出生星盘中的土星与海王星合相

嘿。

Hey.

我的名字是克里斯·布伦南，你正在收听占星播客。

My name is Chris Brennan, and you're listening to the astrology podcast.

在这一集中，我将探讨土星与海王星的合相以及出生星盘，并分享我最近进行的一些初步研究，关于这种合相如何在不同个体的生活中体现，特别是聚焦于那些生活有详细记录的名人和知名人士。

In this episode, I'm gonna look at Saturn Neptune conjunctions and birth charts and share some preliminary research I've been doing recently about how that shows up in the lives of different individuals, especially focusing in this case on, celebrities and notable individuals who have documented lives.

好的。

Alright.

所以，今天我是在2026年2月16日录制的，土星与海王星的合相将在几天后的2月20日精确发生。

So, today, I'm recording this on 02/16/2026, and the Saturn Neptune conjunction is finally going exact just days from now on February 20.

在过去几年里，我们经常从世俗角度讨论这个合相，探讨它将如何影响世界事件。

And, over the course of the past few years, we've been talking about this conjunction a lot in a mundane sense in terms of, like, what it will indicate in terms of world events.

一年前，我的朋友尼克·迪金·贝斯特和我做了一整集，回顾了历史上土星与海王星的合相，以及这些合相在过去两千年来与哪些重大历史事件相吻合。

And a year ago, my friend Nick Diggin Best and I, we did a whole episode looking at Saturn Neptune conjunctions in history and what kind of historical events those conjunctions coincided with over the course of the past two thousand years or so.

但在这集中，我想更多地探讨它在出生星盘中的个人层面表现，即如何影响人们的生活，尤其是具体的事件。

But in this episode, I wanted to talk more about how it shows up in a natal context in birth charts in terms of people's lives and especially in terms of concrete events.

所以这并不全面。

So this isn't comprehensive.

我觉得我还没有完成对这个主题的研究，但我确实有一份很长的示例清单，今天想逐一分享，让大家对我最近做的研究有一些了解，特别是关于这个合相作为命盘特征时的表现。

I don't feel like I've finished researching this topic, but I do have a pretty long list of some examples that I wanted to go through today just to share some of the research that I've been doing to give people a little insight into this conjunction when it comes to acting as a natal signature.

在某些情况下，我还会包括它落在哪个宫位，这似乎对于显示具体显化领域非常重要。

In some instances, also including what house it falls in, which seems to be really important in terms of showing the specific area of manifestation.

这不会是我最后一次探讨这个主题，未来我可能会做其他后续节目。

So this is not the last time I'll do this this topic, but I'll probably do other follow-up episodes in the future.

但与其陷入太多前期铺垫，不如我们直接切入主题，开始看看一些命盘吧？

But instead of getting caught up in too much preliminary stuff, why don't we just jump into it and start looking at some charts?

所以我会在视频版中偶尔在屏幕上展示一些命盘。

So I will show some, charts on the screen for those watching the video versions, occasionally.

但大部分情况下，我认为我只需在本集中口头讲解这些例子即可。

But for the most part, I think I'm gonna just, like, talk through some of these examples for the purpose of this episode.

好的。

Alright.

所以我想从第一个开始，就是贝蒂·福特的出生图，她曾是美国前第一夫人。

So the first one I wanted to start with is the birth chart of Betty Ford who was a is the former first lady of The United States.

她在20世纪70年代嫁给了总统杰拉尔德·福特，她的星盘中在狮子座第十二宫有一个非常接近的土星与海王星合相。

She was married to president Gerald Ford in the nineteen seventies, and she has a pretty close Saturn Neptune conjunction in Leo in the twelfth house.

我们实际上有她的准确出生时间图。

We actually have a time chart for her.

她上升星座是处女座，而这个合相正好发生在第十二宫。

She had Virgo rising, and this conjunction was taking place in the twelfth house.

关于她的故事，简而言之，她在六七十年代一直面临一些健康问题和其他困扰，逐渐对药物、尤其是止痛药产生了依赖。

And the story with her is that, to make a long story short, that she was dealing with some issues, some, like, health issues and different things in the sixties and seventies, and she started developing a dependency on medication, basically, and on painkillers.

其中一些问题源于坐骨神经受压和严重的背痛，医生给她开了阿片类止痛药。

And some of this was triggered by having a pinched nerve and severe back pain, and she was prescribed opioid painkillers.

这就是第十二宫的体现——她确实遭受着某种身体或慢性病痛，那种痛苦非常剧烈。

So that's where the twelfth house thing is showing up where it's like there was a physical or a chronic ailment that was, you know, really painful for her.

因此，医生开始给她开阿片类药物。

And as a result of that, they started prescribing her opioids.

但在同一时期，她也开始依赖酒精来应对丈夫政治生涯带来的种种压力。

But then also during the same period, she started relying on alcohol as a way to cope with, some of the things involving her husband's really demanding political career.

因此，在1978年家人进行干预后，她将这种经历转化为积极的力量，并于1982年共同创立了贝蒂·福特中心——这是一家位于加利福尼亚州的开创性非营利性戒毒康复机构，专门帮助有成瘾问题的人克服 Addiction。

So following a family intervention in 1978, she actually ended up channeling this in a positive way where in 1982, she cofounded the Betty Ford Center, which was this pioneering nonprofit residential treatment facility in California dedicated to helping individuals with, especially, addiction issue and and to overcome addiction issues.

这是一个非常美好的例子，因为它简洁明了：一方面，我们看到了土星与海王星合相带来的问题——她逐渐对止痛药产生依赖；另一方面，她最终将这种经历转化为积极的力量，努力帮助其他同样遭受成瘾困扰的人。

So this is a really beautiful example because of the conciseness and because we can see, on the one hand, the issue that came up with the Saturn Neptune conjunction where, developing a addiction basically to to painkillers, but then also eventually channeling that in a positive direction in order to try to help other people who were suffering from similar addiction issues.

这是一个相当直接的例子。

So pretty straightforward example.

而如今，贝蒂·福特中心已成为一个传奇的治疗机构，多年来，许多名人常被提及曾前往那里，以应对各种成瘾问题。

And then, like, the Betty Ford Center is just like this legendary treatment center at this point in time where people can go to to receive treatment for things, especially, like, celebrities over the past few decades commonly are mentioned, as having gone there to to deal with different addiction issues.

因此，这是一个关于土星与海王星的典型例子：有时会引发物质滥用问题。

So that's a good example of, sometimes with Saturn Neptune, we see, substance abuse abuse issues can come up.

这些挑战有时会以负面方式显现，但有时也会转化为克服这些问题，并最终帮助其他有类似遭遇的人的力量。

And sometimes that can be in a challenging way, but sometimes it can be in a way of, like, overcoming those issues and eventually trying to help other people that suffer from similar issues.

好的。

Alright.

所以这是我最近在研究的一个例子。

So that was one example I was looking at recently.

接下来看其他例子。

Moving on other examples.

另一个更复杂的情况是，我们最近看到，土星与海王星的合相有时会涉及一些神秘事件，这些事件要么被压制，要么被揭露、揭开并解决。

Another one that's more tricky is we've seen recently how sometimes, Saturn Neptune conjunctions can deal with mysteries and mysterious things happening that are either being suppressed or where there's mysteries that are being disclosed and, like, uncovered and solved.

在过去一年中，土星与海王星的合相显然成为了一个主要主题，比如埃普斯坦文件之类的事件。

And that's obviously been a major theme with this Saturn Neptune conjunction over the past year with some of the, like, Epstein files and things like that.

但有趣的是，我找到了另一份出生星盘，它也体现了这些主题，那就是约翰·贝内·拉姆齐的出生星盘，她的土星与海王星合相位于第八宫。

But interestingly, I found another birth chart that brings in some of these themes, and it's the birth chart of John Bene Ramsey who had the Saturn Neptune conjunction in the eighth house.

她的案例广为人知，因为在上世纪九十年代，她在家中被谋杀，围绕凶手身份引发了巨大的谜团。

And, her case is famous because in the nineteen nineties, she was murdered in her home, and there was this huge mystery surrounding who did it.

直到今天，这仍然算得上一个未解之谜，尽管围绕此事有许多不同的理论，关于谁是凶手、谁不是凶手，以及围绕她死亡的各种神秘与混乱。

And to this day, it actually still continues to be a sort of unsolved mystery, although there's a lot of different theories surrounding it and and theories surrounding who may have done it or who didn't and and a lot of mysteriousness and confusion and things like that basically surrounding her her death.

这是她的星盘。

So here's her chart.

我这里快速展示一下，以确认星盘位置。

I will show really quickly here just to confirm the placement.

我们看到她上升星座是双子座，海王星位于摩羯座12度，与土星（位于摩羯座20度）在夜盘中形成合相。

So we see she has Gemini rising and Neptune at 12 degrees of Capricorn, conjunct Saturn at at 20 degrees of Capricorn in a night chart.

最近我们注意到很多案例，都是出生时带有土星与海王星合相的人。

And one of the things that's interesting about this recently, we've been seeing a lot of instances where there's people born under a Saturn Neptune conjunction.

而如今，随着土星和海王星再次在天空中合相，这就像一种重复的行运影响。

And then in different ways, now that Saturn and Neptune are conjoining in the sky again, it's acting as a recurrence transit.

有时候，这些人的故事会再次登上新闻，或者他们的生命出现重要的转折点。

And sometimes those people are coming up in the news again or there's, like, an important turning point taking place with respect to their story.

有趣的是，我最近查这个案例时发现，随着土星与海王星合相逐渐增强（自2023年3月土星进入双鱼座与海王星同宫以来），九月的新闻中也出现了相关报道。

And interestingly, I was just looking this case up and in the news, September as the Saturn Neptune conjunction was building up because they've been co present in the same sign ever since March 2023 when Saturn moved into Pisces with with Neptune.

当时正有一部关于她生平的Paramount+限定剧集在筹备中。

They were developing a Paramount plus limited series about her life.

但最近的新闻是，2025年有报道称，由于法律问题，Paramount可能无限期搁置这部剧集，例如她的父亲约翰·拉姆齐已公开表示可能对该剧提起诉讼。

And but as as recently, the most recent news was that in 2025, there were reports saying that Paramount may end up shelving that series indefinitely due to legal concerns, where, for example, her father, John Ramsey, has publicly indicated that he might take legal action against the series.

因此，围绕这件事仍然有很多未解之谜，接下来一两年内，随着土星和海王星持续合相，很值得观察这是否会继续成为一个长期关注的故事。

So there's still a lot of stuff surrounding that, and it'll be interesting to see if that is something that continues to be, like, an ongoing story as Saturn and Neptune are conjoining and still co present over the next year or two.

但对我来说，关键在于，土星与海王星的合相常常伴随着大量的神秘感、各种理论，以及许多说不清道不明的事情。

But the takeaway for me was just sometimes Saturn Neptune conjunctions can involve a lot of mysteriousness and a lot of different theories and a lot of, yeah, things going on that just aren't clear.

而在这个案例中，由于它落在她的第八宫，这直接体现为围绕她死亡原因的谜团——她究竟是怎么死的。

And in this instance, because it was in her eighth house, it very literally was a mystery surrounding her death and and how she how she died.

稍后我们还会看到其他类似的案例，涉及类似的神秘性。

So we'll see some other ones like that later in terms of mysteriousness.

实际上，我现在为什么不提另一个例子呢？

Actually, why don't I bring up one of the the other ones now?

另一个类似的案例是，我发现约翰·F·肯尼迪的星盘中，土星与海王星合相横跨第十和第十一宫。

Another one that's just like that is I noticed that John f Kennedy had a Saturn Neptune conjunction across the tenth and eleventh houses.

我觉得这非常有趣，因为他于1963年遇刺，这成为过去一个世纪中最引人注目的事件之一，围绕他的死因出现了大量理论——比如阴谋论，或者关于行刺动机的其他猜测：是否还有其他枪手？是否涉及其他人？除了那个被捕并被定罪的人之外，还有谁参与了？诸如此类的问题。

And I thought this was really interesting because he, you know, was assassinated in 1963, and it's been one of the biggest things in the past century in terms of different theories about sometimes, like, conspiracy theories for lack of a better term or other theories about what what the motivation was behind the shooting, if there was, like, another shooter involved, if there were like, who was involved, if there were other people besides the guy that was was caught and was implicated in the shooting and different things like that.

简而言之，肯尼迪的星盘顶部有土星与海王星的合相，我感到特别着迷的是，围绕他死亡的各种理论和阴谋论，过去一个世纪以来一直是最具吸引力的话题之一，因为确实存在一些真正神秘难解的细节。

So, basically, JFK had a Saturn Neptune conjunction up at the top of his chart, and I just find it fascinating that the different theories and conspiracy theories surrounding his death has been, like, one of the biggest, let's say, attractions over the course of the past century for different reasons because there are some genuinely mysterious things surrounding it.

这就是一个例子。

So that's an example of that.

然后，更近一些的是，最近发生的杰弗里·爱泼斯坦案件，显然这已成为当前土星与海王星合相的主要案例，因为他出生时土星与海王星正好合相在第十宫。

And then, obviously, more recently, the the more recent one is, the case that's happening with Jeffrey Epstein, and that's obviously become the main case of this current Saturn Neptune conjunction since he was born with the Saturn Neptune conjunction in the tenth house.

一方面，关于他暗中运作和从事各种活动的事情不断被曝光。

And on the one hand, there's a lot of things coming out about how he was working behind the scenes and doing things.

在某些情况下，关于他所作所为的一些阴谋论已经被证实了。

There's a lot of different, in some instances, like, conspiracy theories that have been confirmed about things that he was doing.

在其他情况下，还有一些相当离谱的阴谋论尚未得到验证，但人们正在讨论并广泛传播，认为他正经历着土星与海王星的再次合相。

In other instances, there's, like, pretty far out there conspiracy theories that are still not validated, but that people are talking about and are sort of, like, circulating right now that he's having this recurrence of Saturn conjunct Neptune.

我在最近的一些节目中提到过一些相关内容。

I talked about some of that in some of the recent episodes.

我在这里不会再深入展开，但通过这次周期，我观察到他再次经历这一相位时学到了很多——显然，这与许多幕后发生的事情、隐藏的真相，以及有时在幕后运作的阴谋有关，这正是我和尼克在一年前的原始节目中总结出的关键词之一。

I'm not gonna get too much into it again here, but that's just another one of those cases where I've learned a lot during this cycle and seeing this recurrence transit for him where, obviously, a lot of it has to do with things that happen behind the scenes and things that are hidden or sometimes conspiracies that are happening behind the scenes, which is one of the keywords that Nick and I found during the the the original episode a year ago.

但与此同时，在合相期间，有时也会揭露那些曾经隐藏在幕后的事件，或者某些事情突然浮出水面。

But then also sometimes on conjunctions, there can be disclosures of things that were happening behind the scenes or something that suddenly comes out into the open.

比如，在最近的一期节目中，我提到或展示了自由之子如何参与波士顿倾茶事件——那是在一次土星与海王星合相期间，一群秘密人士装扮起来，把所有茶叶倾倒入港口，实施了这一行动，但他们是作为一个秘密团体进行的，并试图隐藏自己的身份。

Like, for example, in a recent episode, I talked about or I showed how, the Sons of Liberty were involved in the Boston Tea Party, which is under a Saturn Neptune conjunction where you had this, like, secretive group of people that dressed up and then threw all the tea into the harbor and, like, committed this act, but did so as part of, like, a secret group and tried to keep their identities somewhat hidden.

但就在最近的12月，一家历史学会首次公布了一份经过核实的、参与波士顿倾茶事件的所有人员名单。

But then recently in December, a historical society published a whole list of the names of all the verified members of the people that were involved in the Boston Tea Party for the first time.

所以，时隔几个世纪后，一件过去被保密的事情终于被揭露了出来。

So there was, like, a disclosure, like, you know, centuries later about something that was secret in the past.

我不断看到这种模式在不同时期反复出现，而我正在以各种方式关注这种现象。

And I keep seeing that dynamic come up over and over again at different points, and it's one that I'm I'm paying attention to in different ways.

为了延续这个主题，另一个最近在新闻中出现的类似案例是吉塞尔·佩利科特，这真是一个非常复杂的案件。

Maybe to keep that theme going, another one that's similar that I noticed that's in the news right now is Giselle Pelicotte who this is a really tricky case.

如果你还不了解这个事件，需要提醒一下：这起发生在法国的案件中，一名已婚女性被她的丈夫下药、虐待，还遭到社区中其他人的侵害。

So if you haven't word heard of it, you know, trigger warning, because it involved this case in France where a woman who was married was being drugged by her husband and and abused and also abused by, like, other people in the community.

在2024年2月举行的一场具有里程碑意义的审判中，这件事在过去的几年里逐渐曝光。

And it came out over the course of the past few years in this landmark trial that happened in 02/2024.

这起案件在法国引起了巨大轰动。

And it was a huge case in France.

她正好有土星与海王星的合相，最终发现丈夫多年来一直给她下药，并对她做了种种可怕的事情。

And she has a Saturn Neptune conjunction and basically found out that he'd been drugging her for years and and doing all these terrible things.

而她现在正经历着一次重现的行运，一方面，这正是审判本身——尽管她本可以选择私下处理此案，因为涉及的内容非常敏感，但她选择公开审理，以揭露这一问题，让公众了解真相，并希望通过公开此事帮助未来可能遭遇类似遭遇的人。

And she's having a recurrence transit right now, which on the one hand was the trial itself where even though she could have had the case done the case privately because of what it involved, she chose to have the trial publicly in order to bring light to this issue essentially and to disclose this this issue of what was happening and to try to help, you know, potentially other people in the future by making this more public.

有趣的是，我昨天就已经在研究这个案例，但今天才得知，就在2月17日，也就是土星与海王星合相精确发生的前三天，她刚刚出版了一本官方回忆录，讲述自己的经历并将其分享给全世界。

So, interestingly, just yesterday I'd already been researching this, but then I just found out today that just yesterday on February 17, just three days before the Saturn Neptune conjunction goes exact, she's having a recurrence transit, and she just published an official memoir talking about her story and, like, sharing it with the world.

这真是一个非常震撼的例子，再次印证了我过去几个月反复提到的‘重现行运’这一概念，因为我不断看到这种情况频繁发生：如果一个人出生时有两个行星形成精确的相位，那么在他们生命后期，当这两颗行星再次形成相同相位时，往往会发生极其重要的事件。

And that's a really stunning example of, again, this idea of a recurrence transit that I've been talking about so much over the past few months because I just see it happening so regularly and frequently where if somebody is born with a exact alignment or an aspect between two planets, then oftentimes something really will really important will happen in their life later on when those same two planets align again.

而在某些情况下，比如土星与海王星的合相，这种情况并不常见，因为这两颗行星大约每三十六年才会合相一次。

And in some instance instances, like with Saturn and Neptune conjunctions, that doesn't happen frequently because these two planets only conjoin every thirty six years or so.

因此，当你看到一个人在其一生中可能只有两到三次、甚至可能只有两次这样的合相机会时，而每一次都成为人生的重大转折点，这更显得格外震撼。

So it makes it even more stunning when you see it in those instances of somebody that will only have, you know, what, two, maybe three alignments of that tops, probably just two alignments of that tops in their natural lifetime, but nonetheless having it be such an important turning point.

对她而言，这与出版回忆录、分享自己的故事、并揭露真相息息相关。

And for her, it has to do with, yeah, publishing her memoir and sharing her story and bringing light to this.

我最近一期节目中提到过一个相关话题，我想大概是一个月前，我们曾讨论过，在最初的土星与海王星合相案例中，出现过不少涉及化学物质或投毒的高关注度事件。

And one of the things that brings up that I talked about on a recent episode, I think in the past month, was just how sometimes in the original Saturn Neptune episode, we saw a number of high profile incidents involving chemicals or poisoning and different things like that.

我认为她的案例是另一个例证，因为这不仅涉及她被秘密下药，还以下药或投毒为主题。

And I think her case is another example of that because it involves, you know, she was being not just, like, secretly drugged, but it involves, like, a drugging or a sort of poisoning as a sort of theme at the same time.

所以，尼克和我在最初的那期节目中就发现了这一点，但这一现象后来变得越来越突出。

So that was something that Nick and I found in the re the the original episode, but it's continued to become more and more prominent.

而且我们最近还至少看到了另外两起类似事件，正如我在另一期节目中提到的，我认为美国某政府机构刚刚发布了一份报告，称配偶之间投毒的事件最近有所增加，原因不明，因此他们决定发布通知，以引起公众注意并试图遏制这一趋势。

And we've seen at least two other instances of that recently where, as I mentioned in another episode, I think one of The US governmental agencies just put out a report saying that, like, incidents of spouses poisoning their their spouse are on the rise recently for some reason, so much so that they decided to put out a notification about it to try to get the word out to to to help curb this.

几天前，另一则投毒新闻登上头条，据我所知，是英国或其他几个国家发布声明称，俄罗斯反对派领袖纳瓦尔尼被毒害，他们指出这是一种来自树蛙或类似有毒蛙类的特定毒素，并且已经确定了用于杀害他的确切毒物。

And then, another poisoning news story that was just in the news a few days ago was, I think it was, like, The UK or, like, a few other countries put out this announcement saying that Navalny, the opposition leader in Russia, was poisoned, and they said that it was a specific poison from, like, a tree frog or or something like that, like a poisonous frog, but they had identified the exact poison that was used to kill him.

所以，这又是这种诡异的投毒主题再次出现的一个例子，我们在最初的节目中就发现了这一主题，但在这次特定的合相期间，看到它以不同方式反复出现，确实令人震惊。

So that was another instance of this weird, like, poisoning theme coming up again, which we had found in the original episode, but it's been striking watching that come up in different ways again over the course of this particular conjunction.

好了。

Alright.

关于这个案例还有很多其他事情，但我就不深入讨论了。

So there's a lot of other things involving that case, but I'm not gonna go into it.

那我就先说到这里，继续下一项内容。

So I'll I'll move on and leave it there.

让我看看我还有哪些其他例子。

Let me see what my other examples are.

我提到了纳瓦尔内，所以现在或许值得提一下。

So I mentioned Navalny, so it might be worth mentioning at this point.

你知道，1919年土星与海王星的合相，以及1950年代初期土星与天秤座的合相，对应的正是弗拉基米尔·普京。

You know, one of the Saturn Neptune conjunctions in the '19 in the Saturn and Libra conjunction in the early nineteen fifties was Vladimir Putin.

前几天我突然意识到一件事，他的第一次回归行运发生在1989年，那时正好是柏林墙倒塌、苏联解体的时期——那正是上世纪八九十年代在这一合相下发生的重大土星海王星事件，也是我们此前经历的上一次合相。

And one of the things I came to a realization about the other day was, you know, his first recurrence transit of that conjunction was in 1989 and around that time period where the Berlin Wall fell and then the Soviet Union broke up and there was the dissolution of the Soviet Union, which was the big Saturn Neptune event that took place in the late eighties and early nineties under that conjunction, which is the last conjunction we've had prior to this one.

但这次合相，以及苏联解体和柏林墙倒塌，对普京而言极其重要，因为当时他正作为一名克格勃特工驻扎在东德，亲眼目睹了柏林墙的倒塌。

But that conjunction and and the fall of the Soviet Union or dissolution of the Soviet Union and the fall of the Berlin Wall was incredibly important to Putin because he was a KGB agent in East German who was actually, like, witnessing the fall of the Berlin Wall at this that time.

我认为他曾说过，苏联的解体是二十世纪最重大的地缘政治灾难之一，类似这样的话。

And I think he said that that the breakup of the Soviet Union was, like, one of the greatest geopolitical disasters of the twentieth century or something like that.

但显然，这件事对他个人而言意义非凡。

But, obviously, it was very personally important to him.

我最近意识到，自那以后，他一直在努力重建俄罗斯，从苏联解体后的那个起点开始，甚至在某些方面试图将过去的一些东西重新带回，直至今天——我们正处在当前的土星海王星合相时期，而此刻或即将发生的重大转折点，正是这一合相精确对齐之时。

And what I realized recently is essentially ever since that time, he's been in the process of trying to build Russia back up from that point, from when that breakup happened, and in some instances, trying to bring certain things back from the past in some sense all the way up until today where we're at the current Saturn Neptune conjunction and whatever the important turning point is that's happening right now or that's about to take place here as that Saturn Neptune conjunction is going exact.

所以这个事件对他个人而言极其重要，尽管从更宏观的角度来看，土星与海王星的合相确实与这一重大的占星事件相吻合，但我们必须记住，有时某些全球性事件对某些个体而言比对其他人更重要，尤其是那些未来可能成为有影响力人物或世界领袖的人。

So that one was was super personally important even though, you know, even though the broader thing is that that Saturn Neptune conjunction was coinciding with this huge event in terms of mundane astrology, we have to remember that sometimes there's certain mundane events that are incredibly or are more important for certain individuals than others, especially people that will end up being influential or world leaders at some point in the future.

这是一个非常有趣的案例，我真的很想知道，在这次土星海王星合相下，对普京个人而言，以及对俄罗斯整体而言，下一个转折点会是什么。

So really interesting case, and I'm really curious to see, yeah, what the next turning point is with respect to that under this conjunction for Putin personally, but also for for Russia in general.

好吧。

Alright.

继续。

Moving on.

在上一期节目中，我发现了一个例子，我们不需要深入讨论，但为了重申一下，当我发现克里斯托弗·哥伦布出生于1451年——一个土星与海王星合相的年份时，我感到非常震惊。

One that I found in the last episode that I did that we don't I don't wanna we don't have to talk about extensively, but just to reiterate, I was really blown away when I found that Christopher Columbus was born on a Saturn Neptune conjunction in the year 1451.

而他在1486年——另一个土星与海王星合相的复发年份——首次向西班牙王室提出探索通往印度新航线的构想。

And then he first pitched the idea of exploring a new route to The Indies to the Spanish royals on a Saturn Neptune conjunction recurrence in the year 1486.

我觉得这太不可思议了，因为其中一点是，他抱有一种错误的认知，并且据说至死都坚持着这个想法。

So I thought this is incredible because of, you know, he one of the things about that is he had a mistaken idea and supposedly went to his death.

最终，他临终时仍以为自己发现了一条通往印度、也就是南亚地区的替代航线，但实际上他完全错了。

Eventually, he died thinking that he had discovered an alternative path to the Indies and and to, like like, South Asia, basically, but he was completely mistaken.

他们实际上无意中发现了一个全新的陆地——美洲，并开始殖民它，奴役当地居民，以及种种其他恶劣行为。

They'd actually inadvertently discovered a completely new landmass with the Americas and began to colonize it and, you know, enslave the population and all sorts of other terrible things.

但有趣的是，在这个例子中，由于某种误解，反而达成了其他成就——也就是发现了新大陆，这开启了世界历史的一个全新时代，但这一切都建立在一个错误的前提之上。

But it's interesting in that instance that there was a a mistaken understanding about something or as a result of a mistaken understanding, something else was accomplished, basically, that there was the discovery that took place, which opened up a whole new era in terms of world history, but it was entirely based on a mistaken premise.

而这个错误的前提，据记载，他直到临终前都一直坚信不疑。

And it was a mistaken premise that he evidently, if the reports are true, went to his deathbed still thinking was the case all the way until the end.

因此，有时这是非常重要的事情，也是这个合相最棘手的方面之一，我称之为‘现实扭曲场’：它有时表明一个人对现实缺乏准确的理解，或者存在某种欺骗，或者他们被某些现实层面所误导。

So sometimes it's a really important thing, and it's one of the most tricky things with this conjunction is what I've been calling the reality distortion field where sometimes it can indicate an area where the person doesn't have an accurate understanding of reality or there's something that's deceptive or where they've been deceived about some certain aspect of their reality.

在过去一年观察这个合相的过程中，我越来越意识到，这是因为土星实际上是与欺骗相关的古代行星，而海王星则像是现代行星，也与幻象、欺骗以及看似真实却并非真实的事物相关。

And I've realized more and more over the past year that I've been watching this conjunction that it's because both, Saturn is actually the ancient planet that had to do with deception, and Neptune is kinda like the modern planet that also has to do with illusions and deception and things that look real but are not.

所以，当你把这两颗行星结合起来时，有时就会形成一种强烈的现实扭曲效应。

So it's like you put those two planets together, and sometimes it can create an intense sort of reality distortion field in some way.

但这种扭曲可能是当事人直到后来才意识到的，也可能是一直无法察觉的。

But it may be one that either the person doesn't know about until later, or it may be one in which the person never really figures out, basically.

它可能只是一个盲点，别人或许看得清楚，但当事人自己却看不到。

It may just be a blind spot that maybe other people can see, but perhaps they can't.

所以，你知道，这种事情已经发生过，我们还见过其他类似的例子，比如约翰·博内特·拉姆齐和她死亡背后的谜团，或者吉塞尔·佩利科特，她多年后才意识到自己被欺骗以及发生了什么。

So, you know, that's happened, and we've seen instances of like that in other instances, like John Bonnet Ramsey and the mystery surrounding her death or with Giselle Pellicott who discovered how she was being deceived and and what was happening to her years later.

但即便如此，其中一些事情仍然存在谜团。

But even then, there were still mysteries surrounding some of it.

所以，是的，这是我开始更好地把握的一个非常重要的主题。

So, yeah, so that's a really important theme that I'm starting to get a a much better handle on.

就在完成关于哥伦布的上一期节目后，我注意到一件事：他可能即将再次经历一次行星交叠，因为我看到报道说，白宫的特朗普方面正准备在白宫或其附近为哥伦布竖立一座雕像，时间可能就在未来几周内，如果报道属实的话。

And something I just noticed after I did the last episode with Christopher Columbus is he may be about to do have another recurrence transit because I saw a notice that the White House Trump and the White House may be getting ready to put up a statue to Christopher Columbus on the White House or near the White House sometime very soon, possibly as soon as in the next couple of weeks from the report that I was seeing, if it was true.

如果真的发生，这将是哥伦布去世五百多年后的一次重现星象。

And this would be, if that happens, it's gonna be a recurrence transit for Columbus, something like more than five hundred years after he after he died.

所以我们需要关注这一点，看看它是否真的会发生。但如果真的发生了，那将非常疯狂，而且这将是一个很好的例证，说明我们的出生星盘会随着记忆的延续而持续发挥作用，只要我们的名字和记忆在历史中不断回响，占星学就总会在某些时刻反映出来——尤其是当你的名字在未来某个重要或决定性的时刻被提及时。

So we'll have to pay attention to that and see if that actually manifests and comes about, but that's gonna be kind of crazy if it does, and it and it's gonna be a good example that our birth charts continue to live and to speak for as long as our memory is alive and as long as it continues to echo in history in different ways, the astrology will always anytime your name or your memory comes up at some point in the future, especially in a really important or defining way, that sometimes the astrology itself will reflect that in some ways.

所以我们需要关注这个案例，看看它是否真的会应验。

So we'll have to pay attention to that case and see if that actually turns out to be the case in that instance.

就像埃普斯坦一样，你知道，埃普斯坦自2019年就已去世，但在2025年和2026年，当土星和海王星如此接近时，他的名字突然成为全球性的巨大现象，尽管他已经不在人世了。

Just as, for example, with Epstein, you know, Epstein has been dead since 2019, and yet in 2025 and 2026 when Saturn and Neptune have come so close, suddenly he becomes his name becomes this huge worldwide phenomenon even though he's no longer around.

因此，出生图会继续存在，只要我们的记忆还在，只要我们对世界的影响仍在历史中回响。

So the birth chart continues to live on, especially as long as our memory does and our impact on the world continues to reverberate in history.

好的。

Alright.

那么我们继续下一个话题。

So let's move on to the next one.

另一个是我在研究一个较早的人物——海因里希·科尼利厄斯·阿格里帕，他以撰写《神秘哲学三书》而闻名。

Another one is that I found, an older one, is Heinrich Cordillius Agrippa who famously wrote the three books of occult philosophy.

他出生时正值土星与海王星合相。

He was born on a Saturn Neptune conjunction.

几年前我做过一整期节目专门讲阿格里帕和他的著作，因为他写了一本关于魔法与神秘学的经典之作，几乎囊括了他所知或所学的一切相关内容，后来成为仪式魔法师等人的重要标准参考书。

And I did a whole episode a few years ago on Agrippa and his work because he wrote, like, a classic what became a classic book on magic and the occult, basically, of of everything he he knew or had learned about that subject, and it became like a standard reference volume for ceremonial magicians and people like that in the future.

这很有趣，因为他的著作聚焦于神秘主义和隐秘艺术的结构。

And it was interesting because it was, like, focusing on occultism and the structure of the hidden arts.

但让我觉得好奇的是，我曾经读到过，据说在他生命的晚期，他可能对魔法和神秘学产生了怀疑。

But what was interesting about him that I thought was curious is I did read at one point that towards the end of his life, he may have turned skeptical against magic and the occult.

这引发了一种有趣的张力，我有时会看到这种现象，我认为理查德·塔迪斯在讨论土星与海王星相位时曾提到过，比如在谈论查尔斯·达尔文这样的人物时。

And this is a interesting tension that I sometimes see come up that I think I think Richard Tardis talked about in his treatment of Saturn Neptune when he was talking about different figures like Charles Darwin, for example.

因为达尔文与亚伯拉罕·林肯同一天出生，都处于土星与海王星的合相位置，但两人对这一相位的体现方式却截然不同。

Because Darwin famously was born on a Saturn Neptune conjunction the same day as Abraham Lincoln, and both of them manifested that conjunction in different ways.

但达尔文关于进化论的研究，却引发了与宗教人士乃至整个宗教界的巨大冲突，因为它提供了一种截然不同的科学解释，说明生命和人类如何在地球上产生，这与《圣经》中关于人类和地球起源的描述大相径庭。

But with Darwin, his work on the theory of evolution ended up causing huge tensions with religious people and and, like, the religious community because it showed this alternative, like, scientific way of explaining how life came about and how humans came about on Earth that was different than, you know, whatever it says in the Bible about how humans and and Earth were were created.

因此，这加剧了科学与宗教之间的对立，而这正是土星与海王星合相期间常出现的现象之一。

So it created this more of a science versus religion divide, which is one of the things that we see come up during Saturn Neptune conjunctions.

我和尼克在一年前的那期节目中就记录过几个类似的例子。

And Nick and I had documented a few instances of that in the episode a year ago.

比如，我记不清具体是哪一次合相了，但在19世纪末，曾有一个致力于在科学或怀疑主义框架下研究超自然或超常现象的协会，在一次土星与海王星合相时成立。

Like, for example, I can't remember what the conjunction, but in the late eighteen hundreds, there was, like, a society dedicated to studying, psychic or paranormal things in a scientific or skeptical context that was created on a Saturn Neptune conjunction.

因此，我认为阿格里帕的情况也类似——尽管他以撰写这部关于魔法的巨著而闻名，但他内心可能也存在关于科学与魔法、信仰与怀疑之类的张力，并以不同方式体现在他的一生中。

So I think we see something similar with Agrippa where even though he's known as having written this big book on magic, there may have been attention within him about, like, science versus magic or belief versus skepticism or what have you that showed up in different ways in his life.

我认为，在理解这一合相时，意识到这种动态非常重要：因为土星代表真实、可感知之物，代表宇宙中具体可触的结构，而海王星则代表更具精神性、或仅在抽象层面成立、却未必具有实际存在形式的事物。

And I think that's an important dynamic to be aware of when it comes to this conjunction because, you know, Saturn represents that which is real and that which is tangible and, like, the tangible structure of the universe, whereas Neptune represents things that are more either spiritually inclined or things that make sense in abstract but may not have, like, a tangible reality and different things like that.

当这种 alignments 发生时，你有时会看到真实世界与某种意义上的非真实世界之间的张力。

And sometimes you see a tension between those two worlds of the world that is real versus the world that is not real in some sense when that alignment takes place.

所以我认为我们稍后会再回到这个主题。

So I think we'll come back to that later as a as a theme.

好的。

Alright.

那我们继续吧。

So let's move on.

你知道，过去一年我提到的另一个例子是泰勒·斯威夫特，因为她出生在土星与海王星合相期间，而现在她正经历这次重现。

You know, another one I've mentioned of the past year is Taylor Swift because she was born during the Saturn Neptune conjunction, and she's having the recurrence now.

去年夏天，当土星与海王星合相再次非常接近时——虽然并未完全精确——她和特拉维斯·凯尔西订婚并公布了这一消息。

And last summer, of course, when the Saturn Neptune conjunction came really close again, but it didn't go exact, that was when her partner and Travis Kelce and her got engaged and and announced their engagement.

但我们没有她的确切出生时间，因此无法确定这个合相在她的星盘中落在哪个宫位。

And we don't have, like, a confirmed birth time for her, so we don't know for sure what house it's falling in in her chart.

但我最近才意识到，我们其实有特拉维斯·凯尔西的准确出生时间，而他的本命星盘中，土星与海王星合相正好落在第五宫。

But I I just realized recently that we actually do have a birth time for Travis Kelce, and the Saturn Neptune conjunction, natally is in his fifth house.

所以我认为，至少通过这一点，我们可以更好地理解为什么这个土星海王星合相可能会在这个伴侣关系中以浪漫的背景出现，尤其是在他的星图中。

So I think now even at least through through that, we can kind of understand better why this Saturn Neptune conjunction might be coming up in a romantic context for that couple, certainly in his chart.

他们在去年夏天土星和海王星接近时宣布了订婚，而我认为他们今年晚些时候可能会结婚。

And they announced their engagement last summer when Saturn and Neptune came close, and then I think they're about to get married sometime this year.

我听说报道提到可能在六月，接近金星木星合相的时候，但具体会怎样，我们还得拭目以待。

I think reports were saying in June, maybe close to the Venus Jupiter conjunction, but we'll see we'll see, you know, what ends up happening.

最近我还在研究一个类似的例子，就是凯瑟琳·肯尼迪，她出生于二十世纪五十年代的天秤座，当时正好是土星与海王星合相，她是一位非常著名且有影响力的好莱坞制片人。

A similar one like that I was looking at recently is Kathleen Kennedy who was born with the Saturn Neptune conjunction in the nineteen fifties in Libra, and she's a really famous and influential Hollywood producer.

该怎么讲这个故事呢？

And the how to tell this story?

她曾与史蒂文·斯皮尔伯格和乔治·卢卡斯合作过。

She's somebody that worked with, like, Steven Spielberg and George Lucas.

2012年，当乔治·卢卡斯出售他的公司时，她接过了管理权，而这家公司拥有《星球大战》等作品的版权。

And in 2012, she, actually took over when George Lucas sold his company, which, had the rights to, like, Star Wars and stuff.

那家公司主要的业务就是卢卡斯影业。

That was the main thing that his company did, Lucasfilm.

凯瑟琳·肯尼迪于2012年成为该公司总裁，离开了她之前的制作公司，此后她便主导了所有新的《星球大战》系列电影及相关作品的创作。

Kathleen Kennedy became the president of that in in 2012 and left her previous production production company, and then that's what led to and she was kind of at the helm of creating all of the new Star Wars franchises and everything like that.

但有趣的是，就在今年1月15日，当土星与海王星再次精确合相时，她宣布正式辞去卢卡斯影业总裁一职。

But, interestingly, just, recently on January 15, as the Saturn Neptune conjunction is going exact again, she announced that she's officially stepping down as president of Lucasfilm.

因此，这次合相标志着她职业生涯中一个极其重要篇章的终结——她不仅是著名的制片人，更是这家电影公司的总裁，拥有对《星球大战》续三部曲、所有电视剧及其他相关项目最终决策权的人。

And so it's this conjunction is bringing an end to, like, a really important chapter in terms of her career as this really famous, not just producer, but also in this instance, like, the president of an entire film studio and the person who had the final say about the direction of the Star Wars sequel trilogy and and everything else, all the television shows and things like that.

因此，我们有了她的出生时间，我发现有趣的是，她的土星海王星合相位于第七宫。

And so with that, we have a birth time for her, and what I found was interesting was that her conjunction is in the seventh house.

起初我并不太理解这如何体现，但经过研究后发现，她在上世纪八十年代曾与一位合作伙伴紧密合作制作电影。

And at first, I didn't really understand how that manifested, but I was researching, and it turns out she has a partner who she worked with really closely on producing movies in the nineteen eighties.

后来，他们在八十年代某时结了婚，我认为时间离那次合相并不远。

And then they actually ended up getting married in, like, the the nineteen eighties at one point, I think not too far off from the conjunction.

我想应该是1987年或1988年左右，正好接近她第一次土星与海王星的重现。

I wanna say it was, like, '87 or '88 or something like that, which would be close to her first recurrence of Saturn and Neptune.

到了1991年，两人共同创立了肯尼迪·马歇尔公司，这是一家极为成功、高产且备受尊敬的好莱坞制作公司，此后他们制作了多部大片，如1999年的《第六感》、2003年的《神鬼奇航》、2005年的《慕尼黑》以及2008年的《本杰明·巴顿奇事》。

And then in 1991, the two of them founded the Kennedy Marshall company, which was this incredibly successful, and prolific and respected production house in Hollywood, where after that, they ended up producing really huge movies such as, like, the Sixth Sense in 1999, Seabiscuit in 2003, Munich in 2005, The Curious Case of Benjamin Button in 2008.

那实际上是我最喜欢的电影之一。

That's actually one of my favorite movies.

2012年史蒂文·斯皮尔伯格执导的《林肯》，《谍影重重》系列，比如《谍影重重》以及该系列后续的所有电影，2002年M·奈特·沙马兰执导的《 Signs》。

Lincoln in 2012 by Steven Spielberg, the Bourne franchise, like the Bourne Identity and all the subsequent movies in that franchise, Signs in 2002 by M.

以及过去十年间影响巨大的《侏罗纪世界》三部曲。

Night Shyamalan, and the Jurassic World trilogy that's been such a huge trilogy over the past decade.

因此，在她的星盘中，土星与海王星的合相在这个背景下就说得通了，因为它强烈指向第七宫的重要性，而她与伴侣共同创立这家大型制作公司，我认为正是这一合相的体现。

So, suddenly, the Saturn Neptune conjunction makes sense in that context in her chart because it's really pointing to her seventh house being important and, yeah, working together with her partner to create this huge production company, I think, was was part of that.

但另一方面，她作为制片人并执掌卢卡斯影业，本质上是在从事与电影相关的工作——这虽然关乎艺术，但她更多是从结构层面入手，专注于制片、管理，从商业角度主导这些最终属于艺术或电影创作的项目。

But a lot of it is also that she was in acting as a producer and then heading up Lucasfilm, it's like she was doing something with film, which is, like, about art, but she was very much on the structural side of that in terms of producing and managing and sort of directing things from a business standpoint that are ultimately, like, artistic or cinematic creations.

关于《星球大战》续集系列最终如何发展，其中有许多争议，我们这里无需深入讨论其遗产，但有趣的是，她在八九十年代与伴侣共同创立制作公司，以及如今在第二次合相 transit 时为这段历程画上句点，这两者之间形成了鲜明的对照。

And, you know, there's lots of debates about, like, how that ended up going with, like, the the Star Wars sequels that we don't have to get into here in terms of that and that legacy, but it's interesting how those important turning points of forming that production company with their partner under the late eighties and early nineties conjunction and then bringing something to a close at this point with that second recurrence transit conjunction.

这提醒我们，有时合相标志着新周期的开始和新事物的诞生，但在其他情况下，它也意味着一个周期的终结，为一段漫长时光带来圆满的收尾。

And it's a good reminder that sometimes conjunctions are the start of a new cycle and the birth of something new, but in other instances, it's the end of a cycle, and it's bringing something to completion at the end of of a very long period of time.

因此，在观察这些合相时，请记住这一点。

So keep that in mind when it comes to looking at these conjunctions.

我们来看看。

Let's see.

我文件里的另一个星盘是一个叫史蒂文·帕多克的人，他的土星海王星合相落在第四宫，结果他成了一个大规模枪手。

Another one one of the charts in my files is somebody named Steven Paddock who, had the conjunction in the fourth house, and he ended up, like, becoming a a mass shooter, basically.

我想他就是几年前发生在拉斯维加斯的那起枪击案的涉案者，是的。

I think he was involved in the Vegas shooting, like, a few years ago, which was yeah.

那是一起大规模谋杀案。

It was a mass murder.

他实施了2017年拉斯维加斯枪击案，我认为这是美国历史上规模最大的枪击事件之一。

He he perpetrated the twenty seventeen Las Vegas shooting, and I think it was one of the largest shootings in US history, basically.

但他的星盘中有趣的是，他的土星海王星合相落在第四宫。

But what was interesting about his chart is that his Saturn Neptune conjunction fell in the fourth house.

我曾经注意到他的传记中有一件奇怪的事：他的父亲显然是一名著名的银行劫匪，于1960年史蒂文七岁时被捕。

And I had noticed at one point a a weird thing about his biography, which is that his father evidently was a prominent bank robber who was arrested in 1960 when Steven was seven years old.

后来这个人被定罪，于1969年越狱，并被列入联邦调查局通缉名单。

And this guy was later convicted and escaped prison in 1969 and appeared on the FBI's most wanted list.

我找到了他哥哥埃里克的一段话，他说：‘父亲从未和我母亲在一起，我们并没有在他的影响下长大。’

And I found this quote from his brother, Eric, who said, quote, the father was never with my mom, and we didn't grow up under his influence.

父亲被捕后，他们的母亲告诉孩子们，父亲死于一场车祸，并且对家人隐瞒了他银行劫匪的身份。

And after the father was arrested, their mother told the children that the father had died in a car accident and kept his status as a bank robber a secret from the family.

所以，土星与海王星合相在第四宫，父亲是个罪犯，但他的罪行却被母亲隐瞒，成为一种秘密，甚至是一个谎言。

So Saturn Neptune conjunction the fourth house and, like, the father was a criminal, but also his criminality was kept secret as a sort of, like, mystery or even as a lie, by the mother.

后来，他们长大后，终将在某个时候发现真相。

And then later, they would grow up and, like, find out at some point in the future.

所以，再次说明，有时存在某种模糊、隐藏或被刻意扭曲的事物，而你后来才得以发现。

So, again, it's sometimes that theme of there's something that's not clear or that's hidden or, that's being distorted in some instances deliberately by somebody that you later find out about.

我觉得这在某种程度上非常引人深思，也可能在他长大成为大规模枪手的过程中，对他的心理产生过影响。

And I thought that was fascinating in in some ways and and may also have played into his psychology at some point when he ends up growing up to be this this mass mass shooter.

好吧。

Okay.

那么继续。

So moving on.

让我找找其他有趣的例子。

Let me find some other interesting ones.

我最近想到一个例子，认识的一个人，他的第四宫有土星与海王星合相，这是一个更积极的例子，他出生在20世纪50年代土星与海王星合相期间。

There was one I knew I was thinking about recently of somebody I knew who had a Saturn Neptune conjunction in the fourth house to give a more positive example, and they had the Saturn Neptune conjunction from the nineteen fifties.

到了80年代再次出现合相时，他完成了阿育吠陀医学的培训，这是一种印度传统医学。

And then at the recurrence in the nineteen eighties, they completed training in Ayurvedic medicine, which is like Indian medicine.

他在那次合相期间建立了一个修行所，旨在为人们提供阿育吠陀及精神导向的健康与医疗建议，本质上是一个医疗合作社。

And they founded an ashram on the Saturn Neptune conjunction at that time in order to provide sort of Ayurvedic and, like, spiritually oriented health and medical advice to people, basically, as a medical coop.

我觉得这很有趣，尤其是在第四宫出现这样的配置，意味着建立一个修行所或健康与疗愈的场所，而这与个人对家庭、居住环境以及精神信仰的观念紧密相连。

And I thought that was fascinating having it in the fourth house and the idea of forming, like, an ashram or a, yeah, like, a a place for health and wellness, but that's tied in with one's religious and sort of spiritual views about things in terms of the home and the living place and things like that.

人们会前来拜访，接受针对不同病症的治疗，并被开具草药或其他与阿育吠陀医学相关的健康方案。

And people would come to visit and get treatment for different things and would be prescribed herbs or other health regimens in connection with Ayurvedic medicine.

我觉得这是一个非常棒的正面例证，展示了第四宫土星与海王星合相的积极表现。

So I thought that was really cool manifestation to give you a more positive example of, like, a fourth house Saturn Neptune conjunction.

我曾多次看到——顺便提一下——土星与海王星合相在创立不同宗教团体方面具有重要意义，这在最初的土星海王星合相周期中就已凸显，而过去一年我持续研究时，又发现了历史上多个类似案例，因为海王星代表灵感与灵性层面，而土星则渴望将这些灵性或哲学理想转化为具体的现实形式。

We've seen I've seen so many times just as an aside, Saturn Neptune conjunctions being really important in the founding of different religious communities was a major thing that came up during the original Saturn Neptune episode, but, like, continues to be a really obvious theme that I found other instances of that at different points in history over the course of the past year that I've continued researching this more because it's like you have Neptune, which is like the inspiration or the spiritual side of things, but you put it together as Saturn, really wants to bring those spiritual ideals or sometimes philosophical ideals into concrete form.

有时，这种能量会表现为试图建立一个物理结构、社区或地点，使其与个人的宗教、哲学，甚至在某些情况下是政治理想相一致。

And sometimes that can manifest in attempting to create a physical structure or or community or location that's in alignment with one's religious or philosophical or, just political ideals in some instances.

类似的情况，我之前用过一个出生图，是关于Mercury Cafe的，这是丹佛市一家持续了很多年的本地场所。

Under similar things, I have a birth chart I've used before for the Mercury Cafe, which is a local, was a local place in Denver for many years.

它是在1989年土星与海王星合相期间创立的，我记得这家店于1990年某天开业，上升星座为天蝎座，土星与海王星合相位于第三宫。

And it was founded during the nineteen eighty nine Saturn Neptune Neptune conjunction, and the business opened, one day, I believe in 1990, with Scorpio rising and the Saturn Neptune conjunction in the third house.

我觉得这非常有趣，因为它虽然是一家餐厅，但同时也设有舞台，非常注重社区互动，围绕某种理想组织本地社区活动。

And I found that really fascinating because it was like a restaurant, but it was also a place that had, like, a stage, and it was very community oriented in terms of the local community and in terms of, organizing local community events surrounding an ideal.

但其中特别的一点是，它会举办诗歌朗诵会、诗歌比赛或诗歌擂台赛——我最初开始去Mercury Cafe，就是因为这些活动。

But one thing in particular it did was it hosted and how I usually I first came to start going to the Mercury Cafe is they would host these, poetry readings and poetry competitions or poetry slams.

这正是土星与海王星位于第三宫（沟通宫）的体现：它实际举办了与诗歌相关的社区活动，因此在一段时间里，它成了丹佛当地人参加诗歌擂台赛的必去之地。

And that's part of the third house connection there with Saturn Neptune in the third house of communication was literally hosting and creating community events related to poetry so that for a period of time, it was just this this place everybody would go to in Denver for those poetry slams.

一些非常著名的诗人正是在那里崭露头角，之后取得了成功。

And there were some very famous poets that kind of got their start there and then went on to be successful.

比如安德烈亚·吉布森，她曾在那儿朗诵诗歌，还有其他许多人。

Like, Andrea Gibson, for example, would read poetry there and a number of other people.

这真是一个有趣的例子。

So that was an interesting one.

而且，第三宫还涉及邻居和社区，而这个地方非常注重社区建设，尤其是在政治上，致力于为社区做些好事，特别偏向进步理念之类的。

And, also, in the third house, the third house also has to do with neighbors and communities, and it was a very community oriented place around especially politically, like, in terms of wanting to do good things in the community that were especially, like, more progressive and things like that.

因此，这是一个典型的例子，说明海王星如何将你崇高的理想转化为具体的形态，通过创造一个物理空间来实现它。

So that was an instance where Neptune can be taking your higher ideals and trying to bring it into concrete form by creating a physical space for that for it.

从这个角度看，因为涉及第三宫，所以与当地社区息息相关。

And in that sense, because it was the third house, it had to do with, like, the local community.

好的。

Alright.

其他例子。

Other examples.

我在研究时发现的一个有趣案例是海利·乔·奥斯蒙特，他是一位演员，出生时土星与海王星在第十二宫相合。

A funny one that I found that was a Saturn Neptune conjunction when I was researching is Haley Joe Osment, who was, an actor that had the Saturn Neptune conjunction in the twelfth house.

我觉得这特别有趣，因为他在电影《第六感》中饰演的儿童角色是他最著名且最具影响力的角色。

And I thought that was really funny because his most famous and impactful role was he was, like, the child actor in the movie, the sixth sense.

他最著名的台词，如果你还没看过《第六感》的话，我就剧透了。

And his most famous line, like spoil spoilers if you haven't seen the sixth sense.

我觉得现在每个人应该都看过了，但他最著名的台词是‘我能看到死人’。

I think everyone's seen it at this point, but his most famous line was I see dead people.

我觉得这太惊人了，拥有第十二宫的土星海王星合相，而他最著名的角色就是一个小男孩，能看见那些已经去世、像幽灵一样的人，但别人都看不见。

And I thought that was incredible having a Saturn Neptune conjunction in the twelfth house, and it's like his most famous role is this movie where he's like a little boy, and he can see people who are dead that are like ghosts, but nobody else can see them.

他能够成为已故之人与仍在世之人之间的桥梁，这成为电影的核心焦点。

And he's able to be like the go between in between these two worlds of those that have passed away versus those that are still living, and that becomes, like, the focal point for the movie.

当我们谈到演员时，有时会发现，他们最著名或最具标志性的角色，往往反映了他们星盘中的某种配置。

And we we kinda see that sometimes when it comes to actors, and some of their most famous or iconic roles sometimes speak to a chart placement that they have.

这不仅适用于演员，也适用于其他创作者——有时你的星盘会反映你最终在世界上创造的东西，即使那是一种表演或创意性的表达，而不是直接关于你个人心理或生活中某种行动的东西。

And that's true not just of actors, but other creatives as well where sometimes your chart speaks to what you end up creating in the world even if it's something where you're, like, acting or it's like a creative a creative thing that you're doing rather than something that's, like, about you psychologically or something like that, like some action that you're taking in your own life.

但我认为这是一个非常有趣而引人入胜的例子。

But I thought that was really interesting and fascinating example.

好的。

Alright.

另一个例子回到第三宫，是纪录片导演肯·伯恩斯。

Another one to go back to the third house is Ken Burns, the documentary filmmaker.

他拥有土星与海王星在第三宫的合相。

He has a Saturn Neptune conjunction in the third house.

我觉得他所做的事非常有趣，他以制作纪录片而闻名，尤其是关于美国历史重大事件的纪录片。

And I think it's really interesting how he what he does, he's really famous for doing these documentaries, especially documentaries about major, historic events in American history.

比如，他最近制作了一部关于美国独立战争的完整纪录片系列。

Like, for example, a recent one that he did was a whole documentary series on the American Revolution.

这本质上是沟通和讲述故事，但他还通过重现方式，还原当时的图像和场景，以让你感受到那个时代的氛围。

And it's like communicating and telling a story, but he's also doing so by doing recreation so that he's recreating, the images and the scenarios in order to try to give you a sense of the feeling of that time period.

有时他会使用人们的日记摘录，并让演员在纪录片中朗读这些文字，让你真切地感受到当时人们的想法和感受。

And sometimes he'll use, like, quotes from people's diaries and have actors read those quotes during the course of the documentary to give you a real sense of, like, what people were thinking or feeling during that time period.

但我觉得这很酷。

But I think that's cool.

将这种配置放在沟通的第三宫，并选择通过电影媒介来讲述历史，我认为这正是其中的关键所在。

The idea of having it in the third house of communication and choosing to speak about history through the the medium of cinema, basically, I think is part of what's happening there.

另一个三宫的例子是我曾经认识一个人，他的土星和海王星在三宫合相，他非常关注语言的模糊性以及定义的重要性，同时也对文字和文本中深层或隐藏含义的解读感兴趣。

Another third house one is I knew somebody once that had a Saturn Neptune conjunction in the third house, and they were really focused on this idea of, like, the ambiguity of language and the importance of definitions, but also sometimes the idea of, like, reading into the deeper or sometimes hidden meanings of words and texts.

对他们来说，语言本身的模糊性是一个主要关注点，有时表面写出来的东西之下还隐藏着其他内容，你必须深入思考、挖掘才能理解真正传达的意思。

And that that was, like, a major focus for them was this idea of, like, the the ambiguity in language itself and how sometimes what looks like it's written on the surface that sometimes there's other things that are written below the surface that you really have to think hard about and dig to see in order to understand what's actually being conveyed.

因此，这是我最近反思的另一个三宫表现，我觉得非常有趣且富有洞察力。

So that was another third house manifestation I was, like, reflecting on recently that I thought was really interesting and and insightful.

另一个土星与海王星合相的例子是我认识一位占星师，但他时而认同自己是占星师，时而又质疑自己是否真的是占星师，时而相信占星学，时而又仅仅从历史角度对占星学感兴趣。

Another Saturn Neptune conjunction is I know somebody who was, like, an astrologer, but who kinda goes back and forth between whether they're an astrologer versus whether they're not an astrologer, whether they believe in astrology or whether they're just interested in astrology from a historical standpoint.

在他们人生的不同时期，他们的身份常常显得模糊不清，会反复来回变化。

And oftentimes, it's kind of, like, ambiguous about what they are at different points in their life and at different points in their life will, like, sort of go back and forth.

这种模糊性对于土星与海王星合相来说至关重要，尤其根据宫位的不同，常常会涉及模糊、矛盾甚至反复摇摆的主题。

And this idea of ambiguity is a really crucial one when it comes to Saturn Neptune conjunctions that oftentimes, especially depending on the house placement, there can be these themes surrounding ambiguity and even ambivalence and sometimes, like, going back and forth.

这让我想起我们在最初关于土星与海王星的那期节目中讨论过的一个内容：许多现象都涉及边界之间的模糊性，比如物理边界。

And it kind of reminds me of one of the things we focused on the original Saturn Neptune episode is how there were all these things involving the ambiguities between borders and, like, physical borders.

有时这种模糊性体现在国家或地区之间的边界上。

And sometimes that was, like, ambiguities over borders between countries, for example, or places.

但其他时候，可能是时区带来的模糊性。

But other times, it could be ambiguities surrounding time zones.

例如，我们曾在原始节目中发现，一些最早的时区是在一次重要的土星海王星合相期间设立的。

For example, like some of the first time zones were set up at an important date during a Saturn Neptune conjunction we found in the original episode.

另一个例子是，在过去十年中，每当出现土星海王星合相或刑相时，占星学中的宫位划分问题就会浮现。

Or another one was like house division comes up in astrology at different points over the past decade when a Saturn Neptune conjunction or Saturn Neptune squares come up.

比如2017年就是一个关键年份，当时在土星海王星刑相的影响下，占星界广泛讨论了宫位划分的问题。

So 2017, for example, was a big year where Saturn where house division was being discussed a lot in astrology at that time under that Saturn Neptune square.

最近我反思的另一个有趣话题是杰弗里·科内利乌斯关于占星与占卜的研究。

Another one that was really interesting I was reflecting on recently was, Jeffrey Cornelius and his work about astrology and divination.

有时关于占星是占卜还是科学的争论，与土星海王星的相位以及这两者之间的模糊界限有关。

And sometimes arguments about whether astrology is divination or whether it's scientific are connected with Saturn Neptune alignments and the ambiguity and sort of distinction between those two things.

我会把这一点留到以后再谈，因为我打算将来专门做一期节目来探讨这个话题，但这些是我最近想到的其他一些主题。

So that's something I'll probably save for later because that's something I'd like to do a whole episode on at some point, but those are some other themes that are coming up for me recently.

好的。

Alright.

回溯到19世纪，我查看了一些资料。

Going back, I was looking at some in the eighteen hundreds.

一个有趣的情况是，埃德加·爱伦·坡出生于1809年左右的土星海王星合相期间，他是黑暗诗歌和梦中梦的大师。

An interesting one that came up was Edgar Allan Poe was born under the Saturn Neptune conjunction around '18 o '9, and he was the master of, you know, the dark poem and the dream within a dream.

我觉得这非常出色而优美。

And I thought that was really brilliant and beautiful.

有时，土星根据其与海王星的相对位置，可能带有阴暗的成分。

Sometimes there can be a dark component to Saturn depending on how it's situated with Neptune.

在某些情况下，它可能代表更高的理想，或是美好而富有憧憬的梦想。

And in some instances, it can be, like, the higher ideal and, like, the rosy aspirational dream.

但在其他情况下，它可能更偏向黑暗或悲观的噩梦式情境。

But in other instances, it can be really more of a dark or pessimistic kind of, like, nightmare type situation.

我们能看到这种反复出现的模式，甚至在19世纪末或2025年、2026年的一些新闻事件中也能看到。

And we see that going back and forth in different ways and even coming up, you know, with some of the things that are happening in the news in the late nineteen eighties or or 2025 and 2026.

另一个19世纪的有趣案例是，海王星本身就是在一次土星海王星合相时被发现的，这非常引人注目，因为天文学家最终通过数学计算找到了这颗行星，并推断出它的位置——此前它只是一种数学上的推测，或像幽灵般存在，但人们凭借这种存在感最终成功发现了它。

Another one that is interesting from the eighteen hundreds is that Neptune itself was discovered on a Saturn Neptune conjunction, and this was fascinating because astronomers ended up using mathematical calculations in order to find the planet and kind of infer where it was, where it it had only previously been kind of like a mathematical suspicion or like a ghost that was out there, but they were able to find it because they had this, like, sense that it existed at that point and ended up finding it.

所以，土星与海王星的合相，也打破了可见与不可见之间的界限。

So a Saturn Neptune conjunction and also breaking down the the barriers between what what could be seen versus the unseen.

这是一个非常古老的案例。

A really old one.

我试图找到我所能找到的、带有土星海王星合相且出生日期确切的最古老星盘。

I was looking to see what was, like, the oldest chart that I could find with the Saturn Neptune conjunction for, like, a confirmed birth date.

我文件中有一个是古新柏拉图主义哲学家普罗克洛斯，他出生于公元412年左右，正值当时的土星海王星合相时期。

And one of the ones in my files was the philosopher the ancient Neoplatonic philosopher Proclus, who was born, in the year 04/12 around the Saturn Neptune conjunction at that point.

他是最后几位伟大的新柏拉图主义者之一，试图构建一个庞大而严谨的逻辑体系，以涵盖所有神秘与宗教思想。

And he he was one of the last great Neoplatonists who attempted to build this massive, kind of rigid system of logic to encompass all of mystical and religious thought.

他是柏拉图或新柏拉图传统中最后几位伟大的异教哲学家之一，而当时的新柏拉图主义已经变得极为复杂。

And he was kind of like one of the last great pagan philosophers of the Platonic or Neoplatonic tradition, and Neoplatonism had gotten very complicated at that point.

但他写过一本关于新柏拉图主义定义的书。

But one of the things that he wrote was like a book of sort of, like, definitions related to Neoplatonism.

有趣的是，他是一位非常系统化的思想家，但他所系统化思考的，正是新柏拉图主义这种极其复杂的宗教与灵性教义体系。

And it's interesting seeing that he's like a he was like a very systematic thinker, but he was being very systematic in thinking about Neoplatonism, which has this very complex, like, system of religious and spiritual doctrine, basically.

我觉得这很有趣，因为他属于那个传统中最后几位伟大的哲学家之一。

And I thought that was interesting in terms of him being one of the last great philosophers of that of that tradition.

好的。

Alright.

让我看看我是否还有其他想提到的人，再结束这里。

Let me see if there's any others that I meant to mention before I wrap up here.

好吧。

Okay.

还有两个有趣的例子。

Two more interesting ones.

其中一个特别有趣的是，皮尔斯·布鲁斯南出生于1953年的土星海王星合相时期，他因饰演间谍詹姆斯·邦德而闻名，而在我看来，这本身就很有趣——因为我们正在讨论那种隐秘或不可见的事物，而他最标志性的角色正是一个秘密特工，这个角色始于上世纪九十年代。

One of the most kind of interesting is Pierce Brosnan was born on the nineteen fifty three conjunction, and he's famous for playing he's most famous for playing the role of the spy James Bond, which in and of itself, I thought was kind of interesting when it comes to we're talking about this, like, secretive or, like, hidden thing and the the idea of him being, like, a secret agent in his most iconic role ever started in the in the nineteen nineties.

但我在研究他的传记时发现，有趣的是，在1989年他首次经历这个相位时，正是他原定接任詹姆斯·邦德的那一年，但后来因为合同纠纷而被推迟了。

But I was researching his biography a little bit, and interestingly, at his at the his first recurrence in 1989, that was the exact year that he was originally set to take over as James Bond, but then there were contract disputes that ended up delaying it.

而这次相位重现，标志着他梦寐以求的角色开始变为现实的职业成就。

And this recurrence kind of marked the moment that his dream role started to become this professional tangible reality.

我想再过几年，到了九十年代中期，他最终接过了这个角色，出演了第一部电影《黄金眼》，这是他首次饰演詹姆斯·邦德。

And I think just a few years later, eventually, in the mid nineties, he would actually take over that role in the first movie Goldeneye, which was, like, his first film as James Bond.

所以我觉得这一点很有趣，再次体现了间谍、秘密行动这类主题，有时会通过一个人创造或扮演的角色体现出来，尤其是在艺术家身上。

So I thought that was a cool one in terms of, again, that theme of, like, spies, things that are covert covert operations, but sometimes that coming out through the characters that a person creates or plays as a as a creative or as an artist in some instances.

而在其他情况下，像弗拉基米尔·普京这样的人，他本人就是一名克格勃特工，以更直接、更现实的方式演绎着类似的角色。

Where in other instances, it's like you have people like, you know, Vladimir Putin who was, like, literally a KGB agent and was playing out a role like that in a very much more literal, like, actual sense.

还有一个我不太了解的，就是《黑暗女主人》埃尔维拉。

Another one this one I didn't know about, but Elvira, mistress of the dark.

我不确定大家是否还记得她，但她在八十年代非常出名，有着哥特式的美学风格，而土星与海王星的合相正好落在她的第一宫。

I don't know if people remember her, but she was really prominent in the nineteen eighties, and she had this goth like aesthetic, and the Saturn Neptune conjunction was in her first house.

她出生时上升星座是天秤座。

She was born with Libra rising.

所以她拥有土星与海王星位于第一宫的配置。

So so she had the Saturn Neptune in the first house.

我们再来看看。

And let's see.

Astrodatabank 上有对她的介绍，称她是推销员的女儿，母亲经营一家服装店。

An astrodatabank has a write up for her, and it says she was the daughter of a salesman and a mom who had a costume shop.

两岁时，她被沸水烫伤，后来不得不通过整容手术来修复疤痕。

And at two, she was scalded by boiling water and eventually had to have the scars corrected with cosmetic surgery.

这就是土星位于第一宫的体现——身体和外貌经历了负面事件，同时也可能与海王星和整容手术有关。

So that's the, like, Saturn in the first house of having a negative physical event happening to the body and the appearance, but also possibly the Neptune and the cosmetic surgery.

然后，它继续提到：

And then later, it says it goes on.

她成为了一名拉斯维加斯的歌舞女郎，并与一支摇滚乐队在意大利演出。

It it says she became a Las Vegas showgirl and sang with a rock band that did a gig in Italy.

1971年回到洛杉矶后，她出演了一些电视小角色，同时靠当服务员维持稳定收入。

Then back in Los Angeles in 1971, she played a in television bit parts and waited tables for a steady job.

当她加入喜剧团体时，她的恐怖主持人装扮一炮而红，她尽情演绎着夸张而戏谑的风格。

When she joined the comedy troupe, her horror hostess costume was an immediate big hit, and she vamped and camped it up.

到了八十年代末，Elvira 已成为广为人知的cult偶像，开始销售Elvira主题的服装、漫画、卡通和周边商品，并主持恐怖视频节目。

So by the late nineteen eighties, Elvira was such a recognizable cult favorite that she was marketing Elvira costumes, comic books, cartoons, paraphernalia, and hosting video thrillers.

每年万圣节临近时，她都会从坟墓中再次现身，这么说吧。

Every year near Halloween, she arises again from the crypt, so to speak.

有趣的是，她因扮演这一哥特式角色而声名大噪，因此1988年推出了一部电影，片名正是基于土星与海王星合相的重复主题——《女巫埃尔维拉：黑暗之主》。

And interestingly, she her, like, fame was so much in playing this Gothic character, basically, that they released a movie in 1988, which is under that Saturn Neptune conjunction recurrence titled Elvira mistress of the dark.

所以我觉得，土星与海王星位于第一宫的这个例子既精彩又幽默。

So I thought that was an amazing and funny one in terms of Saturn Neptune in the first house.

在某些情况下，她确实经历了一些身体上的艰难遭遇，但同时也体现了装扮成某种角色、或让外表与真实自我截然不同的理念。

And in some instances, you know, she had a physical thing that happened that was really difficult for her, but also this idea of dressing up in a costume or having one's appearance be different than what it actually is.

或者，这也类似于爱伦·坡的例子，只不过在这里的第一宫，是拥有更黑暗或哥特式的审美，这正是她身上发生的事情的一部分。

Or, also, it's kind of similar to, the Edgar Allan Poe example, but here in the first house, it's like having a darker or Gothic aesthetic, basically, was part of part of what happened there.

好了。

Alright.

另一个例子是亚历山大·格拉汉姆·贝尔，他出生时土星与海王星合相正好跨越了他的第十二宫和第一宫整宫。

Another example is Alexander Graham Bell who was born with the Saturn Neptune conjunction crossing his twelfth and first whole sign houses.

一方面，我之前在多个案例和节目中讲过他的故事，他在发明和推广电话的过程中，一部分经历是致力于打破听觉正常者与听力障碍者之间的界限。

On and on the one hand, I've talked about his story before in a number of examples, another of episodes, but he in inventing and promoting the telephone, part of his story was about breaking down borders between the hearing and and people that are unable to hear or hearing impaired.

而这个故事的一部分是，他的母亲有听力障碍，因此他部分希望借此帮助她。

And part of the story for that is, like, his own mother had hearing difficulties, so he partially wanted to do that in order to help her.

但随后他一生都致力于帮助听障人士，并最终发明了电话。

But then he was involved in in doing different things, working with the hearing impaired for the entirety of his life, and then ended up inventing the telephone.

然而，有趣的是，关于他是否是电话的真正首位发明者存在争议，还有另一位女性也声称自己发明了电话，关于真相究竟如何也一直模糊不清，我对这种围绕此事的神秘感感到非常着迷。

Although, interestingly, there was ambiguity and, like, debates over whether he was the actual first inventor of the telephone or there was another woman who also claimed to have invented it and some nebulousness actually about what the correct answer is surrounding that, which I found really fascinating in terms of the mystery surrounding that and and who the true inventor really is.

另一个例子是格温多琳·布鲁克斯，她的土星与海王星合相横跨第十一和第十二宫。

Another one I found is Gwendolyn Brooks who had the Saturn Neptune conjunction across the eleventh and twelfth house.

她是一位美国作家，出版了二十多本书，并从1969年起担任伊利诺伊州的桂冠诗人。

And she was an American writer and the author of more than 20 books, and she was the poet laureate of the state of Illinois from 1969.

因此，她最终赢得了普利策文学奖。

So she ended up being a winner of the Pulitzer Prize for literature.

1989年，她获得了国家艺术基金会颁发的终身成就奖。

And in 1989, she she received a lifetime achievement award from the National Endowments for the Arts.

我觉得她的人生经历令人惊叹的是，她出生时就带着土星与海王星合相，而在1989年那次周期重现时，她因作为诗人和作家的成就获得了终身成就奖，这堪称一次非凡的周期性星象转渡例证。

So what I found incredible about her her story is just having being born with the Saturn Neptune conjunction, And then eventually on the 1989 recurrence, she was, you know, received the lifetime achievement award for her work as a poet and as a writer, which is an an incredible example of a recurrence transit.

在艺术方面，毕加索的土星与海王星在第十宫形成合相，我特别喜欢这个例子，尤其是他关于立体主义的作品。

In in terms of art, Pablo Picasso had a Saturn Neptune conjunction in the tenth house, and I really like this example because of especially his work on Cubism.

他创作的立体主义作品对我来说非常能体现土星与海王星的特质，因为这虽然是绘画和艺术，但他却赋予形式一种块状感，乍看之下可能显得怪异，甚至不像艺术，尤其是与此前的艺术传统形成了鲜明突破。

And the work that he did on Cubism is really evocative for me of Saturn and Neptune because it's like art and painting, but he's bringing this blockiness to forms, which at first might look looks weird or or looks like not artistic, especially as a break with the previous art up to that point.

但从土星与海王星的角度来理解立体主义，我认为这非常有趣且富有表现力。

But thinking about cubism in that context as part of a Saturn Neptune thing, I think, is really interesting and expressive in terms of that.

他在1917年还经历了一次重现，当时他前往意大利，开始为芭蕾舞剧《俄罗斯之魂》设计布景，这标志着他从以忧郁和类似主题为主的‘蓝色时期’，转向了更具结构性的古典主义阶段。

He also had a recurrence in 1917 where he traveled to Italy and began designing for the ballet Ruses, and this marked a shift from what historians call his blue period, which is more about sadness and things like that into a more structured classical phase of his career.

我希望能有一天深入探讨不同艺术家如何通过绘画或表达方式，体现土星与海王星的相位——或者其它更能描述他们艺术与创造力的行星相位，以及这些重现相位如何有时与他们职业生涯和艺术产出的转变相吻合。

So that's something I'd love to explore at some point is just different artists and how they paint or express themselves as an expression either of Saturn Neptune alignments in this instance or other planetary alignments that might be more descriptive of their art and their creative their creativity as well as how those recurrence transits sometimes line up with shifts in terms of their career and their artistic output.

我最近发现的一个有趣例子是丹尼尔·雷德克里夫，他于1989年出生时土星与海王星呈合相，他最广为人知的角色是在《哈利·波特》系列电影中饰演少年时期的哈利·波特。

A more recent one I found that was interesting is Daniel Radcliffe was born with a Saturn Neptune conjunction in 1989, and he's, of course, most well known for playing Harry Potter as a young or as a child actor in the February.

一方面，他饰演了这些经典电影中的巫师角色，这本身就很有趣，而他目前正经历着一次重现相位。

And on the one hand, that's kind of interesting that he played the role of, like, a wizard in these the this, like, iconic set of movies from the February, but he's having a recurrence transit right now.

关于这一点，有两件事让我觉得特别有意思。

And there's two things about that that I find interesting.

一方面，他目前正在参加一系列媒体宣传活动，因为他在最近的戏剧角色中获得了巅峰级的赞誉。

One is that he's currently on, like, a press run right now because he's receiving, peak critical acclaim for his recent career defining theatrical roles.

到目前为止，这种回归在某种程度上成功地消解了哈利·波特这个角色的阴影，他正逐渐确立自己作为表演界一位持久且受尊重的演员地位，而不仅仅局限于那个角色。

And at this point, this, recurrence is kind of successfully, in some ways, dissolving the ghost of Harry Potter and as he's he's sort of establishing himself as a permanent and respected figure in terms of the acting world outside of that role.

我认为，这一点在于他努力摆脱那个角色，独立地建立自己的身份。

And I think that's one piece of it just in terms of him establishing himself independent of that.

但另一方面，HBO似乎正在拍摄一部新的《哈利·波特》剧集。

But then also, I guess, HBO is, like, shooting a new Harry Potter series.

就在过去一两年里——也许只有一年——他们公布了新演员阵容，并宣布了由谁来饰演新一代的哈利·波特。

And just in the past year or two, maybe it was just the past year, they announced the new cast, and they announced who the new actor is that's playing the new Harry Potter.

因此，从某种意义上说，土星与海王星的回归以两种方式共同作用，帮助他最终与这个角色区分开来。

So in some ways, the Saturn Neptune recurrence is also, like, in two different ways, like that role him finally starting to be differentiated from that role as an actor.

一方面，是凭借他自身的演技和在戏剧舞台上的独立表现；另一方面，也因为另一位演员接过了这个角色，因此这个角色不再仅仅与丹尼尔·雷德克里夫一个人绑定，这在我看来是一个关于回归周期的绝佳例子。

On the one hand, due to his own skill and acting in theater and and on his own, but also in another sense because now another actor has come along to play that role, and so it will no longer be something that, like, singularly defines only Daniel Radcliffe, which I think is a really interesting example of a recurrence in that instance.

我们一年前在关于土星和海王星的世俗占星专题中经常提到的一个主题是，它往往与帝国的衰落或解体相吻合。

One of the themes we we oftentimes bring up that we brought up in the mundane episode on Saturn and Neptune a year ago is it coinciding with the fall of empires or the dissolution of empires.

在上一期节目中，我们找到了许多类似的历史案例，其中有两个出生图特别相关，它们都包含土星与海王星的合相。

And there were a bunch of different examples of this that we found in history in that episode, but there were two birth charts that were interestingly tied in with that that both had Saturn Neptune conjunctions.

其中一个例子是埃及的福阿德二世，他的土星与海王星合相位于第十宫，并与火星相合。他于1952年在其父法鲁克一世被迫退位后，尚在襁褓中便登上了埃及王位。

So one of them was for Fuad the second of Egypt who had the Saturn Neptune conjunction in the tenth house with Mars, and he was the king of Egypt who ascended the throne as just a baby in 1952 after the abdication, the forced abdication of his father, king Faruk the first.

这位名叫福阿德二世的孩子在位不到一年，直到1953年6月，最终成为埃及君主制彻底废除前的最后一位在位君主。

And this child, Fawad the second, he reigned for less than a year until June 1953, and he ended up being then effectively the last reigning monarch of Egypt before the monarchy was completely abolished after that point.

他也是自1805年以来延续至今的这个王室血脉中的最后一位继承者。

And it was also the last in his house lineage that had stretched back all the way until eighteen o five.

因此，他在1952年革命中被推翻，当时君主制和贵族制度被废除，埃及共和国宣告成立。

So he ended up being overthrown when the monarchy and the aristocracy was abolished in the nineteen fifty two revolution, and the Republic Of Egypt was proclaimed.

被废黜后，他被送往法国。

So after being deposed, he was brought to France.

但有趣的是，埃及革命的主要人物之一加马勒·阿卜杜勒·纳赛尔，出生时也带有土星与海王星的合相。

But interestingly, one of the people one of the primary people that was involved in the Egyptian revolution, Gamal Abdel Nasser, was born with a Saturn Neptune conjunction.

如果时间准确，这一合相位于第九宫，他在1952年埃及革命中发挥了领导作用，推翻了原国王法鲁克，并短暂地扶植了他的儿子继位一两年。

And if the time is right, it was in the ninth house, and he played a leading role in the Egyptian revolution of nineteen fifty two, which removed the original king Farouq, and it temporarily installed his son for a year or two.