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乔·罗根的播客。
Joe Rogan podcast.
去看看吧。
Check it out.
《乔·罗根体验》这个节目。
The Joe Rogan experience.
白天训练。
Train my day.
白天训练，晚上听乔·罗根的播客，一整天都这样。
Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day.
嘿，最近怎么样？
What up?
你好吗？
What's up?
兄弟，见到你真好。
It's good to see you, brother.
最近怎么样？
What's cracking?
见到你真好，兄弟。
Good to you, man.
能来这里我很兴奋。
Stoked to be here.
你能来我也很高兴，兄弟。
Stoked to have you, man.
对。
Yeah.
你孩子真可爱，兄弟。
What a fucking cute kid you have, dude.
谢谢。
Thank you.
谢谢。
Thank you.
他真的是最棒的，兄弟。
He's the best, man.
太幸福了。
So blessed.
你。
You.
你刚才是不是想把他放下来？
Were you trying to put him down?
他好像在说，不要。
He's like, no.
我觉得是因为我们刚去了犹他州，我和他待了三四五天。
I think it's because I just spent we just went to Utah, and I had three or five days with him.
就是，和他在一起的时间很多，他有分离焦虑，我也有。
Just, like, a lot of time with him, and he has separation anxiety from me as I do with him.
我就觉得，这太好了，兄弟。
I'm like, that's the best, man.
我认识一些没有孩子的人，他们真的不明白你对孩子的爱有多深。
I know people that don't have kids, it's like you don't understand the level of love that you have for them.
是的。
It's Yeah.
真的挺疯狂的。
It's really crazy.
或者有些人有孩子，却不怎么陪孩子玩。
Or people who have kids and don't hang out with their kids like that.
我就是搞不懂。
I just I don't get it.
我也搞不懂。
I don't get it either.
我会尽可能多花时间陪我的孩子。
I'll spend every second I can with my kids.
对。
Yeah.
这很奇怪。
It's weird.
奇怪的是，有些人可能是因为小时候经历过什么事才这样。
It's weird that people it's something that happened to them when they were young or something.
我也不知道。
I don't know.
不过，是的。
But Yeah.
那最近怎么样？
So what's cracking?
有什么新鲜事吗？
What's what's the latest?
我的纪录片今天上线了。
I mean, my doc came out today.
今天？
Today?
对，就是这样。
So yeah.
是的。
Yep.
等了很久了。
Long time coming.
那段经历感觉怎么样？
What was that experience like?
嗯，开始的时候是在我的书出版后不久。
Well, the beginning of it was was shortly after my book came out.
所以那时候我有点明白为什么人们想要我拍纪录片。
So I kinda understood why people wanted a doc from me at that point.
我当时感到荣幸，也很受宠若惊，你知道，就开始了拍摄这部纪录片的旅程，但它其实没有结局。
And I was I was honored, and I was flattered, and I was, you know, going down the journey of of filming this doc, but it it didn't really have an ending.
我想那时候，大概2017年，隧道尽头的曙光就是我戒了酒，而且从飞机失事中幸存了下来。
I guess the light at the end of the tunnel during that time around 2017 was that I was sober and I survived a plane crash.
但实际上，我一直在挣扎着要不要再坐飞机，挣扎于幸存者的内疚，还有很多别的事情。
But, really, I was struggling with ever flying again, struggling with survivor's guilt, struggling with a lot of stuff.
当时导演们跟我说，你能不能就看看飞机，或者假装要去坐飞机，或者走向飞机？
And at the time, the directors had mentioned to me, can you just look at a plane or act like you're gonna go fly in a plane or walk towards a plane?
我当时就想，绝对不行。
I was like, fuck no.
我根本不可能考虑这个。
I would never I can't even consider it.
就算是为了这部纪录片的结尾，为了那种幻想的效果，我也做不到，你知道吗？
I can't even do it for you for for, like, fantasy purposes for the end of this doc, you know?
过了一段时间，我意识到，我不得不承认，也终于明白，我害怕再次飞行。
And I think that set in after a while where I had to acknowledge and and and just understand I was I was afraid to ever fly again.
这件事对我的影响太大了，以至于它决定了我怎么去巡演，坐大巴去纽约要几天，坐玛丽皇后二号去英国要几天。
And and this thing had huge power over me to the point where it, you know, it dictated how I got on tour, how many days I'd travel on bus to New York, how many days I'd be on the Queen Mary two going to England.
那要花多长时间？
How long would that take?
哦，天哪。
Oh, dude.
太久了。
So long.
去英国那趟太疯狂了。
The England one's crazy.
从这儿坐大巴去纽约，如果中途住酒店的话，大概六七天吧。你知道，我巡演的时候一直带着孩子，他们从小到大都这样。
Comfortably on the bus from here to New York, probably six or seven days if you wanna stop at hotels and at you know, I toured with my kids, you know, their whole life.
所以为了他们，我会停下来玩些好玩的，大概六七天，然后再坐十天的船从纽约到汉普顿。
So stopping and doing some cool stuff for them, six, seven days, and then a ten day boat ride from from New York to the Hamptons.
天哪。
Fuck.
那真是疯了。
It was crazy.
是的。
Yeah.
是的，我的乐队会先走。
Yeah, my band would leave.
他们十个小时就到英格兰了，随便吧。
They'd be in England in ten hours, whatever.
我得花三个星期。
It would take me three weeks.
太糟糕了。
It sucked.
有时候我也会坐玛丽皇后号，遇到恶劣天气，三十英尺高的浪，每小时一百七十英里的风，我就想，这比坐飞机好吗？
And then sometimes I'd be on the Queen Mary too and we'd have wild weather, 30 foot waves, 170 mile per hour winds, and I was like, is this any better than being on a plane?
但是
But
你怕大海吗？我挺怕的。
Do you the ocean freaks me out.
对。
Yeah.
特别是大浪。
Big waves in particular.
它们让我害怕。
They freaked me out.
是的。
Yeah.
我们遇到过几次风暴，唉。
We got into a couple storms Ugh.
在跨大西洋的航行中，确实。
On one of the Transatlantic crossings that yeah.
相信我。
Believe me.
是的。
Yeah.
就像，我心里有什么东西在酝酿，我有一种冲动，想弄清楚到底是什么控制着我，那就是飞行。
Like, something was festering inside where I I had this urge to to to try to figure out what had this power over me, was flying.
对。
And yeah.
嗯，这完全可以理解。
Well, it's totally understandable.
是的。
Yeah.
过了某个时间点之后，我每天都会想起这件事。
Think about it every day after a certain point.
而且还有我的孩子们，你知道，他们从小到大都没坐过飞机。
And then plus my kids, you know, they grew up not flying.
他们从小就把飞机和装死人的金属盒子联系在一起，我觉得，很不幸，因为那确实发生了，我那两个最好的朋友和飞机上的两位飞行员都遇难了。
They they grew up associating a plane to a a metal container where people die, I think, you know, unfortunately, because that's what happened, you know, to my two best friends and the two pilots who were on my plane.
所以，是的，那段时间真的很难熬。
So, yeah, it was it was it was hard.
然后我知道，当我做到的时候，我就能向他们证明，他们也能做到，这大概能打破我那次事故带来的创伤和阴影，不管那已经过去多少年了。
And then I knew the day I did it, I could show them that they could also do it, and it would probably break the the trauma and the spell that my my accident caused however many years ago.
而且，是的，我觉得在我出事之后，整个过程中，别人说我做不到的事情，我就一件一件地完成它们。
And, yeah, I think after my accident and that whole process, I just everything people said I couldn't do after that, would just check them off one by one.
哦，你不能再跑步了。
Oh, you're not gonna run again.
哦，你不能再打鼓了。
Oh, you're not gonna play drums again.
哦，你不能。
Oh, you're not.
你不能再做这个了。
You're not gonna do this again.
而且我自己给自己设的限制，就是我再也不飞了，你知道吗？
And and the one that I gave myself, the the restriction I gave myself is I'd never fly again, you know?
然后我打破了它，我又飞了。
And I I broke it, and I fly again.
而且
And
你花了多少年才重新坐上飞机的？
How many years did it take you before you got on a plane again?
二十年。
Twenty.
我现在回想起来都觉得不可思议。
And I even think back to that.
我就想，二十年。
I'm like, twenty years.
这二十年，我一直被这件事压着，失去了太多。
I lost twenty years with this thing having power over me.
但它就像个怪物一样。
But it just it was like a monster.
它越来越大，我就觉得我得……
It kept getting bigger and bigger and I was like, I gotta
你得从概率的角度来看这件事。
Well, you gotta look at it like in terms of the odds.
你经历过空难幸存下来，那种概率简直是天文数字。
You survived a plane crash, which is the odds of that are astronomical.
你再遇到一次空难的概率非常低。
The odds of you getting in another plane crash are super low.
对。
Yeah.
我知道没人会这么想，因为恰恰相反，你亲身经历过，所以你知道那是什么感觉。
I know nobody thinks about it like that because it's the opposite because you've actually experienced it, so you know what it is.
就像，天哪。
Like, oh my god.
这真的有可能发生。
This is a real possibility.
对。
Yeah.
我现在能理解了，因为我22岁的儿子不太喜欢坐飞机，我总说，比如我们刚在犹他州的时候。
I can see that now because my my son who's 22, he doesn't love to fly, and I always say, like, we just were in Utah.
我坐了一趟飞机。
I took a flight.
你知道吗？
You know?
结果他最后开车去的。
He ended up driving.
我就跟他说，儿子，那危险多了。
And I was like, son, that's way more dangerous.
跟我一起飞吧。
Like, fly with me.
我绝不会让你坐我觉得不安全的飞机。
I'm never gonna put you on a plane that I think is unsafe.
我非常坚持要确保飞行员很棒，飞机也做过维护，等等这些。
I'm so adamant about making sure the pilot's great, the the planes had maintenance, whatever else.
你怎么检查这些东西？
How do you check all that stuff?
嗯，如果是坐私人飞机的话，你确实能确保飞机很好。
Well, just if we're flying private, you're you're able to, like, you know, really make sure it's a great plane.
有时候我们甚至会坐认识的人的飞机。
Sometimes even we'll fly on, like, someone's plane that we know.
所以那样我会觉得更安心。
So that makes me feel better.
但是，对，他就是开了十六个小时的车来回。
But, yeah, he just he just drove sixteen hours round trip.
我就说，儿子，那危险多了。
I was like, son, that's way more dangerous.
确实。
It is.
但是，对，我就是这么告诉自己的，我只能选择相信。
But, yeah, that's what they tell myself, and I just gotta have faith and
是的。
yeah.
二十年后的第一次坐飞机是什么感觉？
What was the first plane trip like after twenty years?
跟我之前想象的完全不一样。
It was nothing like I'd imagined it.
我跟老婆做了个约定，我就跟她说，嘿。
I I made a deal with my wife, and I just said, hey.
如果有什么地方我们去不了，因为她真的很厉害，兄弟。
If there's ever somewhere we can't go because she was a champ, man.
她跟我一起坐过巡演大巴。
She was she was on tour buses with me.
她什么都经历过。
She was on whatever.
就是，你知道，我们出去旅行的时候，她都会跟着，离得挺近的。
Just, you know, going kinda close by for trips that we'd go on.
我跟她说，如果有哪次旅行你想去，但我得坐飞机才能到，你就别提前告诉我，前一天晚上跟我说，我们第二天早上就走，我就去。
And I said, there's ever a trip that you want us to go on that I need to fly, just don't tell me and, tell me the night before and let's leave in the morning and I'm gonna do it.
所以事情就是这样，那次飞行非常棒。
So that's what it was and the flight was awesome.
它完全没有我多年来在脑子里编造的那些可怕的噩梦。而且，是的，我觉得我只是需要一次积极的经历来抵消上一次糟糕的经历。
It had contained none of the awful nightmares that I had fabricated in my head that it would be like over the years And, yeah, I I think I just needed a positive experience to cancel out the the last bad one that I had.
是的。
Yeah.
你知道吗？
You know?
是的。
Yeah.
那真的帮了很大的忙。
That that helped a lot.
而且我觉得我也逐渐接受了我离我的教子很近，他是我助理的儿子，在我的飞机失事中去世了，还有他的妈妈，蔡斯的妈妈。
And I think I think also coming to terms with being so close to my godson, who was my assistant's son who passed away in my plane crash, and and his mom and Chase mom.
而且知道我们之间没有怨恨，我感受到的幸存者内疚是我自己的。
And just knowing that that there was no there was no hard feelings and and the survivor's guilt I was feeling was was my own.
而且想想他们，如果角色互换，他们会希望我就这么坐着不再飞，还是让这件事控制我呢？
And to just think about them and if the roles were reversed, would they want me to really just sit around not flying again or have this thing have power over me?
或者如果我是他们，我会希望他们这样吗？
Or if I was in their shoes, would I want that for them?
当然不会。
Like, of course not.
对。
Yeah.
这是一种很少有人经历过的体验。
It's it's an experience that so few people ever have.
我是说，我无法想象那是什么感觉，尤其是失去朋友，还有撞击带来的创伤，整件事都留在脑海里。
I I mean, I can't imagine what it's like, especially losing your friends and just the the trauma of the actual impact, the whole thing just stuck in your head.
就是
It's
对。
yeah.
说实话，到现在我还是这样，我老婆坐飞机特别淡定。
I mean, to this day, I always like, my wife's a great flyer.
我的乐队成员们也都坐飞机没问题。
My band, they're all good flying.
你知道吗？
You know?
我觉得他们，我老婆，能想象一次旅行，计划一次旅行，想象它会有多棒，多酷，比如去攀岩或者别的什么。
I think they can my wife can probably envision a trip, plan a trip, envision how rad it's gonna be, how cool it's gonna be doing rock climbing or whatever we're gonna do.
而我在到达之前，满脑子想的都是，我能不能活着到那儿？
All I can think about until I get there is, like, am I gonna make it?
这会不会，你知道，我以前经历过一次，差点死了。
Is is this gonna you know, I did this once and I almost died.
所以，你知道，我会尽量去停止这种想法。
So, you know, I'd I'd just stop that pattern of thinking to the best of my ability.
虽然还是会有一点，但我还是很难订机票。
It still happens a little bit, but I still can't I have trouble booking planes.
我订机票的时候总会想到那些事。
I have trouble booking flights without thinking of those things.
你知道吗？
You know?
是的。
Yeah.
我能想象。
I can only imagine.
不过你能挺过来，克服它，还公开分享，这真的很棒，这样别人也能从中得到启发。是的。
Well, it's awesome that you got through it and got over it and did it publicly so that other people can get inspiration from that Yeah.
然后意识到，嘿。
And just realize like, hey.
也许对他们来说，是车祸或者公交车事故之类的。
May you know, maybe for them it was a car accident or a bus accident or whatever it is.
就是，你可以继续往前走。
Like, you can keep moving.
对。
Yeah.
确实。
For sure.
而且当时，你知道，AM AM 和我一起活了下来，然后他又活了一年，最后因吸毒过量去世了。
And I at the time, you know, AM AM survived with me, and then he lived for another year and passed away of a drug overdose.
但在我离开烧伤中心、大部分康复之后的那段时间里，很难找到像我这样在飞机失事中严重烧伤并且失去同伴的人。
But during that time where after I'd gotten out of the burn center and did most of my recovery, it was hard to find anyone who had been in a plane crash that was severely burnt, like, you know, and lost people.
有很多团体和很多人，比如为那些在飞机失事中失去亲人而悲痛的人提供支持系统。
There was a lot of there was a lot of groups and a lot of people that like support systems for people who had were grieving and lost someone in a plane crash.
你知道吗？
You know?
对。
Yeah.
所以我当时挺孤独的，只能自己摸索着去应对和解决。
So I I was kind of just lonely trying to navigate, figure it out.
就在最近，就在我纪录片出来前几天，有人一直艾特我，我看到了。
Just recently, just like a few days ago before my doc came out, someone kept tagging me and I saw it.
是一位叫Reva的年轻女士。
This is this young lady named Reva.
她也有类似的经历，她遭遇了飞机失事，身体百分之五十被烧伤，而且在事故中失去了母亲。
She had a similar experience where she was in a plane crash, fifty percent of her body was burnt, and she lost her mom in the plane crash.
我当时就想，这跟我太像了，我从来没遇到过哪怕稍微有点类似经历的人。
So I was like, this is really similar to me, and I've never met anyone that had even remotely kind of the same experience.
所以我把她接了过来，她出现在了我的首映礼上，那感觉真的很棒。
So I flew her out, and she was at my premiere, and it was just it was just cool.
我跟她说，你知道吗，我见到你和你见到我一样开心。
And I said, you know, it's it's just as cool for me to meet you as for you to meet me.
就像，我从来没见过或遇到过像你这样的人，你明白吗？
Like, this is I I don't I don't see anyone or meet anyone like you, you know?
对。
Yeah.
所以，是的，这真的很酷。
So, yeah, it's it's cool.
这真是一次很特别的人生经历。
That's a very cool human experience.
对。
Yeah.
你知道吗，就是跟别人分享，然后意识到你们都经历过很可怕的事情，但你们都挺过来了，然后……对。
You know, just share it with somebody and realize, like, you've both been through something pretty horrible, but you came out on the other side and Yeah.
在彼此身上找到安慰。
Find comfort in each other.
我觉得最接近这种感觉的，是我出事之后不久，有一次出去吃饭。
I think the closest thing that I came to that was right after my accident and I was out to dinner.
就是那个把飞机降落在河里的那个人。
The guy who flew the the plane and landed in the river.
嗯哼。
Uh-huh.
还记得那件事吗？
Remember that?
萨利？
Sully?
对。
Yeah.
他走过来跟我握了握手。
He came up and shook my hand at dinner.
他一句话都没说，但我当时就想，哇。
Didn't say a word to me, but I was like Oh, wow.
哦，那太棒了。
Oh, that's awesome.
你懂吗？
You know?
是的。
Yeah.
那个故事太疯狂了，简直离谱。
That's a bad That story is fucking crazy.
确实疯狂。
Crazy.
鸟。
Birds.
对。
Yeah.
鸟把飞机弄下来了。
Birds took the plane down.
对。
Yeah.
你会以为他们早就该搞清楚这件事了。
You would think they would have figured that out by now.
对。
Yeah.
最小的差错。
The smallest error.
对。
Yeah.
你知道吗？
You know?
太疯狂了。
It's insane.
对。
Yeah.
坐飞机是有点怪，但我宁愿坐飞机也不坐船。
Flying's weird, but I prefer it over the boat.
嗯。
Mhmm.
坐船那事儿，你得……
The boat thing in the You gotta
那就坐船吧。
do the boat one.
海洋。
Ocean.
去你的。
Fuck you.
玛丽皇后二号上可疯狂了，上面还有太平间呢。
Queen Mary two's a wild there's a morgue on there too.
什么？
What?
对。
Yeah.
船上大多数人都是八十岁的老头老太太，他们这辈子就坐一次跨大西洋的船。
Most people that are on there are 80 years old, and they're doing their one Transatlantic crossing.
所以有些人就死在那了？
And so some of them die?
很多。
A lot of them.
嗯，其实每次跨大西洋航行都有不少。因为我带着我的团队、我的助理和巡演经理一起在船上。
Well, there there's a lot of I think every Transatlantic crossing because I'm on there with my crew and my my assistant, my tour manager.
就像，是的。
It's like, yep.
有人去世了。
Someone passed.
你知道吗？
You know?
哇。
Wow.
所以
So
船上还有太平间。
A morgue on the boat.
船上有太平间。
A morgue on the boat.
这种事经常发生。
It happens so much.
太平间，还有监狱。
Morgue, a jail.
监狱？
A jail?
对。
Yeah.
确实有个监狱。
There's a jail.
玛丽皇后二号上有多少人？
How many people are on the Queen Mary two?
几千人。
Thousands.
哇。
Woah.
对。
Yeah.
我是说，如果有人在船上闹事，他们得，你知道，有警察的。
I mean, if someone pops off on the boat, they gotta you know, there's there's police.
这是真的。
It's legit.
这是真的。
It's legit.
哇。
Wow.
而且整个体验，他们几乎是在庆祝你经过泰坦尼克号沉没的地方。
And the whole experience, they they almost celebrate when you're crossing the Titanic where where the Titanic sits.
他们就像在船上播放那部电影一样。
They're they're, like, playing the movie on the ship.
他们正在广播通知。
They're announcing it.
感觉就是，这真的不一样。
Was like, this is this is just different.
对。
Yeah.
去他的。
Fuck that.
对。
Yeah.
天哪。
Oh my god.
但说实话，我会整天练习。
But it it was honestly, I would I would practice all day.
我会整天练习。
I would practice all day.
我会在船外面跑好几英里，绕着船跑。
I would run miles across the ship, just on the outside of the ship.
在船上也有很多很酷的时刻。
There's a lot of cool cool times on the boat as well.
嗯，我确定。
Well, I'm sure.
你知道，通常你是飞着去巡演的。
You know, you usually fly to tour.
你落地。
You land.
我现在就是这样，然后就像，去，我以前每天训练，打四个小时鼓，跑两个小时步。
That's what I do now, and it's like go, Where I would just train every day, play drums four hours a day, run two hours a day.
等我准备好，你知道，去我要去的地方的时候，我就觉得，我已经准备好巡演了。
By the time I got ready, you know, to where I was going, I'm like, I'm so ready for tour.
不管生活给我什么，我都能应付。
It's like whatever whatever life throws at me, I'm good.
真是难以置信，就连玛丽皇后二号横渡大西洋只要十天，那肯定比老船快多了。
It's just crazy that even the Queen Mary too getting across in ten days, that's gotta be like way faster than the old boats used to do it.
对吧？
Right?
我不知道。
I don't know.
老兄，你开得太慢了。
Dude, you're going so slow.
看起来就像没动一样。
Doesn't even look like you're moving.
有时候你会想，真的假的？
Sometimes you're like, are you serious?
十天里什么都看不见。
You don't see shit for ten days.
只有水。
Just water.
偶尔你会看到一些鸟，就知道快靠近陆地了，但除此之外，什么都没有。
Once in a while, you'll start seeing birds when you know you're getting close to land, but other than that, nothing.
你走过多少次那条路线？
How many times have you done that trip?
七次。
Seven.
对。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
哦，对。
Oh, yeah.
我觉得我肯定宁愿坐飞机。
I think I'd rather fly for sure.
我就是觉得，在海洋中间出点什么事，那太可怕了。
I it's just the idea of something going wrong in the middle of the ocean.
对。
Yeah.
我开始想这个问题了。
I I started to think about it.
你就完了。
You're fucked.
对。
Yeah.
你就完了。
You're fucked.
那里根本没有地方让直升机降落。
There's no place to land a helicopter on there.
别人怎么找到你呢？
How can someone even get to you?
那是在海上，离岸几千英里。
It's a middle it's thousands of miles out to sea.
对。
Yeah.
对我来说两个都很糟糕。
Both suck to me.
对吧？
Right?
坐飞机从天上掉下来，坠入海里，那很糟糕。
Falling out of the sky in a plane crashing into the ocean sucks.
坐大船沉下去，几千人拼命求生，那也很糟糕。
Also being sinking in a huge ship with thousands of people fending for their lives sucks.
我看了太多关于船的视频，比如他们在大浪中航行，那些浪看起来就像一栋楼朝他们扑过来。
I've just watched too many boat videos of, like, them navigating insane waves that look like like a building coming at them.
哥们，我经历过。
Dude, I was in it.
是吗？
Yeah?
对。
Yeah.
我们当时就在那艘船上。
We were in it.
我记得我们船上丢了几扇窗户，然后你基本上就被困在房间里，但房间很大，你只能看着船先往上冲，然后又猛地砸下去。
It think I think we had we lost a couple windows in the ship, and and you're basically confined to your room, but huge where you just see the boat go up and then it go crashing down.
而且你知道，你已经航行了四五天了，所以还在航程中间。
And you're, you know, you're four or five days into the trip, so you still got you're in the middle of your crossing.
那感觉怎么样？
What does that feel like?
很糟糕。
Sucks.
在一艘大船上，和几千人一起。
On a giant boat with thousands of people.
确实很糟糕。
Sucks.
船上一般网络都会断，你就在房间里看点什么。
The Internet goes out usually on the boat, and you're just watching something in your room.
就等着一切平静下来。
Just waiting for everything to get more calm.
那些浪有多大？
How big were these waves?
我觉得我们遇到了35英尺高的浪。
I think we were in 35 foot waves.
对。
Yeah.
像这样？
Like this?
是的。
Yes.
看起来就是这样。
Exact it looks exactly like that.
对。
Yeah.
这让我有点害怕，兄弟。
This freaks me out, man.
对。
Yeah.
这有点像那种……其实这还不算太糟。
It's like some when they this is not that bad.
你看船晃得多厉害。
Well, look how much the boat's moving.
这上面说，这是飓风级别的风。
This is hurricane force winds, it says.
对。
Yeah.
这就像那种风浪很大的天气。
That's like choppy weather.
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我是说，也有好的一面。
I mean, there's positives too.
有一次我们在邮轮上看到了北极光，那种景象我在别的地方从没见过，真的很美。
We saw the northern lights from our cruise one time, and it was like I've never seen it anywhere else, but it was beautiful.
挺酷的。
It was cool.
对。
Yeah.
我想去挪威或者类似的地方旅行，看看北极光。
I wanna make a trip to somewhere like Norway or wherever you could see it.
就像，这个这个。
Like, this this.
对。
Yeah.
这个……哦，我差点有一次也去了。
This is Oh, I almost did that one time.
我差点就坐货船了，不是客船，因为我当时在找去澳大利亚的办法。
I almost went on a not a passenger ship, but a a cargo ship because I was trying to find ways to get to Australia.
你当时打算去澳大利亚啊。
You were gonna go to Australia.
你知道是谁告诉我的吗？
You know who told me about it?
你知道还有谁不坐飞机，还跟我一起坐过两次玛丽皇后号吗？是KRS one。
You know who else doesn't fly and was on the Queen Mary twice with me was KRS one.
真的吗？
Really?
对。
Yep.
他说，Travis，我跟你一样。
And he we he was like, I'm right there with you, Travis.
我就问他，是不是发生了什么事，还是你只能坐船？
I was like, did something, you know, happen to you or why you're you're just confined to being on ships?
他说，没有。
He's like, nah.
我就是不喜欢坐飞机。
I just don't like flying.
所以他和他的家人，其实他告诉过我关于货船的事，因为有些地方没有真正的邮轮航线。
So him and his family actually he had told me about the cargo ship for some of the other places that didn't have actual cruises.
坐船去澳大利亚要多久？
How long is a boat ride to Australia?
哥们，一个月。
Dude, month.
我觉得要一个月。
I think it's a month.
不过我没去。
I mean, I never went.
我没去。
I never went.
坐飞机就已经够难受的了。
The plane flight is hard enough.
二十多个小时，或者差不多那么久。
Twenty something hours or whatever it is.
对。
Yeah.
去他的吧。
Fuck that.
不不不。
Uh-uh.
一个月？算了吧。
Fuck a month.
不行不行。
Mm-mm.
这真的让人不禁感叹，那些坐着独木舟就横渡大洋的人，冒险精神得多疯狂啊。
It just makes you really think about the insane adventure spirit of the people that just took off on canoes and made it across the ocean.
对。
Yeah.
我是说，那些独自划船到夏威夷的人，真是最疯狂的。
Mean, the wildest people that do it by themselves just here to Hawaii.
对。
Yeah.
这种人还挺多的。
There's a lot of those people.
对。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
我认识一个哥们儿，他就这么干过。
I know a dude who just did that.
但我是说，以前那些波利尼西亚人，那时候没有互联网，没有报纸，什么都没有，他们就是坐上船，就到了夏威夷。
But that's I mean, the the people back when there was no Internet, back when there was no newspapers or no nothing, like, the the Polynesian people, they just got on boats and made it to Hawaii.
太疯狂了。
Insane.
对。
Yeah.
比如说，你有没有什么备用计划？
Like, did you have what what was plan b?
对。
Yeah.
你知道，如果你在海上迷路了，你会怎么办？
What what's you know, what what do you do if you're out?
你从哪里弄到水？
How where are you getting water?
你怎么活下去？
How are you how are you staying alive?
对。
Yeah.
我觉得计划B就是让计划A行得通。
I think plan b is making plan a work.
这就是计划B。
That's the plan b.
根本没有计划。
There is no plan.
对。
Yeah.
但生活得有多糟糕，你才愿意上一条船，就盼着上岸时能有点吃的，对吧？
But how bad does life suck that you're willing to get in a boat and just hope there's some food Yeah.
你上岸的时候？
When you land?
而且他们也没有大船。
And they didn't have big boats either.
对。
Yeah.
那他们当时遇到的海浪得有多猛啊？
So what what the fuck were the waves like for them?
而且，那时候iPhone上也没有天气预报应用。
Also, no no weather app on the iPhone.
对。
Yeah.
你完全不知道接下来会发生什么。
You have no idea what's coming.
确实。
True.
完全不知道前面等着你的是什么，而且，你知道，你带着家人，划着船出海。
Zero idea what's waiting for you, and, you know, you're with your family, and you're paddling out there.
对。
Yeah.
就是那种未知，完全未知。
It's the un the unknown, absolute unknown.
那他们怎么回去呢，还是说就不回去了？
And then how do you get back, or do you?
还是说就认了，觉得这就是我们的归宿？
Or do you just say, well, this is where we are?
我是说，他们肯定花了几个月几个月的时间才到那里。
I mean, it must have taken months and months and months to get out there.
他们是怎么活下来的？
I mean, how do they stay alive?
人类的聪明才智，还有那种在极限环境下生存和繁衍的能力，真的挺不可思议的。
Like, human ingenuity, like, people's ability to thrive and survive is pretty insane when pushed to the limits.
对。
Yeah.
比如，我有个朋友，他一年里有半年都在禁食。
Like, people I have a friend who who fasts half of the year.
他只喝果汁和水。
He's just drinking juice and water.
六个月？
For six months?
一年一百六十天。
Hundred and sixty days a year.
他每年都这样。
He does it every year.
怎么做到的？
How?
他是一位厨师，伊多。
He's he's chef ido.
他是一位厨师。
A he's a chef.
实际上，他是一位三十年前立下沉默誓言的厨师。
He's actually a a chef that took a vow of silence thirty years ago.
他是一位植物性生食厨师，而且一年中有半年不进食。
A a plant based raw chef, and for half of the year, he doesn't eat.
他就是只禁食。
He just fasts.
而且这更多是出于健康原因，比如排毒、预防疾病之类的。
And it's more for, like, health reasons, like cleansing and and to prevent disease, whatever else.
但他会变得很瘦，然后下半年又恢复正常体重。
But he gets really thin and then just goes back to his normal weight the second half of the year.
我不知道这样好不好。
I don't know if that's good.
我也不知道。
I don't know either.
但是……
But
谁告诉我们的？
Who told us that?
他每年都这样。
He does it year.
他可能甚至都不确定这是不是好事。
He might not even he might it might not even be good or so.
他就是这么做的。
He just does these things.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得不是。
Don't think it is.
半年都在禁食。
Half of the year fasting.
我觉得这不好。
I don't think it's good.
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但我真没法想象连续六个月只喝果汁会对身体好。
But I can't imagine that just eating nothing but juice for six months is good for you.
对。
Yeah.
我连手术前禁食一天都觉得很难熬，你知道吗？
I have a hard enough time fasting a day before surgery or something, you know?
嗯，这完全取决于你身体是否摄入了大量碳水化合物。
Well, it's all dependent upon whether or not your body's eating a lot of carbohydrates or not.
对。
Yeah.
如果你在吃生酮饮食，那就容易多了。
If you're on a ketogenic diet, it's a lot easier.
你的身体会立刻开始燃烧脂肪，食欲也不会那么强。
Your body just immediately goes to burning fat and your your appetite is not as strong.
那种吸引力，那种重力感，不会那么强烈。
It's not as as insane a pull, the gravity of it.
但我实在想不通，为什么要那样做。
But I I can't even imagine why you would do that.
断食六个月。
Fast for six months.
比如，我觉得有很多数据表明，断食三天、五天之类的，对身体有好处，能引发自噬，让身体清除坏细胞。
Like, I think there's a lot of data that shows that fasting for three days and five days and things along those lines is good, causes autophagy, makes your body clean out bad cells.
这对正在康复或正在经历癌症的人非常有益。
It's very good for people that are recovering from cancer or going through cancer.
很多医生首先会告诉你这个。
It's one of the first things a lot of doctors tell you.
采用生酮饮食并断食，因为癌细胞需要葡萄糖。
Get on a ketogenic diet and fast because cancer cells want glucose.
它们靠这个存活，而你就把它们饿死了。
That's what they want to survive, and you starve them.
而且当你的身体处于碳水化合物状态时，你仍然是以植物为基础的饮食。
And when your body's, like, on a carbohydrate you're still on a plant based diet.
对。
Mhmm.
所以你的身体大部分时间都在消耗碳水化合物。
So your body's eating mostly carbohydrates all the time.
所以你得时不时地补充能量。
So you get you have to kinda refuel all the time.
身体会习惯这种模式。
It gets used to it.
所以像你这样的人有一天不吃饭，那种对碳水化合物的渴望，就像胰岛素大量分泌一样。
So when someone like you takes a day off of food, it's like the pull of the carbohydrates, like the insulin dump.
那感觉非常强烈。
It's a lot.
对。
Yeah.
不过，我吃了很多蛋白质。
I mean, I eat so much protein, though.
我从扁豆里获取大量蛋白质，多得离谱，还有豆类，都是天然食物，不是那种仿肉制品。
I get so much protein from lentils, like an insane amount of protein from lentils, beans, all the natural stuff, not like mock meats.
明白。
Mhmm.
所以我每次做血液检查，蛋白质指标都特别好。
So, like all all my blood work that I do, my protein is top notch.
那太棒了。
Well, that's awesome.
是的。
Yeah.
不过我也搞明白了。
I figured it out though too.
就是说，有很多吃肉的人吃垃圾食品，也有很多吃素的吃垃圾食品。
Like, there's a lot of mean, I there's a lot of junk food meat eaters, a lot of junk food vegans.
关键是要把自己的饮食调整好。
It's about dialing your shit in.
你懂我的意思吧？
You know what I mean?
然后找到适合自己的方式。
And figuring it out.
但就算是你，在烧伤恢复期间，你也开始吃肉了。
But even you, when you were recovering from your burns, you started eating meat.
那是因为当时医院里的医生都很老派，他们在我住院的时候，嗯，就是那样。
Well, because I had doctors that were super old school in the in the in the hospital with me Mhmm.
他们发现我不吃东西，因为他们想给我喂一堆肉，还往我喉咙里插了根管子。
That figured out I wasn't eating because they were trying to feed me a bunch of meat, and they stuck a hose down my throat.
那感觉太难受了。
And that just sucked.
所以
So
他们把管子插进你喉咙里了。
They stuck a hose down your throat.
对。
Mhmm.
就是为了那样喂你，因为我当时其实偷偷吃我想吃的，但没吃多少肉，因为我跟他们说了，嘿。
To, like, feed you like that because I was, like, secretly just eating kinda like what I wanted, but not eating a bunch of the meat because I told them, hey.
我其实不太吃肉。
I don't I don't really eat meat.
所以沟通上出了点问题，他们就直接把管子插进我喉咙里，那样喂我。
So there was, like, a miscommunication where they just put a a hose down my throat and were were feeding me like that.
然后那段时间，我的一个护士特别好，他开始给我做一袋袋牛肉干。
And then during that time, my my one of my nurses was super cool, and he started making me bags of beef jerky.
所以我在医院里吃牛肉干，来获取他们希望我摄入的蛋白质，然后再喝一杯花生酱冰沙，那是什么来着？
So I would eat beef jerky in the hospital to get whatever protein that they wanted me to have, and then down a peanut butter blast smoothie from what is that?
那是Robux还是什么类似的东西？
Is that Robux or something like that?
就是那种，有3000卡路里。
Like one of those and it's 3,000 calories.
所以我平均下来。
So I was I was averaging.
我基本上每天需要摄入6000到7000卡路里。哇。
I I basically had a I had a six to 7,000 calorie diet I needed to hit every day Wow.
才能恢复。
In order to heal.
因为我在六个月内做了30次手术，所以就是尽量吃够。
Because I I just had 30 surgeries in six months, so it was just just trying to to get enough.
六个月里被麻醉30次，对身体来说真的很难受。
Just just 30 times being anesthetized for six months is fucking hard on your body.
是的。
Yeah.
我当时整个人都迷迷糊糊的。
It was I was so out of it.
直到快结束的时候我才真正明白过来。
I didn't really know until towards the end.
你知道吗？
You know?
不过，是的。
But but yeah.
天哪，老兄。
Jeez, man.
你有没有试过用高压氧舱？
Did you ever try using a hyperbaric chamber?
我没办法用，因为，你知道，我最好的朋友，就是和我一起出车祸的那个，AM，他，他大概有百分之六的皮肤被烧伤了。
I couldn't do it after you know, my my my my best friend that was in the the accident with me, AM, he was he was a I think six percent of his body was burnt.
他进了高压氧舱，我记得他后脑勺上有一小块植皮。
And he went in the hyperbaric, and I think he had a a small graft on the back of his head.
他一个半星期就出院了，但我全身百分之七十烧伤，所以不管我怎么努力，都不可能离开医院。
He was out of the hospital a week and a half, but I had seventy percent of my body burnt, so there was no way I was getting out of the hospital no matter how much I did it or didn't do it.
我试过做高压氧治疗，但事故之后我状态特别差，经历了那么多创伤，失去了最好的朋友，我的反应和亚当完全不同，我根本没法进那个小舱。
I tried doing it, and I was just in such a awful place after my my accident where I was I had so much trauma with, like, losing my my best friends, and I was I was definitely my reaction was much different than than Adam's, and I couldn't I couldn't go on the small tube.
完全不行。
There's there was no way.
我觉得那时候，它让我太想起飞机内部了。
I think at the time, it reminded me too much of the inside of the plane.
真的吗？
Really?
是的。
Yeah.
我就是觉得特别幽闭恐惧，而且我当时也特别难受。
I just felt really claustrophobic, and and I was also having a hell of a time.
AM当时是清醒的。
AM was sober.
出事的时候他已经戒酒戒毒十五年了。
Sober for fifteen years when it happened.
我飞机失事前，其实是个瘾君子。
I was I was a drug addict, you know, before my plane crash.
你想想，一个靠药物自我麻痹的人，经历三十次手术，给一堆止痛药，结果还不管用。
And you take a a person who's self medicating, put them through 30 surgeries, give them a bunch of pain meds, and they're not working.
对。
Mhmm.
那就是我。
That was me.
所以我每次手术都会醒过来，尖叫着，对医生又打又踢。
So I was waking up every surgery, screaming, swinging on doctors
天哪。
Oh, jeez.
完全像个疯子，直到他们慢慢给我停药。
A complete madman, you know, until until they weaned me off.
等我离开那里的时候，我再也不想往身体里放任何东西了，而且我和所有医生都关系很好，包括烧伤中心的格罗斯曼医生，就是格罗斯曼烧伤中心。
By the by the time I got out of there, I was I never wanted to put anything in my body again and had a great relationship with all my doctors and doctor Grossman, who owns the burn center, the Grossman Burn Center.
是的。
It was yeah.
这算是圆满了。
It was full circle.
但用这种方式戒掉毒瘾，真是够疯狂的。
But that's a crazy trial by fire to get off drugs.
对。
Yeah.
那就是我的康复过程。
That was my that was my that was my rehab.
哇。
Wow.
嗯。
Mhmm.
妈的，老兄。
Fuck, dude.
那肯定得是——我是说，你被困在床上，动弹不得，他们给你止痛药，你要经历30次手术，你身体70%被烧伤，你的朋友刚去世，而你一个人在这家医院里。
That has to be I mean, you're confined to a bed, you're stuck, they're giving you pain medications, you're going through 30 surgeries, you have seventy percent of your body burnt, your friends just died, and you're in this hospital by yourself.
真是当头一棒。
Huge wake up call.
你脑子里得经历多么疯狂的折腾啊。
What a fucking what a wild ride your mind must have been going through.
对。
Yeah.
你知道，我当时是演出完回家。
It's you know, I was coming home from a show.
我是演出完回家，然后，对，谁会想到你从演出回来坐飞机，结果会在烧伤中心待六个月。
I was coming home from a gig, and, yeah, who who would think you'd get in get in a plane coming home from a show, you're gonna end up in a burn center for six months.
你知道吗？
You know?
四个人没了，你身上百分之七十都烧伤了。
Four people are gone, and seventy percent of your body's burnt.
这需要一点时间来消化。
Takes a minute to process.
你知道吗？
You know?
为什么他们
Why did they
觉得你再也打不了鼓了？
think you were never gonna be able to play the drums again?
嗯，有一段时间他们打算截掉我的脚，因为他们觉得没有足够的皮肤来愈合我的脚或者保住它。
Well, there was a point where they were gonna amputate my foot because they didn't think they could they could they they had enough skin left to to heal my foot or save it.
而且因为我身上烧伤面积太大，他们也不确定我能不能挺过来。
And then because of the amount of burns I had over my body, they weren't they weren't positive I was even gonna make it.
所以一旦他们知道我脱离危险，能活下来，他们就说，你知道，我手上的神经都乱套了。
So it was like once they knew I was out of critical condition and I was gonna make it, they were, you know, all my nerves were messed up in my hands.
比如，我的两只手的尺神经都受损了。
Like, my ulnar nerve was shot in both hands.
我的手当时是麻木的。
My hands were numb.
很多事情都是未知的。
There was a lot of it's just the unknown.
你知道吗？
You know?
我能想象得到。
I can only imagine.
我觉得很遗憾你不能用高压氧舱，因为它确实能加速愈合。
I think, it sucks that you couldn't use the hyperbaric because it definitely accelerates healing.
对。
Yeah.
即使现在，我有时候还会去用一下。
Even now, I I go in I go in sometimes now.
洛杉矶有个高压氧舱，能坐两个人，对我来说正合适。
There's a hyperbaric in Los Angeles that seats two people, and that's perfect for me.
我可以在里面待上两个小时，完全没问题。
It's just like I could stay in there for two hours and I'm fine.
你只是不喜欢密闭空间吗？
It's just a confined space thing for you?
对。
Yeah.
我就是不太喜欢待在密闭空间里。
I just don't love being in confined spaces.
是的。
Yeah.
我也不太喜欢，
I don't love it
不过
either, but
我会去做的。
I do it.
对。
Yeah.
但我从来没经历过那种
But it's I've never been through what
你经历的那种心理折磨吧？
you've mind fuck is?
最让人抓狂的是减压需要的时间。
Is the the time it takes to depressurize it.
所以就算你说，好吧，
So even if you're like, okay.
我结束了。
I'm done.
他们还得花七八分钟来减压，我觉得这就是为什么我觉得双人舱更舒服。
They're like, seven minutes, eight minutes, whatever, while we depressurize it, I think that's that's why I just feel better in the two seater.
对。
Yeah.
有道理。
That makes sense.
对。
Yeah.
天哪，老兄。
Fuck, dude.
那现在你拍这个纪录片的时候，是不是会重新经历所有这些事情？
What now when you're doing this documentary, are you does it relive all this stuff for you?
每次都是。
Every time.
是的。
Yeah.
我很高兴能和你一起做这个，因为我想，我要和乔聊聊那些打斗的事。
I was so excited to come on on this with you because I'm like, I'm gonna talk fights with Joe.
我什么都聊。
I'm gonna talk whatever.
聊车。
Cars.
什么？
What
我们可以聊那个，兄弟。
We could do that, man.
有些采访，我是说，都挺好的，但说实话，我觉得，虽然我不确定为什么，但可能从小时候开始，你知道，我13岁就没了妈妈。
Some of some of them have been I mean, they've all been great, but I mean, to tell the truth, I think since I'm not sure why, but maybe since I was a kid, you know, I lost my mom at a young age, like 13.
比如，一个陌生人走到我面前说，哥们，我刚失去了爸爸，我可能就会哭出来，因为这事对我太敏感了。
Like, I could a stranger could come up to me outside this place and be like, dude, I just lost my dad, and I'd probably start balling because it's sensitive to me.
它会触动我内心的某个点。
It, like, triggers something to me.
所以，是的，聊到纪录片里某些部分，就像用刀割我一样难受。
So, yeah, it's like talking about certain parts of the doc is like gutting me with a knife.
你知道吗？
You know?
你有没有纠结过，要不要继续做这件事，重新经历那些事情？
Were you conflicted as to whether or not you wanted to go through with this and relive all that stuff?
我觉得我早就已经放下了。
I I think I was already far past it.
其实已经到那种程度了，我的纪录片2017年就拍完了，但我觉得没有结局。
It was it was it was to the point where my doc was done in 2017, but I'm like, there's no ending.
这个结局太糟糕了。
The ending sucks.
我连飞机都不敢看。
I won't look at a plane.
我什么都不想做。
I won't do anything.
然后快进到现在，你知道，那就是他们梦寐以求的结局。
And then fast forward, you know, that was their dream ending.
就盯着那该死的飞机看。
Just stare at a fucking plane for me.
对吧？
Right?
然后我就想，不。
And I'm like, nah.
你知道吗？
You know?
所以后来到了2024年或者2025年我坐飞机的时候，我就想，嘿，我飞了。
So and then fast forward to now 2024 or whatever it was when I flew or 2025, it was like, yo, I fly.
我又飞了。
I fly again.
我的孩子们也飞。
My kids fly.
我结婚了。
I'm married.
有太多事情都变了，这让我下定决心把它完成，因为现在终于看到了隧道尽头的光。
There like, so many things have changed, and that kinda triggered me to finish it because there was a a huge light at the end of the tunnel now.
对吧？
Right?
就像是，是的。
It was like Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
有件事困扰了我二十年，但我又飞起来了。
I had this thing that had power for me for twenty years, but I fly again.
而且我觉得纪录片里其他部分，比如我小时候和爸爸关系很紧张，后来变得特别好，他现在就像我最好的朋友。
And and and I I think the other parts of the doc, like, an amazing, like, rough relationship with my dad when when I was younger turned into something, like, beautiful where he's, like, my best friend.
哇，那真是太棒了。
Well, that's awesome.
我可不是含着金汤匙出生的。
I wasn't I wasn't born with a silver spoon in my mouth.
我长大的时候，你知道，家里连热水都没有。
I grew up, you know, not we didn't even have, like, running hot water in my house.
所以并不是说我爸在音乐圈，我妈是经纪人。
So it wasn't like my dad was in the music industry, and my mom was an agent.
完全不是。
It was like, no.
我当时根本不知道该怎么离开我长大的地方，就是每天拼命练琴，我特别执着。
I fucking didn't know how I was gonna get out of where I where I grew up, and just played every day, I was relentless.
我加入了所有乐队，跟所有人合作，每天练两到五个小时。
And I joined every band, and I played with everyone, and I practiced two to five hours a day.
你知道吗？
You know?
所以，哪怕只是给某个孩子一点希望，让他知道他也能做到同样的事，这也是我纪录片里很重要的一部分，我觉得能帮到很多人。
So just even giving some kid hope knowing that he can do the same thing was was like a a big part of my documentary that I felt like could help a lot of people.
当然。
For sure.
然后看到我被击倒，又不得不一次次爬起来继续战斗，当那些糟糕的事情发生在我身上时，看着它们让我变得越来越强大，越来越坚不可摧。
And then just to see me get knocked down and and just have to fight, you know, over and over again when fucked up things happen to me and just watching me have these things just make me stronger and stronger and unbreakable.
我觉得这就是韧性。
I think that's the resilience.
我觉得这是值得大家看到的。
I think that that that is something for for people to see.
妈的，
Fuck,
对。
yeah.
对。
Yeah.
这里面有两个很好的信息。
There's two great messages in there.
最重要的是，你可以克服困难，无论事情有多糟糕，只要你继续前进，保持积极，做正确的事，相信这个过程，最终你会变得更好。
The big one is that you can overcome, that no matter how fucked up things are, if you keep going and if you keep you stay positive, you do the right thing, you trust the process, at the end of it, you'll come out better.
对。
Yeah.
而且成功的公式都是一样的。
And then your the formula for success is the same formula.
几乎每个在某方面特别厉害的人都是这样。
Almost everyone has that is really awesome at something.
变得痴迷，变得有动力，把所有的精力都投入进去，最后你会变得更好。
Become obsessed, become driven, and just throw everything you have in that thing, and you come out better.
是的。
And Yeah.
你最终会到达你想去的地方，或者到达你现在的位置。
You you eventually get to where you wanna be or get to where you are.
这是一个不可否认的公式。
It's it's it's an undeniable formula.
对。
Yeah.
孩子们需要听到这些，尤其是现在这个世界里的孩子，大家都觉得什么东西都来得快，人人都想要那种，你知道的，就是那种抖音心态，人人都想靠一颗药丸减肥，人人都想要，其实过程才是最重要的，就是要变得对过程着迷、爱上这个过程。
And kids need to hear that, especially kids in this world where everybody thinks everything comes quick and everybody wants a you know, it's a TikTok mindset, and everybody wants a pill to lose weight, and everyone wants it's all the process is the most important thing and just get become becoming obsessed and in love with the process.
对。
Yeah.
而且很多人，我不知道怎么说，就是，现在的人没什么平衡感。
And and so many people, I don't know, like, there's not a lot of balance.
对吧？
Right?
就像，我现在找到了更多的平衡，但以前不是这样的。
Like, I've I've found more balance now, but it's like, no.
你必须得他妈的痴迷，你必须得坚持不懈，当你的哥们都在外面玩的时候，你应该在练习。
You've gotta be fucking obsessed, and you gotta be relentless, and you gotta, while all your homies are out doing whatever, you should be practicing.
你懂我的意思吗？
You know what I mean?
你必须自律。
You gotta be disciplined.
比如说，我父母对我特别严格。
Like, I'm so you know, my parents were they were they were really strict with me.
就是说，如果你想玩滑板，想骑小轮车，或者跟朋友出去瞎混，那不行，你得先练三个小时的鼓。
Like, yo, if you wanna go skateboarding, you wanna go ride BMX bikes, go whatever, fuck off with your friends, you gotta go play drums for three hours.
哇。
Wow.
我特别感激他们这么做。
I'm so thankful they did that.
你能想象如果他们没这么做会怎样吗？
Can you imagine if they didn't, you know?
因为在我的纪录片里还有一件事，就是每次我妈去世的时候，我会做什么？
Because the one thing also in my doc is like every time, like, my mom dies, what do I do?
我就会全身心投入到音乐和打鼓中。
I I just throw myself into music and drumming.
就是痴迷于打鼓。
Like obsessed with drumming.
你知道吗？
You know?
参加军乐队、管弦乐队、爵士乐队。
Join marching band, orchestra, jazz band.
你知道吗？
You know?
就是真的把打鼓当成吃饭、睡觉、呼吸一样。
Like just literally eat, sleep, and breathe it.
我出车祸之后也是一样。
Same thing after my accident.
我做了什么？
What did I do?
我回到家那天，浑身都是伤疤，就在外面拼命打鼓，因为那是我唯一熟悉的东西。
The day I got home, I'm outside with scabs all over my body and I'm playing the fucking drums because it's like what I know.
而且我觉得，即使那些孩子不用经历我遇到的那些事，当你擅长某件事时，它也会给你自信。
And also I think for kids even that don't have to hopefully endure anything I encountered, like it gives you confidence when you're good at something.
就像，我也不太清楚。
It's like when I don't know.
任何事情，我觉得当孩子被欺负或者遇到其他事的时候，如果你擅长某件事，你就会想，去你的。
Anything, I think when kids bully you and whatever else, if you're good at something, you're like, fuck you.
比如，我知道我足球踢得很好。
Like, I know I'm really good at football.
我柔术也很厉害。
I'm really good at jujitsu.
我吉他弹得很好。
I'm really good at guitar.
我觉得这真的能给你百分之百的信心。
I feel like it just gives you confidence A 100%.
而且能帮你更好地应对生活。
And helps you just kinda navigate through life better.
对。
Yeah.
你知道吗？
You know?
它是帮助你成长为一个更好的人的工具。
It's a vehicle for developing you as a human being.
完全同意。
Totally.
不管是什么，无论是艺术、音乐、文学，还是你正在做的写作，或者其他什么，是的。
Whatever it is, whether it's art, whether it's music, whether it's literature, whatever you're doing, writing, whatever you're doing Yeah.
不管是木工还是什么。
Whatever carpentry, whatever it is.
只要对一件事着迷，不断进步，你就会发现，好吧。
Just become obsessed with a thing, get better at it, and you realize that, okay.
我明白了，凡事都有个过程。
I there's a process.
我可以把事情做得更好。
I can get better at things.
我是有价值的。
I'm valuable.
我、我能做点事情。
I'm I'm I can do something.
对。
Yeah.
我不是个懒散的废物。
I'm not just a lazy sack of shit.
问题是大众不是那样的。
The problem is the masses aren't like that.
对吧？
Right?
所以，有时候你这样会觉得孤独，但，是的，我觉得你有没有读过蒂姆·格罗弗的《永不停歇》？
So, like, sometimes you feel lonely being like that, but, yeah, I feel like have you ever read relentless by Tim Grover?
没有。
No.
太牛了。
It's fuck.
这是我的圣经，不过我刚在洛杉矶首映，他介绍了我拍的纪录片。
It's my bible, but I just had my premiere in LA and he introduced my doc.
那是什么？
What is it?
就是一本讲三种人的书，他基本上说的是做冷却者、终结者还是清洁工。
It's it's it's a book and he basically talks about being a cooler, closer, or a cleaner.
你懂吧？
You know?
清洁工就是像你和我这样对事情特别执着的人。
And like cleaners are are like people like you and I that are obsessed with shit.
就算我们今天拿了格莱美，也不会接下来一周都去庆祝。
If we won a Grammy today, we're not gonna party for the next week.
我们会想，接下来干什么？
We're like, what's next?
接下来做什么？
What's next?
我们在度假，还在练习，而且不觉得有什么不好。
We're on vacation and we're practicing and we're not feeling bad about it.
这是一种心态，不是很多人都有，甚至有时候会让你觉得自己做错了什么，因为你太痴迷于某件事了。
It's just it's it's a mindset that not a lot of people have and that almost make you feel like you're doing something wrong because you're so obsessed with something.
对。
Yeah.
嗯，别人会让你觉得你有问题。
Well, people will make you feel like there's something wrong with you.
哦，是的。
Oh, yeah.
比如，我花了一段时间才明白。
Like, and I've and it took me a while.
说实话，读完他的书之后，我就觉得，哦，我不是一个人。
Honestly, after I read his book, I'm like, oh, I'm not alone.
有一大堆像我这样的疯子，我就是特别爱打鼓。
There's a bunch of fucking psychopaths like me that just I love the fucking drums.
我喜欢做音乐。
I love to make music.
我可以在录音室里待上二十五个小时。
I could stay in the studio for twenty five hours.
你知道吗？
You know?
而且我不会觉得累，反而觉得很有活力，很治愈。
And and I don't feel burnt out, and it makes me feel alive, and it's therapeutic.
而且我从来不会满足于现状。
And I always I'm never content with where I'm at.
我总知道自己还有成长的空间。
I always know I have room to grow.
我知道自己还有可以进步的地方。
I know there's things I can get better at.
对。
Yeah.
然后还有，你知道，有些人就是很满足于现状，觉得自己不会再进步了。
There's and then there's, like, you know, there's people that are very content just being like, I'm not gonna get any better.
我就觉得我现在这样挺好的。
I'm just I'm cool with where I'm at.
我知道这对我来说已经是巅峰了。
I know this is kind of peak level for me.
我永远不会有这种想法。
I can never think like that.
对。
Yeah.
我觉得，这大概就是必然的吧。
I mean, I guess that's just how it has to be.
为了有出类拔萃的人，总会有一些人，不管什么原因，就是不会坚持到底，不会去做他们真正想做的事。
In order for there to be outliers, there there's always going to be people that just whatever for whatever reason, never follow through, never do what they really wanna do.
你知道吗，梭罗那句话怎么说来着，那个梭罗的名言，大多数人过着平静绝望的生活。
You know, what is that Thoreau comment, the Thoreau quote, most men live lives of quiet desperation.
这种情况挺多的。
There's a lot of that.
有很多人，他们希望自己有精力、有灵感、有自律，或者别的什么，去做他们想做的事，站起来，去做一些真正能带给他们快乐、让他们兴奋、让他们感到满足的事情，真正点燃他们内心的创造之火，那种当你完成一件事的时候，你会说，靠。
There's a lot of people that wish they wish they had the energy or the inspiration or the discipline or whatever it is to do the thing that they want to do, to get up and just to do something that really brings them joy, really brings them excitement, really makes them feel fulfilled, really, like, ignites that creative fire inside of them that where you do something and it's done, you're like, fuck.
对。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
有很多人从来没体验过那种“靠”的感觉。
There's a lot of people that never experience fuck.
对。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
这日子过得挺苦的。
It's a rough life.
我觉得这就是人生的旅程。
I feel like that's the journey.
找到那个东西。
Find that.
你懂吗？
You know?
对，就是这样。
Like Yeah.
或者像那句话说的，找到你热爱的事情，然后想办法靠它赚钱。
Or like that quote, find something you love and figure out a way to get paid for it.
这确实很棒。
Like, that's the that's great.
但我觉得，尤其是出了那次事故之后，类似这样的话就特别有感触。
But I think, yeah, things like that have just especially after my accident.
我就觉得，哇。
I'm like, yo.
人生苦短。
Life is short.
就是
There's
而且随时都可能结束。
And it can go at any time.
对，随时都可能。
Oh, it can go anytime.
我学到了，我学到了。
I've I've I've learned.
我一次又一次地被现实打脸。
I've been smacked in the face over and over again.
你知道吗？
You know?
对。
Yeah.
而且我总是觉得，记得有个人叫哈里·香农，他对我戒酒帮助很大，或者说在我出事前尝试戒酒时帮了我很多，后来我戒掉了。他说，你知道吗，我得问问男人们，如果你现在死了，你希望人们记住的是你现在的样子吗？
And just always feeling like remember, there's this guy named Harry Shannon that was, like, very instrumental in helping me get sober or me trying to get sober before my accident when I got sober, and he's like, you know, I have to ask men, like, if you died right now, would you be the man you'd want people to remember you by?
我就想，我得达到那个状态。
And I'm like, I need to get to that place.
你知道吗？
Do you know?
那就是我想待的地方。
That that's just where I wanna sit.
那就是我想生活的地方。
That's where I wanna live.
对。
Yeah.
你知道吗？
You know?
我总是告诉人们，要像有纪录片摄制组跟着你一样生活，你在做很了不起的事情。
Well, I always tell tell people, live your life as if there's a documentary crew following you around, and you're doing something awesome.
比如，如果你想受到某人的启发，看一部关于某个人的纪录片，那个人让你觉得，哇。
Like, if you wanted to be inspired by somebody and watch a documentary on somebody doing some just someone who's like, wow.
那家伙真拼啊。
That fucking dude's getting after it.
对。
Yeah.
在现实生活中也要成为那样的人。
Be that person in real life.
我还经常告诉人们，成为你试图吸引别人时假装的那个人。
The other thing I always tell people, become the person you pretend to be when you're trying to get laid.
这太有意思了。
It's so funny.
或者你在网上假装的那个人。
Or who you're pretending to be on the Internet
或者社交媒体上。
or social media.
就真的成为那个人。
Just actually become that person.
这比假装容易多了，对。
It's so much easier Yeah.
因为显然有人就是那样的人。
Than pretending because there's obviously someone that's like that.
所以我们才理解那种典型形象。
That's why we understand the archetype.
所以我们才理解那种非常出色的人。
That's why we understand, like, this very exceptional person.
所以，成为那样的人吧。
So become that person.
对。
Yeah.
你可以做到的。
You could do it.
任何人都能做到。
Anybody could do it.
我们都会改变和成长。
We all change and grow.
我觉得像你这样分享自己的故事特别重要，因为有很多年轻人，他们生活中没有像你这样的人，他们能看到你，能跟你产生共鸣，这会给他们动力。
And that's what's I think really important about people like you telling your story is that there's a lot of young people out there that don't have anybody like you in their life and they can see it and relate to you and under and it gives them fuel.
你的故事，还有你充满热情地谈论事情，真的能改变一个年轻人的一生。
It it can your story and just you talking about things passionately can change a young person's life.
可能有个年轻女孩或年轻男孩，听到你的故事，就会迈出一步，走上正确的方向，做出改变。
There's a young girl or a young guy out there that can hear you and that just your story makes them take a step, makes them go in the right direction, makes them make a move to something.
我们都需要从别人那里得到一些东西。
We all need something from other people.
我们靠别人的能量来滋养自己。
We feed off of other people's energy.
对。
Yeah.
我也有这种感觉。
I I feel that.
就像人们第一次看到大卫·戈金斯的时候，你会想，哦，我要开始努力了。
Like, it's like when people see David Goggins for the first time and you're like, oh, I'm gonna get after it.
我要开始，你懂我的意思吗？
I'm gonna get you know what I mean?
这很重要。
Like, that's important.
对。
Yeah.
我之前不知道。
And I didn't know.
我说，你知道，我的纪录片我已经看了十五到二十遍了，前几天在首映礼上我又看了一遍，我强忍着眼泪，心里想，天哪。
I I said, you know, I've watched my doc, like, fifteen, twenty times now, and I just I even watched it the other day at the premiere, and I'm, like, holding back tears, and I'm, like, fuck.
这太沉重了。
It's so heavy.
你知道吗？
You know?
但大家的反应就是，哇。
But just the reaction from everyone is, like, yo.
那改变了我的生活。
That changed my life.
我简直无法再用同样的眼光看待生活了。
Like, I can't look at life the same.
我觉得，如果要说的话，那就是——对。
And I'm, like, if anything, that's Yeah.
我喜欢这样。
I love that.
是的。
Yeah.
你知道吗？
You know?
我们都需要那个。
We all need that.
我不想发布一些帮不到别人的东西。哦，还有，虽然不是我拍的纪录片，但有人愿意和我一起做这个纪录片，我感到很荣幸，也很受宠若惊。
I hate to put out oh, also, it's not like I made my own documentary, but I was honored and flattered someone wanted to do this documentary with me, but, like, hate to put out something that doesn't help people.
对。
Right.
你知道吗？
You know?
对。
Right.
这水是这边的吗？
Is this water right here?
是的。
Yeah.
对。
Yeah.
你面前就有一个玻璃杯。
There's a glass right in front
就在你面前。
of you.
看到了吧，这就对了。
Is there there you go.
我跑的那个地方叫什么来着？
I ran what is it called?
奥斯汀湖？
Lake Austin?
嗯哼。
Uh-huh.
是莱迪伯德湖。
Ladybird.
我今天去跑了。
I ran it today.
对。
Yeah.
太棒了。
It's dope.
真不错。
So nice.
是不是很美？
Isn't it beautiful?
太美了。
So beautiful.
这地方真好。
This is such a great place.
如果我住这儿，我肯定天天去那儿跑，而且好多人在那儿跑步。
If I lived here, I would be out there every day and tons of people running.
我知道。
I know.
所以这里
So There's
这个镇上有很多健康的人。
a lot of healthy people in this town.
我本来没想跑，就打算起来走走。
And I I didn't my goal was to just wake up and walk.
我去了一家不错的浓缩咖啡店，喝了杯拿铁，然后我穿着长裤，运动短裤，剪短的卫裤，上面写着“自杀倾向”，还穿着高筒袜，普通鞋子。
I went to, like, this good espresso spot that has cortados, had a coffee, and then I have long shorts on, sweat shorts, cut off sweats, suicidal tendency sweats, and high socks, and just regular shoes.
我来自的地方，我长大的地方，叫内陆帝国。
And where I come from, where I grew up, it's called the Inland Empire.
然后我就想，天哪。
Like and I'm like, oh my god.
我现在看起来太内陆帝国了。
I look so Inland Empire right now.
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