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如果那里没有门，这是否证明安东尼正在进行一场长达三十五年的 crusade，要推翻这个人？
If there is no door there, does that prove that Anthony is on a thirty five year crusade to bring down this man?
控诉者那种‘必须相信控诉者’的整个信念，在这里也没有立足之地。
Is this whole belief of the accuser, you always have to believe the accuser, that has no place here either.
他只是在告诉你真相。
He's just telling you the truth.
所有发生过的事，以及所有没发生过的事。
Everything that happened and everything that didn't.
没有。
None
这一切都没有任何意义。
of this makes any sense.
没有任何一点。
None of it.
他证明了吗？
Did he prove it?
他证明了吗？
Did he prove it?
如果答案是否定的，就在此停止并作出裁决。
And if the answer is no, stop here and return your verdict.
拉普先生是否
Did Mr.
通过优势证据证明拉普先生触碰了拉尔夫先生的性器官或私密部位？
Rapp prove by a preponderance of the evidence that Mr.
拉普先生是否通过优势证据证明拉普先生触碰了拉尔夫先生的性器官或私密部位？
Fowler touched a sexual or intimate part or parts of mister Ralph.
欢迎收看过滤频道播出的凯文·史派西案审判。
Welcome to the Kevin Spacey trial on Filtered.
这是第九集。
This is episode nine.
#裁决
Hashtag the verdict.
我叫安·麦克尔赫尼。
My name is Anne McElhinney.
在整个播客中，我们讨论了2017年那几个月里，#MeToo运动如何席卷一切，导致凯文·史派西的生活彻底崩塌。
Throughout this podcast, we've talked about how the Me Too movement was all consuming during those months in 2017 that saw Kevin Spacey's life implode.
自那以后，许多职场中的权力动态已被重新定义。
Since then, much about professional power dynamics in many workplaces has been rewritten.
但这些改变究竟有多深入？
But how deep were these changes?
新的#MeToo观念会影响本案的判决结果吗？
Would the new Me Too worldview affect the outcome of the case?
陪审团会相信所有受害者，无论证据如何吗？
Would the jury believe all victims, regardless of the evidence?
几乎所有关键人物都已向陪审团作证。
Almost everyone who mattered had spoken to the jury.
我们听到了原告安东尼·拉普、被告凯文·史派西以及各自支持证人的证词。
We had heard from Anthony Rapp, the complainant, and Kevin Spacey, the defendant, and their various supporting witnesses giving evidence.
现在轮到律师们总结各自的案件了。
Now it's time for the lawyers to sum up their respective cases.
这些总结非常重要，因为律师可以提醒陪审团他们在审判中提出的观点以及揭露的谎言与真相。
These summations are important because the lawyers can remind the jury of the points they scored and the lies and truths they revealed during the trial.
它们还允许律师为通常较为枯燥的证词增添修辞上的修饰。
They also allow the lawyers to add rhetorical flourishes to what can often be quite dry testimony.
正如我们将看到的，这还让律师们有机会夸大或淡化某些重要证词的意义。
And as we will see, it allows the lawyers to possibly exaggerate or underplay the significance of some important testimony.
法庭内不允许使用摄像机。
Cameras were not allowed in the courtroom.
这些总结由演员根据法庭笔录朗读。
The summations are read by actors using the court transcripts.
拉普的律师理查德·斯坦格曼首先发言。
Rapp's lawyer, Richard Steigman, made his case first.
他并没有直接攻击斯佩西，而是先攻击了斯佩西的律师珍妮弗·凯勒。
He started not by attacking Spacey, but by attacking Spacey's lawyer, Jennifer Keller.
斯特格曼指责她错误地声称安东尼·拉普被约翰·巴里曼吸引，并因嫉妒潜在的情敌而憎恨斯派西。
Stegman accused her of falsely claiming Anthony Rapp was attracted to John Barreman and hated Spacey because of jealousy over a potential love rival.
我说什么或女士说什么并不重要。
It doesn't matter what I say or what Ms.
凯勒或任何律师告诉你的关于案件的情况。
Keller says or any lawyer tells you about the case.
这是嫉妒理论的关键，这个编造的、毫无事实依据的论点认为安东尼爱上了约翰·贝雷曼。
It's the linchpin of the jealousy theory, this made up, no facts argument that Anthony was in love with John Berreman.
安东尼嫉妒了。
Anthony was jealous.
当他看到这个，就开始了这场长达三十五年的疯狂报复，一心要扳倒凯文·史派西。
And when he saw this, it started this maniacal thirty five year rage to bring Kevin Spacey down.
尽管表面上这毫无道理，事实前提也完全错误。
And while it makes no sense on its face, the factual predicate is totally untrue.
这份记录里没有任何事实依据。
There are no facts in this record.
没有一位证人作证，也没有任何证据表明安东尼嫉妒约翰·贝里曼、对约翰·贝里曼有感情，或对所见行为感到不满。
Nobody who testified, no exhibits that reflect that Anthony was jealous of John Berriman, had feelings for John Berriman, was offended by the conduct that he saw.
贝里曼告诉你们，他没有。
Berriman told you he didn't.
这一切从未发生过。
None of it ever happened.
正如凯勒在结案陈词中指出的那样，她实际上从未这么说过，但施蒂格曼的开场白非常有力。
As Keller would point out in her closing, she never actually said that, but it was a strong opening from Steigman.
他试图削弱凯勒的可信度，从而动摇她和斯派西的案件。
He was trying to undermine Keller's credibility and so undermine her and Spacey's case.
施蒂格曼在回顾法庭上实际陈述的证词时，立场更为有利。
Steigman was on a better footing as he recapped testimony that was actually given in court.
他要求陪审团思考，声称斯派西在20世纪80年代初性侵他的安德鲁·霍尔茨曼为何要撒谎。
He asked the jury to consider why Andrew Holtzman, the man who claimed Spacey had sexually assaulted him in the early 1980s, would lie.
你必须相信，安德鲁·霍尔茨曼站出来时没有任何动机，没有从中获益，也没有其他理由，只是作为一个关心此事的普通公民，终于说：我听过这个故事，我要分享我的经历。
You have to believe that Andrew Holtzman stepped up with no motive, no benefit to him, no reason to do it other than a concerned citizen who finally said, I've heard this story, and I'm going to share my experience.
你必须相信，这个男人愿意来到法庭，宣誓并承担伪证的处罚，只为向你们讲述他所经历的事情。
You have to believe this man was willing to come into this court and take an oath and subject himself to penalty of perjury just to tell you what happened to him.
这站不住脚。
It doesn't fly.
作为一个不寻常的举动，施特格曼没有深入探讨Spacey针对BuzzFeed报道所发布的声明。
In an unusual move, Steigman did not dwell on the statement Spacey put out in response to the BuzzFeed story.
他当时使用了‘道歉’这个词，但后来又声称那件事从未发生，这正是Spacey在庭审中必须解释的问题。
Using the word apologize then, but later claiming the thought had not happened was something Spacey had to explain during the trial.
这是他辩护中最薄弱的部分，施特格曼在对Spacey的交叉询问中花了大量时间，逐一拆解每个版本的时间线，并质疑Spacey的记忆。
It was the weakest part of his defense, and Steigman spent a significant portion of Spacey's cross examination picking apart the timeline of each version and calling into question Spacey's memory.
记忆。
Memory.
但律师的总结陈词并没有详细剖析这一声明。
But the lawyer's summation didn't pick apart this statement in detail.
相反，施特格曼大部分时间都在引导陪审团关注案件的其他部分。
Instead, Stagman spent most of his time drawing the jury's attention to other parts of the case.
他着重强调了Spacey声称自己逐渐回忆起更多关于与拉普会面的细节，尤其是当他发现BuzzFeed所描述的拉普17岁朋友实际上是19岁的约翰·巴罗曼时。
He made much of Spacey's claim that he gradually remembered more and more about meeting Rapp, especially when he discovered that who BuzzFeed described as Rapp's 17 year old friend was actually the 19 year old John Barrowman.
斯塔格曼指控Spacey先是声称自己什么也记不起来，随后又调整自己的否认和证据以符合巴罗曼的记忆。
Stagman accused Spacey of first saying he remembered nothing and then tailoring his denials and evidence to match Barrowman's memory.
斯塔格曼还试图将Spacey描绘成一个对不当行为态度随意的人。
Stagman also tried to paint Spacey as someone who was casual about inappropriate behavior.
想想这一点。
Think about this.
想想这里正在发生什么。
Think about what's going on here.
他带着一个19岁和一个14岁的年轻人出去吃饭，带他们去热门俱乐部。
He's got a 19 year old and a 14 year old taking them out to dinner, taking them to a hot club.
贝里曼在喝酒。
Berriman is drinking.
现在他又说：嘿，要不要回来看看我的景色，顺便摸摸我的狗？
And now he says, Hey, why don't you come back and look at my view and come pet my dog?
这就是这位成年人对这两个青少年所做的事情。
This is what this adult is doing with these two teenagers.
他想告诉你，Berriman 当时已经19岁了。
He wants to tell you, well, Berriman is a man at 19.
这有什么不对吗？
What's wrong with that?
如果这是真的，如果情况确实如此，如果你是个有理智、谨慎、负责任的成年人，认为在大学里对这样的孩子有所举动是可以接受的，那你还会带上那个14岁的孩子吗？
If that's true, if that's the case, if you're any sort of reasonable person or a prudent person, any sort of responsible adult, and you think it's appropriate to make moves on this kid in college, do you bring the 14 year old with you?
在哪个世界里，这种行为是合适的？
In what universe would that be appropriate?
现在，在晚餐、饮酒和聚光灯之后，他让这个19岁和14岁的孩子待在自己的公寓里，而安东尼·拉普离开了。
And now he's got this 19 year old and 14 year old in his apartment after the dinner and drinks and the limelight, and Anthony Rapp steps out.
Berriman 说，安东尼去洗手间了。
Berriman says, Anthony goes to the bathroom.
就在那时，毫无顾忌地，Spacey 把我推倒在床上，我知道接下来要发生什么。
And then at that point, worldlessly, Spacey pushes me down on the bed, and I knew what was going on.
他一直在向我调情，我也回应了他。
He had been flirting with me, and I flirted back.
我感到受宠若惊。
I was flattered.
好吧。
Fine.
他开始行动了，我知道这意味着什么。
And he's making his move, and I knew what it meant.
这一点毫无疑问。
There's no doubt about that.
你听到了约翰·贝里曼的说法。
You heard John Berriman.
在哪个世界里，这种行为是合适的？
In what world is this an appropriate thing to do?
在哪个世界里，成年人这么做是合适的？
In what world is it appropriate for an adult?
我不在乎他们是男孩还是女孩，你26岁了还把两个青少年带回家。
I don't care if they are boys or girls, to take two teenagers back to your apartment when you're 26 years old.
你26岁了，让一个19岁的年轻人上床，而在14岁孩子在浴室里的时候向他示好。
When you're 26, get a 19 year old on the bed, make a pass at him when the 14 year old is in the bathroom.
当然，26岁的人在14岁孩子就在附近浴室时向19岁的人示好，这是否合适，这是一个观点问题。
It is, of course, a matter of opinion whether it is appropriate for a 26 year old to make a pass at a 19 year old when a 14 year old is in a nearby bathroom.
但这并不违法。
But it's not illegal.
随后，斯蒂格曼转而讨论实际的涉嫌违法行为。
Stegman then moved to address the actual alleged illegal activity.
这迫使他不得不面对拉普故事中最大的问题——那个根本不存在的卧室。
This forced him to address the biggest problem with Rapp's story, the bedroom that wasn't there.
这是一个难以应对的要点，斯蒂格曼很难给出一个合理的解释，说明陪审团为何应该相信拉普的版本。
It proved a difficult point to tackle, and Stegman struggled to give a coherent reason why the jury should trust Rapp's version of events.
他说，斯帕西的律师们把一个微小的差别夸大成了重大区别。
He said Spacey's lawyers were making a small distinction into a big difference.
这是安东尼在2021年2月3日作证时画的草图。
This is a sketch that Anthony did at his deposition on 02/03/2021.
根据被告的说法，安东尼在1986年曾和约翰·贝里曼一起在这套公寓里待过一次，持续了半小时。
According to the defendant, Anthony had been in this apartment one time for half an hour with John Berriman in 1986.
如果你仔细看，安东尼在35年后的记忆中，画出了前门的位置、正前方的客厅，以及厨房的位置。
And if you look at it, Anthony, from memory 35 later, depicts where the front door is, depicts that living room straight ahead, and puts the kitchen there too.
实际上，厨房是在左边。
The kitchen is really off to the left.
他画出了那些大窗户，那些朝西、能俯瞰城市美景的大窗户，然后在左边画出了卧室。
He has those big windows, those beautiful big windows facing west that show the city, and then to the left he has the bedroom.
他标出了床的位置。
He shows you where the bed is.
当你从卧室环顾四周时，正如你所见，那个他最终不得不躲进去以躲避斯派西先生袭击的浴室，就是他在没有任何信息的情况下，35年后画出来的。
And then as you wrap around, as you could see from the bedroom, that bathroom in which he would ultimately need to take refuge from mister Spacey's attack, that's what he drew with no information thirty five years later.
还有工作室，左边的卧室，以及它后面的浴室。
And the studio, the bedroom to the left and behind it, the bathroom.
如果那里什么都没发生，一个人怎么可能记得如此具体的细节？
How in the world could anyone remember it in this specific detail if nothing happened there?
卧室和客厅之间的隔断重要吗？
Does it matter what separated the bedroom from the living room?
那里有没有书架重要吗？
Does it matter if there was a bookshelf there?
那里有没有一扇门重要吗？
Does it matter if there was a door there?
安东尼记得有一扇门。
Anthony remembers a door.
如果那里根本没有门，这就能证明安东尼是在进行一场长达三十五年的 crusade 来扳倒这个人吗？
If there is no door there, does that prove that Anthony is on a thirty five year crusade to bring down this man?
这个论点公平吗？
Is that a fair argument?
这对你来说意味着什么？
Is that what comes up for you?
你是说，如果你相信当时根本不存在门，那他就一定在撒谎，因为他记得有一扇门？
That if you believe there really was no door there at that time that he must be lying because he remembered a door?
但这扇门并不仅仅是平面图中的一个无关细节。
But the door was not just an unimportant detail in a floor plan.
它是指控的关键部分。
It was a key part of the allegation.
如果没有这扇门，就没有安东尼·拉普可以退避的卧室——远离无聊的成人派对，可以安静地看电视，被完全隔绝以至于没意识到派对已经结束，而凯文·史派西后来可以 menacingly 站在那里。
Without the door, there was no bedroom where Anthony Rapp could have retreated to, away from a boring adult party where he could have watched TV in peace, where he could have been so sequestered that he didn't realize the party had ended, and where Kevin Spacey could later stand menacingly.
但施特格曼完全不接受这种说法。
But Steigman was having none of it at all.
认为这个案件取决于公寓中卧室与起居区之间是否存在一扇门、一个书架或其他隔断，这种想法是荒谬的。
The notion that this case turns on whether or not there is a door, a bookshelf, or any other separation between the bedroom and the living area in that apartment is absurd.
安东尼·拉普能够描述它。
Anthony Rapp could describe it.
他能够画出来。
He could draw it.
他能告诉你它在哪里。
He could tell you where it was.
他能描述那些窗户。
He could describe the windows.
哦，但我们确实有个门。
Oh, but we had a door.
大家准备好了。
Get ready, folks.
你们马上就会听到很多关于门的事。
You're going to hear a lot about a door.
施特格曼在这方面是对的。
Steigman was right about that.
接着，他提醒陪审团注意所谓袭击事件的细节，称赞拉普叙述故事时的稳定和没有夸大其词。
He then goes on to remind the jury of the details of the alleged assault, praising Rapp for his steady recounting of the story and lack of exaggeration.
他还顺便讽刺了斯派西。
He also manages to get in a dig at Spacey.
顺便说一句，如果这不能体现安东尼·拉普的特点，那就是他在讲述这个故事时，根本不想夸大其词。
If that doesn't typify Anthony Rapp, by the way, that even as he's recounting the story, he doesn't wanna overstate at all.
他根本不想过度渲染。
He doesn't want to oversell at all.
他不是背稿的。
He's not scripted.
他也不是他们提过无数次的奥斯卡获奖者。
He's not the Academy Award winner, as they've mentioned a million times.
他只是在告诉你事实，所有发生过的事，以及所有没发生过的事。
He's just telling you the truth, everything that happened and everything that didn't.
施特格曼告诉陪审团，辩护方的说法毫无根据，拉普之所以提出虚假指控，是因为他嫉妒斯派西的成功。
Stegman told the jury there was no truth to the defense argument, that Rapp was making a false claim because he was jealous of Spacey's success.
证据在哪里？
Where is the proof?
有谁在他的生活中说过，‘那个人是嫉妒的’？
Where does anyone in his life say, That guy was jealous?
那个人说，你知道吗，Spacey在拿奥斯卡奖。
That guy said, You know, Spacey's winning Oscars.
那应该是我。
That should be me.
他们把这个人的人生挖得淋漓尽致。
They dug as deep into this guy's life as you can imagine.
到底有谁，哪怕是一个心怀不满的同事，一个不喜欢他的人，一个他对待不公的人，甚至一个被传唤作证的朋友，曾说过他嫉妒？
Where is the one person, some disgruntled coworker, somebody who didn't like him, somebody he treated wrongly, even a friend who they deposed who he told.
有谁会走进这个法庭说，他真的是个嫉妒心很强的人？
Where is the anybody to come into this courtroom and say, he really is a jealous guy?
他确实有些问题。
He really has some problems.
他真的非常羡慕别人拥有的东西。
He really covets what other people have.
根本不存在。
It's not there.
这不真实。
It's not true.
这不符合他的本性。
It's not who he is.
这与心理测试的结果不符。
It's not what the psychological testing reveals.
这太荒谬了。
It is ridiculous.
这仅仅是针对诉讼的一种辩护，不多也不少。
It is a defense to a lawsuit and nothing more, nothing less.
他还否定了说说唱是出于寻求关注和事业提升的观点。
He also dismissed the idea that rap came forward because he saw it as an opportunity for attention and a career boost.
但有什么证据表明他想借机牟利呢？
But where's the proof he looked to cash in on the attention?
对吧？
Right?
新书在哪里？
Where's the new book?
关于这件事，脱口秀节目都在说什么？
Where's the talk show circuit talking about this?
这些根本不存在。
None of it existed.
他做了自己认为必须做的事。
He did what he thought he had to do.
他做了自己认为正确的事。
He did what he thought was right.
他站出来部分是出于内疚，坦白说，因为他之前没有站出来。
He came forward in part out of guilt, frankly, that he hadn't come forward before.
拉普寻求四千万美元的赔偿，并因揭发凯文·史派西而获得了国际知名度。
Rapp was looking for $40,000,000 in damages and gained an international profile as the man who brought down Kevin Spacey.
但施特格曼认为，拉普因公开此事实际上遭受了损失。
But Steigman argued that Rapp had actually suffered by going public.
但他们说最后一个动机是贪婪。
But the last motive they say is greed.
他们说他一直在撒谎，撒谎，撒谎，再撒谎。
Well, they say he's been lying and lying and lying and lying.
他让这个故事得以发表。
He got the story published.
它产生了它所产生的一切影响。
It had whatever impact it had.
想想这个。
Think about this.
你为什么要主动站出来，把自己置于这样的境地呢？
Why in the world would you now put yourself in this position to come forward?
他们说这完全是谎言。
They say it is a total lie.
凯文·史派西将迫不及待地重新出发。
Kevin Spacey is going to be raring to go.
他会请律师质询你，调查你的生活，传唤你的朋友，并翻遍你的书。
He's going to have lawyers that question you and dig into your life and depose your friends and comb through your book.
他讲述发生的事情。
He tells what goes on.
他讲述好的和坏的方面。
He tells the good and bad.
他坦诚地讲述自己生活中的真实部分，而他不得不坐在这里接受评判并经历这一切。
He tells the unvarnished parts of his life, and he's had to sit here and be judged and go through it.
他看起来享受这个过程吗？
Does it look like he's enjoying this?
他看起来享受这种关注吗？
Does it look like he's enjoying the attention of this?
他这么做是为了让凯文·史派西承担责任，我知道或许有很多天，他希望自己在做别的事，不必再重温这段创伤，不必再听到这些，也不必让生活的每一个瞬间都被翻出来。
He's done this to hold Kevin Spacey accountable, and I know there is many days perhaps he wished he was doing something else and didn't need to be reliving this trauma and hearing all of this and having every moment of his life dredged up.
他和肯有着幸福的婚姻。
He's in a happy marriage with Ken.
他们彼此相爱。
They love each other.
他们互相支持。
They're supportive.
早期，他们发生过几次推搡事件。
Early on, they had a couple of shoving incidents.
没人会希望这样。
Nobody would want that.
但要坐在这里听这些，坐在这里听这些。
But to sit here and have to listen to it, to sit here and to have to listen to it.
对吧？
Right?
接下来轮到詹妮弗·凯勒总结斯佩西的案件及其无罪主张。
Then it was time for Jennifer Keller to sum up Spacey's case, his claim of innocence.
她迅速回应了斯蒂格曼的说法，即她曾声称安东尼·拉普是出于性嫉妒而行动。
She quickly tackled Stegman's claim that she had argued Anthony Rapp was motivated by sexual jealousy.
无论如何，当他谈到我的开场陈述时，我几乎觉得他是在谈论另一场审判。
Anyway, when he was talking about my opening statement, I almost felt he was talking about another trial.
我从未提及过同性恋愤怒或狂暴愤怒，也没有声称安东尼·拉普对约翰·贝罗曼怀有性嫉妒，或者对他有单相思之类的说法。
I never talked about homosexual rage or maniacal rage or claimed that Anthony Rapp was in love with John Beroman or that he had a crush on mister Beroman or any of those things.
我不记得自己用过‘电影偶像’这个词。
I don't think I used the word matinee idol.
我确实说过他是乔利特的头号人物，我认为这一点从证词中已经很清楚了。
I did say he was especially the big cheese in Joliet, and I think that was pretty clear from the testimony.
但我听到的一些内容，也许是在另一个平行宇宙里，有个不同的珍妮弗·凯勒说了那些话，但那不是我。
But some of the stuff I'm hearing, maybe there was an alternate universe with a different Jennifer Keller making that statement, but that wasn't me.
然而，凯勒确实给安东尼·拉普赋予了其他卑劣的动机，并质疑了‘所有提出指控的人都应被自动相信’这一观点。
Keller did, however, ascribe other base motives to Anthony Rapp and took a swing at the idea that everyone who makes an allegation should automatically be believed.
她反驳了‘我们应该相信所有受害者或自称受害者的人’这种假设。
She pushed back on the assumption that we should believe all victims or people who claimed to be victims.
我们在这里是因为贝罗曼先生。
We're here because Mr.
拉普虚假地指控了一起从未发生过的性侵事件，该事件发生在一场从未举行过的派对，地点是一个根本不存在的房间。
Rapp has falsely alleged abuse that never occurred at a party that was never held in a room that did not exist.
一开始，在我的开场陈述中，我就告诉过你们这个案件与什么无关。
At the beginning, in my opening statement, I did tell you what the case wasn't about.
这与谣言无关。
It wasn't about rumors.
这与社交媒体无关。
It's not about social media.
这与你是否支持或不支持#MeToo运动无关。
It's not about whether you support or don't support the Me Too movement.
但拉普先生确实试图将自己的行为与#MeToo运动挂钩，当他发布声明时就是这样，但那并不是我们今天在这里要讨论的内容。
But mister Rapp did try to hitch his wagon to the Me Too movement and when he made his announcement, but that's not what we're here for.
我的意思是，我们不如现在就把这一点说清楚。
I mean, let's just get that out of the way right now.
我的意思是，#MeToo运动之所以必要，是因为在一个根深蒂固的厌女社会里，长期以来，无论女性指控哪位有权势的男性，她们都不被相信。
I mean, the Me Too movement was necessary because in a deeply misogynistic society, for a long time, women were not believed, no matter what, if they accused a powerful man.
因此，钟摆需要从那种状态摆回，幸运的是，它确实这样做了。
So the pendulum needed to swing away from that, and it did, thankfully.
但是否摆得过远，这也不是由你们来决定的。
But it's also not for you to decide if it swung too far the other direction.
真的不是。
It really isn't.
我想说的是，关于相信指控者这一整个观念。
The one thing that I would say is this whole belief of the accuser.
你总是必须相信指控者。
You always have to believe the accuser.
这一点在这里也不适用。
That has no place here either.
随后，她转向了削弱拉普案件的证据。
She then moved on to the evidence that undermined Rapp's case.
那么，让我们实际来看一下证据。
So let's actually look at the evidence.
让我们来看看拉普先生的说法。
Let's examine Mr.
拉普的故事。
Rapp's story.
第一，他的说法依赖于一个卧室的存在。
Number one, his story depends on the existence of a bedroom.
这是原告无法回避的顽固事实。
That's the stubborn fact that the plaintiff cannot get away from.
他从14岁开始就讲述这个故事。
He started telling this story when he was 14 years old.
多年来，他至少讲述了数十次，而每一次讲述都包含了一个有墙的卧室。
He told it at least dozens of times throughout the years, and every story that he told, every one, included a bedroom with a wall.
这不仅仅是个平面图的问题。
And it wasn't just a mere floor plan issue.
它是他整个故事的核心，因为如果没有卧室，他就没有地方可以躲进去、看电视，直到门打开，才发现其他客人已经全都离开了。
It was central to his entire tale because without a bedroom, there would have been no place for him to retreat into, watch television, and not know that all the other party guests had left until the door opened and he saw they were gone.
所以他还说，当他在Precious Sons关闭后回到乔利埃特时，他向克里斯托弗·哈特讲述了他关于凯文·史派西的故事，你猜怎么着？
So he also says he admits that when he returned to Joliet after Precious Sons closed, he told Christopher Hart his Kevin Spacey story, and guess what?
当时有一个卧室。
There was a bedroom.
所以这并不是那种可以合理辩称‘随着时间推移，你可能忘了那其实是个壁龛式工作室’的情况。
So this isn't the sort of thing where it can be reasonably argued, oh, you know, with the passage of time, you might forget that it was an alcove studio.
不。
No.
他立刻编造了这个故事，并且加入了卧室这个元素。
He promptly made up this story, and he included the bedroom.
凯勒明确表达了她对拉普如何编出这次性侵故事的看法。
And Keller was clear about how she believed Rapp had come up with the story of the assault.
无论如何，为什么他讲的是这个故事？
Anyway, why is this the story that he told?
我认为，合理地推断，这个故事源自Precious Sons。
I think it's, again, a reasonable inference that it came from Precious Sons.
他日复一日、夜复一夜地出现在这部剧中，还被埃德·哈里斯接走，这巧合也太巧了。
It's just too much of a coincidence that he's in this show day after day, night after night, and he is being picked up by Ed Harris.
当埃德·哈里斯在剧中把拉普的角色误认为是他妻子时，
When Ed Harris, in the play, mistakes Mr.
他扑到对方身上，试图发生性行为，但在任何明显的性行为发生之前，他就意识到自己搞错了，立刻起身了。
Rapp's character for his wife and gets on top of him and tries to get sexual, but before anything happens, anything overtly sexual happens, he recognizes his error and gets up.
所以这相当于一个成年人试图与一个14岁的孩子发生性关系。
So that's an adult trying to have engage in sex with a kid with this 14 year old.
他一遍又一遍地重复这个故事。
And he kept repeating it and repeating it and repeating it.
作为一个14岁的孩子，我敢肯定他从未想过自己会因此接受交叉质询。
Now, as a 14 year old, I'm sure he never thought he'd be cross examined about it.
这原本是他讲给朋友听的故事。
This was a story he told to friends.
后来它变成了一种派对上的谈资。
It became kind of a party story.
随着凯文·史派西越来越出名，这个故事成了他不断重复的派对谈资。
As Kevin Spacey became more and more famous, it became a party story that he told constantly.
只要史派西先生
Anytime Mr.
获得任何奖项，或有人称赞他，他都会讲起他的凯文·史派西故事。
Spacey was up for an award, anytime somebody praised him, he would tell his Kevin Spacey story.
但这个说法完全得不到任何佐证。
But that story is completely uncorroborated.
他无法指出派对中的任何一位目击者，也无法描述他们的样子。
He can't identify a single witness from the party, can't describe them.
三十年来，没有任何目击者站出来作证。
No witnesses have come forward in thirty years.
他的律师也找不到任何目击者，因为根本就没有举办过派对。
His attorneys have been unable to find them because there was no party.
凯勒还在他的回忆录中引用安东尼·拉普的话，来削弱他对史派西的指控。
Keller also used Anthony Rapp's words in his memoir to undermine his allegations against Spacey.
当我们住在纽约排练话剧《珍贵的儿子》时，我对妈妈无处不在的陪伴感到烦躁。
When we were living in New York during rehearsals for the play Precious Sons, I had grown restless with mom's constant presence.
我现在想成为一个成年人。
I wanted to be an adult now.
我不再想向她报备，也不想她跟着我满城转悠。
I didn't want to have to answer to her or have her follow me around the city.
我是说真的跟着。
And I do mean follow.
我开始在街上快步行走，让妈妈气喘吁吁地跟在我后面，恳求我放慢脚步陪她走。
I took to walking very quickly down the street, leaving mom huffing and puffing behind me as she implored me to slow down and walk with her.
但我只是装作没听见，继续加快步伐，即使她偶尔在十字路口追上我，我也根本不看她。
But I just ignored her and kept up my pace, not even looking at her when she occasionally caught up with me at a crosswalk.
他在书中提到的一件事是，当他们在纽约时，母亲无处不在地跟着他，这让他非常恼火。
One of the things he wrote about in his book was his annoyance that when they were in New York, his mother followed him everywhere.
她跟得如此紧，以至于他不得不加快脚步才能甩开她。
She followed him to such a degree that he would have to speed up his pace to get away from her.
他会走得更快。
He would go faster.
她也会加快脚步。
She would go faster.
她一直陪在他身边。
She was with him all the time.
现在他说，那只是排练期间的事，而且显然，她从一个像廉价西装一样紧贴着他的过度保护型母亲，变成了允许他在深夜独自外出，甚至去一个她不认识、他也只见过一次的男人家里——而那个男人，是在她另一个儿子遭到性侵之后才与他见过一面。
Now, he says, well, that was only during rehearsals, and apparently, she went from being this hyper protective mom who was on him like a cheap suit to go off into the night, my son, anytime you want, including midnight by yourself to the home of a man she doesn't know and that he doesn't really know except for meeting once after her other son has been sexually assaulted by a man.
这还用得着动脑子吗？
Talk about use your common sense.
凯勒质疑，拉普的母亲是否会让他在20世纪80年代犯罪率高企的纽约深夜独自游荡。
Keller questioned whether Rapp's mother would allow him to wander the streets of nineteen eighties crime ridden New York at a late hour.
非常晚的深夜。
A very late hour.
因为我们知道那是5月20日，星期二，5月20日晚上到次日凌晨，我们知道斯佩西先生当晚在演出，而且那是一部很长的剧。
Well, because we know it was May 20, Tuesday, the night of May 20 into the next day, we know that mister Spacey was performing at night, and we know that it was a long play.
《漫长的一天》这部剧需要很强的耐力，甚至比听律师做结案陈词还要耗神。
Long days' journey into night takes some stamina, even more than it takes for you to listen to the attorney's in closing.
这部剧长达三个半小时。
It's three and a half hours.
非常耗费体力，而且还有中场休息。
It's grueling, and it's got an intermission.
所以一部三个半小时的剧，加上二十到三十分钟的中场休息，因为实在太长太累，所以开场时间是晚上7:30，而不是8:00。
So three and a half hour play, twenty to thirty minute intermission, and because it's such a grueling long play, it starts at 07:30, not at 08:00.
那么我们假设它大约在11点左右结束。
So let's say it ends around eleven ish or so.
三个半小时的剧加上二十到三十分钟的中场休息，最早也要到11点才能结束。
Three and a half hour play plus twenty to thirty minute intermission ends at eleven at the earliest, the very earliest.
但接下来会发生什么？
But then what has to happen?
谢幕。
Curtain call.
杰克·尼科尔森是世界上最大的明星之一。
And Jack Lemmon is one of the biggest stars in the world.
你可以想象，谢幕环节会持续很久。
You can imagine that curtain call takes a while.
你得回到后台。
You have to go back.
你得把妆卸掉。
You have to take your makeup off.
你需要洗个澡。
You need to shower.
你需要脱下戏服。
You need to remove your costume.
然后你要在舞台门口迎接那些等着要签名的人。
Then you greet people at the stage door who are hanging out for autographs.
然后你才回家。
Then you travel home.
好的。
Okay.
如果我们真的要确定原告的位置，最宽松的可能估计是，Spacey先生在11:45到午夜之间回到家。
If we're really going to spot the plaintiff, the most liberal possible estimate for them that puts him home, mister Spacey, between 11:45 and midnight.
而Rapp先生大约在12:30左右到达，因为大卫·莱特曼的节目已经开始了。
And mister Rapp arrives at probably 12:30 ish because David Letterman is already on.
他说从他家走过来需要二十分钟。
He says it's a twenty minute walk from his house.
那么，主人不在家的时候，客人是怎么进来的呢？
Well, did the guests come over without the host being there?
当Spacey先生回家时，客人已经在里面了。
The guests are there when mister Spacey comes home.
我的意思是，谁给他们开的门？
I mean, who let them in?
狗吗？
The dog?
这毫无道理。
That makes no sense.
而且这场派对也成了历史上最短的派对之一，因为拉普先生在卧室里为亲戚观看大卫·莱特曼的节目，只看了一小会儿，就发现他能从门缝看到斯派西先生站在门框边，而客人已经离开了。
And it also goes on to be one of the shortest parties in history because mister Rapp is in the bedroom watching this for a relative, David Letterman, for a relatively brief period of time when he realizes because he can look through a crack in the door where mister Spacey is standing in the door frame, that the guests have left.
那又怎样？
So what?
这是一场半小时的派对吗？
Was it a half hour party?
这一切都毫无意义。
None of this makes any sense.
全都不合理。
None of it.
在某个时刻，为了让自己说的话听起来更可信，拉普先生说他一到斯派西先生的公寓就直接进去了，当时大卫·莱特曼的节目正在播放。
At some point, mister Rapp, to try to make his story sound more credible, had said that when he got to mister Spacey's apartment, he went right in, and David Letterman was on.
你知道，他几乎都没怎么参加派对。
You know, he was barely in the party at all.
他环顾四周，觉得无聊，然后直接进了卧室，发现大卫·莱特曼正在播出。
He looked around, view, got bored, boom, into the bedroom, and David Letterman is on.
那时候大卫·莱特曼节目是凌晨12:30播出，而拉普先生说他刚到那里。
David Letterman comes on at 12:30 in those days, and mister Wrap, he says, has just gotten there.
从他公寓走过去大约二十分钟。
It's about a twenty minute walk from his apartment.
所以他显然是在午夜时分悠哉地出门了。
So he's apparently gone sashaying out the door at midnight.
再见，妈妈。
Bye, mom.
去一个你完全不认识、从未见过的人家里，而且也不知道他什么时候回来，我想。
Going to this house of this guy you don't know and have never met and unknown when he would return, I guess.
然后珍妮弗·凯勒再次用他自己的文字来反驳拉普，或者更准确地说，是用他从未提及所谓斯派西事件的沉默来质疑他。
And then Jennifer Keller again used his own writings against rap or rather his lack of writing about the alleged Spacey incident.
在他的一本自传中，他坦率承认了包括殴打母亲和攻击男友在内的诸多行为，她问他：为什么对这些暴力行为如此坦诚，却对斯派西事件一字不提？
In an autobiography where he openly admitted, among other things, to hitting his mother and attacking his boyfriend, she asked, Why so candid about these assaults and not the Spacey incident?
那本书呢？
And the book?
这本书是一本忏悔录。
The book is a confessional.
如果你看标题，它说讲的是《吉屋出租》，但其实不是。
It says it's about Rent if you look at the title, but it's not.
它讲的是安东尼·拉普，以及他从婴儿时期开始的整个人生，所有曾发生在他身上的创伤经历。
It's about Anthony Rapp, and it's about his whole life from babyhood on, every traumatic thing that ever happened to him.
例如，他在书中详细描述了自己如何对前男友施暴，因为对方想离开他。
He details, for example, in his book, his physical attack on the ex boyfriend because the boyfriend wanted to leave him.
他对这件事进行了极其详细的叙述。
And he goes into huge detail about that.
他还详述了所有童年时期的事件。
He goes into all the babyhood incidents.
他逐一回顾了所有曾发生在自己身上的创伤经历，唯独回避了他现在称作最创伤的一件事：他与凯文·史派西的遭遇。
He goes through every traumatic thing that ever happened to him except what he now says is one of the very most traumatic things: his Kevin Spacey story.
它不在那里。
It's not there.
她告诉陪审团，他们故意首先对拉普进行取证，并可能使用了一个不恰当的比喻来为这种非同寻常的法律策略辩护。
She tells the jury that they deliberately deposed Rapp first, using perhaps an unfortunate metaphor to justify the unusual legal strategy.
还有斯蒂格曼先生。
And Mr.
斯蒂格曼说得对。
Steigman is right.
我们确实首先对他进行了取证。
We deposed him first.
他说存在一条必须这样做的规则，这是错的。
He is wrong that there is a rule that requires it.
根本没有这样的规定。
There is not.
我们这么做是经过深思熟虑的，因为我们知道他正要编出这个卧室的故事。
We did it very deliberately because we knew he was coming up with this bedroom story.
我们知道根本没有卧室。
We knew there was no bedroom.
那是一个小工作室。
It's a small studio.
我们知道必须让他无法脱身——请原谅我用这个词——无法从这件事中溜走。
And we knew we needed to lock him down so that he couldn't, you'll pardon the phrase, wriggle out from under it.
我们就是这样做的。
And that's what we did.
她继续说，拉普对斯派西有特别的理由感到愤怒。
-Rapp had a particular reason to feel angry at Spacey, she continued.
凯勒提醒陪审团，拉普曾接受过同性恋杂志《The Advocate》的一次未发表的采访。
Keller reminded the jury about an unpublished interview Rapp had given to the gay magazine The Advocate.
所以，斯蒂格曼先生。
-So Mr.
拉普作证说，他确实接受过《The Advocate》的采访，而且他很生气。
Rapp testifies that he did have this interview with The Advocate, and he is angry.
他生那些不敢出柜的演员的气。
He's angry at actors who won't come out of the closet.
那他怎么说呢？
And what does he say?
也许他们再也拿不到每部电影两千万元的片酬了，但谁在乎呢？
Maybe they won't make $20,000,000 a picture anymore, but who the cares?
如果他们还没赚够钱，那我为他们感到遗憾。
If they haven't made enough money yet, then I feel sorry for them.
最终，他们能对人们的生活产生的影响如此巨大，以至于他们根本没什么可失去的。
Ultimately, the difference they could make in people's lives is so great they really have nothing to lose.
他承认这确实是他的采访内容。
And he admits that that was part of his interview.
他后来试图让《The Advocate》在2001年麦先生之后发表一篇报道，曝光凯文·史派西。
And he tries to get the advocate later to publish a story and out Kevin Spacey in 2001 after Mr.
史派西获得《美国美人》的奥斯卡奖后，他做了什么？
Spacey gets, what, an Oscar for American Beauty.
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这有点奇怪，因为你会认为拉普先生，
It's kind of odd because you would think that Mr.
作为同性恋社群的活跃分子，应该不希望一个恋童癖者站出来被社群接纳并公开出柜。
Rap, seeing himself as an activist for the gay and lesbian community, would not want somebody to come forward and be claimed by the community and come out as gay if the person was a child molester.
但他却对斯派西先生感到愤怒，
But he was angry at Mr.
因为他没有那样做，没有公开出柜。
Spacey for not doing that, for not coming out.
《倡导者》杂志在2001年，这和我们正在谈论的是另一回事，《倡导者》杂志不会发表，因为他们有不强行曝光他人性取向的政策。
The Advocate in 2001, and that's a different story than we're talking about here, The Advocate won't publish it because they have a policy of not forcibly outing people.
他们不会将
They will not put Mr.
史派西先生的名字写进报道。
Spacey's name in the story.
拉普为什么要谎称受到侵犯？
Why would Rapp lie about the assault?
凯勒认为，可能有很多复杂的原因。
There could be a lot of complex reasons, Keller argued.
但她指出，也有很多人撒谎和夸大其词，有时仅仅是因为想要引起关注。
But she points out that there are also many cases of people lying and exaggerating, sometimes for the simple motive of just wanting attention.
我们见过一些人编造故事，他们明明什么都会失去，却什么也得不到，但不知为何，他们还是这么做了。
We've seen people make stories up who have everything to lose and nothing to gain, and for some reason, they do it.
我经常想到的一件事是布莱恩·威廉姆斯。
One of the things that I always think about is Brian Williams.
我不知道你是否记得，布莱恩·威廉姆斯曾是美国全国广播公司《晚间新闻》的主播，是业内最受尊敬的人之一。
I don't know if you remember, but Brian Williams was the anchor of NBC News Tonight, one of the most respected people in the business.
他在美国人信任度的排行榜上排名非常高。
He was so high on the rating scale of people Americans trust.
我想他当时大概是第20名左右。
I think he was, like, number 20 or something.
他编造了一个故事，说他和一支海豹突击队一起乘坐直升机武装飞机在伊拉克，飞机被导弹击中，被迫迫降，这是一个非常惊心动魄的故事。
And he made up this story that he was with a SEAL team in a helicopter gunship in Iraq and that they were hit by a missile and forced down, and it was a very harrowing story.
他讲述这个故事并没有任何实际好处，或许只是想让自己显得稍微英勇一点，但结果证明这完全是假的。
He had nothing to gain by telling that story other than, I suppose, in a way, making himself look a little bit heroic, but it turned out to be completely false.
另一架直升机确实被击中了，但那是在前三十分钟或后三十分钟，我不太记得了，但他根本不在那个情境中。
There was another helicopter that had been hit, and it was either thirty minutes earlier or later, I don't remember, but he was never in that situation.
但他一遍又一遍地讲述这个故事，直到有人最终去调查，采访了相关人员，发现根本不是真的。
But he told this story over and over, and somebody finally checked into it and interviewed people, and not true.
凯勒表示，拉普如果没有 BuzzFeed 记者亚当·瓦里的配合，是不可能扳倒斯派西的。
Keller said that Rapp would not have been able to bring down Spacey without the cooperation of Adam Vary, the BuzzFeed journalist.
她对瓦里的新闻报道进行了严厉批评。
She was scathing about Vary's journalism.
所以他和亚当·瓦里合谋设下这个圈套。
So he planned this ambush with Adam Vary.
精心策划了这场伏击。
Planned this ambush.
我们会故意让这些指控保持模糊和混乱。
We're going to keep allegations deliberately vague and confusing.
好吧？
Okay?
我们会让它保持模糊。
We're going to keep it confusing.
我们不会让他否认。
We're not going to let him deny it.
我们不想把它具体化。
We don't want it to be pinned down.
具体来说，他说他在2008年托尼奖颁奖典礼上遇到过Spacey先生，当时他在洗手间里被冻住了，因为他看到了Spacey先生。
Specifically, he says he's run into he's had the bathroom incident with mister Spacey at the Tonys in 2008, you know, where he was frozen in the bathroom because he saw mister Spacey.
结果，Vary进行了调查，发现他既没有上台领奖，也没有获得提名，而且我们找不到任何照片。
It turns out, Vary researches it, well, he didn't present and wasn't nominated, and there's no photos we can find.
我们不怀疑他当时在场，但我们不想锁定一个Spacey先生可以明确否认的具体日期。
We don't doubt he was there, but we don't want to nail down a specific date that Spacey could then just flatly deny.
我们仍在调查，但如果无法确定具体时间，我们可能会说你在某个行业活动中见过他，或者类似的说法——一种他无法否认的说法。
We're still looking, but if we can't nail it down, we'll likely say that you saw him at an industry event or some such, something he can't deny.
同样，我们也会避免在派对的故事中过于具体。
Similarly, we're also going to steer away from exact specificity in the story for the party.
比如日期、时间以及谁在场？
Oh, like the date and time and who was there?
是的。
Yeah.
我们会避开这些细节。
We're going to steer away from that.
她说，亚当·瓦里发给凯文·史派西的邮件同样不公平，因为这是与安东尼·拉普共同策划的‘伏击’的一部分。
She said the email to Kevin Spacey from Adam Vary was equally unfair because it was part of the, quote, ambush, unquote, put together with Anthony Rapp.
她认为，由于给史派西的回应时间太短，他被一个被‘我也是’运动吓倒的顾问团队催促着做出了仓促而糟糕的回应。
Because of the short length of time he was given to respond, Spacey was rushed into a botched response by an advisory team cowed by the Me Too movement, she argued.
她还说，史派西的天真反而害了他。
She also said Spacey's naivety worked against him.
而且，是的，他们都慌了。
And, yes, they all panic.
他们都在彼此来回交流。
And they're all talking to each other back and forth.
天啊，你知道吗，我们该怎么办？
My gosh, you know, what are we going to do?
我们该怎么办？
What are we going to do?
这里根本没有合理的时间来回应。
There's no reasonable response time here.
根本没有时间去整理任何东西，翻找文件或查看材料。
There's no time to go over anything, to get out boxes, to look at documents.
什么都没有。
Nothing.
一片混乱。
There's chaos.
斯派西先生被告知必须道歉。
And mister Spacey is told he must apologize.
他必须。
He must.
因此，这个分散的群体之间来回交流。
So there's back and forth among this far flung group.
他开始把各组的想法写在纸上。
He starts to put groups' thoughts on papers.
其他人也来回这么做，而他的英国公关 Nicola Howson——一位非常知名的公关人士——表示，他必须表达钦佩、震惊、道歉和不记得。
Other people do too back and forth, and his publicist in The UK, Nicola Howson, who's a very well known publicist there, says he has to express admiration, horror, apology, no recollection.
这一切都是基于他们讨论的内容。
And this is based on what they've been talking about.
这就是他们必须做的。
This is what they have to do.
在整个过程中，Spacey 先生一直在做什么？
And what does mister Spacey keep doing through all this?
他不断插入‘如果’这个词。
He keeps inserting the word if.
如果。
If.
如果这件事发生了。
If this happened.
我对这件事没有任何记忆。
I have no memory of this happening.
我不认为这件事会发生。
I don't think it would have happened.
我无法想象这件事会发生。
I can't imagine that it would have happened.
如果、如果、如果、如果。但真正让我觉得悲哀，甚至可以说是悲剧的是，他给了沃普先生 benefit of the doubt。
If if if if But what's really sad, I think, if not tragic, is that he gives mister Wrap the benefit of the doubt.
他无法想象有人会凭空捏造这样的事情来诬陷他。
He can't imagine somebody would just make this up about him out of whole cloth.
他真的无法想象。
He really doesn't.
他就只是说，是的。
He's just like, yes.
他绞尽脑汁地想。
He's racking his brain.
这会是什么？
What could this be?
而他今天发布了那句臭名昭著的非道歉式道歉，说如果真发生了，那将是极其错误的。
And he issues that infamous non apology apology today that he so regrets saying if it happened, it would have been horribly wrong.
嗯，那确实会是极其错误的。
Well, it would have been horribly wrong.
这是对的。
That is true.
但如果，如果，如果。
But if, if, if.
他不断强调‘如果’，因为他无法想象这件事真的发生过。
And he keeps insisting on if because he can't imagine it.
凯勒随后提醒陪审团，安东尼·拉普在与斯派西和巴雷曼外出的那个晚上之前的生活状况。
Keller then reminded the jury of what was going on in Anthony Rapp's life before the night out with Spacey and Barreman.
他正处于人生的低谷。
He was at a low point.
他的百老汇大作《珍贵的儿子》原本有望开启他的职业生涯，却以失败告终。
Precious Sons, his big Broadway show that was going to launch his career, had failed.
去看的人寥寥无几，几个月后就被取消了。
Few people went to see it, and it was canceled after a few months.
后来，他遇到了表演大师杰克·莱蒙，而当时还是新星的凯文·斯派西走进了房间。
Then he meets acting legend Jack Lemmon, when Kevin Spacey, an up and coming actor, comes into the room.
但从那时起，拉普先生就不再是焦点。
But from that point on, Mr.
约翰·巴雷曼成了关注的中心，这或许解释了为什么他回到乔利埃特后，从未向克里斯·哈特或任何人提起过巴雷曼的到访。
Rapp is no longer the center of attention.
约翰·巴雷曼成了关注的中心，这或许解释了为什么他回到乔利埃特后，从未向克里斯·哈特或任何人提起过巴雷曼的到访。
John Berriman becomes the center of attention, which may be why, when he goes back to Joliet, he never once mentions Berryman's visit to Chris Hart or anyone.
这是一个奇怪的事实，因为他的高中朋友——这位高中戏剧中的明星——专程来看他在百老汇的演出，而他却从未提起过这个人。
That's a weird fact because his high school friend, who's a star of all these high school plays, comes to see him on Broadway, and he never mentions him.
这太奇怪了。
That is bizarre.
14岁的孩子会谈论他们所有的朋友和高中同学，这本该是一件大事。
14 year olds chat about all their friends, all their high school classmates, and that would have been a big deal.
但仿佛他彻底从记忆中抹去了贝罗曼先生，就像他在讲述凯文·史派西的故事时不断抹去他一样。
But it's like he's just deleted mister Berrowman from the scene completely as he continues to delete him from his Kevin Spacey story.
为什么？
Why?
你可以推测，也可以从中得出推论。
You can speculate, and you can draw inferences from it.
我认为可以合理推断，他当时很沮丧。
I think it's a reasonable inference that he was upset.
他不喜欢事情的发展方式。
He didn't like how things had gone.
约翰本应专注于他。
John was supposed to be focused on him.
我从未说过他爱上了他。
I never said he was in love with him.
我们没有这方面的证据。
We have no evidence of that.
我认为，一个14岁、正在质疑自己性取向且已经与其他男孩有过性经历的少年，看到像约翰·伯罗曼这样的人，可能会对他产生好感，这是合情合理的。
I think it's reasonable for a 14 year old questioning his sexuality who's already had sexual experiences with other boys when you see somebody who looks like John Berrowman maybe to have developed a crush on him.
她向陪审团表示，拉普可能也因自己的事业在首部百老汇戏剧后停滞不前，而斯佩西却一飞冲天而感到愤愤不平。
She told the jury how Rapp may also have been bitter that his career stalled after his first Broadway play while Spaces took off.
我认为你可以得出的另一个推论是，拉普先生。
I think another inference you can draw is that Mr.
拉普把凯文·斯佩西视为同辈。
Rapp saw Kevin Spacey as a peer.
这很奇怪，因为他当时只有14岁，而拉普先生。
It's weird because he was only 14 and Mr.
斯派西当时26岁，但他们在百老汇同时出演了各自的第一个重要角色。
Spacey was 26, but they're both in their first big role on Broadway at the same time.
但这些角色后来怎么样了？
But what happens with those roles?
他的剧目在几个月后就停演了。
His show closes after a couple of months.
斯派西先生的剧目大获成功，成为百老汇的热门剧目，并且后来转移到伦敦，也在那里取得了巨大成功。
Mister Spacey's show is a huge hit, huge Broadway hit, and moves on to London where it also becomes a huge hit.
所以当斯派西先生在伦敦西区风光无限时，拉普先生的剧目却在乔利特变成了灰烬。
So while mister Spacey is living it up on the West End in London, mister Rap's coach has turned into a pumpkin back in Joliet.
然后发生了什么？
And then what happens?
渐渐地，不是一下子，斯派西先生成为了舞台和银幕上的国际巨星。
Gradually, not all at once, mister Spacey becomes an international star of stage and screen.
拉普先生后来怎么样了？
What happens with mister Rap?
他一生只演过一个主要角色，就是《吉屋出租》里的马克，之后多年都是在小剧中演小角色。
He's got one big role ever, Mark in Rent, and then years of small parts in small shows.
名声并没有追随他。
Stardom did not follow him.
这是坏事吗？
Is that a bad thing?
不是。
No.
确实不是。
It's not.
能作为一名职业演员谋生是非常值得钦佩的，而且这很难。
It's really admirable to be able to make a living as a working actor, and it's hard.
很多人试图但未能做到，而他一直作为一名演员工作，这很棒。
So many people try and are unable to, and he has always worked as an actor, and that's great.
但说他不羡慕Spacey先生的职业生涯，他根本不想拥有那样的生涯，这就像我说我不羡慕露丝·巴德·金斯伯格的职业生涯一样。
But this idea that he didn't envy mister Spacey's career, he wouldn't have wanted his career, It's a little bit like me saying, I don't envy Ruth Bader Ginsburg's career.
我不想要那样的职业生涯。
I wouldn't want that career.
我不想要坐在最高法院。
I wouldn't want to be on the Supreme Court.
这不可信。
It's not believable.
凯勒随后开始拆解多克tor。
Keller then set about dismantling Doctor.
丽莎·罗奇奥的证据。
Lisa Rocchio's evidence.
那位精神病医生，RAP方的证人，作证称他遭受了创伤并患有创伤后应激障碍。
The psychiatrist, a witness for RAP, gave evidence claiming he had been traumatized and suffered from PTSD.
那医生呢？
What about Doctor.
罗奇奥？
Rocchio?
她在直接质询中表现得相当不错。
She sounded pretty good on the direct exam.
她听起来非常亲切且很有资格，但随后进入了交叉质询。
She sounded very personable and sounded qualified, and then cross examination happened.
除此之外，我们了解到，她从未怀疑过任何一个所谓的受害者。
And among other things, we learned she has never found a single so called victim that she didn't believe, ever.
从未。
Never.
这或许解释了为什么原告们离开了纽约市——世界上可能最顶尖的、拥有大量精神科医生和心理学家的地方——而跑到罗德岛去找她，因为这个人从未遇到过一个她说不信的受害者。
Which might explain why the plaintiffs went, left the city of New York, probably one of the premier places in the entire world where you could find a psychiatrist or psychologist specializing in this area, and they went to Rhode Island to find this person who has never seen anybody who was lying.
无论是临床还是法医角度，她都声称自己从未遇到过装病的情况，甚至不知道‘装病’的定义。
Clinically or forensically, never, claimed that she didn't even know the definition of malingering.
她不知道这个词的具体含义。
Didn't know what that was, the specific definition.
正如我们所听到的，文献表明，在涉及利益诉求的法医案件中，大约有百分之三十到四十的案例存在装病或伪造症状的情况。
And the literature, as we heard, suggests that malingering or faking symptoms is present in about thirty to forty percent of forensic cases, cases that come to a courtroom where somebody has something to gain.
所以，他们要么在没有残疾的情况下声称自己残疾，要么在不该获得赔偿时索要赔偿，或者类似的情况。
So either they are claiming disability when they are not disabled, or they want money's damages when they don't deserve them or something like that.
但她相信每一个人。
But she believes everybody.
凯勒最后提醒陪审团注意Spacey的王牌证据，她认为这份证据无可置疑。
Keller ended by reminding the jury of Spacey's Trump card, the piece of evidence that she believed was unimpeachable.
她敦促他们，在涉及真相的问题上不要采取中间立场。
She urged them not to take a middle ground where the truth was concerned.
但最终回到我们案件中的明星证人，这确实是明星证人。
But back finally to the star witness in our case, and it is the star witness.
这是证据A。
It's exhibit a.
这是据称事件发生地的公寓平面图。
It's the floor plan of the apartment where this supposedly happened.
这是一间小的一居室公寓。
It is a small studio apartment.
这件事不可能发生在这个小单间公寓里。
It is not possible that this happened in this small studio apartment.
你不能通过说‘天啊，他曾经是性虐待的受害者，事情过去很久了，人总会记错’来弥补拉普先生讲述的故事根本不可能这一事实。
You cannot make up for the fact that mister Rapp has given an impossible story by saying, Oh, gosh.
你知道，他曾经是性虐待的受害者，事情已经过去很久了，人们总会记错。
You know, he was a sexual abuse victim, and it's been a long time, and they get things wrong.
不。
No.
最后，我恳请你们拒绝任何形式的折中裁决。
Finally, one thing I would urge you to do is reject any sort of compromise verdict.
如果有人提议：‘那我们折中一下吧，不支持斯佩西先生，但支持拉普先生，只判一美元赔偿’，请千万不要这样做。
If somebody says, well, let's compromise and reject a verdict in mister Spacey's favor, make a verdict in mister Rapp's favor, but let's just award a dollar of damages, please do not do that.
请千万不要这样做。
Please do not do that.
你们在这里是作为事实的裁决者。
You're here to be judges of the facts.
发生了吗？
Did it happen?
没有发生。
It didn't happen.
对于一件根本没有发生的事，一美元都太多了。
1p is too much for something that did not happen.
对斯佩西先生来说，这并不是关于钱的问题。
And for mister Spacey, this is not about the money.
对斯佩西先生来说，这关乎那天的真相。
For mister Spacey, this is about the truth of that day.
他被冤枉了，他恳请你们根据证据做出唯一合理的裁决。
He was falsely accused, and he asks you to come to the only decision justified by the evidence.
当你们拿到裁决表时，会看到第一行写着：斯佩西先生是否...
When you get the verdict form, you will see that the very first line says, Did Mr.
拉普是否以优势证据证明了斯佩西先生...
Rapp prove by a preponderance of the evidence that Mr.
福勒触碰了拉普先生的性器官或私密部位吗？
Fowler touched a sexual or intimate part or parts of Mr.
拉普先生？
Rapp?
这是一个可以用是或否回答的问题。
It's got a yes or a no.
他证明了吗？
Did he prove it?
他证明了吗？
Did he prove it?
如果答案是否定的，请在此停止并作出裁决。
And if the answer is no, stop here and return your verdict.
这就是我请求你们做的。
That's what I ask you to do.
去回答第一个问题，勾选‘否’，然后作出裁决。
Go to that first question, check no, and return a verdict.
因为完全没有证据表明这件事发生过，反而有大量证据证明它没有发生。
Because there is absolutely no evidence that this happened and plenty of evidence that it did not.
谢谢各位女士们、先生们。
Thank you, ladies and gentlemen.
卡普兰法官做了简要总结，并指导陪审团如何填写裁决表。
Judge Kaplan gave a brief summing up and instructed the jury on how to fill in the verdict sheet.
一共有七个问题。
There were a series of questions, seven in total.
陪审团的任务细致且有些复杂。
The jury's job was detailed and a little complicated.
或许察觉到这一点，卡普兰法官向陪审团保证，他们能够胜任这项任务，而且他们都是聪明的人。
Perhaps sensing this, Judge Kaplan assured the jury they were up to the task and that they were all intelligent people.
引号结束。
End quote.
就这样结束了。
And that was that.
所有论点都已提出，所有证据都已审查、交叉审查并再次审查。
All the arguments had been made, all the evidence examined, cross examined, and examined again.
近两周来，陪审团一直坐着聆听双方的陈述。
For almost two weeks, the jury had sat and listened to both sides.
而现在，唯一剩下的事就是他们要决定谁在说真话。
And now the only thing left was for them to decide who was telling the truth.
涉案金额高达四千万美元，是一笔巨款。
There was $40,000,000 on the line, a lot of money.
但对于当事人而言，所涉及的远不止这些。
But for the protagonists, so much more was at stake.
斯佩西声称，有罪判决将玷污一个无辜者的声誉，并进一步摧毁他的生活。
Spacey was claiming a guilty verdict would smear an innocent man's reputation and further destroy his life.
但另一方面，如果拉普说的是实情，那么判决斯佩西胜诉将让一位富有而有权势的演员逃脱一项恶劣罪行，使受害者得不到任何补偿。
But on the other hand, if Rapp was telling the truth, a verdict in Spacey's favor would allow a wealthy and powerful actor to get away with a heinous crime, leaving the victim without recompense.
在某种程度上，陪审团也在决定，是否因媒体失职和道德恐慌而仓促做出了判断。
To some extent, the jury was also deciding whether there'd been a rush to judgment caused by media malpractice and a meet to moral panic.
事实正在受审，但社会也在受审。
The facts were on trial, but so was society.
陪审团将决定凯文·史派西的正当程序权利是否在2037年那场异常疯狂的#MeToo浪潮中丧失了。
The jury would decide if Kevin Spacey's right to due process was lost in that particularly weird Me Too frenzy of 2037.
所有人都预料陪审团会进行长时间的审议。
Everyone was expecting a long deliberation by the jury.
需要梳理两周的证据，还有大量证人、证词和物证。
There was two weeks of evidence to sift through and a lot of witnesses and depositions and exhibits.
但随后传来消息，陪审团仅用四十分钟就作出了裁决。
But then word came, there was a verdict after just forty minutes.
史派西的律师珍妮弗·凯勒和蔡斯·斯科尼克还记得消息传来时的那一刻。
Spacey's lawyers, Jennifer Keller and Chase Skolnick remembered the moment the news came through.
裁决来得如此出人意料，以至于史派西根本找不到人。
It was so unexpectedly early that Spacey was nowhere to be found.
实际上他们 deliberation 的时间比报道的还要短，因为我们的当事人去吃点东西了，而法庭食堂却关门了。
They were actually out a lot less than the time reported because our client had gone to get a bite to eat and the courtroom cafeteria was closed.
他们不允许你使用手机。
They will not allow you to use cell phones.
你进来时必须上交手机、电脑和其他所有电子设备。
You have to surrender your cell phone and your computers and everything when you come in.
所以他们出去了。
So they had gone out.
陪审团刚刚退庭商议。
The jury had just retired.
他们最多只出去了半小时到四十分钟，就在这时，法警告诉我们陪审团已经达成裁决。
They were only out maybe half an hour to forty minutes at most when the marshal told us that they had a verdict.
我们必须找到凯文。
And we had to find Kevin.
于是我们派人到法院附近的所有咖啡馆寻找他们，亲自逐一查看，最终把他们找了回来。
So we sent somebody out looking for them in all the cafes near the courthouse, physically looking at them, they finally fetched them back.
我想他们实际上是在大约一个半小时或一小时二十分钟时宣读了裁决结果？
And I guess they they actually read the verdict at about, what, an hour and a half or hour and twenty minutes?
差不多就是这个时间。
That's about right.
是的。
Yeah.
但他们回来得很快，非常快。
But they were back fast, really fast.
最终，看起来陪审团几乎没有进行多少讨论或审议，就一致决定了事情的经过。
In the end, it looked like the jury didn't have to engage in very much debate or deliberation to unanimously decide what had happened.
以下是陪审团宣读判决的重现。
Here's a reenactment of the jury delivering the verdict.
Wrap先生是否已通过优势证据证明，Fowler先生触碰了Wrap先生的性器官或私密部位？
Did mister Wrap prove by a preponderance of the evidence that mister Fowler touched a sexual or intimate part or parts of mister Wrap?
没有。
No.
好的。
Alright.
是否有基于诉讼时效的驳回动议？
Is there a motion to dismiss on the grounds of the statute of limitations?
有的，法官大人。
There is, your honor.
案件驳回。
Case dismissed.
各位，还有其他事情吗？
Anything else, folks?
没有了，法官大人。
No, your honor.
好的。
Okay.
谢谢。
Thank you.
就这样结束了，距离案件开始才五年。
And it was over that quickly, five years after it began.
这并没有让詹妮弗·凯勒感到惊讶。
This didn't surprise Jennifer Keller.
是的，速度很快。
Yeah, it was fast.
我的感觉是，当他们这么快就回来时，一定是陪审团作出了对我们有利的裁决，因为我无法想象任何人会带着支持原告的裁决回来，除非花了好几天甚至更久的时间去游说。
My feeling was when they came back that fast, it had to be a verdict in our favor because I could not picture anybody coming in with a verdict for the plaintiff unless it took days and days and days of arm twisting.
我真的无法想象会有一个支持原告的裁决。
I couldn't really picture a verdict for the plaintiff.
但我知道他们的律师很有信心。
But I know that their attorney was confident.
他对结果感觉相当不错。
He felt pretty good about it.
而这一裁决完全是有利于被告的，表明斯派西先生
And that verdict was completely a defense verdict, showing Mr.
不负责任，并且证实了斯派西先生
Spacey was not liable, and showing and confirming that Mr.
拉普的指控是虚假的。
Rapp's allegations were false.
令人惊讶的是，经过这么多年，拉普先生的故事长期以来被媒体盲目相信，从未受到质疑，而一个公正、聪明、受过教育的陪审团仅用五十或五十五分钟就看穿了他的谎言。
And it was remarkable that after all of these years, after Mr.
拉普先生的故事长期以来被媒体盲目相信，从未受到质疑，而一个公正、聪明、受过教育的陪审团仅用五十或五十五分钟就看穿了他的谎言。
Rapp's story was blindly believed and not questioned the media for so long by so many, that all it took was fifty or fifty five minutes for an impartial, intelligent, educated jury to see through his lies.
这是一个充满情感的时刻。
It was an emotional moment.
我们当然非常兴奋，因为我们一直都知道这些指控是谎言。
We were thrilled, needless to say, because we realized all along that these allegations were lies.
我们非常高兴陪审团看到了真相。
And we were so pleased that the jury saw the truth.
但对于拉普先生来说，
But for Mr.
这对他来说一直是一场噩梦。
Spacey, this has been a nightmare.
噩梦。
Nightmare.
到那时，他已经是个长达五年的噩梦。
He'd been a nightmare for over five years at that point.
终于，他有机会澄清事实。
And finally, had his opportunity to set the record straight.
终于，他有了在法庭上陈述的机会。
Finally, he had his day in court.
为了有机会讲述他的故事——真相。
For his opportunity to tell his story, the truth.
他如释重负，欣喜地看到陪审团看清了真相。
And he was so relieved and pleased that the jury saw the truth.
Spacey的清白本应成为重大新闻。
Spacey's vindication should have been a huge news story.
然而，媒体对这场审判的报道却寥寥无几。
However, there had been only sporadic media coverage of the trial.
起初有一些关注，而在Spacey揭露他新纳粹父亲和充满暴力的童年之后，也出现了几篇文章。
There was some interest at the beginning and a few articles after Spacey's revelations about his neo Nazi father and violence filled childhood.
但几乎没有文章详细报道安东尼·拉普指控的逐步瓦解。
But there were few articles detailing the gradual dismantling of Anthony Rapp's allegations.
由于报道如此之少，宣判Spacey无罪的结果让外界感到震惊。
With so little coverage, the verdict exonerating Spacey came as a shock to the outside world.
评论也指出，这一判决结果令人震惊。
And it was also the commentary was what a shock the verdict was.
真是令人震惊的意外。
What a shocking surprise.
但对于一直关注此事的人来说，这并不意外。
It wasn't a shocking surprise to anybody who had followed it.
所以回到媒体的问题上。
And so back to the media.
为什么他们对审判结果如此震惊？
Why were they so shocked at the outcome of the trial?
他们毫不犹豫地将性侵者凯文·史派西的故事传遍全球。
They hadn't hesitated to blast the story of sexual predator Kevin Spacey across the planet.
难道他们不应该持续关注这场决定该指控是否属实的庭审吗？
Shouldn't they have had an ongoing interest in the court case deciding if that claim was true?
显然没有。
Apparently not.
虽然有过简略的报道，但在判决结果不符合最初戏剧性的#MeToo叙事后，报道更少了。
There was cursory coverage, but even less after the verdict didn't fit the initial dramatic Me Too themed story.
史派西的律师珍妮弗·凯勒和蔡斯·斯科尼克对报道的深度和基调进行了严厉批评。
Spacey's lawyers, Jennifer Keller and Chase Skolnick, were scathing about the depth and tenor of the coverage.
在这个案件中，由于凯文·史派西即将出庭作证，他们确实报道了史派西。
In this case, because Kevin Spacey was going to be taking the stand, they did cover Spacey.
他们也报道了拉普，但我真的没看到任何关于拉布在庭上如何被彻底击垮的深入讨论。
And they also covered rap, but they really didn't I didn't see any repertorial discussion of how thoroughly Raab was destroyed on the stand.
他作证之后，就什么都没剩下了。
There was nothing left after he testified.
他们还发表了刻薄且无关的评论，说Spacey拿他父亲是新纳粹分子这件事开玩笑，比如。
And they made snide and irrelevant comments about Spacey making making fun of his revealing that his dad had been a neo Nazi, for example.
这些信息的披露并非为了替什么开脱，而是为了帮助解释他为何一直如此不愿让人知道他是同性恋。
That only came out not to justify anything, but to help explain why he had been so reticent about ever letting anybody know he was gay.
他的父亲是个令人恐惧的人物，不仅让人不敢公开自己的性取向，也让他学会了保守秘密，凡事深藏不露，因为他的父亲实在太可怕了。
His father was a terrifying figure not just letting people know he was gay, but also why he had learned to keep secrets, why he had learned to stay so private, keep everything close to the vest because his father was such a scary guy.
但媒体的报道却基本变成了：Spacey把性侵指控归咎于他父亲是新纳粹分子。
And instead the coverage was basically Spacey blames molesting Rap on his father being a neo Nazi.
对吧？
Right?
我同意。
I agree.
审判期间的报道进一步凸显了媒体的偏见。
The coverage during trial only underscored the media's bias.
一开始就能看出，他们希望Rapp赢，希望Kevin输。
At the beginning you could tell they were rooting for Rapp to win and Kevin to lose.
但开庭陈述之后，气氛变得稍微安静了一些。
But after opening statement it was a little bit quieter.
然后在珍妮弗对拉普先生进行交叉质询之后，
And then after Jennifer's cross examination of Mr.
她彻底击垮了他。
Rapp, she just eviscerated him.
现场更加安静了。
It was even quieter.
甚至都没有人报道这件事。
It was not even covered.
因为这次交叉质询太过致命，让他之后完全丧失了可信度。
That it was just such a devastating cross examination that he had no credibility after that.
但媒体根本没有任何报道。
But the media didn't pick it up at all.
所以我认为这不过是整个审判过程中一贯的常态罢了。
So I think it was just par for the course, what we'd seen throughout the entire trial.
与听说过这些指控的人数相比，很少有人知道曾有过法庭案件，以及斯派西被宣告无罪。
Compared to the number of people who heard about the allegations, few are aware there was a court case and Spacey was exonerated.
想想最初报道与庭审之间的新闻覆盖差异。
Think about the difference between the news coverage of the initial story versus the trial.
你知道斯派西是在2022年10月被宣告无罪的吗？
Did you know Spacey was exonerated in October 2022?
我是媒体的重度消费者，但老实说，我不确定当时是否知道这件事。
I'm a huge consumer of the media, and to be honest, I'm not sure if I was even aware of it at the time.
蔡斯·斯科尼克是这样总结的。
Chase Skolnick summed it up this way.
嗯，拉普先生和他的指控在2017年他接受BuzzFeed杂志采访时所获得的舆论关注是压倒性的。
Well, the publicity that Mr.
当时全球范围内都是铺天盖地的报道。
Rapp and his allegations received in 2017 when he came forward with his BuzzFeed magazine interview was overwhelming.
这是一场全球性的全方位报道。
It was wall to wall coverage around the world.
他不仅被相信，还被奉为英雄。
And he was not only believed but celebrated.
他接受了各大杂志、媒体和电视的采访。
He received interviews in major magazines, publications and on TV.
他获得了奖项，甚至在某些情况下被评为年度人物。
He received awards, and in one case was even the Person of the Year.
然而，在审判期间，随着凯文被宣告无罪，却并未获得同等程度的报道，令人遗憾。
And again, at trial, now that Kevin's been exonerated, there hasn't been the same level of coverage, unfortunately.
同样，也没有同等程度的报道来澄清事实。
There hasn't been the same level of coverage setting the record straight.
那些曾经盲目报道拉布先生指控的媒体，如今却不幸地保持沉默。
These same outlets that so blindly reported Mr.
如今真相已经揭晓，凯文也由公正的陪审团宣告无罪。
Raab's allegations are, unfortunately, silent now.
如今真相已经揭晓，凯文也由公正的陪审团宣告无罪。
Now that the truth has come out and been revealed, and now that Kevin has been exonerated by an impartial jury.
这真是不幸的。
And that is unfortunate.
这里是克里斯蒂·泽里拉，《洛杉矶时报》的娱乐记者。
Here's Christy Zerilla, the Los Angeles Times entertainment reporter.
我们在第一集中听过她的发言。
We heard from her in episode one.
这有点悲剧，因为你知道，凯文·史派西无法回来澄清说‘我没错’，并重建他的事业。
It's a little bit tragic because, you know, Kevin Spacey can't come back and say, I was right, and put his career back together.
事情没那么简单。
It's not as clear cut as that.
我认为，凯文·史派西只是在时机上不幸地与那些被指控的最恶劣的人混在了一起。
And I I think I think, you know, Spacey fell in with the worst of the worst who were being accused, just timing, timing wise.
他和一些长期犯下严重恶行的人待在一起。
He was in there with some people who had done some very bad things for a very long time.
他属于那种人吗？
Is he one of those people?
我不知道。
I don't know.
我不知道。
I don't know.
但时机让他陷入了一连串预设的行动，这些行动彻底摧毁了他的事业。
But the timing set him up for a prescribed series of actions that were to happen that devastated his career.
蔡斯·斯科尼克表示，斯派西案是过度纠正如何摧毁无辜者并颂扬说谎者的例子。
Chase Skolnick says the Spacey case is an example of how an overcorrection can end up destroying innocent people and celebrating liars.
我们正处于#MeToo运动之中，这确实是有必要的，因为长期以来，人们一直逍遥法外，做了太多过分的事，但当钟摆过度偏向一方时，就会出现问题，我认为我们已经达到了这个临界点。
We're in the middle of the Me Too movement, and it was something that needed to happen because for far too long people have gotten away with far too much, but there comes a point when the pendulum has swung too far in one direction, and I think we've hit that point.
我认为，现在人们在没有质疑的情况下盲目相信指控。
I think we've hit the point where people are being believed blindly without question.
而且，拉普先生
And Mr.
他的指控正是这一点的典型代表，对吧？
Rapp is and his allegations are the epitome of that, right?
而多年来，他因提出明显虚假的指控而一直被无条件地推崇和相信。
Where, again, for years he has been celebrated and believed for making demonstrably false allegations without question.
而且同样地，仅需稍加调查，陪审团就在几分钟内看清了真相。
And again, within minutes, the jury was able to see the truth with just the slightest probing.
而且同样地，拉普先生
And again, Mr.
拉普先生继续外出接受采访，并且继续受到追捧。
Rapp continues to go out and do interviews and he continues to be celebrated.
到目前为止，他已被证实是个骗子。
At this point he is a proven liar.
但他依然在接受采访，依然在获得角色和工作。
And he still is getting interviews and he still is getting roles and jobs.
蔡斯·戈尔尼克表示，事后的局面反映了现代道德的糟糕状况。
Chase Golnick says the aftermath is a poor reflection of modern mores.
嗯，我对这反映出的社会状况感到不满。
Well, I'm unhappy with what it says about our society.
我对这反映出我们社会和文化中公正性的缺失感到不满。
I'm unhappy with what it says about our impartiality as a society and in our culture.
因为我们不仅抛弃了‘未经证实即推定无罪’的原则，这里的情况更是有人已被证明无罪。
Because not only have we abandoned innocent until proven guilty, here we have a situation where someone has been proven innocent.
审判已经结束了。
The trial's over.
他已被宣告无罪。
He's been exonerated.
但似乎媒体中的许多人仍然没有明白这一点。
And it seems that many people in the media still haven't gotten it.
克里斯蒂·泽里拉表示，这个案件让她意识到对每个人而言正当程序的重要性。
Christie Zerilla said the case has made her realize the importance of due process for everyone.
‘我也是’运动让我对被指控者产生了更多同情，也让我更加重视‘未经证实即推定无罪’这一理念。
Me Too wound up giving me a lot more sympathy for the accused and a lot higher appreciation of the notion of innocent until proven guilty.
我更深刻地理解了为什么这对我们的司法体系如此关键。
Like, I I understood on a deeper level why that is so vital to our system of justice.
因为否则的话，这就成了暴民统治，成了谁更受欢迎、谁的支持者有多少社交媒体粉丝的问题。
Because otherwise, it's it's mob rule and it's popularity and it's who can you get on your side and how many social media followers do your supporters have?
因为突然之间，他们能让你在错了的时候显得是对的。
Because all of a sudden, they can make you right when you were wrong.
她不仅责怪媒体，还责怪公众，似乎公众对 exoneration 带来的剧情反转兴趣寥寥。
And she blames not just the media, but the public who seem to have less of an appetite for a twist in the tale that comes with an exoneration.
我们已经就此写过文章。
We've written about it.
但读者并不买账。
The readership isn't there.
所以，这几乎像是责备是双向的。
So it's it's almost like the blame goes both ways.
是的。
Yeah.
记者和媒体整体而言，用‘责备’这个词显然不太合适。
Journalists, the media, writ large, are definitely blame's the wrong word.
但确实，当一件事得到解决并结束时，就没那么吸引人了。
But, yes, it is a fact that the it's less exciting when something is resolved and it's over.
因此，媒体在故事的结尾阶段投入的人力不会像开头那样多。
So the media is not gonna put as much manpower on the end as it does in the beginning of a story.
但责任是双向的，因为虽然媒体不会为一个即将崩塌的案件投入十个人，但读者也不会为此买单。
But the burden goes both ways because while the media is not throwing 10 people at a case just falling apart, the readers aren't showing up for that either.
也许吧。
Perhaps.
但在#MeToo运动期间，曾出现过书籍、电影、播客和戏剧。
But there had been books, movies, podcasts, and plays the Me Too movement.
几乎所有的作品都接受了这些指控的表面说法。
Almost all have accepted the allegations at face value.
当我第一次听到这个故事时，我确实认为凯文·史派西是有罪的。
I certainly assumed Kevin Spacey was guilty when I first heard the story.
但我们需要意识到，故事背后往往还有另一层真相。
But we need to realize that there is often a story behind the story.
我不知道有记者与所谓的受害者串通，使斯派西难以反驳这些指控。
I didn't know that a journalist colluded with the apparent victim to make it difficult for Spacey to refute the allegations.
我不知道这个故事中包含了许多不实信息，这些信息通过极其简单的调查——甚至只是瞥一眼维基百科——就能证明是错误的。
I didn't know that there were a number of facts in the story that were not true and could be proven false by extremely basic research, including glancing at Wikipedia.
大多数人认为记者是诚实的，事实都经过核实。
Most people assume journalists are honest and the facts have been checked.
但当一场道德恐慌遇上一个渴望点击率的媒体机构，以及一位愿意歪曲事实、隐瞒能证明清白的信息以强化朋友故事的记者时，会发生什么？
But what happens when a moral panic meets an outlet desperate for clicks and a journalist willing to misrepresent and withhold exonerating facts to make his friend's story seem stronger?
于是你就会得到一个摧毁了一个人一生的故事，但当它在法庭上被审查时，却迅速崩塌了。
Then you get a story that destroyed a man's life, but quickly fell apart when it was examined in court.
到目前为止，凯文·斯派西面对的三起独立诉讼都已告败。
So far, Kevin Spacey has seen three separate court proceedings against him collapse.
在我们制作这个播客时，他正在英国面临进一步的刑事指控。
As we are producing this podcast, he's facing further criminal charges in The UK.
该审判定于2023年6月下旬开庭。
That trial is due to open late June twenty twenty three.
英国的藐视法庭法律非常严格，禁止媒体在审判前报道大量信息。
The UK has very, very strict contempt of court laws, preventing the media from reporting a lot of information in advance of the trial.
由于这些限制，此案的媒体报道非常少，因此我对这些指控了解不多。
Because of these restrictions, there has been very little media coverage of the case, so I don't know much about the allegations.
但我知道，我们有责任对针对凯文·史派西的指控保持怀疑态度。
But I do know we owe it to Kevin Spacey skeptical of the claims made against him.
我们也应该对报道这些指控的记者保持怀疑。
And we owe it to him to be skeptical of the journalists reporting such allegations.
我作为一名记者这样说。
And I say that as a journalist.
但我们对每个人，而不仅仅是史派西，都有这样的责任。
But we owe it to everyone, not just Spacey.
媒体运动和封杀行为起初可能令人感到痛快，但它们是缺乏辨别力的工具，可能会误伤无辜者和有罪者。
Media campaigns and cancellations may seem satisfying at first, but they are undiscerning instruments that can catch the innocent as well as the guilty.
那么，当所有有罪者都被找到后，会发生什么？
And what happens when all the guilty are found?
暴民必须找到新的目标。
The mob has to find its new victims.
下次，可能就是你或你爱的人。
Next time, it could be you or someone you love.
《凯文·史派西审判：未剪辑版》是《未报道故事协会》的项目。
The Trial of Kevin Spacey, unfiltered, is a project of the unreported story society.
本节目由菲兰·麦卡利尔、弗吉尼亚·亚伯拉罕和安妮·麦克伦尼研究与撰写。
It is researched and written by Phelan McAleer, Virginia Abram, and Anne McElhenny.
旁白由安妮·麦克伦尼担任。
Narrated by Anne McElhenny.
音乐、剪辑与音效设计由马克·阿拉米安负责。
Music, editing, and sound design by Mark Aramean.
制作人：菲兰·麦卡利尔、玛格达莱娜·塞加达和安妮·麦克伦尼。
Produced by Phelan McAleer, Magdalena Segada, and Anne McAlehenny.
执行制片人：安妮·麦克伦尼、玛格达莱娜·塞盖达和菲兰·麦克尔希。
Executive producers, Anne McElhenny, Magdalena Segeda and Phelan McElhir.
重演片段由基夫·舒尔执导。
Reenactments directed by Kiff Schull.
重演片段由克利福德·舒尔饰演卡普兰法官，卡尔·戴维森饰演蔡斯·斯科尼克。
Reenactments performed by Clifford Schull as Judge Kaplan, Carl Davidson as Chase Skolnick.
以及詹姆斯·戴尔饰演理查德·施蒂格曼。
And James Dale as Richard Steigman.
米歇尔·加德纳饰演詹妮弗·凯勒。
Michelle Gardner as Jennifer Keller.
录音工程师：
Recording engineers.
摩根·格哈德。
Morgan Gerhard.
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