Episode 192: You Don’t Need As Much Vo2Max Work as You Think!

你就会发现，同样的现象在高中甚至职业层面都会出现——人们很快就变得相对健康，但之后就停滞不前了。

Like, you see some of the same kind of phenomenon that occurred even at the high school or even at the professional side, which is, like, people got relatively fit, relatively quick, but then just stagnated.

根本看不到什么进步。

Like, there was no development that was going on.

能突破到下一阶段的运动员少之又少，几乎没人能做到那一步。

Like, it was few and far between on on athletes who could make that no one could make that next jump.

我们有一大堆跑十三分三十五秒左右的选手。

We had a bunch of, I don't know, thirteen thirty five k guys.

对吧？

Right?

他们在大学时跑十三分三十秒，我们就觉得，行，这批人是下一代了。

And they're, like, thirteen thirty in college, and we're like, okay.

结果呢，还是原地踏步。

These are our next group of guys, and then it's just like stagnation.

就是原地踏步。

It's just stagnation.

就是没人能突破这个瓶颈。

It's just like no one no one can make that leap.

这其实也说得通，你想想看，

And it makes sense where if you look at, okay.

当你过分强调最大摄氧量时，人确实会很快变快、变有氧，但根本没打下扎实的基础，根本没法在此基础上继续提升或调整训练刺激。

Like, this is what occurs when you overemphasize Vo2max is you just kinda you know, you get really quick, really fit for you really quickly, but there's no, like, foundation off of which to either build off of or shift that stimulus off of.

高中生身体特别扛造，主要是因为青春期。

And high school kids, right, are really robust because puberty.

体内激素和各种生理变化都在飞速进行，加上青春期带来的身体发育和刺激，你随便怎么练，他们都能有反应。

I mean, so many hormones and different biological processes are happening at warp speed, And there's a whole, you know, big flux of all these different, you know, stimuli just from a predisposition of, you know, puberty and maturation in their body that, yeah, you can do wild and crazy things with them.

我们得记住，功能性动作筛查最初开发的目的，就是为了改善高中生在力量训练中的动作质量——因为开发团队当时接触的正是这群孩子，他们看到后都惊了。

I mean, this is essentially we gotta remember why the functional movement screen was developed initially was to help get better movement quality in high school kids in the weight room because the prep the developers of it were working with that athlete population just saw, like, holy crap.

有人深蹲时膝盖内扣成这样，做各种动作，但人体其实非常耐造。

This person's valgus knees on a squat, you know, like, doing all this stuff, and the body is very resilient.

我们的身体天生就是为了承受压力、为了生存而设计的。

We are in you know, hardwired to endure and hardwired to survive.

所以我们能承受很大强度的训练，即使这些训练在结构或功能上并不理想，也能撑很久，还不至于出事。

So we can tolerate loads and loadings that might not be the most structurally or functionally sound for a long time and still, like, not die.

但在体育运动中，我们的目标不只是撑下去、活下来。

But in athletics, we're our goal is not to just endure and survive.

而是要真正表现优异。

It's to thrive.

一旦我们用这个视角来看，就得停下来想想：这样的训练方式，能不能帮这个人实现长期的持续进步？

And when we take that lens, we have to step back and go, how is this setting this person up for, you know, a long longitudinal success?

比如，你面前有个高三学生，或者某个运动员，他说：

Now if you have, right, say, a high school senior or an athlete who's like, hey.

我得赶紧把状态练出来。

We gotta get in shape quick.

当然，如果时间紧迫，科学地运用VO2max训练确实是快速提升、取得显著效果的好办法。

By all means, intelligent v o two max application is a very rapid way to go to get outsized and, you know, gains and impact.

我来举个例子。

I'll give an example here.

比如说我老婆，下周要参加全国大学生越野锦标赛。

Like, say my wife, she's gonna run club cross country nationals next week.

她一直在拼命训练，不断加强体能。

And so she's been getting in shape and getting in shape and getting in shape.

在最近一场USATF地区赛中，她到了某个阶段，

And she got to, like, a certain point in the most recent cross country race, know, like, a USATF regional race.

她做了很多间歇训练，

And, like, she had she's doing a lot of flux training.

也做了不少这类高强度的练习，但就是提不起速度。

She's doing a lot of that type of work, but she just couldn't grind.

她说，腿就是迈不动，怎么也快不起来。

She said, I couldn't, like, make my legs move quicker.

怎么也找不到那个更高的档位了，

I couldn't, like, you know, like, find another gear.

对吧？

Right?

当运动员这么描述的时候，如果你从来没练过最大摄氧量训练，那你就明白了。

And when athletes describe that and you haven't been doing Vo2max work, that's like, okay.

没错。

Great.

猜猜我们要做什么？

Guess what we're gonna do?

安排两到三次400米的最大摄氧量训练。

Two to three Vo2max sessions of four hundreds.

强度不小。

Hard.

我们要做十组400米，按3公里配速跑，组间休息时间1比1或者1比2。

So we're gonna do 10 times 400 at three k pace with one to one or one to two work rest ratio.

她每组400米大概要跑80到75秒左右。

So you're gonna do, you know, eight she for her, it's, like, eighty, seventy five seconds for her four hundreds.

所以每组之后得休息80秒到两分钟。

So it's going to take eighty to, you know, seconds to two minutes recovery.

她只要全力跑完，连续三场训练下来，每场之后都需要两到三天的恢复时间，其他什么都别做。

She's gonna just hit that, and it's gonna hit that three sessions in a row, take about two to three days of recovery after each session, doing anything else.

接下来，训练的第二部分是跑三到四英里，速度控制在轻松的15公里或半马阈值配速，中间休息时间要充分。

And then the complement of the second part of that session is, complementing it with, say, three to four times a mile at kinda easy 15 k half marathon threshold pace with very generous recovery.

如果你只做这种强度的训练，恢复时间通常会非常紧。

So usually, if you just did that stimulus, it'd be razor thin recovery.

对吧？

Right?

六十秒、九十秒。

Sixty seconds, ninety seconds.

不对。

Nope.

要慢跑400米，因为这是最初的有氧清理，能帮助氧化并排出体内积累的酸性代谢物。

Take 400 jog because it's also is the initial aerobic flush that helps oxidize and flush out any of those acidic byproducts that come in.

酸中毒的速度没那么快。

The rate of acidosis is not as high.

所以从恢复的角度来看，她真正需要应对的，就是那些快肌纤维里糖原的补充。

So then all she's really fighting, from a restoration standpoint is glycogen resynthesis in those kind of faster twitch muscle fibers.

而这个过程，大概需要两天时间。

And that, you know, time frame takes about two days.

对吧？

Right?

只要你吃够了碳水，营养跟得上，中间别跑得太猛就行。

As long as you're well fed and eat up your carbs and don't run too hard in between.

是的。

Yeah.

我觉得你刚才提到的一个关键点，就是这个恢复周期。

I think an important point you you make there is the time frame.

我们通常在做最大摄氧量训练时容易搞错的一点是，传统上认为要五天以上才能完全恢复。

And I think where we get v o two max work often wrong is we you know, you mentioned this at the beginning is in the traditional sense, the time frame is, you know, five plus days, for you to be able to bounce back.

但在我们平时的周训练安排里，尤其是高中阶段，根本没这么多时间。

But in our traditional kinda weekly schedules, especially at the high school level, like, we don't have that time.

对。

Mhmm.

我们通常的做法是在此基础上再叠加更多高强度训练，比如安排其他训练或者比赛，因为我们每周都比赛。

What we do instead is stack some more hard work on top of that with some other workout or what have you or race often as we race weekly.

就这样不断往坑里挖，高中生身体恢复能力强，所以一开始你看不出问题，也许他们能撑一阵子。

And we just kinda keep digging that hole, and high school kids are resilient, so you don't see that hole initially, or maybe they can withstand it for a while.

但迟早是要还的，你懂吧？

But eventually what happens is like it it you have to pay for it, you know?

没错。

Yes.

这正是适应综合征的典型表现。

It's it's the general adaptation syndrome at its best.

对吧？

Right?

警报阶段就是VO2max训练，之后会进入一个短暂的适应期。

The alarm is the v o two max session, then there's resistance for a little while.

但如果你一直这样下去，迟早会累垮。

But if you keep doing it, exhaustion.

没错。

Yeah.

我得说清楚一点，每次我提到这个，很多人就会反驳，说：那乔·维尔·希尔不是经常做高强度的无氧训练吗？

And the the thing I should say is, you know, a lot of people, whenever I mention this, they'll they'll counter and they'll be like, well, what about, like, Joe V Hill who does some really hard Vo2max sessions?

我会说，他那是针对顶尖运动员的，而那些人都是顶级选手。

And I'll be like, you know, he does with his elite athletes, but these are elite athletes.

你明白吧？

You know?

第一，

A.

第二，如果你仔细看看乔·维尔·希尔是怎么准备的，你会发现他让运动员做了大量有氧阈值训练，而且还在高海拔地区训练。

And, b, if you look at Joe V Hill's system to prep to get there, you're talking a crazy amount of aerobic threshold development, and his athletes were at altitude.

在进入那种高强度阶段之前，他们的有氧阈值和乳酸阈值训练量已经大得惊人了。

So a crazy amount of aerobic thresholds and anaerobic threshold develop lactate threshold development before they even get to that phase of, like, hey.

我们会把那些最大摄氧量训练狠狠地推到极限。

We're gonna crank the crap out of these Vo2max workouts.

对。

Mhmm.

这其实是一种不同的说法。

And it's it's a different way to say it.

我觉得这种方式风险稍高一点，但在精英层面，这种风险可能值得付出的回报。

I would say a little bit riskier, and maybe that risk is worth the reward at that elite level.

但你要知道，他在让运动员进入最大摄氧量阶段之前，早就为他们做了充分的准备。

But, like, they're prepping that he's would prep the athletes before, like, going into his v o two max phase.

没错。

Right.

而且当我们研究精英运动员的训练方式，想把其中的原理应用到普通或业余运动员身上时，有一点很重要：训练越激烈、越严苛，之后的恢复安排也必须越系统、越严格、越到位。

And that I think also the other thing to highlight when we look at elite athletes training and try to extrapolate the principles of why it works into, say, lower level or lower qualification athletes or amateur athletes is the more intense and severe a training session is, the more structured and intense and severe the recovery window afterwards is.

但这一点在很多训练计划里常常被忽略了。

And that's often not seen in training plans.

我说的高强度和严苛，是指这些人一训练完就瘫在沙发上，完全遵循恢复的三大原则。

What I mean by intense and severe is, like, these people are on the couch, you know, really, like, fundamentally abiding by the three r's.

对吧？

Right?

补能、补水、休息。

Refueling, rehydration, and rest.

他们能完全不动弹。

So they have the ability to not move at all.

这样身体才能高效合成糖原和蛋白质。

So they can get glycogen resynthesis, protein resynthesis, in their tissues.

他们一直在补水。

They're hydrating.

他们小睡。

They're napping.

他们睡大觉。

They're sleeping.

这些高强度训练之后，大多数高中生和大学生运动员根本没这个条件，也没这个精力去这么做，普通爱好者更别提了，生活还得继续嘛。

They're doing all these things after these severe sessions that most high school, college athletes don't have the privilege or, bandwidth to do, and most amateurs don't because life goes on.

对吧？

Right?

但对于顶尖运动员来说，这种压力加恢复的模式，本来就是训练体系里不可或缺的一部分——压力加上恢复，才能带来进步。

I mean but for an elite athlete, that is part a parcel of the training process is that stress plus recovery equals growth.

对吧？

Right?

如果我们忽视了训练后恢复所需的深度，压力就会累积，结果不是我们想要的超量恢复和适应，而是精疲力尽，然后莫名其妙地卡在瓶颈期，还纳闷儿：怎么就是提不上去？

When we don't pay attention to or respect the the depth of recovery that we needs to happen after this, that's when we get the stacking of stress and then we get, you know, rather that super compensation and that adaptation we want, we get to exhaustion, we scratch our head and go, hey, why are we stagnating and plateauing?

是的。

Yeah.

没错。

Exactly.

归根结底，还是得看压力和恢复的平衡，得把握好这个度。

It really does come back to that stress and adaptation and making sure that we've got the right balance there.

而且，我觉得这就是为什么最大摄氧量训练特别棘手。

And, again, I think that's why Vo2max stuff is is tricky.

值得再强调一下，它没有天然的限制来防止你做蠢事，比如破坏压力和休息之间的平衡。

It's worth reiterating is it doesn't have the natural barrier to keep you from doing dumb stuff in terms of put like, messing up that balance of stress and rest.

对吧？

Right?

没错。

Right.

这其实就是问题的关键。

And and and that's that's kinda what it is.

所以它回报很高，但也特别危险，因为一不小心就容易搞砸。

That's why it makes it so bang for your buck, but also, like, dangerous because, like, it's so easy to mess that up.

没错。

Right.

所以找到应对方法很重要。

And ways to mitigate that are important.

对吧？

Right?

我们之前聊过这个概念，就是关于所谓的乳酸或酸中毒物质的氧化过程。

We talked about this concept of, you know, oxidation of, quote, unquote, lactic or acidosis ingredients.

所以在你完成一次VO2max训练后，我开始采用一种非常有效的方法：在恢复阶段的初期，安排几组轻度有氧恢复跑。

And so after you do if you have a v o two max session, a paradigm I started using that has been really beneficial is the second part or the first part of the recovery, the initial part of recovery, are these flush, aerobic type reps afterwards.

这种恢复跑的距离可以很短，比如200米，适合中距离跑者，甚至包括高中生级别的跑者。

And it can be as short as 200, like, with middle distance runners or even milers, high school level.

就是以马拉松或者半马配速跑200米左右。

Like, it'll just be 200 meters at kinda, like, marathon half marathon type effort.

基本上落在有氧和无氧阈值区间的下限，也就是那个所谓的‘区间’里，但偏向更低强度的那一端。

So kinda more on the sub t side of that kind of aerobic or anaerobic threshold window that exists or that, you know, that zone, if you wanna call it that.

然后接下来是200米慢跑。

But on the lower end side of it, and then 200 meters, jog.

走一走，或者慢跑一下。

Walk, jog.

其实就这么简单，做两到五圈就行。

It can be that simple doing it for two you know, five laps.

对于年纪大一点的运动员，可以做八百米、一千二百米的恢复跑，甚至跑上一英里。

For older athletes, yeah, you can do flush eight hundreds, flush 12 hundreds, up to flush miles.

关键是得在一开始让身体进行有氧代谢的清理，帮助把那些乳酸代谢物尽快排出去。

But the important thing is you get that initial, you know, aerobic or oxidative flush into the body to help create that stimulation of getting all those lactic byproducts out.

我们现在知道，乳酸代谢物的清除速度比过去认为的要快得多，以前那种认为乳酸、延迟性肌肉酸痛和它们之间有直接关联的说法，其实根本站不住脚。

And we know that, you know, lactic ingredients can be flushed out much more rapidly than was once thought, which was once the accepted paradigm of lactic acid, DOMS, and that, you know, connection that is has actually no correlation or causation to one another.

是的。

Yes.

确实如此。

Very true.

我很高兴你提到这一点，我觉得这正是为什么在完成无氧训练或高强度运动后，做整理活动特别重要——它能直接影响你的恢复效率，也能减轻酸性代谢物对身体的冲击。

You know, I I like that you brought that up, and I think this is, you know, this is why I think the we'll say post workout or cool down activity is really important after v o two max or, like, anything faster is, like, you have the ability to influence the recoverability, but also the impact of that that kinda acidosis on you.

所以像你所说的这些方法，确实很关键。

It's like that's why, you know, things like you said are important.

你可以延长放松训练的时间。

You can, implement longer cool down sessions.

对吧？

Right?

我记得看过大卫·托兰斯的训练，愿他安息，他每次高强度训练后，都会跑几趟400米，速度刚好在乳酸阈值附近。

You can I remember watching, you know, David Torrance, rest of peace, but I remember watching him after a workout where, you know, what he would do is run a couple, four hundreds at kind of that threshold, subthreshold kind of pace after a hard session?

那时候你肯定会想，他这是在干嘛？

And you're just like, what are you doing?

结果人家说，这样能更快把体内的代谢物清理掉。

And it's like, oh, this just clear things out quicker.

所以我们得赶紧活动起来，好让身体尽快恢复，而不是让那些酸性物质一直滞留在体内，成为最后压着你的那股感觉。

So we get back on on on you know, so that I can bounce back off of this instead of letting it kinda sit in my system and be the last stimulus that I feel.

另外，补水也很关键。

You know, also too, that's where hydration comes into play too.

比如喝点含糖的运动饮料，像佳得乐这种简单的就行。

Like, a sugar solution, like, you know, something even as simple as Gatorade.

做完之后马上喝几口，让身体吸收进去，有助于提升血糖水平，也能促进糖原更快恢复，这一点也很关键。

Right after you do that, you know, taking a couple sips, getting that into the body, that will help, you know, your blood sugar levels, you know, perk up, which will also too allow a little bit and foster a little quicker glycosyl replenishment because that's key as well.

所以你看，这里头其实涉及不少重要的原则和核心要点。

So, you know, it's understanding there's lot of, big rocks or principles at play here.

很多时候，VO2 max训练效果打折扣，问题不在训练本身怎么安排。

And oftentimes, the culprit of corrosion in v o classic v o two max sessions isn't the application of the session.

而在于训练后没给身体足够的恢复时间，忽视了恢复的窗口期。

It's the lack of, recovery or recovery or respect to the recovery time horizons after the session.

就连那些顶尖选手，特别前沿、总是追求进步的创新者，比如迈克·史密斯这样的人，也难免会犯新手才会犯的错。

And that's, you know, again, where I say, even someone who is at the top of their game, you know, really, you know, very progressive, like an, an early adopter, an innovator, someone who's always, you know, trying to get their training a little bit better like Mike Smith, can sometimes make a rookie error.

因为这种错误实在太容易犯了。

And it's because it's easy to do.

是啊。

Yep.

谁还没犯过错呢。

We all mess up, man.

就是这么回事。

Mean, that's it.

这得看情况。

It it just depends.

你有没有勇气承认错误，然后去改正？

Are you going to be you know, have the humility to mess up and then correct?

是的。

Yeah.

没错，就是这样。

And And that's yeah.

你接着说。

Go ahead.

关键就在这儿，这才是精髓所在。

That was just kinda that's where the magic lies.

你明白的。

You know?

关键就在于明白这一点，你知道的。

That's what it's all about is, like, understanding that, hey.

有时候我们肯定会出错，但得学会改正。

Like, sometimes we're gonna mess up, and we need to correct.

我还想说一点，不是非要揪着不放，但最简单的方法就是让高中生多做高强度有氧训练，这样孩子们很快就能看到自己跑得更快了。

And the other thing I would say is also is, like, you know, not to harp on the point, but, like, the easiest thing you can do is a high school coach is just give a ton of v o two max where it can see kids get, quote, unquote, faster kinda pretty quickly.

但你也要尊重他们作为运动员的成长过程，尊重他们长期的发展和对运动的享受。

But, like, you have to have respect for their development as athletes, their development over time, their enjoyment of the sport, etcetera, etcetera.

所以，希望你能为他们打好基础，不管他们将来能不能上大学或进职业队，至少能让他们长期享受这项运动。

So hopefully, set them up for long term success if they are going to college or pro if they're lucky enough or, like, long term enjoyment of the sport if they, you know, don't.

因为那些高强度有氧训练，真的特别累人。

Because, like, those v o two max workouts can be utterly, you know, tough.

就是纯粹的苦活儿。

They're just a grind.

对。

Yeah.

其实说实话，你根本不用专门安排训练。

And that's honestly you don't have to do workouts.

你可以让早期的比赛本身就起到提升最大摄氧量的作用。

You can just have the early races be that v o two max stimulus.

对吧？

Right?

让八百米选手跑两公里。

Have your milers run two miles.

如果你在大学，就让八百米选手，甚至五千或一万米的选手。

Have you know, if you're in college, have your milers or, you know, even your five k or 10 k runners.

跑五公里。

Run five k's.

对吧？

Right?

因为赛季初期的目标，其实并不是为了马上出成绩，而是打基础。

Because, you know, the goal is not necessarily in the early part of the season is prep is performance.

我们的目标其实是为赛季末的巅峰表现做好准备。

The goal is to, you know, prepare for that kind of peak performance at the end of the season.

所以赛季初的比赛其实是很好的方式，能帮助达成这个目的。

So races are really early season races are really good tools and vehicles for that.

还有一点要注意，身体完全恢复或代谢掉乳酸这类物质所需的时间，往往比我们想象的要长，别像我大学时那样犯老毛病。

The other thing to also warrant too is knowing that the time horizons for, you know, complete restoration or oxidation, so to speak, of those lactic ingredients takes longer than we think is not to do the classic, which happened to me in college.

我们常常会在关键比赛前一周，搞个高强度的最后1英里计时赛，或者两公里、三公里计时赛，比如在越野赛或分区赛之前。

We're gonna do a hard, hard, you know, last mile time trial or two k, three k time trial the week before, you know, this peak cross country race or the week before, you know, districts or something.

对吧？

Right?

是啊，确实如此。

And it's like, yeah.

那场比赛本该是你真正拼尽全力的时候。

That's your race.

结果你却把全力一搏留在了训练场上。

You left your race on the practice track.

但那时候做这种测试训练非常普遍，因为它能让运动员在赛季关键时期对自己更有信心。

And that was but that was very common to do was that test effort because it gave people confidence in their ability going into that championship time of season.

但与此同时，不幸的是，这种训练一做完，运动员下周的巅峰表现能力就大打折扣了。

But at the same time, unfortunately, you know, shot also their capacity to perform at that level the week after that session was executed.

是的。

Yeah.

有时候，我觉得这其实源于教练们的不安全感。

You know, when sometimes I should say this comes from we'll we'll call it insecurity from the coaches.

像这种训练——无论是跑一英里的计时赛，还是高强度的无氧阈值训练，比如四组一英里，不管是什么形式，大家往往觉得这些才是衡量体能的最直接标准，因为它们和比赛高度相关。

Like, these types of sessions, whether that mile time trial or that, like, really hard Vo2max session, four by mile, whatever it is, those are often your quote, unquote best indicators of, like, fitness because they're, like, specific to the race.

对。

Mhmm.

所以人们就会产生这样的想法：我八百米跑出了这个成绩，

So people would get these ideas of, oh, I ran my eight hundreds at this.

我一千米也跑出了这个成绩。

I ran my thousands at this.

我能以这个速度比赛。

I can, you know, race at this pace.

这确实有它的道理。

And there's, you know, some legitimacy towards that.

但很多时候，我们开始把训练当作一种证明，对吧。

But, like, that is often where we start to use the workouts as, like, proving ground Mhmm.

对。

Mhmm.

而不是把它当作促进适应的刺激手段。

Instead of, like, stimulus for adaptation.

是的。

Yeah.

这其实又回到了那个观念，每个人都会被无氧阈值训练吸引，觉得特别有吸引力。

You know, it goes back to this concept of everyone is, it's very seductive and enticing, the v o two max session.

对吧？

Right?

因为这能证明你训练中取得的进步。

Because it is proof of the gains you have made in training.

但很多时候，由于长跑的能量消耗特性，以及恢复所需的时间与能量物质耗尽密切相关，我们没法像短跑、投掷或跳跃运动员那样频繁地在训练中做测试——毕竟我们的恢复周期更长，还伴随着更大的能量消耗。

And a lot of times, we, unfortunately, because of the energetics of distance running and then the recovery time horizons wedded to the depletion of those energetic substrates, we don't get to, like, do a lot of, like, tests in training, like, say, sprinters might, throwers might, or jumpers might because, you know, we just have longer restoration time horizons because we're also dealing with a lot of energetic, depletion.

所以我们的测试方式有点像‘试炼’，就像你说的，这反而容易让人产生不安。

So our tests are racist, and it's kinda it's kinda like, you know, as you said, it creates insecurity.

它会让人感到迷茫，因为你根本不确定自己现在到底处在什么水平。

It creates, you know, disorientation because you're not really sure where you're at.

这时候，如果你经历过整个周期，了解大多数人是如何对系统性刺激做出反应的，就会有帮助。

And that's where having been through the cycle, having understand how, you know, typically, most people adapt to, you know, a systematic stimuli helps.

但同时也要明白，我们并不需要突然取得巨大突破。

But, also, too, it's understanding we don't need to have these big leaps.

你不需要从一开始的九分三十二秒，一下子就跳到九分一十秒。

You don't need to go from, oh, yeah.

那种突然的飞跃，并不是必需的。

I was a, you know, nine thirty two mile to now I'm, you know, nine ten all of a sudden.

你可能只是稳得很。

It can be you're just solid.

你总是跑在九分十五秒左右，上下差不了多少。

You're always around, like, nine fifteen plus or minus.

如果你能稳定地跑出九分十五秒左右的两英里成绩，不管天气是刮风寒冷，还是闷热潮湿，这种稳定性会让你更有信心在比赛当天发挥出真实水平，真正去跟别人竞争，而不是老盯着计时器，靠起步阶段的节奏来判断今天是好是坏。

And having that stability in your performance capacity can set you up for a lot of success because if you know you can run around nine fifteen for two mile no matter what, whether it's windy and cold or a little bit hot and humid, that gives you a lot more, confidence in the ability to perform on the day and actually compete in the moment against other people versus looking at the clock and then making calculations of is this a good day or a bad day based off early pacing indicators.

是的。

Yeah.

关键就在于你到底想做什么，想达成什么目标。

It really is kind of that nuance there, you know, of what are you trying to do and what are you trying to accomplish?

我觉得现在连高中阶段都变了，我们之前聊过太多次了，但确实现在更看重时间了。

And I think part of what has changed this is, like, even at the high school level is there's, like, a and we've talked about this ad nauseam, but there's a shift towards more time.

没错。

Mhmm.

对吧？

Right?

去跑一场节奏稳定的比赛，拿个成绩。

Go run your paced race and get your time.

或者在越野跑里，直接去那条固定的跑道，跑个快速五公里，而不是等到比赛当天才去凑合。

Or even in cross country, like, go to whatever that place running lane is and get your fast five k versus, you know, show up to race.

我觉得这正是那种自然而然推动你达到更高水平的因素。

And I think this is one of those kind of natural items that pushes that to that level.

那我们到底想做什么呢？

It's like, well, what do we wanna do?

我们当然想跑得快，打破个人最好成绩。

Well, we wanna run fast and get our our PR down.

这就容易让人过度强调那种咬牙硬撑、极限压榨的训练方式，因为计时赛本来就是这么回事。

So, you know, that emphasizes overemphasizes, like, these kind of very tough, kinda ride the line grind it if because that's kinda what a time trial type race is gonna be like.

是的。

Yeah.

大满贯现象说的正是这个意思。

The grand slam phenomena is exactly that.

这些成绩可是轰动全球的壮举。

Like, we those are the shots heard around the world.

你知道吗，在美国，现在有多少高中男生跑进4分钟以内？

Like, you know, with boy high school runners in The US, how many boy high school runners are under sub four now?

这其中很大一部分原因，要归功于超级跑鞋带来的影响。

And it's like, a lot of it has to do with the impact and influence of super shoes.

但真正有意思的是，看看这些因为打破四分钟大关而获得短暂关注的运动员，他们接下来如何适应其他更真实的比赛环境。

But what's gonna be interesting is seeing how these grand slam, you know, athletes who got a little bit of micro fame because of this grand slam of sub of this one sub four mile race in a, you know, very well set up environment actually transition and adjust to different competitive crucibles.

归根结底，无论是在中学阶段还是职业层面，我们的项目始终看的是比赛当天的成绩——无论是马拉松大赛，还是锦标赛的各个轮次，甚至是一场单独的赛事。

Because at the end of the day, our sport is still driven towards at the scholastic level and even the professional level at where you place where you place on the day, whether it's a major marathon, whether it's, you know, championships and rounds of championships, whether it's an individual race.

没错。

Yes.

成绩确实有它的故事性，也确实重要。

Time is a story, and time does have import.

很多人能通过成绩来理解故事，因为他们自己也有马拉松成绩，能对比出谁快谁慢。

And a lot of people can understand from a story and tell you perspective time because they can go, oh, my marathon times this, their marathon times that.

哇哦。

Wow.

真快啊。

That's really fast.

这塑造了一种方向感。

It creates that orientation.

但与此同时，归根结底还是比拼。

But at the same token too, it comes down to competing.

关键在于名次。

It comes down to placing.

我们现在看到的一个好例子，比如凯特琳·图伊。

A good example of that, right, that we're seeing now is, like, say, Caitlin Tuohy.

她一直是个拼命竞争的选手，核心就是不断去拼、去争。

Like, she was always a competitor competing, and that's the concept is compete, compete, compete.

她成功把这一点变成了自己的优势，赢下了全国越野赛冠军，现在作为大学生运动员，也成了NIL职业选手。

And it's she's leveraged it in her favor, right, winning cross country nationals, now becoming a you know, the NLI professional athlete as still a college athlete, you know, or n NIL.

不好意思。

Sorry.

就是，你懂的？

It it you know?

但核心还是赢比赛。

But the concept is still race to win.

从根本上说，我们得重新定义‘赢’——不只是看成绩有多快，很多聪明的高中教练都这么看，他们跟我聊过，说赢其实是从‘拼命冲’到‘稳住节奏’的心态转变。

And, fundamentally, we have to define winning not just solely as what times you ran, but, like, as a lot of smart high school coaches listen to this have done and have talked to me about it is they define it as, like, say, you know, from, say, hood to count hood to coast mentality.

对吧？

Right?

你所谓的‘击倒人数’或者‘淘汰多少人’是多少？

What's, your quote, unquote body count or roadkill?

最后一英里你能超过多少人？

Like, how many people can you pass in the last mile?

最后400米你能超过几个？

How many people can you pass in the last 400?

因为这样能告诉运动员，真正重要的是全力以赴，当天和别人真刀真枪地比，而不是只盯着计时器或者跑道边的大钟看。

Because that then signals to the athlete what's important is about laying it all out there, going for it, trying to, you know, compete against other people on the day versus solely being motivated by what the stopwatch says or that, you know, big clock on the side of the track says.

这是一个很关键的区别。

It's a important distinction.

而且我觉得，这里头其实有很多微妙之处。

And I think, again, there's there's nuance here.

我们不是说成绩一点都不重要，但你确实得培养出比赛的本事。

We're not saying times are never important, but, like, you gotta develop that racing that racing ability.

你明白的。

You know?

尤其是当你逐渐往上走的时候。

And, you you know, especially as you kinda move up the things.

我觉得凯特琳·图利就是一个很好的例子，她从高中到大学都得到了很好的指导，知道该怎么应对这种情况。

And I I think Caitlin Toohey is a a great example of someone who's been coached well in high school and then also collegiately on how to Right.

处理好这种心态。

Handle that.

说到男性选手，我第一个想到的是路易斯·卡布拉尔。

The men's counterpart to this off the top of the head is like Luis Cabral.

对吧？

Right?

路易斯从来不是每年最顶尖的越野跑选手。

Luis was never a top cross country runner on annual.

我觉得他从来没当过队里第一号人物。

He was never, I think, ever the number one man.

对吧？

Right?

但他特别稳定，擅长比赛，一上场就特别兴奋。

But he was very dependable, could race, got excited to race.

到了田径赛道上，他才真正开始变得自信，懂得怎么去比赛。

And then he on the track is where he really started to, like, grow into being confident racing.

结果突然间，这人拿了五公里世锦赛第四名，差点拿下全球奖牌，你都得问一句：这谁啊？

And then all of a sudden, this guy gets fourth in the world in the five k, almost wins a global medal, and you're like, who?

这人从来没拿过冠军，但一直都在参赛。

This guy's never won anything, but he was always competing.

关键就在于这种竞争的冲动和心态，正是我们最推崇的那些顶级运动员身上具备的，比如迈克尔·乔丹、泰格·伍兹这类人。

And that's the thing is that competitive impulse and competitive mindset is what we esteem in some of the greatest athletes out there, like, you know, the Michael Jordans of the world, the, you know, Tiger Woods of the world.

他们可能在场下并不是最完美的人，但一上赛场，思考方式和应对问题的态度就完全不一样，因为他们看重和追求的东西，跟大多数人根本不在一个量级上。

Maybe not the best people, like, off the the the field, but when they're on in the competitive arena, they approach the problem differently and they think differently than most other people because what they esteem and prioritize is, you know, outpaced or much different and outsized from what the majority of people, esteem and emphasize.

所以我们应该研究他们在赛场上的心理机制，而不是因为他们私下做出有害的决定，就一并推崇他们。

So it's important to study their psychology in the competitive arena and not necessarily also esteem them outside when they make, you know, very detrimental personal decisions.

是的。

Yep.

没错。

Exactly.

你说得太到位了。

I think you're spot on there.

非常准确。

Spot on.

好吧。

So alright.

关于刚才这场关于最大摄氧量的讨论，还有什么要补充的吗？

Anything else to add on this kind of v o two max tirade we went down?

和往常一样，我建议你去看看相关文献。

Well, as always, I will say look to the literature.

文献里有个很好的参考，史蒂夫的《跑步的科学》第五章，讲的是最大摄氧量的误区。

And a good point in the literature is Steve's OG, the science of running, chapter five, the fallacy of v o two max.

如果你想找一个简洁、有证据支持的解释，说明为什么最大摄氧量需要被理解但也要谨慎对待，这本书是个很好的起点。

I mean, if you want a really succinct evidence based discussion on why v o two max is something to understand and treat with caution, that's a really good place to start.

这就对了。

There you go.

还是回去看原著吧。

Go back to the OG, man.

《跑步的科学》。

Science of running.

我记得写那一章的时候，因为写了这个内容还挨了不少批评。

I remember writing that chapter and getting some heat from people for writing that chapter.

但我的意思并不是要彻底否定一切，说别再碰这些东西了。

But I think the idea isn't, again, to throw the baby out with the bathwater and say, hey.

别完全放弃这些方法。

Never do this stuff.

而是要明白，它确实有这些好处。

It's just to understand that, you know, here are the here are the benefits of it.

但也存在风险和陷阱。

Here are the dangers and pitfalls.

我们常常太贪心，急着去用、去榨取，其实还没到非用不可的时候。

And, too often, we kinda get caught being greedy and and trying to go somewhere and and exploit it before we really need to go there and exploit it.

说得对。

Yeah.

这其实是个马泽尔锤子的概念。

It's it's a concept of Mazel's hammer.

对吧？

Right?

有了锤子，看什么都像钉子。

If you have a hammer, everything's a nail.

这不过是工具箱里另一件工具，我到现在还在用。

And it's it's another tool in the toolbox, and I still use it.

我的意思是，当需求出现的时候，比如运动员——我举个我妻子的例子。

I mean, when the need is there, when the athlete like, I gave the example of my wife.

当她跟我说，嘿。

When she's like, hey.

我就是换不了挡。

I just feel like I can't change gears.

我就卡在这儿了。

I'm just here.

我真的做不了这件事。

I don't I I can't do this.

当然了，我们现在就得好好利用它。

By all means, it's let we now we need to exploit it.

但关键是要结合具体情况，明白你怎么做，直接影响恢复所需的时间。

But it has to happen contextually with, you know, the background of understanding that how you administer it creates different time horizons for restoration.

你就是得心里有数。

And so you just you just have to know.

很多时候，我们总是不自觉地只盯着努力这一块。

And a lot of times, we just all always gravitate towards the work.

对吧？

Right?

说白了，这正是《巅峰表现》那本书的核心观点。

I mean, that was, you know, peak performance's book in a nutshell.

我们太看重拼命工作了，却忘了同时为恢复留出空间，没有恢复，成长根本无从谈起。

It's like we overemphasize the import of the hard work without also concurrently, budgeting for the need for the recovery to foster that growth.

这一点特别重要，无论是从单次训练或赛季中几次训练的短期恢复，还是从长远来看——比如一个高中生，未来可能上大学、继续参加俱乐部比赛，他的整个成长周期都需要考虑这一点。

And that's the key thing with, you know, an acute transient scale from one session or a couple of sessions within a season, also to a longitudinal scale of the athlete's longitudinal horizon of development in general for that high school kid who will become a college, you know, competitor who might also just also wanna compete at a club level, post collegiately.

没错。

Exactly.

就是这样。

Exactly.

太棒了。

Love it.

好了，各位。

Alright, everybody.

希望这一期的内容对你们有帮助。

Well, hopefully, you found something useful in this episode.

如果觉得有收获，想摆脱社交媒体的负面情绪，那你知道吗？

If you did, if you wanna get off the doom of social media, well, guess what?

加入学者计划吧。

Join the scholar program.

来学者俱乐部吧。

Get in the scholar clubhouse.

这其实就是你的答案。

Like, this is your answer.

这就是你要找的地方。

So It's the spot.

如果你正在

If you're

寻找关于训练、恢复或实际应用的新思路，尤其是你现在正从越野跑转向田径，作为学校教练和运动员，现在正是加入的好时机，慢慢熟悉这个环境，因为这确实挺有意思的。

looking for new new ideas about training or recovery or application of it, you know, especially now as you're transitioning from cross country to track and field for Los Scholastic based coaches and athletes, this is a really good time to hop in and just kinda get used to that environment because it's it's one of those fun things.

这里总是特别热闹。

It's, like, always popping.

我现在每天早上第一件事，不是看新闻，也不是查邮件。

I mean, that is the first thing I look at in the morning now is not the news, not my email.

我第一个打开的网络互动，就是这个俱乐部。

The first, like, Internet engagement or digital engagement I have is the clubhouse.

我一看，哇。

I go, woah.

有人在这儿分享了一些很酷的内容。

Someone posted some cool stuff here.

这太棒了。

This is awesome.

特别喜欢。

Love it.

就是这样。

There you go.

赶紧加入吧。

Get on board.

去看看吧。

Check it out.

感谢大家收听。

And thanks everybody for listening.

我们非常感谢每一位听众。

We appreciate all you guys and gals.

那咱们下次再聊，各位。

So till next time, everybody.

保重。

Take care.

教练得很棒。

Good coaching.