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SiriusXM播客。
SiriusXM Podcasts.
朋友们，又到了周五重温时间。
Time for your Friday reheat, my friends.
这一集请到了喜剧演员、也是《Nailed It!》的主持人妮可·拜尔。
And this episode with comedian and Nailed It!
我记得，这一集里我笑得比这个节目历史上任何时候都厉害。
Host, Nicole Byer, includes what I think to my memory is the moment that I laughed harder than any other moment in the history of this war quell.
还需要更多铺垫吗？
Do you need more of a setup than that?
好吧，听我说。
Well, look.
我和妮可会聊聊她对低俗幽默的热爱，餐厅厨房和喜剧舞台有什么共同点，还有妮可为了纪念她妈妈喜欢烤的那种蛋糕。
Nicole and I are gonna talk about her love of raunchy humor, what restaurant, kitchens, and comedy spaces have in common, and the cake Nicole likes to bake in honor of her mom.
当然，如果你想让我们重温哪一集，我们接受点播。
Of course, if there's an episode you want us to reheat, we take requests.
给我发封邮件或语音留言到hello@Sporkful.com。
Send me an email or a voice memo to hello@Sporkful.com.
告诉我你的名字、所在地、你想让我们重播哪一集，以及为什么。
Tell me your first name, location, what episode you want us to reheat, and why.
非常感谢。
Thanks so much.
还有，看看你能不能猜出哪一刻是我在节目历史上笑得最厉害的。
And see if you can figure out which moment is the moment that I laughed the hardest in sport full history.
这一集包含露骨语言和成人话题，有些内容从开头就开始了。
This episode contains explicit language and adult subject matter, and some of it starts right here at the very beginning.
所以我要先暂停一下。
So I'm just going to pause.
好的。
Okay.
如果你是家长在车里，孩子在后座，可能这是自动播放的。
If you're a parent in the car, your kids in the back seat, maybe this came on autoplay.
现在你手忙脚乱了。
Now you're fumbling.
别出车祸了。
Don't get in an accident.
没事的。
It's okay.
我给你一点时间。
I'm giving you a second.
这个可能不太适合全家一起听。
This one's probably not family friendly.
抱歉了，孩子们。
Sorry, kids.
行吧？
K?
这个是给大人听的。
This one's for grown ups.
好了吗？
Alright?
大家都还好吗？
Everyone okay?
你明白了吗？
You got it?
好的。
Alright.
我们开始吧。
Here we go.
我最近去了趟红龙虾餐厅，我知道那是你的最爱之一。
I recently went out to to Red Lobster, which I know is one of your faves.
我超爱红龙虾的。
Fucking love Red Lobster.
红龙虾、 Chili's 和 Applebee's 是我最喜欢的连锁餐厅。
Red Lobster and Chili's and Applebee's are my favorite chain restaurants.
这位是喜剧演员妮可·拜尔。
This is comedian Nicole Byer.
她主持一档搞笑的烹饪比赛节目《搞砸了》，而且她对连锁餐厅情有独钟。
She hosts the absurd cooking competition show Nailed It, And she is passionate about her chain restaurants.
据我所知，妮可，你在这些连锁餐厅上经历了一些波折，我真的很为你感到难过，因为你特别喜欢红龙虾的卡真鸡肉扁面条。
As I understand it, you you've gone through a tough time with some of these chains though, Nicole, and I really feel for you because you love the Cajun chicken linguine at Red Lobster.
但他们改了配方。
But they changed the recipe on you.
确实改了。
They did.
现在总觉得哪里不对劲，但我又说不上来。
There's something off about it now, and I can't put my little fingy on it.
我还看到，你以前特别喜欢 Chili's 的鸡肉凯撒皮塔饼。
And then you were a big fan of the chicken Caesar pita at Chili's, I read.
是的。
Yes.
然后他们就把那个从菜单上撤了。
And they took that off the menu.
直接下架了。
Got rid of it.
那个有什么特别的？
What was special about that?
我想我就是喜欢沙拉卷。
I guess I just like salad wraps.
我喜欢能拿在手里的沙拉。
I like salad that I can hold.
而且那个酱汁也很好吃。
So and and the dressing was good.
所以就像你可以假装自己在吃健康食品，但其实根本不是。
So it's like you could pretend that you're eating healthy and you're definitely not.
然后Applebee's把他们的苹果烟囱芝士蛋糕也下架了，我真的希望我多说说这个，他们能把它重新加回来。
And then Applebee's got rid of their apple chimney cheesecake, and I'm really hoping if I talk about it enough, they'll bring it back.
很多人吃过吗？
There's a lot of had it?
我没吃过，但我听说过。
I have not, but I've heard tell of it.
听别人描述过，
Describe it from people who
他们其实也不太清楚。
don't know it.
好吧。
Okay.
苹果蜂的苹果烟囱芝士蛋糕，就是把芝士蛋糕裹在糖面饼里，然后炸得恰到好处。
An apple chimney cheesecake from Applebee's is cheesecake put in like a sugar tortilla, and then it's deep fried to perfection.
然后放在盘子里，再舀一勺香草冰淇淋在上面。
And then they put it on a plate, and then they put a scoop of vanilla ice cream on it.
我简直乐开了花。
I'm like beaming.
我说的就是这个。
I'm talking about this.
这是我感觉最胖的一次，我简直在为这个甜点尖叫。
Like, this is the fattest I've ever felt where I'm like literally squealing about this dessert.
但它真的太好吃了。
But it's so good.
它很轻盈，酥脆。
It's like light, flaky.
芝士蛋糕温热得刚好，软软的。
The cheesecake is like just warm enough that it's gooey.
太好吃了。
It's so good.
你需要缓一缓吗，妮可？
It's do you need a minute here, Nicole?
听起来你有点激动了。
It sounds like you're getting a little emotional.
然后我就开始哭了。
And then I just started crying.
我当时就想，我只想要那个苹果芝士蛋糕。
I was like, I just want the apple chibi cheesecake.
这里是《Sporkful》节目。
This is the Sporkful.
这个节目不是给美食家听的。
It's not for foodies.
是给吃货听的。
It's for eaters.
我是丹·帕什曼。
I'm Dan Pashman.
每周在我们的节目里，我们都会痴迷于食物，从而更了解人。
Each week on our show, we obsess about food to learn more about people.
就像我说的，妮可·拜尔主持《Nailed It》节目。
As I said, Nicole Byer hosts Nailed It.
这是一个烹饪比赛节目，参赛者基本上完全不会做饭。
It's a cooking competition show where the contestants basically have no idea how to cook.
他们完全没头绪，节目特别搞笑，在Netflix上大受欢迎。
They're clueless, and the show is hilarious and a huge hit for Netflix.
2020年，妮可被提名艾美奖最佳主持人，是第一位获得该提名的黑人女性。
In 2020, Nicole was nominated for an Emmy in the outstanding host category, the first black woman to be nominated in that category.
我和她稍后会聊聊《Nailed It!》这个节目。
She and I will talk about Nailed It!
稍后见。
Later on.
但妮可早期做单口喜剧和演戏的经历，和她后来在《Nailed It!》里的角色很不一样。
But Nicole's early career doing stand up and acting, it was very different from her role on Nailed It!
那是一个适合孩子看的节目。
Which is a kid friendly show.
比如，我和我的孩子们都很喜欢一起看这个节目。
Like, my kids and I, we love to watch it together.
但在妮可的其他作品中，她一直以大胆直率著称。
But in Nicole's other work, she's long been known for being raunchy and honest.
我拿着我的汉堡。
I take my burger.
我正走着要离开肯尼迪机场，然后我
I'm walking to leave JFK, and I
就想，哦，我得去尿尿。
was like, oh, I gotta pee.
所以我就去
So I go
洗手间。
to the bathroom.
我开始尿尿。
I start peeing.
咱们说实话吧。
Let's get real.
我在拉屎。
I'm taking a shit.
飞机上空间很挤。
Planes are tight.
飞机上还有厨房。
Kitchen on a plane.
所以我一边拉屎一边闻到我的汉堡，我就想，哇，闻起来真香。
So I'm taking a shit and I smell my burger and I'm like, oh, it smells so good.
所以我一边拉屎一边开始吃汉堡。
So I start eating the burger while I'm taking a shit.
在MTV的节目《女孩密码》里，妮可第一次做比基尼脱毛是在镜头前。
On the MTV show Girl Code, Nicole got her first bikini wax on camera.
我要给你弄屁股。
I'm gonna do your butt.
哦，不要。
Oh, no.
你得先撒点粉，对。
You have to put a little powder before Yeah.
把粉撒进去。
Get the powder in there.
哦，我的屁股。
Oh, my butt.
她在即兴喜剧团体“直立公民旅”的时候，演过一个经典小品，讲的是她去试镜，选角导演一直让她演得更像黑人。
When she was with the sketch comedy group, Upright Citizens Brigade, she did this classic sketch where she goes for an acting audition, and the casting director keeps telling her to act blacker.
蛤蜊，我点了。
Clams I asked.
哦，天哪。
Oh, child.
我拿到蛤蜊了。
I got them clams.
你给我的清单上的东西我都拿到了。
I got everything on that list you gave me.
更黑的蛤蜊才能让派对热闹起来。
Blacker clams make the party.
斯派克·李。
Spike Lee.
哦，蛤蜊。
Oh, the clams.
哦，对。
Oh, yeah.
妮可从洛杉矶和我连线。
Nicole joined me from LA.
我们刚开始聊的时候，我告诉她我特别喜欢她的节目《Loosely Exactly Nicole》。
When we first started talking, I told her that I especially loved her show, Loosely Exactly Nicole.
这个节目几年前播了两季，先在MTV上，后来在Facebook上。
It ran for two seasons a few years back, first on MTV, then on Facebook.
这是一部根据她生活改编的喜剧。
It's a comedy based on her life.
有一集叫《死去的妈妈和炸鸡日》。
There's this one episode called dead mom chicken day.
妮可的妈妈在妮可上高中的时候去世了。
Nicole's mom passed away when Nicole was in high school.
这是真的。
That is true.
那确实发生过，但这一集的故事线也涉及妮可想出去吃炸鸡，结果她常去的那家店关门了。
That really happened, But it also factors into the episode's storyline when Nicole tries to go out for fried chicken and her go to spot is closed.
不会吧。
No.
不会吧。
No.
不会吧。
No.
不会吧。
No.
不会吧。
No.
不会吧。
No.
不会吧。
No.
不会吧。
No.
这不可能。
This can't be right.
天哪。
Oh, god.
你看。
Look.
我妈在我16岁那年去世了，每年她生日我都会来这里，因为他们家的炸鸡味道和她做的一模一样。
My mom died when I was 16, and I come here every year on her birthday because their chicken tastes just like hers.
结果它关门了，我现在都不知道该去哪儿了。
And it's closed, and now I don't know where to go.
你真的会以某种方式纪念你妈妈的生日吗？
Do you actually commemorate your mom's birthday in some way?
我好久没这么做了。
I haven't done it in a while.
我以前会给我妈妈做一个彩虹糖霜的彩纸蛋糕，就是给她做个生日蛋糕。
I used to make a funfetti cake with rainbow chip icing for my mom's birthday, like, just to make her a birthday cake.
然后他们问，那是你妈妈最喜欢的蛋糕吗？
And they were like, is that your mom's favorite cake?
我说，不是。
And I was like, no.
我最喜欢的蛋糕是什么？
What's my favorite cake?
因为吃的人是我。
Because I'm the one who's gonna eat it.
死人又吃不了。
A dead lady can't eat.
所以，对，我就那样。
So I yeah.
我以前确实会那样做。
I used to do that.
然后我以前还会做一个给去世妈妈的母亲节蛋糕。
And then I used to make a dead mom Mother's Day cake.
后来，我也不知道，我搬到洛杉矶之后，就有点不做了。
And then, I don't know, I, like, moved out to LA and I kind of nope.
不做了。
No.
我在洛杉矶的时候还做过。
I did it when I was in LA.
我也不知道什么时候就不做了。
I don't know when I stopped
不做了。
doing it.
大概两年前吧？
Maybe, like, two years ago?
在你妈妈生日或者母亲节做那个，会让你感觉好点吗？
Did doing that on your mom's birthday or on Mother's Day make you feel better?
不会。
No.
当然不会。
Of course not.
我妈都去世了。
My mom's dead.
蛋糕又不会让你感觉好点。
Cake's not gonna make you feel better.
哎呀。
Uh-oh.
我是不是
Did I
没有。
No.
没有。
No.
你
You're
我当时想，我把你弄坏了。
I was like, I broke you.
没有。
No.
没有。
No.
没有。
No.
但是在那个“死妈妈鸡肉日”的节目里，你说你要去那家特定的鸡肉餐厅，因为那家做的鸡肉最像你妈妈做的。
But in that episode of Dead Mom Chicken Day, you said that you were going to this specific chicken restaurant because they were the restaurant that made chicken most like your mom's.
你在现实生活中有这样的地方吗？
Do you have a place like that in real life?
没有。
No.
没人做的饭能比得上我妈妈。
Nobody makes food like my mom.
这有点难。
It's it's kinda hard.
就连我家里的人，也没人能做到她那样。
Like, not even nobody in my family even makes food the way she did.
她是个很热情的女人，要是第一次见到你，就会给你一个大大的拥抱，让你觉得她好像认识你一辈子了。
She was this, like, loud woman who just, like, if she met you for the first time, would, like, give you the biggest hug and she made you feel like she knew you your whole life.
我觉得她做饭就是带着爱做的。
And I think she just made food with love.
我只有在特别想做的时候，才能做出好吃的芝士通心粉。
The only time I make good macaroni and cheese is if I'm like excited to make it.
我能把芝士通心粉做得很好吃，但如果我是那种‘必须得做’的心态，做出来就不会好吃。
And I can make very good mac and cheese, but if I'm like, I gotta make this mac and cheese, it won't be good.
我觉得那是因为我不是带着爱去做的。
And I think it's because I'm not making it with love.
你有没有和妈妈一起做饭的特别回忆？
Do you have specific memories of cooking with your mom?
我们会一起做煎饼，直到我们能自己做。
We would make pancakes together until we, like, could do it ourselves.
她会说：‘你来弄。’
She'd be like, you do it.
但我发现我爱吃油炸的煎饼。
But I learned that I love a deep fried pancake.
锅里多放点油，把锅倾斜，把煎饼浸进去，然后狠狠地炸它。
You put a little too much oil in the pan, tilt the pan, submerge the pancake in there, and you fucking deep fry that bitch.
那味道简直绝了。
And it's so fucking good.
还有什么？
What else?
我们还会做我妈的……哦，我到处都找不到类似的食谱，但我妈会做那种奶油奶酪糖饼干，哇。
We would make my mom oh, I can't find the recipe anywhere that seems close to it, but my mom would make these cream cheese sugar cookies And Wow.
那真的太好吃了。
They were so fucking good.
唉。
Ugh.
我超爱那个。
I loved them.
我们会把它们捏成各种形状什么的，然后它们在烤箱里会膨胀，最后你根本看不出自己做了啥。
And we would, like, roll them into shapes and shit, and then they would expand in the oven and you wouldn't know what you made.
但我们总是会笑个不停。
But we always tea, he, heed, and chuckled about it.
你妈妈不在了，你们大家庭的餐桌上少了哪道菜？
What's the dish that's missing from your family your bit your big family table because your mom isn't there?
我不知道。
I don't know.
感觉什么都缺，因为我妈妈，我不知道还有哪个家庭会像她那样搞一个盛大的复活节晚餐，但她就是喜欢，她会做所有的菜，然后端给大家吃。
It's like everything's missing because my mom like, I don't know any other family who used to do, like, a big old Easter dinner, but she loved having a big Easter dinner where she would make everything and then serve it to everybody.
比如，她会整天待在厨房里，那真是一段美好的回忆。
Like, she would just be in the kitchen all day, and that's just, a nice memory.
那你们现在复活节都怎么过？
What do you do on Easter now?
不过了。
Nothing.
我阿姨有一次倒是想通过邮寄给我寄一份复活节晚餐。
My aunt did once try to send me an Easter dinner through the mail.
就像装在信封里那样？
Just like in an envelope?
不是。
No.
装在盒子里。
In a box.
那时候我住在纽约，挺久没回芝加哥看家人了，因为当时我穷得要命。
It was I was, like, living in New York, and I hadn't been to Chicago to visit my family in a while because I was pretty fucking poor.
她说，我要给你做点好事。
And she was like, I'm gonna do something nice for you.
我要给你寄点复活节的东西。
I'm gonna send you a little something for Easter.
我说，好啊，不错。
And I was like, okay, cool.
然后我收到一张取件通知单，我想，明天去取吧。
So I get this, like, pink slip in the mail and I was like, oh, I'll get it tomorrow.
结果周末到了，然后又到了周一。
And then the weekend happened, and then it was like Monday.
然后我就想，哦，我得去取一下。
And I was like, oh, I think I gotta go get it.
所以我去了第一百二十五街的邮局，把那张单子给了他们。
So I go to the post office on, like, one twenty fifth, and I give them the slip.
柜台后面的那位女士就说，天哪，她来了。
And this lady behind the counter, she was like, oh my gosh, she's here.
她来了。
She's here.
布伦达，她来了。
Brenda, she's here.
然后我就想，天哪，她和布伦达怎么这么兴奋？
And I was like, oh my god, why are she and Brenda so excited?
然后她们就说，这有点难办。
And then they were like, it's hard.
然后后面又出来了几个人，我都不知道发生了什么。
And then like other people came out of the back and I didn't know what was happening.
然后他们说，这是你的盒子。
And then they're like, here's your box.
而且盒子还在滴水。
And it was dripping wet.
哦，不。
Oh, no.
而且味道很难闻。
And it stunk.
我当时就想，天哪，这里面是什么？
And I was like, oh my god, what is in here?
然后他们都看着我打开，我阿姨给我寄了一些熟食和一些生食，比如有一袋生的培根。
And they all watched me open it, and my aunt had sent me some cooked things, some raw things, like there was just a raw bag of bacon.
然后还有玉米面包粉。
Then there was like cornbread mix.
然后我记得还有装在保鲜袋里的火腿片，还有装在保鲜袋里的通心粉和奶酪。
And then I think slices of ham in a Ziploc bag, macaroni and cheese in a Ziploc bag.
而且那个盒子在她卡车上放了好一阵子，因为她没有用隔夜快递。
And it had been sitting on her truck because she didn't overnight it.
然后又在邮局放了好几天。
And then it sat at the post office for days.
后来我姨妈给我打过电话，我终于回电了，她问：你收到晚餐了吗？
And then my aunt had called me and I finally called her back and she was like, did you get your dinner?
我说：收到了。
And I was like, I did.
她又问：你吃了吗？
She's like, did you eat it?
我实在不忍心告诉她我没吃。
And I didn't have the heart to tell her, no.
没有，姨妈。
No, auntie.
那东西都坏了。
It is rotten.
但真的，除了青少年，我从来没见过有人像那两个女人那样笑得那么厉害。
But it was very I don't think I've ever had someone, except for teens, laugh at me as hard as those two women laughed at me.
妮可的阿姨给她寄那个爱心包裹，是因为她觉得妮可在复活节需要尝点家乡的味道，尤其是妮可的妈妈已经不在了。
Nicole's aunt sent her that care package because she thought Nicole needed a taste of home on Easter, especially since Nicole's mom isn't around anymore.
但这份心意并没有完全达到效果。
But the gesture didn't exactly pan out.
幸运的是，妮可小时候吃的其他一些食物更容易复刻。
Fortunately, some of the other foods Nicole grew up with are easier to replicate.
我妈妈以前会做那种意大利饺子，不是从零开始做的，就是用袋子里的现成的，但真的很好吃。
My mom used to make these ravioli things, not from scratch, just out of a bag, and they were really good.
我记不清是什么牌子了，但我知道是从好市多买的。
And I can't remember what brand it is, but I know they're from Costco.
你去过好市多吗？
Have you ever been to Costco?
哦，去过。
Oh, yeah.
当然。
Sure.
当然。
Sure.
不过，自从我娶了我妻子珍妮之后，我对它的乐趣就少了一些，但总的来说，这对我的人生是件好事。
Although it has less less I get less joy from it since when I married my wife, Janie, which overall has been a net positive in my life.
但作为条件的一部分，我同意不在家里做猪肉，因为她从小是吃犹太洁食长大的。
But as part of the deal, I I agreed to stop cooking pork in our house because she grew up kosher.
我以前在好市多最喜欢买的东西之一就是猪排。
And one of my favorite things to get at Costco used to be the pork chops.
所以现在对我来说，它就没那么有吸引力了。
So now it's it's lost a bit of its luster for me.
等等。
Wait.
为什么猪肉不行？是因为猪很脏吗？
Why is pork not is it because pigs are dirty?
它们是不是在泥里打滚？
They, like, roll around in the dirt?
我觉得，学者们可能有不同看法。
I think that that's I mean, the scholars probably disagree.
但基本上，是的，猪肉和贝类永远不可能符合犹太洁食标准。
But, basically, yes, the you know, pork and shellfish cannot ever be kosher.
那虾呢？
What about shrimp?
虾不算贝类吧？
Shrimp doesn't really have like, it's not shellfish.
严格来说算。
It it technically is.
如果你买的是带壳的虾，那它就是贝类。
If you if you buy it before it's been shelled, then it's shellfish.
等等。
Wait.
虾有壳吗？
Shrimps come in a shell?
是的。
Yes.
对。
Yes.
它们的整个身体都被壳包裹着。
Their whole body is encased in a shell.
哇。
Woah.
不会吧。
No way.
不像蛤蜊或牡蛎那样是硬壳。
It's not a hard shell like a clam or an oyster.
你现在就搜一张整只虾的图片看看。
Google a picture right now of a of a whole shrimp.
好的。
Okay.
整只虾。
Whole ass shrimp.
它有小小的黑眼睛。
It's got little tiny little tiny black eyes.
头也可以吃。
You can eat the head.
等等。
Wait.
虾有眼睛吗？
Shrimps have eyes?
我大概从来没见过虾。
Never seen a shrimp, I guess.
等等。
Wait.
图片？
Images?
那些太奇怪了。
Those are wild.
虾就长这样？
That's what a shrimp looks like?
恶心。
Ew.
我不知道我还能不能吃虾了。
I don't know if I can eat shrimp anymore.
谁想到去吃那个的？
Who thought to get into that?
谁抓到这些恶心的小东西，然后觉得里面一定有肉？
Who caught these nasty little nuggets and was like, there must be meat inside?
对。
Yep.
那就是虾，妮可。
That's a shrimp, Nicole.
你看到它外面有壳了吗？
And you see how it's got a shell on the outside?
我想那确实是个壳。
I guess it is a shell.
不洁。
Not kosher.
不洁。
Not kosher.
龙虾。
Lobster.
那绝对是贝类。
That's definitely a shellfish.
没错。
That's right.
你以前见过整只龙虾吗？
Have you seen a whole lobster before?
那当然啦。
Duh.
我看过《小美人鱼》。
I've seen the little mermaid.
别这样嘛。
Come on now.
抱歉。
Sorry.
是的。
Yes.
是的。
Yes.
等等。
Wait.
塞巴斯蒂安是龙虾还是螃蟹？
Is Sebastian a lobster or a crab?
我挺确定是龙虾，但现在我们也得查一下这个。
I'm pretty sure a lobster, but now we need now we need to check that too.
好的。
Okay.
我得去谷歌一下。
I gotta Google that.
好的。
Okay.
塞巴斯蒂安。
Sebastian.
哦，所以，是的，塞巴斯蒂安是个该死的螃蟹。
Oh, so, yeah, Sebastian's a fucking crab.
如果那是螃蟹的话，那迪士尼的人得重新考虑一下了，因为在我看来那就像个龙虾。
If that's a crab, you know, then Disney people need to reevaluate because that looks like a lobster to me.
那爪子，它
Those claw It
看起来确实像龙虾。
does look like a lobster.
螃蟹是又宽又扁，而且横着走的。
Crabs are like wide and squat and they move sideways.
他确实是横着走的。
He does move sideways.
是吗？
Does he?
那这就是铁证了。
Well, that's a dead giveaway.
他是一只螃蟹。
He's a he's a crab.
维基百科是对的。
Wikipedia's right.
很高兴我们终于弄清楚了这个问题。
I'm glad we got to the root of that.
我们在这里取得了很大的进展，妮可。
We made a lot of progress here, Nicole.
《小美人鱼》是一部完美的电影，因为我觉得它的核心故事是一个年轻女孩想和别人长得一样，然后一个胖胖的海巫婆说，拥有声音比长得和别人一样更重要。
The Little Mermaid is a flawless movie because I think at the heart of it is the story is a young woman who wants to look like everybody else and then a fat sea witch said having a voice is more important than looking like everybody else.
然后那个聪明的胖女人就死了。
And then that wise fat woman dies.
然后这个红头发的人去了有腿的人住的地方，嫁给了一个她从未说过话的男人。
And then this little red headed person goes to where the people are with legs and then marries a man that she has literally never spoken to.
我觉得这对所有小女孩来说都是一个很好的启示。
I think it's got a great message for little girls everywhere.
接下来，我和妮可要好好聊聊《搞砸了》这个节目。
Coming up, Nicole and I talk all about Nailed It.
这个节目的魅力之一在于她和搭档——著名的法国巧克力大师托雷斯——之间的默契。
Part of the magic of the show is the chemistry she has with her cohost, the famous French chocolatier, Torres.
我记得，我第一次说点带颜色的话时，他就说，妮可。
I remember, like, the first time I said something dirty, he was like, Nicole.
他说，你干嘛说这个？
He's like, why you say that?
我就说，我也不知道。
I was like, I don't know.
我就是个怪人。
I'm a freak.
然后他说，你不是怪人。
And he was like, you're not a freak.
你就是有点污。
You're dirty.
那妮可爱给雅克做哪些不适合上班看的巧克力雕塑呢？
So what not safe for work chocolate sculptures does Nicole love to make for Jacques?
我们马上揭晓。
We'll find out.
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而且，她还解释了为什么她在家从来不吃三明治。
Plus, she explains why she never eats sandwiches at home.
别走开。
Stick around.
接下来是来自我们赞助商的一段精彩内容。
And now a delicious word from our sponsors.
欢迎回到新一期的《Sporkful Reheat》。
Welcome back to another Sporkful Reheat.
我是丹·帕什曼。
I'm Dan Pashman.
嘿，有空的话去看看我的Instagram。
Hey, check out my Instagram when you get a chance.
我会分享我的近况、我吃的东西，还有那些在《Sporkful》上不一定能播出的热门观点。
I share what I'm up to, what I'm eating, all of my hot takes that don't always make the cut here on the Sporkful.
我不明白为什么有人会想剪掉我关于怎么做花生酱果冻三明治最好的那些吐槽。
I don't know why anybody would want to cut out my rants about the best way to make peanut butter and jelly sandwiches.
但重点是，那些内容都在我的Instagram上，我们在那里玩得很开心。
But the point is that that stuff is on my Instagram, and we have a lot of fun there.
还有，有时候我会纠结，这期节目该做什么呢？
Also, sometimes I'm like debating, what should we do for this episode?
然后我会发起一个投票，这样你们就有机会真正参与到节目中来。
And I'll put up a poll so it gives you a chance to actually have input into the show.
你现在就可以边听边做。
You So can do it right now while you're listening.
在Instagram上关注我，账号是The Sporkful。
Follow me on Instagram at the Sporkful.
再说一遍，就是The Sporkful。
Again, it's at the Sporkful.
谢谢。
Thanks.
现在回到喜剧演员妮可·拜尔。
Now back to comedian Nicole Byer.
《搞定了！》
Nailed It!
其实是一档反烹饪竞赛的节目。
Is really an anti cooking competition show.
参赛者基本上都不知道自己在做什么。
The competitors basically don't know what they're doing.
看这个节目的乐趣之一就是看他们搞砸得多惨，但节目并不刻薄。
Part of the joy of watching the show is seeing how badly they screw up, but it's not mean spirited.
感觉更像是参赛者都在配合这个玩笑，而妮可、雅克·托雷斯和一位嘉宾担任评委。
It feels more like the contestants are all in on the joke as Nicole, Jacques Torres, and a guest do the judging.
好了。
Alright.
我们来尝尝吧。
Let's taste it.
天哪。
Oh my god.
这个挺干的。
This is pretty dry.
不。
No.
真的吗？
Really?
我很抱歉。
I'm so sorry.
我本来想客气点的。
I was gonna be nice.
哦，那太糟糕了。
Oh, that's awful.
你往里面放了多少盐？
How much salt do you put in there?
你只放了盐。
You put only salt in that.
真的吗？
Really?
你
You
把盐当糖放了。
put salt instead of sugar.
糖。
Sugar.
好。
K.
三。
Three.
完美。
Perfect.
朋友，你对我们做了这种事，你得把它吃了。
My friend, after doing that to us, you have to eat it.
一点盐算什么？
What's a little salt?
这个节目《搞砸了》真的引起了大家的共鸣。
This show Nailed It has, like, really struck a chord with people.
我很好奇，你觉得为什么？我是说，除了很明显你在里面表现很棒，雅克也很棒，但我觉得有些东西比这更深刻，能打动人心。
I'm curious why do you think I mean, aside from the clearly, fact that you are great in it and Jacques is great, but I feel like that there's something about it that's bigger than that that is connecting with people.
你觉得那会是什么？
What do you think that might be?
嗯，我觉得核心就是我本人。
Well, I mean, at its core, it is me.
我在某个方面是完美的。
I'm perfect in one case.
我觉得这个节目讲的是人们失败，但你仍然能赢。
I think it's like it's a show about people failing, but you still get to win.
而且我觉得在社交媒体上，现在人们展示生活的方式，比如在脸书或Instagram上，一切都是完美的，一切都是美好的。
And I think with social media, the way people present their lives now on, like, Facebook and Instagram or whatever, everything is perfect and everything is wonderful.
而且人们不会真正展示，你知道的，除非他们像，我抑郁了，然后我就像，他们不会真正展示生活中的起起落落。
And people don't really show you know, unless they're like, I'm depressed and I'm like, they're not really showcasing, like, the ups and downs of life.
你明白我的意思吗？
Do know what I mean?
就像，没有人会去拍一个看起来还行的汉堡。
Like, nobody's, you know, photographing a okay looking burger.
你
You
知道吗？
know?
全都是那种我吃过的丰盛大餐之类的。
It's all like this decadent meal that I had or whatever.
我觉得《搞砸了》
And I think Nailed It!
就是普通人做普通事，然后你会觉得，哦，我简直看到了自己，因为我也在做普通的事，我在试着烘焙，和我的男朋友或者孩子一起，什么的。
Is just like normal people doing normal things, and you're like, oh, I literally see myself because I'm doing normal things, and I'm trying to bake, you know, with my boyfriend or my kids or whatever.
而且我觉得大多数美食媒体都有点让人压抑，它们设定了一个完全不可能达到的标准。
And I feel like there's something almost sort of oppressive about most food media that it it creates this completely impossible standard.
每个人都完美得离谱。
Everyone's fucking perfect.
你知道吗，
You know,
你看过《小小厨神》吗？我特别喜欢那个节目，里面总有个小孩说‘我只是想让我爸爸为我骄傲’。
you got this I love Chopped Junior, and there's always like a kid on there who's like, I'm just trying to make my dad proud.
我当时就想，哦不。
I'm like, oh, no.
你永远做不到的。
You're never going to.
对，我觉得当人们做那些浓缩酱汁之类的东西时，那根本就是不可能完成的事，他们用的那些材料我都没听说过。
And, yeah, I feel like it's like an unattainable thing when people are doing like, you know, reductions and like, Chopped, they have to do stuff with shit that I've never heard of.
你会想，波森莓是什么东西？
You're like, what is a boysenberry?
当
When
人们，当《搞砸了》节目里的人真的，尤其是他们特别离谱的时候，你会为他们感到难过吗？
people when people on Nailed It are are really when they're going especially off the rails, do you ever feel bad for them?
不会。
No.
特别好笑。
It's very funny.
而且他们其中一个人还会因为做得差而拿到钱。
And one of them will get money for being bad at what they're doing.
这个蛋糕不错，但有点干。
This cake is good, but a little bit dry.
没有奶油霜。
No buttercream.
可惜，你忘了。
Unfortunately, you forget.
它得好看，但更重要的是能吃。
It to be beautiful, but it need to be eaten.
我觉得你的蛋糕烤得刚刚好。
I think you bake the cake perfectly.
我觉得味道很棒。
I think it tastes great.
但如果你在里面加了奶油霜，那就更好了。
But it would be a lot better if you'd added the buttercream in it.
好的。
Okay.
凯利，我喜欢你的蛋糕。
Kelly, I liked your cake.
它让我很开心。
It made me happy.
巧克力味很浓。
It was chocolatey.
我很喜欢。
I liked it.
谢谢。
Thank you.
你知道，这都是在学习。
You know, it's all about learning.
我做这行快四十年了。
I do that for almost forty years.
我还在学新东西。
I still learn things.
四十年？
Forty?
我还以为你三十五岁呢。
I thought you were 35.
我更爱你了。
I love you even more.
你怎么在子宫里学习的？
How are you learning in utero?
雅克，你真是个神奇的人。
Jacques, you magical.
我听说你和雅克·托雷斯关系处得很好。
And I gather that you and Jacques Torres have really hit it off.
我很喜欢他。
I love him.
他特别好。
He's great.
他是我见过的最温柔的人之一。
He's one of the sweetest men I've I've ever met.
有一天他还给我做了甜甜圈。
He, like, made me donuts one day.
他邀请我去他家。
He invited me to his house.
他拿着一瓶酒灌我。
He pounded me with a bottle of wine.
我们边喝茶边咯咯笑。
We tea he'd and giggled.
而且我听说你为雅克雕刻了不少巧克力丁丁。
And I and I understand that you have sculpted quite a lot of chocolate dicks for Jacques.
他把它们放在办公桌里。
He keeps them in his desk.
那就是个小丁丁墓地。
It's a little dick graveyard.
雅克就爱听黄段子。
Jacques loves nasty jokes.
我们拍片的时候我老说些下流话，他可爱听了。
I say a lot of nasty shit when we're filming, and he loves it.
我记得，我第一次说点带颜色的，他就说，妮可。
I remember, like, the first time I said something dirty, he was like, Nicole.
有一集。
There's one episode.
我记不清是哪一集了，但可能是那个女蛇的。
I can't remember which one it is, but this woman snake maybe.
我觉得可能是蛇的那一集。
I think it might be the snake one.
我不确定。
I don't know.
那个女的做了个东西，看起来特别像那啥，然后他们居然没剪掉。
This woman was making something that looked just like a dick, and then they left it in.
雅克就说，妮可，你觉得那像什么？
Jacques goes, Nicole, what do you think that looks like?
我就说，你不会想让我说出来的。
And I was like, you don't want me to say it.
但我看过雅克的采访，他当然是世界知名的面包师和巧克力师。
But I read an interview with Jacques who, of course, is a world renowned baker and chocolate chocolate maker.
巧克力师。
Maker.
我完全不知道。
I have no idea.
他夸了你的巧克力阴茎。
He complimented your chocolate dicks.
他说，从解剖学角度看，她做得非常好。
He said, anatomically, she's very good.
她做得非常精确。
She makes them very exact.
妮可：嗯哼。
Nicole Uh-huh.
制作一个解剖学上准确的巧克力阴茎的秘诀是什么？
What's the secret to making an anatomically correct chocolate dick?
要有过目不忘的记忆力，脑子里全是阴茎的印记，别的什么都没有。
Having a photographic memory, having a bunch of dick imprints in your brain and nothing else.
所以你可以直接把它们卷起来
So you can just roll them
然后拿出来。
out.
好的。
Alright.
嗯，我觉得这听起来挺有道理的，你说的其实就是经验，就像生活中其他事情一样。
Well, I guess that that does seem like a logical it's just experience is what you're saying, like anything else in life.
你得投入那一万小时。
You gotta put in your 10,000.
对。
Yes.
接下来，我和妮可聊聊她刚开始做喜剧时，如何在男性主导的即兴表演圈子里打拼。
Coming up, Nicole and I talk about navigating the heavily male improv scene when she was starting out in comedy.
广告之后回来。
That's after the break.
别走开。
Stick around.
接下来是我们的赞助商带来的精彩内容。
And now a delicious word from our sponsors.
欢迎回来。
Welcome back.
我们继续来聊我和喜剧演员妮可·拜尔的对话。
Let's return now to my conversation with comedian Nicole Byer.
说到那些黄段子
Speaking of of dick jokes
我特别想跟你聊的一点是，我觉得喜剧圈和餐厅后厨其实挺像的。
One of the things I was curious to chat chat with you about is, you know, I I feel like there's a a commonality between comedy spaces and restaurant kitchens.
都是那种男性荷尔蒙爆棚、充满霸凌的地方，对吧。
Very sort of male testosterone driven abuse abusive places to be for Yeah.
我看了《纽约时报》上的一篇文章，讲的是厨师特蕾西·德贾丁斯的故事，她现在可是个大厨了。
So I was reading this article in the New York Times, and it was telling this story about this chef, Tracy Desjardins, who now is a big time chef.
她开了好多家餐厅。
She's got a lot of restaurants.
对，嗯。
But Mhmm.
她职业生涯早期，在法国一家高级餐厅里，是少数几个女性之一。你可以想象，对女性来说，那可不是个容易待的地方。
Early in her career, she was one of the very few women in a high end kitchen in France, which you can imagine, not an easy place to be for a woman.
然后有一堆活青蛙被送进厨房，几个男厨师杀青蛙的方式特别恶心、特别不人道，我就不细说了。
And a bunch of live frogs were brought into the kitchen, and a couple of male chefs were killing the frogs in an especially gross and inhumane way that I'm not going to recount.
但他们把她叫过去，让她也这么做。
But they called her over and told her to do it too.
她心里清楚，这基本上就是个考验。
And she could tell you this basically, this was a test.
于是她拿起一只青蛙，没有像他们那样杀，而是直接往桌上一摔，用她觉得最人道的方式结束了它的生命。
And so she picked up a frog, and instead of killing it the way they were killing it, she just slammed it down on the table and killed it in what she thought was the most humane way possible.
写这篇文章的《纽约时报》记者金·塞弗森，她是个资深的美食记者。
And the writer of this article in the Times, Kim Severson, she's a longtime food writer.
她说，你知道吗，我很多年前第一次听到这个故事。
And she said, you know, I first heard that story years ago.
我第一次听到的时候，只是觉得这挺能体现女性在职场困境中的机智。
And when I first heard it, I just thought it was kinda like a good example of a woman's ingenuity in a tough situation in the workplace.
但现在她把这看作职场霸凌和骚扰的一个例子。
But now she sees it as an instance of workplace bullying and harassment.
你有没有遇到过类似把青蛙往桌上摔的喜剧版情况？
Have you ever had to do the comedy equivalent of banging a frog against a table?
没有。
No.
我十年前开始在UCB做即兴表演。
I came up doing improv at UCB, and I started ten years ago.
哦，我老了。
Oh, I'm getting old.
我觉得我很快就确立了自己是个强势的人。
And I think I just, like, quickly established that I was a dominant person.
如果有哪个男的在表演里想叫我婊子什么的，我就会看着他，停顿一下，让观众注意到这个男人刚才叫我婊子，然后我会用更有趣、更好、更聪明的台词回击他。
And if some dude was gonna like call me a bitch or whatever in a scene, I will look at him, pause, like, let the audience take in that this man just called me a bitch and then hit him back with something funnier and better and smarter.
所以我觉得，这大概就是即兴喜剧里的那种“喜剧对等物”吧，就是比男人更有趣、更好、更聪明。
So I guess that's that's what it like I guess maybe that's the comedy equivalent in in improv is like just being funnier, better, smarter than men.
但是，每当有男人想强迫我，比如，
But, like, anytime a man has, like, tried to force me into, like,
在表演里搞点性方面的东西，我不会为了做而做，但我会让它比他做过的任何事都更有趣。
a sexual thing in a scene, I'm not gonna just do it to do it, but, like, I will make it funnier than anything he's ever done.
但我确实好奇，在喜剧里把性讲得特别露骨，是不是也算一种自我防御机制？
But I do wonder, like, is is being super explicit about sex in your comedy sort of like its own kind of defense mechanism?
不是。
No.
我一直是个挺性感的人。
I've always been a pretty sexual person.
我体内睾酮素挺多的，而且我一直以来在性方面都很直白。
I have a lot of testosterone, And I've always been, like, sexually explicit.
我觉得这是因为小时候，大家总是说，天哪。
And I think it was because growing up, it was people were like, oh my god.
真不敢相信你居然说出这种话。
I can't believe you just said that.
所以，可能一开始是为了博眼球，但现在这已经深深印在我骨子里了，我说很多话的时候根本不会多想。
So, like, maybe it started off as, like, shock value, but, like, now it's just so ingrained in me that I say a lot of things and never really think twice about it.
比如，前几天有人说，你的播客挺露骨的。
Like, someone the other day was like, your podcast is pretty explicit.
我就说，是吗？
And I was like, is it?
我真不觉得。
I really don't think it is.
但话说回来，我觉得自己做的任何事都不算露骨。
But then again, don't think anything I do is explicit.
我觉得我就是我自己。
I think I'm just me.
我不知道。
I don't know.
我以前特别喜欢吃花生酱配博洛尼亚香肠三明治，但班上的同学总是笑话我。
I used to love peanut butter and bologna sandwiches, but the kids in class would make fun of me.
我这辈子向欺负我的人妥协的次数，我能想起来的也就三次。
And I can only think of three times in my life where I conceded to bullies.
其中一次是……哦，可能两次吧。
And one was oh, may maybe two times.
一次是因为博洛尼亚香肠配花生酱三明治，另一次是因为体操。
One was a bologna and peanut butter sandwich and one was gymnastics.
我因为一个特别讨厌的女孩放弃了体操。
I quit gymnastics over this girl being a cunt.
但后来我就想，好吧，看来我不能吃花生酱配博洛尼亚香肠三明治了。
But then I was like, well, I guess I can't eat peanut butter and bologna sandwiches anymore.
我得换点别的东西搭配着吃。
I gotta eat them with something else.
后来我发现我喜欢吃土豆面包配花生酱。
So then I discovered I like peanut butter on potato bread.
然后我又想，我也很喜欢吃番茄。
So then I was like, but I also really like tomatoes.
为什么不把番茄也加进去呢？
Why don't I throw tomato in there?
然后我就开始吃花生酱番茄三明治了。
And then I would eat peanut butter and tomato sandwiches.
我心里很清楚这很奇怪，所以我在学校不会吃。
And I I knew it was weird in my heart of hearts, so I wouldn't eat them at school.
但我会在那个女士家里吃。
But I would eat them at this lady's house.
她叫阿蕾莎小姐。
Her name was miss Arletha.
她家有个游泳池，我妈妈上班的时候她会照顾我，而且她会给我做这种三明治。
She had a pool, and she would, like, babysit me when my mom was working, and she would make them for me.
她也没说我什么，因为她是个老太太，她早就什么都不在乎了。
And she didn't judge me because she was an old lady, and she was she already didn't give a fuck.
我从她身上学到了很多。
And I learned a lot from her.
你还从她身上学到了什么？
What else did you learn from her?
就是别太在意别人的看法。
Not to give a fuck.
因为有时候我穿着泳衣，就会想，哎呀，我觉得我穿这个看起来好胖。
Because sometimes I'd, like, wear my bathing suit, and I'd be like, oh, I feel I I look fat in in it.
她就说，你只是个小女孩。
And she's like, you're a little girl.
你看起来就像个小女孩。
You look like a little girl.
我就说，好吧。
I was like, okay.
那你现在会不会在自己家里偷偷吃花生酱番茄三明治？
And do you ever eat peanut butter and tomato sandwiches today in the comfort of your own home in secrecy?
不会。
No.
我觉得在家吃三明治挺奇怪的。
I think I think eating sandwiches at home is, like, weird.
等等。
Wait.
怎么了？
What?
我从来没觉得做三明治有什么奇怪的。
I I have never been like, oh, I think it's so weird to just, like, make a sandwich.
我也不知道为什么。
I don't know why.
就是，我不
Like, I don't
那你在家都吃什么呢？
What what do you eat at home?
不是三明治。
Not sandwiches.
我不吃。
I don't.
我不吃……
I don't
你知道你这个想法是从哪儿来的吗？
Do you know where you can trace this opinion to?
就是那种老话，说什么‘滚回厨房给我做个三明治’。
The old, like, get in the kitchen and make me a sandwich.
所以可能我脑子里就把它理解成，我永远不会在厨房里做三明治，也永远不会吃三明治。
So maybe my brain took it as, I will never make a sandwich in my kitchen, and I'll never eat a sandwich.
我永远不会给男人端上三明治。
I'll never serve a sandwich to a man.
也许这就是它的来源。
Maybe that's where it came from.
如果我通过邮件给你寄一个三明治，你会吃吗？
If I send you a sandwich in the mail, will you eat it?
不会。
No.
不会。
No.
我不会吃通过邮件寄来的三明治。
I'm not gonna eat a sandwich sent to me through the mail.
不会。
No.
因为前几天晚上有人对我说了一句话，当时让我脑子一下子懵了。
Because someone the other night said to me something that blew it broke my brain in the moment.
她说，所有的信件都是从过去寄往未来的，这句话让我崩溃了，因为这是真的。
She was like, all letters are sent from the past into the future, And it broke me because it's true.
你写一封信，然后寄出去，因为要过一段时间才能送到对方手里，所以这封信就是寄给未来的。
You write a letter and then you send it to the future because it's gonna take a while to get to that person.
所以，是的，我不想要你那个过去的（三明治）。
So, yeah, I don't want your past sandwich.
这就是独一无二的妮可·拜尔。
That's the one and only Nicole Byer.
她的节目叫《搞砸了！》
Her show is Nailed It!
在Netflix上。
On Netflix.
她还是两档优秀播客的主持人，分别是《你为什么不跟我约会》和《最好的朋友》，后者是她和同为喜剧演员的萨希尔·扎梅达一起主持的。
She's also the host of two great podcasts, Why Won't You Date Me and Best Friends, the latter of which she hosts with fellow comics, Sashir Zameda.
这个节目最初是由安妮·塞尼、阿维娃·德科恩菲尔德和我制作的。
This show was originally produced by Anne Saini, Aviva DeKornfeld, me.
罗伯·麦金利·迈尔斯是我们的编辑。
Rob McGinley Myers was our editor.
节目混音由丹·祖拉负责。
The show is mixed by Dan Dzula.
下次再见，我是丹·帕什曼。
Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.
我是明尼苏达州卡弗的史蒂夫·达林，提醒大家多吃点，吃好点，吃得更好。
And I'm Steve Dahlene in Carver, Minnesota, reminding you to eat more, eat better, and eat more better.
这次重播的制作人是
This reheat was produced by
吉安娜·帕尔默。
Gianna Palmer.
今天这个工作流程的制作团队包括我，还有执行制作人
The team that produces this workflow today includes me along with managing producer
艾玛·摩根斯坦。
Emma Morgenstern.
以及资深制作人安德烈斯·奥哈拉。
And senior producer Andres O'Hara.
我们的工程师是
Our engineer is
Jared O'Connell。
Jared O'Connell.
音乐支持来自Black Label Music。
Music help from Black Label Music.
《Sporkful》是SiriusXM播客出品的节目。
The Sporkful is a production of SiriusXM Podcasts.
我们的执行制片人是Kameel Stanley。
Our executive producer is Kameel Stanley.
对了，如果你想无广告收听《Sporkful》的新节目，可以在Apple Podcasts上订阅SiriusXM Podcast Plus，或者访问siriusxm.com/podcasts+，用Spotify或其他你喜欢的应用收听。
And, hey, if you wanna hear new episodes of the Sporkful ad free, subscribe to SiriusXM Podcast Plus on Apple Podcasts or visit siriusxm.com/podcasts+ to listen with Spotify or another app of your choice.
下次再见，我是Dan Pashman。
Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.
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