萨姆·卡齐米安：新银行应用商店时代已经到来

会有一张Frax DeFi卡。

There will be a Frax DeFi card.

好的。

Okay.

它的运作方式和其他DeFi卡不一样，明白吗。

It will not work the same way as other DeFi cards Okay.

已经运作过了。

Have worked.

就像曼哈顿的街道一样，我会长话短说。

Just like the streets of Manhattan, I'm gonna keep this quick.

我们超过70%的观众都没有订阅。

Over 70% of our viewers are not subscribers.

是的。

Yes.

你。

You.

每周，我们都会采访金融行业里一些最优秀的创业者和投资人。

Every week, we interview some of the best entrepreneurs and investors in the financial industry.

支持我们频道最简单的方式就是点赞并狂戳订阅按钮。

The easiest way to support our channel is to hit the like and smash the subscribe button.

现在，请坐好，放松，享受今天的节目。

Now sit back, relax, and enjoy today's show.

好了，各位。

Alrighty, guys.

我们回到了Token 2049 DAS Asia，来迎接今天的最后一位嘉宾。

We are back here for the final guest at Token 2049 DAS Asia.

Sam，Sam，很高兴见到你，伙计。

Sam, Sam, good to have you, buddy.

能来这里总是很棒。

Always great to be here.

我有点时差，但还是很有精神。

I'm a little bit jet lagged, but I'm still energized.

到目前为止，这个活动怎么样？

How's how's the event been so far?

这一周过得怎么样？

How's the week been?

挺好的。

It's it's been great.

我这次旅程总共花了二十二个小时。

I I also had a, what, twenty two hour total total trip.

所以到这里来确实挺远的。

So it's it's it's far getting out here.

对。

Yep.

但总是值得的。

Always worth it.

Token 2049的组织者，Alex Fiskem，还有他们所有人，真的是做得最好的之一。

Token 2049, the organizers, Alex Fiskem, all of them, they're honestly some of the best to ever do it.

对。

Yep.

我们已经来了好几年了。

We've been coming for a few years.

而且就在一个小时前，我看到他们在推特上宣布，2027年6月要来纽约。

And I just saw an hour ago, they announced on on Twitter, they're coming to New York in June 2027.

所以那将会是一场盛大的活动。

So it's gonna be a huge one.

确实。

It is.

确实，老兄。

It is, man.

所以Sam，我们显然在主持我们的每周节目，叫Stabled Up，讨论稳定币和链上代币化的机构资产。

So, I mean, Sam, we we're obviously running our weekly show called Stabled Up and talking about stablecoins and institutional assets on chain tokenization.

我上周刚在休斯顿参加了Hood峰会，和Robinhood的那些人在一起。

I was just there at the Hood Summit last week in in Houston with the Robinhood guys.

他们当时……

They were...

就是……

You know, it's...

感觉人群对缺少加密新闻有点不满，但很明显，有大量资本和分配者正在进入链上，特别是把稳定币带到链上。

It seemed like the crowd was a little bit upset at the lack of kind of crypto news, but very clearly, there's just this kind of massive sum of capital and allocators coming on chain, you know, specifically bringing stablecoins on chain.

那个OpenUSD网络已经启动了。

That OpenUSD network launched.

我想你们都看到了。

I think you you all saw that.

那是几天前的事了。

That was a couple days ago.

我相信他们在几条链上推出了，并且开始看到一些……

I believe they launched across a couple chains, and, you know, they're starting to see a bit...

一些进展。

A little bit of traction.

我想聊聊你认为这些稳定币最终会存在于哪里。

You know, I wanted to kind of talk about where you think that these stablecoins are actually going to end up living.

所以，如果你想想，比如……

So if you think about, like, the...

这种资产上链的广度，稳定币似乎就像是打开了闸门，让更广泛的资产涌入。

This kind of breadth of assets coming on chain, seems like stablecoins have kind of been like the opening of the floodgates for the broader set of assets.

当你思考稳定币和代币化资产在链上的实际生命周期或存在方式时，我知道这有点像是一个很开放的问题，但你是如何看待这些东西在链上实际存在的？

When you think about, like, like, the actual life cycle or the existence of stablecoins and tokenized assets on chain, I know it's kinda like a very, like, open ended question, but how do you see those things actually, like, existing on chain?

是和加密资产类似吗？

Is it similar to crypto assets?

还是和它们在传统金融体系中的存在方式类似？

Is it similar to the way that they exist in traditional financial system?

代币化资产如何在链上真正拥有自己的生命周期？

How do tokenized assets actually end up having a life cycle of their own on chain?

这是一个……

It's a...

这个问题问得好，因为范围太广了，完全是全新的领域。

I mean, it's a good question because it's so wide, like, greenfield.

因为还太早，所以没人真正搞清楚。

No one's really been able to figure it out because it's so early.

我看到了OpenUSD的相关内容。

I saw the OpenUSD stuff.

Frax实际上是联盟成员之一。

Frax is actually one of the consortium members.

我们有能力以零基点进行铸造和赎回。

We have the ability to mint and redeem at zero bips.

有趣的是，这是一种支付型稳定币。

The interesting thing about it is that it's it's a payment type of stablecoin.

所以据我理解，他们打算根据支付量来收取费用。

So they they intend to take fees from how I understand it based on payment volume.

因为很多支付公司，比如Stripe，还有其他的，像Mastercard、Visa，它们都是做支付的。

Because a lot of the payment companies that Stripe and then the others, Mastercard, Visa, they're they're all payments.

所以，相比货币的存量，流量才是他们主要的现金流来源。

So the the flows rather than the stock of of the of the currency is is what gets them their their main cash flow.

我认为对Frax来说最重要的一件事是，我们正把FraxNet这个新银行平台变成一个应用商店。

I think the most valuable important thing for us at Frax is we're actually turning our FraxNet neobank platform into an app store.

所以这真的是第一个有应用商店的新银行。

So it's actually gonna be the first neobank with an app store.

这么做的原因是，现在有太多东西在发生，就像你说的，每个人——不管你是个人用户，还是做稳定币大额交易的，还是只想持有股票、RWA这些，其实都需要稍微不同的流程。

The reason for that is there's so many things going on, like you said, everyone, depending on what kind of user you are, whether you're if you're retail or you do stablecoin heavy transactions or you just want to hold equities, RWAs, these kind of things, they all need slightly different flows.

你需要能像股票那样铸造或赎回，对吧，然后持有它们。

You you need to be able to either mint or redeem like equities, right, and hold them.

你……

You...

或者如果你是一个使用新银行或平台来处理稳定币和加密货币收付款的企业，你需要它看起来不太一样。

Or if you're a business that is using a neobank or a platform to accept pay ins and payouts of like stablecoins and crypto, you need it to look slightly different.

你需要合规，需要发票，需要会计，还需要余额管理。

You need compliance, you need invoicing, you need accounting, you need balances.

所以我们一直没能做出一个万能的解决方案。

And so we haven't been able to build a one size fits all solution.

没人能做到。

No one has.

你看像EtherFi的卡，对吧，还有Athena的、Plasmas的。

If you look at like EtherFi's cards, right, Athena's, Plasmas.

所有这些很火的卡。

All of these really popular cards.

它们都是面向零售消费者的产品。

They're retail consumer oriented products.

它们是为消费者支付网关优化的。

They are optimized for the consumer payment gateway.

就像你和我。

Like you, me.

我们想买东西，想卖东西。

We wanna buy stuff, we wanna sell stuff.

它们并不是为接受或处理业务的商家而优化的。

They're not optimized for a business accepting or doing anything with.

实际上，卖点就是商家甚至不知道他们在用稳定币。

In fact, the selling point is business doesn't even know they take stablecoin.

这很棒。

That's great.

但归根结底，最终我们真正感兴趣的是，商家最终会想要处理数字资产，而不是仅仅通过Visa或Mastercard的网络。

But at the end of the day, eventually, one thing that we're actually really interested about is eventually businesses will want to do something with with like digital assets rather than only go through Visa or or Mastercard's rails.

就像只走那条路。

Like only do that.

而且我们之前说过，我们一直在和几家大型商家合作，很快就要宣布了。

And we've been, like we've said before and getting close to announcing, we've been working with a few large ones.

是的。

Yep.

他们……

They...

他们参与的程度不仅仅是说，我们直接通过Visa来处理。

The extent of their involvement isn't just, we'll just take it through Visa.

他们实际上想直接托管稳定币，受监管的稳定币。

They actually want to do direct custody of stablecoins, regulated stablecoins.

有意思。

Interesting.

真正接受它们，甚至在某些情况下，能够用它们来提供信贷或处理应收账款。

Actually accept them and even in some cases be able to extend credit or do receivables with them.

所以这就像第一批低风险受监管的数字资产。

So like the the very first instances of low risk regulated digital assets.

不是像比特币或者模因币那样的。

Not like if you're Bitcoin or you're Memecoin.

这类东西。

And these types of things.

完全正确。

Exactly.

而且目前还没有真正的新银行或者那种一体化的平台，能让这些事情变得容易操作。

And there's no real neobank or like integrated like platform that makes it easy to do those things.

所以FraxNet在这个领域做了一些扩展，很快你基本上就能下载各种不同的FraxNet应用了。

So FraxNet has been expanding a little bit in that area where you can essentially soon be able to download different kinds of FraxNet apps.

对。

Yep.

比如发票应用，或者像……

Like an invoicing app, like a...

很明显会有一个卡片应用，但还会有其他功能，比如应收账款应用。

There will be a card app obviously, but then other things as well like a receivables app.

这样你就可以实际上传应收账款，然后如果有实体想要提供信贷，对吧，你实际上可以获得信贷，然后应收账款的支付会直接转到那个经过KYC认证的实体。

So you can actually upload receivables and then if you have a entity that wants to extend credit, right, you can actually receive credit and then the payment of the receivable goes directly to that KYC entity.

这些都是别人没在做的事情，对吧，而企业实际上想用稳定币和低风险数字资产去做这些，然后可能最终他们想用代币化证券来做，对吧，作为第二步或者后续的事情。

These kind of things that no one else is doing, right, that that businesses actually want to be able to do with stablecoins with low risk digital assets, and then maybe eventually they'll wanna do them with tokenized securities, right, as like a step two or thing down the line.

这些确实非常有意思。

These things are interesting a lot.

我喜欢这个。

I like it.

我喜欢这个。

I like it.

而且我喜欢这个应用商店的视角，也喜欢整个观念转变的想法，就是说，不，我们要把它藏起来。

And I like this app store perspective, and I also like this whole idea of the perception shift being like, no, we're we're gonna hide it.

所以现在我们要拥抱它，也许不是通过公开的营销，而是通过我们的沟通和我们的决策。

So now we're gonna embrace it, maybe not publicly through our marketing, but through our comms and through our our decision making.

所以EtherFi也是，你提到新银行那边，他们刚刚推出了他们的……

So EtherFi also, you mentioned on the neobank side, they just launched their...

他们宣布了他们的第一个稳定币，由Athena团队用他们的白标产品提供支持。

They announced their first stablecoin powered by the Athena guys with their white label product.

好奇，a，你对这个的看法，但b，特别是因为我们之前有过那个……

Curious, a, your take on that, but b, specifically because we had that...

我们有过那个Cast CEO的吐槽。

We had the cast CEO rags on.

这家伙确实有点个性。

Guy's a bit of a character for sure.

他有点自以为是，我会当面跟他这么说。

High on his own supply a little bit, and I'd tell him that to him.

所以，你知道……

So, you know...

但我觉得他很聪明。

But I but I think he's smart.

我觉得他知道自己在做什么。

I think he knows what he's doing.

他建立了一家成功的公司。

He's built a successful company.

我们唯一达成一致的就是这种垂直整合，以及他对整个技术栈的掌控。

The one thing that we agreed on was this kind of verticalization and his owning of of the stack.

而且我……

And I

我觉得这话可能就是你说的。

think it was actually you maybe who said this.

就是说，你为什么要围绕Circle的稳定币建一个完整的数字银行？

It was like, why are you gonna build an entire neobank around Circle's stablecoin?

为什么不围绕自己的稳定币建一个完整的数字银行呢？

Why not build or, you know, an an entire neobank around your own?

我觉得Athena和我，我们也跟Guy聊过这个。

And I think Athena and I and we spoke to Guy about this as well.

所以，虽然我很想说，大家都会赢。

And so, you know, as much as I'd like to be all like, everyone's gonna win.

一切都阳光灿烂，但当所有数字银行都在争夺类似的客户、推出稳定币、提供类似的服务时，你确实会开始看到商品化，以及明显的竞争压力。

It's all, you know, sunshine and roses, when when all the neobanks are competing for similar customers and launching stablecoins and having similar offerings, you do start to see a commoditization and obviously competitive forces at play.

那就说说你对EtherFi稳定币发布的看法，以及这种数字银行垂直整合的趋势，还有这如何引领我们看到的那种拥有整个体系的新世界，因为在传统金融服务里，根本没有稳定币这种东西，你不可能在美元轨道上建数字银行。

So just give us your take on EtherFi stablecoin launch and this kind of verticalization of the neobank stack and like how that kind of leads into this newer world that we're seeing of owning the whole thing because in traditional financial services, there's been no such thing as stablecoins such that you're building your neobank on the US dollar rails.

你持有美元不会获得收益……

You don't get yield from holding the...

嗯，确实，如果你持有国债的话，但……

I mean, well, you do, right, if you hold the t bills, but you...

稳定币还有很多其他用途。

There's a lot of other things that you can do with with a stablecoin.

金融科技公司基本上必须和银行合作。

The fintechs had to partner with banks essentially.

对。

Exactly.

他们本身不是银行。

Weren't also the bank.

你就是一家银行。

You're just a bank.

对。

Exactly.

而且，通常你合作的银行，用的都是老掉牙的技术，而且服务不到位。

And and whenever your typical bank, usually it came with you, used boomer tech and it wasn't there.

对。

Exactly.

我其实刚才就在楼下和Mike、Guy一起参加那个发布会。

I actually was just at the announcement with Mike and Guy.

上来之前我在楼下看到了。

I saw it downstairs before coming up here.

我觉得这挺好的。

Look, I I think it I think it's great.

我喜欢这种共赢的心态。

I like the positive sum mentality.

我其实觉得Frax在上一个周期就有点开创了这种共赢的思路，当时我们就说，要和大家一起搞点创新。

I I actually like to think Frax kind of invented the positive sum mentality last cycle when we were like, we'll create curveballs with everyone.

比如搞联合收益，让大家都赢。

Let's do like joint yield part, you know, like everyone wins.

这个思路算是我们发明的，而Terra那种模式，你知道，我...

And and we kind of, you know, invented that whereas, you know, the the the the Terra model, know, I'm...

死就死了。

Die will die.

甩手不干了。

Wipe my hands.

不是闹着玩的。

Not at play.

相反的方向确实不太行，挺有意思的。

The opposite there didn't really work interesting.

其实我不太确定会怎么运作，因为Athena也有自己的卡。

I actually don't know how it will work because Athena has their own card as well.

但再怎么说，也就是……

But again, it's...

我确实同意，大家终于开始意识到，哦，Frax发行稳定币。

I do agree that people are finally seeing like, oh, Frax issues a stablecoin.

Frax还在建一家新银行。

Frax also is building a neobank.

他们确实占据了平台很大一部分的实际份额。

They are capturing a good amount of the the the actual platform.

对。

Yep.

我觉得我们在这点上是对的。

I think I think we're right on that.

而且我认为这就是我们看到的现状。

And I think that that's what we're seeing.

我不太清楚……

I don't exactly know what the...

EUSD在协同效应方面会有什么表现。

What EUSD will do in terms of synergy.

我觉得这个公告发布得有点早，但我很好奇接下来会怎么发展，因为这挺有意思的。

I I think the current announcement's early, but I'm pretty curious to to see because it's pretty interesting.

我不太确定它的经济模式会怎么运作。

I'm not sure I'm not sure how the economics of it will work.

但话说回来，只要两个朋友能一起成长，我们……

But hey, as long as it's two friends and they both are growing together, We...

不。

No.

只是觉得挺有意思的。

It is just interesting

因为Athena给我们带来了卡片、稳定币，还有一个花哨的新银行产品。

because Athena's got us a card and a stablecoin and a fancy neobank offering.

那真是太……太……太……

That's so so so...

那是我唯一感到困惑的地方，也正是这让我们想到了FraxNet应用商店的点子。

That's the only thing that confused me and that's where it led us to our FraxNet app store idea actually.

因为你

Because you

必须得……

have to just be...

因为我们一开始想的是，EtherFi 接受 FraxUSD，你可以在那里消费。

Because we were like we were like at first, so EtherFi accepts FraxUSD, you could spend it in there.

对。

Sure.

我们其实想考虑一下，要不要在我们的 FraxNet 数字银行里做一个 EtherFi 应用，这样你就可以导入你的 EtherFi 卡，然后在 FraxNet 里直接操作金库。

We wanted to actually think, do we build a a EtherFi app inside of our FraxNet neobank so you can actually import your EtherFi card and then you can actually interact with the vault inside of FraxNet.

然后我们想，这倒是个不错的功能。

And then we thought, well, that is a cool feature.

我们可以做一个通用的卡片应用，让你导入这些卡，或者别人的卡，甚至 Frax 自己也可以发行他们的卡。

We could just have a general card application that lets you import those or someone else or even Frax can also launch their own cards.

这样你在数字银行里就有多张卡，它们可以互相交互。

So you have like multiple cards in this neobank and they can interact with each other.

也许，也许根据你实际支付的内容，选一张奖励最好的卡。

Maybe maybe the best one for rewards depending on what you're actually paying.

是的。

Yep.

它会把资金路由过去。

It roots through it.

顺便说一句，要构建这样的东西，实际上架构会非常不同。

In order to build something like that, by the way, it's actually a very different architecture.

你实际上必须能够在所谓的运行时层上构建，而不是在区块链上，因为它可能跨多条链，而是在新银行的实际层上，这个层可以与支付通道、Stripe以及不同的合规流程组合。因为如果你要导入或者开始使用EtherFi卡，如果它真的能在FraxNet平台上运行，你就必须能够打通KYC并重复使用它，而不需要每次都重新做一遍。

You have to actually be able to build on the runtime layers we call it, not not the blockchain because it could be on multiple chains, but on the actual layer on the neobank that can compose with rails, compose with Stripe, And and also can compose with the different compliance flows because like if you're gonna import or you're gonna start getting an EtherFi card, if it can really work in like the FraxNet platform, you have to be able to pipe the KYC and reuse it without actually doing it every single time.

那样的话，你实际上就只是在多个地方注册而已。

Then you're just actually just signing up to multiple places.

所以，

So,

会有Frax卡推出吗？

you know, is there a Frax card coming?

这是你想涉足的事情吗？

Is that something that you wanna even step your feet into?

因为现在人们有点批评Layer Zero，他们说，哦，我们互操作所有链，然后他们又推出自己的链。

Because it almost feels like, you know, people give layer zero some flack right now because they're like, oh, we interoperate all the chains, and then, like, they're launching their own chain.

这有点像，你为什么要推出自己的链，去跟那些你的客户所在的链竞争呢？

It's kind of like, why are you launching your own chain to compete with all the chains that are your are your clients?

我不是...

And I'm not...

不管是正面还是负面，我其实没什么看法。

You know, whether it's positive or negative, don't really have a take.

这只是市场上的一些情绪而已。

It's just what some of the sentiment can be.

代币涨得很猛。

The token's ripping.

我为他们感到高兴。

I'm happy for them.

我也持有一些。

I own a little bit.

不过可惜的是，我目前只能旁观，看着它涨。

I'm sidelined, though, unfortunately, at its eyes.

话虽这么说，但说到FraxNet，感觉就是，好吧。

That being said, you know, when it comes to FraxNet, it's like, alright.

你……

You...

如果你要成为这种聚合器，把所有产品都汇集起来，把大家聚到一个地方，那为什么还要推出自己的卡呢？

If you're if you're gonna be kind of this aggregator of sorts of all these offerings and kind of bring people together into one place, you know, why launch your own card?

这是明智之举吗？

Is is that a smart move?

这是个很好的问题。

It's it's a great question.

我们之前也讨论过很多次。

Something we were talking about a lot.

简单来说，答案是会有一张Frax DeFi卡。

So the short answer is there will be a Frax DeFi card.

好的。

Okay.

它的运作方式和其他DeFi卡不一样。

It will not work the same way as other DeFi cards.

对。

Okay.

之前那些卡是这样的。

Have worked.

所以我们会等到宣布的时候再说明具体怎么运作。

So we'll we'll wait until announce how how

怎么运作。

it works.

我们有一些……

We had some...

汇总。

Rollup.

所以会有一张Frax卡。

So there will be a Frax There's card

Frax卡要来了。

a Frax card coming.

在……里面……

Inside of...

作为一个独立的FraxNet应用，你可以下载并把它放到你的FraxNet账户里。

As as an as an independent FraxNet app that you can download and put into your FraxNet account.

但它的运作方式和其他卡不完全一样。

But it won't work exactly the same way as the other ones.

有趣的是，有些地方用它会有非常非常非常高的收益，不是因为补贴，而是因为我们正在构建的一种不同的机制。

And what's what's interesting about that is there will be certain places that there will be very very very lucrative to use it and not because of subsidies, because of a different mechanic that that we're building.

然后你可以把它和新的DeFi原语一起用，比如Curve池之类的，这些以前我们不太支持，尤其是因为你可以直接花底层的FraxUSD。

And then you can use it with new DeFi primitives and things like that that curve pools, different things that were were not for, especially because you'll be able to spend the FraxUSD underlying.

所以我们可以做一些非常有意思的事情，比如为某些东西提供预刷信用，这会非常独特。

So we'll be able to do some really kinda interesting things like extend pre swipe credit for for certain things and it'll be it'll be really unique.

但最酷的是，我们平台未来的运作方式是，如果你有EtherFi卡或者Plasma卡之类的，这个新银行平台是跨链的，支持多链和很多不同的功能。

But the cool thing about it is the way our platform is gonna work going forward is that if you have an EtherFi card or if you have a a plasma card or something like that, the neobank platform is cross chain and multi chain and supports a bunch of different features.

你可以导入并操作其中一些卡片。

You can import and interact with some of those cards.

充值后，通过FraxNet进行某些操作或提现。

Load them up, do certain things on off ramp through FraxNet.

好的。

Okay.

比如说，你可能见过Stani，对吧，就是Aave那个。

And and so like, for example, you've probably seen or you you had Stani on, right, for for for the Aave

应用。

app.

对。

Yep.

那是另一个例子。

That's another example.

就像，是的。

Where it's like Yeah.

他们有Go，还有那个应用，马上还要出车，感觉就是，走起。

They have Go, they've got the app, they're gonna have the car, and it's like, here we go.

没错。

Exactly.

所以我们就在想，这些应用是不是都很孤立？

So so we were thinking like, are all of these apps, are they very siloed?

因为……

Because the...

而且它们之间唯一能互通的，就是链上的部分，比如代币或者你借出的那个位置。

And and the only thing that's composable between them is the part on chain, like like the token or like the location that you lend.

我们重新架构FraxNet的方式是，KYC、身份信息，所有这些都在不同的FraxNet应用之间共享。

And the way that we've re architected FraxNet is that the KYC, the identity, and everything is shared among different FraxNet apps.

所以实际上，如果你有一个FraxNet账户，你就可以直接注册并存入Aave，以合规的方式赚取收益，用你的账户提现，还能申请一张卡。

So that actually, like, if you have a FraxNet account, you can onboard and actually deposit directly into Aave and earn in like a regulated manner, withdraw it with your account, sign up for a card.

你不需要再KYC一次。

You don't have to KYC again.

你其实可以通过RAIN、通过Persona拿到一张卡，这真的很有意思。

You can actually get a card through RAIN, through Persona, and it's actually really interesting.

你可以把它想象成一部iPhone。

You can think of it like an iPhone.

就像应用商店一样。

Like the app store.

对。

Yep.

你只需要下载各种不同的应用。

You just download multiple types of apps.

你也可以只用那些独立的应用，但那样你就享受不到整个可组合生态系统的好处了。

You can also just use those independent apps and then you will not get the benefit of the entire composable ecosystem.

比如你只用Aave应用，或者只用EtherFi。

You could just only use the Aave app, for example, or only use EtherFi.

当然。

Sure.

所以，Sam，我们之前听说过的一个概念，来自……

And so, Sam, one of the concepts that we had heard about from the...

我记得是SEC。

I believe it was the SEC.

是Hester Peirce，她在辞职前做的最后几件事之一，就是提出了这个潜在的ZK KYC护照的想法。整个概念是，对于代币化资产，你希望资产发行方成为KYC强制平台，显然，还有持有这些资产的银行，以及任何类型的代币化平台。

It was it was Hester Peirce, one of her last things before she resigned was this idea that they were gonna do this potential ZK, KYC passport, where the the whole concept here is that with tokenized assets, you wanna have the asset issuer and be the KYC, mandated platform, obviously, with the bank that's holding those assets and then whatever kind of tokenization platform.

然后，一旦你有了这种单一的KYC验证能力，你就可以在他们所谓的代币化证券交易场所（TSV）上进行交易，无论在哪条链上，在哪个区块链上，跨多个场所都可以。

And then once you have that singular ability to have your KYC verified, you can trade on what they call tokenized tokenized securities venues, TSVs, anywhere on chain, on any blockchain, across a variety of venues.

所以整个概念就是，KYC一次，而不必为每个区块链和每个交易场所都做KYC。

And so the whole concept is like, KYC wants and not have to KYC for every blockchain and every trading venue.

在Uniswap上交易，去Hyper Liquid，去Aave，去Aave，你想做什么都行。

Trade on Uniswap, go to Hyper Liquid, go to Aave, go to Aave, whatever you wanna do.

你觉得FraxNet能在这方面发挥作用吗？

You know, is that something that you think that FraxNet could serve a purpose for?

因为我觉得有价值，如果我想，好，下载FraxNet。

Because I I could see value if I'm like, alright, download FraxNet.

这些我们都会帮你处理好。

We manage all that for you.

如果你想申请EtherFi卡，我们会替你办理。

If you wanna sign up for the EtherFi card, we'll we'll do it on your behalf.

我们会帮你办好那张卡，然后把它们都整合在一起。

We'll do that card, and then we'll aggregate them all for you.

你不需要考虑该用哪张卡消费，因为我们知道如果你在旅行，我们会用AI代理之类的工具来优化最佳方案，等等。

You don't have to think about what card you're gonna spend it on because we know if you're doing travel, you know, we're we're gonna have an AI agent or something optimized, what the best path is, etcetera, etcetera.

这是不是你们的价值主张？

Is that a value prop Even that you're have

FraxNet环境几乎就像一个AI的载体。

the FraxNet environment was almost like an AI harness.

因为我的意思是，所有的

Because what I mean is all

联系，所有的那些……

of the contacts, all the has those...

因为对我来说，比如，好吧，我为什么要再注册一张卡，再注册一张卡，再注册一张卡，就为了把它们加进FraxNet？

Because like for me, it's like, okay, why do I need to sign up for another card, another card, another card just to add them into FraxNet?

那有什么

What's the what's

像Apple Wallet那样的新银行？

the neobank of like Apple Wallet?

对。

Yes.

我的Grok机器人就像我的Apple Wallet，它控制着我所有的其他代理，我再也不用上云了。

My Grok bot is like my Apple Wallet where it's like I have it controlling all my other agents and I don't ever go on cloud anymore.

我也不怎么用Gemini了。

I don't really go on Gemini anymore.

我就用我的Grok机器人。

I just use my Grock bot.

所以跟cookies很像。

So very similar to like cookies.

我觉得那其实就是最终的目标。

I I I think that's actually the end game.

我们其实更有优势去做这件事，因为有了FraxUSD，对。

We're actually even more better positioned to do exactly that because because of FraxUSD Yeah.

我们跟Super State、WisdomTree、Securitize这些都有直接的合作关系，你随便说。

We have direct relationships with Super State, WisdomTree, Securitize, you name it.

比如Midas刚刚把FraxUSD订阅资产加了进来。

Like Midas just added FraxUSD subscription assets.

所以现在他们就有了FraxNet账户，对吧？

So now they have a FraxNet account, right?

所有这些发行方都是这样。

Just all of these issuers.

我就是这个意思。

That's what I mean.

所以我们能够……

And so we're able to...

如果你有FraxNet账户，实际上可以通过我们进行预铸造、铸造和赎回，因为我们在Frax Inc，因为我们发行FraxUSD，我们与所有这些机构都有直接关系。

If you have a FraxNet account, you can actually, through us, pre Mint and and Mint and Redeem because we at Frax Inc, because of we issue FraxUSD, we have the direct relationship with all of them.

没错。

Exactly.

因此，我们已经能够提供一个类似护照的身份来做到这一点。

And so we can already provide essentially a passport ID to be able to do that.

我希望最终他们能……

And I wish eventually they...

如果我们能用ZK技术做到这一点就好了。

If we could do it with ZK Yeah.

但当然，这总是……

But Of it's always...

这取决于最终的发行方。

It has to do with the end issuer.

当然。

Of course.

我们会有那个账户，然后就能……

We'll we'll have that that account and be able to...

一个FraxNet账户就能完成所有这些操作。

One account for FraxNet can do all of these things.

但直到真正的RWA发行方，对吧，确认零知识证明没问题。

But until the actual RWA issuer, right, is like, sure, a ZK proof is fine.

它就能正常运行。

It's gonna function.

你可能需要接受FraxNet的权限设置，分享你的法定姓名和地址等等这些信息。

You'll have to you'll have to like accept your FraxNet permissions sharing your, you know, legal name and address and all this stuff.

但我们现在就处于这个有利位置，这真的很令人兴奋。

But we would be in that prime position to do it now, which is what's really exciting.

完全同意。

100%.

最后一点，就我个人来说，就几秒钟时间。

Last thing, just for me, just a couple seconds here.

我们大概六个月前还在聊那个碗什么时候开始呢。

You know, we were talking like six months ago about when the bowl was gonna start.

我挺有信心的。

I'm pretty bold

嘿，老兄。

up, man.

你那边怎么样？

Where you at?

我觉得你可能会赢。

I think you might win this one.

我觉得你可能会赢。

I think I think you might win this one.

我想我们还有几个月，对吧，到年底？

I think we have a few more months, right, till the end of the year?

看起来你要赢了……

It's looking like you're gonna win this...

我不确定我们能不能达到历史高点。

I don't know if we're gonna get all

历史高点，但是

time highs, but

我觉得我们可以迎来一波不错的第四季度反弹。

I think we can get a nice q four rally.

我很期待。

I'm pretty excited.

我觉得要创历史新高可能有点难。

Think all time highs would be a stretch.

我想

I think

即使加息了也一样。

Even with the rate increase.

即使加了一次息，可能还会有第二次。

Even with one rate increase, there might be a second one.

我知道，这太疯狂了。

I know, which is nuts.

而且你还有可能

And you still have a probably

会赢。

gonna win.

这是一次看涨的加息。

It was a bullish hike.

是不是挺有意思的，我们总是这样操作？

Isn't that isn't that funny how we do these things?

他们自己就会这么写。

They write themselves.

好了，Sam。

Alright, Sam.

谢谢你抽时间，兄弟。

Thanks for your time, man.

谢谢。

Thanks.