在任何年龄正确增强力量、耐力与灵活性的方法 | 帕维尔·查索林

然后你跑十分钟、二十分钟、三十分钟。

And then and you're running at a ten, twenty minutes, thirty minutes.

好吧，目标是这样的。

Well, here's the goal.

他说跑一英里。

He says run for a mile.

这就是目标。

That's the goal.

他有一些数据。

And he has some numbers.

我可以给你一个链接。

I can give you a link.

你可以自己查一下。

You can look it up.

回到迈克的直接握力训练，这也非常好。

And Back to Mike direct grip strength training is great as well.

例如，最适合这项训练的产品是IronMind公司的Captains of Crush握力器。

So for example, the best products for that would be the Captains of Crush Grippers from IronMind.

IronMind公司是现代握力训练的开创者。

IronMind is the company that started a serious grip training pretty much in modern era.

他们的握力器是行业黄金标准。

And their grippers are the golden standard.

几年前，我的同事、力量训练专家布拉德·琼斯和我决定认真投入这项训练，亲身体验一下它的感觉。

Some years ago my colleague, as strong first Brad Jones and I, we decided to get serious about it and see what that feels like.

我们花了整整几个月的时间，最终两人都成功闭合了平行系列中的3号握力器。

And we spent many, many months, we were both able to build up to closing the number three gripper from a parallel set.

这意味着闭合这个握力器需要280磅的力。

So that means that gripper takes two eighty pounds to close.

当你使用非常小的肌群时，这会极其、极其困难。

And when you're using very small muscle groups it's extremely, extremely hard.

我们两人以及其他同事和训练者都观察到，一旦你能做到这一点，其他所有事情都会变得容易得多。

And the observations that we both made and other colleagues and people have made that once you're able to do that everything becomes so much easier.

然而，训练本身极其艰难。

However, the training itself is extremely hard.

因为人们以为训练握力只是一种孤立的活动。

Because people are thinking that when you're training the grip is just some kind of isolated thing.

你可以一边开车，一边捏一捏在百货商店买来的那种小粉红捏捏球。

You can you can ride drive the car and you can kind of squeeze this little pink thing that you picked up at at the department store.

不对。

No.

当你使用像IronMind这样的重型握力器训练时，这是一次全身性的努力。

When you train with a heavy duty gripper like the one from IronMind, it's a full body effort.

你需要运用几乎所有的神经技巧来全力施力。

And you need to use pretty much every neurological trick in the book in order to exert yourself.

例如，如果你看过空手道中的三战 stance，那种膝盖内收、肩膀下压的姿势，会充满紧张感。

So for example, if you've ever seen Sanchin stance in karate, which is a stance where the knees are kind of pulled inward and shoulders are pressed down, there's a lot tension.

全身的每一个部分都高度紧张地参与其中。

Everything is very very seriously engaged.

脚趾紧紧抓地。

The toes are gripping the ground.

所以你基本上是用脚趾抓着地面。

So you're pretty much gripping the ground with your toes.

你在收紧臀部。

You're contracting your glutes.

你在用力绷紧身体。

You're bracing very very hard.

你在压缩内脏。

You're compressing your viscera.

你的肌肉在快速收缩，你正在将所有力量集中起来。

Your lattice firing and you're sending this all this effort.

唯一他们不参与的是，你尽量让斜方肌和脸部不要用力。

The only thing they're not working like you try to keep your traps and face out of this.

你把所有力量集中在你的核心，做这种训练的疲劳感不亚于做深蹲之类的重训。

And you're directing this effort into your group, you get just as tired from doing that work as from doing like heavy squats or something.

这太惊人了。

That's remarkable.

如果你喜欢，这是一件非常棒的事情。

If you like that, it's a fantastic thing to do.

哇。

Wow.

你所描述的运动神经元募集现象非常出色。

The motor neuron recruitment that you are describing is phenomenal.

我对握力与长寿之间的关系有一个想法。

I have one reflection on this relationship between grip strength and longevity.

稍微讲一点神经科学。

Just a little bit of neuroscience.

你可能已经熟悉这一点了，如果你知道的话请原谅，但为了听众们也说明一下。

You may be familiar with this, so forgive me if you are, but for the listeners as well.

控制躯干运动的运动神经元位于脊髓两侧靠近中线的位置。

The motor neurons that control movement of the torso lie closer to the midline on both sides of the spinal cord.

控制远离中线的远端肌肉的运动神经元位于这些神经元的外侧。

The motor neurons that are responsible for more distal muscles that is further from the midline sit outside of those.

因此，当你涉及到手指和脚趾等远端部位的运动时，这些部位离中线最远。

And so as you get out to the movement of the digits, you know, the fingers and toes, those are the most distal from the midline.

无论是否存在肌萎缩侧索硬化症、阿尔茨海默病、帕金森病或其他疾病，运动神经元随年龄增长而退化的速率和模式总是由外向内进行的。

The rate and pattern of degeneration of motor neurons as a function of aging, even if there's no ALS or Alzheimer's or Parkinson's or anything, is always outside in.

我们还不清楚为什么会这样。

We don't know why this is.

这可能与超氧化物歧化酶（SOD）的存在有关。

It may relate to the presence of the enzyme SOD, superoxide dimutase.

但似乎那些训练外周力量的人，能够延缓这种由外向内、由远端向靠近中线区域的退化过程。

But it does seem that people that train their peripheral strength, they can offset some of that outside to in, or distal to more close to the midline degeneration.

因此，我相信——这仅仅是一种信念，并非仅是相关性——当人们训练外周肌肉时，他们实际上能够减缓部分退化。

So I believe, and this is just a belief that it's not just correlative, that when one trains their periphery, they actually can offset some of the degeneration.

这也在大脑中的映射方式上有所体现，但这属于另一个话题了。

It's also the way it's mapped in the brain, which is a kind of a discussion outside of here.

我们需要一些图表来帮助人们真正理解这一点。

We'd need to get some diagrams up for people to really conceptualize that.

但如果你观察老年人，比如70岁、80岁、90岁的人，即使他们的躯干经过训练依然厚实有力，他们的小腿通常也会萎缩。

But it's also the case if you look at older people, 70, 80, 90, their calves are generally atrophied even if their torso is still very thick and muscular if they did training.

所以我觉得，虽然锻炼核心和躯干至关重要，但从长寿的角度来看，锻炼外周肌肉显然也很重要。

So I feel like obviously training the core and the torso is so key, but training the peripheral muscles, at least from the perspective of longevity, it makes sense why that would be important.

当然，有太多理由去这么做，我认为无论你是直接使用握力器，还是使用其他一些设备——显然有无数种设备和锻炼方式，或者作为其他运动的一部分，比如爬绳，都可以。

Well, are so many reasons obviously to do So I think that whether you choose to do that directly with grippers or, there are some other devices, obviously unlimited number of devices and exercises, or as a part of another exercise, like climbing the rope.

我强烈建议听众们去做这些锻炼。

Definitely strongly encouraging listeners to do that.

我打算试试单侧手持壶铃跑步，我会先用右手拿壶铃跑一英里，然后

I'm gonna try this running with the kettlebell on one side for I'll go out for a mile with it on the right, and then

哦，不，你要不断交替，频繁地换边。

Oh, no, you switch all the time and forth, switch as much as

你想换多少次都行。

you want.

好的。

Okay.

因为如果你只在一边做，你的稳定肌会承受巨大压力，而且永远无法恢复。

Because if you try to do it on one side, you're going to pound your stabilizers and just pound them, you're not gonna recover forever.

而这种方式正是发展等长耐力的秘诀之一：快速切换、短暂收缩和短暂休息，反复进行。

And this way, this is one of the secrets to developing isometric endurance, is very rapid switching, short contractions and brief rests, and over and over and over.

这样肌肉就不会缺血，基本上能持续获得氧气。

That way you are not, the muscle doesn't go into ischemia, and it keeps getting oxygen, pretty much.

我想谈谈动作的向心阶段和离心阶段，向心通常指举起阶段，而离心阶段，当然，就是放下的阶段。

I'd like to talk about concentric versus eccentric portions of a movement, concentric generally being the lifting phase and eccentric, of course, folks, lowering phase.

只做向心动作有没有道理？

Is there a case for just doing concentric movements?

有。

Yes.

有没有必要强调离心阶段？

Is there a case for emphasizing the eccentric portion?

在考虑肌肉酸痛、恢复和训练频率时，如何平衡这两者？

How does one balance those when thinking about soreness, recovery and frequency of training?

好的。

Okay.

首先，只做向心动作的情况是当你想尽量减少肌肉增长，同时也想尽量减少酸痛。

Well, first of the case for concentric only is if you're trying to minimize muscle growth, and if you also are trying to minimize soreness.

因此，对于需要控制体重的运动员，或在运动中额外体重会带来负担的项目，这是非常好的做法。

So for athletes in weight classes or athletes in sports where you get punished by carrying extra weight, it's a very good idea.

例如，当巴里·罗斯教练艾莉森·菲利克斯时，那时她成为了最快的选手。

So for example, when Barry Ross coached Allison Felix, at that point she became the fastest.

她赢得了世界200米冠军。

She won the 200 meters in the world.

她当时只有17岁左右，是最年轻的冠军。

She was 17 years old I think, she was the youngest.

因此，他会让她做硬拉，而且只做向心阶段。

And so he would have her do deadlifts and they were concentric only.

她会让她把杠铃放下。

And she would have her drop the bar.

这样做的理由正是如此。

And the reasoning for that is exactly that.

你能够变得更强壮，但不会增加额外的肌肉质量。

You're able to get stronger, you're not putting on extra muscle mass.

而且这种方式很安全。

Also it's safe.

这是一种非常非常安全的训练方式。

It's really very, very safe way to train.

对于那些并不属于这种情况的人，在训练计划中，为了增加多样性，你也可以选择在某些日子避免离心阶段。

And in programming protocol for somebody who's not necessarily in that boat, it's still just for the sake of variety you may want to choose to avoid the eccentric on certain days.

比如你正在恢复，希望加速恢复过程。

Like you're trying to recover, accelerate the recovery.

所以你会举起重量，然后慢慢下放。

So you lift the weight, but then you step down.

所以你完全可以这么做。

So you could definitely do that.

离心训练据说对促进肌肉肥大非常有帮助，但其中有很多前提和限制。

Eccentric work, it's supposedly very helpful to promote hypertrophy, but there are lot of ifs and buts in there.

我现在要专门谈谈离心训练对于力量提升的作用。

I'm going to talk right now about the eccentric work for strength specifically.

这是因为肌肉在下放重量时最强，很容易做出一些愚蠢的举动而受伤，吉姆就经常这么做。

It's very because the muscle is strongest whenever you're lowering the weight, it's very easy to do something knuckleheaded and get hurt, which is Jim Bros do that all the time.

与其那样做，更明智、也更聪明的做法是找一个非常靠谱的保护者，在完成几组常规的低次数大重量训练后，再增加五到十磅超过你最大重量的负荷。

And instead of doing that, what the wise, much wiser approach is to get a perfect spotter, great competent spotter, and put on, after you've done your normal couple of low repetition heavy sets, add maybe five, ten pounds over your maximum.

然后以准备将重量推起的意图，完成一次完美的离心动作。

And make a perfect eccentric with an intention of lifting it.

所以你正在下放这个杠铃，比如卧推的杠铃。

So you're lowering this bar that you just, you know, the bench press barbell.

你让杠铃缓慢下放到胸部，同时全身绷紧，仿佛随时准备将它推回去。

You're lowering it to your chest and you're loading yourself like you're ready to press it back.

你在胸口暂停，但保持肌肉紧张。

You pause on your chest without losing tension.

你准备好将杠铃推回去。

You're ready to blast it back.

然后你的保护者把杠铃拿走。

And then your spotters take it off.

你这样做两到三次。

And you do this about two, three times.

这种策略或其变体曾被里克·威尔使用过。

This sort of a strategy or variation of it was used by Rick Will.

他在80年代，体重81磅时，穿着T恤就能卧推超过500磅，是历史上最伟大的卧推选手之一，而且对训练极其有智慧。

He was able to bench press over 500 pounds wearing a T shirt at the body weight of Buck eighty one back in the 80s, one of the greatest bench pressers, who was extremely intelligent about his training.

他在进行大重量尝试时也采用了同样的方法。

And he did the same thing with his heavy attempts as well.

顺便说一句，更好的做法是——不，我应该说，你得在另一天做这个训练。

And incidentally even better, not even better, I should say you do this on a different day.

当你将这种相同的离心训练与非常完美的辅助上拉结合时，而不是像那些健身新手那样强行上拉。

When you combine this same type of eccentric with a very perfect assisted trap, not forced trap like bros do.

那些人总是说：‘来吧，兄弟’，你知道的，当那个人在颤抖、快撑不住的时候。

It's all you bro, you know, when the guy is shaking there and dying.

不。

No.

所以，假设你的最大卧推是315磅。

So again, let's say that your best bench press is three fifteen.

那么你就上325磅。

So you load up three twenty five.

你完美地将杠铃下放。

You lower it perfectly.

而且你下放的速度要和你最大重量尝试时一样。

And you're lowering at the speed of your max attempt.

所以你并不是下放得特别特别慢。

So you're not going very very very slow.

你知道那些人是怎么做的。

You know how guys do it.

他们把动作的前四分之一阶段放得非常慢，然后直接坠落下去。

They take the first quarter of the range of motion very slow and then they fall through.

这根本没有任何效果。

That doesn't do anything at all.

不，你要以你最大重量时的节奏来下放。

No, you lower it at that rhythm of your maximal weight.

你停顿一下，然后推起。

You pause and then you press it.

你的训练伙伴提供足够的帮助，让你感觉像是在举90%的重量。

And your training partner gives you enough assistance to make it feel like it's about your 90%.

事实上，你能体验到超最大重量的感觉，但不会承受任何心理压力。

So the fact is you get to feel a super maximum weight, but you're not experiencing any psychological stress.

这非常、非常有效。

It's very, very powerful.

而且，你可能会做一到两次单次训练。

And again, you do this maybe for one or two singles.

这也与苏联关于体操运动员的研究有关。

This also ties with the Soviet research on gymnasts.

他们提出了一种叫做人工控制环境的概念。

They came up with something called artificial controlling environment.

他们比较了一组体操运动员：一组在向力量要求高的动作进阶时进行常规的简化训练。

So they compared a group of gymnasts that was working up to some strength demanding skill with doing typical regressions.

同时，他们也在进行典型的力量训练，比如负重引体向上等。

And at the same time they were also working on typical strength training, weighted pull ups and so on.

而另一组则由教练提供完美的辅助，让运动员能够以高水平完成该动作。

And the other group would have the coach provide this perfect assistance to enable the athlete to perform the skill at a high level.

正如他们所说，体验自己未来的运动状态。

As they put it, living their motor future.

但有足够的帮助，使动作不困难也不带来压力。

But with enough help not to make it hard but not stressful.

而两者之间的进步差异简直巨大。

And the difference in gains were just dramatically.

进步快得多，多得多。

So much gains so much faster.

所以我会说，这会是使用离心训练的一个非常好的方式。

So I would say that would be a very good way to use eccentric work.

等长训练也可以极大地提升力量。

Isometric training calls can also be very powerful for strength.

等长训练的一大优势在于它能帮助你学会正确地举重。

And a great value of isometric training is in its ability to coach you to lift properly.

不仅是正确举重，还包括正确的运动表现。

And not just lift properly, athletic events as well.

假设你正在学习如何踢前踢腿，但你的动作总是乱七八糟。

If let's say that you're trying to learn to throw a front kick and you're doing it all over the place.

但如果你把脚抵在墙上，由你的教练或师父帮你调整身体和脚的位置，教你同时向墙和地面施加压力。

But if you place your foot on a wall and if your coach or sensei positions your body, your foot in a certain way and teaches you to start applying pressure to that wall and the ground at the same time.

然后轻轻抵住墙，产生一种脉冲感。

And kind of a pulse it against the wall.

调整你的身体姿势，然后放松，抖动一下肌肉，接着去击打沙袋，你会突然表现得好多了。

Adjust your body and then you relax, shake off your muscles and you go hit the bag and suddenly you're going to do so much better.

同样的道理，假设你正在尝试优化硬拉底部的姿势。

The same thing, let's say that you're trying to optimize your position for the bottom of the deadlift.

所以你加载的重量超过你实际能举起的极限。

So you load up more weight than you could possibly lift.

然后你把自己卡在下方，开始施加压力。

And then you wedge yourself under and you start applying pressure.

这感觉并不舒服，所以你稍微调整一下。

And it doesn't feel good, so you change it a little bit.

等长训练不仅对强化薄弱环节非常有效，还能优化动作角度。

So isometrics are very powerful for not just for strengthening the sticking points, but also for optimizing the angles.

此外，我们还涉及到一种非常显著的抑制解除效应。

Then we're also dealing with something that There's also great disinhibition effect.

所以你的听众可能不知道的是，你的神经系统中有两个踏板，抱歉我这么说，但你显然已经了解这些了。

So what your listeners might not know is So there are two You have two pedals in your nervous system, as in pardon me for telling you this, you don't need Obviously you know all this.

但一个是兴奋，一个是抑制。

But there's the excitation inhibition.

一个是油门，一个是刹车。

There's the gas pedal and the brake pedal.

有许多影响因素，有些是心理层面的，但并非全部，它们都会削弱你的力量。

And there are various influences, some of them psychological but not all of them that are taking away from your strength.

这被称为抑制。

That's called inhibition.

在某些情况下，有记录显示，一位女士曾抬起一辆重达3600磅的汽车前部，救出她的儿子。

And under certain circumstances there are documented cases like a lady lifting off the front of a 3,600 pound car to save her son.

这类案例是有文献记载的。

And there are documented cases of that.

因此，这种抑制解除现象确实发生了。

So that disinhibition takes place.

因此，等长训练确实具有一定的去抑制效应，非常非常强大。

So isometrics does have some disinhibition effects properties, very, very powerful.

此外，等长训练教会你不要在重负荷尝试中放弃。

Also isometrics teaches you not to give up on a heavy attempt.

因为这些实验是在机器上以安全的方式进行的，显然如此。

Because if you put the experiments were done in a safe manner on the machines obviously.

但如果让一个没有经验的人操作，而机器以缓慢的速度移动，当速度接近零时，抑制就会发生。

But if you put an inexperienced person and the machine is moving at a slow rate, so when speed starts approaching zero that inhibition takes place.

因此，受试者几乎会认为任务结束了。

So pretty much the subject thinks the gig is up.

我动不了了，就这样了，我放弃了，因为我失败了。

I'm not going anywhere, that's it, I'm done, I'm just giving up because I failed.

但通过等长训练，你可以培养这种神经驱动耐力，从而安全地突破更重的负荷。

But training with isometrics allows you to develop this kind of a neural drive endurance that you need to grind through safely through a heavier tap.

所以，非常非常强大。

So very, very powerful.

你如何将等长训练融入其中，使其成为热身的一部分？

How would you incorporate isometrics into it so you can do this as a part of your warm up?

你也可以做向心重复训练，它们非常棒。

You can also do positive reps, they're fantastic.

当你将离心、向心、等长和牵引全部结合在一起时。

When you combine eccentric, concentric and isometric and traction all in one.

以深蹲为例，你下蹲到平行位置，保持紧绷，并在那里停留三到五秒。

So perfect example for the squat, you lower to parallel, and you stay tight, and you stay there for three to five seconds.

然后迅速向上爆发。

And then you explode upward.

这是一种非常好的训练方式。

So that that's a great way to train.

我想趁机短暂休息一下，感谢我们的赞助商AG1。

I'd like to take a quick break and thank our sponsor AG1.

AG1是一种集维生素、矿物质、益生菌和适应原于一体的综合饮品。

AG1 is an all in one vitamin mineral probiotic drink with adaptogens.

我从2012年开始每天服用AG1，因此很高兴他们能赞助这个播客。

I've been taking AG1 daily since 2012, so I'm delighted that they're sponsoring this podcast.

我开始服用AG1并持续服用的原因在于，它是质量最高、成分最全面的基础营养补充剂。

The reason I started taking AG1 and the reason I still take AG1 is because it is the highest quality and most complete foundational nutritional supplement.

这意味着AG1能确保你获得所有必需的维生素、矿物质和其他微量营养素，为日常健康打下坚实基础。

What that means is that AG1 ensures that you're getting all the necessary vitamins, minerals, and other micronutrients to form a strong foundation for your daily health.

AG1还含有益生菌和益生元，有助于维持健康的肠道菌群。

AG1 also has probiotics and prebiotics that support a healthy gut microbiome.

你的肠道菌群由数万亿个微生物组成，它们分布在消化道内，影响着你的免疫系统状态、代谢健康、激素健康以及其他诸多方面。

Your gut microbiome consists of trillions of microorganisms that line your digestive tract and impact things such as your immune system status, your metabolic health, your hormone health, and much more.

因此，我始终发现，每天服用AG1后，我的消化功能得到改善，免疫系统更强大，情绪和精神专注力也达到最佳状态。

So I've consistently found that when I take AG1 daily, my digestion is improved, my immune system is more robust, and my mood and mental focus are at their best.

事实上，如果只能选择一种补充剂，我会选AG1。

In fact, if I could take just one supplement, that supplement would be AG1.

如果你想尝试AG1，可以访问drinkag1.com/huberman领取特别优惠。

If you'd like to try AG1, you can go to drinkag1.com/huberman to claim a special offer.

下单AG1时，他们会赠送您五份免费旅行装以及一年份的维生素D3和K2。

They'll give you five free travel packs plus a year supply of vitamin D three k two with your order of AG1.

再次提醒，请前往drinkag1.com/huberman领取此特别优惠。

Again, go to drinkagone.com/huberman to claim this special offer.

我想谈谈神经驱动。

I'd like to talk about neural drive.

我认为是你普及了‘润滑轨道’这个术语，也许是你发明的，但至少是你让它广为人知的，这在你的一本书里提到过。

I attribute you with popularizing, maybe you invented it, but certainly popularizing the term like greasing the groove in one of your books.

顺便说一下，我们在节目笔记的标题中提供了Pavel书籍的链接。

And by the way, we provide links to Pavel's books in the show note captions.

我是你书籍的收藏者。

I'm a collector of your books.

谢谢。

Thank you.

我非常喜欢它们。

I love them.

其中一些感谢您。

Some of them Thank you.

正逐渐成为收藏品。

Are getting to be collector's items.

它们有点难找，但你得跟我在eBay上竞争了。

They're a little bit harder to find, but you'll have to compete with me on eBay.

但有些可以在其他地方找到，我们会提供这些链接。

But some of them can be found elsewhere and we'll provide links to those.

但‘润滑槽’这个概念彻底改变了我对力量训练的理解。

But this notion of greasing the groove completely changed my conceptualization of strength training.

谢谢。

Thank you.

因为我从小接受的训练方式，差不多就是在越野跑季节里长跑。

Because I was weaned more or less trying to run cross country during the cross country season.

我只跑过一次，但非常享受，之后就继续这种训练方式，试图增肌增力。

Only ran it once, but I greatly enjoyed it and continued that sort of training or trying to put on strength and size.

有点像那种麻木、年轻男性对待事情的方式。

Kind of a a numb skull, young male approach to things.

但这种做法对我来说还算有效。

But served me reasonably well.

我很感激自己两者都尝试了。

I'm grateful that I included both.

然而，我那时完全专注于这样一种观念：训练某个肌群，促成适应，然后等待适应发生，再重新训练该肌群。

However, I was so tuned to this notion of training a body part, creating an adaptation, then waiting for the adaptation to occur and then training the body part again.

你知道，网上关于每周练两次还是三次的争论到处都是。

You know, the arguments are all over the internet two times a week, three times a week.

后来我接触到了‘频繁练习’这个概念，作为一名神经科学家，我觉得它直觉上非常正确，结果也确实如此。

And then I came across this concept of greasing the groove, which as a neuroscientist felt so intuitively correct and turns out to be correct.

你会解释它具体是什么，但核心思想是：更频繁地训练或练习某个动作，能为力量发展、肌肉肥大（如果需要的话）打开大量机会。

You'll explain what it is, but the idea that more frequent training or practicing of a movement opens up a tremendous number of opportunities for development of strength, of size hypertrophy if one wants.

而且我认为，这总体上也为个人的健身计划带来了更大的灵活性。

And I would say just generally more flexibility over one's total fitness program.

一旦你理解了这一点，就不再只关注这种分割或那种分割，或者这种次数或那种次数，这种容量或那种容量。

Once one understands you this no longer look at this split or that split or this many reps or that many reps or this volume or that volume.

所有这些都很重要，但你可以开始从神经系统的角度来思考它们。

All that is important, but you can start to think about it through the lens of the nervous system.

对我来说，这就像在沙漠中终于遇到了水，将所有这些不同的概念融合在了一起。

And to me, it was like water in a desert to finally encounter something that brought together all these different concepts.

所以你能为人们解释一下什么是‘润滑轨道’吗？

So could you please explain for people what greasing the groove is?

然后我认为它的含义会变得显而易见，但我们也会明确说明。

And then I think the implications of it will become obvious, but we'll also spell out

安德鲁，请随时打断我，因为接下来内容可能会很长，所以请随时打断我。

what's Andrew, please interrupt me because this is about to become a This might get really long, so please interrupt me at any time.

首先我会讲一下神经层面的部分，然后我们会讨论频率以及由此带来的形态适应和结构适应。

So first I'll talk about the neural component, then we're gonna talk about the frequency and the morphological adaptation, structural adaptations as it leads.

所以，女士们先生们，‘润滑轨道’，我们来打个比方。

So, ladies and gentlemen, grease the groove, we are talking about Let's use an analogy.

让我们想象你是一名弓箭猎人。

Let's imagine that you are a bow hunter.

你在车库里工作。

And you work in your garage.

然后你走出车库，射出一支箭。

And then you walk out of your garage and you shoot an arrow.

接着你就回去继续在车库里干活。

And you just go back to going about your business, just working in your garage.

或者说你是个练习武术的孩子。

Or let's say you're a kid who who practices martial arts.

在每节课之间的休息时间，你都会走到角落里练习你的套路。

And every on every break between classes you just go in the corner and you practice your kata.

这是练习技能的最佳方式。

This is the best way to practice your skill.

以小块的方式，间隔开来进行。

In small portions, in a spaced out manner.

真正有趣的是，传统教育和传统力量训练都是基于临时突击的模式。

What's really fascinating is traditional education and traditional strength training is based on the cramming model.

还记得考前临时抱佛脚吗？

So remember cramming for an exam.

你晚上拼命学习，最后勉强通过了考试。

So you're studying at night and you somehow squeak by and you pass it.

好吧，不错。

Okay, great.

但几天后，你就高高兴兴地把一切全忘了。

And then a couple of days later you happily forget everything.

相比之下，想象一下你在学习一门外语。

So in contrast, imagine that you are, let's say you're studying a foreign language.

你把单词写在卡片上，每次有机会就站在银行排队时拿出来看。

You write words on cards and at every opportunity you're standing in line in the bank.

而普通人则在手机上瞎玩。

So the lesser mortals are fooling around on their phones.

你只是在翻看你的卡片。

You're just going through your deck.

比如，我能翻译这个词吗？

Like, can I translate this word?

我就会把它放回卡片堆里，翻到背面。

I go, put it back in the deck, flip it over.

下次你在其他地方时，再重复一次这个过程。

The next time you're in some other place you do this again.

这就是间隔练习与传统集中练习的一个例子。

So this is an example of space practice versus the traditional mass practice.

间隔练习优越性的证据是压倒性的。

And the evidence of the superiority of space practice is just overwhelming.

这可以追溯到十九世纪。

It goes back to the nineteenth century.

已经有至少一千多篇论文发表过这方面的研究。

And there's at least like more than a thousand papers published on that.

但仍然很少有人这么做，这真的很令人遗憾。

And still very few people do that, which is really sad.

力量是一种技能。

And strength is a skill.

所以二十世纪五十年代发生了两件有趣的事。

So two interesting things happened in the 50s.

一个是托马斯·拉什，他是一位美国运动生理学家。

One is Thomas Rush, he was an American exercise physiologist.

他提出，力量的适应主要是一种技能。

He proposed that strength adaptation was largely skill.

他研究了几乎所有的适应现象，注意到肌肉增长与力量之间没有相关性。

And he looked at pretty much the adaptations, he noticed that there's no correlation between the muscle growth and strength.

与此同时，一位苏联科学家斯蒂帕诺夫——这是他的姓氏。

Then at the same time, a Soviet scientist, Stipanov was his last name.

他正在测量举重运动员在进行 overhead 推举时肌肉的电活动。

He was measuring the electrical activity in the muscles of weight lifters who were pressing overhead.

那时候，推举是比赛项目之一。

And back then the press was one of the competition events.

他发现，随着运动员经过几个月的训练变得更强壮后，他们在举起相同重量时的肌电图信号开始下降。

And what he found is, as the athletes got stronger after some months, the EMGs started dropping off when they're lifting the same weights.

因此，他基本上发现，神经系统的活动变得更加高效。

So pretty much he found out that the nervous system activity became more economical.

他们不需要那么用力，却依然能举起相同的重量。

They were able to try less hard, yet still lift the same weights.

或者说，他们可以更用力地尝试，从而举起更重的重量。

Or pretty much they could try harder and lift even heavier weights.

肌肉肥大无法解释这一点，因为在五十年代，苏联人非常反对肌肉肥大，他们主要只做双次、三次和单次训练。

And hypertrophy could explain that, because in the fifty's the Soviets were very anti hypertrophy, they were just doing doubles, triples, singles pretty much.

所以如果我们观察正在发生的事情，那就是赫布机制。

So if we look at what's going on, it's the Hebian mechanisms.

基本上，每次你激活神经元之间的特定突触连接时，这个连接就会变得更强大。

So pretty much every time that you activate a particular connection, synaptic connection between the neurons, that connection becomes stronger.

所以如果你一遍又一遍地做。

So if you do it over and over and over.

因此，‘让油脂润滑沟槽’这个比喻指的是从大脑传向肌肉的指令，那就是沟槽。

So the grease the groove is the analogy is that command that's coming in from your brain to your muscles, that's the groove.

那就是那条通路。

That's that pathway.

你使用得越多，它就会变得越润滑。

And the more you use it, pretty much the more grease it becomes.

所以它会变成超导体。

So it becomes a superconductor.

因此在未来，你不需要那么用力就能举起同样的重量。

So in the future you don't have to try as hard to lift the same amount of weight.

或者你可以用同样的力气举起更重的重量。

Or you can try the same amount and you can lift harder.

所以我们还没谈到神经驱动的问题。

So we haven't even addressed the neural drive yet.

我们只是让运动神经元对它变得更加敏感。

We just pretty much made the motor neurons more responsive to it.

这是一种非常简单易行的训练方式。

And it's a very easy and very simple way to train.

力量会非常容易地、出人意料地增长。

And strength comes very easily and very, very unexpectedly.

为了确保这种情况发生，必须解决特异性的问题。

To make sure that it does happen, have to address the issue of specificity.

所以特异性，简单来说，就是不深入太多细节。

So specificity pretty much means without getting too much into the weeds.

要想变强，首先你需要举起足够重的重量。

To get stronger, first of all, you need to lift weights that are heavy enough.

如果你关注的是最大单次重复的百分比，通常我们会看75%到85%。

And if you're looking about percentages of one rep max, we're looking at like 75 to 85 typically.

如果重量太轻，就无法在你的神经系统中留下足够深刻的印记。

If you go too light, you don't make the impression on your nervous system.

而且这还不够具体。

And it's just not specific enough.

如果你太快地使用过重的重量，只会让自己精疲力尽。

If you go too heavy very quickly it's just going to burn yourself out.

所以，这个重量最好是足够重以示尊重，又足够轻以避免恐惧。

And so pretty much like it's a weight that's heavy enough to respect and light enough not to fear.

其次，这一点非常令人惊讶：你只做你理论上能完成的一半或更少的次数。

And the second of all, and this is very surprising, is you only do about half or fewer reps that you possibly could do.

比如，假设你举的是你单次最大重量的80%。

So for example, let's say that you're lifting 80% of your one rep max.

假设你最多能做八次。

And let's say that you're able to do eight reps maximum with it.

这在实践中是很常见的。

That's your we're just fairly common.

但你每组只做三到四次，就这样。

Well, you're only going to do about three to four reps per set, and that's it.

到了这个时候，健身圈的人就开始疯狂了：强度在哪？

And the gym bros at this point go crazy, where is the intensity?

力量训练中的强度，只是指重量有多重。

Well, intensity in strength training is just how heavy the weight is.

这跟努力程度毫无关系。

It has nothing to do with the effort.

无数研究已经证明，这比你有多拼命重要得多。

And it's been proven over and over that that's much more important than how hard you're exerting yourself.

当然，有时候也需要那样做。

There are times for that.

确实，有时候是需要那样的。

There are absolutely times for that.

但如果重量足够重，而且你只做可能完成次数的一半，你就会变得更强。

But if the weight is heavy enough, and if you do half the repetitions that you possibly could do, you're going to get stronger.

这非常安全。

It's very safe.

而且你不会在心理上感到疲惫。

And you're not going to burn out psychologically.

而且这对你的身体也非常温和。

And it's also very easy on your body.

因此，这也能够增肌，纯粹是因为你能完成非常高的训练量。

So, also that builds muscle as well, purely because you're able to do a very high volume of work.

我无法解释它为何能增肌的机制。

I'm not able to explain the mechanism why it builds muscle.

但正如苏联人在举重研究中发现的那样，在其他条件相同的情况下，训练量与肌肉肥大之间存在相关性，你就会变得更强壮。

But as the Soviets found out in weight lifting research, there's a correlation between the volume and Robert Roman, between the volume and the hypertrophy, everything else being equal, you're going to get bigger.

所以几乎每天你都在做三到四组，甚至五组重复，这些训练量开始累积。

So almost every day you're doing the sets of three, four reps, maybe even five, and they start adding up.

不知不觉中，你就变得更强壮了，同时肌肉也得到了发展。

And before you know it you're stronger, and at the same time you have developed muscle.

因此，总结一下‘润滑轨道’法，你试图以中等偏重的强度，尽可能频繁地训练，同时保持最佳状态。

So, to summarize the grease the groove, you're trying to train moderately heavy, as often as possible, while staying as fresh as possible.

如果你决定在健身房做，一个非常简单的方案是每十分钟做一组。

And if you decide to do it in the gym, a very simple protocol would be a set every ten minutes.

这听起来真的很奇怪，为什么呢？

It sounds really bizarre, like why?

为什么要休息这么长时间？

Why would you rest for so long?

这似乎与初期的记忆巩固有关。

This apparently has to do with initial memory consolidation.

还有很多未知的东西。

There's so much is still unknown.

所以我们知道润滑式训练非常有效。

So we do know the grease degree of works great.

但我们推测，其中一部分原因与其它领域中学习所涉及的某些现象相同。

But we speculate that some of it has to do with some of the same phenomena related to learning in other fields.

所以如果你一遍又一遍地做某件事，比如你说二加二等于四，二加二等于四。

So if you're doing something over and over, like you're saying two plus two is four, two plus two is four.

你只是在动用短期记忆。

You're just using your short term memory.

你并没有记住任何东西。

You're not memorizing anything.

但如果你说二加二等于四，然后去喝杯咖啡，回来再尝试二加二等于四。

But if you say two plus two is four, you go get a coffee, you come back and you try two plus two, four.

所以这里面就存在那种你需要的理想难度。

So there's that desirable difficulty that you have in there.

你必须去处理它，而不是仅仅机械地重复。

And you have to process that instead of just go through the groove.

这显然有助于这种适应过程。

That apparently helps this adaptation.

所以至少要休息十分钟。

So rest for at least ten minutes.

每组做的次数大约是你可能完成次数的一半。

Do sets of about the repetitions of half of what you're possibly able to do.

并且要倾听你的身体。

And listen to your body.

通常连续训练两到三天，然后休息一天，但要倾听你的身体。

Typically train two, three days in a row and then take a day off, but listen to your body.

顺便说一下，这种‘让润滑成为习惯’是我下一本著作的主题。

Incidentally this grease the groove is the topic of my next book.

我已经写完了，但还没出版。

I've completed it, it's not published yet.

如果你看一下，我念不出这位匈牙利教授的姓氏。

If you look at, I can't pronounce the Hungarian professor's last name.

契克森米哈伊。

Csikszemajai.

谢谢，谢谢，我很感激。

Thank you, thank you, I appreciate that.

他谈论的是，完美的挑战和完美的练习存在于无聊与焦虑之间的那个通道中。

So he's talking about that perfect challenge, perfect practice lies in that channel between boredom and anxiety.

所以，如果你让自己处于这个状态，并且持续以中等强度反复举起中等重量的杠铃，你就会变得更强壮。

So if you put yourself in that channel, and if you keep lifting this moderately heavy weights, with a moderate effort over and over and over, you're going to get strong.

这是增强力量的多种方式之一。

That's one of the many ways to get stronger.

在这十分钟的休息期间，你有做其他动作吗？

Are you doing anything in the rest periods between these ten minutes?

比如，做卧推，然后等十分钟再做下一次卧推，但在这期间，你在第一次卧推五分钟后做泽歇深蹲吗？

So is it, let's say, bench press, wait ten minutes till you bench press again, but in the meantime you're doing zercher squat five minutes after the first bench press?

这是一种实现方式。

That's one of the ways to do that.

你可以同时进行最多三项训练。

You can do up to three exercises at the same time.

比如说，我喜欢泽歇深蹲和卧推，也许再加一项，但我觉得这两项就足够了。

So let's say I like zercher squat and bench press and maybe a third thing, but I'd say those two are enough.

另一个选择是你可以这样做。

And another option is you can do that.

如果你只做一个动作，你可以将这种训练方式融入你的日常生活或运动训练中。

You can incorporate this into, if you would do only one exercise, you can squeeze it into your lifestyle or your athletic practice.

比如，假设你正在教田径训练或武术课。

So for example, let's say you're teaching a track practice or martial arts class.

每到整点十分钟时，你就让全班同学停下，做三个高强度的单臂俯卧撑。

And every ten minutes on the clock you just have the class do, drop and do three hard, let's say three one arm push ups.

好的，然后继续回到课程中。

Okay, and then get back to the class.

这样完全不会产生干扰。

So there's no interference whatsoever.

事实上，这比没有任何干扰还要好。

In fact, it's better than no interference.

在六十年代，苏联人发现了一种叫做‘力量后效’的现象。

Back in the sixties Soviets found out something called the strength after effect.

如果你做的力量训练并不令人精疲力竭，而且对你来说也不是新鲜动作，它就能对你的大脑或身体所进行的任何活动产生一种提振效果。

So if you do strength work that's not exhausting in nature, and that's not novel to you, it has a tonic effect just for anything that you can do with your brain or with your body.

任何事情。

Anything.

所以有些教练会进行所谓的力量热身。

So what they would even do some coaches do a do so called strength warm up.

他们会像往常一样为田径课做热身，比如说田径训练。

They would warm up as usual for a track class, let's say, track practice.

然后他们会做三组，每组三次，使用80%的最大重量，这并不算多。

Then they would do, let's say three sets of three of something like with 80% max, which is not much.

然后他们开始训练。

And they start their practice.

接着教练注意到运动员们开始有点疲软。

Then the coach noticed that the athletes are starting to droop a little.

他会重复这个做法。

He'll repeat that.

你知道，他可能会重复三遍。

You know, he might repeat that up to three times.

所以，通过这种短暂的、极小剂量的力量训练，也就是所谓的纳米级练习，你能让自己重新充满活力。

So what you have is by having this short, a very small dose, like a nano practice of strength, you rejuvenate yourself.

你的生产力会因此大幅提升。

And your productivity increases so much.

所以，无论你只是想在一小时内做几次力量训练，还是想把这和写一部伟大的美国小说结合起来，这都由你决定。

So whether you want to just do the strength exercise, several of them in that one hour period, or whether you want to combine that with writing a great American novel, that's your business.

我猜，如果有人在家能接触到合适的设备，就可以把‘ grease the groove ’融入一整天的活动中。

I suppose if someone has access to the appropriate equipment at home, you could incorporate Grease the Groove into your entire day.

这再理想不过了。

That's ideal.

对。

Yes.

当然，有些设备使用起来比较困难，但你可以使用强力握力器。

And obviously, it's difficult with some equipment, but what you could do, you could use the heavy duty grippers.

你可以做单臂俯卧撑。

You could do one arm push ups.

你可以把一个壶铃放在桌子底下，抓住每一个机会做推举。

You could You could keep a kettlebell under your desk and do press it at every opportunity.

而重点在于，这其实就是一种练习。

And again, the idea is really just practice.

你只需要努力做到完美、完美的动作。

You just try to hit a perfect, perfect trap.

如果你有一些问题，比如你是因骨科问题而依赖热身的人，我在这里说的热身是指身体上的，而不是心理上的。

And notice that if you have some issues, if you're a warm up dependent person for orthopedic issues, I'm talking about warm up very much in the body, not the mind in this particular case.

那么这种方式对你可能不太合适。

Then it might not be appropriate for you.

不过，如果你能休息十分钟，可能还是可以的。

Although, you know, with ten minute rest it might still be okay.

但不热身就练习一项技能，也就是反复排练，对于提升这项技能非常有效。

But practicing a skill without the warm up, that means rehearsal, is very powerful for improving that skill.

人们常常误以为表现好就等于进步，等于学习。

People think they automatically equate performance with improvement, with learning.

但事实并非如此，完全不是这样。

But it's not so, not at all.

当你突然做某件事时，就像狙击手开冷枪一样。

When you're doing something that's just out of the blue, it's The way a sniper would take a cold shot.

这要难得多，因为你必须自己生成解决方案。

That's so much harder because you have to produce that solution.

或者举一个更贴近大多数观众的例子，比如高尔夫。

Or maybe an example that's closer to most viewers, golf.

你去练习场，开始击球，然后惊讶地发现：哇，你太棒了。

You go to the driving range, you start hitting it, and like wow, you're amazing.

你只是把自己调整到最佳状态，一击，就完美了。

You just get yourself fine tuned, you hit, you're perfect.

然后你去打比赛，却无法复制那种状态。

Then you go and you play the game, and you cannot replicate that.

因为突然间，球杆不同了，地形也不同了，一切都变了。

Because suddenly different club, different topography, everything is different.

而你并没有那种当场自我调整的条件。

And you didn't have the luxury of that tuning yourself up right there.

所以感觉上你并没有变强，但你确实会变得更强。

So it feels, it doesn't feel like you're stronger, but you are going to get much stronger.

我一直很想和你们分享一些最近的发现，这些发现并非出自我自己，但我认为你们可能会感兴趣，而且我相信大多数人也会对此感到好奇。

I've been eager to share with you some recent findings that are not my own, but that I think you might be curious about, and that I think most people hopefully will be curious about as well.

这并不是所谓的‘反复润滑’，但它至少提供了一种部分的机制解释：为何某些具有高度运动神经元和注意力投入的身体活动，能够产生高度的警觉性，正如你所说，或许有助于写出伟大的美国小说。

It's not greasing the groove specifically, but it provides a at least partial mechanistic understanding of how particular types of physical movement with this high motor neuron and attentional engagement can generate high levels of alertness that can be devoted to, as you say, writing the great American novel perhaps.

匹兹堡大学有一位名叫彼得·斯特里克的人，他首次开始绘制肾上腺与大脑之间的连接图谱。

There's a guy at the University of Pittsburgh named Peter Strick, who for the first time started to map the connections between the adrenals and the brain.

他能够做到这一点，得益于一些非常酷的技术。

And he was able to do this using some really cool technology.

核心结论如下：肾上腺释放的肾上腺素——正如一些听众可能知道的——并不能穿过血脑屏障，但它会与迷走神经上的受体结合，从而刺激大脑中的去甲肾上腺素，进而提升警觉性。

The basic takeaway is the following, adrenaline released from the adrenals, as some of the listeners may know, doesn't cross the blood brain barrier, but turns out it binds to receptors on the vagus, which then stimulates noradrenaline in the brain and provides this increase in alertness.

那么问题来了，你该如何激活你的肾上腺？

So then the question is, how do you get your adrenals engaged?

我们可以坐在这里进行瞪眼比赛，我肯定输。

We can sit here and we can do a staring competition, which I'll lose for certain.

但还有很多心理技巧。

But there are all sorts of psychological tools.

我们可以喝咖啡之类的。

We get caffeine, etcetera.

还有各种方法可以接触冷水。

There are all sorts of ways to cold water.

但彼得发现的是，运动皮层中有一些特定区域，通过两条突触的连接（即双突触连接）直接投射到肾上腺。

But it turns out what Peter found was that there are particular locations in the motor cortex that send a two, basically a two synapse connection, disynaptic connection directly to the adrenals.

而那些激活肾上腺的运动皮层区域会促使它们释放肾上腺素。

And the areas of motor cortex that engage the adrenals cause them to release adrenaline.

但仅仅是特定肌群的运动——比如你之前提到的收紧核心——就能引发肾上腺素的释放，而肾上腺素通过迷走神经刺激脑干区域释放去甲肾上腺素，从而唤醒整个大脑，提升学习能力和任何任务的表现。

But just by sheer movement of particular muscle groups are the core, as you were talking about before, like bracing the core, causes the release of adrenaline, which then via the vagus causes the brainstem area to release noradrenaline, wake up the whole brain essentially, increase learning and performance in anything.

此外，运动神经元的激活越强、越有意识，就越能触发肾上腺素的释放。

And as well, the stronger and stronger activation of the motor neurons, deliberate activation of the motor neurons seems to engage adrenaline release.

对我来说，这是一种绝佳的方式，能让人意识到他们对所谓的动机拥有内在的控制力——运动本身就能增加肾上腺素，从而增强想要运动的倾向。

Now, to me, this was a wonderful way of trying to persuade people that they have internal control over this thing that we call motivation, that movement itself can increase adrenaline, which can increase the tendency to want to move.

但同样，你也不希望肾上腺素过多。

As long as, again, you don't wanna have too much adrenaline either.

对。

Right.

对。

Right.

我想聊聊这一点。

And and I'd like to talk about that.

但我觉得，至少在这个国家，我和很多人从小就被灌输和塑造了这样的观念：如果我想提高动力，就得看个励志视频之类的。

But I think I and so many other people were kind of raised and conditioned, at least in this country, to think, oh, if I wanna increase my level of motivation, I need to, like, I don't know, watch an inspiring video.

那可能很不错。

That could be great.

或者我可以喝咖啡，或者喝能量饮料。

Or I can drink caffeine, and that could or an energy drink.

当然，这也会有效。

And certainly that will do it.

但对我来说，我发现特定的动作和特定肌肉的参与本身会改变神经化学环境。

But to me, the the discovery that particular movements and particular muscles being engaged in activity itself changes the neurochemical milieu.

我的意思是，这本来就是理所当然的。

I mean, of course, it had to be.

对吧？

Right?

这简直是显而易见的事。

It's a big duh.

但无论如何，我很兴奋能与你们分享这些——嗯，谢谢。

But I think that anyway, I was excited to share with you these Well, thank you.

我确实发现了这些。

I did discover them.

这才是新闻。

That is news

对我来说。

to me.

所以我读了《裸体战士》。

So I read the naked warrior.

我读的时候是穿着衣服的，但这是一本很棒的书，因为它讲的是仅靠自身体重的训练。

I was clothed when I when I read it, but it's a wonderful book because it talks about body weight only exercises.

还有像这样的概念：比如用力握紧拳头，让拳头捏得非常紧，这样能提高另一侧的握力，诸如此类的事情。

And this concept of, for instance, like trying to crush one's fist making a really strong fist on the other side and how that will increase your gripping ability on the other side, this kind of thing.

是的，正如你所知，以你神经科学的背景，显然有非常多神经学现象。

Yes, as you know, with your background in neuroscience, obviously there's so many neurological phenomena.

比如，我们可以把肌肉想象成一种软件，如果我们有意识地去调动它，就能变得强大得多。

Like if you can think of like muscle software that we have access to that, if we become conscious about accessing that, we can be so much stronger.

是的，当你谈到做三到四次重复，或者两到三次重复，强度约为最大单次重复的85%或80%，然后休息十分钟，在这中间的十分钟里去学习一些重要的东西，无论是身体上的还是认知上的。

Yeah, so when you talk about doing a set of three or four repetitions or two to three repetitions at about 85% or 80% of one rep mass, waiting ten minutes, and then the intervening ten minutes going and trying to learn something important, physical or cognitive.

这对我来说非常合理，因为这与肾上腺素有关，也与你的整个神经系统在这一间隔期间发生的变化有关。

This makes perfect sense to me because of the relationship of adrenaline, but also the way that your entire nervous system has changed in the intervening period.

而且你还有情境干扰。

And plus you have the contextual interference.

所以‘油腻的沟槽’这个说法并不是我发明的，我只是能够将其系统化、解释并可能加以完善，但这个概念自《传道书》时代就已存在。

So one of the greasy groove is not something that I invented, it's something that I was able to codify and explain and possibly refine, but it's been around since the day of Ecclesiastes.

特别是在力量训练方面，保罗·安德森。

And specifically in strength training, Paul Anderson.

保罗·安德森，有史以来最伟大的举重运动员之一。

Paul Anderson, one of the greatest weight lifters of all time.

他是苏联民众的最爱。

He was a big favorite of the Soviet public.

你知道，苏联人非常难以取悦，但他们称他为‘自然的奇迹’，因为他实在太强大了。

You know, very tough group to impress, but they called him the wonder of nature, he was so strong.

保罗·安德森会做一组深蹲，然后四处走动，喝点牛奶，半小时后再做一组推举，如此反复。

And Paul Anderson would do a set of squats, then he would wander around, drink some milk, half an hour later do a set of presses, now go do this again.

因此，他——我不该说‘重新发明’，他根本不知道神经元和尼龙的区别，却独立创造了如今仍属前沿的许多训练理念。

And so he reinvented, not should I say reinvent, no, he invented without knowing neurons from nylons many of the training concepts are just cutting edge today.

再者，这个情境干扰的概念，还记得我们之前谈过，如果你在产生解决方案时更困难，比如你努力回想2加2等于4，或者如何投球，那么你会学得更多。

And again, so this concept of contextual interference, remember we talked earlier how if it's harder for you to produce a solution, if you're trying harder to remember two plus two is four, or how to throw the ball, then you're going to learn more.

而不是别人直接告诉你2加2等于4。

As opposed to if somebody just hands it up, two plus two is four.

所以保罗·安德森同时具备了时间间隔和情境干扰——他的训练方式让之前的记忆痕迹在时间中消退，并通过另一个动作彻底抹去之前形成的模式。

So Paul Anderson had both the spacing, time came like, so the groove has been forgotten in the sense of time, and the contextual interference he did in another exercise that erased whatever previous groove read there.

看看这些前辈们，他们有多么天才，真是非常令人着迷。

And it's very fascinating how looking at some of these old timers and just how genius some of them were.

嗯。

Mhmm.

是的。

Yeah.

这种无意识的天才之处真是太棒了。

The unconscious genius aspect of it is so cool.

当然，我并不想贬低当今常见的健身计划，但我确实觉得大多数人采用的方式是这样的。

And of course, I don't want to be disparaging of common gym programs these days, but I do feel like the way that most I'll do it.

人们，是的，他会这么做。

People Yeah, he'll do that.

是的，大多数人训练时的想法是：好吧，我每周去健身房三到四次，或者一天练胸，另一天练胸和二头肌。

Yeah, the way that most people train in terms of thinking, okay, I'm going to hit the gym, you know, three, four times a week, or I'm going to train chest one day and chest and biceps.

虽然这种训练方式有一定价值，但我认为，要全面打造力量和肌肉肥大，还有大量其他方法值得探索，而你们与我们分享的这些方法却很少被讨论，因为人们没有从神经系统角度去看待。

While that has some value, I feel like for creating all around strength and hypertrophy, there's just such a incredible treasure trove of other things that you're that sharing with us are just not discussed as much because people don't take the lens of the nervous system component.

我想问一下关于神经系统在训练适应和恢复方面的问题，我早期的训练思维在一定程度上受到迈克·门瑟的影响。

One thing that I'd love to ask about the nervous system in terms of training adaptation and recovery is that I was weaned somewhat under the thought patterns of Mike Menser.

那是在达里安·叶茨的时代。

This was in the Darian Yates era.

我跟迈克有过一些接触。

And I knew Mike a little bit.

我曾付费跟他电话咨询过。

I paid for a consult with him over the phone.

我们从未当面见过。

We never met in person.

所以这让我妈妈问，这个成年男人为什么打电话到我们家？

So that had my mother asking, know, why is this grown man calling our home?

而且在以前，你得给别人汇钱。

And why are you wire in the old days, you had to wire somebody money.

所以我确实这么做了。

So I do.

但这是非常值得的，因为迈克告诉我，训练的目标是引发适应性变化。

But it was so worthwhile because Mike taught me that the goal of training was to induce an adaptation.

任何额外的东西都是不必要的。

Anything additional was not necessary.

在他看来，过多反而适得其反。

And in his case, felt was counterproductive.

训练频率非常低，等等。

Very infrequent training, etcetera.

这效果非常好，让我从一百五十磅长到了二百一十磅，其实我根本不需要增重，但我的身体反应极其强烈。

And it worked tremendously well to take me from like one hundred and fifty pounds to two ten pounds, which I had no need to do, my body just reacted like crazy.

但话说回来，那时候我才十六七岁，也许做任何其他事情都会得到类似的结果，谁知道呢？

But then again, was 16, 17, and 18 years old in that time, probably could have done any number of different things and experienced similar results, who knows?

但核心概念是，你训练是为了引发适应，然后休息，再让这种适应帮助你在良好姿势下举起更重的重量，诸如此类。

But the concept of course is that you train to induce an adaptation, then you rest, and then you allow the adaptation to serve the moving higher poundages in good form, this sort of thing.

然而，问题在于——门瑟强调过这一点——任何形式的训练，比如举重，都会对整个神经系统以及肌肉和结缔组织造成压力。

The problem however, is that, and Menser highlighted this, is that training of any kind, lifting, etcetera, taxes both the nervous system as a whole and the muscles locally in the connective tissue.

我们该如何看待训练与恢复？

How should we think about training and recovery?

所以当你描述‘润滑动作’时，我可以想象，如果我在家或去健身房，也许可以做四到五组这种训练，但到了某个点就会变得适得其反。

So when you describe grease the groove, I could imagine if I had a home set up or I'm going to the gym, I could maybe do four or five rounds of this training, but at some point it becomes counterproductive.

所以

So

哇，好多精彩的问题。

Wow, a lot of great question.

我只是

I'm just

试图思考如何安排这类训练，同时考虑到神经系统会整体疲劳。

trying to think about how to schedule this sort of thing, keeping in mind that the nervous system fatigues as a whole.

此外，还存在局部肌肉疲劳的问题，或者如果过度训练，还可能增加受伤的风险。

And then there's also the issue of local muscle fatigue or even the propensity for injury if you just overdo it.

当然。

Sure.

是的。

Yeah.

所以如果我们能就此展开讨论一下

So if we could just riff on this

如果你不介意的话，安德鲁，我会把这些问题拆开来讲，因为刚才提到了很多很好的问题。

for If you don't mind, Andrew, I'll break it up because a lot of great questions right there.

所以，正如你提到的，训练有多种不同的方式。

So one, as you mentioned, there are different ways of training.

而且，再次强调，除了长时间休息之外，降低训练量的参数主要基于苏联的举重体系。

And again, decrease we the groove load parameters apart from the long rests are very much based on Soviet weight lifting system.

我想稍后谈一谈这一点。

And I'd like to talk a little bit about that later.

另一种体系则完全且截然不同，它与迈克·门瑟的训练方法密切相关，原因很快就会明朗，那就是八十年代经典的美国力量举系统。

Another system does a completely and radically different, and it ties very much to Mike Menser's training, for reasons that become obvious, is the classic American power lifting system from the eighties.

当人们争论训练方法时，他们需要明白，实现目标的方式有很多。

And when people argue about training methods, what they need to understand is there are many ways to get the job done.

奥特科维尔在爱沙尼亚的研究发现，由于刺激的组合方式多种多样，所产生的适应性也各不相同，因此可以通过许多不同的途径达到相似的结果。

Know, Otkovir, his research in Estonia found because there's so many different combinations of stimuli and the different adaptations that result, you can arrive to similar outcomes in a lot of different ways.

所以，说某种方法是对的、另一种是错的，有时候是做不到的。

So to say this is right and this is wrong, you cannot sometimes do that.

我的意思是，我可以说大多数方法都是错的。

I mean I can say most of things are wrong.

但我也可以这么说，训练有多种正确的方式，而且它们可以截然不同。

But I can also say there is multiple right ways of training, and they can be radically different.

它们之所以不同，是因为它们依赖于非常不同的生理机制。

And they're different because they rely on very different phenomena.

所以在这种情况下，你谈论的是恢复和训练频率，这同样是解决这个问题的绝佳方式。

So in this particular case you're talking about recovery and frequency which is again a great way address it.

我将讨论两种完全不同的训练体系。

I'm going to talk about two systems that are completely different.

但它们都有着相同的传承，都为国家赢得了众多金牌。

And yet have that same pedigree that they have brought so many gold medals.

其中一个体系是苏联举重体系，运动员们每天会训练好几次。

So one system is the Soviet weight lifting system, is again where athletes would train several times a day.

保加利亚体系则是这一模式的更极端例子，每天训练。

And Bulgarian system is a more extreme example of that, and every day.

而另一个极端则是美国力量举体系，代表人物有休·卡西迪、马蒂·加拉格尔、埃德·科恩、柯克·科瓦尔斯基，从70年代到90年代都是如此。

And the other extreme would be the American power lifting system exemplified by Hugh Cassidy, Marty Gallagher, Ed Cohn, Kirk Kowalski, so starting from the 70s through the 90s.

那是力量举历史上非常辉煌的年代。

Those are really glorious day for years power lifting.

在这一体系中，他们每周每项动作通常只做一到两组大重量训练。

And in that system they would pretty much do one or two heavy sets per lift once a week.

所以这有点像迈克·门策尔的研究，某种程度上，不过我们稍后会解释原因。

So it's kind of a little bit like Mike Mentzer's work, kind of, but we'll address why.

那这怎么可能呢？

So how can that be?

这两种系统又怎么能都有效呢？

And how can both systems work?

所以你要考虑恢复问题。

So you address the recovery.

有一个概念叫异时性，'hetero' 意思是不同的，'chronicity' 指的是时间。

There's a concept called heterochronicity, which hetero means different, chronicity refers to time.

因此，身体的不同系统恢复速度各不相同。

So the different systems in the body recover at different rates.

如果你不考虑这一点，就会遇到严重的问题。

And if you don't take that into account, then you're going to have some serious problems.

所以，苏联体系在频繁训练时会考虑：如果我们想要高频训练，那就这么做，这正是我们所做的。

So, the Soviet system took If you look at the Soviet system with frequent training, they looked at, okay, we want to do frequent practice, which is exactly what we do.

我们不希望过度损伤肌肉，导致它们需要很长时间才能恢复。

We don't want to beat the muscles up so much that it takes them very long time to recover.

避免过多的离心负荷和酸中毒，避开这类问题。

Not too much eccentric stress, not too much acidosis, avoiding things like that.

他们能够以某种方式调整负荷，比如说，你的重量很重，但不至于过重。

And they were able to adjust the loads in such a way, so let's say your weights are heavy but not too heavy.

重复次数也不会太多，因此你几乎能在一夜之间恢复。

The reps don't go too high, so you're able to recover pretty much overnight.

这样做的好处是，研究表明，如果你将相同的训练量分散到更多的天数中（而不是增加训练次数），会获得更好的效果。

And the benefit of that is, it's been shown that if you fragment a given workload over more days, no more sessions, you get better results.

你的身体、神经系统、内分泌系统、肌肉组织等，如果将负荷分成小份，就能承受更多。

And it's your body is able, and your nervous system, endocrine system, your carcass, everything is able to handle much more, if it's split into small doses.

我们用一顿饭来举例。

So let's use an example of a meal.

假设你正在参加一场进食比赛。

Let's say if you were trying to do an eating competition.

你一天之内能吃多少东西？

How much you can eat in twenty four hours.

这可不是像康尼岛那种比赛，看谁在一餐里能吃下多少热狗，不是这样的。

So it's not like those Coney Island, know, how many hot dogs you can eat in one sitting, no.

但如果你把食物分散到一整天里吃，你可能会吃下更多。

But you'd probably eat a lot more if you spread it throughout the day.

这个道理是一样的。

And this is the same idea.

就像纳西姆·塔勒布讲的那个寓言：一位国王因为生气而对儿子说，他要用一块大石头压碎他。

Just like that parable from Nassim Taleb about the king that got angry at his son, and he says he's going to crush him with a big rock.

然后你意识到：等等，我到底做了什么？

And then you realize, well, what did I do?

我并不想杀死这个孩子。

I don't want to kill this kid.

但这位国王的名字叫国王的护卫，对吧？

But the king's name, King's Ward is king's ward, right?