙巴尔乐队一直保持着那种神秘感，是的。
Like Babyshambles sort of kept that mystique Yeah.
而自由人乐队所制造的这种污名，是的。
And that stigma that the Libertines had created Yeah.
并且贯穿了他整个职业生涯。
And sort of carried out his whole way through his career.
所以卡尔根本无法复制这种感觉。
And so Carl wasn't really able to replicate that.
你会把《Yeti》这张专辑和这些专辑相提并论吗？
Is it would you even place Yeti anywhere near any of these albums?
哦，不会。
Oh, no.
《Yeti》根本算不上什么。
Yeti don't even come on.
它们只是雷达上一个短暂的亮点。
They're a, like, blip on the radar.
是的。
Yeah.
Yeti
Yeti
这就像是在踩狗屎一样。
It's like when you're walking dog shit, basically.
是的。
Yeah.
听一下吧。
Have a listen to it.
我当时想，哦，是个同名的高中乐队。
I was like, oh, some high school band with the same name.
录音方式就是我们把麦克风往房间里一放。
And it's just oh, recording technique is we just put a mic in a room.
你根本连声音都录不好。
It's like, you don't even sound fucking good.
对。
Yeah.
不。
No.
听我说，Yeti，我认为你可能是最死忠、最狂热的Libertines乐迷，甚至比Yeti本人还懂他们的音乐。
Look, Yeti, I think you it's the most hardened fanatical Libertines fan that even really listens that much to Yeti.
所以，如果你不知道的话，Yeti其实是John Hasselva，Libertines乐队的贝斯手。
So Yeti, if you don't know, is John Hasselva, Libertines bassist band.
他们其实并不怎么样。
They're not very good.
是的。
Yeah.
我注意到的一点是，我对Hassell有点失望，但在Pete和Carl各自的其他乐队里，他们的贝斯手都要强得多。
The one thing I've I have noticed, I'm I'm a bit down on Hassell, but in both Pete and Carl's other respective bands, their bass players are a lot better.
而且他们真的、真的、真的，非常好。
And they're really, really, really, like Yeah.
对乐队的声音至关重要。
Instrumental to the sound.
尤其是婴儿闹剧乐队，我觉得。
Especially Babyshambles, I would say.
因为那里有很多空隙。
Like, because there's so much space there.
是的。
Yeah.
然后他们还做所有那些回响效果。
And then and then they do all the dub stuff.
是的。
Yeah.
我觉得德鲁·麦康奈尔在很多婴儿闹剧乐队的歌曲里弹贝斯。
I think Drew McConnell plays bass on a lot of those Babyshambles.
他本身也是一个词曲作者。
He's a sort of a songwriter in his own right.
是的。
Yeah.
我认为，对于The Libertines的双吉他配置来说，贝斯手只需要守住根音就够了。
I think I guess with the twin guitar attack of The Libertines, all you really need for a bass player to do is to hold down root notes.
他实际上就做这些，跟着和弦进行走。
That's all he really does and follows the chord changes.
意思是，和弦变化很多，但其他东西并不多。
Mean, there's lot of chord changes, but there's not a whole lot more going on.
没错。
No.
我们现在有点跑题了，但我觉得加里·鲍威尔能撑住他，因为他是个如此出色的
We've kind of gone a bit down a rabbit hole now, but Gary Powell I think carries him because he's such a
鼓手。
great drummer.
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
他确实是那种风格。
That he's sort of yeah.
他节奏感特别强，几乎承担了更多贝斯的部分。
He he he's just so rhythmic that he that he carries a bit more of the bass.
是的。
Yeah.
但我们回到这张专辑吧。
But back to this album.
对。
Yeah.
听好了。
Look.
我觉得这是一张非常棒的专辑。
I think it's a really great album.
我记得我第一次听这张专辑时，完全沉浸其中。
I I do remember when when I first listened to this, I was hanging out, absolutely hanging out.
当时我正住在韩国首尔，第一天就跑去商店买了这张专辑并播放了。
So I was actually living in Seoul in South Korea at the time and I went the first day, came out to the shop and bought it and played it.
我听的第一首歌是《Can't Stand Me Now》。
And the first song I heard was Can't Stand Me Now.
是的。
Yeah.
我当时就想，
And I was like,
直接击中了我。
Hit me straight up.
听完整张专辑后，我觉得，是的，我感到很失望。
And then by the end of it, I listened to the whole album and I was like, yeah, I'm disappointed.
是的。
Yeah.
我又听了一遍，还是觉得失望。
Listened to it again, was still disappointed.
我开始慢慢喜欢上一些歌曲，但2004年的时候，确实有很多令人失望的第二张专辑问世。
Started getting into some of the songs, but still, that 2004, there were a lot of disappointing second albums coming out.
我记得《Antics》也发生了同样的情况。
I remember the same thing happened with Antics.
几乎是一模一样的情况。
Pretty much the same thing.
现在回头看，《Antics》和《Libertines》几乎是同时发行的。
And now I look back and Antics and Libertines, came out very at around the same time as each other.
但它们都是在跟进那些划时代的专辑。
But they were both following up these monumental albums.
是的。
Yeah.
但它们各自都是很棒的专辑。
And they're they're both great albums in their own right.
但我的期望实在太高了。
But my expectations were just too high.
这些乐队中有谁推出了更好的第二张专辑吗？
Did did any of those bands come up with a better second album?
嗯，也许可以说The Strokes吧
Well, might say The Strokes I
我觉得我们之前争论过，他们不相上下。
think we argued they were on par.
是的。
Yeah.
我的意思是，可能有些人认为《Show Your Bones》比《Fever to Tell》更好，尽管后者出自《Year Your Years》。
I mean, there's probably people who think Show Your Bones is better than Fever to Tell under Year Your Years.
我的意思是，BRMC的第三张专辑是
How I mean, BRMC's third album is
也许是最佳专辑。
maybe maybe the best album.
毫无疑问。
Definitely.
第二张专辑没什么亮点。
The second one wasn't much chop.
是的。
Yeah.
但确实如此。
But yeah.
我的意思是，很多乐队都做到了。
I mean, a lot of them did.
The Vine的首张专辑、Interpol的首张专辑、The Strokes的首张专辑、The Libertines的首张专辑。
The Vine's first album, Interpol's first album, Strokes first album, Libertines first album.
这些乐队的口碑都是在第三张专辑时才真正爆发的，白条纹乐队也是如此。
These are sort of the I mean, the the hype sort of broke through on their third album and so did the White Stripes.
是的。
Yeah.
所以他们大概确实做到了，嗯。
So that they sort of probably did their Yeah.
它们的专辑，而且之后推出的才是各自的最佳专辑。
Albums and their best albums later on.
我说啊，《大象》那张专辑绝对是顶级水准，我根本不会把杀手乐队的作品归到这类里。
I mean, Elephant was probably killers killers, I wouldn't even put in there.
杀手乐队、 Franz Ferdinand、Bloc Party，
Killers, Franz Ferdinand, Block Party,
还有Kingsley，后来还有DuPont。
Kingsley, eventually, DuPont.
对。
Yeah.
他们大概是在2005年前后出道的。
I I they sort of came out in the mid two thousands.
他们算是借上了那股潮流的东风。
They sort of rode the wave.
你有没有了解过Datsons这支乐队？
Did you ever get into the Datsons?
是的。
Yeah.
我确实听过达特森乐队。
Did get into the Datsons.
是的。
Yeah.
他们的第一张专辑很棒。
The first album was great.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
我实际上看过好几次达特森乐队的演出。
I saw the Datsons a few times actually.
他们来自新西兰。
They're from New Zealand.
所以，是的。
So yeah.
不。
No.
第一张专辑非常好。
The first album's really good.
它非常具有时代特色。
It's very of its time.
是的。
Yeah.
它非常单一，但在它擅长的方面做得很好。
It's very one dimensional, but it's very good at what it does.
D4，另一张来自新西兰的专辑，没那么好。
The d four, the other one that came out of New Zealand, it weren't as good.
但，是的，看吧，那是一个很棒的场景。
But, yeah, look, it was a great scene.
而且，我的意思是，这可能是英国乐队中最早打开局面的，让很多其他乐队也得以兴起，比如我们常说的北极猴子。
And, I mean, this was, I guess, probably the the British band that opened it up to a lot of other those bands, you know, we talk about the Arctic Monkeys Yeah.
还有凯撒酋长乐队、马西莫公园和Block Party。
And, you know, the Kaiser Chiefs and Maximo Park and Block Party.
还有编辑乐队。
There were there were editors.
还有卡萨比安等很多乐队。
There are a lot of bands Kasabian?
纷纷涌现。
Coming out.
是的。
Yeah.
卡萨比安。
Kasabian.
2000年代中期是英国音乐非常美好的时代。
It was sort of a really great time for British music in the mid two thousands.
是的。
Yeah.
还有一波第二波，是的。
There was that second wave that Yeah.
花了点时间。
Took time.
那确实挺火的。
It was it was pretty big.
Ash乐队甚至复出了。
Ash even made a comeback.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
本该这样的，是的。
It should've yeah.
我的意思是，Babyshambles 也是那一波的一部分。
I mean, Babyshambles were part of that as well.
是的。
Yes.
乐队的历史。
History of the band.
我们上一期结束时提到过，今天我们将从一个适合开端的结局继续讲起。
We So we kind of left off the last episode where we're gonna pick up today, an ending fitting for the start.
是的。
Yeah.
我本来只想谈谈《Up the Bracket》的发行，因为我们差不多是在这张专辑发布时才刚完成的。
And I would just I was going to just talk about the release of because we pretty much just finished when the Up the Bracket was released.
所以看看当时它受到了怎样的评价，还挺有意思的。
And so it's kind of interesting to look at how that was received.
《卫报》给了它三颗星，五颗星中的三颗。
So in the Guardian, they gave it three stars, three out of five.
但《Q》杂志也给了它三颗星。
But that and Q gave it three stars.
是的。
Yeah.
但除此之外，《Blender》给了五颗星，《NME》给了八分（满分十分），《Pitchfork》给了八点五分（满分十分）。
But other than that, yeah, Blender five out of five, NME eight out of 10, Pitchfork eight and a half out of 10.
像《Pitchfork》给的分数比《NME》还高。
Like, Pitchfork going bigger than NME.
这就是《Pitchfork》，是的，他们这次判断错了。
That's Pitchfork, yeah, they got this one wrong.
但他们确实对过一些，我们稍后会讲到。
But they got a few of them because we'll go into it.
但第一张Babyshambles和Dirty Pretty Things的专辑，他们给了七分（满分十分）。
But the the first Babyshambles and Dirty Pretty Things, they gave like seven, seven by five.
是的。
Yeah.
我认为Pitchfork是一家糟糕的媒体，这一点很多人可能都知道。
And Pitchfork, I think, horrendous publication as people probably know.
但没错，他们过去确实很懂行。
But, yeah, they used to be onto it.
是的。
Yeah.
实际上，他们过去我认为比现在更尊重吉他音乐。
Actually, they used to, I think, respect guitars a lot more than they do now.
Spin给了它一个，The Village Voice也给了它一个。
And Spin gave it a and The Village Voice gave it a.
所以它确实获得了一些非常好的评价。
So some really some really good reviews it it got.
所以也有些评价是褒贬不一的。
So there were a few mixed ones.
我觉得当《Up the Bracket》发行时，很多人都觉得这是下一个大热之作。
I think when Up the Bracket came out, lot of people were thinking, Oh, this is the next big thing.
他们被过度炒作了。
They're completely over hyped.
我觉得这张专辑需要一段时间才能慢慢显现魅力。
And the album takes a while to grow, I think.
专辑发布前，我们提到过和六响枪乐队的巡演吗？
Before it came out, did we mention the tour with the Six Pistols?
他们是如何担任六响枪乐队的开场嘉宾的？
How they supported the Six Pistols?
我觉得我们提到过卡尔·巴雷特的一次对话。
I think we mentioned a conversation that Karl Barret had.
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
所以他们有过一些相当重要的开场演出。
So they they had a pretty few big, like, support acts.
他们为性手枪乐队担任开场嘉宾。
They supported the Sex Pistols.
观众对他们恨之入骨。
The crowd hated them through shit.
他们开始看到黄色潜水艇。
Started seeing yellow submarines.
他们穿着红色外套。
They were wearing the red coat.
但后来情况好转了。
But they came around.
他们为莫里西担任开场嘉宾，并在欧洲巡演。
They supported Morrissey and they toured Europe.
他们为 vines 乐队担任开场嘉宾。
They supported the Vines.
我们聊过这个。
We talked about that.
他们开始搞一些游击式的演出，比如在酒吧里用原声吉他表演，或者在他们家里？
And they started sort of doing their guerrilla gigs, which was Them playing in pubs with acoustic guitars or their house?
是的。
Yeah.
主要是他们在家里。
Their house, mainly.
是的。
Yeah.
我的意思是，确实也有酒吧。
I mean, there were pubs.
你说得对。
You're right.
但实际情况是，当第一张专辑正在录制时，皮特发现了lebertines.org。
But like So what happened is when this When the first album was being recorded, that's when Pete discovered lebertines.org.
他开始在网上发帖，逐步打破观众和乐队之间的隔阂。
And he sort of started posting and breaking down all these sort of barriers between the crowd and the band.
是的，他们就开始试着做了。
And yeah, they just sort of started testing.
第一次他说，自由人乐队要在我们家的门口演出。
And the first time he said, the libertines are playing at this gate at our house.
大家都以为这是个玩笑，只是论坛上有人在瞎说。
And everyone thought it was a joke, just somebody on the forum saying it.
有些人决定去现场，其中包括NME的记者安东尼·索顿。
And some people decided to go, including Anthony Thornton, an NME journalist.
那确实是一场真正的演出。
And it was actually a real gig.
之后，所有人都蜂拥而至。
And then after that everybody was all over it.
所以《卫报》说过一句话，我觉得完美地概括了那张首张专辑：‘还有谁能让文学看起来这么酷？’
So one of the things The Guardian said, which I think sums up that first album so well, they said, really has literacy looked so cool?
我觉得用这六个字来概括那张首张专辑，再贴切不过了。
And I think that's the best way in six words to sum up that first album.
展开剩余字幕（还有 480 条）
他们赢得了NME最佳新乐队奖，击败了BRMC、The Coral、The Vines和The Datsons。
They won best new band in the NME, best band of the year over BRMC, The Coral, The Vines, The Datsons.
哦，The Coral。
Oh, The Coral.
我从来没想过再听到这支乐队。
That's a band I never thought hearing again.
还有他们的音乐。
And the music.
是的。
Yeah.
他们其实还不错。
They're actually alright.
对。
Yeah.
我记得石玫瑰乐队的曼尼发现了他们，
I remember Manny from The Stone Roses picked them up,
我买了他们的专辑。
and I got their album.
是的。
Yeah.
他们在四月去日本巡演，那时皮特的行为开始变得非常古怪。
So they toured Japan in April, and there were a few like, Pete's behavior was starting to get really strange.
是的。
Yeah.
他在那里做了一件事，我想这预示着未来几年将要发生的事：他上了libertines.org，开始猛烈抨击约翰和加里。
And one of the things he did there, which I guess was a sign of things to come over the next couple of years is he went on to libertines.org and started kind of ripping into John and and Gary.
哦。
Oh.
他还说他们根本不算乐队成员，而且他和他们相处不来。
And sort of saying that they, you know, weren't really part of the band and that he wasn't getting on with them.
这有点过分了。
It's a bit of a dick move.
是的。
Yeah.
他经常做这种事。
He did this kind of thing a lot.
好的。
Okay.
海洛因会让人变得傲慢。
Heroin makes you arrogant.
是的。
Yeah.
他当时在使用，我不太清楚，但是
And he was on I wouldn't know actually, but
不。
No.
我不知道。
I don't know.
但凡是用过海洛因的音乐人，都会变得傲慢。
But, like, everyone who any musician who's been on heroin has becomes arrogant.
是的。
Yeah.
他们变得那样，然后通常都会死掉。
They become like And then they die usually.
是的。
Yeah.
所以没错。
So yeah.
他有一次在日本演出，刚开场第一首歌就开始砸掉所有音箱。
He sorta he had this show that this one gig they played in Japan and he just smashed up all the amps on the first song as soon as they started playing.
是的。
Yeah.
大家都对他非常不满。
And everybody was really quite shitty with him.
然后他留在那里，独自清唱，接着回到后台割了自己的胸口。
And then he sort of stayed there and sang a cappella by himself, and then he went backstage and cut his chest.
这很有野心。
That's ambitious.
是的。
Yeah.
给他点药吧，或者随便什么都行。
Give him a fix or whatever.
嗯，我觉得他其实正在经历戒断反应，因为他当时在日本。
Well, think he was actually going through withdrawal because he was sort of in Japan and
很难接触到你。
It's hard to get to you.
是的。
Yeah.
没错。
Exactly.
他一从英国回来，就直接去了白教堂，去找彼得·沃尔夫和沃尔夫曼，开始吸可卡因。
And as soon as he arrived back from The UK, he went straight to Whitechapel to meet up with Peter Wolf, Wolfman, and get onto the crack.
所以这正是他说自己不再和卡尔混在一起，而是和新团队混在一起的时候。
So this is kind of when he said it wasn't hanging out with Carl so much, but hanging out with his new crew.
我想我之前提到过彼得·沃尔夫是个阴暗的人物。
And I think I mentioned Peter Wolf as this sort of dark figure.
我们和他合作过一首歌。
We did a song with him.
是的。
Yeah.
他确实参与了。
He did.
有点特制的。
Bit chartered.
对。
Yeah.
我们会深入讲这个。
We we'll go into that.
是的。
Yeah.
他和他合作过一首歌。
He did a song with him.
他是个词作者，有点失败者的模样，自以为是个作家，实际上只是那种人
He was this songwriter, kinda loser dude who thought he was a writer and basically was just one of these
像超级手那样的人？
Like super hands or something?
是的。
Yeah.
有点像《IT狂人》里那个超级手，但更糟一些。
A bit like super hands from if people know who that is from Peep Show, but kinda worse.
2003年5月，他们去了纽约，开始制作下一张专辑，并称之为‘Baby Shambles’录音 session。
In May 2003, that's when they went to New York and they started working on the next album and and they called it the Baby Shambles session.
是的。
Yeah.
那就是
That's the
那些由自由人乐队和婴儿沙堡录制的歌曲，比如《号角的最后一声》《阿尔比恩》《沉溺于这种感觉》《路边》。
one that laid down songs that are recorded by Libertines and Baby Shambles, like Last Post of the Bugle Albion, which is on down Albion, In Love With The Feeling, The Side Of The Road.
还有《关闭我们国家》。
And then Shut Us Nation.
是的。
Yeah.
但确实很多。
But yeah, a lot.
三张CD那么多，因为我记得我订购过。
Three CDs worth because I remember ordering it.
真的吗？
Oh, really?
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
而且有很多原声版本。
And a lot of acoustic.
约翰只在一首歌里演奏过，我想。
And John only played on one song, think.
所以大部分都是卡尔和皮特的。
So a lot of it is Carl and Pete.
是的。
Yeah.
而且我觉得，那就是他们俩都在手上纹了‘The Libertines’的时候，是吧。
And I think, well, that that that's when they both got Libertines tattooed on their hands Yeah.
还有卡尔的笔迹。
And Carl's handwriting.
他们唱过一首叫《Good Old Days》的歌，歌里列出了他们说过要明天做的事，其中一个人说要去纹身。
There's a bit they did a song Good Old Days, and during that they say a list of things we'd said we'd do tomorrow and he says get a tattoo.
皮特说要去纹身。
Pete says get a tattoo.
第二天，他们就去纹了那个著名的自由人纹身。
The next day they went out and got the very famous Libertine tattoo.
皮特把三张CD都给了一个叫海伦·苏的人，让他把它们放到网上，这正是你得到它们的原因。
Pete gave the CDs, all the three CDs, to someone called Helen Sue and told him to put them on the internet, which he did, which is obviously how you got them.
是的，我的意思是，他通过在网上发帖，约她在切尔西酒店大堂见面。
Yeah, well, I mean, he met her by posting online for her to meet me at the Chelsea Hotel in the lobby.
就是费舍尔去世的地方？
Where Fisher died?
是的。
Yeah.
嗯，还有很多耶稣的内容。
Well, yeah, with a lot of Jesus.
这就是我们之前提到过的那个非常著名的例子。
Is like very famous one we've talked about.
我想我们在关于帕蒂·史密斯的那一段里聊过这个。
I think we talked about that in Patti Spear, Patti Smith one.
所以是的，她在那里遇见了他，他把CD交给她，让她上传上去。
But So yeah, she met him there and he gave him the CDs and told her to upload them.
我想这大概是互联网第一次被这样使用，因为这些内容后来出现在了二十周年纪念版里。
And I guess this was sort of the first time when the Internet was being used on this, where because this is the sort of stuff that comes out in twentieth anniversary edition.
就在那里，早期的样带。
It's right there, early demos.
但新专辑中尚未正式发行的歌曲，已经免费发布了。
But the songs that hadn't been released off the new album were already being released for free
给粉丝们。
to fans.
而且第一批宝宝帮派的歌曲也已经发布了。
And the first two Babyshambles out there.
是的
Yeah.
没错
Exactly.
那是一大堆新歌。
It was a mountain of new songs.
一定非常令人兴奋。
It must have been so exciting.
我说我得到了它们，其实是在我听到之后才得到的，那时候我也没法上网。
When I say I got them, I got them after I heard the I didn't have access to the Internet as well back in this
大概有多少首歌？
How many songs for
不知道。
don't know.
其中有一首歌有二十分钟长，是个串烧。
Well, one of the songs is like twenty minutes long, it's a medley.
但说实话，我觉得每张CD上大概有十二三首歌。
But, yeah, I'd say there's probably about 12 or 13 Shit.
每张CD上大约有这么多歌。
Songs on each CD.
是的。
Yeah.
大概有四十首歌左右。
It's like Probably about 40 songs in there.
就像是他们的
It's like their
宽幅专辑。
wide albums.
是的。
Yeah.
没错。
It is.
我的意思是，其中一些是第一张专辑的版本。
I mean, some of them were the ones versions of the first Yeah.
但很多都是新歌。
Album, but, yeah, a lot of them are new.
比如这张第二张专辑的很多歌都来自Babyshambles的录音 sessions。
Like, a lot of this second album, a lot of the songs were on the Babyshambles sessions.
这真是太棒了。
It's it's great.
实际上真的很好，哦，里面还有几首翻唱曲。
It's actually such a really oh, there's a few covers as well.
是的。
Yeah.
我觉得
I think
Adam Green，他可能也签过Rough Trade，是Moldy Peaches的成员，是的。
Adam Green, who may have been on Rough Trade as well, who was in Moldy Peaches Yeah.
《What a Wasted》有一首翻唱版本。
Does What a Wasted, does a cover version.
我觉得有The Stone Roses的《Sally Cinnamon》。
I think there's Sally Cinnamon by The Stone Roses.
是的。
Yeah.
还有几首，我觉得也有《The Last》这首歌。
There's a few there's The Last song, I think, as well.
比如，是的。
Like yeah.
这真的很酷，而且录音质量也没那么差。
It's it's it's pretty cool, and it's really but the recordings are not that bad.
它们显然是小样，但是
They're obviously demos, but
用的是不错的麦克风。
They're with good mics.
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
氛围真的很棒。
They're real good atmosphere.
是的。
Yeah.
我想我们第一期做的自由人专辑，音质可能不太好，说到好麦克风了。
And I think maybe the first episode we did, the first Libertines episode, the sound quality might not be that good, speaking of good mics.
对此表示歉意。
So apologies for that.
我们当时在尝试。
We were experimenting.
我们确实买了一个新麦克风，它带有一个小调音台，但我们还没弄明白怎么用。
We we actually bought a new mic and it's got like a little soundboard but we haven't figured it out.
我们正在处理这个问题。
We're working on it.
我们正在买一台新电脑或新笔记本电脑，是的。
We're getting a new computer or new laptop Yeah.
我们会为下一集把这个问题解决好。
And we've got we're gonna get it sorted for the next episodes.
也许我们应该搞个Patreon。
Maybe we should get a Patreon.
是的。
Yeah.
也许吧。
Maybe.
我们正在努力工作，花了很多钱。
We're working really hard and spending a lot of money.
是的。
Yeah.
而且我们还有一些非常酷的东西正在酝酿中。
And we've got some really cool stuff potentially bubbling.
我们希望让所有内容的声音都达到最佳效果。
We wanna get everything sounding great.
是的。
Yeah.
没错。
Exactly.
所以我想他们曾经在CBGBs演出过，那地方还在的时候还挺酷的。
So I guess they played CBGBs, which was kind of cool when it was around.
他们演出过
They played
你有没有，我去过，我提过这件事。
Did you I went to I've talked about this.
在2003年。
In 2003.
是的。
Yeah.
他们去了鲍里街音乐厅演出，之后见到了达蒙·阿尔巴恩，你之前提到过这件事吗？
They went to the They played at the Bowery Ballroom, and they met Damon Albarn after the did you meet about this?
没有。
No.
达蒙·阿尔巴恩特意 backstage 去见他们，就像见偶像一样。
And Damon Albarn came backstage to meet them, like, as this hero dude.
据说，皮特对他特别无礼。
Apparently, Pete was just super rude to him.
他表现得非常冷淡，达蒙想和他握手，他却盯着对方的手看了好久，然后只说了一句：‘嘿，伙计，最近怎么样？’
He was really aloof and then Damon tried to shake his hand and he just looked at his hand for ages and then said, how you going mate?
说完就转身走开了。
And then just turned around and walked off.
达蒙·阿尔巴恩说：‘我给你们一点建议吧，作为过来人。'
And Damon Albarn was like, I'll give you guys a bit of advice coming from me.
你对观众太好了，你得把他们当垃圾对待。
You treat your audience too well, you've got to treat them like shit.
那就是达蒙·奥尔班给的建议。
Like, that that was Damon Orban's advice.
达蒙·奥尔班？我上次去看模糊乐队巡演，那真是他妈最做作、最无聊的演出，他们根本不想演，我再也不会去看他任何一场破演出了。
Damon Orban, like, I I I went and saw the Blurs last tour and it was the most fucking plastic, boring like, they did not wanna be there and I'll never ever go and see any of his fucking shit again.
是的。
Yeah.
他是个混蛋。
He's a cunt.
有人发了一篇评论，说那场演出装腔作势又烦人，就在这些评论里。
Well, somebody posted a review that said that was pretentious and annoying on one of these reviews.
这些评论中的某些？
Some of these reviews?
知道。
Know.
但他确实傲慢又烦人。
But he is pretentious and annoying.
他一点幽默感都没有。
He's got no humor.
不，没有。
No, no.
当他们在美國时，他们上了大卫·莱特曼的节目。
When they were in The US, they played David Letterman.
我想我提过他们表演了《I Get Along》。
I think I mentioned they played I Get Along.
他们穿着红色外套什么的。
They were wearing their red coats and that.
我觉得他们穿着红色外套。
I think they were wearing their red coats.
总之，当他们在纽约时，皮特完全失控了。
Anyway, when they were in New York, Pete was off the rails.
卡尔在他的回忆录中提到了这件事。
Carl goes into it in his memoirs.
我觉得皮特·沃尔夫曼告诉他：嘿，如果你想搞到东西，就随便去找个无家可归的人。
I think Pete Wolfman told him, hey, if you wanna get if you wanna score, just go up to any homeless dude.
他们不知道那地方在哪。
They don't know where it is.
所以他 basically 就跟这些无家可归的人都交上了朋友。
So he basically just befriended all these homeless people.
是的。
Yeah.
他把他们带回了酒店。
He brought them back to the hotel.
凯尔说，那里到处都是瘾君子和贩子晃悠。
And Kyle was like, there were just all these junkies hanging out and dealers hanging out.
皮特走过来对他说：老兄，我真的很担心。
And Pete came up to him and said, dude, I'm really worried.
我不知道怎么把这些人都弄出去。
I don't know how to get these people out of here.
所以 apparently，Kyle 就这么进去了，因为
So apparently, Kyle just went in there because
他
he
状态太差了，直接把他们都赶了出去。
was so fucked up and just went and kicked them all out.
是的。
Yeah.
基本上就是把他们 physically 推了出去。
Basically, just physically pushed them out.
对。
Yeah.
然后他说，Pete 根本没感谢我。
And then he said, Pete never thanked me for it.
在皮特的书中，凯尔对他有点抱怨。
In Pete's In Kyle's memoirs, he's kind of like a bit whingy about Pete.
他有点心存不满。
He's got a bit of a chip on his shoulder.
我觉得他待自己挺好的，但他对皮特确实有点抱怨。
Like, I think I think he hands handles himself very well, but he's he is a bit whingy about Pete.
但这也无可厚非。
But that's that's fair enough.
我觉得他有理由这么想。
Think he got the entitled to be.
他们回来后，据说沃尔夫曼搬去和一个叫杰克·菲奥尔的人同住，这人挺有意思的。
When they got back, there was this I guess what happened is Wolfman moved in with a guy Jake Fior, who's really interesting.
他和瑞奇·热维斯一起演出过，就是这个叫杰克·菲奥尔的人。
He played with Ricky Gervais, this guy Jake Fior.
他还是《黑书》中迪伦·莫兰角色的灵感来源。
And he also is the inspiration for Dylan Moran's character in Black Books.
他经营一家书店。
He owned a bookshop.
所以彼得·沃尔夫搬进了冈瑟巷。
So Peter Wolf moved into Gunther Grove.
冈瑟巷。
Gunther Grove.
是的。
Yeah.
我觉得约翰尼·罗滕曾经住过那里。
I think Johnny Rotten lived once.
我想，那就是他们第一次举办这种大型狂野演出的地方，当时还贴了告示。
And that was, I guess, where they first sort of had one of these big gorilla gigs where it was posted.
彼得没来，抱歉，卡尔也没到场，但警察来了，场面有点失控。
Pete didn't turn up sorry, Carl didn't turn up to that, but the police did and it went a bit haywire.
那里有很多吸毒者和形形色色的怪人。
And there were just a lot of druggy people and out there sort of people.
我觉得Paddington乐队演出过。
I think the Paddington's played.
Pete和Wolfman都演了。
Pete and Wolfman played.
Pete有点生气了，我想这对他来说是个转折点，因为当时他们正要搬走，Pete意识到他可以召集这些人自己组织活动，而不必通过公司或经纪人。
Pete got kind of pissed, I guess this was sort of a turning point for him saying Because they were moving away at this stage and I think Pete realized he could call upon all these people organize this and not go through companies, not go through managers.
他当时和他们的经纪人Benny关系不好。
He wasn't getting along with Benny, their manager at the moment.
他和Carl也合不来。
He wasn't getting on with Carl.
所以Rough Trade方面试图让他听话。
So he was The rough trade was sort of trying to get him into line.
于是他渐渐地，你知道的，Babyshambles这样的模式以及自己动手做事的想法就占了上风。
So he sort of you know, and that's where this Babyshambles sort of thing and doing things himself sort of took over.
大约在这个时候，他们正在录制《别回头望向太阳》。
Around this time they were recording, don't look back into the sun.
所以
And so
和伯纳德·巴特勒一起。
With Bernard Butler.
是的。
Yeah.
和伯纳德·巴特勒一起。
With Bernard Butler.
彼得就是不喜欢，他几乎没怎么出现。
And and Pete just didn't like it and he didn't really turn up much.
他们试图让他来，但他就是不配合。
They tried to get him to turn up and he just wasn't having it.
我昨晚其实听了《别回头望向太阳》。
I was actually listening to Don't Look Back Into the Sun last night and
这是一首很棒的歌。
It's a great song.
是的。
Yeah.
但他们不得不依靠皮特的指导人声来拼凑这首歌，其中有一段你能清楚地听到卡尔·巴雷特补录了皮特的部分。
But they had to piece it together from Pete's guide vocals and there's this one bit where you can just hear Carl Barrett patching over Pete's bit.
是的。
Yeah.
然后吉他部分，伯纳德·巴特勒不得不演奏皮特的吉他部分。
And then the guitar bits, Bernard Butler had to play Pete's guitar bits.
是的。
Yeah.
也许这就是为什么它听起来这么棒。
Maybe that's why it sounds so good.
而这基本上就是他们分崩离析的过程。
And that this is basically them crumbling.
他根本就不出现。
He wasn't turning up.
他们相处得不好。
They weren't getting on.
我们来听一下这首歌吧。
And let's actually listen to that song.
是的。
Yeah.
这首歌没有收录在任何专辑里。
It's not on any album.
没有。
No.
没有。
No.
确实没有。
It's not.
它是一首独立发行的单曲，就像《What a Wasted》那样。
It's a stand alone single like What a Wasted.
好的。
Okay.
不要回头看太阳。
Don't look back into the sun.
是的。
Yeah.
这是一首很棒的歌。
It's a great song.
很棒的歌。
Great song.
所以我想，大约在2003年5月左右，发生了一个巨大的转折点。
So I guess a huge turning point happened in I think it was around May 2003.
我觉得卡尔是五月或六月出生的。
Think I think Carl's born in May, so or June.
不管怎样，那时候正好是卡尔的生日。
Anyway, around that time, because it was on Carl's birthday.
所以，皮特，在那场冈特罗夫罗夫的演出之后，又在怀特查佩尔组织了一场。
So Pete, after that Gunter Grove Grove gig, organized one in Whitechapel.
这就像一场神奇的神秘之旅，他在网上发帖，人们在某个地点集合，然后被引导到怀特查佩尔的一处屋顶。
And it was like this magical mystery tour where he posted online and people met in a certain place, then they got guided to this rooftop in Whitechapel.
皮特
Pete
他对这场活动非常兴奋。
was super excited about it.
卡尔说：‘嗯，我会去表演。’
Carl said, Yep, I'll come and play.
因为他没去上一场。
Because he didn't go to the last one.
当时，卡尔正和朋友们在生日当天聚会。
At this time, Carl was hanging out with his friends on his birthday.
他们组织了卡拉OK之类的活动，他玩得特别开心。
And they sort of organized this karaoke and this thing, he was loving it.
他说，能和自己喜欢的人在一起真好。
He was like, oh, it's nice to be around people I like.
总之，卡尔没去这场演出。
Anyway, Carl didn't go to this gig.
是的。
Yeah.
而且大家都问，卡尔去哪儿了？
And Pete was pretty much Everybody was saying, where's Carl?
他一直在等，后来到了凌晨一点、两点，他试着打电话给卡尔，但卡尔还是没出现。
And he was waiting, and then it went I think it got to 1AM, 2AM and he was trying to call him and Carl didn't turn up.
我觉得那是个巨大的转折点。
I think that was a huge I mean it was a huge turning point.
他很生气，因为第二天就是自由人乐队欧洲巡演的开始，而卡尔，抱歉。
Was pissed because the next day was the start of the European tour for the Libertines and Carl oh, sorry.
彼得没搭上车。
Pete didn't get on
去德国的火车上，却没有出现参加演出。
the train to Germany and didn't turn up to the gig.
皮特，确实非常生气。
Pete, yeah, was so annoyed.
他决定不再参加那次巡演，因为出现了这场缺席。
There was this no show that he decided, I'm not gonna go on that tour.
我要让他们看看。
I'll I'll show them.
他根本就没出现，而尼克·加夫里洛维奇是那个技术人员，后来他就在巴士上成了自由人乐队的一员，他们当时问：你
And, yeah, he just didn't turn up and it was Nick Gavrilovich who was like the tech and that he basically became a member of The Libertines, like, while he's in the bus, they were like, did you
那压力怎么办？
What about a fucking pressure?
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
没错。
Exactly.
所以当时皮特想回来，但卡尔说不行。
So Pete at this time, right, because they they pretty much Pete wanted to come back and say, Carl said no.
他们召开了一场新闻发布会，不对，是发布了新闻声明。
And they put out a press conference sorry, a press statement.
声明大致说，彼得身体不适。
And it was basically saying, Peter is unwell.
我们不能和他一起演出。
We can't play with him.
等他好些了，欢迎他回来。
He's welcome back when he's better.
说白了，他完蛋了。
Basically, he's fucked.
我们不能让他和我们一起演出。
We can't have him playing with us.
他们所做的就是皮特决定自己成立一个自由派乐队。
What they did was they What Pete did So Pete decided to start his own libertines.
所以，你叫它自由派乐队？
So he Oh, you called libertines?
不，不是，是自由派乐队。
No, no, libertines.
实际上，是tlibertines还是tlibertines，或者什么奇怪的名字？
Actually Was it a tlibertines or tlibertines or something weird?
哦，是吗？
Oh, was it?
好吧。
Okay.
但他根本没那么做过。
Well he never did that.
根本没有什么自由派乐队，但他确实打算在查塔姆玩一种塔普和丁琴。
There was never any libertines but he sort of started He was gonna play this tap and tin in Chatham.
是的。
Yeah.
那里有一家酒吧，他打算去The Libertines演出。
A pub there, he was gonna play at The Libertines.
那是一场大型的慈善演出。
It was a big issue benefit show.
但他没有去，根本没有去。
But he didn't Didn't
没出现吗？
turn up?
是的，他没出现。
Yeah, he didn't turn up.
他实际上开始组建了Babyshambles，当时的阵容非常奇怪。
He actually got a really well, this is when he started Babyshambles, and it was a really weird line up.
其中有个来自一支叫The Only Ones Kids的乐队的家伙。
It was some guy from a band called The Only Ones Kids.
皮特·珀罗特。
Pete Perrott.
是的。
Yeah.
谁会参与录音，因为他当时在录音现场。
Who who will go into in the recording, because he was there at the the recording.
好的。
Okay.
我认为在这个阶段是他、斯卡伯勒和史蒂夫。
I I think at this stage it was him, Scarborough, Steve.
那是他的杰玛·克拉克。
It was his Gemma Clark.
这人的儿子们
This guy's sons
来自皮特·珀罗特。
from Pete Perrott.
是的。
Yeah.
好的。
Okay.
我以为他们稍后才进来，但可能……哦，是的。
I I thought they were in a bit later, but may maybe Oh, yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
或者我说，当时的阵容是流动的。
Or I mean, it was a fluid lineup.
是的。
Yeah.
但这个时候还没有Baby Shambles。
But there wasn't quite baby shambles at this stage.
我觉得他只是在即兴演奏。
I think he was just jamming.
我想他当时正和他们一起即兴演奏。
I think he was jamming with them.
但我认为他还是和这些人安排了一场婴儿混乱的演出，尽管他们没出现。
But I think he booked a baby shambles gig with these people when they didn't turn up.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
所以。
So
所以那简直是一团糟。
So it was a shambles.
是的。
Yeah.
大概在这个时候，是的，最令人揪心的部分之一是，欧洲巡演之后，自由人乐队和卡尔进行了英国巡演。
So around this time, yeah, what was going so one of the most harrowing parts is after the European tour, The Libertines with Karl played in The UK tour.
他说第一场是在曼彻斯特，几乎演变成了一场骚乱。
He said the first night was in Manchester and it just almost a riot.
整个观众开始扔东西。
The whole crowd started throwing things.
大家都在问：彼得在哪？
Everybody was where where is Pete?
我们要彼得。
We want Pete.
整个巡演期间，粉丝群体开始出现分裂。
And it was this whole tour, like and and the whole fan base was starting to get divided at this stage.
他们说论坛上全都是各种机会。
And they were like The Forum had whole chances.
自由人乐队的粉丝们分成两派：有人说彼得是个瘾君子，现在又说彼得是天才。
Libertines all was like, Pete's a junkie, and now the Pete Gone, Pete's a genius.
甚至连观众中也发生了冲突，支持彼得的和支持卡尔的互相争斗。
And even the crowd, some people got There were fights in the crowd, like the pro Pete and the pro Carl.
所以，这不仅让乐队内部变得分裂，粉丝群体也开始分化。
So it was just becoming really divided, not only in the band, but in the fans.
大约在这个时候，Kill City乐队的主唱丽莎·莫里什怀上了皮特的孩子。
Around this time, Lisa Morrish, who was the lead singer from Kill City, got pregnant with Pete's baby.
是的。
Yeah.
她和埃米莉亚一起巡演。
That toured with Emilia.
皮特决定进入疗养院（Priory）戒毒，Rough Trade公司为他支付了费用。
Pete decided to go into rehab, the Priory, and Rough Trade sort of paid for it.
但他只在那里待了五到六天。
But he only He was only there five to six days.
这是在六月份。
This is in June.
是的。
Yeah.
他的儿子在七月出生。
And his son was born in July.
事情是这样的，他有个女朋友，而狼人发消息告诉他要娶她。
What happened is he had this girlfriend and Wolfman just sent him a message saying he was marrying her.
于是皮特自己办了出院。
And so Pete checked himself out.
但当他赶到时，狼人却说：不，我只是想让你出来。
Then when he got there, Wolfman was like, no, I just wanted you to come out.
并让他重新投入工作。
And got him back into the gear.
真是杯具。
What a cup.
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
所以这有点像是，真是够恶心的，
So this is sort of What a what's nasty,
恶心的人。
nasty people.
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
所以，正如你所说，皮特第一次参加Babyshambles的演出是在佩克汉姆的艾维之家，但他没出现。
So, yeah, as you say, Pete's first Babyshambles gig was in Peckham in the Ivy House, and he didn't turn up.
所以，没错，论坛上开始出现很多喷子。
So, yeah, the the forums started going there were a lot of trolls coming out.
整个乐队都给人一种特别恶心的感觉。
Like, the whole band had this just real nasty feel about it.
还有另一场演出。
There was another gig.
我觉得是在凯尔文。
It was in Kelvin, I think.
而且又没出现。
And there was an it was a no show again.
是的。
Yeah.
但发生的是，到了某个时间点，公告上说皮特被逮捕了。
But what happened is people got to a certain time and then there were There was word on the announcement that Pete had been arrested.
是的。
Yeah.
所以实际情况是，当自由人乐队正在演出时，皮特去了卡尔的公寓。
And so what had happened is while the actual Libertines were around playing, Pete had gone into Carl's flat
还有多尔加吉他？
and Dollar guitar?
是的。
Yeah.
笔记本电脑。
Laptop.
是的。
Yeah.
像一把复古吉他，还有一些别的东西。
Like a vintage guitar, some some other things.
怎么回事？
What was the deal?
比如，只是
Like, was it like just
所以皮特说他当时海洛因吸得特别严重。
So Pete sort of said that he was pretty fucked up on heroin
在
at
我想他是去找他谈话，然后破门而入，偷走了东西。
the I think he went round there to talk to him and then he kicked in the door and just stole stuff.
他给丽莎·莫里斯打了电话，是的。
He rang up Lisa Morris Yeah.
那是他孩子的母亲，她报了警。
The mother of his child, and she went to the police.
是的。
Yeah.
她向警察说了情况。
She she told the police.
我不想给她太多发言机会，但我对她评价不高。
I don't wanna give her too much airtime, but I don't rate her much.
哦，好吧。
Oh, okay.
是的。
Yeah.
我其实不太
I don't really
我不会考虑。不。
think about No.
我的意思是
I mean
是的。
yeah.
她的歌并不怎么样。
Her songs aren't that good.
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
她啊，是的。
She's yeah.
你这是在给她你的时间啊，伙计。
You're giving her your time, buddy.
对此感到抱歉。
Sorry about it.
但她乐队最棒的地方是，曾为Babyshambles提供过一位吉他手。
But the best thing about her band is that it gave Babyshambles at one of their guitarists.
是的。
Yeah.
好的。
Okay.
是的，实际上，在《Kill City》时期，吉他手Pete Welsh写了第一本关于暴动少年的书。
Yeah, so actually, at Kill City, the guitarist Pete Welsh wrote, I guess, the first book on the kids in the riot.
是的。
Yeah.
他们有一部口述历史。
They have those an oral history.
那是一部口述历史。
It was an oral history.
关于自由人？
Of of libertines?
这是一部关于自由人的口述历史。
It was an oral history, like, of the libertines.
是的。
Yeah.
所以书中汇集了不同人的引述。
So it's you're all the different people with quotes.
所以你只是带着录音机去采访，然后记录下来。
So you just had a tape recorder and wrote
整理出来。
it out.
是的，我想是这样。
Yeah, I guess.
但这本书不错，不过我想问题在于当时皮特状态很糟糕。
But it's it's good, but, like, I guess the problem with it is Pete's fucked up at the time.
所以他一直在说这些根本不是真的、特别糟糕的事情。
So he's just saying all these really fucked up things that weren't even true.
嗯哼。
Mhmm.
你真的不知道该相信什么。
And you don't really know what to believe.
我想，一共有四本书。
There there's, I guess, four books.
其中一本是卡尔·巴雷特的回忆录，写得非常好。
One is the Karl Barret memoirs, which are really good.
但你知道，这些都是一些非常私人的个人故事。
But you know, it's very private personal stories kind of thing.
一部特里波尼的回忆录。
A Thrypony memoir.
是的。
Yeah.
说唱乐队的回忆录。
Thrypony memoir.
还有一本名叫《绑在一起》的书，作者是《新音乐快递》的记者安东尼·桑顿，还有为第二张专辑拍摄封面的罗杰·萨金特。
There's one called Bound Together by Anthony Thornton, who's an NMA journalist, and Roger Sargent who photographed the cover of the second album.
那本书写得特别好。
And that's really good.
我觉得那是最权威的一本。
I would say that's the definitive book.
对。
Yeah.
还有另一本叫《多彻蒂：最后的摇滚浪漫主义者》。
There's another one called Docherty, Last of the Rock Romantics.
没错。
Yeah.
而且这本书实际上写得非常好。
And that's actually really good.
是的。
Yeah.
那是亚历克斯·某人的作品。
That's by Alex somebody.
我想不起来了。
I can't remember.
还有另一本叫《Riot中的孩子》，那本书还行。
And the other one, there's Kids in the Riot, which is that which is okay.
它遗漏了很多内容。
It misses out a lot.
所以，总之，如果你对进一步阅读这个话题感兴趣，我会推荐《Bound Together》。
So yeah, anyway, I would recommend Bound Together if you're interested in reading further on this.
这是一个引人入胜的故事。
It's a fascinating story.
8月11日，他认罪了，皮特承认了入室盗窃。
August 11, he pleaded guilty, Pete guilty to burglary.
他被判了六个月。
He got six months.
大家都觉得这相当令人震惊。
Everybody thought it was pretty shocking.
他被关进了旺兹沃思监狱，奥斯卡·王尔德也曾被关在那里。
He went to Wandsworth Prison where Oscar Wilde went.
我们觉得他有点那样。
We saw he kind of like that.
他收到了很多信。
Got lots of mail.
卡尔寄了一张明信片。
Carl sent some postcard.
我想他在三周后提出了上诉。
He had an appeal after three weeks, I think.
所以法官罗杰·戴维斯判处他六个月监禁。
So judge Roger Davies sentenced him to six months.
然后他的刑期在上诉后被德里克·因曼·库尔法官减刑。
And then his sentence was reduced on appeal by judge Derek Inman Cool.
在两站火车上。
In two Just for the train spot.
是的。
Yeah.
彼得和卡尔在这里闹翻了，但卡尔还是安排好去接他。
Pete and Carl had sort of fallen out here, but Carl had sort of organized with him to go and pick him up.
所以在10月8日，他在监狱服刑两个月后，于上午10:30获释。
And so on the October 8, after his two months in prison, he was released at 10:30 a.
上午。
M.
囚犯LL 5217。
Prisoner LL 5217.
卡尔在那里，他们吃了饭，洗了澡，然后直接去了酒吧喝酒。
Carl was there, and they had some food, had a shower, and went straight to the pub to get pissed.
第二张专辑的经典封面就是在那时候拍的，是的。
And the classic album cover of the second album was taken Yeah.
在专辑发布的时候。
When it got released.
那就是那个晚上。
That was the night.
皮特·道格蒂说，监狱里其实什么都能弄到。
And Pete Dougherty, he says that the thing about prison, like, can get anything you want.
你可以弄到任何毒品，可以弄到酿酒精的原料，但最让他恼火的是，他想写东西的时候却弄不到纸和笔。
You can get any drug you want, you can get the ingredients to make alcohol, but the thing that pissed him off the most was he couldn't get pen and paper when he wanted it.
真的吗？
Really?
是的。
Yeah.
哇。
Wow.
他会为此大发雷霆。
And he would kick
对这件事大加抱怨。
up a stink about that.
这太惊人了。
That's amazing.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
这很酷。
That's cool.
所以我想，那天他获释时，显然你在他专辑封面上看到的念珠，是他从神父那里拿走的。
So I guess that day he got released, apparently the rosary beads you see him wearing on the album cover, he'd taken from The Priest.
这很奇怪，因为这后来成了一个巨大的时尚潮流。
And it's so weird because that became a huge fashion statement.
在Babyshambles的演唱会上，前排的黄牛会出售念珠，因为他开始佩戴它们。
At Babyshambles gigs, the touts at the front would be selling rosary beads, because he started wearing them.
他们去了现在被称为‘自由演出’的现场，地点是Tap and Tin，也就是他原本要在查塔姆演出却未现身的同一个地方。
They went to what's now known as the Freedom Gig, and that was at the Tap and Tin, the same no show place where he was gonna play in Chatham.
于是Libs乐队在那里表演了。
And so the Libs played there.
他们表演了简短的一套曲目，Pete和Gary也去了。
They played a short set, and Pete and Gary went as well.
这是他们被乐队开除后，很久以来第一次再次同台演出。
And it was the first time they'd played together for a long time since they've been kicked out of the band.
节奏部分本来就不该出现。
Rhythm section weren't ever meant to turn up.
是的。
Yeah.
所以这是一件大事。
So it was a big thing.
是的。
Yeah.
就是这样。
That's it.
那实际上是一个巨大的时刻。
And that was actually like this huge moment.
比如，敌人称那是年度最佳演出。
Like, enemy called it the gig of the year.
是的。
Yeah.
据说有人哭了。
Apparently, there were people crying.
每个人都觉得，他们回来了。
Everybody was like, they're back.
这是一个充满希望的时刻。
It was this moment of hope.
人们以为皮特会死。
People thought Pete was gonna die.
他进过监狱。
He'd gone to prison.
乐队在他缺席的情况下继续演出。
The band were playing without him.
他当时正在组建自己的乐队，但就在那场演出中，一切突然凝聚在了一起。
He was forming his own band, and then all of a sudden, everything came together at this this gig.
是的。
Yeah.
于是，这成了一个让人忘却一切、乐队重归的时刻。
And So it was this kind of moment where it was all forgotten and the band were back.
那时Babyshambles仍在演出，但他们打算回归The Libertines。
Babyshambles still were playing around this time, but they were going to move on with the Libertines.
所以大约在这个时候，班尼·普奇离开了。
So around this time, Banny Pucci quit.
她只是说，时间够了。
She was just like, that's enough time.
她把接力棒交给了艾伦·麦吉，他是一位相当知名的人物，创立了Creation唱片公司，发掘了My Bloody Valentine等乐队。
She handed over the reins to Alan McGee, who is a pretty well known guy who started Creation Records, Discovered, you know, My Bloody Valentine
是的。
Yeah.
还有Primal Scream和Jesus and Mary Chain。
Primal Scream, and Jesus and Mary Chain.
他称他们是他合作过的最具文化意义的乐队。
And he called them the most culturally significant band he's ever worked with.
说得通。
Fair enough.
对。
Yeah.
所以他想做的，是带他们去威尔士，去他那座与世隔绝的家里，让Pete远离这些设备。
And so what he wanted to do, he wanted to take them away to Wales, to his house, which was completely isolated from everything, to get Pete away from the gear Yeah.
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