如何找到你的人生目标

这是一档iHeart播客节目。

This is an iHeart podcast.

我是乔纳森·戈德斯坦，在《重量级》新一季中，我帮助一位百岁老人修补破碎的心。

I'm Jonathan Goldstein, and on the new season of heavyweight, I help a centenarian mend a broken heart.

一位101岁的老妇人如何能再次坠入爱河？

How can a 101 year old woman fall in love again?

我还帮助一名男子为他14岁时犯下的持械抢劫赎罪。

And I help a man atone for an armed robbery he committed at 14 years old.

于是我拿枪指着他，说这不是玩笑。他蹲下了。我记得当时有种涌上心头的快感，就像，好吧。

And so I pointed the gun at him and said, this isn't a joke. And he got down. And I remember feeling kind of a surge of, like, okay.

这就是权力。此外，我的老朋友格雷戈尔和他兄弟试图通过催眠术解决我的问题。

This is power. Plus, my old friend, Gregor, and his brother try to solve my problems through hypnotism.

我们可以给你全新设定，让你随时都魅力四射。

We could give you a whole brand new thing where you're, like, super charming all the time.

更能直视他人的眼睛。

Being more able to look people in the eye.

不要总是躲在麦克风后面。

Not always hide behind a microphone.

在您获取播客的任何平台收听《重量级》。

Listen to Heavyweight wherever you get your podcasts.

普希金。你的人生目标是什么？这是个听起来非常宏大的问题，老实说，这也是我们大多数人回避谈论它的原因。人生的目标似乎必须意义重大——治愈一种疾病、拯救濒危物种，或是创立一家价值十亿美元的公司。

Pushkin. What's your life purpose? That is a very big sounding question, which honestly is why most of us shy away from talking about it. Your life's purpose feels like it needs to be important. Curing a disease, saving an endangered species, or founding a billion dollar company.

它应该是某种宏大的事物。对吧？错了。因为正如我们将在本期节目中听到的，目标可以存在于像收集棒球卡并与志同道合者共度时光这样简单的事情中。这个例子直接取材于本期嘉宾的生活。

It's supposed to be something big. Right? Wrong. Because as we'll hear in this episode, purpose can be found in something as simple as collecting baseball cards and hanging out with others who share your passion. That's an example taken directly from the life of my guest for this episode.

大家好，我是乔丹·格鲁梅特。我是一名临终关怀医生、个人理财播客主持人，也是《目标密码》一书的作者。

Hi. I'm Jordan Grummet. I am a hospice physician, personal finance podcaster, author of the book, The Purpose Code.

乔丹的职业生涯几经波折。有时，他在毕生追寻目标的过程中会遭遇重大困境。但如今，他对现状相当满意，这使他成为我们本季收官之作《如何找到人生目标》的绝佳向导。乔丹在特别年轻时就开始渴望找到人生目标，但却走上了一条他后来意识到是错误的道路。这一切始于一场突如其来的丧亲之痛。

Jordan's career has taken many detours. At times, he's found himself facing some big dead ends in his lifelong quest for purpose. But today, he's pretty happy where things ended up, which makes him an excellent guide for this concluding episode of our how to season, where we'll discuss how to find your purpose. Jordan began yearning for purpose at a particularly young age, but set off to find it in a direction that he later realized was a mistake. It all began with an unexpected bereavement.

这件事几乎影响了我的一切。那时我七岁，我的父亲是一位备受尊敬的著名肿瘤学家，一位人人敬仰的癌症医生。他突然脑动脉瘤发作，这意味着他当时正在医院查房，突然剧烈头痛倒下，陷入昏迷，一两天内就去世了。那时候，你知道，还没有这些极端救治措施的概念。神经外科医生进来直接说，他基本上已经脑死亡了。

It pretty much affected everything. I was seven years old, and my father was this prominent oncologist, this cancer doctor that everyone looked up to. And he had a brain aneurysm, which meant he was literally rounding at the hospital, got a severe headache, collapsed, went into a coma, and died within a day or two. Back then, you know, there was no talk of these extraordinary measures. The neurosurgeon came in and said, look, he's pretty much brain dead.

他们撤掉了生命维持系统。而我才七岁。和大多数七岁孩子一样，我以极度自我为中心的视角看世界。我告诉自己是我有问题。是我不够好。

And they removed life support. And I was seven years old. And as most seven year olds are, I looked at the world through a very self centered lens. I told myself that there was something wrong with me. I wasn't enough.

我不够优秀。我做事不够完美。我不够讨人喜欢。于是在某个时刻，我脑海中形成了这样的信念：如果我成为像他那样的医生，就能从宇宙层面修复这个世界。只要我踏着他的足迹前行，一切就会好起来。

I wasn't good enough. I didn't do things well enough. I wasn't lovable enough. And so at some point, I developed the narrative in my own head that I could cosmically fix the world if I became a doctor like him. If I just stepped into his footsteps, if I walked his path, everything would be okay.

这个信念支撑了我很长时间。实际上我有学习障碍，但我克服了它，完成了大学和医学院的学业。那时候这是一种充满喜悦的目标感和身份认同。我对金钱、事业之类的东西毫无兴趣。

And that narrative served me for quite a long time. In fact, I had a learning disability. I got over that, made my way through college and medical school. This was a joyful version of purpose and identity at the time. I wasn't interested in money or career or any of those things.

我只想成为父亲那样的人——这个信念一直支撑着我，直到它不再有效。

I just wanted to be like my dad, and it served me until it didn't.

那么让我们聊聊它失效的时刻。我知道你最初怀着重要使命感的医学生涯，后来发生了什么让它逐渐变成了另一回事？

So let's talk about the part where it didn't. What happened in your medical career that I know what started out as kind of this important purpose kinda wound up becoming something else?

其实说白了就是职业倦怠。最终我意识到，这种宏大的目标感——比如通过成为父亲那样的医生来弥补他去世的事实——根本是无法实现的。我确实成了医生，但这没有解决任何问题。我依然无法释怀生命中这个重大变故，而我每天却在做着不喜欢、不享受、不能充实自己的事情。所以我既没能达到那个宏伟目标，也没能享受这个过程。

Well, what pretty much happened is burnout. And what I eventually realized is this version of purpose, this audacious version of purpose, like, I can cosmically save this fact that my father died by just becoming a doctor like him wasn't actually reachable. And so I became a doctor, and it didn't solve any of the problems. I still didn't feel good about this sentinel thing that happened in my life, and yet I was spending my days doing things that I didn't love and I didn't enjoy and that weren't filling me up. And so I wasn't reaching that big audacious goal I had, but I also wasn't enjoying the process either.

这正是导致职业倦怠的完美温床。

And that is the perfect setup to burn out.

作为医生经历职业倦怠时，你有哪些具体症状？它是如何表现出来的？

So what were some of your symptoms when you were going through burnout as a doctor? Like, how did it manifest?

就像'周日恐惧症'。每到周日晚上你就会想'明天不想上班'。早晨醒来时不是充满干劲，而是倍感压力。对比现在的生活，我花更多时间享受做事过程本身，而非只关注结果。

It's the Sunday scaries. Right? Sunday night, you're like, I don't wanna go to work. It's the waking up in the morning and instead of being energized, being stressed. I contrast that to my life today where I spend a lot more time doing things that I enjoy the process of doing regardless of the goal.

现在我每天清晨4:35都会雀跃地起床，因为迫不及待想开始工作。而过去虽然也是4:30或5点起床，但那是因为焦虑——面对堆积如山看似不可能完成的任务。两者状态截然不同，如今我对工作充满乐观和喜悦，这是从前没有的。

And I kind of jump out of bed at 04:35 in the morning every morning because I'm so excited to jump in. Whereas I might have still gotten up at 04:30 or five in the morning then, but it was more I was so anxious that there were all these things on the table that seemed impossible that I had to get through. And so it really manifests itself very differently. There's a certain amount of optimism and a joy in which I leap into activities now that I just didn't have then.

你是怎么走出这种状态的？毕竟投入整个职业生涯成为医生后感到倦怠，要转型肯定很困难吧？接下来你是怎么做的？

And so how did you break out of this? It must be really hard to kind of, you know, trained your whole career to become a doctor. You're feeling burned out. What was the next step?

算是机缘巧合。很多人都会这样：当他们承担着不适合自己的宏大目标时，往往会尝试在生活间隙塞进更适合、更快乐的事。比如我热爱写作和沟通表达。

It was kind of a happy accident. And I think this happens to a lot of people. When they take on big audacious purpose that doesn't suit them, they actually often try to fit these things in that are more joyful, that suit them better around the sides, like when they're not busy doing other things. So I love writing. I love communicating.

我也喜欢公开演讲。当时我试图把这些融入生活，但又告诉自己'不能靠这个谋生，写作只是爱好，是消遣'。

I love public speaking. And so I was trying to integrate that into my life. And I had told myself, well, you can't really do that for a living. Like, writing is a hobby. It's something you do for fun.

所以我只能在午餐时间或晚上妻子孩子睡着时抽空阅读。2014年2月，机缘巧合下，当时我正在写一个关于医学的博客，分享当医生的感受，有位叫吉姆·多利的白大褂投资者寄来了他的书。他写了本关于医生个人理财的书，想让我在博客上写书评。虽然我一直以优雅的财务行为为榜样，却从未真正理解其含义。他的书向我阐述了财务自由的概念——拥有足够资金后，你就不必再被迫做不想做的事。

So I was fitting it in during my lunch hour or at night when my wife and kids were sleeping. And so fortuitously, in 02/2014, I was writing a blog about medicine, what it felt like to be a doctor, and this guy named Jim Dolly, the white coat investor, sent me his book. And he had written a book about physician personal finance, and he wanted me to review it from my blog. And I had always had modeled for me beautiful, wonderful financial behavior, but I never had the words understand what that meant. And so he sent me his book, and it described this concept of financial independence, this idea of having enough money so that you didn't have to spend your days doing things you didn't wanna do.

读完几小时后，我意识到自己财务状况其实不错。我不必再为了薪水继续这份无法充实自我的工作，这个发现让我欣喜若狂——但只持续了约一分钟。随后我陷入严重恐慌，因为我发现除了组建家庭这类基本人生轨迹外，这个职业曾是我唯一的身份标识与人生意义。而现在我意识到，这个定义我的职业已不再适合自己，更可怕的是，它仍是我与父亲之间最后的纽带。

And within a few hours of reading this, I realized I was doing fine financially. Like, I didn't have to continue doing this thing that wasn't filling me up just because I needed a paycheck, which was amazing and exhilarating for all of about a minute. And then I had a major panic attack because I realized this only thing that I'd ever identified myself as, this only version of purpose I really knew outside of, you know, the basic pedestrian stuff of having a family and kids and that kind of stuff. But my only real sense of purpose was tied to something I realized didn't suit me anymore. And not only that, but it was that singular connection I still had to my father.

我谈论着要放弃，也知道必须放弃——至少因职业倦怠、焦虑和压力必须部分退出。但另一方面，如果抛弃这个唯一定义过我的职业，我还剩下什么？于是我开始长达数年的探索，试图构建有意义的人生。我不愿良莠不分地全盘否定，不能直接放弃行医——虽然当时确实可以甩手说'我不干了'。

And I was talking about walking away, and I knew I had to walk away, at least on some level because of the burnout and the anxiety and the stress. On the other hand, if I was gonna walk away from this only thing that had ever defined me, who would I be? And so that started a process which took years of trying to figure out how to develop and pursue a life of purpose. And I wasn't ready to throw the baby out with the bathwater. So I couldn't just walk away from medicine because I probably could have, at that moment, said, I'm done.

'我辞职，不干了'——但我缺乏这种情感勇气。于是我从更简单的方式入手：运用我称之为'减法艺术'的方法。

I quit. I'm out. But I didn't have the emotional fortitude. So, actually, I started with something much more simpler. I used what I call the art of subtraction.

我开始剔除工作中不喜欢的部分。我不喜欢经营私人诊所，就关掉了它；后来又取消了夜间和周末在养老院的工作。最终只剩下临终关怀服务，照顾晚期病患。

I started getting rid of what I didn't like in my job. I didn't love owning my own practice. I got rid of that. I eventually got rid of the working in the nursing home in the nights and the weekends. What I was left with was doing hospice work, taking care of the terminally ill.

奇妙的是，我发现即便没有报酬，我也愿意做这份工作。它成为我的锚点——虽然整体职业已失去意义，我不再以此定义自我。

And strangely enough, I realized I would do that even if I wasn't being paid for it. That was an anchor for me. I'm like, okay. This job no longer feels purposeful. I don't identify by it.

但作为临终关怀医生的这部分工作，却是我快乐与意义的锚点。我可以坚守这部分，而这每周仅需10-15小时，于是产生了大量空白时间：我该怎样填充这些空间？这让我重拾那些长期被压抑的爱好，比如写作、公开演讲和自我表达。由于是通过理财知识抵达这个阶段，自然就开始撰写相关文章并制作播客。

But there's this little piece being a hospice doctor, which was an anchor of joy and purpose for me. So I could stick with that, but that, of course, opened up a huge amount of space because I was doing that about ten or fifteen hours a week. So the question was, what type of life did I wanna lead in all that open space? And that's where I came back to those joys that I'd always submerged, things like writing and public speaking and expressing myself. And since I got there through learning about personal finance, it was a natural place for me to start writing and podcasting about.

你转向花更多时间陪伴临终患者的经历似乎也让你对人生目标有了新的领悟。那是什么？

It also seems like your switch to spending more time with those in palliative care sort of taught you something else about purpose. What was that?

有趣的是，我的人生曾并行两条轨迹。一条是成为个人理财专家，开设相关博客并最终创办播客。另一条则是继续照顾临终患者。在病榻旁陪伴十到十五年后，我意识到金融从业者擅长教我赚钱投资。

Well, interestingly enough, my life had taken two tracks. Right? One track was becoming a personal finance expert, doing a blog on that, and eventually a podcast. But the other track was I was still taking care of the terminally ill. And after doing this for ten, fifteen years and sitting at people's bedside, I realized that when I was talking to financial people, they're really good at telling me how to make money or how to invest.

但当我问及'怎样才算足够'或'金钱究竟为何服务'时，往往只得到茫然的眼神。而我的临终病人明知大限将至，却只想谈论生命中最重要的事物——特别是那些遗憾。他们后悔始终缺乏精力、勇气或时间去完成什么？我开始思考：若金融从业者知晓这些会怎样？

But often if I ask them questions like, well, what does enough look like in your life or what is this serving? I got a lot of blank stares. On the other hand, then I go see my hospice patients who would know that the end was coming and all they wanted to do was talk about what was important in their life and specifically about regrets. What did they regret never having the energy, courage, or time to do? And I started thinking about what if all my financial people had this knowledge?

假如他们能短暂地站在临终者角度，思考那些未完成的重要事项呢？我们能否将这些遗憾转化为人生目标的锚点？就像某种召唤，某种隐约的启示。

What if they could put themselves in the shoes of someone who is dying and just for a brief period of time, think about those really important things that they hadn't accomplished? And what if we could then flip those around and turn them into anchors of purpose? Like, okay. This is a beckoning. This is an inkling.

这些对我至关重要。若余生毫无作为，继续以'时间不够''金钱不足''精力不济'或'害怕失败'为借口，终有一天会像我见过的病人那样，在医生走进病房时惊觉为时已晚。我想做的就是把这种认知传递给正在探索人生的年轻人——如何赢得人生游戏？如何死而无憾？

This is this big important thing to me. If I do nothing for the rest of my life, if I keep on saying I don't have enough time, I don't have enough money, I don't have enough energy, or I'm afraid I'm gonna fail, one day a doctor like me will walk into your room and you'll realize it's too late. And so what I wanted to do was take that feeling, that knowledge, and give it to all these younger people who are trying to figure out their life. How do we win the game? How do we die without regrets?

于是遗憾转化成了目标锚点，我们必须围绕它构建有意义的人生。我常说：目标不是等来的。人们总以为要么天降鸿运功成名就，要么错失良机万劫不复。

So regrets became purpose anchors, something we have to build a life of purpose around. And I always say this, you don't find purpose. Everyone's like, I'm waiting for it. It's either gonna fall on my head. I'm gonna be successful and happy, the world's gonna be great, or I'm gonna miss it, and everything's gonna be horrible.

真相是我们能听见这些微弱的召唤，但必须付出艰辛努力——围绕它构建有意义的人生。临终者给我们的启示就是：不要等到来不及。

The truth of matter is we have these whisperings, but then we have to do the hard work, which is building a life of purpose around it. And I think the dying, they have that message to give us. Don't wait until it's too late.

看来要找到人生目标，我们首先得明白它是什么。什么是目标？当我们思考如何寻找它时，从心理层面能获得哪些益处？

So it seems like to find purpose, we have to start by knowing what it is. What is purpose? And as we think about finding it, what are some of the benefits that can come from it psychologically?

这是我最爱的问题，因为通俗来说，我们常把目标视为'为什么而活'，但我觉得这种定义有问题。更好的理解应该是：目标是那些让我们眼前一亮的当下与未来行动。就这么简单。我不喜欢'为什么'的表述，因为这会让事情变得压力山大——要么永远找不到答案而迷失，要么找到了就永远幸福。

So this is my favorite question because I think colloquially, we talk about purpose as being our why, and I think that's problematic. I think the better way to look at it is purpose are the actions we take in the present and future that light us up. That's it. Simple, straightforward. Why don't like looking at it as our why is because then it becomes high stakes, and we're back to this I either don't figure it out in all this loss or I figure it out and I live blissfully happy.

我们都知道现实并非如此。所以我认为这个定义更贴切。为什么它重要？研究结果很明确，有无数关于人生目标意义的研究。

And we all know that's not how it works. And so I think it's a much simpler definition. Why is it important? Well, the studies are clear. I mean, there are a million studies out there that look at having a purpose in life and what that means.

多项研究表明，拥有目标能提升健康水平、延长寿命并增加幸福感。这就像一颗神奇药丸——如果医生告诉你吃下它能多活10%-20%，更健康快乐，谁都会服用。但人们常因目标看似虚无缥缈而放弃追求。有趣的是，另有研究显示高达91%的人会经历'目标焦虑'，这与前文研究似乎矛盾。

And we know from various studies that it leads to increased health, longevity, and happiness. And so it's really important if we had a pill. If the doctor could give you this pill and say you're gonna live 10 or 20% longer, you're gonna be happier and healthier, of course, we would take it. And yet people get so confused about purpose because it seems ephemeral and hard to reach that they give up on it. And in fact, other studies, which seem to contradict those first studies, show that up to ninety one percent of people at some point in their life have what's called purpose anxiety.

这种追寻目标的过程反而会引发沮丧和焦虑。问题在于：为何目标既是至宝又是压力源？部分原因在于我们误解了目标本质。长久以来将目标等同于'终极意义'，导致我们设定不切实际的宏大梦想，最终徒增挫败感。其实应该聚焦当下与未来的具体行动，做那些让自己眼前一亮的小事——这才是研究中所有积极结果的真正关联。

This idea of finding their purpose actually frustrates them, cause them depression, anxiety. And so the question is how can it be both? How can be purpose be, like, the most important thing, but also so anxiety ridden? And I think part of the reason is because we get this idea of purpose wrong. We've been stuck in that purpose is our why for so long that we make these big audacious dreams, often ones we don't have the agency to achieve, and it leaves us frustrated as opposed to focusing on action in the present and future and doing these little things that just light us up, which I think is much more associated with all those good things we see the study show.

你提出的这个区分非常关键，关于...

And so you've made this distinction that I find really important between,

就像你所说的那样

you know, what you seem to be

谈到这种宏大的P目标，那种高高在上、令人畏惧、引发焦虑的宏大目标，以及你所说的小p目标。什么是小p目标？我们遗漏了什么？

calling sort of this big p purpose, the kind of big, highfalutin, kind of scary, anxiety inducing purpose, and what you've termed little p purpose. What's the little p purpose? What are we missing?

小p目标是过程导向而非结果导向的。其核心在于做那些让你感到兴奋的事。这样做的好处在于它不可能失败。我说大P目标是非此即彼的——你要么实现这个极其大胆的目标，要么彻底失败。

So little p purpose is process oriented instead of goal oriented. And so the idea is doing things that light you up. And why this is good is it's impossible to fail. I say big p purposes all or nothing. You either succeed in this really big audacious thing or you don't.

而小p目标则包容万象。它往往非常非常丰富。想想看：我们有无数种可能去做那些会让我们享受的事情？相反，大P目标更注重结果，通常我们并不喜欢为了达成目标而必须经历的过程。

Little p purposes all are all. And so it tends to be very, very abundant. Think about this. What are the million different things we could do that we would enjoy? Conversely, big P purpose is much more goal oriented, and, usually, we don't love the process of doing the things we do just to get to this goal.

这会产生几个问题。其一是在美国我们常说'只要想到就能做到'。所以我们不仅思考目标，而且总是追求这种过度宏大的目标——我要成为亿万富翁，我要竞选总统。

And that's problematic for a few reasons. One is we often say things in America like, if you can think it, you can build it. And so we don't just think of purpose, but it's always like this big outsized. I'm gonna be a billionaire. I'm gonna run for president.

我要建立八位数营收的企业。很多时候，社交媒体和社会都在向我们推销这种观念。于是很多人会说：'我不知道自己的人生目标是什么，我找不到它。'然后他们会怎么做？

I'm gonna have an 8 figure business. And a lot of times, we're sold this by social media and society. And so a lot of people like, I don't know what my purpose is. I can't find it. And so what do they do?

他们直接拿起手机刷Instagram和TikTok。他们看到什么？六块腹肌、八位数企业、最时髦的衣着、周游世界各国。问题在于，那些发布这些形象的人——无论是社交媒体还是营销——大多试图向你推销商品。但我们却误将这个版本当作人生目标，因为我们不知道什么才是有意义的，而且我们被告知目标就应该宏大、有影响力且重要。

They go right to their phones, and they look at Instagram and TikTok. And what are they seeing? They're seeing six pack abs and 8 figure businesses and wearing the nicest clothes and traveling to every country in the world. And the problem is a lot of the people putting out those images, whether it's in social media or in marketing, are trying to sell you something. But we co opt this version of purpose because we don't know what feels purposeful, and we've been told that it's supposed to be big and impactful and important.

但大多数人实际上并没有能力练出六块腹肌或经营八位数企业。我们不是那个在正确时间、正确地点、说着正确话语、拥有完美基因再加十足运气的天选之人。所以很多时候我们会失败，这让我们感到迷茫焦虑；或者更糟的是，我们成功了却依然感到空虚。于是我们不得不加倍努力，选择更宏大的目标——现在我有了八位数企业，但我想成为身价数十亿的富豪。

But a lot of us don't have agency to actually have six pack abs or run the 8 figure business. We're not the right person at the right time saying the right things with the right genetics and a whole lot of luck. And so a lot of the times we fail, which makes us feel just lost and anxious, or, god forbid, we succeed and we realize that we don't still feel filled up. And so we have to double down and then pick the biggest, better thing. So now I have an 8 figure business, but I wanna be a multiple billionaire.

我想跻身全球前50位亿万富豪之列，或类似的目标。我们知道人容易安于现状，尤其在追逐这类功利性目标时。

I wanna be in the list of top 50 billionaires or what have you. We know that we tend to habituate back down to a baseline, especially with this goal oriented purpose.

我们需要看看其他榜样，不是社交媒体上的网红或亿万富翁。寻找实现小目标（little p purpose）的人时，往往不是预期中的那些。你提到过小时候社区里那个经营棒球卡的人，能分享他的故事吗？为什么这对获得小目标如此重要？

It's like we need to look at other examples, not the kind of folks on social media or the billionaires. Like, when we're looking for people who achieve little p purpose, it's not necessarily the people we expect. You shared the story of someone that you grew up with, this kind of baseball card guy that worked in your neighborhood. Can you share his story and why was it so powerful for gaining little p purpose?

罗曼改变了我的人生，虽然他从未刻意为之。这正是小目标的意义——它不仅触手可及，还能产生深远影响。罗曼高中时是棒球手，膝盖受伤后放弃梦想，没上大学，接手父亲的古董店，因为他擅长翻新家具。

So Roman changed my life, and he never ever meant to. But he did anyway. And this is, I think, the importance of little p purpose because not only is it reachable and something we all can do, but it actually can lead to really big impact in legacy. And so Roman was a baseball player in high school. He blew out his knee, kinda gave up on that dream, decided not to go to college, and took over his father's antique shop because he was good at redoing furniture.

人们会送来衣柜等家具，他修复后转卖。有次一位男士送来衣柜，他发现有利可图就买下了。在店里修理时，发现抽屉里有盒棒球卡，便打电话问对方要不要取回。

Right? They would bring him armoires and things, and he would fix them up, restain them, and sell them. And so he's busy in this life running the antique store, and a gentleman dropped off an armoire, and he saw that he can make an easy profit, so he bought it. He was in the back starting to fix it up at his antique store and noticed a box of baseball cards in one of the drawers. So he called the guy up and said, hey.

对方说不用管。罗曼对棒球卡一窍不通，就随手放在柜台。几天后，一位女士带着满脸不耐烦的青少年进店。

I got your baseball cards. You wanna come pick them up? The guy said, Nat, don't worry about it. So Roman knew nothing about baseball cards, and we took them, put them on the counter, didn't even think about them. A few days later, a woman came in with her snarky teenager looking bored as can be at being brought into this antique store.

那孩子注意到棒球卡，翻看后问罗曼：这些卡多少钱？罗曼完全不懂行情，随口说10美元。

And then he noticed the box of baseball cards and starts flipping through them, and he looks up at Roman and says, hey. How much for the baseball cards? Now Roman had no idea. This was just something extra, so he was like, $10. That'll be fine.

孩子放下10美元，像所有叛逆少年那样把卡片摊开，指出其中三张就值100美元。罗曼本可生气，但他反而被深深吸引了。

So the kid plops down $10. And as snarky teenagers do, he spread them out on the table and said, this one, this one, and this one, three of the 100 of cards. He said, these together are worth a $100 on their own. Now Roman could have been angry, but he wasn't. But instead, he found himself enthralled.

他大脑中有一部分区域意外地活跃起来，原因不明。我想他自己也不清楚。或许是回忆起了往自行车辐条间塞棒球卡片的童年，又或是记起幼时与父亲坐在瑞格利球场看台的时光。具体缘由难以确定，罗曼恐怕也无法解释，但那一瞬间的火花，就此成为他人生意义的锚点。这里再次强调关键区别——

A part of his brain lit up that he wasn't expecting, and I don't know why. I don't think he knew why. Maybe it was that he used to remember putting baseball cards in the spokes of his bike or that he remembered going to Wrigley Field with his dad and sitting in the bleachers when he was a little kid. I'm not sure what it was, and I don't think Roman could have told you, but he felt a spark, and that became a purpose anchor for him. Now this, again, is the big distinction.

并非他找到了人生意义。尽管那天他脑内确实有光亮闪现，但真正需要的是围绕这点星火构建完整的意义人生。于是他决定：我要在古董店里卖棒球卡。这并非为了赚取百万财富——他的古董店本就经营得法。

It's not that he found a purpose. Although this one day something lit up in his brain, he actually had to build a life of purpose around it. So he decided, I'm gonna sell baseball cards in my antique store. He wasn't trying to make millions of dollars. He already had a successful antique store.

他只是单纯觉得这事有趣又好玩。当即雇用了那个嘴欠的少年店员，开始钻研棒球卡市场行情，着手采购存货。几年后，我走进了那家古董店。

He just said, boy, this sounds fun and interesting. So he hired the snarky teenager right away. He started studying the baseball card market. He started buying inventory. And a few years later, I walked into that antique store.

那时的我八九岁年纪，刚经历丧父之痛，患有学习障碍，几乎没什么朋友，是个标准的书呆子。

You see, I was this eight, nine, 10 year old. My father had died. I had had a learning disability. I had almost no friends. I was the typical geek or nerd.

我没有任何社交圈，却痴迷棒球卡。走进那家店后，罗曼成了我的人生导师。每当我情绪低落，他会开导我，送我免费棒球卡包。我们拆开包装，嚼着中间那块难吃得要死的口香糖。

I had no community, but I loved baseball cards. And so I go to that antique shop, and Roman became a mentor. When I had a bad day, he would counsel me. He'd give me a free pack of baseball cards. We'd open it up and eat the god awful gum that came in the middle.

受惠者远不止我——数十个孩子在这个小小意义载体中找到了归属、联结与自信。可惜罗曼后来罹患癌症，不得不关停店铺，最终离世。那已是三四十年前的事了。但请想想那些从他建造的小小共同体走出的孩子：有人成为医生律师，有人像罗曼般从事买卖，但都带着满满的自信与归属感行走世间。

And it wasn't just me, but it was dozens and dozens of other kids who found community and connections and a sense of confidence all from Roman's little p purpose. Sadly, Roman eventually got cancer. He had to close the antique shop, and he died. That was, like, thirty or forty years ago. But think about all those kids who left that little community that he built, who became doctors and lawyers, and maybe they bought and sold things like Roman, but walked in the world with a huge amount of confidence and a feeling like they belonged.

三十年后，这些孩子仍在改变世界，养育子女，或许连对棒球卡的热爱也传承了下去。我常将此与米奇·曼托对比——童年集卡时我们最渴望得到的就是曼托卡。假设当年我或罗曼以曼托为人生楷模，比如立志成为职业棒球运动员打破纪录，这种宏大的目标...罗曼根本做不到，他的膝盖早就废了。

Thirty years later, those kids are still changing the world and having their own kids and passing down maybe even the love of baseball cards. And I like to contrast that to Mickey Mantle because when I was a little kid collecting baseball cards, all we wanted was Mickey Mantle cards. Now if I or even Roman, for that matter, had decided to look at Mickey Mantle and develop a sense of purpose around him, like, maybe we wanna be Major League Baseball players and break all sorts of records like him, that's kind of big audacious purpose. Well, Roman couldn't. He blew out his knee.

而我，只是缺乏天赋、技能和导师。我没有任何条件去实现那些。所以如果那是我们对人生意义的定义，当我们失败时，我们俩可能都会陷入痛苦。但相反，那个人记住了罗曼——这个做了件让他热血沸腾的事的人，而一个美妙的意外是，他改变了世界，他的影响至今犹存。数十年过去，他的效应和影响力依然清晰可见。

And me, I just didn't have the talent, the skills, the mentors. I didn't have anything in place to do that. So if that had been our version of purpose, we probably both would have ended up miserable when we failed. But instead, the guy remembers Roman, this guy who did something that lit him up, and a happy accident of that was that he changed the world, and he still exists. His effect, his impact are still there all these decades later.

那么，我们如何效仿罗曼的榜样，找到属于自己的小‘意义’？广告过后，我们将听到乔丹的建议。良好的沟通在生活和职场中都至关重要。我朋友马特·亚伯拉罕的播客《快速思考，聪明说话》能帮助你提升这方面能力。每周马特都会与包括我在内的专家对谈，分享基于研究的实用技巧，比如如何深入对话、成为更好的倾听者，以及如何在冲突中清晰表达。

So how can we follow Roman's example and find our own little p purpose? We'll hear Jordan's tips right after the break. Good communication is essential in life, both personally and professionally. And my friend, Matt Abraham's podcast, think fast, talk smart, can help you do better with that. Each week, Matt sits down with experts, including me, to share practical research backed tips to help you learn things like how to connect deeply in conversation, how to be a better listener, and how to communicate clearly through conflict.

本月，《快速思考，聪明说话》推出科技工具创作者迷你系列，教你用他们的工具改善职业沟通与生活。若你准备好升级沟通技能，每周二可在任意播客平台收听，并访问fastersmarter.io获取更多提升内容。在灼热沙漠中彻底迷路的人，有时会报告说看到地平线上有救命水。但无论他们朝那片闪烁的湖泊走多远，始终无法抵达。医生兼播客主乔丹·格罗梅特指出，我们这些渴求人生意义的人常陷入同样陷阱。

And this month, think fast, talk smart features a mini series with tech tool creators on how to use their tools to improve your professional communication and your life. So if you're ready to level up your communication game, listen every Tuesday wherever you get podcasts and find additional content to level up your communication at fastersmarter.io. People who get hopelessly lost in the blazing desert sometimes report seeing what looks like life giving water just over the horizon. But no matter how far they walk towards that shimmering lake, they never reach it. Doctor and podcaster Jordan Grommet says those of us thirsting for purpose often fall for the same thing.

我们追逐的愿景，最终往往只是他所谓的‘意义幻象’。

We chase after visions that turn out to be what he calls purpose mirages.

意义幻象本质上是伪装成对我们有益的宏大目标。无论是某个净资产数值——比如想达到百万或亿万身家，还是某项职业成就，你都会说服自己：一旦达成就会幸福圆满。即便你根本不喜欢实现目标必须经历的过程。举个典型例子：我在播客领域常看到这种现象，因为我热爱播客。

Purpose mirages are basically big p purpose that masquerades as being good for us. And so whether this is some net worth, like, wanna get to that million dollars or billion dollars or whatever it is, whether it's some career achievement, whatever it is, it's something that you convince yourself that you will be happy and everything will be perfect once you reach it. Even if you don't basically feel yourself lit up by the process of doing these things you have to do to get there. And so I'll give you a perfect example. I see this all the time in podcasting because I love podcasting.

对我而言，做播客就是‘小意义’。我极度享受这个过程。当我对着麦克风采访某人时，除了享受一小时愉快对话，结果如何并不重要。但我可以将其扭曲成幻象——比如告诉自己‘这很好，但我还想要月下载量破百万’。

And for me, podcasting is little purpose. It's something I deeply enjoy the process of doing. Once I get in front of that microphone to interview someone, it doesn't matter what comes of it other than I have a really joyful hour of conversation. I could turn that into a mirage. I could kind of say, well, that's fine, but I also wanna get a million downloads a month.

于是突然间，这件事就从享受过程变成了目标导向的行为。可能我会意识到：要达到目标，就得做些我非常抗拒的事。比如我不爱玩社交媒体，讨厌制作TikTok视频。这些事让我痛苦不堪，做完后往往整天闷闷不乐。

And so all of a sudden, this changes from something I enjoy the process of doing to more of a goal oriented, goal centered process. And maybe I realized to get there, I'm gonna have to do some things I really don't wanna do. Like, I don't love social media. I don't love making TikTok videos. Those are things I agonize over and find that I when I do them, I'm generally not happy at the end of the day.

但如果我真的想达到百万下载量，或许这是我必须做的事。结果就是，无论最终是否达成目标，我们大部分时间都在让自己无法享受正在做的事情。

But if I really wanna get to that million downloads, maybe that's something I need to do. And so what happens is we set ourselves up to not enjoy what we're doing for most of the time whether we get to that goal or not.

我认为这至关重要，因为不仅在我的生活中，尤其在耶鲁学生身上，我看到这种追逐幻影的行为——无论是金钱、成就、分数还是其他——最终会挤占他们原本可能拥有的微小意义。你热爱运动，或许因此成为田径运动员。但随后变成了追逐胜利和奖金，于是你开始厌恶它，因为你转而追求这些外在事物。我们可能陷入这样的境地：追求错误事物的过程会彻底抹杀

And I think this is so important because I've seen, not just in my own life, but especially with my Yale students, right, where this idea of kind of going after these mirages, whether it's money or accomplishments or grades or whatever, it winds up crowding out the little p purpose that they could have had. You love your sport, and you're sort of maybe you're a track athlete because of that. But then it's then it's the wins and the monies, and then you start hating it because now you're sort of chasing after these other things. So we can get in these situations where, like, the part that we hate going after the wrong thing can, like, literally get rid

我们曾经从其他事物中获得的快乐。

of the joy that we were getting from something else before.

是的。我认为幸福满足感更像马拉松而非短跑。我们再次将自己推向倦怠，因为我们做着内心并不热爱的事去追求自以为会喜欢的东西。问题在于，你花费大量时间在过程里，而真正达成目标的时间却极少。而且人类天生擅长将幸福感重新适应回某个基准水平。

Yeah. I mean, I think happiness contentment is really a marathon, not a sprint. Again, we set ourselves up for burnout because we are doing things we innately don't love to get to this thing we think we will love. But the problem is you spend so much time in the process and so little time in actually achieving the goal. And, again, we're really good as human beings at habituating back down to a certain level of happiness.

即使你认为那个目标会让你兴奋不已、并因此终生幸福，我们都知道这种感受转瞬即逝。所以更明智的做法是投入那些我们享受过程的事情，因为这实际占据了我们大部分时间。要知道，时间流逝从不停歇，它无法被商品化。

So even if you think that goal is gonna really light you up and you're gonna be happy the rest of your life because of it, we all know that it's fleeting. It's transitory. So it makes much more sense to invest in those things we enjoy the process of doing because that's gonna actually take up most of our time. And, you know, the secret is time passes no matter what you do. It can't be commoditized.

你无法购买、出售或交易时间。唯一能掌控的是随时间推移选择参与的活动。在我看来，赢得人生的游戏，就是用尽可能多你热爱的、有意义的行动填满时间，同时剔除尽可能多你厌恶的事物。

You can't buy it. You can't sell it. You can't trade it. The only thing you can do is control what activities you're involved with as time passes. And so winning the game, in my opinion, is filling up that time with as much purposeful activity you love the process of doing and getting rid of as many things that you loathe as possible.

特别是对年轻人，我常说：你们应该从现在开始审视日程表，每周每月持续优化它。因为生命有限，我们不知还剩多少时光。我希望你们都能赢得这场游戏，所以请持续调整日程，加入热爱的、有意义的小事，去除厌恶之事，如此周而复始地循环改进。

And especially with young people, I love to say, it behooves you to start looking at your calendar today and start working towards improving that calendar every week, every month because time is finite, we have no idea how much we have. And so I want you all to win the game. So I really want you to continuously look at the calendar and build in things you love, little p purpose, and get rid of things you loathe and just wash, rinse, and repeat over and over again.

这就引出了你关于如何找到更好人生小目标的第二个建议，对吧？当我们审视自己的日程时，必须关注内心的真实感受。第二条建议是：你无法从外部寻找人生目标，必须由内而外地发现它。这一点我特别认同，尤其是想到我的学生们时——我们太容易陷入他人对'人生目标应该是什么'的设定中了。我们可能会不知不觉地...

And that gets to your second tip for kind of finding better little p purpose, right, which is that when we kind of look through our calendar, we have to pay attention to what's going on internally. Tip number two is that you can't look for your purpose externally. You need to find it yourself. This is one that I really love because especially when thinking about my students, I think it's so easy for them and for all of us to just get caught up in other people's ideas of what, you know, our purpose should be. We can kind of co

采纳他人喜好的东西，结果却让自己误入歧途。

opt what other people seem to like in ways that sort of really run us astray.

如何解决这个问题？怎样才能从内心找到自己的人生目标？

How do we fix this? How do we find our purpose internally?

确实有些绝妙方法能连接你的目标感，但首先要明白：社会、营销广告、社交媒体都在为你定义人生目标——这些定义往往服务于他们的需求。商业营销显然想从你身上获利，而父母家人为你设定的目标版本，也常常是为了满足他们自身的需求。

There are some great ways to really connect with your sense of purpose, but it is true. The first thing you have to realize is society, marketing, social media, everyone has a version of purpose for you that probably fulfills their needs. So when we think of society marketing, it's obvious they wanna make money on you. But but also your parents and your family, they have a version of purpose for you. And often, it fulfills their needs.

也许你能弥补他们未竟之事，或者他们担心你的稳定生活。因此他们为你构建的目标版本，可能与真实的你并不契合。关键是要放下他人定义的目标，去触碰属于你自己的版本。所以我常说：人生目标不是找到的，而是我们主动创造或构建的。

Maybe you can make up for the thing they couldn't do, or maybe they're worried about your stability. And so they create this version of purpose for you too, which might not align with who you actually are. And so the idea is to let go of other people's version of purpose and get more in touch with yours. And so I often say, we don't find our purpose. We create or build it.

但确实需要那些'目标锚点'——那些让我们眼睛发亮的细微征兆或召唤，围绕它们才能构建有意义的人生。最佳方式是通过具体练习来更深入地感知这些锚点。我们开头讨论过的'临终遗憾'就是其中之一，我认为遗憾是思考人生目标的绝佳起点。濒死之人只剩有限时光，

But it is true that we need these purpose anchors, which are inklings or beckonings of things that light us up, which we can then build a life of purpose around. And so the best way is to think about a number of exercises we actually can do that help us get way more in touch with what these purpose anchors are. You and I talked about one of them in the beginning, which is the regrets of the dying. I think regret is a wonderful way to start thinking about purpose. Again, people are dying only have a short period of time left.

他们的精力所剩无几。可悲的是，遗憾会带来巨大痛苦，因为他们已无力改变。但如果我们让你设想：如果生命只剩一周或一个月，你会为什么事后悔？开始思考'如果永远没有精力、勇气或时间去做某件事会怎样？'——就能将其转化为目标锚点。最容易的部分就是意识到什么对我们真正重要。

They don't have a lot of energy. And so, unfortunately, regret is really, really disappointing because they don't have agency to do anything about that. But if we can put you in that mindset of what would you regret at the end of your life if that was to be in the next week or month and start thinking, what if I never had the energy, courage, or time to do? We can then turn that into a purpose anchor. That's the easy part is realizing what's important to us.

困难的部分在于你必须付诸行动。你需要围绕它真正构建一个有目标的生活。所以我认为遗憾是一种很好的方式。另一种方式是童年的快乐。所以我总是告诉人们，孩子们是极富目标感的。

The hard part is then you've gotta do the work. You've gotta actually build a life of purpose around it. So I think regrets are a great way. Another one is joys of childhood. So I always tell people kids are extremely purposeful.

对吧？他们尚未被他人对目标的定义所影响，尤其是年幼时。所以他们外出玩耍，做任何想做的事，完全忘记了时间。

Right? They haven't co opted anyone else's version of purpose yet, especially when they're very young. So they go out and they play. They do whatever they wanna do. They lose track of time.

他们进入了我们所说的心流状态，沉浸其中。他们甚至忘记回家吃晚饭，只是享受当下。大多数时候，孩子们并不担心什么宏大的目标，他们只想做自己想做的事，享受做事的过程。

They enter what we call, right, this flow state where they're so lost. They forget to come home for dinner, and they're just enjoying the moment. Kids don't worry about some big audacious goal most of the time. They just wanna do what they wanna do. They love the process of doing it.

随着年龄增长，当我们开始考虑职业、学业等事情时，我们逐渐放弃了这些对目标的纯粹理解。所以我常告诉人们：看看你的卧室，回想那些装饰品——墙上的海报、奖杯、画作，往往这些就是我们可以围绕构建人生目标的召唤。

We let go of those versions of purpose as we get older, when we start thinking about career and school and all those other things. So I often tell people, you know, look around your bedroom. Think back to what decorated your bedroom. What were the posters? What were the trophies?

对我来说，我很忙，对吧？我有很多事情要做，有很多目标锚点。但如果哪天这些不够了，我小时候很爱棒球卡。每次在Facebook刷到或报纸上看到棒球相关的内容，特别是那些老照片时，我的大脑就会兴奋起来。

What were the drawings? Often, those can be those beckonings that we can then build a life purpose around. Hey. For me, I'm busy. Right?

我能感受到那种激动，在胸腔里，在大脑中。我知道这就是童年的快乐，它可以成为一个目标锚点。如果我觉得生活缺乏目标感又有空闲时间，就可以开始追寻这个兴趣。

I have a lot of things going on. I have a lot of purpose anchors, but if I ever run out of them, I loved baseball cards when I was little. And so every time I'm scrolling through Facebook or looking in the newspaper and I see something about baseball or baseball cards, especially, like, with the old time photos, my brain lights up. I feel it. I feel it in my chest.

我能真切感受到这种兴奋。所以我知道这是童年的快乐，它可能成为生活的目标支点。当我感到生活缺乏意义又有闲暇时，就可以重新追寻这份热爱。

I feel it in my brain. I'm like, I get really excited. So I know that's a joy of childhood. It's could be a purpose anchor. And if I find that I really am like, boy, life doesn't feel very purposeful and I have free time, I can start pursuing that.

看来你正在触及第三个要点的核心，即我们需要关注过程而非目标。我们需要留意那些所谓的‘人生锚点’，那些能点燃我们激情的事物。你之前提到过‘人生锚点’，但能否快速定义一下？这些究竟是什么？

It seems like what you're doing there is sort of getting to what your tip number three is, right, which is that we need to notice the process, not the goal. We need to kinda pay attention to these so called purpose anchors, the stuff that lights us up. You've mentioned purpose anchors before, but I wanted you to kinda give me a quick definition. You know, what are these sorts of things?

人生锚点就是那些细微的直觉，是能让你感到快乐的召唤。关键在于：什么事情能让你天然感到愉悦？很多人会说‘我不知道’，但其实我们大多能感知到生活中这些微弱的呼唤。比如我学医时就隐约知道自己还想成为作家。

So purpose anchors are just the inklings. They are the beckonings of things that you could find joy in. And so the question is, what seems joyful out of the box? And, again, a lot of people like, well, I don't know what that is, but a lot of us do know that they're whisperings in our life. Like, I knew when I was training to be a doctor that I also wanted to be a writer.

就是有种莫名的吸引力，所以我总试着在忙碌间隙挤出时间写作。我们都知道，很多人睡前辗转反侧时，有时会冒出疯狂的想法，兴奋得彻夜难眠。

There was just something about it, and that's why I was trying to fit it into these little bits of time when I wasn't busy with other things. We all know that many of us are trying to fall asleep at night. Sometimes we have these crazy ideas, and we get so excited. We stay up all night. We can't fall asleep.

结果第二天筋疲力尽，觉得那想法太荒唐，就抛诸脑后继续工作。但有时，那些正是内心的微声呼唤。

And then the next day, you are so exhausted. You figure it was crazy. You move on. You go to work and never think about it again. But sometimes those are the whisperings.

比如：什么让你夜不能寐？什么使你热血沸腾？当你做某件事时，亲友们说你整个人都在发光？这些就是人生锚点——那些能带给你即时喜悦的事物。

Like, what keeps you up at night? What excites you? What do your friends and family tell you when you do this thing you are most lit up? Those are those anchors. They're just things that cause you immediate joy.

无需解释缘由，但这是启动行动力的绝佳起点，开始构建我所说的‘攀登路径’（那些有意义的行动）。锚点应该随处可见——多数人深入挖掘后，会发现生活中有许多令他们兴奋的小事。当他们放下‘必须做大事’‘必须符合他人期待’或‘必须追求名利’的执念，单纯思考‘我热爱什么’，一切就会变得简单而丰富。人们谈论人生意义时，从不会用‘丰富’这个词。

There doesn't need to be an explanation, but it's a great place to start that active process of creating action in the present and future, building what I call these climbs, these purposeful activities. It's just a great starting place, and they should be abundant. Most people, when they do the work, realize that there are actually lots of little things out there that excite them. And when they let go of this idea that has to be this big important thing or something other other people wanna do or it has to lead to some kind of wealth or fame, when they drop all that and just say, well, what are the things I love to do? It becomes much easier and much more abundant, which is something that people never they never use that term abundant when they talk about purpose.

它总被看作极度稀缺的东西，所以我想扭转这种认知。

It always seems like it's something totally scarce, and so that's why I wanna kinda flip that switch.

现在是短暂休息时间。但稍后回归时，乔丹将分享他从临终病人身上学到的一课。《幸福实验室》稍后继续。究竟什么才算过好一生？是关于幸福、目标、爱情、健康还是财富？

It's time for a quick break. But when we return, Jordan will share a lesson he learned from patients in their final days of life. The happiness lab will be right back. What does it even mean to live a good life? Is it about happiness, purpose, love, health, or wealth?

在追求美好人生的过程中，什么才是真正重要的？这些正是获奖作家、创始人和访谈人乔纳森·菲尔德在其顶级播客《美好生活计划》中向嘉宾提出的问题。每周，乔纳森都会与知名思想家和实践者对话，如亚当·格兰特、格雷琴·鲁宾、安吉拉·达克沃斯等数百位人士。立即收听，在您喜爱的播客应用中搜索《美好生活计划》。

What really matters in the pursuit of a well lived life? These are the questions award winning author, founder, and interviewer Jonathan Fields asks his guests on the top ranked Good Life Project podcast. Every week, Jonathan sits down with renowned thinkers and doers, people like Adam Grant, Gretchen Rubin, Angela Duckworth, and hundreds more. Start listening now. Look for Good Life Project on your favorite podcast app.

乔丹·格罗梅特医生表示，他曾错误地认为行医能赋予人生目标，但确实在职业中找到了极具意义的环节——与临终者共处的工作。姑息治疗让他学会了另一种发现微小人生意义的重要方法：进行所谓的'人生回顾'。

Doctor Jordan Grommet says he was wrong to think that practicing medicine would give his life purpose, but he did find one part of his profession that was deeply fulfilling, his work with people at the end of their lives. Working in palliative care taught him another great way to identify that little p purpose by conducting what's called a life review.

我最初是在担任临终关怀医疗主任时听说'人生回顾'的。开始从事临终关怀工作是因为我长期照料许多老年人，陪伴他们走完最后时光。有位临终关怀护士说：'你在这方面很有天赋，或许该加入我们。'

So I first heard of a life review as a hospice medical director. And so I started hospice work because I was working with a lot of elderly, and I was taking care of them at the end of life. And hospice nurse said, hey. You're really good at this. Maybe you should work with us.

临终关怀医生并不多见。我开始与他们共事后，很多知识都是在实践中学习的，尤其是这类工作。每周例会时，社会工作者总会提到'我们进行了人生回顾'等等。

There's not a huge number of hospice doctors. I started working with them. And a lot of times you learn on your feet, especially doing things like this. And I would go to our weekly meetings, and the social workers would keep on talking about, okay. We performed a life review, etcetera.

头一两次听到时我没太在意。但后来我开始追问：什么是人生回顾？为什么要做这个？在临终关怀中，我们有几项主要目标。

And, you know, the first time or two, I heard it. I didn't think much about it. But then I started asking questions. What is this life review, and and why do we do it? And so in hospice, we have a few main goals.

并非延长生命，而是让患者舒适，缓解他们的疼痛、恶心，确保他们在想离世的地方（无论是家中、养老院还是辅助生活机构）安详离去。另一关键点是帮助他们——以及家属——接受生命即将终结的事实。社会工作者、牧师、医生和护士可以通过'人生回顾'与患者或家属互动，这是一套结构化问题，引导人们真正回顾生命中的重要时刻。

It's not to prolong life. What it is is to make people comfortable, cover their pain, their nausea, make sure they're dying where they wanna die, whether that's home, in a nursing home, or assisted living. But another piece of that is helping them come to terms and their family for that matter come to terms with this idea that their life is ending. And one thing that social workers, chaplains, doctors, nurses can do with a patient or their family is called a life review. It's a series of structured questions that ask people to really review the important moments in their lives.

他们最重要的时刻是什么？他们最大的成就是什么？最大的失败又是什么？哪些关系对他们最为重要？我们也常问的一个重要问题是：他们有什么遗憾？

What were their most important moments? What were their biggest triumphs? What were their biggest failures? Which relationships meant the most to them? And a big part of that too we often ask is what are their regrets?

因此，我发现这种人生回顾对临终者极为有益，它能帮助人们找到内心的平静。但在从事临终关怀工作时，我也意识到很多人会问我：怎样才能善终？我常说，善终的最佳方式就是好好生活，因为我们往往以生活的方式死去。于是问题就变成了如何好好生活——既然人生回顾在临终时如此有益，为什么不提前开始做呢？

And so this life review, I found so beneficial in the dying, and it helps people find the sense of peace. But I also realized when working with hospice, you know, a lot of people ask me, how do you have a good death? So I often say, well, the best way to have a good death is to have a good life because we tend to die the way we lived. And so then the question becomes how to have a good life, and I was seeing so much benefit with this life review while people were dying. Why not start doing that earlier?

为什么我们不每年进行这样的回顾？为什么不定期做人生审视，向自己提出这些重大问题？我尤其喜欢关于遗憾的问题，因为我认为这是开始构建人生目标锚点的绝佳切入点。

Why aren't we doing this on a yearly basis? Why aren't we doing these life reviews and asking ourselves those big questions? And, again, I especially like the regret question because I think it's a great place to start working on those purpose anchors.

这就是第四个建议——人生回顾的理念。第五个建议我们之前略有提及，现在我想深入探讨：回到童年。具体来说，回到你童年的房间。当你重返儿时的房间，你看到了什么？这些物品如何揭示你幼时的志向？

And so that's sort of tip number four, this idea of a life review. Tip number five is something we mentioned a little bit before, but I wanna dig into a bit now, which is this idea of going back to childhood. Like, literally going back to your childhood room. When you go back to your childhood room, what do you see, and what did it tell you about your little p purpose?

天啊。房间里到处都是各种棒球卡，贴满运动海报，摆着少年联盟的奖杯。可能还有几本写满诗歌的笔记本——我从小就爱写诗。

Oh my god. There was a mess of baseball cards in every way, shape, or form. There were sports posters. There were trophies from Little League. There was probably a few notebooks of papers and pens because I started writing poetry when I was little.

课本散落各处。有趣的是，这些物品早已暗示了我成年后的模样，只是当时浑然不觉。房间里没有著名医生的照片，没有玩具听诊器。

There were school books everywhere. Funny enough, there were the hints of what I would eventually become as an adult. I just didn't know it at the time. What there wasn't, there wasn't pictures of famous doctors. There wasn't toy stethoscopes.

《格雷解剖学》那本名著也不在我的书架上。耐人寻味的是，几乎没有任何物品显示我对医学的兴趣，却有大量线索表明我热衷特定运动、收藏、写作和沟通——唯独没有成为医生的迹象。

Grey's Anatomy, that famous book, was not on my bookshelf. Interestingly enough, there was almost nothing that reflected an interest in medicine and so many things that suggested an interest in certain types of sports, in collecting, in writing, in communicating. All of that was there. Just nothing about being a doctor.

所以你有棒球卡、成堆的物品、写作的痕迹，却没有听诊器。这些线索在暗示你怎样的生活目标？

So you had baseball cards, piles of stuff, evidence of your writing, no stethoscopes. What kind of hint is that giving you about your purpose?

我当时试图挪用他人定义的目标——我父亲的目标。因为经历了重大创伤后，幼小的我需要抓住某种能让我继续前行的意义。成为像他一样的医生就能解决一切问题，这逻辑似乎很合理。但挪用他的目标与真实的自我并不契合——其实只要环顾那个房间，就能看清我究竟是谁。

I was trying to co opt someone else's version of purpose, my father's. And because I had gone through this really traumatic thing, and I needed as a kid to grasp onto something that made sense so I could move forward. And so it really made sense that if I became a doctor like him, I would fix everything. But co opting his version of purpose didn't fit with who I was. And so all you had to do was look around that room to see who I was.

但我确实围绕着这个不属于自己的目标构建了整个人生，而我认为多数人都是如此。我们大多数人都会采纳外界建议的某种人生目标。只有少数幸运儿能避开这个陷阱，他们识别出内心真正的热情并追寻那条路。但多数人在成年转型期就被告知：好了，游戏时间结束。

But I really built a life around this purpose that wasn't mine, and I would submit that most of us do exactly that. Most of us grab on to some version of purpose that is suggested to us. There are a few really lucky people who don't, who realize what lights them up and pursue that path, but most of us pivot to becoming adults. We're told, okay. Playtime is over.

你曾是孩童，但即将成为青年，是时候认真对待学业了，该从那些象征成功的主流职业中选择一个能保障经济收入的。我想所有人都这么做了，我们就这样一头扎进去。

You were a kid then, but now you're becoming a young adult, and it's time to get serious about school. It's time to pick one of those main careers that suggest success that's gonna provide for you economically. And I think all of us do that. We just jump in.

完全遗忘了曾经散落在地板上的那些东西。而你提出，如果回顾童年房间发现地板上堆满杂物，那也完全没问题。这引出了第六条建议，你称之为「意大利面测试法」。什么是意大利面测试法？为什么在寻找微小目标时涌现大量线索反而是好事？

And just forget all the stuff that was on our floor. And you've argued that if you look at your childhood room and there's lots of stuff all over the floor, then that's okay too. That gets us to tip number six, which is what you've called the spaghetti method. What's the spaghetti method, and why is it okay if lots of stuff comes up when you start looking for these small purposes?

关键在于：当探讨微小目标时，仍有人感到抗拒。他们会说：我回顾了人生遗憾，这没用；我回忆了童年欢乐，这也没用；我审视了工作，找不到任何热爱的部分。

Well, here's the thing. When discussing a little p purpose, I still get people resilient. They'll say, look. I thought about regrets in life review. That's not helping I've thought about the joys of childhood.

如果你也属于这类对寻找人生锚点感到抗拒的人，我建议采用意大利面测试法——把各种可能性抛向墙面，看哪些能粘住。对平常拒绝的事说「好」，与平常不接触的人交谈。

That's not helping me. I've looked at my job, and there's nothing there that I love that's not helping me. And so if you are one of those people, if if you were kind of resilient to finding these anchors, I think it behooves you to find the spaghetti method, which is you throw a bunch of things against the wall and see what sticks. You say yes to things you normally don't say yes to. You talk to people you normally don't talk to.

你会做一些可能让你感到些许焦虑或不自在的事情。一天结束时，你会评估并问自己：这件事让我感到振奋了吗？是或否。如果答案是肯定的，嘿，我确实从中找到了些许快乐。

You do things that maybe make you feel a little anxious or uncomfortable. And at the end of the day, you evaluate and say, did that light me up? Yes or no. And if the answer is, hey. I did find some joy in that.

那可能就是一个目标锚点的开端。

That might be the beginning of a purpose anchor.

所以你其实是在用‘意大利面法’尝试各种新事物，寻找所有这些可能的目标锚点。但你也提出了反面观点，比如我们不能在所有琐事中都追求微小的目标，尤其是当我们忙于那些无法赋予我们意义的事情时。这正引出了你的最终建议——第七条，对许多人来说可能很难做到：拥抱减法艺术。这是什么意思呢？

And so you kind of do use the spaghetti method and find all these possible purpose anchors by trying these new things. But you've also argued the flip side, which is like, we can't have little p purpose in everything, especially if we are busy with all this stuff that's not giving us purpose. And that's what gets us to your final tip, tip number seven, which might be a hard one for a lot of us when you embrace the art of subtraction. What's that?

我经常谈论职场，因为这是人们总问我的问题。他们说：听着，我得朝九晚五上班，虽然不喜欢但需要赚钱。你说要找到人生目标。

So I often talk about the workplace because this is a question I get all the time. They're like, look. I've gotta do my nine to five. I don't love it, but I need to make money. You're saying find your purpose.

我感觉被困住了。这份工作对我没有意义，但我必须做，现状就是如此。所以我总是告诉人们，就像我对待医生职业那样做：列出你工作中的20项职责，然后拿支尖铅笔开始划掉所有你不喜欢的、厌恶的、无聊的内容等等。大多数人这样做后，只会剩下一两件事。

I feel stuck. Like, this is something that's not purposeful for me, but I've gotta do it, and it is what it is. And so what I always tell people is do exactly what I did with being a doctor. I want you to list out the 20 things that are roles and responsibilities of your job, and I want you to take a sharp pencil and start scratching out everyone you don't like, everything you loathe, everything that's boring, etcetera. Most people, when they do that, will have one or two things left over.

对我来说是临终关怀医疗。所以目标就是记住我们说的‘赢得游戏’——尽可能多做热爱的事，尽可能少做厌恶的事，不断循环这个过程。既然暂时无法辞职，那就思考：有哪些方法可以让我在工作中多做热爱的事，少做不喜欢的事？我再举个例子说明。

For me, was hospice medicine. And so the goal then is remember, we said winning the game, right, is doing as much little people as possible and getting rid of as many things you load as possible wash, rinse, repeat. So the goal then is I'm not gonna get out of this job, but what levers are available to maybe do more of that stuff I love in the job and do less of stuff I don't love? And so let me give you another example. Think about it this way.

假设你在餐厅工作，不喜欢在前台接待，90%时间都在做这个。但你每周四上午有两小时库存整理时间——你热爱记录、整理和下单这些事。

Let's say you work at a restaurant, and you don't like working up front at the counter and you spend 90% of your time doing that, but the one thing you do love is every Thursday morning, you get to stock the stockroom. It takes about two hours. You love writing things down. You love organizing. You love ordering.

就是这样。也许，拥有你餐厅的那个人实际上拥有四家餐厅，每家餐厅都有一名负责库存的员工。于是你可以去找老板说，你知道吗？我并不太喜欢在前台服务顾客的时间。或许你可以让我每天轮流去我们不同的餐厅，负责每家店的库存和仓库管理。

That's it. Well, maybe the person who owns your restaurant owns four restaurants, and there's an employee who has the stock for each of those restaurants. And maybe so you go to your boss and say, you know what? I don't really love my time at the counter helping customers. Maybe you allow me to go to all of our different restaurants every day, and I'll stock and do the stockroom in each one of them.

这样一来，我增加了做喜欢事情的时间，减少了做不喜欢事情的时间。你开始改善现状，开始优化日程安排，开始在这场游戏中逐渐占据上风。如果我们能月复一月、年复一年地这样思考，我们能带来多大的改变呢？

And therefore, what I've done is I've increased the time I'm doing something I like and decreased the time of doing something I don't like. And so you're starting to improve things. You're starting to improve that calendar. You're starting to win the game just a little bit. So if we can think about that month to month, year to year, how much change can we bring in?

我们能减去多少不必要的事务？能增添多少令人愉悦的事情？如何优化这些比例？最终，随着年龄增长，我们会做越来越多热爱的事，越来越少厌恶的事。

How many things can we subtract? How many joyful things can we add? And how can we improve those numbers? So, ultimately, as we get older and older, we're doing more and more things that we love and less and less things that we loathe.

那么遵循这些建议如何真正改变了你的生活？我们故事开始时你是个精疲力竭的医生，尝试新方法后，你现在的目标感是怎样的？

So how's following these tips really helped your life? I mean, we started this story with you being a very burned out doctor. You tried some new things. Where's your sense of purpose now?

我在2014年2月意识到自己可以离开临床医学，直到2018年才精简到只保留临终关怀工作，并投身其他事业。现在我快乐多了——原因很简单：当我打开手机日历，上面几乎所有事项都是我自己添加的，也能瞬间取消。

I mean, I learned that I could walk away from medicine 02/2014. It took me till 2018 to subtract out enough to be left with only hospice work and jump into other things, and I find myself a lot happier. And I'll tell you why. I mean, it really comes down to this. When I open the calendar app on my phone, almost everything on that app, everything in that calendar is something that I put there, and I can get rid of at the drop of a dime.

我花很多时间做播客，有时自己剪辑。这过程可能很痛苦，但如果我不想做了，随时可以停更一期。我拥有完全的掌控权和自主权。

I spend a lot of time podcasting, and sometimes I edit my own podcast. Okay. That can be painful. But if I decided I didn't wanna do it, I could get rid of it and just not put an episode out. I have complete control and agency.

这种自主性让我感受到掌控力，极大提升了幸福感。多年来我不断优化日程安排，现在所做大多是自己想做的事，这种充实感难以言表。更美妙的是，我不仅享受这些事，还发现与他人的联结更深了。

I have autonomy. These things allow me to feel in control, and that increases my happiness quite a bit. I found that I've been able to improve that calculus in my schedule over the years over and over again. And so most of the things I do are things I wanna do, and that feels deeply fulfilling. And what's really beautiful about that is not only do I really like doing these things, I found that I connect to other people more.

因为当我还是医生时，我并不热爱这个职业。所以我有点不喜欢和医生圈子的人来往。我不会告诉别人我是医生。参加派对时，我从不透露自己的职业，因为感到难为情。因此我认识医生同行数十年，却从未与他们建立深层联系。

Because when I was a doctor, I didn't love being a doctor. So I kinda didn't like hanging out with doctor people. I didn't tell people I was a doctor. When I go to a party, I wouldn't tell anyone what I did for a living because I was embarrassed. And so I knew doctors for decades, but never connected with them on a deeper level.

当我开始投身让我热血沸腾的事业时，不仅能在几分钟内与人建立联结，还开始与他们合作——邀请他们上我的播客，他们也回请我上他们的节目。后来我写书时，他们会主动说：'嘿，我认识个经纪人，帮过我忙，你要不要见见？'

When I started doing things that lit me up that I loved, not only did I connect with people within minutes, but I also started collaborating with them, having them on my podcast, and then they would have me on their podcast. And then I was writing a book, and they'd say, hey. I've got this agent. They helped me. Why don't you meet my agent?

最终我围绕这些热爱之事构建了社群，这真正带来了幸福感。不仅是做想做的事，更在于与人联结、协作、共建，成为志趣相投者社群的一份子。

And so what happened is I ended up building communities around these activities, and that has really led to happiness. Not just doing what I wanna do, but connecting with people, collaborating, building, and being part of communities of people who I love doing things that I find deeply interesting.

听起来你现在处境很幸运对吧？经历过医生生涯，经济上也足够成功，能进行常人难以实现的转型。但你想传达的是：这并非专属于起点优越、财力充足的幸运儿。

And it seems like you are in a very lucky place. Right? You had this time as a doctor. You were sort of financially successful enough that you could move certain things around in a way that not everybody could. But it sounds like your message is that this isn't just something for privileged folks who are starting out with the right finances to switch things around.

这是每个人都能够做到的。

This is something that everybody can do.

确实如此。我常提醒人们——这其实是个关于特权的对话。有人看着我说：'你是医生，懂理财，事事顺遂。你真走运，但我的情况不同，我才22岁。'

It is. And so what I often remind people and this is really the privileged conversation. People look at me and say, well, you're a doctor, and you found out that you understood your finances, and everything was great. Well, lucky for you, but that's not me. Like, I'm 22.

每周工作五六十小时，既没时间追求所爱，也不喜欢现在的工作。其实阻碍因素就那几个——时间和金钱总是人们推脱的主要理由。先来快速聊聊时间问题。

I'm working fifty, sixty hours a week. I don't have time to do the things I love, and I don't love my job either. Well, there are a few things. Really, time and money are always the biggest reasons why people say they can't do this. So time, let's talk about that really quickly first.

美国劳工统计局定期进行时间使用调查。他们普遍发现大多数美国人每天约有五小时空闲时间，实际上，社会经济地位较低群体可能拥有更多空闲时间。因此问题很可能不在于时间，而在于金钱。我认为金钱确实是追求有意义生活的重要工具，但它只是众多工具之一。

The Bureau of Labor Statistics does the American Time Survey on a regular basis. They've generally found that most Americans have about five hours of free time a day, and, actually, those in lower socioeconomic classes probably have a little bit more. And so it's probably not time. So then it's money. And I like to say money is a really important tool to living a life of purpose, but it's only one of many tools.

我们常常忘记运用自己的热情、青春活力、人脉关系、技能和社区资源。这些都是可利用的工具。所以我想说：如果你22岁，每周工作50小时却不喜欢当前工作，能否运用减法艺术，在现有工作中增加你喜欢的部分？

And so often we forget to use our passions, our youth, our energy, our connections, our skills, our communities. All of these things are tools also. And so I like to say, hey. You're 22, and you're working fifty hours a week, and you don't like your job. Can you use the art of subtraction to do more of what you do like within the job?

或者你可以尝试加法带来的快乐？也许你精力充沛且周末有更多自由时间——毕竟没有家庭负担、房贷压力或子女牵绊。你可以开始从事有意义且带来快乐的活动，或许能发展成副业最终创造经济收益。即便不能，你也通过加法为生活注入了意义，而不必立即放弃不喜欢的事物。

Or can you use the joy of addition? Maybe you have a lot of energy and you have more free time on the weekends because you don't have a family and you don't have a mortgage and you don't have kids yet. And so you can start doing a purposeful, joyful activity. Maybe you turn it into a side hustle that eventually leads to some economic margin. But even if it doesn't, you've used the joy of addition to add in some purpose into your life even if you haven't gotten rid of something you don't love.

我们还有许多被忽视的调节杠杆。比如22岁时若与父母同城，或许可以住他们家地下室省去房租，这样就能把不喜欢的全职工作减为每周四天，用多出的一天追求有意义的事或赚钱活动，逐步掌控并改善生活节奏。这看似是特权阶层的论调，但确实存在可立即运用的工具来为生活赋予意义。

We have all these other levers that people generally don't think of. If I'm 22 and I live in the same city as my parents, maybe I go live in their basement and don't have to pay rent. Maybe that gives me a little economic margin so I can work four days a week at this job I don't like instead of five days a week. Maybe I can fill that other day with purpose or some money making activity and start controlling things, start improving that schedule. I think it's easy to say this is an argument of privilege, but we know that there are some tools and some levers that we can use to start bringing purpose into our life now.

即便是每天花十五分钟刷Facebook并加入棒球卡或球迷社群，这十五分钟也增添了快乐元素，正是我们赖以构建意义的微小起点。

Even if that's fifteen minutes of me scrolling through Facebook and joining baseball card or baseball fan pages, those fifteen minutes are still adding in something joyful, and that's that little beginning that we start building off of.

关于人生意义的研究表明，当你向这个微小开端敞开怀抱并付诸尝试后，最终会获得更多能量、社群支持和实践机会。某种意义上，正是通过这些细微尝试，你的人生意义版图会随时间逐渐扩大。

And I think one of the things we know from the purpose research is that once you open up to that little beginning, once you try a little bit, you wind up feeling more energized. You wind up getting more community. You wind up getting more opportunities to do this. So in some sense, you grow your purpose pie over time just by trying this out in little ways.

没错，这就是动能效应。最困难的是开始行动——这又回到了目的、行动与当下未来的关系。最艰难的是为首次行动积蓄动能。

Yeah. It's momentum. The hardest thing is starting. The hardest thing and, again, we get back to purposes, action, and present in the future. The hardest thing is building the momentum for that first action.

但一旦你开始采取这些行动，势头就会逐渐形成。所以，再次强调，自主权、能动性，这种我能真正掌控生活中发生的事情的信念，一旦你开始感受到它，几乎会让人上瘾。你不想停下来。

But once you start taking these actions, the momentum builds. And so, again, autonomy, agency, this idea that I can actually control what's happening in my life, once you start feeling that, it almost becomes addictive. You don't wanna stop.

你可能不想停止为生活增添意义，但有些美好的事物必须告一段落，比如这一期节目。不过让我们快速回顾一下乔丹关于寻找人生目标的建议。第一条建议是避开那些虚幻的目标陷阱。变得富有、成名、赢得格莱美奖，这些都不是能真正改变你生活的现实目标。相反，寻找那些微小的意义和你能立即付诸行动的事情。

You might not want to stop adding purpose to your life, but some good things have to come to an end, like this episode. But let's quickly recap Jordan's tips for finding purpose. Tip number one is to avoid those purpose mirages. Getting rich, becoming famous, winning a Grammy, these aren't realistic goals that are really gonna transform your life. Instead, look for little p purpose and things you can do right away.

第二条建议，你的目标必须完全属于你自己。不要仅仅为了取悦父母、朋友或同龄人而做事。第三条建议是停止将目标视为必须达成的终点，而是将其看作一个过程，并在快乐的活动出现时尽情投入。第四条建议是进行人生回顾。

Tip number two, your purpose has to be yours and yours alone. Don't do things just to impress your parents, friends, or peers. The third tip is to stop thinking of purpose as a goal you've got to reach. Instead, think of it as a process and engage in joyful activities whenever they present themselves. Tip four is to conduct a life review.

问问自己有哪些遗憾，以及在为时已晚之前能否为此做些什么。孩子们很擅长发现生活的意义。所以第五条建议是回顾你童年的热情所在。那里是否藏着能让你成年后感到快乐的线索？如果毫无头绪，第六条建议推荐使用'意大利面法'——多尝试。

Ask yourself about your regrets and if there's anything you can do about them before it's too late. Children are great at finding purpose. So tip number five is to look back at your childhood passions. Are there any clues to the things that might bring you joy as an adult? And if you draw a blank, tip number six recommends the spaghetti method.

只需大胆尝试各种可能赋予你更多意义的事情。最后第七条建议不是关于增加，而是关于删减。尽可能去除生活中糟糕乏味的部分。乔丹的建议到此结束，本期节目也接近尾声，我们的'如何'系列季就此完结。

Just experiment and try out lots of stuff that might give you more purpose. And the final tip, tip seven, isn't about adding more. It's about subtraction. Remove as many of the bad and boring parts of your life as possible. We've reached the end of Jordan's tips, the end of this episode, and the end of our how to season.

不过别担心，未来几周我们还将为您带来更多内容。请务必继续收听由我——劳瑞·桑托斯博士主持的《幸福实验室》下一期节目。

But not to worry as we'll have lots more in store for you over the coming weeks. So be sure to return soon for the next episode of the happiness lab with me, doctor Laurie Santos.

我是乔纳森·戈德斯坦，在《沉重人生》新一季中，我将帮助一位百岁老人修补破碎的心。

I'm Jonathan Goldstein, and on the new season of Heavyweight, I help a centenarian mend a broken heart.

一位101岁的老妇人如何能再次坠入爱河？

How can a 101 year old woman fall in love again?

而我帮助一个男人为他14岁时犯下的持械抢劫赎罪。

And I help a man atone for an armed robbery he committed at 14 years old.

于是我拿枪指着他，说这不是玩笑。他蹲下了，我记得当时有种冲动，感觉像是，好吧。

And so I pointed the gun at him and said, this isn't a joke. And he got down, and I remember feeling kind of a surge of, like, okay.

这就是力量。而且，我的老朋友格雷戈尔和他兄弟试图通过催眠来解决我的问题。

This is power. Plus, my old friend, Gregor, and his brother tried to solve my problems through hypnotism.

我们可以给你一个全新的设定，让你一直超级迷人。

We could give you a whole brand new thing where you're, like, super charming all the time.

更能直视别人的眼睛。

Being more able to look people in the eye.

不必总是躲在麦克风后面。

Not always hide behind a microphone.

无论你在哪里收听播客，都能听到《重量级》节目。

Listen to heavyweight wherever you get your podcasts.

这是iHeart出品的播客。

This is an iHeart podcast.