418. 如何修复友谊

这个月，我们将深入探讨当大脑偏离轨道时会发生什么，以及我们可以做些什么。

This is a month of deeply personal and honest conversations about what happens when the brain goes off course and what we can do about it.

请在 iHeartRadio 应用、Apple 播客或其他你常用的播客平台收听《Intercosmos》。

Listen to Intercosmos on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

自主权。

Agency.

知道自己才是身体最懂的那个人。

The ability to know that we're the experts in our own body.

在播客《Cultivating Her Space》里，多姆医生和特里·洛马克斯为黑人女性创造了一个可以真实表达、被认真倾听的空间。

On the podcast, Cultivating Her Space, doctor Dom and Terry Lomax create a space where black women can show up fully and be heard.

我真心觉得，人到三十岁，就不该再和别人合住一间房。

I wholeheartedly think, you know, you hit 30, you shouldn't have to share a room with anybody.

对。

Mhmm.

从处理友谊与疗愈，到设立界限、优先照顾自己的心理健康。

From navigating friendships and healing to setting boundaries and prioritizing your mental health.

这些是我们在日常生活中很少能坦率说出口的真实对话。

These are real honest conversations we don't always get to have out loud.

生活中不同方面的要求简直太不讲理了，对吧？

Totally unreasonable with different parts of life, right?

比如，三餐都要吃，还得每顿都保持正念。

Like, oh, we'll have all three meals and make sure you're mindful during all of them.

根本不可能做到。

Absolutely not.

有一顿饭，我站着给孩子们喂饭。

During one meal, I'm I'm standing and handing my children food.

因为疗愈、赋能和韧性不是空谈，而是需要践行的生活方式。

Because healing, empowerment and resilience aren't just ideas, they're practices.

在今年这个心理健康意识月，再也没有比现在更该好好关爱自己的时候了。

And this mental health awareness month, there's no better time to pour back into yourself.

在 iHeartRadio 应用、Apple 播客或你常用的播客平台收听《Cultivating Her Space》。

Listen to cultivating her space on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts.

我说一句，我们待会要聊的有些内容，对你来说可能挺明显的，尤其是如果你是个情绪智商很高、特别敏锐的人。

Let me say, I do think some of what we're about to talk about is gonna be fairly obvious to you, especially if you're like a very emotionally intelligent switched on person.

但这并不意味着你真的在这么做。

That doesn't mean that we're applying it though.

知道是一回事，能不能落实是另一回事。

Just because you know doesn't mean that you're putting it into practice.

我觉得，这其实是自我觉察很强的人常遇到的问题。

I think this is a common issue with being a very self aware individual.

你可能什么都知道，但就是做不到。

Like, can have all the information and none of the execution.

所以，不管你现在处在什么情况里，我都希望你能好好想想，把自己代入进去，每一点都问自己：我该怎么去做？

So whatever situation you are in right now, I want you to really picture your your situation in this context and just consider in every point, like, how how would I go about this?

我该怎么把这种理解用到实际中？

How am I going to apply this understanding?

还有一个很大的问题一直悬着：我的这段友谊，还值得挽救吗？

There's also a big question lingering here as well, which is like, is my friendship worth saving?

这段友谊是不是该让它留在过去？

Is this friendship best left in the past?

我觉得，确实有些该这样。

I think, yeah, some are.

有些友谊，就该放下了。

Some friendships are best left.

已经结束了。

They're done.

对吧？

Right?

伤得太深了。

The hurt goes too deep.

情况太难熬了。

The situation is too unbearable.

你再也不想和他们做朋友了。

You don't wanna be friends with them anymore.

有时候，结果就是这样。

That's just sometimes the outcome.

但我相信，你听这一集一定有你的原因。

But I think that you're listening to this episode for a reason.

当你心里突然涌起一种牵挂，觉得‘我还是在乎他’，说明这段感情还有值得保留的地方，那就值得去修复。

And I think when you feel that tug and that lingering sense of like, miss them, I still care about them, there's something left there, then it's worth repairing.

所以，如果你想修复这段友谊，第一步是好好想想：你为什么想挽回？

So the first thing that you're gonna do if you wanna repair the friendship is just reflect on why you wanna mend it.

你到底想从这段关系里得到什么？

Like, what what do you seek to gain?

如果你都不清楚自己为什么看重这段友谊，那修复它就没有意义。

There's no point mending a friendship if you don't know why you value the friendship.

如果你也不清楚自己想改变什么。

If you don't know what you want to change.

如果你根本看不到和这个人未来的可能。

If you don't actually see a future with that person.

好好深入想想。

Just really dig in deep.

这个人身上到底有什么吸引你？

What is it about this person?

说实话，这本身也是一个让人更理解人性的过程。

Like, honestly, it's also a great humanizing exercise.

你最想念这个人哪一点？

What is it about this person that you miss?

你对这个人有什么遗憾？

What are your regrets to do with this person?

你觉得你们之间是不是有什么误会，其实可以化解？

Do you with this situation, like, you feel like there's a misunderstanding you could overcome?

你们俩是不是都能从这段关系里学到些什么？

Do you feel like there are ways that you could both learn from each other?

你是想修复这段友谊，只是为了避免在即将到来的活动中尴尬吗？

Do you wanna mend the friendship to make things less uncomfortable for an upcoming event?

你的目的是什么？

Like, what is your intention?

因为这两者是不一样的。

Because they are gonna be different.

对吧？

Right?

也许你的动机是内疚，觉得该向他们道个歉。

Maybe your intention is like you feel guilty and like you feel like you owe them an apology.

每个人的动机都会很不一样。

Everybody's motivation is gonna be very, very different.

试着弄清楚你自己的真实想法。

Try and identify what it is that yours is.

一个是你想主动维系的友谊，另一个是你觉得该做个了结、但不一定想继续的关系，这两者是有区别的。

And the difference between a friendship that you actively want to continue and a situation that you just think deserves closure, but not necessarily the continuation of the relationship.

我觉得这两种情况都同样值得去面对。

I think both of those situations are equally worthwhile.

这两种选择都很有意义，对吧？总比让事情一直悬着、烂在那里，永远没有个了结要强。

They're both very worthwhile options, right, compared to the alternative of leaving the situation just like open and festering and like never with any closure.

但它们需要你采取不同的做法。

But they're gonna necessitate a different approach.

对吧？

Right?

这两种选择都有价值，但你处理的方式得有点不一样。

They're both worthwhile, but you're gonna have to go about it a little bit differently.

因为你想修复一段友谊，就得多做几步工作。

Because wanting a friendship to repair means that you're gonna have to do a couple of extra steps.

如果你只是想让这段关系有个了结和理解，那其实没必要要求对方改变行为。

Wanting a friendship to just have closure and understanding kinda means that, you know, there doesn't really need to be behavioral change for the other person.

所以重点在于对话本身，可能只要好好谈上几个小时，就能解决了。

So it's more about like the the conversation and it probably could be resolved by a couple of hours of just real deep talking.

明白这一点，真的特别重要。

So just knowing that is very very valuable.

其次，一旦你弄清楚了自己的动机，就会更清楚自己这么做的真正目的。

Secondly, once you've kind of identified your motivation, you have that increased self awareness around your intentions.

接下来，该坦诚面对自己：哪些地方是你做得不对，或者本可以做得更好的。

I think then the time comes to admit to yourself what you did wrong or what you could have done better.

这可能听起来有点争议。

This might be controversial.

如果你想修复一段友谊，就得放低姿态。

If you wanna repair a friendship, you need to humble yourself.

即使对方也有责任。

Even if they played a role as well.

哪怕主要责任在对方身上。

Even if they played the main role.

我知道很多人不认同这一点。

I know I know people won't agree with this.

但这其实是个考验自我的过程。

This is an ego exercise though.

这明显是个误会。

And obviously, this is probably a miscommunication.

这只是一个身体反应。

This is a physical.

并不是什么情绪崩溃。

It's not a crazy breakdown.

你一上来就全副武装，非要捍卫自己的立场，一点不让步，这样根本没用。

You going in guns blazing, ready to defend yourself and ready to defend your position to the death, unable to make any concessions, this is not gonna be productive.

对吧？

Right?

放低姿态，承认自己做错的地方——哪怕只有一两件事——对实现修复友谊这个目标很重要。

Humbling yourself, admitting what you have done wrong, even if it's just one or two things, is important for this for this goal, which is to repair the friendship.

因为这并不是为了争对错，而是为了重建心理上的安全感。

Because it's not about scoring points, it's about restoring psychological safety.

是为了重建信任。

It's about restoring trust.

当你连自己的一点责任都不愿承认时，我觉得这其实是在表现出防御心态。

And when you're unwilling to acknowledge your role, even a small part, I think it signals defensiveness.

我觉得，我也知道。

And I think and I know.

研究显示，防御心态会立刻触发对方的威胁反应。

Studies show us that defensiveness is the thing that's gonna immediately activate the other person's threat response.

他们马上就会变得防御起来，就像你一样。

They're immediately gonna go on the defensive like the defensive.

他们会觉得自己没被听见，不被认可。

They're gonna feel unheard, invalidated.

他们会更加固守自己的立场，因为那里才是他们觉得最安全的地方。

They're gonna become more entrenched in their own position because that's where they feel safest.

这和我们的自我保护机制密切相关。

Again, is closely tied to our ego defense mechanisms.

我们都想保护自己。

We wanna protect ourselves.

我们都不想觉得自己是个坏人。

We don't wanna feel like we are a bad person.

但这也说明，我们心里可能存在着认知失调，明明有些信息在挑战我们‘我是对的’这个想法，却还在抗拒。

But it also shows that we're probably going in with some cognitive dissonance where we're resisting some information that challenges our sense of being the good one.

那些信息或事实，其实可能是真实存在的。

Information or facts that may actually be there.

我觉得，只要你肯放低姿态，就能更专注地在当下，也能更理解对方的感受。

And I think beyond that, just by humbling yourself, you you allow yourself to be more present and you allow yourself to have more empathy for them.

你会降低情绪的对抗性，也给对方树立了承担责任的榜样。

You will you lower the emotional stakes, you model accountability.

研究者还发现，这会引发一种‘脆弱感的相互回应’。

And researchers have also seen that it creates what we call a reciprocity of vulnerability.

简单说，当一个人先软化态度，说一句‘对不起，我刚才那样不对’，营造出开放、愿意学习的氛围，对方就更愿意跟着放下防备。

Basically, when one person softens and one person says, I'm sorry for this, sets the emotional tone of openness, says I'm willing to learn, the other person is far more likely to follow.

所以这样做，效果要好得多。

So it's a lot more fruitful.

我只是觉得，这会把气氛从对抗变成合作。

I just think that it makes it it it just shifts the dynamic and the tone from adversarial to collaborative.

你猜怎么着？

And guess what?

就算对方不愿意放低姿态，哪怕他不肯认错，你这么做依然有效，因为你心里更清楚了——至少你试着站在对方的角度看问题。

Even if the other person doesn't do this as well, even if this person is unwilling to humble themselves, it's still effective and it still means that you get to walk out with more clarity because you'll be able to say, like, I stepped into their shoes.

你看到了全局。

I got the bird's eye view.

你愿意承担责任。

I was willing to take accountability.

这部分，我算是做到了。

This part of my job is done.

修复这段友谊的下一步，可能是最难的，但总得有个人先迈出这一步。

The next step for repairing your friendship is probably the hardest one, but somebody needs to reach out first.

对吧？

Right?

或者你还在那种尴尬的状态里，彼此都心知肚明出了问题，可谁都不愿意主动提。

Or if you're still in that awkward state of like, we both know something's wrong but neither of us really wants to touch it.

如果你正处在这种情况，你们当中得有一个人先开启‘我们得谈谈’的模式。

If you're in that situation, one of you needs to initiate the like, we need to talk protocol.

我觉得这个人就应该是你。

And I think it should be you.

我完全能感觉到，你刚才翻了个白眼，叹了口气，还深吸了一口气。

And I can totally I feel like I can sense that you rolled your eyes, you groan, you took a deep breath.

我知道这很难受，但你也知道，我说得没错。

I know it sucks, but I think you know I'm right as well.

听这段话的人是你。

You're the one who's listening to this.

知道出了问题的人也是你。

You're the one who knows something's wrong.

有心想要修复这段友谊的人，还是你。

You're the one who has the intention of repairing the friendship.

所以这次得你主动一点。

So you're gonna have to be the bigger person.

我会一步步教你该说什么、该发什么。

I'm gonna talk you through exactly what you're gonna say, what you're gonna send.

别担心。

Don't worry.

我会陪着你。

You won't be alone.

但这件事必须由你来做。

But it has to be you.

你发消息之前，最好先打个招呼，让对方有个心理准备，别一上来就直接说：‘我们谈谈吧’。

When you go to send the text because I think it's worth preparing somebody that you wanna have the conversation rather than just being like boo, we're gonna talk about it.

首先，别在深夜发消息。

Firstly, don't send the message late at night.

也别带着敌意去发。

And don't send it from a place of hostility.

我二十岁的时候经历过一次友情破裂，有个朋友在凌晨两点给我发了条消息，那是我这辈子收到过最刻薄的一条信息，大意是说我们得好好谈谈。

I had a friendship breakup when I was like 20, where a friend of mine texted me probably one of the meanest messages I have ever received in my life at like 2AM in the morning, essentially being like, we need to figure this out.

顺便说一句，你错了。

But by the way, you're in the wrong.

那天是我祖父的葬礼。

That was the day of my grandfather's funeral.

凌晨两点，我祖父葬礼的那天。

2AM, the day of my grandfather's funeral.

他给我发了那条消息。

He sent me that message.

从那一刻起，我们修复这段友谊的可能就彻底没了。

Any hope of us repairing that friendship was like gone in that second.

我知道自己确实有很多地方该道歉。

I knew I had serious things to apologize for.

我知道我确实做错了，但当时我只觉得，这太让人心里难受了。

I knew that I'd messed up, but I was just like, this is so emotionally unsettling.

我清楚得很，你根本不是想好好谈，就是想冲我吼。

And it's so clear to me that you don't like, you just wanna yell at me.

根本谈不上什么合作了，这事就这么结束了。

And there's not gonna be any collaboration here that it was just like that's it's it's done.

如果你真想解决这事，下班后五点、六点，有时间好好想想，发条消息把你的想法说清楚。

If your intentions are to get somewhere from this, 5PM, 6PM, after work, they have time to sit with it, state your intentions clearly over text.

你打算道歉吗？

So like, do you wanna apologize?

你打算聊聊吗？

Do you wanna talk?

你打算弄明白到底发生了什么吗？

Do you wanna figure out what happened?

你打算找到一条出路吗？

Do you wanna find a way through?

把你要说的事具体点出来，然后在消息里告诉朋友，你希望最后是个什么结果。

Highlight the situation you are talking about, like and tell your friend what the ideal outcome is in your text message.

记住，这一集我们聊的是如何修复一段友谊。

Remember, in this episode, we are talking about how to repair a friendship.

这才是真正能达成目标的最佳方式。

This is, like, the best way you can go about it to get that outcome.

这就像你自己设计的一条聊天模板。

This is like a make your own adventure text message.

对吧？

Right?

但这个结构其实适用于任何情况。

But you can use this structure for everything.

你明白吗？

You know?

我举个例子。

I'll give an example.

比如，‘我想聊聊婚礼上发生的事’，这是目的；而‘希望下次婚礼还能和睦相处’，这才是你想要的结果。

Like, there's a difference between I wanna talk about what happened at the wedding, intention, so that we can be amicable for the next wedding, outcome.

然后好好聊聊。

And talk.

就是，意图、行动、结果。

Like, intention, action, outcome.

比如，我想为我对你那位共同朋友说的话道歉，因为我相信我们能渡过这个难关。

Versus something like, I want to apologize for what I said to our mutual friend because I think that we can get through this.

同样是，意图、结果、行动。

Again, intention, outcome, action.

再来一个，就当是举个例子。

And then like another one just for fun.

几周前，你的那些行为让我觉得很难过。

Like, I felt hurt by your actions a few weeks back.

我想把话说开，让我们能互相理解，继续往前走。

I wanna clear the air so that we can reach a mutual understanding and move forward.

这种表达方式，什么时候都管用。

Like, that structure works always.

我觉得这套方法可能连真正的分手都解决不了，不过那是后话了。

I think it probably wouldn't even work for for a real breakup, but that's for another time.

主动承认出了问题，真的挺让人害怕的。

I think it's really scary to be the one to acknowledge that there's a problem.

但只要你把话说出口，就离放下这件事更近了一步。

But by saying it out loud, think you're one step closer to being able to just move on.

克莱尔·科恩写过一本叫《女性友谊的真相》的书，特别棒。

There's this amazing book by Claire Cohen called The Truth About Female Friendship.

书里她提到，只要没人先迈出这一步，问题就只会停留在彼此的脑子里。

And great book, by the way, but she talks a lot in her book about how until somebody takes that first step, the situation only exists in each other's heads.

当问题只在你心里反复琢磨时，你会不断添油加醋，猜来猜去，还跟别人讨论，越想越离谱。

And when it sits in your head, it's mutated over and over again by you replaying and you adding assumptions and you having conversations with other people.

最后它被你一层层加工，变成了当初那件事的核弹版。

And it's adding all these these ingredients in until it becomes this like a nuclear version of what it once was.

把问题搁着不管，就像把它关进一个有毒的培养皿，最后矛盾完全扭曲成了根本不存在的样子。

Like, keeping it aside is like keeping it in like a toxic incubator until the conflict ends up representing something that it never was to begin with.

要解决这种问题，阻止它继续恶化，最直接的办法就是干脆把事情摊开，直接谈一谈。

The easiest way to kill this kind of beast and to stop this from developing is just like just straight up be like, let's just freaking tear it open and talk about it.

就算最后他们根本不会改变主意，就算他们不想跟你说话，这本身也是一种了结。

Even if it turns out nothing will change their mind, even if they don't wanna talk to you, that is still closure in its own form.

就像我刚才说的，其实还有别的选择。

As I just mentioned, like, there is that alternative.

那个选择，那种结果，始终是可能发生的。

That alternative and that outcome is always possible.

他们可能会拒绝你。

They may say no.

他们也可能直接消失不回你消息。

They might ghost you.

到了这一步，虽然我之前说要为朋友争取，但这时候，就别再强求了。

And at that stage, as much as I said fight for your friends, just leave it.

你已经做了你觉得对得起自己、最该做的事，他们也会做同样的选择。

Like, you did what you thought was right and best for you, They're gonna do the same thing.

不用说，如果对方不想跟你交流，你就不该强迫他们。

It goes without saying that, you know, you shouldn't force the other person to engage with you if they don't want to.

相信我，我懂。

And trust me, I get it.

我知道，当你真心实意地敞开心扉、鼓起勇气主动联系，却换来一句‘不’的时候，那种伤害有多深。

I understand just how hurtful it can be for you to, like, really put your heart on the line and to be, like, really vulnerable and reaching out in the first place and for them to just be like, no.

真的挺痛的。

Like, it hurts.

这本质上是一种社交拒绝，但比那更让人掏心掏肺。

Basically a form of social rejection, but so much more, like, vulnerable.

但我还是觉得，这本身就是一个答案。

But I still think that's an answer.

我知道，比起直接谈开，这种沉默可能更难熬，因为你面对的是种模糊的失去。

Like, I know it's probably harder than if you had had the conversation because there's this ambiguous loss.

很明显，他们有非常坚定的想法，你永远听不到，他们也永远不会告诉你，所以你得自己给这段故事画上句号。

And it's obvious they have some very strong opinions that they'll that you'll never hear and they'll never share with you, and that means that you have to close the story.

但有时候，这就是生活。

But sometimes that's just life.

对吧？

Right?

这其实也是一种教训。

That's a lesson in other ways.

这不是关于谦卑，而是关于接受。

That's a lesson not in humility but in acceptance.

这就是靠近任何人时，必须承担的风险。

And that's just the risk of ever being close to anybody.

有时候，他们根本看不到维系友谊有多重要。

Sometimes they don't see the importance of fighting for friendship.

有时候，他们也看不到修复关系有多重要。

Sometimes they don't see the importance of repairing.

有时候，你做过一些事，自己都没意识到有多伤人，可他们就是不想提。

Sometimes you have done things that you don't realize were immensely hurt, like harmful, that they don't wanna talk about.

事情本来就是这样。

And that's just the way things are.

别再深究了。

Don't go digging.

别再逼迫了。

Don't go pushing.

学会给自己一个了结，这也是一种领悟。

There is there is, again, a lesson in creating our own closure.

我觉得这真的很有帮助。

I actually found it helpful.

我曾经也遇到过类似的情况，心里觉得可能是自己搞砸了。

I went through a situation like this where I was like, I really have probably screwed up.

我想和对方聊聊。

I wanna talk about it.

但我也不太清楚到底发生了什么。

I also didn't really know what had happened.

她不想跟我谈，我就列了个清单，因为一直在那儿反复琢磨。

And she didn't wanna talk to me and I made this list because I was like obsessing over it.

我列了一大堆，全是我想过她的好，所有我喜欢她的地方。

And I made this huge list of like everything I loved about this person.

我想要她拥有的每一样东西，我真心希望她能过得好。

Everything I wanted you like, everything I wanted for her.

我多希望看到她开开心心的。

How happy I wanted to see her.

我还一直告诉自己，事情只能是这样发展了。

And I also just kept saying like, this is the only way it could have gone.

我们彼此生命中的这段角色已经结束了，但这段经历依然很重要。

The role we played in each other's lives is over, but the role we played was important nonetheless.

事情本来就应该这样收场。

This is just it just had to be this way.

这就是我们友谊现在的样子。

This is just the state of our friendship.

最近我在伦敦街上碰见她了，她正和伴侣一起走在我的那条街上，还是在另一个国家。

And I actually saw her walking in London recently, walking down my street in a different country with her partner.

我隔着马路，有点不敢过去。

And I was a bit of a coward across the road.

但我还是回头看了她一眼，说不上来为什么。

But I kind of, like, looked back at her just like I don't know.

我们从来没能好好道别，但她看起来真的很快乐。

We never got the closure, but she looks really happy.

她就是那种特别开心的样子。

And she just seemed really happy.

如果当时我们试着挽回，如果她主动联系我，愿意和我聊聊，也许就不会变成现在这样——至少作为朋友，我们反而更幸福了。

And maybe if we tried to fix things at that time and if she had reached out and accepted my, like, want my desire to, like, talk about it, we wouldn't be in the situations we were now where we were happier not as friends.

那时候，我就是觉得这么想挺合理的。

Like, I just feel like that made sense to me in that moment.

我们各自需要的未来，注定了我们不能再做朋友。

That, like, the future that we needed meant that we couldn't be friends anymore.

看看我们俩在各自的未来都过得那么幸福，这对我来说比那场关于结束的对话、追究错在哪里、为什么出问题、反复翻旧账要重要得多。

And look at us both in these futures very, very happy, and that was worth more to me than the closure conversation and figuring out what went wrong and why and rehashing details.

我不是说每种情况都这样，但有时候确实就是这样。

Not to say that's every situation, but I think sometimes that is the situation.

现在回头看，经历了这件事，六年后的我忍不住想，哇，分手之后，一切果然都该怎样就怎样了。

And now me having the hindsight of being through that situation and like six years later being like, wow, just like a breakup, it all works out the way it should be.

我只是想跟你分享一点我这种感受，说不上来为什么。

Like, it's just something I kinda wanna, I don't know, impart on you, I guess.

不过还是回到聊天本身，回到当对方说‘是的，我们确实需要谈谈’的时候，我们该怎么应对，而不是任由情况恶化到彻底沉默。

But back to the chat, back to how we're gonna approach when somebody says, yes, I think we do need to discuss rather than the worst case scenario of nothing.

你要做好心理准备，面对尴尬，也准备好可能被深深误解。

Prepare for the awkwardness, and prepare to possibly feel deeply misunderstood.

你之所以陷入这种局面，是因为当初有人被误解了，事情变得模糊不清。

I just you're coming to this like, the reason you're in this situation is because somebody was misunderstood and things were confusing.

这就像猛地撕掉创可贴一样。

And that's gonna be like ripping off a band aid.

整个过程会特别难受，但之后你会感到极大的释然，因为那种模糊不清的感觉正在慢慢消散。

Like, it's gonna be deeply uncomfortable, and then you're gonna find such relief that it's just the ambiguity is slowly disappearing.

我也希望你能相信，你是个成年人，对方也是，你们都能应对冲突，也能承受不适。

I also want you to trust that you're an adult, they're an adult, you can handle conflict, you can handle being uncomfortable.

某种程度上，摩擦很重要，甚至是成长和成为更好自己的必要部分。

And in part, friction is an important and is a necessity for growth and becoming a better person.

亲自见到朋友，也会帮你更好地面对这一切。

Seeing the friend in person as well will also help you with this.

记住对方是活生生的人，记得他们值得被理解，这远比在短信里或电话中争个对错更有价值。

Remembering that they are flesh and blood, remembering that they deserve empathy is so much more valuable than like having an argument over text or even over the phone.

这确实更难。

It's harder.

但值得这么做。

It's worth it.

给自己多一点时间。

And just give yourself a lot of time.

如果你要谈这场对话，就得做好觉得尴尬的准备。

Like, if you're gonna have this conversation, prepare to feel awkward.

另外，也别只留一两个小时，得多留点时间。

Also prepare, like, a couple of hours.

最好安排几个小时，好好把事情说清楚。

Like, prepare a couple hours to really hash things out.

我觉得，只要你给自己留出这个空间，我认识的人里，没人会后悔和朋友这样谈一次，哪怕一开始很别扭，哪怕结果没那么完美。

And I think if you give yourself that space, I don't know anybody who has ever regretted having a conversation like this with a friend, even if it was awkward to begin with, even if the outcome was less than ideal.

因为，主动走进这种尴尬的场面，首先能让你得到答案。

Because I think putting yourself in what is going to be an awkward situation, firstly, gives you answers.

其次，大概率能修复你们的友谊。

Secondly, probably will repair your friendship.

就算事情没按预期发展，这种做法本身也特别能肯定你自己。

And it's also just really self affirming in a way even if it doesn't go right.

我不确定这么说你能不能懂，但愿意面对这些不舒服的时刻，说明你是个愿意为朋友争取的人，说明你愿意为所爱的人承受不适，说明你诚实，能直面真实的人性，也说明你就是你一直想成为的那个人。

I don't know if this makes sense, but I think being willing to put yourself in uncomfortable situations proves that you are a person that fights for your friends, proves that you are somebody who endures uncomfortable things for those they love, proves that you are honest, proves that you can embrace raw human emotion, and that you are the person that you say you are.

再说一遍，就算结果不如意，就算让你特别紧张，你至少可以对自己说：我努力过了，我挺身而出了，这就是我践行自己价值观的证明。

Like, again, even if it doesn't go your way, even if it makes you really anxious, you can always leave that situation being like, at least I tried, at least I fought, And here is proof that I live out my values.

我说过我是好人。

I say I'm a good person.

我说过我能面对艰难的对话。

I say I'm somebody who has hard conversations.

我说过我是靠谱的朋友。

I say I'm a good friend.

这，就是证据。

Here is the evidence.

说实话，我挺享受这种不适感的。

Like, I enjoyed this discomfort.

我做了件对在乎的人而言最不容易的事。

I did the thing that was not the easiest thing for somebody that I cared about.

光是这一点，我觉得——说真的，我也不知道该怎么形容。

And that in itself is I think I don't know.

这对我们的自尊有好处，也能提升我们未来当朋友的能力。

I think just good for our self esteem and good for our future capacity as a friend.

好的。

Okay.

在继续聊其他一些你可以提前准备的事情，以及艰难对话结束后会发生什么之前，我们再休息一小会儿。

Let's take one more short break here before we talk about a few other things that you can prepare for and what happens after the hard conversation is over.

请继续关注我们。

Stay with us.

威尔·法瑞尔的重磅玩家和iHeart广播联合呈现《足球妈妈》。

Will Ferrell's big money players and iHeart podcast presents soccer moms.

我是利安。

So I'm Leanne.

对。

Yeah.

这是我的好朋友珍妮特。

This is my best friend, Janet.

嗨。

Hey.

从高中起我们就形影不离了。

And we have been joined at the hip since high school.

没错。

Absolutely.

这么多年过去了，我们还是天天黏在一起。

Now a redacted amount of years later, we're still joined at the hip.

只是屁股比以前大了一圈。

Just a little bit bigger hips, wider.

这是一档播客。

This is a podcast.

我们正在车后头录节目，车是我的本田奥德赛，正赶着去儿子们的足球赛呢。

We're recording it as we tailgate our youth soccer games in the back of my Honda Odyssey.

零食饮料都备齐了。

With all the snacks and drinks.

顺带一提。

Sidebar.

你怎么选了硬苏打水，没选啤酒？

Why did you get hard seltzer instead of beer?

哦，他们搞买一送一。

Oh, they had a BOGO.

那你还真买对了。

Well, then you got it.

要不要来点白葡萄酒？

Do you wanna white collar something here?

来一杯吧。

Just hit me.

你们在干什么呢？

What are y'all doing?

麦克风？

Microphones?

你是在录说唱专辑吗？

Are you making a rap album?

我本来想问，后来怎么了？

I would What happened

两者都怎么了？

to both?

我敢打赌，我肯定会买。

I would bet I would buy it.

突破防守就像热刀切黄油一样顺畅。

Cuts through the defense like a hot That knife through sponge

听起来真诱人。

sounds delicious.

哦，

Oh,

你真走运，我不是个瘾君子。

you're lucky I'm not a drug addict.

我还没酗酒，算你幸运。

Lucky I'm not an alcoholic.

你真该庆幸我不是个杀手。

You're lucky I'm not a killer.

我特别喜欢这支队伍，也一直在努力成为他们可以信赖的人。

I love this team, and I'm really trying to be a figure in their lives that they can rely on.

哦。

Oh.

可以在 iHeartRadio 应用、Apple 播客，或者你常用的播客平台收听《足球妈妈》。

Listen to soccer moms on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

大家好。

Hi, everyone.

我是切丽尔·斯特雷德，著有《走出荒野》和《微小而美丽的事物》。

I'm Cheryl Strayed, author of Wild and Tiny Beautiful Things.

我很高兴告诉大家，我新开了一档播客，叫《心越群山》。

I'm excited to share that I have a new podcast called Mind Over Mountain.

每期节目里，我都会采访运动员、冒险家和追求刺激的人，聊聊那些塑造并激励他们完成非凡壮举的内心世界和人生经历。

In each episode, I interview athletes, adventurers, and adrenaline seekers to discuss the inner landscapes and life experiences that informed and inspired their extraordinary feats.

我也会加入一些实用的建议，帮我们更好地理解如何面对自己生活中看似无法逾越的困难。

I also bring a bit of advice into the mix so we too can better understand how to face our own seemingly insurmountable challenges.

你知道我打算做什么吗？

Do you know what I'm gonna do?

我会把你内心本来就有的东西唤醒出来。

I'm gonna pull out what you already have inside.

我们来到这个世界时，就在为生存而拼搏。

We're coming into this world fighting for our lives.

我所做的，只是把你内心本来就有的东西唤醒出来。

All I'm gonna do is pull out what you already got inside.

我们的目标是互相支持、彼此庆祝，这可不是谁的故事比谁更精彩。

We're there to support and celebrate each other, and that is not like a your story versus my story.

你一定会一步步走上山顶，翻过那座山。

You're gonna walk up and over that dang mountain.

你不是光靠意志力就能硬扛过去的。

You're not just gonna put your mind over it.

对。

Yep.

没错。

Yep.

说得对。

Exactly.

如果我走不过去，我就穿过去。

And if I can't walk up and over it, I'm gonna go through it.

每周四在iHeartRadio应用、Apple播客或你常用的播客平台收听《意志超越高山》。

Listen to mind over mountain every Thursday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

为什么现在人人都这么痴迷于爱情？

Why is everyone obsessed with romance right now?

我是说，每个人都是。

Like, everyone.

你那个自称不看书的同事，其实正在读言情小说。

Your coworker who, quote unquote, doesn't read is reading romance.

你妈、BookTok，还有整个互联网。

Your mom, BookTok, the entire Internet.

我是桑贾娜·巴斯克。

I'm Sanjana Basker.

我是泰勒·麦卡勒。

I'm Tyler McCall.

欢迎收听831电台，一档言情主题播客。

And this is Radio eight three one, a romance podcast.

讲书、讲套路、讲改编、讲狗血、讲热议。

The books, the tropes, the adaptations, the drama, the discourse.

我们还要探讨这一切背后，反映的是人们如何真正去爱、渴望和着迷。

And what all of it says about how we actually love, yearn, and obsess.

接下来我们要去《呼啸山庄》。

We're going to Wuthering Heights.

顺便说一句，这根本不是一部爱情小说。

Which for the record is not a romance novel.

但它却一直萦绕在爱情小说领域上

And yet it has haunted the romance genre for

整整两百年。

two hundred years.

这次我们要深入探讨黑暗爱情、年龄差距，

We're getting into dark romance, age gaps,

还有某些俄罗斯冰球运动员。

certain Russian hockey players.

还有会动的感情对象，这事儿还真存在。

And sentient objects in love, which is a thing.

每期节目我们聊的都是这种话题。

That's the kind of conversation we're having every episode.

请收听

Listen to

可以在 iHeartRadio 应用、Apple 播客，或者你常用的任何播客平台收听 Radio 831 这个节目。

the Radio eight three one podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

有时候，大脑会变成一个让人难以安身的地方。

There are times when the mind becomes a difficult place to live.

这里是大卫·伊格曼，欢迎收听《内在宇宙》播客。

This is David Eagleman with the Inner Cosmos Podcast.

值此心理健康宣传月，我们推出一系列节目，深入探讨当心灵陷入困境时会发生什么。

And for Mental Health Awareness Month, we're dedicating a series to understanding the mind when it struggles.

我们将邀请医生、研究者，还有亲身经历过这些的人一起对话。

I'm joined by doctors, researchers, and those with lived experience.

我们会和创作型歌手朱尔聊聊焦虑的问题。

We'll talk with singer songwriter Jewel about anxiety.

我开始住在车里，结果车又被偷了。

I started living in my car, and then my car got stolen.

那时候，我开始去商店偷东西。

I was shoplifting.

我经常突然恐慌发作。

I was having panic attacks.

我得了广场恐惧症。

I was agoraphobic.

如何熬过这些艰难时刻。

And making it through hardship.

活在当下是一种需要学习的本事，真的很难做到。

To be present is a learned skill and it's hard to be present.

我们会和约翰·尼尔森聊聊临床抑郁症，以及拯救他生命的脑部植入手术。

We'll talk with John Nelson about clinical depression and the brain implant that saved his life.

我明白的是，这个手术让我感到快乐，因为我彻底摆脱了疾病。

What I learned is that procedure made me happy because I'm disease free.

我们还会邀请杰德·布鲁尔这样的权威专家谈焦虑，约翰·赫希菲尔德谈强迫症，以及大脑如何改变的科学原理。

And we'll talk with leading experts like Judd Brewer about anxiety and John Hirschfield about obsessive compulsive disorder and the science of how the brain can change.

这个月，我们将深入、坦诚地探讨大脑偏离轨道时会发生什么，以及我们能做些什么。

This is a month of deeply personal and honest conversations about what happens when the brain goes off course and what we can do about it.

可以在 iHeartRadio 应用、Apple 播客或者其他你常用的播客平台收听《Intercosmos》。

Listen to Intercosmos on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

本周《Crimeless》迎来了我们的第一位嘉宾。

This week on Crimeless, we're joined by our first ever guest.

喂？

Hello?

不好意思。

Sorry.

我们的第一位真人嘉宾。

Our first ever human guest.

我根本没法和那只叫 Shamrock 的鹦鹉待在一个房间里。

I don't think I could be in the same room with Shamrock the parrot.

我会紧张得不行。

I'd be too nervous.

没错。

That's right.

本周我们邀请到了非常幽默的威尔·法瑞尔，和罗里·斯卡勒以及我，乔什·迪恩，一起聊一聊那些也叫威尔·法瑞尔的人犯下的各种罪行。

The very funny Will Ferrell joins Rory Skull and me, Josh Dean, for an episode dedicated to the many crimes committed by people also named Will Ferrell.

他向同伴喊了一声，要拿钳子来。

They called to his fellow officer for the nippers.

钳子是什么东西？

What are the nippers?

问得真好。

Very good question.

不对。

No.

我刚才在想，这会不会是个不错的沙拉酱名字？

I was thinking, would that be a good name for, like, a salad dressing?

轻微伤害？

Simple assault?

而且这还是个文字游戏，跟‘盐’有关。

And it's a play on words, salt?

也许吧。

Maybe not.

我觉得咱们该投点钱，看看效果。

I say we invest and we see.

只有一种办法能知道。

There's only one way to know.

这事儿可没让警察觉得好笑。

This did not amuse the cops.

顺便说一句，警察平时还挺乐的，但这次没笑。

By the way, normally, the cops are amused, but this did

这事儿可没让警察觉得好笑。

not amuse the cops.

威尔甚至坦白了自己干过的一些坏事。

Will even comes clean about some of his own crimes.

我可没被抓到。

I didn't get caught.

你知道为什么吗？

You know why?

如果你不想让人怀疑你，走路的时候就吹个口哨。

If you don't wanna be suspected of anything, you whistle as you walk.

听好了。

Listen

在 iHeartRadio 应用、Apple 播客，或者你常用的播客平台收听《CrimeList》。

to CrimeList on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts.

当你和你爱的人谈一些你特别不想面对的事情时，我曾经从一位职场导师那里得到过一条特别好的建议：在任何冲突中，都要准备比你原本想说的更少说话。

When it comes to having hard conversations with people you love about situations you really don't love, one of the best pieces of advice I've ever received came from a mentor I had at my corporate job who told me, in any conflict situation, prepare to be more silent than you'd like to be.

简单说，让对方多说。

Basically, let the other person speak.

这时候该听，而不是争辩。

This is a time for listening, not debating.

我每周至少会想起一次这句话。

And I think about that at least once a week.

我总是想起那句话：我们有两只耳朵，却只有一个嘴巴。

I always think about that phrase that's like, we have two ears and one mouth.

在进行艰难对话时，试着遵循这个比例。

Like try to use that ratio when you are having a tough conversation.

我觉得这条建议之所以这么有价值，不是因为你不该表达自己的想法，也不是因为你没有发言的权利，而是因为它直接违背了人在社交紧张时本能地插话、辩解、大声表达的冲动。

I think the reason this is such a valuable rule is not because you shouldn't say what you wanna say and it's not because you don't have a right to speak up, but it just goes directly against your brain's instinct in moments of social tension to just jump in there, defend, be loud, say your piece.

当对话让人感到有威胁时，你的神经系统就会进入一种轻微的‘战斗或逃跑’状态。

When a conversation feels threatening, your nervous system shifts into basically a mild version of fight or flight.

你不是在单纯地说话。

You're not just talking.

你其实是在潜意识里保护自己，因为你觉得自己处于某种危险之中。

Like, you are subconsciously trying to protect yourself because you feel like you're kind of in danger.

正因如此，人们才会说出或做出一些事后后悔的言行。

And that's when people end up saying, doing, communicating things in ways they don't want to.

所以，这并不是要你少说话。

So it's not about speaking less.

而是给自己留点空间，把真正想说的说出来。

It's about giving yourself space to say what you actually wanna say.

他们总是啰啰嗦嗦地解释太多。

They overexplain.

他们动不动就插话。

They interrupt.

他们总在为自己辩解。

They defend.

你就会错过对方话里真正的意思。

You are gonna miss what's actually being said underneath.

你听到的，只是你希望听到的部分。

All you're hearing is what you wanna hear.

你根本没在听他们的解释。

You're not listening to their explanation.

你也没在听他们的看法。

You're not listening to their point of view.

你根本没在听他们说了什么，也没在听他们这么想的原因。

You're not listening to their words or their motivations.

你只是在听表面的语境，然后套用你自己的感受。

You're just listening to the context and what you think applies to your feelings.

心理学里还有一个概念叫逆反心理。

There is also a concept in psychology called reactance.

这就是人的一种本能反应：当你觉得别人在试图说服你、纠正你，或者逼你做不想做的事，比如逼你道歉、逼你接受某种观点时，你反而会更抗拒。

This is our human tendency to push back harder when we feel like someone is trying to persuade or correct us or trying to force us into something we don't want to or we don't wanna do or, you know, force us into an apology, force us into a perspective.

研究已经证明，当人们还没充分了解情况、还没说完自己的想法，就被迫去道歉或表现同理心时，只会让之后的矛盾更尖锐。

And they've done studies on this that reveal that when people do feel like they're forced to apologize or show empathy before they truly have enough information or they've said what they want to say, it just creates more tension and conflict down the line.

当然，你要为自己发声。

Obviously, stand up for yourself.

当然，你要说真话。

Obviously, be truthful.

该翻的石头，你就去翻。

Turn over the stones that you want to turn over.

但如果你觉得这件事会引发太多情绪，别急，你可以先沉默，给自己时间消化。

But if you're feeling overwhelmed by what this is gonna bring up, remember you can always just be silent whilst you process.

你不需要立刻对对方说的每句话都做出回应。

Like you don't immediately have to say something into in response to whatever it is they choose to say.

这当然不是在玩什么游戏。

And not to it's not a game, obviously.

也不是谁先道歉谁就赢的较量。

It's not a tit for tat competition.

但我认为，这么做在很多方面都能帮你更好地掌控情绪。

But I think it will probably give you an advantage in many ways, at least in terms of emotional control.

修复一段友谊，也意味着你不必马上接受对方的第一个道歉。

Part of repairing a friendship is also knowing that you don't have to accept the first apology.

如果你只是把问题藏起来，随便接受对方一句敷衍的话来安抚自己，然后假装一切过去了，这对你们未来的友谊并没有好处。

And then again, it's not advantageous for the future of your friendship if you just if you just sweep things under the rug and just take whatever The first thing that comes to you as a way to placate your feelings and then you move forward.

你可能需要反复几次，才能真正把这件事理清楚。

You may have to come back to this a few times.

你完全可以说：我不接受你的道歉，但我还是想把事情解决。

You're allowed to say, I don't accept your apology, but I still wanna work it out.

或者：我还是不这么看。

Or I still don't see it that way.

或者：我不确定你能不能站在我的角度想，而不是只说‘谢谢’或者‘我也是对不起’。

Or I still don't know if you see things from my perspective instead of just thank you or I'm sorry too.

我觉得这些建议真的特别实用。

I just think this is such, like, practical advice.

保持沉默。

Be silent.

如果你不想接受，就别轻易接受第一次道歉。

Don't accept the first apology if you don't want to.

愿意坐下来，公开承认关系出了问题、事情不再如初，这需要很大的勇气和脆弱感。

It takes so much vulnerability and strength to come to the table and to outwardly admit things are are damaged and things are not what they should be.

说‘我想修复它’，同样需要很大的勇气。

It also takes a lot of courage to say, I wanna fix them.

你已经身处这个不舒服的境地了。

And you're already in this uncomfortable space.

你其实已经做了最难的事——主动开启对话。

Like, you did the hardest thing of all, which was to enter the conversation.

所以再坚持一下。

So push on.

留在这个空间里，直到你得到你需要的，或者你们双方都真正感觉好起来了。

Stay in the space until you get what you need or you both sincerely feel better about the situation.

我觉得我自己经常看到这种情况。

I feel like I personally see this a lot.

人们做了艰难的谈话或对峙，对方给了个道歉或借口，因为实在太过尴尬，就想赶紧了结这事。

People have the hard chat or the confrontation and an apology is given or an excuse is given because and it's just so awkward they're like, let's just get it over with.

但根本就没有真正的理解。

And there's no actual depth of understanding.

我觉得最糟的就是，你刚做完这么艰难的事，还跟别人说‘我们都和好了，一切恢复正常’，结果后来才发现，对方其实还在生气，问题根本没解决。

And I think there's nothing worse than coming out of one of these conversations, having done the hard thing, telling everyone like, yeah, we're all good, things are back to normal, and then hearing later on that like, they're still angry or there's still a problem.

所以啊，多沟通，多沟通，再多沟通。

So, like, communicate, communicate, communicate.

继续往前走。

Keep pushing.

继续深挖下去。

Keep uncovering.

如果你觉得还有话没说透，那不如干脆说清楚。

If you feel like there is things left unsaid, you know, you may as well.

你既然都已经在这儿了。

Like, you're here now.

你已经把最难的事做完了。

Like, you've you've done the hard thing.

我还认为，最后得问问对方心里到底是怎么想的。

I also think checking at the end with what the other person is feeling.

比如说，你可别让这种误会继续存在。

For instance, like, again, you don't want that discrepancy.

你可不希望他们走的时候觉得一切都好得很。

Like, you don't want there to be them to walk away and be like, we're totally fine.

可你心里清楚，根本不是这么回事。

And you're like, no, we're not.

或者他们走的时候觉得，所有责任都是我的。

Or them to walk away and be like, they blamed me for everything.

而你却想，哦，我确实能理解他们的想法。

And you'd be like, oh, I really see their perspective.

一定要清楚彼此的想法，知道双方各自想改变什么。

Like, really have a clear idea of what each other's point of view is and what you wanna change and what they wanna change.

如果对方想先离开，好好想想刚才说过的话，再回来找你，你也得尊重这种需求。

If the other person wants to go away and think about some of the things they've said, then come back to you, you need to respect that too.

你自己也可能需要这么做。

You might need to do that as well.

你也许会感到有点迷茫。

Like, you might feel a little bit confused.

当然，我之前说过，你可能需要回头再谈，或者继续推进对话。

Obviously, I know I said like, keep like, you may have to come back or that you should keep pushing the conversation.

但同样合理的是，你也可以说：我需要更多时间好好想想。

But it's also fair to be like, no, I need more time to think about it.

我真正想说的是，别一到这一步就觉得：行了，搞定。

What I'm really saying is like, don't just get to this point and be like, cool.

我们已经谈过了。

We've done it.

我们把最难的事做完了。

We've done the hard thing.

事情已经处理了。

We've done the situation.

我们聊过了。

We've talked.

现在该往前看了。

Let's move on.

而且，你还是觉得受伤，或者他们也还没走出来。

And like, you're still hurt or they're still hurt.

别再这样了，我觉得归根结底，最轻松的处理方式，往往对友谊的长久来说并不是最好的。

Like, don't again, I think what this is what it all comes down to, the easiest situation is often not the best situation for the longevity of your friendship.

所以，如果感觉还没好，如果你还在挣扎，或者他们明显没放下，那回头再谈也没关系。

So if it's not fine, if you are still struggling, If you If they clearly haven't moved on, like, it's okay to come back.

我觉得，聊完之后的几天里，你心里肯定会有点空落落的。

I also think in the days after you have a conversation, you're gonna feel a little bit raw.

有些话可能说出口了，让你不得不直面自己的一些问题。

Things may have been said that you're like, oh, like I really had to like confront some things about myself.

给自己一点时间，深呼吸一下。

Just take some time to breathe.

没必要聊完就马上发消息给他们。

Like, you don't have to text them straight afterwards.

也不用立刻恢复到以前那种状态。

You don't have to like immediately jump back into how you were before.

但一定要把门留着。

But definitely like leave the door open.

如果你说过会主动联系、约时间，那就一定要做到。

And definitely like if you said that you'd reach out and you would make plans, do it.

如果他们提出了行为上的改变要求，或者让你说清楚自己的需求，那就说出来，用行动证明。

If they asked for changes to behavior or they asked for you to tell them what you needed, tell them, show them.

如果你还有别的想法，当然也要告诉他们。

If you still have more thoughts, obviously, tell them.

这可是我们友谊彻底修复前的最后一道坎。

Again, this is the final snag for our friendship full outs.

我们都走到这一步了，真的走得很远了。

We get so far, so far, so far.

前面所有的障碍我们都跨过了。

We jump over all the hurdles.

连别人的意见我们都没放在心上。

We jump over other people's opinions.

我们连那种一谈起来就特别伤自尊的尴尬事都能跳过去。

We jump over how freaking awkward it is sometimes to just like talk about things that sting our ego.

可偏偏到了最后关头，自尊心又冒出来，一巴掌把改变的机会拍没了，还觉得这事太难了。

And then here the ego comes in again and swoops in at the last moment and like prevents us from actually changing anything or decides that it's too hard.

所以当你走到这一步时，真得问问自己：如果继续这样下去，等一切回到原样，我会真的开心吗？

So I think when you get to that point, really be like, okay, if it keeps going this way, like, am I gonna be happy if it just goes back to what it was before?

到底什么才是需要改变的？

Like, what actually needs to change?

因为你可不想六个月后，又得重说一遍同样的话。

Because you don't wanna be here again in six months time having the same conversation.

也不希望这场对话白谈了，你们俩说的话，谁都没真正听进去。

Or you don't wanna have had this conversation for nothing because neither of the things that either of you said actually got through.

你知道吗？

And you know what?

我觉得九成情况下，其实都没问题。

I think 90% of the time, I think it's fine.

我觉得，其实不用后续跟进，情况也会慢慢变好。

Like, I do think it does get better without needing the follow-up.

大多数人其实都愿意改变。

And most people are susceptible to change.

大多数人，包括你，可能只需要二十分钟的聊天，就能把话说开。

And most people, you included, probably just need a twenty minute chat to clear the air.

我觉得，对于长久的友谊来说，这些对话迟早会变得有趣，或者变得感人。

I also think for long term friendships, like, eventually these conversations become funny or they become sentimental.

怎么说呢，它们会以一种奇怪的方式变成经典。

You know, they become iconic in a weird way.

就是那次差点让关系破裂的争吵。

Like, the fight that nearly ended things.

那次当时觉得特别重要的分歧，我们终究挺过来了。

The disagreement that felt significant at the time, and we made it through.

在很多情况下，这反而成了彼此联结的契机。

And in many cases, that is a bonding thing.

我真希望我们能把和朋友吵架看成是一种增进感情的方式。

Like, I wish we saw fighting with our friends as a bonding exercise.

就算你在争执、在意见不合，这依然是一段珍贵的共同经历。

Even when you're arguing, even when you're disagreeing, it's still a valuable shared experience.

这其实本来就是友谊的核心所在。

And that's like the whole basis of friendship anyways.

我坚信一点：除非你和朋友吵过一架，还一起挺过来了，否则你根本算不上真正了解他。

A hill I will die on is that you don't truly know your friend until you've had a fight with them and you've gotten through it.

这种经历会打开一种全新的深度——沟通、价值观、韧性，听起来可能有点老套，但就是爱。

It's like the thing that opens up like a whole new depth of like communication and shared values and resilience and like it's gonna sound corny, like love.

它会让你更爱自己的朋友。

It makes you love your friends more.

当然，你们本来就已经彼此在意了。

Obviously, you love each other.

你们俩都真心想一起度过这个难关。

Like, you both collectively wanted to make it through this.

这真的让人特别安心，因为不是每段友谊都能做到这样。

And that's like really reaffirming because you don't do that for every friendship.

有些人甚至在维持了多年的亲密关系里，都不愿意这么做。

Some people don't even do that for like relationships they've been in for years.

我觉得这恰恰说明了你们的用心和坚持。

And I think that is a sign of dedication.

如果你们能一起走过这段，以后回想起这件事，俩人都会感叹：原来这个人真的那么在乎我。

And I think if you guys are able to make it through this, you're gonna look back and both of you are gonna be like, wow, that person really loves me.

而且我觉得，这为友谊树立了一个很好的榜样——很多关系总在猜：你是不是生我气了？

And there's I also think it sets this precedent where a lot of friendships operate on this like, are you mad at me?

你是不是还在生我的气？

Are you not mad at me?

可谁也不肯直接问，结果心里憋着焦虑和紧张。

And they never actually ask and there's a lot of anxiety and tension in that.

以后你们不会再有这种猜来猜去的困扰了。

You guys won't have that again.