如何与铁人三项世界冠军露西·查尔斯-巴克莱进行交叉训练

当状态不好时，真的会非常非常艰难。

When it's going badly, it's so, so tough.

所以是的，跑步有时让我又爱又恨，但目前我觉得自己很享受，状态不错。

So yeah, sometimes it's a love hate with running, but at the moment I feel like I'm loving it, so I'm in a good place.

好的，很好。

Okay, good.

是的，我跑步时经常超负荷，比如我妻子每天都跑步，我会说，哦，好啊，一起去吧，然后我出去跑四十分钟，之后就浑身像要散架一样。

Yeah, usually get over my skis on the runs and like I'll be like, my wife runs every day and I'll be like, oh yeah, let's go and I'll go out there and I'll be like forty minutes and then I'm just leaking oil everywhere.

我会想，天啊，为什么？

I'm like, oh no, why?

我为什么要答应这件事？

Why did I say yes to this?

因为她跑得很快。

Like, cause she's fast.

既然这是WHOOP播客，我有一些关于恢复和WHOOP的问题，我想我们的听众会想听你的看法。我的第一个问题是：对你来说，完美的恢复日是什么样子？

So since this is the WHOOP podcast, I have some recovery and WHOOP style questions that I think our listeners would like So to hear from you my first question is, what does a perfect recovery day look like for you?

我的恢复日通常包括一次轻松的游泳和一次力量训练。

So my recovery days generally include an easy swim and a strength session.

这大概是在铁人三项世界里最轻松的安排了，通常还会遛狗。

That's probably as easy as it gets in triathlon land and a dog walk usually.

是的。

Yes.

我见过你的狗。

I've seen your dogs.

狗在你的生活中占了很大一部分。

The dogs are a big part of of your world.

是的。

Yeah.

好的。

Okay.

我们得

We gotta

谈谈这个。

talk about this.

它们是我生活中非常重要的一部分，我觉得散步是最好的方式，能让我从三铁这个全然占据生活的世界中抽离出来，清空思绪，亲近自然。

They are a huge part of my world, and I feel like they're the best way to, like, switch off from that all consuming world of triathlon and just going for a walk, clearing my mind, being in nature.

而且我养的这两只狗特别有趣。

And they're so entertaining, the two dogs I have.

它们叫洛拉和泡菜。

They're called Lola and Pickle.

它们真的是很好的 distraction，但我发现它们对恢复特别有帮助。

And, yeah, they just are a really great distraction, but I find they're really good for recovery.

除此之外，当然还有摄入优质的营养，定期看理疗师。

And then alongside that, obviously, eating really good nutrition, seeing my physio regularly.

我总是在休息日去找理疗师，做所有该做的好事。

Like I always use my physio on a rest day and yeah, kinda just do all the good things.

我回家后还会泡个舒服的澡。

I have a nice bath at home as well.

有时候我得花点时间才能鼓起勇气坐进去，但我发现这确实也挺有帮助的。

Sometimes it takes me a bit of time to, like, build up the courage to go and sit in there, but I find that also really does help quite a lot as well.

小憩？

Naps?

我们是在小憩吗？

Are we, like, are we napping?

我特别不擅长小憩。

I'm a really bad napper.

我丈夫总说，每个职业运动员都会小憩。

Like, it's the one thing my husband is like, every pro athlete naps.

你为什么就不做呢？

Like, why won't you do it?

我说，不。

And I'm like, no.

我还有太多别的事要忙。

I've got too much other stuff to do.

我得去洗衣服。

Like, I need to do the laundry.

我得做这个。

I need to do this.

有事情要做的时候，我没法只是躺着小睡，我可能还得发邮件，或者努力跟上生活的节奏。

I can't just be napping when there's things to be done or I might be sending emails or, yeah, trying to keep on top of life.

所以这可能是我真的能从中受益的事情。

So it's probably something I could really benefit from.

说到你的丈夫里斯，我们之前见过他，他现在正和你一起旅行，你们俩似乎非常默契。

It seems like, speaking of your husband Reese, who we got to meet earlier, who's traveling with you right now, that you guys are really locked in together.

我听过一段内容，你说在过去一年里，他做了大量研究，如何让你更符合空气动力学，比如在风洞中测试，寻找所有能让你更快、打破更多纪录、发挥最佳状态的细微改进。

I was listening to something where you were saying that maybe over the last year, he had been doing a bunch of research in how to make you more aerodynamic, like being in the wind tunnel, to find all of this different one percenters that can bring you even faster and break more records and be at your best.

但我想问的是，自从你开始更多地使用科技后，有没有注意到自己的表现和恢复有明显改善？

But I guess, have you noticed any big changes in your performance and recovery since you've started using more tech?

因为我觉得这个问题的背景是，在环法自行车赛或其他赛事中，每年的比赛成绩都在越来越快。

Because I guess the way I'm thinking about this question is that in the Tour de France or in these other events, start to see these times going faster and faster every year.

但你也意识到陶瓷轴承之类的，嗯。

But you also realize that ceramic bearings and, like Yeah.

你知道，鞋套，还有它们的触感。

You know, shoe covers and, you know, the way that they're feeling it.

每年都有太多东西在变化。

So many things are changing from year to year.

这是一项非常依赖科学的运动。

It's very science heavy sport.

但聊聊雷斯吧，他是怎么帮助你完善你的技术的。

But, yeah, talk a little bit about Reese and and maybe how he's been helping you, you know, perfect your game.

是的。

Yeah.

当然。

For sure.

我的意思是，雷斯一直是我生活中非常重要的一部分，当然也是我运动生涯中不可或缺的一部分。

I mean, Reese has been such a huge part of my, well, my life, but also, obviously, my sporting career.

我们当初都是游泳运动员时认识的。

We we met back when we were both swimmers.

他当时在大学学习运动科学，而我则在那里的高水平游泳队训练。

He was studying sports science at university, and I was, like, on the high performance swim squad there.

他总是那个提供最佳建议的人，我会想，好吧。

And he always was the person that just had the best advice and was I'd be like, okay.

我要在训练中试试这个方法。

I'm gonna try that in my training.

十次里有九次，这方法都管用。

And, like, nine times out of 10, it would work.

我会想，你是怎么知道这招会有效的？

And I'm like, oh, how did you know this was gonna work?

从我整个职业生涯开始，他就一直沿着这条路走下去。

And he's kind of followed that path throughout my whole career.

他会研究空气动力学、营养学等各种东西，然后我们把这些应用到训练中，我就因此取得进步和提升。

He'll be researching aerodynamics, nutrition, all sorts of things, and we'll apply that to the training, and then I progress and and make gains.

所以，是的，他对于我的职业生涯来说绝对是不可或缺的，一直都在我身边。

So, yeah, he's completely invaluable to my career for sure and just has been there all the way.

他也是非常支持我的。

He's just incredibly supportive as well.

我觉得他非常擅长严厉的爱。

I'd say he's very, very good at tough love as well.

但你需要这样的方式。

So but you need that.

我认为在比赛后没必要粉饰太平，他会非常务实，逐条分析，说：你看，这里你做得不够好。

I think there's no point in sugarcoating things like after a race, he'll be very pragmatic, break it down and say, look, you wasn't good enough here.

我们需要改进这一点。

We need to work on this.

但这就是你需要的。

And but that is what you need.

进步就是要一点一点地积累。

It's like one percents all the time to progress.

自从我从事铁人三项运动以来，已经十年了，这期间进步的速度和我们所看到的变化简直令人难以置信。

And since I've been in the sport of triathlon, which is about ten years, the rate of progression and the things that we've seen over that time is just insane.

当我刚起步的时候，根本没人注重空气动力学。

Like, when I first started, no one was really aerodynamic.

现在，整个女子选手群体都把空气动力学优化到了极致。

Now the entire female field has, like, dialed their aerodynamics.

他们每年三次、四次进入风洞，只为寻找任何可能提升的功率。

They're in the wind tunnel three times a year, four times a year, just trying to find those watts wherever you can.

今年年初，我们在风洞中取得了重大突破，这要归功于里斯。

So we've made some big gains in the wind tunnel at the start of this year, which was thanks to Reese.

他研究了各种不同的方案，然后说：我觉得我们应该试试这个。

He'd kind of looked at all these different things and was like, I think we should try this.

就连风洞实验室的人也都说：这肯定行不通。

And even the people in the wind tunnel were like, this is not gonna work.

但结果真的成功了，我认为这是因为我的体型在铁人三项选手中比较独特，得益于我的游泳背景。

And it did work, but I think it's because I'm quite a unique shape for a triathlete with my swim background.

我的肩膀比大多数其他铁人三项运动员宽得多。

I'm much broader in the shoulders than most other triathletes.

所以适合我的方法不一定适用于其他运动员，尤其是那些肩部非常纤细的普通自行车手。

So things that work for me might not necessarily work for other athletes, particularly maybe not the general cyclist who's a very slim shoulder build.

所以他一直在探索各种不同的方法，总是能跳出常规思维，真的非常了不起。

So, yeah, he's just been incredible in looking at different things and always thinking outside the box.

所以，他发挥了巨大的作用。

So, yeah, he plays a huge part.

当我赢的时候，他也等于赢了。

And it's like when I win, he wins as well.

嗯，整个团队都会赢，但确实是一次巨大的团队合作。

Well, the whole team wins, but it's yeah, a huge team effort.

是的。

Yeah.

是的，有一支优秀的团队总是好事。

Yeah, it's always good to have a good crew.

所以很明显，那些空气动力学方面的改进都是实实在在的。

So obviously like those aerodynamic games, those are real.

你一看就知道，嘿，我们就能变得更快。

Like you look at that and you know like, Hey, we're just gonna go faster.

所以这简直就是免费的速度提升。

So that's like free speed.

完全正确。

Absolutely.

但你觉得，关于WHOOP或者你所获取的数据，这些数据和指标在多大程度上改变了你的训练方式？

But how much of it do you think, I guess, with regards to like WHOOP or the data that you get, like the data and the metrics that you're bringing in are changing the way that you're training?

又有多少还是依赖于感觉呢？

And how much of it's also just still based on feel?

是的，我喜欢WHOOP的一点是，它通常完全符合我的实际感受。

Yeah, I think what I love about WHOOP is that it usually is, like, completely in line with how I feel.

所以我早上醒来时，心想‘今天可能要处于黄色状态’，结果果然如此。

So I wake up and you're like, oh, I think I'm gonna be, like, in the yellow today, and then I am.

所以这就像是和我的感觉保持一致。

So it's like just matching up with how I feel.

而游泳是一项非常依赖感觉的运动。

And swimming was a very field based sport.

比如，我以前是长距离游泳运动员，我的配速可以非常稳定。

Like, obviously, I used to be a distance swimmer, I could be quite metronomic in my split.

所以在1500米中，每100米的配速都基本一致，完全凭感觉来完成。

So, like, for every 100 meters, it will be the same for a 1,500, and you're just doing that purely based on feel.

我觉得我非常擅长倾听身体的信号并了解自己的状态，但有数据作为支撑真是太好了，而且还能查看这么多不同的指标，确实让我觉得非常有趣。

So I feel like I'm very good at listening to my body and knowing, but just to have that data there to back it up and then so many different things that you can look at and Yeah, I find it fascinating.

我觉得，从一个几乎没有数据的运动项目，转到像铁人三项这种数据狂热者天堂的运动，我正好处在两者之间。

I think coming from a sport where there wasn't much data and then going into triathlon, which is like data geeks heaven, I feel like I sit somewhere in the middle.

所以我既享受数据带来的帮助，也喜欢倾听自己的身体。

So I enjoy having the data, but I also enjoy listening to my body.

是的。

Yeah.

我经常把Whoop看作是房间里的第三个人。

I often think of Whoop as like the third person in the room.

所以你看着某个数据，跟Reese交流，跟教练沟通，然后把这些作为佐证，确认：这又叠加在那之上。

So you're like, you're looking at something, you're talking to Reese, you're talking to your coaches, and then you're like making that corroborating evidence, Okay, this is on top of this.

我们还有这种异常数据，它也在告诉你，描绘出你自以为的感觉究竟是怎样的。

We also have this thing that's like outlier here, and that's also saying and painting a picture for where you think you feel.

它可能是在确认，或者提醒你：嘿，实际上可能并不是这样。

And it's maybe, yeah, confirming or saying like, Hey, actually, maybe it isn't this.

是的，完全正确。

Yeah, absolutely.

我认为运动员往往不擅长休息日。

And I think as athletes, we can be quite bad at like taking the rest day.

我认为铁人三项运动员尤其不擅长。

I think triathletes are particularly bad.

所以当你感觉特别疲惫、本该休息一天时，我们却会因为内疚而强迫自己去训练。

So if you're feeling like you're super tired and maybe you should have the day off, but then we, like, guilt trip ourself into training.

但当我看到WHOOP数据显示我处于红色区域，我的呼吸频率升高、心率变异性下降时，我就觉得我确实应该听从这些建议。

But then if I have the WHOOP data there that's, like, saying I'm in the red, it's saying my respiratory rate is up, my HRV is down, I'm like, oh, I probably should listen to this.

这样一来，那种内疚感就消失了。

And then it kinda just takes that guilt away.

你会意识到，其实我现在选择彻底休息、好好恢复，才是正确的决定，明天我反而能练得更好。

You're like, you know, actually, I'm making the right decision here to just have a complete day off, take the rest, and then tomorrow I'm gonna train better again.

所以，是的，它就像第三个人在默默支持你的决定，这一点我非常喜欢。

So, yeah, it is like that third person kinda just validating your decisions, which I really like.

你认为在使用WHOOP时，最关注的是哪一项数据？

What do you think is the number one thing that you look at with WHOOP?

我们在这里与大量运动员合作，非常幸运。

We work with a ton of athletes here, very luckily.

能与这么多优秀的人和不同项目的运动员合作，我感到无比荣幸。

Feel super privileged to be able to work with so many cool people and different athletes.

但有些人特别关注起床和入睡的时间。

But some of them are really focused on like, Hey, time in, time out of bed.

这对我来说最重要。

That's most important to me.

还有一些人关注HRV趋势，比如在我休赛期时，我想看到这样的数据。

And some are focused on HRV trends, like, when I'm in my off season, I wanna see this.

或者在我进行大强度训练后，我想看到它在一段时间后恢复。

Or when I do a big block, wanna see it bounce back after a certain period.

我其实非常关注我的静息心率，因为我觉得这非常重要。

I'm actually really focused on my resting heart rate because I think that's super important.

甚至用它来监测海拔高度之类的情况。

Or even using it for altitude and things like this.

我们看到很多人希望在海拔训练前等待特定时间，基于WHOOP的数据，比如：‘我们要上去了。’

We see a lot of people that wanna see a certain amount of time pass before they start to do any exercise at altitude based off WHOOP data like, Hey, we're gonna go up there.

我们知道上去后会进入红色区域，但当我们回来后，要等到某些指标恢复到基线水平，才愿意进行任何强度训练，我们希望看到数据回归基线。

We know we're gonna be in the red, but then when we come back and get to some baseline, we wanna see before we even do even a lick of intensity, like we wanna see some metrics come back to baselines.

你觉得你最看重、最喜欢用它来做什么？

What do you think is the number one thing that you use it for, you love about it?

因为我这里有大量来自日记和其他方面的WHOOP数据，但我很好奇，从你的角度看，你最关注什么？

Because I've got a lot of whoop data here from journaling and other things, but I'm curious from your standpoint, like what do you look at most?

是的。

Yeah.

我认为睡眠可能是我最关注的，关键是保持规律。

I think sleep is probably the biggest thing that I track, and it's trying to be in routine.

比如固定时间睡觉、固定时间起床，这样做你确实会感觉更好。

So going to bed at the same time, waking up at the same time, and you definitely feel better for doing that.

当我能保持固定作息时，大多数情况下我的恢复分都会在绿色区间。

And then when I can track that, most times when I'm in bed at the same time and getting up the same time, then my recovery score is in the green.

所以这绝对是我在意的一个指标。

So that's definitely something I track.

我也非常喜欢查看HRV数据。

I also really enjoy looking at HRV.

我觉得它非常有趣。

I find it so interesting.

而且它还非常个性化。

And also how personal it is.

所以有些运动员的HRV非常高。

So how some athletes have this super high HIV.

而我觉得我的HRV可能处于中等水平。

And I would say that mine maybe sits somewhere more in the middle.

但对我来说，如果感觉特别好，大概是在七十左右，那时我会感觉很棒。

But for me to be feeling really good, yeah, it's probably around like the seventies, then I'm feeling great.

我感觉状态很好，可以开始行动了。

I'm feeling good to go.

所以，这确实是我很喜欢追踪的一个指标。

So, yeah, it's something I really enjoy tracking.

显然，心率也是一个重要的指标。

Obviously, heart rate is a big one.

比如，我知道如果心率升高，就可能有生病的风险。

Like, I know if it's elevated, then I could be at risk of getting sick.

所以这只是稍微管理一下，告诉自己：好吧，也许今天我应该降低一点训练强度，或者更仔细地倾听身体的声音，又或者补充一些维生素C，诸如此类的事情。

So it's just managing that a little bit and saying, okay, maybe I should be reducing that intensity a little bit in my training today or just listening to my body a little bit more or topping up on the vitamin C, things like that.

所以，能有这样一个小小的辅助指南真是太棒了，我知道自己正在为身体做正确的事。

So, yeah, it's amazing to just have that little secondary guide and yeah, know I'm doing the right thing for my body.

你说过，你特别喜欢它和你的感受相吻合。

You said that it also, you really loved that it matches up with how you feel.

我个人会和自己玩一个游戏：早上醒来时，我会想，哇，今天感觉真棒，然后去看我的Whoop分数。

I personally would play this game with myself where I'd like wake up and be man, feel I feel great today, and then look at my whoop score.

我想知道你是否也会玩这个游戏。

I'm curious if you also play this game.

是的。

Yeah.

当然。

For sure.

而且最近我经常参加比赛，有那么一天，我想：我暂时不看我的分数了，免得成绩不好影响心态。

And I also like recently I I was racing obviously quite a lot recently, and there was one day where I was like, I'm not actually gonna look at what my score is until after this race in case it's bad.

我当时想，我不希望它影响我的心理状态。

I was like, I don't want it to like throw off my mental state.

我觉得我醒来了。

I'm like, I've woken up.

我感觉不错。

I feel good.

那我们就按这个状态来吧。

So we're just gonna go with that.

然后挺有意思的是，比赛结束后我看了下数据，发现我的恢复率是96%。

And then it was quite interesting because then after the race, I looked at it and I was like, I think it was like 96% recovered.

我当时想，哦，我早该看看的，因为这会给我带来信心提升。

I was like, oh, I should have looked at it because it would have given me a confidence boost.

但没错，我确实有那种感觉，而且我猜对了。

But, yeah, I obviously had the feeling and I was right.

所以，这感觉很好。

So yeah, it was good.

如果有人不知道的话，有一个无痕模式。

There is an incognito mode for anyone that doesn't know.

你可以在比赛日隐藏你的指标。

You can hide your metrics on race day.

就是这样。

There we go.

这还挺酷的。

Which is kinda cool.

这样你就能获取所有的压力数据，但不会影响你的心理状态。

Then you can get like all your strain data, but you don't get in your head.

因为对于任何人来说，比如：嘿，今天我不想了解这些数据。

Because even for anybody, like, Hey, I don't wanna know today.

你可以记录下你做的任何事情，但我会之后再看。

You can record whatever you wanna do, but I'll look at it afterwards.

所以这真是一个不错的小小

So it is like a good little

知道了，不错。

Good to know.

它在汉堡里。

It's in the hamburger.

如果你只完成了一半，可以去右下角查看。

You can go down to the bottom right if you're half in and check it.

考虑到你经常旅行，而且经常一天训练两次，你觉得在睡眠习惯上，有哪些最重要、你一直坚持或建立起来的做法？就像你提到的起床和睡觉，但当你在旅途中时，比如你从不离家不带的东西，或者你总是会做的某件事，又或者你住的房间必须保持某个温度。

I guess with that, with so much traveling and double days of training, what do you think is the most important thing for your sleep routine that you've done or that you've put in place, you know, in daily life, like you were saying getting out of bed and sleep, but like also when you're on the road, like what are some things that you, you know, like I don't go on the road without this or I always do this or, you know, the the room that I stay in wants to be this temperature.

你有没有类似这样的坚持？

Anything like that that you really subscribe to.

是的。

Yeah.

关于睡眠，确实有几件事很重要。

There's definitely a few things with sleep.

我旅行时总是自带枕头。

Like, I always travel with my own pillow.

所以它占了我半个行李箱，但只要带上我的枕头，我就能保证睡个好觉。

So it takes up half my suitcase, but I, like, I'm guaranteed a good night's sleep if I have my own pillow.

听起来有点深奥，但确实有效。

It kinda sounds a bit deeper ish, but it works.

无论我去哪里，我都会随身带着它。

I bring it everywhere with me no matter where I go.

去年年底，我开始在睡前戴上防蓝光眼镜，因为我很喜欢玩手机、打游戏或者只是放松一下。

Towards the end of last year, I started wearing, like, the blue light blocking glasses before bed so that I I love being on my phone and playing games or just switching off, like, that kind of thing.

所以，我会在睡前戴上防蓝光眼镜来帮助入睡。

So, yeah, I wear the blue light blocking glasses before bed just to help.

我发现这带来了明显的改善。

Found it has made quite a difference.

我总是待在尽可能黑暗的房间里，而且还会把房间调得很冷。

Always being in, like, the darkest room possible, making it quite cold in there as well.

所以，我这个人出门旅行时从不关空调，不过我在家本来就会一直开着空调。

So, yeah, I'm not someone who travels and doesn't have the air con on, but I have air con on at home all the time anyway.

所以我觉得我已经很习惯了。

So I think I'm pretty used to it.

所以这些基本上是我的首选。

So yeah, they're kind of my go tos.

我还在努力避免吃得太晚。

Trying to not eat too late as well.

我会在睡觉前好几个小时吃完最后一餐，以便食物能消化掉。

So having that last meal a good few hours before I go to sleep so that it's digested.

是的，我想就是把我在家的做法应用到旅行中去。

Yeah, guess just implementing the same things I do at home and then trying to apply that when I travel.

这并不总是容易，但我会尽量在家时那样做。

It's not always easy, but yeah, trying to replicate home as much as possible.

太棒了。

Love that.

你喜欢硬一点的枕头，还是软一点的？比如那种羽绒枕之类的？

Do you like a firm pillow or is it like a soft, are you like a kind of like a feather, like down pillow, per se?

实际上还挺硬的。

It's pretty firm actually.

是的，对。

Yeah, yeah.

它处于中间偏硬的位置。

It's somewhere quite in the middle.

我真的很讨厌特别软的枕头。

So I really hate a really soft pillow.

是的，那样我的脖子就会扭到，对游泳来说可不好。

Yeah, then my neck is just thrown out and then for swimming, that's not good.

对骑公路车的气动姿势来说，也不好。

And for riding the TT position, it's not good.

是的，确实，那就像一个卷腹动作。

Yeah, seriously, that is like a crunch position.

说到在床上看屏幕，我们注意到你的WHOOP日志中有时会记录你在床上使用屏幕，我们发现这会使你的恢复指数下降7%。

Speaking of screen time in bed, one of the things that we noticed in your WHOOP journal is that you sometimes track that you use a screen in bed and we noticed that it increases your recovery by 7%.

所以我们可能通过防蓝光眼镜抵消了一些影响，但谁不喜欢刷一刷呢？

So we might be offsetting things with the blue light blocking glasses, but who doesn't love a good scroll?

比如我个人就喜欢逛Zillow，看那些房子，也不知道为什么。

Like, I'm I'm personally like to hang out on Zillow and like look at the I don't know why.

我只是喜欢看房屋信息，想知道你最喜欢的是什么，是在追剧吗？

I just love looking at the house listings, love to know what you love about is it catching up?

你睡前在手机上都做些什么？

What are you what are you doing on your phone before you go to bed?

因为有些人会说这是个缺点，但我觉得适度的话，一切都还好。

Because some people would say this is a downside, but like, I think I think in moderation, everything's fine.

是的。

Yeah.

我觉得这取决于你具体在做什么。

I think it depends, yeah, what you're doing.

我的意思是，我当然不会在睡前刷那些会让我生气或愤怒的评论，但我确实喜欢浏览英国那些超大的房子。

I mean, obviously, I'm not scrolling through and, like, reading comments that are gonna get me fired up and angry before bed, but I am definitely someone again, I do like to go and browse, like, huge houses in The UK and, like, look at those.

我觉得那就对了。

And I think then it's like, right.

我会大胆想象。

I'm gonna dream big.

如果我比赛表现很好，总有一天我能买得起这栋房子。

If I race really well, then one day I might be able to afford this house.

所以，没错，跑步确实有同样的效果。

So, yeah, that's definitely something that race is the same.

我们很喜欢做这件事。

We enjoy doing that.

是的。

Yeah.

玩纸牌游戏之类的，有个游戏叫Rummer Cub。

Playing like card games or there's a game called Rummer Cub.

我不知道你有没有听说过。

I don't know if you've heard of it.

不。

No.

这有点像一个数字策略游戏，里斯一家对此很着迷。

It's kind of like a a numbers strategy game, Reese's family got quite into it.

你也可以在线玩。

And you can play them online as well.

我通常和随机玩家对战，但没错，玩这种和我的生活完全无关的游戏，真的能帮助我放松。

I normally play just random players, but, yeah, just switching off playing a game that's like completely nothing to do with my life, I find that really helps me unwind.

是的，因为需要平衡的事情很多。

Yeah, because there's a lot to balance.

这很酷。

That's cool.

您已被邀请加入WHOOP高级实验室的等待名单。

You're invited to join the waitlist for WHOOP Advanced Labs.

高级实验室将经过临床医生审核的实验室结果直接推送至您的WHOOP应用，为您提供最全面的生物标志物和生物测量数据，从而获得对健康的最深入理解。

Advanced Labs delivers clinician reviewed lab results right into your WHOOP app for the most complete view of your biomarkers and biometrics and the most comprehensive understanding of your health.

与其他检测不同，WHOOP 将您的检测结果与 WHOOP 数据整合在一起。

Unlike other tests, WHOOP integrates your lab results with your WHOOP data.

了解您的习惯和行为如何影响您的生物标志物，并获得清晰的指导，帮助您改善结果。

See how your habits and behaviors influence your biomarkers and get clear guidance on what to change to improve your results.

要加入等待名单，请访问我们的网站或 WHOOP 应用中的健康标签页。

To join the wait list, visit our website or the health tab in the WHOOP app.

您记录的另一件事是无麸质饮食。

One of the other things that you logged was a gluten free diet.

我记得昨晚和一些 WHOOP 团队成员共进晚餐时，您提到自己被诊断出患有乳糜泻，并且每天都记录这一点，但这对您来说是什么样的体验？

And I remember when we were, we had dinner last night with some of the Whoop crew and you had noted that you also had been diagnosed with celiac and you obviously logged that every day as like one of the things, but what's that been like for you?

是的，大约在四五月的时候，我发现自己患有乳糜泻。

Yeah, so it was around April, May that I found out I had celiac disease.

我一直觉得自己的健康状况有些不对劲，后来情况变得非常糟糕。

I definitely knew for a while that something wasn't quite right with my health and I kind of had got to a point where it got really bad.

我还经历了许多无法解释原因的伤病。

I'd also had so many injuries that we couldn't really explain why that happened.

我们只是把它归因于，你是个耐力运动员。

We were just putting it down to, well, you're an endurance athlete.

你的身体承受了很大的压力。

You put your body through a lot.

但我知道自己在很多方面都做得很对。

But I knew that I was doing so many things right.

我在想，为什么我是唯一一个每年因为这项运动多次受伤的运动员呢？

I was like, yeah, but I can't why am I the only athlete that gets injured, like, multiple times a year who's doing this sport?

所以大概在四月，我去了德国拜访几位赞助商，吃了大量的面筋。

So it was around, yeah, April, I'd actually gone out to Germany to visit a few of my sponsors and I'd eaten so much gluten.

我们吃了披萨、意大利面和德国啤酒。

We'd had pizza, pasta, German beers.

从那里回来后，我觉得自己状态非常差。

And I got home from there and I was like, I am really not well.

我当时就想，我要去看医生，好好检查一下。

Like I was like, I'm gonna go to the doctor and get this looked at.

所以他们做了些血液检查。

So they did run some blood tests.

我去检查时，他们说：‘你知道你患有乳糜泻吗？’

And I went in and they were like, You do know you have celiac disease?

我当时说：‘不，我不知道。’

And I was like, Nope, I didn't know that.

我都31岁了，居然不知道自己有这个病。

I've got to like 31 years old, didn't know I had this.

这确实解释了很多问题。

So it really did explain a lot.

这在一定程度上解释了为什么我会反复出现应力性骨折之类的问题。

It kind of explained why I'd be getting stress fractures things like that.

尽管我吃得非常健康、营养均衡，但由于 gluten 毒害了我，我的身体根本无法吸收这些营养。

Although I ate a really healthy balanced diet, I wasn't absorbing any of that nutrition because I was poisoning myself with gluten.

所以，从那以后，我感觉健康多了。

So yeah, since then I felt so much healthier.

我体内的炎症明显减轻了。

Inflammation is so much more down in my body.

我现在的精力更充沛，而且更稳定。

I just have so much more energy or consistent energy.

白天不再出现能量大幅下滑的情况。

I'm not having those big dips in energy throughout the day.

我的训练也更加规律了，借个好运。

And my training is far more consistent and touch wood.

今年我一直很健康。

I've been healthy this year.

没有任何问题。

I've had no issues.

这真是一个巨大的积极改变。

So it's been such a positive change.

如果有人有和我类似的症状，我确实会建议他们去检查一下，因为这对我来说简直是改变了人生。

Something that I, like, do try and promote people to if they're having similar symptoms to what I had, definitely go and get it checked out because it's been pretty life changing for me for sure.

我实际上也有过完全相同的经历。

I actually had the exact same experience.

在我三十岁出头的时候，我记得喝了一瓶啤酒，结果整整一天都瘫在沙发上起不来。

Like, in my early thirties, like went in and was like, man, I remember drinking a beer and I literally couldn't get off the couch for a day.

我二十多岁的时候也喝啤酒，但到了三十多岁，每次和朋友喝啤酒，都会彻底垮掉。

Like, don't know, I drank beer in my twenties, but then like in my 30s, every time I'd have a beer with friends, I'd be completely knocked out.

我记得有一次我们出去，喝了几杯，和你一样，还吃了披萨和其他很多东西。

And I remember when we went out, we had a couple, and like you, we had had some other things, pizza and a lot of it.

我记得当时心想：天啊，我状态太差了。

And I remember being like, Man, I'm just right.

医生说：你先回来，在来之前至少一天不要吃麸质之类的东西。

And the doctor said, Come back, you have to not have gluten for a day or something like this before you come in.

我觉得我得测试一下。

It's like, I gotta test it.

他跟我说：哥们，我有个坏消息。

He was like, Hey, man, I got bad news.

你人生的这一部分，这一章已经结束了。

This part of your life, this chapter's over.

是的。

Yeah.

不。

No.

刚开始的时候真的很令人沮丧。

It's quite devastating in the beginning.

比如，作为骑行爱好者，我们喜欢在骑行途中停下来喝杯咖啡，吃点蛋糕、糕点或牛角包，但当这些食物都从菜单上消失时。

Like, when, obviously, like cyclists, we love having, a coffee stop ride and there's cakes and things or pastries and croissants and it's like, oh, when they're off the menu.

但当你感受到因此带来的好转时，你就会觉得，好吧。

But then the amount you feel better for it, you're kinda like, okay.

这是值得的。

It is worth it.

是的。

Yeah.

当然。

For sure.

好的。

Okay.

所以，我想接下来要聊的是你的YouTube频道，因为我确实在上面看到一些HIROCs的内容。

So I guess then the other thing that I wanted to talk about is your YouTube channel, because I did see some HIROCs on there.

跟我们说说这些HIROCs吧。

Just give it to us with the HIROCs.

怎么回事？

What's going on?

因为我们也有一些HIROCs运动员加入了我们在波士顿总部的活动，Hyrox已经火起来了，但我很好奇，因为你已经参与了这么多运动。

Because we've had some HIROCs athletes in that were also joining us here at HQ here in Boston, And Hyrox has taken off, but I'm curious to know because you already are doing so many sports.

我真的很想知道，你为什么还想挑战更多运动，尝试不同的东西。

I'm really I'm really curious that you are looking to take on more sports and try different things.

是的。

Yeah.

最近确实出现了一种趋势，一些铁人三项运动员退役后开始尝试HIROCs。

There's been a few oh, there's been a bit of a trend actually with, like, triathletes retiring and then dipping their toe in high rock.

我看到过几位职业铁人三项运动员尝试过这项运动。

So I've seen a few professional triathletes that have had a go.

我本人非常喜欢健身房和类似这样的锻炼，所以觉得这看起来挺有趣的。

And it looked kind of fun, and I'm someone who does really love the gym and that kind of thing.

当时我正好在兰萨罗特岛的Club La Santa训练，那里有一个相当不错的HIROCs训练设施。

So I happened to be out in Lanzarote at Club La Santa where I train where they they actually have a pretty good high rock setup there.

那里恰好有一位名叫露西·普罗克特的女士，她是顶尖的HIROCs运动员之一。

There happened to be a lady called Lucy Proctor, who is one of the best high rocks athletes.

她当时也在那里，而我刚完成铁人三项，心想：‘我们可以一起做个HIROCs训练。’我当时觉得这可能有点傻，因为我刚比完铁三，肯定很累。

And she was there and I had just done the Ironman and I was like, oh, we could do a high rocks workout together, which I was like, maybe this is really stupid because I've literally just done an Ironman and I'm gonna be tired.

但我还是想，我知道这会很难，但我觉得应该也会很有趣。

But I was like, oh, I knew it would be hard, but I was like, I think it'll also be fun as well.

所以我决定和她一起进行一次训练。

So I decided to do a training session with her.

我妹妹霍莉也在那里拍摄，这有好有坏，因为我做了很多错误的动作，引起了攀岩社区的热议。

My sister Holly was there filming it as well, which was good and bad because I did a lot of things very wrong and the High Rocks community hounded me for it.

被盯上了。

Scouted.

是的。

Yeah.

对。

Yeah.

俯卧挺身跳跃不算有效次数。

The burpee broad jumps were not a rep.

所以我经常被指出这一点。

So I got that a lot of times.

这不算有效次数。

They're not a rep.

这不算有效次数。

They're not a rep.

我当时想，好吧，伙计们，我不是认真的在做这个。

I was like, okay, I'm not doing this seriously, guys.

没关系。

It's fine.

我只是在锻炼一下。

I'm just doing a workout.

但我真的非常喜欢它。

But I honestly loved it.

太有趣了。

It was so much fun.

我当时想，也许我根本不该尝试这个，因为它比我平时的训练有趣太多了，我完全可以接受它。

I was like, probably actually shouldn't have tried this because it's so much more fun than my training that I could definitely get on board with it.

我觉得在细节上还需要做不少调整。

I felt like it would need quite a lot of work in, like, dialing in the specifics.

我知道关于哪些不算有效次数之类的规则还挺多的。

I know there's quite a lot of rules around no reps and things like that.

但总有一天我一定会试一次。

But at some point I will definitely do one.

也许我会先从双人项目开始，因为我们之前做过一次双人训练，特别有趣。

Maybe I'll start with the doubles because we kind of did a doubles workout and it was so much fun.

我知道露西·戴维斯在这里，她早年也是一名游泳运动员。

I know Lucy Davis is here who also was a swimmer in her earlier life.

所以我也很希望有一天能和她一起做双人项目。

So I wouldn't mind doing the doubles with her one day as well.

我觉得有不少人会找我一起做这个。

I think there's quite a few people that would hit me up to do it.

但也许几年后，我们会试着试试看。

But, yeah, maybe a few years down the line, we'll give it a try.

我现在还是打算继续练铁人三项。

I think I'll with triathlon for now.

露西三号。

Lucy number three.

我们之前有露西一号，然后是露西·戴维斯，现在又有了露西·普罗克特。

We had Lucy number one, then we had Lucy Davis, and now we've got Lucy Proctor.

所以我觉得，如果你们真的投入某件事，那肯定会有一些……

So this is, I feel like if you guys go into something, there's gonna be some

想象一下这场盛大的接力赛。

Imagine huge the relay.

不，说真的，是的。

No, seriously, yeah.

我觉得解说员看到这个都会乐疯了。

I feel like the announcer's gonna have a trip with that.

但你确实拥有非常棒的社交媒体粉丝群。

But yeah, you've got a really cool social media following.

你制作了大量内容，还打造了一个非常出色的YouTube频道。

You do a lot of content and you've built like a really great YouTube channel.

对于还没看过的人，我建议你们去看看，上面有各种内容，比如你的饮食方式、训练的日常生活等等。

For anyone that hasn't checked it out, I think they should go check it out because there's all kinds of stuff on there about like how you eat and how you, you know, a day in your life of training.

是的，你显然已经建立了作为职业运动员的品牌，也打造了这个平台，但这种记录这类内容的热情是从哪里来的？你为什么开始做YouTube频道呢？

Yeah, you've built obviously your brand as a professional athlete, you've built this, but where did that passion for documenting stuff like this come from and why did you start a YouTube channel?

每个人都有社交媒体，但YouTube的氛围完全不同。

And everyone has a social media, but YouTube's a different vibe altogether.

是的，我一直是个很有创意的人。

Yeah, I think I've always been someone that's quite creative.

上学时，我当然学习了所有与体育相关的课程，但也学习了摄影，而且非常喜欢艺术和设计这类东西。

So at school, I studied obviously all the sports, but I also studied photography and I really liked art and design and that kind of thing.

所以我很有创意。

So I was quite creative.

但我的姐姐霍莉也非常热爱运动，而她的创意一面则更为突出。

But then my sister, Holly, was also seriously sporty, but then her creative side was like, I'd say the bigger side.

她应该不会介意我这么说。

She probably won't mind me saying.

所以霍莉大学毕业时，她学的是摄影。

So when Holly graduated from uni, she'd studied photography.

我问她，是否愿意加入进来，帮忙打理社交媒体？

And I asked, did she wanna come on board as, like, helping with social media?

也许我们可以做一个YouTube频道。

Maybe we could do a YouTube channel.

我们可以一起探索一下，真实地分享我的旅程。

We could kinda just explore that and really share my journey.

我觉得它真的迅速发展起来了。

And I feel like it just it really did take off.

我的确很幸运，Holly在她的领域非常出色，但我也真的很享受分享我的故事，试图通过激励他人，或者分享我受伤时的艰难时刻、我是如何克服的、我做了什么，来帮助别人。

I mean, it obviously helps that Holly is incredible at what she does, but then I do really enjoy sharing my story and trying to help other people by either inspiring them or also sharing, like, the tough times when I've had an injury, how I've overcome it, what I've done.

我收到的很多留言都说：‘我也有应力性骨折，我跟着你的经历走，这激励了我，让我没那么难受了。’

And a lot of the messages I get from people are like, oh, I've I've had this stress fracture, I followed your journey, and it's inspired me and made me not feel so bad.

我觉得我能重新站起来，甚至比以前更好。

Like, I feel like I can come back from this and will be as good as I was before, if not better.

所以，如果我能通过分享我的内容，对别人的生活产生任何积极的影响，那对我来说就是非常重要的意义。

So, yeah, if I can be giving any positive influence on someone else's life from what I'm sharing, then that's a really important message for me.

嗯嗯。

Mhmm.

是的。

Yeah.

太棒了。

Love that.

我也觉得太棒了。

I love that.

你觉得你做过的最喜欢的视频是哪一个？

What do you think your favorite video that you ever did was?

哦，我们做了很多很棒的视频。

Oh, we've done so many good ones.

我的确特别喜欢比赛的视频，尤其是当比赛表现很好的时候，因为那就像重新体验那一刻。

I I mean, I always love the race videos, especially when the race has gone well because it's like reliving that moment.

最近，我参加了铁人三项安萨罗特赛，很幸运有霍莉开着媒体摩托，为那天拍下了大部分画面。

So recently, I raced Ironman Anzarote and was lucky enough to have Holly, like, on a media moto getting most of the footage for the day.

所以我几乎重新体验了整个一天，那真是非常非常愉快的一天。

So I almost just relived the whole day, and it was a really, really fun day.

像兰萨罗特对我来说就像第二个家。

Like, Lanzarote is like a second home for me.

所以这就像是在家门口比赛一样。

So it was like doing a home race.

那里的观众太棒了，而且，是的，再回看一遍。

The crowds there were amazing and just, yeah, rewatching it back.

比如，这是我可以在室内骑行器上反复观看的视频之一，然后告诉自己：好吧，再给我一点动力。

Like, it's one of them I can just rewatch it back on the trainer and be like, alright, let's give me a bit more motivation.

但当然，我们一路上做了很多有趣的事情，我也喜欢回头去看那些旧视频。

But, yeah, we've done so many fun things along the way and yeah, I enjoy going back and watching the old ones as well.

这是一场家庭聚会。

It's a family affair.

确实如此。

Is for sure.

确实是。

Is.

我们还要让父母和我们一起去高海拔地区训练，这样他们可以在我们训练时帮忙照看狗。

We're also roping my parents into come to altitude with us on our So next training they can look after the dogs a bit while we train.

我们会把这称作他们的假期，但他们将会

And, yeah, we'll call it a holiday for them, but they'll be

帮忙。

helping.

你的父母从伦敦回来时会飞回来。

Your parents will be flying when they come back down to London Life.

就是这样。

That's it.

他们俩身体都很好。

Well, they're both quite well.

我妈妈特别喜欢跑步，我爸爸则努力跟上她，我敢肯定他们回家后会尝试在公园跑中打破个人最好成绩。

My mom particularly loves running, and my dad tries to keep up with her, but I'm sure they'll be trying to do like a park run PB when they get home.

如果你在伦敦本地的五公里赛跑参赛名单上看到最后一个名字，尤其是训练营之后，可要当心了。

If you see the last name on the start list of your local, whatever, five k in London, watch out, especially if it's after the training camp.

还有几个最后的小问题。

A couple last quick questions.

你接下来有什么目标呢？无论是短期还是长期的，包括赛场内外的？

What do you have for upcoming goals, like near and long term, I guess like on and off of the race cars?

你有什么计划？

What do got?

我回家这个周末会参加一场游泳比赛，纯粹是玩玩。

I'm actually doing a swim competition this weekend when I get home just for fun.

我想看看自己能多接近以前的游泳成绩。

It's kind of like seeing how close I can get to the old swimming times that I used to do.

我总觉得这特别有激励作用。

I always find that quite motivating.

而且

And

我觉得，游泳可能是最难激励自己训练的，因为我的水平一直不错，但要重新达到以前的游泳水平，需要付出大量努力。

I would say, like, with swimming, it can be the hardest one to motivate myself to train for because I'm always at a good level, but it requires so much work to get back to the level I used to swim at.

所以当我能设定一些小的、专注于游泳的目标时，真的会很有帮助。

So when I can implement, like, small swim focused goals, it really does help.

所以，是的，这个周末我将参加800米和1500米的比赛，这算是一个小的额外目标。

So, yeah, I should be racing an 800 and a 1,500 this weekend, which is like a small side goal.

接下来对我来说最重要的赛事是伦敦100公里赛，这显然是我的主场赛事。

And then the next big event for me will be the London t one hundred race, which obviously is a home race for me.

因此它具有重要的意义。

So it has that significant importance.

我大部分朋友和家人都会来看比赛。

Most of my friends and family will come down and watch.

去年我其实没能完成比赛，这让我非常伤心。

I actually didn't finish the race last year, which was heartbreaking.

所以如果今年我能顺利完成，那就太棒了。

So if I can just finish this year, that would be incredible.

但我真希望能在那场比赛中登上领奖台。

But I'd love to get on the podium in that race.

那会很棒。

That would be great.

之后，我的大目标是重返科纳的铁人三项世界锦标赛，争取再次夺冠或比上次跑得更快。

And then after that, the big goal will be going back to the Ironman World Championships in Kona and trying to win again or trying to go faster than last time.

我可能会设定一些更个人化的目标，这样即使没赢，也不算彻底失败。

I'll probably set some kind of more, I guess, like personal targets within the race as well, just so that it's like, if you don't win, it's not a complete failure.

我认为在比赛中设定这些次要目标真的很重要，这样即使最终没能达成主要目标，你依然能在比赛中取得重大成就。

I think it's really important to like have those side goals within a race as well to know that even if you didn't get that kind of outcome goal at the end, you still achieve big things within the race.

所以，我肯定会进一步细化那天我希望达成的具体目标。

So yeah, I'm sure I'll break it down a little bit more into what I want to achieve on that day.

但科纳对我来说总是特别特别重要。

But Kona is always so, so special to me.

所以这绝对是今年最重要的目标。

So that's pretty much the biggest goal of the year for sure.

是的。

Yeah.

你去科纳会是什么样子？

What will going into Kona look like for you?

比如，你会提前一周还是两周去？

Like, will you go early, like a week early, two weeks early?

我从来没去过，但听说那是个盛大的活动。

I've never been, but I've heard it's quite the event.

而且我知道他们把男子和女子比赛分开了，不过我也听说它们又要合并了。

And also, I know that they split the men's and the women's events up, although I've also heard that it's coming back together.

每个人都会再次齐聚科纳，共同庆祝这场盛事。

Everybody's gonna get to hang on Kona again for the big party.

是的。

Yeah.

2026年，我们都会一起回去，我觉得这太棒了。

2026, we will all go back together, which I think is amazing.

当我们都聚在一起时，那种氛围简直太棒了。

Like, the atmosphere when we're all there is so incredible.

当我第一次去那里参赛时，我感受到的就是这种氛围。

And when I first went and raced there, that's what I experienced.

我和里斯当时都是以业余运动员的身份参赛的。

Rhys and I was both racing as amateur athletes.

而且，那种所有运动员之间的团结精神真的太棒了。

And, yeah, just that camaraderie between all the athletes is so amazing.

所以我觉得，2026年一定会非常精彩。

So I think, yeah, 2026 will be incredible.

今年，我当然也期待着它。

This year, obviously, I look forward to it as well.

当女性拥有自己专属的一天，所有人都关注我们时，这依然非常特别。

It's still really special when women do have their own day and, like, all eyes are on us.

我觉得这真的很重要。

I think that is really important.

但与男子职业选手在同一时间踏上赛道，仍然有一种神奇的感觉。

But there's still something magical about being out on the race course the same times as the pro men.

比如，当我们骑到半程时，看到男子选手们骑回来，你总会好奇：谁在领先男子组的比赛？

Like, I when we're riding out to, like, the halfway point and the bike and the men are coming back, you're always like, oh, who's who's leaning the men's race?

男子组的比赛进行得怎么样？

Like, how's that going?

所以，这就像在你奋力拼搏时，顺便增添的一点娱乐乐趣。

So, yeah, it's like a a side bit of entertainment that's going on whilst you're pushing yourself.

因此，我确实很期待2026年能再次经历这一切。

So, yeah, I definitely look forward to that in 2026.

但首先，我们得先度过今年。

But, yeah, we've gotta get through this year first.

而且，我希望自己能再次前往那里，跑出一场精彩的比赛。

And, yeah, hopefully, I can go there and have a really great race again.

非常感谢你成为WHOOP的运动员。

Well, thanks a lot for being a WHOOP athlete.

感谢你来到总部，也感谢你今天抽出时间与我们聊天。

Thanks for coming through HQ, and thanks for taking some time to chat with us today.

哦，非常感谢你。

Oh, thank you so much.

这很有趣。

Been fun.

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If you enjoyed this episode of the WHOOP podcast, please leave a rating or review.

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Check us out on social at Whoop at Will Ahmed.

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If have a question with us answered on the podcast, email us podcast to whoop dot com.

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New members use the code WILL, w I l l, to get a $60 credit on WHOOP accessories when you enter the code at checkout.

好了，各位，今天就到这里。

That's a wrap, folks.

感谢大家的收听。

Thank you all for listening.

我们下周再见，继续收听 WHOOP 播客。

We'll catch you next week on the WHOOP podcast.

一如既往，保持健康，保持在绿色区间。

As always, stay healthy and stay in the green.