最常回放的时刻：立即提升对话能力的框架！

你可以直接统计每次约会中他们问了多少个问题。

And you can just measure it, measure how many questions they asked on each date.

问的问题越多的人，对方约他们第二次见面的可能性要高得多。

People who ask more questions are enormously more likely to get asked on a second date.

你可以想象一下，你参加了二十次初次约会，如果我跟你说，史蒂文，你只要在每次约会中多问一个问题。

So much so, imagine you go on twenty first dates, and I say, okay, Steven, you just have to ask one extra question on those 20 dates.

只要你这么做，就能让其中一次约会变成第二次约会，仅仅因为多问了一个问题。

If you do, you'll convert another date into a second date from just one question per date.

根据数据来看。

According to the data.

没错。

Yes.

这一点对男女都适用，但对男性尤其有帮助，因为男性平均问的问题比女性少。

It's true for both men and women, but it's particularly helpful for men because they ask fewer questions on average than women do.

真的吗？

Really?

是的

Yeah.

明显少很多

Significantly less.

对

Yes.

数据中另一个有趣的性别差异是，男性更愿意同意第二次约会。

And the other funny gender effect in the data is that men are just more likely to agree to go on second dates.

他们总体上没那么挑剔。

They're less discerning in general.

但如果男性想被邀请第二次约会，多问几个问题就行了。

But if they wantif men want to get asked on the second date, just ask more questions.

我多问问题，对对方有什么影响？

What is me asking more questions doing to the other person?

这会让对方觉得被倾听，觉得你真想知道他们的想法，对你有兴趣。

It makes them feel heard and like you want to know their answer, that you're interested in them.

所以这不仅表达了你的兴趣，还能让你了解对方的想法和经历，从而获得更多信息，以便提出更深入的问题。

So it signals your interest, but also you learn what's in their mind and what their experience is, which gives arms you with more information to then ask more better questions.

这不只是问得越多越好，虽然那确实是个不错的开始。

So it's not just about asking more, although that's a good start.

关键是能问出特别棒的追问。

It's about asking fuck great follow-up questions.

提问的好处，几乎完全来自于追问的力量。

The the the benefits of question asking are almost entirely driven by the power of follow-up questions.

你能举个例子吗？比如怎么问出一个特别好的追问？

Give me an example of asking a great follow-up question.

在约会的时候。

On a date.

桌上摆着食物。

There's food.

气氛特别好。

It's going really well.

我刚跟你说了，今天早上我沿着日落大道散步，特别棒。

I've just shared with you that I went on an amazing walk down the Sunset this morning.

那我会说，真的吗？

And then I would say, really?

天哪。

Oh my god.

我早就想去了。

I've always wanted to go.

快跟我讲讲，到底怎么样？

Tell me tell me about it.

怎么个

How

太不可思议了。

is Incredible.

我走到那儿的时候。

So I got to this point.

我以前从来没来过这儿。

I had never been here there before.

到了这儿，我得做个决定：是拐去看看玛丽莲·梦露的公寓，顺便说一句，那地方就在弗兰克·劳埃德·赖特房子旁边，还是往几个街区外走，去看看门德兹兄弟的家。

There was I had to decide, was I gonna veer off and go see the Marilyn Monroe apartment, which, by the way, is right next to the Frank Lloyd Wright house.

天哪。

Oh my god.

还是往几个街区外走，去看看门德兹兄弟的家。

Or was I gonna go a few blocks away was the Menendez brothers' house.

谁啊？

Who's that?

就是那两个杀了自己父母的兄弟。

The two brothers who killed their parents.

我的天。

Oh, shit.

在奈飞上看过。

On Netflix.

是的

Yeah.

哦

Oh,

哇

wow.

好吧

Okay.

所以我当时就卡在正中间，正好在一个十字路口上。

So I would literally, right in between, and I it was at this crossroads.

我是选高雅的呢？

Do I choose cultured?

还是选那种猎奇的呢？

Do I choose morbid curiosity?

那你最后选了哪一个？

And which one did you choose?

我选了有品位的。

I went with cultured.

我自己一个人太害怕了。

I was too afraid by myself by myself.

你真可爱。

You're so cute.

确实如此。

That's true.

好吧。

So okay.

我们没问题了。

So we okay.

我们现在不约会了。

We're off our date now.

那真有趣。

That was so fun.

你问的问题特别暖心，真的让我觉得你在认真听我的故事，支持着我。

You were asking such lovely questions, and it really helped to, like, cheer me on like you actually wanted to hear this story Mhmm.

别人可能根本没兴趣，那样的话，我会觉得挺尴尬的。

Even though it might like, someone else might have been, like, not that interested, and then you feel embarrassed.

我刚分享了这么多私密的事。

Like, oh, I just shared a bunch of vulnerable stuff.

我一个人在洛杉矶散步。

I was walking alone in LA.

我对这个故事里的两个兄弟特别好奇，甚至有点着迷。

I had morbid curiosity about these two brothers in this story.

那一刻，很容易让人觉得自己的感受被忽视了，但你接着问问题，让我觉得你真的想了解更多。

It's very easy to make someone feel invalidated in that moment, but follow-up questions make me feel like, oh, he wants to know more.

你是在陪着我走这段路。

He's coming with me on this journey.

那我刚才做得对吗？

Did I do the right thing then?

是的

Yeah.

你做得很好。

You were doing great.

好的。

Okay.

对。

Yeah.

那什么才是不该做的呢？

And what what's the wrong thing to have done?

对我而言，如果只是

For me to just just

哦，想象一下，如果我跟你说我沿着日落大道走了趟，特别棒，你却回我说：‘那条街上我最爱的餐厅是家寿司店。’

Oh, imagine if I had been like, oh, I went on this on an amazing walk down the Sunset Strip, and you said, oh, my favorite restaurant on the Strip is a sushi place.

天哪。

Oh, shit.

我去了一家特别棒的餐厅，还去了家特别棒的店。

I I went to this amazing restaurant, and I went to this amazing store.

是的。

Yeah.

那里卖爱马仕的产品。

They carried Hermes.

我买了一双特别棒的靴子。

I bought an amazing pair of boots.

这种事大家经常干。

People do that all the time.

简直天天如此。

Constantly.

这叫‘婴儿潮一代式提问’。

So this is called boomer asking.

‘婴儿潮一代式提问’？

Boomer asking?

不是因为婴儿潮一代。

Not because of boomers.

我们喜欢

We love

你什么意思？

What are you saying?

这是给所有年龄段的人的。

It's for people of all ages.

去玩这个叫婴儿潮的，它是个回旋镖。

Commit boomer it's a boomerang.

哦，

Oh,

好吧。

okay.

所以我跟你说

So I say to you

我是不是掉粉了？

Do I lost subscribers?

没有。

No.

没有。

No.

我们很喜欢老年人。

We love boomers.

所以我问你，比如史蒂文，你最喜欢的餐厅是哪家？

So I say to you, like, Steven, what's your favorite restaurant?

周先生。

Mr.

周先生的。

Chow's.

哦，我去过周先生的。

Oh, I've been to Mr.

周先生的店。

Chow's.

上次我去周先生的店时，

Last time I went to Mr.

带了一大群朋友，有个朋友特别激动，

Chow's, I went with a whole bunch of friends, and I had a friend who was all really

那时候。

the time.

所以我问了这个问题。

So I've asked the question.

你跟我分享了这么珍贵的东西。

You've shared something with me that is such a gift.

任何自我坦露都是莫大的礼物。

Any sort of self disclosure is such a gift.

我并没有问，那你跟谁一起去的？

And instead of saying, oh, who did you go with?

那你点了什么？

Or what did you order?

里面是什么样子的？

Or what is it like inside?

你觉得怎么样？

How did you like it?

我总是把话题不知不觉拉回到自己身上。

I bring it the focus of the conversation right back to myself.

做这种事的人自己根本没意识到。

People that do that don't know they do it.

没错。

Correct.

比如我会和同事一起去吃饭，有时候一桌十来个人。

Because I will obviously, you know, I will go for dinner or we'll have, I don't know, 10 of my colleagues there.

然后偶尔会有一个同事，就正好在做这种事，是的。

And then sometimes I'll have one particular colleague who is doing exactly that Yes.

他们自己根本没意识到。

And they have no idea.

你难道不想直接说，别这样了么？

Don't you wanna be like, stop.

对啊。

Yes.

别这样了。

Stop.

天哪。

Fucking hell.

你就直接问问他们的情况呗。

Just, like, ask them about their thing.

他们是新来的。

They're new here.

我们就是想让他们感觉自在一点。

We're trying to make them feel comfortable.

哪怕只问一个跟进的问题，也可能就够了。

Even one follow-up question might be enough.

如果你能先问下一个问题，再把话题收回到自己身上，有时候这就足够了。

And so if you use this mindset of, like, ask the next question before you pull it back to yourself, it sometimes can be enough.

多问几个跟进的问题，效果可能更好。

Probably many more follow-up questions is better.

但哪怕只是问一句，比如‘哦，你去的是哪位先生那儿？’

But even just one where I was like, oh, who did you go to Mr.

然后呢？

With?

他们就会愿意接着回答。

And they let you answer.

这时候我就可以说，‘我也去过那儿。’

Then I say, oh, I've been there too.

你能看出他们脑子里立刻有了反应——当你提到‘周先生’是他们最爱的餐厅，他们马上就联想到什么了。

You can see it happening in their head because you say the word mister Chows is your favorite restaurant, and they immediately There's an association.

是的。

Yes.

我得跟大家讲讲关于周先生那家餐厅的精彩故事。

Brilliant story about mister Chows that I need to tell everybody.

人们这么做其实很合理。

It makes sense that people do this.

我们的大脑天生就特别以自我为中心。

Our brains are incredibly are wired to be egocentric.

我们对自己经历的一切都记得清清楚楚。

We know all of our lived experiences are owned with 100% accuracy.

因为那是我们亲身经历的。

We lived it.

所有这些都储存在脑子里。

It's all up here.

所以，我们在对话中听到或看到的任何事，都会自然而然地勾起你脑海中关于自己经历的回忆和联想。

So anything that we see or hear in our conversations is, of course, going to trigger all of these memories and associations in your mind about your lived experience.

这可是好好聊天的大敌，因为它总让你没法先去关心对方。

And it's such an enemy of good conversation because it constantly tugs you away from being interested in the other person first.

我还在会议里见过另一种情况，以前也跟人聊过好几次：有人在说话，旁边的人一边听一边不停地附和。

The other thing I've seen in meetings, which I've had to have a converse couple of conversations about historically, is when someone will be talking and then someone's listening going, yeah.

对。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

我知道自己有时候就是那样，天哪，真不好意思。

And I know I'm like, oh my god.

人家其实有话要说。

They've got something to say.

我明白。

I know.

对。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

他们这是在逼着对方说话呢。

They're yaring them out.

是的。

Yes.

他们试图用不断插话的方式让对方闭嘴，好让自己把观点强加出去。

They're trying to yeah them into silence so that they can get their point across.

就是这样。

That's

没错。

right.

是的。

Yes.

我以前也遇到过这种情况。

And I've had

得发消息过去说：你刚才一直说‘是是是’。

to send messages in the past to say, by the way, you were saying, yeah, yeah, yeah.

这让旁观者觉得你根本没在听，只是想抢着说话。

And it made it seem to an objective observer, like you weren't listening and actually you were just trying to say something.

所以为了你着想，你知道的，也许

So just in the interest of you, you know, maybe

也许别这么做。

Maybe don't.

别老说那种，比如

Just don't say, like

他们对这种感觉是怎么回应的？

How do they respond to that feeling?

因为我其实没像刚才说的那样直接表达。

Because I didn't I constructed it more

更委婉一点？

Tactfully?

我表达得比刚才说的要委婉得多。

Tactfully than I just described.

但我反复想过这个问题，只是因为我在会议里见过他们这样做了三四十次。

But I thought about it a lot and I just wanted to because I'd seen them doing this thirty, forty times in meetings.

是的。

Yeah.

他们可能没意识到别人怎么看这种行为。

And I don't think they realize how it's perceived.

现在你明白我为什么在那么多对话中都有这种感受了吧？有很多类似的情况，你看到别人在做这种不妥的交谈举动，其实完全能理解为什么会这样。

Now you know how I feel during so many conversations for so many different re there are so many things like that where you see other people doing the dastardly conversational thing, and it's totally understandable why.

他们太兴奋了。

They're excited.

他们有话想说，结果反而没法真正去倾听对方在讲什么。

They have a thing they wanna say, and it's preventing them from actually engaging with the person who's talking and and what they're saying.

这些情况都是可以理解的。

All of these things are understandable.

重要的是要带着不评判的心态去看待。

It's important to come from a place of non judgment.

对。

Mhmm.

这是因为我们的大脑天生就容易走神，而不是专注于别人。

It's because our brains were built to wander, not focus on another person.

对。

Mhmm.

因为我们本质上都很自我，总是从自己的角度出发，这两点都阻碍了我们真正与他人建立连接。

Because we're deeply egocentric beings, and we focus on our own perspective, both of those things hold us back from really being able to engage with someone else.

我想回到你之前说的，那种十分满分的亲和力。

I wanna go back to your thing of, like, a 10 out of 10 likability.

那些看似微不足道的小事，其实都在一点一点损耗你的亲和力——比如你没法真正专心听对方说话，也没法提出跟进的问题。

That those are the little things, the little death by a thousand cuts to your likability are these things where it's like you're not able to actually really focus on someone else and really engage with what they're saying and ask follow-up questions.

之后在对话中，还能想起对方之前说过的话，因为你足够细心。

And then later in the conversation, call back to something they said earlier because you're just that clever.

但要真正做到这些，障碍实在太多了。

Are so much stands in the way of of doing that.

就拿我刚才说的那个例子来说，我开始收到和这个人共事的人给的负面反馈。

In that particular example I'm thinking about, I started to get negative feedback from people that worked with this person.

有一天我发现，收到的负面反馈是：我觉得他根本没在听我说话。

And I noticed one day the negative feedback was, I don't think they're even listening to me.

是的。

Yeah.

因为他确实没在听。

Because they're not.

因为他根本就没认真听。

Because they weren't really listening.

所以我一收到这个反馈，马上就想到：斯蒂文，你早就见过这种情况了。

And so the minute I got the feedback was the minute I thought, you know what, Steven, you've watched this happen.

你知道这确实是事实。

You know it's objectively true.

你有责任，既然你是他上级，得跟他谈谈，因为这已经影响到他的发展了。

You owe it because you're this person's report to have a conversation with them about it because it's getting in the way of their success.

对我来说有趣的是，如果我把认识和共事过的人，按他们沟通时的自我觉察程度画个图，有些人就是天生特别缺这个。

The fascinating thing for me is if I plot everybody I know and work with on an axis of self awareness as it relates to their communication, some people are just they kind of just got to have it.

而另一些人则完全相反，根本意识不到自己给别人留下的印象。

And then some people are on the other end of this spectrum where there's no apparent self awareness of how they're coming across.

他们能力出众，也非常努力，但沟通方面的自我认知不足，往往是影响他们职业发展的唯一关键因素。

And they're so talented and so hardworking, but this one thing of their communication self awareness is honestly, in some cases, the single thing, the single gravitational force on their career trajectory.

没错。

Yes.

那人们能改变吗？

And can people change?

还是说这跟基因有关？

Or is it just like a genetic thing?

是可以改变的。

They can.

首先，我要说，无论处在光谱的哪一端，都有利有弊。

First, let me address, there are pros and cons to being at both ends of that spectrum.

如果你太过敏感、自我意识过强，反而容易分心。

If you are too hypervigilant and too self aware, it can be distracting.

这可能意味着你太讨好别人了，久而久之就会精疲力尽。

It might mean that you're sort of people pleasing too, which can lead to burnout and exhaustion.

如果你处在缺乏自我认知的那一端，那确实会是个大问题。

If you're at this lack of self awareness end, of course, it's gonna be a real problem.

所以我特别喜欢去教和辅导那些人，因为他们的自我认知是可以提升的。

And so I love teaching and coaching people at that end because you can become more self aware.

我很多在哈佛的学生刚来上课时，就是这个状态。

So many of my students at Harvard come into the course, and that's how they are.

你这话是什么意思？

What do you mean?

他们根本不清楚自己的长处和短板在哪里。

They are not aware of what their strengths and weaknesses are.

他们也不知道自己哪些地方做得对，哪些地方做得不对。

They don't know what they're doing right and wrong.

他们只知道，自己要么讨厌聊天，要么不擅长聊天。

They just know they either hate conversation or aren't good at it.

所以，只要他们上完这门课，就会变得清醒很多，真正意识到对话是一种至关重要的技能——不是那种模糊的、软性的能力，而是能实实在在影响他们生活中一切重要事情的技能，就像一种可衡量的经济价值。

And so just by going through this talk course, they become much more sort of clear eyed and open to the fact that conversation is a skill that matters profoundly, not in a sort of soft skill, fuzzy way, but as a in a quantifiable way that impacts everything that matters to them, like a bottom line, almost as like an economic value to them.

一旦他们明白这是种需要提升的技能，哪怕在三个月的课程里看不出巨大进步，长远来看他们也很可能会越来越好，因为他们现在知道了问题所在。

And so just having their eyes open to the fact that, like, this is a skill and a skill they need to get better at, even if I don't see them getting massively better in the course of three months, it means that they are likely to get better at it over the longer term because now they know.

现在他们明白了，也知道自己的对话能力还远远不够。

Now they get it, and now they know that they aren't great at it yet.

我们之前聊过，作为沟通高手和讨人喜欢的人，那些‘千刀万剐’的小毛病还有别的吗？

Are there anything else that you know, we talked about death by a thousand cuts as it relates to being a 10 out of 10 conversationalist and like likable person.

还有没有其他一些微小的习惯，我们自己都没意识到，却在悄悄损害着我们？

Are there any of these other small things that we do which are harming us but tiny that most people don't know

我们跳到K吧。

they're Let's move to k.

因为我要顺着这个框架往下讲。

I'm because I'm moving along in this framework.

我们现在跳过L，但不是说以后永远都不讲L。

We're skipping l now, which we would never skip l forever.

K代表善意。

K is for kindness.

我们从小就被教导要善良，但长大后却常常在实际行动中做不到。

Often, we're all taught this virtue of kindness when we're children and spend the rest of our lives sort of falling short of actually doing it in practice.

我一直以来都很着迷于这个问题：真正善良的人，他们心里在想什么？他们是怎样与人互动的？

I've forever been obsessed with this idea of, well, what are people who are actually kind, what are they thinking about, and how are they interacting with other people?

他们做出什么样的选择？

What kinds of choices are they making?

他们是怎么跟别人说话的？

How do they talk to other people?

当你说到‘千刀万剐’式的伤害时，其实我们说话时一些不尊重的细节，正在悄悄削弱我们本想表达的善意。

And so when you say death by a thousand cuts, there are these sort of mistakes that we make in the respectfulness of our language that undermine our actual kindness to other people.

比如你提到的，用对对方的名字，这你举过例子，十项里有一项就是叫错名字。

Making sure you use someone's name you gave this example, and the one out of 10 is like use the wrong name.

这真的很重要。

That is really meaningful.

你得知道别人的名字，并且正确地叫出来。

You need to know people's names and use them correctly.

还要注意合适的礼节，比如有时候说‘嘿，亲爱的’会很暖心。

And with appropriate formality, right, sometimes it's wonderful to say like, hey, honey.

但有时候你得说‘很高兴认识您，医生。’

And sometimes you need to say, it's nice to meet you, Doctor.

布鲁克斯。

Brooks.

对吧？

Right?

你得能读懂这种分寸。

Like, you need to be able to read that.

有一项研究，分析了奥克兰警察和市民之间的对话，就在我们附近，普通的交通拦停场景。

There is this paper where they studied conversations between police officers and citizens in Oakland, actually close to here, in normal traffic stops.

警察拦下市民，走上前说‘你超速了’，他们用随身摄像头记录了整个过程，整理出所有对话文本，然后评估警察在交流中使用的语言是否得体。

So when police pulled over citizens and walked up to the car and said, you were speeding, you know, and they used body cam footage and got all the transcripts from these interactions and then measured the respectfulness of the language that the police officers were using.

有一些发现其实并不意外，但非常糟糕：警察对黑人公民使用的语言，比对白人公民更不尊重。

There are some really, you know, not surprising but terrible findings that police officers were using less respectful language towards black citizens compared to white citizens.

但更广泛地说，那些警察用语更尊重的互动，结果都更好。

But sort of more, broadly speaking, the interactions where they were using more respectful language went better.

发生的冲突更少。

There were less conflicts.

对方开车离开时，也不会再有其他问题。

They drive away without further infractions.

我们在语言中做出的微小选择，以及尊重的表达方式，涉及上百种语言细节，这是一个很微妙的概念，但却实实在在地影响着互动的结果。

So the tiny choices we make in our language and the language of respect varies along hundreds of features of language, and it's a very gradient concept, but they have a real impact on how these interactions go.

我们常说的系统性种族偏见，其实就源自这类细节。

We think about sort of like things like systemic racial bias, that's it comes from that kind of stuff.

它就藏在我们彼此交谈时的语言里，悄悄流露出来。

That's where it leaks out is in the language we use with each other.

所以，我们每个人都可以学会使用更尊重他人的语言。

So we can all learn to use more respectful language.

你有没有想过，我们的情绪状态会怎样影响我们完成这些事情的能力？

Do you think much about how our emotional state is impacting our ability to accomplish any of these things?

我觉得，那些我最没耐心、最不友善的日子，往往都是没睡好的日子。

Because I think, you know, the days where I'm least likely to be kind are the days where I haven't slept.

是的。

Yeah.

那天我最好还是别跟人聊天了。

I should probably be avoiding all conversations that day.

我觉得，从这些研究里学到最重要的一点就是，对话其实特别耗费心力，需要不少精力。

It's really I think one of the biggest things I've learned from all of this work is that conversation is remarkably effortful, and it requires quite a bit of energy.

就算你知道怎么当个好的交谈者，很多时候也没那个精力去实际做到。

Even if you know how to be a good conversationalist, often we don't have the energy to actually do it.

我没力气去想聊什么话题了。

Oh, I don't have the energy to brainstorm topics.

我也没力气继续追问下去了。

I don't have the energy to continue asking follow-up questions.

我要放任自我中心，一直聊到太阳下山。

I'm gonna let my egocentrism take over and boomerask till the sun comes down goes down.

我不是那种人。

I'm not boomers.

不是那种人。

Not boomers.

行吧。

Fine.

有个

There's a

我们看法不太一样。

difference of opinion here.

我会不小心说出不礼貌的话，却不去纠正或弥补。

I'm going to accidentally use disrespectful language and not repair that, not correct it.

让我夜不能寐的是，人类确实有局限性。

That's kind of what keeps me up at night, that human beings do have limitations.

我们的时间是有限的。

We are limited in time.

我们的精力也是有限的。

We're limited in energy.

我们的大脑可不是超级计算机。

Our brains are not supercomputers.

所以现实中，那些沟通能力很强的人，往往也达不到自己的期望，就是因为他们没那个精力。

And so in practice, people who are great communicators will often fall short of their own hopes because they don't have the energy to do it.

我觉得布琳·布朗曾经跟我说过，她回到家累得没劲儿的时候，就会对伴侣说：今天我只剩10%的电量了，这事真没法儿处理。

I think Brene Brown said to me that when she comes home and she's out of energy, she'll just say to her partner, Listen, I'm on 10% today, I can't deal with this now.

这可真是自我觉察的典范。

And talk about self awareness.

如果你真能做到这一点，能坦率地说出来，而且你和同事、家人的关系足够稳固，能直接说：兄弟，我今天状态只有2分。

Boy, if you can do that, if you can say and you have sturdy enough relationships at work and at home that you could say, Dude, I'm like a two out of 10.

今天就别为难我了，那真的会帮大忙。

You gotta cut me a break today, it would be tremendously helpful.

要意识到自己只处于十分之二的状态，需要相当强的自我觉察，而周围的人也得有足够的包容，因为迟早你也得对他们报以同样的理解。

It requires quite a bit of self awareness to recognize that you're at a two out of 10 and a lot of grace from the which people around means that you're gonna have to give them grace in response at some point.

这才是健康的关系。

That's what good relationships are.

还有那个L。

And the l.

L。

L.

我们来按正确顺序排列一下吧？

Shall we put them in the correct order?

对。

Yeah.

P-a-l-k。

P a l k.

L代表轻松感。

L is for levity.

我们之前聊过一些艰难的对话，以及它们为什么会这么容易变得激烈。

So we've talked a bit about difficult conversations and how they can so easily get overheated.

当你想到那些失控的聊天时，很容易马上想到对抗和冲突，因为这些情况特别显眼。

When you think about chats that go off the rails, it's quite easy to think of hostile conflict, difficult conversations, because they're very salient.

它们让人印象特别深刻。

They're very memorable.

可能会有人大喊大叫。

There might be shouting.

肯定会有人受伤、变得防御。

There's gonna be hurt feelings, defensiveness.

但其实，对话更大的敌人是无聊和心不在焉。

The more common enemy of conversation is actually boredom and disengagement.

所以，是的，我们会不会互相烦？

So, yes, do we get annoyed with each other?

当然会。

Absolutely.

但几乎每段对话都会出现冷场，大家提不起兴趣。

But almost every conversation has stints of disengagement where people aren't interested.

所以幽默和温暖能帮我们避开冷淡和无聊。

And so levity is humor and warmth to help us avoid disinterest and boredom.

轻松的氛围本身，对快乐和投入就很重要。

And levity is important for sort of happiness and engagement's sake itself.

我们在一起时是否享受这段时光，其实很关键。

It matters that we're enjoying our time together.

但更深层的是，如果我们彼此不靠近，对对方说的话不感兴趣，就根本没法实现其他任何目标。

But maybe even more profoundly, if we are not leaning towards each other and interested in what the other person is saying, we can't achieve any of our other goals.

好的对话，离不开双方的共同投入。

Good conversation requires mutual engagement.

如果我感到无聊，心思飘走了——这其实挺常见的，我注意力不太好，但很多人都这样，人脑在对话中走神的概率高达25%。

So if I'm bored and my mind is wandering, which happens a lot because I have attentional issues, it happens to a lot of people a lot, the human mind wanders, 25% of the time during conversation, so it's quite common.

一旦你心不在焉，双方都脱节了，那其他事情也就无从谈起了。

If your mind is wandering and you're not engaged with each other, then you can't do anything else either.

说服、一起做决定、头脑风暴、建立联系——这些都无从谈起。

Persuasion, making decisions together, brainstorming, connecting, none of it.

所以，轻松的氛围非常重要，它让事情变得有趣，也让我们能彼此保持连接，而不是疏离。

So the l is very important because it makes things fun and enjoyable, but it's also important because we need to stay here with each other and not disengage.

如果你本身不是一个热情的人呢？

What if you're not a warm person?

这真的特别有意思。

It's so fun.

被指责有种族歧视。

Accused of being racist.

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

没错。

Yeah.

别人经常跟我说，你这个人太严肃了。

People say to me people say to me a lot, like, you're very serious.

真的吗？

I'm like, really?

我有时候确实给人感觉挺严肃的。

I'm I think I come across as serious sometimes.

我觉得你确实可能显得有点严肃。

I think you may come across as serious.

不过呢，你给人的感觉也很温暖。

I I think but you do come across as very warm.

这两者之间是有区别的。

And so that's an important distinction.

你这是在夸我吧。

You're using flattery.

我早就看出来了。

I've seen that on your compass.

我不是在奉承你。

I'm not.

我只是在直接表达我的看法。

I'm giving I'm giving very direct feedback.

这么说，你是在奉承我。

Gearing, so it's flattery.

奉承。

Flattery.

高情感联结。

High relational.

我可看透你了。

I'm onto you.

幽默感其实包含两个方面。

So there's levity is two parts.

一个是幽默，一个是温暖。

It's humor and warmth.

在哈佛的课上，每次讲到这一部分，我都会对学生们说：如果你觉得自己不幽默，而且觉得这辈子都不会变幽默，那也没关系。

And I always start this part of my class at Harvard by saying to my students, if you're not funny, and you think you never will be, it's okay.

如果你是个特别严肃、完全不搞笑的人，我可不觉得自己能在两个月内让你变得幽默。

I don't think I'm gonna be the one to make you funny within the span of two months if you are a deeply serious, unfunny person.

有些人相信，人是可以通过时间慢慢变得更幽默的。

Other people believe that you can get funnier over time.

这个我们待会儿再聊。

We can talk about that in in a moment.

但我深信，任何人都可以变得更温暖。

What I do deeply believe is that anyone can be more warm.

表达感激就是增加温暖的一种方式。

And so warmth moves include anything, expressing gratitude.

非常感谢你今天抽出时间。

I'm so grateful for your time today.

也非常感谢你认真参与了我的内容。

I'm so grateful for you engaging with the content of my work.

恭维话

Flattery.

说些赞美的话

Giving compliments.

换个话题

Just shifting topics.

如果你能更敏锐地察觉到对方对某个话题开始厌倦，并更有勇气和主动性地及时切换话题，这能大大帮助对话保持流畅自然。

So if you can get better at sensing when people are getting bored with a topic and getting more courageous and assertive about switching more frequently can be very, very helpful for keeping the conversation sort of bubbling along.

呼应前文

Callbacks.

呼应前文就是提到之前聊过的内容

Callbacks are any reference back to something that you've talked about previously.

哦

Oh.

这招特别管用

They're total magic.

这说明你之前一直在听对方说话，甚至可能在你们认识一个月前就注意到了。

It shows that you were listening to someone earlier in the conversation, maybe even earlier in your relationship, like a month ago.

如果我能提到我们之前聊过的事，就表明我确实听进去了。

If I can call back to something we talked about, it shows I heard you.

我当时在想你说的那些话。

I was thinking about what you said.

我记住了，而且现在还能巧妙地拿回来用。

I was able to retain it in my mind, and I'm clever enough to reference back to it now.

很多时候，当我重新提起这件事，特别有意思，对方会突然说：‘天啊，你还记得这个？’

And often, it has this really amazing quality where if I bring it up again, it's funny because you're like, oh, shit.

这真的太机智了。

That's super clever.

对。

Mhmm.

很多人常问我该怎么得体地结束对话，我有两点建议。

Often, lot of people ask me how do we end conversations well, and I have two pieces of advice there.

我再回到刚才说的回溯话题上。

I'm gonna bring this back to callbacks.

第一点，没人知道该怎么结束对话。

One is nobody knows when to end conversations.

就是最后一次转换话题。

It's the final topic switch.

就是最后一次确认结束的时机。

It's the final coordination choice.

根本没法确定。

There's no way to know.

没有标准答案。

There is no right answer.

所以最好的办法就是直接结束。

So it's better to just end it.

干脆一点，说走就走，别磨磨唧唧，还觉得尴尬或内疚。

Like, be assertive, walk away, rather than hemming and hawing and feeling bad and embarrassed about it.

第二条建议是，现在正是尝试回拨的好时机。

The second piece of advice is that it's a great time to try a callback.

在对话的最后一刻，你可以说：希望你这个周末和女朋友玩得开心。

The very last beat of the conversation, you can say, and I hope you have a great time with your girlfriend this weekend.

对吧？

Right?

就是他们之前提到的任何事情都可以用上。

Like, whatever they they had mentioned.

哦，他们说要去看电影。

Oh, I'm gonna go we're gonna go to see this movie.

那你就说：希望你这个周末看电影看得开心。

I hope you have a great time at the movie this weekend.

是的。

Mhmm.

对吧？

Right?

这能让人感觉到，哦，你三十分钟前跟我提过这事，我记着呢。

Showing that, like, oh, I heard you thirty minutes ago when you told me this thing.

这样能让告别显得更自然顺畅。

That can help to smooth the exit ramp away.

你刚才听到的，是上一期节目里被反复播放的片段。

What you just listened to was a most replayed moment from a previous episode.

如果你想听完整期节目，我下面提供了链接。

If you want to listen to that full episode, I've linked it down below.

详情请看简介。

Check the description.

谢谢。

Thank you.