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嘿，我是你的朋友梅尔，欢迎收听梅尔·罗宾斯播客。
Hey, it's your friend Mel, and welcome to the Mel Robbins Podcast.
你有没有参加过葬礼，然后一离开就感到一种强烈的紧迫感？
Have you ever gone to a funeral and noticed that as soon as you leave, you have this deep urgency.
你会想，我必须允许自己好好生活。
You're like, I I I have to allow myself to live my life.
或者你参加婚礼时，会重新意识到相爱是多么非凡的事。
Or you go to a wedding and you are reminded of just how extraordinary it is to be in love.
这些时刻，仿佛生命的能量正从你体内流过。
These moments, it's as if the force of life is moving through you.
今天你听这场对话时，也会经历这样的感受。
Well, that's gonna happen to you as you listen to the conversation today.
它会对你产生变革性和深远的影响，因为你即将听到最重要的情感建议。
It will have a transformational and profound effect on you because you're about to hear the most important relationship advice.
我们今天的专家将用一种你从未听过的角度来谈论爱。
Our expert today is gonna talk about love in a way that you've never heard before.
他还会教你成功关系中的简单习惯。
He's also gonna teach you the simple habits of successful relationships.
对我个人而言，这是我在本播客中听过的最具影响力的一次对话，我迫不及待想让你和你所爱的每个人都能体验到。
For me personally, this is one of the most impactful conversations I have ever had on this podcast, and I cannot wait for you and everybody that you love to experience it.
嘿，我是你的朋友梅尔，欢迎来到梅尔·罗宾斯播客。
Hey, it's your friend Mel, and welcome to the Mel Robbins podcast.
我非常高兴你在这里。
I am so excited that you're here.
能与你相聚总是我的荣幸。
It's always an honor to be together.
能与你共度时光总是我的荣幸。
It's always an honor to spend time with you.
但今天，我实在等不及了。
But today, I can't wait.
如果你是新听众，或者因为有人分享了这一集而来到这里，我想花一点时间，亲自欢迎你加入梅尔·罗宾斯播客大家庭。
And if you're a new listener or you're here because someone shared this episode with you, I wanna take a moment and personally welcome you to the Mel Robbins Podcast family.
今天，你将听到有史以来最棒的恋爱建议。
Today, you're going to learn the best relationship advice that you will ever hear.
今天的嘉宾塞克顿是关系领域的世界权威，但他的视角可能出乎你的意料。
Today's guest, Sexton, is a world renowned authority on relationships, but coming from a perspective you may not expect.
他是畅销书《如何保持爱情》的作者，但他同时也是全球顶尖的离婚律师之一，这意味着数十年来，他一直近距离目睹婚姻破裂的原因。
He's the author of the bestselling book, How to Stay in Love, but he also happens to be one of the top divorce attorneys in the world, which means for decades, he has had a front row seat to the reason why marriages fall apart.
他将告诉你，大多数分手并不是因为发生了灾难性事件。
And he's gonna tell you, most breakups don't happen because of something catastrophic.
而是源于日积月累、被所有人忽视的小错误。
They result from the little mistakes over time that everyone misses.
今天，他会告诉你这些错误是什么，并让你相信，一些微小的改变才是建立持久而充满爱的关系的关键。
Today, he'll teach you what those mistakes are and convince you that a few small changes are the secret to creating lasting and loving relationships.
闲话少说，让我们热烈欢迎詹姆斯·塞克顿来到《梅尔·罗宾斯播客》。
Without further ado, please help me welcome James Sexton to the Mel Robbins Podcast.
詹姆斯·塞克顿，欢迎来到《梅尔·罗宾斯播客》。
James Sexton, welcome to the Mel Robbins podcast.
很高兴来到这里。
Great to be here.
我有很多问题想问你，但我想先从这一点开始。
I have so many questions for you, but where I wanna start is this.
如果我认真对待你今天要教我的一切，并将其应用到我的生活和关系中，我的生活会发生什么变化？
How could my life be different if I take everything to heart that you're about to teach me today and I apply it to my life and my relationship, what what what could change?
是的。
Yeah.
作为一名执业超过二十五年的离婚律师，我拥有一个非常独特的视角。
I mean, I think, you know, as a practicing divorce lawyer for twenty five plus years, I have a really unique vantage point.
你知道吗？
You know?
很多人获得和给出的恋爱建议，都来自心理学背景。
A lot of relationship advice that people get and people give, it it's coming from a psychology background.
它们来自一种假设性的、理论性的背景。
It's coming from a a hypothetical theoretical background.
而且，这当然很有价值，但不像亲身经历那样，也不是如此真实坦率的版本。
And, again, it has tremendous value, but it's not like in the trenches, and it's not this really raw candid version.
因为我觉得人们总是对治疗师撒谎，但他们不会对律师撒谎。
Because I think people lie to their therapists all the time, but they don't lie to their lawyer.
你的医生和律师是你在任何情况下都不应该欺骗的两个人。
Like, your doctor and your lawyer are the two people you should never lie to under any circumstances.
我们所做的一切都是为了保护你，我们所说的一切都受保密特权保护。
Everything we're doing is to protect you, and everything we're saying is subject to privilege.
所以你可以向我们坦诚地说出真实情况。
So you can tell us the raw, candid truth.
我认为这让我对……有了一个独特的视角。
And I think that's created in me a a unique perspective on you know?
比如，如果你想弄清楚如何保持汽车的良好状态，就别去问汽车销售员。
Like, if you wanted to figure out how to keep your car in good shape, don't talk to the car salesman.
他们只接触新车。
All they do is deal with new cars.
去找修车师傅。
Talk to the mechanic.
去找那个见过汽车所有可能出问题方式的人，他会告诉你：嘿。
Like, talk to the person who's seen every way a car can break down and will say to you, hey.
这些是容易出问题的地方。
Here's the stress points.
这里是我发现这种车型常出故障的地方，以及如何加强和预防这些问题。
Here's where I find this model of car tends to break, and here's how you could shore that up and prevent it.
所以我试图给人们的，不是一些空洞的陈词滥调，比如‘你需要保持联系’，这到底是什么意思？
So a lot of what I try to give people instead of, like, platitudes, like, oh, you need to maintain connection with your like, what does that mean?
我需要知道这具体指的是什么。
Like, I I need to know what that means.
如果我想修复或维持我的关系，而你却说‘保持联系’。
Like, if I'm trying to fix my relationship or keep my relationship on track and you say, stay connected.
好的。
Okay.
你是说，比如约会之夜或者更多性生活？
Do you mean, like, a date night or more sex?
还是我们应该去度假？
Or should we go on vacation?
还是我们在一起吃早餐时应该问不同的问题？
Or should I be different questions when we're having breakfast together?
我们是不是应该一起吃早餐？
Should we be having breakfast together?
你的意思到底是什么？
Like, what what do you mean?
我需要实际可行的办法。
Like, I need practical things.
因为作为一名律师，你知道，我懂什么并不重要。
Because as a lawyer, you know, like, it doesn't matter what I know.
重要的是我能够证明什么。
It matters what I can prove.
所以我不只是需要以那种宽泛的方式思考，就像研究人员或心理学家可能会做的那样。
So I don't just have to think in these broad ways that, you know, maybe a researcher or a psychologist can.
我必须具体地想，好吧。
I have to think, okay.
什么能证明某件事？
What can demonstrate something?
什么样的证据能支持我所提出的内容？
What is evidence to support what it is that I'm putting out there?
所以我认为，你从这次对话中带走的，应该是这样一种感觉：我现在可以为关系带来一些实际、具体的行动，这些并不复杂，也不需要我购买任何东西。
So I think what you could walk out of this conversation with is a feeling of I have practical, specific things that I can now bring to my relationship that aren't complicated, that don't require me to buy anything.
它们只需要我认同某项任务或某种日常惯例。
They just require me to buy into a task or a routine.
如果你在听完这次对话后，能将这一点带入关系中，我认为你们关系中的挑战可能会得到改善。
And if if you can bring that to the table after this conversation, I think you'll actually see challenges in your relationship potentially improve.
或者，如果你足够幸运，正处于一段稳固的关系中，你会发现自己在维持这种状态。
Or if you're fortunate enough to be in a place where your relationship is strong, you'll find yourself kind of maintaining that.
因为你知道，保持健康比等它垮了再想重新开始要容易得多。
Because, you know, it's a whole lot easier to maintain fitness than to let it fall apart and then try to get back on track.
就像最初的几英里特别难，而我的目标正是通过我见过成千上万人犯过的错误来帮助人们。
Like, those first miles are so hard, and that's really what the goal is is to to help people by learning from the mistakes I've now seen thousands of people make.
只是让他们维持一段良好的关系。
Just keep their relationship in a good place.
你来得太好了，因为我真的不想犯那些错误。
I am so excited you're here because I don't wanna make those mistakes.
很好。
Good.
关于你提到的健身这个例子，你说保持它可能更容易。
And what's interesting about that example of fitness is you said it can be easier to maintain it.
我觉得放任它下滑和维持它一样容易。
I think it's almost equally easy to let it fall off as it is to maintain it.
关键在于，当你开始下滑时，是否理解那些微小的调节杠杆。
It's really whether or not you understand those little levers when you start to fall off.
因为就像健身一样，你的关系中现在可能有一些方面正在下滑，而你甚至没有意识到，这是一个重大错误，最终会让你坐在像你这样的詹姆斯面前。
Because just like fitness, there are probably areas in your relationship right now where you are falling off and you don't even realize this is a major mistake that will land you in front of somebody like you, James.
是的。
Yeah.
而且，下滑的感觉在一段时间内就像在飞翔。
And and and falling feels like flying for a little while.
你是什么意思？
What do you mean?
就像，感觉很好。
Like, it feels good.
你知道的？
You know?
当事情处于一种顺其自然的状态时
Like, when things are sort of coasting
对。
Yes.
而且你会觉得，因为现在有太多事情涌向我们，是的。
And you kinda go because there's just so much coming at us Yes.
在这个世界上。
In the world.
所以你就想，好吧。
And so to go, alright.
我有我的人。
I got my person.
我把这个稳住了。
I got that locked down.
我可以去操心其他所有事情，孩子、工作，你知道的，世界上发生的一切，其他所有事。
I can worry about all this other stuff, the kids, work, you know, what's going on in the world, everything else.
因为我拥有这个。
Because I have this.
我很好。
I'm good.
我很好。
I'm good.
我们会坚持下去，因为我们有彼此。
We'll hold we we have each other.
我们戴着戒指。
We we're wearing a ring.
我们在认真经营这段关系。
We're doing the whole thing.
我们的关系已经深入了。
Like, we're we're in.
我们再也不用为那件事担心了。
We don't have to worry about that anymore.
但与此同时，不，
And meanwhile, like, no.
那是你得去给那盆植物浇水的事。
That's that's that you gotta water that plant.
就像，那种你一直在寻找的关系，当你找到它的时候，它显得如此重要。
Like, that's a that's a relationship that when you were looking for it, it was so important.
当你找到它的时候，你因为找到了它而感到无比幸福。
And when you found it, you were so happy that you found it.
你知道，我们常常犯一个错误，以为爱是永久赐予我们的。
You know, we make the mistake of thinking love is, like, permanently gifted to us.
它只是借来的。
It's loaned.
每一段婚姻都会结束。
Like, every marriage ends.
它会以死亡或离婚告终，但终究会结束。
It ends in death or divorce, but it ends.
这是一件有点奇怪的事，你对别人说：我希望你的是以死亡告终。
And and it's one of those weird things, like, to say to someone, I hope it ends in death for you.
但说真的，这就是事实。
Like but but it's the truth.
我希望你的婚姻以死亡告终，因为另一种结局就是离婚。
Like, I hope your marriage ends in death because the other way that it's gonna end is divorce.
大多数婚姻都以离婚收场。
And the majority of marriages end in divorce.
超过百分之五十的婚姻以离婚结束。
Over fifty percent end in divorce.
而这还只是那些彻底失败的婚姻。
So and that's just the ones that catastrophically failed.
想想有多少人，你知道的，婚姻表面上成功了，没离婚，但他们并不幸福。
Like, think about how many people, you know, succeeded in marriage, but, you know, they meaning they didn't divorce, but they're unhappy.
他们从未真正成为最真实的自己。
They never really become the most authentic version of themselves.
他们为了孩子而维持婚姻，只是不想分走一半财产。
They stay together for the kids because they don't wanna give away half their things.
这算什么？
What is that?
再有10%、20%？
Another 10%, 20%?
现在你有一个失败率高达70%的事情，但我们却说：咱们干吧。
Now you have something that fails 70% of the time, and yet we are like, let's do it.
我们得让人去报名参加这个。
We gotta sign people up for this.
这是一件很棒的事。
It's a great thing.
即使有人告诉你他要结婚了，如果你反问：真的吗？
It's a like, even if someone says I'm getting married, if you were to say, really?
为什么？
Why?
这会显得很无礼。
It would be rude.
问这个问题是很不礼貌的。
That's a rude question to ask.
但与此同时，你正在做一件大约有50%到70%失败率的事情。
But meanwhile, you're doing something that fails roughly 50 to 70% of time.
说‘为什么’并不算过分。
It's not unreasonable to say why.
我认为关键问题是，这就是为什么我说，坠落的感觉就像在飞翔，直到你撞上地面。
And and I think the big issue is and that's why I I say, like, falling feels like flying for a little while until you hit the ground.
因为有时候当你意识到‘这段婚姻已经不再是个好地方’时，问题已经积重难返，很难回头了。
Because sometimes by the time you realize, oh, this marriage is not a good place anymore, it's real far gone, and it's real hard to come back.
你知道的吧？
You know?
所以当人们说，‘你知道吗，离婚的首要原因是什么？’
And that's why when people say, like, oh, what you know, what's the number one cause of divorce?
其实，缺乏连接才是离婚的首要原因，但还有很多其他由缺乏连接衍生出的症状，人们容易把这些当作原因，说‘这就是问题所在’，但其实它们并不是根本原因。
It's like, disconnection is the number one cause of divorce, but there's a whole bunch of other symptoms that come from disconnection that are easy to point to and say, well, that was the cause, but it wasn't the cause.
根本原因就是缺乏连接。
The cause was the disconnection.
没有一滴雨对洪水负有责任，但洪水不过是无数雨滴的集合。
No single raindrop was responsible for the flood, but the flood's nothing but little raindrops.
你相信婚姻吗？
Do you believe in marriage?
我相信。
I do.
是的。
Yeah.
我相信。
I do.
我的意思是，我认为这是一个个人的问题。
I mean, I think I think that's an individual question.
我喜欢把关系，尤其是浪漫关系，看作是一本长书中的章节。
I like to look at relationships, romantic relationships, as chapters in a long book.
我认为，就像一本长书中的任何一章一样，有些章节是悲剧性的，有些是悲伤的，有些则充满了纯粹的喜悦。
And I think like any chapter in a long book, you know, there's some chapters that are tragic and some chapters that are sad and some chapters that are just filled with nothing but joy.
你知道吗？奥森·威尔斯说过，一个故事是喜剧还是悲剧，取决于你在哪里结束它。
You know, think Orson Welles said that that whether a story is a comedy or a tragedy depends on when you end it.
你知道吗？
You know?
我觉得，我们向人们推销的很多恋爱故事——比如浪漫喜剧之类——本质上就像是关系版的色情内容。
And I think a lot of, you know, relationship stories that we sell to people, rom coms and things like that, they're kind of the relationship equivalent of pornography.
它们只是对真实关系的一种风格化呈现，没有复杂性，只保留了美好的部分。
Like, they're just a stylized version of what actual relationships look like, you know, without any of the complexity, like, with just the good part.
我觉得婚姻，我不认为我能单靠自己就学会所有关于自己的东西。
And I think I think marriage I don't think I can learn everything I need to know about myself from myself.
我觉得我需要一个人，能看见我的盲点，而且我希望这个人是我可以毫无顾忌地做自己的人。
I think I need someone who'll see my blind spots, and I think I need that person to be someone I can be really fearless around.
我觉得，归根结底，婚姻应该浓缩为四个字，我认为这可能是你能对某人说、或有人对你说、并且知道它们是真心话的最美丽的词语。
And I think, like, at its core, marriage should boil down to to four words that I think I think are potentially the most beautiful words you could say to someone and mean or have someone say to you and know they're true.
那就是：你是我最喜欢的人。
And that is, you're my favorite person.
还有什么比被人告诉，并且确信当这个人这么说时他是真心的，更美好的呢？
Like, what could be more beautiful than being told and knowing, like, that when this person says it, they mean it.
你是我最喜欢的人。
You're my favorite person.
然后对那个人说，是的。
And to say to someone back, yeah.
你是我最喜欢的人。
You're my favorite person.
在这个世界上，还有什么比拥有这一切更好的呢？
Like, what would be better in the world than having that?
你知道吗？
You know?
所以我喜欢思考事物的终点，然后逆向推导。
And and so I like to think about kind of the end of things and then reverse engineer.
对我来说，当你生命尽头时，如果能看着另一个人说，你帮助我成为了最真实的自己，而你依然是我最喜欢的人。
And to me, like, at the end of your life, if you could look at another person and say, you helped me become the most authentic version of myself, and you're still my favorite person.
这可能是你所能收到的最棒的婚礼祝酒词。
That's the greatest wedding toast you could ever have.
这可能是你一生中能得到的最美好的祝福，我认为这也是你生命中最大的财富。
Like, that's the greatest blessing you could have in your life, and I think it'd be the greatest asset you could have in your life.
但无论是代表警察、教师、消防员、首席执行官、顶尖运动员，还是名人，我们在这件事上都同样糟糕。
But having represented cops, teachers, firefighters, CEOs, elite athletes, celebrities, we are all equally terrible at this.
你希望每一对夫妻在结婚前都明白什么？
What do you wish every couple understood before they got married?
有两个方面，而且它们是矛盾的。
So two things, and they're contradictory.
我先说出来，因为一旦我说出口，我知道听起来会像自相矛盾。
So I say that out front because as as soon as I say it, I I know it's gonna sound like a contradiction.
但我想，作为一段长久婚姻的过来人，你会同意的。
But I think you'll as a long long married person, I think you'll agree.
我认为他们犯了两个相互矛盾的错误。
I think they make two contradictory mistakes.
一个是认为嫁给这个人会改变他。
One is thinking that marrying this person will change them.
所以，你知道，他到处乱扔袜子，但如果我们结婚了，他就会改掉这个习惯。
So, you know, he leaves his socks everywhere, but if we get married, he'll stop doing that.
或者他喝酒太多，但如果我们结婚，你知道，她不太有财务责任感，但如果我们结婚，她就会振作起来，把事情理顺。
Or he drinks too much, but if we get married to something you know, she's not very fiscally responsible, but if we get married, she'll, you know, shape up and get that together.
认为只要和某人结婚，他们就会变成更好的自己，而且一定会改变。
So thinking that if you marry somebody, they're gonna become a better version of themselves, and they'll definitely change.
这不是个好主意。
This is not a great idea.
这就像你不是在买一家业绩低迷的公司，指望股价会上涨。
Like, this is not you're not buying a depressed company that this you're hoping the stock will go up.
明白吗？
Okay?
但矛盾的是，也有人认为这个人永远不会改变。
But the contradictory thing is also thinking this person will never change.
如果我们结婚，就会阻止他们改变。
That if we get married, that it'll prevent them from changing.
哦，我明白为什么这两者是一回事了。
Oh, I see exactly why these are the same thing.
对。
Right.
因为这是一种感觉，嘿。
Because it's the feeling of, hey.
你知道的。
You know?
就像，这太棒了。
Like, this is so good.
就像，性生活太棒了，我们的陪伴太棒了，我们的对话太棒了，我们在一起的整体氛围太棒了。
Like, the sex is so good, and our companionship is so good, and our conversation is so good, and our whole vibe together is so good.
就像，如果我们结婚，就像是为这一切筑起一堵墙，让它一直保持美好。
Like, if we get married, we're gonna it's like building a wall around this thing, and it's gonna keep it amazing.
你知道吗？
You know?
这就是我们必须做的。
And that's this is what we have to do.
我们会加固所有抵御外界的防线，一切都不会改变。
We'll shore up all the defenses against the world, and we'll nothing will change.
我们会一直幸福地生活，做爱，享受美好的一切，就像现在这样，永远如此。
We'll just be happy and having sex and having a great just like we are right now forever.
这简直太荒谬了。
And, like, that's just ridiculous.
根本就没有什么。
Like, there's nothing.
也许在人们三四十岁就去世的时代，这还可能实现，因为那时人生短暂。
There's no way to have maybe when people died in their thirties and forties, that was possible because you had a short window of time.
但事实上，就像说，嘿。
But the truth is, like, to say, hey.
我会和某个人在一起三四十甚至五十年，维持这种极其强烈而亲密的关系，而且你知道，这一切永远不会改变。
I'm gonna be with somebody thirty, forty, fifty years in this very intense, intimate relationship, and, you know, it'll never change.
这简直太疯狂了。
Like, that's insane.
我们的身体会变化。
We're gonna our bodies change.
我们的目标会改变。
Our goals change.
我们所面临的压力，以及我们周围的整个社会，都在不断变化。
The the pressures we're the society around us is constantly changing.
科技也在变化。
Technology is changing.
那么，你如何能相信，我们和政府签订的关于关系的契约，能阻止它逐渐瓦解，或避免我们身体、生活以及所有其他关系中必然发生的自然变化呢？
So how would you think that a contract we sign with the government about our relationship is gonna prevent it from eroding or having any of the, like, natural things that happen to our bodies, to our lives, to every other relationship we have.
那么，在意识到会有如此多变化即将降临的情况下，你是不是该问自己一个更好的问题？
So is there a better question to ask yourself knowing how much change is gonna hit you?
你明白我的意思吗？
You know what I'm saying?
比如，如果你能抓住每一对年轻情侣，是的。
Like, so if you could grab every young couple Yeah.
摇晃他们的肩膀
By the shoulders
对。
Yeah.
在他们觉得‘这个人就是我的对的人’的那一刻。
Who's in that moment where they're like, I think this is my person.
你现在是我最喜欢的人。
You're my favorite person now.
是的。
Yeah.
而你正感受到压力，或者你一直想结婚，或者你所有朋友都在结婚，或者你是唯一单身的，又或者你离婚太久，想再试一次。
And I'm feeling the pressure or I really have always wanted to get married or all my friends are getting married or I'm the only single one or I've been divorced for too long and I wanna try this.
你有没有想过，有没有一个问题，是你希望伴侣或个人能停下来认真问自己的？
Like, is there a question that you wish couples or people personally would just stop and ask themselves the true question?
我觉得关键在于，我们能做哪些小事来保持联系？
I think everything is what little things can we do to stay connected?
我觉得这并不难。
And I don't think it's that hard.
比如，你每周花十分钟来维护一段关系，就能避免很多不必要的冲突。
Like, I think you can dedicate ten minutes a week to the upkeep of a relationship and stay out of my office a lot of the time.
我真心相信，如果你每周花十分钟对伴侣说：这周我做了什么？
I genuinely believe that if you spent ten minutes a week just saying to your partner, what did I do this week?
告诉我这周有哪三件事让你感到被爱。
Tell me three things I did this week that made you feel loved.
我相信你会对答案感到惊讶。
I think you'd be surprised at the answer.
我觉得你自以为知道答案，但其实你会很意外。
Like, I think you you think you know the answer, but you'd be surprised.
比如，如果你的丈夫对你说：这周我做了哪三件事让你感到被爱？
Like, I think if your husband if if you if he said to you, what are three things I did this week that made you feel loved?
那些实际的答案，你可能根本猜不到。
The practical actual answers, you might not be able to predict those.
比如，他可能根本无法提前猜到这些答案，因为正是这些小事让我们感到被爱。
Like, he might not have been able to guess in advance what they are because little things make us feel loved.
顺便说一下，如果你有勇气，带着这样的态度开始这次对话：嘿。
And by the way, if you if you have courage and you go into this transaction saying, hey.
我们不要以防御的心态来听。
We're gonna not hear this defensively.
对。
Yeah.
我们要坦诚交流，也要以非防御的方式去倾听。
Like, we're gonna speak honestly, and we're gonna hear in a non defensive way.
那么你可以再问一个问题：这周我在哪里做得不够好？
Then you can ask another question, which is, where did I miss the mark this week?
这周我本可以做得更好的三件事是什么？
What are three things I could have done better this week?
这周我做了哪三件事让你感觉不被爱或不被重视？
What were three things I did this week that made you feel less than loved or less than seen?
你可以轻松地问：这周我做了哪三件事让你想和我发生关系？
You can have fun with it and say, what are three things I did this week that made you wanna have sex with me?
比如，这周我做了哪三件事让你感到有吸引力？
Like, what were three things this week that I did that turned you on?
顺便说一句，答案简直离谱。
By the way, the answer's bonkers.
绝对离谱。
Absolutely bonkers.
比如哪些？
Like what?
作为一个异性恋男性，当我问这个问题时，答案总是最奇怪的事情。
As a heterosexual man, when I've asked that question, it's the weirdest things.
就是说，哦，你看到狗从外面进来，你正一边给它们擦干，一边用那种眼神看着它们。
It's like, oh, you were the dogs came in from outside and you were, like, you know, kinda toweling them off in the way they were looking at you.
然后，这就让你想和我做爱？
And, like, that made you wanna have sex with me?
我是说，我带着狗怎么了？
Like, here I the dogs?
我正努力练出腹肌呢。
I'm trying to get me pack abs.
而与此同时，这些事情却让你感觉……真的，就是那些……
And and meanwhile, this is what makes you, like like, feel but it really like, the things that
让我明白。
make understand.
因为当我听到你问什么让你有感觉时，我心想，克里斯也问我过这个问题。
Because I I honestly, when you said what makes you feel, I was thinking to myself, well, Chris asked me that.
我在这儿工作的时候，他正和朋友去滑雪，还带上了我们的两只狗。
While I was here working, he was with his friends skiing and he took our two dogs.
所以他一整天都在徒步上山、滑雪下山。
And so he spent the day, you know, hiking up the mountain and skiing down.
狗在追着他跑。
The dogs were chasing him.
他给我发了照片。
He sent me photos.
对。
Right.
我感到非常被爱，因为他在这过程中还想着我，大白天还特意发给我这些。
And I felt so loved that he remembered me in the middle of that and sent me that in the middle of the day.
而且你要明白，那真正意味着什么，那不仅仅是表面的事情。
And see and you identify what that really was, which it wasn't just the thing.
而是藏在背后的东西。
It's what's underneath it.
是的。
Yes.
就像他想，哦，这太棒了。
Like, that he thought, oh, this is so good.
我想和她分享这个。
I wanna share this with her.
是的。
Yes.
这就是我说你是我最喜欢的人的意思。
Like and that's what I mean about you're my favorite person.
其实就是保持一点点的连接和觉知。
Like, all that is is just staying a little bit connected and conscious.
这花了什么代价吗？
Like, what did that cost?
什么都没花。
Nothing.
什么都没花。
Nothing.
不需要花钱。
Cost nothing.
我们总是过于执着于这些隆重的举动。
And we get so fixated on these grand gestures.
比如，所谓的旧日爱情，就是像计划她的生日派对这样的大事。
Like, you know, old love is about, like, these grand I'm gonna plan her birthday party.
我要把它办得盛大无比。
I'm gonna make it huge.
听我说。
And listen.
隆重的举动确实有其价值。
There's value in grand gestures.
但像这样的日常小事，才是关键。
But, like, day to day things like that, that's the thing.
顺便说一句，这在双方身上都适用。
And it by the way, it works in both directions.
比如，我敢肯定你做的某些小事，你可能甚至不觉得那有什么大不了的，但正是这些小事让他感到深深的连接、被重视、被看见、被理解、有安全感，甚至仅仅是他知道，你知道他和你一样爱狗，因为你们对共同喜爱的事物有连接，无论是你们的孩子、伴侣动物、一项活动，还是一个朋友圈，知道‘哦，这个人对此的感受和我一样深’这件事本身就意义非凡。
Like, I guarantee there's some little thing you do that you may not even think is that big of a deal, but that's the thing that makes him feel deeply connected, valued, seen, understood, safe, like, and all like, even just the fact that he's you know, you know he loves the dogs as much as you because the shared connection of things you love, like whether that's your children, whether it's companion animals, whether it's an activity, whether it's a friend group, there's something about knowing like, oh, this person feels this as deeply as I do.
这个人对……我指的是动物，对我来说是件大事，怀有如此深厚的爱与连接。
This person feels this depth of love and connection for I mean, animals for me is a big thing.
我是个爱狗的人。
I'm a dog person.
但是，和某人分享这一点并知道‘哦，这没问题’，这种感觉是如此美好。
But, like, there's something so beautiful about sharing that with someone and knowing, oh, it's okay.
我之所以能安心离开，是因为这个人像我一样爱着这些狗，一样宠着它们，会给我发照片，会做所有我在外出时做的那些小事，这样我就知道狗狗们感到安全和被爱。
I'm away because this person loves the dogs as much as I do and panders to them as much as I do and will send me photos and will, you know, do all the little things that I do when I'm out so that that, you know, I know that the dogs feel safe and loved.
对我来说，像这样的事，彼此之间很容易就能表达出来并互相提醒。
To me, like, that that is so easy to just articulate to each other and remind each other.
我觉得，知道并听到这些并不会让魔力消失。
Like, I don't think it takes the magic away to know that and to hear that.
我想，如果克里斯听到你说‘你知道那让我感觉有多特别吗？’
Like, I think if Chris heard you say, do you know how special that made me feel?
你知道那有多美好吗？
Do you know how beautiful that was?
当你这么做时，你知道这让我多么更爱你、多么更感受到被你理解吗？
Like, do you know how much more that makes me love you and feel seen by you when you did that?
你会说，我只是在给狗狗拍照而已。
You'd be like, I was just taking a picture of the dogs.
但与此同时，那根本不是重点。
Like meanwhile, like, it's not the thing.
重点是背后的东西。
It's it's what's underneath.
那是它所象征的意义。
It's what it's emblematic of.
我觉得我们很多人都有这么多这样的小事。
And I I feel like so many of us have so many of those things.
但我们就是不说出来。
And but we don't say it.
而且这些事有好有坏。
And and they're good and bad.
比如，如果你像我这样的人，我喜欢在一天结束时把所有碗碟都洗完。
Like like, if you're the kind of person like me, I like all the dishes out of the sink by the end of the day.
我很喜欢洗碗，因为与法律工作不同，洗碗有明确的开始和结束，做完就完了。
Like, I'm very and I like doing dishes because unlike the practice of law, there's like a middle and end, and you're done.
然后你会觉得，哇，一切都干净了。
And it's like, oh, everything is clean.
但处理案件就不一样了，我可能会一直工作，是的。
Whereas with cases, it's like I could work Yes.
每天工作二十四小时，还是会有更多事情要做。
Twenty four hours a day, and there'd still be more to do.
这并不是说要让水槽里堆满脏碗碟。
It's not about, like, leaving the sink full of dirty dishes.
关键是，这些行为象征着什么？
It's about what do those symbolize?
这象征着你知道，我喜欢事情以某种方式存在，但对你来说并不重要。
That symbolizes you know that I like things a certain way, and it's not that important to you.
你默认我会处理这件事，而你根本不需要在意，这总是藏在表象之下的那件事。
You assume I'm gonna take care of this thing and that, you know, you don't have to like, it's it's always the thing under the thing.
如果在一段关系初期，当彼此还充满善意、连接和乐观时，你就在那时说：嘿。
And if if early on in a relationship when there's still all this abundance of goodwill and connection and optimism, if that's when you say, hey.
让我们通过这些小小的实际对话和沟通，来找到维持这一切的方法。
Let's figure out how to keep this here with these little tiny practical discussions, communications.
无论是我们每周互相发送一封包含清单的邮件，还是我们每周一起散步聊天，做这件事。
Again, whether it's an email we send each other once a week with that list or whether it's we go for a walk, and it's like our walk and talk once a week, and we do this.
我认为，这些实际的小事才是维系彼此连接的根本方式。
I think those kinds of practical little things are the way you stay connected, period.
为了确保你在听或在YouTube上观看时，已经清楚那两个简单的问题。
Well, just to make sure as you were listening or you were watching here on YouTube that you got just those two simple questions.
第一个问题是：我做了哪三件事让你感受到被爱？
The first one was what are three ways that I made you feel loved?
让你感到被爱。
Made you feel loved.
是的。
Yes.
第二个问题是：我有哪些地方做得不够好？
And the second one was what are three ways where I missed the mark?
对。
Yeah.
就这些。
That's it.
你也可以顺便提一下，比如这周我有哪些地方让你感到被爱。
And and you might wanna throw in, you know, here are three ways you made me feel loved this week.
因为，再次强调，我坚信正向强化的作用。
Like, just to because, again, I'm a I'm a believer in that positive reinforcement.
你不会像打狗一样去逼人吧。
Well, you you don't beat your dog into Yeah.
变得乖巧。
Becoming well behaved.
是的。
Yeah.
你用爱让他们做到。
You love them into it.
是的。
Yeah.
奖励良好行为。
Reward good behavior.
这就像基础中的基础，但我们就是不做。
This is, like, basic this is the basic stuff, but we don't do it.
我们总是先说：你哪里做错了。
We start with, this is what you did wrong.
明白我的意思吗？
Know what I mean?
就像你会说，啊。
Like, you're like, ah.
对。
Right.
对话的切入点非常重要，因为有很多夫妻，你知道的，我经常听到，尤其是来自男性的声音。
And the entry point in the conversation is so important because there's so many couples, for example, that, you know, there's there's something I hear all the time, particularly from men.
就像说，我们现在的性生活不如以前多了。
It's like, oh, we don't have as much sex as we used to.
以前性生活可多呢。
Used to have so much sex.
好吧。
Okay.
所以如果你去跟妻子说，你知道，我们现在的性生活不如以前多了，你知道她会怎么回应。
So if you walk into your wife and say, you know, we're just not having sex as much as we used to, you know the response.
那你也不在家。
Well, you're not here.
而当你在家时，情绪却糟透了。
And when you're here, you're in a terrible mood.
我情绪糟是因为工作现在怎么样了？我们将来会怎样？
Well, I'm in a terrible mood because work is now where are we going?
我们根本没前途。
We're going nowhere good.
没人会从这种对话中走出来想着：咱们多做点爱吧。
Like, no one's walking out of that conversation going, let's have more sex.
每个人从这种对话中走出来都会想：是啊，这正是我们不再多做爱的原因。
Everyone's walking out of conversation going, yeah, this is exactly why we're not having more sex.
但如果你换种方式开启对话，比如：天啊，前几天我开车经过一条街，突然想起我们刚约会时，去的那个便宜的小旅馆，那时候我们根本没钱住得起。
Whereas if you entered that conversation with, god, you know, I was driving down the street the other day, and I remember when we were first dating and we went away to that, like, cheap B and B, you know, that we didn't, like, have the money to afford.
本来打算去的地方，结果我们一整天都待在床上。
Were supposed to go to and we ended up staying in bed the whole day.
还记得吗？天啊。
Like, remember that god.
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我刚刚在想那天的事。
I was just thinking about that day.
那时候我们身体上那么亲密，我就特别喜欢这一点，好吧。
Like, that was so you know, like, when we were so connected physically, I just love that about, okay.
现在？
Now?
现在你却说，咱们订酒店吧。
Now you're like, let's book the hotel.
现在就订吧。
Let's book right.
我在做什么呢？
Like, because what am I doing?
我在谈论我们曾经做过的事，那是我们的一个版本。
I'm talking about something we're we did at this was us, and it's a version of us.
咱们暂时回到那个时刻吧。
Let's visit it for a second.
那不是很棒吗？
Wasn't it great?
我喜欢这一点。
Here's what I love about that.
我喜欢这一点。
Here's what I love about that.
你可以利用怀旧，回到那段更好的时光
You can use nostalgia and going back to a better time
当然。
Sure.
作为参考点，提醒你们双方，是的。
As a reference point to remind both of you Yeah.
提醒你们怀念什么，以及所有这些琐碎小事背后潜藏的东西，正是这些导致了如今的不满和疏离，还有治疗师特里·里尔所说的正常婚姻愤怒和敌意，我想他怎么说来着？
Of what you miss and something that's underneath all these little things that have led to all this discontent and disconnection and what therapist Terry Reel calls normal marital rage and, and hostility, I think he what's he call it?
正常的婚姻敌意？
Normal marital hostility?
是的。
Yeah.
这被称为正常的婚姻怨恨。
It's called normal marital resentment.
是的。
Yeah.
这正是关于疏离感的，因为我认为怨恨源于内心深处知道你们当初是从不同的地方开始的。
That is just about the disconnection because I think the resentment comes from knowing deep down you started in a different place.
我认为对很多人来说，你根本不知道如何回去。
And for I think for a lot of people, you just don't know how to get back.
而且你觉得既然感觉这么不对劲，是的。
And you think since it feels so off Yeah.
你眼前的东西才是你指出的问题。
What's right in front of your nose is what you're pointing out.
是的。
Yeah.
但我们一直被告诉，爱情应该是很容易的。
Well, we've been told it's supposed to be easy too.
我认为我们不断被媒体中那些毫不费力的爱情例子所轰炸。
I think that we're constantly barraged in media with examples of just effortless love.
我认为爱情中确实有一部分是完全毫不费力的。
And I think that there is an aspect of love that's utterly effortless.
爱是一种情感，但爱也是一个动词。
Like, love is an emotion, but love's a verb.
你知道吗？
You know?
什么意思？
That mean?
爱是一个动词。
Love's a verb.
我的意思是，爱是一种情感。
I mean, love is an emotion.
这是一种感觉，但也是一个动词。
It's a feeling, but it's a verb.
比如，爱一个人就是以爱的方式对待他们。
Like, to love someone is to act with love for them.
就是，爱是一个动词。
Like like, it's it's a verb.
这是一种你去做的事情。
It's a thing you do.
所以它不仅仅是一种感受。
So it's not just something you feel.
它是你需要去实践的，以爱的方式对待他人。
It's something you act upon and and to act with love towards someone.
因此，以爱的方式对待他人、真正地去爱一个人，需要你对他们的了解以及他们的盲点。
And so the acting with love towards someone, loving someone, actively the act of loving them requires, a, some understanding of them and their blind spots.
比如，在一段关系刚开始时，和你的伴侣坐下来，说：看。
Like, what would be wrong with sitting down with your partner at the start of a relationship and saying, look.
我们迟早会吵架的。
We're gonna get in a fight at some point.
probably 是我的错。
It's probably gonna be my fault.
我会说些蠢话。
I'm gonna say something stupid.
我经常说些傻话。
I say dumb things all the time.
所以我们肯定会在某个时候发生争执。
So we're definitely gonna have an argument at some point.
当我们真的吵起来时，你是个什么样的人？
When we do, what kind of person are you?
你需要一点时间冷静一下吗？
Do you, like, need a minute?
我该让事情稍微冷静一下吗？
Should I let it kinda, like, air out?
因为如果我试图强迫对话，我们就会爆发一场大争吵。
Because if I if I try to force the conversation, we're gonna have a big argument.
还是说你是那种‘不能带着愤怒睡觉’的人？
Or are you the, like, we cannot go to bed angry.
我们必须把这件事解决掉。
We gotta work this out.
我们今晚必须谈一谈这件事。
We have to talk about this tonight.
因为学会这一点的最佳时机，不是在你吵架的时候。
Because the time to learn that is not when you're in a fight.
真正该学习这些的时候，是你们之间充满连接与乐观的时候。
Like, the time to learn that is when there's this abundance of connection and optimism between the two of you.
当那个时刻来临，你需要在冲突中保持清醒，然后说：好吧。
And then when that moment comes to have the presence of mind, when you have a conflict to go, okay.
我们早就知道这会发生，而这就是我们之前讨论过的方式。
We knew this was gonna happen, and this is how we talked about.
我们将一起努力应对这个问题。
We're gonna try to navigate this together.
再说一遍，我建议任何人用于关系中的做法都是免费的，而且通常不需要超过几分钟。
Again, like, everything I'm proposing anybody do in their relationship is free, and it usually doesn't take more than a few minutes.
顺便说一下，你提到的怀旧，我认为怀旧是一种强大的工具。
And by the way, what you said about nostalgia, I think nostalgia is a powerful tool.
但不仅仅是怀旧。
But it's not just nostalgia.
它还涉及框架构建。
It's also framing.
因为存在一些有效的方法，可以调节你配偶的情绪状态。
Because there are ways to effectively manipulate the emotional state of your spouse
请告诉我们。
Please tell us.
为了他们的利益。
For their benefit.
对吧？
Right?
请告诉我们。
Please tell us.
我的意思是，作为一名律师，我的工作就是操控人们的情绪状态。
What do I mean think of as a lawyer, my job is to manipulate people's emotional state.
这就是我的工作。
That's my job.
我希望法官喜欢我的当事人。
Like, I want the judge to like my client.
我希望我的当事人感到安全。
I want my client to feel safe.
我希望对方感到害怕。
I want the other side to feel scared.
我希望法庭记录员喜欢我。
I want the court reporter to like me.
我希望法庭工作人员喜欢我，因为他们会回到法官的办公室，我希望他们说，塞克顿是个非常优秀的律师。
I want the the court officer to like me because they're gonna go back in chambers with the judge, and I want them to go, Sexton's a really good lawyer.
我不希望他们说，塞克顿太傲慢了。
I don't want them to go, that Sexton's so arrogant.
所以我必须真诚，不是每个人都能帮我，但几乎每个人都能害我。
So I gotta be real I want everyone not everybody can help me, but damn near everybody can hurt me.
因此，我会在法庭上尽最大努力操控每个人的情绪状态，同时不让任何人察觉我在这么做。
So I'm gonna do my best in that courtroom to manipulate everyone's emotional state and have no one think I'm doing it.
不过，还有另一件事。
Well, here's the other thing, though.
当你这么做的时候
When you're doing it
是的。
Yeah.
你非常真诚且目的明确。
You're very authentically intentional.
百分之百。
A 100%.
因为这正是你真正想要的。
Because that's what you actually want.
百分之百。
A 100%.
而且通过
And by the
话说回来，人们听到“操纵”这个词，但你实际上是在非常有策略地行事，因为你确实希望法庭官员认为你是一位出色的律师。
way So, you know, because people hear the word manipulate, but what you're actually being is you're being super strategic because you do want the court officer to think you're an excellent lawyer.
听好了。
Listen.
我拧螺丝是因为我想让螺丝被拧进墙里。
I manipulate the screw because I want the thing to be screwed into the wall.
是的。
Yes.
操纵本身并不一定是邪恶的。
Like, manipulation is not in and of itself anything nefarious.
对。
Yes.
举个我以前说过的例子吧，我是出庭律师，所以我尽量保持剃须干净。
Like, what when you an example I I've given before is so I you know, I'm a trial lawyer, so I try to be, like, clean shaven.
我没法做到那种‘哎呀’的情况。
I don't get to have that, like, oops.
我不知道自己长点胡茬居然这么有魅力。
I didn't know I was sexy stubble that's so popular.
所以我必须保持剃须干净。
So I have to, like, be clean shaven.
但在周末，我喜欢不刮胡子。
But on the weekends, I like to not shave.
就是给自己放几天假，不刮胡子。
Like, it's a couple days off from it.
我不用去法庭。
I don't have to be in court.
所以这很棒。
So it's great.
周末我不打领带，也不刮胡子。
I don't wear a tie, and I don't shave on the weekends.
到了第二天，星期天的时候，我就长出了一些胡茬，还挺粗糙的。
By, like, the second day, by Sunday, I have, like, scruff, and it's kinda coarse.
是的。
Yep.
我当时在和一个皮肤非常敏感的女生交往。
And I was dating a woman who had very sensitive sensitive skin.
皮肤。
Skin.
嗯。
Mhmm.
嗯。
Mhmm.
每当我想要亲她时，她都会说：‘天啊，你的胡子太扎人了。’
And anytime I would like go to kiss her, she would go like, oh god, like your beard's so scratchy.
我立刻在心里想：‘好吧，明白了。’
And immediately in me, I went, like in my head, like, you know, like, alright.
所以现在我见你的时候，周末也得刮胡子吗？
So now I gotta shave on the weekends too when I see you?
这段关系没成功。
That relationship didn't work out.
毫不意外。
Not surprisingly.
不是因为那个原因，但确实没成功。
Not for that reason, but it didn't work out.
我下一段恋情中，她也有同样的问题。
My next relationship, she had the exact same issue.
她皮肤很敏感。
She she had sensitive skin.
但她的应对方式是，我会刮胡子，而她总是会过来说，天啊，你没胡子的时候我最喜欢了。
But her response, her way of handling it was, I would shave and she would invariably come up and go, god, I love it when you're clean shaven.
就像你让我想起约翰·汉姆，像《广告狂人》里的唐·德雷珀那样。
Like, it's like you remind me of, like, John Hamm, like, with Don Draper in Mad Men.
你知道的？
You know?
伙计，我一天要刮三次胡子。
Dude, I would shave three times a day.
我总是不停地刮胡子，然后我会想，哦，我今天刚刮过。
I would I would constantly I would shave, and I'd be like, oh, I just shaved today.
她会说，天啊。
And she'd like, oh my god.
我太喜欢了。
I love it.
好的。
Okay.
她做了什么？
What did she do?
她是怎么以积极的方式影响我的？
What did she do but manipulate me in a positive way?
她只是说，不是把重点放在我觉得自己做错了什么，而是告诉我，你做的另一件事——哦，我太喜欢了。
Like, all she was doing was say instead of framing it as something I'm doing wrong, she framed it as here's this opposite thing you do that, oh, I love it.
现在，我想取悦我的伴侣。
And now I I wanna please my partner.
我希望我的伴侣觉得我很好，觉得我有魅力，当然，我会朝着这个方向努力。
I want my partner to feel good about me and think I'm sexy and think I'm so, of course, I'm gonna wanna move towards that
对。
Right.
而不是逃避它。
And not pull away from it.
所以很多都在于如何表达。
So a lot of it is about framing.
怀旧是一种非常强大的工具，但关键在于我们如何界定自己真正想要达成的目标。
Nostalgia is a very powerful tool, but it's really like how do we frame what it is we're trying to accomplish here.
而且常常要专注于那些进展顺利、你喜欢的事情，并强化他们做得好的方面。
And really focusing often on the things that are going well and that you like and tripling down on what they're doing well.
因为，我的意思是，让我们
Because, I mean, let's
坦诚地说。
be honest.
这个世界无时无刻不在批评我们。
The world is, like, constantly criticizing us.
即使是有建设性的批评，也仍然是批评。
And even constructive criticism is criticism.
想象一下，那个本该是你最爱的人，而你也是他们最爱的人，却在批评你，这感觉并不好。
Like and it doesn't feel great to have this person who's supposed to be your favorite person, and you're their favorite person, and they're criticizing you.
到处都在批评你。
Like, everything is criticizing you.
在这种关系中，真正正确的东西往往就是治愈感觉不对劲的良方，而批评很少能通向那里。
Like, what's right in this connection very often is the cure for what's feeling wrong in it, and criticism is rarely the path there.
如果你仔细想想那些小小的错误，就像修车师傅能告诉你车哪里会出问题一样，你觉得在长期关系中人们常犯的错误有哪些呢？
If you really think about kind of all those little mistakes, kinda like a mechanic that can tell you what's gonna go wrong with the car, what do you feel are the list of mistakes that people make in long term relationships
是的。
Yeah.
这些错误会导致离婚，或者引发我们可能都没意识到的各种问题？
That lead to divorce or lead to all the problems that we may not realize?
我知道你已经说过，归根结底，是疏离。
And I realize that you've already said that underneath it all Yeah.
是疏离。
Is disconnection.
但具体是哪些错误，是我们必须真正了解的？
But what are those mistakes that we need to really know about?
是的。
Yeah.
我的意思是，如果我们从我们相遇并坠入爱河时的状态开始思考。
I mean, I think if you start with where are we when we meet and fall in love.
我们坠入爱河的速度非常快。
We fall in love super fast.
我的意思是，我们与对方的连接几乎是瞬间发生的。
I mean, we we really connect with the person so instantaneously.
然后我们分崩离析的方式也一样，就像破产一样，缓慢地积累，然后突然一下就崩了。
And then we we fall apart the same way we go bankrupt, which is very slowly and then all at once.
你懂吗？
You know?
就像一点点、一点点地靠近悬崖边缘。
It's like this little tiny little bit little bit off the cliff.
所以我认为，从爱中抽离也是同样的道理。
And so I think it's the same thing with falling out of love.
所以，破坏关系的主要因素是不忠、财务不当，还有明显的欺骗。
And so the big relationship killers are infidelity, financial impropriety, you know, outright deception.
这可是个大问题。
Like and that's huge.
我觉得我经手的离婚案件中，有大约百分之八十五都与不忠有关。
Like, I I would say a good eighty five percent of the divorces that I'm involved in, infidelity has some role in it.
你认为为什么会这样？
Why do you think that is?
因为我觉得，这和为什么这么多人想结婚的原因是一样的。
Because I think we have a human the same reason why so many people wanna get married.
我们人类有一种渴望与他人建立联系的天性。
We have a human desire to connect to another person.
我认为我们是社会性生物。
I think we're social creatures.
这深植于我们的本性之中。
This is something in us.
我们渴望与另一个人建立联系。
Like, we want to connect with another person.
我们迫切需要被关注和显得有趣，也希望感受到被爱。
We we need desperately to to be interested and interesting, and we want to feel loved.
我们渴望与他人有身体上的接触。
We want physical connection with another person.
我们渴望身体接触所带来的关注。
We want the attention that comes with physical connection.
你知道，无论是婚姻初期、约会，还是婚外情的初期，我们迷恋的不只是对方这个人。
You know, we want the I I think we, whether it's marriage and the early days of marriage or dating or the early days of infidelity, it's not just the other person that we kind of fall for.
还有和对方在一起时，我们感受到的自己。
It's also who we feel like when we're with them.
你知道吗？
You know?
当有人觉得你美得惊人或帅得惊人时，你会觉得自己挺拔了几分。
Like, you stand a little taller when someone sees you as so beautiful or so handsome.
就像，你感觉自己成了另一个版本的自己。
Like, you you feel like a version of yourself.
就像，我办公室里所有有过婚外情的人，经常都会说，你看。
Like, everyone I talk to in my office who's had affairs, very often, they'll say, like, look.
我爱我的配偶。
I I love my spouse.
我从未停止过爱我的配偶。
I never stopped loving my spouse.
但我的配偶再也不觉得我漂亮或英俊了。
But, like, my spouse doesn't find me beautiful or handsome anymore.
就像，没人再……呃，我遇到了这个人，而我对他们来说非常迷人。
Like, nobody you know, like and and I've and then I met this person, and, like, I'm fascinating to them.
他们告诉我我有多美或多英俊，我真的感受到了。
They tell me how beautiful I am or how handsome I am, and I actually feel that.
因为被人说你很棒，这种感觉实在太美好了。
Like, I feel that way because it's so lovely to be told, you know, you're so wonderful.
我现在很享受和你在一起的时光，甚至只是我们俩现在这样交谈，那种感觉真的很美好，你说的话真的很有意思。
I'm enjoying being and even just the two of us right now talking to each other, there's something so beautiful about, like, oh, what you're saying is so interesting.
我很享受和你聊天。
I'm enjoying talking to you.
这种交流真的很美好。
Like, that's such a lovely exchange.
所以，从人性的角度来看，如果你想想那七宗罪，
So it's a natural human like, if you think about, like, the seven deadly sins
对。
Right.
你
You
其实它们只是七种非常正常的人类欲望，只是被推向了错误的方向。
know, all they really are is, like, seven very normal human things taken to the wrong level.
我们想要吃东西。
Like, we wanna eat.
好的。
Okay.
暴食。
Gluttony.
我们需要与他人建立亲密的联系。
We we we need intimate connection with another person.
色欲。
Lust.
你知道吗？
You know?
当有人伤害我们时，我们会生气。
We get angry when someone hurts us.
愤怒。
Wrath.
如果你仔细看这些，它们本质上都是被扭曲了的正常人性。
Like, if you look at those things, all it is is a normal human thing weaponized.
所以我认为，这就是我们迷失方向的地方——我们只是忘记了，最常见的情况其实就是这种疏离感。
So I I think that's where we, you know, we lose the plot in that we we just forget like, the the most common thing, again, is just that disconnection.
而这种疏离感可能表现为：我与你让我感受到的那个自我脱节了。
And that disconnection can be in the form of I'm disconnected from the me you made me feel like.
是的。
Yes.
这其实是我自己的问题，
Which is a me problem,
顺便说一下。
by the way.
通常来说，我相信你也会注意到，当你有一段存在不忠的亲密关系时，
Typically, by the way, I'm sure you see this, is that when you have a relationship where there's been infidelity
对。
Yeah.
而那个出轨的人会感到被理解、被看见，觉得自己更有底气，也更有趣。
And the person who's cheating is being, is feeling seen and feeling like they can stand taller and feeling like they're interesting.
被出轨的一方会想：我也希望在我们的关系中得到这些，你这个混蛋。
The person who's being cheated on is like, well, I wanted that too in our relationship, you asshole.
我也同样缺少这些。
Like, I was missing that too.
所以你能明白，是的。
And so you can see Yeah.
这种疏离感和缺乏被关心的感觉，确实是个问题。
That the disconnection and the lack of feeling cared about Right.
没错。
Right.
这对双方来说都是个问题。
Is a problem is happening for both of them.
这对双方来说都是个问题。
It's happening for both of them.
在这些时刻里，你本有机会及时扭转局面。
And there were all of these moments where you had a last clear chance to steer out of that.
但如果人们能早点沟通，比如说，嘿。
But there's an opportunity for people if they'd communicated early on, like, hey.
我觉得我的注意力开始飘了。
I'm not feeling like I feel like my eye is wandering.
我不希望自己的注意力飘走，我想把这份工作做好。
I don't want my eye to wand like, I wanna be good at this job.
对吧？
Right?
比如，当你结婚时，你是在签下一份工作。
Like, when you marry someone, you're signing on for a job.
这很棒。
Like, it's wonderful.
这是幸福，所有这些，但这也是一份工作。
It's bliss, all this, but it's also a job.
它有一份工作描述。
It's got a job description.
你知道的吧？
You know?
顺便说一句，这是一份疯狂的职位描述。
Like, I'm and by the way, it's an insane job description.
你要做我最好的朋友、最好的共同父母、最好的室友、最好的旅行伙伴，天啊。
Like, you're gonna be my best friend, best co parent, best roommate, best travel partner, bet like, wow.
真的吗？
Really?
这可是一长串要求啊。
Like, that's a big list.
你真的找到一个人能胜任所有这些吗？
You found one person that can do all of that?
我们一直让人相信，不行。
We've convinced people that, no.
不行。
No.
这个人就该在各方面都出类拔萃。
This is your person, and they should be the best at everything.
如果他们做不到，顺便说一句，你的灵魂伴侣可能就在外面，而你错过了机会，你得去找那个人，因为生活本该像一部好莱坞浪漫电影。
And if they're not, by the way, maybe your soulmate's out there and you missed the boat, and you gotta go find that person because life is supposed to be like a Hallmark movie.
你知道的。
You know?
我觉得现在任何一段关系中的人，都会努力靠近，因为很容易就变成室友关系。
I I feel like anybody that's in a relationship right now is leaning in because it's easy to feel like roommates.
是的。
Yeah.
很容易陷入平淡期。
It's easy to fall into a lull.
对。
Yeah.
你身边到处都是其他人。
There's other people all around you.
你的书《如何维系爱情》中确实有一章，第十九章。
You actually have a chapter in your book, How to Stay in Love, chapter 19.
如果我们设计一台制造不忠的机器，那它一定是Facebook、Instagram、YouTube和社交媒体。
If we were designing an infidelity generating machine, it would be Facebook, Instagram, YouTube, social media.
是的。
Yeah.
这是第114页。
This is page 114.
如果你对这段关系或婚姻略有不满，尤其是如果不满程度远超轻微，那就远离社交媒体。
If you're vaguely unhappy with your relationship or marriage, and especially if you're more than vaguely unhappy with it, stay away from social media.
你在那上面看到的绝大多数内容，都是披着幸福外衣的不幸。
The vast majority of what you'll find there is unhappiness masked as happiness.
它会扰乱你的思想、情感和关系。
It will fuck with your head, your heart, and your relationship.
你详细谈到了社交媒体是如何成为有史以来最大的不忠温床。
And you talk all about how social media is a single greatest breeding ground ever for infidelity.
此前的一切——无论是 swingers 俱乐部、钥匙派对、聊天室、职场诱惑、Ashley Madison、Tinder 还是 Grindr——都算不上。
Nothing that has come before, not swingers clubs, key parties, chat rooms, workplace temptation, Ashley Madison, Tinder, Grindr.
不。
No.
不。
No.
不。
No.
不。
No.
甚至连色情内容也远远比不上。
Not even porn comes within a thousand miles.
是的。
Yeah.
我坚持这个观点。
I stand by that.
为什么？
Why?
因为这简直就是对一夫一妻制婚姻制度的多重打击的完美风暴。
Because it's just a perfect storm of of attacks on the institution of a monogamous marriage.
比如，你有一个看似无害的理由来使用这项技术。
Like, it it a, you have a innocuous reason you should be using this technology.
哦，意思是你可以找个借口。
Oh, meaning you got a cover.
你就像说，我有的是时间。
You're like, I have all the time.
得等我们。
Have to wait for us.
是的。
Yes.
我想看看这个人到底在干什么，或者那个什么什么的Facebook群组，你知道的，是为我们孩子的事情，或者像这样，你用手机的理由成千上万，全都是完全无害的。
I wanted to see what this person's up to or, oh, the Facebook group of blah blah blah is, you know, for our kids' thing or, like, there's a million reasons you'd be on your phone that are totally innocuous.
对。
Right.
不像脱衣舞俱乐部。
Unlike a strip club.
不像脱衣舞俱乐部。
Unlike a strip club.
比如，如果我觉得我儿子足球训练中的一位妈妈很有魅力，而我接近她的唯一方式就是直接在训练时走过去，这会显得很突兀；但如果我们因为都属于同一个群组而互相关注社交媒体，那就不同了，对吧？
Or if, for example, I think that one of the women at my one of the moms at my son's soccer practice is attractive, If the only entry point I have for talking to her would be walking up to her at practice, it's not as threatening because you can't really do that without it being but now while we follow each other on social media because we both are part of that group that is a group chat that you know?
现在我还能看到她的度假照片。
And now I also see her vacation pictures.
现在我也可以很自然地对她说：哦，我看到你们去图卢姆了。
And now I I might innocuously say to her, oh, I saw you guys went to Tulum.
你们住哪儿？
Where did you stay?
我们也在考虑去。
We're thinking about going.
现在我在和你说话。
And now I'm talking to you.
顺便说一下，我现在是私下和你聊天。
And I'm talking to you, by the way, privately.
我就在你的私信里。
Like, I'm in your DMs.
我们在聊天，所以这可不是像在足球场上去接近你那样。
We're talking so it's not only like not it's not like approaching you at the soccer game.
这更像是单独在餐厅里接近你。
It's like approaching you alone in a restaurant.
就我们两个人在聊天，没人能看到我们在说什么。
Like and we're just the two of us talking, and no one can see what we're saying.
你这是在为人们制造完美的条件。
You're just creating this perfect storm for people.
顺便说一下，那个表演性的自我。
And by the way, the performative self.
人们发的都是自己最好的照片。
Like, all anyone posts is the best pictures of themselves.
你什么时候会看手机上的社交媒体？
And when and when are you on your phone looking at social media?
是在你度过最棒的一天或最美好的时刻时吗？
Is it when you're having, like, the greatest day or the greatest moment?
不是。
No.
你是在地铁上。
You're on the subway.
你是在厕所里。
You're on the toilet.
你感到无聊。
You're bored.
对吧？
Right?
你只是觉得无聊。
You're just bored.
你正在过自己的搞笑片段，却在看别人的高光时刻。
You're living your gag reel, and you're looking at everyone's greatest hits.
你真的以为，刷完社交媒体后，会让自己和现实中的亲密关系更紧密吗？
And and you're supposed to walk out of that transaction feeling deeper connected into your real life relationship?
不会。
No.
这完全是种分心，但这种分心会制造各种诱惑和虚假连接，对你的婚姻根本没好处，而且当配偶问你为什么总在看手机时，你总有无数借口可以推脱。
It's a total distraction, but it's a distraction that is gonna create all kinds of enticements and connections that really are not gonna be good for your marriage, and you have total plausible deniability if your spouse has any question about why are you on your phone.
我们每个人刷手机都有成千上万的理由。
There's a million reasons we'd all be on our phone.
所以，是的，这简直是一场完美风暴。
So, yeah, it's a perfect storm.
作为离婚律师，我们真该感谢这些平台的创造者，是他们给了我们职业保障。
Like, as divorce lawyers, we owe the people who made these platforms a debt of tremendous gratitude because they have given us job security.
所以如果你处于一段承诺的关系中，是的。
So if you're in a committed partnership Yeah.
你自己对社交媒体有什么样的基本准则？
What is the kinda ground rules around social media for yourself?
是的。
Yeah.
那你的伴侣呢？
And for your partner?
我喜欢你提出这个问题的方式，因为我觉得很多问题都与你实际在做什么有关。
I I like how you framed that question because I think a lot of this has to do with what are you doing.
对。
Yes.
比如
Like
因为我觉得大多数已婚人士都希望拥有幸福的婚姻。
because I think most people who are married would like to have a happy marriage.
所以就像大多数人希望保持健康一样，问题不在于你想要什么。
So just like most people would like to be in good shape, the question is not what do you want.
而在于你愿意为此付出什么代价？
It's what are you willing to trade for it?
也就是说，为了得到那个目标，你愿意放弃什么？
Like, what are you willing to give up in exchange for that thing?
所以我认为我们必须首先问自己：我使用这项技术的方式，如果我的配偶就站在这里，我会有所不同吗？
So I think the first question we have to ask ourselves is, am I using this technology in a way that if my spouse was standing here, I would use it differently?
比如，如果我的配偶在看我关注了谁，我还会关注这些人吗？
Like, would I be following these people if my spouse was watching who I follow?
我并不是建议我们必须互相监控对方的社交媒体。
I'm not suggesting we have to monitor each other's social media.
这是一项我认为夫妻必须自行决定的非常个人化的选择。
That's a, I think, a very personal decision couples have to make.
但我认为最好的切入点是审视自己。
But I think the best entry point is yourself.
对吧？
Right?
因为我对自己有更大的控制力，而不是其他任何东西。
Because I have much more control over myself than anything else.
所以我认为，最好的起点是：如果我的配偶也参与这场对话，我还会以这种方式和这个人交流吗？
So I think starting with, would I be having this communication with this person in this specific way if my spouse was part of the conversation?
有时候，答案显然是否定的。
And sometimes it's very obvious that the answer is no.
我真的认为，预防不忠的切入点在于监控自己的行为。
Like, I I genuinely think the cure for the entry points of infidelity is monitoring your own behavior.
如果我的配偶站在我旁边，我会这样跟这个人说话吗？
Like, if my spouse was standing next to me, would I be talking to this person this way?
我会这样盯着他们看吗？
Would I be looking at them this way?
如果我的配偶站在这里，我的肢体语言还会是这样吗？
Would my body language be what it is if my spouse was standing here?
如果答案是否定的，那就留意一下。
And if the answer is no, okay, then just notice that.
留意这一点。
Notice that.
我不是说你必须做得不一样，但要注意，因为你意识到，嘿。
I'm not saying you have to do it differently, but notice that because you realize, hey.
这有问题。
This is a problem.
我知道我总把话题拉回到饮食和健身上，但你知道，我比控制自己的大脑更能掌控饮食环境。
Like, I I know I keep bringing things back to, like, food and fitness, but, you know, like, I can't I can control my food environment better than my brain.
如果家里有薯片，我就会吃。
Like, if there's potato chips around, I'm eating them.
所以我知道了，好吧。
So I know, okay.
我不能把那种东西放在家里。
I can't have that in the house.
或者如果我把它放在家里，那是在明白我会在某时一口气把那些薯片吃光的前提下。
Or if I have it in the house, it's with the understanding that, oh, yeah.
我知道。
I'm gonna annihilate those potato chips at some point in one sitting.
你懂的？
You know?
这没关系。
And that's okay.
听我说。
Like, listen.
生活是要享受的。
Life is to be enjoyed.
但如果你因为自律就是用你现在想要的，去交换你最想要的。
But if you because discipline is trading what you want now for what you want most.
那么，我最想要的是什么？
And so what do I want most?
我想要一段长久而令人满足的关系。
I want a long term satisfying relationship.
我希望在这段关系中感到快乐。
I wanna be happy in this relationship.
我希望我的伴侣在这段关系中也感到快乐。
I want my partner to be happy in this relationship.
我希望我们两人都感到充实。
I I want both of us to feel fulfilled.
我希望我们两人都感受到爱。
I want both of us to feel loved.
我的目标就是这些。
Like, that's what I want.
詹姆斯，我非常感激你在这里。
James, I am so grateful that you're here.
我还有更多问题。
I have so many more questions.
我可以听你讲一整天，但现在我想暂停一下。
I could listen to you all day, but I wanna hit the pause.
因为如果你和我一样，只想把这段话发给我的丈夫克里斯。
Because if you're like me, just wanna send this to my husband, Chris.
我想把这段话发给我的每一个孩子。
I wanna send this to every one of my kids.
我确信你生活中也有一些人，就像我身边的人一样，我想给你一个机会，把这段非凡的对话分享给你所爱的人。
I'm sure there are people in your life that are coming to mine, and I wanna give you a chance to share this extraordinary conversation with people that you love.
所以，请听一听我们的精彩赞助商带来的几句话。
So take a listen to our amazing sponsors while they share a few words.
请不要离开，因为詹姆斯·塞克顿，他才刚刚开始。
Do not go anywhere because James Sexton, he's just getting started.
接下来，他将告诉你，如果你的婚姻正开始陷入恶性循环，你需要做的三件具体事情。
And coming up, he's gonna tell you the three specific things you need to do if you're in a relationship that's starting to have a downward spiral.
我们还将涵盖更多内容。
There's so much more we're gonna cover.
请继续关注我们。
Stay with us.
欢迎回来。
Welcome back.
我是你的朋友梅尔·罗宾斯。
It's your friend Mel Robbins.
今天，你和我将与杰出的詹姆斯·塞克顿共度时光，他将分享你听过的最棒的恋爱建议。
And today, you and I are getting to spend time with the incredible James Sexton, who is sharing the best relationship advice that you're ever gonna hear.
所以，詹姆斯，接下来我想谈的是这个。
So, James, the next thing I wanna talk about is this.
假设你现在正处于关系中的某个阶段，就像此刻正在聆听的我们这里的听众一样，感到恐慌。
Let's say that you're at that point in your relationship where as the person who's here with us right now is listening and having a panic attack.
因为你意识到，你正处在每一段长期关系都会经历的阶段。
Because you realize you're in that phase of the relationship that every long term relationship goes through.
是的。
Yeah.
你已经经历了童话般的故事。
You've had the fairy tale.
是的。
Yeah.
现在进入维护阶段了。
Now you're in maintenance.
是的。
Yeah.
现在你开始感受到怨恨了。
Now you're noticing the resentment is hitting.
是的。
Yeah.
你们已经疏远了。
You're disconnected.
是的。
Yeah.
你们没有性生活。
You're not having sex.
是的。
Yeah.
你总是对你最喜欢的人感到烦躁。
You're annoyed at your favorite person all the time.
你在想是不是有个人更好。
You're wondering if there's somebody better.
你希望情况不是这样，但你开始觉得，我们还能回到过去吗？
You wish it wasn't this way, but it's starting to feel like, will we ever get back?
你立刻应该做些什么？
What are some of the things that you should do immediately?
对。
Yeah.
我的意思是，根据我二十五年处理婚姻法律事务的经验，我想告诉你，你现在所处的状态，正是大多数已婚人士所处的状态。
I mean, I think in in in twenty five years of practicing matrimonial law, what I'd say to you is you're where most people are who are married.
就是说，你现在就处在这个状态。
Like, that's where you are.
你和大多数已婚人士一样。
You're where most people are.
你很可能是因为一连串微小的选择，逐渐陷入了我所说的这种恶性循环。
And you probably got there by this succession of small choices that created this, what I would call, like, a downward spiral.
这种循环就是，你知道的，为什么我要做那件事呢？
This spiral where, you know, well, why should I do that?
你就不做那件事。
You don't do that.
那为什么我要做呢？
Well, why should I do that?
她也不做那件事。
She doesn't do that.
于是你就想，为什么我要做呢？但好消息是，无论你现在身处何处——无论是最近才开始这样，还是已经深陷低谷，甚至都记不起当初我们在一起时那种美好感觉了——你都可以扭转这个恶性循环。
Well, why should and the good news is wherever you are, whether that started just recently or whether you are down in the valley, right, like it has just been, I don't remember what it was like and what it felt like when we were in that great place, you can reverse that spiral.
它的工作原理是一样的。
It works the same.
它在相反的方向上也是同样的原理。
It works the same in the opposite direction.
它出错的方式是怎么一样的呢？
How is is the same way that it went wrong?
小的。
Small.
小的行动。
Small actions.
比如，从小事做起。
Like, start small.
从留张便条开始。
Start with leave a note.
留张便条。
Leave a note.
你明天早上要出门上班。
You're leaving in the morning for work.
留张便条。
Leave a note.
昨晚和你一起玩真的很开心。
It was really fun hanging out with you last night.
我娶了世界上最漂亮的女人。
I married the prettiest girl in the world.
或者，你知道的，嘿。
Or, you know, hey.
谢谢你，你知道的，昨天帮我处理了那件事，还给电缆公司打了电话。
Thanks for, you know, thanks for taking care of that, you know, thing for me yesterday and calling the cable company.
当我的大块头男人做这种事时，真的让我很感动。
It really means a lot when my big strong man does things like that.
随便吧。
Whatever.
比如，一些小小的礼貌或善意根本不费事，花五秒钟就能做到。
Like, some little courtesy or kindness costs nothing, takes five seconds to do.
你知道你其实也做过吗？
You know you also did?
因为你真的很擅长操控
Because you're really good at manipulating
是的。
Yeah.
而且很有策略性。
And being strategic.
对。
Yeah.
你在那张便条里提醒了我
You reminded me in that note
是的。
Yeah.
关于我当时的感受
Of how I felt
是的。
Yeah.
我们刚认识的时候。
When we first met.
是的。
Yeah.
是的。
Yeah.
世界上最美的人。
Prettiest girl in the world.
是的。
Yeah.
最强壮的家伙。
Strongest guy.
地球上最棒的人。
Best person on the planet.
为什么不呢？
And why not?
为什么不呢？
Why not?
就像，一整天这样做都特别简单。
Like, that's so easy throughout the day.
我经常告诉我的男性朋友，如果你在白天给妻子发一首对你有特殊意义的歌，附上链接，说：‘我今天在咖啡店听到这首歌，就想到你了’，那种感觉真的很棒。
Like, I I I tell a lot of my male friends, if you text your wife in the middle of the day with a song that was like a song important to you and you send a link to that song and you go, I heard this song in the coffee shop today and I thought of you, like, that that's an incredible feeling.
那种感觉令人陶醉，美妙至极。
Like, it's an intoxicating, wonderful feeling.
而且，只需要一点点小事，就能让人重新回到那种感觉中。
Like and and it doesn't take much to just bring someone back to that place.
顺便说一句，对方最初的反应可能是：‘是什么让你有这个想法？’
And by the way, the person's initial reaction might be, what what inspired that?
就像，如果你已经深陷谷底，对吧。
Like, where because if you're down far enough in the valley Right.
你就会想，其实说一句‘你知道吗？’并不难。
You kinda go like but it's not hard to just say, you know what?
我只是觉得，我得更好地告诉你这些事。
I just I feel like I have to do a better job of, like, telling you these things.
我经常想到，但有时却没有说出口。
I think of it a lot, but I sometimes don't say it out loud.
谁会不想听到这些呢？
Like, who would not want to hear that?
这需要多少代价？要花多少钱？
Like, how much would it take and how much would it cost?
什么都不用。
Nothing.
这完全不需要花钱。
It would cost nothing.
给你的配偶写一封邮件，列出十件我爱你的理由。
To write your spouse an email, here's 10 things I love about you.
十件事。
10 things.
顺便说一下，这不只是为他们写的。
And by the way, you're it's not just for them.
他们读到这些一定会很喜欢。
Like, they'll love reading that.
但这也是为你自己写的。
But also, like, it's for you.
提醒自己，你当初为什么选择了这个人？
Like, remind yourself, why did you choose this person?
这个人身上依然有那么多美好之处。
Like, there's still so much beauty in this person.
你身上也依然有那么多美好之处。
There's still so much beauty in you.
为什么你不花点时间，好好感受这份温暖呢？
Like, why wouldn't you take a moment and just enjoy the warmth of that?
它就在这里。
Like, it's right there.
没人会向你宣传这个，因为它是免费的。
It's like, no one's gonna advertise this to you because it's free.
你不需要买书来学习它。
You don't need to buy a book to learn it.
你不需要去上课。
You don't need to take a course.
我这里没什么可以卖给你。
There's nothing I can sell you here.
这其实就是你本来就拥有的。
Like, this is just you have it.
它就在这里。
It's right there.
它就在你面前。
It's right in front of you.
你得在某个时刻主动避开它。
You have to actively steer away from it at some point.
而且，再说一遍，改变永远不会太晚
And, again, and it's never too late to change
这个循环。
that cycle.
我在想那个听到这话的人。
I'm thinking about the person who hears that.
是的。
Yeah.
他们正在写那封包含十件事的邮件，我觉得我们很容易被困在自己的角落里
They're writing the email of 10 things, and I think we can get so sequestered in our corners
那样
that
你的第一反应可能是：我想不出十件，或者为什么他们不写给我？
you your immediate reaction is either I can't think of 10 or why aren't they writing it to me?
是的。
Yeah.
或者如果他们不回复怎么办？
Or what if they don't respond?
是的。
Yeah.
所以你知道你在说什么吗？
So you know what saying?
很好的问题。
Great questions.
我想我会分别回答这些问题。
So and I think I would answer them separately.
第一个问题是：如果我想不出关于这个人我爱的十件事怎么办？
So the first one is, what if I can't think of 10 things I love about this person?
那你或许应该考虑离婚。
Then maybe you should consider getting divorced.
什么？
What?
我的意思是，如果你告诉我，你和一个人结婚了，却想不出有10件你爱他的事，世界上有80亿人。
I mean, if you if you're telling me you're married to a person and you can't think of 10 things you love about them, there are 8,000,000,000 people in the world.
也许你嫁错了人。
Maybe you're married to the wrong one.
有时候，幸福地生活在一起，意味着各自幸福地生活。
Like, sometimes happily ever after means happily ever after separately.
我离过婚。
Like, I'm divorced.
我前妻是我最喜欢的人之一。
My ex wife is one of my favorite people.
她太棒了。
She's amazing.
我非常爱她。
I love her very much.
有很多我爱的人，但我并不想和他们结婚。
There are a lot of people I love that I wouldn't wanna be married to.
实际上，所有人都是这样。
Actually, all of them.
所有人都是这样。
All of them.
对吧？
Right?
因为这是一种非常特殊的关系。
Because it's a very specific kind of relationship.
如果你告诉我，你从80亿人中选出了这个人作为你生命中最亲密的伴侣，却想不出有10个你爱他的理由，那也许你该考虑离婚了，因为这种现实太荒谬了。
If you're telling me, I can't think of 10 things this person I chose out of 8,000,000,000 other options to be my most intimate partner in life, I can't think of 10 things I love about that person, I maybe you should consider a divorce because that's an insane reality.
顺便说一下，也许你们已经渐行渐远了。
And by the way, okay, maybe you've grown so far apart.
我前妻已经和一个很棒的男人再婚十五年了，他在性格上和我完全不一样，但非常适合她。
My ex wife has been remarried for fifteen years to an amazing guy who's absolutely nothing like me personality wise and perfect for her.
我得告诉你，我爱她。
And I have to tell you, I love her.
我也爱他。
I love him.
我们就像一个奇怪的家庭。
We're like a weird family.
但说实话，愿上帝保佑。
But the truth is, like, God bless.
愿上帝保佑。
Like, God bless.
她找到了属于自己的那口锅的盖子。
She found the lid for her pot.
太棒了。
Amazing.
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