RWH031：富足与迈克尔·伯格

因此，卡巴拉的观点无疑是，而且不深入细节的话，我父亲的老师罗布·布伦温是以色列工人工会的精神领袖。

So, certainly, the kabbalistic view is that is and without going to details, my father's teacher, Rob Brenwein, was was the spiritual leader of the workers union in in Israel.

他之所以接受这份工作，是因为这符合他的一种信念——正如你可能知道的，历史上，宗教团体中一直有一种观点，认为最伟大的智者是那些整天埋头研究、追求智慧的人。

And the reason he took that job is because it was one it was one of his, you know, as you probably know, historically, there has been this view amongst religious groups that the greatest sages are the ones, again, who spend all their time, all just in study and pursuit of wisdom.

他坚信并表示，没有实践的智慧算不上真正的智慧。

He believes it and says that wisdom without work is not wisdom.

正如他所说，如果你不活在现实世界中，你的智慧就全都是徒劳的。

That and the the quote is, again, that if you're not living in this world, your wisdom is is all for naught for naught.

因此，卡巴拉智慧中有一条非常明确的观点：那种脱离现实的智慧，根本算不上真正的智慧。

And so it's a very strong line in the kabbalistic wisdom that the own that, again, wisdom is not even really wisdom.

如果智慧没有体现在对现实世界的参与中，就不能被称为智慧。

It cannot be considered wisdom if it's not born out in in engagement in this world.

我再讲一个故事。

And I will add one more story.

我的许多故事中，你可能听说过，但你的听众或许不知道：卡巴拉主义者，尤其是乌克兰伟大卡巴拉主义者巴尔·谢姆·托夫的弟子们，常常会传授他们的教义和故事。

One of my many you really may know you know, but maybe your listeners don't, that the Kabbalists, especially those who are students of the great Kabbalists from Ukraine, the Baal Shemtov, would often give their teachings and stories.

这是一个被传述的故事。

And this is one of the stories that is that is that is given.

这个故事是关于我们知道，你们中有些人可能知道，在被称为高圣日的时期，即犹太新年和赎罪日，是我们精神上为新的一年做准备的时候。

The story is about a a we know some of you might know that on the this what are called the high holidays, Rosh Hashanah Yom Kippur is a time that we spiritually set up our year.

据说，这一年将要发生的一切——财富、健康，以及所有将要发生的事情——都基于我们在高圣日或犹太新年和赎罪日期间建立的联系而被决定。

It said that everything that's going to happen in that year, wealth, health, everything that's going to occur is is prepared based on our connections that occur on the high holidays or Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur.

在其中一天，这位卡巴拉主义者在与学生们聚会后说道。

And on one of those days, there were the kabbalist sat down with students afterwards.

他说，我想告诉你们，因为他能看见你们在祈祷中为来年所求的内容，以及天堂的回应，也就是造物主的回应。

He says, I wanna tell you, because he was able to see, what you asked for in your prayers for the next year and also what the heavens responded, what the creator responded.

他对一位学生说，你知道，你经营着一家旅店。

He says to one student, he says, you know, you run an inn.

在那个年代，经营这样的旅店或小酒馆是很常见的，那里有几个房间，是一家小小的旅店。

In those days, it was very common to be able to run this inn, pub where they had a few rooms, billion a small a small inn.

你经营着它，但你意识到，在整天与醉汉、形形色色的底层人群打交道的时间里，你根本没有时间真正地研习。

And you run it in, and but you realize that in all the hours that you have to spend running the pub around around drunk people, around sort of lower people, you don't have any time to really study.

你根本没有时间好好祈祷。

You don't have any time to really pray.

你没有时间做灵性上的功课。

You don't have time for your spiritual work.

于是你向造物主祈祷，说：你知道吗？

So you pray to the creator, and you said, you know what?

在今年年初，赐予我所有需要的钱。

In the beginning of this year, give me all the money that I need.

我不想要富有，我只希望我的所有开销都能得到保障。

I don't wanna be wealthy, but I just wanna have all my expenses taken care of.

这样我就能把一整年都投入到学习、祈祷和灵性修行中。

And then I can dedicate the entire year just to study, to prayer, to spiritual work.

第二天，在祈祷时，你重新思考了你的请求。

And then the next day, in the prayers, you you rethought your request.

于是你说：你知道吗？

And you said, you know what?

如果我在年初就拿到所有钱，我可能会花太多时间担心它，而无法真正全身心投入灵性修行。

If I get all my money in the beginning of the year, I might spend too much time worrying about it, and and I won't really dedicate all my time to to to the spiritual work.

所以请在年初给我一半，下半年再给另一半，这样我就能整年都专心投入。

So give me half in the beginning of the year, half in the second half of the year, and then I'll be able to dedicate the whole year.

到了下午，在祈祷中你再次重新考虑了自己的请求，于是你说：你知道吗？

And then the afternoon came, and in the prayer you reconsidered your request again, and you said, you know what?

我仍然感到害怕，年初就拿到这笔钱太多了。

I'm still afraid, and that amount of money in the beginning of bill will be too much.

我会花太多时间担心它。

I'll spend too much time worrying about it.

那就给我四等分吧。

So give me even quarters.

每个季度给我该季度所需的钱，这样我就不用再为钱操心。

Every quarter, give me all the money that I need for that quarter so then I can don't have to worry about money.

我不必再经营这家满是醉汉的酒馆，可以全心投入灵性修行、学习和祈祷。

I don't have to run this pub with all the drunkards around me, and I could dedicate my life to the spiritual work and to study and to prayer.

你想知道他如何对学生们说，天上的回应是如何对待你的祷告的吗？

And do you wanna know what he said to his students with the heavens answer to your prayer?

他说，当然。

He said, of course.

当然。

Of course.

他说，你以为你来到这个世界就是为了成为一个纯粹的精神存在吗？

He says, you think that you came into this world to be this pure spiritual being.

那不是你来到这里的理由。

That's not why you're here.

天使确实存在，但造物主——不是天上的天使。

Angels exist and the creator rather, not angels in the heavens.

你来到这个世界，是为了投身于这个世界，置身于这个世界的污浊之中，身处酒馆的醉汉之间，却依然能抽出三分钟进行一些精神上的行动。

You're in this world to be engaged in this world, to be in the filth of this world, to be around the drunkards in the pub and still find three minutes for some spiritual action.

这才是你来到这个世界的原因。

That's why you're in this world.

而这，当然，正符合你的观点和查理·芒格的观点，即我们来到这个世界并非偶然。

And that, of course, is is to to your point and to Charlie Munger's point that that the reason we're in this world is not a coincidence.

我们来到这里不是为了逃避它。

We're not here to run away from it.

我们来到这里是为了投身其中，同时又能从中抽出那寥寥数分钟或片刻，获得精神上的联结与升华。

We're here to be engaged in it, yet to be able to extract from it the the the few minutes or moments of of spiritual connection and elevation.

是的。

Yeah.

这很有趣。

It's funny.

我昨天给一个人写信。

I I I was writing to someone yesterday.

我总是幻想一种平静安宁的生活，但这种生活似乎从未发生。

I always have this fantasy of a calm, peaceful life, and it never seems to happen.

我总是有些不堪重负，同时应付太多事情，感到压力重重等等。

I'm always somewhat overwhelmed, juggling too many things, feeling stressed and the like.

不在俱乐部里。

Not in the club.

真有趣。

It's funny.

你知道吗，我小时候，如果你问我理想的生活是什么，我的梦想总是去以色列北部、卡巴拉的圣地，结婚生子，整天整夜地学习，从不与任何人交往——而这恰恰与我今天的生活完全相反，但那才是真相。

You know, when I was growing up, if you asked me what my dream life would be, it was always the same dream to go to the North Of Israel, the city of Kabbalahs, and have you know, be married with my kids and but just study all day and all night, not engage with any person ever, which is the exact opposite of what my life is today, but because that is the truth.

真相是我们来到这个世界，不是为了逃避它。

The truth is that we are not in this world to run away from it.

我们来到这个世界，是为了投身于它的泥泞之中，同时从中汲取巨大的光明与快乐。

We're in this world to be engaged in the mud of it and to yet extract great light and and enjoyment from it.

我想更详细地谈谈如何增加我们对现有财富的享受。

I wanted to talk in more detail about how to increase our enjoyment of the money we have.

因为几年前你和你妻子莫妮卡在《精神饥饿》播客中做了一期非常有趣的对话，谈到了如何更平衡地享受金钱。

Because you did a very interesting podcast a couple of years ago with your wife, Monica, the Spiritually Hungry podcast, where you talked about how to enjoy our money in a more balanced way.

你提到自己小时候家境贫寒，不得不去旧货店买衣服，却从未感到匮乏。

And you talked about growing up without money yourself and having to buy clothes in thrift shops and the like, but never having any sense of lack.

所以你说，最重要的不是我们拥有多少钱，而是能够享受我们已有的钱，并从中获得快乐和满足。

And so you were saying that the most important thing is not how much money we have, but being able to enjoy what money we do have and get pleasure and fulfillment from it.

因此，我想更深入地探讨一下，究竟该如何做到这一点。

So I wanted to talk in a bit more depth about how actually to do this.

如果我没记错的话，你提到的第一点是，这里有许多值得讨论的要点。

And the first thing you said, if I remember rightly, there are a whole slew of points that are worth discussing here.

但你提到的一个颇具争议的观点是，认识到钱从一开始就不属于我们，这正是坦普尔顿所谈论的，即我们只是上帝财富的管家。

But one of the things you talked about that's kind of a provocative idea is the importance of recognizing that the money is not yours in the first place, which is something that Templeton talked about there, right, where he talked about being a steward of God's wealth.

你能谈谈这个观点吗？为什么这样想会有帮助？

Can you talk about that idea and why it's helpful to think this way?

是的。

Yes.

这非常重要。

It's very important.

首先，你说这有点争议，但事实上，只要你认真思考超过五秒，就会意识到这是真的。

So first of all, you you say it's a little controversial, but the reality, of course, is that if you think about it for more than five seconds, you realize that it's true.

对吧？

Right?

没有一个富人能把自己的钱带进坟墓。

No wealthy man ever takes his money into the grave.

我的意思是，他也许能物理上带走它。

I mean, he might be able to physically take it.

但这对他或她没有任何好处。

It does does him or her no good.

所以从客观和哲学的角度来看，钱并不属于我们。

So objectively, philosophically, the money is not ours.

对吧？

Right?

这只是一个事实真相。

That's that's just a factual reality.

但更重要的是，如果我们理解一切皆为能量，而且更重要的是，我们所拥有的一切实际上都不属于我们。

But more importantly, if we understand that everything is energy, and and more importantly, that none of what we have is actually ours.

这同样适用于金钱之外的其他事物。

And this is true, again, not just of money.

智慧也是如此。

It's true of wisdom.

有多少智者在瞬间中风，所有的智慧似乎都消失了？

How many wise people have a stroke, in a second, all that wisdom seems to no longer exist?

有多少人深爱着自己的车，却遭遇了意外？

How many times people have a car that they love and something happens?

对吧？

Right?

人们以为自己拥有某物，而它却突然消失的情况，几乎占了99%。

The the the times that people think that they own something, and then it goes away is 99 of the time.

也许需要一年、五年、五十年，才轮到我们赖以生存的这具身体。

It might take a year or five years, fifty years, this body within which we live.

认为这身体是‘我的’是荒谬的，因为我们都知道，不幸的是，到了某个时刻，它就不再为我们服务了。

To think that it is mine is ridiculous because we all know that, unfortunately, at a certain point, it no longer continues to serve us.

这一切想说明的是，我们所拥有的那些东西，自我让我们以为它们属于我们，比如这是我的智慧。

That is all to say that the false view of that which we have acquired, which the ego wants us to take ownership of, which is this is my wisdom.

这是我的钱。

This is my money.

这是我的车。

This is my car.

这是我的孩子。

This is my child.

这种来自自我的、错误的想法，客观上在物理上并不真实，但更重要的是，也绝对不具有精神上的真实性。

That thought which comes from the ego and is false, it is not is a it is objectively not physically true, but more importantly, certainly not spiritually true.

我们所得到的一切都是出于某种目的的馈赠，或为了享受、参与、分享它们。

All we are given are gifts for purpose, either to enjoy, to partake, to share them.

当我们真正地将自己拥有的一切视为并非属于我们，而是被赋予我们来照料时。

When we really and truly view everything that we have as not ours, but as given to us, again, for to take care of.

如果拥有巨额财富，其中很大一部分，其目的当然就是分享。

If it's a tremendous amount of wealth, a big part of that, of course, will have to be its purpose is to share.

但关于财富，甚至我们的孩子，确实如此。

But but it's true about wealth, and even our children.

我们所经历的最深的痛苦，往往源于自我让我们相信：这是我的东西。

Some of the the greatest pain that we ever feel stems from the ego convincing us that this thing is mine.

当任何人试图夺走它，或真的成功夺走了它，就会带来巨大的痛苦，因为原本属于我的东西被夺走了。

And then when anybody tries either take take it away from me or succeeds in taking it away from me, that causes great pain because this thing that was mine has now been taken away from me.

如果你认为：不，这从来就不是我的。

If you view it as, no, this is not this was never mine.

这从来就不是我的。

This was never mine.

它是被赐予我的。

It was given to me.

也许它只是被赐予我一天。

Maybe it was given to me for a day.

也许它只是被赐予我一周。

Maybe it was given to me for a week.

首先，你会更享受它，因为你的珍惜之情永远不会减退。

First, you have greater enjoyment of it because your appreciation for it never wanes.

而且，again，我有很多话不想深入到这个珍惜的层面，但我觉得这是这个理念的基础。

And, again, I there's a lot I don't wanna go to this point of appreciation, which I think is foundational to to to this idea.

有一种教诲说，当我们把任何东西——金钱、礼物、智慧——视为自己的时，我们实际上是在将它与其源头分离，也就是我们所说的造物主之光，那股持续不断、永恒流动的能量。

There's a teaching that says that when we take anything, money, gifts, wisdom as our own, what we're actually doing, and this might be a deep spiritual concept, we're separating it from its source, what we call the light of the creator, that energy that is that is sustaining, that is flowing all the time.

如果我们自我 ego 说服我们：不。

If we our ego convinces us, no.

这是我的钱。

This is my money.

这是我的智慧。

This is my wisdom.

这种想法将它与其源头割裂开来。

That thought separates it from its source.

但当你把一朵花从土地上剪下来时，会发生什么？

But what happens what happens to a flower when you cut it off from the ground?

它开始枯萎。

It begins to die.

虽然可能需要一天、一周或一个月，但它已经开始枯萎。

Now it might take a day or a week or a month, but it begins to die.

因此，如果我们理解到‘拥有’这种想法实际上切断了我们的祝福——无论是金钱还是其他任何我们拥有的东西——使其与源头分离，它自然会失去生命力，从而我们也无法再从中获得任何收益。

So if we understand that the thought of ownership actually cuts away our blessing, be it our money, be it anything that we have away from its source, it will, of course, lose its life force, and therefore, the pledges that we are able to extract from it.

所以原因有很多。

So the reason many reasons.

但其中一个重要的原因是，我们要以一种非占有的心态生活，而是意识到我们只是暂时拥有这些事物，时间长短未定。这首先在灵性上让我们的祝福与源头保持连接，使它们能够持续获得生命力，因此我们也能持续从中获得愉悦。

But one of the reasons it's so important to live with a thought, with a consciousness of not ownership, but, again, having it for a certain amount of time, an undetermined amount of time, it, first of all, spiritually allows our blessings to be connected to their source, which allows them to be able to be to be receiving life force, and therefore, we continue to receive pleasure from them.

因为，再次说明，我们之所以知道这一点。

Because, again, why we know this.

再次强调，人际关系可能是最明显的例子，我总是用这个例子，因为这确实令人痛心。

Again, relationships is probably the most obvious case, and I always use this example because it's sadly true.

几乎每个人在第一次约会时都充满兴奋。

Almost everybody on the first date is very excited.

几乎每个人在婚礼当天都十分兴奋。

Almost everybody on their wedding day is very excited.

到第五年时，世界上大多数人的兴奋感已经大不如前了。

The majority of the world by year five is not as excited, certainly.

到了第十年，大多数人已经不再幸福了。

And by year ten, most people aren't happy.

让我们来看看这个连续的过程。

So let's look at that continuum.

对吧？

Right?

我相信你认识丹尼尔·卡尼曼。

And I'm sure you know Daniel Kahneman.

是的。

Yeah.

所以他承认，婚姻是人们所做的最荒谬的事情之一，因为数据和事实告诉我们，这简直是个糟糕的选择。

And so he bites the fact that that marriage is the most is the is is the silliest thing that people do because the the the fact and the figures tell us it's a terrible choice.

对吧？

Right?

但人们仍然不断去结婚。

People still continue to make it.

但我认为更重要的是，要深入探究这个问题的根本原因。

But but I think more importantly, go to the to the root of that.

为什么现实中，人们对爱情和关系抱有希望，而这种希望却几乎总是破灭？

Why is that the reality where people have this hope for love, for relationships that almost always dies?

它几乎总是会消逝。

It almost always dies.

其中一个原因是，当你和某人结婚时，你认为他们属于你，却忘了——当然，没有人，实际上什么也不真正属于你。

And one of the reasons is because when you marry somebody, you believe that they are yours, Not remembering nobody, certainly, but nothing really is ever mine.

因此，我必须每天努力去赢得它。

And I therefore, I have to be earning it every single day.

只有当你真正相信你并不拥有它时，这种欣赏才可能真正产生。

That appreciation can only truly stem if if you would truly believe that you do not own it.

如果你明白，你并不拥有这段美好的婚姻——无论是在第一天、第十年，还是第二十五年，那么你就有了可能性，或者说能力，让你们的关系中的爱不断成长。

And if you understand that you do not own this great marriage, not not on day one and not in year ten and not in year twenty five, then you have the possibility or, I would say, the ability to have the love in your relationship grow.

回到我们之前讨论的关于财富的话题。

Taking that back to what we were talking about before as it pertains to wealth.

第二点，也是不幸的是，我认为大多数人会问的一个重要问题：我如何看待自己与所获得之物的关系？

The second, and unfortunately, I would say most people, it's an important question people ask themselves, how do I view my relationship with that which I acquire?

无论是金钱、汽车，还是房子。

Be it money, be it a car, be it a house.

是我的自我欺骗了我，让我以为这些东西属于我吗？

Has my ego convinced me that it is mine?

这正是它走向消亡的第一步。

Well, that is the first step to its dying.

死亡可以以许多方式到来。

Now death can come in many ways.

也许你紧紧抓住这笔钱，但它却无法带给你快乐。

It could be that you hold on to that money, but it doesn't give you pleasure.

它也可能表现为一种方式，当然，你并不执着于这笔钱。

It can be a mean, of course, you don't hold on to that money.

但要真正持续地从我们所获得的钱财和物质中获得极大的愉悦，唯一的方法就是记住：这不属于我。

But the only way to truly maintain and to continuously be able to receive great pleasure from the money and acquisitions that we that we that we take in in its life is by remembering it is not mine.

正如我们所说，这能使其与源头保持连接，从而让生命力、这种能量持续流动，因为金钱就是能量，这是一个重要的议题。

That, as we said, keeps it connected to its source, which allows the life force, that energy to continue to flow through it because money is energy, which is an important topic.

也许我们稍后会稍微谈一谈。

Maybe we'll talk about a little bit later.

但它能让它持续处于这种能量的流动之中，因此，我能从中获得更多的愉悦。

But it allows it to continue to to to be in that flow of energy, and therefore, I'm able to extract from it more pleasure.

其次，这一点非常重要：它让我能够保持感恩，并理解我所拥有的这一切——因为它不属于我，所以我才拥有它，真令人惊叹。

And secondly, which is very important, it allows me to maintain appreciation and the the understanding that that this thing that I have, because it's not mine, I have wow.

我今天早上醒来时，发现那一百万美元依然在我银行账户里，或者我喜爱的那辆漂亮汽车依然停在车道上。

I woke up this morning, and this million dollar is still in my bank account, or this beautiful car that I enjoy is still in my driveway.

你知道，我相信我们大多数人还记得，我小时候就有许多清晰的记忆：当你得到一件新玩具时。

You know, I'm sure most of us remember, and I I have many clear memories of this as a child when you get a new toy.

对吧？

Right?

而且，通常你会整天玩它，渐渐就感到厌倦了。

And, usually, you play with it all day, and you get sort of sort of bored with it.

但作为孩子，你常常第二天早上醒来，它几乎又像全新的一样，你依然能从中获得乐趣。

But as a child, often you wake up the next day, it's almost like it's brand new to you, and you enjoy it.

我们的生活本应如此，无论是对待金钱，还是对待我们所享受的物质，都不是拥有，而只是暂时使用，因此心怀感恩。

That's the way our life is meant to be, whether it's our relationship to money, whether it's relationship to to the physical things that we enjoy, never ownership, only used for any undetermined amount of time, and therefore, appreciation.

如果你能保持这两点：意识到这份福气是礼物，这笔钱不属于我，而是与更高的源头相连。

If you're able to maintain those two things, which is the thought that this blessing is gift, this money is not mine, but it's connected to a higher source.

其次，因此我每天醒来都对它心怀感激，并且这种感激与日俱增，这样就能维持金钱中的能量，从而持续获得愉悦。

And second, therefore, I have great appreciation and a growing appreciation for it every day that I wake up, then that is able to maintain the energy within the money, and then for the pleasure that that we receive.

还有最后一点，所罗门王有一句箴言。

And one more point to this, there's a verse from king Solomon.

他说，你常常会发现，财富被个人持有反而会成为他们的祸害。

He says that you will find often wealth kept with the individual for their detriment.

那里有很多人，不幸的是，我遇到过这样的人，我相信你也遇到过，他们拥有很多钱，却无法从中获得应有的快乐，或者至少无法获得你预期他们能享受到的快乐。

That people there are a lot of people, and, unfortunately, I've met people like this, I'm sure you have, who have a lot of money, but are not able to extract great pleasure from it or at least not the pleasure you would expect them to be able to extract from it.

而这正是由这两点造成的。

And that that is because of these two things.

他们把财富视为自己的所有物，因此必然会对它失去感激之情。

They have taken ownership on it and therefore necessarily will lose appreciation for it.

关于感恩的这个问题，既实际又深刻。

This question of appreciation is so practical and profound.

我记得几年前，你在一个周六做过一次演讲，当时你引用了《旧约》中一个美妙的短语，我记得你翻译成类似‘我因所有的祝福、所有的恩赐而感到谦卑或被深深触动’这样的话。

And I I remember several years ago, you gave a talk one Saturday where you you used this wonderful phrase from the Old Testament that I think was, which as I remember you translating it, was something along the lines of I'm humbled or made small by overwhelmed by all of my blessings, all of my gifts.

我把它用希伯来文和英文都记了下来，每天都会看，就像芒格所说的那样，通过重复将好的、简单的理念深深印入我们的大脑。

And I wrote it down both in Hebrew and in English to look at it every day, to kind of hammer into my brain in the sort of way that Munger talks about, pounding good ideas, simple but good ideas into our brain through repetition.

因为对我来说，这是一种非常重要的实用方法——与其不断提醒自己还有人比我更富有、更聪明、更好看，不如反复告诉自己：不。

Because it felt to me so important as a way, a sort of practical means, instead of constantly reminding myself that there are other people who are so much richer and smarter and better looking and, you know, that I I I would just keep coming back and being like, no.

不。

No.

不。

No.

我被我所拥有的一切礼物深深打动。

I'm overwhelmed by all of the gifts I've been given.

你能谈谈这个想法吗？作为一种非常实际的方式，不断将这种意识刻入我们的脑海：我们并非处于匮乏之中，而是处于丰盛之中？

Can you talk about that idea just as a a very practical way to keep pounding into our head, this sense that we're not coming from a place of of lack but abundance?

当然可以。

Absolutely.

这与你之前提到的一个观点有关，这也是《塔木德》中的一句名言：谁是富有的人？就是那个对自身所拥有的一切心怀感激的人。

And it relates to something you you mentioned before, and it's a it's a it's a quote for, again, from the Talmud that says, who is a wealthy man, The the one who is appreciative of what he or she has.

对吧？

Right?

就是对自身所拥有的感到满足。

That is happy with what they have.

事实上，正如我经常说的，现实与灵性之间的界限往往很模糊。

And the reality is that it is, you know, again, this is I I often like to talk that, you know, sort of the line between fact or or reality and spirituality.

我们知道这一点，也有相关研究证明，一个人银行账户里的金额与幸福感并没有关联。

We know that and this and there's studies on this, that the the dollar amount that a person has in their banking account does not correlate with with with happiness.

这只是一个事实。

That is just a a fact.

对吧？

Right?

这是一个经过研究证实的事实。

A studied a studied fact.

所以，如果你明白我们每个人都可以富有，无论我们拥有多少钱或多少物质，唯一的区别就在于感恩。

So if you understand that each one of us can be wealthy, regardless of the amount of money that we have or the amount of acquisitions that we have, the only differentiator the only differentiator is is appreciation.

我经常讲一个男人接到医生电话的故事。

You know, I often use the story of the guy who gets the call from the doctor.

对吧？

Right?

他做了检查，结果看起来不太乐观。

He had the tests, and and he and and the test didn't look so good.

所以医生说，为了做检查，我们必须这么做，然后他接到了那个电话。

So the doctor said, we have to do this for the testing, and he gets that call.

电话里医生说，一切都没问题。

And the call doctor says, everything is okay.

你没有得这种病。

You don't have this disease.

就在那一瞬间，我们都能想象到那个瞬间，尤其是我们这些年纪稍长的人，在那一刻，没有任何事情能让你烦恼。

In that second, and we we can all imagine that second, certainly those of us who are a little bit older, we in that second, there's nothing that can bother you.

对吧？

Right?

但到底是什么变了？

But what changed?

实际上，什么都没变。

Literally, absolutely nothing.

在电话打来之前，你本来就已经健康了。

You were healthy before the phone call.

你在接到电话之后依然是健康的。

You are healthy after the phone call.

你现在感受到的喜悦如此强烈，以至于即使此刻发生更糟糕的事，打你一巴掌，你也根本不会在意，因为你此刻的幸福让你重新珍惜了刚刚过去的那一秒所拥有的生活。

The joy that you're experiencing now had such great joy that literally, if you worse than it became a slap in the face, it wouldn't bother you because you're so happy right now is you gained appreciation for the life that you had as it was a second ago.

因此，感恩可能是我们为获得幸福和财富都需要培养的最重要的品质。

And appreciation, therefore, is probably the most important trait that we need to develop, both for happiness, but then also for wealth.

但幸福当然是最重要的，因为如果你拥有更多财富却更悲伤，那你根本不会想要那样的财富。

But happiness, of course, is the most important thing because if you had more wealth and you'd be sadder, then then you wouldn't want that wealth.

我们追求更多财富的唯一原因，是我们希望并相信，更多的财富能带来更大的幸福。

The only reason we wanna achieve greater wealth is because we hope and believe that greater wealth brings us greater happiness.

但我告诉你，实现人生真正幸福最重要的事，就是提升你感恩的能力。

But I'm telling you that the most important thing that you can do to attain real happiness in life is to grow your your ability to appreciate.

就像你提到的那句经文，那是雅各说的，正如你所说，花时间去这么做——顺便说一下，科学上也研究过这一点，你可能也知道，那些在周日写下感恩清单、记录自己感激之事的人，生活更成功、更快乐。

And like you said, with with that verse, so it's a verse that was said by Jacob, and literally, as you said, taking that time and by the way, the science around this as well, which you probably know that it's a site they've done studies on this, that people who spend their Sundays creating a list of gratitude or what they are appreciative of live a more successful and happier life.

这是事实，因为它基于一个灵性法则：让我们感到愉悦的根源，正是我们对它的感恩。

That is a fact Because it's based on the spiritual rule that the indicator or the the the what causes our pleasure is our appreciation for it.

事实上，就我自己而言，我一直在努力改善很多方面的自己，以及我想改变的事情。

So what in fact, if I I I know for myself, the most I I work on many aspects, hopefully, of myself and things that I wanna change.

但有一件事始终如一，那就是我每天早上醒来时都会提醒自己，因此我们每天早上都会进行一种卡巴拉冥想，以唤醒对生命的感恩之情。

But the one thing that is always constant that I try to wake up with every single morning, and therefore, there's a kabbalistic meditation that we do every single morning, right, that that we have awakened appreciation for being alive.

如果我们每个人都能真正珍惜当下这一刻的光明，以及下一刻的光明，我们就会成为世界上最幸福的人。

And if any one of us truly appreciated light, the second of light that we have now, the second of light that we have next, we'd be the happiest person in the world.

不幸的是，生活的洪流让我们逐渐失去了对一切事物的感恩。

Unfortunately, the flow of life causes us to lose appreciation for all things, for all things.

我们之前已经稍微讨论过这一点。

And we spoke about that a little bit before.

我要特别强调一下，对于听众来说，最重要的一件事就是每天找到一种方式，唤醒深深的感恩之心。

If I can really, really underscore this for the listeners that one of the most important things that you can do is find a way to awaken great appreciation every single day.

顺便说一下，你必须为此进行冥想。

And you have to meditate on it, by the way.

你知道吗？

You know?

而且，通常你会冥想，想想如果这些东西不存在了，我会有什么感受？

And often, it's you know, you meditate on, you know, well, how would I feel that this didn't exist?

你知道吗？

You know?

一个人如果不珍惜自己的健康。

I don't appreciate a person doesn't appreciate their health.

花一分钟，或者五分钟想想，如果你现在得住院，你会有什么感受？

Think for a minute, for five minutes, how would you feel if you had to be in the hospital right now?

一个人不珍惜自己的妻子或配偶，如果你现在孤身一人，你会有什么感受？

A person doesn't appreciate their wife or their spouse, how would you feel right now if you're by yourself?

当你冥想这些你早已拥有却逐渐失去感激之情的生活方面时，你会发现自己会变得多么快乐。

And you'll see that you meditate on these areas of life with which you have abundance already, but have lost appreciation over time, you will see how much happier you are.

我会给自己做一个测试：一周内，我有多少次会因感激而心潮澎湃？

And I would one test that I test myself is how often in a week do I feel overwhelmed with appreciation?

不是因为新得到的东西。

Not for something new.

我们都可以对新进入的钱、新收到的礼物、新建立的关系产生感激之情，这当然如此。

We all can can awaken appreciation for the new money that comes in, the new gift that comes in, the new relationship that comes in, of course.

我在说的是，一周内我有多少次能强烈感受到对自己所拥有之物的感激？

I'm talking about how often in a week do I sense an overwhelming appreciation for what I have?

就像你提到的那句诗，我根本不可能完成那些工作，去配得上我所拥有的这一切丰盛礼物。

Like like that verse that you said, that then I could never have done the work, whatever that is, to to to deserve all this abundance of gifts that I have.

这有点疯狂，我们每个人实际上都是富有的。

And it's kind of a crazy thing that that every single one of us is is is is wealthy.

我们每个人都有丰盛，但我们却失去了对已有丰盛的感激之情。

Every single one of us has abundance, but we've lost appreciation for that which we have abundance for.

我想把这一点与另一个重要的教诲联系起来，这或许能赋予它更强的动力。

And I'd like to tie that into one other important teaching, which maybe gives it a greater impetus.

不过，我认为成为世界上最幸福的人，可能是最重要的动力。

Although, I think being the happiest person in the world is probably the most important impetus.

但拉瓦什拉格，这位伟大的卡巴拉学者和中心创始人说，为了获得更多——更多的金钱、更多的智慧、更多的喜悦——我们必须拥有我们称之为‘容器’的渴望。

But Ravashlag says, the great Kabbalist and founder of the center says that the vessel we know that in order to have more, more money, more wisdom, more joy, have you to have what we call a vessel, desire.

但他表示，我下一次成功的容器、我下一笔财富的容器、我下一份祝福的容器，就是我对现有福分的感恩。

But he he says the vessel for my next success, the vessel for my next money, the vessel for my next blessing is my appreciation for the blessings that I have.

以至于，我对当前所拥有的福分和丰盛缺乏感恩的程度，会让我几乎无法接收到下一份额外的礼物、下一重财富——而这本应是我注定要实现和拥有的。

So much so that if I to the degree that I lack in appreciation, in overwhelming appreciation for the blessings that I currently have, the abundance that I currently have, it becomes almost impossible for me to receive the next gift, the next wealth that I meant to achieve and that I meant to have.

这挺有趣的。

It's it's funny.

几年前，我和一位名叫霍华德·马克斯的著名投资者讨论过这类话题。

I had a a conversation about these sort of topics with a famous investor named Howard Marks a few years back.

霍华德，我上次查的时候，管理着大约1700亿美元的资产，他是个亿万富翁。

And Howard, last time I looked, oversees something like a $170,000,000,000, and he's multibillionaire.

他是犹太人，但从小在基督教科学派的环境中长大，对灵性问题持观望态度。

And he he he's Jewish but grew up actually as a Christian scientist, but he's sort of on the fence about his spirituality.

你知道的。

You know?

他是个极富理性的人，同时也非常深入地思考生命中更宏大的问题。

He's a he's a great rationalist and also kind of very thoughtful about about the the larger questions of life.

他经常谈到谦逊对他作为投资者以及生活各个方面的重大意义。

And he often talks about the importance of humility for him both as an investor, but in in every area of life.

所以他当时说，你看。

And so he was saying, look.

我人生中所有美好的事情，让我成为亿万富翁的一切，都基于运气。

Everything that's happened to me that's been good that allowed me to become a multibillionaire was all based on luck.

甚至从他获得第一份工作开始就是这样，我想那是在一家后来成为花旗集团的银行，但他当时非常想进入雷曼兄弟公司，而那家公司后来破产了。

And it it started even with the fact that he got his first job, I think, at a bank that became Citigroup later, but he desperately had wanted to go to Lehman Brothers, which subsequently went bankrupt.

但他没得到那份工作，因为本该打电话通知他被录用的那个人喝醉了，宿醉未醒，最终根本没打那个电话，他很多年后才得知这件事。

But he didn't get that job because the guy who was supposed to call him and tell him that he'd been hired got drunk and had a hangover and failed ever to call him, and he only found out about it many years later.

于是他列举了所有自己幸运的遭遇，这些其实与他自己的努力、才华或智慧毫无关系。

And and so he was listing all all of the ways in which he'd got lucky that really had nothing to do with his own efforts or brilliance or intelligence or anything.

我曾经在接受一次采访中提到，他拥有极高的智商，这显然对他的成功起到了作用。

And I once gave an interview where I mentioned how he had this incredibly high IQ, and it, you know, it had clearly contributed to his success.

之后他给我发了邮件，说：你看。

And he emailed me afterwards, and he said, look.

那些没有充分认识到自己运气的人，忽略了聪明才智本质上也是一种运气。

People who don't fully acknowledge their luck miss the fact that being intelligent is nothing but luck.

没有人能通过自己的努力获得高智商。

No one does anything to deserve a high IQ.

我觉得这非常有意思，即使是像霍华德·马克斯这样的人，也确实需要不断提醒自己所拥有的好运，因为这让他更加谦逊。

And I thought that was really interesting that even, know, for someone like Howard Marx, it actually it it helped him to keep focusing on his on his good fortune because it made him, for one thing, more humble.

因此，这保护了他免受我所说的‘宇宙主宰综合症’的影响——那种你开始相信自己天赋异禀、聪明绝顶，从而过度扩张、承担过多风险并最终自我毁灭的心态。

And so it protected him from what I called master of the universe syndrome, where you start to believe, wow.

我如此有才华、如此聪明，结果却过度扩张，承担过多风险，最终自我毁灭。

I'm so talented and so smart that you end up overreaching and and taking too much risk and blowing yourself up.

完全正确。

Absolutely.

而且这和我们之前说的一切都息息相关。

And it relate everything that we said even before.

对吧？

Right?

那种缺乏谦逊所滋生的自负，那种认为‘我靠自己努力’的自负。

The ego that comes from lack of humility, the ego that comes from the thought that I've done a time.

我曾在一次讲座中提到过这一点。

I've mentioned this in one of my lectures.

我认为是比尔·盖茨说过，要成为比尔·盖茨这样的人，他需要数以百万计的人的支持。

I think it was Bill Gates who said, you know, to be who Bill Gates became, he needed millions and millions of people.

世界上没有任何一个人能完全靠自己取得成功。

There's no one person in the world who will ever be successful on their own.

无论是大学，还是大学里的所有老师，还有那些你所知道的——成功需要一个村庄的支持。

You know, whether it's the university, the all the teachers in the university, they went to all the you know, that statement takes a village.

任何一个人的成功都需要整个世界的助力，这应该帮助我们既保持谦逊，也意识到将成就归功于自己是多么荒谬。

It takes the world to make any one person successful, which should help us both gain humility, but also realize how silly it would be to take ownership.

无论是我们的智力，还是我们的财富，都是如此。

Again, whether it's on our intelligence or whether it's on our wealth.

是的。

Yes.

当然，你知道，要成长需要某些特质，但我相信我们都明白这一点。

Of course, you know, it it takes certain attributes to be able to to to to grow, but you'll have I'm sure we know this.

对吧？

Right?

两个智力水平相同的人，一个会成功，另一个不会。

Two people with with the same level of intelligence, one will be successful, one one will not be.

两个拥有相同欲望的人，一个会成功，另一个不会。

Two people with the same level of desire, one will be and won't won't be successful.

所以，显然，客观上并不是一个人的生理特质或努力本身使他比别人更成功，那么问题就来了：究竟是什么？

So it is clearly, but objectively not the the physical attributes or even even work of one person that makes them more successful than the other, then the question becomes then what is it?

但最基本地说，这不是我。

But at the most basic level, it would be it's not me.

这不是我的自我。

It's not my ego.

保持这种谦逊，或许能让我们持续心怀感恩。

And maintaining that humility gains hopefully, gives us the ability to maintain appreciation.

从精神层面来说，我相信当我们能够保持谦逊与感恩时，就能与我们的财富共同成长。

And, spiritually, I believe that when we are able to maintain that humility and appreciation, we're able to grow with our wealth.

我见过很多非常成功的人，从物质层面看他们很成功，但在幸福感方面却非常失败。

And I I've met many, many people who are very, we'll call them successful in the in the physical sense, but are very unsuccessful in the in the happiness sense.

我不确定是否常说这是一种负相关，但显然不存在正相关。

And and I don't if you would say this often a negative correlation, but there certainly is not a positive correlation.

我认为这归结于我所说的自我，即保持谦逊的能力，以及对所取得的成就和拥有的东西不执着的能力。

And I think it boils down to the what we would I would call the ego, what we would refer to as the ability to maintain humility and the ability to maintain a lack of ownership on that which we have achieved and that which we have acquired.

是的。

Yeah.

我还记得一位著名的亿万富翁艺术收藏家大卫·克莱利曾对我说，他有很多亿万富翁朋友，他称他们为‘贫穷的富人’。

I I remember this multibillionaire famous art collector as well, David Clealey, saying to me once that he had all of these multibillionaire friends who he described as poor rich people.

这是一个绝妙的说法，他还说，他也认识很多‘富有的穷人’。

That was a wonderful phrase, and then he said he he also knew plenty of rich poor people.

但我非常喜欢‘贫穷的富人’这个说法。

But I love that phrase, poor rich people.

对。

Right.

因为正如我们之前所说，幸福与我们能从所拥有的事物中获得的愉悦感成正比。

Because as as we said before, the being happy is correlated to how much pleasure we are able to extract from that which we have.

如果我再深入一点，这里涉及一个灵性概念，这是我最喜爱的概念之一，但可能在威廉的对话中太深奥了。

And if I could if I go a little bit deeper, there's a spiritual concept here, and it's one of my favorite ones, but it might be too deep in William's deals.

告诉我，是不是太深了，或者需要

Let me know was too deep or it needs

我无法理解的地方，你尽管指出来，那说明它太深了。

to be I I won't be able to understand it to point out that it's too deep.

那你就说吧，迈克尔。

So go ahead, Michael.

所以，我们所谈论的这种能量，也就是我们称之为造物主之光的那股能量，创造这个世界的力量，资本家们称这种能量为‘无限’。

So so the understanding is that the energy that we speak of, which we we call the light to the creator, that energy that created this world, the phrase that the capitalists refer to that energy is the endless.

‘无限’，意思是它没有尽头。

The endless, meaning it has no end.

这意味着，所有存在的事物——我穿的这件衬衫，就是你对我们说话的麦克风——都是这种能量的一部分。

So what that means is that if everything that exists, the shirt that I'm wearing is a microphone to which you're speaking, to which we're speaking, is a part of that energy.

这意味着，一切都有可能成为无限的。

It means that everything has the potential to be endless.

一切都是无限的一部分。

Everything is part of the endless.

一切皆源于无限，因此一切内部都蕴含着无限的能量。

Everything came from the endless, and therefore everything has limitless energy within it.

我甚至可以举一个实际的例子。

I I'll use even a practical example.

我们知道，原子的裂变——它无处不在，时刻存在于我们周围和体内——能释放出巨大的能量。

We know that the splitting of an atom, which exists in abundance all around us within us all the time, creates so much energy.

但这意味着，万物内部所蕴含的能量，远比我们目前所提取的要多得多。

But it must mean that internally there is much more energy in everything than we are currently extracting.

因此，当我看着我的妻子，当我看着我的智慧，当我看着我拥有的任何事物，并理解它们并非有限，而是能够为我提供无限的丰盛时，我的关系就能带给我无尽的快乐。

So when I look at my wife, when I look at my wisdom, when I look at anything that I have, and I understand that it is not finite, that it actually has the ability to to supply me with an with an endless abundance so my relationship can give me an endless amount of pleasure.

我的钱，无论有多少，在当前状态下，也能为我提供无限的快乐。

My money, no matter how much it is, can at its current state, can can supply me with an endless amount of pleasure.

当你真正理解这一点时——再次强调，这并不是一个简单的概念，也不容易在生活中实践，但它会彻底改变你对一切事物的看法，也会让你对生活和财富有完全不同的认知。

When you really and, again, this is not a a simple concept nor one that that takes that it's easy to actually live with, but it gives you a completely different view on all things, and it gives you certainly a different view on life and on wealth.

我们每个人此刻在生活中，都已经拥有了一切所需，足以过上充满幸福的生活。

That every single one of us has right now in our life anything and everything that we need in abundance to be able to live a life of great happiness.

唯一的问题是我们目前无法从我们的金钱中提取无限的能量，无法从我们的关系中提取无限的能量，也无法从我们拥有的任何事物中提取无限的能量。

The prob the only problem is we're not able we're not currently able to extract the endless energy from our money, the endless energy from our relationship, the endless energy from anything that we have.

我记得很多年前读过一本书，书中提到，真正有灵性的人可以花数小时冥想，从一朵玫瑰中获得快乐。

I I remember there was a a book that I read many, many years ago that spoke about the fact that the the this truly spiritual person could spend hours meditating and gaining pleasure from the rose.

这是真的。

And that's true.

对吧？

Right?

如果一切事物都与无限的能量和无限的光明相连，那就意味着一切事物都至少具备潜力，能为我带来无尽的快乐。

That that if everything is connected to the endless energy and an endless light, that means that everything has the potential, at least the potential, to give me endlessly, endless pleasure.

而感激与谦逊，这些都是通往从我们拥有的一切中提取无限能量的阶梯。

And appreciation, the humility, all that are are stepping stones toward being able to extract the endless energy from all the things that are ours.

让我们短暂休息一下，听听今天赞助商的信息。

Let's take a quick break and hear from today's sponsors.

当你经营一家小企业时，招聘到合适的人才至关重要。

When you're running a small business, hiring the right person can make all the difference.

合适的员工可以提升团队素质，提高生产力，并将你的业务推向新的高度。

The right hire can elevate your team, boost your productivity, and take your business to the next level.

但找到这样的人本身可能就像一份全职工作。

But finding that person can feel like a full time job in itself.

这就是LinkedIn职位的用武之地。

That's where LinkedIn jobs comes in.

他们的新AI助手通过为你匹配真正符合需求的顶尖候选人，消除了招聘中的猜测成分。

Their new AI assistant takes the guesswork out of hiring by matching you with top candidates who actually fit what you're looking for.

它不再让你逐份筛选简历，而是根据你的标准筛选申请人，并突出显示最匹配的人选，帮你节省数小时时间，在合适的人选出现时迅速行动。

Instead of sifting through piles of resumes, it filters applicants based on your criteria and highlights the best matches, saving you hours and helping you move fast when the right person comes along.

最棒的是，这些优秀的候选人已经都在LinkedIn上。

The best part is that those great candidates are already on LinkedIn.

事实上，通过LinkedIn招聘的员工，至少留任一年的可能性比通过主要竞争对手招聘的员工高出30%。

In fact, employees hired through LinkedIn are 30% more likely to stick around for at least a year compared to those hired through the leading competitor.

一次就招对人。

Hire right the first time.

请前往linkedin.com/studybill免费发布职位，然后推广你的职位以使用LinkedIn的新AI助手，更轻松快捷地找到顶尖候选人。

Post your job for free at linkedin.com/studybill, then promote it to use LinkedIn jobs new AI assistant, making it easier and faster to find top candidates.

免费发布职位，请访问linkedin.com/studybill。

That's linkedin.com/studybill to post your job for free.

条款和条件适用。

Terms and conditions apply.

每一家企业都在问同一个问题。

Every business is asking the same question.

我们该如何让AI为我们所用？

How do we make AI work for us?

可能性无穷无尽，而猜测风险太高。

The possibilities are endless and guessing is too risky.

但袖手旁观绝非选项，因为有一件事几乎可以肯定：你的竞争对手已经在行动了。

But sitting on the sidelines is not an option because one thing is almost certain, your competitors are already making their move.

借助甲骨文的NetSuite，你今天就能让AI发挥作用。

With NetSuite by Oracle, you can put AI to work today.

NetSuite是全球超过43,000家企业信赖的头号AI云ERP系统。

NetSuite is the number one AI cloud ERP trusted by over 43,000 businesses.

它是一个统一的套件，将你的财务、库存、电商、人力资源和客户关系管理整合为单一数据源。

It's a unified suite that brings your financials, inventory, commerce, HR, and CRM into a single source of truth.

这种互联互通的数据，让AI变得更聪明，不再只是靠猜测。

That connected data is what makes your AI smarter so it doesn't just guess.

现在，借助NetSuite AI连接器，你可以使用任何你选择的AI，连接到真实的业务数据，提出你曾经想问的每一个问题——从关键客户到现金状况，再到库存趋势。

And now with NetSuite AI Connector, you can use the AI of your choice to connect to your actual business data and ask every question you ever had, from key customers to cash on hand to inventory trends.

无论你的公司年收入是数百万还是数亿，NetSuite都能帮助你保持领先。

Whether your company earns millions or even hundreds of millions, NetSuite helps you stay ahead of the pack.

现在，NetSuite 免费提供商业指南《揭开人工智能的神秘面纱》，访问 netsuite.com/study 获取。

Right now, NetSuite's free business guide, Demystifying AI at netsuite.com/study.

这份指南免费提供给您，访问 netsuite.com/study 即可获取。

The guide is free to you at netsuite.com/study.

2026 年，是你终于付诸行动的一年。

2026 is the year you finally do it.

这一年，你不再只是空想，而是真正将它变为现实。

The year you stop sitting on that idea and actually turn it into something real.

我们每个人都有技能、想法和副项目，知道它们本可以更上一层楼，但梦想与行动之间的差距，就在于迈出第一步。

We all have skills, ideas, and side projects we know could be more, but the difference between dreaming and doing is taking that first step.

Shopify 为你提供在线和线下销售所需的一切工具。

Shopify gives you everything you need to sell online and in person.

数百万创业者，包括我自己，都已经迈出了这一步，从家喻户晓的大品牌到刚刚起步的初创者。

Millions of entrepreneurs, including myself, have already taken this leap from massive household brands to first time founders just getting started.

使用 Shopify，打造你的梦想店铺非常简单。

With Shopify, building your dream store is simple.

你可以从数百个精美的模板中选择，并自定义以匹配您的品牌。

You can choose from hundreds of beautiful templates and customize them to match your brand.

设置也非常快速，内置的AI工具可以撰写产品描述，甚至帮助编辑产品图片。

Setup is fast too, with built in AI tools that write product descriptions and even help edit product photos.

随着您的业务增长，Shopify也会与您一同成长，帮助您从一个仪表板处理更多订单并拓展至新市场。

And as you grow, Shopify grows with you, helping you handle more orders and expand into new markets all from one dashboard.

在2026年，停止等待，立即用Shopify开始销售。

In 2026, stop waiting and start selling with Shopify.

注册每月1美元的试用版，今天就开始在shopify.com/wsb上销售。

Sign up for your $1 per month trial and start selling today at shopify.com/wsb.

前往shopify.com/wsb。

Go to shopify.com/wsb.

就是shopify.com/wsb。

That's shopify.com/wsb.

今年新年，让Shopify陪伴您开启第一声成功。

Hear your first this new year with Shopify by your side.

好的。

Alright.

回到节目。

Back to the show.

另一个显然非常重要、能让人真正享受财富而不被其控制、不成为其奴隶的方面，就是能够捐出钱财，与他人分享。

Another thing that's obviously really an important aspect of enjoying one's wealth and not feeling controlled by it, not becoming a slave to it, is being able to give money away to share it.

我记得很多年前第一次见到坦普尔顿的时候。

And I I remember Templeton all those years ago when I met him.

我去巴哈马拜访他那天，他大概83岁了，他说：你看。

He was probably 83 when I went to visit him in The Bahamas for a day, and he said, look.

我现在是我一生中最幸福、最忙碌的时候，因为我现在只做精神层面的事。

I'm the happiest and the busiest I've ever been because now all I'm doing is spiritual.

我把我的钱都捐出去了。

I'm giving my money away.

我用它来——他有一个非常独特的使命，就是将他所谓的‘人类的精神财富’提升一千倍，我想是这样。

I'm using it to to he he had this this very idiosyncratic mission to increase what he called the spiritual wealth of mankind a thousandfold, I think.

同样地，当我回想起我采访过的许多著名投资者，比如乔·格林布拉特，这位最传奇的对冲基金经理之一，他建立了一个由大约45所特许学校组成的网络，而我的儿子亨利就在其中一所学校当老师。

And likewise, when I give when I when I think of a lot of the interviews that I've done with famous investors, people like Joe Greenblatt, one of the most legendary hedge fund managers, he's he set up a network of something like 45 charter schools in New York City where my son Henry works as a teacher.

这些人都非常专注于给予和分享。

A lot of these guys are very, very focused on giving and sharing.

我书中的第一个人，马尼什·帕布拉伊，利用自己能够理性、冷静地进行股票投资的能力，帮助印度成千上万来自贫困家庭的聪明孩子摆脱贫困。

The first person in my book, Manish Pabrai, uses the fact that he can make these kind of rational dispassionate bets on stocks to lift tens of thousands of kids out of poverty across India, these very highly intelligent kids who come from very poor families.

我想知道，您能否谈谈这种给予与分享的机制——无论是通过慈善、捐税还是其他方式——以及为什么我观察到的这些人的生活似乎具有某种精神基础。

And I wonder if you could talk about this whole concept of injecting this this flow of giving and sharing, whether it's through charity or tithing or whatever, and why what I've observed in these people's lives would would have a spiritual base on it.

为什么这些人的幸福感似乎超过了那些只热衷于收集大量法拉利、更大私人飞机和更豪华游艇的投资者？

Why why do these people seem happier than the investors I've seen who are just building massive collections of Ferraris and bigger private planes and bigger yachts?

而那些人看起来并没有那么快乐和满足，但也许我只是在自我欺骗。

And those guys those guys don't seem quite as happy and fulfilled to me, but maybe maybe I'm deluding myself.

好吧，我们不妨说，他们或许既能享受这一切，同时也能回馈社会，希望如此。

Well, let's say let's just say that it they might it's possible to have all that pleasure and also be giving back, hopefully.

但让我们来谈谈捐税这一精神概念。

But but let's talk to the spiritual concept of tithing.

这当然是一个圣经中的概念。

And this is, of course, a biblical concept.

这在历史上一直存在。

This has historically always been around.

它与我们之前谈到的内容相关，即是什么让我们的馈赠——无论是金钱还是人际关系——保持活力。

And it relates back to what we were saying before that what keeps our gifts, be it money, be it our relationships alive.

对吧？

Right?

因为很不幸，我们知道人们可能拥有金钱。

Because, unfortunately, we know people can have money.

这些钱可能是死钱。

It could be dead money.

人际关系也是如此。

It could be be in a relationship.

即使表面上还维持着关系，也可能是一段死气沉沉的关系。

It could be a dead relationship even if they're still maintaining the the facade of it.

让任何事物保持鲜活的是那种能量的流动，也就是我们所说的通往造物主的光。

What keeps anything alive is that flow of energy, what we call the light to the creator.

我们需要积极地去做，正如我们之前所说，谦逊和感恩能够持续地将我们的祝福与财富同其源头连接起来。

And we had need to be actively and that's what we said before, humility, appreciation connects keeps connecting our blessings, wealth to its source.

当一个人拿走他或她赚到的十美元，并有意识地这样做——这正是什一奉献所应具备的意识。

When a person takes $10 that he or she made and consciously and this is what needs to be the consciousness of tithing.

他或她会说：‘这钱归于主。’

He or she says it followed.

我知道这十美元并不属于我。

I know all these $10 are not mine.

没有一分钱是属于我的。

None of it is mine.

是的。

Yes.

我为此付出了劳动。

I worked for it.

是的。

Yes.

我知道，我付出了很多时间，但我知道这不属于我。

I I you know, I put in the hours, but I know that this is not mine.

这来自于我所说的能量的创造之光。

This is coming to me from what I would call the light to the creator of that energy.

因此，为了表明、澄清并明确这一点：这不是我的钱。

And therefore, to to indicate, to clarify, to make very clear that this is not my money.

我只是拿走其中一部分。

I'm taking a part of it.

我本可以拿走全部，但我只拿十分之一，其余的用于分享。

I would take all of it, but I'll just take a one tenth of it and give it towards sharing.

所以，再次强调，慈善或个人选择的任何其他用途。

So, again, charity or in whatever way a person chooses to use that money.

那么，这个人实际上将剩下的九美元与它的源头连接了起来。

What the person does then is he actually connects the remaining $9 to their source.

当这笔钱处于活跃状态时，它就带着能量流动。

And if where that money is alive, that money money is flowing with energy.

剩下的这9美元会带给他比拥有10万美元却与源头断开的人更多的快乐。

That $9 left will give him more pleasure than somebody who has a $100,000 that is not connected to its source.

那是死钱。

That is dead money.

因此，什一奉献或捐出金钱的意义，并不主要在于我为接受我分享的穷人做了善事。

So the purpose of tithing or the the importance of giving money away isn't so much because I'm doing a favor to the poor man to whom I'm sharing.

更重要的是，比如《佐哈尔》——这本卡巴拉基本经典——将穷人称为造物主赐予我们的礼物。

More importantly more importantly and therefore, for instance, the zohar the kabbalistic basic kabbalistic text refers to a poor man as a gift given to us by the creator.

因为当我有能力拿出收入的十分之一捐给穷人时，这会让剩下的9美元获得生命力。

Because when I give when I have the ability to take one tenth of my money and give it to a poor man, it gives life to the $9 remaining.

当这9美元充满生命力时，它们就能增长，带来快乐，并为我带来更多丰盛。

And when $9 are alive, they can grow, and they they can give pleasure, and they can give they can give me more abundance.

如果这10美元我没有捐出，它们就会与源头断开，从而开始枯竭。

When they'll when those $10, if I did not give it, are cut off on their source, then they they begin to die.

所以，什一奉献，因此卡巴拉主义者使用‘得什一’这个说法，因为在希伯来语中，这是一个文字游戏，‘什一’这个词与‘财富’一词源自同一个词根。

So tithing, and therefore, the the Kabbalists use the phrase, get tithe, because in Hebrew, it's a word wordplay, but the word tithe is the same comes from the same root as the word wealth.

所以他们所说的词意思是：奉献什一，以便你变得富有。

So the words that they say is, which means tithe so that you become wealthy.

再次强调，什一奉献的作用是主动将你手中剩余的钱与它的源头连接起来，从而使这笔钱能够持续增长和繁荣。

Again, that tithing, what it does is it actively connects the money remaining in with you to its source, and then that money can continue to grow and to flourish.

所以想象一下，一个人在进行什一奉献时，究竟在做什么。

So imagine what a person is doing by tithing.

假设你有一棵想结果实的树，如果你保持枝条与树干相连，它就会源源不断地为你结出果实。

Is he you know, if you're if you have a branch on a tree that you wanted to grow fruit, by keeping it attached to the tree, it'll continue to give you fruits in abundance.

当你不进行什一奉献，或者把钱全部据为己有时，你就切断了它与源头的联系，就像把树枝从树上砍断一样。

When you don't give tithe or when you keep the money only to yourself, you cut it off from from the source, you cut down the the branch from the tree.

当然，它就再也不会为你结果了。

Of course, it will not continue to bear fruit for you.

所以，整个目的——从资本主义的角度来看，我父亲常常说：‘我之所以一直给予，是因为我是世界上最自私的人，我知道，只有不断给予，我才能持续不断地获得。’

So the whole purpose, the capitalistic view, and often, you know, my father would often use the phrase, the reason I give all the time is because I am the most selfish person in the world, and I know that the only way that I can continue receiving endlessly is if I give endlessly.

这就是十一奉献的理念：通过十一奉献，更重要的是背后的念头——这些钱不是我的，我必须确保留在我手中的钱始终与源头相连。因此，我把这当作一种象征、一种行动，表明我知道这一切本属于我。

And that's the idea of tithing, that by by tithing and, more importantly, the thought behind it, which is not my money, I may need to make sure that whatever money stays with me remains connected to its source, and therefore, I take this as a token, as an action that says, I know that all of this is in mine.

我会拿出其中十分之一捐出去，这样我的钱就能像树枝连着树一样保持连接，从而结出更多果实，带来更多的财富。

I'm gonna take one tenth of it, give it away, and that keeps my money attached, the the the branch to the tree, enabling it to bear more and more fruit, enabling it to bring more and more wealth.

因此，圣经中确实有一节经文说，造物主说：‘你来考验我吧。’

And therefore, there's actually a a verse in the Bible that says the creator says, test me on this.

考验我吧。

Test me.

我向你保证，如果你十一奉献，你将发现丰盛无穷、无边无际。

I promise you that if you tithe, you will find abundance without without and without limit.

这很难做到，因为就我个人而言，我在做慈善和十一奉献时，常常害怕自己会一无所有。

It's a difficult thing because I I often find with charity and tithing and the like personally, there's a there's a fear of being without.

我内心有一部分认同这样的想法：是的，我应该把钱捐出去。

There's a part of me that's like, buy into the idea that, yeah, I should give money away.

我应该乐善好施。

I should be charitable.

我应该成为一个更好的人，这也会对我有益。

I should be a better person, and it will benefit me.

然后还有一种根深蒂固、隐隐约约的恐惧，那就是，但如果这还不够怎么办？

And then there's this deep seated kind of underlying simmering fear of, yeah, but what if it's not enough?

如果我无法照顾我的家人，那该怎么办？

What if I can't take care of my family, god forbid?

我想知道，你是如何应对那种挥之不去的恐惧和匮乏感的——担心自己可能并不安稳。

And I wonder how how you deal with that that lingering sense of fear and lack that you may not be okay.

如果我所相信的这套体系其实并不真实呢？

And what if I'm buying into this system that isn't really true?

这听起来是个不错的主意。

It's a nice idea.

所以我会把这些情况分成两类。

So I I would so I would put those in two different categories.

如果一个人真的担心付不起账单，我不会建议他匆忙去奉献，尽管确实有人这么做，而且也从中获得了成功。

I would definitely say if a person is concerned about literally paying their bills, I would not be rushing to tide, although there are those who do that, and they do find success with that.

但我认为第二类人群要多得多。

But I think the second group is a much bigger group.

对吧？

Right?

当我们并不真的担心支付房贷或电费时，却仍然觉得，通过给予，我会失去一部分东西。

When we're not really concerned about paying, right, the the mortgage or or or the electricity bills, but we still think, you know, that by giving, I I I lose some of it.

对于第一类人，也就是那些真的担心付不起月度账单的人，我不太会大力提倡施舍。

In in the first group, meaning people if somebody's truly, truly concerned that they're not able to pay, you know, their their monthly bills, I I wouldn't be pushing too much towards siding.

但其余的人群——大多数时候、大多数人——虽然手头有余钱，却担心如果我现在给了，下个月怎么办。

But it's the rest of the group, which is most most of the time, most of the people were there is that extra, but the fear is if if I give this maybe next month.

对吧？

Right?

《佐哈尔》中有一句名言：一个现在有钱却为明天担忧的人，与造物主的光明没有联系。

There's there's a quote in the Zohar that says, a person who has enough money for for now and worries about tomorrow has no connection to the light of the creator.

对吧？

Right?

但大多数人属于这种类型：是的，我现在有，但明天、后天、明年怎么办？

But most people are are are in the category of, yes, I have I have now, but what about tomorrow, the next day, next year?

因此，只能把钱紧紧攥在自己手里。

And therefore, have to, you know, hoard it only only for myself.

对这一群体，我会再次说，正如那句话所说：试试看。

To that group, would say, again, as the I would say the the verse says, try it.

试试看。

Try it.

捐出10%，看看会发生什么。

Give, you know, once 10%.

看看结果如何。

See what happens.

正如我们开头所说，这必须是经过实践验证的。

They you know, as we said in the beginning, it has to be tried and true.

在你的书中，我相信我们都听过一些人用这种方法取得巨大成功的例子。

Now in your book, and I'm sure we've all heard stories of people who have been very successful using this method.

所以我总是说，既然这么多成功人士都使用过这种方法，并且因此获得了成功，这本身就足以说明问题，更何况这背后还有许多古老的智慧和原始真理。

So I would always say, well, if so many successful people have used it, and it's brought them success, it's that's some indication aside from the fact that there's also so much ancient wisdom, original around this.

我会说，就像创造者所说的那样，试一试吧，看看通过分享，你是否会体验到更丰富的富足。

I would say try, as the creator says, try me, and see if you do not experience greater abundance by by sharing.

也许你不必从十分之一开始。

And maybe you don't start with one tenth.

也许你可以从五分之一，或者别的比例开始。

Maybe you start with one fifth or or something.

至于你之前提到的这一点——你又重复了一遍——无论是从个人经历还是被研究证实的角度来看，我们都有一部分原因，为什么在大多数情况下，我们比接受更享受给予。

And then to your point, which you said again before, and this is both anecdotally and and also proven by studies that there's a reason why, for the most part, we enjoy sharing more than receiving.

这与我们源自的能量有关，也就是我们所说的创造者的光明，这种能量永远在给予，从不为自己索取。

That that that relates to the fact that the energy from which we come, what we call the light of the creator, is an energy that is always giving, never never receiving for itself.

如果我想要更多的富足，想要更多的祝福，那么我就必须更贴近这种能量。

And if I want more abundance, if I want more blessings, then I have to be more in line with that energy.

因此，当我分享时，除了给分享对象带来诸多益处之外，这种行为还让我更接近宇宙的能量流动，也就是创造者的光明，从而让更多的富足得以流入。

So when my actions of sharing what it what it does aside from many benefit it has to the person from with which I am sharing, it puts me in contact closer to the flow of energy of the universe and be called the light to the creator, and therefore more abundance can come.

顺便说一下，对于那些担心捐出十分之一收入的人，为什么不捐出十分之一的时间呢？

And by the way, what I would say to those who are concerned about giving, let's say, one tenth of their money, why don't you give one tenth of your time?

我们每个人都有些相对充裕的东西可以分享。

We all have something that we have a little bit more of that that we can give.

所以，我建议一个人可以从捐出十分之一的时间开始，用来投入分享。

So I would maybe a person starts with one tenth of their time that they that they dedicate towards sharing.

因为什一奉献，再次强调，应该涵盖一切。

Because tithing, again, should be of everything.

它应该包括我们的智慧。

It should be of our wisdom.

它应该包括我们的金钱。

Should be of our money.

它应该包括我们的时间。

Should be of our time.

它应该包括我们的爱。

Should be of our love.

应该涵盖我们拥有的每一个方面。

Should be of every aspect that that we have.

而且，我坚信，我们会发现这些行动、这些小小的步骤——对于我们这些需要从小处开始奉献时间或进行分享的人来说，当我们这样做的时候，一定会看到它的益处。

And, again, I strongly believe that we will find that those actions, those small steps, for those of us who need small steps of of tithing of our time or any actions of sharing that we will do, we will see the benefits of it.

我想谈谈如何不给予和分享。

I wanted to talk a bit about how not to give and share.

我仔细阅读了您许多过去的讲座和著作，其中有一些内容浮现出来，我希望您能加以讨论。

And I I've been looking through a lot of your old lectures and writings and the like, and and there are a couple of things that came up that I I hope you can discuss.

其中一个明显的是，不要以仅仅是为了抬高自我 ego 的方式去给予和分享。

So one of them, obviously, is is not to give and share in ways that are just designed to prop up our own ego.

在您的著作《成为像神一样》中，您写道：带着有意识地想要成长为像神一样的愿望捐出一美元，是一种具有转化意义的分享行为。

And there's a book of yours called Becoming Like God where you wrote a dollar given with the conscious desire to grow to become like God is an act of transformative sharing.

而捐出一千万美元，只是为了自我炫耀、追求名声和获取更多权力，那就不是。

A bequest of $10,000,000 given for self glorification, fame, and additional power is not.

您能否谈谈这种感觉：什么时候给予看似美好，但可能伴随着不那么纯粹的动机？我们应该如何提升自己的意识，使给予不再只是为了让自己显得更富有、更有权势、更有影响力？

Can you talk about that sense of when giving kind of is nice, but maybe it comes with not the best consciousness and where we should sort of work on our consciousness so that it's not just about, you know, making ourselves look richer, more powerful, more influential?

明确地说，我认为这种情况经常发生。

To be clear, I think and this happens all the time.

一个人如果捐出一大笔钱，无论是捐给医院还是博物馆，总是会这么做，无论怎样。

A person who's a significant amount of money to whether it's through a hospital, to a museum, always do that regardless.

我的意思是，这显然对个人在某种程度上、对机构当然也有好处。

I mean, it it obviously brings benefit both to the individual to some degree and to the institution, of course.

所以，我从来不会反对这样做。

So I would always I would never recommend against that.

但当我们内省时，我们每个人都要问自己：如果我想分享的原因，是因为这能让我与我所说的宇宙的流动、能量或造物主的光明相连。

But as we look internally, each one of us, I would ask the question, if the reason why I want to share is because it would connects me to what I call that flow of the universe or or the energy or the light of the creator.

那么这种分享就必须是真诚的。

Then it has to be true.

也就是说，当我给予时——无论是给医院捐一大笔钱，还是借给表弟一笔钱——这会在我内心唤起什么样的感受？

Meaning, when I give and whether it's a big check to a hospital or whether it's a, you know, a loan to my cousin, what feelings does that awaken within me?

任何与自我膨胀相关的感觉，比如‘我是大人物’，都要警惕。

Any feelings that become attached to the ego, oh, I'm the big man.

我是那个能够做到的人。

I'm the person who can do it.

这会削弱给予的能量，从而减少我从这种给予中获得的益处。

It diminishes the energy of that given, and therefore diminishes the benefit that I will receive from that giving.

当然，帮助那些需要钱的人总是好的。

Of course, it's always good to let people who need money.

当然，向那些需要援助的机构捐赠慈善总是好的。

Of course, it's always good to give charity to those in in institutions that are in need.

但我总是把它回归到我自己身上。

But I always bring it back to me.

这个行动能给我带来最大的益处是什么？

What will bring me the greatest benefit from this action?

事实上，越无私、越真实、越源自我称之为灵魂的那部分——它与分享的力量相连——这种给予对我就越有力量，我从这一行动中获得的回报也就越多。

And the the the the reality is that the more selfless, the more true, the more it is coming from that part of me that I call my soul that is connected to that force of sharing, the more powerful it will be for me, the more benefit that I will receive in return from that action.

因此，任何分享的行为都是值得的。

So any action of sharing is is is worthwhile.

但如果我们谈论我们能获得的最大益处，这正是我们给予的原因。

But if we talk about the ultimate the ultimate way that we can benefit, and that's the reason we give.

我们给予并不是仅仅因为想做个好人，虽然这很好。

We do not give because simply we wanna be a good person, which is nice.

我给予和分享，是因为我知道，为了我的成长，我需要这些分享的行为，它们带给我富足与祝福。

I give, and I share because I know that I need for my growth those actions of sharing, that that gives me abundance, that that gives me blessings.

这种行为越纯粹，对我的力量就越强大。

The purer that action can be, the more powerful it will be for me.

接收者可能对收到的10美元和我给他们的1000美元同样开心，但那1000美元如果只是出于我的自我，而真正的灵魂驱动的分享行为，我所获得的回报却完全不同。

The receiver might be just as happy with the $10 that the thousand dollars that I give them that I that is all for my ego, and the thousand dollars that I give them is truly from the place of my soul that is simply an action of sharing, but I will not receive the same benefit.

因此，我认为对我们这些参与分享行为的人——我希望我们所有人都在某种程度上如此——至关重要的是，尽我们所能，确保我们能从中获得最大的益处。

And therefore, think it's very important for those of us who are and I hope all of us to some degree are involved in the actions of sharing that we make sure to the degree that we can, that where we can receive the greatest benefit from them.

获得分享行为最大益处的方式，是确保我出自最纯粹的内心，不是出于自我，而是出于分享的渴望，更重要的是，这让我与所有祝福的源头相连。

And the way to receive the greatest benefit from actions of sharing is to make sure that I am coming from the purest place, not of ego, but of a desire to share more importantly because it connects me to the source of where all of my blessings come from.

我们很多人都在纠结另一个大问题：如何在不宠坏孩子、不摧毁他们为自己奋斗动力的前提下，把钱给他们并和他们分享。

There's another big issue that a lot of us wrestle with of how to give money and share with our kids without spoiling them, wrecking their desire to achieve stuff for themselves.

沃伦·巴菲特曾 famously 说：你应该给孩子们足够的钱，让他们能做任何事，但不能多到让他们什么都不做。

And Warren Buffett famously said, you should give your kids enough money so they can do anything, but not enough so that they'll do nothing.

这指导了投资界许多人，让他们有理由捐出大量资金，同时仍给子女一些钱，使他们能在人生中拥有一个不错的起点。

And that's guided a lot of people in the investment business so that, you know, it gives it it gives them the justification to give away a lot of money, but they they still give something to their kids so that, you know, they'll have a decent head start in life.

在卡巴拉中，有一个我觉得极其深刻的概念，叫做‘羞耻之面包’。

There's a concept in Kabbalah that I've found incredibly profound of bread of shame.

我想知道你能否谈谈这个概念，它意味着什么，以及我们如何以真正帮助而非削弱他们的方式，给予金钱或帮助孩子及家人。

And I wondered if you could talk about that and how what it what it means and how basically we can give money away or help our kids or family members in ways that will actually help them rather than disempower them.

当然。

Absolutely.

正如你所说，卡巴拉的一项基本教义是提出这样一个哲学与神学问题：我们为何存在于这个世界？

So like you said, it's a foundational teaching of Kabbalah that the question the philosophical theological question is asked, why are we in this world?

为什么这个世界不完美？

Why why isn't the world perfect?

为什么会有痛苦、苦难和死亡？

Why is there pain, suffering, death?

如果上帝是善良的，是那无限光明、创造者的品质，为什么我们每个人的生命中都会遇到困境？为什么这个世界不是全然美好的？

Why do we all come to struggles in our life if god is good, that quality endless light, quality creator is good, why isn't everything good in this world?

答案是，如果一切从一开始就处于完美状态，我们就永远不会真正拥有它，而只会体验到所谓的‘羞耻之面包’。

And the answer is because if everything was created in its perfected state, we would never have earned it, and we would be experiencing what is called bread of shame.

未经努力就得到的东西，会让我们对它感到不满。

Being bread or what is given to us without having earned it causes us to feel unhappy with it.

因为我们的本源，我们来自之处，正是创造者的光明。

Because our root, where we come from, is that light of the creator.

我们所有人都是由那光明、那能量构成的，那能量是分享与创造的能量。

We are all made of that light of that energy, that energy that is of sharing, that is of creating.

如果我们降生在一个已经完美的世界里，我们或许会一时享受，甚至长久享受，但最终，你会意识到：这不是我创造的。

If we came into a world created in its perfection, we wouldn't we would enjoy it for a while, maybe a long while, but eventually, you may would come to the point where we would understand, I didn't create this.

我没有努力获得它。

I didn't earn this.

我们的本源是创造、是让事物变得更好的力量，因此，最终我们会对这种不劳而获的完美感到不满。

My energy, where we come from is the is the force that creates things that that makes things better, and therefore, eventually, we would be unhappy with it.