Episode 225: The Magic is in the Man/Woman, Not the Miles.

我们希望整个团队能齐心协力，大家互相支持，团结一致。

We wanna do it collectively as a group dynamic as, you know, all for one and one for all.

这个道理你得明白。

That's you know, you gotta understand.

这就是熵增的规律。

It's entropy.

阻力确实很大。

Friction costs are high.

别放弃，继续往前推。

Just keep pushing.

坚持把这件事做下去。

Just keep trying to deliver it.

一旦真把势头带起来了，那可就太棒了。

Because then once you get that momentum oh, boy.

那时候特别有意思。

It's a lot of fun.

天哪。

Like, oh, boy.

就这样，对了。

Like, there we go.

你懂的。

You know?

每个人都想参与进来，成为其中一员。

Everyone wants to start to tap in and be a part of it.

我觉得对教练们或者运动员们来说，你们得先说，好吧。

And I think for the coaches out there or the athletes out there, you gotta say, okay.

我该怎么为自己的处境带来一点动力，让你自己和别人都能跟上节奏，一起加入进来呢？

How can I start to deliver a little momentum to my circumstance and situation and, you know, create the capacity and others to reciprocate and join the party?

因为这才是真正关键所在——人越多，奇迹越多。

Because that's really, really what it's all about, more magic with more people.

说白了，这其实特别简单。

I mean, you know, it's super simple in that regard.

然后突然间，你开始实施的一切——训练、练习、举重、团队谈话、比赛中的竞争氛围——全都开始提升、升级。

And then all of a sudden, everything you start applying, the workouts, the drills, the lifting, you know, the team talks, the competitive energy at meets, all that all starts to elevate and escalate.

如果你是在远程在线指导运动员，那就要确保你所带的这些远距离运动员，身边有一个完整的支持网络。

And if you're in a situation where, like, say, you're coaching online remotely or whatever, it's making sure, like, with those athletes you're working with from afar that they have an integrated support network built in.

也许他们没有别人能和他们一起做同样的训练，但至少可以找到一些人，一起轻松地联结一下，比如在恢复日做做瑜伽之类的，让支持的文化融入他们的生活圈，这样他们的旅程才能持续下去。

Maybe they don't have people who can do those same workout with them, but perhaps they have individuals that they can, you know, link up and tap in with for easy days or simple, you know, like, more relaxed, like a yoga session or something just so there is some culture of support integrated into their network so the journey can be sustained.

没错。

Absolutely.

我突然想到关于情绪传染的研究，本质上说的是，你认同的人、你身边的人，情绪真的是会传染的。

I think I I I I'm reminded of the research on emotional contagion, which essentially says that, you know, those people that you identify with, that you surround yourself with, like, emotions are contagious.

比如有一项研究显示，如果教练在场边暴躁大吼，球员就会感到沮丧，要么犯规更多，要么表现更差，因为这种情绪会从教练身上蔓延到整个团队。

So one of the one of the studies, for example, showed that, like, the coaches if the co if a coach was overly angry and screaming on the sideline, it made the players feel frustrated and either commit more fouls or, you know, play worse because that emotion is getting transpired from the coach everywhere else.

类似的研究在各种运动中也证实了，不管是负面还是正面的情绪，只要某个领导者专注投入，这种状态都会在整个团队中传播。

And the same similar research has been shown on on players and athletes in a variety of sports that shows, like, you know, in both ways, negative and positive, like, if some leader, someone whose focus is on it, like, that spreads across the team.

我觉得这恰恰说明了团队的力量——它远不止是简单地喊一句‘团队’这么回事。

And and I think I think that's, you know, speaks to the, the power endeavor of of of the team aspect is it's not just like, you know, oh, team.

这听起来不错。

This sounds good.

就像孩子们说的，情绪是会传染的。

It's that we you know, to use the kids' language, the vibes are contagious.

对吧？

Right?

人与人之间的情绪状态会相互影响。

The vibes are gonna shift among people.

我觉得在跑步、越野跑或者田径这类团队项目中，这一点特别明显。

And I think especially in running that in cross country and team aspects like that or track that that holds forth.

我记得很多次，当我还在休斯顿队的时候，我们的主教练勒罗伊·伯雷尔总爱说，田径比赛也有自己的节奏。

And I remember so many times, you know, when I was part of the Houston team, our head coach Leroy Burrell would always talk about he was he would talk about the momentum of a track meet.

对吧？

Right?

每次参加联盟比赛前，他都会说，我们需要让比赛的节奏带动起来，让好状态一环扣一环地延续下去。

When we would go into the conference meeting, he would say, we need some momentum of the track meet where things built upon each other.

而且，具体怎么发展，他总会说，我们需要一个人来点燃这个势头，扭转整个局面。

And, you know, depending on which way things would go, he would say, we need someone to be that spark, someone to shift that momentum.

对吧？

Right?

有时候情况看起来有点不妙，比如比赛一开始，整个队伍都在观望，能量会往哪个方向走。

If things were kinda looking a little sketchy because, like, you know, you start the track meet, and and and it's almost the team is looking for what way the energy is gonna flow and go.

在那么多分区比赛中，我们经常一开始状态不太好，但突然就有人站出来，做了一件大事。

And inevitably, they're at so many conference meets, we'd we'd be looking a little sketchy, and then someone would would show up and do something.

你懂的。

You know?

那个点燃势头的瞬间，一下子就扭转了局面。

And that that momentum spark would shift it.

我特别欣赏的是，这种关键时刻往往都是短跑、跳跃、投掷选手，或者中距离运动员干出来的。说实话，这些不同项目的队员平时根本没什么交流。

And what I loved about this is this was often among sprinters, jumpers, throwers, you know, distance athletes, middle distance athletes, where it's like, you know, if we're honest, like, sometimes these guys barely talk to each other in certain groups.

对吧？

Right?

但总会有那么一个人，能突然带动整个节奏。

There's like but there was always something that connected where it's like, up, there's the momentum changer.

那就是我们需要的火花，团队一下子就能被点燃，顺势而上，或者反过来也一样。

That's the that's the spark we needed, and the team would kinda take off and grow and flow or vice versa.

你懂的。

You know?

虽然不常发生，但偶尔也会有这样的情况。

Not all often, but every once once in a while, that would occur as well.

所以我一直觉得，这种势头不仅体现在比赛日，训练时也同样重要。

So I I always think of it as as that is, like, it's it's that momentum both in race day and and stuff, but also in practice.

你给训练带来的是什么样的氛围？什么样的能量？

Like, what vibes, what energy are you bringing to practice?

你树立了什么样的标准？

What standards are you setting?

因为这些都会改变团队的风气——什么被鼓励，什么被接受，甚至包括我们几点到训练场，带着什么样的态度来训练。

Because that shifts that momentum of what's incentivized, what's acceptable, even things like when we show up to practice, at what time we show up to practice, what attitude we show up to practice.

这些都会在大家之间不知不觉地传递开来。

Like, that all gets gets kind of transmitted amidst everybody else.

是的。

Yeah.

谢谢你提到这个势头的问题，史蒂夫。

I'm so glad you brought that momentum thing, Steve.

确实如此。

Like, it it's true.

这就是我这么喜欢田径团队项目的原因。

That's why I love team track and field.

对吧？

Right?

当你参加区级、地区级或锦标赛的时候，这种感觉尤其明显。

It's why it's so awesome when you are in a context of having a a district regional conference meet.

因为一旦有人表现突出，或者遇到困难时挺了过来，这种反应对接下来上场的队友来说，意义重大。

Because if someone does something and, you know, and elevates or someone, you know, does has adversity, and then that response that is available to the rest of the team coming up in the run a show of meats is so important.

对吧？

Right?

就像那年你们冲全国冠军的时候，布莱恩在障碍赛里摔了，情况挺糟的。

It's kinda like, say, you know, that year you guys were trying to win the national championship at And, you know, Brian went and he fell in the steeple and this and that.

但这件事反而激励了其他队员，比如四乘一百米和一百米的选手。

But it sparked in other guys on, like, the four by one and the 100.

好吧。

Like, okay.

真够呛。

Shit.

行吧。

Alright.

我们本来指望布莱恩拿分的，现在得重新调整策略了。

Well, we gotta down level up because we thought we're gonna get these points from Brian.

所以咱们得加把劲，把水平提上去。

So now we gotta, you know, step our game up.

对吧？

Right?

真正的回应就在这里面。

And that's where the competitor's response is.

真正的关键在于这个人本身。

That's where the magic's in the person.

我们常常就说，行吧。

And so often, we just say, okay.

训练我们都做完了。

We did the workouts.

身体状态也准备好了，可以出发了。

We're ready to go because we're physically fit.

但比赛那天，我们以前也说过，你得再加把劲。

But on race day, we talked about this before, you have to bring extra.

对吧？

Right?

你得进入一种心理状态，告诉自己，好吧。

You have to be in a mental space where it's like, alright.

我必须比平时训练时多拿出10%的精力来应对这场比赛。

I gotta bring 10% more to this than I did in any workout possible.

我在身体上已经做好了准备。

I'm prepared physically to do it.

我已经付出了应有的努力。

I've done the work.

没错。

Yes.

但过程不会轻松。

But it's not gonna be easy.

不会轻易得到的。

It's not gonna be handed out.

你懂的。

You know?

这东西不是别人会送上门来的。

It's it's not gonna be given.

我觉得我们有时候就搞错了重点，总觉得人家跑得快啊，参加了个计时赛，拿了全国或者全州最快成绩之类的，说来说去就是这些。

And that's where I think sometimes we lose the plot is thinking, oh, they ran so fast, or they did this time trial race, and you have the fastest time in the nation or the state and blah blah blah blah blah.

但真正关键的是，你得能挺进那种最艰难的境地。

But then it comes down to actually being in the junk, so to speak.

因为任何锦标赛、任何高水平比赛，从来都是一团乱，总出岔子，计划赶不上变化，但关键是你得有本事应对，然后说不。

Because any championship meet, any kind of high performance meet is always messy, always sloppy, doesn't always go to plan, but it's having that ability to respond and say, no.

不行。

No.

不行。

No.

不行。

No.

我付出了这么多努力，不可能就此放弃。

I worked way too hard for this.

不行。

No.

不行。

No.

不行。

No.

这些人可都指着我呢。

These people are depending on me.

不行。

No.

不行。

No.

不行。

No.

不行。

No.

我必须把这事搞定。

I gotta get this done.

体育中这种能力能迁移到生活的方方面面——不管是当伴侣、父母，还是在工作中担任领导角色，关键就在于学会说不。

That's a quality in sport that then is transferable to everything in life, whether you're gonna be a spouse, you know, a parent, a, you know, leader in your business operations at some level, that transference of saying, no.

不行。

No.

不行。

No.

别人还指着我呢。

People are depending on me.

我得出现，得交出成果。

I gotta show up and deliver.

我们说的就是这个。

That's what we're talking about.

真正神奇的事，就发生在这种时候。

That's where magical things happen for people.

但有些人就是随便露个面，说‘我可是下了功夫的，看看我的作品集，看看我的Strava记录，看看这个’，然后就问：‘为什么没人直接给我个奖杯呢？我这四个月的训练数据可是最帅的！’

But people who just show up and say, I've done the work, look at my portfolio, look at my Strava log, look at this, and then they go, oh, why didn't someone just hand me a trophy because I had the sexiest training profile here for the last four months?

这类人总会碰壁，直到他们明白：你练的其实是那些乱七八糟的状况。

Those people always will struggle until they understand, like, you're training for the slop.

在任何高绩效的领域，都会有一大堆杂乱和挫折，但如果你已经准备好迎接它，期待它，身心都适应了它，那才真叫厉害。

In any type of high performance endeavor, there's a lot of slop and chop, but it's if you're ready for it, if you're excited for it, if you're conditioned for it, if you're prepared mentally and emotionally for it, then wow.

小心点吧。

Watch out.

是的。

Yeah.

完全正确。

Absolutely.

我觉得这么说还挺贴切的。

I mean, I I think I think that's the way to kind of put it.

而且我也很喜欢你刚才说的，我们其实是在为生活做准备，因为我觉得这才是真正的转移——当你看到那些运动员能保持自律、坚持到场、理解背后真正需要的东西时，这种能力会渗透到你做的每一件事里。

And I also like that you said, like, we're preparing for life on these things because that's what I think that's what I think this transfers over to is that when you see athletes who are able to, you know, get that discipline, get that showing up, get that I idea behind, like, what it takes and what we're trying to do, like, that goes to every endeavor and and everything that you do.

这也就是我经常跟以前的队友开玩笑的原因。

I mean, this is why I often joke with my former teammates.

我们其实一直在用这些学到的经验。

I'm like, you know, we use these lessons that we learned all the time.

就连跑步这项运动，回溯历史，我们之前提到过鲍曼和莱迪亚德。

And I think even in in running, you know, going back to history, we talked about Bowerman and Lydiard.

说到莱迪亚德，大家总爱纠结于他的训练方法具体是怎样的。

And often when it comes to Lydiard, so much is spent on, like, the well, what was the Lydiard's method?

比如基础阶段跑多少里程，然后是山坡训练、间歇跑、冲刺调整这些细节。

The the miles run-in the base phase and then the hill holes and then the intervals and and sharpening and all that stuff.

但莱迪亚德真正了不起的地方，是他让一群住在同一片小区域的人，持续地以极高水准训练，这种做法在当时已经很久没人这么做了，甚至可以说是几十年来头一回。

But the the magic of Lydiard was it was he convinced a bunch of guys, all living in this small little area, to do training at a high level consistently that really hadn't been done in that way for a while, like, forever.

对吧？

Right?

这其实是一种全新的训练升级。

It was a new kind of, like, level up of training.

扎多佩克以前也练得很多，但那会儿整天都是间歇训练。

Like, Zadopec did a ton before, but it was, like, all intervals all day.

而莱迪亚德不一样，他说：嘿，

And and Lydia, it's like, hey.

咱们试试这个方法，大量长跑，再加上山坡冲刺、各种高强度训练，全都要来一遍。

We're gonna try this thing where we run a ton and, you know, do these fast workouts in in in hill circuits and all that stuff.

咱们把所有这些都试一遍。

We're gonna try try it all.

他让这些人相信，即使我们全都来自这个小岛上的一个小地方，也能成为世界顶尖水平。

And he convinced them that, like, we can be among the best in the world even though we all can't come from, like, this very close little area on on a small island.

对吧？

Right?

他让他们坚持每天准时训练，长期不懈，最终看到成效。

And and convince them to show up and do the work consistently over the long haul so that they could see the benefit.

莱迪亚德的厉害之处在于，他让一群人连续几个月、几个月、几个月地一起进行高强度训练。

Like, the the benefit of Lidyard is, you know, again, he convinced guys to go months and months and months and months of training at a very high load together.

是的

Yeah.

你明白吧

You know?

当你

When you

仔细想想，这简直就像不可能完成的任务。

think about it, it was literally like mission impossible.

真的是不可能完成的任务。

Literally mission impossible.

但我觉得我们还得提一点，那就是他也和他们一起跑。

But the other thing too I think we have to, like, call out is he also ran with them.

他就在那儿拼命跑，还说：

He was out there hammering and saying, hey.

我也在练，而且我也不算厉害。

I'm doing this too, and I'm I'm no good.

我都老了。

I'm old.

我都四十几岁了，具体多少不重要。

I'm 40, 45, whatever.

对吧？

Right?

但他却真的和他们一起在那儿拼命练。

But he'd be out there hammering alongside with them.

我觉得，很多人其实也不明白这一点。

And I think, like, that's the thing people also don't understand too.

就连早年鲍尔曼那时候，杰瑞的手下都是职业选手了，杰瑞自己还陪着他们在霍利斯特一圈圈地跑。

It's like even in the early days of, you know, Bowerman when it was Jerry's guys, when they were pros, Jerry was out there in the, like, fall hammering laps around Hollister with them.

我说的那个人就是我。

I mean, I'd so and so was I.

我也跟他们在一块儿，一跑就是十英里、十二英里，配速六分半，一直陪着跑。

I'd be hanging out and, like, we're hammering laps at, you know, six minute five thirty pace for 10 miles, 12 miles at a time right alongside.

所以啊，教练也在拼，这下子我可不能偷懒了。

So it's like, oh, coach is doing it too.

你看，人家都这么拼，我哪好意思松懈？

You know, I can't slack.

这老头都一把年纪还这么拼，我这个本该又快又健壮的，难道要当拖后腿的那个？

This guy's old and out of shape, and I'm supposed to be the fat fist or, fast and fit one here?

我真得加把劲了。

Man, I better level up.

不是这样的。

No.

还有件事我想说，确实到后来会很难，但你想想这个例子，还有谁像他一样年纪大了还坚持训练？比如珀西·萨拉迪。

And and there's something also I I get it that at some point that becomes hard, but, like, you look at that example, you know, who else was doing that and also, you know, was older and got dropped, but Percy Sarady.

对吧？

Right?

你去看看YouTube上他爬沙丘的视频吧。

The go look at the videos that are on YouTube of him hammering up the the sand dunes.

对吧？

Right?

再说一个我特别喜欢的故事，就是在埃利奥特赢得奥运金牌之前，塞里蒂做了什么？

Or one of my favorite stories, which was before Elliot won his Olympic gold, what does what does Serrity do?

他跑到热身跑道上，拼尽全力跑了个1500米。

He goes to the warm up track, runs all out 1,500.

全力以赴。

All out.

这位老先生当时应该已经六十多岁了，跑完1500米后走回去对埃利奥特说——我记不太清原话了，但大概意思是：你可能跑得比我快，但你不可能比我更拼。

This guy who, I think at that point was, I don't know, in his sixties, mid sixties, whereas all out 1,500 then goes back to Elliot and says, I'm gonna butcher the quote, but it's something like, you know, you may race faster than me, but you will not run harder.

意思就是，我也在经历这场战斗。

And saying, like, essentially, I'm I'm in this battle too.

我也在承受这份煎熬。

Like, I'm in this crucible.

我把全部都豁出去了。

I'm putting it out on on the line.

你明白吧？

You know?

我正在经历你即将面对的一切——那种努力，那种疲惫。

I'm I'm experiencing what you're gonna experience, the effort, the fatigue.

说白了，我们是在并肩打一场仗。

Like, we're going to a war essentially in in this together.

我觉得这其中有一种说不清的魔力。

And and I think there's something something magical, like, to to that.

而且我觉得，也不一定非得那样。

And I also think it doesn't have to be like, okay.

你陪着运动员训练，做这一套一套的动作。

You go train with your athletes and you do all this stuff.

但有一件事我一直特别喜欢，就是我当年跟汤姆·泰尔斯一起训练的时候，那时候他已经七十多岁了，我们正在练某个动作技术，他突然就停了下来，说：等一下。

But, you know, one of the things that I always loved when I was what training with, Tom Tales, and this was when he was in his seventies, right, is, you know, we'd be working on some biomechanics thing, and he'd sit there, and then then he'd just stop, and he'd say, hang on a minute.

然后他起身跑上几个来回，做几组步幅。

And he'd do a stride or two down the track and back.

他就会说：你这是在干嘛啊？

And he'd be like, what are you doing, man?

他会说：我想重新感受一下那种感觉，这样能更好地讲给你听。

And he'd be like, I'm trying to remember what it feels like so that I can explain it to you better.

你知道的。

You know?

这种参与感真的很特别，你会觉得：嗯，没错。

And there's there's just like this this little buy in in this experience where you're like, okay.

我们在把这件事和某种更深层的东西联系起来。

We're connect we're connecting it to something.

你知道的。

You know?

我们正一起踏上这段旅程。

We're on this we're on this journey together.

我们试着一起去体会、去理解那种感觉和经历。

We're, like, trying to understand, like, the feeling, the experience together.

也许那位老教练不像以前那样精力充沛，也没法做到所有事情，但他会努力站在我的角度去体会，这样才能更好地指导我。

And I might not be as like, the old coach might not be a spit and might not be able to do x, y, and z, but, like, they're trying to put themselves in my shoes so that they can experience it and, like, coach me up better.

我觉得这特别有力量。

And I think that's so powerful.

我还想说一点，我明显感觉到，当我跟休斯顿队一起训练的时候，和后来跟腱撕裂、小腿拉伤的那两年，也就是乔恩记得的那些伤病年份，完全是两回事。

And the other thing that I'd also say is, you know, I noticed a big difference between when I was training with the team at Houston and then my, you know, couple year period where my Achilles was torn and calves were straining because of it and all sorts of stuff that the injury bug years that Jon remembers.

那时候，我对团队的感知也跟以前不一样了。

And there was a difference between my, like, pulse on the team or not.

以前我训练的时候，会轮流和男队员、女队员一起慢跑，有时候也参加不同的训练小组。

Because I when I was training with the and I'd alternate between training with the guys and girls on easy runs, sometimes workouts, you know, different groups.

但当我坐在场边的时候，那种感觉完全不一样。

But my pulse was a little bit different when I was on the sideline.

我注意到了，而且很清楚地感受到了。

And I I noticed that, and I was aware of it.

而且我觉得，那种不同是朝着更糟的方向发展的。

And I and I think it was different in in a worse kinda way.

所以，如果你在听这个，心里想着，哎呀。

So and and if you're hearing this and you're saying, like, hey.

我没法跟队伍一起跑步。

I can't run with my team.

哪怕只是骑上自行车，跟在运动员后面或者旁边一起跑，这种经历我也觉得特别重要。

Even stuff like hopping on the bike and going on the you know, riding behind or next to some athletes on that stuff.

我高中教练就是这么做的。

Like, those experiences, I think And that's what my high school coach did.

他本身是短跑选手，不是长跑运动员。

Like, he was never he was a sprinter and not a distance runner.

但他天天骑着自行车，我们还故意带他冲沙坡、走各种路，就想甩掉他。

But, man, he was on that bike, and we'd try and take him up sand hills and all this stuff to kinda lose him.

有时候在那些险峻的小路上，他连人带车都摔了，可还是坚持骑着不放弃。

And sometimes, he'd, like, fall off the bike because we take him on these treacherous trails, but he still keep trying on that bike.

他这么做，就是为了能陪着我们、督促我们、更好地指导我们。

Like, it was there to, like, push and coach and all that stuff.

这种氛围让人感觉我们真的是一起在经历、一起探索，就像莉迪亚做的那样。

And there's something about that that creates that atmosphere more along the lines that Lydia did of, like, we're in this together, and we're gonna explore this.

而我在这里，就是想陪大家走完这段路。

And I'm here to help along this journey.

是的。

Yeah.

这可是真刀真枪地投入啊。

It's I mean, it's skin in the game.

对吧？

Right?

在田径、长跑和越野跑这项运动里，很少有教练只在场边看着，这正是它特别的地方。

It's just that's what our sport is affords a little bit more than maybe others is very there's very few sideline coaches in track and field, distance running, cross country.

你懂的。

You know?

如果你真是这么做的，那就得好好问问自己了。

And if you are, you have to really ask yourself, k.

我怎样才能从场边走到场内，真正和队员们在一起？

How can I get off the sideline and get more in the arena with my team?

因为当人们看到自己的领导者亲身经历艰难时刻时，这也会传递信息、定下基调，营造出一种团结和感染力的氛围。

Because when people see their leaders, you know, doing hard things themselves, that also sends a message, sets a tone, and creates a environment of cohesion and, contagion.

这种感染力能让那些犹豫不决的人心想：哦，原来如此。

And that contagious energy is something that allows maybe people who are on the fence to go, oh, well, hey.

如果连我那位老教练都这么拼，那我凭什么不行？

If if the old guy or gal, my coach, is doing this, then I can do it too.

也许我在成绩或量上达不到同样的水平，但那份努力是实实在在的。

Maybe not the same quality of output in terms of time or volume, but the effort is there.

那份干劲是存在的。

The energy is there.

我们人类天生就被这种干劲所打动。

And that's what we as human beings intrinsically respond to is energy.

作为教练，如果我们能展现出这种干劲，就能给队员洒下一点魔法般的火花，让他们彼此之间也互相传递下去。

And that energy as a coach, right, if we can demonstrate that, then we can create that sprinkle that magic, that kinda dust on our athletes, and then they can sprinkle it on each other and so on and so forth.

每个人的做法都不一样。

And everyone does it different.

对吧？

Right?

我的意思是，每个人营造这种能量的方式都不同。

I mean, everyone has a different way of creating that energy.

但最简单的方法，就是亲身去做，积极投入。

But the easiest way, right, is by doing and be fiercely active.

但也许你的处境不允许这样，这时候就体现出教练的创意了——得想办法通过语言、榜样作用或影响力来传递这种能量，而不是非得靠身体上的高强度付出，尤其是当你当前的条件不允许时。

But maybe your situation doesn't afford that, so that's where the, you know, create creativity of coaching comes in and figuring out how to create that energy maybe in word, indeed, or exposure, versus actual physical exertion if that is not afforded for you for your current circumstance.

没错。

Exactly.

我想起像弗兰克·阿利亚诺这样的人。

And I think of people like, you know, Frank Agliano, gags.

他确实会在跑道上拼命带训练，但他真正营造出的能量，更多是通过沟通——无论是跑道上对学员的激励，还是平时通过邮件、电话、短信这些方式。

Like, he went out there hammering intervals, but, like, the energy that he often would create through his communication, both on the track, you know, from people who are coached by gags, both on the track, but also off the track through emails, calls, texts, etcetera.

就是能感觉到，这人是真的在乎你。

Like, that there was just this understanding of, like, this guy cares.

他全身心投入。

He's invested.

我记得，虽然我和他接触不多，但有一件事我特别记得，就是我转学那会儿。

And I remember, again, I didn't have a I have had a lot of interactions with him, but I remember one specifically when I I transferred in in in college.

对吧？

Right?

我在莱斯大学待了两年，然后休学了一段时间，之后才转到休斯顿大学。

I did two years of Rice and then sat out and then did transfer to Houston.

那时候我是个天赋很高的学生，却过得特别艰难。

And I was this phenom who was struggling.

我记得，过了在莱斯的那两年，突然接到一个陌生号码打来的电话，当时我正在开车。

And I remember after, you know, the two years at Rice, I get this I get this call from this unknown number, and I'm driving.

那件事我到现在都记得清清楚楚。

I still remember it.

那时候他给我打电话，真是让我没想到。

And at this and it was it was gags.

他居然主动给我打电话。

It was gags calling me.

我当时就是个普普通通的大学生，从来没跟他讲过话。

And I was just some college, again, runner who had never talked to him.

那时候他正处于退役后的巅峰期。

And at this time, he's at the height of kind of his post collegiate.

我记得那时候他应该是在……

He's, you know, leading the the, at that time, I believe it was no.

好像是个发展队。

I think it was the farm team.

对，就是发展队。

It was the farm team.

对吧？

Right?

所以那正是职业田径队复兴的开端，因为之前那个小圈子已经消失了。

So it was like the renaissance of it it was the start of the renaissance of professional track teams because he had the enclave that went away.

田径运动一度沉寂，后来那个农场队又把它重新带了起来。

Track kinda went down for a while, and then the farm team was, like, raising it back up.

对吧？

Right?

那正是后来所有俄勒冈团队的前身。

Which was the precursor to all the Oregon ones.

他给我打电话，说：嘿。

And he calls and he's like, hey.

他跟我讲，自己现在怎么样怎么样。

You know, that I'm, you know, I'm blah blah blah.

他说：你根本不认识我，但我就是想告诉你，天赋不会消失，史蒂夫。

Like, you don't know me, but I just want I I just wanna tell you that, you know, talent doesn't go away, Steve.

你完全有可能变得很出色。

Like, you can you can you can be great.

就是，你知道的。

Like, you know?

他就给我来了一番打气的话。

And he just gave me this pep talk.

十五分钟后挂了电话，我心里就想，这太棒了。

And, you know, fifteen minutes later, hung up, and, you know, I was like, this is awesome.

我一下子充满干劲。

Like, I'm fired up.

我准备好了。

I'm ready.

我已经开始训练了。

I'm I'm training.

我永远不会忘记这件事。这位先生根本不认识我，我们从来没聊过，我也不知道他怎么弄到我电话的，但他看到一个高中时特别出色、大学却陷入困境的小伙子，就主动打来电话，只为给我一点动力和鼓励。

And it was just and I'll never forget that because it's like, here's this guy reaching out to me who never talked to him in my life, never had any conversation, have you know, don't know how he got my number, but he's he saw this kid who was good really good in high school, struggling college, and decided to reach out and provide just some energy and some inspiration.

这对我来说又是另一个例子：如果你没法和他们一起训练、一起跑步，或者做这些事，你到底该怎么做到呢？

And and that to me is another example of, like, well, how do you how do you do that if you can't train with them or run with them or do all this stuff?

就是这些小事，才真正让人明白其中的意义。

It's those small things that that really kind of create that, oh, this is this is what it means.

这才是我做这件事的方式。

This is this is how I do this thing.

这才是真正获得那种动力的意义——让我能把这份能量传递回运动、传递回我的探索、我的旅程、我的队友，让我们一起看到彼此能走到多远。

This is what it means to get that energy invested so that I can, like, pour it back into the sport, my exploration, my journey, my teammates so that we can see what we're capable of.

对。

Yeah.

我先岔开一下，想聊聊教练身上的那种魔力。

I'm gonna take a take a quick tangent here and actually talk about the magic in the coach.

对吧？

Right?

你提到的那些小细节确实很有道理。

Because you bring up a good point with gags.

他在场边时，那种气场和能量真的很特别。

He had a presence and an energy about him trackside.

凡是被他带过的人都知道，尤其是他晚年的时候，总是往田径场边的椅子上一坐。

Anyone who was coached by him knows this, but especially in his latter years, he just plopped down in a chair at the track.

你知道的，他带的是新泽西和纽约的田径俱乐部，运动员们都会过来跟他报到。

You know, he's doing the New Jersey, New York track club, and athletes would come up to him, check-in.

他们做完训练就走，可他就一直待在角落里，纹丝不动。

They go do their workout, but he would just be posted up in the corner.

你懂的。

You know?

但他身上有种气场，一种存在感，哪怕你从200米起点开始，也能听见他的声音。

But he carried an energy about him, a presence about him that you could hear him across the track if you were starting at 200.

就好像他拿着大喇叭，整个场地都听得见似的。

And it's just like he was on, you know, megaphone throughout the whole track.

他和Gags一样，大部分执教生涯里都坚持亲自带练，除了在俄勒冈项目和俄勒冈田径俱乐部那段时间。

And he and, you know, Gags famously practiced most of his tenure except for Oregon Projects, Oregon Track Club time at random mass practice tracks.

你去过乔治城大学那个奇怪的300米户外训练场吗？

Like, have you ever been to Georgetown's weird 300 meter practice track outdoors?

那地方简直是最滑稽的训练场地了。

It is, like, the most, you know, silly facility ever.

迈克·史密斯也在那儿带了很多年队员。

I mean, Mike Smith coached there for a long time as well.

对吧？

Right?

那地方可算不上什么顶级设施。

It's not like this amazing facility.

还有新泽西和纽约那边，也没啥像样的场地。

And then, you know, New Jersey, New York, they didn't have, like, the most amazing facility.

就是罗格斯大学的室内馆，还有天主教高中的户外跑道。

They you know, Rutgers indoor, this, you know, Catholic high school outdoor.

对吧？

Right?

关键根本不在这些上面。

It it's not about that.

关键是教练在现场的那种气场。

It's about the magic of the presence of the coach.

文也是这样。

Vin was the same way.

文在田径场指导的时候，整个人气场特别强，整个训练过程都被他掌控着。

When Vin was at the track coaching, he had a very big presence and demeanor over the session.

他就是特别积极，给的指导也特别清楚。

And his thing was just being very positive, giving clear direction.

迈克在带训练的时候，你一看就知道他在教。

When Mike's coaching, right, you will watch Mike coach.

情况都一样。

Same deal.

他在田径场上，气场特别足。

Big presence at, at the track.

杰里也是这样。

Jerry, same deal.

就连阿尔贝托也是这样。

Even Alberto, same deal.

这些年来，我亲眼见证的每一位朋友和导师，都是这样。你去耐克校园的田径场，直到今天我回去，还是能感觉到那种氛围。

Like, all these friends and mentors of mine who I've witnessed over the years, that was the one thing that, like you know, you go to the Nike Track at the campus, and now I go back, you know, to this day.

但现在的场地，总觉得少了点什么。

And it just seems kinda empty to me.

因为不再有那些人，带着同样的热情，全心全意投入到长跑训练这项事业里，让它变得如此特别、独一无二。

Like, because you don't have the same people there with the same energy giving kind of, like, their heart and soul into this endeavor called distance running or, you know, running training and making it something really special and unique.

现在他们分散在全国各地了。

The you know, they're sprinkled now more across the country.

但真正的魔力，其实也在教练身上。

But that was really like, the magic is in the coach as well.

我们必须找到办法，用我们的魅力去激励运动员，让他们去完成那些看似不可能的事——因为这从来都是核心。

And we have to figure out a way to be magical for our athletes to get them to do the impossible because that's really always what it is.

顺便提一下，我高中时的队伍富兰克林，今年在州锦标赛上表现简直炸裂。

I mean, shout out to my high school team, Franklin, who absolutely destroyed the state meet this year.

我的意思是，耶稣会中学，就是去年在NXN全国大赛拿到第二名的那支男生队伍。

I mean, Jesuit, right, boys who last year got number two in the nation at NXN.

对。

Mhmm.

他们是怎么做到的？完全是靠团队合作。

And how they do it, they did it as a team.

杰里和我看着比赛，就说：这些孩子是在为彼此而跑。

Like, Jerry and I were watching this and they go, oh, these guys are running for each other.

很明显，他们谁都不想拖队友的后腿。

Like, it was very clear that they were not gonna let each other down.

我高中时的教练，现在已经在那儿拿了两次冠军了。

And my high school coach, you know, he's now once two takes titles there.

那简直是不可能完成的任务。

It was mission impossible.

对吧？

Right?

这是东南波特兰，你知道的，那些经济和社会条件都比较困难的孩子。

This is Southeast Portland, you know, socioeconomically challenged kids.

跑步根本不是他们关注的事。

Like, running is not a thing.

你可以说富兰克林中学的项目不错。

You can talk about Franklin having a good program.

不对。

No.

是雅各布。

It's Jacob.

雅各布就是整个项目。

Jacob is the program.

他就是那儿的神奇所在。

He is the magic there.

每个人对他都有自己的看法，但我知道他到底在做什么，有多拼命。

And everyone has their opinion of him, but I know what he's doing and how hard he's working his butt off.

他为此付出了整整二十年的光阴。

And he's dedicated twenty years of his life to this.

看到这样的成果，真的太了不起了。

To see that success is phenomenal.

对吧？

Right?

但本质上，全靠他一个人扛下所有，把五到二十个孩子凝聚成一个整体，给他们机会去突破自我、创造非凡——不只是为自己，更是为彼此，建立起一生都难以割舍的情谊。

But it's just one person essentially taking it all on their back to then create a cohesive group of five to 20 kids and giving them that opportunity to elevate and do something really special and dynamic, not just for themselves, but for each other that will then create bonds that last a lifetime.

我们还看到了一些老校友，就是我刚在富兰克林当教练那几年带过的学生。

And, you know, we saw old alums out there, you know, athletes I had coached when I started coaching, you know, at Franklin for the first couple years of my career.

比如我高中时的队友泰勒·格林，现在在一所规模小点的学校当教练，他带的队伍成绩特别好。

I mean, it was I mean, my high school teammate, Tyler Green, who's a coach at a smaller school division, like, his teams won.

他带的女队拿了小型学校组的州冠军，男队拿了亚军。

The, his girls team won the small school division state title team title, and the boys team got second.

你看，从他，到泰勒，再到我，我们这一代代教练都在努力，把长跑和田径的激情带到波特兰大都会区，和所有其他优秀教练一起，这才真正形成了一个社区。

Like, to see that coaching tree versus him, you know, and Tyler and now myself here, all of us trying to, like, create and rally this energy around distance running and track and field in the greater Portland Metro Area along with all the other great coaches who are out here doing it, like, that's what creates community.

对吧？

Right?

但我们这些教练，大家目标一致，团结起来，明白我们手头的任务就是化无为有——这正是最优秀的教练一直在做的事。

But we as coaches, we got aligned and come together and understand the mission and the task we have at our disposal is to make literally something out of nothing because that's really what the best of us do and the best of us keep doing.

我太喜欢了。

I love it.

我觉得我没法再说得更好了，只能补充一点：那些长期做得出色的高中项目，就是最好的例子。他们走进学校，往往接手的是被其他项目淘汰的孩子，或者那些自己摸索出来的人，然后一点一点建立起独特的团队文化。

I I don't think I can top that, only to say that I think the high school programs, the ones who do it well and have done it well for a while, are great examples of that because they go into they go into these schools, and often they take kids who maybe got cut from other sports or or they just figure it out and, like, create this culture in this team.

优秀的项目就是这样建立起来的，而且他们就靠这种文化茁壮成长。

And the good programs, like, create that when and and and they thrive on it.

我很幸运，曾经参与过一个非常出色的高中团队文化。

And I was fortunate to be part of a, you know, a very good high school culture.

我的教练生涯是从带高中生开始的，我也努力打造了一个我认为很棒的高中团队氛围。

I've got my start in coaching high school kids and created a, you know, I think, a great high school culture.

我们当时就差一点能参加NXN了。

We just missed NXN.

有一年，我们在州锦标赛拿了第二名。

We're second at the state meet one year.

这真是个很好的提醒——不管在什么层级，只要你能营造出这样的氛围，让人充满干劲，有时候你就会想，嘿……

And and it's it's just it's it's it's nice to have that kind of reminder that it's like, you know, at whatever level it is, if you can create that kind of environment that empowers, that creates that sometimes, like, hey.

咱们试试看，做点不可能的事吧。

Let's try and do the impossible.

就这么干。

Let's do it.

这周我正好想到一件事，看到一个关于德州游骑兵队的采访，他们刚赢得世界大赛冠军，一垒手被问到：你们是怎么做到的？毕竟之前几年他们表现一直很差。

And I'm actually reminded this week, I saw a quote from, you know, in in Major League Baseball, the Texas Rangers won the World Series, and their first baseman afterwards, got interviewed and, you know, asked, well, how do you guys because they they essentially, you know, sucked for a couple years.

答案是：开心的球员。

And it said, happy players.

我跟你说，真的。

I'm telling you, man.

当一群球员真正开心的时候，你一定会看到最好的表现。

When you get happy players together, I think you are going to find the best performance.

接着他又提到，那种快乐的团队文化，让人愿意到场、愿意努力、愿意分享想法，全身心投入，他们正是打造了这样的氛围。

And then he goes on to to, you know, talk about how, like, is the culture of, like, happy players wanna show up, wanna work, wanna share ideas, and be fully invested, and that's what they created.

我觉得无论是在工作上，还是在我们的运动中，只要能营造出一种让人愿意投入、踏实付出、共同成长、真正参与其中并不断进步的环境，好事自然就会发生。

And I I think it's the same whether you're talking about work, whether you're talking about our sport, whatever, is if you can create an environment that that empowers people to show up, put in the work, like, share in that that growth, that development, and get invested in it and getting better, improving, etcetera, good stuff happens.

你看到的不只是那些亲身参与的人。

And you see it in in it's not just the people doing it.

对吧？

Right?

就像你提到的，还有那些校友，那些与团队有联系、愿意延续这种传统的人，真的特别让人感动。

It's, as you pointed out, the alums, the people who are connected, the people who want who are carrying on that legacy, and it's it's just so cool to see.

是的。

Yeah.

别把快乐和轻松混为一谈。

You know, let's not mistake happiness for ease and things like that.

真正的快乐，总是根植于某种意义。

Happiness is always kind of anchored in purpose.

有些人管这叫找到自己的人生意义。

And that's you know, some people call it finding your why.

意义才是关键。

Purpose is the key.

当你活在自己的使命里，做着内心真正认同的事，就会觉得：对，这就是我该用一生去做的事。

And when you're living your purpose and you're doing what feels right in your skin, feeling like, yeah, this is why I should be doing it with my life.

我这一生，能用的时间就这么点，日子就这么些。

I only have so many hours, days, months, years on this planet.

正是这份意义，带来了动力；而这份动力，点燃了火花。

That purpose creates drive, and that drive creates a spark.

这火花就是能量的种子，而这种能量，会感染他人。

That spark is the seed of energy, and then that energy is infectious.

这就是核心所在。

And this is the idea.

对吧？

Right?

快乐的人很有感染力，因为他们扎根于自己的使命，充满动力，身上自然散发出一种能量。

Happy people are infectious because they are anchored in their purpose, they're driven, and they create this spark about them.

对吧？

Right?

比如说我，当上波特兰州立大学的主教练，我特别开心。

You know, like, for me, I'm super happy, like, being the head coach of Portland State.

能通过田径和越野跑这项事业，去影响这么多年轻人的心灵和人生，这简直是我梦想成真。

Like, it's a dream come true, right, to be have this vehicle to impact so many hearts and minds and lives through the lens of track and field and cross country.

但我也会着急，毕竟我接手才三个月，真希望队里的孩子们能立刻体会到这一切的真谛。

But I get impatient too because I'm, you know, month three into this journey, and I want the kids on that roster to experience it the right way right away.

不过我老婆老提醒我，才过了三个月而已。

But I my wife keeps reminding me, it's been three months.

你才带他们两个月呢。

You've only been coaching them for two months.

我知道。

I'm like, I know.

但我清楚那会是什么样子。

But I know what it can look like.

我知道那能成为什么样子。

I know what it can be.

我知道我们能做到什么地步。

I know what we can do.

我知道这里能发生什么。

I know what can happen here.

你只要不断提供机会，持续示范，坚持到场，不断招人，把这些事一直做下去，因为当一群目标明确、充满干劲和能量的人聚在一起时，消息自然就会传开，吸引力也就来了。

And, you know, you just you just keep providing the opportunity, keep demonstrating, keep showing up, keep recruiting, keep doing all that because word gets out when there's highly driven people who have a high purpose and energy about them, and that creates attraction.

我就希望这一切能像打个响指那样瞬间发生。

And I just wish it was, like, snap of the fingers.

哇哦。

Woah.

这就开始了。

Here we go.

事情不会那么快见效，但所有优秀的教练——不管出名还是不出名——都明白并坚持这一点：哪怕状态差，哪怕成绩不理想，哪怕咱们在联赛里垫底，也照样日复一日地做下去。

It's not gonna be that, but that's a key thing that all the best coaches, famous and unfamous, right, who are out there doing good work, understand and deliver day after day after day after day even when they suck, even when the results are not there, even, like, you know, we're getting dead last in the conference meet.

现实就是这样。

It is what it is.

对吧？

Right?

你手头能用的人员是继承来的，你能做的有限，别指望第一年就在赛场、跑道或球场上看到立竿见影的成绩。

You only can do so much with, you know, personnel that you inherit and, you know, understand, like, it's not about performance on the field or the track or the course year one.

第一年的重点是塑造人的心志，等到了第二年、第三年、第四年，你才能真正开始打这场仗，而且能长期保持高水平。

It's about shaping and sculpting hearts and minds year one so that year two, year three, year four, you can start to play that game, and sustain it at a high level.

完全正确。

Absolutely.

我觉得这正是核心所在。

I think that's what it what it's all about.

这正是你想要打造的文化、氛围，那些你努力去建立的东西。

You know, that's what that's what the culture, the environment, the things you're trying to create.

如果你能做到这一点，训练和努力就能发挥出最大效果。

And if you can do that, like, that allows the workouts, the work to maximize itself.

我们常常把顺序搞反了。

Too often, we get it backwards.

很多人一上来就拼命优化训练内容，却没意识到，必须先建立起这样的文化，才能真正激发出自己的潜力，不然就会自己拖自己的后腿。

We try and maximize or optimize the workouts first without realizing that, like, we need to have that culture in place, in order to get the most out of ourselves or else we're gonna be holding ourselves back.

希望听了这些，你能有些启发。

So, hopefully, you know, in listening to this, you got some ideas.

你开始明白，嗯——

You realize that, like, hey.

我懂了。

I I get it.

训练当然重要，但真正决定一个人的，不是训练本身。

The workouts matter, etcetera, but, like, they don't make they don't make the man.

对吧？

Right?

那可不是关键所在。

And that's not that's not where the magic is.

我们得营造合适的环境。

We've gotta create the right environment.

只要环境对了，其他事情往往就水到渠成。

And if we create the right environment, the rest often flows from it.

作为教练，我们花太多时间在训练上，但不妨稍微调整一下，重新想想。

And as coaches, we spend a lot of time on the workouts, but just, you know, shift that a little bit, reevaluate.

你有没有在做那些事，为人们创造一个能成长、能成为竞争者的空间？

Are you doing the things to create the space where people can thrive and become competitors?

对。

Yeah.

这个空间太重要了。

That space is so important.

我经常跟波特兰州立大学的运动员们这么说。

I and I tell the Portland State student athletes all the time.

我当时就说，嘿。

I was like, hey.

作为运动员，我大概两三个月就能看明白。

It only takes me about two to three months to figure out as an athlete.

这并不难。

It's not hard.

其实很简单。

It's pretty simple.

这部分工作其实挺容易的。

That's the easy part of the job.

但要真正了解一个人，得花六个月到一年，观察你如何应对压力、关键比赛、你的反应、言谈举止，还有你面对看似艰巨的任务时的态度，以及你如何管理压力——这些才是关键，是人的部分。

It's the six months to a year to figure you out as a person and to get more observation about how you handle difficult circumstances, competitive crucibles, your response, your reaction, your language, verbally, body, etcetera, you know, over time, seeing you, you know, approach, things that you see as a daunting task or how you manage stress, that's the thing, the human element.

对吧？

Right?

细节的把握，那些细微的互动，都需要时间去体会。

The attention to detail, all the little micro interactions that take time.

这让我想起科比·布莱恩特说过，当他跟着特克斯·温特和菲尔·杰克逊学习时，看比赛录像的方式跟大多数人看篮球比赛的方式完全不一样。

And I'm reminded of, like, Kobe Bryant talking about how, say, watching game film under his, tutelage of, like, Tex Winter and Phil Jackson, when they came on board, was different than, say, how a lot of people tend to do and watch game field and basketball.

对吧？

Right?

我就用这一点来收尾吧。

So I'll leave with this.

大多数人只看表面的东西。

What most people do is look at superficial things.

嗯，没错。

Okay.

嘿。

Hey.

一般来说，他们的战术布置是怎样的？

What's the general, like, setup?

比如说，他们平时打的是什么战术？

Like, you know, what's their, play that they're running?

都是非常基础、表面的东西。

Very basic, you know, superficial things.

科比谈到这个的时候，说的是菲尔和特克斯·温特在NBA篮球界带来的改变。

Kobe was when he talked about it, with what Phil and Tex Witter brought to table in the world basketball NBA.

特克斯·温特创造了三角进攻体系。

Tex Witter created the triangle offense.

他们看比赛录像时，关注的是最细微的细节。

They looked at game film at the smallest attention to detail.

脚步是怎么动的？

What's the footwork?

身体语言是怎样的？

What's the body language?

队友之间那些细微的配合是怎样的？

What's the microinteraction between the teammates?

投篮没进或者被犯规的时候，他们的姿态有什么变化？

What's, you know, their posture here and there when the shot doesn't go in or they they get fouled?

对吧？

Right?

因为他们想捕捉的是对手的细微表现，而不仅仅是战术阵型的布置。

Because they're trying to pick up cues about the people that they're gonna be competing against, not just the formation of the plays being ran.

所以科比就说，确实如此。

And so Kobe's like, yeah.

对这些家伙来说，看比赛录像要花六个小时，而我以前的教练，看录像可能两到两个半小时就完了。关键就在于，一切从细节入手，正是这种深入到极致的关注，才让那些能持续产出、真正完成任务、有竞争力的人，和那些来来去去、浮于表面的人区分开来。

It took with these guys, you know, six hours to watch game film versus, like, with my prior coach before filming them, you know, you just it take maybe two, two and a half because the attend it all starts with attention to the tail, and it's going that deep into that attention to the tail that is the separator and separating element of people who can consistently produce and get the job done or be in the conversation to be competitive versus those who come and go.

很多时候，我觉得我们缺的正是这种微妙的细节和对细微之处的重视，而这些恰恰是所有成就的基础。

And, you know, more often than not, I think that's what we're lacking is the subtlety and nuance and attention to the tail and really stressing that because that's the foundation of everything.

一切的核心，就是注重细节。

Everything is attention to detail.

说实话，史蒂夫和我创办这个奖学金计划，就是因为觉得市面上很多书和资料对细节的挖掘太浅薄了，根本没讲透。

And, you know, honestly, like, this is why Steve and I started the Scholar Program is because we didn't feel like the attention to detail was being highlighted and magnified enough in a lot of the books and literature that was offered superficially.

所以我们才要深挖，因为只有深入进去，才能真正理解、提升，也才能让我们的执教方式变得——怎么说呢——更有魔力。无论你教什么、怎么教，只要真正懂了这一点，你的执教生涯就能不断收获成功。因为真正的魔法，不在里程数，也不在训练量，而在人本身。

And so that's why we go deep because that deep dive contextualizes and elevates and allows us to be, quote, unquote, more magical with how we coach, what we coach, and how for the duration of our coaching career because you just keep getting that success when you understand that the magic lies in the man and the woman and not necessarily just the miles or the workouts.