欧洲最大珍本书籍盗窃案的幕后黑手是谁？

本BBC播客在英国境外由广告支持。

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside The UK.

莉兹从对真实犯罪感兴趣变成了亲身经历真实犯罪。

Liz went from being interested in true crime to living true crime.

我丈夫说，你父亲被杀了。

My husband said, your dad's been killed.

这里是《双手被缚》，一档探索吉姆·米尔加谋杀案的真实犯罪播客。我当时完全处于震惊之中。莉兹的父亲被谋杀，她的母亲被发现锁在衣柜里，手脚都被绑着。

This is Hands Tied, a true crime podcast exploring the murder of Jim Milgar. I was just completely in shock. Liz's father murdered and her mother found locked in a closet, her hands and feet bound.

我感觉一点都不真实。

I didn't feel real at all.

十多年过去了，她仍在寻找答案。我们仍在抗争。请在iHeartRadio应用、苹果播客或任何你获取播客的地方收听《双手被缚》。

More than a decade on, she's still searching for answers. We're still fighting. Listen to hands tied on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

见证历史。

Witness history.

历史，由亲历者讲述。

History as told. By the people who were there.

我们是通过精彩档案带您回到

We're the podcast that takes you back

历史关键时刻的播客。

to a key moment in history through incredible archive.

原子弹利用了宇宙的力量。

The atomic bomb harnesses the power of the universe.

以及关键目击者的惊人记忆。

And the amazing memories of key witnesses.

我们看到一道巨大的闪光射入我们所在战壕的检修孔。

We saw a tremendous flash of light into the manhole of the trench that we were in.

见证BBC全球服务带来的历史。

Witness history from the BBC World Service.

我度过了非常有趣的一生。

I've had a very interesting life.

立即收听。在您获取BBC播客的任何地方搜索“见证历史”。

Listen now. Search for witness history wherever you get your BBC podcasts.

欢迎收听BBC全球服务的纪录片。

Welcome to the documentary from the BBC World Service.

第五层。

The Fifth Floor.

层。楼层。法尔纳克·阿米迪。

Floor. The floor. Farnak Amidi.

这里是第五层，BBC全球故事讲述的核心，汇聚了来自世界各地的BBC记者。我是主持人法内克·阿尼迪。爱沙尼亚塔尔图的大学图书馆是一个庞大的粗野主义建筑群，周围环绕着混凝土喷泉和未来主义钢雕。但在这座不起眼的建筑内，藏着一件隐秘的珍宝——价值数千的珍稀书籍。2022年4月，其中一些书籍被盗。

This is the Fifth Floor at the heart of global storytelling with BBC journalists from all around the world. I'm your host Farnek Anidi. The university library in Tartu in Estonia is a large brutalist complex surrounded by concrete water fountains and futuristic steel sculptures. But inside this unassuming building lies a hidden treasure rare books worth thousands. In April 2022, some of these books were stolen.

据欧洲执法机构欧洲刑警组织称，这起盗窃案是一个针对12个国家国家图书馆的犯罪行动的一部分，包括波罗的海国家、波兰、芬兰、德国和法国。这被称为自第二次世界大战以来欧洲最大的书籍盗窃案。那么幕后黑手是谁？我的同事，来自BBC俄语频道的尼娜·纳扎罗娃一直在调查这个故事，她加入了《第五层》节目。尼娜，很高兴你再次来到节目。

According to Europol, the European law enforcement agency, this theft was part of a criminal operation that targeted national libraries in 12 countries, including the Baltic States, Poland, Finland, Germany, and France. It's been described as Europe's largest book heist since the second World War. So who was behind it? My colleague, Nina Nazarova from BBC Russian, has been investigating this story, and she joins the Fifth Floor. Nina, great to have you back on the program.

你好。那么尼娜，我们从爱沙尼亚的盗窃案开始吧。我们对它了解多少？发生了什么？

Hello. So let's start, Nina, with the theft in Estonia. What do we know about it? What happened?

2022年4月，两名男子走进图书馆，自称是为躲避战争而逃离的乌克兰难民。如你所记得，乌克兰战争当时刚刚开始。年长的那位告诉图书管理员，他正在帮助年轻的那位完成大学学业，他们要求借阅八本旧版的俄罗斯文学作品，并且他们回来了好几次。但在同年8月晚些时候，图书管理员在进行书面书籍检查时，注意到两本原版书已被替换为赝品。封面是原版的复制品，但并非原件。

So in April 2022, two men walked into the library and introduced themselves as Ukrainian refugees fleeing from the war. As you can remember, the war in Ukraine just started back then. So the older one told the librarians that he was helping the younger one with his university studies, and they asked for eight old editions of Russian offers, and they came back several times. But later in August the same year, the librarians were doing a written check of the books, and they noticed that the two original editions had been replaced with fakes. So the covers were copies of the original, but it was not the original.

那是制作精良的仿制品。他们开始检查借阅者名单，最后借阅这些书的就是这两名男子。

It was nicely made mock ups. And they started to check the users list. And it was these two men who read them the last.

在那之前的所有那些月份里，都没有人能分辨出原件和复制品之间的区别吗？

And until then, all of those months, nobody could tell the difference between the original ones and the copies?

是的。这些是做得非常精细的伪造副本，上面还有印章，而印章是图书馆书籍的基本识别标记。所以很容易把它们当作真品。而且

Yes. These were really meticulously done forged copies. And it had the the stamps, so that's the basic identification markers of library books. So it was easy to take them as real. And

只是为了提供背景信息，描述一下这个系统是如何运作的。因为我认为你不能就这样走进图书馆，拿起这些珍贵的书籍、稀有书籍，然后像其他任何书一样带回家。

just for context, describe how the system works. Because I don't think you can just walk into a library and get take one of these precious books, rare books, and just take them home just like any other book.

不能。通常在图书馆里，有所谓的珍本书籍区。理想情况下，他们有特定的程序，你必须先申请才能借阅。然后人们通常会在阅览室阅读，并有图书管理员在一旁监督。本应如此运作。

No. It's normally in libraries, there are, like, rare book sections. And ideally they have a specific procedure you have to first apply to get them issued. And then normally people would read them in the reading room, with some librarians watching over. That's how it's supposed to work.

但在一些图书馆，没有如此严格的控制，或者可能有时在你提供身份证明的情况下，他们允许你将这些书带回家阅读。所有图书馆都有不同的规则，有些比较宽松，有些允许你更自由地使用稀有版本。

But in some libraries there is no such strict control, or probably they sometimes allow, if you provide an identification, they allow you to take these books to read at home. All libraries have different rules, and some are milder, and some allow you to work more freely with rare editions.

那么这些小偷是针对特定的书籍吗？他们拿走了什么？

So were these thieves targeting specific books? What were they taking?

是的，这实际上非常有趣，因为图书馆里显然有很多稀有版本，但它们针对的是俄罗斯黄金时代非常特定的作家。这个术语通常指十九世纪早期。所以是亚历山大·普希金、尼古拉·果戈理和米哈伊尔·莱蒙托夫的作品。可能他们在世界上不如托尔斯泰和陀思妥耶夫斯基那么有名，但在俄罗斯，他们被认为是俄罗斯文学几个世纪以来最杰出的代表。

Yes. That's actually very interesting, because there are lots of rare editions in the libraries, obviously, but they were targeting very specific authors of Russian golden era. And this term usually applies to early nineteenth century. So it's books by Alexander Pushkin, Nikolayn Koko and Mikhail Lermontov. Probably they are less known in the world than Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but in Russia they are considered the very best that Russian literature produced over centuries.

而生前版本，特别是弗罗斯特的生前版本，极其珍贵。

And lifetime editions, Frost lifetime editions especially, are extremely valuable.

你能解释一下什么是生前版本吗？

Can you explain what a lifetime edition is?

它是在作者生前出版的版本。这些是他亲自监督或准备印刷的书，并且在他还活着的时候出版。实际上，普希金和莱蒙托夫都因决斗英年早逝，这使得这些生前版本更加珍贵。

It's an edition published during the lifetime of the author. These are books which he himself supervised or made ready for printing, and they were published while he was still alive. Actually, both Pushkin and Lemontov died very young at duels, and this makes these lifetime editions even more valuable.

你说珍贵，它们到底值多少钱？

Like when you say valuable, how much are they worth?

嗯，这取决于具体的版本以及保存状况。例如，塔尔图被盗书籍造成的损失估计为15万欧元，而华沙那家图书馆的集体损失超过50万欧元。所以这相当于一套公寓或一辆非常昂贵的汽车的价格。所以它

Well, depends on the particular edition and how well it is being preserved. For instance, the damage from stolen books in Tarto was estimated at €150,000 and in that library in Warsaw the collective damage was more than €500,000 So it's the price of apartment or a very expensive car. So it's

这对书来说是一大笔钱。是的。那么是谁开始调查这些犯罪的？

That's a lot of money for books. Yes. So who started investigating these crimes?

这些犯罪在十几个国家持续了一年半，最终由欧盟执法机构欧洲刑警组织（Europol）投入努力来调查所有这些案件。因此，不同国家的警察相互合作，调查的代号是“普希金行动”。

These crimes took place for a year and a half in dozen country, and it took the efforts of Yevropol, the EU law enforcement agency, to investigate all these. So police of different countries collaborated with each other, and the code name for the investigation was Operation Pushkin.

非常贴切。

Very well suited.

是的，以亚历山大·普希金的名字命名。

Yes, named after Alexander Pushkin.

那么他们查出了什么？这一切的幕后黑手是谁？

So what did they find out? Who was behind all of this?

他们逮捕了九个人，有趣的是，这些人显然都是讲俄语的格鲁吉亚国民。其中一名在两个国家因多项罪行被判刑的男子是我交谈过的人。他目前正在监狱服刑，名叫贝卡特·西里基察。

So they arrested nine persons, and interestingly, all of them were Georgian nationals who spoke Russian, obviously. And one of the men who was sentenced for free crimes in two countries was a person I spoke to. He's currently in a prison, and his name is Bekkat Sirikitsa.

那么他们都是团伙作案吗？

So were they all working together?

我们无法确定这一点，因为他现在已被判刑，他的儿子和儿媳也因在不同图书馆盗窃同一批书籍而在格鲁吉亚被判刑。但他否认认识其他被捕的人。所以我们无法证明他是团伙头目，但他确实非常活跃。

We cannot say this because he is sentenced now, and his son and his daughter-in-law are also sentenced in Georgia for the same book theft by the different libraries. But he denies that he knows other people who were arrested. So we cannot prove it that he was the gang leader, but he was very active.

如你所说，你确实和他谈过。你能打电话到监狱找到他。他被关押在哪里？谈话内容如何？他是个什么样的人？

As you mentioned, you did speak to him. You were able to call him in prison. Where is he held in prison? And what was the conversation like? What kind of person is he?

他目前在爱沙尼亚的监狱。嗯。在爱沙尼亚，监狱允许犯人与记者交谈。他是个相当有个性的人。非常礼貌，有幽默感，而且我认为他很坦诚。

So he is currently in Estonian prison. Mhmm. And in Estonia, prisons allow you to talk to to journalists. And he is quite a character. He is very polite and he has a sense of humor and he's very open, I would say.

他向你讲述了他的生活，他早年的经历吗？他是谁？

What did he tell you about his life, his early life? Who is he?

他是格鲁吉亚人。在阿布哈兹地区长大，后来住在库塔伊西。他在童年和青少年时期经历过贫困，因为那正是苏联解体前后的岁月。他甚至告诉我，饥饿时他曾伪造过面包票，因为当时在格鲁吉亚的一些地区还使用面包票。他把票放在工作的灯下直接复制。

He is a Georgian. He grew up in the Abkhazia region and later lived in Kutaisi. He experienced poverty as a child and teenager because it was the years right before the fall of the Soviet Union and after. He even told me that the hungry child once he forged a bread stamp, because there were bread stamps back then in some parts of Georgia. He put it on a working lamp and just copied it.

后来他在格鲁吉亚的一所学校当老师，显然他对教师的薪水并不满意。于是开始从事古籍工作。他开始修复、清理古籍，并以此盈利。他购买旧书，清理、修复后转售给一些人，这些人后来可能把书带到了俄罗斯，因为那里是主要市场，并在那里再次转售。他对自己的古籍工作非常自豪，他 literally 告诉我，我引用原话：‘我就像个古籍巫师’。

And later he worked as a teacher at school in Georgia, and apparently he was not satisfied with his salary as a teacher. And he started working with old books. He started restoring them, cleaning them and selling for profit. So, he bought an old book, cleaned it, restored it and sold for profit to some people who later probably took the books to Russia, because that's the main market for them, and resold the books there. And he's very proud of his work with books, and he told me literally that I'm quoting, I'm like a wizard with books.

我只要把书拿在手里，就能立刻告诉你它值多少钱，以及在拍卖会上能卖多少。

I can hold a book in my hand and immediately tell you how much it's worth and how much they might pay at auction.

所以你提到他对自己手艺和所做的事感到自豪，但他是否认为自己所做的是犯罪呢？

So you mentioned that he takes pride in his craft and what he does, kind of, but does he consider what he does a crime?

不，我的意思是，修复书籍不是犯罪，但显然研究这些书籍是犯罪。他在两个国家的三起案件中被判有罪，先是在拉脱维亚，然后在爱沙尼亚。

No, I mean, restoring books isn't a crime, but obviously studying the books is a crime. And he was found guilty in three cases in two countries. First in Latvia and then in Estonia.

我猜你和他谈过爱沙尼亚的盗窃案。他对此是怎么说的？发生了什么？

I assume you got to talk to him about the theft in Estonia. What did he have to tell you about it? What had happened?

是的。贝克特·塞尔基察告诉我，他和侄子一起去了塔尔图图书馆，并帮助侄子在法庭上进行研究。他官方部分承认了罪行。但和我谈话时，他甚至否认看到侄子偷书。而在泰国，他确实在法庭上承认了罪行。

Yes. Becket Serkitsa told me that he went to Tartu Library with his nephew and that he was helping the nephew with his research in court. Officially, admitted partially his guilt. And when talking to me, he denied even seeing his nephew steal. And in Thailand, he actually did admit his guilt in court.

他告诉我，他确实拿了10本珍稀书籍并且没有归还。当时只有他一个人在场，所以他无法否认。但在拉脱维亚发生了另一件非常有趣的事。那是邻国。他被指控并判定为协助和教唆盗窃。

And talking to me, he indeed took 10 rare books and never took them. And it was just him there, so he could not deny it. But another very interesting thing happened in Latvia. It's a neighboring country. He was charged and convicted with aiding and abetting theft.

检方称他并非单独行动。首先，在齐里基泽去图书馆前几个月，他预订了一些书，拍照并检查了它们。之后他再次前往，并与另一名男子同住一个酒店房间，而那名男子实际去图书馆偷了齐里基泽之前查看过的同样书籍。几个月后，齐里基泽被拉脱维亚当局拘留，他被指控协助犯罪，即预谋犯罪并帮助他人了解该偷什么。但和我谈话时，他否认了这一情况，并讲述了一个非常有趣的故事，说他甚至不认识那个人，只是某天在里加中央市场用格鲁吉亚语打电话时，一个陌生男子走近他，用格鲁吉亚语交谈，称自己也是格鲁吉亚公民，没有钱，提议合住酒店房间。齐里基泽告诉我，他出于好心同意了，同住期间他们聊过珍稀书籍，但他并不知道对方有任何非法意图。

And the prosecution said that he wasn't acting alone. So first, several months before Sirikidze went to the library and ordered some books and took pictures and checked them, and after that he came again and lived in the same hot room with another man who actually went to the library and took the books, the same books Tsirikizya was checking out before, so to all of them. And some months after that Tsirikizya was detained by Latvian authorities and he was charged with aiding the crime, that premeditated the crime and helping the person to know what to steal. While talking to me, he denied that it was the case and actually painted a very interesting story, that he didn't even know the person, but somehow he was visiting Rigas Central Market and talking in Georgian over the phone, and somehow some person unknown to him came, approached him and talked to him in Georgia, that he is also a Georgian citizen, and he has no money, and offered him to share a hotel room together. And Sirikitsu told me that he agreed out of kindness, and while they lived together, while they shared a room together, they talked also about rare books, but that he wasn't aware that this person had any intentions of doing anything illegal.

那是他的说法，有趣的是，拉脱维亚调查人员并不相信这个故事。

That was his story, and interestingly enough, the Latvian investigators didn't believe the story.

两个格鲁吉亚人随机在里加市场相遇，而且都对珍稀书籍感兴趣，这确实相当罕见。所以，我猜是的。

It is quite rare for two Georgians to just meet randomly in a regal market, and both of them are into rare books. So yeah. I guess.

是的。而且他基本上告诉调查人员，他知道拉脱维亚国家图书馆藏有非常昂贵的珍稀版本。如果他真的参与了任何盗窃，他会建议偷更昂贵的版本。

Yes. And, basically, he told the investigator that he knew that Latvian National Library, there are very expensive rare editions. And in case he indeed was involved in any student, he would have advised to steal more expensive editions.

这非常有趣。

That's very interesting.

所以很明显他无罪，因为如果他有罪，他会建议偷更贵的书而不是更便宜的。

So obviously he's not guilty because if he had been guilty, he would have advised to steal more expensive books and not less expensive.

强有力的辩护！

Strong defense!

是的，但显然没有被认真对待。他在拉脱维亚的审前中心待了六个月，之后他告诉我他受审了，并且他也部分认罪了。

Yes, but it was not taken seriously, obviously. And he spent six months in the pretrial center in Latvia, and after that he told me that he was tried, and he pleaded partially guilty as well.

那么，这是他第一次参与非法活动吗？

So, was it the first time he was involved in illegal activities?

不，实际上早在2016年，他就在格鲁吉亚因盗窃英国历史资料中的旧书而被定罪。之后，他迅速将书卖出，然后向警方自首。由于他承认了罪行，他获得了缓刑。

No, actually back in 2016, he was convicted in Georgia for stealing old books from British history material. After that, he managed to sell them quickly, after which he turned himself to the police. And because he admitted his guilt, he received a suspended sentence.

尼娜，这次行动还有谁参与？

Nina, who else was part of this operation?

特里基齐的儿子马特和他的妻子安娜·戈库拉泽也因从博尔肖夫图书馆偷书而被定罪，那是另一个国家，波兰。博尔肖夫图书馆受损最严重。我认为总共从博尔肖夫拿走了73本稀有版本。这些书来自19世纪初，它们经历了很多，因为它们幸存了下来，例如在1944年的华沙起义中，它们被拯救了。所以这些书承载了很多历史，但它们被偷了。

Trikizi's son, Mate, and his wife Anna Gokulazze also convicted for stealing books from Borchow library, so that's another country, Poland. And the Borchow library was hit the hardest. I think that in total 73 rare editions were taken from Borchow. And these books were from early nineteenth century and they survived a lot, because they survived, for instance, in Warsaw Uprising in 1944, and they were saved. So these books seem a lot of history and they were stolen.

所以，我们确切知道马塔、西里基察和安娜·戈戈拉泽确实访问了图书馆，因为他们被那里的闭路摄像机拍到了。但在这些摄像机上，他们没有做任何非法的事情，只是查阅了一些旧版本。但后来发现他们试图再次用一些初版替换掉所有的借阅记录。马塔·茨里基察不认罪，而他的妻子认罪以换取缓刑。此外，茨里基察的女儿也被指控协助犯罪。

So, we know for sure that Mata, Sirikitsa and Anna Gogoladze did visit the library because they were on cameras, on closed circuit cameras in there. But on these cameras they didn't do anything illegal, just checked out some old editions. But later it was discovered that they tried to swap again all their auditions with some first copies. Mata Tzrykitsa pleaded not guilty, and his wife pleaded guilty in exchange for a suspended sentence. And also Tzrykitsa's daughter was charged with helping the crime.

基本上，她（茨尔基塔的女儿）被指控为马特和安娜购买机票，所以她是犯罪的一部分。但她不认罪，她的律师告诉我，她不知道他们为什么去波兰，她不知道有任何计划的非法活动。所以这就是关于塞尔基茨亲属的全部情况。

Basically, she Tsirkita's daughter was charged with buying airplane tickets for Mate and Anna, so she was part of the crime. But she pleaded not guilty, and her lawyer told me that she wasn't aware why they were going to Poland, that she was not aware of any illegal activities planned. So that's for Serkitz's relatives in total.

正如你提到的，这像是最大的一起盗窃案。为什么他们能如此轻易地从华沙图书馆偷走这些书？

And as you mentioned, this was, like, the biggest heist. Why was it so easy for them to steal these books from the Warsaw library?

华沙大学的伊罗尼·穆拉洛夫教授告诉我，这可能与图书馆管理制度的放宽有关。珍本部门的理想情况是人们在图书管理员的严格监督下阅读这些书籍。但显然，图书馆试图对访客更加开放，因此规则发生了变化，变得更加宽松。并且有怀疑认为，当窃贼到来时，他们确切地知道目标书籍是哪些，并且他们准备了非常逼真的仿制副本，所以他们准备充分。可能是，一旦他们看到了图书馆管理制度的宽松，就将其视为

Professor Irohny Muralov from Warsaw University told me that it could be connected with the easing of regime in the library. The ideal situation with rare books departments is when people read these books under strict supervision of librarians. But obviously, libraries try to be more open to visitors, so the rules changed and they were milder. And there is a suspicion that when the thieves came, they knew for sure which books they targeted, and they had very good mock up copies, so they were well prepared. It could be that once they saw the Ease of Regime's library, they saw it as

一个金矿。总共有多少本书被盗？

a gold mine. Altogether, how many books were stolen?

超过170本。

More than 170.

那它们最终流向了哪里？这些书现在在什么地方？

And where did they end up finally? Where are these books?

有迹象表明这些书最终流入了俄罗斯的莫斯科图书拍卖会。例如，还有另一个人因在另一个国家、另一个图书馆行窃而被判刑，这次是在立陶宛的维尔纽斯大学图书馆。他认罪并交代说，这起犯罪是由莫斯科某拍卖行指使的。他基本上指认了一个人，但那可能不是真名，因为我没能在莫斯科拍卖行找到这个名字的人。但他交代说，他从莫斯科收到了伪造的文件和书籍仿制本，在从维尔纽斯偷走了17版书籍后，他也将它们寄往莫斯科，并通过加密货币获得了报酬。

So there are signs that these books ended up in Russia at Moscow book auctions. So, for instance, there was another man who was sentenced for stealing in yet another country, yet another library, this time in Lithuania in Vilnius University Library. And he pleaded guilty and told that the crime was ordered by some Moscow auction house. He basically named a person, but it probably was not a real name, because I didn't manage to find such a person with this name in Moscow auctions. But he told that he received the fake documents and fake copies of books from Moscow, and after he stole 17 editions from Vilnius, he sent them to Moscow as well and got the fee in cryptocurrency.

有证据表明，从华沙大学被盗的书籍流向了莫斯科一家特定的拍卖行，伊罗尼姆·格拉瓦教授给我发送了来自该拍卖网站上的、带有图书馆印记的书籍截图。这实际上是一个非常有趣的案例，它表明调查古籍犯罪非常困难，因为这个拍卖网站的一些页面已被删除。但还有网页存档版本。它显示有一本带有十九世纪印章的书来自华沙大学图书馆。但这个印章不是新的，它来自十九世纪。

There is an evidence that books stolen from Washoe University turned over to the specific Moscow auction house, and professor Irohnyum Grava sent me screenshots with the books from the library from the site of this auction. And it's a very interesting, actually, case, which shows that it's very difficult to investigate the crimes in antique books, because some pages were deleted from this auction website. But there are web archived versions. And it shows that there is a book with a nineteenth century stamp that is from Warsaw University Library. But the stamp isn't new, it's from nineteenth century.

我与拍卖行负责人谈过，他们说根据俄罗斯法律，禁止他们销售带有现代印章的书籍，因此他们会非常仔细地检查。但销售带有十九世纪印章的古籍是完全没有问题的，因为俄罗斯在1917年发生了一场伟大的革命。在那之后，发生了太多事情，太多的历史事件，以至于你不能仅仅声称十九世纪的印章意味着什么。这就是问题所在。我们有一方声称这肯定来自我们的图书馆。

And I talked to the director of the auction, and they say that by Russian law, they are prohibited from selling books with modern stamps, so they check very thoroughly. But it's absolutely fine to sell antique books with nineteenth century stamps because there was a great revolution in Russia in 1917. After that, so many things happened, so many historical events that you cannot just claim that nineteenth century stamp means anything. So that's the point. We have one side which claims it's surely from our library.

而另一方则声称，根据俄罗斯的法律，我们没有做错任何事，因为这里没有现代印章。

And the other side claims that we are doing nothing wrong by Russian lore because there is no, like, modern stamp here.

但非常有趣的是，他们没有在这些珍贵书籍上盖现代印章，而只是保留了十九世纪的印章。

But it's very interesting that they hadn't put a modern stamp on these valuable books and just kept the the nineteenth century stamp.

这些书籍是历史物品，是历史文物。他们不想通过添加任何现代墨水或任何东西来破坏历史。就像，这些被视为博物馆物品。他们希望以历史状态保存这些书籍。

These books, they are historical objects, historical artifacts. They don't want to ruin the history by adding any modern inks or anything. Like, these are seen as museum objects. They wanted to preserve the books in historical state.

所以俄罗斯的拍卖行没有理由对此产生怀疑？

So there was no reason for the auction houses in Russia to be suspicious?

是的。没有理由怀疑，因为带有必要印章的书籍在世界各地的拍卖会上都有出售，所以这没什么大不了的。

Yes. No reason to be suspicious because books with necessary stamps are being sold in auctions around the world, so it's no big deal.

那么私人收藏家呢？他们在这整件事中扮演什么角色？

And what about private collectors? What is their role in this whole thing?

我认为现在在俄罗斯购买这些古籍的只有私人收藏家，因为它们价值连城，而国家机构没有这样的资金。我曾与一位稀有收藏家分享过我的故事，他实际上对自己的收藏非常公开，并出版了他的收藏目录以及一本关于古籍的书。他告诉我，他自己在最近两年，从2022年到2024年，目睹了这一切，并注意到俄罗斯市场上出现了大量新的初版书，对他来说很明显这些书基本上是被盗的。因为初版书数量如此之多，不可能只是某个私人收藏拿出来售卖。但为什么会这样呢？

I think that the only people who buy these antique books now in Russia are private collectors only because they worth lots of money and state institutions, they don't have such money. I talked to my story with one of the rare collectors who actually is very open about his collection and published a catalog of his collection and also a book on antique books. And he told me that he himself seen these last two years, from 2022 to 2024, and he told me that he noticed lots of new lifetime editions on Russian market, and it was clear for him that they've been stolen, basically. Because it was like so many of these Lifetime editions, it could not have been just a private collection going for sale. But why is that?

他推测，现在俄罗斯与西方开战，对一些收藏家来说，从西方夺回文化财产是件好事。有些人甚至可能对书籍可能是被盗的事实视而不见，因为他们认为这是将他们的遗产从西方带回俄罗斯。

He assumed that now Russia war is with the West, that for some collectors it's a good thing to take back the cultural values from the West. Some people may even close their eyes on the fact that the books might have been stolen because they see these as taking their legacy out from the West back to Russia.

这是欧洲最大的书籍盗窃案，但不是第一次，对吧？

This is the biggest European book heist, but it's not the first, is it?

显然不是。有趣的是，因偷书正在服刑的贝克特·塞里金泽，以及一位正常的古籍收藏专家，他们都告诉我从图书馆偷书非常容易。正在服刑的贝克特·塞里金泽告诉我，如果你想偷半公斤黄金，价值5万欧元，你得对付20个武装人员。但如果你想偷一本同样价值5万欧元的书，你只需要在图书馆里对付一个瘦小的老太太，而且没有监控。

Obviously not. It's interesting because both Becket Serikinze, who has been serving time for stealing books, and the expert who is a normal collector of antique books, they both told me that it's very easy to steal from the libraries. Becket Serikizy, who is serving his time, told me that if you want to steal a half kilo of gold, which costs €50,000, you have to deal with 20 armed men. But if you want to steal a book which costs the same €50,000 you have to steal with a tiny old lady in the library with no CCTV.

所以这就是人们选择偷书的原因。

So that's why people go for it.

谢谢你，尼娜，与我们分享这个引人入胜的故事。很高兴你能来。

Thank you, Nina, for sharing this fascinating story with us. It was great to have you.

总是很愉快。谢谢你。

Always a pleasure. Thank you.

BBC俄语的妮娜·纳扎罗娃。您正在收听的是BBC世界频道的纪录片

Nina Nazarova from BBC Russian. You are listening to the documentary from the BBC World

莉兹从对真实犯罪感兴趣变成了亲身经历真实犯罪

Liz went from being interested in true crime to living true crime.

我丈夫说，你父亲被杀害了

My husband said, your dad's been killed.

这里是《双手被缚》，一档探索吉姆·米尔加谋杀案的真实犯罪播客。我当时完全处于震惊状态。莉兹的父亲被谋杀，她的母亲被发现锁在壁橱里，手脚都被绑着

This is Hands Tied, a true crime podcast exploring the murder of Jim Milgar. I was just completely in shock. Liz's father murdered and her mother found locked in a closet, her hands and feet bound.

我完全感觉不到真实

I didn't feel real at all.

十多年过去了，她仍在寻找答案。我们仍在抗争。请在iHeartRadio应用、苹果播客或任何您获取播客的地方收听《双手被缚》

More than a decade on, she's still searching for answers. We're still fighting. Listen to hands tied on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

见证历史

Witness history.

历史由亲历者讲述

History as told. By the people who were there.

通过播客带您回到

With a podcast that takes you back

历史的关键时刻 通过不可思议的档案

to a key moment in history Through incredible archive

原子弹利用了宇宙的力量。

The atomic bomb harnesses the power of the universe.

以及关键目击者的惊人记忆。

And the amazing memories of key witnesses.

我们看到一道巨大的闪光射入我们所在战壕的检修孔。

We saw a tremendous flash of light into the manhole of the trench that we were in.

见证BBC国际服务的历史。

Witness history from the BBC World Service.

我度过了非常有趣的一生。

I've had a very interesting life.

立即收听。在您获取BBC播客的任何地方搜索“见证历史”。

Listen now. Search for witness history wherever you get your BBC podcasts.

金枪鱼。你爱它。你吃它。而对于捕捞全球大部分金枪鱼供应的南太平洋岛国来说，这是一笔大生意。

Tuna. You love it. You eat it. And for the South Pacific island nations catching the bulk of the global tuna supply, it's big business.

全世界每两个金枪鱼三明治中，就有一个源自太平洋。

One in every two tuna sandwiches worldwide starts in the Pacific Ocean.

但情况可能不会一直如此。气候变化正将金枪鱼种群推出这些国家的水域，推向公海，这对这些发展中经济体来说并非好兆头。敬请关注第六季《渔获》，将在Apple、Spotify或您获取播客的任何平台播出。

But that might not always be the case. Climate change is pushing tuna stocks out of these countries' waters onto the high seas, and that does not bode well for these developing economies. That's coming up on season six of The Catch, coming to you on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.

这里是《第五层》，我是法纳克·哈米迪。现在请听这个。这是一位在尼日利亚成为网络红人的七岁男孩。他名叫伊曼纽尔，会弹键盘和打鼓。BBC Pigeons记者阿德肖拉·伊库拉·乔卢去拜访了他。

This is the Fifth Floor, and I'm Farnack Hamedy. Now have a listen to this. This is a seven year old boy who's become an online sensation in Nigeria. His name is Emmanuel, and he plays the keyboard and the drums. BBC Pigeons reporter Adeshola Ikula Jolu went to meet him.

我的名字现在，我从四岁开始学习键盘。

My name now, I started learning keyboard when I was four.

这位年轻的天才，他是一个了不起的男孩。有趣的是，我在网上看过他的几个视频，我在想这个让互联网惊叹的年轻男孩是谁。我发现他对乐器、鼓和键盘有着极大的热情，但主要是鼓。在尼日利亚，你会发现老一辈人打鼓技巧非常娴熟。但然后你看到这个小男孩打鼓如此娴熟，你会想知道他是怎么做到的，因为通常来说，鼓棒应该比他的手还重。

Well, this young talent, it's he's an amazing boy. Interestingly, I've seen a couple of his videos online, and I'm wondering who is this young boy who is taking the Internet by surprise. I discover he has this great passion for, musical instrument, the drums and the keyboard, but essentially the drums. And here in Nigeria, you find the older generation who are very skillful in drumming. But then you find this young boy who is just so skillful on the drummer, you're wondering how because ordinarily, the stick for the drum should be heavier than his hands.

但他握得如此牢固、如此有趣，人们都被他展示的技能所震撼，然后我说这是一个我们可以讲述的好故事。

But then he's holding this so firmly and so interestingly that people are wowed by his display of skills then I said this is a good story that we can tell.

所以我爸爸教了我键盘的基础知识，他甚至在墙上贴了一张关于转位的纸。所以每当他出去的时候，有时我就会看看墙。我会试着去找到他说的东西。

So my dad taught me basic of keyboards like He even pasted a paper of inversions on the wall. So anytime he goes out, sometimes I would just look at the wall. I would try and find what he said.

他来自这样一个家庭，父亲和母亲彼此相爱，他们也热爱音乐。他们过去常在唱诗班唱歌，你知道，加入需要唱歌的教堂，并且演奏一些可用的小乐器。在很小的时候，他就开始和父亲待在一起，看他父亲总是观看关于鼓和键盘的教程，然后他的父亲确实能看出这个小男孩对他正在看的东西非常感兴趣。于是他决定给他买一套鼓，还有钢琴，让他也能继续练习，以便能很好地掌握。所以在两、三岁的稚龄，他就已经非常出色了。

He's from one of those families where the father and the mother, they love each other and they also love music. They used to sing in the choir, you know, join churches where they have to sing, you know, and play some of the little instruments that are available. And at a very tender age, he started staying with his father and seeing how his father always watch tutorials on drums, on keyboard, and then his father could actually see that this young boy have so much interest in, you know, in what he's watching. And then he decided to get him some set of drums as well as, you know, piano for him to also continue to practice so he could master this so well. So at a very tender age of two and three years, he was already very good.

从那时起，他就一直在不断地精进这项技能。

Since then, he has continued to master the skill so well.

我第一次弹键盘并且弹得很好是在Eoin牧师的教堂。当我弹奏的时候，有那么一刻，我看到每个人都在说，哇，哇，哇，哇，哇。他们在大声喊叫，喊叫，喊叫。声音非常大，我为自己感到骄傲。

My first time that I played keyboard and I played it very well was at pastor Eoin's church. When I was playing, at some point, I saw that everybody was just saying, wow, wow, wow, wow, wow. They were shouting, shouting, shouting. It was very loud and I and I felt proud of myself.

他能完美地演奏两种乐器：键盘和鼓。目前，他也在学习吉他。他还在学习萨克斯风。无论在家还是在学校，他总是接触到这些乐器。有趣的是，在家里，他有自己的乐器。

He can play perfectly two instruments, the keyboard and the drums. Currently, he's also learning the guitar. He's also learning the saxophone. Both at home and in school, he's always exposed to this instrument. And interestingly, at home, he has his own instrument.

事实上，他在家里有一个小型录音室，他也在那里制作音乐。在学校里，他也有音乐老师，他们也在培养他学习新技能。

In fact, he has a mini studio at home where he also produce music. And in school as well, he has music teachers who are also developing him in terms of, you know, learning new skills.

我有很好的听力训练，这叫做绝对音感。不是他唱什么，这是主的作为。我知道它在A调上。Miracle，后面这个，我知道它在F调上。我喜欢演奏和制作的最喜欢的音乐类型是嘻哈福音、嘻哈和摇滚。

I have good ear training and it's called pitch perfect. It's not what he sings, this is the doing of the Lord. I know that it's on A. Miracle, later this also, I know that it's on F. My favorite genre of music that I like to play and produce is hip gospel, hip hop, and rock.

所以我们和他一起度过了大约五到六个小时。有趣的是，我其实很好奇他将来想成为什么样的人，他告诉我他想当一名足球运动员。我说，什么？你有这样的天赋却想当足球运动员？他说，是的。

So we spent about five hours to six hours with him. And interestingly, I was actually interested in what he was going to become, and I had him say he wants to be a footballer. I said, what? You want to be a footballer with this talent you have already? He said, yes.

不过我没看出这两种天赋之间有什么关联。但后来他告诉我，他其实可以兼顾两者，你知道，一边踢足球，一边搞音乐。

I'm not seeing any correlation between the two talents, however. But then he told me that he can actually match them you know do football by the side and also do music by the sides.

我想给想学习演奏这种乐器的学生们的建议是，他们应该坚持学习，坚持练习，因为熟能生巧。再见。

What I would advise students who want to learn how to play the instrument is that they should keep learning, should keep practicing because practice makes perfect. Bye.

我是BBC Pigeon的Adeshola, Ikolojulu。如果您想告诉我们您对节目的看法，或者有问题要问我们出色的记者，请发送电子邮件至 thefifthfloor@bbc.co.uk。注意是thefifthfloor，一个词，@bbc.co.uk。以上就是我和第五层节目团队的全部内容。我是Ferennica Amiti，感谢收听。

Adeshola, Ikolojulu from BBC Pigeon. And if you want to let us know what you think about the show or you have questions for our amazing correspondents, send an email to the fifthfloor@bbc.co.uk. That's the fifth floor, all one word, @bbc.co.uk. That's all from me, Ferennica Amiti, and the rest of the Fifth Floor team. Thanks for listening.

您刚才收听的是BBC国际台制作的纪录片。

You've been listening to the documentary from the BBC World Service.

Liz从对真实犯罪感兴趣，变成了亲身经历真实犯罪。

Liz went from being interested in true crime to living true crime.

我丈夫说，你爸爸被杀了。

My husband said, your dad's been killed.

这里是《双手被缚》，一档探索Jim Milgar谋杀案的真实犯罪播客。我当时完全惊呆了。Liz的父亲被谋杀，她的母亲被发现锁在壁橱里，手脚都被绑着。

This is Hands Tied, a true crime podcast exploring the murder of Jim Milgar. I was just completely in shock. Liz's father murdered and her mother found locked in a closet, her hands and feet bound.

我感觉一点都不真实。

I didn't feel real at all.

十多年过去了，她仍在寻找答案。我们仍在抗争。请在iHeartRadio应用程序、Apple Podcasts或您获取播客的任何地方收听《双手被缚》。

More than a decade on, she's still searching for answers. We're still fighting. Listen to Hands Tied on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.