人工智能如何改变美国的回收方式

欢迎收听科技新闻简报。

Welcome to Tech News Briefing.

今天是1月13日，星期二。

It's Tuesday, January 13.

我是《华尔街日报》的伊莎贝尔·布斯凯。

I'm Isabelle Bousquette for The Wall Street Journal.

特朗普政府大幅削减了对太阳能和可再生能源的补贴。

The Trump administration has slashed subsidies for solar and renewable energy.

但在市场的许多领域，太阳能项目仍在继续。

But in many segments of the market, solar deals are persisting.

我们来揭示其中的原因。

We're shedding light on why.

如今，人工智能无处不在，甚至在回收厂也随处可见。

Then AI is everywhere these days, including recycling plants.

事实证明，一些新技术在分拣垃圾流方面非常出色。

It turns out some new tech is pretty good at sorting through streams of garbage.

我们将深入探讨它是如何运作的，以及它从垃圾中淘出的宝贵资源。

We'll dive into how it works and the valuable treasures it's plucking out of the trash.

但首先，太阳能项目最近受到了抨击。

But first, solar projects have been under fire recently.

特朗普政府大幅削减了对可再生能源的激励措施，并称太阳能和风能是世纪骗局。

The Trump administration has slashed incentives for renewable power and called the sun and wind powered energy the scam of the century.

但尽管如此，一些太阳能项目依然前景光明。

But despite that, the sun is still shining on some solar deals.

一些公司仍在押注太阳能，因为与天然气发电站相比，太阳能有时能更快、更便宜地投入运行。

Some companies are still betting on solar energy, which can sometimes be faster and cheaper to get up and running than natural gas sites.

这对可再生能源行业的发展方向意味着什么？

What does it mean for where the renewables industry is headed?

《华尔街日报》可持续发展记者克拉拉·哈德森现在加入我们，为我们详细分析。

WSJ sustainability reporter Clara Hudson joins us now to break it down.

那么，有哪些公司和行业正在投资可再生能源并达成这些交易呢？

So what kinds of companies and industries are investing in renewable energy and making these deals?

这非常有趣，因为太阳能行业的前景可能比你想象的要复杂得多。

It's really interesting because the outlook for the solar industry is maybe a lot more complex than you might think.

特朗普政府曾批评并削减了补贴，但大型企业似乎仍认为这是一种必须投资的能源。

So the Trump administration has criticized it and cut subsidies, but then it seems like big business still thinks this is an energy source that they need to be investing in.

这在一定程度上是因为太阳能相对便宜，而且建设周期短。

And that is in part because it's relatively inexpensive and quick to get up and running.

那么，有哪些公司和行业正在投资可再生能源并达成这些交易呢？

So what kinds of companies and industries are investing in renewable energy and making these deals?

基本上，任何承诺使用低碳能源的公司都可能考虑太阳能。

Essentially, any company that has a pledge to use lower carbon energy sources might consider solar.

当然，环保是原因之一，但对企业来说，多元化能源来源、实现能源结构多样化也同样重要。

So there are definitely environmental reasons, but it's also important for a business to diversify where it's going to get its energy from and to have a mix of sources.

具体来说，像Meta和谷歌这样的大型科技公司去年都发布了太阳能相关公告。

In terms of which companies in particular are investing in solar, big tech companies like Meta and Google made some solar announcements last year.

但就连时尚行业也不例外，拥有Coach和Kate Spade的Tapestry公司也刚刚宣布了太阳能项目的新进展。

But even in the fashion industry, Tapestry, which owns Coach and Kate Spade, just made an announcement about some solar project developments too.

你提到科技行业，我想知道人工智能热潮以及为数据中心保障能源的需求，在推动这些企业转向太阳能公司中扮演了多大的角色？

So you talk about the tech industry and I'm curious how big a role is the AI boom and the need to secure energy for data centers playing and driving some of these business to solar companies?

这是整个图景中非常重要的部分。

It's a really big part of the picture.

特别是科技公司需要

So tech companies in particular need to

拥有

have a

一种全面的能源战略，以应对人工智能日益增长的能源需求。

broad energy strategy for how they're going to power the growing demands of AI.

它们真的需要一切可能的能源来源，包括太阳能。

And they really need everything that they can get, including solar.

这目前是一个迅速发展的领域。

And this is a really developing area at the moment.

因此，谷歌甚至表示，计划未来利用太空卫星的太阳能来为人工智能供电。

So Google has even said that it's planning to use solar power from satellites in space to power AI in the future.

这真的很有意思。

That is that is really interesting.

所以看起来这里有很多商业机会。

So it seems like there's a lot of business that is happening here.

但特朗普政府削减激励措施的政策对这个行业有影响吗？

But have the Trump policies slashing incentives hurt the industry at all?

是的。

Yeah.

这个行业确实一直不太稳定。

The industry has definitely been rocky.

我认为关于太阳能的言论是，目前这个行业很难应对。

And I think the rhetoric around solar is that it's a tough industry to navigate right now.

一些公司真的面临困境。

And some companies have really been struggling.

有些公司已经申请破产或宣布关闭，它们将原因归咎于美国新的政策环境。

Some have filed for bankruptcy or announced that they're shutting down, and they're pointing to the new policy environment in The US as the reason for that.

那么，太阳能在美国的未来会怎样？

So what is the future of solar in The US?

今年我们应该期待看到什么？

What should we expect to see this year?

我想我们得看看它如何发展，因为太阳能面临的逆风很大程度上取决于特朗普政府。

I suppose we'll have to see how it develops because the headwinds that solar is facing really depend on the Trump administration.

所以，今年这种情况会如何演变，谁知道呢？

So who knows how that might unfold this year?

对于一个被总统批评或未得到支持的行业来说，这显然不是好事。

And it's clearly not great to be an industry that the president has criticized or isn't really backing.

但总体而言，从长远来看，太阳能仍有许多光明之处，因为国内一些最大的公司正在努力推动这一发展。

But overall, there are still lots of bright spots for solar in the long term because some of the biggest companies in the country are working to make that happen.

这是《华尔街日报》可持续发展记者克拉拉·哈德森。

That was WSJ sustainability reporter, Clara Hudson.

你对太阳能的未来有什么看法？

What do you think about the future of solar?

如果你是Spotify的听众，请给我们留言。

If you're a listener on Spotify, be sure to leave us a comment.

接下来，美国各地的设施正在使用人工智能更高效地分拣垃圾。

Coming up, facilities across The US are using AI to get more efficient at looking through trash.

这到底是如何运作的？

How exactly does it work?

广告后继续。

That's after the break.

对一个人来说是垃圾，对另一个人来说却是宝藏，而越来越多的这种判断正由人工智能做出。

One man's trash is another man's treasure, and increasingly, that decision is being made by artificial intelligence.

美国各地的回收中心正转向人工智能，以应对分拣可回收物这一繁琐而困难的工作。

Recycling centers across The US are turning to AI to fill the messy and difficult job of sorting through recyclables.

这一技术变革恰逢其时，因为对铝的关税使废金属比以往任何时候都更有价值。

The technological shift is coming at a good time since tariffs on aluminum have made scrap metal more valuable than ever.

《华尔街日报》商品记者瑞安·德泽蒙与我们的主持人帕特里克·科菲讨论了这一情况的进展。

WSJ commodities reporter Ryan Dezember spoke with our host, Patrick Coffey, to talk about how it's all going down.

那么，瑞安，人工智能是如何用于分类可回收物的？

So, Ryan, how is AI being used to sort recyclables?

由于人工智能的应用，美国的回收分拣设施正经历一场相当重大的技术变革。

America's recycling sorting facilities are undergoing a pretty significant technological revolution thanks to AI.

人工智能正在取代大量原本站在传送带旁、手动捡拾啤酒罐、纸板箱或其他待分类物品的人工。

And what is happening with AI is that it's sort of replacing a lot of the humans that would stand over these conveyor belts and have to, like, grab all the beer cans or the cardboard boxes or whatever they're trying to sort.

人工智能正接管作为大脑的角色。

The AI is taking over as sort of a brain.

它监控着一切。

It watches everything.

他们在传送带上安装了这些装置，能够观察每一件物品，并立即识别出它的类型、是否属于食品级材料，以及在商品市场上转售这些材料的可能价格。

They put these boxes over the conveyor belts that watch every item and they instantly recognize what it is, if it's food grade material, how much the market price of it might be in the commodities markets to resell this stuff.

其中一些系统甚至能计算出每件回收物的重心，以便后续的机械爪能够准确抓取。

Some of these even calculate like the center of gravity for each piece of recycling that you throw away so that a robotic claw or something could grab it down the line.

这真是非常了不起，它正在消除美国最不受欢迎的工作之一。

It's like a really remarkable thing, it's taking one of probably the least desirable jobs in the country away.

那么，我们主要讨论的是美国人放入彩色分类回收箱的物品，还是说这适用于所有垃圾？

So are we primarily talking about items that Americans have placed in our color coded recycling bins, or or is this really applied to all of our trash?

嗯，实际上这适用于所有垃圾。

Well, it's sort of being applied to all the trash.

原因是，你知道，很多这类设施只接收回收物。

And the reason you know, a lot of these facilities just take the recycling.

对吧？

Right?

单流回收是指你不需要把易拉罐、塑料瓶和纸板箱分开，而是全部放进一两个袋子里。

Single stream recycling where you don't really separate your cans from your plastic bottles, from your cardboard boxes, but all goes into like one bag or two bags.

所有这些都会被送到一种叫做材料回收设施（MRF）的地方。

That all gets taken to something called a material recovery facility or a MRF.

这种设施遍布全国，标准做法是：家庭中的人们先将他们认为可回收和不可回收的物品分开，然后集中处理。

And those are all over the country, and that's sort of the standard way to do it is sort through once humans have at home separated what they think is recyclable and what's not.

但现在，人类其实很不擅长回收，尤其是美国人，特别不擅长回收。

Now, basically humans are really bad, Americans in particular are really bad at recycling.

我们的回收习惯很差。

We have bad recycling habits.

我们通常不清楚哪些东西是可回收的，所以一团糟。

We usually don't really know what's desirable, what's recyclable, so it's a mess.

很多非常有价值的东西都被扔进了垃圾桶。

A lot of the really valuable stuff goes into the trash.

这些公司开始重新考虑一个想法：也许我们干脆把所有东西都扔进一个垃圾袋，然后让计算机来分拣。

These companies are starting to come back to the idea that maybe we just throw it all in one trash bag and then they sort it, let the computers do the work.

例如，不从垃圾中手工分拣铝罐的一个重要原因是因为这很脏、不健康，不能指望人们去做这种事。

One big reason for not sorting through trash to get aluminum cans out, for example, is it's gross and unhealthy and you shouldn't expect people to have to do that.

如果是机器人控制机器，它们根本不在乎有多恶心。

If it's robots controlling machines, they don't care how disgusting it is.

你报道中让我着迷的一个方面是，如今许多处理设施现在使用气流而不是带夹爪的机器人来分离材料。

One element of your reporting that fascinated me was about how many processing facilities now use puffs of air rather than like robots with claws to separate materials.

你能解释一下这是怎么运作的吗？

Can you explain how that works?

是的。

Yeah.

近年来，重大突破在于将能够即时识别物品并告诉机器该抓取什么的AI技术，与几乎微型的气流喷嘴结合起来。这些喷嘴位于传送带末端或大型箱体内，物料进入后，计算机就会发出指令：‘我们要这个，这是新闻纸，喷一下’，于是所有新闻纸被吹向一侧，而线路上的其他所有物料则被导向另一侧或掉落。

So the big sort of breakthrough in recent years has been combining the AI that can identify things instantly and tell machines what they should grab with basically little air jets, and they will be at the end of a conveyor belt or in a big box and the material goes in and the computer will basically tell it, we want that, that's a piece of newsprint, puff it, and it'll send all the newsprint one way and everything else that's on the line goes the other way or drops down.

当你观看时，这看起来有点像混乱，但最终，他们得到了更纯净、更干净的物料捆，这些物料的市场价格更高，也更便于人们重复利用。

It kinda looks like chaos when you watch it, but in the end, they're getting much more pure and clean bales of material, and theirs have a better market price and are more useful to people to reuse.

所以我们认为这价值很低，显然。

So we think of this very low value, obviously.

这些由AI驱动的机器人从我们的垃圾中捡出的最有价值的宝贝有哪些？

What are some of the most valuable treasures that these AI driven bots are picking out of our trash?

是的。

Yeah.

这会随着时间变化。

So that changes over time.

你知道，铝的市场需求非常高。

You know, the market for aluminum is really high.

当特朗普总统对进口铝征收50%的关税时，这使得我们国内已有的铝变得更加珍贵。

When President Trump put a 50% tariff on imported aluminum, that put a premium on the aluminum we already have in the country.

想想啤酒罐、建筑废料。

Think beer cans, construction debris.

所以，回收我们 already 拥有的这些东西，铝就是一种可以无限循环利用的材料。

So grabbing that stuff that we already have, and aluminum is one of these things that's infinitely recyclable.

一旦你生产出铝，只要不把它埋在垃圾填埋场里，它就能永远存在。

Once you make it, you have it forever as long as you don't bury it in a landfill.

因此，这是一种市场需求提升的产品。

So that's a product that's got an improved market.

你还有纸板箱。

You also have cardboard boxes.

越来越多生产纸板材料的造纸厂，尤其是那些主要使用南方松木木浆的原生纸浆厂，已经陆续关闭，这使得纸箱制造商更加依赖回收旧纸板来制造新纸箱。

More and more paper mills that produce the cardboard material, a lot of the virgin mills, which use tree pulp, pine mostly in the South, they've been shutting down, and that's put box makers more reliant on everything in getting that old cardboard back to make new boxes.

因此，这是一个相当强劲的市场。

So that's a market that's pretty robust.

关于塑料回收，我们都有很多疑问，而其回收记录一直很差。

Plastics, we all have questions about plastics recycling and the track record's pretty poor.

我们都听过这样的故事：你的垃圾其实最终还是进了垃圾填埋场，或者被运到了其他国家。

We've all heard these stories about, well, your stuff really just ends up in the landfill or we send it to some other country.

随着所谓生产者责任延伸法的出台，像饮料公司、洗发水瓶和洗涤剂瓶制造商这样的大公司，有了动力去回收自己的产品，以提前应对旨在遏制塑料污染的法律。

With the advent of what are called extended producer responsibility laws, big companies like companies that make soft drinks or like shampoo bottles and detergent bottles have incentive to get their products back, to get ahead of these laws that are meant to curb plastic pollution.

因此，人们大力推动塑料的更好分拣。

So there's a lot of push into better sorting plastics.

这项技术正被用于这一目的，以便我们能更有效地将汰渍洗涤剂瓶回收并制成新的汰渍瓶。

And this technology is being put to use to that end so that we can be better at sending the Tide detergent bottles back to become new Tide bottles.

这是《华尔街日报》商品记者瑞安·德ember和科技简报主持人帕特里克·科菲。

That was WSJ commodities reporter Ryan December and Tech News Briefing host Patrick Coffey.

以上就是科技简报的全部内容。

And that's it for Tech News Briefing.

如果你是在Spotify上收听的听众，请务必给我们留言。

If you're a listener on Spotify, be sure to leave us a comment.

本期节目由安东尼·班西和朱莉·张制作，监制为凯蒂·弗格森。

Today's show was produced by Anthony Bansi and Julie Chang, with supervising producer Katie Ferguson.

我是《华尔街日报》的伊莎贝尔·布斯凯特。

I'm Isabelle Bousquette for The Wall Street Journal.

今天上午稍后，我们将带来T和B科技快讯。

We'll be back later this morning with T and B Tech Minute.

感谢收听。

Thanks for listening.